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faith_n	church_n	doctrine_n	err_v	4,912	5	9.7791	5	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A15134	An examination of M. Doctor VVhytgiftes censures, contained in tvvo tables, sett before his booke, entituled The defence of the aunswer to the admonition, &c.; Examination of M. Doctor Whytgiftes censures, contained in two tables, sett before his booke, entituled The defence of the aunswer to the admonition, &c.	Fulke, William, 1538-1589, attributed name.	1575 (1575)	STC 25433; ESTC S119896	42,859	56

Centurye that there were Archbyshopes in S. Ambrose his tyme and shewe also howe muche they dyffered from the Archbyshopes that followed in the Popishe tymes yet in some other place they might alleadge the auctoritie of Ambrose out of his booke de dignitate sacerdotali to proue that in his tyme the degree of an Archbyshope was not distinct from the degree of a Byshope in dignitie but onlye for order sake because he there deuideth the Clergye into no more degrees then these three Byshopes Elders and Deacons 24 He sayeth that Ierome and Augustine speaketh of Archdeacons in those places where they only speake of Deacons pag 346. 24 Vndoubtedlie Ierome speaketh of an Archdeacon in the place quoted by T. C that is in his Epistle to ●uagrius Wher fyrst he fyndeth greate faulte that any Deacon should be preferred befor the Elders or Priests which by the Scriptures he proueth to be equale to the Byshopes and afterward sheweth howe the Byshope came to be preferred namlye by consent of the reste of the Elders for auoydinge contention as yf the Armye chuse a Capitayne or the Deacons chuse one amonge them selues whom they knowe to be a diligent man and call hym Archdeacon So that by Ieroms iudgment the Archdeacon was preferred aboue the Deacons but not thereby pre●erred before Elders So the falsifycation of Ierome is not to be aduouched The lyke maye be sayde of Augustine for seinge the Archdeacon in those tymes was but the cheife Deacon and so but a Deacon whatsoeuer was spoken against the presumptions of the inferior deacons ouer the Elders maye be also sayde of the Archdeacons or cheife deacons I thinke master Whytgifte howsoeuer he woulde seme to walke vnder a cloude in this matter yet he will not saye for shame that the Archdeacons in sainte Ieroms and sainte Augustines dayes had auctoritie ouer the Elders and mynisters as they haue nowe whiche is the thinge in question and whiche T.C. denyeth 25 The words of Socrates are falsefyed pag 350. 25 The wordes of Socrates be not falsefyed for they be not alledged nor translated but his meaninge is faythfully and truely rendered that the Byshops of Rome and Alexandria leauinge the sacred function were degenerated into a seculer rule or dominion which master doctor translateth that they were passed the limites of priesthode to an outward dominion What difference is here in the sene If T. C. take ●pon hym to translate out of Greeke into Latine or Englyshe by all lykelyhod he well do it as well as master doctor can doe It is happy he can not saye but that the sence is all one thoughe the wordes be not the same And yet there is no great difference betwene passing and degeneratinge the limites of priesthode and the holy ●unction seculer dominion and outward dominion 26 He vntruely reporteth the words of Cypriane pag 257. 26 He reporteth no wordes of Cypriane but onlye affyrmeth a truthe out of Cypriane that 90 byshopes of one prouince condemned Priuatus an hereticke master doctor quareleth at the name of prouince wherbye T. C. meaneth that t●ac● of the countrye whiche was neare about the Cittie where these byshops dyd meete For yf the diocesses had been so large as commonlie the diocesses of byshopes are nowe so manye coulde not so often meete in councell as it is manifest in deede by that epistle of Cyprian ▪ with master doctor citeth lib 1. Epist 3. and manye other that 40.39.66 byshopes mette in councell commonly euerye yeare and peraduenture more then one in the yeare whiche coulde not be yf they had dwelled so farre a sounder as byshopes do nowe As for that he alledgeth out of Masseus of the patriarche of Antioche to proue the lardgnes of one prouince is to little purpose for there were but fower Patriarches in the worlde vnder the byshope of Rome as appeareth in the councell of Laterane therefore euery one of them muste haue a great manye prouinces vnder hym Besids that he expresseth not what tyme ther wer so manye byshops subiect ▪ to hym sauing that he semeth to saye that they are nowe and T C. speaketh of Cyprians tymes thirten hundreth yeare agoe 27 He falsefye●h the meaninge of Tertullian alludinge that to ceremonies that Tertullian meanethe of faythe and of saluation pag. 370. 