is to iudge the later ANSVVER Who ever that was a supposed member in our Ecclesiasticall state durst disclaime the iudgement censure authority of our Church But your reasonlesse reason is the later Church is not to iudge the former If by the former Church you meane the ancient Catholike Church for the first 500. yeeres we maintaine our reformed Church to bee the same but if by the former church you meane the now Roman Catholike faith as Bristow and the Rhemists deliver Bristow mot 12. in marg Rhem in Annot in Rom. 1 8. that the Romane and Catholike Church be all one then we reiect and abhorre that Synagogue of Sathan wherein Ziim and Iim the Ostrich and Vulture and Schritchowle doe remaine And by many more degrees then Papistes prefer the Pope before the Emperour wee preferre the Reformed Churches which doe mainetaine the ancient Catholike Apostolike faith reformed from errors superstitions and heresies stealing in by the degrees of time and occasion into the window of the Church Mr LEECH And what did I herein good Reader but obserue the prescription of Antiquity in this behalfe Contr. Iulian Pelag. lib. 2. and namely that of S. Augustine against the Pelagian hereticks Patres oportet vt populi Christiani vestris novitatibus anteponant eisque potius eligant adhaerere quà m vobis ANSVVER Nay what did you but as Pelagian himselfe did magnifie the nature of man so strengthen the arme of flesh as if you would incite it to rebell against heaven and what did you otherwise then as hereticks of all ages who haue stoode so much vpon authorities out of some authors falsely collected that they will not be drawn no not by Scriptures to the acknoweledgemēt of their errors Such S. Austin observed the Donatists to be Aug. contra Donatist Quis autem nesciat sanctam Scripturam Canonicam tam veteris quā novi Testamēti c. where in a large discourse hee manifesteth that the Canon of Scripture is only so sure that there ought to bee no doubt or disputation thereof but for Fathers and Ancient Bishops much might be reprehended therein The cause that S. Austin in confuting the Pelagians did appoint the reading of the fathers to the people was this because the fathers formerly had delivered by strength of scripture the contrary doctrine to that heresie And yet that holy father speaking of himselfe and al the ancients before him Neque enim debeo negare saith he ad Vincentiū sicut in ipsis maioribus Aug. ad Vincentium Victorem ita multa esse in tam multis opusculis meis quae possunt iusto iudicio culpari that in him nor in any other this is a prescription of Antiquity to rely only on fathers Mr LEECH Here D. Airay distasting my refusall to stand vnto the verdict of the reformed Churches questioned with me about the rule of my faith I answered him briefly Contr. haeres cap. 1. c. See D. Field pag. 239. that I wholly followed Vincentius Lyrinensis his direction to wit Canonicall scripture and Ecclesiasticall traditiō the first being sensed by the second ANSVVER To refuse the iudgement of the ruler and to fly to a stranger is punishable in Policy to condemne and contemne your owne mother Church and to stand to the iudgement of a strange Church nay of a Synagogue a stranger from the Church is culpable in divinity It was a seasonable question to aske the rule of your faith whē it was manifest you had forsaken the faith your answer was vnsound ioining with Canonicall Scripture Ecclesiasticall tradition these be two therefore not the rule but rules whereas Canon regula must be but one Aq. lect 1. in 1. Tim. 6. Aquinas on Timothy affirming that the Doctrine of the Prophets and Apostles is called Canonicall because it is the rule Traditions wee renounce as vnworthy to be ioyned with Scripture Melch. Can. lib. 3. c. because Canus in this doeth expresly teach that whatsoever the Church of Rome practiseth and hath not warrant from Scripture the same things and the practise of them shee hath received by Tradition which Popish traditions we abhorre to supply scripture with as knowing that the Scripture containeth all things necessary to salvation and also affirme that the most certaine rule of interpretation is by comparing Scripture with Scripture Vincentius Lerinensis is not for you he alloweth nothing barely vpon Tradition For by all the passages of his booke he doth plainely teach that no Traditiō is to be received but that which is consonant vnto Scripture such as S. Austin delivereth Quod vniversa tenet Ecclesia Lib. 4. contra Don. cap. 23. such as the whole Church hath doth hold agreeing to the Canon of the revealed word And from famous D. Field that powerfull hammer of all Heretikes that claime tenure in the Church you cā produce nothing to helpe your cause either in that page or in his whole booke Neither is Tradition to sense or expound the Scripture as you say This is your third interpreter first you appealed to the Church then to the Fathers now to Traditions the next appeale must bee to the Pope or else you will be cashierd Mr LEECH This rule he called Popish exclaiming against it as the very ground of Popery and superstition Wherevpon I desired him for my better instruction to giue a rule of faith more certaine infallible then this which be brāded with such disgracefull imputation ANSVVER Popish it is without all gainsaying For howsoever we reiect not all Traditions as first D. Field in his 4 booke of the Church the number and names of the Authors of Canonicall Scripture secondly the cheefe heades of Christian doctrine as delivered in the Creed of the Apostles Thirdly the religion purely collected out of Scripture delivered to succeeding ages fourthly the continuall practise of the Primitiue Church though not expresly commaunded but necessarily contained in Scripture and lastly Traditions of order not of faith such as are our Canons and Constitutions agreeing to the ancient and grounded on S. Paules speech Let all things be done in order I say we reiect not these though Waldensis in his time complained Waldens tom 3. tit 7. cap. 63. that the necessary Traditions of the Church were so confounded that they could hardly be discerned from the rest The points that we deny bee these first Scripture needeth not the Adiectiue help of Traditions it is a most sufficient rule and containeth all things necessary to salvation Secondly wee abhorre the comparison of these two and much more the preferring of tradition before Scripture as Hosius Baronius Symancha and others professe some affirming Hosius contr Petric c. 92. Baron an 33. nu 11. Sym. instit tit 24. n. 40. that all Scripture came to vs by Tradition therefore Tradition more worth others that Scripture needeth help from Traditions but Traditions neede no assistance from Scripture And therefore if you
this it will bee no otherwise prooved then c Confess Petric c. 92. de Traditionibus Hosius proveth that the greatest part of the Gospell is come to vs by tradition and verie little of it committed to writing which is a most rash false conceipt of his But Andradius acknowledgeth that the Cittie of refuge for all the runnagate points in Religion is Tradition His words d Andrad Orthod explic lib. 2. pag. â—0 be Quam traditionum autoritatem si tollas nutare vacillare videbuÌ„tur Manie points would reele totter if not supported by the helpe of Traditions Saint e 1. Cor. 9.6 Paule hath warned that no man presume aboue that which is written and f Regul contract 95. fol. pag. 502. Basill admonisheth that it is necessarie and consonant to reason that everie man learne that which is needfull out of Scripture both for the fulnes of godlines and least they bee invred to humane traditions Yet I answere concerning Traditions that when this controversie is fully discussed you wil be as vnable to proue your position from anie Apostolicall tradition as the men of Doryla in g Cicero pro L. Flacco Tully who when they were to proue somewhat against Flaccus out of their publike Records and their records were called for they said they were robd of theÌ„ by the waie so your Traditions which must speak for you they are lost by the waie no one neither Bellarmine nor Coccius nor Sonnius nor anie writer can produce one Apostolicall sanction tradition or authority And for the practise of the Church the Ecclesiasticall histories shew that the ancient servaÌ„ts of God which first retired themselues from the worlde did it not for anie opinion they had hereby to obtaine perfection but to escape persecution as h Sozomen lib. 1. c. 12. Sozomen writeth and to hide themselues And some of them were lay-men as k Athan. Ep. ad Dracont Dyonisius voucheth some of them married men as i Dion Ecclesiae hierar c. 6. Athanasius recordeth all of them freemen from binding themselues with vowes as l Nic. lib. 9. c. 14. Nicephorus proueth And for the practise of Popish Monkes now the patterns of this Evangelicall perfection m Philobib c. 5. Dunelmensis delivereth it Greges vellera fruges horrea porci olera potus patera lectiones sunt hodie studia Monachorum And you knowe the old verse O Monachi vestri stomachi sunt amphora Bacchi Vos estis Deus est testis teterrima pestis Mr LEECH But yet since contrary to my probable persuasion certaine private spirits whose faith is their owne fancy itching rather after prophane novelty and hereticall innovation then abiding the wholesome doctrine of sacred Antiquitie and the Churches dogmaticall tradition haue by all meanes laboured to impugne my doctrine and to defame my person I haue thought my selfe in conscience and duty both before God and man obliged a swell for the generall satisfaction of all whom this present busines may any way concerne as for my owne discharge in particular being the party herein especially interessed briefly to coÌ„pile and publish the whole carriage and progresse of this matter in the ensuing treatise humbly recommending and ever submitting my opinion vnto the graue and infallible iudgement of the Church at whose feete and tribunall alone prostrating my selfe I must stand or fall as also referring my selfe with the moderat deportment of my cause vnto the sincere iudgement of the discreet and impartiall Reader ANSVVER You were drawne to this vnwillingly in respect of your vnabillity to maintaine the opinioÌ„ but most willingly in desire to stand out in contradiction But why should you rubbe ouer any here with the title of itching spirits Barn It is the rule of S. Bernard when in disputation or coÌ„ference there is rayling or reviling tunc non veritas quaeritur sed animositas fatigatur Truth is not sought for but strong and stubborne stomakes disgordge their poison Hee that hath giuen leaue to try the spirits hath prohibited the condemning nay iudging of a brother and therefore while you slander them with the itch of prophane novelty you bewray your selfe to bee infected with the scab of heresie They that gainesaid your doctrine were wise and honest learned and religious not a few but the consent of all of all degrees among vs. And so farre are they from defaming of your person that I doe assure my selfe that everie religious honest heart in Oxford will bee desirous to cover it with the mantle of charity to pray that it maie bee invested with the robe of Christs righteousnes wishing from our harts that no other cause then conscience and duty as you saie had obliged you to publish this your Treatise and that the discharge of your selfe and satisfaction of others had beene more truelie and charitablie performed that you had submitted your opinion to Gods word rather then the Church seeing the Church is not the infallible rule of iudgement as you hold n Relec. controu 4. de potestat ecclesiae in se q. 3. art 2. resp ad arg 5. Stapleton him selfe after loÌ„g discussing durst not absolutelie affirme it but seemeth to make it rather probable then credible when he confesseth that it is not anie article of our faith to beleeue that the authoritie of the Church is the rule of our faith And not only a Doctor but a Pope speaketh in this case more plainlie o Decret Greg. lib. 5. de sent excom c. 28. a nobis saepe Innocentius affirming that the Churches iudgement followeth opinion which often deceiveth and is deceived And howsoever I maie saie to you as p Aug. de vnit Eccles cap. 2. S. Augustine did to some heretiques of his time De hoc inter nos quaestio versatur vtrùm apud nos an apud illos vera Ecclesia sit the question being controverted betweene you and vs whethers is the true Church neither of vs can proue the argument by the Church seeing q Chrysost in Hom. 10. in 1. Tit Chrysostome doth conclude that the Scriptures must teach who hath the true Church r De vnit Eccles cap. 16. S. Austin resolving that Scriptures be documenta fundamenta firmamenta the proofes foundations grounds of our cause and therefore vnlesse you bee contented to submit your opinion to the Scriptures it is manifest that you acknowledge that your doctrine and the Scriptures were never acquainted The Pharisies the false porters of the kingdome Å¿ Mat. 23.13 tooke awaie the key of knowledge and they received their reward a volley t Luk. 11.42 of wo. Take heede least doing the like you incurre the like danger More respectiue are the Schoolemen of Scripture then you are u Lom dist 23. LoÌ„bard x Scot. 3. dist 23. q. vin Scotus y Oc. 3. q. 8. art 3. Ockam z Bi 3. dist 23. q. 2. lit g. h.
