Popedome of Innocentius and we desire you fairely to produce the like euidence or els cease vniustly to pretende the succession which you can shew no right to Finally that it is the onely short and sure way to discerne trueth from falshood which is the onely thing we ought to ayme at the great Tertull. testifies and makes manifest What the Apostles preached saith he that is what Iesus Christ reuealed vnto them ought not to be tryed Praescrip c. 21. nor proued saue onely by the same Churches which the Apostles founded by preaching vnto them by word of mouth or afterwards by their Epistles Which things being so it is euident thence that all doctrine which doth conspire or agree with those Apostolicall Churches which are the Mothers matrices and sources of faith is to be esteemed true as holding without all controuersie what the Churches receiued of the Apostles the Apostles of Christ Christ of God Marrie all other doctrine ought to be preiudged of falsitie which sauours against the Truth of the Churches Apostles Christ and God c. But we Catholikes miscalled Papists communicate for the present and did communicate with the Apostolicall Church of Rome in her Pastour Alexander the VI. in the yeere 1500. as holding no doctrine contrarie to it but conspiring with it therefore our Doctrine is to be iudged true the contrarie to be preiudged false This concludes Tertullian is an EVIDENCE of Truth or accordin to Irenaeus plenissima ostensio a most full DEMONSTRATION Such a Demonstration it is which we demand of you in the hehalfe of your Protestant Church from the yeere 1500. downeward of your Church I say whether you define it as in the 39. Art The visible Church of Christ is a congregation of faithfull men Art 19. in which the pure word of God is preached and the Sacraments be duely ministred c. Or as you describe it by oppositiō to ours tearming it a Congregation of men c. which opposeth Masses vnbloudie Sacrifice adoration of the consecrated hoste worship of Angels and Saints and prayer to them Purgatorie the Supremacie the infallibilitie of the Church c. Assigne the place where this Congregation appeared giue vp the names at least of some of their chiefe Bishops or Pastours or Doctors or Elders Verifie that they preached against the Masse vnbloudie Sacrifice c. Rationall and modest men will iudge I am spareing enough in these my demands sith it is to goe no further then a Definitione ad definitum to know where this Cōgregation c. then was yea euen your owne men confesse it For will not a Fulke against Fulke say that Pastors and Doctors haue alwayes bene in the Church Heskins and Sanders p. 69 and that they haue continually from Christ to Luthers tyme resisted false doctrine will not others maintaine b Bācroft in Recognitione pag. 441. That the administration of the word and Sacraments is absolutely necessarie to saluation c Willet in his synopsis pag. 71. That the Church continues no longer then it hath these markes d Hiper in his common places l 3. p. 548. That these markes ought to be externall and visible to the end men may know where the Church is and to what societie euery one of the faithfull ought to ioyne himselfe Finally e Whitgift in Def. p. 465. that the Church of God is not to be shut vp in one kingdome c. My demand is sparing enough then I say for I might well require further according to the Ancient Fathers Rules aboue to haue it euidently proued that such a Church or Congregation had alwayes bene in all tymes and places one and the same and that too made good by continuall and vninterrupted succession that so it might appeare to haue descended from some of the Apostles and consequētly be indeed as the true Church is defined in the Nicene Creede one holy Catholike Apostolique Howbeit knowing well that neuer yet any Protestant hath returned a faire answer euen to these few demands I will presume you will find it worke enough for the present to point vs out within the tyme prefixed The place where the Congregation was assembled The names of the Preachers or Preacher at least with euidence that he preached or held the Doctrine of the thirtienyne Art or what els may be meant by the pure word of God or opposed that which is contayned in the Councell of Trent And that they or he duely administred the Sacraments and that but two onely according to Christs ordinance c. Doe not I beseech you as you sometymes did name S. Ignatius That is too prodigious a leape at once to skippe aboue 1400. yeares backwards and yet not proue your affirmation neither to which euery disputant is lyable I could with like facilitie name him too and yet you would not admitt that for good payment You will please to remember the thing I demand is that you would acquaint vs with the names of some of your Bishops or Pastours c. in the beginning of the 16. Age not in the end of the first As S. Ignatius passed too tymely for our present purpose so Bishop Tunstall and B. Gardner came too sate though you made no bones to name them too but sure you were not serious with your friends in a subiect which exacted it or els your poore answer is a plaine conuiction how desperate your cause is They haue both left learned workes behind them which will euer speake them Roman Catholikes a Tunstall pag 47. de verit Corp. Christi Ed. Parisianae 1554. The Transubstantiation and the b Idem in codem lib. pag. 93. Sacrifice of the Masse are not tenets of the Protestant Church to name no more a Et Gard. in Confutatione c. pag. 73. Nor did Bishop Tunstall sure dye a Prisoner in Lambeth in Queene Elisabeths tyme for being a Protestant b Idem in codem lib. p. 5. If this assertion then to witt that Bishop Tunstall and Bishop Gardner helped to continue the succession of the Protestant Church which came accompanied with noe countenance or apparence of Truth were tearmed impudent what wrong were done to it since it could not fall from a man as hauing any thing of satisfaction any face of reason but as a Mercurie of euery wood to stand in the light and to stoppe the course of Truth which S. Augustine might haue haply tearmed inanissimam vocem temeritatisque plenissimam l. de moribus Ecclesiae Cath. c. 29. For was it euer written euer affirmed euer called in question by any By any I doe not say by Catholikes but euen by Protestants themselues Nay doe not euen a In l. de Praesulibus Anglia in vita Tunstalli Good man and b In Elisabetha pag. 37. Camden deliuer the contrarie and put it out of all doubt Doe not flie to the Catholike Romane Church neither that were too poore a shift to begge a succession
dreadfull sacrifice which is put vpon the altar is offered Which I will demonstrate vnto you by an example for I know many doe say what doth it profit a soule departing out of this world in sinne that mention is made of him in this sacrifice for if any king should send such into banishment as offend him and after their kindred making a crowne should present it to the same king for those banished men who suffer punishment whether would he not bestow vpon them some part of the remission of their sinnes in the same manner vsing prayers for the dead though otherwise sinners we plaite not indeed a crowne but we offer God sacrificed for our sinnes that we might make him who is most mylde propitious both to our selues and them OBSERVATION Marke here an vnbloudie worship and a propitiatorie hoste ouer which memorie was made of such as departed this life before vs c. intreating that by their prayer ours might be heard In fine prayer for all in common out of a beliefe that it is a great helpe to their soules A dreadfull sacrifice put vpon the Altar and offered for our sinnes What Church but the Rom. Catholike doth still obserue this ancient custome Gregorie Nazianzene In his oration in cōmendations of his deceased brother Caesarius Anno 380. And such things they are which we offer which if small and vnanswerable to deserts yet while we doe according to our possibilitie they are acceptable to God And some to witt things or duties we haue alreadie payed and other we will pay offering anniuersarie honors and comemorations c. OBSERVATION Anniuersaries and commemorations for the dead which we in communion with the Church of Rome still obserue and none but we At least the booke of common Prayer expresseth not such practice Gregorie