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the_o sum_n of_o a_o disputation_n between_o mr._n walker_n pastor_n of_o st._n john_n euanglists_n in_o watling-street_n london_n and_o a_o popish_a priest_n call_v himself_o mr._n smith_n but_o indeed_o norrice_n assist_v by_o other_o priest_n and_o papist_n hold_v in_o the_o presence_n of_o some_o worthy_a knight_n with_o other_o gentleman_n of_o both_o religion_n print_a 1624._o the_o sum_n of_o a_o disputation_n bebetweene_n mr._n walker_n pastor_n of_o st_n john_n evangelist_n in_o watling_n street_n in_o london_n and_o a_o popish_a priest_n call_v himself_o mr._n smith_n but_o indeed_o norrice_n assist_v by_o other_o priest_n and_o papist_n may_v last_v 1623._o hold_v in_o the_o presence_n of_o some_o worthy_a knight_n with_o other_o gentleman_n of_o both_o religion_n the_o occasion_n of_o the_o disputation_n sir_n william_n harington_n knight_n have_v a_o kinsman_n of_o the_o romish_a catholic_a religion_n by_o much_o reason_n with_o he_o and_o many_o persuasion_n have_v 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he_o will_v desire_v no_o more_o for_o the_o victory_n yea_o say_v he_o if_o you_o have_v read_v doctor_n whitaker_n you_o know_v that_o he_o hold_v as_o i_o do_v and_o that_o you_o wilful_o and_o false_o father_n on_o he_o thing_n untrue_a mr._n smith_n mr._n smith_n enrage_v with_o this_o answer_n protest_a what_o he_o have_v say_v be_v true_a and_o the_o more_o to_o persuade_v the_o stander_n by_o he_o add_v more_o special_o that_o doctor_n whitaker_n do_v in_o his_o write_n maintain_v that_o the_o whole_a essence_n of_o the_o true_a church_n consist_v only_o in_o the_o true_a preach_v of_o the_o word_n and_o the_o right_a administration_n of_o the_o sacrament_n which_o be_v thing_n visible_a mr._n walker_n sir_n i_o do_v not_o love_v to_o contend_v by_o oath_n and_o protestation_n but_o by_o proof_n i_o will_v here_o write_v down_o your_o word_n which_o he_o do_v and_o read_v they_o in_o the_o hear_n of_o all_o and_o ask_v if_o he_o have_v not_o true_o write_v and_o all_o assent_v 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guide_n even_o as_o the_o apostle_n say_v of_o a_o man_n regenerate_v and_o bear_v of_o god_n that_o he_o can_v sin_v 1_o joh._n 3._o to_o wit_n in_o the_o main_a against_o the_o main_a precept_n of_o the_o gospel_n believe_v and_o repent_v for_o he_o can_v fall_v into_o impenitency_n and_o infidelity_n because_o the_o seed_n of_o god_n even_o his_o holy_a spirit_n abide_v in_o he_o but_o that_o he_o have_v sin_n and_o do_v lie_v if_o he_o say_v he_o have_v none_o to_o wit_n through_o infirmity_n and_o weakness_n of_o the_o flesh_n so_o likewise_o it_o be_v true_o say_v of_o the_o true_a church_n and_o every_o part_n thereof_o that_o as_o it_o build_v only_o on_o the_o scripture_n and_o do_v urge_v no_o doctrine_n of_o faith_n of_o necessity_n to_o be_v believe_v but_o such_o as_o the_o scripture_n teach_v so_o it_o can_v err_v no_o more_o than_o the_o scripture_n for_o this_o be_v a_o work_n of_o infallible_a faith_n but_o because_o all_o man_n live_v in_o the_o church_n have_v as_o 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this_o question_n whether_o the_o whoâ—e_v militant_a church_n of_o england_n may_v err_v mr._n walker_n i_o answer_v to_o this_o as_o before_o that_o it_o be_v a_o captious_a and_o ambiguous_a confuse_a question_n and_o that_o this_o militant_a church_n