done the like you had never rambled on such a Collection as this to say Christ had erroneously taught him the way to life by vade vende omnia if this bee not a Counsell of voluntary poverty Your sequell is out of ioint and absurd rather Christ would haue never applied this plaister if he looking through the windowes of this young mans soule into his inward most retired roome had not found covetousnes to be his hinderance and encombrance And this proveth it selfe in the Text for he went away sorrowfully I cannot but note the malice and virulent dealing of your ignorant contradicting spirit traducing Calvine for a blasphemous interpreter who taught no more then he learned of the Fathers and if among those that did interpret Scripture since the fathers time any one is worthy to be accounted fidus interpres Horat. Art Poet. for his soūdnesse and profoundnesse blessed Calvin is who was as Eramsus wrot of Tonstall a world of learning Eras epist 84. Claud. Verderius conscio in Autores pag. 174. and as Theodorus Gaza testified of Plutarch that if any mā were so limited that he could only read one humane authors bookes he would read Plutarch so many renowned Divines next vnto sacred Scripture haue of all other authors choisly and cheefly selected this holy servant of God So that in this Paragraph you blaspheme God iniure truth accuse your knowledge and abuse your conscience Mr LEECH Lastly I would but demand what S. Paule meant 2. Cor. 7.25 Vid. Damas dict Gnomi in Indice to distinguish plainely betwixt Precepts Coūsells thus praeceptum non habeo consilium do for so the vulgar readeth which all the latine Church followeth and all the Greeke Fathers haue so taken it if there be no Counsells For he groundeth this his distinction vpon his Masters wordes Non omnes capiunt and therefore S. Paul had no precept But qui potest capere capiat And hence floweth the second branch consilium do as S. Hierom S. Basill and divers others of both Churches doe obserue ANSVVER Discourses that grow tedious are odious and such is this your frequent and too often querulous quaere The distinction in S. Paule is betweene 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 betweene a precept and sentence no word signifying Counsell in that place I haue already shewed how Antoninus maketh S. Dominick the Author of Evangelicall Counsells Anton. parte 3. vt ante and S. Paul the teacher of faith and the law and yet you produce S. Paul as a speciall bullwark for your Counsel house Many Fathers haue I confesse read that Text so but the originall ministreth no such interpretation nor doe the Fathers themselues otherwise hence ground but that qui potest being enabled is qui debet hee that is commanded You and Coccius teach the Fathers to speak very preposterously Beware of the Fathers curse or rather of Gods curse seeing you call them to beare false witnesse against the Law Gospell and God himselfe Mr LEECH And that this point may be every way full and perfit builded vpon so many seuerall rockes as there bee seuerall places of Scriptures let the Doctors of the Church speake Vincentius Lyrin in cōmonitorio being the most probable Maisters and teachers in the Church against quot capita tot sensus the very bane of all religion mother of innovatiō let the church interpret Scripture and hee that will not heare the Church you know what followeth 2. Pet. 1. vlt. sit tibi tanquam haereticus Nay sit tibi tanquam ethnicus For as it is said of the letter of the scripture that it is not of any private inspiration For it came not in old time by the will of man but holy men spake as they were moved by the holy Ghost Serm. 17. in Cantic So may it be as truely saide of the sense of the Scripture that it is not of any priuat spirits interpretation And the reason why every man should flie from a private spirits interpretation A sentence that striketh the Religion in England as dead as a dore naile is this as it is excellentlie rendred by that mellifluous Father S Bernard Nonnulli adesse putant spiritum cùm non adest suúmque sensum pro sensu spiritus sequuntur deviantes suásque sententias magistrorum sententijs praeferūt that is for I cānot but translate it many men thinke that they haue the spirit of God when they haue it not erroneouslie following the sense of their owne private spirits for the meaning of the holy Ghost preferring their owne private opinions before the publique iudgements of their masters and teachers ANSVVER You haue suffered shipwracke vpon your rockes They be severall indeed Psal for they are severed far from you which is manifest in that you rocke to and fro in your preposterous building like a tottering wall or like a broken hedge You call for advocates the Doctors of the Church Num. 23.38 and fetch them in as Balaac did Balaam but they answer as there hee did but with a more holy spirit We are come vnto thee and can we nowe say any thing at all The worde that God hath put in our mouthes that shall we speake But if this helpe you not you call the Church to testifie with you To the church we leaue as much as the spowse hath made her iointer in the interpretation of Scripture by the Church Tertull. libro de praescrip haereticorum that of Tertullian is to be remembred who warneth of some Qui non ad materiam Scripturas sed materiam ad Scriptur as excogitant and thereby run into one of those two miseries which S. Austin observeth Aust Comm. Faustum lib. 22. cap. 32. Caiet in praef Com. in lib. Mosis aut falli imprudenter aut fallere impudenter you say the Fathers of the Church are for you yet Caietā beleeveth that God hath not tyed the exposition of the Scriptures to the senses of the Fathers And if the Fathers serue not you saie let the Church interpret Scripture We distinguish the Church from the Synagogue of Antichrist and seeing wee hold that Scriptures must tell which is the Church wee must deny that the Church must tell vs the sense of Scripture Gerson doth disclaime the iudgement of Pope Gerson de exam doct part 1. cō 5. Councell or Church cōcerning interpretation of Scriptures and trial of doctrine when hee delivereth that the examination of doctrine concerning faith belongeth not to the Councell or Pope but to every one that is sufficiently learned in Scriptures Cus Ep. 2. pag. 833. And Cusanus cannot deny but that by the iudgement of the Church the Scripture is fitted to the time and the sense altered as the time altereth We make the spirit of God speaking in Scripture to be iudge of the Scripture and Act. 17.17 as the men of Berea sought the Scripture to approue the
received light But in this Art Grace so far aboue Art haue so enriched his iudgement by study that though he mainetaineth the reading of the fathers and the frequent quotation of thē and maketh vse of them in Sermons as much as anie whatsoever in which kinde as in all others his talent is most extraordinary yet he farre disclaimeth that ever he beleeved that you could produce anie true authorities either in generall from the fathers or in particular from Gregory whom you make the Author pillar and maintainer of your Doctrine The observation of Ludovicus Rabus is fit to bee remembred by you In his 1. volume of Collection out of Austin Lud. Rab. in 1. tom to recōcile by the meditatiō of that reverend father divers places of Scriptures There bee saith he two sorts of men which much wrong antiquity Quorum alterum iniquum nimis planè distortum omnia à veteribus piâ antiquitate prodita magno supercilio fastidit atque contemnit D. Kings 40. Lecture vpon Ionas And these are most learnedly confuted by the 40. Lecture of Doctor King vpō Ionas Being worthy to be hissed at and contemned for contemning those blessed ornaments of learning and pillers of religion in their time who spake and wrote lived and died in defence of Christs truth Ambrose worthily stiled orbis terrarum oculus Augustin haereticorum malleus great Athanasius eloquent Cyprian golden mouthed Chrysostome and the rest Their names be memorable and their monuments of indefategable paines be honourable throughout all generations and let it for ever bee a brand of the greatest ignorance to contemne their learning and writing Lud. Rab. ibid Alterum vero nimis cautum circumspectū absque iuditio aut discrimine vllo omnia veterum dicta scripta tanquam Praetoria amplectitur mordicus defēsa cupit such as suck only the gall of their inke study only the blotts of their papers and if there be any 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 imposed and impostured into the Fathers writings these they study to maintaine That if Tertullian savor of Montanisme or Cyprian of Rebaptisme or Origen of Millieranisme if Nazianzen seem to be an Angelist or Hierome a Monagamist this they swallow without distinction or discreatiō never looking into the Interpretations or Retractations of those opinions And this they will as resolutely teach as Canon of Scripture whereas the most worthy Father that ever lived since Christ time S. Austin in his 2 Tome Epist 19. Aust 2. Tom. Ep. 19. Ep. 40. ad Vinc. Ep. 111. ad Fortun. ad Hieronymum in his 48 Epistle ad Vincentium in his 111 Epistle ad Fortunatianum doth absolutly conclude Neque enim quorumlibet disputationes quam vis catholicorum laudatorum hominum velut Scriptur as Canonicas habere debemus vt nobis nō liceat salva honorificentia quae illis debetur hominibus aliquid in eorum scriptis improbare atque respuere si forte invenerimus quoad aliter senserint quà m veritas habet divino adiutorio vel ab alijs intellecta vel à nobis Talis ego sum in scriptis aliorū tales volo esse intellectores meorum This caveat may serue you especially who relie more vpon reading then vpon vnderstanding Your clause of accusation is false wherein you impute to that famous Doctor and others the accepting and reiecting of the Fathers at their pleasure It is the common practise of your owne as I haue already shewed Mr LEECH Now whereas I added farther that the best learned in Oxford concurred with me in this point yea said hee there are many of you that will play with Popery as the fly doth with the candle you hoouer over and about it as neere as you dare but you will bee sure to keep your wings from sindging ANSVVER You that father opinions vpon the ancient Fathers may as easily traduce moderne Doctors Did ever any concurre with you in publike declaration of this doctrine I speake it againe and am assured of it that you traduce some that favoured your person rather then your doctrine and did much distast that you should any way deale with controversie Who interceeded for you who offered to defend it to dispute it The speech of Mr Vicechancelour concerning those that play with Popery c. I beleeue was only and particularly appropriated to your selfe though you desire to draw others into your reputation livery If any doe confectionat their religion and double in the true worship of God I feare to iudge them and as much feare to follow them Mr LEECH Though I made a friendly defence of those men at whō he malitiously girded as being mē of incomparable worth in that place yet I disclaimed all assistance from them or any others protesting that I depended not vpon men nor Angells but only vpon the sacred Scripture interpreted by the ancient Church Which rule of faith as it is most certaine so my application thereof in this particular is free from all exception ANSVVER Your friendly defence it doth offer offence in cōtinuing the derivation of your owne folly vpon any of incomparable worth Incomparable worth is a title to be bestowed only vpon men of Incomparable paines and studies and so are our Publike Governors and most learned Readers in divinity Of these as many as had occasion to discourse vpon your doctrine haue all gainsaid it and in solemne Lectures and Disputations in our publike divinity Schoole it hath beene often fanned confuted You say you depend not vpō Angells so thinke I also for though the Angells be not ambitious yet I am sure they would thinke it some iniury if not to thē yet to the truth that man should be equall to them in perfection and Angelicall integrity as you affirme From Scriptures interpreted by the Church you received it not the Church did never graunt it the Scriptures doe no where ground it What the rule of faith is you haue already beene taught Mr LEECH Well quoth he whether I shall bee able to proue this doctrine false or not I cannot tell but as I think I shall Howsoever certaine I am that I shall be able to condemne you of great indiscretiō for preaching such doctrine in these revolting times when there is such generall Apostasie from the gospel vnto Popery ANSVVER Qui semel verecundiae limites transilijt gnaviter fit impudēs Whether this your speech deserue not the blackest Character of falshood or no I will not say I cānot tell but I am bound by all the assurances of truth to beleeue that your report in this will be an article against you in iudgement O◠impudens Was there diffidēce or distrust or the least touch of doubt in him was not his resolution so firme and his protestation so faithfull that he told you with much zeale and earnestnesse he knew and would proue your doctrine to bee false and shamefull and your selfe ignorant and most vnskilfull in point of Controversie
