conscience how to carrie my selfe betweene my Prince and Prelate His answere was they were hereticall bookes and that I ought not to reade them And he further said that I might spend my time better in reading Iohnsons playes which he there offered unto me Then and not before I began to distrust and reading the foresayd collections in the Authours themselves I perceived that all was not found that came from Rome though I was formerly told that the Priests had written out of mallice against the Iesuites and not truth Then I considered what fundamentall poynts the Protestant beleeving Catholiques and the Papist pretending Catholiques differed in And I found in deverse protestant writters that they deny not any one poynt of reall Catholique Faith explicitely to bee beleeved of necessitie or as necessary to salvation as was made evident in the disputation betweene Fisher and his partner on the Romish part and Doctor White and Doctor Feately for the Protestants in Sir Humphrie Linne his house in Sheerelane where the Protestant disputantes maintayning that they denyed no essentiall poynt of Catholique Religion but the innovated unjustifiable Doctrine of Rome They made their instance First Doctor Feately challenged the Iesuites to shew that for the first 500. yeares any one of fifteene poynts of Popish beleefe which hee then rehearsed had beene beleeved by visible Congregation of Christians or by any one Father or writter of note Wherewith he droue the Iesuites to this shamefull evasion viz. That these are Scholasticall poyntes not fundamentall Wherevpon Doctor White Replyed that all those poynes had been concluded by the Councell of TRENT and therefore were fundamentall to the Papists And receiving no answer from the Iesuites to this Reply Doctor White insisted in sixe particular poyntes of innovated Popish Doctrine and challenged the Iesuites to shewe if they could any one Father or writer of note for the first sixt hundred yeares after Christ who held any one of the said sixe poynts Whereto nothing was answered as you may see manifest in the Relation printed 1624. Since which time meeting Mr. Sweete one of the aforesayd Iesuite Disputants I asked him why he would not yeilde as well to trie the succession of doctrine as of names whereas the succession of Doctrine and not of names was most materiall to giue satisfaction to doubtfull consciences because that by the Doctrine it would have appeared who had taught according to the Scriptures Contrary whereunto whosoever teacheth is accursed Gal. 1.8 But to all this I could gett no other answere but this viz. It would have taken too long a time When I could receiue no better answere from Master Sweete I immagined that hee might bee of the opinion of the Priestes and Papistes in the first thirteene yeares of Queene ELIZABETHES Raigne For the most of them did not make then any separation from the Protestants as beleeving any reall difference betweene them to cause them to separate For the Laity went to Church generally and the Priests tooke benefices holding the English Leiturgie as good as the Latine Becanus saith Controv. Angl. If the King be an hereticke and command us to pray at the Church with his subjects possumus id praestare wee may doe it And I finde some other * Parsons treat to mitigat cap 2. fol. 63. Iesuites of the same opinion that Protestants are no heretiques untill that by a lawfull Iudge he or they bee denounced convicted and condemned by name which we ascribe not to the Protestants I demaund then by what rule of charity shall the Papists separate themselves from the Protestants in the worship of God now contrary to the practise which was before 13. Elizabeth Moreover in the same leafe Parsons reasoneth thus out of Saint Augustine lib. 4. de bapt cont Don. c. 16. If a man should for example beleeve the heresie of Photinus who denied the distinction of three persons in God and the divinity of Christ and should thinke it the true Catholicke faith Istum nondum dico haereticum saith Saint Augustine I doe not thinke this man yet to be an heretique except when the doctrine of the Catholique faith to wit that which hath beene held generally by most Churches in Christendome be made manifest unto him Observe here that he doth not say the Church of Rome because that the damnable doctrin which brought forth the Powder plot had been all ready broched and put in practise And the Romish bookes burnt in Paris for the sayd doctrine Else hee would have defended the Faith of Boniface the Eight That it is alltogether necessarie to salvation to beleeve the Roman Church And so let the Article of the APOSTLES CREED be forgotten For it were needlesse to enquyre what the Vniversall Church hath taught if as that Decree teacheth it be sufficient to salvation to beleeue the now particular Roman Therefore I beleeve the Romish Catholique and Protestant Catholique in whatsoever they teach according to the fundamentall poyntes of the universall Faith contayned in the APOSTLES CREED And not the corrupted doctrines of the particular Church of Rome which the Iesuite Disputants were as it seemeth ashamed to defend in Sir Humphrie Lines house as is abouesayd Now it may bee demanded how so many wise religious grave and learned Romish Catholiques can be thought so ignorant as to beleeue the particular Roman to be the universall Catholique Church which all are bound to beleeue by the Apostles Creed It is apparant that many of them