your labours and blesse you for them as Moses blessed the builders of the tabernacle Exod. 39.43 Your first argument therefore is to weak to vphold your church or best assemblies and the assumption of your profyllogisme is denyed The 2 argument 2. THose Churches whose true members are onely espowsed to Christ a true visible Churches Ephe. 5.30.32 2. Cor. 11.2 But the true members of our best assemblies are espowsed onely to Christ. Therefore c. Proof of the assumption They are espowsed onely to Chrisi which are indued with true sauing faith Eph. 5 30.31.32 with Iohn 15.3 4.5.7 17 20.21 But the true members of our best assemblies are indued with a true sauing faith confessed by Mr. Iohnson in Iakob pag. 7· Look also in the confirmation of the 5. argument folowing here Therefore c. Answer HEre agayn you haue gott an other starting hole whiles you plead but for the true members of your best assemblies yet neither tel you vs which are your best assemblies nor who be the true members of them that how to follow or where to finde you we cannot tel As is the way of an eagle in the aire such is the way of an adultrous woman it is hid and cannot be known But I will see if I can discouer your falsehood though I cannot find your footing First I deny that the true members of your best assemblies are espowsed onely to Christ. for as the prophet sayd of Israel lift vp your eyes uÌto the high placs behold wher you haue not plaied the harlot Now whils a church doth play the harlot Christ willeth vs to plead with her that she is not his wife neyâher is he her husband Idolatrie is spirituall whordome as the Prophets testifie Psa. 106 39. Ier. 3.9 Deut. 31.16 but the true members of your best assemblies commit idolatrie in their daylie worship according to their Romish leiturgy or book of commoÌ prayer an idol of your own inuentioÌ How are they theÌ espowsed to Christ alone Yes they are say you because they ar indued with true sauing faith I answer Faith is in the hart as it is writen with the hart man beleeueth Rom. 10.10 The hart no man knoweth but God alone as agayn it is written thou Lord onely knowest the harts of all the children of men 1 King 8 39 So then I ask you how you know that your members haue true faith your answer must needs be vnlesse you wâll make your selfe a God you know it not but by their words and works Wel theÌ let vs bring these to th' trial their confession and theâr practise leauing their faith to God that knowes it The confâssion of theâr faith is set downe in their service book the 12. articles of the Creed But this Creed the Papists also confesse and read in their church and if it will proue your people to haue true faith it will proue theirs to haue likewise you say no more for England then for Rome Agayn the Apostle sayth there are some which professe that they know God but in works doe deny him and are abominable and disobedient and to euery good work reprobate So then words are not yenough to proue true faith But we must come to the Apostle Iames his triall shew me thy fayth out of thy works for faith without works is dead Now the works of your people are apparant to be evil they standing in communion or confusion rather with the vnclean profane and wicked whereby al Gods holy things are defiled as it is written Num. 19.22 Hag. 2.14 submitting their soules to Antichristian prelates and priests and hearing their voyce contrariâ to Iohn 10 5. worshiping God in vayn after their own invented seruice book which is a high transgression of the second commandement Exo 20 And these things are general and publick the particular and more priuate inâqâities will not easily be numbred Whereas therefore you would perswade vs your church is espowsed onely to Christ although her fornicatâons are so manifest between her brests because she sayth she beleeveth only in Christ it is with no more colour then as if Bilhah wheÌ she was known to lie with Reuben should haue pleaded yet am I an honest woman and espowsed to Iaacob onely for my loue and harty affection is towards him alone But the wise man teacheth vs these be but the tricks of an adultrous woman she eateth and wipeth her mouth sayth I haue done no iniquity Pro 30 20. The scriptures which your selfe allege doe also make against your chvrch Eph 5 30. We are members of Christs body of his flesh and of his bones Fârst your church can shew no covenant that was made between Christ and her at any time the gathering and planting of your church having been by the Magistrates authority not by the word of Christ winning mens soules unto his faith separating them from the vnbeleevers and taking them to communion with himselfe Secondly in saying his body the Apostle excludeth al other bodies as more plainlie appeareth in the other scripture 2 Cor. 11.2 where he prepared the church as a pure virgin for Christ which cannot be whiles she defileth her self with others as doth your church with the abominations of the Papists compaÌying also in the bed of loue with the Prelates whom the better son of you haue confessed to be Antichristian and their inferâour priests who work vpon mens consciences by their jurisdiction ministery doctrines canons c. being as the bridegrooms of your church not the friends of the bridegroom which stand and heare and reioyce for the bridegrooms voyce for that Christ should speak and rule vnlesse it be according to their own canons they cannot endure The other places in Iohn 15. 17. will confirme also that the true members of your best assemblies are not espowsed onely to Christ For Christ sheweth that his Father is the husbandman who caleth and bringeth vnto and planteth in him the true vine all the branches that is the particular persons of the Church But the true members of your best assemblies are as yet the branches of that false Antichristian vine your confused church of England not separated from but liuing and growing in one stock body and communion with the idolatrous and profain So that you cannot say as did the Israel of God Thou hast brought a vine out of Aegypt thou hast cast out the heathens plaÌted it Christ sheweth that his branches were purged of the Father by the word spoken vnto theÌ your members ar not yet purged or clensed by the word of Christ from their idolatries and profane communion with the ympes of Satan The word of life the word of separatioÌ from the serpeÌt his seed hath not yet sounded in the eares or at least not sunk into the harts of your people Christ branches bring forth much fruit through their abiding in him being able without him to doe nothing your
branches bear little fruit but vnto themselues and as Moses foretold their grapes are grapes of gal their clusters bitter for the publick idolatries vsed in your assemblies after the maner of the mother of Rome shew that your vine is of the vine of Sodom Christ prayed onely for them that should beleeu in him through the word that they all might be one in the Father and the Son as the Father in him and he in the Father but the true members of your best assemblies are one with the world for whome Christ would not pray being on spiritual body ioyned in communioÌ with the whol multitude of profane and wicked of the land That strange it is you should read the scriptures and not discerne how farr you are from being vnited with Christ who as himselfe was not of the world so neyther are his people but chosen and separated out of the same Whereas you bring no proof that your people haue true faith but by Mr Iohnsons confession it sheweth how distressed and helplesse your estate is Yet doe you great wrong to Mr. Io as the reader may see in the place that you cite For although considering them apart from the constitution of your Church he thinketh by the appearance of the knowledge faith and fruits of diuers that they may well be thought in regard of Gods election in Christ to be heirs of saluation and in that respect true Christians yet in respect of the constitution of your Church he sayth they can not be iudged true Christian. Now we deal against your church in regard of the constitution thereof not doubting but God hath many elect heyres of salâation among you which we leaue vnto him that knowes them Your argument then from Mr Iohnsons confession is faultie and agreeth not with the rules of right reasoning for whereas he limiteth his iudgment of them shewing in what respect it is plainelie excepteth their church-constitution you bear your reader in hand as if he granted it without lâmitation and that too according to the Scriptures in your first proposition which evidently do concern the churches constitution You may much abuse any mans words if what he speaketh respectively you will take and allege as spoken absolâtelie So your proofe fayleth you In the end you referr vs to the confirmation of your 5 Argument following to the Answer whâreof I also refer the reader Now though I haue answered first to the assumption or second part of your argument on proof whereof you doe insist yet the first part also shal be better examined ere I let it passe Those churches you say whose true members are onely espowsed to Christ. are true visible churches By true members I conceiue you doe meane not as the truth is all baptised and so reteyned in your church but some few choise persons or forward professors among whom there is an imaginary brotherhood and separation from the other profane in your parishes though invery deed they stand all one bodie If thus you intend as the proof of your assumption plainelie intimateth you do then offer you violence to the similitud of mariage or espowsall which al meÌ know is not with some few members of a womans body as her fingers or hands c but with the whole woman who giueth her selfe by covenant vnto her spowse or husband And as in civill mariage so it is in spirituall for Israel of old when the Lord became a husband vnto them did not some of them but all the multitude generally make covenant with their God the scriptures also which you alleg Eph 5.2 Cor 11 speak of the whole body of the church not of a few select members of the same For though it be true of every visible church that some onely are elect howsoeuer all be called yet the discerning of this belongeth to God alone and not to vs who esteem of persons according to their outward covenant profession and walking Your reason then seemes to be like this That womans âhose true members as namely her eye and eare and some of her fingers are espowsed onâly to such a man She is his true and lawfull wife But the true members of N howsoeuer her whole bodie in generall is coupled with an adulterer and the most of her members ar affected and wholly giuen ouer to that adulterer and her pretended husband they hate never made couenaÌt with ar espowsed only to such a man Threfore c. If this reason be not absurd let him that readeth iudge and if such absurdity be not implyed in your argument shew if you can in your next writing for if you striue to avoyd this you will fall into another evill as shall then be manifested The 3. argument IN what churches soever is such an ordinance of God in publick vse and forâ by which there is ordinarily made an vndoubted resurrection or quickning froÌ the death of sinne vnto the life of grace and a new birth they are true visible churches of Christ. Iam 1 18 1 Pet 1 23. But in the best of our assemblies is such an ordinance of God c. Therefââe c. The assumption is manifest because by that ordinance of preaching which is in publick vse and force there is ordinarily made an vndoubted new birth seing there doe ordinarily appear in many the vndoubted fruites and testimonies of Gods spirit after the publick and ordinary preaching of the word in our best assemblies Answer THE first part of this your argument seemeth to imply an error as that a church is first gathered constituted of an vnregenerate profane and worldly people over which are set Pastors and Teachers who by preaching the Gospel doe beget them or some of them vnto thâ faith and quicken them from the death of sinn c which quickning or new birth is a proof that they are a true visible church This course I finde to be contrary vnto the scriptures which I would thus manifest When the Lord Iesus would shew mercy to the world and call his elect out of the same he sent Apostles Prophets and Evangelists to preach his saluation to all peoples The people to whom they preached werâ not for the most part churches of God but assemblies of heathens and idolaters as for example the men of Lystra of Corinth of Athens where Paul preached in Mars street and other like places By meaneâ of this manner preaching many âeople were regenerate or beâne a new quickned from the death of sâââe aâd tuââed from idols to the liuing God And being thus begotten vnto God they were separated from others that belâeued not and ioyned togither into a holy comâunion not hauing other officers over them for a while till men were fitted for such a worke Therefore oft times the Apostles departed to other places and left the Evangelâsts to redresse things that remayned and to ordein them Elders in every citie as the Apostles
appoynted them These Elders called generally Bishops or Ouerseers had charge of their particular flocks and might not goe from them as did the Apostles but attend and feed them These now could not properly be sayd to beget their peoâle to the faith as the Apostle noteth to the Corinthians but to feed and instruct them and therefore are not called Fathers but Feeders or Pasters and Pedagogues Child-leaders or Instructeurs From which I gather that people must regenerate and borne again before they may be admitted into any particular church or haue officers ouer them and that ordinary ministers which feed their flocks cannot be sayd to beget them as is the common vawnt of you Ministers in England which me thinks even reason it selfe might shew you For you that are now over your parishes how found you your people at first a church or no church If you say a church then you begat them not but entred vpon other mens labours that were before you if you say they were not a church then you condemn the state of your parishes as they were planted before you were their Ministers Now then to come to your âroposition In whatsâever churches that is assemblies for so I vnderstand you to vse the werd generallie as the Scripture sometime vseth Ecclesia is such an ordinance of God in publick vse and force by which there is ordinarily made an vndoubted new birth c. they are true visible churches of Christ This I denie for in the assemblies of the heathens in the Apostles daies as before is proued there was such an ordinance of God sometimes in publick vse and force as by it ordinarilie there was made an vndoubted new birth as th' fruit of th' Apostles preaching sheweth· yet were not those assemblies of heathens true visible churches of Christ. but such onelie as were converted to God and separated from the rest that beleeved not and joyned in a holy communion togither were true visible churches Whereas you assume that in the best of your assemblies is such an ordinancâ of God c this also I denie for your ministers are not Gods ordinance he hath not called or sent them they execute no lawfull office in your assemblies But your assumption you say is manifest because by that ordinance âf preaching which is in publick vse and force there is ordinarily made an vndoubted new birth I answer first in verie many of your assemblies there is no such ordinance of preaching in publick use as you here bâast of but bare reading onely yet those assemblies are by the Constitutions of your church to be reputed as true visible churches as the other SecoÌdly in those other other where preaching is I deny that there is ordinarily madâ an vndoubed new birth Your proof is because thâre do ordinarily appear in many the undoubted fruites and testimonis of Gods spirit c. I answer first if this be so yet what will these many help the moât and greatest âumber in whom such fruits appear not When many of the hethens beleeued the Apostles word did their beleef bring the other that beleeued not into the church did not the Apostles separate the beleeuers from the rest and teach them to come from among them Yet you for the faith of some will vnite all the assemblie vnto Christ and his church contrary to the Apostles practise and to all the scriptures Secondly I deny that there doth ordinarily appear in many such vndoubted fruits of Gods spirit after your ordinary preaching as for which we may esteem them true visible churches Some fruites I knâw there doe appear so doe there among the Papists yea they take occasion for such things to reproch you that there follow not so many good works after your preaching as after their doctrine but among neyther of you are those fruits seen whâch by the testimonie of scriptures will proue you true visible churches So we haue here but your bare affirmation to rest vpon and though I might thus end with as bare a deniall tâl you bring further proof yet for to help the reader I wil shew that ordinarily there appeareth not a new birth after your preaching Because of your publick idolatrous estate whereân you stand subiect to Antichristian Prelatâs and canons whiles you haue your publick worship after the Romish idolatrous manner and are stil comming led in one bodie with the profane and serâents seed with many other evils among you which plainly shew you want the new birth and are stil in your old mothers womb This the scriptures which you allege in your proposition will confirme for the Apostles shew Iam 1 18 1 Pet 1 23. that Christs church is a people begotten of God with the word of truth that is the Gospell but your church was first begotten gathered constituted ordered and is still continued by the Magistrates word and authority which if it did not inforce the people the estate wherein you now stand would soon be changed your church dissolved and eyther be better or Worse And where you learned so to inforce fââth and constrein men to be members of your church I can not tel vnlesse you follow Mahomets doctrine who taught that men should be compelled to the faith by warr and sword Againe the Apostle addeth this for a testimony and end of our new birth that we should be as the first fruitâ of Gods creatures This men are not till they be as was Israel hallowed to the Lord Ier 2 3 which was by separation from the world Levit 20.26 and a willing covenant with the Lord Exod. 19.5 6.8 Dâut 26 17 18 19 And that the like must be of vs Christians an other scrâpture confirmeth saying These are they wâiâh are not defilâd with women for thây are virgins this implyeth a seâarâtâon from the world âhâsâ fâllow the Lamb whithârsoeuer he goeth this argueth a couenant and communion with Chriât and in the next words both poynts are repeted these are 1 bought from men being the first fruits 2 ânto Gâd and to the Lamb after this followeth the fruit and in their mouth ãâã found no guile for they are without spot before the throne of God Whereas therefore you haue stood so long against vs for separation and would mainteyn a meer confusion of all sorts of people in a Câârch vpon an imaginary separation made in the clowdes of your own fansies whiles outwardly and indeed you are one body with the wicked you are vndoubtedly âot yet borne a new your Church hath not strength to bring forth your ministers are vnskilfull midwiues and the saying of the Prophet coÌcerning the people of Ephraim is verified also vâoÌ your people be is an vnwise son els would be not stand still such a time even in the breaking forth of the childâen Hos 13 13. The 4. Argument IN what churches soeuer all things needfull to saluation by publick authoryây and gânârall approbation are ordinarily and
answer I may err iudgment so may others even whole churches therefore let euery man look how he iudgeth and how he deâendeth on other men and let evey mans âudgment be tried by the scriptures For this cause we say vnto you seing we haue fought for the judgement of other churches but can get no answer procure you some reasons from them in defence of your church ministerie worship and ecclesiasticall gouerâment and if by Gods word they can justâfy those things and evince that we haue done evil to depart from you we will returne vnto you Otherwise if they reioyce neuâr so mâch for your estate we are verâly perswaded that both they and you haue more causâ to mourne for the many abominations that are amâng ãâã To conclude consider in an example the weight of your argument for by the like reâson the envious ministers in Pauls time mought thus haâe justâfied themselues That mânisterie and ministration for which the Apostles of Christ reioyce is true to be obeyed and continued in But our ministery and minâstration is such as for it the Apostle Paul reioyceth yea and will râioyce Philip â 16.18 If you Answer the Apostle reioyced for the preaching of Christ not forthe envious affection of the preachers who might be damned themselues notwithstanding their true doctrine it is true And so minde I for the reformed churches They reioyce for the many truthes you profesâe against Popery as we also doe the like yet may you neverthelesse perish for your false constitution idolatrous worship popish hierarchie and other transgressions that are among you Amend your liues therefore and turne your feet into the wayes of peace for if you rely vpon man anâ make âlesh yoâr arme and will not heâr the word of the Lord that condemneth your iniquities you shâll perish in your sinns other chârches shall not be able to excuse of sâue you ARGVMENTS That the PREACHERS of the best assemblies of the church of ENGLAND are true ministers of Christ. I THâ prâachers after whose publick powerfull doctrine of the word do ordinarily follow repeÌâance conuersion to God sauing fayth in Christ loue to the brethrân and oâheâ fruits of the spiâit Gal. 5 6 22. in the hearers are true ministers of God and of the visible chârcâ But âfter âhe dâctrine of Gods word taught by the preachers of our best asseâbliâs doe ordânarily appear the fruites of the spirit in the hearers Thârefore thâ preachers of our best assemblies are true ministers of Christ. The âroposition is proued because onely the word that God doth send in the ãâã oâ his ministers is ordinarily effectuâll for these things Ier. 23 22 Esa. 55 11. Mat 7 20 Luk 1 76 Ioh. 10.1 2. 1 Cor 9 1. â 4 15. Thâ assumption is proued by the answer to the assumption of the 4 argumeââ ãâã thâ churcheâ Answer OVR separation is from your Church consisting of many assemblieâ all compact into ore bodâe and from all your Ministerie both prelacie and priesthood We cannot tel which assemblies or ministers be best for they that seem best may proue worst because they most deceiue the simple the wolf that comes in a sheeps coat is no whit better than he that commeth in his natiue hiew but he may doe more harm in that he is disguised Reason would perswade vs that the Bishops are the preachers of your best assemblies for they haue greatest dignity fatherhood and authority in your church they preach in the highest and most honorable assemblies of the land they are most carefull to obserue their oath of due obedience to keep the canonâ orders lawes and ceremonies of your church and set themselues against such as secretly vndermine the state of the church and ministerie of England yet openlie stand members and professed friends of the same They and their assemblies are best ordered after the constitution and lawes of your church So that to speak as I think I know not which assemblies be best where the Leven hath sow red the whole lump though I can guesse which you doe mean but plain dealing about your ministers and asâemblies would haue beseemed you best Tel vs therefore when you next write what ministers you mean whether the Bishops Deanes Doctors c. that are in the cathedrall churches or the Doctors and Diuines that are in your vniuersities or thâ Parsons Vicars Lecturers that are in your Parishes Again what Ministers they be whither Apostles or Prophets or Evangelists or Pastors or Teachers for all these are ministers Eph. 4. and meet it is to know your meaning for though Apostles and Pastors be both ministers ordeined of Christ yet if one will say everie Pastor is an Apostle he is but a liar So you see it is needfull that we ransack these your ambiguous and generall termes Now for your argument first I answer to the proposition that though these fruites you mention doe many times follow the doctrine of Christs ministers yet not theirs onely nor alwaies Not onelie because other men that are not in office of Ministerie may by excercise of their gifts work such fruites as appeareth 1 Cor. 14.1.31.3.24 25. c. I appeal also to your selues whether you thinke not that your best ministers though silenced or degraded from all ministeriall office may not when they teach work repentance fath and other fruites of the spirit Neither doe these fruites alwayes follow the doctrine of true ministers for Noah preached 120· yeares yet followed there not faith and repentance in the old world Christ himselfe preached to Chorazin and Bethsaida yet left the woe vpon them and complaineth in Esaias that he had laboured in vayn among the Iewes and of Israel it is said All the day long haue I stretched out my hand a disobedient and gâynsaying people To reason therefore from the effects this man wrought faith by his teaching therefore he is a true minâster or this man wrought not faith by his teaching therefore no true minister is vnsound and vnconcludable by the scriptures The âroofs of your proposition being examined wil be found to light for your purpose if you mean that the officers doctrine onely or alwayes is effectuall for these thinâs to weet repentance faith c often I know it is and alwayes it hath effect eyther to life or death in the hearers Your scriptures are Ier 23 22. which sheweth what true prophets should labour to doe namely to turne sinners from their evill way c whereas the false prophets did otherwise Eze 13 22 but proueth not that the prophets onely did this for the Priests and Levites did it also Mal 2 6 yea priuate men may often turne their neighbours from evill Leu 4 27.8 19.17 Prou. 31.26 Mal. 3 16 Mat. 18.15 Iam. 5.19 20. neyther proveth it that the prophets alwayes did this for Esaias crieth Lord who hath beleeued our report Isa. 53.1 and it is written that the Lord testified to Israel by all the Prophets
