Selected quad for the lemma: father_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
father_n	ghost_n	person_n	trinity_n	16,077	5	9.9221	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A07802	The dovvnefall of poperie proposed by way of a new challenge to all English Iesuits and Iesuited or Italianized papists: daring them all iointly, and euery one of them seuerally, to make answere thereunto if they can, or haue any truth on their side; knowing for a truth that otherwise all the world will crie with open mouths, fie vpon them, and their patched hotch-potch religion.	Bell, Thomas, fl. 1593-1610.	1604 (1604)	STC 1818; ESTC S113800	116,542	172

the catholike Church and there hath reckoned vp the consent of peoples and nations authoritie begun with miracles nourished with hope increased with charitie established with antiquitie succession of priests from Saint Peters seat and the name of Catholike he addeth that though these things bee great motiues to keepe him in the vnitie of the Church yet must the truth of the scriptures be preferred before them all In regard whereof he promiseth to giue more credit to Manichaeus than to the Church and to yeeld vnto his doctrine if he shal be able to prooue it out of the scripture In the meane while he must giue him leaue to preferre the credit of the catholike Church before his bare wordes especially seeing the Church but not Manichaeus was the outward meanes and externall helpe that brought him to the faith of the Gospell The second Obiection The baptisme of infants is a matter of faith but not conteined in the holy scriptures ergo not all things necessarie for mans saluation are therein to be found The Answere I answere that it is contained in the scriptures and I proue it by sundry reasons The first argument is drawne from the couenant For infants being within the couenant ought not to be debarred from the signe and seale thereof I will establish my couenant betweene me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an euerlasting couenant to be God to thee and to thy seed after thee Againe you are the children of the Prophets and of the couenant which God made to our fathers saying to Abraham euen in thy seede shall all the families of the earth be blessed Againe repent and be euery one of you b●ptised in the name of Iesus Christ for the remission of sinnes and ye shall receiue the gift of the holy Ghost For the promise was made to you and to your children and to all that are a farre off euen so many as the Lord our God shall call Againe if the first fruits be holy the whole lumpe also is holy And if the roote be holy the boughes also Againe suffer the yong children and stay them not from comming vnto me for to such belongeth the kingdome of heauen And where Saint Matthew hath little children then S. Luke hath 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 infants which can neither vnderstand nor come Againe your children are holy yong children therefore must be baptised The second argument is drawne from the analogie of the figure of the old testament For circumcision to which baptisme succeeded did pertaine to both ages as well to yoong as to old In whom also yee are circumcised with circumcisiō made without hands by putting off the body of the flesh subiect to sinne by the circumcision of Christ buried with him in baptisme in whom yee are also risen againe through the faith of the operation of God who raised him vp from the dead Thus saith Saint Paul by whose wordes we may learne sufficiently that baptisme did succeed to circumcision for the same end vse and purpose viz. that by it we may putting off the bodie of sinfull flesh be buried together with Christ and rise again with him through faith The third argument is drawne from the practise of the Church For the Apostles of our Lord Iesus were commaunded to baptise all sorts of people withour exception Goe therefore and teach all nations baptising them in the name of the father and of the sonne and of the holy Ghost Againe we read in the historie Apostolical that the whole house of Lydia was baptised neither yong nor old being excepted Againe we may find in the acts that the keeper of the prison at Philippos was baptised all they of his houshold incontinent Againe in another place we may read that the whole family of Stepha●●s was baptised not one at all exempted The Obiection Infants haue no faith ergo they may not be baptised The Answere I denie the antecedent because their faith and profession is this to be borne of the faithfull in the vnitie of the Catholike Church Againe though they haue not actuall faith yet haue they faith fundamentallie and by inclination In which sense our Lord Iesus doth reckon them among the faithfull when he saith in this manner VVhosoeuer shall offend one of these little ones that beleeue in me it is better for him if a milstone were hanged about his neck and he were cast into the sea Infants therefore when they are baptized in the Church for faithfull are then deemed to beleeue after their manner VVho albeit they haue not faith in act yet haue they the spirit and vertue or foundation of faith by Gods operation in them Neither ought this thing to seeme strange vnto vs. For if the infants of the wicked ones haue infidelitie and impietie though not in act yet in inclinatiō by nature as writers graunt then truly may it be said that the infants of the faithfull haue faith and pietie though not in act yet in inclination by grace For grace cannot be of lesse force through Christ than nature through the fall of Adam for God saith plainely I will be thy God and the God of thy seed after thee The third Obiection VVee beleeue the trinitie of persons in vnitie of substance but this is not in the scripture Ergo. The answere I denie the assumption for the trinitie of persons is plainly auouched in the holy Gospel where it is thus written But the comforter which is the holy Ghost whom the Father will send in my name he shall teach you all things Thus saith our Lord Iesus In which words we see mention made of three distinct persons first of the Father which sendeth secondly of the holy Ghost which is sent thirdly of the Sonne in whose name he is sent Againe in another place it is thus written There are three which beare recorde in heauen the Father the VVord and the holy Ghost and these three are one Item Matth. 28. verse 19. The fourth Obiection It is not to be found in the holy scrpture that Christ is consubstantiall and of the same substance which the Father Ergo. The Answere The antecedent is false For first in the prophesie of Zacharias I find these wordes arise O sword vpon my shepheard and vpon the man that is my fellow saith the Lord of hostes Secondly in many places of the new testament First in these words I and my Father are one Secondly in these words If ye beleeue not me beleeue the works that ye may know and beleeue that the Father is in me and I in him Thirdly in these words VVho being in the forme of God thought it no robberie to be equall with God Fourthly in these words She shall bring foorth a sonne and thou shalt call his name Iesus for he shall saue his people from their sinnes For this respect saith holy

