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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A25216	A reply to the Reverend Dean of St. Pauls's reflections on the Rector of Sutton, &c. wherein the principles and practices of the non-conformists are not only vindicated by Scripture, but by Dr. Stillingsfleet's Rational account, as well as his Irenicum : as also by the writings of the Lord Faulkland, Mr. Hales, Mr. Chillingworth, &c. / by the same hand ; to which is added, St. Paul's work promoted, or, Proper materials drawn from The true and only way of concord, and, Pleas for peace and other late writings of Mr. Richard Baxter ...	Alsop, Vincent, 1629 or 30-1703.; Barret, John, 1631-1713.	1681 (1681)	Wing A2919; ESTC R6809	123,967	128

Cases wherein Moderation ought to be shewn And is not that very agreeable to the Christian-temper And what may others say now of your Icenicum If what I transcribed thence seem to you not agreeable to the Christian temper then was you not under some great Distemper either at the writing of this latter or that former Book In the Christian-temper I have Occasion p. 370. to borrow something from Bishop Downam what he noteth to have always been the Hypocrit Guise I there say is the genius of false Zeal S●il To neglect the greater Du●●es and to affect the Observation of the less to prefer Circumstances before th●●obstance and Ceremonies before the Works either of Piety or Charity to place the heig●th of their Religion either in observing or urging Ceremonies or Controversies in inveighing against them And I say further p. 371. You would not take him for a wise and careful Builder that laid the greatest Weight on the weakest part of the Wall And is that true Zeal for God Or rather is it not a selfish Zeal which is for ones own Opinions or own Party neglecting those things which make most for the Honour of God and wherein the main Interest of Religion lieth If I could see any thing there or in that Book which chanceth to bear the Name of the Rector of Sutton that is not agreeable to the Christian-temper and to the Truth and Doctrine of Christ I hope I should be ready to retract the same Ibid. For it is to pick up all the Passages he could meet with in a Book written twenty Years sinc with great tenderness towards Dissenters before the Laws were establish'd And have you repented of that your former Kindness and Tenderness towards them since the Laws were against them But Solomon tels us A Friend loveth at all times and a Brother is born for Adversity Which I observed 〈◊〉 agreeable to the Christian-temper p. 219. And you cannot deny that which you told us twenty Years since of the Magistrates Power being bounded He hath Power of determining things undetermined by the Word 〈◊〉 they be agreeable to the Word His Laws must be regulated by the general Rules of the Divine Law Rector of Sutton p. 12. That no Laws of Men can hinder but what was Truth will be Truth still and what was Duty will be Duty still In what followeth you more humbly as it would seem than truely confess in Mr. Cotton's words the weakness or unwariness of those Expressions which I have gathered out of your Irenicum That Book was your First-born And the First-born was the chief of their Strength Psal. 105. 36. But it seems you are for reading Gen. 49. 3. Principium doloris rather than Principium roboris The beginning of your Strength is now become the beginning of your Grief Thus you now let the World know indeed that whereas you had written much favouring the Cause of Dissenters your Thoughts at last are changed as to those Things and Persons too Next you fall hotly on me And have you not very well required the Author of that Book for the Tenderness and Pitty he had for you and the Concernment he then expressed to have brought you upon easier Terms c. Reverend Sir I hope you will give me leave to speak when I am thus spoken to I suppose you expect my Answer when you put Questions so close to me First then I thank you for your good pains taken in that Book and for your truly Christian Design in it so agreeable to the Christian-temper though it hath been unsuccesful I doubt not yet but that Book will stand as a Witness before God and the World against many who can never answer that Strength of Reason in it an Evidence of Truth against unn●cessary rigorous mischievous Impositions and yet were for pressing and are still for continuing them upon us But it is no ill Requital of the Author that I have an esteem of his Work And if you can reconcile the Scope of your Sermon with what I cite out of your former Writings do your self that Right Or if you can refute those Collections otherwise such as meet with them may be tempted to think you self-condemned When you say you wrote in Tenderness c. I hope you did not only play the Orator make a flourish meerly with Words or plead our Cause against your own Judgment nor acted the part of Politician as hoping to engage a Party but wrote your Judgment as a sober and indeed well studied Divine Will you say you wrote partially then as swayed with your Pitty and Tenderness towards Dissenters How then shall we be satisfied and assured that you have not written partially of late out of overmuch Fondn●ss on Conformity If you wrote impartially your Judgment and Reason deserves to be regarded till you or some other for you bring greater Str●●gth of Reason to prove you was then in an Error You pleaded wel● for 〈◊〉 ●●ms and what can you say now what have you thought of since to justify Mens imposing harder Terms How can you answer your own Interrogatories What ground can there be why Christians should not stand upon the same Terms now which they did in the time of Christ and his Apost es And whether do they consult the Churches Peace and Vnity who suspend it upon such things as you know what How far doth the Example of our Saviour or his Apostles warrant such rigorous Impositions Rector of Sutton pag. 7 8. You express your having been concerned to have brought us in But were not many of us in both in the Church and in the Ministry before we were put out by the late Impositions● By this expression of yours it would seem your Church is a new Church lately erected standing upon new Terms which I shall have occasion again to take notice of But were we not true Ministers before had we not a valid Ordination Deny it if you can And if we were true Ministers before then it is a great Question whether we are not so still unless you can prove we were justly degraded And consequently whether we are not obliged to the exercise of our Ministry as we may have opportunity Preface p. 72. And hath he now deserved this at your hands to have them all thrown down in his ●ace and to be thus upbraided with his former Kindness Is this your Ingenuity your Gratitude your Christian-temper Now are not these pretty sharp Reflections If you can justly charge me with any Bitterness and Rancor c. I shall acknowledg such things not agreeable to the Christian-temper and would be ashamed of them If you are ashamed to own your former Principles many will judg it is without Cause It may prove you fallen from those sober Principles but it will not prove those Principles false When you speak of my throwing them in your Face my Design was not to cast Dirt upon so worthy a Person What I alledged I took to be matter of