more to separate from theâ being maynteyned in a false vnleâse a false Church haue more privâlige tâen â crâe And we consider that our separation is from the corrââptioÌ of â false Church 2. The scrâptures also are playn that we must separate and forsake all false Churches as well as corruâtions in a true 2. Cor. 6 17. Come out from among them and separate your sâlues saith the Lord and touch no unclean thâng and I will receiue you Reuelation 18 4 Goe out of her my people that ye receive not of her plagues Hosea 4.15 Come not ye vnto Gilgal neither give vp to Bethâven and many the like How rightly then doe you allege scriptures as if they taught vs separation in a Church onely and not out of it also when it is false and Idolatroâs 3. Yoâr selues are a president to vs of like practise in separating not in but out of the Church of Rome as yoâ haue dealt with the mother so doe we with the daughter because like mother like daughter according to the prouerb Eze. 16.44 4. You allege thâ examples of all the prophâts yet shew you not any that âalâed by your râle to seâarate in the Church and not out of it Wee are sure they called the people out of the Church of Israel when it was idolatrous aâd forbad them to come at their aâsemblies Hos 2.2.3.4 4 15.17 Amos. 5.5 And how they coâld themselues joyn with that Church from which they separated others is strange uÌto us especially coÌsiâerinâ that Israel in that estate is noted by the proâhet Azariah to be withâut the true God without Pââist to teach ând wihtâut law 1 Chro. 15.3 and may we thinke he separated not from that Church The Israelites thân sacrââiced to Divils not to Gââ Deut. 3â 17. Chron. 11.15 and wil yoâ sây the prophets separated not from them 5. The like I Answer to the examples of Christ and his Apostles who as tâey absteyned from corruptioâs in the Ieâish Church so were they qââre sepârâteâ from all false Churches as the Samâritans and other like Mat 10 5. Ioh. 4.22 Act. 2.40 199 so theâr examples also doe approue our practise 6. Wâere as you would haue noted that those Churches which Christ and hâs Apâstles coââunicated with were Antianosaicall as yours we âay arâ ãâã I ãâã tâe comparâson For â the Iewish Church consistâd it all ãâ¦ã the same Leuit 20 21.16 of a people separated not onely from heathens but also from fâlse professors heretiks and idolaters and were children of the prophets aâd couenant of God Iohn 4.9 Act 3.25 But your Church cânsâsteth âf an vnseparated people children of Idolatrous Priests strangers from the couenant of God 2. The Iewes then had their sacrifices seruices and solemne feasts according to Moses Law Mat 8.4 Mar 14.12 Luk 9. âO 2.21 24 and Chrâst himselfe jâstâfâed theâr worship Ioh. 4.22 but your seruice worship and fâstivalâ are after Antichrists law translated out of his masse-booke 3. Theâr Priests were according to Moses instâtution of Aarons line Luk 1 5. with 1 Chro. 2.1 10 their Scribes and Pharisees sate in Moses chaâre Mat 23.2 your Priests after the Popes institution your prelates fit in Antichrist chair So they wer not so much against Moses as you are agaânst Christ and that your Church reteyneth not the foundation Christ shal through his grace anone be proued The 2. Consideration 2. OVR Church hath the essentiall notes of a true church able to beget a true sauing faith to worke the fruites of the spirit to make a man a true and perfect Christian and last of all to saue him To the which also Christ hath tied his gracious promise and blessing to the end of the world Rom 10 13 17 Mat 28 19.20 Act 20.32 2 Tim. 3.15.16 1. Tim. 4.16 Iam. 1.21 Isa 55 11. Answer THese notes which you propound 1 are not the essentiall notes of a true Church a neyther if they were are they ordinariely found in your Church 1. These are not essentiall notes because 1 One man may haue al this you speake of and no one man is or can be a Church for that consisteth of a multitude or nuÌber of persons it is an assembly or convocation joyntly together it is a body and euery one severally is but a member 1. Cor 12 20.27 That one man may haue all your esâentiall notes may appear in Pavls exaâple who was able to bâget a true sauing faith to worke the fruites of the spirit and so the rest 1. Cor. 4 â5 Gal. 3 2 5. 2. An Angel may haue all the notes you mention and no Angel is a Church For example the Angel Gabriel who was sent to giue Daniel knowledge and understanding and preached liuly of Christs death the benifits thereof Dan. 9.21.22 c 3. A wicked man may doe al that you speake of but no wicked man is a true church Iudas sent forth with the other Apostles to preach and work miracles might bring others to saluation by his doctrine though hâmselfe were a reârobate Mat. 10.5 6. c 4. A true Church is the spowse hous of Christ bringeth him forth a sâirituall seed But as God gaue the blessing of multiâlying childreÌ onely to lawfull maried estate yet often it commeth to passe through hâs almighty power and goodneââe that harlots also are partakers of this bleâsing and doe bring forth children so the blessing of spirituall propagation is peculiar to the true Church yet God which brought light out of darknes causeth some children to be borne and brought vp vnto him in false Churches For example the Church of Rome the mother of whordoms and abominations of the earth hath doubtles since she was wedded to Antichrist borne and brought vp by the generall true grounds of Chrstian relâgeon taught in her many children of God and heyres of saluation This I sâppose your selues will not deny neyther yet wâll you say that Rome is Christ true Church Your reason then is as if Thamer should haue pleaded I am able to bear câildren to nourse and brâng them vp to mans estate c. therefore I am my Father Iudahâ true and lawfull wife Gen. 38 15.18 c. 2. Now if these were essentâall notes which you haue set down yet helpe they you nothing for I deny that they ar ordinarily found in your Chârch For though I doubt not but the doctrine of your Church hath saued many yet that is Gods extraordinary blessing not the ordinarie effects of your Church This is the thinâ you should haue proued by comparing yoâr Church and minâsterie with the Lawes and promises in Gods word which because you haue not done but onely quoted some scriptures generally which men of all religions may doe likeweise I will by one or two of the scriptâres that your selfe here ciâe shew how vnlike you are to a true Church and Ministery In Rom. 10.3.17 th' Apostle treateth of two things 1 of calling on the name of the Lord and 2 of faith by
hearing his word 1. Whosoeuer call th upon the name of the Lord shal be saued This we are to understand according to Dauids exposition whosoeuer calleth vpon him in truth Psa. 145 18. for God is a spirit and must be worshiped in spirit and trâth Ioh. 4.24 but the worship and calling vpon God which your Church vseth in reading the prayers letanie collects and other like things of your Leiturgie translated out of AntiChrâst masse-booke is carnall false Idolatrous for such a manner of diuine service you haue no commandement or warrant in the scriptures And this popish worship begetteth not but destroyeth faith and the true caling on Godâ name and deceiueth mens sowles for in vayn they worship me sayth Christ teaching fâr doctrine the precepts of men Mat. 15.9 and they that wayt vpân lyâng vanâties forsake their own mercy Ionah 1 8 2. For the other poynt Faâth is by bearing or by report saith the Apostle and proueth it by Isa. 53.1 Lord who hath beleeued our beâring that is our report Now no man can truly and faithfully report ânlesse God hath first spoken vnto ââm neâther can aây man fruâtfully hear other report or doctrine then the Lords and so hearing is by the word of God iâ the mouthes of such as are sent as he sheweth in the 15 verse But youâ Ministers are not truly and lawfully sent for they cannot shew eyther calling ordination or office according to Chrâsts Testament therefore they cannot truly and lawfully preach his word and consequently cannot beget ordinarily a true sauing faith The next scripture also Mat 28 19 20 playnly condemneth the state of your Church and ministerâe for 1. There is a lawfull calling authorizing and sending of ministerâ from him that hath all power in heauen and in earth saying Goe therfore and teach but such a sending your ministers haue not for as your selues haue sayd they enter not in by Chrict but by a Popish and vnlawfull vâcation 2. There is a commandement to teach or make disciples before they be receiued into th' Church by baptisme for oâ them that ar taught such onely as gladly receiue and beleeue the word are to be baptised and admitted into the Church as the practise of th' Apostle sheweth Act. â 40 41. but your Church was not thuâ gathered or plaÌted by th' preaching of the Gospell but by the commandement of the Magistrate neither weâ onely the willing beleevers receiued and others refused but the whole profane multitudes wer admitted or rather compelled into your church wher they and their seed are still retâyned 3. There Gods Ministers are willed to teach Chrâstians so baptised to obserue all things whatsoeuer Christ commanded his Apostles verse 20 so they haue his gracious promise and blessing to the end of the world but in your church many things are obserued which Christ neuer commaâded Yea the Ministerie and goâerment appoynted in his TestameÌt are held and confirmed by practise among you not to be perpetual not necessary nor fitting for your state but an other pompous minâstery and Lordly ecclesiastical gouerment after the manner of the court of Rome And as for power and liberây to obserue Christ commandements that is farr from your people which al are in bondage to the Bishops and their courts hauing not chrâstian freedom to censure sinne or sinners or practise the ordinances of the Gospel as the Apostles did vnlesse Princes and Parliaments will permit or command them The like may be sayd and returned vpon you from the other scriptures by you alleged all which doâ concerne the true church and ministerie as your selues will not deny and so will helpe you nothing vntill you proue your church and ministerie such Boast not therefore of a true sauing faith and fruites of the spirit when such bitter fruites and works of the flesh doe reign among you for faith without works ãâã dâad Iam. 2.26 Now then if you will giue us leaue to consider the state of your Church aright we would mind it thus your Church hath the essentiall notes of a false Church namly a confuse prophane worldly people with an Antichrâstian Prelacie and preisthood over them able to beget ordinarily but a vayne and dead faith through want of the true ministery of the word in Christs ordinance and by meanes of the false worship and false doctânes that are in your Church to worke the fruits of the flesh as the idolatries and other sinful actions abounding in your Church doe shew to make a man a very Antichristian by resisting persecuting and blaspheming the true way of Christ and practise of his Gospel which alas too many doe and last of all to destroy him if he repent not of his sinneâând find mercie with the Lord. which we desire you all may finde for the saluation of your soules The 3. Consideration OVr Church and ministerie are approved of and rejoyced for of all the pure reformed Churches in the world Our confession by them placed in the Harmonie of Confessions giâing vs the right hand of fellowship as also by all the godly learned and most sound and excellent fathers lights of the churâh that euer liued in or meddle with our church Bucer Marâyr Fagius Alasio Knoxe who liued ân our church Caluin Beza Bullinger Gualtâr âymlâr Zanchius Iunius Rolocus c. with others verie many who haue giuen their testimony and approbation to our church and ministerie Wherin if our errors were fundamentall damnable and Antichristian as you terme them these churches and persons had vndoubtedly the spirit of discerning and could not be deceiued all at once 1. Cor. 11 16. 14.33 â 15 10.15 14.32 37 2. Thes. 1.4 Answer THough you come against vs with horsemen and charrets yet we will âemember the name of the Lord our God by whose word alone all doctrines must be tried all persons must âudge and be iudged It is incident to the best men and purest churches to erre and be deceiued wherefore their sentences and approbations must be examined by Gods word If you say otherweise you teach corrupt and popish doctrine With such weapons as these haue the Papists long foâght against you and where you can bring one they can bring many to witnesse for them and their Romish superstitions Antiquity vniversality and sâch lâke popular reasons they seek to vphold their kingdome withall 2. The word of God condemning your church and ministerie as we haue often proued and our proofes ly vpon you yet unanswered though all churches in the world should aâproue of you your case wer âo whit the better for all men are vanity 3. The Iewes obieâted as weighty aâ argâmânâ agaââât Câriât him selfe wheâ they sayd dâth any of the rulers or of the Phariseâs ãâã in him but this people which know not the Law are âursed Iâh 7 1â 19 4. If the reformed Church's apâroue so well of youâ Church and
ministerâe they are nââ onely against vs but against themselues for theyr own Câârches consist of â separated and voluntary people wheras yoârs are coâfused and compelled they condemn and haue reâeâted the hierarchie and ministerie of Archbishopâ Lord bishoâs c. Prâests Parsoâs Vicars c. which are yet among you and haâe amonâ them anâther ministerie Now how they can apâroue of two sorts of Churches mânâsterâes so contrary one to another let them look to ât 5. It seemeth to me you are verie lauâsh in your praise which now vaunt so of the aâprobation and reioycing of al the âure reforâed Churches in the world whereas heretofore you complayned that you had all the bâst refârmed Chârâhes throughâut Châistendom agâinst you Agayn the Harmony that you mention was set forth but by the French and Belgick churches the things that they approue among you are certayn general heads of religeon which a Bâshop wrote in an Apologie of your Church most of all which heads we our selues also approue and reioyce for But the controuersies between you and vs touching the gathering and constituting of a Church the manner of divine seruâce the form of Church government and the like are eyther not at all or in very generall termes set down in that boâke and so uerie slenderly if ought at all by them aâproued or reioyced for To giue an instance or two in the tenth section of that Hârmony treating of the Chârch your English confession is so shorâ and in generall words I doubt not bât the Pope himselfe will subscribe vnto it letting him haue his own interpretation In the 15 section of Ecclâsiasâicall meâtings you speake of prayer in the tongue which all yoâr people vnderstand Now because the Reformed churches approue of thiâ we must take it belike that they approue of your Leiturgie and service book also and al your publick worship though it be not set downe fâr any to judge of In the 16. section of Holy day's fasts c. there yoâ wriâe agâinst purgatory which being put into the Harmonie iâ ynough as seemeth to proue that other chârches approue of al your Pope holy-dayes and festiuals The lâke may be minded for other poynts as in the 17. section for ceremonies things indifferent which being approued of and reioyced for by all the Reformed churches in the world the Prelatâs wâl haue a shrewd hand against you that are called Puritans for standing so much against the ceremonies of your Church as you do· And for your minâstery I marveil you say not that it is approued of and râiâyced for of the Pope also for in the 11. section of that Harmony you beleeue these orders and degrees of ministers in the Church 1 Deacons 2 Priests and 3 Bishops which orders wehther the Reformed Churches approâe of or no I am sure the Counsel of Trent doth and hath decreed If any shall say that in the Catholik Church there is not a Hirarchie instituted by diuine ordination which consisteth of Bishops and Priests and ministers let him be âccursâd Concil Trident. Sess 23. Can. 6. But now seeing not onely the Fathers of the Counsel of Trent but all reformed Churches in the world as you sayd doe approue of and reioyce for this your ministerie I hope the Bishops and hirarchie of your Church shall no more be preached writen against by your inferior Priests as many a day they haue been as being Antichrâstâan Thus may you see what a weak foundation you bring for your church and ministerie and if we lyfted to fight against you with your own weapons we could allege many things from the persons whome you cite against your present church and ministery but the word of God yeeldeth vs armour ynough for this battell against you as in due tâme through his grace shall be seen 6. In the meaÌ while it shal not be amisse to put the reader in mind how your selues heretofore haue iudged and written of your ministerie which you say it is approued of and reiâyced for of all the pure reformed churches in the world your ministers being as before is noted Deacons Priests and Bishops Of the Deacenship you haue written that it is a meer humane institution a degree to the Priesthood and nothing like to the ordinance of God Of Priests c. that they cam from the Pope as out of the Troian horses belly to the destruction of Gods kingdom Of the Bishops c. that you account them no natural members of the body of Christ church becauase they are of humane addition not borne with her nor grown up with her from the cradle Agayne that they be rather members of the strumpet of Rome then of the spouse of the Lamb c. And haue not you the reformed Churches great cause now to reioyce for this ministery 7. Moreouer consider you also how we may allege that now 10. yeares sithence we have published our Confession of faith and causes of our separation from your Church and ministery to the learned Vniversities of the Reformed churches with desire if in our faith or practise we erred that they would shew it vs but to this day we know not any that haue vndertaken so to doe wherefore we also may suppose by their silence that they approue our case or at least suspend their iudgments and condemne vs not 8. Finally it is written in one of the scriptures that you quote the spirituall man iudgeth all things but he himselfe is iudged of no man 1 Cor. â 15. Now every true Christian is a spirituall man Gal. 6. 1. 1 Pet 2.5 therfore he may judge and discerne by Gods word and spirit faith from here sie and the true church from the false he may see with his eyes liue by his own faith and not depend vpon other men to liue walk in sin till other churches condemne it Let every man therfore retayn his liberty and take heed how he iudgeth 4. THe onely wicked Paâists Athâist and most ungodly ones are aduersaries to our godly ministers and people The godly in all placâs and times among vs by them alone anâ ordinarily haâe been conuerted vnto Christ and by them approâed reuârenced and obeyed alwayes in the Lord. Answer 1. IF the onely wicked be adversaries to your Godly ministers and people it perteyneth not to us who hate none of you bât wish well and pray for you al euen for our persecutors we are aduersaries onely to the sinns corruptionâ that are among you whiles we reproâe you for âinne you should âudâe that we loue and hate you not as the law teâcheth We say therefore with the Apostle are we become your enemies because we âell âou the truth Gal. 4 16. 2 The Atheists and wicked oneâ that so hate your godly ministers and people are theâ not also mââbers of yoâr owne Church So then your church is diuided against it selfe and you are aduers one to another And why tel
not slanders but matters known to all that are acquainted with the course and state of your Church Answer ALl this being true it sheweth the badnes of some men not any badnes in the faith we professe An infidel might haue obiected vnto Israel as you doe here The Lord hath testified against you by giuing ouer ouer very many of your people to Carnall life Sedâmitrie Peorisme Bautisme many other idolatries with strange Gods The Papists may and doe obiect the like things to your selues at this day much more iustly then you do to vs. For when any such haue appeared among vs we presently cast them out if they repented not whereas with you such are stil reteyned in the bosome of your Church yea such hereticks and vicious persons as we haue excommunicate you doe entertayn as is knowen to all that ar acquainted with your estate Wherefore the Lord hath testified for vs not against vs whiles by the light of his word such hypocrites haue been discouered and avoyded but you are condemned by your own doctrine whiles such miscreants and flagitioius persons are kept in your communion The 6. Consideration 6. THE churches and godly learned persons that euer heard of your separation did not approue of it which was the quarrel that Fr Iohnson had with Mr Iunius and he sharply replyeth on him Nay Mr Barrow plainely rayseth at Caluin and the Geneua church and euen at al churches in Christendom in his Discouerie and counsels not with other reformed churches about their separation but Answers as Mr Iohnson doth the word is neer vs we need not go ouer the seas to seek it as if the Spirit of the Prophets were not subiect to the Prophets and himselfe as the Pope had infallible rule of inâerpretation of the scriptures in his brest Answer THE strength of this reason is quelled before in the answer to the third of your first Considerations thither I refer the reader Further I answer here that you teach such doctrine as standeth not with Christian freedom or truth whiles you would forbid vs the profession and practise of the Gospel til we haue consulted with and be approued of other persons and Churches For though I grant ther is a good use of aduising with other Churches if conueniently we can eyther when cases are difficult or when in any respect it doe concerne them yet that in all matters of religioÌ ChristiaÌs should be bouÌd thus to walke when the finne to them is euident which to other Churches not wel acquainted with their estate is not so perspicuous this were to abridge Christian liberty and to bring our consciences in bondage vnto men that though God forbid vs al communion with idolatrie yet we may not separate vnlesse they approue it It is contrary to the word of God which teacheth vs that Gods commandement is not hid from his people neyther is far off not alost in heauen nor beyond the sea but in our mouthes âârts to doe it But you to deceiue your reader allege this as if it were Mr. Bârrows or Mr Iohnsons reason and not the doctrine of Moses and of the Apostlâ The colââr that you bring for your selfe is that saying of the Apostle the spirites of the prophâts are sâbiect to the prophâts 1 Cor. 14.32 which scripture considered by the words and circumstances of it will in no weâse proue your purpose Fâr first it may be qâestioned whether the meaninâ be that the spirits of the prophets are subiect to other prophets or to thâmselves For the Prophets among the gentiles such as the Corinthians naturally were were sâbject unto caried and ruled by their spirits and not their spirits subject to them so that they could not choose but sâeâke as Sâbylla wâtneâseth of her selfe neither could they lin or cease speaking when they would themselues yea and in holy scripture we see how Balaam prophesied good to Israel and bleâsed when he would haue cursed thâm Saul also and his messengers prophesied as it were by constreynt being ouermastered by the spirit soo as he could not coâteyn himselfe buâ stripping off his clothes propheââeâ all that day and all that night when he had no purâose thus to doe Now therfor where as the Apostle here had ordeyned that if any thing were reâeled to another that fare by the first prophet should hold his peace because almight prophesie one by one if any should allege that they could not hould their peace but must speak so long as their spirit moued theÌ he telleth them that the spirits of thâ prophets are suâiâct to the prophets so intimating that they may if they will giue others leâue to speak shewing also a reason hereof because God is not the author q of confusion but of peace And if thus wee understand the Apostle his words make nothing for that you say Vnto this also may be added that he speaketh this affirmatâuely they are subject and not by way of ordinance let them be subject as els where he vseth and as other things in this place are spoken as Let the prophets speak Let the first hold his peace Let women be silent But be it granted which I will not deny that he meaneth their spirits wer subject to other Prophets because when they had spoken others were to iudge yet those oâher were the Prophets of âhe same church and there present not in other churches For Paul meant not that the spirits of the Prophets in Corinth were subiect to the prophets in Rome or Iudoea and so must send to them for approbation but appoynteth like order in this as was in all other the Churches of the Saincts And if they were bound as you would haue us to send and submit to other churches and others likeweise to them then no Church hath no power in iâ selfe to aprââe of her prophets or Ministers or of their doctrine without the good likâng of others Which how farr it is from the Apostles mind I leaue it for the dâscreet reader to judge neither thinke I but your owne brethren will distaât yââr so collecting from this place Howsoeâer they doe it is verie like if you had liued in Ahabs dayes and should haue heard 400 prophets at once prophesying good vnto the King and Micaiah onely prophesying evill you would with Zidkijah haue smitteÌ him on the cheek as now you do vs in reproch told him that his spirit must be subiect to the prophets especially they being so many and he but alone But if it were further granted vnto you that we must be subiect to the prophets of other churches yet I suppose you wil not deny but al prophets and churches must trie and iudge euery thing by the word of God according to which if any man speak not his iudgment is not to be regarded And we haue offred and doe still offer our doctrine and practise to the triall
their dutie Gods word teacheth uâ tâat âf a man walke in any one sinne though he doe not all he shal nât liue but die the deâth Ezek. 18 11 13. Wâen Gibeah was giuen oveâ to the Sinne of Sodom if the Priests and prophets should haue preached against idolatrie swearing breaking of the Sabbath and such like evils and not against that particular filthynes which the people followed should they haue preached repentance truly When Israel followed Iereboams calues at Dan and Bethel if the ministers then had preached against Sodoâie whordome drunkennes and the like and not cried out aâainst that present idol worship but pleaded rather for it shâuld they haue tâuâht repenatnce truly Even thus it is with your best minâsterâ they will thââdeâ out in their pulpits against Popery and idolâtry in âeâerâll aâainst theft whordome prâde coueteousnes and mâây oâher iâqâââieâ but the sinne which cleaueth so fast to the bones of âoâr Church tâe heynous enormities in Gods worship amongst you these they meddle not with neither vpon payn of excommunicatiââ draw the people to repentance for them as after I will further shew Perhaps now and then they will glance at the Bps. or some other corruptions but bring the people from vnder these iniquities they doe not nay they plead for them rather and cry oât vpon vs which haue forsaken so grosse abâminations Now there being no notice giuen by the ministers or taken by the people of the siâns wherein they liue the other two parts of true reâentance doe also fail among you for farr you be from confessing your sins which though you offer the sacrifice of fools yet will you not know that you doe evill and most farr from amending them when with so high a hand you doe maintain them although the testimonie and sâffrings of vs your disâised and persecuted brethren against them haue sounded in your eares now manâe a day Thus teach they not repentance aright As for faith it cannot be sound and true where it hath not ground oâ the couenant and promise of God Gods couenant and âromise of saluation you haue not without repentance as Christ sayd Except ye repent you shall all likewise pârish for surely God will wound the hairie âate of him that walketh in his sinnes To preach faith therefore and aâply iustification by faith to an vnrepentant people is to ârofane that holy doctrine and turne the grace of God into licentâousnes But to giue the seales of the righteousnes of faith baptisme and the Lords supper to the wicked blasphemers irreligious and to their seed it is a sinne of sinâ for which your ministers shall giue an heauy account to Christ at his appearing as haue counted the ârecious blood of his testament an vnholiâ thing and washed and fed therewith eâen doggs and swine as the scripture calleth such vngodly âersons And thus you haue not truly taught among you eyther repântance from dead works or faith towards God which are the doctrine of the beginning of Christ and the very foundation as the Apostle saith I will now also compare the practise of the Apostles in the placâ which you cite with yours that the reader may see how your right eye is blinded to bring scripture so playn against your selues In Act. 2 37 c the manner of gathering and planting that churchâ is thus described There was first the word preached by the Apostles verse 14 c which being heard pricked the harts of the âeople verse 37. there was repentance taught not for adultery theft worshiping of Idols oâ the like whereof it may be that people was not knowen to be guilty but for their particular trespasse in refusing of Iesus Christ into whose name they must be baptised if they would be saued verse 38 then followed a playn separation from such as frowardly resisted the truth vers 40 and none were baptised or ioyned to the church but such as gladly receiued the word verse· 41. After this followed a contânewing notwithstanding the imminent peril of trouble and persecution for the truth sake in the Apostles doctrâne and fellowship and breaking of bread and prayerâ verse 42 If you had walked in this primitiue churches steps you should before the constituting of your Church haue preached vnto the poor ignorant and idolatrous Papists which was the generall face of the land at Q Maries death repentance for their sinns in all their idolatries wâll worships and superstitions subiection to Antichrist his prelacie priesthood and gouernment c. To such as had their harts pricked with your doctrine you should haue shewed the true way of the Gospel faith and holy walking therein You should haue taughâ them a separation from the profane and obstinate and haue gathered into the Church such onely as gladly receiued the word and with them you should haue walked in a holy communion and practise of Christs ordinances thâugh Princes and Parlâaments thoâgh men and Angels should haue forbidden threatned you for it Thus had your church beeÌ the daughter of thât mother church in Ierâsalem whereas now by neglecting this patterne and reteyning the Popish confuse multitude and a great part of their ministery and worship you haue imitated Bâbylon âe mother of fornications aâd âre as vnlike Sion as you are like your selues The objection which you feared and therefore would prevent with answer is yet of more weight then will be eased by your syllogisme the aâsumption whereof I deny For the true constituting of a Church by the word perached callâng men to a willing holy covenant with God sepâratinâ them from the wayes of Satan Antichrist his false idoatrââs worship priesthood and government vniting them togither in the comâunion of the true faith and bond of loue and peace which ar the controuersies between you and vs these poynts are cleerly set down in scriptures to the vnderstandâng of the spirituall as the history of all the Bible and the practâse of the Apostles and primitiue churhes already alleged doe plainely shew and I am sure you will not deny but they were spirituall Whereas you would âroue they are not clearely set downe to the vnderstand of the spirituall because thowsands of ministers and people of the churâh of Englând are of contrary iudgment to vs first we haue many testimonies of your own minâsters for the things that we defend against you as in this and other books we haue manifested Secondly if we had no such testimony yet what doe you but make your selues iudges in your own cause that though we bring never so playn evidence against you from the word yet if you see it not or wil not see it must not be needful for saluation More vnsound and popish doctrine hath seldome been taught But I leaue vpoÌ you the saying of Christ vnto the Pharisees If you âere blinde ye should not haue sinne but now ye say WE SEE therefore your sin remayneth Iohn 9 11. And whereas