capitall danger wishing M. Vicechancellor to question me vpon the point of the kings Supremacy for surely said he you shall finde him vnsound therein ANSVVER The reverend faithfull and laborious Doctor must possesse his soule in patience and receiue his part of your improbable and vncharitable interpretations as wel as others His vnderstanding inlightened with the beames of diuine truth suffer not as you slander him to be overthrowne in his rule of faith his memorable free-will offrings in Sabaoth exercises to turne many to righteousnes his worthy performance of all Vniuersity exercises his indefatigable studies so greate that a place of the most publike charge did sue to him to draw him from his chosen retirednesse his zeale paine faith doctrine manner of living though hee hold his minde vnfainedly below his place yet these testifie to the world his worth to be farre aboue his state The reason that he proposed the point of supremacy to you was this in the course of the proceedings and speeches with you he observed that you had forsaken the reformed congregations of the church the scriptures the infallible rule of faith and therfore seeing your fidelity to God was so changed it was fit time to obserue how you were affected to the Kings Maiesty seeing the Apostle ioineth them togither Feare God honor the King you having neglected the first the second was to be feared The question of the supremacy in this kinde was the only Touchstone the Shibboleh to try an Ephramit Iud. 12.6 for in every true subiect there ought not to be more loue in his hart thē liberty in his tongue to professe the crowne and dignitie and supremacy of that loadstone and gracious loadstar of hearts the kings most royall Maiesty This being not only an ancient Canon and a point confessed by Bishops in this our land in the raigne of the most ancient kings who resisted the vsurpation of that man of blood the Pope but as in the beginning of many Princes raignes so revived in the inauguratiō of our most peaceable most wise most religious Salomon Canons and Constitutiōs made 1603. Canon 1. When in the Convocation helde by all the Beaw-peeres of learning the Bishops and Clergy it was commaunded that all Ecclesiasticall persons of what degree soever should maintaine no obedience or subiection to be due to any forraigne power but that the Kings power within his Realmes of England Scotland and Ireland and all other his Dominions Coūtries is the highest power vnder God to whom all men as well inhabitants as borne within the same doe by Gods lawes owe most loyalty and obedience afore and aboue all other Powers and Potentates in earth If you giue not God what is due to God no marvaile you gaue not Cesar what is due to Cesar A disease in the head is the head of diseases and rebelliō against the head doth manifest the infectious state of the whole body of your beliefe And therfore it wisely was questioned concerning the supremacy It was a question guided by a religious intention and grounded vpon wise observation Mr LEECH But M. Vicechancellours thoughts carried him so far away at that present that he gaue no care vnto this impertinent bloudy question but prosecuting the vindictiue designement formerly concluded vpon betwixt D. Aglionbee and himselfe who held a secret cōference together he resumed his old accusations of false erroneous scandalous and Popish doctrine for delivering and reinforcing whereof I deserued the seuerity of Iustice ANSVVER His vigilancy was not absent Had he beene set on vengeance as you shamefully accuse nowe had beene the time to be avenged but now you see notwithstanding al your reproaches and slanders of passion the worthy Vicechancellour limited his power by his wil and this was a noble revenge that he might hurt and did not There was no such conference between Doctor Aglionbee and him as you report But he did truely and worthily ingeminate and often repeate those tearmes of erroneous scandalous and Popish doctrine Mr LEECH Perceiving now their resolution to punish me without farther examination of my cause or respect of my iust defence I finally proposed vnto them these two demands First that they would proceede against me iuridically by way of Articles so I should know precisely what was the error and falshood of my Doctrine and they should receiue my answer made in forme of law For this hath ever beene the custome of proceeding in this Vniversity and in God his Church ANSVVER It was time when you held right neither in point of Scripture of faith of the Church or of the point in controversie reiected their censure neglected their iudgement and able to vphold your selfe by no means but negatiues And therefore never continue this obstinate accusatiō that they did not examine your cause or respect your defence The cause was offred by disputation to be discussed by Lecture it was already confuted defence you were able to make none but what you brought in a schedule transcribed out of Coccius Your first demand was senselesse Was it not a Iuridicall proceeding to be called according to our Vniuersity statute in that behalfe which is this that for scandalous preaching the Vicechancellour require the assistance of the Doctor of the chaire whose incomparable indefatigable paines hindering him he desired to be spared at that time by the present approach of the Act. D. Holland Vpon the absence of the Reuerend Father of the chaire some other Doctors of Divinity are to be called and there were fiue more in Iuridicall manner appointed here you were convented and censured by the most absolute forme of Law Mr LEECH Herevnto M. Vicechancellour replyed What Articles you shall haue articles time enough meane while I say that all meaning my Sermon is false scandalous Popish erroneous c. ANSVVER Articles were not promised you you accused your selfe and delivered your Articles in your sermō no mention no promise no expectation of any at this your conventing You prevaricat by prescriptiō and custome The old Monke almost blasphemously applied Sicut erat in principio but I may say truly beginning middle ending every Page Section Paragraph haue matter faulty in faith or false in fact And among the rest this Article is to bee preferred against you for speaking of Articles here where there was no such request obtained by you nor expectation of any by promise from him It was iustified and ever will bee till you recant that your doctrine was false in opinion scandalous for the occasion Popish for tradition and erroneous for hereticall innovation Mr LEECH My Second demaund therevpon was that he and his associats would condescend vnto this small request to wit I will here set downe this affirmatiue proposition Sunt Evangelica Consilia and subscribe vnto it in your presence May it please you also to set downe the negatiue Nō sunt Evangelica Consilia and subscribe your severall names therevnto and signifie therewithall
may suffice for thy instruction concerning these Motiues Onely I may not forget to advertise thee that whereas through their titles I vse this perpetuall stile THE PROTESTANTS c. howbeit the most learned amongst them differ in iudgement from the common sort and in this respect cannot bee concluded in the generality of ALL I haue not done this without good consideration For though the principall divines in England do vtterly distast the vaine opinions of D. King and such like yet since by publike profession of the truth they giue not sufficient notice vnto the world of their Catholique positions I must involve them also in this common accusation And as they against their knowledge Corde creditur ad iustitiam ore fit confessio ad salutem doe suffer a preiudice to fall vpon God his truth they must likewise against their will suffer an infamy to remaine vpon their owne persons ANSVVER The Catholikes like to the olde Circumcellions are Individua vaga ever in motion Campians reasons Bristowes motiues the one ten the other 48 yours a Iurie This former treatise hath answered all yours But seeing they so commanded your affection and convinced your vnderstanding wee will heare your descriptions and marke the motions If it be the good of your Reader you wish you would not leade him into so many darke entries of the Chambers of death your booke is come into the hands of many better informed soules then your selfe and some that haue breathed lately from their Antichristianisme that haue seene and heard more then you haue and haue hated and abhorred and returned You seeke to iustifie but do condemne your selfe and you hope your satisfaction will proue an infection to some But each man doth disdaine that these should draw ouer any wise Proselyte They are the same in substance as in your sermon only as the Patron of error can change his shapes so doe these You say you must not forget to advertise and I cannot omit to discrie the vntruth in the advertisement For if with an indifferent eie ANY observant in the state of our Church doe looke vpon the more learned Of our Divines he shal finde that either they be writers or publike Readers or continuall Preachers against Popery neither doe they differ in iudgement from the common sort as most iniuriously you traduce them By publike profession in the vnity of the spirit in the bond of peace in the essense and substance of religion all agree And howsoever there haue beene some differences in opinion betweene many of the most orient fixed starres in the firmament of the Church as betweene Ruffinus Ierom Ierom Austin Austin Symplician and many others yet all the world wil free our Church from hauing in her Religion any diversly affected from the truth addicted to Popery at the least any that ever were of deserving note or accounted the Principall divines If there be any such homely and home-made peeces as your selfe that coccle they be no sooner noted but punished Your preiudice and infamy will returne vpon your selfe for accusing our worthiest to maintaine a linsey woolsey blended mangled Religion Being supplanted your selfe in reputation you seeke to supplāt others the vtmost spirits of your malice and spite being as Enginers to overthrow the credit of those that by their learned paines do seeke to overthrow the wals of Babell Their publique profession and positions free them from your common accusation their sermons Lectures writings might satisfie you but that these heavenly showers haue fallen besides you Error surprising your will ignorance your knowledge a smale things may moue you that were never setled Mr LEECH The First motive The Protestants admit not a triall of their Religion by the testimony of the Fathers whatsoever they pretend to the contrary BEcause it is a preposterous devise to iudge the former ages of the Church by the later D. Field pag 204. We willingly admit a triall by the Fathers saith he in the name of his Church therefore the courses of my study haue ever beene directed vnto a diligent pervsall of ancient Fathers whose authority simply considered as it may preponderate our moderne writers so in reference vnto the Church being her witnesses who is the iudge to define all controversies their testimony is to be preferred before all Authors whatsoever Neither resolued I thus without serious deliberation and especially contra haeref cap. 1. 2. the graue counsaile of Vincentius Lyrinēsis did prevaile with me seeing that learned holy men did generally conspire in this opinion If any man will discerne Heretical pravity from Catholike verity he must be furnished with a double helpe first the Canon of sacred Scripture Secondly the tradition of the Catholique Church wherein three things inseparably concurre Vniversality Antiquitie Consent The reason of which prescription is yealded by him to be this The Scripture is sublime and forasmuch as all men sense it not alike it is necessarie to adioine therevnto the continuall interpretation of the Church Vpon this infallible ground evident vnto all men of any apprehension I builded my faith conforming it alwaies vnto those Orthodoxe principles which I had derived out of the venerable Fathers Hence I assumed this doctrine of Evangelicall Coūsells which as I delivered out of the sacred volumes of Antiquitie so Antiquitie it selfe deduced it with mee out of the divine Oracles of holy Scripture And therefore seeing that my opinion was cleerely built vpon this foūdation I pressed it vncessantly vntill my vniust Iudges were enforced to forsake this meanes of triall and consequently to punish the Fathers in me as I had spoken by them But when I plainely saw that my doctrine could not be condemned without condemnation of the ancient Church and that my Iudges were driuen to this extremity I inferred that their Religion could not be good and that their consciences were verie bad ANSVVER It is a most preposterous devise to make the Fathers iudges of the Scriptures whereas the Scriptures as S. Austin confesseth ought to be the iudges of the Fathers otherwise what you impute to vs is the practise of your selues which you seeke approbation of the former Church by the latine That the Fathers may preponderate the moderne writers I answere for their antiquity they doe but where the same truth is in both for their authority they do not exceed Hath the Church had no growth since their time Hath the sonne of righteousnesse Psal 19. going from the ende of the heauens and in his compasse returning to the ende thereof againe by his beames given no more light then when it first rose Hath not God revealed somethings to one which he hath not to another 1. Cor. 14.30 as S. Paul speaketh Our reverend estimation of the Fathers is most learnedly and fully delivered by his Maiestie in his premonition and our willingnesse of a triall by the Fathers is openly testified by the Reverend Bewcleark D. Field these exceptions
by faith Your last close concerning men assisted with power to punish you disaffected by peevish fancy is meerely false it was not peevish fancie as your Popish folly tearmeth it but it was religious piety policy that disaffected reiected your doctrine the power of Scripture of Fathers of all authority assisting them Rage not courage strengthned you and therefore Iustice and Religion did censure punish you and God wil without your repentance plague you for your vile and violēt tearms against the disciples of truth your selfe being a fellower of blindnes and a hater of goodnes In the meane time this is my 7 confirmation that our doctrine is true Religion and Catholique seeing they that seeke to disgrace it be either statizing Politiques or slaundering Heretiques able to say little in shewe lesse in sense least in truth Mr LEECH The eight Motiue The Protestantes can patiently suffer the articles of the Creede c. to be violated but they are severe in those things that repugne their vtility or sensuality whatsoever EVery truth in respect of God revealing it and the Church propoūding it is of equall necessity to be beleeved howbeit in respect of the matter it selfe one truth may be of greater consequence and dignity then an other And yet it is not the greatnes of the matter it selfe but the manner of revealing which tieth vs to a necessity of beliefe I will instance in this present busines The distinction of Evangelicall Counsailes from Legall Precepts is a truth to be accepted vpon necessity of salvation Why because it is sufficiently revealed vnto vs by God and fullie propounded by the Catholique Church so that it is either wilfull ignorance not to know it or extreame obstinacy to withstand it But yet the Articles of the Creede which are the first elements of faith commended vnto vs by Apostolicall tradition may iustly be reputed more waighty in respect of the matter which is handled therein as namely the descent of Christ into hell Which article of faith is admirably perverted by the Ministers in England un so much as 3. or 4 sondry opinions thereof are freely and vncontroulably deliuered by them vnto their simple flockes I might instance in their different opinions about the Sacraments and other high misteries of saluation wherin fanaticall spirits expatiate without any reproofe But I willingly pretermit these and come to other particular points of doctrine which I preached amōgst them without impeachment First against Caluin his hereticall Autotheisme destroying the vnity of the divine essence I taught with the Nicene Creede and all antiquity that Christ is Deus de Deo hauing the same substance that is in the Father really communicated vnto him in his eternall generation Secondly with S. Gregory Damascen the Greek Latine Church I taught that Christ assumed our nature perfit and complete in the very instant of his conception contrary to the absurd opinion of diuerse Calvinisticall Protestants who avouch that his incarnation was by tēporall degrees and not by entire perfection in an instant Thirdly that God was only the permissiue not any impulsiue cause of sinne though Calvin blaspheme to the contrary and deride the distinction Fourthly Christ crying out Deus meus Deus meus c was not in a traūce he suffred no torments of hell died not by degrees as though his senses decayed by little and little but in perfit sense paine obedience patience humility constancie he rendred vp his righteous soule a voluntary sacrifice for sin But the common opinion of Calvinists is contrary vnto this position Fiftly Filius spiritus sanctus quoniam non sunt a se diem horam iudicij nesciūt a se pater autem quoniam a se est scit a se Hilar. in Mat. Respectu ordinis non teporis Lib. epist 8. c. 42. In Marc. 13.32 Christ was not ignorant of the day of iudgement either as God or man not as God for though he knew it not primarily originally as of himselfe being not God of himselfe yet did he know it secondarily by way of communication from the Father Not as Man for though hee did not know it Ex naturâ humanitatis yet did he know it In naturâ humanitatis as S. Gregory distinguisheth And this doctrine is contrary to Calvin his blasphemous glosse to wit Christus communem habuit cum Angelis ignorantiam These and many such like doctrines directly opposite to Calvin his tenents as he is cōtrary to truth for though his disciples call him a great light of the gospel yet I rather approue the censure of D. Hunnius Calvin Iudaiz a famous Lutheran saying that Calvin is an Angell of darknesse could passe vnnoted and vncontroled by my Calvinian Iudges and all other adherents vnto that faction Why then is this distinction of Precepts Coūsailes so hatefull vnto the Calvinists Alas it toucheth their coppy hold most of them being either married men or bending that way and therefore let Sacraments Christ Church c be abused nay let many points of Catholique doctrine be preached by Orthodox divines yet they are more attentiue vnto the suppression of this truth the like which doth more directly concerne their carnall pleasure and worldly profit For they that haue sold themselues to be the exact vassals of their owne affections and other mens wils are carefull to provide against any thing right or wrong true or false which may be preiudiciall therevnto rather attending what it is which will maintaine their sensuality thē what is orthodox in sound divinity ANSVVER The dignity of truth with the necessity of every truth we preach but this distinctiō so oft idle and vnnecessarily repeated I passe over as ever holding that they be Evangelicall precepts The Article of Christ his descēt into hell is not perverted by our ministers it is beleeued taught by vs witnesse Mr Rogers in his booke The Catholique doctrine of the Church of England Mr Perkins on the Creed our Articles concluded vpon in Convocation and other bookes in this kinde Bellar. de Anima Christi l. 4. cap. 6. §. quaeritur Bellarmin de anima Christi lib. 4. cap. 6. § quaeritur 2. saith thus Omnes conveniunt quòd Christus aliquo modo ad inferos descenderit Of the maner only of this descending if there bee some doubt there was the like also among the Fathers and so Bellarmine also in the place before cited declareth that aboue threescore Creedes of the ancient Fathers Councells leaue out this Article yet Luther Brentius the Centuriasts retaine it and Calvin cited by Bellarmin lib. 2. Inst cap. 16. § 8. dicit hunc articulum in praecipuis habendum The schoolemen agree not on it Durand 3. sent dist 22. quaest 3. Durand 3. sent dist 22. quaest 3. is confuted by Bellarmin in his booke de anima Christi lib. 4. cap. 15. So that if this be a motiue to forsake vs it should also bee a motiue for you to
of eradication to bee rooted out of their possessions whereas otherwise their daies might haue been long in the land which the Lord their God had given thē The most Reverend but now deceased much lamēted Prelat did not by chāge of place chāge his thoughts your intimation is base and false to make the worlde beleeue any other affection in his Grace towardes Religion then what God and man approved openly so by the sequel of your busines it is manifest Where in your second limb of that mōstrous accusation is against his Iustice his approbation of the Vniversitie censure was as much as another condemnation of you pretenses his grace needed not for maine reasons wanted not his experience of the truth knowledge wisedome iudgement and goverment of his vicegerent and the worlds experience of his Graces prudent and eminent carriage in all his high and honourable imployments do free them both from your imputations and returne you your smoaky evaporations a Phrase lent you from the sulphureous fume of the bottomlesse pit But you conclude that you are nothing and worse then nothing The 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of your booke sheweth that you are somewhat more then nothing the only argumēt to serue your turne to proue the Pope to be God is because he can make something of Purgatory which is nothing I could turn this vpon you but I forbeare and only returne to your owne figure How pleaded you for Iustice With stubborne tumultuous quarellous disobediēce In what In a point derogatory to the Iustice and Law of God When Then when you oppressed truth reiected your faith disobeyed your Iudge beganne to forsake your Church Before whom In the open face of heaven in the presence of God men and Angels in the holie place the pulpit in the best place on the best day For what end the dishonor of God the disgrace of his law which you accused of insufficiencie and imperfection Thus you did delude and were deluded for this these Reverēd Doctors haue beene by you iniuriously traduced That I may truely say no Revolter ever did offer more scandall in generall to our Church or slander in particular to so many worthy members thereof Mr LEECH TO M. DOCTOR KING DEANE OF Christ-Church in Oxford and Vicechancellour of the Vniversitie H. L. wisheth health and salvation in Christ IESVS SIR though your will was your law to punish me without my offence yet it shall not bee your sanctuary to defend your selfe without more sufficient reason For as you convented me before a selected Calvinian assembly so now I convent you and them before all men in the assured confidence of my good cause and in the comfortable peace of my sincere heart And since you dealt with me as a Magistrate by the strength of your authority you must giue mee leaue now to deale with you as a Scholler by the validity of arguments Finally because I wish your future happinesse I cannot omit to acquaint you with your present miserie which I will lay forth before your eies in Syllogisticall manner and then I will referre you vnto the consultation of your owne heart Whatsoever doctrine is founded vpon Scripture according to the conformable opinion of the ancient Church that is a point of Catholike faith But the doctrine of Evangelicall Counsailes is founded vpon Scripture according to the conformable opiniō of the ancient Church Therefore the Doctrine of Evangelicall Counsailes is a point of Catholique faith The Maior is a maxime in all Christian schooles The Minor is proued by the ensuing testimonies of the Fathers whose vniforme verdict in this behalfe is the iudgement of the Church Whosoeuer doth obstinately impugne any point of Catholique faith he is an heretike But Doctour Kinge D. Aglionby D. Airay D. Hutton D. Benefield c. do obstinately impugne a point of Catholique faith Therefore D. Kinge D. Aglionby c. are heretikes De haeres ad Quod-vult D. in perorat The Maior is granted by all men of iudgement and is confirmed by S. Augustines rule The Minor is proued by their own proceedings against me in this particular Every heretike is bound to recant his heresie or else he is liable to the punishment decreed in the Canonicall law of the Church But D. King D. Aglionby c. are heretickes Therefore D. King D. Aglionby c. are bound to recant their heresie or else they are liable to the punishment decreed in the Canonicall law of the Church The Maior is cleare of it selfe The Minor is proued already And because it shall appeare yet more sensibly I pray you to consider that whosoeuer reiecteth the ioint consent of Fathers in a point of doctrine as D. King doth herein he is an hereticke and this I will breefly declare by foure evidences FIRST Epist 1. ad Leon. cap. 1. by the testimony of Flavianus Patriarch of Constantinople saying Haeretici est praecepta Patrum declinare instituta eorum despicere In Concil Chalced. SECONDLY by the testimony of Eudoxius admitted in a generall Councell qui non consentit sacrosanctorum Patrum expositionibus alienat se ab omni sacerdotali communione a Christi praesentia See Sozom. l. 7. c. 12. THIRDLY by the proceedings of the most Christian emperour Theodosius against the proud distracted Hetikes who would not submit themselues vnto the iudgements of the venerable Fathers See Vincent Lit. cap. 41. FOVRTHLY by the practise of the Ephesine Counsaile against Nestorius who was iudged an heretike not only in regard of the matter itselfe Veterum interpretum scripta perdiscere dedignatus est See Socrat. l. 7. c. 32. NOTA. wherein he erred damnably but in regard of the manner and tryall by the holy Fathers which his contemptuous spirit did vtterly decline Many also of those Fathers by whose testimony the cause was then handled against Nestorius are the very same whose verdicts I shall now produce against D. King and against his abettours whosoeuer ANSVVER TO Mr. HVMFREY LEECH LATE Minister now Revolter SIr it is Salomons counsel in the 4. verse of the 26. Chap. of Proverbs not to answer some sort of mē yet in the next verse he adviseth to answer such lest they TRIVPMH in their owne eies Vpō the instruction of the former verse this worthy Deane intends to contēne rather then answer and yet wisheth you lesse presūption greater knowledg lesse sophistry more honesty but vpō the directiō of the insuing vers I the weakest of many yet strōg enough for this cause haue vpon reasons of some importance vndertaken to confute your calumnies to cleere the truth to cōfirme the faithfull In Christian Policy you were to be answered and in common charity you are to bee counselled hereafter to care what you write whom you revile so to rule your pen and order your tongue that you be not iudged either in this worlde or in the future or in both for a prostituted cōsciēce if not a
vnto thee Arise and if you heare not this I ingeminate his speech yet to a third yong man i Act. 9.4 Saul Saul why persecutest thou me Mr LEECH O what an exchange had this yong man made what an offer did Christ make him what counsell did the wisdome of the father giue him how much doth it now repent him In a word ô how happy had he beene both in body and in soule since he had beene secure of the salvation both of body and of soule and not only secure of that but thesaurū habuisset in coelo his penny had beene of pure gold he had had measure for measure yea aboue measure heauens remuneration heaped vpon him in lieu of Christian perfection if he had parted with himselfe and abandoned the worlds trash to haue partaked with Christ and heauens treasure ANSVVER It had beene a royall exchange if he hereby for riches that are transitory had obtained heauens blisse his soules security I am glad that all your lamp is not leavened that yet you beleeue a man may bee secure and certaine of his salvation which is a point vncertainely delivered among you What meane you by his now repenting Thinke you that he is in hell I doubt not but you may easily know seeing in Rome you haue news every day from hell and purgatory Certainty of salvation howsoever it be opposed by the Iesuits in generall yet k Medina 1. 2 q. 112. art 5. p. 630. Medina averreth that he would haue every beleeuer certainely to hope he shall obtaine eternall life Vega saith l Greg. de Valentia tom 2. pag. 957. Gregory de Valentia holdeth that some spirituall men may be so certaine that they bee in grace that this their assurance shall be without al feare and staggering And m Cathar assert apolog Catharinus holds the same certainty of faith which we teach I might vrge much out of n 3. d. 23. p. 46. Scotus o Par. 3. q. 61. mem 7. art 3. Alexander of Hales p Lib. 3. distin 20. q. 1. art 2. Bacon others whō you claime yours And q Stap. de Iustif pag. 341. Stapleton commeth so nere to the point as that hee professeth thus wee leaue not a sinner hanging in the midst of wavering doubtfulnesse but wee place him in good and firme hope Your penny of pure gold I will not stand to waigh if I should bring it to the ballance of the sanctuary I should find it scarce sense and much lesse Scripture Mr LEECH And yet this being a counsell not a precept it is not enioined as a precept to all but giuen by way of counsaile vnto perfecter men as the Fathers teach And the reason is excellently rendred by S. Gregory the great to be this It is not enioined as a precept to all for then were it sin either to marry or to possesse any of the worldes goods but yet it is counselled vnto men of more holy rancke For these haue an arbitrary and voluntary choice in their things ANSVVER That your owne advocate should giue evidence against you is great disadvantage S. Gregory himselfe calleth it praeceptum a precept not a counsaile I desire all indifferent readers to looke on the 25 Chapter of his 26. booke of Moralls Greg. Mor. lib. 26. where as I saide before you borrowed this distinction there is only the word precept neither counsel nor counselled is there mentioned And in your place vrged but not quoted not found in S. Gregory suppose it were so it may haue a good meaning for that which you call a counsell is nothing but a particular praecept which though it bind not all yet it must bee observed of those who are furnished with gifts and find themselues fitted thereto by Gods spirit Mr LEECH Such were the Apostles and those Apostolicall mē that hauing possessions sold them brought in the mony laid it downe at the Apostles feete ANSVVERE What Apostles did so Indeed Peter and Andrew forsooke their nets Mat. 4.20 a Mat. 9.9 Matthew forsooke his custome Reliquerunt non vēdiderunt saith one b Luk. 19.8 Zaccheus did restore al Luk. 19.8 c Mat. 19.27 The Disciples did forsake all Mat. 19.27 S. d Phil. 3.8 Paule did vilie value all Phil. 3.8 Only the Merchant did sell all Mat. 13.46 But that is but a parable Laert. Plut. Heathens did somewhat in this kinde e Mat. 13.46 Diogenes neglected all Socrates contemned all Crates cast awaie all and yet these were as farre short of the disciples as the Disciples of Angelicall perfection But to the purpose that the Apostles sold all it is not so they sold nothing for they had nothing to sel That the Apostolical mē sold their possessiōs Act. 4.35 Act. 4.35 it is true but it was not by Evangelicall counsaile nor for Angelicall perfection but to supplie the present want of the Church Mr LEECH Such was holy Antony that ancient Monke of Egypt S. Paul the Hermite S. Benedict S. Hierom S. Basil S. Gregory Nazianzen S. Gregory the great S. Bernard and many other Doctors and Fathers the most renowned lights of learning and greatest pillars of the Church ANSVVER For your Catalogue of Saints f Trithem Anthony was no such Monke nor Benedict the former lived in the year 330 the later in the yeare 500. I marvaile not that you make these to be Monkish Counsellors seeing before you haue so reckoned the Apostles themselues You ioine the Saints very vnequally and claime kindred of some that never knew your religion I examine not the sanctitie of some of them but denie all their bils of Sale or if they sold al I hope you wil be accōptable what they did with the mony I acknowledge the reverence of those blessed Fathers S. Hierom S Basil S. Gregorie Nazianzen c. I marvailed why you brought not in S. Francis till I remembred that g Canus loc Theol. l. 11. c. 7. Canus calleth him a lowsie Saint and yet hee instructed a Cade lambe so wel that it would kneele at Masse and the Saint was wont to preach to geese which heard him with devotion Or why remembred you not S. h Baron ano 1208. n. 5. Fulbert a man of Evangelicall perfection who being sicke the virgin Marie came gaue him sucke from heaven Or among many others i Ant. part 3. art 23. c. 1. §. 1 S. Dominicke whō Antoninus maketh the first inventor of Evangelicall Coūsailes Of whom he affirmeth that before he was borne there were two images founde in a church at Venice the one of S. Paul the other of Dominicke on S. Pauls image was written By this man you may come to Christ on Dominickes image But by this easier Antoninus giveth the reason because Paules doctrine led but to faith and keeping of the commādements but Dominicke should teach the observing of Evangelical Counsailes which is the easier way Risum