Nyssene In his oration That we are not to lament their death who dyed in faith Lib. de anima Resur That either being purged in this life by prayers and the studie of wisdome or expiated after death by the furnace of a purging fire c. Againe It is altogether necessarie that while that which is faultie is consumed in purging fire the soule also which is vnited with the same faultines should remayne in the fire till that bastard materiall forged and corrupt mixture be entirely abolished being consumed by fire c. OBSERVATION Expiation after death by purging fire The soule relayned in fire till what is vicious and corrupt in it be purged by fire S Chrysostome Hom 12. in Matt. Why doest thou after the death of thy friends call the poore together why doest thou beseech the priests to pray for him I am not ignorant that your replie will be to the end the deceased may attayne to repose and that he may finde his Iudge more propitious or fauourable c. Againe Hom 21. vpon the Acts. Then shall his wife with confidence pray to or petition him God putting downe the price of our Redemption for him By how much he was more subiect to sinne by so much more stood be in need of almes deeds Call the widowes and tell his name Order euery one to make supplications and prayer for him This will appease God though it be not performed by himselfe but another for his sake be the Authour of the Almes And this is a doctrine of the dinine Mercy God hath giuen vs many wayes of saluation c. Oblations prayers and almes are not made in vaine for the dead The holy Ghost disposed all these things willing that we should helpe one another Againe Oration ◠1. vpon the first to the Corinth supplications almes oblations which he mentioned immediatly before were not rashly inuented nor doe we in vaine make memorie in the diuine mysteries of the deceased and approaching we beseech the proposed lambe who tooke away the sinne of the world in their behalfe but that they might haue some consolation thereby Neither doth he who is present at the Altar while the venerable mysteries are performed crye in vaine For all those who haue reposed in our Lord and those also who celebrate their memories c. for what we doe are not stage-playes God defend but these things are done by the ordinance of the Holy Ghost Againe In his Epist to the Philipp the 3. serm moral These things were not establisbed in vaine by the Apostolicall lawes or Constitutions that a memorie should be made of those who haue departed this life in the venerable and dreadfull mysteries OBSERVATION The priest makes prayer to God for propitiation to the sinnes of the dead For their repose The price of our Redemptiō is put downe for them Vse of the name of the deceased which the Catholike Church obserues yet in the Collect of the Masse of the dead as Peter Paul c. Prayer and supplications though performed by others appease Gods wrath is a doctrine of the diuine mercy disposed by the holy Gh. An Apostolicall constitution that memorie should be made in the diuine mysteries or Masse of the soules departed Theodoret. In the 5. booke of his Ecclesiasticall historie ◠36. The Emperour Theodosius hauing placed his eyes and aspect vpon the biere wherein were the reliques of that holy man S. Chrysostome he powred out prayers for his parents and intreated that they might be pardoned the iniuries which they had done through ignorance Now his parents were deceased long before c. Againe He offered prayers to God for the deceased beseeching him to remitt In the Historie of the holy Fathers of Iames Nisibit◠what he had offended in his life tyme and that he would daigne to receiue him into the Quire of Angels OBSERVATION Prayers at or ouer the Reliques of Saints a thing neuer heard of in our English Protestant Church for the soules departed that the iniuries which they had done might be pardoned not that the number of the elect be shortly actomplished c. which onely was the custome of the English Protestants in their Forme of Buriall Basilius Seleucius In his serm of Lazarus his being raysed to life If he who dyed were a sinner and had much offended God we must not onely weepe but giue almes also offer the Sacrifice of the Altar and performe such other things as may afford some consolation to the soule departed OBSERVATION Almes giuen and the Sacrifice of the Altar offered for the soules departed This practice is not found in the Order for the buriall of the dead in the booke of Cōmon prayer but is peculiar to the Catholike Rom. Church Procopius Gazaeus vpon the sixt chapter of Isaye makes mention of a purging fire Gregorius Presbyter In Theodoro Archiman drita Where some said to him that his mother was dead thou art deceiued quoth he she is not dead but liues He powred out prayers to our Lord for her fasting for the space of a weeke that our Lord would pardon her Leontius In the life of Iohn
but rather repugnant to the word of God In fine S. Damascene Deliuers it for an vndoubted custome in the Catholike and Apostolike Church to make memorie of the Dead in the vndloudie Sacrifice But the Prot. Church of England will haue it to be a fond thing vainely inuented and the Sacrifice of the Masse ablasphemous fable a dāgerous deceipt rather repugnant to the word of God See what a goodly accord there is betweene the ancient Greeke Fathers and our new Reformers or rather behold their apparently iarring and irreconcileable discord which the smoothest witt is not able euen speciously to appease or to tune it vp to any their least aduantage Their stale and cold replies drawen from the diuersitie which they pretend to be amongst Catholikes themselues vpon this subiect gaine no credit nor are of any moment with rationall men As That they agree not about the place where Purgatorie should be Nor about the Tormentors whether Angels or Deuills Nor about the torments whether by fire or water or neither Nor about the causes of the torments of Purgatorie whether veniall sinnes onely or mortall sinnes also for which full satisfaction hath not bene made in this life Nor about the tyme which the soules tormented may remayne in Purgatorie c. Nor about their state c. For all these things swarue from the purpose as not coming home to the state of the question betwixt vs and the English Protestants which is Whether there be a Purgatorie not where the place of Purgatorie is who are the Tormenters what torments there be whether pure and true fire or some other thing equiualent c. of all which we pronounce with S. Basile Superuacua in Ecclesia sileant Let not superfluous and vnnecessarie questions be heard of in the Church especially so farre as to confound matter of Faith with matter of opinion Now these things touching the place of Purgatorie c. passe among Catholikes for matters of opinion not of Faith and are with amitie humilitie and submission disputed in our schooles but haue not yet bene defined in our Councells whence the beleife or not beleife of them are of free choyce amongst vs we being neither made of the number of the faithfull by that nor miscreants by this We are not of those presumptuous soules who thinke to haue accesse to all the diuine secrets while we know by Saint Paul that we are none of his Counsellours We are willingly persuaded by S. Basile to prayse what we haue receiued vpon the accompt of faith and what hath bene deliuered ouer in trust to vs but doe not curiously sound hidden mysteries We finally receiue of the Catholique Romane Church that there is A Purgatorie and of that we dare not doubt but where and what it is c. she hauing of that deliuered no Decree in all humilitie we dispute nor doe our doubts therin violate touch or call in question the beleife of Purgatorie that stands still vndoubted and inuiolable Since therefore all the Easterne Bishops and Fathers as we haue seene deliuer the same doctrine with one heart one mouth one faith touching purging fire c. Prayer Almes Sacrifice for the dead c. wherby great rest is procured to their soules may not I iustly admire to heare one man stand vp and affirme the cōtrarie and that with so much confidence as that he feared not to passe his word to yeald himselfe à Catholike vpon the proof of it Contra Iulianum l. 2. s. 2. and may I not with iust offence speake to him in S. Aug. words saying To what purpose doc these