you further bring aginst vs forreyn churches and speciall persons the chiefest lights of this age first mind whither this be not âlso â ground of Popery so to presse humane authority and whether the Papists cannot for many of theâr heresies allege the ancient fathers the chiefests lights of their ages whome your selues I suppose will not deny but to be spirituall seing their testâmonies are often alleged by your church in pulpits and in print Secondly this your dealing is such as both the better sort of the late Fathers as Augustine for example who was of mânde that counsels Bishops c. ought not to be obiected for triall of controuersies but the holy scriptures onely and the very superstitious Popelings themselues haue condemned saying that we are rather to beleeu âne priuatâ faithfull man then a whol Councel and the Pope himselfe if a man haue better aâthorety reason on his side Thirdly your obiection and pleading against vs is much like as if the Iewes should haue obiected against Christianity thus It is not needfull to saluation to beleeu that Iesus who was crucâfied is the Christ for then it would be cleerly set down in scripture to the vnderstanding of the spirituall Dan 12 10 Prou 8 9 but that it is not for the thousands of priests and people of Israel Gods own people among whom are the chiefest lights of this age the Rabbines expounders of the law c. which are vndoubtedly spirituâll are of contrary judgment to you his disciples Iob 7 47 48 49.52 Fourthly as I haue before answered forreyn churches and the lights in them haue cleerly seen the things we stand for and doe asseât with vs touching separation from Antichristianisme gathering into and walking in a holy communion of Saincts and other poynts of greatest moment between you and vs. as their Harmony of Confessions besides other particular books many doe testify If you obiect their particular judgment of your churches estate I answer that is not needfull to saluation therefore they may misse in it and yet be spirituall for if men iâ their own churches profesâe and walke in the truth so farr as God giues them to see and thinke better of other churches then they doe deserue such errors even the most spirituall are subiect vnto It was cleerly revealed in scriptures that the Gentiles should be called vnder the Gospell Deut 32.43 Gen. 12 3 Psal. 67. 117 Isa. 11.10 Chrâst âimself plainly confirmed and commanded it Mat 28.19 Iohn 10 16 Act 1 8. Yet the Apostle Peter himselfe and many other spirituall men perceiued it not till in more speciall and particular weise it was to them reuealed Act. 10.14 28 34 3â 11 2 â 18. As Peter and many other godly then fayled in esteeming worse of the Gentiles then they should so learned and godly men now may fayl in esteeming better of your estâtâ then it doth deseruâ The 5. Argument WHatsoeuer church is the mother of the faithfull is a true visible church but the best of our assemblies are c. Ergo true visible churches The preposition is true because that regeneration and new birth is onely ordirarily wrought by the word preached Rom 10.8.17 Iam. 1.18 1 Pet. 1 23. which is onely and ordinarily found in the visible Church Gal 5 26. 1 Iohn â 5. The assumption is true because many are ordinarily new borne in our best assemblies by the ordinance of preaching in publick vse and force as appeareth by Mr Iohnsons foresayd confession as also by the meanes of the causes and meanes ordeyned by God to beget faith in the hearers and efficacie thereof Esa. 55 11 Rom. 10.17 and lastly ây the infallible effects of faith and fruits of the spirit appearing in the true members of our best assemblies Gal. 5 6 22. Answer HEre you seem to bring a new argument though it be but the old in a new coat for take away this mantel wherewith your Major is clothed The mother of the faithfull and all the rest wil be but regeneration and new birth wrought as you say by the preaching in your best assemblies Which things we heard in your third argument and there refuted As you here vrge them agayn I further answer first to your proposition Whatsoever church say you is the mother of the faithfull is a true visible church But Israel say I in her idolatrous estate was the mother of the faithfull yet was she not in that estate a true visible church therfore your proposition is not true That Israel then was the mother of the faithfull appeareth by the words of the Lord Plead with your mother Hos 2 2 That they which were willed thus to plead were the faithfull appereth by theâr names Ammi Ruhamah that is My people and she that hath obteyned mercy That yet notwithstanding this mother was not a true visible church appeareth by the Plea to be made against her She is not my wife neyther am I her husbaÌd her estate being as elsewhere is sayd without the true God and her children that continewed in her idolatrie should obteyn no mercy Thus you see a church may be sayd to be the mother of the faithfull and yet not be a true Church of God You would confirme the proposition to be true because regeneration and new birth is ordinarily wrought by the word preached which is one lie and ordinarily found in the visible church I answer the word preached is to be found also in the false church as among Papists Anabaptists Anabaptists c. as ordinarie if not more ordinarie then ân many of youâ assemblies and although there be not such or so many truthes âaught among them as are among you yet the word that is taught hath effect for sanctâfication of life in as great measure as ordinarâly appeareth in your Church of Engl. where so much profannes reigneth as all men see and know The church of Rome is as your selues prâfeââe a falâe church yet doubt I not neyther doe I thinke you doubt but sundrie children haue been borne vnto God by that harlot The church of Enâland it as we professe a false church your Ministery also falâe yet God which brought light out of darknesse hath brought forth I doâbt not and saued many of his dear châldren among you But let not thiâ embolden the rest to continew with you in your false estâte least they finde no mercy with the Lord because they be children of fornications To your assumption then I answer as you first set it down I graunt it yet will not your conclusion follow for it may be a mother of the faithfull and yet no true visible church for the reason foreshewed But as you afterward explain your selfe saying the assumption is true because many aâe ordinarily new borne c. I deny it thus to be true because neyther is a new birth ordinarily to be had among you neither haue you Gods ordinance of preaching in publick vse and
haue not consumed or abolished the Antichristian prelacie and other abominations of that man of sinne nay it is evident they maynten Antichrist for haue they not al receiued their ministery from the prelates promised obedieÌce to their ordinaris yet your preachers wer woÌt to say the prelats ar AntichristiaÌ Agayn if your ministers had in them the spirit of the Lords mouth they would ere this time haue made a separatioÌ from the wicked popish sinful generation for God sayd vnto Ieremie if thou take away the precious from the vile thou shal be as my mouth But this doctrine of separation your ministers wil neyther teach nor suffer to be taught but lock vp the kingdome of heauen as much as they can that men may not enter they blame vs for nothing so much as for separation when nothing is more needfull to be done if we will keep the couenant of our God and maynteyn that war which his own Maiestie first proclaymed between the womans seed and the serâents Gen. 3 15. so vnlike your ministers be to the mouth of God As vnlike they are also to those Angels and witnesses Reu. 18. 14. 11. whâch cried the downfall of Antichrists pompous church and ministerie and called al Gods children out of it saying Goe cut of her my people but your ministers cry that men should tarry within as the potters that contrary to Gods commaundement dwelt with the king of Babel for hâs work and such as are gone out they labour to bring back agayne saying that with them is the true doctrine of saluation their errors ar not fundamentall their corruptions abolish not from Christ all reformed churches apâroue of theâr church and ministery and many such Babilonian songs haue we heard among them And whereas in Reâ 14 there followed an Angel that with a lowd voyce threatned all those that worshipped the beast and his image and receiued his mark in forehead or in hand your ministers themselues stand vnder that wrath whiles the mark of the beast is so open in theâr foreheads by that false ministery of priesthood which they haue receiued from the Bishops whose vnlawfull authority and iurisdiction they submit vnto and teach men to doe the like in whâch respect they cannot excuse themselues from worshipping the Beast seing that hierarchie and prelacyâ is by the light of Gods word and by the aâteâtation of the Christian reformed churches and by your own confession heretofore found to be Antichrâstian if the Pope be Antiâhrisâ Râme be the throne of the Beast Thus men may see that your ministers are far from overthrowing Antichrist kingdome your selfe haue shewed a good reason why Satan cannot cast out Satan The 5. argument THose ministers which are the sauiour of death to the wicked and life to the godly are the true ministers of Christ 1 Cor. 2.16 Such are the ministers of our best assâmblies Ergo true ministers of Christ. Answer THis naked argument hath not a ragg to help to couer the falsehood of the aââumption wherefore ât may soon be stript and let goe I disprâue that which you haue asâumed thâs Your minâsters are not the saviour of death to the wicked because they suffer them in the bosome of theâr church by their sacraments and blessinâs confirme them in their sinns doe not excommunicate the profane or vicious liver but let them remayn in mixture with the rest and plead for such a people to be the true church of God They are not the sauour of life to the godly because they preach not the way of lâfe trâely by separating from idolaters and idolatry and gathering to a hâly communiân in the faith and obedience of the gospel Bât whileâ they persecute preach and write against Gods children which prâctise the orâinances of his couenant and by fayr pretexts and tolorable reasons seek to draw them back to their confused assembliâs they are lâke those whome the Lord reproued thus And will ye pollute me among my people for handâuls of barly and fâr peeces of bread and to stay the soules of them that should not die and to giue life to the souleâ that should not liue in lying to my people that heare your lyes Ezek 13.19 The 6. Argument THese ministers that are hated of all men for the sake of Christ are the true ministers of Christ 1 Cor. 4 9 10.11..12.13 2. Cor. 6.4.5 6.8 Mat. 10 â2 Such are the ministers of our best assemblieâ Therefore true ministers of Christ. The MINOR is proued for that thây are hated of the most part and of the most evil of all sorts as were the Apostles and desciples of Christ. Consider what I say ând the Lord giue thee understanding in all things 2 Tim 2.7 Answer THis your last reason comes al too late and wil help your ministery nothing For by the discussing of your former arguments We haue seen that your ministers cânnot proue their office calling or entrance into the sheepfold by Christ neyther administer they according to his testament but after their owne invented leitârgie lawes and Cannons So that if they be hated of all men in respect of their ministery they are not hated for Christs sake seeing they haue none of his ministery hated it may be they ar of many so are Frâars and Monks and the rest of Anti-christs clergie so it is written that the â¡ whore shall be hated made desolate and naked her flesh eaten and shee burned with fyer but it is the cause not the suffering which makes the martyr Whereas therfore your minor is proued by a bare affirmation onely that so it is as is your manner of disputing you must take a better course and proue things otherwise ere we will yield for the Arrian and Anabaptists and all sorts of religion wil Plead that both they and their ministers are hated for Christs sake but every tree is knowne by its fruits Yet haue yea no such cause to complayn of hatred for the ministry of your Church is aproued and reioyced for as your selfe while are sayd of all the forreyn reformed Churches in the world and at home wee know how it is reuerenced honoured and obeyed Your cheifest ministers being acknowledged for spiritual Lords and right reverend Fathers the inferiour priests as sound and excelent Divines followed and flockked after by the people And how they are provided for by rich Bishoppricks fat benefices al ouer the Land besides their dayly intertainment at great and rich mens tables who is there among you that knoweth not These are not signes of hatred Therefore let him that readeth consider indeed what you haue sayd and the Lord giue him vnderstanding in all things O England ISRAEL thy Prophets are like the foxes in the wast places Ezek. 13.4 Positions concerning a true Church INtending to set down some arguments against the corrupt estate of the present church of England I thought it profitable to prefix some few positions as a
of which churches being joyned togither in the profession and practise of the Gospel of Christ haue his power and presence with them and is to conuene or come togither in one for the worshâp of God and performance of publick duties 29. Whatsoeuer promise or blessing of God is bestowed on the church on earth generally considered the same may be apprehended injoyed by every particular church though not in like measure by all as the promises generall and examples particular of the church in Corinth and others mentioned in the scrâpture doe confirme 30. The Testament of Christ sheweth vs no Prouintiall Nationall Emâerial or other lâke Church hauing seuerall meetings or aââemblies and special Pastors ouer the same neither since thâ Apostles Prophets âvangelists were taken from this world are there any other lawful Bishops or Church-gouernours then the Bishops or Overseers of the particular churches neyther euer was ther other lawful Head Lord or Lords spirituall of the Church then Iesus Chrâst alone 31 Vnto the chârch are to be admitted all vnto whome the couenant and promise of God doth apperteyn and they are so many as the Lord our God shall call and all those are called in the iudgment of man which hauing heard the word of God doe professe repentance from dead works and faith in God by Iesus Christ the alone Sauiour of âhe world and promise obedience to the word through the holy Ghost the sanctifier of the elect Such of all sorts and estates of people in the world are with their seed to be receiued into and nourished ân the church their ignorance being holpen by instruction their weaknes borne by lenity their faults corrected i with loue and meeknes and their feeble consciences comforted with the promises of God 3â Out of the Chârch are all sâch to be kept as are profane worldly and wicked vntill they be called of God vnto repentance faith in his promise and out of it are to be cast all such as sinne against the law of Goâ by errour or corruption in doctrine or conuersation and will not by prâuate or publick admonistion be reclaymed and amended 33 Every particular church or congregation throughout the world hauâng equall interest in Christ and in his word or couenant consequently haâe equall power and ought to haue a lâke care to practise all the commandements and ordinances of the Lord standing fast in the lâberty where with Christ hath made them free 34 Every one that would be saued ought to joyne himself vnto some particular church where Gods name is seâ and knowen and called vpon that in and with the same he may grow vp in the faâth and loue of Christ vnto saluation 35. Although the church consisteth onely of sâch as are called yet these are of two sorts some outwardly onely and for a tyme which though they be in the church yet are they not indeed of the Church othersome called also inwardly effectually and for ever So that the churches on earth haue many hypocrites and reprobates for members of them whose secret sinns defile themselues alone Howbeit the Lord knoweth them that are his a true Christian may by the word ãâã spirit of the Lord and fruites of his faith haue assurance that himself is the Lords of others he is for their outward good profession and conversation which he seeth to hope and judge as of himself leauinâ the finall doom and iudgment vntill the Lord come who will lââhten things that are hid in darknes and make the counsels of the harts manifest and will reward every man according as his works shal be 36 The best churches on eart are alwayes subiect to haue open greeuous sinas of all sorts break out in them all which âniquitieâ mâst speedily be redressed and euery church purged by repentance or casting out of the impenitent least wrath doe come on all the congregation 37. For churches by sinning and impenitencie therein may forfeyt their couenant and be forsaken of God and for their adulteries by dâuorced from Christ and so left of his people the candlestick being remoued out of the place 38 By this which hath been sayd may appear that euery people called of God into couenant and communion with Christ and one with another and so walking though with much weaknes ignorance and dayly syn is to be esteemed a true church of God but they that are not so called and come into couenant with the Lord howsoeuer they may professe many excellent truthes yet want they the mayne essentiall thing which makes a true church 39 A church thus hauing the essence or being by refârence vnto or coniunction with Christ which is a secret and spirituall thing cannot now as it is a church properly be seen with carnall eye Whereas then the church is sayd to be visible it is figuratiuely spoken and after a sort to weet so farr as by a peoples profession and conuersation seen or heard men may discerne and iudge by the rules of Gods word 40. As Christ the head and sauiour of his body cannot be found or knowen by the wit or wisdom of man but by the revelation of God so the Church which is his body kingdome and spowse caââot be discerned by naturall or humane skill but by the manifestation of God alone through his word and spirit 41 Hence it is that the true churches of God are both contemned and condemned of the world as heretiks schismatiks sedetious c. when the false antichrâstian assemblies are highly honoured and regarded For they whâch vnderstand not the word of God whâch natural men doe not nor haue the spirit of God which naturall men haue not how should they rightly judge of or discerne the Church of God 42. And Satan to deceiue the simple doth deck his synagogues with many ornaments of the church of Christ as the preaching of the word prayers sacraments discipline he procureth them also honour amplitude and prosperity when from the true church oftimes he taketh not onely outward peace and glory but bereaueth the same of Christs publicke ministery of the word and sacraments by persecuting imprisoning banishing and killing the officers of the Church and scatteting the members 43. Yet is not Satans synagogue for all the pomp thereof a church of God because it inioyeth and useth not his word and holy things aright according to his heauenly ordinance Neyther can the true churches be spoiled or depriued of the word of God which is graffed in them and able to saue their sowles is seed immortall and endureth for ever but in the mids of their many afflictions they both hold forth that word of life as lights vnto the world and by the same doe edify and
the church is builded contrary to the âlayn and manifest doctrine of the scriptures Leu. 20.24 1 Kin 8 53. Act. 2.40 and 19.8 â Iohn 17.16 2 Cor. 6.14 â7 18. The form and order of their vâiting is alsâ strange for these profane people euen all persons in a famâly anâ all families in a parish are vnited into one parish church as it is called not voluntarily âas ought to be in the true chârch but by constreynt not by any due profeâsion of repentance from âead workâ and faith in God but by the priests readinâ a Confession absolution and such like popish stâff as is to be seen in their seruice book not vnder the guidance of Chrâsts officers but of a Parson Vicar Curate or other like creature of the Bishops who in many places can but read English vnto them And this with the other Parâshes of the Dioceââe so gathered also are vnited into one See or Dâocesâââ church vnder a Lord Bishop and his Coârtiers and all the Dioces into two Proâinciall churches the Prouinciall into one nationall church called the Church of England ouer all which there is a most reuerend Father and spirituall Lord Archbushop Primate and Metropolitan vnder whome al Bishops and Priests of the land are subiect and all people and parishes in the land bound to obey the dead canons and decrees which he the Ach Lord with his brethren of the gouerning clergie agree of in their repreâatiue church in the Conuocation howse if once the Ciuill Magistrate giue life vnto them This forme and order of a church is not to be found in Chrâsts Testament but receiued it is from the church of Rome by heritage or succession as the Papists boast of to the dishonour of Protestants when they say A religion c. that distinguished the multitude into pârishes âroportioÌed âhe tithes annâxed thâ Glebeland fonÌded the Bishopricks âmitted the Dioceses c So as the mother is the daughter is false in her câstitutioÌ though in the doctrin which she profeseth she is far better purer theÌ that whoremother of Rome The discussing of thes things as Mr Bern. refereth to other places books so also do I seing in thiâ place âe hath brought nothing of weight to proue his coÌstitutioÌ For the scriptâre that he alegeth the 3. things that he colecteth from theÌ do make against his purâose The word is not by Christs mânistery riâhtly reached applyed to the people but vnsufferabley abused to the maintenance or the confusion and idolatries that are among them the sacraments are highly profaâed and prostituted to the most vngodly and thir seed and popishly administred and the externall profession which the people make is by constreynt and therefore nought worth besides it is corrupt and idolatrous being a mixed profession partly of the truth of God partly of their own inuentions as appeareth by their Communion book Canons and the like Our second error should be that we hold their Constitution a real idol and so them idolaters To confute this Mr Ber. sayth that he hâth perused in any scriptures and can see none that take an idol or idolaters in any such sânse agaân that Marlorat mentioneth 47. idols and not one of them in âhe sânse Whether this article be of Mr Bernards own forginâ or where he hath had it I cannot tell his reader must take all of his credâ for he lets not down his author As for his confutation hereof it is very slender that becaâse he seeth it not or Maâlorat nameth it not therefore it is no idol For it is no sure position that Mr Bernard seeth all that âhe scriptures teach and both he and Marlorat may as soon number the hayres of their heads aâ all the idols that are in the world Wel therefore yet may ât be a real idol for oâght that this man hath sayd to saue it And if it be a false constitâtion as before is proâed set vp in stead of a true what is it better then a very idol In the end he târneth and renteth vs for making oâr own constitution as he sayth an idol or goddesse and feighneth that we may say Great is the Goddesse Constitution great is Diana of the Bââânists Bât seing this is but a reâroch of a scorner and the reproch reacheth vnto Christ himselfe who hath appoynted the frame order and constitution of hâs own chârch which we haue laboured for I leaue him for this calumniation vnto his rebuke who will teach him one day no more to blaspheme And whether may we think tendeth the inuectiue of this vayn man who thus skoffeth at the Constitution of Christs church but to bring in a mere ataxie or confâsion worse then was at Babels tower-building for take away the orderly framing and constituting of a church and there will be but a Tohu as the scripture speaketh a rude indigest heap or confute Chaos more beseeming the wild beasts of the wood then any humane much lesâe diuine polâty That such as are not of a particular constituted church to weet such a one as ours is are no subiects of Christs kingdome Neyther is this position set downe in our words to my knowledge neyther doth Mr Bârnard take away but confirme rather the thing that we hold for he granteth that they offend God which may and doe not ordinarily hauing ãâã canes offred liue in a church rightly constituted and we grant that many of Christs subiects for want of meanes doe not liue in a true constituted church If therefore he were not a caviller he would not haue reckned this among our errors That all nor in our way are without and we apply against them in Engl. 1 Cor. 5 12 Eph. 2 12. The first part of this position you must impuâe to Mr Bernards charity who wâll needs frame our assertions for vs because he thinkes we cannot speake for our selues we might leaue it vnto him to frame an answer also But if he would let vs tel what we hold it is that all not in the way âf Châist are without and if this be an error let him make the most of it The applying of those scriptures against them he must be content to bear til he or his brethren can proue theÌselues a true church for though there bâ great differences of peoples professing religion some with more truth âome with lesse yet all not wâthin Christs church are without as thâ Aâostle speaketh Mr Bernards exception that those places are meant of sâch as neuer professed Christ at all is childish why doth he not except aâaânât the holy Ghost himselfe who apâlieth against the false Christâans of the Râmish Church words and sâeaches meant first of heathen Babylon that profeââed not God or Christ at all His boasting of the word sacraments effects and deliuerances are before in this traatise taken away And Mr Bernards proofs are but a begging of the question which he blameth in otherâ as