doctrin of the Apostles though the Apostles doctrine was Scripture so we admit of no fundamentall interpretation to builde vpon but that which is approved by the sacred scriptures The place that you vrge out of Matthew Math. 18.17 Hee that will not heare the Church let him be tanquam Ethnicus you may vpō your better review finde it is spoken concerning those that refuse to heare the admonition or iudiciall censure of the Church not the glosse or interpretatiō of the Church Wee confesse the letter of Scripture was not nor the sense is of any privat inspiration and therefore trial which is made by the Scriptures is no privat iudgement but the publike cēsure of Gods spirit that speaketh openly in the Scriptures to all men And Basils rule shall bee ever the true practise of the true Church Basil de examin doctr part 1. Cons 5. that they that bee conversant in the Scriptures should examine all that is said whether it agreeth with Scriptures From a private interpretation not agreeing with the Canon of Scripture we fly because as you vrge out of Bernard Nonnulli adesse putant spiritum Acts and monuments by Mr Fox many thinke that they haue the spirit of God with them as they that in that Councell sang veni spiritus and an Owle was sent them they killed that spirit And many thinke they haue the spirit Nicol. Clau. disput de cōcil and yet shut out the spirit as the Councell of Pisa did You saie the sentence of Bernard striketh our religion as dead as a dore naile it is a clownish marginall you might haue learned amongst Scholers that a dore naile could not be said to be dead because it had never life Privat opinions with vs sway not each wel disposed mā submitteth himselfe to the censure of the Church wherein we liue our Church to the Scriptures and this wee make to be the last resolution Mr LEECH It is lawfull to followe the spirit in interpreting the Scripture but it must be the spirit of the Church that spirit of peace vnity charity that descended vpon the Apostles vnited for domus vna c. they abode all in one house a signe of externall charitie Mens anima vna one minde one soule for they had but one God one faith one Church Ancient Church Calvins and Luthers congregations a signe of internall spirituall vnity The same spirit ever since continued in the Church vnited in faith not divided in faction And wee may seeke for the sense of the scripture but where It must not be out of the stincking puddle of a private braine The aforesaid gentlemen c. but forth of the treasuring memory of the Church Christi Evangelio vim nō inferat humana praesumptio patrum semel definita non sunt iterum in dubium vocanda This is contrary to cursed Luther it is blessed Leo in his 94. Epistle let not humane presumption dare to offer violence vnto the Gospell of Christ for the constitutiōs of fathers once decreed are not further to bee questioned Nec definitiones eorum perpetuae commutandae quorum regulam secundum scripturam esse didicimus So speaketh Flavianus bishop of Constantinople in his Epistle to Pope Leo the first Neither are the perpetuall determinations of them to be changed whose rule we haue learned to agree with scripture ANSVVERE Vnity was the bond of Patriarkes Chariot of the Prophets refuge of the Apostles solace of the Saints and Character of Christians But is this belonging to them who abhorre vnity whose religion is rebelliō whose faith is faction as our Church litargie speaketh in the prayer against the conspiracies of Papists What part in vnity haue they that haue divided Christs Coate nay Christs body Christs Church Quis tulerit Gracchos de seditione loquentes Doe all the opinions in the world squadron themselues into so many divided factions as Papists Do not they like the Midianits sheath every man his sword in his neighbours side Cumel is against Suarez Bellarmine is invaded by Carerius for giuing to little to the Pope Marsilius and Father Paulus encounter him for giving to much Cardinall Columna striueth with Baronius Barelay with Boucher Antonius Augustine tilts against Gratian. That as Ieronymus de Cavallos hath set forth in the law his speculum aureum opinionum Communium contra communes so also in the diversitie of contradictions riotting one against another the sweet and mellifluous Author of the Peace of Rome whom I may tearme a library for a whole nation as Mirandula entitled another great scholler hath most amply delivered and sealed it with their own proofs Doct. Hall so also hath Crastovius in his booke Bellum Iesuiticū 205 contradictions of the Iesuits Pappus hath collected 237 differences in doctrine out of Bellarmine Laborious and reverend D. Willet proveth that there be 70 maine contradictions betweene the olde Papists and the new 37 among the Iesuits 57 points wherein Bellarmin is at strang variance with himself 39 essentiall contradictions of Popish religion 100 opposite Constitutions of the Popish Canons And many more might in this kinde bee registred wherein are divers assertions which are onely taile-tied as Sampsons Foxes with a firebrand betweene them but are head-severed wrenching one from another So that you are the divided factiō not we our difference only de fimbria non de toga yours de toga de corpore de Christo many ridiculous many blasphemous all erroneous We doe not seeke the sense of Scripture out of the stinking puddle of a privat brain as out of the Crows nest of your invention that impostumated phrase doth traduce vs nor doe wee by humane presumption offer violence to the Gospell of Christ as many thousand places in Popery bee abused as your blasphemous Pope who vpon that place Act. 2. Papa Clem. In Canonis cap. disertiss 12. quaest 1. Bellar. lib. 2. de sacram c. 1 Bell. Tom. 1. lib. 3. cap. 3. Bell. de Mon. Erant Apostolis omnia cōmunia addeth immo coniuges or your detorting Cardinal Tortus the Torturer of Scripture vpon that spiritus Domini ferebatur super aquas ergo Baptismus confert gratiam ex opere operato or againe vpon that Scripture Bibite ex hoc omnes id est saith hee omnes Apostoli or vpon that place vocauit nomen eius Enos coepit vocare nomen Domini ergo Enos fuit Monachus and infinite many more violences by him offred Your cursed epithet against Luther is full of hellish fury I doe assure my selfe that God blesseth where the Pope curseth and as sure I am blessed are they that die in the Lord and so is he for he resteth from his labours And was Luther cursed for denying some interpretations of the Fathers Did not Caietan as much In praef com in lib. Mosis in affirming that God had not tied the expositions of the Scriptures to the sēse of the Fathers And did not
LEECH To these I might adde Wickliffe against the order of begging friers where he stileth them Christ his high Counsells Likewise Luther in the 30. article of his assertions Iudicious and learned Hooker in his Church Politie and the Apologie in defence of him in the Chapter of satisfaction D. Barlow The Bishop of Rochester and elect of Lincolne in his sermon preached at Court concerning the authority of Bishops the 4. page before the ende ANSVVER It is not vnfitly said by you I might adde for never was so small a booke so stuft with additions and detractions as this is adding to divers Authors detracting from divers persons Heresie is a Bastardy it seldome knoweth the true Father that names many Fathers falsly this vrgeth many fainedly and indeed hath no lawful Father but that outlawried pervagus terrae in the first of Iob Iob. 1. Gen. 4. it selfe being vagus terrae as Cain was in the 4. of Genes For those that here you ad to your Catalogue of Authors and Authorisers First Wickliffe must be heard in his owne maner of speech Wick against begging Friers Chap. 34. Luther yet he needs no interpreter In the 34 Chapter against begging Friers these be his words Many blind fooles binden them to the high Counsells of Christ that cannot keepe the least commandement but see hypocrisie of them sith each Counsell of Christ is commandement for some time and some circumstances how binden they them to more then the commandements Not by the Counsels for they been commandements but they fainen this to draw yong children into their rotten habit and other fooles that knowen not the perfection of Christs order Now you haue heard wickliffe himselfe beleeue him and reade no reporters of his fragments Next Luther fauoureth your cause verie little In the place you cite him hee saith that there is but one Counsaile Evangelicall if you stande to him there avowing only the Counsell of Virginity you must let Poverty go begge and obedience go loose But Luther vpon better consideration doth vtterly discharge all Coūsails Luther de votis Monasticis Tom. 2. fol. 300. in his book de votis Monasticis Tom. 2. fol. 30. a. Mr Hooker is before interpreted and I hope will giue satisfaction though you quote him falsely in his Chapter of Satisfaction the place being found in the Article of superogation His Apologist is also made plaine in the same place The Bishop of Rochester now of Lincolne then the Austin of Hippo nowe the Ambrose of Millaine doth no way yeelde you suffrage in his powerfull sermon cōcerning the Antiquity Superiority of Bishops shewing out of Clemens Alexandrinus that the Apostles manured the Church with a double tillage 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 If saith hee any thinke that this maketh way to Popish traditions vnwritten verities it is no other then S. Paules distinction of praeceptum and Consilium c. His reverend wisdome most accute iudgement alleaging the word out of a vulgar translation meaneth by the name Consilium those things which S. Paul 1. Cor. 11.34 calleth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 things vnwrittē which the Apostles did or spake as the times occasioned and the holy Ghost directed further then this there is nothing in that place or sermon giving warrant to your opinion of iustifying popish monkish Counsells and how great his dislike is to any such position his learned speech at Lambeth which like a thunderbolt strooke you dumbe doth testifie to all So that all these witnesses refuse you Luther wickliffe Hooker D. Covell and this most reverend Prelat not vouchsafing your doctrine coūtenance or maintenance Mr LEECH These and many more of their ranke I might adde if I could be perswaded that the Fathers needed their sons suffrages And yet certaine I am Sonnes in this point or such like For no otherways did I meane that the sons stande in neede of their fathers testimonies Or were it not rather so that all these being men of eminent note in our Church are rather relatores antiquae fidei quà m authores novae doctrinae relators of the ancient faith of the Church to their credit and honor in that respect he it spoken rather then authors and coyners of any new doctrine And therfore passing them and for this time sparing them not to strike a haires breadth from my former groūds Leo Epist 17. 94. my maine conclusion is this maneant termini patrum intráque fines proprios se quisque contineat sufficiant limites quos sanctorum patrum providentissima decreta posuerunt let the bounds of ancient church abide and let every man keepe himselfe within due bounds limits let the meetes which the Fathers most prouident decrees haue set content vs. And the reason is excellently rendred by S. Bernard Epist 77. ad Hugonem de S. Victore viz quantò viciniores erant adventui salvatoris tantò mysterium salutis pleniùs praeceperunt the neerer the Fathers were to Christ his incarnation the more cleerely and fully received they the mysterie of salvation ANSVVER It is true the Orthodoxall Fathers need not the suffrages of their sonnes and yet Bellarmine denieth it and is so vnnaturall to the Fathers as that he maketh them to need the suffrage of the Pope Bellar. de Pōt l. 2. c. 27. § Respon istos for when hee is pressed by Nilus to follow in the question of the Primacy the opinion of the Fathers he professeth that the Pope hath no Fathers in the Church for they are all his sons So by this Gregory the great shall stand in need of Burgesies testimony Cā you endure this that Gregory whose learning holinesse eloquence c. was so eminent he that you call Patron though he never bestowed so much as opinion vpon you shall he need the testimony of Mounsieur Burghesi whom your owne confesse to be none of the best Popes and sure not of the best men But to the Fathers this I say we respect and honor them in generall and the present quotation of S. Bernard we dislike not For Patres quo saniores eo seniores quo iuniores eo ieiuniores but they being impostured as Papists professe to practise it in their Index expurgatorius that if the Fathers speak against any points now maintained by papists Ind. Expurg belg fol. 20. then the Index warneth thus Let vs excuse it or extenuat it or deny it by some devise or faine some other convenient sense whē it is opposed in disputation Our main conclusion hence is Patres quo Papis viciniores eo corruptiores Mr LEECH To these were my iudgement and opinion any Of Luther Calvin all their proper Disciples Qui non cōsentit Sāctorum Patrum expositionibus seipsum alienat ab omni sacerdo tali communione à Christi praesētia Eudoxius in Concil Chalced. I durst not otherwaies then subscribe with all humble submissiō to the censure of the Church fearing that censure of
