be heard among them And for us thy poore handmaids here humbly suppliant before thee let thy holy Spirit direct lead and assist us in the way which may be most acceptable to thy Majesty and profitable for thy People and comfortable to us all in our distressed estate And shew unto thy Servants what thou wouldst have us to doe in this difficult businesse about the presenting of this Reply to the King which with our selves and all thine we humbly commend to thy grace and blessing through Iesus Christ to whom with thee ô Father and the Holy Ghost be all honour and glory now and ever Amen Mother Now my deare Children I will tell you what resolution GOD hath put into my heart upon the very close of this Prayer namely that we addresse our selves to the King with this Reply together with an humble Petition And because all of us perhaps would be too many let as many of you as are willing to attend me goe with me to the King the rest let them goe and be humble suiters at the Throne of Grace that our GOD would give us to find Grace in the eyes of the King so as hearkening to our Petition he may doe accordingly Such therefore of you as are willing to accompany me stand on this side and the rest stand on that side Well I see you are equally divided Six with me and Six for me With me Charity Humilty Prudence Piety Patience and Verity For me Faith Hope Zeale Iustice Mercy Prayer Now my Gracious Children be strong and of a good courage Our Cause is good and GOD is for us and though our enemies be great yet they shall not prevaile against us TO THE KINGS MOST EXCELLENT MAIESTY THE TRVE CHVRCH AND CHILDREN THE TRUE FAITH AND RELIGION OF JESUS CHRIST do humbly present their Petition of Right THAT whereas a Book intituled A Relation of a Conference between WILLIAM LAUDE and Mr. FISHER the Iesuite hath been by the said WILLIAM now of Canterbury lately republished and that under your Majesties Patronage and in the publishing whereof as he saith he hath obeyed your Majesty And whereas A Reply to the said Relation is now under the Patronage of JESUS CHRIST and in obedience to his Word and by assistance of his Grace here published and presented to your Majesty and before all the World in which Reply are detected and clearely evinced by manifold and infallible Testimonies sundry particular passages and Doctrines of the Relator which directly overthrow all true Christian Faith and Religion And whereas in this Reply is clearely proved that Prelaticall Government of the Church or the Hierarchy as they call it is meere Antichristianisme and the very Mistery of Iniquity branded by the Apostle and expresly forbidden by Christ himselfe to his Apostles whose Successors the Prelates falsely pretend to be and that all Prelates even as they are Prelates are both by their Profession and Practise so many Antiâ—hrists adversaries to CHRIST who as the Great Antichrist sit as Gods in the Temple of GOD Lording over the Faith Soule and Conscience of GODS People thrusting CHRIST out of his Throne And whereas notwithstanding the manifest truth hereof confirmed by most cleare Testimony and undeniable Proofes of Scripture the Relator or Prelate hath in his said Relation uttered sundry blasphemous Speeches belying the Wisedome Counsell and Providence of GOD and of CHRIST as making Him the Author and Ordainer of such a Hierarchicall Government of his Church which is to Father upon GOD and CHRIST a most notorious Lye and Falshood where he addes withall a blasphemous New Article of Belief of the Church of England that this is a truth And whereas the Holy Scriptures is and hath been in all Ages and by all Sound and Orthodox Divines both Ancient and Moderne both Forraigne and Domestick universally received held and constantly beleeved and maintained against all Adversaries of the Truth to be the Onely Rule of Faith and Iudge of Controversies in Divinity and alone Selfe-sufficient to give Testimony to it selfe that it is the undoubted Word of GOD as in this Reply also is fully prooved And whereas the Relator notwithstanding hath loded the Scripture with many intollerable reprâ—ohes and blasphemous words of disgrace censuring it as an insufficient witnesse to it selfe and an incompetent Iudge of Controversies in Faith as being both a blinde dumbe and dead Judge and that it hath no light in it selfe but is as a Candle in a box without light till Tradition of the present Church doe light it and the like the very ground of all Infidelity and Apostacie And whereas notwithstanding all such his blasphemies against the Scripture wherewith he hath stuffed some 30 leaves in Follio besides many other the like scattered all along his Book he the same Relator out of his grosse hypocrisie addeth this proud Blasphemy to all the rest That he hath given the Scripture all honour and ascribed unto it Sufficiencie more then enough And whereas also as appeareth in this Reply the Relator belyes and blasphemes the Holy Ghost himselfe making him the Author of most notorious lyes and vanity And whereas the Relator doth define a meere false and counterfeit Catholicke Church contrary to that Holy Catholick Church beleeved in the Creed whereby he overthrowes both that Article of Faith and with all the Communion of Saints teaching that his Catholicke Church though it cease to be holy yet is a true Church of CHRIST still And whereas of and in this his new Catholicke Church which the Relator beleeveth he makes the Church of England and of Rome to be one and the same Church and both to hold one and the same Faith of that his Catholicke Prelaticall Church which Faith is declared in the Reply not to be the true saving Faith and that they both do set up and professe one and the same Religion not different in which Faith and Religion of the Church of England and of Rome he saith as he hath lived so he resolves to dye as much to say as he will live and dye an English-Romish-Catholicke And whereas the Replyer proveth and which no Papist denyeth that the maine substance of the Romish Religion is the Masse And whereas the Relator confesseth that though a simple Papist may as he saith yet no Romanist as a Romanist living and dying in the Roman Faith can be saved and yet this Faith of Rome is the same with that of England wherein he will end his dayes So as the Church of England may hereby see in what a case she is and how highly she is preferred by her Primate as to be brought to be of the same Church the same Faith the same Religion with Rome enough to startle all your Majesties Subjects that till now thought themselves to bo Protestants and no Papists and to cause all zealous Christians to abandon all communion with such a Church as is the same Church of the same Faith and Religion with Rome And wheras
either in profession dissenteth or in practise differeth from the Church of Rome you reckon those among Romes corruptions Therfore on the contrary in whatsoever you are one and the same Church with Rome those must be no corruptions but the very pure Essence and Substance of that one Church which is just there where Romes is now And what are those Namely One and the same in the Hierarchy or Prelaticall Government which is so essentiall to your Church as where 't is not there 's no Church Onely with this difference The Pope Christs Vicar over the whole world and your Lordship his Vice-roy over all England that other world One and the same in all the members of this great body of the Hierarchy and in all the Officers of this Church-Government as Chancellors Archdeacons Officialls Commissaries and so downe to the very Skirts of that goodly guarded Babilonish Government One and the Same in all your Ecclesiasticall Courts as the Prerogative Court the Court of Arches the Bishops Ordinary Court the Spirituall Court the Court of Inquisition and High Commission with a little difference in the name One and the Same in their Canons and chiefly the Popes Canon Law One and the Same in your Episcopall Robes and vestments both rare and rich as purple and scarlet and fine linnen as it were the livery whereby you are known to be of one and the same house or family with that Woman Rev. 17. aliâs the Great Whore of Babilon with whom you claim Sister-hood So also in your Miters your Rochets Palls Semiters Square Caps Tippets and so cap a pied One and the Same in your Liturgy Service or Matins or Service-Booke which even your Iesuite confessed to be Catholick and so One and the Same in all your Service dressing and garbe as rich Copes Palls and other Altar-ornaments goodly guilt plate faire Crucifixes over them and devout adoration unto them and praying toward the East where your Altar and Crucifix standeth goodly gay Images and Loud-sounding Organs and sweet chanting Choristers and Chanters Deanes and Subdeanes and Prebends Epistlers and Gospellers Singing-men and Viergers and a huge Sately pome and Equipage more then I can tell where you have Long Service and Short Sermons or rather to avoyd tediousnesse none at all yea and your Service in your Cathedralls in an unknown tongue the Popish Service mumbled in a strange tongue and yours in a strange tone chanted and roared out so loud by a sort of profane and drunken Singing Men and Apish Boyes with such a black Sanctus as the people is no way edified as not knowing whether they sing a Song of Robin Hood or play a Scotish Jigge One and the Same in your Altars Priests Sacrifices Onely with some small difference in some termes and manner of expression both holding a reall presence Rome explicitly by Transubstantiation and England implicitly not daring to speake plainly how onely willing to come as neare Rome as the time will give leave in stead of an Host you will have at least your Crucifix a representation of Christs body Sacrificed on the Crosse either upon the Altar for a pawne till the Host it selfe come or as neare over the Altar as may be One and the Same in exercising an Antichristian Tyranny over mens Soules Consciences Bodies Purses Estates by holding them in hard bondage under your roaring Canons and intollerable burthens of Ceremonies but this is rather to be referred to the Title or Caput of Hierarchy the Essence and Substance of your One and the Same Church One in punishing the Transgressors of Ecclesiasticall Canons more severely then of Gods Commandements One in execution of Discipline by Excommunication in your blind Courts for every trifle which must cost more then a trifle to get off So as there must be a Commutation and Solution for Absolution One in Dispensations and Prohibitions dispensing with such as will dispend that by Licence they may Marry or eate flesh in Lent One and the Same in persecuting the true Church of Christ his Word his Ministers his People onely Rome doth it under the name of Hereticks of which you are none and you under the name of Puritans the worst of Hereticks One and the Same in bowing at the Name Iesus One and the Same in observation of Holydayes onely with some difference Rome hath more yet not an English Almanack but sets them forth at least in black attyre as the Papists veile their Images all the Lent from the peoples view to make them hunger the more after such food after their long Fast at Easter in hope that in time they may come to be cladde in Scarlet their Holy-day suit So as a Religious Gentleman late the Astronomy-Reader in Gressham-house but now translated above the Starres for Setting out an Almanacke with a Martyre to every day in stead of the Popes Saints was brought into the High Commission Court where he hardly escaped findging for an Heretick One and the Same in profaning and disesteeming the Lords day both accounting it to be of humane Authority both preferring their Church-holy-dayes before it both profaning it onely with this difference Rome profanes it onely practically but England both practically and professedly and Authentically by Speciall Dispensation and Edict One in condemning Innocents in your Ecclesiasticall Courts mixt with temporall Iudges as in your High Commission and in temporall Courts mixt with Ecclesiasticall Iudges such a sower leaven as after Ecclsieasticall Censure you deliver them over to the Secular power where through your instigation no mercy can be expected your selves being both Parties and Iudges One and the Same in holding the rule of Faith onely with this difference Rome equalling her Tradition with the Scripture and you puting a necessity of the present Churches Tradition and voyce as without which the Scripture cannot be beleeved to be the word of God as was touched before and as will appeare more fully at after So as Rome yoaketh her traditions in equall ranke with the Scripture and you put your Churches Authority and Tradition for the Forehorse to draw and lead the Scripture into mens beliefe as the Oxen drew the Arke towards Ierusalem that it is the word of God One and the Same in exempting your Clergy from the Civill power and Iudicature onely with this difference Rome hath got it in possession and you have often attempted it and openly professed your hope of Seeing the Clergy of England as high as ever they were or as the Lawyers now are In a word One and the Same in your Babilonish Faith and Religion For Rome hath so contrived some of her doctrines as those about Grace layd down in the Decrees of Trent as that those two mighty dissenting Sides about merit of Congruity to wit Andreas Vega with his Franciscans and Dominicus Soto with his Dominicans both Sides bearing a great sway and swindge in the Councel as that each side perswaded it selfe that the Decrees brought from Rome
did locally in Soule descend into Hell the place of the damned without any proofe from Scripture is Sin My reasons are these 1. Because this opens a gappe to men to beleeve humane Traditions to be of Faith to Salvation as of equall credit and authority to the Scriptures Now it cannot be proved that the Creed it selfe with its forme and words and Articles and Title called The Apostles Creed is other then a humane Tradition or that the Apostles composed the Creed Secondly This argues as a too high estimation of a thing humane as if it were autópistos of selfe-Credit so a too base estimation and undervaluing of the holy Scripture as if they alone were not the Rule of Faith or not to be relieâ— and rested on alone for all matters concerning Christian Faith So as to give Credit to any thing else besides the Scripture as of equall Authority with the Scripture as you make your Creed to be and not examining it by the Scripture is a detracting from the Authority of Scripture and consequently a denying of the Scripture to be the Sole Rule of Faith For the Creed it is either a part of the Scripture or not a part if it be not a part of Scripture as indeed it is not then all the Articles of Faith in it being but a small abridgement of Christian Faith and so of necessity and in comparison of Scripture it selfe very obscure and Scanty are to be proved and illustrated from Scripture the Sole Rule of Faith and Tryall of all Truths Thirdly in Particular to beleeve Christs descent in Soule into hell locally must stand with some reason and analogy or proportion of Faith layd downe in the Scripture For Christ did or suffered nothing but the Scripture shews the Reason Cause and End of it For instance Isaiah Saith To us a Child is borne to us a Son is given So the Angel to the Shepheards To you is borne this day a Saviour which is Christ the Lord. This then shews the End of Christs Incarnation namely for our Salvation Then for his Death He was delivered up for our Sins And Forasmuch as the Children were partakers of flesh and blood he also himselfe likewise took part of the Same that through death he might destroy him that had the power of dâ—ath that is the Devil And deliver them who through feare of death were all their life time subject to bondage So for his Resurrection He rose againe for our Iustification So for his Ascention It was that he might send the Holy Ghost and goe to prepare a place in heaven for all his So for his Sitting at Gods right hand There he makes Intercession for his people rules as King his Church in preserving protecting governing his people and makeing his and their foes his Footstoole But for any such thing as Descent into hell neither is it found in the Scripture nor much lesse any reasons given there of it Indeed Peter Speaking of Christs Resurrection alledgeth Psal. 16. Thou wilt not leave my Soule in Hell So in the English In the Hebrew it is commonly taken for the Grave not for the place of the damned But will you take Peters exposition of it Speaking by Christs owne Spirit This saith he David Seeing before Spake of the Resurrection of Christ that his Soule was not left in Hell neither his flesh did see Corruption So then this place Psal. 16. was by the Holy Ghosts owne Interpretation a Prophecie of Christs Resurrection from the Grave and not of any Descent into Hell the place of the damned For he is not said to rise out of hell as you say he went downe into Hell nor to ascend out of Hell as you beleeve he descended into Hell Will you have a particular Article of Christs descent into Hell and shall you not need another Article for his Ascent out of Hell againe And the Apostle saith Christ descended Eis tà katótera mère tes ges to the lowest parts of the Earth which is spoken of his humiliation to the Death and the Grave but here is no word of his Descent into any such place as Hell the place of the damned But admit your Faith to be true that Christs Soule descended locally into Hell I aske to what end or purpose Can you shew any Reason from Scripture for this Will you say his Soule went thither to suffer Surely that had its Consummatum est upon the Crosse there it was finished Will you say he went to triumph over the Devil in his owne Dâ—nne That was also done on his Crosse as on his Triumphall Chariot And can you give any reason why Christ should descend into hell in regard of us What that so he might deliver our Soules out of Hell Surely this also was done in his Death And againe if it were necessary that Christs soule should goe locally into hell to deliver our soules then also it was necessary for his body to descend into hell to deliver our bodies from thence For he came to redeem our bodies as well as our soules Or what els can you Say Certainly what ever you can invent the Scripture will presently discover the vanity of it But for my part I dare beleeve nothing concerning Christ and my Salvation but what the Scripture hath revealed But the Scripture hath revealed no such thing as the Descent of Christs Soule into Hell locally But you will then object unto me Do I not beleeve my Creed and every Article in it I answere I doe Why then say you Doe I not beleeve the Article of Christs Descent into Hell I say I doe being understood or expounded according to the Scripture and the Analogy of Faith therein How is that Christ dyed and in his Passion he suffered the Torments of Hell in his Soule on the Crosse and in the Garden But his Descent into Hell is set after his buriall And doe you not know that the ancient Heathen used to put Hádes for the state of the dead So as katelthein eis hadou is to goe or to abide in the state of the dead which Christ did for 3. dayes and then arose againe and revived So as the Article shewes the continuance of Christs being dead and buried till his Resurrection Againe you know the Nicene Creed mentions onely Christs buriall and no Descent into Hell and Athanasius his Creed katelthen eis hadou He Descended into Hell without speaking a word of his buriall All which doe confirme what I say that christ in being buried remained so long in the State of the dâ—ad his soule seperated from his body and being said to Dâ—scend into Hell hades signifying also the Grave thereby is meant his being buried for so long a time till his rising againe As it is said in the next Article The third day â—e rose againe from the dead that is from the Grave where he abode in the state of the dead Now I have given
you a reason of my Faith Can you give one reason of yours concerning this Article as you take and beleeve it with your Church of England Show but one reason or shadow of a reason out of Scripture Nay except you bring every Article of the Creed to the examen or tryall of Scripture for the staying and establishing of your Faith you may run into many monstrous errours What doe you beleeve concerning Christs death You beleeve that hee dyed But for whom Whether for the Elect onely in Gods Purpose Account Appointment Acceptance or universally for all men Elect and Reprobate I tell you my Lord if you beleeve that Christ dyed for all men universally as well for the Reprobate as the Elect you destroy both Gods Grace in giving Christ for his people onely the Elect and also the merit and effâ—icacy of Christs death The Scripture shewes these things aboundantly But I mention this onely by the way Againe What doe you beleeve concerning the holy Catholicke Church You beleeve I dare say and you doe say it that the Catholicke Church on earth consists visibly of all Prelates and those that are subject unto them as one intire Body This is your Faith But if you examine this by the Scripture you will find it to be an Errour no lesse soule then false as hath been shewed So doe you not beleeve the Article of the Communion of Saints You doe But who are your Saints on earth You will hardly allow any Saints on earth till after their death they be Canonized by his Holinesse at Rome Nay in plaine termes you persecute both the Saints themselves and their Communion Can you indure such as but professe holinesse And for their Communion doe you not hunt out and persecute Private Fasting and Prayer among the poore soules of Christ when publick they can have none and no other remedy or weapons are left them to defend themselves withall against your bloody Cruelty So as the truth is you neither rightly beleeve the Holy Catholicke Church nor the Communion of Saints but are a notorious both denyeâ— and persecuter of both And therefore we see what a necessity there is that we should bring the Articles of the Creed to the Standard Rule the Scripture both as the surest and safest way yea and the onely way to preserve our Faith from Errour But you object the Fathers for the Sense of this Article of Christs Descent into hell as you beleeve it What if they beleeved so Is their example a sufficient Rule for us We must examine their sense they held of it by the Scripture If it be not according to the Scripture we reject it The Fathers might for a time hold an erronious generally received opinion before it came to be controverted and well sifted and examined by Scripture But they were ever ready to have their faith and opinions tryed by the Scriptures All the ancient Fathers were of this mind and spirit As before Pelagius his time the Fathers spake too liberally of Mans Free-will which after upon his Heresie they reformed and by Scripture abundantly confuted the Pelagians and especially Augustine Ierome Prosper Fulgentius Hilarius and others And Augustine inticing a Donatist to dispute about that Heresie Saith unto him Ratione agamus divinarum Scripturarum authoritate agamus Let us dispute the matter by Argument let us be guided by the Authority of the Divine Scriptures Not what I and thou Say but what Christ Saith And this was the Spirit I say and practise of all the Fathers in such cases So as if this Article of of Christs descent into hell had been by occasion of controversie about it well searched into and examined by the Scripture no doubt but the Fathers would therein have regulated their Faith according to the truth of Scripture But the Church of England say you holds and beleeves that Article as you doe No marvaile when you doe And should you hold otherwise must it not doe so too And yet we have but your bare word for it But you will alledge your Article That Christ went downe into hell But we must examine your Article by the Scripture And it is not the sound of your Article but the sense and that it agreeth with Scripture But we have shewed that no such thing is in Scripture And you tell us withall what Mr. Rogers upon the Articles saith of this That then Then I say in diebus illis the Church of England was not resolved of this Article and he was then the Arch-bishop of Canterbury his Chaplein your Predecessor Richard Bancroft But now your Lordships bare word is enough to Sway the Ballance which before stood but in aequilibrio in an even peize not resolved but now resolved But this I can tell you what ever your Church of England now beleeves there is and I hope a good sound Church of Christ yet in England that beleeves the Creed and all the Articles thereof and this in particular no otherwise then they find them agreeable to the Scripture and the Analogy of Faith And this is agreeable to that which once a Prelâ—te of England said By the generall confâ—ssion of all Antiquity Traditions must he warranted by the Scriptures or els we must reject them And Isidore saith A Prelate if he teach or command any thing besides that which is evidently cammanded in the holy Scriptures let him be taken for a false witnâ—ssie to God and a committer of Sacriledge But looking a little further I find you confessing That the Church of England hath not determined as yet either way by open Declaration upon this Article No hath she not How then doe you affirme and would perswade us that you beleeve with the Church of England that Christ descended into hell without any further Dispute We hope therefore it will not be long before your Declaration come forth with a Definitive Sentence determining the sense of this Article one way or other And the rather because in the late Declaration before the Articles wherein this Article of Christs going down into hell is particularly set downe for one they are declared to be of ambiguous sense and yet men must hold to the letter of the Article So as by that Declaration we are lesse resolved of the Articles then before A new Declaration therefore we would faine see which is cleare Declarative and Determinative and therein tell us whether Christs Soule descended into Hell the place of the damned or into Purgatory the Suburbs of hell and whether Locally and for what end and purpose because the Scripture is altogether silent in this whole mystery and whether you find hell to be in the Center of the Earth or no because your Article saith He went down into hell c. But in the mean time I have for my part ingenuously given you a reason of my Faith touching this Article which I am so resolved on by the Scripture that whatsoever Declaration you or your Church of England