vnderstood of the ordinary cathedrall parish assemblies of England which all are by one line For defense of these churches Mr Bern. refers the reader to an other treatise after and so doe I to the answer of the same following Yet least he should seem âo say nothing Mr Ber excepteth 1 That they haue no false head for they hold Iesus Christ. I answer so might Ieroboam haue pleaded for himself his people that they had no false head but the true God which brought them out of the Land of Aegypt Yet were they a false church The Papists Papists and Anabaptists at this day hold and professe Iesus Christ yet such errors are among them as Christ in deed is deneyed the parishes of England professe him also but such is their estate otherweise that they haue him not truly for a head prophet priest or king vnto them as befor is proued But it is yenough for Mr Bernard to affirme without proofe and correction with him is a needfuller argument in this case tâeÌ iâstruction For when the Priests liâs preserue not knowledge how should men be answered but by the gaole or gallowes 2. The matter sayth he is not false and to shew this he noteth a difference between No matter true matter and false matter No matter are thây which make no profession of Christ at all as Iewes Turks and Pagans True visible matter are all such as openly professe this mayn truth that Iesus the sonne of Mary is the sonne of God Christ the Lord by whome onely alone they shal be saued And false matter is contrary to this true matter I answer this false matter is very rawly set down for being contrary to the former true it may imply Iewes and Turks whome he made no matter and then it confoundeth his own distinction But if he mean that they which professe not Christ rightly and truely as he setteth downe are a false matter then say I ât will euince the matter of their Churches to be false seing there is not aright and true profession of Chrâst made by their parishes But Mr Ber. leauing out this word rightly truly tels vs they all professe this fayth as is apparent 1 by the doctrine of their church vidz that in the Harmony of Confessions 2 by the same publickly preached 3 by the same mainteyned by their lawes writings and blood of holy martyrs I answer if all this were granted yet will it not proue Mr Bernards purpose for some may write and preach the truth the Magistrate may establish it by law and some may seal it with their blood and yet not al the nation be a true matter for Christs church except they also make lâke profession Which that the parishes of England doe not the profanenes of the multitudes shew But least I be thought to speake of envy let vs hear the testimony of their own ministers and such as were no fauourers of vs at all as their malicious writings of vs sheweth Mr Nichols esteemed a forward preacher among them sayth We finde by great experience and I haue now fiue and twenty yeres obserued it that in those places where there is not preaching and priuate conferring of the Minister and the people the most part haue as litle knowledge of God and of Christ as Turks and Pagans To confirme this he giues vs an example in his own flock For I haue been in a parish sayth he of fowr hundred communicants and maruelling that my preaching was so little regarded I tooke vpon me to conferre with euery man and woman before they receiued the communion I asked them of Christ what he was in his person what his office how firme came into the world what punishment for sinne what becomes of our bodies being rotten in the graue and lastly whither it were possible for a man to liue so vprightly that by wel doing he might winn heauen In all the former questions I scarse found ten in the hundred to haue any knowledge but in the last question scarse one but did affirme that man might be saued by his own wel doing and that he trusâed he did so liue that by Gods grace he should obtâyn euerlasting life by serâing of God and god prayers c. Now then this being so tell me I prây yâu sayth Mr Niâhols first for Athâisme whether these be any bettor then Aâhâisâs whiâh know not Christ And tell me I pray you Mr Bernard whether thâââ be a ârue matter such as Christs church consisteth of But you would âaââ vs beleeue the Bishops and Priests of Engl. are wondrous men for iââhey write books or preach sermons to the people their whole Dioceses and Parishes must needs be estemed conuerts and profelytes Such effect grace was neuer heard of before since the world began More absurd it is to say that the good lawes of the Magistrate doe make a profane idolatrous multitude true professors but most of all that because some few were martyrs therefore they that killed the martyrs professe Christ truly If these be not pregnant reasons then M. Bernards book is little worth 3. But he proceedeth and sayth The visible form is not false which is the vniting of vs unto God and one to another uisibly This he would proue by 3 reasons 1 because the word is preached and offred to the people 2 Because of the peoples open profession of their fayth vnto the doctrine God working in them a will to receiue it 3 because the Lords supper is in vse among them Sundry scriptures are alleged to shew that thus the primitiue churches were planted and constituted all which we grant but when he comes to apply these to themselues he barely assumes that thus is their case neyther answering any reason of ours to the contrary nor shewing any reason of his own to confirme that which he sayth And what cause in the world what church is so bad but may thus be pleaded for He knowes wel that we except and the visible estate of that church their own monuments records complaints c. doe bear witnes with us that they were planted in this religion and profession by force of the Magistrates law that multitudes are profane that many thowsands want the preaching of the word that they ar al compelled to come to church be baptised receiue the communion and the like and what profession the poor ignorant people make is before manifested If he would heare more of their profession and subiection to the word and ministery Mr. Nichols shewes it thus How little haue they esteemed the godly and learned ministers How content they be with simple and ignorant men How hardly are they drawn to pay duties which law hath appoynted How many quarrels they pick against painfull ministers And how little reuerence they giue to any that are faithfull How they follow their couetousnes and pleasures How they fil al sorts of courts with brawles foolish and
the wâcked with great dishonour of the precious blood of Christ and therefore to be no true seal of Gods couenant vnto them 4. That their faith and repentance is a false faith and a false repentance Faithfulnes and repentance is desired in Mr Bernard himselfe who careth not to calumniate us We professe to iudge no secret things such as true faith and repentance are We are perswaded many in true churches may haue a false fayth and a false repentance because there are many hypocriteâ also that many in false churches may haue true faith and repentance for there are Gods elect But who these are on both sides we leaue vnto God that knowes them Of Mr Bernards church this is that we say they walke not in the true fayth they bring not forth fruites of trâe repentance in the publick estate wherein they stand 5. That thâir Ministers conuerting men to God there doe it not as Pastors but as Teachers This distinction which Mr Bern. skoffeth at must rest skoff and all in his own bosome till he bring out another father I know not who begat it 6. That their church standeth in an adultrous estate A strange assertion sayth Mr Bern. what idol worship we False worship is spirituall adultery Ier. 3. If Mr Bern. were not a stranger in Christ fold he would so acknowledge it and not count it our errour If he say the error is in holding their worship to be false then say I he repeteth now the third time that which before he made our 10. agayn our second Errors and if he goe forward thus he may multiply it to a thowsand and teach us new Arithmetik If he would know what idol he worships let him take his Ordinary for one among many who standeth for a spirituall Lord ouer many churches vsurâing Christs place to him doth Mr Bern. with his flock bow and stoup An other idol he may âânde in his pue 7. That we cannot say certaynly by any warrant of Gods word that any of them hath eyther faith or fear of God A hard speech If that man whome he mentioneth in the margine so sayd let not one mans word be imputed to our common cause He may see it otherwise minded by others of us before in this treatise pag. 39 and our Apolog. pag. 91.92 8. That nâne of their ministers may be heard Not heard in the execution of their ministery for it is of Antichrist Christs sheep hear his voyce not a strangers Ioh 10 All Antichrists ministers are strangers So are all ministers of euery false Church Such their church and ministery hath bene proued to be in many treatises 9 That it is not lawfull to ioyne in prayer with any of them As a false church generally so the members thereof particularly may not be communicated with in spirituall actions Such we hold haue proued their church to be Til Mr Bern. take away this foundation he fighteâh but with shadowes and sheweth his ignorance in the communion of the Saincts 10. That ministers may not celebrate mariage nor bury the dead There wanteth a third thing to make vp the error Churching of women These and the lâke ministerial functions we know the Romish Antichrist layeth on his priests and the Prelates of England on theirs But in Christs testament we finde no such duties imposed vpon his ministery Let Mr. Ber therefore bury his dead still for he will quicken but a few by his popish doctrine 11 That ministers should onely liue of voluntary contribution and not eyther of set stipends or tithes Against this Mr Bern. allegeth Gods wisdome who allowed a setled maintenance under the law and there is nothing against it in the Gospel God in wisdome appoynted tithes first fruites other particulars for his Prirsts liuelihod uÌder the law Christ in wisdom appoyntâth noÌe such for his ministers under the gospell but Pope Paschalis about 827 yeares after Christ decreed that tithes should be giuen to the priests This Popes wisdome Mr Ber. preferreth before Christs It cannot be deneyed but tithes were a part of the Law and that Chrisâ abolished the legal Priesthood whervpon it followeth by the playn doctrine of the Gospel if the priesthood be changed then of necessity must there be a change of the law Heb. 7.12 But Mr Bern had rather any shadow should be done away then this of Tithes for it hath much substance with it and there be moe siluersmithes of Demetrius minde which sayd Siroye know that by this craft we haue our goods But what sayth one of their own ancient Martyrs against Mr Bernards predecessors This Priesthood is blown so high and borne vp in pride and vayne glory of their estate and dignity and so blinded with worldly couetousnes that thây disdayne to follow Christ in uery meeknes and wilfull pouerty liuing holily and preaching Gods word truely freely and continually taking thâir liuelihood at the freewil of the People of their pure almose wher and when they suffice not for their true and busy preaching to get their sustenance with their hands To this true sentence grounded on Christs own lâuing and teaching of his Apostles these foresayd worldly and fleshly priests wil not consent effect ally c. If this martyr were now aliue the Clergâe of England would sooner condemn him for a Brownist then approâe of his doctrine albeit now that he is dead they garnish his toomb 12. That their churches ought to be raced down and not to be jmployed to the true worship of God To repayr this ruine M. Bernard telleth us there is great difference between Antichristianisme and Paganisme He might tel us also there is great difference between Paganisme Paganisme some Pagans worshippâng the true God ignorantly some the Sun and Moon and host of heauen some the Diuil himselfe But what were this to the purpose The thing he should shew is that God more estemeth fauoureth aloweth or tolerateth antichrists idol howses then of the Pagans Till he doe this we know that by Gods word and in his account as Pagans worship Diuils so Antichristians worship diuâls Let men feign to themselues what difference they lâst But it must be proued sayth Mr Bern. that our churches were built by Antichrist First God in his law required no such proof when he commanded utterly to destroy al the places wherein the nations which Israel should possesse serued their Gods whether it were in the groue which Abraham himselfe had planted or on the altars which he had builded the law of God made no inquiry Secondly If M Bern. will seek the records of his temples he may find many to haue been builded by Papists if he will grant that they be Antichristians or if he will goe fârther he may finde some of them builded by heathens and dedicated to Diuils But though the Records sayd nothing yet the form and shape of these masse howses proclayme
them to be the uery shrines of idols and lyable to the Curse Thus are we come to an end with M Bernard passing by his impertinent discourses which in his rouing he ran into leauing him also for his unchristian reproches and iniurious calumniations to the mercy or iudgment of the Lord who behold commeth with ten thowsânds of his Saincts to giue iudgment against all men and to rebuke all the vngodly among them of all their wicked deeds which they haue wickedly committed and of all their cruâl speakings which wicked sinners haue spokeâ against him THE MINISTERS POSITIONS SHAKEN THere is added to Mr Bernards book an other work intituled CERTAIN POSITIONS held and maynteined by some godly ministers of the gospel against those of the separation and namely against Barrow Greenwood The groundwork whereof is thus layd That the Church of England is a true Church of Christ and such a one as from which whosoeuer wittingly and continually separateth himselfe cutteth himselfe âff from Christ I will not stand vpon the consequences that may be made of this position whereby all that abhorrâng the abominations in that church and so separating from it are quite cut off from Christ whatsoeuer truth they profeââe and walke in or whatsâeuer other church they ioyne vnto but I will insist in a brieâ answer to that which these Ministers bring to proue this their peremtory sentence and they be 4. reasons 1 For that they enioy and ioyne togither in the use of those outward meanes which God in his word hath ordâyned for the gathering of an inuisible Church that is preaching of the gospel and administration of the sacraments 2. For that their whole church maketh profession of the true faith 3. For that thây hold and teach c. all truthes fundamental 4. For that all known churches in the world acknowledge that church for theâr sister and giue vnto her the right hand of fellowship These things haue been before handled in this treatise and the weakneââe of them discouered yet because it may be thought new men will make new arguments and many heads together bring forth deep counsels let us weigh what these godly ministers haue here sayd For proof of the first poynt they doe allege that the meanes which they vse and enioy haue been effectuall to the vnfained conuersion of many as may appear both by the other fruites of faith that may be found amongst them and by the martyrdome which sundry haue enduâed c yea euen we our selues are able to witnes with them that if there be any true faith and sanctification in us it was begun and bred in thâir assemblies Secondly that if Mat. â8 18.20 Eph. 4 11.12.14 be well examined it wilâe found that the meanes which Christ ordeyned for the gathering of an inuisible church are the very same which they enioy euen the preaching of the word and administration of the sacraments I answer All this that they say will not proue their Position namely that the church of England which consisteth of the whole nation diuided in to many dioceses and parishes vnder one or two Archbishops c. is a true church of Christ. For the Papists boast of all these things as colourable and as truely as these ministers Their priests haue conuerted many from Pagenisme Iudaisme and profanenes of life their church hath had many martyrs Luther and others that first left them had their faith begun in their assemblies c. and whatsoeuer Ministery is in England from the Archprelate to the halfe priest the Papists haue amongst them yea Engl. had it from them And it is to be admired that these godly ministers can allege nothing for their church but such old popish stales How vainely they assume these things vnto themselues hath been shewed befoâe fruits of faith appear noâ in their confuse assemblies whâre God is publâckly dishonoured by false worship his enemies profane wicked people fostered and bleâsed with his most holy things and Antichristian prelates and Canons obeyed Were it as they say that many haue been conuerted is that âenough to make all the church We haue testimonies from their own mouthes that there be swarmes and thowsands of profane irreligeous atheists blasphemers and open wicked liuers Mr Gifford a champion of their own hath confessed and printed it that through want and absence of â sincere ministery there is a flood of ignorance and darknesse ouerflowing the most part of the land the fear of God is banished from the greatest part the wonderfull heaps and piles of sinne which should be washed and clensed away by the word doe undoubtedly with one voyce cry alowd in the eares of the Lord for veâgeance vpon the whole realm c Shal now a few supposed conuerts makâ all this rowt a Christian church It is impiety and an ouerthrow of the Gospell Gen. 3.15 2 Cor. 6.14 18 Mat 15.13 Reu. 21..2 3.27 and 28.15 What meane these Ministers to boast so much of their martyrs whose blood cries against them in the eares of the Lord of hosts For did not their church kill them Let one of themselues speake in this case least we be thought partiall Who knoweth not sayth Mr Nichols how much blood of Gods Saincts was spilt in former ages and how many howses were guilty of blood And when did this land serioâsly and sincerely humble it selfe by âpen repentance make reconciliation for the same Nay rather how many thowsands repined at the happy reign of her maiesty for the casting out of the idolatrous and superstitious worship of God and for the establishing of his holy namâ and the liberty in preaching of the Gâspell This testimony is known to bâ true the greater is their sinne that now plead for such a people to be a true Church of God Shall the Cainites be honoured for Abels martyrdom or the Iewes for crucifying Christ then also may the bloody genâtion of Papists be canonized for Saincts and made members without râpentance of a christian church And for these ministers let them heart and make vse of Christs words to their predecessors Woe unto you for ye build the sepulchres of the prophets and your fathers killed them Truly yâ bear witnes and allow the deeds of your fathers for they killed them and yâ build their sepulchres Fulfil ye also the measure of your Fathers It is a slight and simple kinde of reasoning to tel us if those scriptureâ Mat. 28. Eph. 4. be well examined it will be found that the meanes which Christ ordeyned for the gathering of an inuisible church ar the uery same which they inioy First what doting Friar will not say this much for his popish Synagogue Then why doe not these ministers bring the meanes they boast of to the examination by these scriptures is it yenough think they to the examination by these scriptures is it yenough thinke they to cite a text or two and then ran away The
scriptures they allege haue been before examined and the ministers of Engl. being put into the other ballance are found all too leight But if it were true that they had the meanâ yet their argument is false if they conclude of the effect Israel had farr better meanes then England I am sure for the Prophets and Apostles and Christ himselfe preached among them Yet loe he complayneth that he had laboured in vayne for Ierusalem killed the Prophets and stoned those that were sent vnto them and the Lord by his Apostles stretched forth his hand to a disobedient and gainsaying people And shall we thinke that the Prâests of Engl. haue such power and grace tied to their lips that because they haue âreached therefore the whole nation is a true church Or dotâ there such vertue proceed from these ministers as can make the multituâe of swaggering professors atheists blasphemers and all sorts of profane which swarme in the land to be turned Christians worthy to be washed and fed with the body and blood of Christ. and yet continue atheists and profane as before what wondrous effect shall we next hear of but that their preaching hath conuerted the Diuils also But let us hear what testimony M. Gifford hath left behânde him of the graâ learned prâachers of the church of Engl among whom himselfe was one and of the people in their parishes The Diull sayth he is content those preachers should ride vpon his back because he is sure they will not spurg all him they be very gentle riders Doe ye not thinke that if they should set forth Gods word as they ought and spread the light that all wicked of which their parish is full would storme and fret against them the Diuill himselfe would fiâk about if they should spur him but a little But they can tell a smooth tale in the pulpit garnished with some merry story for to make the people merry or els some old rotten allegory or some far fetched matter out of some great writers that their people may be at their wits end and admit them A man would thinke to see the people come out of the church blowing that they were fed as ful as tikes when they goe home with emty bellies This I dare warrant if it be not so let me loose both mine eares that gâe through the parishes of these graâe and learned Diuines and except such as run to fetch their victuals otherwhere ye shall not finde fiâe among fiue skore which are able to vnderstand the necessary grounds and principles of religion and yet the People will say they be excellent deep men But I loue not those welles which are so deep that a man can draw no water out of them Loe here the means which the parishes of England doe enioy and worthy effects that follow If Mr Barrow or any of vs should I haue written this it would haue been counted sââffing râyling blasphemy but now that Mr Gifford so worthy a patron of the church hath thus recorded I hope the witnes wil be thought irrefragable And now let these godly ministers examine Mat 28. Eph. 4 and see if there they can finde these meanes which they enioy iustified But they proceed and tel vs in their second reason that their whole church maketh profession of the true faith For the ConfessioÌ of their church tegither togither with the Apologie thereof and those articles of religion agreed vpon in the Conuocation howse anno 1562 doe proue this euidently But herein they would deceiue the simple euidently for first profession of the true sayth when men in practise doe deny it maketh them not a true church but they are as the Apostle sayth abominable Then for profession it selfe if it be by constreynt for fear of punishment by mân that otherweise are profanâ lewd and dissolute and enemies to the gospell this is no true profession such as will make men a true church for they ought to receiue and professe the truth willingly and gladly Psal 110.3 Act. 2 41. Now we know that with them men were and are forced to the profession they make and if it were at their own choise many thowsands would professe otherwise Their own acts and Monuments besides manifest experience doe witnes this For Mr Fox reporteth that when K. Edward had established this church and religion many people in Cornwal Deuenshire and other places not onely misliked it but openly rebelled for their old idolatrie The Preists though some allowed yet others dissembled and many carelessly conâemned all and still excercised their old monâed Popery The Iustices c were not onely slack in furthering of religion but hindred so much as lay in them the Kings proceedings c. So that ciuill force not Christian zelo made men Protestants in that Kings dayes wherefore at his death hauing gotten Q. Mary they soâ vp agayn their Romish superstition and persecuted the other vnto the death Til Q. Elisah came and inforced them the second tyme to put away theâr Latin Masse and images and receiue that English seruice and ceremonies whâch since haue preuayled to this day Whâch how willingly the people yeâlded vnto Mr Nichols testimony to omit all others before alleged sheweth And How wel this religion is liked of now after so many yeres let the multitude of church papists in England shew together with the whole rowâ of rebels in Ireland all which are of the communion of the church of Engl hauing the same Bishops Priests service â the English and Irish that dwel in the country being ioyned togither in one body and brotherhood Then adde to these papists the profane time-seruers such as M. Gifford deseribeth thus I know there be many which care not for the Pope but yet beleeue much of his doctrine they be those which we call Atheists of no religion but look whatsoeuer any prince doth set forth that they will profess and add vnto them those other firarmes in the church of England that Mr Chaderton complayneth of eronius and hereticall sectaries witches charmers sorcerers murtherers theeues adulterers liars c and all these togither being compelled by law into one church and brotherhood can any man doubt now of that which these ministers say that their whole church maketh profession of the true faith The Confession Apologie and Conuocation-howse articles are strange proofs of the peoples profession If a few men in their Studies or Consistories write books or articles of religion and send them a broad must all people that see or hear them wil they nil they needs be counted professors of that religion yea such also as neuer heard of them in their liues nor caÌnot tel what they meaÌe Surly these ministers ar eyther very ignorant or carelesse what they say when they call this an euident proof The churches in France and Belgia haue published Confessions and Articles also better then those in England yet
are there thowsands and ten thowsands dwelling among them that neyther so professe nor are members of their churches But if it were granted that the publicke writings articles canons c. are to be esteemed the faith profession of all Engl. yet we deny them to make profession of the true faith for their Seruice book homilies book of Ordination with the impious canons confirming all the Romish idolatries Antichristian clergie and ceremonies that are among them excommunicating ipso facto all that speake against them this is no true Christian profession whatsoeuer other truthes are mixed with them For as the Papists holding many good grounds of religion in generall yet by other additions and contradictions do ouerthrow the truth so is it in England as before in this treatise and in many others hath been proued and after shall further appear Whereas these Ministers confidently deny that their church accounteth any one for her childe or member that doth not professe the faith of Christ in some measure it is nothing but a vayn flourish For was there euer such grossnes in the deepest gulfe of Popery as to deney Christ utterly and not to professe him in some measure Nay it could not be the throne of Antichrist vnlesse he did professe Christ. It is wel known none are baptised among the Papists but they professe the very same faith that is now professed at the baptisme in Engl. namely that which they call th' Apostles Creed So then what haue these godly ministers sayd more then the simplest papist in the world could haue sayd for his church Now in that they make this a colour as if the profane and wicked were not accounted children of the church they shew themselues to be the snare of a fowler in al their wayes yet set they a snare so slight that euery man may breake it For who knowes not that there be multitudes of profane and wicked persons in the land Who knowes not that the whole land generally is baptised Yea the baptisiing of the seed of the most wicked is not onely practised but befended in print by their late Archbishop D. Whitg who pleaded what if it be the child of a dronkard or of an harlât what if the Parents be papists what if they be heretiks c. shall not their children be baptised Yes he will haue it to be a common passage for all uile persons Good and euil sayth he clean and vnclean holy and profane must needs passe by it And at baptisme their seruice book teacheth the priest to say of euery one we receiue this child into the congregation of Christs flock Being thus receiued not one of a thowsand wicked persons are euer excommunicated but are fostered in the church vntill their death and then the priest is taught agayn to say that it hath pleased God to take vnto himselfe the sowle of their dear brother there departed and so he committeth his body to the ground in sure and certayn hope of resurrection to eternal life This being the generall state of the land as all men know what dissemblers are these Ministers to intimate as if their church acknowledged not the open wicked for her children and members Mr Gifford when tyme was yeilded farr otherweise I confesse sayth he that our church if ye vnderstand the whole assembly is ful of al wicked vices There are a number among vs which are of your brood speaking to a âapist whâse euill life is seen wel yenough there arâ a very great number of meer worldlings which doe not greatly esteem any religion although they seem now because of lawes to allow and fauour our side c. Now hauing sayd somewhat for themselues such as it is they cauil at our description of a church when we say that it is a company of faithfull people that truely worship Christ and reaââly obey him This say these Ministers is vtterly vntrue if it be understood of the visible church This is strange What would they haue vs describe the Church to be a company of infidels or a company of faithfull and of infidels togither when Paul teacheth that there is no communion between such 2 Cor 6.14.15 or should we say a people that falsely worship Christ Indeed if so we held we might wel returne to their Church of England for there is false worship more then yenough The Apostle writing to the visible church of Ephesus calleth them Saincts and thâ faithfull in Christ Iesus Wil they say that this also was utterly untrue Their own Articles of religion in England say thus the visible church of Christ is a congregation of faithfull people c. and is this also vttârly vntrue But let vs hear their reason why this should be vntruth For say they if euery one that the church may account a visible member be truely faithfull how is our Sauiour to be vnderstood when he compareth the churâh or ministery thereof to a draw net gathering aswel that which must be cast away as good fish c. Me thinks these godly ministers f should be ashamed so to depraue not onely our meaning but our very words that when we say of faithfull people that truely worship they wil turne and transâ lace them to truely faithfull and then gather as afterwards they doe as if men may not account any to be members of the church by their outward profession vnlâsse they know them to haue true faith which the Lord onely is able to disâârne Could any reasonable man thus construe our words or gather from them vnlesse he purposely would depraue especially knowing as these men know wel our constant witnesse otherweise who esteeme of all men by their outward profession and walking and haue long since published in our Confussion that many hypocrites will lurke in the church whiles it is on earth But thus it pleased these men to abuse vs before the simple reader Their third reason for their church is that they hold teach and maynteyn every part and article of Gods holy truth which is fundamentall The proof of this they would haue to be seen in their Confessions Catechisnes and Articles of religion published and approued of in their church This reason is like if not the very same with the former which sâake also of professing the true faith as was to be seen in their Confâsââân Apologie Articles What meane these ministers to cloy their reader so ofteÌ with one dish of meat a little diuertly dressed It is doubtlesse for want of better store Yet this whâch they bring is very vnsauoury for it is not seasoned with the salt of Gods couenant First for that poynt of fândamentall truth which they so long haue stood vpon and coâld neuâr be gotten distinctly to shew what truth is fundamental and what not we haue now these ministers resolute judgement of it thus The onely fundamental truth in religion is this That Iesus Christ the Son of
God who took our nature of the Virgin Mary is our onely and alsufficient Sauiour For proof of this they first allege that thây receiue this truth are the people of God and in the state of saluation they that receiue it not cannot possibly be saued Mat. 16.18 Mark 16.16 1 Iâh 4.2 Col 2.7 But first none of these scriptures doe say that this one article which these ministers haue set downe in this forme of words is the onely fundamentall truth in religion Neyther doth any other scripture that I know of so speake for though Christ onely is the foundation of the Christian church and though as they secondly allege no other point of religion is necessary otherwise then as it tendeth necessarily to teach or confirme this one truth yet foloweth it not but other points also are fundamental truthes the denyall of which will abolish from Christ. Secondly they haue altered added to and omitted some of the words of these scriptures for their own aduantage For fearing that we would as indeed we mean to doe presse them with the profession of the Anabaptists Papists and other heretiks they thinke to preuent vs. And first against the Anabaptists which deny that Christ took our flesh these men haue added who took our nature of the Virgin Mary Then against the papists which hold merit of works they adioyne these words our onely and alsufficient Sauiour And this because the church of England mainteyneth the truth in these points against those fore sayd heretiks On the other hand to help themselues in their corrupt Antichristian walking and false constitution they omit and mention not th' Apostles words Col. 2. wher he sayth As ye haue receiued Christ Iesus the Lord so walke in him rooted and built in him and stablished in the faith as ye haue been taught c The discreet reader may soon espy their purpose in this cunning cariage For let the position be set downe in the scripture termes and we shall see how weake their plea will be The onely fundamentall truth in religion is this That Iesus is the Christ the sonne of the liuing God comen in the flesh in whom we must beleeue and h walke being rooted and build in him and stablished in the faith as we are taught in the new testament If now these ministers will insist vpon the three first scriptures onely and generall terms that are in them it is apparant that the Papists Anabaptists and many other miscreants doe hold and professe them absolutely absolutely But if they joyne with them Colos. 2. and compare the walking rooting building and stablishing in the faith taught by th' Apostles with the Popish church or with their own it wil be found that neyther of them hold the foândation Christ aright Themselues wâll grant it of the Papâsts and other heretiks and for their own church it is before in this treatise proued So then to come agayn vnto their reason that they hold âeâch and mainteyn euery part of Gods holy truth which is fundamântall whereby they woulâ conclâde themselues to be a true chrâch the arâument is deneyed Fâr first if ât were granted that thây hâld âaught and maiâteynâd every part of fundââental truth which yet with them is but one article onely as we haue heard it wâll not follow necessaryly that therefore they are a true chârch or that they truely professe the Christ an faith There wanâ two things 1 obedience to the truth professed withoât which men shal be damned whatsoeuer they professe 2 and a right profession of the true faith onely without errâurs adioyned that ouerthrow the same faith and obedience thereto For if a people profeâsing that onely fundamentall truth which these ministers speake of should withall professe Mahomet the prophet of the Turks or H. N. the God of the Familists or any other like abomination were this misceline profession of Christ and Belial togither a true and sound profeâsion I trow not So then these ministers must alter their plea thus that they hold teach mainteyn and obey every part of the fundamentall truth and nothing els with it that ouerthrowes the same If now they say this they doe I haue before in this treatise disproued it and here agayn will briefly disproue it thus They professe to beleeu the Communion of Saincts and that the visible church is a congregation of faithfull people Yet contrariweise they hold teach and mainteyne that their own church is a true church of Christ though it consists as wel of vnholy as holy infidels as beleeuers and innumerable wicked persons openly seen and known That this they hold mainteyn is proâed by their continual clamors and reprochful writings against vs that call vpon them for a separation of light from darknesse It is proued by Dr Wâitgifts plea before mentioned that the children of Papists heretiks and other wicked persons are and ought to be baptised amoÌg theâ It is further proued by the visible estate of their church knowne vnto all among them and testâfied by her dearest freinds fauourers Mâ Gifford speaking to his brethren âf the Communion of Saincts in Engl. sayth Yee would euen powr out your stinâing and râtâen pâyson like blaspemous and venemous beasts ye would speake after this manner you that are so full of the spirit you that are Saincts and suâh like What are you Diâils are ye of the flesh No doâut ye are vntill God convert ye But we may se how diuiâishly men ar become wicked when a man cannot make any appearance to be godly and holy but it is reproched as though it were a shamefull thing to be lead by the spirit c. These and the like records with the continuance continuance in this confused estate plainely proue an ouerthrow of that article of the true church which is the body of Christ and the body being disanulled Christ the head cannot soundly be reteyned Agayn they professe in Engl. that the puâe word of God is to be preached the sacraments duely administred c. also that in our doings that will of God is to be followed which we haue expresly decleared vnto vs in the word of God Yet withall they professe and practise in that church to read the Apocrypha âcriptures in which are found vntruthes and errors when many parts of the authentik scripture are neuer read among them they haue also written homilies in sted of preaching a written Leâtourgâe Letany collects c. in sted of praying which Leitoargie with all the popish contents therein must be approued and vsed by all the Priests and people and God serued by it euery day They haue also an antichristian clergie caâled and ordeyned according to their pontifical or book of ordination which ân their beleef hath not any thing that of it selfe is sâperstitious and vngodly c. Finally all the Romish reliques yet in England to be seen in the
and idolatrous outward worship of God which is polluted with the writings of men vidz with read slinted prayers homilies catechismes c. Here let it first be obserued that whereas Mr Barrow whose books they would seem to answer hath giuen 4. causes of our separation namely the 1. false worship 2. profane people 3 false ministery and 4. Antichristian hierarchie these godly ministers like the vniust steward that set down fifty for fiue skore haue contracted the 4. causes into 2. for what cause let him that readeth consider Secondly in the two which they professe to answer they keep not the words by Mr Barrow there set downe as to begin with the first he sayth For that the profane vngodly multitudes without exception of any one person are with them receiued into and reteyned in the bosome of the church These ministers set down the poynt to be about the not gathering by due meanes Whereas if it were granted that they had due meanes of gathering yet the exception made is of force against them rather more then lesse for they that haue the true meanes of gathering a church and yet gather it amisse the greater is their sinne Now to the particulars whereas Mr Barrow had first shewed by many scriptures and reasons what manner persons were to be the matter of Gods church and then compared here with the people of the church of Engl. where all sorts of wicked persons are admitted kept in communion to this the ministers answer First that they might lawfully be accounted a true church though it could not appear that they were at the first rightly gathered For euen as the Disciples might be wel assured of Christs bodily presence amongst them when they saw and felt him though they could not haue discerned which way or how he could possibly come in so may we esteem them a true church of whose present profession and faith we are wel assured though we cannot see by what meanes they were first gathered This answer of theirs is full of errour and frawd for not to speake how they corrupt Mr Barrowes words in the places which they quote by leauing out things of speciall importance first they blamed because all profane wicked persoÌs ar of the mater their church they tel us they may esteem them a true church of whose present profession and fayth they are wel assured If this answer be direct and to the purpose then we must beleeue that the godly ministers are wel assured of the present profession and faith of all the lewd profane irreligious and wicked persons in the realm which are members of the church of Engl. Against these was the exception made for these the answer is giuen vnlesse they answer their own fansies and now what assurance the ministers have of such mens faith let the faithfull iudge Secondly the similitude which they bring is a great abuse of the reader whome they would blinde with a false comparison which if it were duely made would make against them thus As the disciples might be wel aââured of Christs bodily presence when they saw and felt him c. so men may he wel assured of the wickeds bodily presence in the church of Engl when they see and feel them as who doe not But now as these men haue made the parable what likelihood of truth is there in it for iustifying the vngodly If a man seeing a Priest in bed with one of the Popes courtizans should blame him for this fornication and an other to defend him should plead thus As we are sure that Sarah was Abrahams wife though we cannot tell when or how they were married so may wee esteeme these two of whose present chascity we are wel assured to be lawfull man and wife though we cannot tel how they came together would this be a sufficient defence Yet loe when Mr Barrow blamed the Priests of England for linking themselues in the bed of spirituall loue with the idolatrous Papists and all other wicked of the land at the beginning of Q. Eliz. and continuing in like sinful commixtur vnto this day these Ministers now to saue their credit tel vs an example of Christ presence c. as before is seen Yea the indignity of it stayeth not here for as the Apostle by the Ministery of the gospell prepared the church of Corinth as a pure virgin for her husband Christ so these men pretending to be true Ministers will haue Papists Atheists profane and wicked persons to be Hephzi-bah people in whome God delighteth they will bring this sinfull and adulterous generation even all the vngodly in the land vnto the bed of Christ in his church whether he will or no Which high transgression is the ouerthrow of the mayn ground of the gospell which euer since it began to be sounded in the world hath proclamed a separation of the children of God from the children of Belial as before hath bene proued This being thus obserued how these ministers haue missed at first oâ the question the further they goe the further they stray and run themselues out of breath in vayn For neyther the examples of Melchisedek Iob Cornelius c. nor their reasons following of 2 other meanes of gathering the church then by the preaching of the Gospel 3 of the preaching of Mr. Wickliff c 4 5 of the course that Q Elizab. took for bringing the Gospell in agayne c. none of these I say will proue eyther that open profane and wicked persons may be receiued and kept in the bozome of the church or that there be not multitudes of open profane and wicked members of the church of England Their present lamentable estate proclaymeth this latter to all men that haue conscience their own writings also heretofore doe strongly confirme it and all the scriptures cry out against the former teach a separation as before in this treatise and in sundry other books is manifested As these ministers have thus passed by the mayn controuersie so haue they in their pretended answers inserted some things corruptly and fraudulently which I will briefly touch First for to bolster out the constreyned profession of faith and ioyning to the church which their people are compelled vnto they plead that Synce Kings became noursing fathers c. to the church their lawes haue been means to bring men to the outward society of the church and the parable proueth that men may be compelled to come Luk. 14 23. This doctrine openeth a dore in the church to all the profane in the world contrary to the scriptures Isa 25.2 35.8 9.2 Chron. 23.19 Reu. 21.27 Leuit. 10.14 Zac. 14.21 2 Cor. 6.14 17. Act. 2.41 19.9 For if a prince may compel some of his subiects to be members of the church he may compel al and if one prince may doe it all may So if there were such an Emperor as Augustus that commanded all the world to be taxed he might
vpon the sands for the profane popish multitude had not receiued the gospel before but as hath been shewed werâ constreyned by K. Edw. against their wills to hear English Mattins in their churches where they were wont to hear Latiâ Latin masse and were glad with all their hearts when their old blind devotion did agayn take place and they might suck the blood of such as spake against it So they cannot rightly be sayd to fall from the gospel which they neuer receiued And what secret congregations there were in Q. Maries dayes I know not but if they were so secret as onely they met now and then in priuate and ordinarily went to church openly with Papists they were not a true church of Christ. And that constreyned vnion of Papists and of Protestants at the beginning of Q Eliz reign vnder Archbishops Bishops Priests c. with most of the same mattins even-songs rites ceremonies c. that before had been imposed this order can neuer be warranted by the testament of Christ nor such a commixture proued to be a true church And whereas it is noted for an other vntruth that Mr. Barrow and Greenuâ should say that in one day by the blast of her Maiesties trompet at the Beginning of her reign all sorts of men were drawne to a profâssion of the gospell without any further means vsed these ministers may be seen to be mere cauillers and bent to depraue For the words euen as themselues haue set them down whereby the reader may espy their falshoode were these where such profane multitudes were all immediately from publicke idolatry at one instant receiued or rather compelled to be members of this church in some parish or other without any due calling to the fayth by the preaching of the Gospell going before or orderly ioyning together in the faith there being no voluntary or particular confession of their own faith c. Now these men to reign an vntruth yea an other vntruth when nonâ was afore haue among other things changed without any due calling to the faith into without any further meanes vsed and then to conuince this their own fictioÌ they tell vs of sundry preachers sent betweeÌ Nouember Midsommer that called many But his neyther cleareth them of corrupt dealing nor proueth that the whole realme which at Midsommer was compelled to this church worshâp ministery c. was duely called vnto the fayth much lesse that they orderly ioyned together in the same So that the vntruth must rest in their own bosome This being proued say these ministers that there was a true Church in thiâ land before her Maiesties reign the question must not be whether the meanes she vsed were the right meanes for the first calling and conuerting a people in the faith but wether she took not a lawfull course for the recalling and reuniting of her subiects vnto those true professors whose fellowship they had forsaken Loe how these men run on as if they had proued that whereof we haue yet heard scarce any shew of proof And altering closely the question they say there was a true church in the land whereas they must prouâ a true church of the land as now it is and long hath been esteemed the Church of England hauing an Archbishop and other officers ouer it which âre in their Conuocation house the Representative Church of England So it noâ not being a true church the examples they allege of reformation by the Kings of Iudah fit not their turnes for Iudah was a true church though some corruptions had crept in as will easily doe into the best Abijah the predecessor of Asa mainteyned Gods true religion and worship against idolatrous Israel both by word and sword So Asa found not his kingdome a false church as K. Edw Q Elizab. found England yet vsed he that great care for reformation mentioned 2 Chro. 14. 15. and his son Iehoshaphat after him greater care both to reforme and teach the peoâle 2 Chron. 17. Afterwards when abominations had ouerspread the land Hâzekiah laboured a godly reformation and opening the dores of the Lords house he brought in the Priests and Leuites not the Chemarins or Baals Priests as the popish clergie which their own notes on Reu. 9.3 acknowledge to be the Locusts of the bottomlesse pit were brought in or rather reteyned still in this church as Mr Fox sheweth Hezekiah sent ouer all the land to conuert the people from idolatry who laughed the messengers to scorne and mocked them howbeit divers submitted themselues and came to Ierusalem and it was God that gaue Iudah a hart to obey the King and rulers according to his word Neyther were any admitted to the Passeouer but such as had voluntarily yeilded repented and eyther sanctified themselues or els being preuented through want of time were healed or clensed of the Lord at the Kings prayer The other disobedient Israelites God punished by the sword and slauery of Asshur because they would not obey the voyce of the Lord their God Finally Iosijah purged the land of idols false worship reduced his people vnto the true seruice of God which they with himselfe had couenanted to walke in These examples we acknowledge al Christian princes should folow hauing equall power with these Kings of Iudah to abolish all idolatry within their dominions yea and to punish obstinate idolaters and not suffer any superstitious worship among their subjects but to procure their conuersion by the word yet not to compell them to be members of the church because they cannot giue them faith and repentance which is the onely dore into Christs kingdome and cannot be opened to any but by God alone Which doctrine and practise these ministers if they would not learne out of holy writ mought haue seen set forth in their own book of Martyrs where when Ethelbert King of Kent was conuerted and Christened and after him innumerable other daylie came and were adioyned to the church yet the King sayth Mr Fox compelled none for he had learned that the faith and seruice of Christ ought to be voluntary and not coacted I acknowledge the Godly and gratious disposition and care of K. Ed. Q Eliz. at the first for restoring of the Gospel to be worthy of purpetuall praise and memory and the error that was in reteyning the popish profane multitudes the Antichristian clergie the Romish worship worship turned into English some few grosse things left out and thâ other euils yet to be seen in the ecclesiasticall estate these I iudge are rather to be imâuted vnto the false clergie men which were trusted too much in thes matters dealt not according to the trust reposed in them but sought to inrich themselves with the spoyles of Bable and of Iericho the Bishopricks benefices and other like Romish reuenues rather theâ for the build the howse of God vpon the foundations of Sion And
life which serue to heal the nations with if he offer to touch the Egyptian vlcers that appeare in your worship church-government ministerie ceremonies c. he is presently thrust out of dores and if he dare but affirme these or any of these to be disceases and botches in your body sinns against God or repugnant to his word he is excommunicated ipso facto by the decrees of the whole representatiue church of England And are you willing now to be healed Nay if any among you not medling with the publike estate of your church but feeling or fearing his own particular sowl sicknes doe resort to a physician whose receipts are not after the common sort for aduise about his health or of friendship and acquaintance to see him he is subiect to the censure and thunderbolt of your church Witnesse the late practise in Norwich where certayn citizens were excommunicated for resorting vnto and praying with Mr Robinson a man worthily reverenced of all the city for the graces of God in him as your selfe also I suppose will acknowledge and to whome the cure and charge of their sowles was ere while committed Would any vnmercifull man haue dealt so with his bondslaue in a case of bodily sicknes But hereby all may see what small hope there is of Curing the Kanker of your church THe second question is Are they themselues healed then where were they healed where were they called where were they regenerate and begotten to Christ was it not in the womb of this our church and by means of the immortall seed of Gods word that is dayly sown in our church a holy church a church of God where in ordinarily men are called and brought to God The winde bloweth where it will and we heare the sound thereof but know not whence it cometh and whether it goeth so is every one that is bârne of the spirit To your demaund then I answer we werâ câllââ being in Bââylon your Church I meane which restreyneth the ãâã by vnriâhteousnes there was our regeneration begun Where we faâ in darknes and in the shadow of death the light of God appeared and ãâã vs lâfe If you yet inquire how this was I refer you to ãâ¦ã brouâht light out of darknes and daylie bringeth forth the ãâ¦ã treasâre and his wayes are past finding out for as I knâw ãâã tâe way of the winde nor how the bones doe grow in the womb of her that is with childe so know I not the work of God that worketh all If you demaând of the means it was doubtlesse the word and spirit of the Lord without which there is no calling no regeneration Now where you ask how then we can deny that to be a true church wherâin ãâã men are called and brough to God I answer first you take vp more thân we lay down when you say ârdinarily for the ordinary and common fruit of the word among you is through your own corrupt handling and hearing of it euell and not good the many walke the broad way and Gods calling is like to that which the Prophet sayth one of a city and two of a tribe in resâect of the worldly multitudes Secondly all the Saincts are not begotten vnto Christ in the wombe of a true particular church for when the Apostle preached among Pagans conuerted many I would know in the womb of what church they were begotten they were first conuerted vnto Christ before euer they were in any other church then that Ierusalem which is aboue the mother of all the elect Let vs come to later times your selues when you began to be a church of protestants in what particular womb were your people begotten I suppose if in any it was in the womb of your mother church of Rome where they had both receiued Baptisme the seal of regeneration and been catechised in Christian religion and then look how your selues can deny that to be a true church or be free of vnthankfulnes towards her that bare you But you prosecute your cause against vs and would driue vs eyther to say there is indeed a true ministery of the word among you but it is not powrfull to any but our selues or els that we were not called in your church but since we left you To the first I answer there is no necessity that we must grant a true ministery for first we hold that the true word may be put in Balaamites mouthes and a false ministery may through Gods wondrous grace beget faith in his elect if you say otherweise you will shake the foundation of your English church layd by Austââ the monk Pope Gregories Apostle and damn all your late fathers vnder the Roman Clergie Secondly we âie not the grace of God in the true church to the ministers lips knowing that men by other meanes are often conuerted to the Lord. And if your ministers in England hold that men cannot be begotten to Christ among them but by their preaching you may take vp your Letanie which causlesse you vse for vs and say from this horible and bellish pride good Lord deliuer them As they cannot restreyn the winde from blowing so much lesse the spirit of God from breathing out of other places then ministers mouthes To the second also I answer that it is one thing to be called in your church as you speake and another thing to be called by your church or ministery as I thinke you mean It is written Reu. 18.4 Goe out of her my people you see here Gods people were in Babylon and are called ovt of the same not by Babel it selfe or any minister of it buy by a voyce from heauen So we might be called in your church though not by the same And thus we haue not bard our selues from pleading against you as you would bear men in hand neyther yet shew you of whom or wher you had that which you say we all stoutly answer and stifly stand to it namely that we leau your church meerly only out of conscience c. We haue a better ground if you would receiue it euen the Law of the Lord that so commandeth both vs and our consciences Conscience is the blinde Papists common plea but we know that mans conscience is as much defiled as any other part or power of his sowl or body and therefore it may be no rule of our actions but the law of God onely which is pure perfect and vndefiled Yet you wil needs proceed and say then we had conscience before we left you I answer yea or els we would not haue left you Thinke you that your predecessors had no conscience when they left the Popish church Then where say you of us and minde whether the Papists will not say as much of you where came they to that conscience and care of their saluation but in our church You are answered before we had it in your church as Gods