27 I neuer knewe a man of suche learninge so farre to ouershoote hym self as master Whytgifte dothe in this place For he alledgeth a woorke of Tertulliane to proue that his rule as to be vnderstande onlye of matters of faythe and not of ceremonies or matters of discipline where he speaketh onlye and manifestlye of a ceremonie and a matter of discipline namelye the coueringe of Virgins in the congregation accordinge to the doctrine of sainte Paule For whereas the contrarie custome was crept into the Churche of Carthage that Virgins came barre headded into the congregation and had longe continued he declareth that Christ and the truthe is moste auncient and before all customes and therefore that to be followed whiche was fyrste in this matter And whereas master doctor woulde gather a difference out of Tertulliane of matter of fayth and matter of discipline he is muche deceiued For Tertulliane wrytinge of them that helde one true sayth whiche is immutable and erred in this matter of discipline sheweth that althoughe they retayned the rules of fayth vnchaungeable yet discipline also ▪ yf it were corrupted by euill custome muste be reformed accordinge to the worde of god And this is the true meaning of his words which are alledged by master Wgytgifte this lawe of fayth remaining other things of discipline and conuersation admitt newnes of correction the grace of God woorkinge and goinge forwarde euen to the ende He sayeth not that they maye be chaunged newely euery daye but t●at they maye be newely corrected yf they be growen into abuse and reformed accordinge to the Scriptures Now lett master doctor take h●de that he falsefyeth not the meaninge of Tertullian whiche interpreteth his meaninge cleane contrarie to the scope of his whole booke 28 He kepeth backe the woords of Theodoret that explane his meaninge pag 412. 28 The wordes here spoken of in the Censure are afterward in the probation pag 413. sayed to be one woorde Tavten This Well put Tavten to that whiche T. C. sayeth and what is the matter mended Theodoret sayeth that Chrysostom had the same care of the churche of Thracia Asya and Pontus that he had of the churche of Constantinople erge he had the same rule and auctoritie What lodgike is this But Theodoret sayeth in plaine woordes he gouerned the Churches in Pontus with those lawes M. D confesseth the Greeke to be katekosmei tois nomois that is he garnished or bewtefyed with lawes But dothe he falsefye Theodoret because he leaueth out Tavtois there Suerlye there is asmuche subtiltie in leauinge out the other and greater preiudice in translatinge katekosmei he gouerned then in ●matting Tavtois these Yet you will saye yt can not be auoyded but that he had

indifferencye Secondly he addeth yf men would labour to purge yt of the abuses whiche ought to be according to the worde of God nowe what letteth the puritie But ether the worde of God teacheth not howe to purge the Churche perfectlie or ells that men can not followe the rules prescribed by the woorde of God throughlie Yf you grante imperfection in the worde all men knowe whereof that smellethe yf ther wante ability in men then the rules were not rightly framed for man yt will be aunswered that the lyke is obiected of the lawe by the Pelagians and Papists yf no man can kepe the lawe then the lawe was geuen in vayne but this obiection is soone auoyded For the lawe and these rules are not ryghtly compared because they differ in the ende for whiche they were giuen The lawe was not geuen that men shoulde fullfill yt but to shewe them ther synne These rules were giuen because God woulde haue his Churche in the outward pollicye to be well gouerned But M D will haue an example of this purytie what thinketh he of the Churches planted by the Apostells so longe as they contynewed in such order as the Apostells established in them were they not pure and vnspotted as touchinge the generall gouernement and outward pollycie of them were the Apostells also ignoraunt or vnable or vnwillinge to bringe this thinge to passe as for the spottes in the Churche of the Corinthians and Galathians 〈…〉 were not lefte by th'Apostell when he 〈…〉 but cast in by fals Apostells that came after 〈…〉 they were th● f●ultes of the men not the imperfection of the orders whiche if they hadde been ryghtly obserued he neded not to haue written to the one for excommunication of the adulterer nor to the other for confutinge of ther heresye wherefore by thes examples maye be inferred that althoughe