tâ—e Rule and Foundation of our Faith but what we find written in the holy Scriptures This is that word of God which is authenticall of Authority to his Church and therefore Authority to us because written So as your unwritten word whereiâ— you agree with Bellarmine and your Apostolicke Traditions wherin you come home to your A. C. the Jesuite we receive none of them all as authentick or to have any thing to doe to expound the Scripture in any doubt about the Faith But if you can shew us any Traditions Apostolick we will by your leave examine them by the Scriptures and not the Scriptures by them You name baptizing of Infants for a Tradition Apostolicke We doubt not but the Apostles baptized the Infants of beleeving Parents For the Infants or Children of such are holy as the Apostle sheweth And so they belonged to the Covenant And as the Children of the Jewes in the old Testament were circumcised as pertaining to the Covenant and promise made to Abraham and to his Seed So Baptisme succeding in place of Circumcision as a Seale of the Same Covenant belongs to all Children of beleeving Christian Parents As the Apostle saith Therefore it is of Faith that it might come by Grace and the Promise might be sure to all the Seed not to that onely which is of the Law but to that also which is of the Faith of Abrahâ—m who is the Father of us all So as beleeving Christians have the same interest in the Covenant with Abraham and their Children or Infants have the like priviledge of Baptisme as the Infants of the ancient Israelites had for Circumcision Therefore the Baptizing of Infants was certainly practised by the Apostles as well as the baptising of beleeving Parents So as we doe not baptize Infants because you tell us it is a Tradition Apostolicke but because it is as clearely and firmely grounded in the Scripture as the baptizing of beleeving Parents We exclude therefore whatsoever Word unwritten or Traditions Apostolicke as you call them as being either partiall or equall Rules of Faith with the Scriptures as Bellarmine calls them or as Interpreters and Iudges of the Scripture in doubts about Faith as you are bold to affirme We have no word of God but the Scripture we acknowledge no Traditions Apostolicke but what we find they delivered in Scripture The Prophets in the old Testament sent Gods people to the Scripture for information instruction resolution in all matters of Faith and Cases of Conscience To the Law and to the Testimony Saith Isaiah if they Speake not according to this word it is because there is no light in them He Saith not To the Traditions of our Fathers but To the Law and to the Testimony Gods word written Els there is no light in men they are blind guides that in matters of Faith lead us any where but to and by the Scriptures And the Prophet Ieremiah They have rejected the word of the Lord and what wisedome is in them All wisdome without this word of God is foolishnesse all knowledge without this is ignorance and blindnesse So our Saviour Christ Search the Scriptures for in them ye thinke to find eternall life and they are they which testifie of me So as Christ allowes us no other Testimony of him and of Faith in him but the Scriptures We must erunan Search them not the Archives or Sacraries of blind Traditions though guilded over never so faire with the name of Apostolick nor of any pretended word of God unwritten And Christ answereth the Lawyer when he asked what he should doe to inherit Eternall life What is written in the Law How readest thou And the Apostle That none presume above that which is written And Whatsoever things were written afore time were written for our learning that we through patience and comfort of the Scriptures might have hope And Peter We have a more sure word of Prophecy to wit the Scriptures of the old Testament whereunto ye doe well that ye take heed In all which places and many more the Scripture is still commended to us as the onely absolute sufficient perfect and compleat Rule of our Faith in all matters or doubts of Faith touching our Salvation So as it hath no other interpreter but it selfe not any Tradition not any word unwritten But of this you will give us occasion to speak more at after L. p. 72 73. Faith is the gift of God of God alone and an Infused habit in respect whereof the soule is meerely recipient The Sole Infuser is the Holy Ghost Till the Spirit of God move the heart of man he cannot beleeve P. I confesse when first I read these words I began to muse with my selfe and to argue thus What is my Lord of Canterbury turn'd Orthodox no Arminian in the Doctrine of Grace But looking a little further and observing both the Authors you alledge as Stapleton a great man with you and other Popish Authors as is usuall with you throughout your Book and also considering of what Faith you here Speak I changed my conceit and found that you were no Changeling For wheras I thought that all this faire â—â—ourish of Faith is the gift of God of God alone A habit infused The Holy Ghost the Sole Infuser The soule meerely recipient Till Gods Spirit move mans heart he cannot beleeve had been meant of that Grace of Saving and Iustifying Faith which the Scripture teacheth and particularly the Apostle Ephes. 2.8 By Grace ye are saved through Faith and not of your selves it is the Gift of God c. I imagined I say that as you used the Apostles very words and the Language of Scripture so you had done it in the sense and mind of the Apostle and of the Scripture which Speaks so of the Saving and Iustifying Faith But when I found the contrary I confesse I blushed at my folly in having such a conceit of you having had so much experience both of your usuall perverting of Scriptures and your corrupt sense throughout your Book and considering that light and darknesse cannot stand together and how you hâ—ve altogether suppressed the Preaching of the Doctrines of Grace and finding that all this Faith you Speake of is nothing els but that historicall Faith in beleeving the Scriptures to be the word of God which beliefe is common to the very Reprobates and Devils themselves who beleeve and tremble Phristouâ—i they quiver and Shake as when mens teeth Chatter in their head in extreme cold And yet how doe you abuse the Scripture and your Reader in giving to this Faith those peculiar Attributes which are proper and peculiar to the onely Saving Grace of Saving Faith the Sole Infuser Giver and worker whereof is the Holy Ghost Tell me how come the Devils to that historicall faith whereby they beleeve the Scripture to be the very word of God and all things therein to be most certainly true and so all
is in the Scripture such a light as is of force to breed faith Nay you have already again and again and I know not how often expresly and flatly denyed that there is in Scripture so much light as of it self hath force to breed so much faith as to beleeve it to be the word of God And this was all the Question with you but even now But how comes in this Negative Not to make a perfect knowledge The Question was not all this while whether the Scripture had so full a light in it as to make a perfect knowledge But seeing you took this in to cast a myst before mens eyes that they may not so easily discern your jugling trick in answering A.C. and yet keeping your credit as if you herein maintained no other thing then what they Divines of the Church of England have held that which you say the Jesuite pretends I will answere this too That all Orthodox Divines do hold and that according to the Scripture that there is in it such a full and cleare light as to make a perfect knowledge For First there is a knowledge perfect and 2 ly we have no other Schoolmaster to teach it but the Scripture and 3 ly this perfect knowledge is required of Christians Be not children in understanding saith the Apostle but in understanding be men So the English hath it But the Originall is tais dè phresì téleio gÃnesthe In understanding or wisdome be ye perfect So Heb. 6.1 Wherfore leaving the Principles of the Doctrine of Christ let us be caried on to perfection That is to perfection of Knowledge in the mystery of Christ. Now this knowledge is no where but in the Scripture and so this perfection no way to be attained unto but by the Scripture as the onely rule and meanes thereof So the Apostle to Timothy saith From a child thou hast known the holy Scriptures which are able to make thee wise unto Salvation through faith which is in Christ Iesus All Scripture is given by inspiration of God and is profitable for doctrine for reproof for correction for instruction in righteousnes that the man of God may be perfect thorowly furnished unto all good works So as Tertullian might well say Adoro plenitudinem Scripturarum I adore or admire the fullnesse of the Scriptures It is a Fountaine yea an Ocean of Knowledge And if we cannot attaine to that full perfection of Knowledge in this life which is to be found in the Scripture it is defectus vasis non fontis the defect is in the vessell mans soule For we know but in part and we prophecy in part saith the Apostle and not in the fountaine the Holy Scripture which is like Iacobs Well full of Water but deep so as every one hath not such a lage vessell and long line as can draw forth a full measure of knowldge out of it yet he may draw for a plenitude or fullnesse of the vessell according to its quantity and the proportion of Faith given to every man yet not so exactly full by reason of our infirmity and in-capacity of our vessell which is partly of a leaking condition plenus rimarum as he said full of cracks and a great deale we lose in the very drawing of it up as a bucket doth of water before it come to the toppe So as the defect is not in the Well wherein it was but now over head and eares as we Say under water and fuller then it could hold but in the bucket in bringing it up or containing and retaining of it L. p. 87. Faiths evidence is not so cleare for it is of things not seen Heb. 11.1 in regard of the object and in regard of the subject that sees it is in enigmate in a glasse or darke speaking Now God doth not require a full demonstrative knowledge in us that the Scripture is his word and therefore in his Providence hath kindled in it no light for that but he requires our faith of it and such a certaine demonstration as may fit that And for that he hath left sufficient light in Scripture to Reason and Grace meeting when the Soule is morally prepared by the Tradition of the Church P. Speaking Still of that Faith whereby a man beleeves the Scripture to be the word of God which Faith is Historicall here you confound it with the Saving justifying Faith just as the Papists doe For as they so you here alledge for your faiths unclean evidence Heb. 11.1 where the Apostle describes Faith thus Faith is the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen By which very description it is cleare and evident that he speakes not of that Historicall Faith of Scripture common to all men but of the Saving Faith peculiar to Gods Elect Tit. 1.1 and given to the Saints Jude 3. which notwithstanding comprehends in it the Historicall Faith of Scripture to be the word of God and that in a higher degree and measure then any Reprobate can have even as the Rationall Soule of man being it comprehends in it the Sensitive faculty in a more excellent manner then it is in the bruit beasts and the Vegetative faculty in a more excellent manner then it is in the plants because as the sensitive and vegetative qualities of the soule of man being comprehended under the Rationalls are subjected to the rule and command of Reason and so doe participate in some kind of the very nature of the Rationall faculty man being both moving and seeing and hearing and smelling and tasting and touching not as a bruit beast but as a Reasonable creature So Historicall Faith being comprehended under the Saving and Justifying Faith in a true beleever it is in him more excellent and advanced to a higher pitch of perfection then it is or can be in a naturall man so as it participates so farre of that plerophorÃa tes pÃsteoes that full assurance of Saving Faith as that it not onely apprehends and beleeves the Scripture to be the word of God but doth beleeve it so certainly and firmly and with such an affiance and affection as that the Beleever will rather dye then for the terrours of death it selfe be brought to deny this truth And what is this trow you but a full and certaine demonstrative knowledge that perswades him to this But for This Historicall Faith in a meere naturall man or one unregenerate though he be sufficiently convinced in his Conscience that the Scripture is the word of God yet he hath neither so much affiance in it nor affection to it as that he wil be content to loose life and all if need be for the maintenance of this truth This full Demonstration he wants But for that Faith which the Apostle speakes of and describes Heb. 11.1 which you make to be your Historicall Faith and the evidence of it in regard of the objest not so cleare as being of things not seene it is
as you imposed upon me So as No Right that is No Orthodox Church at Rome And yet no newes it is that I granted the Roman Church to be a true Church For so much very learned Protestants have acknowledged before me and the Truth cannot deny it For that Church which receives the Scripture as the Rule of Faith though but as a partiall and imperfect Rule and both the Sacraments as instrumentall Causes and seales of Grace though they adde more and infuse these yet cannot but be a True Church in Essence How it is in manners and Doctrine I would you would loâ—ke to it with a single eye P. Not Right then not Orthodox you hold the Church of Rome to be That 's somthing yet Yet True you ever have and will hold her to be unlesse she absolutely fall away from the Faith Well And yet I wot well you give absolutely falling away from the Faith So large bounds as it is to be feared you will never come to give her for absolutely gone and fallen away from the Faith so long as she can have but one bare thread or ragge of the profession of the Faith of the Creed nay if she can but say over her Creed though as you Confesse elsewhere she hath quite overthrown the sense of it And if the sense of it be destroyed surely the Faith of it also This will more fully appeare as we goe along We come to your Reasons why you hold Rome a True Church 1. For very learned Protestants which hold with you in this First we can set both as learned and double the number of of Protestants who will weigh down the Scale against those that seem to be of your opinion Secondly we could out of those very Protestant Authors whom you mean though I suppose you seldome read such Authors and in other things scarce name them Honoris causa collect more against this opinion That the Church of Rome is a true Church then you can for it As out of Iunius himselfe for Instance I mentioned before a laâ—e Book intituled Babel no Bethel never yet answered by any Jesuite or other Priest Romish or English where the Author hath cleared all or most of those Protestants which his Adversaries alledged and I suppose you meane from this opinion of yours And then also the Author proves by many concluding Arguments and in my opinion unanswerable that the Church of Rome is no true visible Church of Christ as having lost the very Essence of a true Church To which Booke I referre your Lordship could your patience but brook the Authors name or your Conscience not tremble at the mention of him To your Second Reason First I deny that the Church of Rome receives the Scriptures as A Rule of Faith For first The Rule of Faith must be in it selfe simply Divine and Infallible But such to the Church of Rome the Scripture is not For she makes the Infallibility and Divine Authority of the Scripture to depend upon the Church as you do upon Church Tradition which you confesse to be not simply Divine and Infallible Ergo Rome receives not the Scripture as A Rule of Faith Secondly Rome receives not holds not The Rule of Faith Ergo she is not a true Church As the late Dr Carleton of Chichester in his Book of the Church hath well and learnedly proved For not to hold the Rule of Faith is to deny and destroy the Faith and to fall absolutely away from the Foundation of Faith and to set up a new and false Faith upon a new and false Foundation Nor dare or doe you say that Rome receives the Scripture as The Rule of Faith but onely as A Rule of Faith to wit a partiall Rule as Bellarmine calls it But if the Scripture be as it is The onely Rule of Faith and ever hath been in all ages so held till Rome in the Councel of Trent changed this Rule then not to hold it so for The Rule that is the onely Rule but onely as a partiall Rule joyned with other Rules equall to it as her Traditions which Bellarmine in his Book de verbo Dei non scripto calls the word of God unwritten is to reject the onely Rule and so to fall absolutely away from the Faith And you confesse that the Church of Rome holds the Scripture but as a partiall and imperfect Rule And is this nothing with you What is this but to evacuate and utterly make voyd the Rule when for a perfect intire and absolute onely Rule it is made but a partiall imperfect and joynt Rule And when humane Authority is equalled with Divine Humane Traditions with Divine Scriptures as an equall Rule of Faith Nay and those her Traditions which she calls her word of God unwritten are such as teach things directly contrary to the Doctrines of Scripture as of Purgatory Invocation of Saints and the like Is not this a'kurosai as Christ saith to make voyd and of no Authority the Commandements of God by mens Tradition Yet this Camel you can easily swallow you slight this over as a matter of nothing as if it were all one thing in a manner to hold the Scripture The Rule of Faith and A Rule of Faith namely a part or piece of the Rule The whole Rule and a partiall Rule The onely perfect Rule and An imperfect Rule All this breakes no squares with you but that Rome for all this holds the Rule of Faith and therfore you hold her for a true Church of Christ. But yet in so saying you plainly imply That if Rome held not the Rule of Faith she is no true Church of Christ but is absolutely fallen away from Christ the Foundation For you give this for a Reason that Rome is a true Church because she holds the Rule of Faith Ergo If she hold not the Rule of Faith she is no true Church of Christ but is absolutely fallen away from the Faith Whereupon I argue thus That Church which denyeth the Scripture to be the onely Intire Absolute perfect Rule of Faith is fallen absolutely away from Christ and so ceaseth to be a true Church that is to have the very Essence and beeing of a true Church of Christ But the Church of Rome denyeth the Scripture to be the onely Intire Absolute Perfect Rule of Faith Ergo the Church of Rome is absoluely fallen away from Christ and so ceaseth to be a true Church that is to have the very Essence and beeing of a true Church of Christ. The Minor Proposition is confessed by your Lordship For you say The Church of Rome holds the Scripture but as A Rule a Partiall Rule an Imperfect Rule Thus she denyeth the Scripture to be the onely Intire Absolute Perfect Rule of Faith And for the Major Proposition you doe by necessary Consequence confesse it also to be true For you set it down as a Reason why you hold the Church of Rome to be a true Church because she holds the
in his innocent nakednesse then with his devised Fig-leaves how applyed to the Prelaticall Church 103 104. Prelates Service sensuall and heathenish as done to an unknown God fully displayed 104. Prelates pompous Ceremonies like the Cardinals Sumpter 105. No necessity of Prelates Ceremonies sith both Superstitious and Superfluous saving that they are all the Substance of their Religion 106 107. True Reformation ought to have no Ceremonies at all to bind the Conscience 107. Prelates Ceremonies strengthen Superstition and Idolatry and destroy true piety 108. What is that Substance of Religion which Prelates Ceremonies doe fence 106 107. And what strength they adde to his Religion how it is weaknesse not to see 108. Prelates Ceremonies are beggerly Rudiments yea Aegyptian bonds and Babilonish Chaines 108. How by the Prelates Ceremonies so eagrely urged the Jesuites win ground 108 109. Romes Reconciliation hastened by hossing up wodden Altars and hurling down golden Ministers 109. The Jesuites hale in Popery through the Prelates broad Gates he hath layd open ibid. 21. How the Prelate hath layd open the wider-gates of his Catholicke Church by pulling down the walls and bulwarks of Christs true Church 109. The Prelates wider-Gates whither they lead 110. The Prelate hath nothing to doe with the true Faith nor Communion with the true Saints ibid. He perverteth the Scripture Jude 3. falsely applying the Saints Faith to his boundlesse Catholicke Church 110. What Truth the Prelate professeth and with what singlenesse of heart 110 111. And his notorious hypocrisie in deluding the King 111. The Prelate puts all his Book upon the King as published in obedience to his Majesties command ibid. What we may expect from the Prelate who resolves to dye in that Faith wherein he hath lived ibid. And so what hope he can have of Gods favour 112. THE CONTENTS OF THE MAINE POINTS AND PASSAGES IN THIS insuing Reply to the Relation it selfe 2. WHat is that Church whose judgement the Prelate would have the people to depend upon 113. And not to be too busie with Seripture but moderately in things obvious 114. How the Prelate yeelds the Jesuite this that the Church of Rome is a true Church on whose judgement people must depend 115. The Prelate a Subtile underminer of the Truth 116. 4. The papall Church holds no one point of Saving Truth ibid. 23. How the Prelate vants himselfe for the great Champion of the Church of England 117. 29. How the Prelate overthrows Christ while he makes things not Fundamentall in the Faith necessary to some mens Salvation but tells us not who those be 117 118. 31. How the Prelate can bind all men to peace by his Churches Declaration yea though it be not the Churches 118. The dangerous Consequences hereof 119. 32. The Prelate selfe-condemned for adding things contrary and detracting things necessary 120. 35. How against the Prelate things considered in the manner of Beeing onely are fundamentall in the Faith Instanced in sundry particulars 120 121. The many absurd consequences of Popish Reall-presence ibid. 37. How the Prelate makes things which are fundamentall in the Faith not to be so to all men 122. See 117.118 If the Prelate doe at all discerne what the true Faith is what use he makes of it 122. 39. How the Prelate falsifies Lyrinencis and is loth to English some of his words 123. If the Church of Rome be Lupanar Errorum a Stews of Errours 't were good that all should know her in plain English to be so to avoyd her though the Prelate be loth English men should know it ibid. How the Prelate applauds the Iesuite Stapleton in a grosse point of Popery whom Dr. Whitakers in the Chaire at Chambridge confuted 124. How therein the Prelate prefers Stapleton before Bellarmine who comes nearer to the Truth ibid. 40. How the Prelate is justly as an Enemy to Assurance of Salvation and so of true Saving Faith 124. 43. How the Prelate makes it whether for a penny Beliefe of Scripture or the Creed hath the Precedencie of a Prime Principle of Faith 125. 44. The Prelate allows some Traditions for Apostolick though not fundamentall in the Faith ibid. 45. The Prelates Faith of Christs Descent into hell which Article is by the Replyer discussed 126 to 129. 47.48 For default of examining the Articles of the Creed by Scripture the Prelate overthrows two Articles The Catholicke Church and the Communion of Saints 129. 51. Notwithstanding the Prelate we ought boldly and publickly to affirme The Truth against errour 132. 53. The Prelate submits the Faith of the Church of England to the judgement of the Fathers whether her Articles be according to Scripture How by those Fathers he is condemned 132 133. With what limitation the Church within the first 400 or 500. yeares may be sayd to have been at the best 133 134. How the Replyer declines the occasion of entring into a comparison between the truly Reformed Protestant Churches and that within the first 500. years after the Apostles 134. Conformity to Popish Rites a Pretence to bring Papists to Church as the Christians anciently intertained Heathen manners to draw them to be Christians 134. Augustine complained of Ceremonies then when if the Prelate say true the Church was at the best ibid. 62. The Prelates false professed Faith concerning the Catholicke Church in the Creed which he defines to be the Society of all Christians 135. 66. How the Prelate jumpes with Bellarmine for a word of God as well unwritten as written 135 136 137. Baptisme of Infants a Doctrine of Scripture not an unwritten Tradition We ought to repaire to Scripture in all doubts of Faith 137. 72 73. How the Prelates words not well examined may make us beleeve he is no Arminian but Orthodox in the Doctrine of Grace while he abuses the Scripture most palpably and grosly 138 139. 75 76. What the place and office of naturall Reason is in judgeing of Scripture against the Prelate magnifying naturall Reason to the vilifying of Scripture the blindnesse and vanity thereof in judging of Divine things and matters of Faith 140 141 142 143. Vnsanctified Reason how it judges the Scripture to be false 143. How the Prelate is put to his naturall Reasons pregnancy in matters of Faith 1â—2 77. The Prelates extreme blindnesse or malice in saying The Scripture is strengthened with probable Arguments from the light of Nature and humane Testimony to convince men without which it is not so demonstratively evident of it selfe 144. At large confuted 14â— to 149. A secret power in Scripture convincing a naturall man in the reading or hearing of it preached that it is the very word of God 148 149 150. See also A motion of the Replyer to the Prelate how he shall make tryall of the Scriptures powerfull sufficiencie to convince him that it is the word of God 149. A comparison of the Scripture with the Sun 151. Gods word preached and not Church-Tradition the ordinary prime motive and instrument of Faith Illustrated