Flavianus Bishop of Constantinople in his first Epistle to Pope Leo the first Haeretici est praecepta patrum declinare instituta eorum despicere It is the propertie of an heretique to decline the precepts of holy fathers contemning their cannons and decrees ANSVVER Your iudgement or opinion is very small seeing you take vp any thing at the second hand and from Coccius Treasury that cocks dunghil cul Pearles as you thinke them Twise before you submitted your selfe to the Church and in every page almost to the interpretatioÌ„ of the Fathers That the Church hath necessarily a stroak in the decision of Controversies we deny not but so ever that it subscrib to the truth of scriptures Next you submit to the Fathers the Fathers we reverence more then any Papists in the worlde doe neither doe I beleeue that ever any Protestant in the Christian world hath offered so much disreputation vnto the Fathers as Bellarmin himselfe hath don not only in generall De Pont. lib. 2. c. 27. § resp istas Bell. de Purg. c. 18. praeterâ—a q. ad quartum de poenitent l. 1. c. 1. § igitur Beilar de verbo Dei l. 3 c. 10. § dicens making all the Fathers but Children and novices to the Pope but in particular almost every Father is vilified by him To Damascene he giues the flatly and affirmeth that Tertullian is not to be reckoned amoÌ„g Catholiques so worse then so he speaketh of many others so ill a Patron is he of them that disesteeming any of them in any thing that crosseth his assertions he concludeth thus it is evident that the cheefest of them haue greeuously erred So that it seemeth Bellarmine is the heritique that Leo speaketh of who declineth from the precepts and coÌ„temneth the decres of holy Fathers Mr LEECH Thus much be spoken in defence of that great pillar of the latine Church S. Gregory saying Quidam non iudicantur pereunt quidam iudicantur pereunt quidam iudicantur regnant quidam non iudicantur regnant as also in defence of that sentence inferred vpon the last braunch transcendunt aliqui praecepta legis perfectiori virtute ANSVVERE It is strange in divinity not only but in common sense that first you should make your sermon theÌ„ after choose your Text it was vsuall in you if those that were best acquainted with your vnmethoded studies be not mistaken You grounded your distinction vpon that Text that without much wresting and wiredrawing would not serue you And you accommodated your distinction as vnfitly to this doctrine of Counsells as you father this doctrine vpon Gregory from whose authority you cannot produce any word of Evangelicall Counsell your defence was a very poore on you left S. Gregory to fight for himselfe for you fled Cum caeteri pugnabant maximè tu fugiebas maximè saith the Comoedy Father Anbignies defence for concealing Ravelliacks damned treason against the last French King was this Anti-Coton that God had given him a grace to forget all that he heard in confessioÌ„ It appeares you haue the like guift to mistake most that you read in the Fathers else you would never haue maintained such disiointed inferences Mr LEECH This I haue the rather done God and his holy Angels in whose presence I now stand and speak De Mysterio Mediatoris lib. 1. As hereticks as temporizers bearing me witnesse lest that imputation of Fulgentius should light vpon me viz. Fidem Ecclesiae nolle asserere est negare vno eodémque sileÌ„tio firmat errorem qui errore seu tempore possessus veritatem silendo noÌ„ astruit Dominicam gloriam qui non firmârit evacuat divinaÌ„ contumeliam qui non refutârit accumulat Miles ignavus som noleÌ„to corpore depressus regia castra oppugnantibus tradit dum competentibus vigilijs non defendit That is not to aver the Doctrine of the church is to deny the faith of the Church So are some in England So are others for with one the selfe same silence he strengthneth an error who being possessed or carried away with errour or time avoucheth not truth by his silence He that coÌ„firmeth not the glory of God weakneth it and he that confuteth not iniurie offred vnto God augmenteth it The slothfull sleepy souldiour betrayeth the Kings tents to his enimes whilst hee keepeth not true sentinell as he should ANSVVER Fulgentius speech fitteth vs as well as you your protestation we partly beleeue and yet but partly because you sinne more of negligence then of ignoraÌ„ce I would I could giue you that testimony which S. Paul did the Israelits Rom. 10.2 I beare you record that you haue the zeale of God but not according to knowledge or as another testimony of Scripture in the like case that you do onlie stray by ignorance Then would I hope that terrour of conscience should not punish your error in knowledge The Donatists loved their opinions better then their liues and you affect your owne folly more then Gods glory wherefore my exhortation to you is Returne Returne ô Shunamite Can. 6.12 if you wil not my praier and Petition for you is this Father forgiue him for he knoweth not what he doth Your marginallis false scaÌ„dal not our Church slander not our professors The Law Gospell agree in this Cursed be he that revileth the elders of his people Mr LEECH Hath any weedes of superstition growne vp with this Doctrine in the field of the Church Oh let not the pure wheate of Evangelicall Counsailes of perfection quoad viam quoad gradum fare the worse for the weedes Vnskilfull husbandmen are they and very vnfit to manure the Lord his tillage whose preposterous zeale issuing from the ground of a private groundlesse iudgement would pul vp both wheate and tares togither ANSVVER The words be otherwise in your coppy commanded by authority and by the notes against which exception was taken by the learnedst of our assemblie Vnder your owne hande This Paragraph beginneth thus Hath any weedes of SVPEREROGATION growne vp c. And dare you not nowe vse the same tearme Insteede of supererogation you put in superstitioÌ„ I grieue to think that you do receiue the wages of iniquity for maintaining as far as your poore revenews serues these two bastards of the Pope Aug. retract l. 1. c. 19. Hier. l. 1.3 contra Pelag. Theodor. in Rom. 10. Chrysost in Rom. 10. hom 17. Sed. in 10. RoÌ„ impiety absurdity The works of supererogation are of al other points of Popery most abhominable besids that none of the fathers teach so and that many of them bee expresly against theÌ„ as Austin HieroÌ„ Theodoret Chrysostome Sedulius your owne defenders Aquinas Gerson Iansenius Paludanus and Cusanus all deny this point And seeing that Scarlet whore of BabiloÌ„ druÌ„k with the blood of Gods Saints is nowe carted by heavenly iustice through all the reformed Congregations of the world I see not but every true Christian
that D. Hutton had inhibited me that D. Benefield whose bookes I was not worthy to carry had publikely confuted my doctrine c. with such like frivolous allegations ANSVVER Here to helpe your memory which wandreth as much as your iudgement you forget that vpō your bragge that all the Latine Church held with you D. Aglionbee asked you what was the Church and you receiving a blow where you had no ward were driven so farre out of the way as to affirme the last resolution of the Church to be not in primam veritatem but in the iudgement of men the absurdity of which position I haue dealt with in your Epistle The Vicechancellour seeing such presumptuous insolence ioined with ignorance herevpon remembred you how the inhibition by authority and the confutation of that controversie might haue staid your proceedings and added the due worth of the Doctor who had determined that point in his solemne Lecture Mr LEECH As for D. Hutton his inhibition I answered as before adding farther that I respected not his iudgement in this matter For I knew indeed that as his vnderstāding is not very deepe so his affection is not very good who in a certaine booke or rather statizing pamphlet concerning the crosse in baptisme defendeth this laudable Christian ceremony by tradition of the Church as it is witnessed by the holy Fathers and yet now in a point of greater importance expressed in Scripture taught by Fathers practised by the Saints defined by the whole Church he blushed not to accuse me nay S. Gregory himselfe of Popery in this doctrine But singular is my comfort to consider by what Iudge I am thus vsed in what cause and with what Patrone from whom our Nation first receiued her first faith for whose faith I must now forsake my nation ANSVVERE You leaue the answer of your neglect of D. Huttons gouernement and traduce his iudgement Inhibition is matter of authority not of learning why disobeyed you that command you answere but not to the purpose you respected not his iudgement Let not malice be iudge but cōsider how base infamous malitious your reproaches be his soūdnes of iudgment is approved sufficiently by the consent of our whole Vniversity And that booke which so scornfully you reproach is esteemed deservingly and is of reverend respect with the best Bishops of our Church Where the Fathers agreeing to Scripture are truly vrged and vnderstandingly interpreted both D. Hutton and all of our part with all willingnesse receiue their assertions But when Fathers are misvrged arrested and impostured by Coccius or Bellarmin and you receiue them at second hand not from the foūtaine but from the ditches we returne your party-coloured blended sentences as vnworthy of approbation because they be vsed as the Tyrant entertained his guest if to long for his bed to chop of if to short to racke them out The doctrine which you call a point of great importance expressed in Scripture taught by Fathers practised by the Saints and defined by the whole Church is not so founded as you presume to teach Scriptures no where expresse it Fathers teach it not the Saints of God haue not practised it the Church of Christ hath not defined it Therefore he only accused you of Popery but not Gregory For as formerly hath beene said D. Hutton and all any way seene in Gregories Moralls may perceiue how you foist into the Text the words Evangelicall Counsells Your comfort will proue your corrasiue your Iudge in this was God others were but his deputies the cause was religiō nay the very marrow pith of Religion and the opposition of many absurd hereticall positions Your Patron was not Gregory hee neither taught you this nor from him our Church received their first faith Neither for defending this were you cōstrained to leaue the Land you forsooke your Religion rather then your Nation Vegetius tells that in the Roman Armies Vegetius Non fugere was a speciall precept The way for you to Triumph had beene to recant and to remaine in your station not to fly Bosquiers speech is true Bonsq cont 7 the Devill is overcome by resisting but the flesh and the world by running away but you fled because you would run into the world Mr LEECH As for D. Benefield with his lecture his bookes I passed them over considering that M. Vicechancellour made excursions from the point loading me only with contumely and disgrace ANSVVER You passed him ouer because he doth so far overpasse you but he is in your bosome his Lecture lyeth heavy on your heart it is such a pang that you will not easily remoue The Vicechancellour loading you as you call it with disgrace knewe you had a back provided for a burthen If his speech seeme harsh to you you turned his tongue being turned your selfe Otherwise his tongue is the hearauld of encouragement and comfort himselfe the refuge of innocencie a Tutor to his Colledge and a father to the Clergy in his Accademicall governement Mr LEECH Wherefore not suffering him to divert mee from the maine issue Haeretici est praecepta Patrum declinare saith worthy Flavian in his first epist to LEO the great I desired him to deale punctually that is to say first to admit a triall by the Fathers or to deny it if he denied it he should be thereby sufficiently convinced Secondly if he admitted this triall then either to disproue my authorities or to approue my doctrine ANSVVER To deale punctually is so proper vnto all his discourses that all his Auditors will acknowledge this a speciall felicity in the power of his speech Your demands were preposterous in your Epistle you commit your selfe to the censure of the Church now to the triall of the Fathers no appeale at all to the Scriptures without which whatsoever is taught is like Israells building in Aegypt without stuffe no warrant for the matter they build with Mr LEECH But he not daring to make a briefe and punctuall answer to my reasonable demands fell extravagantly into a mention of the reformed Churches summoning me before their tribunall for the censuring of this doctrine ANSVVER Not daring Why continueth this Bracchadochian humor it hath long beene in the consumption it will at length spend it selfe What dareth not he that vndertakes without rashnes and performes without feare did ever your experience finde him to be a read shaken with the winde or to want the sinewes of courage and resolution No you knowe hee is ballaced with wisedome and worth able to vndertake the most resolute and vndauntedest of the contrary side in the worlde Neither in this was there the least note of extravancie as your exorbitancie of accusation doth impute for by whom should a minister of the reformed Churches bee censured but by the power iudgement of the reformed Churches Mr LEECH Which course of proceeding I vtterly disclaimed as vnequall because the later Church is not to iudge the former but contrarily the former
diffidence in this point All testimonies divine humane of God and of his Church did firmely establish me therein And therefore though I conferred with many learned men vpon the same yet I never demaunded of any man by way of doubt Sir What is your opinion c. but I alwaies said This is the Doctrine of all the Fathers this is the iudgement of the whole Church it is founded vpon sacred Scripture c. will you stand to it or will you disclaime it wherevpon I commonly receiued this answere the doctrine is true in it selfe though not seasonable for these times But Master D. King hauing not any such certainty of infallible grounds could not but fluctuate in the instability of his private iudgement ANSVVER VVhich two proposed coÌ„siderations be both false How can any indifferent Reader looke vpoÌ„ your lines with any other entertainement but contempt first you accuse Doctor King to want well grouÌ„ded knowledge whoÌ„ your conscience knoweth to be profound ready and resolute in all faculties in all studies in all learning was not the force of reason vsed as the meanes to coÌ„vert you when a solemne lecture was read vpoÌ„ the point was not the TeneÌ„t of our Church shewed you were not disputations many times offred you and did not the Doctors that assisted at the convention of you catechise you so farre as they founde you not able to answer what the church was what faith was what the rule and Canon was c was this violence of Authority or force of reason Violence did not appeare in authority against you never was wilde fire so quietly quenchâ—d nor open mouthed aduersary so favourably handled so movingly incited or so fully confuted Your secoÌ„dly is twin with the former only the limmes be greater Did he punish you with an evill conscience you suffred with a good Or you suffered with an evill and he censured you with a good You say you had not the least scruple of diffidence or distrust in this point Doubting in some causes is commeÌ„dable it is the meanes to sift and fanne try the wheat of truth froÌ„ the chaffe of error What mist had veiled and invelloped that eie sight that sawe not the monstrous absurdities of this point But you say all Testimonies are for you divine humane c. Your Testimonies haue beene pervsed and in them there is nothing worthie to commande affection or beliefe God and his Church I am sure certitudine fidei be against you and this I am established in that Gods law is not wanting nor imperfect craveth not the assistance and support of CouÌ„sels God vseth not second editions with supplemeÌ„ts he hath set forth no other Deuteronomy In your conference with many I beleeue you traduce many for I knowe that some that you had personall though not doctrinal fauor from do for ever disclaime any honest thought of you Were any common measure of hatred fit for a revolter I shoulde haue hoped that you would forbeare your slanders against many but your heate and hate do both conspire to make them subiect to interpretation who are most opposite to your opinion I dare pronounce it that no one of iudgemeÌ„t learning sound Religion did giue you that answere that here you deliver I haue beene bolde to enquire of your questions with some of very worthy respect and they disclaime the countenance and mainetenance of your opinion you know you were so repressed from preaching this Doctrine that while a Reverende and learned Doctor of publike respect and place in the Church and private goverment in the Vniversity remained here you durst not deliuer this but in the time of his attendance and absence in Convocation busines then you began to settle your selfe vnsettle truth Traduce none nor gull the world as if any affirmed your doctrine to be true All the learned in the world can not make sense of that which you by your written coppy deliuered where your literall meaning is often so poore that it can reach no sense and your mysticall so transcendent that no sense can reach it Truth is seasonable at all times and only enimies of truth will at any time suppresse it Falsifie no mans speech This slaunder coÌ„meth from no good spirit The well rooted resolution of the Vicechancelour anchored him his grouÌ„ds had certainty if Scripture containe it hee had truth infallibility his iudgement was not privat his certainty did not fluctuate Iude. 11. 