are not naturally ignorant or of incapacitie But it is as apparant that they are made so by Arte. For whereas our Saviour Christ hath appoynted a prescribed obedience according to the Lawes Divine as in Deutrenom 17.10.11 The vnited Priests aforenamed with the Divines of Venice and France accuse the now Divines of Rome the Iesuites for teaching an absolute obedience to the Pope and their Superiour as I will relate and beginne with the third part of the Iesuites Constitutions Cap. 1. Where their vowe of obedience is at large described as well to the Pope as to their Superiour in these words following And because of the things which belong to the vowe c. we will speake of obedience which all must labour strictly to observe and not onely in those things which they are bound but others also though the same be not a commandement but onely a signe of their Superiours will as if it were our Saviour Christs owne voice And let every one perswade himselfe to be governed even like a dead carkasse turned and tumbled even which way soever a man will Or like an olde mans staffe which serveth him that holdeth it in his hand for whatsoever he will use it where and when he list Vpon this passage the Glosse hath these words Obedience concerning the execution of it is then performed when that which is commanded is done The two which dispatched the two Henries in France seemed to have learned this Obedience And if the powder had taken fire more
saith he but that hereafter if any Pope crosse their plotts and purposes the Iesuites will haue such a figge in store for his Holinesse as no Antidote-shall prevent or long preserue his life after it When I had read these things in the authours aboue named I concluded that Rome might be a part of the Catholick Church though a member corrupted with errours but it could not be the Catholique Therefore I did not much marvell when I saw diverse Romish Priests come openly to Paules Crosse in London and preach that the Mysterious working of Antichrist is now in Rome which caused them to come out of her as out of Babilon As you may see in Sheldon the Converts printed Sermon and in Higgens his first and second Sermon lately printed And yet saith Sheldon many Christians may be saved in Rome beleeving the true fundamentall points of Catholique faith and not partaking with her in her latter corrupted doctrine authorized and Printed at Rome which hath beene burnt by the Catholique Roman Authoritie in France which I take it are these Bellarmines bookes teaching that the Pope hath power disponendi omnium temporalia to dispose of the temporall things of all And no doubt but this doctrine might cause those poore deluded soules to enter into the Powder plott thinking the deede to be meritorious as appeared by the speech of Sir Everad Dighbie at his death An other may be Becanus his booke wherein he dispuring of King-killing concludeth in the affirmatiue in these wordes Nihilcertius nothing more certeine Suarez is an other who in his booke against King Iames saith That none can kill him but those whom the Pope shall appoynt To these may be added Mariana whose judgement in his booke is that it is the safest way to poyson him These bookes were burnt in France for teaching damnable and seditious doctrine even by the Roman Catholique authoritie and partie there I meane by such Catholiques as will persist in the true fundamentall poynts of Catholique faith not be deluded with their errors No though the Pope himselfe should decree them Much lesse will they forsake the Apostles Creed Extrau cap vnam SaÌ„ctam de maior et obed Credo Ecclesiam Catholicam I beleeue the Catholique Church Though Boniface the eight hath long since Decreed That it is alltogether necessary to to beleeue the Church of Rome See the grand impostor of the now Church of Rome put forth by the Bish of Covent Leech feild 1628. and to be subiect to the Roman Bishop Which thirteenth Article added by that Pope the wiser sort of Catholiques in France doe not beleeue but oppose with wordes writings Decrees and fire not boasting themselves to bee the onely Church inerrant as ROME doth but holding themselves to be a true member of the Catholique protesting against these corrupted doctrines of Rome innovated by the Iesuites as appeareth by the Priests bookes aboue recited of whom I give you here some taste as followeth some whereof I formerly mentioned Doct. Elye in his notes upon the Apologie pag. 9. in the preface saith thus They plunge themselues over head and eares in Ecclesiasticall affaires with such audacitie and obstinacie as that they haue turned all topsie turvie And in the Quodl page 321. We find it thus of the Iesuites doctrine Certeinely therin is nothing else but fallacie vpon fallacie error vpon errour one contradiction encountring another And in the booke called Declar. Mot. ac turb in Angl. pa. 29. a Iesuite mainteineth this most atheisticall and heathenish assertion that one who is not a Christian may be Pope of Rome And as it is in Anthony Copelies letter pag 67. an other Iesuite openly and for found doctrine maintayned it first to his Auditours in the Schoole and at this instant expressely in the Inquisition doth say Non est de fide credere hunc Romanum Pontificem esse Christi Vicarium It is not a matter of Faith to beleeue that this present Pope is Christs Vicar Also in the Quodl pag 31. Thus we reade To let passe their eronious Doctrine concerning their Generals