the order of gouernement and outward pollycie be neuer so pure and perfecte yet yf men be negligent to obserue yt greate enormities maye growe in the Churche But that there can be no perfecte order for the right gouernement of Christe his Churche requireth some other facultye then Logike to frame a good argument of thes examples Finally men muse why this opinion shoulde be compted so daungerous in T. C whiche is so stoutly defended by the accuser him self in bothe his bookes For yf ther can be no Churche pure and vnspotted in the whole gouernement and outwarde pollycie why dothe he so boldly defende the Churche of England as he pretendethe in her gouernement and outwarde pollicie that he will acknowledge no spo●te nor blemishe thereof but ether he defendethe yt as bewtyfull or ells remouethe yt as beinge in the men and not in the order of gouernement 3 He affyrmeth that many thinges are bothe commaunded and forbidden of whiche there is no expresse mention in the worde whiche are as necessarie to be followed or auoyded as th●s whereof expresse mention is made whiche soundethe to the confirmation of the very foundation of all papistrie pag 77. 3 The third daungerous poyncte of doctryne in M. Whytgifte eares soundethe to the confyrmation of Poperye ▪ but this his Censure in other mens iudgement soundethe more malicyously then godly or learnedlye for yt is well knowen howe farre T C is fledde from all Papistrie And his meaninge in those wordes is euident to any man that is disposed to vnderstande him That many thinges are commaunded and forbidden in the worde of God by generall preceptes whiche are not expressed particularly in there speciall names and kindes Why shoulde this be noted in the margent for a Papisticall assertion but afterwarde it is term●d most ciuily an vnaduised assertion because M Whytgyfte counteth expressed as yt pleaseth him which he maye well doe wh●n he interpreteth his owne wordes but who made him a dictator to determine the sence of other mens wordes Euery man is best interpreter of his owne wordes ▪ 〈…〉 fallw hen a man is accused for speakinge 〈…〉 he shall not be admitted to expounde his 〈…〉 yet by lawe his aduersary shall not be his expounder but vir bonus a good and indifferēt man Yf lawyers be sumwhat captious they are to be born withall when doctors of diuinitie permitt vnto them selues suche lybertie of wranglinge ▪ 4 He holdethe that the doctrine of free will is not repugnaun● to saluation and yet is yt a doctryne cleane contrary to f●●e 〈◊〉 by Christe pag 82. 4 In the thre former Censures thoughe vncharitably yet in this behalf he hathe dealt more vprightlye in that he hath sett downe neere the very woordes of T. C but in the fourth Censure he hath sett downe nether his woordes nor his meaninge for his woordes be these And yf you meane by matters of faythe and necessary to saluation those without the whiche a 〈◊〉 can not be saued then the doctryne that teacheth there is no free will or prayer for the deade is not within your compasse For I doubt not but diuers of the fathers of the greeke Churche whiche were great patrons of free will are saued holdi●ge the foundation of the faythe whiche is Christe T C dothe not holde that the doctryne of free will is not repugnant to saluation but only obiecteth against that whiche he supposeth to be M. D meaninge by matters of faythe and necessary to saluation for he him self so meanethe by matters of faythe and necessary to saluation as he countethe the doctryne that teacheth there is no free will or prayer for the deade to be within the compasse but yet he is perswaded you will saye that many patrons of fre will are saued M D is of the same mynde neuerthelesse he saythe that he that dyeth in the opinion of free will holdeth not the foundation by whiche woordes yt semethe he hath had no great conferens with the free will men of our tyme and that he imagineth that those fathers of the greeke Church dyed not in the opinion of free will. But who is able to affyrme that I doubt not but they repented before they dyed and desyred pardon of all there errours and ignoraunces as of all there secret and vnknowen synnes but yet it is most like they dyed in this opinion that they thought free will to be no errour A Christian man must desire forgiuens of those synnes which he hathe committed not knowinge they were synnes and lykewyse of those errors whiche he holdethe not knowing them to be errors wherefore they dyed not without repentaunce althoughe they dyd not reuoke that particuler errour 5 He sayeth that all the commaundements of 〈…〉 Apostells are needfull for our saluation whiche is a 〈◊〉 error pag 103. 5 The fyfte poincte is defyned to be a notorious error and in pag 103. it is quoted for a grosse error and in the text T C is sayd grosslye to haue erred in affyrminge that all the commaundements of God and the Apostells are needfull for our saluation with good store of the like Rethorike but what need all this