your words serue but to make euident to the world either how negligent you haue bene to acquaint your selfe with the words and sence of Catholike Doctors in this behalfe or hauing vsed diligence to know them with what fraude you goe about to circumuent the ignorant c. Si nesciens hoc fecisti cur non miseram respuis imperitiam si sciens cur non sacrilegam deponis audaciam si cernis cerne tandem tace Pelagianam Lutheranam linguam tot linguis Catholicis deprime tot venerandis oribus proterua ora submitte Hitherto I haue insisted vpon the productions of the Greeke Fathers authoritie onely because the challenge called thither alone though I could haue vsed a more sure and satisfactorie way the Scriptures as they are vnderstood both by the Greeke and Latine Fathers together with the practice of the whole Church of God and haue said with S. Augustine Vbisupra I conceiue that part of the world ought to suffice you in which it pleased our Lord to crowne the first of his Apostles with a most glorious Martyrdome if you would haue giuen care to Blessed Innocentius presiding ouer that Church you had forthwith freed your perilous youth from the Pelagian Lutheran snares For what could that holy man haue answered to the African Councells Anglicanis conuicijs but what the Apostolicall and Romane sea holds with the rest of the Churches c. There is no reason therefore to prouoke to the Bishops of the East because they two are Christians and that faith of both the parts of the world is one and the same because faith it selfe is Christian and certes the Westerne part brought you out the westerne Church did regenerate you c. It rest that I make the great Saint Augustine alone speake for the practice of the Latine Church and himselfe because I perceiued by a paper which M◠Cosens himselfe presented me with that he had vsed some endeauour to drawe him to his side or at least if he could preuayle no further to render his testimonie doubtfull to the end that he or others might build wood hay stubble or worse vpon that mistaken foundation which he doth most clearely in these ensuing passages S. AVGVSTIN CONF. lib. 9. cap. 12. The Sacrifice of our price is offered for her Sacrifice offered for her soule And. c. 13. booke the same Now I beseech thee heare me for the sinnes of my Mother He prayes for her sinnes Againe a little after She desired onlie that à Memorie should be made of her at thy Altar She desired to be remembred at the Altar at which she serued without intermitting any day where she knew the holie victime was dispensed wherby the hand-writing was blotted out which was contrarie to vs. To these passages some haue made answer that they doe admitt prayer for the Dead a Commemoration to be made for them at the Altar yea and Sacrifice to be offered also Howbeit not as we meane to deliuer them from their paines but for diuers other effects And that thereby we cannot enforce a Purgatorie nor did S. Augustine speake of purging fire Let the holy Father therefore answere for himselfe S. Augustine li. 2. c. 20. de Genesi against the Manichees After this life he shall haue either purging fire Purging fire or eternall punishment So farre are anie from escaping this sentence
for them either in the Sacrifices of the Altar or of praier or almes-deedes Though yet they profit not euerie one they are made for but those alone who obtaine in their life time that they may profit them De Haeresibus haer 53. The Aerians tooke their names for à certaine Aerius who being Priest was said to be troubled he could not be made Bishop and falling into the Arrians heresie added some of his owne tenets affirming that it was not lawfull to pray or offer Sacrifice for the Dead De cura pro mortuis c. 1. In the bookes of the Machabees we reade that a sacrifice was offered for the dead Howbeit though it were not at all read in the ancient Scriptures the authoritie of the vniuersall Church which is euident in point of this custome is uo small matter where the commendation of the dead hath its proper place in the prayers of the priest which are powred out to God at his Altar Here you will marke two things The first is that saint Augustine esteemed the Machabees to be Scripture since he argues for Purgatorie from it and indeed he confirmes the same both in his seconde booke of Christian Doctrine the eight Chapter and also in his 18. booke of the Cittie of God 36. Chap. in these words The bookes to witt two of the Machabees are held to be Canonicall not by the Iewes but by the Church The seconde that though there were no scripture for it yet ought the authoritie of the vniuersall Church to preuayle at it doth in many other things of greater cō sesequence Witnesse the said Saint in diuers passages which both the Catholike and Protestant doe admitt of For first Epist fundamen moued by the authoritie of the Church we beleeue the Gospell it selfe which without it we should not beleeue I would not saith he beleeue the Gospell vnlesse the authoritie of the Catholike Church did moue me to it Secondly we beleeue many things which are not in the Scripture as that the sonne is consubstantiall with the Father It is not found written in holy writt saith he and yet that it is said is defended in the assertion of faith That the Father is vnbegotten We read not in those bookes the scriptures that the Father is vnbegotten Epist 174. and yet we make good that we ought to say so in the same place That the Holy Ghost is to be adored Giue me say you he meanes Maximinus an Arrian some testimonies where the Holy Ghost is adored as though forsooth replyes saint Augustine out of these things which we reade we vnderstoode not also some things which we reade not That it was written when the Apostle saint Paul was baptised no mention being made of the rest of the Apostles It is written when the Apostle saint Paul was baptised and it is not written when the rest of the Apostles were baptised and yet we must vnderstand that they also were baptised Finally that a child which cannot yet speake is said to beleeue and may be baptised Be it farre from me to affirme that children beleeue not c. he beleeues in another who offended in another It is answered dicitur he beleeues and it is of force and he is numbred among the faithfull baptised See what a necessitie is imposed vpon all Christians to haue some other infallible ground besides Scripture to stand vpon both to make good Scripture it selfe to witt that it is the true word of God that there are so many bookes of it and no more that we haue the true sense of it c. and many other maine grounds of Christianitie which you see we dare not denye while yet we can produce no formall scripture for them Now what ground that is let the same Saint Augustine deliuer Saint Cyprian faith he doth admonish vs that we should run backe to the fountaine that is to the Apostolicall Tradition and so bring downe the chanells to our tymes It is the best way l 5. cap 26. contra Donatistas and to be done without doubt And againe it is manifest that in a thing doubtfull the authoritie of the Catholike Church confirmed by the order of Bishops succeeding one another and the consent of people Ex libro cōtra Manichaos Dist 11.6 Palam from the verie foundation of the seas of the Apostles till this present tyme is of force to faith valet ad fidem And to know which is an Apostolicall Tradition which not De Bap. con Don. l. 4. c. 24. and l. 2. c 7. and Epist 118. c. 1. the same saint Augustine leaues vs another Rule thrice ouer for fayling What the VNIVERSALL CHVRCH holds and is not yet established in Councells but is alwayes obserued is most rightly beleeued to haue bene deliuered by no other then by Apostolicall authoritie Whence he concludes that it is a most insolent madnesse to dispute whether that ought to be done which the whole Church frequents all ouer the world But the whole Church all ouer the world in the yeare 1517. frequented as all our aduersaries confesse and condemne in vs an vnblouddy sacrifice prayer almes c. for the dead that they might be freed from their sinnes c. therfore it was following saint Augustins phrase and is a most insolent madnesse to deny it In conclusion either hath the proposition and practice of the VNIVERSALL CHVRCH auhoritie to conuince the beleife of a thing not otherwise written yea