as_o the_o rest_n may_v err_v and_o not_o err_v according_a to_o the_o former_a diverse_a respect_n and_o consideration_n mr._n smith_n whether_o be_v the_o church_n of_o england_n so_o tie_v to_o the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o such_o help_n that_o it_o can_v err_v nor_o misinterpret_v the_o scripture_n in_o fundamental_a point_n of_o faith_n mr._n walker_n i_o answer_v that_o as_o in_o all_o other_o particular_a church_n so_o in_o the_o particular_a church_n of_o england_n there_o be_v a_o double_a voice_n one_o of_o the_o church_n as_o she_o be_v the_o true_a church_n of_o christ_n and_o that_o be_v both_o her_o voice_n commend_v the_o scripture_n only_o to_o be_v believe_v as_o necessary_a for_o save_v knowledge_n and_o true_a 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if_o they_o be_v deadly_a but_o either_o the_o whole_a number_n or_o at_o least_o some_o in_o the_o number_n of_o the_o church_n will_v renounce_v it_o and_o so_o the_o whole_a shall_v not_o err_v final_o this_o be_v my_o answer_n but_o because_o i_o will_v give_v you_o some_o ground_n whereon_o to_o fasten_v that_o we_o may_v not_o spend_v time_n in_o question_n but_o may_v come_v to_o disputation_n which_o be_v the_o intent_n of_o our_o meeting_n i_o will_v grant_v you_o thus_o much_o that_o the_o church_n of_o england_n may_v err_v for_o a_o time_n and_o after_o some_o manner_n in_o a_o point_n fundamental_a or_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n ground_n what_o you_o can_v upon_o this_o and_o let_v we_o have_v some_o disputation_n by_o way_n of_o strict_a argument_n and_o syllogism_n mr._n smith_n i_o have_v enough_o out_o of_o your_o own_o confession_n to_o prove_v that_o you_o have_v neither_o church_n nor_o faith_n and_o i_o pray_v you_o gentleman_n to_o mark_v and_o take_v notice_n he_o grant_v that_o the_o protestant_a church_n of_o england_n may_v err_v in_o a_o fundamental_a point_n if_o in_o one_o then_o as_o well_o in_o another_o and_o so_o from_o one_o to_o another_o till_o it_o err_v in_o all_o and_o so_o have_v no_o faith_n at_o all_o and_o have_v no_o faith_n it_o be_v no_o church_n thus_o you_o see_v i_o have_v prove_v that_o protestant_n have_v neither_o church_n nor_o faith_n and_o therefore_o i_o beseech_v you_o all_o take_v heed_n of_o they_o who_o by_o their_o own_o confession_n have_v forsake_v the_o catholic_a church_n and_o faith_n and_o do_v wilful_a run_v into_o all_o damnable_a error_n and_o heresy_n and_o lead_v man_n into_o destruction_n you_o see_v how_o plain_o they_o be_v convince_v and_o i_o appeal_v to_o you_o all_o judge_n whether_o i_o have_v not_o plain_o prove_v that_o which_o i_o do_v under_o take_v to_o wit_n that_o they_o have_v neither_o church_n nor_o faith_n and_o so_o be_v in_o a_o most_o damnable_a estate_n mr._n walker_n to_o these_o word_n utter_v with_o great_a vehemency_n and_o action_n of_o the_o hand_n and_o whole_a body_n mr._n walker_n stand_v up_o and_o put_v of_o his_o hat_n make_v this_o reply_n first_o say_v he_o though_o it_o be_v your_o motion_n and_o my_o desire_n that_o i_o may_v talk_v mild_o without_o bitter_a word_n yet_o see_v he_o first_o break_v out_o so_o unreasonable_o and_o go_v about_o by_o bitter_a and_o reproachful_a word_n and_o gesture_n to_o bear_v down_o the_o truth_n i_o must_v crave_v leave_n of_o these_o gentleman_n to_o answer_v you_o in_o your_o kind_n though_o it_o be_v very_o unseemly_o