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A42884 A true and lively character of a right communicating church-member briefely laid down in eighteen severall arguments: proving an absolute necessity of separating, not only, from all that are openly prophane, but from such also, who have not some visible, that is to say, probable worke of the sanctifying spirit upon them. By Iohn Gobert Master of Arts, and minister of the Gospel. Gobert, John. 1650 (1650) Wing G904B; ESTC R217419 24,327 70

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because such as are now call'd Presbyterians were in the Bishops times call'd Conformists because they subscribed to the doctrine and discipline then established it must needs follow that if some other weighty cause mooved not viz. a reformation of a Church Member that one of these Parties at least rather sought occasion of exception against the Bishops then found it 3. It setteth Professours together amongst themselves for who knows not that though in respect of practice of taking in or casting out these two Parties differ not but in circumstanciall or matter of discipline yet the judgement upon which such and such are to be taken or not to be taken in is something more and a matter doctrinall The 17th Argument is from the mimicall imitation of the Papists wherein they strive to have all the members of their Church visibly holy thus Whatsoever is pretended by the adversaries of truth and so farre practised by them as more sutable and serviceable to Gods honour that in gathering of Church-members is not of truths friends to be left out and neglected but even the adversaries of truth do by their doctrine and practise teach in pretence at least that only members visibly holy are to be received into Church-fellowship Ergo this ought of truths friends to be sincerely taught and practised The major will be easily granted by all such as thinke it reasonable that for zeale of holinesse Churches professedly reformed come not short of Papists The minor proposition is proved by instance Take those points of popery which are truly so called that is wherein they and we the case so standing doe and must differ and we shall all along still observe that in all their doings they aime at perfection in a Church-member As first in their beliefe concerning Baptisme they teach and beleeve that Baptisme doth absolutely take away originall sinne so that those motions of sin or unto sinne by some called reliquiae or the remnants of sinne are not sin properly as indeed they are not of the person but of the nature as our Divines distinguish Neither is it a specificall property of all sinne to be voluntary by their owne confession to instance in originall sinne in an infant But put the case now that a Church-member of theirs fall into a sinne after Baptisme they call mortall they then fall upon another salve for perfection or visible holinesse in a Church-member and that is their doctrine concerning pennance wherein they teach that auricular confession which by them is made a Sacrament conferring grace doe restore them fully to that integritie which they received in Baptisme and when they are thus restored they have a doctrine that of such as are in grace the Law can be fulfilled and kept So that their after-obedience and pennance doe not only ex congruo but ex condigno merit life eternall And all these beliefes though protestants doe justly except against as hay stubble and wood built upon the golden foundation of the christian profession yet from these tenents as bad as they are we may gather thus much That they thinke it a very unreasonable thing to admit of a Church-member into communion in all the ordinances which is not at least visibly holy The eighteenth Argument is from hence That no mischief or spirituall danger can follow the taking into Church fellowship Members only that are visibly holy Thus Whatsoever can be profitably done without the least prejudice or spirituall hinderance of any one not taken in for a Member that caeteris paribus that is to say which can be done without any kind of inconvenience ought to be put in practise But the gathering of Members only visibly holy can be practised without the least hazard of such as are not qualyfied that is they can run no spirituall hazard or danger Ergo such kinde of Church gathering ought to be put in practise The major is easily proved and may well serve for a 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or signe of Gods will and pleasure this way for if there were the least hinderance to mans salvation by such a practise we might safely say this or such a way could not be of God For as among Divines that sence of scripture is not to be received which being so taken oppugneth other scriptures so neither is that thought to be Gods ordinance which opposeth the generall good of mans salvation The minor is thus proved Whatsoever hindereth not either the covenant of Gods election or the influence of the spirit from working faith and repentance yea which hindereth not the increase of grace in any that are actually in Gods favour that cannot be a prejudice to the salvation of any but to take in for Members of a Church such onely as are visibly holy doth none of these it neither hindereth the covenant of Gods election nor the influence of the spirit in working faith and repentance neither doth it hinder the increase of grace in any that are actually in Gods favour Ergo to take in only such qualified Members is safely and securely to be practised The major being granted The minor proposition is grounded from the example of the woman of Canaan who was no visible Member of a Church and yet her faith was greater then any's in Israel If indeed we were popish in our beliefe that the Sacraments were not only seales but meanes of grace so farre that they give grace ex opere operate then there might be some question in the point But our beliefe is that one either well catechised or preached unto wanteth nothing externall simply necessary to salvation If any doe now object that if we can with such safety be out of this externall Church communion wherefore then as well not out as in to what end is it to become a member To which we answer First that this might be as safely objected to any professed ordinance which all acknowledge to be of God May we not thus except against Baptisme or the word preached May not reading serve instead of preaching or is it not enough to hear of the doctrin of Baptisme Therefore as in such cavils the usuall answer is That not the want of an Ordinance but the contempt is damnable and that ordinance is contemned which we might enjoy and do not The same answer will serve for this present purpose When we may become members and are not gathered t is our contempt Secondly this exception would serve if we held that Church-communion were only for our selves but this we doe not Church-communion is for more necessary and importent ends as first that Gods will and command in this particular might be fulfilled and done and this all parties confesse not only by their owne practise but by beleeving the communion of Saints Secondly this Church-fellowship is the Citie set upon an hill and a lighted candle set upon a candlestick that others might see this ●●●ly work and so glorifie God for it in the day of their conversion FINIS