a palpable error pag. 532. and pag. 604. he affyrmeth directlye to the contrarie 12 The twelueth is calleth a palpable error but yf I maye saye as I thinke the Censure is a palpable cauill for T. C. hath thes very wordes ●her ●he speakethe of this matter able inoughe to expresse his meaninge I speake of those whiche are of the Churche and of discrescion to examine them selues M.D woulde make hym contrary to hym self because he sayeth in another place that Papistes and excommunicate persons must be compelled by the Magistrate to heare sermons and yet not admitted to the communion so that by his censure these be two assertions directlye contrarye on to the other Suche as be of the Churche maye as well offer themselues to the communion as to the prayers and hearinge of the worde and this they that be not of the Churche muste be compelled to heare but not permitted to receiue Secondlye he makethe instan● of suche as be weake in fayth corrupt in iudgement ignoraunt in the right vse of the Sacrament not knowinge howe to examine them selues but T. C. excludeth all those that be in any suche respecte vnmeete to examine them selues I am sorye I haue troubled you with so manye wordes in so playne a matter 13 He denyethe that the Churche or any man maye restrayne the people from bodely labor in any of the syxe dayes whiche i● to drawe from the Magistrate his lawfull a●ctoritie and to giue carnall libertie to the people pag 541. 13 The thirtenth assertion is condemned of Anabaptisme in abriging the Magistrat● lawfull auctoritie and of libertinisme in geuinge the people to muche carnall libertie But good Lorde howe vniustlye Hathe the Magistrate lawfull auctoritie to commaunde the people to be ydle whiche God expreslye forbyddeth or can any man ordeyne a religious reste suche as God ordeyned one the Sabbat in the Lawe For it muste be ether ydlenes or a Sabbat that thes Magistrate shoulde institute For if the Magistrate or the Churche will cōmmaunde men to 〈◊〉 from there 〈◊〉 labors that they maye be imployed in publik affayres or giuen to holye exercises T. C. will not gaynsay it as not many tymes before this assertion he affyrmeth playnelye Nowe towchinge the carnall libertie that this assertion geuithe ▪ ●s M D. sayeth I promise you I can not imagine what shoulde be mente thereby for I colde neuer conceaue that plowinge cartinge and other laboringe of men in ther vocations whereof T. C. speaketh shoulde be compted carnall libertie 14 He sayeth that the lyfe of the Sacrament dependethe of the preachinge of the worde whiche if it be true then is the sacrament of Baptisme not to be mynistred to infantes because they can not heare the worde preached and in dede this is the gr●●●de of Anabaptisme pag. 566. 14 The fourtenth assertion is myghtely pressed with the accusation of Anabaptistrye partlye because the metaphor of lyfe is vrged so vehemently by M D and partlye because the speache of T C. in this place is sumwhat vnproper or els perhaps corrupted in the pryntinge But first it is nether charitable no reasonable to expounde a metaphore too stronglye agaynste hym that vsed it as yf a man should saye my lyfe is in your hands it were harde to conclude agaynst hym ergo it is not in your bodye and so you are deade and then you muste be buryed c. Lykewise wher T C sayeth the lyfe of the Sacraments dependeth of the preachinge of Gods worde it is an harde conclusion of M. D ergo the Sacraments ministred without a sermone are deade and beinge ministred to infants whiche can not vnderstande the sermon is not effectuall But where he sayeth that the lyfe of the Sacramentes dependeth of the preachinge of the worde of god I suppose he meanethe of the worde of God preached and declared and peraduenture so his wordes were but altered by the prynter For M D assertion of the lyfe of the Sacramentes yf it be not charitablye expounded is as foule an error as he would seme to chardge T. C withall and woulde brede as great absurdities For he sayethe that the lyfe of the Sacramentes dependethe vpon Gods promysses expressed in his worde and n●ther vpon preachinge nor readinge For yf the lyfe of the Sacramentes dependethe vpon Gods promisses expressed in his word although the same be neuer read nor preached and declared the Popishe masse maye be counted the