that_o in_o my_o manner_n of_o answer_n you_o may_v behold_v the_o unseemlynesse_n of_o your_o dispute_v and_o then_o with_o like_a word_n voice_n and_o gesture_n he_o answer_v to_o this_o effect_n first_o where_o as_o you_o say_v that_o you_o have_v prove_v that_o which_o you_o do_v undertake_v you_o show_v yourself_o without_o wit_n or_o reason_n for_o you_o be_v not_o able_a to_o 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all_o faith_n yet_o it_o do_v not_o there_o upon_o follow_v that_o it_o do_v so_o and_o that_o now_o present_o it_o have_v no_o faith_n neither_o be_v a_o church_n at_o all_o thus_o gentleman_n you_o see_v how_o i_o have_v prove_v this_o man_n by_o his_o own_o speech_n to_o be_v without_o wit_n reason_n modesty_n or_o honesty_n rove_a without_o wit_n or_o reason_n rail_v without_o modesty_n and_o false_o charge_v we_o against_o all_o show_n of_o honesty_n but_o i_o fear_v i_o that_o this_o kind_n of_o friar-like_a preach_n be_v odious_a and_o distasteful_a to_o all_o judicious_a beholder_n i_o pray_v you_o let_v we_o dispute_v orderly_o and_o according_a to_o art_n and_o if_o you_o be_v able_a to_o dispute_v scholarlike_a let_v we_o have_v one_o argument_n frame_v into_o a_o short_a syllogism_n mr._n smith_n i_o warrant_v you_o i_o can_v make_v syllogism_n to_o your_o small_a comfort_n mr._n walker_n and_o i_o doubt_v not_o but_o i_o shall_v as_o easy_o answer_v they_o to_o your_o 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desire_v to_o hear_v mr._n walker_n dispute_v upon_o his_o question_n which_o when_o mr._n smith_n seem_v loath_a to_o yield_v unto_o as_o be_v weary_a already_o mr._n walker_n desire_v that_o he_o may_v but_o turn_v one_o argument_n against_o mr._n smith_n question_n and_o prove_v the_o contrary_a to_o be_v true_a to_o this_o all_o assent_v and_o the_o gentleman_n who_o begin_v to_o distrust_v his_o former_a profess_a popery_n come_v to_o mr._n walker_n and_o stand_v at_o his_o back_n desire_v he_o to_o press_v one_o argument_n against_o mr._n smith_n question_n whereupon_o mr._n walker_n thus_o begin_v to_o prove_v that_o a_o true_a christian_a church_n may_v err_v for_o a_o time_n in_o some_o fundamental_a point_n and_o yet_o be_v a_o true_a church_n mr._n walker_n that_o which_o the_o ancient_a apostolical_a church_n may_v do_v other_o succeed_a church_n may_v do_v with_o the_o same_o success_n the_o apostolical_a church_n may_v err_v and_o do_v err_v in_o a_o main_a point_n and_o 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he_o to_o be_v of_o such_o a_o church_n as_o st._n peter_n be_v when_o christ_n say_v math._n 16._o happy_a be_v thou_o simon_n etc._n etc._n and_o upon_o this_o rock_n i_o will_v build_v my_o church_n who_o answer_v that_o he_o desire_v to_o be_v of_o no_o better_a church_n second_o he_o proceed_v thus_o the_o kingdom_n of_o god_n which_o come_v by_o the_o preach_a of_o the_o gospel_n be_v the_o true_a church_n but_o that_o be_v come_v already_o as_o our_o saviour_n himself_o testify_v matth._n 11._o 28._o and_o luk._n 11._o 20._o it_o be_v a_o base_a shift_n to_o say_v that_o the_o come_n down_o of_o the_o holy_a ghost_n make_v they_o a_o church_n for_o his_o extraordinary_a gift_n come_v not_o to_o make_v they_o christian_n and_o member_n of_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n but_o to_o make_v they_o fit_a messenger_n to_o preach_v to_o all_o nation_n and_o to_o every_o people_n