infallibilitie of truth for deciding of matters Their absurd paradoxes of Aequivocation and ibid. pag 29. The Iesuites every way in Printed bookes in writings manuscripts and most of all in private conference have taught contrarie to the Roman Church And therefore saith Anthony Copely pag 40. It is no marvell if in fundamentall poynts of Catholique faith they oppose against the Angelicall Doctor and be therefore endited before his Holâ—nes at this present by the Dominicans in Spayne for Pelagians and sundrie other kindes of heretiques as also impostors by the Sorbonites of Paris and all other French Clergie as we credibly heare And Quodl pag 138. Never was there any Religious order that held such extravagant exorbitant irreguler opinions as they doe Doct. Bagshawes answer pag 20. saith thus Father Weston and Archer are charged by Doct. Norden for defending the stues to be as lawfull as the Pope himselfe as if they had as it seemeth a very league with hell against the truth These were not the first motiues which made me mistrust the Romish doctrine for by my bringing up I was so prejudicate in mine opinion as that I thought scorne to imagine that the true Catholique faith could infalliblie be received from any place but Rome In so much as when I heard of that most inhumane barbarous and damnable Powder plott conceived and attempted only by Romish Catholiques I was amazed to thinke that from Rome and from no other place in the world could be received the saving faith I then professed it to certeine famous Iesuites to whom I was then devoted that I thought to beleeue the Roman Catholique Church was as ridiculous as to say Christendom Kent or the vniversall particuler I was notwithstanding then easily satisfied herein when they told me that the meaning was not to make a particular Church to be vniversall but onely to intimate that no faith is truely Catholick but that faith which is taught in Rome as they sayd they were readie to justifie and that there was no more reason for vs to forsake the Church of Rome for the Powder plott then for the Apostles to have forsaken Christ for the fact of Iudas And thus I rested a while satisfied Widrintons Supplic to the Pope untill the oath of Allegiance came out Then went I to my sayd Father f Widrint ans to Fits Herb. and told him that diverse e Priestes defended that the King had made a lawfull oath to try the Romish which of them did adheare to the true Catholik faith of Rome and which to the innovated treasonable doctrines thereof And that d they further defended that those who refused to take this oath should not onely be hanged for traytors but loose also their soules eternally for wilfully denying their lawfull Allegiance Whereupon I asked him againe whether I might reade the sayd bookes to informe and satisfie my
Hee that is an honest man by scruple and a religious bridle take heede of him and account of him as hee is and hee hath religion without honestie I will not say hee is more wicked but farre more dangerous than hee that hath neither the one nor the other Who so killeth you will thinke that hee doth an acceptable service unto God Not because religion teacheth or any way favoureth wickednesse as some very foolishly and maliciously from this place doe object for the most absurd and falsest religion doth it not but the reason is that having no taste nor image nor conceit of honesty but by imitation and for the service of religion and thinking that to be an honest man is no other thing than to be carefull to advance religion They beleeve all things whatsoever be it treason treachery sedition rebellion or any other offence to bee not onely lawfull and sufferable being coloured with zeale and the care of religion but also commendable meritorious and worthy canonization if it seeme for the progresse and advancement of religion and the overthrow of their adversaries Thus you may see what conceit that learned man had of yeelding to men that absolute obedience which is due to God alone So that he was farre from the doctrine of the Iesuites who in their 13 rule do teach that if the Superiour say that white is black we must beleeve it and obey And a Iesuite once avowed to my face before sufficient witnesse that this rule is orthodoxe Hee that will see more concerning this point let him reade De la Mar. against the Iesuites his open pleading in Parliament of Paris against Monthalon their chosen Advocate He that would beholde how the particular Church of Rome hath beene led by particular factions to forsake the universall Catholicke faith let him reade George Carleton since Bishop of Chichester his booke of Iurisdiction Regall Papall Episcopall If any man reade these and see not the universall faith there brought to particular fancie it must bee crassa ignorantia if hee have will to please God and capacity for to understand But the greatest motives yet to perswade me that Rome hath corrupted the Catholique faith are two The first is for that all the most religious the most learned yea the very Canonized Saints of Rome have in all latter ages cryed out of the corruptions in the Church of Rome as you may finde in a booke published both in Latine and in English by IAMES MAXVVELL a Researcher of Antiquities which no Romish Papist ever contradicting I presume that it cannot bee excepted against by the later yeares See what the Priests haue written against the Iesuites He that hath not meanes to come by the bookes themselues