Lordes supper althoughe the Lorde● deathe be not therin preached and declared nor yet reade to the edifeynge of the people Agayne yf the lyfe of the Sacraments dependethe altogether vpon Gods promysses expressed i● his worde and nothinge at all of preachinge or declaring● of the same they maye be mynistred to infidells for there can be no fayeth where there is no preachinge of Gods worde They giue lyfe ex opere operato of the worke wrought as the Papists saye to all that receaue them whether they be worthye or vnworthye within the couenaunte or without it But I knowe M D. will aunswer that he dothe not exclude preachinge The lyke maye be sayd of T. C. that he dothe not exclude the promysses of Godes worde but ioyneth preachinge to them althoughe he dothe not of necessitie require preachinge immediatlye before euery action of there administration but that of necessytie the worde of God must not only be reade but also preached and declared vnto the people amongest whom the Sacraments are mynistred or els they maye be ministred amonge the Turkes and Iewes So that yf the assertion of T. C. ●e weyghed with indifferencie it tendeth no more to Anababaptistrie then the assertion of Iho● Whytgifte to Papistrie 15 He doubteth whether he maye call hym mynister or no that can not preache whiche beinge 〈◊〉 with his former 〈◊〉 that the mynister is if the beinge of the Sacramente it will fall out that he counteth all those not baptised whiche haue bee● baptised by any other than by preachers pag. 568. and 6●● 15 The fyften Censure is a mea●e cauill taken vp by ●●●kinge a phrase of speakinge contrarie to the speaker Although it semeth that ether M.D. or his printer ●athe lefte out some wordes pag. 568 whiche T. C is chardged to vse by the Censure in the table For in the pag. 568. he is made to speake th●s That there shoulde be in steade of a preachinge mynister yf I maye so call hym and in steade of preachinge readinge c as thoughe he doubted whether a preachinge mynister were a mynister whiche is cleane contrarie to that he is burdened withall in the Censure But lett it be as the Censure reporteth that his wordes are of a mynister that can not preache dothe he doubte whether he be in any respecte a mynister because he sayeth yf I maye so call hym In deede this manner of speakinge declareth that he iudgethe hym that can not preache a man vnworthy to be a mynistre but he dothe not denye hym altogether Or 〈◊〉 what saye we to these speaches

Nero a most cruell man ▪ yf I maye call hym a man whiche is so farre from all humanitie Dyd he tha● so spake doubte whether Nero was a man in nature Iosephus sayethe of Christe in those dayes there was a man called Iesus yf I maye call hym a man dothe Iosephus doubte whether he were a naturall 〈◊〉 One sayethe to his seruaunte thou wycked seruaunt yf I maye so call thee whiche behauest thy selfe more lyke a master then a seruaunte dothe he doubte whether he be his seruaunte or no A man speakethe to his wyfe thou arte a disobedient wyfe yf I maye call the a wyfe whiche carest so lytle for they husbande Doth this man doubte whether the woman were his wyfe you see what a childish cauill this is to grounde so great a slaunder of Anabaptistrie vpon it The lyke fonde quarellinge he vsethe pag 583. wher T. C. hathe these wordes ▪ What reason is there that it shoulde be graunted to one that can not preache beinge as they call hym a mynister to mynister bothe the Sacramentes when as the same 〈◊〉 not permitted to a Deacon as they call hym whiche is able to preache M. W. noteth in the margent why do you account hym no mynister this geare woulde be marked In deede it woulde be marked or ells M. D. woulde 〈◊〉 awaye all with cauillinge and slaunderinge For who seethe not althoughe he haue but one eye that T. C. speaketh of the vnproper vsinge of these termes Mynister and Deacon ▪ whiche signifye all one and yet are commonly vsed for diuers offices and that whiche is proper to the one as he sayeth made common to the other not denying but affyrming hym to be a mynister where he sayeth beinge a mynister as they call hym for these wordes onelye as they call hym shoulde be enclosed with the parenthesis as in the next member of the sentence where he speaketh of the Deacon as they call hym where the phrase is all one 6 He semeth to be of this iudgement that onely those whiche be of the famelye of God ought to be baptised whiche is a daungerous error for not all that be baptised are of the famelye of god pag 621. 