or no If not It were but meete that the simpler sorte should be instructed clearely and fairely vpon what infallible warranty they beleeue these ensuing points which they meete not with in their Bible 1. That Christians haue indeed the whole reuealed word of God 2. That it is contayned in so many bookes neither more nor fewer 3. That the Epistle to the Hebrewes is a part of it how euer it was some tymes doubted of 4. That there is a certaine number of Sacraments c. as aboue out of saint Augustine BVt if you graunt me that the vniversall Church hath such an infallible authoritie and that vpon it you depend for the certaintie of the precedent articles I may say with S. Augustine you obserue by this of what importance the authoritie of the Cathol Church is but you must also answer me why Catholikes may not with equall confidence depend vpon the same authoritie in point of assurance of purgatorie I am not able to discouer a disparitie or apprehend how being held credible in the deliuerie of those she should not also be credible in this since both are equally proposed both relye vpon the same veracitie or credit Be pleased to ponder this part well and afford the world a cleare and satisfactorie answer The grounds of Christianitie seeme to me to be shaken if the Churches veracitie herein beviolated and great pittie it were that the animositie to make good our priuate opinions should betray Gods knowen truthes An erring Disputant saith saint Augustine is
pardonable in other questions which are not yet maturely digested De verbis Apost Serm. 14. nor confirmed by the full authoritie of the Church their errour is to be borne with but it must not aduance so farre as to endeauour to shake the verie foundation of the Church Of the Popes supremacie Against the Popes supremacie Mr Cosen 's vsed 4. or fiue arguments which I will put downe as they past The first Cos S. Gregorie being demanded certaine questiōs of Augustine Achb. of Canterburie answered him that he was to learne of neighbour Churches how he was to behaue himselfe seeming thereby to say in effect why doest thou aske me who haue noe such authoritie learne of the neerest Churches c. Carre To this it was answered that this obiection was nothing to the purpose because S. Augustins demaund was in matter of ceremonie not of Faith of particular obseruance of a small part of the Church not of the generall gouernment of the whole wherein the Popes supreme power is especially and properly exercised and knowne For these are the words of his third demaund Why there being but one faith are the customes of Churches so diuers And there is one custome of Masses in the Romane Church and another is obserued in the Churches of France So that it appeares euidently that saint Augustins demand to saint Gregorie was onely about the diuers customes of saying Masse the verie word will hardly now be welcome and was indeed like to that of Ianuarius to the great saint Augustine Doctor of the Church Epist 209. and saint Gregories answer againe entirely consonant to the great S. Augustines speaking of an indifferent no necessarie obseruation Le ts heare them both Saint Gregory Your brotherhood is acquainted with the custome of the Church wherein you will remember you were bred But it pleaseth me that if you haue found any thing either in the holy Romane Church that of France or in what other soeuer which may be more agreeable to Almightie God you carefully make choyce of it and powre out by speciall institution in the English Church which is as yet young in faith the choycest things which you can cull out of diuers Churches for the things ought not to be loued in respect of the places but the places by reason of good things Cull therfore what is religious pious and right out of what Church soeuer and hauing gathered them as it were into a bundle settle them as a custome in the heart of the English Saint Augustine vpon the like occasion But other things which are diuersified in diuers places and regions as is that that some fast saturday some not some dayly communicate the body and bloud of our Lord others receiue certaine dayes onely in some place no day is omitted wherein it is not offered in others on saturday and sunday onely in others againe on sunday alone or what euer may be obserued of this nature the whole kind of them haue free obseruances nor can a graue and prudent Christian obserue any better rule or discipline herein then to behaue himselfe according to the Church where he chanceth for the time to light for what is neither enioyned against faith nor good manners may be indifferently obserued and may be kept for their societie amongst whom we liue Now how out of these premises of Saint Gregorie this conclusion which was in question Ergo saint Gregorie did not acknowledge himselfe the Head of the Church can be inferred I confesse I am not able to diuine It will belong to him who made vse of it to make it appeare or els to cease with his to bragge of a victorie when the weakest may discouer he falls so farre short of all shew of a proofe and consequenly as was replyed in his presence that passage alleadged made nothing at all to the purpose pretended which was to conclude against the Popes supremacie For the rest how truly saint Gregorie did acknowledge vindicate and exercise the supreme authoritie of the Church of Rome shall be made manifestly and plentifully appeare vpon occasions of answer to Mr Doctors other obiections as they occurre Though the same might be partly obserued too euen out of his said replyes to saint Augustins questions as when he saith to the 9th quest We giue thee no authoritie ouer the Bishops of France because the Bishop of Arles receiued the Pall from ancient tymes of my predecessours whom we ought not to depriue of the authoritie receiued Againe in the same place But we committ the care of all the Brittain Bishops to thy brotherhood that the vnlearned may be taught the infirme strengthened by persuasion the peruerse corrected by authoritie Againe in the answer to the 8. quest We will haue thy Brotherhood so to order Bishops in England c. OBSERVATION Marke how he giues him authoritie ouer the Bishops of Britanie denyes him authoritie ouer the Bishops of France as hauing formerly receiued authoritie from the same sea by the gift of a pall which is practised by the Romane Church till this day finally how he expresses himselfe by Volumus we will c. all which are the words of a master and speake his power to the life at least if we make him the iudge of the Controuersie as Mr Cosens his argument will haue it Cos Againe the same saint Gregorie cryed out against Iohn Patriar of Constantinople for proudly assuming to himselfe the pompous name of vniuersall Bishop c. ergo he did not allow the supremacie of Rome Carre This was his seconde medium and I confesse it were specious enough had it neuer before bene heard of but being too obuious and euen worne thread-bare with euery ones frequent handling it is transparent to vulgar eyes and he walkes but in a nett who makes vse of it for a cloke To this my answer was that therfore saint Gregorie exclaimed against the proud and pompous title of VNIVERSALL BISHOP vhich Iohn Patriarke of Constantinople assumed to himselfe because he apprchended that thereby all the office or dignitie of Bishop was absorpt or exhausted so as none should be Bishop but himselfe Now whether this apprehension was true we labour not it is sufficiēt to shew that saint Gregorie at least made such a conceipt or feared so much Which is euident by these passages drawen out of his owne Epistles 1. l. 4. Epist 32. If therfore saith he that name of vniuersall Bishop be assumed by any to himselfe in that Church c. the vniuersall Church therfore which God forbid doth fall from its state when he falls which is called vniuersall But may that name of blasphemy be farre from the hearts of Christians wherein the honour of all priests is taken away while one doth madly arrogate it wholly to himselfe 2. And it is very hard to be patiently endured in so much as despising all Epist 34. l. 4. Indict 13. my said Brother fellow Bishop should only endeauour to be called The Bishop