by pregnant Comparisons ib. 83. How the Prelate hangs the Beliefe of Scripture to be the word of God necessarily upon the Authority of the present Church and other such poore inducements all but meere probabilities which may beget opinion but never beliefe 152 153 154 155. All examined and proved to be meere vanity in all which the Prelate destroyes all Faith and hope of Salvation 156. also 157. In what sense and way onely a Naturall Man being led by the Prelates hand as of the present Church to read the Scripture may be induced to beleeve it is the very word of GOD 154. 84. Further notorious blasphemies of the Prelate in derogating from Scripture as having no light but as a candle in a box of 12 in the pound till Tradition of the present Church doe light it Examined 157 158 159. How the Prelate perverts the Scripture and puts out the light of it 157. Other blasphemies of the Prelate against the Scripture Gods word and the Holy Ghost making his Church-Tradition the eyes inlightner 159 160 161. Gods own voyce in Scripture read and preached begets beliefe that it is Gods word 161. 85. The Prelates prosecution of this Argument in advancing his present Church Authority further confuted 162 163. 85 86. A Subtile and Sly evasion of the Prelate from the Jusuites true objection 164. A pretty tricke of Legerdemain 195. Scriptures full light teacheth a perfect knowledge against the Prelates Evasion 165 166. 87. The Prelates perverting of Scripture in his Babylonish confounding the Historicall with the Saving and justifying Faith as he alwayes doth and another Scripture in confounding the regenerate with the unregenerate 166. to 170. Whereupon the Replyer addes a notable Discourse of the nature of true Saving Faith 170 to 174 as namely of its admirable operations in the severall faculties of the Soule with its excellencie c. The Prelate Contradicts himselfe not knowing wherof he affirmeth Saving that by Faith he ever meaneth a false Faith whereby he destroyeth the true 173. The Sure beliefe of Scripture is a Christians sure comfort in trouble 172 173. 88. Hookers Sensible Demonstration so applauded by the Prelate throughly scanned and soundly proved to be false by most evident Demonstrations proving the Scripture to prove it selfe Gods word 174 to 177. The Prelates Ground from Nature being applyed to Scripture proved false and Christs Saying which the Prelate objecteth cleared 177 178. 89. Hookers stating of the Question commended by the Prelate for Tradition as the Key to open the Entrance to Scripture proved false in the Prelates sense and that Key to be a false pick-lock 178 179. 91. How the Prelate in charging the Pope for usurping Lordship over the world is taken tardy for doing the like himselfe over All England contrary to S. Peters rule alledged by the Prelate 180. 93. What assistance Lawfully sent Pastors and Teachers have ordinarily of God 180.181 95. The Prelate selfe-condemned ibid. 98. The Prelate belyes the Scripture to credit his Church-Tradition 182. Scripture little heholden to the Prelates Church-Tradition ib. His bold belying the Scripture as if that gave Authority to his usurped Church-Tradition ib. The Prelate catcht in his own Delemma or Net ibid. A Solecisme of the Prelate ibid. 100. The Prelate maliciously yoakes the precise party as he calls it with the Jesuite onely making that 10 times worse 183 184. The precise party with the Prelates factious silence Ministers vindicated from his wicked and false reproches 184 185 186. The Prelates 3 marks of his imagined Author of Ipswich Newes 186. The Prelates hypocriticall words and desperate deeds for Preaching how they agree and his cursed hypocrisie cryed shame of by his infamous practises 187. The Prelate knows not what true Preaching meanes 188. Difference between true Sermons and the Preachers for infallibility ibid. The Prelates Diabolicall malice against the true Preachers of Gods word 189. The Replyer at length forced by the Prelate to answre his compari-tween the Ancient Fathers and the best moderne Reformed Dison be vines for Preaching 190 191. Other Cavils of the Prelate answered 192 193. 104. The Prelate perverteth the Fathers to uphold Tradition still which they were against to the Prelates sense 194 195 196. Prelates Popish pretence of Scriptures deepnesse to draw men from them to seek to the Oracles of the present Church Tradition 196 to 199. With the mischiefes that may follow upon it ibid. The Prelates Popish zeale noted by occasion in his forcing all Bibles to be bound with Apochrypha 196 197. How the Prelate overthrows a true Principle and Maxime by a false 198. Grace makes Supernaturall truth more evident then Nature doth the Naturall 199. 106. Another excellent discourse of Saving Faith occasioned by the Prelate bewraying his profound ignorance herein 200 201 202. The Prelats bold belying and blaspheming Gods secret Councels 202. The Prelates broad blind Popish way 203. Fully confuted 203 204. 109. Prelate againe blasphemeth in belying Gods Councels 205. 1â—6 The Prelate hangs the Credit of Scripture upon mans opinions of Gods sufficiencie ibid. Mans opinion of Gods sufficiencie how vaine blind and impotent 206. The Prelate himselfe proved to have a blind opinion of God and of his Sufficiencie and consequently he is an Infidel not beleeving the Scripture to be Gods word 207 108. as which saith he depends on mans opinion of Gods sufficiencie 111. The Prelate still detracts from Scripture all along 208. 113. By the Prelates Doctrine the Faith of all the Apostles Martyrs ancient Fathers and Doctors which know no such Tradition of the present Church as a necessary prime inducement to lead them to the beliefe of Scripture to be Gods word is Hereticall and Schismaticall 206 210. Ergo the Prelaticall Church Schismaticall and Hereticall 115. Most notorious blasphemy of the Prelate against the Holy Ghost making him the Author of falshood as is shewed 211 212 213 214. Sundry probable Reasons layd down by the Replyer why the Prelate should as he doth chuse the light of nature as the Second to his Church Tradition to introduce beliefe of Scripture to be Gods word and of God to be God 212 213. No reverend perswasion of Scripture had till first the Tradition of of the present most Reverend Father commend it as Laudable 212. How the Prelate dallies with Romish Idolatry 211. How the Prelate hangs mans beliefe of God as of Scripture upon his Church Tradition 212. 116 The Prelates good inclination to mans free-will in beleeving The Prelates notorious and grosse hypocrisie pretending respect to the Scripture to be the motive of his tedious vain groundlesse and gracecâ—ssâ— discourse in disgracing and vilifying of it altogether and that as gâ—osly as ever any â—esuiâ—e did 215 216. The Prelaâ—es most wickâ—d perverting and abusing of Scripture 216 Wâ—o are his Christianly dâ—sposed men whom in his Discourse he â—ndâ—avoureth to satisfie ibid. 118. A nimble shift and put off of the Prelates 217. The absurbity of his Comparison of his
shall set forth to the contrary I must crave pardon if it be not of the same faith with you And thus farre you allow any in the Church of England this liberty for your words are Is it not lawfull for any in the Church of England to say I conceive thus or thus of it c Although you adde L. p. 51. It is one thing to hold an opinion privately within himselfe and another thing boldly and publickly to affirme it P. I doe I confesse boldly and publickly affirme this my faith concerning this Article which my faith I doe assure my selfe is true being grounded upon good and cleare evidence of the Scripture on which my faith is built and not upon any thing of humane Authority And in making open confession of this my faith I doe therin follow the Rule of Scripture which saith Bretheren if any of you doe erre from the Truth and one convert him Let him know that he which converteth a Sinner from the errour of his way shall save a Soule from death and shall hide â— multitude of Sinnes Now what know I that this Declaration of my Faith with Reasons from the Scripture may by Gods grace be a meanes to convert if not your Lordship from your errour yet others or may preserve them from falling into it being dangerously entred into it by such an example as your selfe And however if it be lawfull for you boldly and publickly to affirme such things of beliefe which are not found to be in Scripture why may it not be as lawfull for me boldly and publickly to affirme the Contrâ—ry But the Scope of your Speech as I conceive is to maintaine your practise in punishing in High Commission such as expound this Article by and according to the Scripture L p. 53. For that all the Positive Articles of the present Church of England are grounded upon Scripture we are content to be judged by the joynt and constant beliefe of the Fathers which lived within the first foure or five hundred yeares after CHRIST when the Church was at the best and by the Councels held within those times and to submit to them in all those points of Doctrine P. But first as is before noted as you give accasion why have you made your Articles to be DÃpsucoi of a double sense So as in that respect how can you call them Positive being so perplexed in themselves And againe Whom doe you meane here by Wee I suppose you and your church of England You are contented to be Judged by Fathers and Councels within the first 500. yeares whether your Church-Articles be grounded on Scripture or not Are you contented so indeed Then you must be contented to undergoe the Censure of departing both from the judgement of the Scriptures as disavowing them for the onely rule of Faith and Doctrines to be tryed by and also from the joynt and constant beliefe both of Fathers and Councels within the first 500. yeares For their joynt constant and unanimous beliefe was that nothing besides the Scripture is to be Judge in matters of Faith And if you want leasure to read the Fathers doe but peruse the learned Discourses and Disputes of the Divines of the Church of England before your being a Prelate as Dr. Carleton of the Church De Ecclesia Dr. Whitakers forementioned Dr. White his way to the true Church Dr. Bilson yea and all those that have written of these Controversies and they will abundantly show this that it was ever held as a Principle and therefore not to be denyed nor needfull to be proved and which Dr. Carleton in his said Book proves never to have been altered till in and by the Councel of Trent That the Scripture is the sole rule of Faith But thus you and your Church of England are contented to be one and the Same Church with Rome in refusing the Scripture as the Sole Iudge of your Doctrines But will you be judged by the joynt and constant beliefe of Fathers and Councels within the first 500. yeares whether your Articles about Grace Election Predestination c. bearing as you Declare a double and opposite sense in their Pelagian and Arminian sense be according to the Scriptures or no If I name onely Augustine who was Pelagionorum Malleus that Hammer to knock down the Pelagians both the Fathers and Councels within those first 500. yeares did joyntly and constantly professe that which he writ to be the Beliefe of the whole Church it was so clearely and fully proved out of Scripture In so much as you may read in the Histories of the Councels as in Binius how that some Councels and Bishops of Rome set downe Large Passages in Augustins Tracts against the Pelagians as the Jugement of the Catholick Church and the particular Decrees and Acts of such and such councels If then you will stand to the Judgement of those ancient Fathâ—rs and Councels then you must at their Barre hold up that hand which was a chiefe instrument in drawing up the said Declaration which hath so enigmatized and darkened the Articles as they have no other Light left but a kind of twilight which inclines rather to the night then to the day rather to favour the Pelagian Heresie then the Orthodox verity But this being your language all along that you put not onely your Articles and the Articles of the Creed but the Mysteries also of the Scriptures to the Iudgement of the Primitive Church Fathers Generall Councels we will Supersede from speaking more of it in this place Again where you say that the Church was then at the best if you understand it during the age and time of the Apostles 't is most true but if of the Succeding ages within 500. yeares we may doubt of it or rather resolve the contrary unlesse you meane it comparatively to the ages after that wherein Antichrist and the Mystery of Iniquity began more brightly to shine forth and display themselves in the Roman Sea both in corruption of doctrine and of Gods worship beyond all excesse For you may know that within the space of the first 500. yeares the Church was so overgrown and pestered with the heresie of Arius as the world groaned under it wondering it was become an Arian as Hierome speakes Totus ingemuit mundus miratus se factum esse Arianum And among many corruptions and much unsoundnesse in Doctrine what multitudes of Superstitious devises and heathenish Customes not onely crept but crowded into the service of God Which Heathenish Rites as we find in B. Rhenanus his Annotations upon Turtullian were by the Christians in a kind of carnall policie admitted both because many ancient men being converted to Christianity such as it was could not easily part with their old Customes as also that thereby they might draw other of the Gentiles to become Christians Just such a policie as our new Doctors I meane of your Church of England have used in a pretence at least making us beleeve
that coming as neare as you can to the Papists in their Ceremonies you shall thereby bring them to the Church And surely this is the ready way either to bring Papists to your Church or you to their Church But I say the Church was so pestered with Rites and Ceremonies even in Augustins dayes that he complained that Christians were now in a worse case and condition under the Gospel then the Iewes were under the Law for though their yoake was grievous yet those Leviticall rites were of Gods owne ordaining and commandement but Christians saith he are brought under an intolerable yoake of Ceremonies of mens devising and imposing But now on the other side if I should enter into a Comparison between the Reformed Churches since Luther and those Primitive and ancient Churches as aforesaid I know it would be very tedious to your Lordship and extremely move your Patience especially if I should by many degrees preferre Calvin Bezâ— Zanchius Iunius and many hundred more Worthies both for learning and piety and chiefly for Soundnesse in Doctrine in the Reformed Churches beyond the Seaes yea and not a few on this side as Cranmer Ridley Latimer Hooper all Martyrs Iewel Whitakers Reynolds Perkins with infinite more and all within one Century before such as those Centuries aforesayd produced whose Names for Envy-sake I forbeare to mention Lastly you say you are content to submit to them in all those points of Doctrine If you be then for Shame cleare away those Cloudes which the said Declaration hath over-cast your Articles withall and cast away your Arminian Pelagian sense and take off your Suspension of them and let them speak one single truth as they formerly did and as all understood them according to the Scriptures L. p. 62. The Catholicke Church we beleeve in our Creed to be the Society of all Christians P. What you beleeve is one thing But we beleeve the Catholicke Church of Christ in the Creed to be the number and Society of all the Elect as the next Article expounds it The Communion of Saints but not that Company of all Christians which you name and meane Christians in name and profession tag and ragge pell mell good and bad Papists and Protestants of which the greatest number are no true living members of the true Catholick Church the mysticall body whereof Christ is the Head and which by Faith onely we apprehend for we beleeve the Holy Catholicke Church but cannot discerne with our bodily eyes as we doe a visible Object This is that Church which Christ loved for which he gave himselfe that he might sanctifie and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word to present it to himselfe a glorious Church not having spot or wrinckle or any such thing but that it should be holy and without blemish This we beleeve to be the Holy Catholicke Church and no other But thus indeed as you tell us before you make wider the Gates of the Catholicke Church then ever Christ made them or rather indeed you exclude the Catholicke Church of Gods Elect and set up a new Catholicke Church which may be seen but ought not to be beleeved L. p. 66. Agreed on for me also it shal be that Gods word may be written and unwritten P. Agreed on with whom Even with no lesse then Bellarmine For in the very next words you give us the reason why it is agreed upon for you that Gods word may be written and unwritten For Say you Cardinall Bellarmine tells us truely that it is not the writing or Printing that makes Scripture the word of God but it is the Prime unerring Essentiall Truth God himselfe uttering and revealing it to his Church that makes it Verbum Dei the word of God Doth Bellarmine say so And that truely And to what end I pray you doth the Cardinall say so Is it not to overthrow the Scripture for being the Sole word of God and to bring in another word of God which he calls verbum non Scriptum an unwritten word that is a word besides the Scriptures and equall to the Scriptures which is Romes unwritten Traditions And to this end and purpose Bellarmine using these words doth he tell you truely and is this the reason for which it is agreed on for you that Gods word may be written and unwritten Now though it be true that that which is spoken by God is his word though it be not written yet to us there is now no other word of God but that which is written that which is contained in the Scriptures And this word written is that alone which our Faith is grounded and settled upon According to that of Iohn Many other Signes truely did Iesus in the presence of his Disciples which are not written in this Booke But these things are written that ye might beleeve that Iesus is the Christ the Son of God and that beleeving ye might have life through his Name So as we are not to inquire further what Christ spake or did besides what we find written But your Lordship tells us before of certaine Traditions Apostolicall which it seems are that word of God which may be unwritten For you say If the Scripture be a Foundation to which we are to goe for witnesse if there â—e doubt about the Faith and in which we are to find the thing that is to be beleeved as necessary in the Faith we never did nor never will refuse any Tradition that is Vniversall and Apostolicke for the better exposition of the Scripture And to this place you referre that which you say pag. 58. As for Tradition I have said enough for that and as much as A. C. where 't is truely Apostolicall From which words first we observe that you make but an If of the Scripture as a Foundation If the Scripture be a Foundation and If in it we are to find the thing that is to be beleeved as If it were to be found in any thing else And Secondly how home you come to A C. the Jesuite in admitting Tradition Apostolicke to expound any doubt about the Faith and so with Bellarmine you are agreed for a word of God unwritten as well as written And you further adde here pag. 66. Speaking of the Scriptures their being written gave them no Authority at all in regard of themselves Written or unwritten the Word was the same But it was written that it might be the better preserved and continued with the more integrity to the use of the Church and the more faithfully in our memories So you Now 't is true that by the writing of the Scripturâ—s Gods word contained therein is preserved continued in integrity and the more faithfully kept in our mâ—mories But is thiâ— all Nay the very writing of them though it added no Authority to Gods word in regard of it selfe yet as the Scriptures are to us Gods word is of the greater Authority because written For we acknowledge no other word of God as
your 16 th Sextion mentioned before which continueth from p. 59. to 116. wherein are sundry passages â—o this purpose whereof the last was one and the rest we shall touch as we meet with them And here I cannot though I said I would no more wonder but admire that such Speeches should flow down so fast from the Sea of Canterbury which is a mighty Catarrhact or distillation of the eye drowning the sight and flowing from such an abundant humour in the head as it is like to turne into a Dropsie possessing and putrifying the whole body which if not prevented by some remedy from hâ—aven must needs prove Epedemically mortall You are the first Antagonist of Iesuites that ever uttered such things and you might well have given them leave to utter such base Speeches of the holy Scriptures as more proper for a Jesuite then one pretending the Faith of a Protestant But the difference is not great nor matters is much which of you be the mouth having all one Spirit and being all one and the Same Church So as being the Metropolitan of that Church which with Rome is one and the Same you have the greater priviledge to speake in the language of that pregnant Mother who is so full of the names of Blasphemy against the word of God Now is not the Scripture so demonstratively evident in it selfe as to enforce assent What then shall doe it Probable Arguments from the light of Nature But Nature is blind as we shewed before of naturall Reason And againe how can that which is but probable confirme that which is truth For the Scripture is Truth it selfe As Christ saith Thy word is Truth Now there being strictly no proportion between Probability and Truth how can the Light of Nature which you say is but probable confirme that which is truth And we shewed also how the Naturall man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God which things are contained in the Scripture But you adde Arguments from humane Testimony confirme the Scriptures to be Gods word That which is but humane cannot strengthen that which is Divine I receive not the Testimony of man saith Christ. So the Scripture is so farre above humane testimony that it can receive no strength from it no more then God can receive strength from the creature Gods word from mans word And the Scripture being Gods written word is above Mans bare word As Christ tells the Jewes who took Christ for a meere Man If ye beleeve not Moses his writings how shall you beleeve my words Thereby implying That Writings the Scripture are above mans words Againe humane testimony in Comparison to Gods word is but a lye For every man is a lyer Moreover in saying The Scripture is not evident enough to demonstrate it selfe to be the word of God and to enforce assent but being strenthened by Probable Arguments from the light of Nature and of humane Testimony 't is then wilfullnesse and pride to suspect it Here you set the light of Nature above the word of Grace probability above Truth humane Testimony above Divine Man above GOD. For Christ tells us that the Scriptures beare witnesse of him And you Say the Scriptures are not sufficient witnesses of themselves and so consequently of Christ without mans testimony So as hereby you disable the Scripture as being an incompetent witnesse of Christ because not evident enough in themselves without humane Testimony So as how you can cleare your selfe from blasphemy I see not But this is but one degree For you adde The light which is in Scripture is not light enough it cannot beare sufficient witnesse to it selfe Now you open your mouth a little wider to blaspemy But we shall have yet more of ths Suffe out of your Wardrobe Of which I may say this by the way That you bewray how grosly and palpably blind you are in discerning the Scriptures glorious brightnesse being like that Woman in Lipsius who being blind her selfe blamed the house she was in for being very darke So you because you are blind your selfe the god of this world having blinded your eyes therefore you blame the holy Scriptures of GOD for being darke not bright enough to to beare witnesse to it selfe Why Surely all light is Sui index sui Communicativum it is a witnesse to it selfe that it shineth So as all in the house doe see it yea though it be but the light of a Candle as Christ saith If therefore the Scriptures have not so much light in them as all may see it to shine forth then they have no light at all For if there be any light at all it will shew it selfe But this you will not stick to tell us anon that the Scripture hath no light in it selfe and therefore no mervaile if here you say the Light that is in it is not bright enough And you tell us here also That the Testimony of the Holy Ghost ordinarily is not so much as considerable in this Question Why What is the Question Is it not how or by what meanes we beleeve the Scriptures to be the word of GOD Is not this the Subject Question of this whole 16 th Section and which you handle throughout And this being so have you forgotten what you told us before of this beliefe that the Scripture is the word of GOD Namely that faith is the gift of God of God alone and an infused habit in respect whereof the Soule is meerely recipient and that the sole infuser is the Holy Ghost and Till the Spirit of God move the heart of man he cannot beleeve And now doe you come and tell us The Holy Ghost ordinarily is not so much as considerable in the Question Yea but here you tell us this is not the Question What then Namely how the Scripture may be proposed as a Credible Object fit for beliefe And for this you set us downe a rule of Proposall which must of necessity take its rise from the Tradition or Authority of the Present Church Whereof we shall heare more anon But by your leave this is not the Question but the other For this your manner of Proposall you put it not as a Question but as an a'Ãtema a Question begged not to be argued and disputed upon as the nature of a Question is to be but you doe dogmatÃzein obtrude and force upon us a novell opinion of your owne devising without proofe of Reason Argument or Authority from the Scripture And therefore we deny your Question or Position as Heterodox or a Paradox contrary to the truth of God word which is the onely rule of determining all Questions in Divinity about faith whereof this is not the least How or by what meanes a man comes to beleeve the Scripture to be the word of God Now for the determining herof you would tye us to the one only manner of Proposing the Scripture as a Credible object fit for beliefe and that is necessarily to