2. Pet. 2.17 S. Iude doth attribute this to Apostats and S. Peter describeth them to be clowdes without water carried about with a tempest to whom the blacknesse of darknesse is reserved for ever Mr LEECH To returne now vnto the conference of M. Vicechancellor with the aforesaid Doctour he received a cold satisfaction vnto his hot demaund For the Doctour wondering that any difficulty should be made in this matter answered presently without any demur there are Evangelicall Counsailes and no doubt can be made thereof And what was thinke you Doctour Kings reply vnto this graue and confident assertion Did he dispute against it no he could not Did hee gainsay it no he durst not Thus the renowned pulpit-Doctor that could domineere over his poore inferiour censure him depraue him vilifie him with intolerable reproaches such as he feared not to vtter but I am ashamed to mentioÌ„ stoode mute not daring to disclose his opinioÌ„ which he could not iustifie by any waight of reason ANSVVER To returne to your most vntrue relation As before so againe I answere that the Vicechancelour did not doubt of the doctrine he manifested no haesitation he sought no satisfactioÌ„ The discourse was at dinner where neither argument was vrged nor any suffrage of iudgement required the allowance of the distinction being graunted by this reverend Deane what followeth therevpon Dare you conclude therefore that your doctrine was true The other sister and famous Vniversity hath had much experience of his rare dexterity in cleering the obscure subtilties of the Schoole and easie explication of the most perplexe discourses And not only he but others haue graunted such a distinction for distinctions bee but intentions they are signarerum non res signatae Many graunt Counsells that doe as much hate your opinion as you hate our Religion And how different froÌ„ your Tenent this learned Doctor is doth appeare in the sequele of this Chapter But first to your interrogation or rather your imaginary supposition The Vicechancelour needed not to dispute it nor meant to gainesay it For howsoever properly there bee no Evangelicall Counsells so he doth and ever did maintaine yet he never denied such a distinction repreheÌ„ding the consequents positions you grounded therevpon rather then the name of Counsels In scorne you call him the renowned Pulpit Doctor a Title generally worthily bestowed vpon him for who ever saw him without reverence or hard him without wonder Yet you heape so many obloquies vpon him that I marvell your soule doth not
your place or faculty to preach That being most true which you falsely apply of Iehu and Ioram while the fornications of Iezabell and the abominations of Babell were mainetained by you no peace to be kept with you Isay 48.22 God commandeth it There is no peace to the wicked saith God Mr LEECH Wherefore after signification of my thankful minde to his Lordship who now vouchsafed in some sort to commiserat my vniust vexations I answered that I had greater respect of the cause for which I suffered then of the punishment which I did sustaine assuring M. Barkham that restitution vnto my place was not the principall part of my desire For as God did require of me the constant iustification of his eternall truth so I coulde not but require it also at their hands who by their function as Ministers and dignity as Bishops were specially obliged therevnto ANSVVER His Grace commiserated your stubborn opposition but never iudged your iust punishment vniust vexation The respect you had of the cause was more then your respect of God truth faith peace or conscience If restitutiō to your place was not the chiefest of your desires what was Was it your desire of conquest and victory that your individual sentence should haue overswayed the iudgement definitiue resolution of so many so wise and learned Iudges It is impietie to averre that God did require the iustification of this truth by you Truth it is not to be iustified it was not by all the proceedings it is manifest that God by the mediatiō mouth of his Magistrates approveth it not The function and dignity of your iudges did yeeld you all equity though you continue your accusations and supercilious detractions against them Mr LEECH Whereas he pressed me farther with motiues of profit and that I hindered the course of my preferment by contending against the authority of Magistrates who as he said must stand one with another my reply was to this effect that I desired not to rise where truth must fall vertue is the path to Honor Heavē must not be lost for earth the plenty of riches doth not recompence the emptines of the soule a good conscience is a continuall feast ANSVVER These motiues of profit and preferment if they were vsed are subordinate to the motiue of sauing your soule These can neither repaire nor empaire those directing inciting comforts that come from aboue The contentments that the world cā afford are but weake and momentary but the ambition of preferment in heauen is the holy resolution making a true Christian firme and square You hindred your selfe in your worldly heauenly course in cōtending with religious Authority And howsoever you professe you made vertue the path to honour yet this is proued contrary for you refused the best of vertues Lombard quadruplex conscientia your religion And though a good conscience be a continuall feast yet Lombard and others distinguish of conscience that as a good conscience may be troubled so an evill conscience may bee so quieted that it thinkes it selfe good Mr LEECH As for the Magistrates I reverenced their persons and honoured their places knowing that their power is from God but designed for the preservatiō of his truth which if I impugned let them strik mee with the sworde of Iustice but if they withstood it yet I must defend it with courage Ecclus 4. as also I shall suffer for it with patience For I alwaies had the counsaile of the wise man before mine eies Striue for the Truth vnto death c. ANSVVER Had you considered duly that not only their power is from God Rom. 13.2.4 as Paul speaketh but as hee addeth hee that resisteth the power resisteth the ordinance of God and they that resist shall receiue to themselues condemnation giving the reason for hee beareth not the sworde in vaine your respect had beene more to thē if you had thus remembred the dignity from God giuen them Courage is then good when a good cause and a good conscience meet But to be couragious in defence of any adulterine proposition that hath not radicall truth it is condemned and wil be punished Acts are to be measured by desires desires by integrity And had you had God alwaies before your eies you had not been so Apocryphally wife in your owne eies Mr LEECH Which resolution in me though it sorted not with his liking nor yet perhapps was expected from a poore oppressed scholler whom his vncharitable adversaries had determined either to bowe or breake yet hee importuned me at the least to see his Lord and not to neglect his favorable inclination to doe me good ANSVVER Poore and lame and slack arguments cannot enforce resolution in the will or settle information in the vnderstanding All the connexions and all your concoxions out of Coccius had not this nutritiue power to nourish your conscience to such a strength of resolution But some other vnrevealed cause there is which only the searcher of all hearts knoweth Reprehension is not oppression nor had you any vncharitable adversaries they are adversaries to all vncharitablenesse they meant to direct straighten you not to bow much lesse to breake Some vpon whom you seemed to relie most in Oxford haue protested that they had proceeded in the same or a more strict course against you if the censure had passed their hands Mr LEECH Wherevpon I made a shew that I would shortly visit his Grace And this I did because I did probably collect that my intention was by some meanes disclosed vnto him whereby I might be defeated of that course vpon which I was now wholly resolved For me thought that God did speake within my heart as he spake sometimes vnto Abraham his seruant Goe forth of thy land Gen. 12.1 and from thy kindred and from thy fathers house and come into the land which I shall shew vnto thee For can any Church or any faith be in that land where the very grounds and principles of ancient Christianity are dissolved where there is no certaine foundation to build Religion vpon Where every mans power is his reason to make good his doctrine Where an iniury sustained for the truth can finde no redresse without treasonable connivencie to see the truth oppressed ANSVVER This was Aequivocation in speech and action neither honest but both common among Papists S. Austin condemned the Priscilianists for this and so other Fathers haue reproved this lying mummery hypocrisie Sepulueda de Ration dicēdi testimon Et de ratione dicendi occulta in praefat Azor. Ies Inst par 1. l. 11. c. 4. in fine cap. Emanuel Sa. in Aphor. And not only Scotus Aquinas Henricus Gabriell Biell are resolute against it as Sepulveda witneseth but also Iesuits themselues haue reproued it as Azorius Emanuell Sa and others You began to equivocate timely I doubt not but you haue increased it The reason of making this hypocriticall shew was lest you should be defrauded
or rather annotations considered that there are divers Fathers meerely forged as Hyppolitus Amphilochius the epistles of Cletus Anacletus c. B. Iuell D. Rainolds that world of learning the honorable B. of Winchester haue proued which point was never answered as yet Secōdly divers false tracts are fathered on the true fathers as Mr Perkins Probleme a book neuer answered the worke now in our Oxford library in hand for comparing all the Fathers with their most ancient manuscripts do shew 136. bastard Epistles already discovered in Gregory Thirdly the Fathers are reiected most scornefully by Papists where they cannot wrest them to their purpose as is proved by the practise of Canus Villa vincētius Sixtus Senensis Baronius Bellarmine Fourthly that all of these Papists haue taxed the Fathers for particular errors Fiftly omitting many more reasōs the fathers make more for vs thē for Papists nay only for vs not for Papists as that precious Iewell of the Church hath irrefragably proved The counsaile out of Lyrinensis is already answered but this I adde hee doth not there meane vnwritten verities or a supply to bee made to scripture for hee doth acknowledge in the next Chapter and so againe in the 41. that solus Canon Scripturae sufficit ad omnia Vincent Lirinens satis supérque that the Scripture is sufficient alone against all Heretickes yea alone for all things more thē this that it is more then sufficient his 41. Chapter doth plainely deliver vnam regulā to be scripture the interpretation of which is ever to bee approved by Scripture And for those notes of vniversality Antiquity and consent which you say doe inseparably concurre Vinc. c. 4. c. 5. 11. he saith not so the word inseparably is not his for Vincentius sheweth that Heretikes haue claimed the two former shewing that the Arrians had vniversality and the Donatists Antiquity And for consent he forewarneth as a Prophet in 39 Chapter that when men endeavor Maiorum volumina vitiare to corrupt the ancient Fathers as Papists most openly doe to obtaine Consent then the only remedy is sola Scripturarum authoritate convincere to convince them by the only authority of Scripture And therefore if you built your fort vpon this ground as not hauing red or not vnderstood your Author choosing some fragments and not observing all the particulars and passages of his meaning your foundation is not on the corner stone the foundation rotten the building reeling and your doctrine hath no approbation from Vniuersality Antiquity or lastly from consent either iointly from all from the greatest number of fathers or from that which is the only Countenance and Approuer of Spirits Doctrines from the Scripture That therefore which you make your first motiue to haue rended you from the truth the same I make my first confirmation to settle me therein and to detest Popery that seeing Papists admit not a trial of their religion by Scriptures that the Fathers admitte none that reiect Scriptures as also that Papists approue not alwaies the Testimony of the Fathers as they pretend I infer in particular that this doctrine of yours is worthily condemned but not the Ancient Church as also in generall that by condemning of vs in any point you cōdemne Antiquity seeing our Reformed Churches be reduced to the ancient Primitiue And therfore your New foūd Religion is Rebellion against the Truth Apostasie frō Scripture and Antiquity Mr LEECH The second Motiue The Protestants preferre their Reformed Congregations before the ancient Catholique Church AS my violent Iudges did palpably disclaime the sentence of the ancient Church so they vnreasonablie required my submission vnto their reformed Congregations which as they be not comparable with the purity of the former so their principal Doctours Luther Zwinglius men no lesse odious each vnto the other S. Austin S. Ambros S. Hierom. then both are hatefull vnto the Church of Rome are no waies matchable with the Patrones of my doctrine For as S. Gregory Nazianzen iustly excepted against the Arrians in this māner If our faith be but 30. S. Gregory Epistola 1. ad Cledō contra Arrianos yeeres old 400 yeares being passed since the incarnation of Christ then our gospell hath been preached in vaine our martyrs haue died in vaine vntill this time c. So if for a point of faith I must remit my selfe vnto Luther Zwinglius Calvin and their reformed conuenticles rather then vnto the holy Fathers ancient Church thē surely the gospell hath beene miserably taught and all our predecessors haue beene pitifully deceiued for 1600. yeares since Singular therefore was the folly and partiality of my Iudges to detract authority from our blessed Fathers to yeeld it vnto Lutherans men of as new a stāpe in these times as the Arrians were in S. Gregory Nazianzen his time whose carnal appetites and base condition of life drew them to allow that in their doctrine which they performed in their practise being contrary in both vnto the canon of scripture and continual succession of the Church The consideration whereof did manifestly detect vnto me that either their vnderstāding is very meane or their will very perverse who feared not to disauthorise the Fathers yet would not grant me the same liberty against their brethren in whom I neuer approued any thing other waies then it was consonant with the prescription of Antiquity or dissonant from hir Tradition ANSVVER THe reformed Church that hath left Babylon and is escaped as a bird out of the snare of the fowler having received true Religion 〈◊〉 according to Scripture was in all reason to haue had submission performed from you both because that the truth professed is against this position as also for that profession and subscription you had willingly afforded to her when you were supposed to be not only a member but a Minister in her Congregation Had you straied as a sheepe through simplicity it had been lamentable but to fly being a shepheard through Apostasie this is damnable Luther and Zwinglius though they agreed not in all points yet they both ioined in demolishing your Dagon Great lights of the Church haue diffred in some particulars nay haue whet their pens like rasors and edged their tongues like swords yet in the truth of God they haue agreed to the suppressing of the kingdome of Sathan The differēces between these two were nothing so scādalous as their ioint conflicts with Rome were victorious To coūtervaile your place out of Gregory Nazianzene Prudent Peristep hym 10 which you apply improperly Prudētius witnesseth the heathens did scornfully so deale with the religiō of Christianity in the beginning thereof Nunc dogma nobis Christianum nascitur post evolutos mille demū Consules so you as if after so many holy Fathers our Religion had beginning from Luther Zwinglius or Caluin But how contrary to all truth this is Bristow Motiue 45. Bristow his confession sheweth in