may reade the Collections made by Tho. Iames which I haue found truely cited out of the said books of the Priests The Collections of Tho. Iames printed at Oxford were sold by Iohn Barnes neere Holborne Conduite The second motiue is that within this later hundred yeeres the Church of Rome hath vsurped authority to expurge reprint alter or change what they haue thought good out of both ancient and late Writers that speake against them as may appeare by their Indices Expurgatorij concerning which I referre you to D. Iames his Collections printed 1625. But concerning the credit of the Canonized Saints and others cited by Maxwell it is necessary you should heare what the greatest and learnedst Doctors of Rome haue thought of them Thus may you reade in Trithem Abbas in his booke of illustrious men That Pope Eugenius the third with the consent of 18 Cardinals and a great number of Bishops assembled in the Councell of Treiur And also Pope Boniface the ninth did Canonize diners of the Saints that spake against the corruptions of Rome Turrecremata Bellarmine and Baronius with the most famous learned men of Rome haue all highly commended the said Saints that thus cryed out of Rome and called out loud for reformation in their dayes The like was done by the good French Cardinall Peter de Aliaco in his booke of Reformation of the Church in his time presented to the Councell of Constance And the Councels both of Constance and Basil did vna voce disallow the Popes vsurpation in challenging himselfe to be aboue a generall Councell insomuch that the said Councell deliuered it as a deposite of the Church by vnanimous consent in forme of a Decree that it ought not to be so In these words The Pope tenetur obedire ought or is bound to obey the Councell etiam in fide moribus euen in matter of FAITH and manners Yea where was the Popes authority aboue a generall Councel when all Appeales to parts beyond the Seas were prohibited by the African Councell They are not then the late Protestants alone that haue called for Reformation of the Romish Church but euen also these ancient The late famous Sir Thomas Moore holden one of the lights of the Roman Church and defender thereof in his time seemeth to scorne that any man should beleeue that he was so farre corrupted in the Faith as to beleeue the Pope to be aboue a generall Councell Dial. l. 1. c. 26. His words are Neuer did I beleeue the Pope to bee aboue a generall Councell Notwithstanding the Papalins contrary to the Catholicke faith haue accounted the French Church to bee a schismaticall Church for holding the Vniuersall or generall Councell to be aboue the Pope as appeareth at large in the aforesaid pleadings of De la Martilire against the Iesuites Heare now what the Seminarie Priests speake against the faction of the Iesuites that hath swayed and ouer-ruled Rome at and since the Councell of Trent Watson Quodl pag. 82. doubteth that Antichrist may be already come for that the Iesuites be the fore-runners of Antichrist though it appeareth that Saint Bernard thought he was come before when as he saith Ep. 127. that Antichrist then sate in S. Peters chaire If then the godliest and learnedst of the Church of Rome haue in all Ages cryed out of the corruptions both of the doctrine and manners in the Church of Rome as you may see in the books aforesaid then we may say there haue neuer wanted Professors and Protestants in all Ages defending that Catholicke Roman Faith which Paul commended to the Romans resisting the tyranous vsurped innouated Doctrine of the Church or Court of Rome as may bee further seene in that from time to time euen generall Councels as well as Prouinciall haue refisted the innouations of Rome The African Councell and others of that time resisted Appeales to the Pope The later Councels of Constance and Basil haue concluded that the Pope is not aboue a Generall Councell As then Saint Paul saith that God hath set in the Church Apostles Prophets Euangelists Teachers for the perfecting of the Faith vntill all come to the vnity of the Faith Eph. 4.11 12 13. See Master Bernards booke entituled looke beyond Luther And
that vn till Christs comming againe 1 Tim. 6.14 So if you looke beyond Luther you shall finde that there neuer wanted a visible company of Pastors protesting against the innovated doctrines of the Church of Rome which made as I suppose the Iesuite disputants in Sir Humphrey Linds his house ashamed to try the succession of doctrine offering their blinde buttery booke of names For if they durst try their succession of their doctrine Why did they not either then vndertake it or since make supplication to his Maiesty that they might proue the same and so saue their Credits And since that I had digested and set downe in writing these former inducements I haue beene yet further confirmed by the reading of two bookes the one of Sir Humphrey Linds intituled via tuta wherein is manifestly proued that whatsoeuer the Protestants hold positiuely for matter of faith no learned Papists can or euer could deny And that whatsoeuer the Protestants deny of the things held by the Papists the same cannot be prooued to be Catholicke and Apostolicke agreeing with the Apostles Creed The other is Doctor Fauours booke entituled Antiquity triumphing ouer Nouelties wherein is as plainely proued that the Papists doe speake contemptuously and disgracefully of the Scriptures to deterre men from reading of them Contemne those first