the well-beeing of a Christian. A true Christians life is full of affliction more then other men For this he hath the greatest need of comfort Now wherein hath a Christian most solid comfort Surely in the Scriptures David a man of afflictions can tell us this by his own experience Remember Lord Saith he the word unto thy Servant wherein thou hast caused me to hope This is my Comfort in my affliction for thy word hath quickned me And v. 52. I remembred thy judgements of old ô Lord and have comforted my selfe And v. 54. Thy Statutes have been my Songs in the house of my pilgrimage Gods word is that which supports Faith in prayer to God in affliction As v. 76. Let I pray thee thy mercifull kindnesse be for my coâ—fort according to thy word unto thy Servant And v. 80. Let my heart be sound in thy Statutes that I be not ashamed And v. 92. Except thy Law had been my delights I should then have perished in my Affliction And that excellent Psalme which Aug. so much admires and not without cause calling it Magnificum Psalmum it is his own word is full of such meditations and consolations grounded upon Gods word And the Apostle also sheweth this where he saith Whaâ—soever things are written aforetime were written for our learning that we through patience and comfort of the Scriptures might have hope Now how could a Christian in affliction comfort himselfe in the Scriptures had he not a full demonstrative knowledge by Faith that the Scripture is Gods word and therefore all his promises therein are most true and in Christ yea and Amen I say a full demonstrative knowledge by Faith which is ' élenkos the demonstration of things not seen as before Not that this full demonstrative knowlâ—dge in â—aith hath in it the full perfection of Degrees which is not attained in this life but it is such a full demonstrative knowledge such a sure trust and confidence in God according to his word such a hope in his Promises in Christ that although his â—aith be sometimes assaulted with temptations of feares and doubtings arising either from infirmities and corruptions within or from Satans suggestions without yet the beleever sticks closse and will not let go his hold but as Iob saith though God kill him yet will he trust in him Then then being so your assertion is very bold and blasphemous in saying God in his Providence hath kindled in the Scripture no light for that namely full demonstrative knowledge wherof we have made sufficient demonstration to the contrary And your own next words will confute you for you say He requires our faith of it and such a certain demonstration as may fit that Doth he so And what is that faith but wherin there is such a certain and demonstrative knowledge as gives a man full assurance that the Scripture is the word of God And this is that faith which God especially râ—quireth in hiâ— people as without which they cannot beleeve unto righteousnes and confesse unto Salvation But this is not that faith with its certain demonstration which you mean For as you adde yours is such a faith as is begotten of Reason and ordinary Grace which is ever the burthen of your Song where the soule is morally prepared by the Tradition of the Church Of which enough before Neither can your morall faith probably perswaded by your Tradition ever become to be élegkos a demonstrative assurance that Scripture is Gods word So as hereby you overthrow both the beeing and well-beeing of a Christian and leave him stript of all means and hope of Salvation and consolation by the Scripture L. p. 88. Hooker gives a very sensible Demonstration It is not the word of God which doth or possibly can assure us that we doe well to think it is his word For if any one Book of Scripture did give testimony to it yet still the Scripture would require another to give credit unto it So that unlesse beside the Scripture there were some thing that might assure c. And this he acknowledgeth saith Buerly is the Authority of Gods Church Certainly Hooker gives a true and sensible Demonstration P. First for your Author here alledged he was we all know not onely a Creature but a Champion for your Hierarchy and Ceremonies And besides that his Book was guelt in some things before it could have its passeport to travaile abroad However as you say of Others so I of him he was but a private man And if you take his words to be the Doctrine of the Church of England you may seeing the Jesuite doth so approve of it as also your selfe doth Well let Hookers words be so as you alledge them yet give me leave to detect in them a mixture of some absurdity and some impiety together As in these words It is not the word which doth or possibly can assure us that we doe well to think it is his word And so in that sense which is the onely sense a sensible man and sound Christian can make 't is true that the Scripture neither doth nor possibly can assure us that we do well to think onely it is his word For as the Scripture cannot lye so it cannot assure us that we do well when we come short of our duty as in thinking which is but opinion when we should beleeve which is Faith For the Scripture requires a firme Faith in us and approveth not of thinking as sufficient But now for his sensible Demonstration which is this That if any one book of Scripture did give testimony to all yet still the Scripture would require another to give testimony to it and so we can never come to assurance this way I answere The Scripture is a compleat body in it selfe and every part of it an uniforme and homogeneall member to the making up of this body So as the Scripture is to be taken first in the whole lumpe or body as bearing full witnesse to it selfe and every part or Book of Scripture hath a witnesse in it selfe and for it selfe and for the rest too there being such a sweet and full harmony in the whole and all the parts Gods Spirit speaking and breathing in it as the Animall Spirits in mans body moving the whole and every part and shewing that it is Gods word And we must never in this notion fever the Spirit of God from the Scripture his owne word which it filleth in every part as the life-blood doth the veines So as there is not a Book of Scripture wherein the Majesty of GOD and his Wisdome and Goodnesse and Righteousnesse and Holinesse doe not in some degree more or lesse shine forth And Mr Hooker might as well have reasoned thus It is not the whole frame of mans body that can perswade us that we doe well to thinke that it is a mans body for though one member by its motion doth beare witnesse to the rest that they are
parts of mans body yet still that member wants other members to beare witnesse unto it that it is a part of mans body As if every particular member of mans body by its inherent proper motion were not a sufficient witnesse not onely to all the rest of the body that it is a living and true organicall body of man but also to it selfe that it is a true living member of this body Or as thus It is not the whole frame of heaven and earth that can assure us that we doe well to thinke that God made all the world for if any one Creature should give testimony to all the rest yet still that Creature would require another Creature to give testimony to it that it is one of Gods Creatures and so we should never come to any pawse to rest our assurance this way that God created the whole world heaven and earth and all the Creatures therein Now what is there besides the Creature that can assure us of this What The Authority of men or the Tradition of the whole world No for By Faith we come to understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God so that things which are seen were made of things which did not appeare Now whereupon is this Faith grounded Surely on the word of God and confirmed abundantly by the whole frame of heaven and earth and all the Creatures therein not one of them but having a stampe of the Creator upon it to assure us that it is his Creature And how doe we come to be assured that this word of God is contained in the Scripture By the Authority of the present Church Doth Hooker Say so Had you Said The Ancient Church as the Jewes in witnessing for the Old Testament and the Ancient Apostolick Church in witnessing for the New you had said Somthing As also if you had put the Ministry of the Word for the Authority of your present Church For as we said before the Ministry of the Word is Gods own voyce which commends unto us the Scripture as the word of God This is Gods owne ordinary meanes to bring men to Faith and not the Authority and Tradition of I wot not what present Church And now against Mr Hookers sensible Demonstration as you call it I will oppose another Demonstration which is not onely sensible but most true as proving that the testimony of Scripture to be the word of God is in the Scripture it selfe First Paul in the Epistle to the Romans witnesseth that unto the Iewes or Israeliets under the Old Testament were committed the Oracles of God those Oracles were contained in all the severall Bookes of the Old Testament which the Jewes kept intire and inviolate without the mixture of Profane Books And of this Scripture Paul speaketh and testifieth saying All Scripture is given by inspiration from God And Christ himselfe giveth testimony of the Old Testament saying to the Jewes Search the Scriptures for in them ye think ye have eternall life and they are they which testifie of me And what those Scriptures were the Jewes knew well enough for they were deposited with them and they kept them as their chiefest treasure And Peter also gives testimony to the Old Testament saying of it that Holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost speaking of the Scripture expresly in that place in the former verse And To Him give all the Prophets witnesse Thus the New Testament gives testimony to the Old that it is the word of God And I hope you will not except against this testimony as insufficient Againe the New Testament gives witnesse to it selfe that it is the word of God Peter witnesseth of Pauls Epistles that Paul wrote them according to the wisdome given unto him that is the Holy Ghost And Christ said to Peter I have prayd for thee that thy Faith faile not Yea He sent the Holy Ghost to all his Apostles that should lead them into all truth Ergo what they preached and wrote was the Truth and word of God And Christ made all his Apostles his witnesses who in all their writings beare-witnesse of him both of what they saw and heard and so their record left in writing is true See Luk. 1.2 1 Joh. 1.3 3 Joh. 12. And none writ the New Testament but either Euangelists or Apostles all indued with the Holy Ghost And the Wisdome of Christ reserved his beloved Disciple Iohn as the last surviver of all the rest to write the Book of the Revelation and to conclude as the New Testament so the whole Bible with that Charge If any man adde to this Book or take away from it c. as shewing that the whole and intire Scripture was now compiled and consummate I might be copious in this point But I will summe up all this The New Testament gives testimony to the Old that it is the word of God also to it selfe one Book to another one Apostle to another who were all witnesses of Christ Christ and the Holy Ghost to all the Apostles all their writings being guided by the Spirit of Truth and giving joynt witnesse unto Christ and to the truth of the Gospell Yea and the severall parts beare witnes to themselvs As 1 Cor. 14.37 If any man think himselfe to be a Prophet or Spirituall let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the Commandements of the Lord. And 1 Pet. 5.12 I have written brieflly exhorting and testifying that this is the true Grace of God wherein ye stand And Joh. 20.31 These things are written that ye might beleeve that Iesus is the Christ the Son of God and that beleeving ye might have life through his Name So 1 Joh. 1.3 4. 2 Joh. 5. 3 Joh. 12. And we also â—eare record and ye know that our record is true And as the New Testament doth every where beare witnesse both to the Old and to it selfe both in the whole and every part even by the Spirit of God that speakes and breathes in the whole and every part So the Old Testament in like manner beares witnesse both to it selfe and to the New Testament and that by many Types and Prophecies all which are fulfilled in the New So as these two Testaments are as Ezechiels Wheeles one within another the New Testament being the Old revealed and the Old the New veiled Or they are like the two Cherubims both looking towards the Mercy-Seat which is Christ the Summe of them both the Old looking upon him as he was promised and to come the New as he is now exhibited and come Thus we have here a full true and evident Demonstration that the whole Scripture gives testimony to it selfe that it is the word of God And yet you Say That Truth it selfe cannot say that Scripture it selfe can doe it But you adde L. ibid. That Scripture cannot beare witnesse to it selfe nor any one part of it
of the New Testament L. p. 123. Even that Scripture of the old Testament was a light and a shining light too therfore could not but be sufficient when Tradition had gone before P. What told you us but now of misleading the Jewes by leaning too much upon Tradition and do you goe about the same way to mislead them blind as they be and to make them yet more blind if possible That you have gone to mislead Christians Doe you tell the Jewes now that the old Testament is sufficient when Tradition had gone before So as without Tradition preceding no sufficiency in the Book I perceive you will not yet have done with your Tradition as without which nothing is done L. p. 125. Certaine it is that by humane Autthority Consent and proofe a man may be assured Infallibly that the Scripture is the word of God by an acquired habit of Faith Cui non subest falsum under which no error nor falshood is but he cannot be assured Infallibâ—y by Divine Faith cui subesse non potest falsum into which no falshood can come but a Divine Testimony And a little after If you speake of Assurance onely in Generall I must then tell you a man may be assured nay Infallibly assured by Ecclesiasticall and humane proofe Men that never saw Rome may be sure and infallibly beleeve that such a City there is by Historicall and acquired Faith P. Although you use here a Schoole Distinction Cui non subest falsum cui non potest subesse falsum Of Faith Historicall and Faith Divine Assurance generall and Assurance particular yet in truth in the upshot it will appeare you speake very Confusedly as in the Babylonish Dialect or Phrase For first you attribute Infallibility to your acquired habit of Faith wherein is no falshood which habit of Faith you oppose to Divine Faith wherein no falshood can be whereas Infallibility in its genuine or Gramaticall sense importeth impossibility of Error or falshood For infallible is that which is not subject unto error which cannot be deceived So as you doe under correction very much mistake in applying your Schoole distinctions Non subest non potest to Infalliblity I remember indeed that the Schoole-men apply this Distinction to Faith Cui non subest cui non potest subesse falsum but never to Infalliblity for that is alwayes such Cui non potest subesse falsum which cannot be deceived Look a little better in your School-men and I beleeve you will find it so as I say Secondly while you would seem to put a Difference between your acquired habit of Faith which you expresse and instruct to be Historicall and Divine Faith which you say is onely to beleeve the Scripture to be the word of God you doe bring both ends together making your Acquired Faith and Divine Faith one and the same kind both Historicall Onely Historicall Faith may differ respectively to the object Humane or Divine For it is an Historicall Faith that beleeves there is such a City as Rome in which respect it may be called Historicall Faith humane and it is an Historicall Faith that beleeves the Scriptures to be the word of God in which respect it may be called Historicall Faith Divine Divine I say respectively to the object but being in kind the same Historicall Faith with the other whose object is humane And you tell us before that ordinary Grace and a morall perswasion upon the necessary previous Authority and Tradition of the present Church works this your Divine Faith All which reacheth no further but to an Historicall Faith call it what you will acquired or divine And your building this your Faith upon the Rise of humane Authority and morall perswasion how ever you use the ingredience of ordinary Grace by naming of it yet you are not able to say whether this Historicall Faith be an habit infused or acquired though you never so much daube it over with Divine Onely thus you give us occasion to take notice what an accute School-Divine you are at least so farre as a distinction or two will goe which rather confound then distinguish But admit you could demonstrate and make it plain unto us that your ordinary Grace what ever it is and a morall perswasion puts a speciall difference between your Divine Faith and Historicall yet to what purpose will all this prove May not both these Faiths be found in wicked men and Reprobates however distinguished by divine ordinary Grace and the like The Schooles have a knowne Distinction much more proper and sensible and agreeable to the truâ—h of Scripture then those you bring and so apply For speaking of the Difference between ordinary common Graces and those peculiar to the Elect they call the first Gratia gratis data Grace freely given meaning Ministeriall Graces which God freely gives as well to the wicked as to the godly he gave as Royall KarÃsmata or Graces to Saul as to David and Apostolicall Graces as well to Iudas as to Peter And this Grace Thus freely given is grounded on those words of Christ freely you have received freely give But that peculiar Grace which God freely gives too but onely to his Elect is distinguished from the other being called Gratia gratum faciens Grace makeing us acceptable unto God according to that of the Apostle According as he hath chosen us in him c. haveing predestinated us c. To the praise of the Glory of his grace wherein he hath made us accepted in the Beloved Or that Being justified freely by his grace c. Now ordinary and Common Grace being freely given of God to whom he will good or bad depends not upon humane Authority as a necessary inducing Cause Yet you make your present Church Authority which is but humane a necessary previous Cause to ordinary Grace whereby your Historicall or Divine Faith as you call it is wrought in beleeving the Scripture to be word of God and so what ever faire termes you guild this Faith withall it wil be found no better then either meerely humane or at least common unto the wicked and Reprobate which for all this your Divine Faith goe to hell and then the difference is not so great between your Historicall and Divine Faith which you keep such a puzzell about but that a man may without any great hazard winck and chuse Ob. But you tell us before That ordinarily the Scriptures must have Tradition to goe before Therfore that you place not an absolute necessity in it Ordinarily So you once say indeed But so as withall it must be absolutely necessary For you make all other meanes of this beliefe to be deficient without your Church-Tradition leading the way As for the Scriptures those have not light sufficient for themselves and are as a candle that must first be lighted before it can give light and that is by Church Authority As for the holy Holy Ghost that works not this Faith but by
Rule of Faith the Scripture Implying that to hold the Scriptures to be the Rule of Faith is one speciall note of A true Church But now you confesse againe that Rome holds not this Rule but as a partiall and imperfect Rule And therefore denying this Rule of Faith she ceaseth to be a pure Church of Christ And which is the more this the Church of Rome doth ex professo solemni Decreto professedly and by solemne Decrees ratified as irrefragable and that under Anathema to be received of all And this is farre more then to doe it by Practise onely And yet in Practise to destroy and overthrow but onely some speciall Doctrines of Scripture though otherwise the Scripture be professed and confessed in this or that particular Church to be the intire and onely Rule of Faith is de facto to disclaime the whole Scripture and to unmake it the perfect Rule of Faith and so thereby such a Church possessing such and such Errors as are Fundamentall that is against the Foundation is fallen from Christ as hath been formerly proved Now if but any one part of Scripture in this or that Doctrine of Christ be overthrown so as therein it is not made the Rule of Faith and this overthrowing such Doctrines being once professed and maintained generally in any one particular Church makes that Church to cease to be a true Church of Christ as not holding the Scripture intirely but professedly overthrowing it in such and such particulars then how much more the Church of Rome professing and maintaining gumne kephale with a whores forehead that the holy Scripture is not the onely Rule of Faith intire and perfect but partiall and imperfect as your Lordship confesseth doth thereby proclaime her selfe to all the world to be fallen away absolutely from Christ and so ceaseth to be a true Church of God And denying the Scriptures to be the Rule of Faith she denyeth the Foundation of the Apostles and Prophets Iesus Christ himselfe being the chiefe corner stone and so is fallen quite from the Foundation Nor onely thus by Addition of another Rule doth the Church of Rome overthrow the onely Rule of Faith the Scriptures but also by denying the selfe Authority of them as also you doe and withall by tying the sense of Scripture to the interpretation of the Church as also you doe at least in difficult places and by holding and maintaining false Doctrines against the Scriptures which overthrow Christ and wherein they will not be regulated by the Scriptures as you also doe in your Altars and forbidding the Doctrines of Grace to be Preached and other things which if the Church of England hold with the Church of Rome and with you you and both your Churches are fallen absolutely from Christ and so cease to be true Churches of God As also your very Hierarchy makes you to be no true Church of Christ were there nothing else as before is sufficiently proved And if you desire any further proofe that the Church of Rome is no true Church of Christ I still referre you to the forementioned Book Babel no Bethel And though you supprest the Book yet ten to one but one of your Hounds will hunt it out for you Next for the Sacraments which is your second Reason you say The Church of Rome holds both the Sacraments as instrumentall Causes and Seales of Grace though they adde more and misuse these Ergo she cannot but be a true Church in Essence For Answere First she holds them not absolutely to be Sacraments but dependently upon the Priests intention which you mention elsewhere And so hath the Councel of Trent defined of the Sacraments so Vega so Bellarmine Secondly if she be sure the Priests intention be not wanting or going a wool-gathering in his Consesecration then she makes the Sacraments to be not Instrumentall Causes of Graces but aitia kúria Principall and efficient working causes of Grace ex opere operato as they barbarously speake by the immediate vertue of the worke wrought So the Councel of Trent also So as they shut out the Holy Ghost from this worke as the Principall Efficient worker and sealer of Grace Thirdly For Baptisme which you make to be an Infallible Marke of that Church to be Christian besides their infinite corruptions of the Element of water which the Apostle calleth pure water with their spittle salt creame exorcismes or conjurations of the Devils insultations and the like they hang the very beeing not onely the vertue of this Sacrament upon the Priests intention which intention of the Priest is so uncertaine as Vega one of the prime Sticklers in the Councel of Trent as aforesaid in his Booke upon the Councel of Trent especially the sixt Session where he treateth of certainty of Faith in Iustification Confesseth that there can be no certainty of Salvation to a man because he cannot be certain whether he hath true Baptisme or no and that in regard of the Priests intention whereof he cannot be certaine So as by this their own Doctrine no one Papist can be sure that he is a Christian and so consequently neither can all the members of that Church severally nor conjunctly the whole Body it selfe be sure whether they or it be Christian or no and so the Church of Rome upon this very ground cannot resolve certainly whether she be a Church of Christ or no unlesse your Testimony will help her out at a dead lift And that not onely in regard of the Priests intention in the Sacrament of Baptisme but also in their Additionall Sacrament of Orders one of these more which they have added to the two So as for default of the Popes intention in ordering of Prelates or of the Prelates invention in ordering one another and in ordering of Priests and of Priests intention in Consecrating their Sacrament of Baptisme as themselves Vega and others do argue the case they are all put to the stagger whether they have in that Church either Priesthood or Sacraments For all hangs upon that weake pin or haire of the Priests intention So as another of their Primipili a Standard-bearer of the Dominicans in the same Councell Dominicus Soto forementioned in his Book de natura gratia saith that Deus in potestate Sacerdotis posuit Populi salutem GOD hath put the peoples Salvation in the Priests power Now all this considered and withall the time when this was made a Decree in the Councel of Trent a matter of 100 yeares agoe and when it was but new and the Pope and Prelates and Priests could not perhaps of a good while learne their lesson perfectly and so get a habit of it but that in all their Consecration of Prelates and Priests still intention was to seek and where it breakes off as in the Pope and Prelates in their Consecration of Orders there followes a meere nullity in succession of the whole Generation of Priests downwards and so through that whole body no Priesthood now no Sacraments