3 Because if one be called an vniuersall Patriarch Epist 36. ibid. the name of Patriarch is taken from the rest 4. Least some priuate thing being giuen to one l. 4. Epist 32. all the priests might be depriued of their due honour Hence it is manifest that sainct Gregorie vnderstood Iohn the Patriarch of Constantinople so to arrogate the name of vniuersall Bishop as that he did derogate thereby frō all other Bishops that he did madly arrogate that power wholly to himselfe that with the contempt of his brethren he alone would be called Bishop that the name of Patriarch would be taken from the rest c. As though forsooth he alone were properly the only true Bishop all the rest being but as his Deputyes or Delegates Which were indeed an intolerable sacrilegious abominable attempt altogether repugnant to the sense practice of the Catholike Apostolike Roman Church which holds the least lowest of Bishops to be as absolute proper perfect in genere Episcopi as the greatest in place dignitie For the rest it is so euident that vniuersall Bishop or vniuersall Patriarch may be taken in some other tolerable though not in this pompous odious sense that none cā with any apparāce of reason deny it For reade we not in the 1. Act. of the Councell of Constantinople vnder Menas an addresse to Pope Agapetus in these words To our most holy most blessed Lord Archbishop of the Ancient Rome Oecumenicall or vniuersall Bishop Agapetus Yea doth not euen saint Gregorie himselfe often deliuer In his Epist 32 34. of his 4. book 30. of his 7. that the same Title of vniuersall Bishop was giuen to his Predecessours howeuer out of humility or feare of scandall they refused it in the Councell of Chalcedon one of those 4. Generall Councells which he professed to receiue honour as the 4. Gospells affirming in particular of that of Chalcedon that he embraced it with his whole heart obserued it with a most entire approbation and therfore could not conceiue that any thing was there attributed to the Sea Apostolike which had no good sense at all So farre must he needes be from crying against it in all senses But to loose no more time about a Title or in a question de nomine the worst of questions which I discouer not to be so important to the Catholique cause that it should stand or fall by the Presence or Absence of it Seruus Seruorum Dei being without controuersy the most Christian most vsuall with all our Popes hauing been left them by the same saint Gregorie l. 12. Ep. 32. I thus answer M Cosens his Argument in forme Saint Gregorie cryed out against the proud title of vniuersal Bishop c. In that odious sense whereby he conceiued or feared that Iohn of Constantinople so pretended to be Bishop as that he would not be content to be vnus è multis one amongst many but vnus solus the onely one vt despectis fratribus Episcopus appetas solus vocari excluding all others from that dignitie which out of his words I haue shewed to be his doubt aboue Page 123. I graunt it most willingly as he did it most worthily He cryed out against it in all senses imaginable in particular as it signifies Bishop Head of the vniuersall Church or imports the Supremacy which is the only thing now in question I deny it vndertake to conuince the said Denyall to be rationall good out of the same Saint by many euident titles omitting for breuities sake the multitude of authorities out of others which with ease I could produce THE FIRST TITLE BY WHICH Saint Gregorie makes good the Supremacie is his owne words FIRST l. 11.6.54 by his owne formall words in many places of his workes As in the 11th booke 54. Chapt. where he saith If answer be made that there was neither Metropolitane nor Patriarch one must reply that the cause ought to be heard and iudged by the Sea Apostolike which is the head of all the Churches 2. l. 7. Ep. 63. Whereas he to witt the Primate of Bizacium in Afrique saith he is subiect to the Sea Apostolique if any fault be found in a Bishop I know not what Bishop is not subiect to it Marry when faults exact it not all are equall in the way of humility 3. Hom. 21. vpon the Gospell Why God all mighty permitted him Peter whom he had appointed to be ouer all the Church to be affrayd at the word of à maide to deny himselfe 4. 5. Pauit Psalm v. 9. And the temerity of his madnesse he speakes of a certain Heretique goes so farre that he does challenge to himselfe the Roman Church the head of all the Churches 5. l. 6. Ep. 48. When I knew that Maximus was made Bishop against reason custome I dispatched away letters that he should not presume to celebrate the solemnity of Masses Which letters of mine being published in the Citty c. he caused publikely to be torne did publikely insult in contempt of the Sea Apostolike which how I endure you know who am readyer to dye then that the Church of Blessed Peter the Apostle should degenerate in my dayes 6. l. 6. Ep. 48. I earnestly beseech exhort you with the affection of a Father that euery one would suspend himselfe from an vnlawfull communion and that he would vtterly auoid such as the Sea Apostolique admitts not into the fellowship of her Communion least that he thence stand guiltie in the sight of the eternall iudge whence he might haue been saued 7. l. 4. Ep. 34. Though Gregory's sinnes saith he himselfe to Constantina Augusta be so great as to deserue to suffer such things yet the sinnes of Peter the Apostle are none that he should merit to endure them in your reigne Therfore I beseech you again again for God Allmighty's sake that as the precedent Princes your Parents sought for the fauour of saint Peter the Apostle so also you would endeauour to seeke conserue the same not permitting that his honour may in any sort be diminished with you by reason of our Sinnes who serue him vnworthily who may both now be a helper to you in all things hereafter may be able to absolue your sinnes 8. l 7. Ep. 64 Whence haue they the Grecians till this day that the subdeacons goe in Linnen-Coates tunicis but that they receiued it from their mother the Roman Church 9. Ibid. As for that which they say of the Church of Constantinople who doubts but it is subiect to the Sea Apostolique 10. l. 7 Ep 54 Peruerse men c. will not be subiect to the precepts of the Sea Apostolique they reprehend vs as it were in point of faith l. 4. Ep. 32. which they know not Lastly in his Epistle to Mauritius the Emperour being the very place which is worthy to be
and bloud of our Lord God Iesus Christ our Redeemer and be lyable to a strict punishment at the day of Doome If vpon the 4. booke 34. Chap. there he excommunicates or suspends from Masse the Bishop of Salonitane who was made without his knowledge against custome as he complaynes The Bishop of the Cittie of Salonitane was ordered without my owne or my Nuncius his knowledge wherein a thing was done which neuer happened vnder the reigne of any the preceeding Princes And concludes with a couered reflection or reprehension against the Emperours themselues And saith he if the causes of Bishops who are committed to me are carried with my most pious Lords by syding and the supportation of others what doe I vnhappie man in this Church But I giue thankes to God and impute it to myne owne sinnes that my Bishops should contemne me and flie to secular Iudges for refuge against me In conclusion fearing to trespasse vpon the patience of my gentle Reader I omitt a number of other cleare passages and appeale to euery Christian heart whether it be not euen industriously to endeauour ones owne losse to dwell vpon the words of an Authour which manifestly contayne some doubtfull and odious sense and thence force the conclusion to what our passion aymes at without going on with the same Authour to heare him out and to take along with vs what he plainely positiuely and frequently deliuers vpon the same subiect It is true sainct Gregorie cryes out against the proud title of vniuersall Bishop yet speakes he not in a limited sense and points he not particularly at what he feares in it saying Least all priests should be thereby depriued of due honour Least he should endeauour to be called Bishop alone c. as I haue intimated from himselfe aboue pag. 123. But is it not also true that he more then any such is God's prouidence preaches proclaimes practises the power of supreme Head of the vniuersall Church Tearming the Sea of Rome THE HEAD OF ALL THE CHVRCHES NOT KNOWING WHAT BISHOP IS NOT SVBIECT TO IT WHERE PETER WAS APPOINTED