Preaching when 〈◊〉 In the Contents of your Book Part. 1 § 17. it is thus The ●ld Non 〈◊〉 Iudgment of the unlawfulness of Mens preaching here when forbidden by ●aws full● cleared from some late Objections Which you undertake p. 78. c. That their Judgment and Practice was to forbear ●rea●hing in their Parish Churches while they were under Suspension I grant And did not the present Non-conformists follow them herein Did they not generally quit the Temp●es as well as their Tithes and Pr●●ts from Aug. 24. 62. yielding these to be at the Magisnates dispose They would not that you or others should call their Preaching as you do preaching i●●pposition to established Laws whereunto they yielded as far as they could be satisfied it was lawful for them But do you your self be●●●ve that the old Non-conformists thought it unlawful for them to preach at a● when silenced Then you cannot take them to have been very hone●● upr●ght Men who did so ordinarily 〈◊〉 from their own Principles Were not some of them glad of an opportunity of Preaching in another Diocess when they might not be suffered to preach where they lived And were not many of them for the exercise of their Ministry in private when they were denied liberty in publick Fr. Iohnson speaks of their suf●ering themselves to be deposed from their stated publick Ministy which you seem to overlook And so I think Bez● may well be understood of quitting their former publick Employments with whose Testimony you make so great a Flourish p. 21 22. What! is Beza for silencing and stopping the Mouths of such a number of faithful and able Ministers Would Beza even Beza at such a time as that be for silencing so many Preachers It appears that Beza was not of the Mind of our Adversaries That he expresseth no such terrible apprehensions at their quitting their Places as he doth at their Preaching in opposition to the Laws To which I return Were not the Non-conformists generally both at that time and since for quitting their Places rather than holding on in publick to the defiance of the Laws They have desired as far as they could to avoid the exasperating of Rulers They were not for opposing Sword to Sword as Bradshaw has it they were not movers of Sedition nor have been to this day And would Mr. Baxter even Mr. Baxter be for their silencing yet he says in his Search for the English Schismatick p. 37. It is not their Judgment speaking of the meer Non-conformists that they are bound to Preach when by opposing violence or the offending of Rulers it is likely to do more hurt than good and once preaching to deprive them of all the usefulness of their Lives c. But I doubt not there are many Christians yet alive who can remember some of the old Non-conformists and their preaching in private Houses when suspended from Preaching in Churches One writes me word that Mr. Hildersam used to preach in his own House when silenced and two or three Families came to hear him Another special Friend helping me to a sight of some Papers of Mr. E. Reyner formerly of Lincoln I meet with this considerable Passage For me to preach in this Place and at this Time is no way necessary since others may do it and I my self tho put by here may do it as well and freely elsewhere as in New-England Ireland Scotland Holland yea haply in some remote out-wing of the Kingdom And thus God in his ordinary Providence doth order it that his Church gains much by this course of removing Ministers and transplanting the Gospel to such Places as never heard the sound thereof before and in the mean while they may have time to do much good in private c. And I think this was the general Sence of the Non-conformists that they did not look on the censure of Suspension if unjust as a sufficient discharge from the exercise of their Ministry Had they thought themselves bound to cease Preaching whensoever they were prohibited by Men they were honester Men than to act so contrary to their Judgment as they used frequently to preach tho more privately or in Places where they were not known when suspended by the Bishops But these things were not to be publickly talkt of then when the High Commission-Court was up and there was such Inquisition after their Meetings I have this Account of Mr. Simeon Ash from one whose Father 's House was as his home sometimes that when he was sought after by Pursevants coming to them they had Meetings in the Night-time Another a Minister tells me he hath heard from Ancient Christians in Ringly Congregation that Mr. Iohn Angier sometimes Minister there being silenced and having his Chappel suspended by the Bishop of Chester used to preach to divers in his own House till such times as he was removed to Denton I suppose there are some in those Parts yet alive that can testify so much Mr. Westowbye I well knew His Bible was his Licence The Courts could not take him off but he would be at his Work in one place or other Once after my preaching for him when he was scarce able to get into the Pulpit for Age and Weakness accompanying it he entertained me with a Discourse of much of his Life past the Troubles and Opposition he had met with in the World and the great Experience he had of the most encouraging Success of his Ministry under his greatest Troubles that in his Travels he could write to his Wife as he said that God bad given him many Children she knew not of But to enquire after the Practice of particular Persons would be a tedious and endless Work You have the Iudgment of the Assembly under that Head of Ordination where they would have the Person to be ordained declare his sincere Intentions and Ends in entring into this Calling And his Resolution to continue against all Trouble and Persecution If that Assembly were Non-conformists then you see there the Iudgment of the Non-conformists But if they were generally Conformists then you see wee have the Judgment of a Learned Synod of Conformists for us 4. Are you not too partial in allowing Protestants to be occasionally present at some parts of Worship in the Roman Church and that frequently too to hear Sermons c. how far your et caetera may reach others cannot tell till you better inform them while you do not allow them to be present at the Worship performed in the Assemblies of Dissenters The former you are for pag. 108. To your Question there doth this make a Man to have Communion with the Church of Rome I answer yea so far as he joyns in their Worship so far he has Communion with them Sure you will not deny a Man to have any Communion with you in hearing the Word preached who comes for that End and that frequently too So here you must be supposed to grant Occasional Communion with the Roman Church in