what one wise and honest man did in preventing so wicked a Decree of a whole Generall Councell of many Prelates And assure your selfe were there but a few sound Puritans admitted to your Generall Councel and might have free liberty to speake you would not be able to resist the evidence of Truth which they should bring in as Arelatensis told the Prelates in the Councel of Basil concerning the poore inferiour Priests But if you shall exclude the Puritans and so all Reformed Non Prelaticall Churches out of your Prelaticall Councel Generall how should it be a Generall Councel But I cry you mercy Puritan Reformed Churches are already by you doomed for no members of your Catholicke Church whereof and wherein yours and Romes Church are one and the same and therfore as Heathen they ought to be shut out for Wranglers as they were from the Councel of Trent Another Reason against a Generall Councel being Iudge in Controversies is because all sound and Orthodox Divines both Ancient and Moderne both Forraigne and Domesticke in the Church of England formerly with all the Orthodox Fathers in this point have held professed and beleeved That the holy Scripture is the sole sufficient Iudge in all Controversies of Faith And for proofe hereof What say you to Dr Whitakers Lectures against Bellarmine and Stapleton in this Point Or how do or can you answere any of his Arguments drawn from cleare Scriptures and Testimonies from the Ancient Fathers But it seems you have not been acquainted with him as not once mentioning him in all this For that were besides your Purpose But you will except against him as a Puritan which is a sufficient confutation with one puffe of your mouth And so you doe all honest sound learned Religious Orthodox Divines whatsoever whom particularly to alledge here would but make your stomacke rise and so I passe on to the rest Secondly and Thirdly and againe and againe I deny that the Decrees of Generall Councels bind any true Christians Faith and Conscience so much as to outward obedience to any one Ceremony as before Yea though your Councel Decree according to the Scripture yet jure proprio and absolutely of its own Authority it binds not the Conscience That 's proper and peculiar to the Scripture alone immediatly the onely binding Rule of Faith and Conscience How much lesse doth a Councel bind in a matter of error in a point of Faith This is such an abominable point of Divinity as never any Arch-Prelate of Canterbury since the Reformation and I presume before ever uttered Divinity say I yea Divinity Diabolicall and monstrous Impiety and Antichristian Tyranny to be hissed out by all that beare but the bare name of Christians And this Answereth also to the Fourth which is as full of ridiculous absurdity as of impious folly You hope forsooth that a Councels errors will not be so great as all men shall discerne them That may well be when many thousands take no notice at all of any such Councel Decrees And how many men have not the eyes to discern even the grossest errors How many in the Church of England doe discerne the grossenes and danger of your seting up of your Altars in all the Churches of England as namely that it is a denying of Christ the onely Altar And the bringing in of the Popish Priesthood and sacrifice But what if you could in a Provinciall Councel of Canterbury make a Decree for seting up and worshiping of Altars as you doe and that all men did see the grossnes of it Would the sight of it exempt them from at least externall obedience being once defined in that your Synod And so of a Generall Councel for universall obedience No the knowledge of the grossnes of the error will not serve their turnes to excuse them from obedience For you tell us We must notwithstanding yeild obedience If so surely it were the safest way then for men to close their eyes that they may not see at all and so yeeld blind obedience to your Decrees pinning their soules as I said to the Prelates Innocent white sleeve to be led blindfold to hell then seeing and knowing to sin against their Conscience in yeelding obedience But how ever seeing or not seeing hang or be damned the Decree of a Generall Councel even in point of error in the Truth yea though men know it to be against Gods word must be universally obeyed till evidence of Scripture or a Demonstration to the contrary made the error appeare and untill thereupon another Generall Councel equall to that did reverse it Which may be long enough before all these things concurre What Must the Decree of the seventh Generall Councel the second of Nice for the worship of Images bind all men to Obedience till another Generall Councell equall to that upon Demonstration to the contrary shall reverse it Or must the Decree of the Councel of Lateran under Pope Innocent 3. for Transubstantiation be beleeved and obeyed by all men at least in externall obedience to worship the Altar and Hoast till another Councell equall unto that shall reverse it Or must the Decree of the Generall Councel of Constance for the taking away of the Cup in the Sacrament from the People bind all to obedience till another Councel equall unto that shall reverse it Or lastly shall the Decrees of the Councel of Trent which calls it selfe a Generall Councel ratifying the worship of Images Transubstantiation and the taking away of the Cup wiâ—ing the Peoples nose of it besides all those other damnable and damning errors against the cleare Truth and Faith of Christ bind all to obedience till another Councell equall to that shall reverse it Then certainly all Papists by your sentence are bound to be damned Nay are not you and your Church of England bound to obey all those Decrees of Former Generall Councels as that of the second of Nice for worship of Images not yet reversed by a Generall Councel equall to that though by a Councel at Frankford called by Carolus Magnus Emperour of the West that wicked Decree was condemned But the Decrees of this Councel are smothered and kept in hugger mugger as being outfaced by such a prevailing generallity of unblishing Images and so have lost their place among the Records of the Councels And besides that Councel at Frankford was not for generallty equall to that of Nice under that wicked Empresse Irene Which being so and so that Decree of Nice not yet reversed why say I doe not you obserue your own Rule in obeying that Decree in worshiping of Images Or why at least though you here write somthing against them to some small purpose as coming neare to Idolatry doe you not yeeld externall obedience in doing corporall Reverence to those Images you have set up onely reserving your internall worship and keeping your Faith to your selfe But to satisfie us for that you have over or upon your Altar in your own Chappel at Lambeth
they renounce all such lords Aske them againe why they subject their Consciences soules and bodies to the will and lust of man in will-worship forbidden by the Apostle ô they answere they never knew that before and now that they know it they repent of it and from henceforth they renounce it and resolve to loose rather life and all then they will doe so any longer Thus even a good Christian through ignorance may for a time in a dangerous errour but so soon as he is convinced of it he will not for all the world continue in it So he that hath true saving faith in Christ resting on Christs merits alone for his justification he neither will nor can be brought to beleeve that he must be justified by his works For this is against the very nature of saving faith which rests onely on Christ renouncing all other respects So that 't is impossible that any true member of Christ should by any errour be so seduced as to be seperated from Christ for he is preserved by the spirit of Grace by the power of God through faith unto salvation So that as the whole body of the Church of Christ so every particular member of this body hath the certaine and infallible seale of the Spirit of Truth given him of Christ according to his promise purpose and intention for all truth absolutely necessary to salvation having both his Spirit and word to guide them into all truth Finally 't is very true being taken in a true sence that Christ never intended to leave an infallible certainty in his Church to satisfie either contentious or curious or presumptuous spirits And if not presumptuous spirits certainly not such spirits as usurpe a Prelaticall and Lordly Authority and to sit as visible Iudges of Scripture in Generall Councels imposing upon all men a servile yoake of obedience to their Decrees whether right or wrong true or false Nay to such presumptuous spirits God hath given eyes not to see and hath made their hearts fat not to understand the truth not to see the light that shineth in his word and therfore they say it is darke and speake disgracefully of it So as the presumptuous is properly yours As for the contentious and curious these are they that contend for the truth against your undermining and oppugning of it and are curious â—o search and sound the bottome of that Mystery of Iniquity which is cunningly yet grosly enough folded up in the voluminous leaves of this your Booke So as for these so contentious and curious Christ did intend to leave an Infallible certainty in his Church to satisfie them and to assure them of the Truth so as not all the opposition and contradiction in the world can beate them from it To the Tenth you make no matter of it if Generall Câ—uncels erre in one or a second or a third so it be not in things necessary In other cases it makes no matter if they erre And what matter is it then if there be none of your Generall Councel at all For you confesse that they may possibly though not easily erre in things necessary and in fundamentall points of Faith and yet obedience must be given If then it be no matter if in other things they erre onâ—e twice thrice yea or if you will in a hundred things take all these together and the world should be free from many dangers if it were rid of Generall Councels altogether But in the meane time you make no matter of it if in so erring they load the world with an intollerable burthen of errours which all men must bow their necks under till another Generall Councel doe free them and perhaps in stead of freeing them may lay as much more load upon them Truly my Lord if you had not a liberty to talk with your pen what you please and a strong opinion also that whatsoever you write or speake must needs be of every body highly applauded as if all you write were Oracles you would never have suffered such foule blots to have dropped from your pen. But 't is no matter If you erre in this and that and another c. aswell as your Generall Councels so as we knowing them may not in obeying or assenting erre with you To the Eleventh you say for necessary faith to salvation we have the Scriptures Creeds 4 first Generall Councels So then being furnisht of necessaries what need we any more I think the Apostles rule for temporall things may hold well in spirituall he saith having food and rayment let us therewith be content So Having all things necessary for faith to salvation let us use these well and bâ— content not affecting to be loaden with a multitudo of humane devises which Prelaticall Councels Courts and Canons put upon us And are Generall Councels so Cheape as that you should keep such a doe having no Necessaries to trouble them withall But it seems you have some other necessaries besides those of faith that will require a Generall Councel For you tell us pag 211. The setling of the Divisions of Christendome as the reconciling of England with Rome the making of Canons which must bind aâ—l particular Christians and Churches cannot be concluded 〈…〉 but there to wit in a Generall Councel Why but there For the Church of England you may doe what you please onely you desire perhaps a Generall Councel to conclude for Altars and other utensils and so ease your shoulders of the envy and crime of Innovation but for that also you have a sufficient put off as is shewed before But the reconciliation and setling of the Divisions of Christendome will conclude all But still the Scripture with you is not alone sufficient for necessary faith to salvation without the Creed and at least the 4 first Generall Councels Why was the Scripture before there were any either Creeds or Councels And was not the Scripture then alone sufficient for all things necessary to salvation The Creeds and Councels are not to be added to the Scripture as if without them it were not an absolute and compleat Rule As for the Creeds they were for the summe and substance of them extracted from Scripture and must still be reduced to Scripture for their true sense and interpretation as before And for the Decrees of the 4 Generall Councels we approve of them no further then the Scripture warrants them And therfore though Twelfthly you humbly submit to the Scripture as it is interpreted by the Primitive Church and Generall Councels and not els yet we submit our faith onely to the Scripture as it is interpreted by it selfe and by the spirit of Christ speaking and breathing in it which by the Scripture interprets the Scripture unto us as Augustine doth well observe in his Second Book de Doctrina Christiana And herein you shew your faith not to be Divine but humane as which you submit not meerly to the Scripture but unto the Iudgment of men as
the same honour that you give to the Saints which they represent as divine honour to the Crosse and Crucifix as they teach as we have shewed Is not here a full and home contradiction to the Scripture For Contradiction is not onely in an expresse Negative but in an impiâ—â—â— Negation when such and such a Doctrine doth necessarily imply a contradiction to the Scripture And in this kind all the Doctrines of Popery whereof we have given sundry Instances before are direct contradictions to the truth of the Scriptures L. p. 340. It doth not follow since the Councel of Trent hath added a new Creed that this Roman faith is now the Catholick For it hath added extravea things without the foundation disputable if not false Conclusions to the Faith So that now a man may beleeve the whole and intire Catholicke faith even as St. Athanasiâ—â— requires and yet justy refuse for Drâ—sse a great part of that which is now the Roman faith P. Is it so then Hath the Councel of Trent added a new Creed and so Roman faith is not now the Catholicke but to be refused as drosse extraveous false without the foundation How then doth this agree with that faith which even now you confessed that the Church of Rome had and hath the saving Faith that One Faith of the Apostles as whereby a Papist living and dying in that Faith may be saved And if Rome hath added a new Creed how holds she still that one Faith And do not you beleeve Romes new Creed For what is this Creed That the Roman faith is now the Catholicke How is this then a new Creed That Romes faith is now the Catholicke For say you it hath added extravious things without the foundation Disputable if not false conclusions to the Faith Is this all Parâ—urient Mâ—ntes I expected here some monstrous evidence against the Church of Rome when you began to tell us she had brought forth a new Creed But this your Rumor will not be taken for a Creed without some sounder proofe then we see you yet bring for all your faire florish For what 's this new Creed Alas a poore Cento patcht up of certaine extravious things What without the Foundation Good enough yet so long as nâ— Canon against the Foundation or a mine of Powder to blow up the foundation Onely without the foundation Alas that 's not worth the talking of If the new Creed be of things onely without the foundation you may leave them out of your Creed as things not necessary to be beleeved or at least not to be beleeved of all Christians alike as you teach us before and Bellarmine too that All things de fide are not necessary to be beleeved of all men or are not necessary to salvation And perhaps Bellarmine means Romes new Creed you speak of which though the Councel of Trent hath made it to be de fide yet it is not necessary for every man to beleeve it or not absolutely necessary for every mans salvation But what more 2. Disputable As you sayd before Disputed Quâ—stions Disputed and Disputable still Ergo what can you make oâ— such a Creed at the worst but some disputable matter not yet sufficiently discussed though determined in the Councel of Trent and sit perhaps to be reserved to be determined upon some clearer demonstrations in your next Generall Councel whose Decrees then true or false shall be received as your Creed And as we said before things Disputable may yet prove to be truth being throughly scanned and thus Romes neâ—â— Creed may prove as Credible as you call it disputable But any more yet yes if not false conclusions If Which receiving a faire interpretation from your mouth may be all one as if you had said Nâ—t false Conclusions because as yet Disputable And while things are but disputable and in dispute they are as yet no false Conclusions For the Premisses of the Argument must goe before the Conclusion But yet your Conclusion is somwhat 〈◊〉 For you say A man may beleeve the whole and intire Catholick faith and yet justly refuse for drosse a great part of that which is now the Roman faith What Drosse And Iusâ—ly refuâ—e as Drosse What are you that man that may doe thus And will you doe thus Nay you for your part have bound your hands from taking any thing as drosse which Rome hath put in her new Creed For those things even the worst of them you say are disputable Therfore not yet concluded and determined for Drosse And if you shall now take those things for drosse which with you are but disputable how can you justly doe it For if mettall be in dispute among the râ—siners it is not presently doomed for drosse being yet in their best judgements but disputable the Test must first try it whether it be drosse or not And so it is the Test or the Testaments of Christ that must try all false mettals shine they never so gold like and discover and condemne them for Drosse And surely my Lord your single judgement through never so singular will never be taken by any as solid enough to preponderate the Decrees of a whole Councel as Trent to conclude those Decrees to be Drosse both after you have called them but disputable and after Rome hath Decreed them for her new Creed But you goe no further yet then Posse a man may take them c. And you may in time come actually to take those disputables for no Drosse but good Currant Coine not onely passing for Currant in Rome but also in England as holding the same Creed and being one Church So as a little more Allay then Ordininary shall not disable the currantnesse of it And what is there in all Romes new Creed of Trent which you say is of things Disputable which is any worse drosse but rather as good silver as those her Altars and oâ—her superstitions which you have borrowed of her Which were they but soundly disputed would prove drosse indeed as formerly also is proved Againe here you confine the whole and intire Catholicke faith to Athanasius his Creed You might have at least taken in the other two Creeds to boot and yet not all of them together will make up the adequate Rule of the whole and intire Catholicke faith For the Catholicke faiths full latitude whole and intire cannot be measured but by the line and Rule of Scriâ—ture alone The onely túpos didâ—kus as the Apostle caâ—ls 〈◊〉 the Matrix or Mold wherein faith must be cast 〈◊〉 to receive its perfect forme which is not cannâ—â— be whole and intire but as it is according to the whole and 〈◊〉 Scripture conformed And you adde L. p. 3â—2 No man can properly be said to beleeve the whole Creed that beleeves not the whole sense as well as the letter of it and as intirely P. Now you told us before that Rome hath lost the sense of the Creed at least in some things
and their Successors the true Ministers of the Gospell who by their preaching declare who have their sinnes pardoned and who not So as your colouring over your usuall evasion of the Papists about their merits which they say are not absolutely meritorious of themselves but as being dipped and dyed in Christs blood whence they receive the tincture of merit But as the merit of Christ is altogether immanent in himselfe and not transient to us but onely by Imputation through faith and not by any infusion or inherencie as Papists teach So the power of Priestly Absolution is so proper and peculiar to the Person of Christ that it is not communicative or derivative to any Creature No not I say to the Leviticall Priests who otherwise were Types of Christ. They onely offered sacrifices for sinnes but as Types and which could never take away Sinnes as the Apostle speakes And their Office was to discerne and judge of the Leprosie and to pronounce a man cleane or uncleane according to those signes and markes which God himselfe gave Now Leprosie was an Embleme of Sinne. And as those Ministers of the Old Testament did with the Leprosie namely pronounce or declare it onely to be or not to be So the Ministers of the Gospell are to declare unto beleevers the pardon of sinnes by those signes and markes which God hath set in his Word and to impenitent persons condemnation except they beleeve and repent But for power of Absolving men from Sinnes as to Say Thy Sins are forgiven thee that 's Christs voyce alone Never any of the Apostles used this voyce to any Thy Sins are forgiven thee but as Peter said to those that were pricked in their hearts and asked Men and Bretheren what shall we doe Repent saith he and be baptised every one of you in the Name of Iesus Christ for the Remission of Sins But to Say I absolve thee from thy Sins or Thy Sins are forgiven thee is onely his who can give Repentance and Faith These two Prerogatives are inseperable in Christ as Peter sheweth Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour for to give Repentance to Israel and forgivenesse of Sinnes and we are witnesses of these things Saith he Now if you can prove that Christ hath made you Such Princes and Saviours as to give you a power which Symon Magus would have bought with his money to give Repentance to any man then I will without any more adoe confesse that you have also a power to forgive Sins Otherwise not till then by your assumed and usurped Priesthood and presumptuous yea blasphemous forgiving of Sins I Absolve thee you deny Iesus to be the Christ the onely Christ to wit the onely Priest who onely hath merit and power as to give Repentance so remission of Sins to whom he will And thus as you take upon you to be a Priest both by your profession and practise you are an Antichrist For who is a lyer but he that denyeth Iesus to be the Christ He is Antichrist Saith the Apostle Iohn Secondly neither were it any great difficulty to prove that you Prelates and that according to your owne Doctrine in many places of your Book do deny Iesus to be the Christ to wit the onely Prophet of his Church For you allow no beliefe that the Scripture is the voyce of Christ the Prophet except the voyce and Tradition of the present Church doe first usher it in And this Church must alwayes be meant of a Prelaticall Church No question of that And for Exposition and Sense of Scripture you deny that the Scripture it selfe and of it selfe hath sufficient light as at after we shall see at large and therefore you referre us either to the Exposition of the Primitive Church or the Decisions of Generall Councels for the right Sense of the Scripture Thus you doe akurōsa as Christ saith or make voyd and of no authority the voyce of Christ by your Tradition Nay you Say also That if a Generall Councel should Conclude and Decree an Errour yet all men ought to yeeld obedience at least externall thereunto till another Generall Councel equall to that shall reverse and correct it And by the way what if it shall make it worse or adde more Errours to it But thus doe you not deny Christ to be the onely Prophet of his Church of whom God Saith Heare Him Him onely His Word onely His Voyce onely when you do not take his Word to be light enough and to be sufficient to interpret it selfe but that you must have recourse to Generall Councels consisting of Prelates as your Oracles to decide all doubts and controversies of Faith Doe you not thus attribute a greater light to men then to the voyce of Christ GOD Saith of Christ that Prophet Heare him in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you but you say In all doubts and controversies of faith heare what a Generall Councel Saith yea though it determine Errours yet all men are bound to yeeld obedience thereunto Thus the expresse voyce and cleare word of Christ that Prophet must depend upon Men and those an Assembly of Prelates or Priests which Christ never ordained in his Church and not men upon It. And so in this respect also denying Christ to be the onely All sufficient Prophet to instruct and establish his Church in all Truth while you deny his word to be Autópistos and Autà rkes of selfe-Credit of it selfe to be beleeved and selfe-sufficient to shew and interpret it selfe you prove your selfe an Antichrist For who is a lyer but he that denyeth that Iesus is the Christ He is Antichrist Your Grace therefore is an Antichrist But I come to the third Instance to which I confesse I thought to have confined my selfe and not to have touched the other two in this place though they be no lesse proper then this which is That you Prelates both by Profession and Practise as you are Prelates doe deny Iesus to be the Christ in that you deny him to be the onely Lord and King of his Church For what is for Christ to be the King of and over and in his Church but as to exercise his Almighty power and Fatherly care and Spouse-like love in protecting and preserving his Church from all evills in comforting her in the midst of afflictions in supplying her with all necessary Graces and Blessings and in vindicating the cause of his People against all their Persecuters and Oppressors So also in bearing a Speciall Kingly Rule in and over their Soules and Consciences in all things concerning Faith in the Worship and Service of God So as the people of God doe and ought to acknowledge Christ herein their onely King and not to suffer their consciences to be captivated and insnared by any ordinance of Man whatsoever in point of faith and ceremonies in Gods service injoyning a necessary conformity thereunto 'T is Christs Prerogative alone in