BY ALMIGHTY GOD TO BE OVER ALL THE CHVRCH THAT NO COMMVNION IS LAWFVLL WHICH THAT CHVRCH ADMITTS NOT. THAT IT IS THE MOTHER CHVRCH THAT THEY ARE PERVERSE MEN WHO WILL NOT BE SVBIECT TO IT Will you heare these propositions secōded and confirmed by his publique practices which suffer no glosse Is it not he who gouernes and giues lawes to Europe Afrique and Asia Doth he not order all the Bishops of England to be vnder saint Augustine Doth he not sende the Pall to Auston in France and by the fauour of his authoritie rancke it next to Lions Doth he not in Spayne depriue a Bishop ordered against the Canons of Priesthoode and all Ecclesiasticall ministerie depriuing the Bishops too who consecrated him of the body and blood of Christ c. Doth he not in Afrique command Columbus to vse canonicall rigour against Bishop Victor if Donadeus Deacon whom he Victor had degraded had right on his side Doth he not in Greece by the authoritie of Blessed Peter prince of the Apostles disannulle what the Bishop of Iustiniana Prima had done and depriue him of the holy Communion for thirtie dayes Doth he not professe openly that the cause of the Patriarch of Constantinople though the Emperour resided there was according to the Canons deuolued to the Sea of Rome and was ended by his SENTENCE If we will then heare Gregorie le ts heare him throughly If we fly to his authoritie let vs stand to his verdict Let not his word be taken where it pleases you and reiected where it displeases you for so I shall haue cause to make vse of a passage of saint Augustine against the Manichees in in Ep. Fundam and say Doe you conceiue me a foole in such a measure that without giuing any reason at all I should beleeue what you please and what you please not I should not beleeue Noe that were not to deale fairely and ingenuously If Gregorie must be our vmpire LET ROME BE TEARMED THE HEAD OF ALL THE CHVRCHES as he stiles it and exercise iurisdiction ouer all the Churches as we haue seene him practise and let not VNIVERSALL BISHOP which we cannot or will not vnderstand aright stand betwixt vs as a wall of diuision a seed-plott of irreconcileable discorde The fortunes of Greece depend not vpon it nor Christian Beatitude If it signifie head or chiefe-bishop of the VNIVERSALL CHVRCH it is but ROMES DVE if it would entayle the whole right power and dignitie of Bishop vpon Rome alone Rome reiects it as sacrilegious and blasphemous and so doe we Mr Cosens his third Mediū or argument was that appeales to Rome were prohibited in the Mileuitane and 6th Carthaginean Councell and that vnder paine of excommunication Ergo the Africans did not acknowledge the Supremacie of Rome Carre My answer was that for minor or lesser persons or minor and lesser causes appeales were prohibited I granted it That Appeales were forbidden for Maior or greater persons at least in maior or greater Causes I denyed it And consequently I denyed the Conclusion intended to witt Ergo the Africans did not acknowledge the Supremacie of Rome And the reason is because the Supremacie of Rome is discerned and exercised in greater causes as in matter of faith or the generall gouernment of the vniuersall Church For such they precisely are which Rome did alwayes challenge as properly belonging to her owne iurisdiction Heare in confirmation of this what saint Gregorie writes to the Bishop of Iustiniana prima l. 2. ep 46. If any cause of faith or crime or Money-matter be commenced against our fellow-Bishop Adrian Bishop of Thebes if it be a thing of little importance let it be iudged by our Nuncio'es Responsales who are or shall be in the Royall Cittie Constantinople but if it be a matter of weight let it be referred hither to the Sea Apostolique And such Africa neuer denyed to Rome to witt aknowledgment of iurisdiction and subiection in GREATER CAVSES but contrarily had frequent recourse to the Popes of Rome with due submission and aknowledgment Yea the verie Fathers to the nūber of 61. of the Mileuitane Councell wrote to Pope Innocētius in these tearmes Wheras God by his speciall grace hath placed thee in the Sea Apostolique and hath giuen vs thee such an one talē one so qualified or so good in our dayes that it would rather be imputed to our negligence if we should conceale from thy veneration what we iudge ought to be represented for the Churches aduantage then that we neede to apprehend that thou wouldst esteeme it importune or otherwise slight the same we beseech thee daigne to employe thy pastorall care in the great dangers of the infirme members of Christ for a new and most pernicious heresie c. Againe in the same place while we intimate these things to thy Apostolicall heart we neede not vse many words to exaggerate so great
the Councell of Nice and not otherwise being acquainted with the Councell of Sardis saue onely whith a spurious one made neere Sardis by the Arrians as S. Aug. giues testimonie and fauoured by the Donatists And on the other side being wearied out with frequent costly and disorderly appeales as in the present with that of Apiarius a simple priest for the second tyme were willing doubtlesse to haue lighted vpon some lawfull redresse in that behalfe yet marke I beseech you with what humilitie and respect to the Sea of Rome it is sought for They sue they supplicate they protest in the interim to obserue what was enjoyned them by the Popes Legates which certainly they had had no reason to doe had they apprehended no authoritie in the Pope to command We professe saith Alypius Bishop of Tagaste that we are willing to obserue what is established in the Councell of Nice In the 6. Councell of Carthage and a little after but we finde it not as our brother Faustinus brought it And therevpon he applyes himselfe to Aurelius Bishop of Carthage that the Acts of the Councell of Nice should be sent for into Greece that all ambiguitie might be remoued saith he and concludes Howbeit We professe as I said before that in the meane while we will obserue these things till the entire Coppies exemplaria concilij Niceni shall come With which the Popes Legate Faustinus was so fully satisfied that he pronounced vpoÌ„ it Nor doth your sanctitie fore-iudge or doe a preiudice to the Church of Rome c. in that our brother and fellow-Bishop Alypius daigned to say the Canons were doubtfull but onely please to write these verie things to our holy and most Blessed Pope c. To which Aurelius Archb. of Carth. replyed Besides these things which we haue promised in the Acts we must of necessitie withall most fully intimate by the letters of our Townes euery thing we treate of to our holy brother and fellow Priest Boniface Which the whole Councell seconded with Placet And we professe adds Aug. Bishop of Hippon we will obserue this sauing a more diligent inquisition about the Councell of Nice Finally the whole Councell resolues to expect the Actes of the Councell of Nice authenticated vnder the three Patriarches hands whereby say they the chapters which are contayned in the present instructions commonitorio of Faustinus c. being there found shall be strengthened by vs or not being found shall be more fully handled in a subsequent Synode collected to that effect Let now indifferent persons iudge what could euer be spoken with more submission and indifferencie and lesse entrench vpon the Popes knowen authoritie which euen by this their proceeding clearely discouers it selfe and shines as it were through this seeming miste of the Africane opposition Otherwise 1. In Ep ad Celâ—st Gone Afric c. 15. Why is a Councell expressely called in obedience to Pope Celestine 2. And why doth the same Pope giue this honorable testimonie of S. Aug. who was one of the cheife supposed Antiappellants that for his life and merits they alwayes had him in their communion and that he was neuer touhed with so much as a rumour of any sinister suspition 3. Why did the same S. August in cause of an Appeale made by Bishop Anthonie of Fussal to Pope Celestine haue free recourse to him as to caompetent Iudge instructing and commending the cause vnto him acknowledging that some for certaine faults the verie Sea Apostolike as he saith ep 261. iudging or confirming the iudgements or sentences of others were neither depriued of Episcopall dignitie nor yet left altogether vnpunished desiring him to