King of the church of England p 74. c. not the spowse of the same pag 42. c Compulsion to the faith and church vsed in Engl. but vnwarrantable pag 120.78.131 c.. p 133 Constitution of a church pag 98.99 K. Edwards reformation of religion and how it was accepted pag. 120.133 Foundation Christ and Fundamentall truth pretended and discused pag 34.123 c. 126.117 c Gifts proue not a true ministery pag 13 c. Matter of the church of Engl. pag 106. Ministery of the church of Engl. pag 108 c. A Papist argument against the church of Engl. pag. 111. Pattern of planting a church pag. 44. Popular gouernment obieâted and answered pag. 101 c. Popes authors of many ordinances now in Engl pag. 137 c. Positions concerneng a true church pag. 65 c. Profession in Engl. contrary to their estate and praâtise pag 124 c Reformation by the Kings of Iudah p. 134. c Reformed churches alleged for approbation of the church of Engl. and answered pag. 9 10.22 c. 48 51 â2 c. 128 129. Repentance not truely preached or practised in the church of Engl. pag. 45. c. 56. c. Separation proued necessary p 5 22 granted by our aduersaries pag. 1 Synns suffred how they defile the church pag. 101. c. Spirits of the Prophets subiect to the Prophets scanned pag. 28.29 Testimonies of the ministers of Engl. against the estate of that church concerning The people pag. 2.107.108.59 60 62.122.125 126.127 The ministery and ministers pag. 3.11.112.81 114.119 136 142 143. The worship pag 3 The church gouernours pag 4 Worship of God in the church of England polluted pleaded for against pag. 137. c CONSIDERATIONS Touching the poynts in difference betvveen the godly ãâ¦ã people of the Church of England and the seduced brethren of the separation A Separation we deny not from the corruptions of the Church wherein we liue 1 in iudgment 2 profession 3 practise 1 of teaching euâry part of truth and righteousnes 2 of performing the things we teach 3 of reprouing every part of sin and error 4 and absteyning from all corruptions of life and dâctrine for which particulars so many of both parts haue suffred and doe suffer so many things But the difference is we suffer for separating in the Church you out of the Church And this to be true you know vnlesse you will cauill against your own conscience and knowledge Answer WHO so examineth these your Considerations and weigheth them in the ballance of equitie may finde them wanting in many poynts touching the differences between your Church and vs that separate froÌ the same and insufficient in the poynts that are handled to perswade any wise hart to returne vnto you You ouerpasse 1 the hierarchie of your spirituall Lords the prelates with their vnder officers which reign ouer you 1 and the forme of Gods worship by your Leitourgie or seruice booke set vp and vsed in all your parishes These are two mayn exceptions that we make against you though you dissemble them in this your writing and insist vpon other two 1 the people and 2 inferior ministerie as I conceiue you as if these onely were the poynts of difference between vs and you Which whether you haue done of ignorance or of fraud rather to deceiue your reader I leaue it vpon your conscience to consider of Againe the two things that you take vpon you to handle you for down in these termes the godly Ministers and people of the Church of England whereas our separation is from your Church in generall wherein many vngodly ministers and people are to be found standing in commixture or confusion rather as one body with those which are estemed more godly and religeous and therefore you deale not syncerely to make our separation to seem but from apart and those the godly Agayn whereas there is a scisme in your Church by two contrary factions at warr with your selues Conformitans and Puritans as you stile one another you deale not plainely to tell vs whither party you meane to defend but lead your reader into clowdes and mâst speaking of godly miâisters and people not naming who or where they are That thoâgh one may gueâse whome you mean yet you write so generâlly covertly that if danger or in conuenience come by any thing you haâe sayd yoâ may sâifâ it of to eyther side for your best aduantage A ãâã you deny not from the corruptions of the Chârch whârein ãâã liue yet ãâ¦ã not what those corruptions are which behooued you to haâe done if you woulâ haue effeâted oâr retârne vnto you For we are uerily perswaded that they are nothing bât your corruâtâons ãâã we haue separated froâ and therefore cannot reioyne our selues vnto you till they be remoued And seeing you may minde some things to be corruâtions in your Chârch and we othersome it cannot be we should well accord till particulars be related which therefore if you write agayn we pray you in your next to set downe Yet for the present it is well that the truth hath wrung out such a testimony from yovr own mouth and pen whiles you grant and deny not such a separation in generall as you mention to the branches whereof if you will stand and abide also by whâch you haue heretofore wrâtten I doubt not but the discreet reader will see your bat ell is âot so much against vs as against your selues the sword which you haue draâ ãâã slay svch as be vpright of way doth enter into the verie hart of your own Church the bâwes which you haue bent at us are broken For âe forsake your Church for this mayn corruption that all sorts of profane and wicked men haue been and are both they and their seed receiued into and nourished withân the bâsome of your Church contrary to the first couenant of our redemption wherein God with his owne mouth proclaymed perpetvall emnity and warr against the Serpent and his seed which the women and her seed should wage though with the brusing of the heel thereof Gen. 3. Contrary also to the example of all Gods Churches since the world begann who alwayes were seperated from the vngodly as the scriptures shew Now that this is a corruption aâong you your selues haue taught saying and complayning that in the Church are swarmes of Atheists jdolaters Papists erroneus and hereticall sâctaries witâhes charmers sorcerers murtherers theeues adulterârs liers c Also that among you the holy Saccraments are communicated with the Papists the holy misteris of God profaned the Gentiles enter into the Temple of God the holy things are indifferently communicated with clean and vnclean circumcised and vncircumcised Againe that there be thâwsands which be men and women growne which if a man ask them how thây âhalbe saued they cannot tell As for wickedness in pride envy haâred and all sinns that can be nâmed almost it deth ouerflow and yet
not the discipline nor teach their people to keep and obserue the same yea they blame us for practâsing Christs lawes withouâ the Magistrates leaue as if Christ wer not head of the church Prince of all the Kings of the earth Again they administer not their doctrine sacraments and discipline as this realm hath receiued neither reuerently obey their Ordinaries but resist preach and write against the Bishops their canons rites and ceremonies as much as they dare Thus halt they between two opinions and practise neither the discipline of Chrâst nor of the prelâtes whiles yet they would seem to practâse both being in this poynt like to the Saâaritans which whiles they would both fear the Lord and serue theâr images also they neither feared God nor did after their orâinances as the scriptures sayth What then may we esteem of your ministers pâwer and authority in teaching Aâaine cânsider you if some Absolom Adoniaâ or other vsurper should say I haue 1 sanctification 2 knowledge 3 spirit of dâscerning 4 of âtteraâce 5 of power and authoritie in iudging 6 effectual ordinârie decidind ending of controuersies c therefore I am a lawfull King Iudge or Magistrate and God hath giuen witnesse by these vndââbted testâmonies of the truth of my Magistracie whether this âlea woâld serue him or these testimonies approue his office yet are these most âregnant proofs of your Minâstery 6. The 6. and last testimonies is their effectual ordinary calling and bâgetting to the faith of God c. This I haue before touched and shewed that ordinarily they beget not but hinder the true faith they keep the people in blândenes and idolatrie whâch is a worke of darknes and of the flesh and if by their preaching any be brought to the true faith I account it Gods extraordinary work which I doubt not but is also aâoÌg the Papist Againe if this were granted them I would know what office they would claym iâ the church hereby whether Apostleship of some other function For in the Church of Corinth were many teachers and instructours yet begat they not their âeople to the faâth for the Apostle Paul challengeth to be their father only and to haâe begotten them in Christ through the gospel 1. Cor â 15 So there may be a lawfull Pastor or Teacher in a church which neuer begat any of them to the faith but onely nourisheth and increaseth faith in them that were begotten afore He is chosen to feed the flock 1. Pet. 5. â not to begett the same the flock is a company of faithfull people begotten before they haue a Pastâr The begetting of faith was first and chiefly by the Apostles and Evangâlâsts that went about preachâng the word to them that had not heard it Rom. 15 20.21 It âs also by the ministers of churches or prophets though not in office of ministerie whân vnbeleeuers come into their assâmblies 1 Cor. 14.24.25 It is also by all Christians priuately meâ and women which preaching and witnessing the truth of the Gospell reading talking conferring of the scriptâres doe conuert many unto God informe their children and families in the faith and saue their soules Act 8.4 18 â6 1 Cor. 7.16 Eph. 6 4. Deut. 6.7 Sâ the begetting of faâth is no certaine testimony of a true Minâsterie Whereas therefore you conclude that your Ministery begat us also if ever we werâ trâly begotten in thâ spirit we may answer yov with Moses âe take to muâh vpon you yâ sons of Levi. For know you not the wind bloweth where it liâteth and you hear the sound thereof but cannot tâl whence it commeth or whether it goeth and so is euery man that is borâ of the spirit It seemeth you count nothing preaching but that which is in the pulpit nothing the word of God but that which commeth out of your Ministers lips but thanks be unto God that hath giuen vs better to discerne the worke of his grace and hath breathed vpon vs with his holie spirit whiles your Ministers stood lik the 4. Angels in the corners of the earth holding the windes that they should not blow The 6 Consideration 6. ALso our godly people haue all the marks and tokens of Gods people and elect 1 which the scriptures set downe 2 which the people in the timâ of Christ and his Apostles had 3 which the professors of any church that is now in the world haue 4 yea which your selues in your supposed perfection can boaââ of which is sealed vnto them 1 by the care peace and testimony of a good conscience in all things 2 by suffring for sundrie parts both of righteousnes and ãâã 3 by effectual comforts in such sufârings 4 assârance of faith of hope of remission of sinns Gods dear loue vnto them 5 by spiritual loue and thâ fruits thereof 6. by the progresse and daylie growth in knowledge strength and godlinessâ c. Answer THAT many of your people are Gods elect I vndoubtedly acknowledge and I would to God such were the estate of you euery one Yet the constitution of your people in your church is not a Communion of Saincts with which we may participate but a confuse mixture of all sorts of men from which the godly must separate as touching the worship of God In this your defence of them you begin thus Our Godly people Buâ who ar they can we tel are not al your people godly of the true church it is written thy people shal be al righteous if your people be not such why make you not a separation from the vngodly that will not be reclaymed or why cast you them not out from among you Thus ought you to doe by the Testament of Christ. 2. Cor. 6.14.17 1. Cor. 5.13 If you doe it not you profane Gods everlasting couenant I deny not but many hypocrites and reprobates wil creep into the true church and much vngodlinesse will their break out as in any assembliâ in the world but when it is seen the sinner is presently to be reproued and eyther must purge himselfe by repentance or be excommunicate Luk. 17.3 Mat 18.15.16 17. Thus still the church continueth a comâunion of Saincts an vnleauened lump a holy nation 1 Cor. 1 5. â 1 Pet. 2 9. Now for your works and tâkâns you say they have all 1 which the scriptures set ârâw This is denied and had you searched the scriptures you might easilie haue seen it otherweise For They are not a separateâ people called out from the world which is oâe prâncipal âark as before I haue shewed vrged often in the scriptures 1. King 8 53. Isa. 52 1â Ier 15.19 Ioh. 17.14.16 Reu'18 4 They are not the Lords free people injoyâng the libertie of the gospell but in thraldom to strange Lord aâd lawes ecclesiastical Contrary to Lâuit â5 42.55 1 Cor. 7. â3 Ioh 8 32 36 Gal. 5 1. They walk not in the truth of the gospel but in many things ar corrupted with
ignorant distracted weak offended blame not vs which testifie the truth but your selues and such as reâist it Thinke you that Chrâst came to giue peace on the earth he hath told you may but rather debate For fiue in one howse shal be diâided three against two and two against three father against sonn mother against dâughter and bleâsed is he that shall not be offended in Christ When the Temple of God is opened in heauen the ark of his couenâât seen therein there are lightnings and voyces and thundrings earthquakâ and much bayl Thinke it not strange then if troubles doe follow follow the preaching of the Gospell neither impute your own faults vnto vs but submit your necks vnto the yoke of Christ least he send out his arrowes and scatter you and increase lightnings and destroy you How your churches âstate hatâ been iustified by you the reader may se by that you haue brought and how far we are from your vnchristian calumnies shall further appâaâ by the help of God in the answer to your other Considerations that now next follow On your part consider 1 YOur Separation is very strange vnboard of in any age of the Church hauing no shew of warrant from Gods word eyther by commandement or example Answer YOV would not call our separation strange if your selfe were not a stranger from the common wealth of Israel What age was there euer in the world since light was separated from darknes that heard not of separation from the false Chârch the fast man Adam saw it in the separation of Seths posterâty from Caines Noah did the like in Sems posteritie from Chams Abraham was called out of Chaldee Lot out of Sodom Israel out of Aegipt and Babel faithfull Iudah from rebellious Israel Christs disciples from faithleââe Iewes and Gentiles and all the Lords people from your confused Babylon Yea God him selfe did first teach it when he made a separation between the wâmans seed and the Serpents Gen. 3. â5 And yet you say it hath no shew of warrant from Gods word Hereafter I suppâse you will say so no more but wil see if you can proue your selues a trâe Church meet to be communicated withal which when you doe we by Gods grace will returne vnto you The 2. Consideration 2 THE poynts in difference between vs and you did arise at first from persons in whome God tâstified against your present causes 1 Mr. Bolton hanged himselfe â Mr. Brown revolted and came back from you 3 Mr. Peâry Barrow and Greenwood were hanged 4 Mr. Iâhnsons and the rest banished and note not by heathen and Antâchristian tyrants as were true Martyrs of Christ but by Christian Magistrat's profâssing and mayntâyning the Gospell of Christ. Besides your principal pillars of greatest reckning gifts and iudgement haue returned from you unto the Church of England as Harrison Smith Crud Slad and sundry other miââsters and men of learning and account who also liued holily and died most comfortably in the Lord notwithstanding Answer IT is a wonder if you be a teacher in your church that your salt is so vasauory Shal mens persons now be brought against the case of Christ haue you no better learned him Mought not a Canâanite or Philistian have reasoned thus against Israel The wares against us and you did arise at first from persons in whome God testified against your present cause Some were brunt with fire som sunk into the earth aliue some were destroyed by serpents some by pestilence some by the enimies sword some by the sword of their own brethren euen Moses and Aâron your ârincipall pillers of greatest reckning dyed in the desert for their sinne and of six hundred thousand men that came out of Aegipt to fight against vs onely two men are left aliue and note these things have come vpon you bâ the hand of your God whom you say that he hath sent you to warr agaynst vs Thus might a PagaÌ haue pleaded against Gods church then with as much truth and more colour then you that are called a Christian can do against vs. But let us see your particulars 1. Mâ Bolton yoâ say hânged himselfe And so did Iudas one of the âirst and principall publisherâ of Christs Gospell Will you therefore call Christâaâity into question for it Besides this Bolton one of the Elders of that separated Church whereof Mr. Fits was Pastour in the beginning of Q. Eliz. reigne first revolted at Pauls Crosse was reproued and excomâunicate for this by the church and aftâr not hauing grace to returne or âepent hanged himselfe This is testified to me by one yet liuing among vs who thoâ was member of that church well acquainted with the affairs thâreof and with this matter and saw the man dead Which being so Boltons Martyrdom is little for the credit of your cause and church where of he died a member 2 Mr. Brown reuolted c. And to did Demas and divers others in al ages who loued this present world more then God But consider you here the Apostles words what though some haue been vnfaithful shal their vnfaithfulnes make the faith of God without effect Farr be it Rom. 3.3 4. besides how wel Mr. Brown approueth of your church though he liue in it if you ask him I suppose will tel yov 3. Mr. Penry Barrow and Greenwood were hanged And so was Christ himselfe and note not by heathen tyranns for Pilate washed his hands of his blood but by Priests Scribes and Pharisees professing and mainteyning the religion of God as your church now dooth And you that allege the hanging of these men to reproach our faith it is probable that if you had then liued you would haue reproached Christ him selfe in the fellowship of whose afflictions and reproaches we now rejoyce and are not ashamed But fulfill you the measure of your forefathers 4. Mr. Iohnsens and the rest ãâã And so was Iâhn the sonn ofâ thunder and many other of Gods people many tâmes You and your church shall haue small cause to boast of your persecuting Christs witnesses when the day of your ãâã shall come Your captions note that these âunishments are neâly heathen tyranââ but by profesâed Christians is indeed worthy to be noted and lamented yet is it of no note or force to disproue the truth of our cause For who âersecuted Chrâst and his Apostles more then the Israelites Gods peculiar and profesâed people who mâre then the builders refused him the chief corner-stone wheâe were the Prophets killed but in Ierusalem Yea not onely false Chrâstâans and hypocrites but Gods elect-seruants may so be ouertaken as to persecute and kill the Lords people Did not the Patriarcheâ sel Ioseph into Aegipt when some of them would haue kâlled him was not Solâmân a good King Yet sought he to kill Ierobâam without cause whom God
had appoynted to be King after him Was not Aja a godly King and good reformer of the church yet was he wroth with Hanani the Seer and put him into prison onely for speaking vnto him the word of the Lord. What weight is there then in thiâ your cavil that our affliction are by Christian magistrates therefore out cause is evill Good princes may be ouer caried eyther by their own affections or by the suggestions and prouocations of other men And if you will not yet see your folly mind this for your selues that you which ãâã called Puritans are molested imprisoned persecuted and note not by hethen and Antichristian tyranns but by your own Christian magistrates and Bishops professing and maynteyning the gospel of Christ. Ergo eyther your cause or your argument is naught Your last poynt is partly false and partly friuolous for Mr. Harrison returned not vnto your church of England but died at Middleburgh in this faith that we professe Mr. Smith Crud and some others which never were officers much lesse pillars in our Church did indeed forsake their first faith and died soone after with what comfort themselues now know But what if many more had forsaken vs yet the truth of the gospell which we professe shall stand Christian religion was at a low ebb when so many went back that Iesus sayd to the twelue will you also gee away Yet Christianitie still flourisheth and shall so long as the moone endureth And we with comfort doe behold that though many bad ones haue gone away yet God bringeth better in their place dayly The 3. Consideration 3. NOte your dissentions between 1 Brown and Harrison 2 Brown ãâã Barron 3 Barroâ and Francis Iohnson 4 Francis and George Iohnson 5 âr Iohnson and Mr. Slade that great scholler 6 Chaphân and others aâout Anahaptisme nay none of your great Rabâines but haue grosly disagrââd disagreed among themselues It piâieth vs to see your poor congregation how lamentably it hath been rent with mutuall dissentions bitings and deuouring of echâethers whâch doubtlesse is no ãâã âf the spirit of God These are not lies but matters known and they are matters horrible and strange Answer IF you were an Atheist or Pagan as you professe to be a Christian you mought in this maââr reprâch the church of God âuer since the world began saying Note the dissentions âetween Kain and Abel Cham and Noah Esaw and Iaacob Ioseph and the Patriarches Moses and the Isralites Moses and the Leuites Moses and his âwn sister and brother Gedeen and the men of Ephraim of Succâth and of Pennel Abâmelech and his brethren Iâphteh and his brethren Beniamin and the other triâes of Israel Saul and Dauid Dauid and Absalom the ten tribes and the two from Ieroboams times and after the Pharisees Sadducees in the Iewish Church the Apostles of Christ the dissântions in Corenth and the other Apostolike Churâhes These are not lies but matters knowne and râcorded in the scriptures and they are matters horrible and sârangem So then if your proposed Cânsideration be of weight to turne vs from our present faith because of the dissentions that haue been among vs the like consideration ânought turne vs also which God forbid from all faith and religion make vs as very Atheâsts as a many of your church already are And indeed wher unto leadeth this manner reasoning which you vse bât vnto Atheismâ For if an Infidel âhould mind religion mought he not be kept back by considârâng the dissentions in faâth between Painims Iewes Mahometists and Chrâstians and a Iew or Turke be kept from Christianitie because of the disâentions between Protestants Papists Arians Anabaptists and other sects many Yea are not the Papists at this day hindred from true religeon by noting as you doe the dissentions between Luther Zwinglius Calvân c But it seemeth all these were farr from your consâderation or if you minded them yet were they but motes in your ey they be our dissentions ours onely that trouble you It pittieth you to see our poor congregation how lamentably it hath been rent c. but you are hard-harted and take no pity belike on your own Church which you so highly commend vnto us though dissentions for discipline that I speake not of other matters haue been so great that you haâe not onelie preached printed on against an other now many a year and that in verie bitter and hostile manner but also persecuâede imprisoned fought the blood on of an other Wel howsoeuer we haue indeed just cause to lament that by our dissentions you and others haue taken occasion to blaspheme the truth of God yet herin haue we comfort that such things must be amongst us as the Holy Ghost saith that they which are approuued may be known And you if by no meanes you will learne the estate of a Church here on earth where it is in continuall warr with the Serpent and his seed but stil you think these things horrible and strange take heed you stumble not at the stone Christ to your distruction haue your abiding in that house which the strongman armed keepeth and the things that he possesseth are in peace Luk 11.21 The 4. Consideration 4. YOur chiefest teachers cannot as yet determine what the discipline iâ that they would haue as what the difference is between a Pastor a Doctour whether Apostates ought to be admitted to office in the church c. Answer 1 THere is no such dissention among vs touching these matters as you would here insinuate though if there wer yet our imperfection and difference in iudgment sheweth that we are weak men but no whit preâudâceth the truth we professe 2 The heathen Philosophers in the Niâoean Synod obiected the like against Christians that they agreed not in opinion among themselus Sâzomen lib. 1 cap. 18. 3. Your selfe heathen-like may obiect against Paul and Barnabaâ twoo of the chiefest teachers of Christian religion one of the two things wherewith you here doe reproach vs because they not onely could not determine whether Iohn Mark who had before departed froÌ them should accompanie them in the work of the Gospel but were so stirred that they departed asunder one from the other Act. 15.37.38.39.40 4. You might much better blame your owne Church and chiefest teachers that cannot as yet determine what the discipline is that they would haue witnesse your long continued controuersies in print wherein what adoe you make about discipline all the world knoweth If your selues would walke better in the truth peace and concord of the gospel you might wiâh more equitie find fault with us pul therefore the beam first out of your own eye The 5 Consideration 5 THE Lord hath also testified against you by giuing over very many people 1 to Atheisme 2 carnall life 3 Papisme 4 Anabaptisme 5 Ariânijme 6 Familisme which are
of al men by that word if men eyther will not trie nor giue sentence at all or doe judge amisse we are not bound to wayt vpon them but must liue by our own faith The reformed churches haue been wrââten to by vs for we know and acknowledge them to be true churcheâ and our brethren in the Lord they giue vs no Answer Shall wee coÌtinew still ân boÌdage to Antichrâst til they bid vs com out What scripture teacheth vs so If they or any convince vs of error or evill and we yeeld not leâ vs be esteemed accordingly otherwise if we walke in the truth and they will not approue it be it vpon them as they shal answer befâre the Lord. Mr. Iunius whom you mention to reply so sharply neyther approueth your Church nor condemneth our practice no not though he were instantly vrged the writings between him and us are extant to the world let the reader judge what both sides haue sayd Your censure of Mr Barrow or scoffing rather at him neyther hurteth him or vs nor helpeth you His playn dealing in reprouing the corruptions of these times you call rayling it is marvel you say not also the prophets rayled on the people of Israel when they vsed sharp rebukes for I suppose you can hardly shew any hard speech that Mr. Barrow ther writeth which the Prophets and Apostles haue not vsed before But if he were overcaried with some seuere speeches in a good causeâ neyther we not himselfe euer iustified that infirmitie we know that we are frayl men let the sharpnesse therefore be his but the trueth which he sharply teacheth Gods And why carp you at the manner of his writing and meddle not with the matter That book with others haue discouered the idolatries of your church which neyther by you nor any haue euer yet been answered refuted by the scriptures For your self let the reader iudge what you âaue sayd The 7 Consideration 7. THe great and grosse disorder and partiallity in administring of your disciplinâ which George Iohnson sheweth cheerly besides the wants of sunctimony and common duties of godlynes which he sayth are to be found in farr greater measure in the câmmân professârs of the church of England and saith further that the Dutch churches take you for a most vnquiet conâentious and disorderly people Answer THis article you obiect vnto vs vpon one mans report that was for lying and slandering false accusation and contention himselfe cast out of our Church By what rule or word of God can you admit of the testimony of an excommunicate against a whole congregation Reason also might teach you that no man standing against a church to excommunication will ever speake wel of that church in the cause wherein he standeth But grant that this all were true which he reporteth what would you vrge vpon it that therefore Christianitie which we professe is evill so perhaps a Turk or Iew would doe with as much reason as you can conclude that our separation from you is euill Was there ever any truth think you that men did walke in it as they ought or any Church in the world wherein the discipline as you call it was administred as it should Iulian the Apostata that wrote so much against Christ reading the testimonies of Moses the Prophets and Apostles Deut. 9.7.22.24 Isa. 59 3 4 5 c. Mic. 3.9.11 1. Cor. 5.1.2 11.21.22 c. 3 Iohn 9.10 had as good ground to blame the Israelites and Christians for their manners discipline and consequently to disswade them from their faith as you do vs yea he might allege faithfull and vndeniable witnesses whereas you rely vpon a slanderer Finally what ayme you at in all this but to draw vs back vnto your church and there it is like we shall find discipline without disorder or partiallity to weet in your Bishops courts for there the discipline of your church is to be seen Of which we need say nothing the voyce almost of al the land crieth out of their abominations Onely we obserue how pregnant your perswasions are to make vs beleeu that because there ar sinns in Sion there be none in Babylon The 8 Consideration 8. GOD neuer witnessed for you nor gaue testimony of his approuing your separation whether we consider your ministerie or people For hardly can you shew any one person conuerted by your ministery from papistry or atheisme or other open wickednes as by Gods blessing multitudes haue been by ours but onely haue you seduced and wrought vpon the tender consciences of such as by our ministery were first begotten vnto Christ But which is specially to be obserued from your distracted and devided congregations multitudes haue fallen away to euery kind of impiety herisie reigning in the world Answer IF God approue our seperation and our ministerie by his word as we are surâ he dooth it is yenoâgh though our ministery haue not conuerted any Your reason is as if a Câinite should haâe sayd vnto Nâah God neuer witneâsed for thee nor gaue testimony of his approuing thy building of the Ark for hardly canst thou shew any one person converted by thy precahing or Ark building these 120. yeares Our ministery belongeth to our church the assemblies whereof Papists Athâists such like wicked ones vse not to frequent and how is it poâsible âur ministery should conuert such as come not to heare it If we wââld obiect vnto you that few Turks and Saracens haue been converred by yâur mââisterie what would you answer Yet where you say âe can harâly shâw my c. we can if need wer shew you many that wer sometime profâin irreligious whiles they were of your church but coÌmâng and heârâng by Gods providence the doctrine of our church haue been reclâymed from their lewd life doe walk holily in the faith with vs. It is true in âeed that our cause hath wrought most vpoÌ such as being somtimes vnâer yoâr ministery had tender consciences pliable to the truth others of more corrupt consciences haue set against blasphemed it Tâe ââââideratioâ of this in any wise mans iudgment wil rather lead vnto âhen ârom our cause when the better sort by your own confession do come vnto vs the worser and refuse remayn stil with you Your last poynt which you would haue specially to be obserued that multitudes haâe fallen from vs to every kind of heresie and impietie is indeed worthy to be obserued For first the scripture is fulfilled which sayth mâny shâll âleaue vnto them faynedly Dan. 11.34 Secondly being fallen if they had com to a more holy faith better walking wheÌ they were gone out from vs it might haue importeâ ours to be evil but now that they haue fallen to grosse heresie impietie it argueth Gods hand so be heavy vp on them because they continued not in the truth with vs. And this the scripture confirmeth saying of such as receiue not the loue of the truth