one of these either expresse word of God or evident consequence â—ut of it And a little before Every wrangling Disputer may neither deny nor doubtfully dispute much lesse obstinately oppose the Determinations of the Church no not when they are Dogmata deposita Deposed Principles P. Now all these Passages weighed together do clearely and distinctly resolve themselves into these Conclusions 1. That the Church may decide and determine some things without any evidence or so much as a probable Testimony of holy Writ and herein you consent and jumpe fully with that notorious Papist and adversary of the once Church of England Stapleton whom the learned Dr. Whitakers publickly confuted in the Divinity Schooles in Cambridge as his Works can yet testifie And yet behold now the Church of England hath got a Champion in the Chaire of Canterbury who pleads for and applauds that in Stapleton which Dr. Whitakers and many other learned Divines in England formerly have refuted And for further Confirmation hereof you tax Bellarmine as of untruth where he confesses that nothing may be certaine by certâ—inty of Faith unlesse it be contained immediately in the word of God or be deduced thence by evident consequence Whereupon you inferre that if nothing can be certaine then certainly no Determination of the Church it selfe wanting expresse word or evident Consequence out of it Thus you condemne Bellarmines true Saying if by the Word of God he understand the Scriptum alone and not his word unwritten and approve and preferre Stapletons false and hereticall sentence before it Secondly That things so decided and determined by the Church without either evident or so much as probable Testimony of holy writ yet are so de fide so firmely to be beleeved as every wrangling Disputer may neither deny nor doubtfully dispute much lesse obstinately oppose Consonant hereunto you â—ay at after pag. 224. The Determination of a Generall Councel â—â—ring is to stand in force and to have externall obedience at least yeelded to it till evidence of Scripture or a Demonstration to the Contrary make the errour appeare and untill thereupon another Councel of equall Authority do reverse it And so also pag. 226. c. Where here I mention for clearer proofe of what you say here but not to anticipate or prevent our fuller Answere when we come to those places where we shall supply our brevity here L. p. 40. I hope A. C. will not tells us there 's any Tradition extant unwritten by which particular men may have assurance of their Severall Salvations P. But what think you of it Will you tell us there is no such thing written in the Scripture That true Beleevers may have assurance of their owne Salvation But if there be why doe you forbid Preachers to meddle with it considering the true and solid comfort which it bringeth to him that hath it As the 17 th Article confesseth might it be suffered to speake out and had you not put a gagge in the mouth of it L. p. 43. Mine is That the beliefe of Scripture to be the word of God and infallible is an equall or rather a preceding prime Principle of Faith wâ—th or rather to the whole body of the Creed P. How The Belief of Scripture to be Gods word and infallible no more but an equall or rather a preceding prime Principle of Faith with or rather to the whole body of the Creed This is yours you say your Saying And I beleeve it to be yours For it is as like to one of your Sayings as may be For here you attribute no more credit to the Scriptures then to the Creed both equall onely differing perhaps in point of some precedencie of time or So with an or rather equall or rather preceding the difference not great if any Thus doe you not equall a Church Tradition with the Divine Scripture For we have it by Tradition that the Apostles compiled the Creed and each his Severall Article And is this or any other Tradition of equall Credit with Scripture And is not the Scripture the Rule whereby the Articles of the Creed are to be interpreted which are no otherwise to be beleeved but as they are agreeable to the Scripture So as for the Purpose if you goe no further for the Sense of the Article of Christs Descent into hell then the very Letter of the Article you can make no Sense of it nor give any reason for it And how then can you give a reason of your Faith in this particular Except you do beleeve it because you do beleeve it and because the words are He Descended into Hell But of this more by and by L. p. 44. Some Traditions I deny not c. to be Apostolicall but yet not fundamentall in the Faith P. You might do well to point out unto us which be those your Apostolicall Traditions that we may distinguish them from those Traditions which Rome calls Apostolicall Or rather perhaps you admit of all those as Apostolicall indeed but yet not Fundamentall Surely if you can prove them to be truely Apostolicall namely that the Apostles delivered them immediately to the Church by word of mouth why are they not fundamentall in the faith Why are not all bound to beleeve them or give as much Credit to them as to the Articles of your Creed which you Say are fundamentall in the faith L. p. 45. The Church of England taketh the words He descended into hell as they are in the Creed and beleeves them without further Dispute and in that Sense which the ancient Primitive Fathers of the Church agreed in P. Here a Question may be moved 1. In generall Whether a man taking up a matter upon such trust as he gives equall beliefe unto it as to the Scriptures themselves doe not therein Sinne damnably As making that a fundamentall ground of his Faith which is not found to be in the Scripture Secondly in particular Whether a man resting in the very Letter of the Article He descended into Hell beleeving thâ—reupon as surely as he beleeves that God is in Heaven that Christs Soule did locally descend into Hell among the damned there having no regard at all to what the Scripture Saith of it whether the Scripture Say any such thing or no doe not hereby make way for his owne Descent into Hell Or thirdly Whteher you do as verily and firmly beleeve Christs Descent into Hell as you doe his Ascent into Heaven Seeing the Scriptures Speakes clearely and expresly of this but not so of that and whether you are aâ— much bound to beleeve his Descent into Hell because you find such words in the Creed as his Ascent into Heaven because you find it in the Scripture Now for Answere to all these together I conceive that to make any thing of the necessity of Faith to Salvation besides what is found in the Scripture is Sinne and in particular to beleeve that because it is Said in the Creed He Descended into Hell therefore Christ
begin at the Tradition or Authority of the present Church or els there is no dealing with you But what if we shall propose a better manner and way of propounding the Scripture as a Credible object fit for beliefe And this we shall doe God assisting overthrowing your false way and vindicating the onely right and true safe and sure way that will certainly lead us to this beliefe That the Scripture is the word of God And for a ground hereof I lay down the Contradictory of your words for my true Position which is this That the light which is in Scripture it selfe is bright enough it can and doth of it selfe beware sufficient witnesse to it selfe For proofe hereof The Scripture is the witnesse of Christ as is said before and a witnesse must be a sufficient and competent witnesse without all exception els 't is rejected Now the Scripture is without all exception it is a holy true and faithfull witnesse free from all vice or defect It is pure and perfect so as it needs nothing to be added to it So Salomon Every word of God is pure Adde thou not unto his word least he reprove thee and thou be found a lyer Adde thou not Ergo it is a most perfect and competent witnesse Againe as the Scripture is every way a Competent and sufficient a perfect and Compleat witnesse without all exception So it brings full and cleare Evidence with it for that whereof it is a witnesse For this Salomon saith All the words of my mouth saith Wisdome are in righteousnesse there is nothing froward or perverse in them they are all plaine to him that understandeth and right to them that find knowledge The Scripture is plaine cleare and evident So Peter saith Ye have a bebaâ—oterón tòn prophetikon logon a most sure word of Prophecie whereunto you doe well that ye take heed as unto a light that shineth in a darke place The Scripture then is a most sure witnesse and it is a light that shineth The light is not in it as the fire in the flint but it a light shining forth as the light of the Sun Thy word saith David is a Lamp unto my feet and a Light unto my path And The entrance of thy words giveth light it giveth understanding unto the Simple The very first entrance or gate as the word signifieth of Gods word doth illuminate and give light it giveth understanding to the Simple the rude and ignorant it enlightneth the eyes Now all this could not be without a light that shineth and that clearely too such as upon the first entrance of it giveth light and understanding to the simple But how comes this light of the Scripture to shine forth I Answere First of its own proper nature Let but an unregenerate Man read the Scriptures and he shall feele such a Convincing light in them as he will perceive there is a Divine power in them But this light of Scripture by Gods owne appointment shines forth more bright and is more effectuall when it is preached Of this the Apostle saith If all prophecy that is preach the word of God as in that place and there come in one that beleeveth not or one unlearned he is convinced of all he is judged of all And thus are the secrets of his heart made manifest and so falling down on his face he will worship God and report that God is in you of a truth Now whence is all this Conviction and Confession but from the power of Gods word preached So Heb. 4.12 The word of God is quicke and powerfull and sharper then any two edged Sword piercing even to the dividing asunder of Soule and Spirit and of the joynts and marrow and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart This this is that that dazleth mans clearest reason convinceth and confoundeth his Conscience and as a mighty Engine batters down and layes levell Strong holds and all high things that exalt themselves against the knowledge of God bringing into Captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ as the Apostle speakes And is Gods word the Scripture preached in the power and purity of it a discerner of the thoughts and intents of mans heart Then let that man tell me whether without any more testimony this be not the very word of God And that there is in it Theiónti a divine Spirit and power that thus can search into the inmost bowels and secrets of mans heart So as as the Samaritan woman said to her neighbour Come and see the man that hath told me all that ever I did is not he the Christ So a naturall man thus convinced and confounded by the power of Gods word and Secrets of his heart discovered may he not now truely report and say Come and heare that word which hath discovered unto me all the Secrets of my heart must not that needs be Gods owne word So as this Discovery is it not by that native operative effectuall and resplendent penetrating lihgt shining in the Scripture the beames whereof are displayed in the Ministry of this word of God what is it then that enforceth and even extorteth this assent and confession from a naturall man but the cleare evidence of Gods word preached that the Scripture is the word of God which is so preached And to bring this a little neerer home and set it closse against your owne Gate What Say you my Lord for I must deale plainly with you seeing you are so bold with the Scripture will you be tryed by this word of God whether it have not sufficient Light in it selfe and of it selfe even to convince your owne heart and Conscience that the Scripture is the word of God I say in and of it selfe without all those circumstances which you put as necessary previous inducements to this beliefe whereof your Church Authority is ever the Prime Will you be content but to make tryall of your selfe in this Case How is that Why doe but once come into some obscure poore Parish Church where there is a good Zealous and Orthodox Preacher and come disguised as Ahab at the Battell of Ramoth Gilead in a private manner not in your Pontificalibus with your long Sattentraine carried after you et magna comitante Caterva a troope of gallants at your heeles So as none takes notice of you much lesse the Preacher and come your selfe in person not sending your tà o'ta your Long Eares I meane your Scouts and Spies Informers Promoters Priests or Pursuivants Delators and Sycophants for these will seldome tell you the truth of things But I say come your selfe in a private disguise and so stand muffled up in the Croud and hearken diligently to the Preacher first how he doth o'rthotomein tòn lógon divide his text aright as it were anatomising and ripping up the bowels of it and then how fitly he grounds his docttrines or points of Instruction upon his
your Authority and Commendation should be brought to read the Scriptures and therein should find many Prophecies and among the rest how there should come False Prophâ—ts being Wolves in Sheeps Clothing pretending holinesse but Persecuting Gods Saints pretending Religion but oppessing Gods word pretending to be Christ vicâ—royes but tyrannizing over his people and such as should Apostatise from the Faith and set up Doctrines of Devils as in abstinence from certaine Meates and Marriage at certaine times and how Christ and his Apostles were humble and despised the world being crucified unto it and how they which were proud pompous Lords claiming to be their Successors follow none of their steps neither in diligent preaching nor practise of a holy life are such Antichrists as the Scripture hath foretold and how in the last dayes perillous times should come when men should be Selfe-lovers covetous boastors proud blasphemers unholy without naturall affection implacable covenant-breakers false accusers incontinent fierce despisers of them that are good Traitors heady high-minded lovers of pleasures more then lovers of God Having a forme of Godlinesse but denying the power thereof with many other like things which when they come to compare with the State of the present times and especially of the present Church and chiefly of the Prelates themselves and shall find most of these Prophecies fulfilled in these present times they will certainly hereupon conclude that these be those last dayes and perillous times wherin these things so long agoe foretold doe clearely shew that certainly the Scriptures are the word of God The next thing I note here is that you Say a man so probably led must compare the Scripture with it selfe and other writings What other writings I pray you shall he compare the Scriptures with Shall humane writings light him a Candle to shew him the Sun shining at noon day But thus humane testimony comes in for a Second Inducer And for all your previous inducement you must still at last joyne some thing of man with Scripture Well what 's the third Ordinary Grace And this with the Authority of the present Church may beget in a man an ordinary beliefe that Scripture is the word of God As it seemes such ordinary Grace brought King Agrippa to beleeve the Prophets to be the word of God yet for all that he was but almost perswaded to become a Christian. And this Ordinary Grace is it seems that Holy Ghost which you told us of before The Fourth is morall inducement Well admit this bring him to a morall beliefe or opinion The Fifth is a reasonable perswasion by the voyce of the Church Well what theâ— After all this the Scripture gives greater and higher reasons of Credibility to it selfe then Tradition alone could give Here 's then the upshot of all as we noted before you by these steps advance the Scripture to a Credibility So as all this while you have walkt the round and gone in a Circle and end just where you began for you began at Probability and end in Credibility whereas the Scriptures were credible at least that is such as might be beleeved before you taught this new way to come to the beliefe of them So as this your Conclusion comes to just nothing Only you seem to attribute some thing to the Scripture being assisted with those other inducements wherein it surpasseth your Tradition alone Which is such a comparison and commendation as you could not devise the like to abase the Credit of the Scripture But to conclude What a Tedious Dispute you make here with the Jesuite about that which when you have done all you can will never bring a man upon any sure grounds so much as to beleeve that the Scripture is the word of God much lesse to bring him to Saving faith in Christ. But what doe I speake of Saving faith Alas that 's no worke for your pen. You are for a Scholasticall Dispute here which is so jejune and barren that many Scholasticks would hisse it out of their Schooles much more Divines out of the Divinity Schooles as indeed nothing pertaining to true Divinity but to a Spoyling through Philosophy and vaine deceit as the Apostle Speakes But the summe of all your inducements the Prime whereof must necessarily be your present Churches Authority amounts to this That men being by a bond of necessity tyed to this your Church as without which he cannot come to beleeve Scripture to be Gods word and without this beliefe no faith of Salvation and your Tradition with all other helps cannot bring a man to that beliefe when all is done the Conclusion is that according to your Tradition no man can come to be Saved So as thus by this your new Doctrines you overturne the Foundation of Faith by the very roots leaving no footing for faith to stand upon whereby a man may have any hope of Salvation But I shew'd you before a short and sure way for a man to come to this beliefe and not onely so farre as to beleeve the Scripture to be the word of God but to beleeve that he hath his part of Salvation in that word And this way is by hearing the word of God preached For Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God And this faith being the Saving faith in Christ as it apprehends all the Promises of God in the Scripture to be true and to belong to him so it comprehends the beliefe of Scripture to be the word of God And this this word of God preached and heard is that voyce of the Church of Christ or rather Christs owne voyce in the Church calling men yea and instrumentally causing Gods Spirit effectually working in and by the word to beleeve unto righteousnesse and to confesse to Salvation whatsoever is written in the Scripture to be most true as being the word of God himselfe And besides this true Christians in all ages never beleeved and Authority Tradition voyce of men simply to be any necessary prime inducement to beleeve so much as the Scriptures to be the word of God L. p. 84. That divine light which the Scripture no question hath in it self is not kindled till these helps come Thy word is a Light So David A Light Therefore it is as much a manifestation to it selfe as to other things which it shewes but still not till the Candle be lighted not till there hath been a preparing instruction what light it is till Tradition of the Church and Gods grace put to it have cleared his understanding So Tradition of the present Church is the first morall motive to beleeve P. These words confirme your former with a little illustration A divine Light here you confesse to be in the Scripture But you meane some dimme Light At the best not bright enough not sufficient to shew it selfe to be the word of God And here That Light whatever it is is not kindled till these helps come 'T is but a
to another it is grounded upon Nature which admits of no created thing to beare witnesse to it selfe and is acknowledged by our Saviour If I beare witnesse of my selfe my witnesse is not true that is is not of force to be reasonably accepted for truth P. Though the Scripture as it is considered in the written Letter be a Creature yet the matter of it the Light the Truth the Authority and Evidence of it is meerly Divine as wherein God hath imprinted and expressed his Divine Nature Counsell and Will So as as is said before we must never abstract the Scripture from that Spirit of God which is alwayes in it and with it as a cleare and sufficient witnesse of it and as the very life and Soule of it Whereas you with the Papists take the Scripture for no other but as a bare Letter or barke of a Tree or dead Corps without any Divine Spirit in it But you aledge Christ Saying of himselfe If I beare witnesse of my selfe c. You must know that Christ here speaks as the Jewes took him for no other as a meere Man But take him as Christ God-man in one Person and is he not a'utâ—pistos worthy of himselfe to be beleeved And what Saith he when the Pharisees objected unto him Thou bearest record of thy selfe thy record is not true Though I beare record of my selfe yet my record is true Saith he For is not Gods record true And againe v. 17. It is written in your Law that the testimâ—ny of two men is true I am one that beare witnesse of my selfe and the Father that sent me beareth witnesse of me So may the Scripture say Though I beare record of my selfe yet my record is true for the Father speaketh in me and Christ speaketh in me and the Holy Ghost speaketh in me and all these joyntly beare witnesse in me with me and to me that I am the word of God And in the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established And hereunto might I adde the many Divine and Admirable works and effects which the word of God produceth all which beare witnesse abundantly that the Scripture is the word of God Why what works what effects doth it produce Yea what not It enlightneth the eyes it quickeneth dead Soules it is that great Engine of battery that subdueth the world unto Christ. It is the sharpe two-edged sword lively and mighty in operation c. it is the mighty power of God to Salvation it is to all men the sweet savour of God the savour either of life unto life or of death unto death Loe my Lord what think you now of this Word Is it trow â—ou onely a dead letter being of such a Divine and Spirit-full efficacie as no word of man is or can be And here might I bring many negative proofes to shew it cannot be the Word of Man But let this suffice I will passe on L. p. 89. No man can set a better State of the Question then Hooker doth his words are these The Scripture is the ground of our beliefe the Authority of man that is the name he gives to Tradition is the Key which opens the doore of entrance into the Knowledge of the Scripture P. We have already answered sufficiently that the Scripture is both the Garden wherein all the pleasant Flowers and wholesome Fruits of Paradise are planted and grow which are of that beauty fragancie sweetnesse and relish as he that beholds them smells to them and tasts of them may easily discerne they are not of a terrene or earthly nature Non vox hominem sonâ—t and it selfe is the Key that lets in those that will to tast of her Fruits which I say when they once tast they will Say This is none other but the Garden and Paradise of God even the Word of God This is that Key of knowledge for the taking away whereof Christ denounceth a Woe to the Pharises And that by this Key is not meant Tradition is plain seeing the Pharisees did not take away Tradition but they exalted it so farre as therby they made the Word of God of none effect Is this the Tradition that you call the Authority of Man and so highly commend which the Pharisees used for no other Key but as a false Key or picklocke to robbe the Scripture of their Divine Authority But if you understand by Tradition here the Delivery of the Scripture from hand to hand to be kept as a Depositum by the Church of God thus the Scripture is a rich Cabinet full of precious Jewels together with the Key or Spring-lock so united unto it as it is a part of the Cabinet and so deposited with the Church of God as by the Ministry and preaching of the Word the Key is turned and the Cabinet unlocked the Key being no other but of Gods owne making and appointing and so the Cabinet thus opened and man looking into it his eyes being also opened by the same Key there he finds that goodly Pearle of the Kingdome and that rich Treasure which to purchase he goes and sells all that he hath But suppose now for all this we should either grant your Lordship such a Key as Prelaticall Authority whereby you assume a power of opening an entrance to men to read the Scriptures when the Key is once in your hand what if you should prove so closse fisted and so churlish a Keeper as not to suffer them to come to read the Scriptures as you have done in not suffering them to heare them preached on the Lods dayes at least in the After-noones As also in so keeping fast under Locke and Key those precious Jewels of the Doctrines of Gods Grace as aforesaid as the Ministers themselves may not come at them once to touch them So as it might prove a dangerous thing and too suspicious if you had such a Key of Authority or the Authority of such a Key put into your hand men should rather be shut out from the Scriptures then have the entrance open to goe freely to them when they will But if you will needs perforce wrest this Key as the Preaching of Gods word out of the hands or from between the teeth of Godly Ministers as you have done we have no remedy but to complain to the Lord of the Vineyard and pray him to vindicate his Key out of such Hucksters hands and to force you to give up your usurped false Keyes L. p. 91. Could the Pope and his Clergie put this home upon the wâ—â—ld as they are gone farre in it that the Tradition of the Present Church is Divine and Infallible how might they and would they then Lord it over the Faith of Christendome contrary to S. Peters Rule whose Successors certainly in this they are not P. Thus you confesse there is or may be a Lording of the Clergie over the Faith of Christendome or Christians contrary to S.