command all the things directed to him to wit the Processe to be read before c. It was neither for want of witt vertue nor learning sure for in that qualitie what Pope might not rather haue had recourse to him 4. Why is Faustinus admitted into their Councell and permitted to propose the Popes pleasure which they promise to obserue till farther inquirie be made in a matter ministring iust cause of doubt 5. Why is Apiarius a turbulent and wicked priest in vertue of the Popes release by prouision as it is called and by his order admitted to a second hearing in Afrike after he had bene twice cast out by the votes of the Bishops there 6. Why doth Faustinus himselfe pronounce in the full assembly that by this their proceeding no preiudice was done to the Sea of Rome 7. Why did Aurelius esteeme it a point of necessitie to impart all the particulars of their treatie to Pope Boniface 8. Finally why is it concluded by the vnanimous consent of the whole Councell that if the things which Faustinus had in his instructions be found in the Actes of Nice they will confirme it If not they doe not say they will forthwith cast of obedience to the Church of Rome they will call another Councell and treate the busines more fully But I will yet goe on and say Fourthly put case I would giue what can neuer be proued nay what is contrarie to the knowen truth of the Fact That the Africans opposition had bene against the right of Appeales to Rome not against the maÌ„ner onely and that in maior persons and causes too in a word that what they proposed onely had bene decreed also and that conciliariter too yet how would this conclusion be made good by Mr. C. Ergo the Pope of Rome is not supreame head of the Church Certainely in a Protestant sense it could not sith they affirme that euen Generall Councells c. both may erre and haue somtymes erred in the 21. article of the 39. Ergo a fortiori this of Africa which was but a Prouinciall Councell may haue erred and consequently one should be conuinced of rashnes to conclude any thing out of it especially in matter of faith till mens consciences were assured that though it might yet indeede it did not erre here in which how it should he made good I am not wise enough to guesse Nor yet can it be made an argument ad hominem and conclude against a Catholike for he doth not place the infallibilitie of the Church in the decree of a prouinciall but in the Definition of a Generall Councell Ergo nothing followes hence neither Ergo to be short I will conclude this part with these fewe testimonies of the African Fathers as well before as after this 6. Councell of Carth. in point of the Popes Supremacie omitting a number of most pregnant places out of other Fathers partly for breuities sake and pratly because the Africans are most concerned herein Tertull. l. de Pudicitia c. 1. n. 5. He styles the Pope of Rome the High priest and Bishop of Bishops and tearmes the Church of Rome In Praesc â— 36. n. 212. Happie Church to whom the Apostles powred out all their doctrine together with their bloud S. Cyprian The Primacie or chiefe place rule and authoritie In l de vnitate
Ecclesiae the word Primatus being so Englished by the best Grammarians is giuen to Peter c. They dare sayle to the Chaire of Peter and to the Principall or chiefe Church Epis 55. ad Cornelium Papam And writing to Stephen Pope of Rome he saith Let thy letters be dispatched into the Prouince of Arles and to the people there residing whereby Marciane who being Bishop of Arles fauoured the Nouatian heresie being excommunicated another may be substituted in his place and the flocke of Christ may be gathered together which to this day is contemned being dispersed and wounded by him Optatus Mileuitanus A Bishops chaire was first conferred vpon Peter in the Cittie of Rome In l. 2. cont Parmenianum wherein the HEAD of all the Apostles Peter sate c. Victor Vticensis And especially the Romane Church which is the HEAD of all the Churches In l. 2. de Persec Van. S. Augustine l. 2. de Bap. contra Donat. Peter the Apostle in whom the Primacie of the Apostles had the preeminencie with so exceellent a grace or aduantage Againe Like as all the causes of Mastership were in our Sauiour In quaest Noui Test q. 75. so after our Sauiour they are all conteyned in Peter for he constituted him to be the HEAD of them the Apostles that he might be the Pastor of our Lords flocke Eugenius who was one of Aurelius his Successours in the Archbishopricke of Carthage The Roman Church is the HEAD of all the Churches Fulgentius de Incarn Gratia c. 11. That which the Roman Church which is the HEAD or toppe of the world holds and teaches and which the whole Christian world together with it both beleeues without hesitation to Iustice and doubts not to confesse to faluation I conclude then that since it is most euident that the Africans were for vs Catholikes both in their words and practices as well before and in the fore said Councells as after the same it is altogether in vaine for the Protestants thence to hope for any helpe or support to their Cause Now Mr. C. hauing returned you a faire full and satisfactorie answer to each of your obiectioÌ„s permit me the fauour of one of your setled answers to that one onely demand which I then made and often iterated and still iterate as being the verie summe and abridgement of all controuersies to witt where was your Church in the yeare 1500. c. till the yeare 1517. when Luther began to storme This is the rule I haue bene taught by the ancient Fathers First by Irenaeus who had the happinesse to haue seene Policarpe S Iohns scholler We saith he can number those who were instituted Bishops in the Churches by the Apostles and their successâ—urs euen vnto vs who taught or knew noe such thing as these doe madly fancie to themselues And a little after But whereas it is too long to nuÌ„ber the successions of all the Churches in such a volume as this we coÌ„found all those who by any meanes gather more then they ought either by their wicked self-complacencie or vaine glorie or els by their owne blindnes and erroneous sense by pointing out that tradition which that greatest most ancient and most knowne Church to all men founded and established at Rome by the two most glorious Apostles Peter and Paul and by faith announced to men brought downe euen vnto vs by the successions of Bishops for vnto this Church by reason of its more powerfull principalitie euery Church ought to resort that is all the faithfull all ouer the world wherein that TraditioÌ„ which is from the Apostles is conserued by those which are all ouer vndique And so names the Popes from Linus who succeeded S. Peter c. till Eleutherius who was in his tyme of whome he saith Now Eleutherius in the twelueth place hath the Bishopricke from the Apostles and he adds By this ordination and succession the TRADITION which is in the Church from the Apostles and the proclamation of Truth is brought downe vnto vs And this is a most absolute demonstration plenissima ostensio that it is conserued in the Church from the Apostles till this day and is deliuered ouer in truth Behold the succession of Bishops is esteemed by him and deliuered vnto vs for a certaine demonstration that those who haue it on their side haue the same liuely faith conserued euen from the Apostles tyme till this day Secondly by the learned Tertullian in the same age saying In Praescri p. c. 32. Let them produce the origin's of their Churches let them declare the row or processe of their Bishops so running downe from the beginning by successioÌ„s that that first Bishop may haue had some one of the Apostles or Apostolicall men which yet perseuered with the Apostles for his Authour and Predecessour Let the Heretikes saith he a little after euen forge any such thing if they can And he counts Peter Linus Cletus Clemens Anacetus Auarestus Alexander Sixtus c. Thirdly Optatus Mileuitanus In 4 Tom. carm contra Marcion saying In that singular vnica Chaire Peter first sate to whom Linus did succeede c. to Iulius Liberius to Liberius Damasus to Damasus Siricius at this day who is our fellow with whom or in whom all the world agrees with vs in one societie of Communion by the commerce of letters formed to witt a kind of circular or communicatorie letters vsed in those tymes to discouer them