force If your people were truelâe regenerate they would not sinne mâstike me not I know the remainders of sinne dwell in the best men and draw them to that they neyther would not ought but as thâ Apostle sayth He that is borne of God sinneth not And seing so many and great sinns reign in your best assemblies how can you say you are regenerate for I haue before manifested that ordinarilie people are kept and continued among you in an vnholy communion with the wicked and irreligious and nourished with sâperstition and idolatrâ these and the like things are no tokens of true regeneration Mr Iohnsons confession is before treated of and will not import that which you would infer The causes and meanes ordeyned by God to beget faith are not by Esa 55 11 Râm 10.17 proued to be among you For there is spoken of the word going out of the Lords mouth but your minâsters are not the Lords mouth because they haâe not from him their calling sending and authoritie to preach bât haue it from his enemie Antichrist and as the Apostle saith how shal thây preach except they be sent Neither are they as the Lords mouth because they separate not the precious from the vile Ier. 15 19. Neyther are the infallible effects of faith c. proued by Gâl 5 6 â2 to be in the true members of yâur best assemblies For seing faith is there sayd to work by loue and there is no loue of Christ vnlesse men keep his commandements and his commandâments are not kept in your idolatrouâ assemblies it cannot be affirmed that you loue the Lord if so you contineâ continew in sinne or that you haue true faith But rather seing the contrary works of the flesh which the Apostle there mentioneth adultery fornication c idolatrie witchcraft hatred c. contentions seditions heresies c. are found in the true members of your church for all among you are baptised and all baptised are true members you are more rightly to be reputed vnregenerate and vnsanctâfied in that your sinnfull and confused estate Neyther haue you Christs power in your best assemblies to cast out the wicked from among you but they are fostered fâd and blessed with your word prayers sacraments c. and such as absteyn from your idolatrie and from communion with the wicked you hate reproach excommunicate and persecute that your church is indeed a mother to the profane But a stepmother to the faithfull The 6 argument THose Churches for whome the Churches of God reiâyce are true Churcheâ 2. Thes. 1.4 But our best assemblies are such for whome the churches of God reioyce Ergo. The reason of the proposition is because the churches of God haue the spirit of discerning a true church and ministery from a false as Ioh 10.27 5. Maâ 24 24 1 Cor. 14 32. and 10 15· 1 Ioh. 4 1· The assumption is true because all the churches of God reioyce in our best assemblies and haue giuen vs the right hand of fellowship and testimony of a truââhurch hauing ioyned our publick confession with their Harmony Answer THIS argument is one and the same with the third of your first Constlerations saue that it hath gotten the fashion of a syllogisme The in sâfficiencie of this reason I haue there shewed and thether doe referr the reader Further here I answer that you turne the testimony of the reformed churches to your best advantage yet neyther with equitie nor good successe For they joy not for your best assemblies more then for your worst but for your Church in generall and the confeâsion of the same They rejoyce for every Bishop Priest and Deacon and for every Parish that maketh such confession as Bishop Iewel in his Apologie hath set down Part of which Apologie they haue vnited with their Harmânie And why bring you them as approuing your best assemblies onely Your Lords the Prelates may truely say you doe them wrong to apply vnto your selues the applause which other churches giue to their Apologie They wil tel you in your own words the churches of God haue the spirit of discerning a true church and Ministery from a false But the reformed âhurches haue discerned the nationall church of England whereof the Archbâshop of Cant· is Pastorâ to be a true church they haue discerned the Diâcesan Bishâps in England as well as the Parish Priests to be true Ministers and reioyce as well for their Sees as for yoâr Parishes hauing joyned these all alike in their Harmony And what will you that suffâr sâ many things for sepârating in yâur chârch as yoâ sâyd answer to your right reverend Fathers against whome like vnnaturall children yoâ hauâ striven so long and would have them with their jârisdâctâon âut out of your church thât the Pârâsh priest or Deacon mâght Lord it alone More particularly I answer yoâr first propostion is vnsound cannot be proâed from the scripture you allege 2 Thâs 1.4 from which text yoâ must conclude on this faâhâon Pâul and Siluanus and Timotheuâ reioyced of the Thesalonians in other churches of Gâd because of their pacience and faith in all persecutions c. Therefore the reformed churcheâ reioycing for the church of England it must needs be a true church The conseqâence is denied True churches may err in their judgment of an other church especialy if theâ be not rightly informed of the statâ thereof as the reformed churches are not by that your Apologie Moreover he that mindeth the things recorded of that church 1 Thes. 1 3 6 7 9 c. and the different estate to be seen in your church may soon perceiâe their is no lâke cause of joy for you âs for them that if there be a lâke effeât it is in error The reason of the proposition is no better confirmed by the scriptures you allege For when Chrâât sayth Iohn 10 27 5. Mâ sheep hâar my voyce and they will not follow a stranger doeth he send his sheep to other flocks to try their shepheards by or if I see my shepheard to be a thâef a hireling a wolf mâst I commit my sowl vnto hâm because other shepherds wâll giue him the right hand oâ fellowship In the other scriptures say nât the Apostles to the particular churches and persons iudge ye what I saâ try ye thâ spârit and beleeue not euery spirit But you would not haue our selues to iudâe or try but to send over sea and hear what other churches iudge if they apâroue we must not disalow You may as wel bid vs. put out our own eyes that other men may lead vs and as soon will we follâw you in that as in this your popish counsell We have learned to liue by our own faith and know that every man shall beare hâs own bârden and answer for himself to God But you will tell vs if we can iudge and discerne the true church others can doe it also and better I
we must be separated thirdly the corruption of nature in our selues the lust of the flesh the lust of the eyes and the pride of life all which are of the world and whâch we must hate and crucifie so turne and become like little children euen borne agayn that we may see the kingdome of God 16. The estate wherevnto God called his church in this life is generally to the communion or fellowhsip of his sonne Iesus Christ as being their onely mediator and Sauiour the Prophet Priest and King of the church which they beleeuâng and professing are alâo made partakers in a proportion and in their measure of these three offices with him 17. Iesus Christ is the Prophet raâsed vp of God vnto his people to teach them all that God commanded him which also he did both by himselfe and by the Mânistery of his seruants sent of him And as all the treasures of wisdome and knowledge are hid in him so him the church mâst hear for all heauenly wisdome and knowledge is to be learned of him and every person which shall not hear this Prophet shall be destroyed out of the people 18 This Prophet call office of Christ he hath communicated with the church by giuing to the same his word for their instruction and comfort and graffing the same within them his spirit also as an Anoynting to teach them all things giuing gifts also or ministers to open and apply the same vnto their sowles likewise power and freedome by witnes profession and practise to hold forth that word of life as lights in the world thereby to preach vnto others the faâth of Christ to edâfy and build vp one another dayly therein to prouoke vnto loue and to good works to admonish and reprehend for evill and iniquity to forgiue and comfort one another in the bowels of Christ whose word therefore all ought to labour that it may dwel plenteously in them that if any man speak it may be as the words of Gâd 19. Iesus the son of God is also the great high priest or Sacrificer of the Church by whose obedience and sacrifice or oblation of hâs own body and blood the church is clensed from all sinn and reconciled to God by whose intercession the church with the holy actions oblations of the same are accepted of God and made heires of blessing 20. And this his Prâestly office is ãâã imparted to his church as they haue not onely interest in his death and suffrings whereby they are reconciled to God but also are themselues made a holy priesthood to offer vp spirituall sacriâices acceptable to God by him giuing vp their own bodies a liuing sacrifice mortifying their members whâch are on earth and crucifyâng the flesh with thâ affections and lâsts offring vp contrite and broken hârts with sacrifices of praise confeâsing to his name and praying not oââly every man for himself but one for another doing good and dâstributing to the neceâsities of the Saincts suffring afflâction for the Gospell and fynally if they be called therevnto powring out the r soules vnto death fâr the truthes sake 21. The Lord Iesus Christ is also the gouernour and king ouer Sion Gods hâly mount and sitteth at his Fathers right hand and reigneth till all his enimies be made his footstool being a King iudge and lawgiuâr to hâs people commanding and ruling them by his word and spirit jâdging them in iustice and equâty preseruing and defendâng them by his almighty power from all their enimies 22. And this his kingly office he so communicateth with hâs church as they are by him preserâed and defended from all aduersarie Pâwer freed from the dominion of sinne and tyrannie of Satan from subiection to the world and seruitude vnto men and restored to the ioyfull libârty of the Châldren of God the world and all things in it made theirs that howsoeuer they haue still to combate with the Diuill to wraâtel against principallities powers to suffer hatred affliction of the world anâ to warr with the fleshly lusts which fight against the soâl yet neither deaâh nor life nor Angels nor principallities nor powerâ nor things present nor things to come nor heigth nor depth nor any other creatâre shal be able to separate them from the loue of God which is in Christ Iesus our Lord who hath made them Kângs and Priâsâs vnto God even his father and they shall reign on the earth till hâuinâ serâed here theâr time they come to reign with him in glorâ in âhe heauens for euer 2â Vnto the participation of these promises and heauenly graces are all peoâles ârâuoked by the Gospell âreached and such as obey the câlââng of Gâd anâ come vnto Chrâst are vnited vnto him theâr head and âedâatâr from whomâ proceedeth the Iustification and sanctificatioâ of tâe Churcâ 24. Iustification is the partaking of Christs justâce or righteousnes ân his fulfilling and obeyinâ the law of God and dâschargâng all ouâ depts and trespasses by his death so freeing vs from the curse and setâing vs in full fauour with God and vnder his blesââng which righteousnesse of Christs is fully made ours and impâted to vs by faith for our justification 25. Sanctification is the partakâng of Christs holynes by being graffed with him to the simillâtude of his death and resurrection whereby the corruption of nature or old man in vs becometh crucified and buried with him and the new man or image of God is put on and renewed dayly in a holy conuersation 26. Hâthârto of the Churches union and communion with Christ her head now followeth the union of the churches memberâ one with another which is theirâ couâling togither as one body by the communion of one and the same spirit faith and loue 27. The vnion of the members one with another is to be considered generally or totally and particularly Generally as the chârch is called vniuersall or caâholik comprehending the whole family of God in heauen and in earth and the fraternity or brotherhood of all Christians which are ân the world in whome there is but one faith in one and the same God by that one Lord Iesâs Christ throuâh one Spârit Thus haue they all one Father which is God one mother Ierusalem which is aboue and by the mediation of Chrâst are all made one baptised by one spirit into one body and al made to drink into one spirit 28 More Particularly they that are called of God and members oââhe Church vniversall are vnited and gathered into many churches or congregatioÌs in several cities countrâes every
comfort one another in the faith and feare of God whose power and presence they haue with them in all estates and places 44 So to conclude a true church is a sacred communiallty consociate and knit togither into a mistical body whose head is Christ whose members christians of any nation or condition whose soul is the word and whose spirit is the spirit of the liuing God who gathereth togither dry desolate bones layeth synewes on them makes flesh to grow and couereth them with skin and putteth breath in them that they may liue and stand vpon their feet an exceeding great army Vnto him for all his blessings be praise in his churches throughout all generations Amen Amen ARGVMENTS Disprouing the present estate and constitution of the CHVRCH of ENGLAND EVery true Church is the body of Christ and hath him for the head thereof For ât is wrâtten God hath appoynted him ouer all âhângs the head of the church which is his body Eph 1 22 23 and agayn to the church of Corinth it is sayd yâ are the bâdy of Christ 1 Cor 12 27. But the church of England is not the body of Christ neyther hath him for the hâad thereof Because it waâ first constituted as now it standeth of the members of Antichrist namely the idolatrous Papâsts which openly professed Antichristian sme in Q. Maries dayes haâing Abadden the Pope for their head and spilled much christian blood that they might mainteyn their Romish abominations Who all except some few that of themselues refused were at the beginning of Q. Elisabeths reign receâued into the body of the church and so haue continued they and their seed euer since Yet did they not then enter in by repentance and faith in Christ which two things are the beginning and foundation of the kingdome of God but by the commandement of the Magistrate were compelled vnto the Church sacraments ministery c. which then were by law establâshed and euer since continewed Now the Magistrates law cannot work faith in any seing faith is the gift of God and by his word onely is wrought in mans hart So that the Magistrate though he ouâth to abolish idolatrâe and set vp Gods true worship to suppresse all errours and cause the truth to be taught yet cannot he constreyn men to ioyne vnto the church but they must doe it williâgly and gladly the Lord perswading them herevnto And these of whome we speak not being perswaded by the Lord and his word but âs the worldly multitude alway is beâng ready to receiue any religion the prince woâld establish rather then they would suffer persecution wherein that their popish estate the body of Antichrist yet then compelled and vnâted vnto this church Agayn not onely those that were popishly ãâã and superstitious but such also as were profane and irreligâous atheists blasphemers whoremongers theeues drunkards witches and all other vngodly persons of which then were and still are too too many in the land these al though by reason of their wicked and miserable estate âhey wârlimmes of Satan and as the scripture calleth such children of the Diuill were yet receiued into the Church likeweise they and âheir seed so continew as the state of that Church plainely sheweth For eâen to this day profane people mockers and contemners of religion thaâ blasphem God and his holy name even in the streets as they walk such as cal themselues the donned crew Familists Atheâsts and all other sorts of miscreants and wicked liuers are members of the Church of Enâland vnited with the body and partakers of the sacraments and other holy actâons of the same Now these children of wrath this sinnfull generation cannot possibly be members of the body of Christ nor haue him for their head seing they are not partakers of his life and spirit nor called to his faith neither admitteth he any such vnto him vntil they repent he hath no coÌcord with Belial therefore not with the children of Belial the members of his glorious body must not be the dead stânking and abominable members of Satan Light and darknes heauen and hel will as soon be vnited togither Neyther will it be yenough to say that some are affected to reliâion are of better life and conuersation c. and that for their sakes the residew are sanctâfied and may be ioyned vnto and reputed Christs body and Church for they that professe more sincerity yet are not come to a true ârofeâsion of the Gospell or renoâncing of Idolatrie but after theâr false and popish manner worship God with the rest remayning one body one Church with them Now we are taught of God that the religious are so farr from sanctifying the wicked as contrariweise the wicked doe pollute them whatsoeuer the vnclean person toucheth sayth the Lord shal be vnclean and the person which toucheth him shal be vncleane â wherefore come out from among them and separate your selues and touch no vnclâane thing and I will receiue you and I will be a Father vnto you and ye shal be my sonns and daughters sayth the Lord almighty So then the religious and well affected people must separate from the rest if they would be acknowledged of God for his and not think by their holynes to sanctify the profane Agayn it is as easy to make peace agreement between Christ the Diuil as between Christ and such open obstinate synners the children of the Diuill yea it ouerturneth at once the first promise of saluation made by God and so the uery ground of Christian religion For when God first promised redemption to mankind it was by Christ the seed of the woman that should crush the serpents head who in due time appeared for this purpose that he might loose the works of the Diuill destroy and abolish him And as then the Lord put enmity between Christ and the serpent so did he also between him and the serpents seed that is wâcked men which being children of the Diuill would take the Diuâls part to hate and kill Christ and root out his châldren and reliâion accârding to whâch decree and word of his Father oâr Lord Iesus set himselfe not onely agaânst the Serpent but against sâch wicked men also as would not be turned from their impietie therefore he sayth by his proâhets Dâe not I hate them that hate thee ô Lorâ c I hate thâm with an vnfeighned hatred as they were mynâ vtter enemies I hate the assembly of eâil doers and company not with the wicked Betimâs wil I destroy all the wicked of thâ land that I may cut off all the workers of iniquity from the city of the Lord Three shepheards I cut of in one moneth and my sowl loathed loathed them and their sowl abhorred me with many such like speeches throughout the scriptures whereby Christ shewed how farr he was and would be from being head vnto
of state professors that follow the Emperours religions that they worship not God but the purple robe that is the authority and persons of Prânces Moreouer the church of England hath not Christ for their Mediator because they cannot come vnto God by him nor haue assurance by faith that he maketh intercession for them for that they offer vnto God a worship or seruice which themselues haue made and taken by imâtation out of Antâchrists Massebook which Leitârgie or Diuine seruâce hauing in it also many erroneous superstitious and idolatrous ordiâances rites and ceremonies being not required of God nor warrantable by Christs testament they read out of their book dayly in theâr aâsemblies and offer or obtrude ât vpon God By meanes whereof they also extinguish the true way of calling vpon God by the help of his spârit as the Apostle teacheth and bring in a fleshly and dead kind of seruice reading other mens words instead of their own praying and calling on the name of the Lord. Which humane devise is contrary to the second commandement that forbiddeth vs to make or submit vnto any similitude or likenes of any thing in heauen earth or vnder the earth in matters concerning the worshâp of God And it being against the old couenant or testament which Christ hath confirmed vnto euery âod and ãâã against the new testament also which calleth vs vnto a worship of God in spirit and truth hath no promise to be sanctified by Christs Medâation who sanctifieth no idols nor idol seruice or false worshiâ but contrariweise hath testified their offrings of blood will I not offer nor by make mention of their names with my lipps For asmuch then as the people which worshippeth is not the called iustified sanctâfied peâple of Gâd but an vnlawfull câmmixture ãâã fall sorts of âersâns and forasmuch as the worship it self which they read with and before âhe holy bible and thrust vpon God whither he like it or not is a false dead and vayne inuented worship of their own not commanded of God not iustifiable by his word it cannot be by the doctrine of the scripture or a any promâses therein that Christ should be Mediator for such worship or worshippârs or put any odours vnto such prayers Therâfore the church of England is not the true church of God EVery true church of God hath Christ for the Prophet of the same For of ãâã it is written I will raise them vp a Prophet from among thâir brethren c. and every person which shal not hear that Prophet shal be desered ãâã the people Dâut 18.18 Act 3 23. But thââhurch of England hath not Christ for the Prophet of the same Because it hath neyther himself in his own person to teach them for he is now in heaâen and there must be vntill the time that all things be restored neyther hath it his appoynted ordinanâe of teaching by prophesie or office which if it had Christ were the Prophet of the same as himself sayd if I send any he that receiueth him receiueth me The church of England hâth not Christs ordinance of prophesie without office for it is vnknowen vnpractised and vnsufferable among them for priuate men to preach in their aââemblies they must be ministers allowed by the Ordinary els it is punishable by the law of their church though by the law of Christ all men may prophesie in his church which is to speake to edifying to exhortation and to comfort and all men are exhorted to couet this mâre then other spirituall gifts 1. Cor. 14 vers 31.3.1.39 Neyther hath the chârch of England Christs appoynted officers to teach which are set down in scripture to be these Apostles Prophets Euangelists Pastors and Teachers Ephe 4.11 Of which the first three serued for the first publishing of the gâspel throughout the world the latter two continue stâll vnto the worlds end but in stead of these it hath the hierarchie and ministery of Antichrist to teach the same namely Metropolitan Archbishops Lord Bishâps Deanes c. Priests and Deacons which is none of Christs Ministery eyther in name office calling administration or mayntenance but the very ministery of the man of sinne as he left it in the land and as is to be seen at this day in Rome and other his dominions and in the lawes and canons of the popish church wher ar all the offices that now be in England Thus hauing not the ministery giuen of Christ but a different ministery giuen of Antichrist it followeth also by proportion from Christs words saying he that receiueth him that I send receiueth me and he that receiueth me receiueth him that sent me that the church of England receiuing such as Antichrist the Pope did send hath receiued Antichrist himselfe and so hath intertayned him for their Prophet and not Christ. Now where it is obiected that there are many excellent truthes publikly taught in this church and by this ministery of England it is answered that is not yenough vnlesse it were taught in and according to the ordinance of God For false Prophets teach much truth as is to be seen among Papists Anabaptists Arians and other like heretiks And as the morall good works which heathens doe in honouring their parents and Magistrates giuing almose absteyning from and punishing murder adultery theft c. are not inded good works according to christian religion because they are not done in obedience to Gods word by persons that are called iustified and sanctified by that word and so not done in faith and consequently cannot please God even so the theologicall works which Antichristians doe in preaching the truth praying ministring the sacraments c. are not indeed works pleasing vnto God because they are not done by persons that please him for alwayes the man must be accepted before his work can be and such persons please him not as without his calling and sending presume to administer his holy things It is not therefore the work but the word of God that sanctifieth the work which we must look vnto for as by this the vertuous heroik and religious acts of the Patrâarchs and other holy men differ from the like acts of Pagans and infidels so also by this the difference iâ to be put between the works and administrations of trâe and false Christians And seing the ministers of England are not by Christ called and sent as the better sort of themselues heretofore haue confessed so haue not his word to warrant their administration whatsoeuer good doctrine they teach it proues them no more to be true ministers then the excellent doctrines and prophesies of the soothsayer Balaam will proue him to be a true minister of God or that the Moabites or Madianites hauing him to sacrifice prophesie and teach among them had an ordinance or prophet of God See Deut. 18 10.11.14.15 c. Agayn Christ is not the Prophet of this
them which also he was willing a gentleman should haue printed in his own name that M Bern. might haue slept in a whâle ãâã whither himselfe I say and his fellow Reformists who are disaâoyntâd of their hope be not sorry for this prosperitie let themselues say As for vt we haue learned not to fret or enây when we see the wicked flourish for they shall soân be cut down as grasse and wither as the green herb Sory we are indeed for their lamentable estate and desire that they may find mercy at the hands of the Lord. Our foârth kind of sinne he sayth is our abusing of the werd misaleging and ãâã it c. This was the third of his probabilities before answered and is here for a shew mustred agayn among our sinns but nakedly and without all proof I leaue it therefoâe to the reproof of God and to the godly iudgements of all that shall read our writings and allegations of the scriptures The 5. sinne is our wilfull persisting in our schisme This is agayn to beg the question first let it appear to be schisme that we are in let the reasons aâd grounds of our separation be orderly dealt in and soundly convinced by Gods word then if we yeild not let vs be holden wilfull Otherweise to persist in wel doing is good And as easily do the Papists cal Protestants schismaticks as they vs. Whether M Bernard with all the helps that he hath had from other men hath conuinced vs of schisme let the godly judge If reproching of vs and idle excursions into by matters be a conuiction doubtleââe he hath done it better then any before him The 6. syn is our rayling and sââffing and as he sayth Henry Barrowes blasphemies who hath âgrâgiously abused all their holyest exercises of religion c. I answer if such sinne be in any of vs it is even by our selues condemned and âf by humane infirmity any haue been ouertaken with vnseasoned speeches we desire the Christian reader to bear with and pardon it in vs as himselfe would haue pardon of God The like hath Mr. Barrââ earnestly intreated in his Preface to his Discouery as the reader may see so farr was he from delighting in such wayes Secondly I answer howsoeuer I will not justify all the words of another man nor yet mine own for in many things we sinne all that many of the thângs which this man counteth raylings scoffs and blasphemies are no other speaches them the holâ Ghost hath vsed before vs in the scriptures and applâed to like persons and seemed as harsh to men of those times as these doe to men now Thirdly it is lâkely that some be rather the printers fault vnlesse Mr. Bernard hath forged them himselfe then Mr Barrowes Fourthly the Reformists themselus amongst whome Mr Bern. sometimes seemed one haue uttered as hard speeches against the Prelateâ other corruptions of their own church though now like time seruers they gloze with their reuerend Fathers as this man maketh the first of Mr Barrowes raylings scoffs and blasphemies to be his caling the Bishops Antichristian But how many volumâs haue themselues heretofore written of this argument And who amongst vs hath euer dealt as did Marâin Marprelate among themselues Finally Mr. Barrow did sharply in ãâ¦ã against the reforming preachers as being the greatest deceiuers of the people vnder shew of holines This maketh them aâayn so eâer agaiâst him but whither he spake not right of them may in part be seen already time will shew more they can no longer halt as hitherto they haue but eyther they must recâncile them to thâir Fathârs or quite forsake them and a bleâsed work of God it is that the most dangerous seducers should thus first be discouâââd THe third and last sort of reasons which M. Bern. vseth against vs is Our errors and as he sayth the matter of our sâhisme The errors which he reckneth vp and vndertaketh to confute arâ ten The first of them is that we hold the constitution of their church to be a false constitution To this he sayth 1. That we cannot proue this simply by any playn docârine of scripture c. 2. That it is against the euidence of the scriptures which maketh the word Mat. 28.19 Mar 16 15. 2 Cor. 5.19 11 2. Iob 23.23.24 Act. 2.14.37.38 16.32.33 the externall profeâsion Act. 8.12.37.38 and Sacraments Mat. 28 19. 1 Cor. 10.16 the visible and true constitution of a company so gathered and knât together and so was theirs constituted as that book of Mr. Ber. sheweth and as in another ere long shal be plainly manifested c. First Mr Ber. setteth down barely this as our position and doctrine not nameâng place or boâk where it is written nor the proofs that we make of it but peremâtorily sayth we cannot proue it Whereas it hath in many books by many playn doctrines of scripture been euidently proued so as Mr Bern. and all his fellow priests could neuer yet make a playn and direct answer And if when book is writen after booke no refutation be made but a bare deneyall as here M. Bern. sayth we cannot proue it I say the ministers of Engl. may so turne away any thing but with what credit or conscience the wise will judge Secondly for M. Bernards reason it selfe wanteth a good constitution being to confuâedly set down as a man knowes not what he makes the constitution of a church or how he would conclude that their church is constituted aright He pretends the word to be the Constitution of a church whereas the scriptures that he quoteth and reason it selfe might teach him that the word is the instrument or meanes of Constituting conseruing the church constituted so also be the sacraments But as the constitution of a common wealth or of a city is a gathering and vniting of people togither into a ciuill polity so the Constitution of the common wealth of Israel as the church is called and of the city of God the new Ierusalem is a gathering and vniting of people into a diuiue politie the form of which polity is Order as the heathens acknowledged calling polity an order of a city which Order is requisite in all actions and administrations of the church as the Apostle * sheweth and specially specially in the constitution thereof so that next vnto faith in God it âs to be esteemed most necessary for all holy societies Wherefore Paâl rejoyced for these two things in the Church at Colâssâ euen their order their stedfast faith in Christ. Now whereas to the constitâtioÌ of a chârch there belong â a people as the mattâr whereof and 2 a calling gathering and vniting togither as the form whereof the church consisteth in both these the Constitution of the Church of Engl. hath in sundry treatises been âroued false For with them all sorts of profane worldly and wicked âersons are receiued as the matter whereof