Peters Rule But you restraine this to Romes usurped Infallibility as if without this she could not Lord it over Christendome How comes your Lordship then with your Hierarchy to Lord it over the Soules and Consciences of Gods people even over all England that other world You disclaime your Church-Authority and Tradition here to be Divine and Infallible By what Authority then doe you Lord it over all England Certainly Divine Authority you have none for it And as you Say of Rome so I doe to you Certainly you are no successors of the Apostles in this as both hath been and shal be more shewed And because you cite here that place of Peter what think you of it Doth it not condemn all kind of Lordship over Gods heritage As Lordship over mens Consciences in captivating them to humane Ordinances as Ceremonies in Gods worship As Lordship over Ministers forbidding them to Preach Gods word both how farre and when you please As Lordship over the very Commandements of God in dispensing with them as in the 4 th and 5 th Commandement Or Lordship over mens Soules as touching their beliefe and reading of Scriptures as the word of God all which must depend upon a necessity of your present Church-Authority as without which you tell them it is not fit that they should either read the Scriptures or beleeve them to be the word of God Now is Rome so far gâ—n in puting home her Infallibility as therby to Lord it over the greatest part of Christendome Then how farre are you gone in Lording it over the Soules and Consciences of all the People in England and Ministers too in all these particulars formentioned But to proceed L. p 93. The Lawfully sent Pastors and Doctors of the Church in all Ages have had and shall have continuall assistance but not infalliâ—le at least not Divine and Infallible P. Such therefore as are not Lawfull Pastors and Teachers have not continuall Assistance as all Prelates and Priests as you call yourselves But for Lawfull Pastors if they have continuall assistance whence have they it but from Christ And how then is it not â—ivine And if Divine how not Infallible The assistance certainly for so much as it is and in those things wherin it is is no lesse Infallible then Divine For that which is Divine is Infallible as was touched before But because this Assistance Divine is given to every man but in part for we know in part and we prophecie in part and to some in one kind to some in another both to whom and when and how much and to what speciall purpose as it seemeth good to the Divine wisdome but to all to profit withall and for edification as the Apostle speakes therefore it comes to passe that even good men and good Pastors lawfully called may somtimes run into some errours both by reason of humane frailties and infirmities and when they passe the bounds of their peculiar karÃsmata or Ministeriall Graces bestowed upon in this or that kind or measure and doe not keep closse to the Rule Gods word Having therefore gifts saith the Apostle differing according to the Grace that is given unto us whether Prophecie Let us Prophecie according to the proportion of Faith or he that teacheth on teaching or he that exhorteth on Exhortation And yet when we have done all that we can we come farre short of what we should doe Yet all Gods Elect both Pastors and People have Christs promise so farre fullfilled in them and made good unto them by continuall Divine and Infallible Assistance of his Grace and Spirit dwelling in them that they are preserved from all those Errours which might seduce them from Christ as himsefe Saith Math. 24.24 L. p. 95. When Command is for Preaching the Restraint is added Goe Saith Christ and teach all Nations But you may not Preach all things what you please but all things which I have commanded you The publication is yours the Doctrine is mine P. How then dare your Lordship be an Instrument of Restraining and Prohibiting any Doctrine of CHRIST which hee hath in his Word commanded to be Preached and Published to his People How will you answere this be-before that Judge And why do you suborne your Arminian Faction to preach their Heresies out of your dâ—psucoi double minded Articles while you restrain Gods Ministers from preaching the Truth and Suspend them for so doing L. p. 98. Though Tradition and Scripture doe mutually yet they doe not equally confirme the Authority either of other For Scripture doth infaâ—libly confirme the Authority of Church Traditions truly so callâ—d but Tradition doth but morally and probably confirme the Authority of the Scripture P. Then Surely your Church-Traditions make the Scripture but a poore requitall when for an infallible confirmation of them they returne a Confirmation onely morall and probable Can they not returne such as they receive at least in some degree But what be those Traditions of the Church truly so called That inducing Tradition which of necessity must lead men to beleeve the Scriptures to be the word of God But shew us where hath the Scripture given you any such Authority much lesse infallibly confirmed it Or how is this a Tradition truly so called Because you call it so But if Scripture have not sufficient Light to prove themselves to be Gods word what Light find you there infallibly to confirme the Authority of your Tradition And if your Church Tradition doe not confirme the Authority of Scripture infallibly how then Ergo fallibly and deceitfully But probably you Say But probability cannot confirme truth This is a meere Solecisme of yours and any common Aristotelian would hisse it out of the Philosophy Schooles And in a Law-Case a Probable Testimony is not Legall it is no Testimony And will you Say then that the Scripture hath confirmed to your present Church such an Authority infallibly to be a confirming Testimony of the Authority of Scripture which is insufficient and illegall How much the neerer is Scripture Authority for such a Testimony Or your probable testimony doth confirme Scripture-Authority to be probable That 's all and that 's nothing saving that hereby you make the Scripture to be of no Authority at all For first you Say The Scripture hath no testimony of its Authority sufficient in it selfe Secondly that it must first have testimony from the Authority of the present Church and thirdly that this testimony is but probable not infallible Therefore necessarily it followeth that it is but at the most probable if the Scripture have any Authority at all And this is that Goates-haire wherewith you have full stuffed almost 30 of your Folio-leaves as before we have noted And yet the thread of that 16 th Section is not yet cut off or spun out L. p. 100. The Iesuite in the Church of Rome and the precise party in the Reformed Churches agree in this That the Sermons and
proof of the things beleeved How say you then that the maine grounds which prove them are concealed from our view and folded up in the unrevealed Councel of God And what main grounds I pray you be those Can you tell Or doe you speake in the Clouds that you may seem to say something which you understand not For certainly this Mystery of Faith is concealed from your understanding as appeareth by your darke and clowdy words And is that unrevealed councell of God the object of our Faith Cometh not Faith by hearing of the word of God wherein God hath revealed his will to us Or doth the Tradition of your present Church lead you to beleeve such sencelesse speculations Indeed the Apostle saith That in Christ are hid all the treasures of wisdome and knowledge Hid that is layd up and contained as a Treasure But not hid from his true Church and faithfuâ—l people as the Apostle saith If our Gospel be hid it is hid to them that are lost in whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them that beleeve not least the light of the glorious Gospel of Christ should shine unto them And againe Eye hath not seen nor eare heard neither have entred into the heart of man the things which God hath prepared for them that love him But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit But where Search the Scriptures saith Christ for in them ye thinke to have eternall life and they are they which testifie of me so to this purpose the Apostle speaketh excellently Ephes 3.4 5 6. and 1.9.17 18 19 and in many other places But to you it seems these things are hid and folded up and therfore no mervaile you know not what you say nor wherof you affirme As the Apostle saith of some Who were turned aside from Charity out of a pure heart and a good Conscience and of Faith unfained unto vaine â—angling Desiring to be teachers of the Law understanding neither what they say nor wherof they affirme Let therfore the Prophet Esay read you a Lecture Stay your selves and wonder Cry ye out and cry They are drunken but not with wine They stagger but not with strong drinke For the Lord hath powred on them the spirit of deep sleep and hath closed your eyes The Prophets and your Rulers the Seers hath he covered And the vision of all is become unto you as the words of a Book that is sealed which men deliver to one that is learned saying Read this I pray thee And he saith I cannot for it is sealed And the Book is delivered to him that is not learned saying Read this I pray thee And he saith I am not learned Wherfore the Lord said Forasmuch as this people draw neere me with their mouth and with their lippes doe honour me but have removed their heart farre from me and their feare towards me is taught by the Precepts of men Therfore behold I will proceed to doe a mervailous worke amongst this people even a marvailous work and a wonder for the wisdome of their wise men shall perish and the understanding of their prudent men shal be hid Woe unto them that seek deep to hide their councel from the Lord and their works are in the darke and they say who seeth us And who knoweth us surely your turning of things upside down shall be esteemed as the Potters Clay Loe my Lord I hope this word is not folded up if to you it be you shall one day both see and feele it more clearly and sensibly fulfilled But you goe on God in Christ say you resolving to bring Mankind to their last happinesse by Faith and not by Knowledge What by a blind Faith For by Faith and not by Knowledge is all one as to say by such a Faith as is without Knowledge and so without light in it and so blind Wheras the true saving Faith is a knowing Faith it is the evidence of things not â—een it sees him that is invisible as before is shewed But my Lord if the maine grounds be folded up in the unrevealed counsell of God I wonder by what revelation you come to know his secret That God in Christ hath resolved to bring Mankind to their last happinesse by Faith and not by Knowledge surely God hath no where in Scripture revealed any such resolution of his And if it be not written Timeas 〈◊〉 illâ—d as Tertullian forementioned said to Hermogenes the Heretick Feare that Woe to them that shall adde to the Booke of Scripture But if you had leasure to Read the Scripture it reveales unto us plainly what God in this businesse hath resolved to do and how he will bring Mankind to his last happinesse and that is by a seeing not a blind Faith by a Faith explicit and cleare not implicit and folded up by light and not by darknesse This is Gods way that he hath chalked out unto us in the Scripture as before is fully proved of Faith and therfore we are sure that God in Christ in his eternall councell resolved to bring us this way to heaven and no other way And this way is Christ and Christ is light and in this way we must walke as children of the light and not as children of darknesse And every true beleever as he becomes a new man so of a blind man he becomes a seeing man For this cause Christ came the true light that he might lighten every man that comes to him For this cause was Paul sent to preach to the Gentiles To open their eyes and to turne them from darknesse to light and from the power of Satan unto God that they may receive forgivenesse of sinnes and inheritance among them which are sanctified by Faith that is in me saith Christ so that every true Christian in his conversion of blind becomes seeing of darknesse becomes light in the Lord of Satans boâ—dmâ—n Gods serâ—ant and by this way onely through Faith in Christ they receive forgivenesse of sinnes here with sanctification and hereafter the eternall inheritance But as for you my Lord as you have found out another way namely a blind way not by the way of knowledge by which yet you pretend to your last happines so be assured of this that the place you are going unto is just like the way that leads unto it blind and darke yea utter darknesse where the Pit is into which both the blind leader and the blind led shall fall And for your further conviction or else confusion and confutation of your folly and information of your blind Disciples and confirmation of the truth to all the children of truth note what Christ himselfe saith expresly point blanke against you You say God in Christ resolved to bring Mankind to their last happinesse by Faith and not by Knowledge But Christ saith This is the will of him that sent me this God hath resolved on that every one
witnesse to it selfe But this Say you it hath not Ergo not the other Againe you Say pag. 81. Church-Authority must first light the Candle Ergo the Scripture hath no light of it selfe much lesse light enough for faith to beleeve But though it should though it be granted that Scripture had light enough for Faith to beleeve yet light enough it gives not to be a convincing Reason and proofe for knowledge As if you said Neither for Faith for we have proved before that faith and knowledge goe inseperably together true faith being a seeing and knowing faith and not a blind faith The Scripture teacheth no blind faith And why should not Scripture give light enough to be a convincing Reason and proofe for knowledge When it is a sufficient light to discover unto a man the secret thoughts and intents of his heart wherof man himselfe is thorowly convinced and thereby in himselfe condemned of his own Conscience But this knowledge you cannot away withall But you can never put out the eyes of your Conscience though you may for a time fold it or lull it fast asleep Much lesse shall you be able to put out the light of Scripture which is greater then the light of your Conscience As Saith the Apostle If our heart or Conscience condemnes us God is greater then our heart and knoweth all things If therfore the heart or Conscence that is in man be a sufficient witnesse of all his thoughts good and bad and layeth them before him as the Apostle saith much more is Gods word a sufficient witnesse and giveth light enough to be a convincing reason and proofe for knowledge And Solomon Saith The spirit of man is the Candle of the Lord searching all the inward parts of the belly If such then be mans spirit the Candle of the Lord searching all the inward parts of the belly that is all the secrets of mans heart how much more is the Spirit of God in the Scripture his Word such a searcher yea saith the Apostle The Spirit searcheth all things yea the deep things of God And these deep things of God he hath revealed unto us by his Spirit And where but in his word the Scripture is the voyce of this Spirit of God And it was the constant sentence of all the Ancient Fathers whom you would seem so much to adore which Augustine expresseth in these words In Scripturu sacris apertè continentur ea omnia quae necessaria sunt ad Sâ—lutem In the holy Scriptures are clearly contained all those things which are necessary to Salvation Now how should this be true if the Scripture doth not give light enough to be a convincing reason and proofe for knowledge L. p. 113. To prove the Scripture to be the word of God first cometh in the Tradition of the Church the present Church So 't is no Hereticall or Schismaticall beliefe Then the testimony of former Ages c. P. Here at length you come neere the winding up of the long thread of your endlesse Discourse in this your 16 th Section the summe wherof is to prove that the Scripture is of no selfe-credit and Authority And first and last your present Church Tradition must be the Prime hand to lead the blâ—nd to this beliefe that Scripture is the word of God For otherwise the beliefe thereof should be Hereticall or Schismaticall For thus you say To prove the Scripture to be the word of God First comes in the Tradition of the Church the present Church So 't is no Hereticall or Schismaticall beliefe Ergo Beliefe of Scripture to be Gods word comes by any other way as by the word of God it selfe read and heard in the preaching of it and by Gods Spirit speaking in it then wherein the Tradition of the Church the present Church hath been the Prime leader This beliefe is Hereticall and Scismaticall Ergo this beliefe in all the Apostles Martyrs Ancient Fathers and Doctors of the Primitive Ages who never knew any such Tradition of the present Church as whereon this beliefe should depend for its necessary prime inducement was Hereticall and Schismaticall They constantly held till Rome and you brought in this your blind guide to tread down under feet the light of the Scripture and to exalt the Authority of your Antichristian Hierarchy that the Scripture was of self-Authority and Sufficiency to prove it selfe to be the word of God and by the hearing of it preached and read to beget and confirme faith in al beleevers without any such inducement of Church Tradition as you speake of And therefore here you passe your sentence of condemnation of this beliefe in all those forementioned for Hereticall and Schismaticall But how justly may this sentence be retorted upon your selfe and your present Church as both Hereticall and Schismaticall Hereticall as in the maintenance of Doctrines of Devils as afore of the Pelagian and Semi-Pelagian Heresies under colour of your doubtfull Articles of Religion as you have made them by publik Edict and Declaration and flatly forbidding to preach of the Saving Doctrines of Grace as they are clearly layd down and taught in the Scripture and in seting up and maintaining of your Altars whereby the onely Altar Iesus Christ is denyed and in dâ—spensing with the 4 th Commandement yea destroying and unmoralizing of it and so overthrowing the Lords-day-Sabbath wherein you subvert the whole worke of Redemption with the Resurrection and the like thus your present Church is Hereticall as also in this in holding and stiffly maintaining by you a necessity of your present Church-Tradition for the inducing of beliefe of the Scripture to be Gods word as not sufficient and wanting light of it selfe to doe it and which otherwise is of no credit at all Thus I say you are damnably and desperately Hereticall Secondly your present Church is also Schismaticall being a Seperation from the true Church of Christ in your Hierarchy or Prelacy which being altogether â—ntichristian hath no communion in that respect with Christs Church and therfore is notoriously Schismaticall yea in this also Schismaticall that you account and brand that beliefe of Scripture to be Gods word for Hereticall and Schismaticall which is not first induced by your present Church-Tradition wherein you are Schismaticks from the Faith and so from the Church of the Apostles and Ancient Fathers and succeding Churches which never held any such Hereticalll opinion concerning any such insufficiencie of the Scriptures and Authority of the present Church as you most pertenaciously and pernitiously hold Therfore I Conclude that if the present Church of England approve of your Book and hold as you doe it is both Hereticall and Schismaticall But you conclude L. p. 115. So then the way lyeth thus as farre as it appeares to me The Credit of Scripture to be Divine reduces finally into that which we have touching God himselfe and in the same order For as that So this hath three main Grounds to which
all other are reducible The First is the Tradition of the Church and this leads us to a Reverend perswasion of it The Second is light of Nature and this shews us how necessary such a revealed Learning is and that no other way it can be had Nay more that all proofes brought against any point of faith neither are nor can be Demonstrations but Soluble Arguments The Third is The light of the Text it selfe in Conversing wherewith we meet with the Spirit of God inwardly inclining our hearts and sealing the full Assurance of the suffiâ—iencie of all three unto us And then and not before we are certain that the Scripture is the word of God both by Divine and by Infallible proofe But our Certainty is by Faith and so voluntary not by Knowledge of such Principles as in the light of nature can enforce Assent whether we will or no. P First here you make the manner of the way and order of beliefe of God and of the Scripture to be one and the same So as beliefe of Scripture to be Gods word must first be induced by the Tradition of the present Church els it wants credit so beliefe of God to be God must be in like manner and order induced els that 's without credit too This is just as we applyed Tertullians Speech before concerning the Roman Senate which would not alow Christ to be admitted and inrowled in the Catalogue of their Gods aâ— Caesars motion because according to a Decree of the Senate it had not first moved it as the Prime inducing cause whereupon Tertullian saith Ergo nisi homini placuerit â—eus non erit Deus Therefore unlesse it shall please man GOD shall not be GOD. So by your Doctrine here God shall not be beleeved to be God unlesse it come in by the doore of the present Churches Tradition as the sole necessary prime inducer of it How did men beleeved God to be God before this new Doctrine of yours came in to lead them the way was all the world then drowned in a Deluge of Atheisme and Infidelity so it seems Till this light of your present Church Tradition shined in the world it was all as thaâ— Aegyptian palpable darknesse all men sitting all that time and not stirring one foot to any degree of beliefe that GOD was GOD. But come we to your 3 Grounds wherein you summe up all the Totall of all this tedious Discourse in this Section The First is The Tradition of the Church that 's ever presupposed as a Prime principle having the Precedencie before that other Principle that Scripture is that word of God as before Well what doth this Tradition It leads us say you to a Reverend perswasion of the Scripture This is a faire inducement And without this no Reverend perswasion of the Scripture can be had Thus the Scripture must be beholden to your Tradition for a Reverend perswasion of it And who will not have a Reverend perswasion of that which the most Reverend Father in God commends as LAUD able Well let this suffice for that The Second is the light of Nature Well and what office hath that It shews us how necessary such a revealed learning is and that no other way it can be had But your Revealed Learning here is somwhat obscure we cannot well tell whether you mean this your Revealed learning of this your present Church-Tradition concerning beliefe of Scripture or the Scripture it selfe But be it either or both all is one we doe not much stand upon it Let it be the Scripture beleeved to be Gods word by the first necessary Inducing cause Tradition as then which no other way can be had This is then your Revealed learning which the light of Nature shews us how necessary it is How necessary it is that the beliefe of Scripture to be the word of God should be induced by Tradition becâ—use no other way it can be had Of Natures light we have spoken before sufficiently And one noâ—e more resulteth from your words here And that is That forasmuch as natures light is altogether blind in spirituall things and can no more judge of the Scriptures then a blind man of Colours nor discerneth any more light in the Scriptures then a blind man doth light in the Sun when it shineth at noon day and Natures light judging all things according to her carnall sense and having those things in greatest admiration and highest esteem which have the greatest and most glorious outward luster dazeling the eyes of her carnall mindednesse and there being nothing in the world that carries with it a more glorious and glittering show in the eyes of carnall and naturall men then a Hierarch or Prelate Sitting in his Chaire in his Pontificalibus with all heads bare round about him in the Great Hall of his Princely Palace and especially when he sits the supreme Judge in all those Causes brought into his Court and all this glory is accumulated and highly elevated in the light of Naturall mens eyes not onely in respect of all the outward splendor of the Present Church but because of an Instinct of nature in all men concerning Religion and Piety and the Service of God which is â—ed and nourished with a great pretence and profession of holinesse in thâ—se Right Reverent Fathers whose very bare Titles of most Reverend Fathers stike a reverence into all such Naturalists hearts as in children toward their Fathers and much more to their Ghâ—stly Father and which also is highly contented and pleased with the variety of Ceremonies and Pompous Service as most sutable and agreeable to natures fancy which knows no other Religion but that which stands in these externall things And seeing this Tradition of the present Church hath no testimony ground nor warrant for it in the Scripture but is a thing meerly usurped by the pride of Man And seeing none are fitter Judges to passe their sentence on Traditions side then such as are blind as Nature is in all spirituall things onely having a bare name of light as a Candle going before her whereby others may take notice of her Therfore not without great reason do you take the light of Nature for a Second to your Church Tradition as a fit consort which will easily speake for you whatsoever you desire giving her blind testimony to confirme your blind Cause And you adde Nay more that all proofes brought against any point of Faith neither are nor can be Demonstrations but Soluble Arguments To wit without your Church Tradition as the Inference sheweth This is a pretty point in Divinity indeed That the light of Nature is become a Iudge in points of Faith whether the Arguments brought against it be Demonstrative or no But this sâ—ppery is so fully refelled before that we need to say no more We come now in the last place to your Third ground Which is the light of the Text it selfe in conversing wherewith you say we meet with the Spirit