so this tradition is not excepted but virtually implied in our affirmation Fiftly the scriptures canonicall are discerned from not canonicall euen of themselues like as light is discerned from darkenesse hardnesse from softnesse and sweetnesse from bitternesse Thy word ô Lord saith the Prophet is a lanterne to my feet and a light vnto my pathes VVe haue a right sure word of prophesie saith S. Peter whereunto if ye take heed as vnto a light that shineth in a darke place ye doe well vntill the day dawne and the day-starre arise in your hearts Yet most true it is that the faithfull onely can discerne it For as the Apostle saith If Christs gospell be hid it is hid in them that perish in whom the God of this world hath blinded the minds of them which beleeue not least the light of the Gospell of the glorie of Christ should shine vnto them And the same Apostle elswhere teacheth vs that the spirituall man iudgeth all things VVhich text two famous papists Lyranus and Carthusianus doe expound of things partaining to our saluation S. Iohn is consonant to S. Paule affirming that the vnction which the faithfull haue receiued doth teach them all things Yea Christ himselfe saith That his sheepe doe heare his voice And he addeth that they follow him because they know his voyce But doubtlesse if Christs sheepe that is the faithfull and Gods elect people doe know his voice and therefore doe follow him then by a necessarie consequence they can know Christ speaking to them in the holy scripture and so can discerne holy writ from prophane fables or stories Melchior Canus a famous papist maketh this case cleere his words are set downe in my Golden ballance Sixtly the formall obiect of our faith is veritas prima the first veritie or God himselfe as Dionysius Areopagita telleth vs. Yea Aquinas that famous papist surnamed their angelicall doctor teacheth the selfe same doctrine Non enim fides inquit diuina alicui assentitur nisi quia est à Deo reuelatum For diuine faith saith Aquinas will not yeeld assent to any thing vnlesse it be reuealed of God VVhich truth of doctrine Saint Austen confirmeth in these golden wordes Iam hic videte magnum sacramentum fratres sonus verborum nostrorum aures percutit magister intus est Nolite putare quenquam hominem aliquid discere ab homine Ad monere possumus per strepitum vocis nostra si non sit intus qui doceat inanis fit strepitus noster Quam multi hine indocti exituri sunt quantum ad 〈◊〉 pertinet omnibus locutus sum sed quibus vnctio illa intus non loquitur quos spiritus sanstus intus non docet indocti redeunt Magisteria forinsecus adiutoria quaedam sunt admonitiones Cathedram in coelo habet qui corda docet Sequitur interior Magister est qui docet Christus docet inspiratio ipsius docet Vbi illius inspiratio illius vnctio non est forinsecus inanit●r perstrepunt verba Now brethren behold here a great sacrament the sound of our wordes pierceth your eares but the master that teacheth you is within Thinke not that man learneth any thing of man we preachers may admonish by the sound of wordes but if he be not within that teacheth in vaine is our sound how many will goe hence vntaught For mine owne part I haue spoken to all but to whom that vnction speaketh not inwardly whom the holy Ghost teacheth not within they goe home vntaught as they came The outward teachings are some helpes and admonitions but he sitteth in his chaire in heauen that teacheth the heart The master is within that teacheth it is Christ that teacheth it is his inspiration that instructeth VVhere his inspiration and his vnction is not there the outward noise of words is in vaine Thus writeth this auntient and learned father with many moe wordes to the like effect By whose doctrine we may learne sufficiently if nothing else were said that howsoeuer men teach how soeuer Paul plant or Apollo water yet will no increase follow vnlesse God giue the same I therefore conclude that we doe not beleeue this booke or that booke to be canonicall because this man or that man or the Church saith soe but that the scripture is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that it hath in it selfe that dignity which is worthy to haue credite that the declaration of the Church doth not make vs beleeue the scripture but is only an outward helpe to bring vs thereunto and that wee therefore indeed beleeue the scripture and this or that booke to be canonicall because God doth inwardly teach vs and persuade our hearts so to beleeue For certes if wee should beleeue that this or that booke is canonicall scripture because the Church saith so then should the formall obiect of our faith and the vltimate tearme into which our faith is resolued be man and not prima veritas or God himselfe as Areopagita and Aquinas teach vs. And it will not helpe the papists to replie out of Saint Augustine That he would not haue beleeued the Gospell vnlesse the authoritie of the Church had mooued him thereunto For S. Austens wordes are these Nisi authoritas ecclesiae me commoueret I would not haue beleeued the Gospell if the authoritie of the Church had not iointly mooued me therunto For wee must note that there is a great difference betweene mouere and commouere Mouere is to moue absolutely and a part by it selfe but commouere is to moue respectiuely and together with another thing So Saint Austens meaning is nothing else indeed but that the authoritie of the Church did outwardly concurre with the inward motion of the holy Ghost to bring him to the faith of the Gospel Now Saint Austens meaning is this and and none other viz. that he maketh much more account of the vniuersall Church than of Manichaeus and his complices because the Church did first moue him to heare the Gospel preached and to giue some credit to the same I say some credit because the Churches authoritie did onely moue him to beleeue the Gospell fide humana non fide diuina with humane faith not with faith diuine For this diuine faith with which we Christians doe beleeue the Gospell proceedeth not from the outward teaching of man but from the inward instruction of the holy Ghost as I haue out of the same Austen already prooued Yea the selfe same father declareth in the same chapter that he speaketh of himselfe as being a Manichee not as being a Christian. What faith Saint Austen wouldest thou say to him that should answere thee I doe not beleeue it but for the authority of the Church And this sense is confirmed because S. Austen cōfesseth in the very same chapter that the authoritie of the Gospel is aboue the authoritie of the Church And in the chapter aforegoing after he hath told vs what kept him in