these words the truth is that some there haue beene in many ages Motiue 46. in some points of their opiniō in his next motiue that many points of Protestancie were long before and in divers places As also the Waldenses spoken of by many who were almost 400. yeeres since do manifest our Religion to haue beene more anciēt then so But we stand not so much vpon these as because we are certaine that from the time of Christ the profession and succession of the doctrine of Protestant religion hath with much happines continued and hath appeared in place and persons and time and Doctrine and from the beginning of the Churches declination there haue beene some ever who resisted the Church of Rome and refused their Doctrine and therefore you may conclude as you do that the Gospel hath beene miserably taught amōg thē who haue not sought after the purity of doctrin Scornefull and shamefull is that title you call vs by in the by-name of Lutherans we haue no other title but Christians And as vniust is your slander that Lutherans are men of carnall appetites and base condition whose regularity in life by integrity of conversation is farre aboue any sort of Papists And this your second consideration is my second confirmation that Papists having not true knowledge cannot haue true faith either Originally in the foundation or Doctrinally in their assertions because they want the assurance either evidentiae or inhaerentiae accounting the Scriptures subordinat and the Reformed Churches illegitimat Mr LEECH The third Motiue The Protestants brand the Catholique doctrine with the name of Popery Luther THe name of Papists was first deuised by a luxurious Apostata inventour also of the name of Sacramentaries for so both Catholiques and Zwinglians stand indebted vnto him in these respects By the insolency of this man it came to passe that as many other doctrines so particularly this had beene stamped with the imputation of Popery whence it was that my Calvinian Iudges calumniating both me and it were pleased to fasten the note of Popery vpon it and of a Papist vpon me But since my grounds are meerely Catholique as you see and since this doctrine it selfe is the common faith of ancient Church it followeth either that it is no Poperie as these mē tearme it or that Popery truely conceiued is the very Catholique faith But of the two the later is more probable Wherevpon I inferred this conclusion for my finall resolutiō that Popery was necessarily consequent vpon the true grounds of diuinity and therefore my Iudges betrayed their owne folly in this behalfe for asmuch What Pope did ever devise this and many other doctrines which are called Popepery as by a condemnation of this doctrine they must inevitably confesse that Popery well vnderstood is the doctrine of Antiquity and that the Fathers were no lesse Papists haue in then my selfe ANSVVER LVxurious Apostat you know is a scandalous title cast vpon Luther whose many volumes continuall sermons and indefatigable paines did receiue a better Testimony out of the mouthes of learned Papists as is before proved The sirname of Papists is among some of you gloried in and are you ashamed of it Seeing it commeth from the worde Papa that is the Pope to whom you all profess subiectiō as a matter necessary to salvation why should you abhorre it Indeede it is S. Hieromes rule aduersus Luciferianos If any which are said to belong to Christ wil be tearmed not of our Lord Iesus Christ but of some other Hier. advers Lucif c they are not the Church of Christ but the Synagogue of Antichrist But you reply that you do not approue and assume this name more learned and more wise Papists do Anast Cochel Palaestrit honoris 1. p. 9. 6. Cochelet is zealous in the defence of it if it bee odious to others it is glorious to him wee are Papists saith he and confesse it and glory in that name and to this purpose I coulde cite others Luther was the first Author you say of this name It were the abuse of my Reader to discourse about such impertinēcies but otherwise I could easily disproue this This doctrine was by Luther and your Calvinian Iudges called Popery It was some iniurie sure to ioine things of so dislike natures as to cal him Papist who holds popery and it had beene a great calumny to you if you had not become Papist because then you were tearmed so and now professe your selfe to bee so Is not this a good reason to make you Turnecoate to leaue the religion and Church wherein you were Baptised Or because we tearme your Catholique doctrine Poperie therefore you are so angrie you will leaue vs. But consider that Catholique Doctrine is the Doctrine of the Catholique Church and the true Catholique church by the signification of the word is the vniversal Church so called because it is over al the world is not tyed to anie Country place person or condition of men According to which sense the Romane Church cannot bee called the Catholique Church Boz sig Eccl. l. 19. c. 1. Bell. de Rom. Pont praef lib. 3. c. 21. For Bozius Bellarmine doe complaine that the Protestants doctrine possesseth many and large Provinces England Scotland Denmarke Norwey Sweden Germany Mag Gregor descrip 166. Poland Bohemia Hungaria Prussia Litvania Livonia And Maginus in his Geography saith that the Greeks lōg since departed frō the Church of Rome appointed thēselues Patriarks these provinces follow the Greeks religiō Circassia Walachia Bulgaria Moscovia Russia Mingrelia Brosina Albania Illyricum part of Tartary Servia Croatia and all the provinces living vpon the Euxine Sea And not only all these but how manifest is it that the kingdome of France and the low Countries florish in the Protestant beleefe besides many thousands in Spaine and Italy It is as easie to proue that Popery is not Catholike in time as it is plaine it is not vniversall in place for besides that Reynerius who lived three hundred yeeres agoe Refert Illyr catol. tom 2. doth acknowledge that the Waldenses which professed as wee doe were reputed to haue beene ever since the Apostles time so on the contrary it is open to all the world that the Romane Church hath receaued many new born bastardly opinions which were never before extant I knowe there was a time whē the faith of the Romans was published through out the whole world Rom. 1.8 But now the Angell hath told vs that Babylon is fallen many alterations from the state of that Church Who knoweth not howe strange the point of Supremacy was even in the time of Gregory the great how the Councells of Lateran and Trent giue the Pope so great a transcendency as that he is aboue a generall Councell that the Councell of Constance and Trent forbid the Cup to the lay people that Transubstantiation was made a matter of faith by Innocent
owne fellowes as this the advantage is small to take vp a tearme of contumely from any hot-brained railer to cast vpon the name of this Angell of his Church Your Paradoxes did not passe vnnoted both because of the rudenesse of the delivery of them the vnaptnesse of the tearmes as also your ignorance that as you would not truely preach as a Protestant so you knewe not how neatly to play the Papist All of any note noted your absurdity and insufficiencie either to shew yourselfe a friend or an enemie You aske why this distinction was so hatefull I answere the distinction so vsed as the Fathers interpreted was not denied but the cōsequēces of it as you vrged it were harmefull therefore hatefull Not because so many of our Religion be married for howsoever marriage is a most honorable state how many hundreds in our Vniversity haue consecrated themselues to God in the Ministrie that abhorre your opinion and yet be not matched or married but the cause of the contempt and loathing of the Doctrine is that it was derogatory to the law of God to the Church of God to the sonn of God a doctrine that hath bewitched many and led them Captiues into the habitation of darknesse the Cell or Hell of blindnesse a doctrine whose roote is heresie whose trunk vncommanded privacie whose branches be infidelity against truth violating the law contemning the Precept whose leaues be pertinacity hypocrisie whose fruits be idlenesse drowsinesse filthinesse This is the cause of the suppressing and choaking of this and such continuing weeds of heresie that seek growth in our Church no other cause of pleasure or profit God and his Angells be witnesses They that haue sould themselves to worke wickednes with greedinesse looking for the reward of Balaams wages are ready to resist all truth and if it fall within compasse of their itching humor willing to get a name will be the Patrons of bewitching error And therefore here I fasten my right constant determination to avoid that religion that corrupteth the knowledge with blindnesse and the heart with hardnesse Mr LEECH The ninth Motiue The Protestants doe vnconscionably impugne the knowne and manifest truth SInce the controversies of Religion are many in number and intricate in nature it was my desire from the beginning of my paines in the study of sacred Theology to finde out the true Church that so I might referre my selfe vnto her decision and rest within her bosome For which cause I wholly employed my selfe in turning ouer the volums of the ancient Fathers and whatsoever I found clearely expressed by their vniforme testimony I accepted that according to Vincentius his rule as the iudgement of the Church Among other Doctrines which seeme Popish vnto the new Evangelists I receiued this particular from their instruction so clearly taught so conformably witnessed so iointly approued that if the grounds of Religion be not vncertaine then this Doctrine is absolutely free from all exception And for proofe hereof I remit me vnto the sētences of the Fathers wherewith I thought it meete to conclude this discourse Wherefore since they that glory in the Fathers wāt neither wit nor learning for this matter doe impugne this doctrine and punish her professours how can I think that they doe not fight against their conscience and reasō And how can I thinke that any truth will finde entertainement at their hands when this truth so potent so irrefragable is thus fondly reiected by my Calvinian iudges But whome haue they condemned me a brother somtimes of their gospell a graduat of their schooles a Minister of their Church No but in me and with mee reverend Antiquity the gray headed Fathers the venerable Doctors yea holy scripture it selfe is censured by my vnworthy iudges Wherefore as Ieremiah See Apolog. Iusti Calvin pag. 11. 12. the Patriarch of Constantinople wrote vnto the Lutherans so may I testifie and proclaime vnto these men The ancient divines who were the light of the Church you intreate at your owne pleasure honouring and extolling them in wordes but reiecting them in deed endeauoring to shake them out of our hands whose holy and divine testimonies we should vse against you We see that you will never submit your selues vnto the truth Finally as the Patriarch concludeth that hee will haue no entercourse with the Lutherans forasmuch as hee is taught by S. Paul to avoid an heretike after the first or second admonition so I being persecuted by men of this condition am bound to a void them knowing as S. Paul speaketh that such as they are condemned by their owne iudgements ANSVVER THE controversies in Religion are many hence great alterations haue beene moved in Europe great changes through the world Controversies were in abundance raised by the infection of the smoake of the bottomlesse pit divers armies of Hereticks vanquished by the Reverend fathers yet al these as if but half dead are againe revived by Antichrist only this is the difference the former Heretikes were cōfuted because they opposed the fathers these later wiser in their generatiō seeke to confute all other that oppose them by the Fathers Each man among them at first asketh the way to the Church no Church can serue them but Rome that is their parish Church all other but Chappels they obserue not the alteration of many Christian nations from the sea of Rome or the occasion of this revolt the declination of that sea from the sincerity of the faith and the vnspeakeable corruption thereof Which seperatiō was made vpō these two groūds first because Rome did persecute the professors of this reformatiō with al bloody massacres secōdly because that Antichristian sea would admit no reformation of her corruptiōs but grew vncurable according to that of the Prophet We would haue cured Babilon but shee would not be healed And such hath beene the growth of this Reformation the Lords most holy name for ever be praised that the Church hath recovered more health in one age then shee had lost in two and the Romane Synagogue left infected as that it hath not only drunke the cup of all others abominations but breedeth heresies in it selfe inwardly and hath received such poysons by ambition such corruptions by want of reformation and such indelible markes of Antichrist by continuall persecution outwardly as now it is made plaine to all the world shee is not the Church But the Question of the church you aske of the fathers It is a worthy speech of Iob aske the fathers and they shall tell thee but how vnhappy is hee that perverteth all he readeth or that stomacke that turneth all into poisō that it receiveth you say you bestowed your whole time in turning over the volumes of the Fathers you did turne them indeed frō their meaning it was no more cōmēdable thē the cōtinuall praying of the Eutichae or the cōtinual reading of the Pharisies the one without care senselesse the other without knowledge fruitlesse and both superstitions