vnlesse perhaps he hath blessed some of their youthes with the Sacrament of Confirmation how many of their soules he hath conuerted yea let them say whether euer he saw their faceâ As for the Bishops Deputies the parisâh priests many of them are dumb by nature and cannot preach many are made dumb by their spirituall Lords power and silenced for disobedâence so preaching wexeth geazon and people perish for want of Instruction In the mean tyme this painful Clergie feedeth the Lay weekly with their mattings Euensong and Homilies and sometimes in a year with sermon and reading the Bishops canons They discipline their notorious sinners with reading curses and Comminations out of the pulpit till the Lent penance which is much to be wished be restored agayn they solemnize the holy dayes of Angels and of Saincts they giue ech man the sacrament at Easter deuoutly vpon his knees they baptise with water and a signe of the crosse in the aâer they wed their parishioners with a ring teach the man to worship his wife in the name of the Father and of the Son of the holy Ghost they church the women after childbirth they visiâ the sick and absolue him from all his sinns and howsel him with a Communion and last of all they bury the dead in sure and certayn hope of resurrection to eternall life And this is yenough for priests to doe in the country parishes but in the Cathedrall churches where Bishops Deanes and other great Doctors do reside there the Queristeâs and Organ-pipes make sweeter melody Mr. Bern. confesseth that the Lord onely prescribes the duties to be done in euery distinct âffice now he that knowes not these dutiess to belong to Christs ministers or these works to be a faythfull performance of ministeriall office let him read Mr Bernards book for there he hath quoted many scriptures the end of all which is to raise an euident proof of the truth of their ministery and administration as if one should cite the second commandement for to vphold idolatrie The effects of their administration in conuerting sowles is but a vayne boast as their idolatrous estate with the lamentable ignorance and profanenes of the people every where sheweth The reasons brought by others for Mr Bern bringeth none to perswade such effects are before in this treatise answered It maketh also against the estate of this church and ministery for if these preachers haue conuerted and wrought faith in some of their hearers then it followeth that before that conuersion they were infidels yet were they of the church and had this ministery set ouer them as all men know Which how it can stand with the râles of Gods word hath neuer yet bene shewed The example which Mr Bern. allegeth of th' Apostle 1 Cor 9.1.2 helpeth him nothing For Apostles were sent to conuert heathens but Pastors are set for to feed conuerted Christians And the Priests of England challenge to be Pastors I ween and not Apostles Agayn the work and seal of Pauls Apostleship was seen in Corinth by separating the beleeuers from infidels and gâtherâng the Saints onely into the communion of the church vnder the officers giâen of Christ but in England the vnbâleeuers and wicked were receiued and are reteyned in the church So that Mr. Bern. is but a âalse Apostle as his work shewes if he be any at all But in the end he tels vs we forget to iustifie the lawfulnes of our own ministers who are made âiâistârs ây sâch as are no ministers contrary to the constant practise of the church of God from the dayes of Adam hitherto c. In which dispute Mr. Bern. teacheth playn apostasie from the Gospell unto Poperie from whâch he deriueth the minâstery of his church of Engl. For seing all the examples that he allegeth from scriptures are of Diuine persons and approued ministers of the true church and comming to his church of England he fetcheth her ministery out of the Popish church and from the Prelates thereof it cannot be if his last words agree with his first but the poâish church is a true church and their prelates true ministers Otherweise hâs reasoning is absurd to say God ordeyned Adam Moses odeyned Aaron Christ ordeyned the Apostles the Apostles ordeyned orther mânisters in churches therefore Antichrist of Rome his synagoâue of Satan hâs eldest sonâes the Prelates must or may ordeyn miniâters in the church of Christ. If this be a good consequence let al men iudge if âââs it be not then Mr. Bern. holdeth the popish church and the âopish ministers true ministers and so himselfe and his church of England must needs be schismatiks for leauing that church of Rome When he hath cleared himselfe of this his absurd doctrine then if he cannot see that the church of Christ hath power to ordeyn her own ministers it shal be shewed hâm by the scriptures Tâll then what should we do folowing of a wauering reed whome we cannot tell by his writing whether he be Papist or Protestant And that the reader may see into what an intricate Labyrânth the ministers of England haue brought themselues about this matter of their ministery by writing as they haue doâ both of the Papists and of us I will set down a Papist argument against them from which how handsomely they can defend themselues I would fayn see There came out in anno 1602 a book called A detection of diuers notable vntruthes c. wherein the author hauing to deal wit Mr Sââcliff who as he sayth had reasoned thus The true church is a societie of faithfull people vnder lawfull Pastors c But the Church of Rome hath long wanted true Pastors and Bishops for the Romish Bishops haue no authority âr missioÌ but froÌ the Pope to whome also they swear feally but he hath no authority to send them or ordeyn them âeing himselfe no Bishop c. This argumeÌt of Mr Sutcliffs the Papist retorteth vâoÌ theÌ thus The true church of Christ hath alwayes true Pastors and Bishops but the English Congregation wanteth true Priests and Bishops Therefore the English congreagation ãâã not the true church of Christ. The fiâst proposition sayth the Papist he must not deny being of his own making c. The 2 proposition is apparant according to Mr Sutcliffs diuinity For most certaine it is that their first Bishops receiued their orders and consecration from our catholik Bishops as his brother Bel confesseth Suruey pag. 201. And the thing it selfe speaketh seing when Lâther begun there was not any protestant Bishop or Priest c. And if Mr Sutâliffe dare deny that their Bishops were cânsâcratedlâ ours then let him name who they were that did lay hands vpon Mr Parker the first of Cant. that deriued not their mission authority and consecration from the Bishop of Rome Certayn it is thât âyther none at all can be named or els none bâsides therefore if our Bishops be
hierarchâe worship ceremonies ordinances church constitution c. which things can neuer be approued by the word of God are yet held and vpheld taught and mainteyned in the church to the excommunicating and persecuting of all such as speake against them or refuse to communicate with them This sinfull mixture and maintenance of so much antâchristian error with the christian truthes that they profeââe is no true Christian profession and practise of our obedience vnto the fundamentall truth of the gospell neyther can the ministers proue that these contraries will stand together when account shal be giuen before the iudgment seat of Christ. Secondly I answer as to their former reason that although some Bishops and Priests haue written Articles Catechismes c. yet are not these approuâd much lesse walked in by the church of Engl. neyther are the people rooted bâilded and stablished in the faith according to Colos. 2. but are diââolute and profane in their conuersation rooted in uices and stablished in iniquitis as lameÌtable experience teacheth all men as the testâmonâes of their own ministers before alleged proue and many other we might allege and must if these men still continue to vrge that which is knowne to be farr otherweise For how well their people doe walke in the faith of the foundation Christ and approue of all fundamentall truthes in the scriptures let these testimonies of their own freinds shew The most part of your honest men saith Mr Gifford to and of his brethren now a dayes delight so much in the word of God and meditate so much in it that they care not a button though they neuer heare it they loue it and set as much by it as they doe by an old sââe Euery man sayth an other followeth the pride couetousnes whordome dronkennes of his owne hart and no man remembreth Ioseph The barrs are filled with pleadings the streets are full of cries of the poor fulnes of meat and contempt is among vs and who considereth Yet if this our sinne were onely against men and not against God there âight be some hope But when the mouth of the blâspemous swearer is not tiâd vp and the hands of the idolatrous generation of Atheists and profane persons be not chained when the most holy and precious word of God is manifestly contemned the ioyfull and heauenly tidings of saluation so negligently and vngratefully troden vnder foot the true and faithfull messengers pursued arraygnned and diuers wayes âfflicted then if the old world for malicious imaginations Sodome and Gomora for pride fulnes of meat and vnmercifulnes if Ierusalem for abusing Gods Prophets and wilfulnesse were woefully destroyed what may we poor carelesse People look for it we doe not repent but as it is almost vniuersally feared spâedy ruine and vtter desolation The exceptions which these Godly ministers take against Mr Barrowes writings and yet professe not to answer them need not now to be stood vpon till the particulars whereby he hath discouered their errors and euill dealings be by them taken away They further taxe note it in him as a strange opinion and an error full grosse mainteyned in pag. 156.157 of his Discouery vidz that euery truth conteyned in the scripture is fundamentall But the grossnes or crossnes wil be found in themselus for that which Mr Barrow there inueigheth against was this that though transgressions and errors be obstinately continued in and openly taught after they be reproued and conuinced by the word of God yea and the parties dye in that estate without repentance of these transgressions or errors yet may they hold the foundation and be vadoubtedly saued Of this minde were and still continue sayth he fiue of the very principal and best esteemed ministers of Engl. both for learning and conscience although there were alleged against the same these expresse scriptures Num. 15.30 31. Exod. 23.21 1 Sam. 15.22.23 Ezek. 18.26 Mat. 5 18 19 Iam. 2 10. c. This was the thing that M Bar. there bet down shewing further that if the whole scripture was giuen by inspiration of God and is profitable to teach to conuince to correct to instruct in righteousnes if it be the groundwork and foundatioÌ of the church of our fayth if it be the law and rule of our life the light of our eyes c. If euery word of God be holy pure perpetuall then is this deep learning of theyrs diuilish and blasphemous that thus to colour and couer their wickedness make some part of gods word fundamentall substantiall necessary other accidentall superficiall needlesse especially where it sheweth reproueth and condemneth their doings c Now what say these ministers against this plea they plainly yeild in effect to th'truth which they could with no coulour gainsay we beleeu say they and teach that there is no Part of holy scripture which euery Christian is not necessarily bound to seek desire knowledge of so far sorth as in him lyeth Very wel sayd had they added also this word obeyed which I suppose they would be thought to intimate there would be no difference between M Barrow and them though thus they would traduce him But least they should seeme to condemne themselues they except yet dare we not cal euery truth fundamentall that is such as if it be not knowne and obeyed the whole religion and fayth of the church must needs fall to the ground and agayne we doubt not that some parts are of more vse and more necessary for men to know then othersome In these things excepting the word fundamentall which seemeth to be but strife about a word We agree with them neyther doth Mr Barrow that I can perceiue disagree for it is one thing not to know and obey euery truth as they speake and another thing to know as hauâng reproofe and conuiction by the word of God and yet to disobey and rebel against the truth and continue obstinately in transgreâsion which was the poynt in hand And for the world fundamentall seing all Gods testimonies are true and Dauid sayth that the Lord hath founded them for euer I see no cause why we need be afraid to call euery trâth fundamentall that is such as is firme and stable and on which we shovld ground and builde our faith and actions vp on alwayes Yet seing now what these ministers vnderstand by the word I will not striue Also M Barrow himselfe in his Obseruations vpon Mr Giffârds last reply telleth him that he denyeth not in vse of speech such distinction so much as withstand such eronius abuse of that distinction which M. Gifford and other deuines of these tymes would infer thereof And in deed the simple are much beguiled by this subtile distinction For when the sinns and idolatrâes of these Priests are blamed answer is made though they be sinns yet are they not fundamentall they cut vs not off from Christ we hold him the foundation and
and dissolute quallity onely moued thereto in a lazy speculation layd wicked sacrilegious hands on the Lords ark taken his vndefiled testimonies in their defiled mouthes disgraced defaced and defamed the glory and Maiesty of diâine rites and mysteries c. they run like hungry companions with an eye onely to the flesh pots so sel both themselues and their people for morsel of bread and messe of pottage to the Diuill He mentioneth also accursed and simonical patrons who haue sodered simoned the walls of their houses with the very blood of sowlâs some others among you speaking of that a miserable vulgus that woâfulâ crew that racked regiment of dunsticall and vnlettered Sir Iohns which haue euen couered the land like the froggs of Aegypt leading many thow sands with themselues into the ditch and âhe same not still graced countenanced by the Prelatâs as being their creatures And others complayn that whol swarms of idle scandalous popish non-resident Ministers are tolerated euery where amongst you Your selfe Mr Crashawe in this very sermon tel in of little petty Babylons namely incurable sinns among you 1. That great sacrilege and church robbing as you call it committed by Impropriations in which case you affirme at this day almost halfe of the kingdome is wherby it comes to passe that an ignorant and vnpreaching ministery is set ouer a great part of your people which is the sourse and fountayn of all other euils in your church 2. The vngodly players enterludes so rise in the nations which you call a bellish deuise the Diuils own recreation to mock at holy things by him deliuered to the heathen from them to the Papists and from them to you And these you say bring religion and holy things vpon the stage And hypocrisie a child of hel must bear the names of two churches of God Nicholas S. Antlings Simon S. Maryâveries which churches by these miscreanâs are thus dishonoured you say not on the stage onely but euen in print To this you add âheir continuall profannesse on their phrases and sometime Atheisme and blasphemy their continuall profanening of the Sabbath which generally in the country is their play day and oftentimes Gods diuine seruice hindred or cut shorter to make room and giue time for the Diuils seruice Many other like testimonies might I allege froÌ your own mouthes of exceeding impiety openly practised not by the people onely but by the Priests and Clergie and how doth your discipline heal these corruptions when by your own grant such caitiffs are graced and countenanced by the prelates when your law punisheth the conscionable ministers more then such as your selfe say of your petty Babilon of Impropriations this deep wound was once curable yenough c. but now alas how incurable it is he obserues but little that sees not And vnlesse the K. Maiesty vouchsafe to take the matter into his hands otherweise it is incurable Agayn you say of that horible abuse of the Sabbath c. that est is hath been complayned of and some haue endeuoured to heal it but it is ãâã of Babylon that will not be healed but rather it creps ãâã a ãâã though the whole state from the foot to the head and if you would yet haue more add herevnto Mr Iacobs testimony who hath so manfully stood for your church The right and true discipline ecclesiasticall sayth he in âch proper visible church is one mayn part of the ordinary meanes of saluation appoynted by God for euery sowl and this we in England vtterly want Now let the reader iudge whether there be not deadly corruption in your discipline which euen in a true church would soon eat out if it wer not healed the hart and life and being of a church according to your demaund But you proceed and ask vs. Q. What book of Canonicall scripture receiue we not what hold we for Canonicall that is not A. What book of Canonicall scripture receiued not the idolatrous Isâelites what held they for Canonicall that was not The like I ask for the Arians Anabaptists and sundry other heretikes of these times and shall these or any of them be therfore true churches Agayn in your own church there is read for holy scripture erroneous books and lying stories as Tobie Iudith and other Apocrypha Your Homilies citing thâÌ call them holy scripture and say the holy Ghost speaketh so in the scriptures the chiefest ministers of your church sometimes preach and take texts out of them If this be not to hold them canonicall I know not what you count canonicall Q. What sacrament that Christ ordeyned doe we want and what haue we more then Christ ordeyned A. What sacrament wanted Ieroboam the son of Nebat what had he more then God ordeyned Or the Anabaptists at this day Yet if one would stand with you he might by your Communion book proue Confirmation to be a sacrament but who ordeyned it I cannot tel vnlesse Pope Clement Agayn Mr Bradshaw a man of your own church and profession hath proued against you in print that your Crosse in baptisme ring in mariage surplice c. are sacraments in your church and not of diuine institution Q. What article of faith deny we or what hold we for an article of faith this is not A. Suppose that the Papists should ask you such a question what would you answer For all the Creeds that are in your communion book are they not with euery article neyther more nor lesse in the masse book and other popish pamphlets The Papists and you both confesse Christ in words both deny him in practise Q. What fundamentall heresie doth our doctrine maintayn A. The vnlawfull commixture of the children of God and children of the Diuell in one church and communion is a fundamentall heresie being stifly mainteyned All the scritures condemne it all wel reformed churches avoyd it nature it selfe teacheth to abhorr it yet in such profane communion your church abiderh and you wil not endure to bââr of a separation Q. What haue we in our church that ouerthrowes the being of a church A. A popish Clergie and Laitie Q. What is necessarily required to make a church that wee doe want A. You want both matter and forme of a true church namely a people called of God separated from the world and vnited with Christ and one with another according to the rules of his eternall Testament Q. I will end as I began wherein are we deadly and incurably wounded A. The sinns before mentioned are deadly wounds of Satan the onely cure is by repentance and faith in Christ Iesus âut as yet you be farr from cure for loe you make questions of your diseases and will not beleeue that you are sick Herevpon you refusâ all salues and medicines and will neither haue physician nor chirurgian to meddle with your sores If any Leech come with a curing tongâe and words that be leaues of the tree of
Vniuersall consent agreement and applause of Churches in al nations of Synodes and Councels of Fathers and learned men haue been the continuall boast of Papists in all their books against the Protestants now they in Enâl to beare out their estate vrge agayn and agayn the like against vs that when Gods word will not vphold them yet mans word at least may honour them before the people See after in this treatise pag 9. 22. 44 5. 89 91.92.128 4. Whereas the truth hath brought for her defense the evident scriptures papists haue been wont to carp at the allegations and interpretations of them and chalenge their aduersaries for corrupting them the formall protestants in Engl. haue done the like against the Reformists and they now use the like colour against vs but how truely let the particulars shew after in this book pag. 90.91.97 5. To reuile and calumniate such as forsooke them hath been the coÌmon practise of Papists calling them heretiks schismatikes Lutherens Calumists c. and matching them with wicked heretiks heretofore now liuing The same way doe our aduersaries now walke in proclayming vs to be Schismatiks Seduced Brownists Donatists c. and to make vs the more odious vnto the people they enroll vs sometime with the most vile blasphemers that they can mention For he was esteemed a forward âreacher amâng them who to grace his own cause by disgracing the truth would needs ioyn vs with the blasphemer Hacket sometimes a brother of the reformists and hot mainteyner of their cause to make his malice the more remarkable he puts in the margine of his book The brownest and Hacket of an euill spirit and that which he writeth besides is so fraudulently set down that the simple reader who knowâth not our cause may thinke that this Hacket was one of vs. This abuse we suâfer because forsooth we were thought to hinder their couÌterfeyt reformation which Hacket would haue set vp by force for which they beare their reproch at his hands that wrote English Scottizing for discipline but this man most iniuriously would turn it vpon vs. These and the like arguments doe euill men continually vse against the truth which presseth them and which they seek to suppresse but all in uayne for it will preuayl mangre their opposition and that which they thinke to hinder the Gospell bâ God will turne to the furtherance of the same and confusion of his aduersaries Against these and all other like colours wherewith false churches aâ adorned two meanes haue been vsed for to discouer the falshood thâ one manifesting the fact or estate of a person or people the other the lawfulnesse of the same The commandement of God is a lantern and the law a light to declare what is good or euill and evidences there are of euery publick estate and action For in al ages God hath moued some to obserue and speake against the abuses reigning and some haue recorded things for their glory which turne vnto their shame ây this meanâ the skirts of the whore of Rome haue been discouered whiles some that loued and othersome that loathed her haue painted out her filthinesse which being compared with the chastitie of Christs spowse set forth in holy writ hath caused righteous men as was foretold to iudge her children after the manner of harlots and of murtherers and the very hornes of that beast to hate the whore and burne her with fire And we at this day that witnesse the truth against the remainders of that whores cup are driuen to breake silence to plead for Christ in publik because the aduersaries so importune vs by continuall preaching and writing against vs and seeking to bear out all with the cloke âf the gospel and to hide the iniquities vnder a vaile of professing truthes fundamentall they will hardly be a known of the manifold euils and grosse corruptions that preuayl in their assemblies Therefore also are we forced to produce their own writers for to witnes with vs who both heretofore and to this day complayn of the sinns that reign among them And worthy it is to be obserued how the ministers of England are come to contradict and depart from their own grounds for to mainteyn their corrupt estate For now they vtterly deney the visible church to be a company of faithfull people that truely worship Christ and readily obey him coâtraây both to all the scriptures and to their own Articles d of religioâ Aâd Mr Bernarde in the name of all the diuines in their church yea if we âay beleâue him of all the reformed Churches in Christendome telleth vs with a marginall note also to haue it wel obserued that the true word of God preached and true sacraments of Christ administred are infallible tokeâs of a true church I say not saith he the word truely preachâd nor the sacrâmânts rightly administred but thus the true word preached the true sacrâmânââ administred Now lay these things together and see what a holy communion they will make the church of God to be namely if not a roât of miscreants yet at least a mesceline multitude of beleeuers and infidelâ holy and profane Among whome it the true word be preached though neuer so curruptly falsly peruersly by any Popeling Baalist or Balaamite if the true sacraments be administred though neuer so superstitiausly profanely and disorderly to the open wicked c. yet there must needs be a true church Such heauenly doctrine or rather such hellish error is now taught by the transformed ministers for to make meÌ keep communion with Belial Against these and other like impostures haue I endeauoured to bring out the truth though naked and destitute of all wordly ornaments and by it to manifest the present aberations of my country from the primitiue faith of Christ I haue also produced their own testimonies a-against them that the Saincts on eart may say their rock is not as our Rock euen our enemies being iudges And if they will yet resist the world may see they are condemned by themselues But my harts desire and prayer for my brethren is that they may be saued turning from darknes to light and from the power of Satan vnto God that they may receiue forgiuenes of sinns and inheretance among them which are sanctified by faith in Christ. Hânây Ainsworth A Direction to some principall things conteyned in this book Administration of the Ministers of Engl scanned with the effects pag 14. c. 58. c. 60. c. 62. c. 109. c. 110. c. Antichrists kingdome not ouerthrowne by the ministers of Engl. pag. 61. c. Begetting of faith how it is pag. 5 6 It is no essentiall note of a true church p 6. It should be before the planting of a church p. 40 41 146. Building of the church and how it is performed in England p. 33 34 c Christ not the head Mediator Prophet Priest or