in_o their_o proper_a tongue_n but_o if_o all_o this_o will_v not_o convince_v you_o let_v we_o know_v who_o 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they_o which_o be_v require_v to_o the_o essence_n of_o a_o christian_a church_n undoubted_o they_o be_v a_o true_a church_n and_o to_o deny_v this_o be_v to_o resist_v the_o manifest_a truth_n of_o the_o gospel_n thus_o the_o disputation_n end_v for_o the_o priest_n do_v not_o give_v any_o answer_n but_o be_v very_o willing_a to_o make_v a_o end_n the_o protestant_a gentleman_n seem_v well_o satisfy_v and_o make_v they_o ready_a to_o depart_v and_o one_o of_o the_o roman_a catholic_n call_v mr._n walker_n aside_o begin_v to_o colloque_n and_o flatter_v with_o he_o tell_v he_o that_o he_o be_v a_o good_a logician_n a_o good_a linguist_n and_o well_o read_v and_o that_o god_n have_v give_v he_o a_o sharp_a wit_n and_o ready_a tongue_n and_o therefore_o no_o marvel_n though_o he_o prevail_v and_o make_v a_o good_a cause_n seem_v bad_a when_o he_o oppose_v it_o and_o a_o bad_a seem_v good_a when_o he_o defend_v it_o but_o say_v he_o take_v heed_n that_o you_o do_v not_o trust_v to_o your_o wit_n and_o learning_n too_o much_o lest_o they_o deceive_v you_o and_o make_v you_o triumph_n over_o the_o truth_n to_o he_o mr._n walker_n answer_v that_o he_o know_v himself_o inferior_a to_o many_o hundred_o in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n that_o it_o be_v not_o any_o power_n in_o himself_o but_o the_o power_n of_o the_o true_a cause_n which_o make_v he_o to_o prevail_v for_o magnus_fw-la est_fw-la veritas_fw-la &_o praevalebit_fw-la great_a be_v truth_n and_o will_v prevail_v a_o gentleman_n overhear_v laugh_v and_o say_v i_o be_o glad_a that_o you_o find_v some_o of_o our_o minister_n more_o learned_a than_o your_o priest_n contrary_a to_o your_o common_a brag_a and_o boast_v that_o all_o learning_n be_v among_o your_o priest_n and_o jesuit_n and_o so_o they_o part_v mr._n smith_n alias_o norrice_n embrace_v mr._n walker_n and_o say_v i_o pray_v god_n we_o may_v meet_v in_o heaven_n and_o mr._n walker_n reply_v and_o say_v i_o desire_v so_o also_o and_o hope_v we_o shall_v so_o do_v if_o you_o will_v forsake_v your_o error_n and_o embrace_v the_o truth_n which_o be_v profess_v in_o the_o reform_a church_n of_o christ_n soli_fw-la deo_fw-la gloria_fw-la finis_fw-la math._n 13._o 4._o 16._o 12._o
thus_o that_o church_n which_o may_v err_v for_o a_o time_n in_o a_o fundamental_a point_n necessary_a to_o salvation_n have_v not_o sufficient_a mean_n of_o salvation_n for_o that_o time_n you_o be_v such_o ergo_fw-la it_o be_v no_o true_a church_n mr._n walker_n here_o be_v the_o same_o three_o fault_n which_o be_v in_o your_o former_a argument_n first_o no_o proof_n of_o the_o proposition_n deny_v second_o four_o term_n three_o the_o manner_n be_v still_o false_a for_o possibility_n of_o err_v do_v not_o take_v away_o sufficiency_n of_o mean_n for_o the_o time_n mr._n smith_n i_o prove_v it_o thus_o that_o church_n which_o may_v err_v for_o a_o time_n in_o a_o fundamental_a point_n necessary_a to_o salvation_n for_o that_o time_n have_v not_o the_o whole_a infallible_a truth_n requisite_a to_o salvation_n but_o your_o church_n may_v so_o err_v ergo._fw-la it_o have_v not_o the_o whole_a infallible_a faith_n requisite_a for_o salvation_n mr._n walker_n i_o see_v you_o can_v bring_v 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