and best generall Councels wherin they speake against them and for the Protestants And in the later they take what parts make for them and reiect what makes against them as reprobate as I find Cardinall Bellarmines distinction of them to bee partim probata partim reprobata L. 1. c. 4. de concil eccl The like doe they by the Fathers and also by Histories as you may see if you reade cap. 7 8 9. of the said booke of D. Fauour And all this it seemeth will not serue the turne for they haue set vp shops and Inquisitors of purpose called their Indices Expurgatorij to blot out in the Catholicke Writers what makes against them with a deleatur and to adde what may serue their turne And likewise in their citations they make vse of Bastard and counterfeit Fathers acknowledged by themselues to be such as you may see more plainly and particularly in Doctor Iames his booke printed 1612. entituled A Treatise of Scripture Councels Fathers corrupted by the Romish Pastors And as for their contempt of the Fathers When Tertullian pleaseth Bellarmine he is with him granissimus Author A most graue Author a famous Doctor a Catholike Writer Bellar. de Rom. pont l. 2. c. 5. But if he speake against or please not Bellarmine then he is an Heretique and he will answer fidem non esse omnino adhibendam Tertulliano in hac parte that no credite at all is to be giuen to Tertullian in this case ibid. lib. 4. cap. 8. And as for the vse which the Papists doe afford vnto that euidence of antiquity which is histories Doctor Fauour proposeth certaine examples to make it plaine that in this case the Romanists either miserably or doggedly snarle at all antiquity or vtterly reiect and deny it Cap. 9. § 20. the most expedite course they can deuise to ouerthrow that which in truth would ouerthrow them His first instance is in the matter of Pope Ione The truth of which historie when he hath confirmed by the witnesse of more then a double Grand-iurie of sufficient Authors older and later Greekes and Latines domesticall and forraigne Diuines Lawyers and Physitians Philosophers Poets and other humanitians Priests Bishops in their accompt Saints and Cardinals Fryars Monkes and Canons yea and whole Vniuersities not one of them an enemy nay not so much as one of them not a friend to the Roman Catholicke Court and Religion c. At last hauing named the seuerall Authors in the Margin of his page hee saith Yet because this story doth preiudice the vaunt of their perpetuall succession doth make vncertaine their pretended onely sufficient ordination giues a shrewd shake to their counterfeit rocke c. Fiue or sixe and thirty Authors constantly in diuers countries in many Ages in Catholicke Vninersities Citizens of Rome and Officers in the Popes Court secular religious are all corrupted falsified denyed discredited shaken off and branded with infamy and all must be without sap or sense truth or honesty learning or credit onely to salue that frothy Sea from this filthy Queane And all this begun and set on foot by that one consciencelesse Onuphrius De Rom. pon◠l. 2. c. 6. whom Cardinall Bellarmine himselfe reiecteth as a contradictor of all antiquity and for auouching that for which he hath no authority Who was borne some hundreds of yeares after some of the said Historians which is strange that any man should beleeue it fit that he alone is sufficient to out-beard and out-face all former antiquity And saith D. Fauour I maruell how they laugh not one at another when they see how they gull the simple world as the Auruspices did among the Gentiles His second example is the story of Pope Silvester the second infeofing Antichrist in the Sea of Rome by liucrie and seisin about which he sheweth that they vse the like dealing as about the former story of Pope Ione And while I considered these foule abuses in the Church of Rome there came to my minde an answer which a Iesuite Father Floyd made vnto me when I told him that King Iames his answer to Cardinall Perrone his speech in the Parliament of Paris did charge the said Cardinall with manifold falsifications of the holy Scriptures to proue the Popes power to depose Princes And that if the King were not answered the cause would be much scandalized The Iesuite answered mee that there was too much written already and that he must be answered another way I was afraid then to aske him any more fearing it might be another Powder-plot the rather because I heard Master Smith my old Lady Kneuets Priest affirme that he had heard a zealous Catholicke say when he first heard how the Powder-plot had missed that it was the onely way in the world that could haue beene deuised to haue rooted out the Protestants And now I am easily drawne to beleeue Father Floyd that they will answer no more with bookes or writings but with force and plots if as the Scripture saith Ex ore tuo te iudico a man may iudge according to their owne words specially if we consider how the secular Priests do charge the Iesuites with ambitious vsurping authority in the Church of Rome corrupting it with their treasonable doctrines as is euident in the said Priests bookes whereof I haue already giuen the Reader some taste And I thinke good here to adde more the rather because that the bookes are not easily to be had for that the Iesuites making vse of a rich Spanish Ladies purse for the buying vp and burning of hereticall bookes they tooke vp as many as they could of these Priests books which they counted worst