to be of the same coÌ„manion Produce the origine of your chaire you who will needs challenge the Holy Church to your selues Fourthly S. Augustine In his Ep. 165. thus If the order or processe of Bishops who succeede one another be considerable how much more certainly and indeed sauingly doe we count from Peter himselfe c. For Linus succeeded Peter c. and so counting downe to Anastasius who then was Pope he coÌ„cludes in these words in this ranke or lyne of succession no Donatist Protestant Bishop is found c. Now to know of what consideration and weight the succession is with the same S. Augustine le ts take it from himselfe in his Ep. Fundamenti cap 4. where he professeth that the succession of priests from the verie Sea of Peter the Apostle till this present Bishop-pricke most iustly retaynes him in the bosome of the Catholike Church That this is a reasonable demand in it selfe I am most confident because Fathers so learned and able prouoked to it in their tymes with so much confidence and taught others to doe the same It is necessarie saith Tertullian Praescrip c. 20. that euery familie should be brought backe and reduced to its origine And that it is reasonable in particular from vs it seemes no lesse euident because what we demand we are readie to exhibite to discerne whether you or we are true successours to S. Peter we name our men immediatly from him who haue succeeded one another till this day till this present
of her against whose Idolatrie you dayly crye out Nor is it that Church we enquire after we know that that Cittie placed vpon a hill neuer lay hidd that Tabernacle seated in the sunne was alwayes illustrious constant permanent we can bring in reum confitentem vpon that subiect we haue conuictions from our Aduersaries owne mouthes c The surueyer of the pretended discipline 6.8 Priests of all sorts together with the people frō the topp to the toe were drowned in the puddles or dregges of poperie saith one Euen 1260. yeares the Pope and his Clergie possessed the outward and visible Church of Christians raygning without any debatable contradiction saith another d Luther de Capt. Bab. de Bap. The Popes tyrānie for many ages hath extinguished Faith c. saith a third This Idolatrous Romane Harlot then this chaire of pestilence this whore of Babylon for thus yours please to qualifie the Spouse of Christ his wholly faire in whom there is found no spott or blemish was easily found by such as euen sought her not she liued she raigned soueraignely too without contradiction entirely without limitation or reserue ouer priest and people perseuerantly euen for the space of 1260. yeares But we desire Remember I pray to haue the obligation to be ledd to the Protestants Church within the tyme prefixed to heare their sermons to see the administration of their two Sacraments onely let this be shewen and we are readie to communicate with them vnder what kinde or kinds they please But if as it indeed neuer was so it be impossible it should be proued nay if the same be publikely professed by your owne Authours saying In the ages past there was no face of a true Church for some ages the pure preaching of the word vanished e Inst l. 4. c. 1. § 11. so Caluin From 400. yeares and more the Religion of Christ was wholly turned into Idolatrie adds f in his Acts pag. 767. Fox The Church was at that tyme inuisible and could not be shewen confesseth Regius g lib. Apol. pag. 176. The Truth was then vnknowne and vnheard of when Martin Luther c. openly pronounceth h In Apo. p. 4. c. 4. Diuis 2. I uell We say that for many ages before Luthers tyme a generall Apostasie ouerspred the face of the earth nor was our Church in that tyme conspicuous or visible to the world concludes i In exposit symb p. 400. Perkins permitt me to aske by what iniquitie are poore soules fedd or rather starued with falsitie and to conclude with that strongly reasoning Tertullian in the person of the Catholike Church saying who are you when and whence came you what doe you doe in my possession being none of myne By what right dost thou ô Marcion ô Protestant cutt downe my wood By what prerogatiue dost thou ô Valentine diuerte my fountaines By what authoritie dost thou ô Apelles transport my bounds THIS POSSESSION IS MYNE why presume you being strangers to feede and sowe herein at your pleasure THE POSSESSION IS MYNE I POSSESSE IT OF OLD I POSSESSE IT FIRST I HAVE SVRE RECORDS OR EVIDENCES FROM THE OWNERS TO WHOM THE THINGS BELONG I AM THE HEIRE OF THE APOSTLES And this by best right may the Catholike Romane Church affirme because she alone is able by her neuer interrupted succession of her Bishops to deriue her pedigree from the same Apostles Counting confidently without fearing to be contradicted by any though her verie enemyes In the first Age. Petrus Linus Cletus Clemens The 2 Age. Anacletus Euaristus Alexander sixtus I. Ye'esphorus Hyginus Pius Anicetus Soter Ileutherius Victor The 3. Age. Zephyrinus Calistus Vrbanus Pontianus Anterus Fabianus Cornelius Lucius Stephanus Sixtus II. Dionysius Felix Eutychianus Caius Marcellinus The 4. Age. Marcellus Eusebius Miltiades Syluester Marcus Iulius Liberius Felix II. Damasus Siricius Anastasins The 5. Age Innocentius I. Zozymus Bonifacius Celestinus I. Sixtus III. Leo magnus Hilarius Simplicius Felix III. Celasius I. Anastafius II. Symmachus The 6. Age. Hormisdas Ioan. I. Felix IV. Bonifacius II. Ioannes II. Agapitus Syluer us Vigilius Pelagius Ioanues III. Benedictus I. Pelagius II. Gregorius magnus The 7. Age. Sabinianus Bonifacius III. Bonifacius IV. Deusdedit Bonifacius V. Honorius I. Seuerinus Ioan. IV. Theodorus Martinus I. Eugenius Vitatianus Adeodatus Donatus Agatho Leo Benedictus II. Ioan. V. Conon Sergius The 8. Age. Ioannes VI. Ioannes VII Sisinnius Constantinus Gregorius II. Gregorius III. Zacharias Stephanus II. Stephanus III. Paulus I. Stephanus IV. Adrianus Leo III. The 9. Age. Steph. V. paschalis Eugenius II. Valentinus Gregorius IV. Sergius II. Leo IV. Benedictus III. Nicol. I. Hadrian II. Ioan. VIII Martinus Hadrianus III. Stephanus VI. Formosus Bonifacius VI. Stephanus VII The 10. Age. Ioan IX Benedict Leo Christoph Sergius Anast Lando Ioan X Leo VI. Stephanus Ioannes Leo VII Stephanus Martinus Agapitus Ioannes Leo Benedictus Ioannes Donus Benedictus Benedictus Ioannes Ioannes Ioannes Gregorius V. Syluester II. The 11. Age. Ioannes XVII Ioannes XVIII Sergius V. Benedictus VIII Ioannes XX. Benedictus IX Gregorius VII Clem. Damas Leo Vict. Steph. IX Nicol. Alexand. Greg VII Vict. Vrban Paschas The 12. Age. Gelas Calixtus Honorius II. Innocentius II. Gelestinus II. Lucius Eugenius Anastasius IV. Hadrlanus Alexand. Lucius Vrbanus Gregorius VIII Clemens III. Celestinus III. Innocentius III. The 13. Age. Honorius III. Gregorius IX Celestinus IV. Innocentius IV. Alexander IV. Vrbanus IV. Clemens Gregorius Innocent Hadrian Nicol. Martinus Honorius IV. Nicol. Celestinus Bonifacius VIII The 14. Age. Benedictus X Clemens V. Ioannes XXI Benedictus XI Clemens VI. Innocentius VI. Vrbanus V. Gregorius XI Vrbanus VI. Bonifacius IX The 15. Age. Innocentius VII Gregorius XI Alexander V. Ioannes XXII Martinus III. Eugenius IV. Nicolaus V. Cailistus III. Pius II. Paulus II. Sixtus Innocēt VII Alexander VI. The 16. Age. Pius III. Iulius Leo Hadrianus Clemens Paulus Iulius Marcellus Paulus IV. Pius IV. Pius V. Gregorius XIII Sixtus V. Vrban VII Gregorius XIV Innocentius IX Clemens VIII The 17. Age. Leo XI Paulus V. Gregorius XV. Vrbanus VIII Innocentius X. Thus did S. Irenaeus bring downe the successiō of the Church by naming the Bishops of Rome who immediatly succeeded one another from S. Peter to his tyme. And he iudges it a most ABSOLVTE DEMONSRATION Thus did Tertullian c. And he puts it downe for an EVIDENCE of TRVTH Thus did Optatus c. And he concludes that in Pope Siricius who then sate all the world agreed with them Africans in one Communion Thus did S. Augustine c. And he cōfesses it retaynes him in the bosome of the CATHOLIKE CHVRCH Thus finally doe we Catholikes to this day And we instantly demand 1. Why the like proceeding should not be held an absolute Demonstration an Euidence of Truth as well from vs as from them 2. Why we English Catholikes may not by as good right be said to agree with all the world in one Communion in Pope INNOCENTIVS who sitts