what evidence can the Church of Rome now give us or what assurance can she have besides the bare name That she is still a Christian Church Onely Vega helps it aswell as he can That in reason and Charity men are not to thinke that the Priest should be so carelesse at the Consecration as not to look to his Intention upon which the Salvation of all menâ— soules dependeth Fourthly for the Sacrament of the Eucharist or of the Altar as they call it First this is in the same Predicament with Baptisme for the Priests intention which if not present at the Consecration of the Host as they call it there is no Transubstantiation no body of Christ and so they worship a wafer instead of Christ and so by their owne Confession in that case they commit materiall Idolatry as a Jesuite confessed in Dispute with Dr Featly But Secondly by the very name of Sacrament of the Altar they destroy the Sacrament that Christ ordained in his last Supper called therfore the Supper of the Lord. For they have turned it from a Supper to a sacrifice yea and that from an Eucharisticall sacrifice as the Fathers called it to a Propitiatory sacrifice for the sins of quick and dead as is noted before And so this Sacrament they have Non sacramented and made of it a whole burnt sacrifice Secondly they have utterly destroyed the materialls or Element in this their Sacrament the bread and wine that no maâ— should so much as dreame or once take it for the Lords Supper For a Supper cannot be without bread and drinke and heâ—e is neither And so it is neither Supper nor Sacrament And thus they have taken away noâ— onely the cup from the people but the bread also altogether So as there is nothing in their Sacrament but a meere lye meere imaginations Phantasmes of Accidents without subject as we said before And so enough of this And lastly the Church of Rome having disanulled the Sacraments of Grace it hath withall disabled them from being seales of Grace For it is the property of a seale to give a sure and certain Impression and thereby a Confirmation of the Covenant But in Popish Sacraments all certainty is taken away as is shewed and so having lost the seales consequently the Covenant of Grace it selfe is of no force unto them And thus in denying the two Testaments to be the onely rule of Faith and overthrowing the two Sacraments the seales of Faith yea having lost and disclaimed the true Saving Faith it selfe what evidence hath Rome left her to shew and prove that she is now a true Church of Christ or hath the Essence of a true Church Let her shew her evidence As he said Let Baal if he be a god plead for himselfe Yet all this is of no Force to your Lordship but that like Ixion imbracing a cloud for Iuno as it is in that Fable so you imbrace but a cloud or rather the shadow of a cloud instead of the once faire Virgin Rome you must needs have her a true Church still She onely say you misuses the two Sacraments A small triviall trifle to speake of Misusing then is nothing with you What say you then to those wicked Princes and Priests of Israel that misused the Lords Prophets Was this nothing They so misused them that they stoned them to death And so the Church of Rome hath so misused the two Sacraments that they have stoned them them to death and left not one alive But they have made amends for it For say you they have added more even no lesse then five which are as the five wounds wherewith the Lord was crucified to death For those five have eaten out the other two of Christs own ordaining both expressing his death the one for ingrafting us into it the other for growth and strength by it as our spirituall food And these five Sacraments fo humane invention they must have their vertue of conferring Grace ex opere operato being all as they use them a meere evacuating of Christs me it s But time permits not a longer discourse of them Enough is said for Answer And for Conclusion the Church of Rome having taken away the Authority of Scripture and added her own Traditions and having taken away and misused the Lords Sacraments and added their own Sacraments what remaines to that Church but that which the Divine Iohn Concludeth the whole Bible withall I testifie unto every man that heareth the words of the Prophecie of this Book If any man shall adde unto these things God shall adde unto him the plagues that are written in this Book And if any man shall take away from the Book of this Prophecie God shall take away his part out of the Booke of life and out of the Holy City and from the things which are written in this Booke Out of the Holy City which is the Church of Christ. Here then in this holy City is no place for the Church of Rome L. p. 131.132 The Church of Rome both was and was not a right or Orthodox Church before Luther made a breach from it For in the Primitive times of it it was a most right and Orthodox Church but upon the immediate times before Luther or some Ages before that Rome was a corrupt and tainted Church farre from being right And yet both these times before Luther made his breach P. The Conclusion then of your speech here is this That Luther made his breach from the Church of Rome not onely as it was Corrupt and tainted immediately or in some Ages before but also as it was right and Orthodox in her Primitive Times For you say And yet both these times before Luther as well those wherein the Church of Rome was most right and Orthodox as those wherein after before Luther it was corrupt and tainted made his breach And thus you make the rent on the Protestant party to be not onely from the corrupt and tainted Church of Rome but from the most Right and Orthodox Church of Christ. A pestilent speech bewraying the speaker to be in the very gall of bitternesse and in the bond of iniquity and worhty to be abhorred and abandoned of all that beare the name of Protestants But this agreeth with that which we noted before how you exclude all the Protestant Reformed Churches beyond the Seas where your Prelacie and Hierarchy is not erected nor my Lord Bishops Chaire allowed from being any Churches of Christ or members of the true Catholick Church For here also in Luthers rent from the Church of Rome not onely as corrupt and tainted but as once Right and Orthodox you include all those Reformed present Churches and to exclude them out of the true Church of Christ. But as before we have shewed and proved and shall yet more upon fit occasion ministred upon the same cause for which you exclude all Reformed Protestant Churches beyond the Seas from being Churches of Christ
the making of it That is That it is ill very ill done of those who ever they be Papists or Protestants that give just cause to continue a seperation P. Here you speake plain Papists or Protestants and why not then Protestants as well as Papists that did very ill in making the seperation as they doe ill in continuing of it But yet your meaning here may possibly be that as it was ill done of the Roman party to give the first cause of the separation so it were no lesse ill done to continue the same cause to the continuing of the Schisme You may doe well to perswade Rome to lay down all her Corruptions which the Protestants have and doe protest against her that so if the Schisme be any longâ—r continued it may then appeare to be long of the Protestants â—ut if Rome be obstinate and incorrigible in her errors you have no reason to say it is ill done on the Protestant party to continue the Schisme But it may be perhaps ill done of the Protestant Church of England notwithstanding to continue the Schisme for as it may be well done of you to sowder it againe And therfore while the case is thus in agitation and Rome maks no more hast to meet you the multitude of her impedimenta bagge and baggage and all kind of Trumpery retaining her peace and which in no sort she will part withall and so will not stirre a foot over Tiber what 's wanting on her part you will supply with all expedition dressing up her sister the Church of England in Romes fashion unto such a conformity and symphony as promiseth a making up of the maâ—ch with all faults on both sides sooner perhaps then Rome could hope for L. ibid. The Kings and the Church of England had no reason to admit of a publick Dispute with the English Romish Clergy till they should be able to shew it under the Seale or Powers of Rome That that Church will submit to a third who may be an Indifferent Iudge between us and them or to such a Generall Councel as is after mentioned P. First the English Romish Clergie are by the Laws of England Traitors and therfore to be disputed withall at Tiburne So as if you put them to shew their warrant to dispute with you under Romes seale they will require of you perhaps to shew them under Englands seale an abrogation of the Laws against them And you tell us before that the Church of England knows well that a Parliament cannot be called at all times Nor will the Powers of Rome permit their Religion to be disputed on And whom will you chuse to dispute with them some peaceable men that will not be apt to fall out with the Jesuites your Lordship being Moderator But you know Rome denyes the Rule of Faith the Scripture And Contra negantem Principia non est disputandum Who shall else be the Umpier Who the Third Who the Indifferent Iudge Could both the Churches joyntly chuse a more Indifferent Iudge then your selfe Sure Rome her selfe would nominate you before Bellarmine himselfe if he were living A Generall Councel indeed of Romish English and other Prelates might do much so you should be sure to exclude all the Protestant Reformed Churches for wranglers as Franciscus à S. Clara well adviseth And then if a Generall Councel should reconcile and compose all differences though never so erroniously yet the Error must stand till another Generall Councel shall reverse it as you tell us at after But you adde L. p. ibid. and 146. And this is an honest and I think a full Answer And without this all Disputation must end in a clamour and therfore the more publick the worse because as the Clamour is the greater so perhaps wil be the Schisme too P Nay my Lord if you stand upon termes of honesty indeed you should have nominated the Scripture for the onely sufficient and upright Iudge between you This had been honest in one that professeth but the name onely of a Protestant But for that you told us enough before whereby we understand that this point of honesty is no part of your meaning But if your Answere were not in this respect honest I must tell you neither was it full but an empty and frivolous Answere To dispute of Divinity or Religion where Scripture is not the onely Iudge is as to judge of gold by the colour without the touchstone And so he that could shew the best colour for his matter by a false light should carry it away And I may say truely without the Scripture be Iudge your disputation must needs end in a clamour where the voyce of God is of no authority But then also if Scripture should be the Iudge you might well say The more publicke the worse For it is such a light as would discover all your fallacies and so raysing a clamour of the publicke Audience when they should observe such collusion between the English Clergie and the English Romists it might breed such a detestation against all Reconciliation with Rome as would make the rent the wider and so all your labour should be in vaine And then you might use the Proverbe As good never a whit as never the better L. p. 148. That there are errorr in Doctrine and some of them such as most manifestly indanger salvation in the Church of Rome iâ— evident to them that will not shut their eyes P. To indanger Salvation is much and for you to say so much is much too and you saying so much we need not make much doubt of the truth of that you say in this Case And yet in saying so much you speake not all truth The truth is as we have proved and shall yet further That Romes Errors in Doctrine are damnable and cannot consist with salvation as is evident to those whose eyes are truly opened L. ibid. A. C. himselfe confesses that error in Doctrine of the Faith is a just cause of seperation so just as that no cause is just but that Now had I leasure to descend into particulars or will to make the rent in the Church wider 't is no hard matter to prove that the Church of Rome hath erred in the Doctrine of Faith and dangerously too And I doubt I shall afterwards descend to particulars A. C. his importunity forcing me to it P. By A. C. his canfession then the Protestants are able to justifie their seperation abundantly As for your Lordship you are so charitably and peaceably affected that you are loth upon any termes though it concerne the salvation of mens soules in such a case to speake the truth home to make the rent wider till by your Adversaries importunity I would say A. C. you be forced to it You have too tender a heart to be a Surgion when for feare least the opening of the wound make it wider you suffer it to fester inwardly It were well if you were halfe so tender hearted to the
But who shal be Judge of that Alas we are never the nearer if you Prelates be the visible Iudges For then what Canons or Constitutions shall crosse either Scripture or Positive Law of the Land which you shall define and determine to be fit for you to govern the Church by What Laws of the Realme shal be just which crosse one of your Canons Did not in a Cause pleaded in your High-Commission the Popes Canon aledged by the Advocate on the one party preponderate a Statute of Edw. 6. alledged by the Advocate of the adverse party so as the Popes Canon carryed the Cause So as while you will be the visible Iudges you will lead us all in a Circle and make us so turne round as we should not know where we are imagining that all the world went upon wheels Yea but there is yet one qualification may help at a pinch For you say Archbishops and Bishops under a Gratious Keng to governe c. 'T is true indeed that under the shadow of a Gracious King to you you are imboldened to do all you do Lastly you say the Church of England doth not beleeve there is any necessity to have one Pope or one Bishop over the whole Christian world And are there not trow you many thousands in the Church of England which doe not beleeve there is any necessâ—y of having One Pope or Arch-Prelate over the whole Church of England the other world as before And I beleeve there is no more necessity of the one then of the other but that they might be well spared as Christ will one day not spare them And as I said before the Pope by as good a Title may argue a necessity of his being uneversall Bishop over the whole Christian world as you can setting the Law of England aside for your being Pope over the whole Church of England And that upon your own Ground for you say The Church of England and the Church of Rome is one and the same Church no doubt of that and The Church of England may find her selfe where Romes is now just there then if so that both are one and the Popes Principality more powerfull then that of Canterbury and if there be a nccessity that Canterbury be over the whole Church of England which is but a part of the Catholicke and that for order and unity why not the like necessity for the Pope to be supreme over all for preserving order and unity seeing your Militant Church is but one and to make many heads many Vice-Roys is to divide the body and Kingdome and so make rents in it which you like not of But to conclude I beleeve and with me all true Beleevers who have their judgements rightly informed wherever they be in any part of the world that there is a necessity of duty lying upon all Christian Magistrates to exterminate and exterpate the whole Hierarchy and Prelacy as Antichristian enemies of Iesus Christ and of his Kingdome yea and the band of Civil States and people out of the world For so we read Rev. 17.16 17. A place worthy to be written in the hearts of all Kings Christian. And it is the duty of all true Christians to rowse up the Spirit of prayer in them and to stirre up the coals of zeale to flame forth in offring up of pure Incense of fervent Prayer especially in these times wherin Satan so rageth and his Instruments grow so malapert and mischievous that God would hasten the accomplishment of Antichrists Kingdome that so the Kingdome of Iesus Christ may be exalted and inlarged and he alone rule and raigne in his Church L. p. 212. Somwhat may be done by the Bishop and Governours of the Church to preserve the unity and certainty of Faith and to keep the Church from renting or for uniting it when it is rent And this pag. 198 one Pope cannot doe P. Somwhat Why you tell us immediately before that the Pope or a Bishop may perhaps despense in some cases with the Decrees of a Generall And this I hope is somwhat more then somwhat Or perhaps at least And we have shewed before how you Prelates do either preserve the Church from renting or when it is rent make up the breaches of it namely by an uniting and confederating against Christ and his true Church and by labouring tooth and nayle to support and keep safe and sound your Antichristian Hierarchy which is not truly and properly an unity but a conspiracie against Christ from whose true Mysticall body you have made the Great and unreconciliable Rent And therfore you to preserve the unity and certainty of Faith intire which even as you are Prelates you are altogether Apostates from and enemies unto Or is the spirit of Infallibility intayld to the Prelates Chaire For doth not this necessarily imply either an Infallibility or at least a greater dexterity and a more excellent and Divine spirit to be in Prelates qua Praelati Infulati as they are Mitred Bishops then in all those that are no Prelates when onely by Prelates though but somwhat to this purpose may be done But we have shewed before what ability or soundnesse of judgement in divine spiritual matters we may expect to be in Prelates in comparison of others who are both learned pious judicious Divines L. p. 194. To draw all together to settle Controversies in the Church there is a visible Iudge and Infallible but not living and that is the Scripture pronouncing by the Church and there is a visible and living Iudge and that is a Generall Councel P. Here I goe backe a little to fetch in this passage as fiâ— here to usher in a many other Passages scattered here and there in your Book which is hard to reduce to any order or forme But we must do as we may And I shall not wittingly offer violence to any part in the least though somtimes here and there I am faine to pull them in by the head and shoulders And here you doe with the Papists make the Scripture to be but a dead letter for say you it is not a living Iudge no nor yet a speaking Iudge but as it is pronounced by the Church Wheras the Apostle saith of it Zonâ—o lógos tou Theou The word of God is living or lively nor onely so but e'nergès effectuall as it is before noted And if you will apply this to the Word preached that 's true too Although you will not confesse preaching of Gods word to be the Scripture or yet the word of God But it must be pronounced by the Church as the onely mouth of Scripture and that must be also in the Churches sense Of which sufficiently before Yet this you adde to all your other indignities you put upon the Scripture that you make it a dead Iudge and so indeed no Iudge at all as before you plainly tell For if it be blind as wanting light and if it be mute or dumb
They are taught this one Maine Principle That they must be saved not by Faith onely but by their good Works whereby they must merit their Salvation Now this all Papists learned and unlerned professe This unlesse they cease to be Papist they live and dye in and so they are necessarily and certainly damned For to adde any thing to Faith in Iustification is damnation as before it shewed And saith the Prophet They that observe lying vanities forsake their own mercy But Thirdly you say They may be saved so they conforme to a Religious life Now what is the Religious life of a Papist and especially of a silly ignorant Papist Namely to goe to Shrief or Confession to the Priest his Ghostly Father as often as may be as the Fernall Glory published by your Chapleins licence teacheth or at the least once a yeare against Easter to keep his Lent-fast strictly so as upon paine of damnation or greivous penance not to eat an egge all that time and so observe all othor Fasting-dayes in the yeare together with all Holydayes to say over their Beads every day in repeating their Pater Noster Ave Mary Creed and ten Commandements â—f either they be so learned or devout to goe to their dayly Masse and Mattens where it is their safety to understand never a word nor to say Amen to the Priest but by the sound of his voyce which they understand no more then the chattering of a Magpy to call upon such a Saint his speciall Mediator and say a Pater Noster and Ave Mary before such an Image and especially of their Lady and a thousand such like observations wherein a Popish Religious life consisteth And so this is the Religious life of your ignorant silly Papist wherin living and dying he may be saved if he may beleeve your Doctrine But to this you adde An humble and peaceable obedience To What Or to whom As to the Priests Ghostly Discipline when he injoynes sore penance as whipping-cheare in Lent or the like Or if you meane peaceable obedience to the Civil Magistrate as in England that must be according to their Ghostly Fathers direction and limitation they must not take the Oath of Supremacy nor in some cases the Oath of Allegiance when it makes for the Catholick Cause And though to satisfie the Law and save his purse he come once a moneth to Church and heare your service yet Sermon he must not heare especially if the Preacher be Puritannicall for that might turn him quite from his Popery And thus such partly by their peaceable civill life and partly by their humble Popish Religious life so living and dying may be saved And therfore to such silly Ignorants we must not deny salvation Why so For first We have not so learned Christ say you Wee What wee Wee to wit you and your present Church of England And surely you had not need to deny salvation to that Church with which you and your Church is one and the same Church least otherwise you might leave your selves as little hope of salvation as others doe them But this is a piece of your learning of Christ it seems to beleeve that a silly ignorant Papist that knows not the right hand from the left that is drowned in Ignorance blindnesse superstition Idolatry Infidelity and as a drowned man knows it not may securely wrappe himselfe in the shrowd or mantle of his silly ignorance and so goe to heaven Thus have you learned Christ. But Wee Wee I say that renounce all communion with the Whore of Babylon and with all her Abominations have not so learned Christ as having heard him and been taught by him as the truth is in Iesus as to beleeve there is salvation to be hoped for of any but such as walke according to Christs rule and live and dye in his Faith And what 's Christs rule Even that which follows in the same place vers 22 To put off and renounce the former conversation of the Old Man which is corrupt according to the deceitfull lusts waâ—king v. 18. in the vanity of our minds having the understanding darkened being alienated from the life of God through ignorance as the Gentiles because of the blindnesse of their heart who being past feeling have given themselves to all â—â—sâ—viousnesse to worke all uncleannes with greedinesse Wherupon the Apostle addes But have not so learned Christ so as to thinke to be saved in a Heathenish life drowned in ignorance from which you cannot distinguish the life of an ignorant Papist except that it is infinitely more stupid and fuller of grosse ignorance and all abominations then the Heathen were and saving that Papists professe the name of Christians We have not I say so learned Christ. What is then the learning of Christ To put off the Old Man and that ye be saith the Apostle renewed in the spirit of your mind putting on the New man which after God is created in Righteousnesse and true Holinesse This is the learning of Christ. So as without this learning neither any silly ignorant Papist nor the most pregnant acute learned Arch-Prelate can be saved We must have both the Righteousnesse of justification by Faith imputed and of Sanctification of the spirit of Christ inherent and shining forth in a holy life and conversation It is not a Pope-holynesse in keeping of a Lent fast or worshiping of an Altar and such like counterfeit holines of mans devising This you learne not of Christ. For Christ saith In vaine they worship me teaching for Doctrines the Commadements of men or humane Traditions This holinesse saves not but shuts men out of the Kingdome of Heaven But secondly You call it stifnesse and churlishnesse in Protestants to deny all Papists salvation We shall by and by see your Charity to Papists which is so extreame great as we need not wonder at your malice against those some Protestants you speake it Is it stifnesse to avouch the truth And if they do bebaiousthai as the Apostle exhorteth Titus constantly affirme what not onely is truth but also necessary to be spoken as being a matter of such moment and consequence as concernes the savation of soules by denying salvation to whom it belongeth not and when men are seduced in a false perswasion therof call you this churlishnesse Certainly this churlishnesse in so denying is better then your charity in affirming a falshood Nay what will you say if this which you call churlishnesse be found to be true Charity when your Charity will be found to be deadly hatred against the soule of that silly ignorant Papist For true Charity ever consists with verity els it is no Charity but vanity Now those Protestants which deny salvation to all Papists living and dying in the Roman faith doe it upon sound and solid grounds even upon cleare evidence of Scripture For the Roman Faith is not the true Christian Faith as we have proved And without the true Christian Faith
professed in the Church of England is nearest of any Church now in Beeing to the Primitive Church Therfore not a Religion known to be false And thus I both doe and can prove were not the deafnesse of the Aspe upon the eares of seduced Christians in all humane and divided Parties whatsoever P. You doe wisely to put it to the judgement of the indifferent Reader who unlesse he be a most indifferent man between your Church of England and that of Rome and so undifferent from you both in judgement and affection to whom this which you say shall appeare to be true For no such thing can appeare to any Reader that is not so affected as to beleeve your bare word so soon as ever it sounds in his eare or whose eyes doe not looke through the false glasse of your Perspective Indeed you have proved to all men sufficiently both by this your Discourse and by your Practises that you and Rome do not set up a different Religion We all beleeve it And consequently we beleeve that herein you come full as neare to the Primitive Church as Rome doth alwayes excepted Romes lineall Pedegree from Peter and you know you are a Degree once removed And how neare you both come to the Primitive Church of the Apostles especially the primest and purest we have before shewed sufficiently And if you come nearest who I pray you are furthest off Surely the most pious the most religious the most zealous the most painfull and faithfull preachers of the Gospel the greatest contemners of the world the most humble and meeke the most patient in suffering persecution for the truth the most pure and precise in their life and conversation the most exact conformist to the onely Rule of Faith and true Religion the word of God such as are not ambitious covetous carnall and worldly minded envious malicious cruel haters and persecuters of Gods word of his Ministers and people Such such I say must be furthest off from the Doctrine and practise of the Apostles and of the most pure and Primitive Church in their time if you the Prelates and Churches of England and Rome come the nearest unto them L. p. 377. But is there no superstition in Adoration of Images None in Invocation of Saints None in Adoration of the Sacrament P. Yes and grosse Heathenish Idolatry too yea and infidelity to boote though you would mince it never so small into a matter of superstition onely And may not I say to you But is there no superstition yea no Idolâ—try in your Adoration of Altars yea and worse then that of the Papisâ—s for they worship their God you the Altar None in your Adoration of the Name IESVS None in bowing before your Crucifixes over your Altars No inducement at least to Idolatry in your goodly Images erected in your Churches No 〈◊〉 smell of Popish superstition and Idolatry in yâ—ur Adorations in the presence of such Imâ—geâ— The Iewes would not â—o much as stoop to tye the latchet of their shooe in the place where an Image was least their bowing might seem to be to the Image And who knoweth with what mind you do your humble and lowly Dâ—votion before such sacred Reliques And to summe up all together is there no superstion yea no Idolatry in all that will-worship of yours and of the Church of Rome attended with so many Rites and Ceremonies of mans invention For what is all Will-worship but Idolatry yea and the highest kind of Idolatry As Vincentius saith What are strange Gods but strange errours for that Hereticks reverence their Opinions no lesse then the Gentiles doe their Gods And Augustine saith It is the vilest and 〈◊〉 kind of Idolatry when mâ—n worship their own fancies observing that for a Religion which their erronious and swelling minds imagine Thus we see as a learned Divine of the Church of England and of great Eminencie said that a corrupt and vicious Religion such as Popery is and such as you have made yours of the Church of England not a different Religion 〈◊〉 an inward and ghostly worship of Idols which saith he Prince ought not to 〈◊〉 at or tolerate seeing no man and therfore no Prince can 〈◊〉 two Masters For saith he if God be truth they which presume to worship him with lyes as in contrary faith must needs come to passe serve now not God but the Devil a lyer himselfe and the faâ—her of 〈◊〉 whose service no Christian Prince may so much as 〈◊〉 so he Thus our Divines of the Church of England in former ages shall 〈◊〉 up as witnesses to condemn you in the day of Judgement who teach and maintain things contrary to that truth which they delivered L. p. 378. What not prove any superstition any errour at Rome but by pride and that intolerable Truly I would to God A.C. saw my heart and all the pride that lodgeth in it P. This you speake to A.C. as to a Jesuite or some Frier or some Priest All is one such a one being a Ghostly Father you may safely sub sigillo Confâ—ssionis or sub stola under the seale of Confession or under the Friers frocke under the Rose as we say open the windows of your Brest and let him look in and view all the Roomes and corners of your heart to see what pride hath taken up her lodging there and so the world shal be never a whiâ— the wiser for it But you need not to wish any such thing The pride of your heart cannot so easily be hid as that you need wish with Momus if there were a glasse window in your Brest for men to look in and see it much lesse a subtile prying Jesuite Alas though the glaring light of it blind your own eyes that you cannot see it your selfe yet any other that is but purblind may through the Glasse or spectacles of this your Book see the monstrous multiformious shape of it had they not seen it before expressed in the Capitall Characters of your most insolent and all daring practises And that you yet see it not there is not a more infallible argument or signe of a more monstrous proud heart which is ever selfe blinded But look to it What saith Ieremie The heart is deceitfull above all things and desperately wicked who can know it I the Lord search the heart and try the reynes even to give every man according to his wayes and according to the fruit of his doingâ—s L. p. 379. I hope God hath given the Lady mercy P. Namely that same Lady who formerly had been either brought unto or confirmed in that Romish Religion by that which you resolved her in namely That she might be saved living and dying in the Roman faith and Religion wherein it seems as she lived so she dyed Now truly my Lord If God did give her mercy it is little God hamercy to you But what ground have you for this your hope Even as much as for