16. The syxtene assertion is counted a daungerous error and affyrmed in M. D. opinion to sauor very stronglye of heresye but what heresy he sheweth not T C sayeth that baptisme is an entrye into the house of God ▪ whereby only the famely of God muste enter and those he countethe to be of the famely of God whiche be cleane holy and within the couenant M.D. replyethe that no man can tell who be electe and who reprobate therefore lett hym baptize the children of Turkes and Iewes yea the Turkes and Iewes them selues without conuersion vnto the fayeth because no man knoweth whether they be electe or reprobate But it semeth he forgettethe what S. Paule wryteth 1. Cor 7. For there he teacheth vs to knowe who be cleane and who vncleane who holy and who vnholy who within the couenaunt and who without it and wher he sayeth that all that be baptised are not of the famelye of God he is contrary to hym self in other places where he countethe all them that are baptised to be Christians pag 518. and ells where and yf they be Christians they be of the famely of God yet all that are baptised with externall baptisme be not the electe of God but onely suche as are baptised with the holye Ghost yet all that are baptised maye be counted of the famelye of God which is the Churche so longe as they nether departe from it nor are iustlye caste out of yt 17 He secludeth the children of excommunicate persons and of professed Papistes from the sacrament of Baptisme vntill they be able to make a confession of there fayth whiche smelleth very strongly of Anabaptisme and it is a manifest error pag. 622. 17 The seuententh assertion is chardged to smell very stronglye of Anabaptistrye and to be a manifeste error Surely yf it be an error it is not so manifeste as M. W. affyrmeth but whether yt be an error or no it is farre inoughe from the sauor of Anabaptistry excepte it be in suche a mans nose that hathe raked so longe in the puddle of Anabaptistrye to espye yf he coulde fynde his brother drowned in it that his heade is so stuffed with the stinke of it that he imagineth all thinges where he commeth to sauour of it For allthough T. C. affyrme that the children of heretykes and other excommunicate persons ought not to be receiued to baptisme before there parents repente yet yf they be receued he denyeth not there baptisme nether would he haue them rebaptised yf they imbrace the Christiane religion which there parentes reiected yf a man affyrme that matrymonie ought not to be solempnised without the consent of parentes he doth not deny the matrimonie which is already solempnised or giue the partis leaue to marry others or will them to be maryed agayne m. D. houldeth that baptisme ought not to be ministred without a surples yet he woulde be lothe to be counted an Anabaptiste as to denye that the baptisme mynistred without a surples is lawefull and to saye that therefore yt muste be mynistred agayne Now concerninge the error whiche is made so manyfeste and affyrmed to be voyde of all Scripture reason and auctoritie ▪ suerlye yf it haue not Scripture as yf it be an error it 〈◊〉 not yet it hathe greate apparence of Scripture and suche as might moue as greate a clearke as D. Whytgifte 〈◊〉 For Math 18. Christ willeth that an excommunicate person● should be as an heathen or publicane wher vpon by reason a man will inferre But the childe of an heathen man 〈◊〉 not to be receiued to baptisme therefore nether the childe of an excommunicate man shoulde be admitted But the iudgement of Beza is contrarye I graunt but yet his reasons are not so cleare that they can satisfye euerye simple man whiche buyldeth vpon these words of our Sauiour Christe math 18. yf he refuse to heare the Churche lett hym be to thee as an heathen and publicane Notwithstandinge I hope that for asmuche as T. C. is nowe at Geneua with M Beza as I heare of whom he is iudged to be one of the best learned in Europe that by godly conferens had betwene them ether T. C. shall be willynge to acknowledge his error in this matter or yf he be able to defende it by the worde of God M Beza hym self will reuoke his iudgement 18 He sayeth that princes must remember to subiect them selues vnto the Churche to submit theire Scepters to throwe downe there crownes before the Churche and to lycke the duste of the feete of the Churche And by the Churche he meaneth the presbyterye and eldershyp so that he woulde haue Princes in as great bondage to his seniors as euer they were to the Pope pag. 645. 18 In the eightenth assertion T. C. is greuously chardged as thoughe he

of Dauid nor in the dayes of Kinge Salamon that feaste was celebrated vntill the dayes of Esdras but yf the place be to be vnderstaunde as M D with all his interpreters expounde it yet the wordes sounde otherwyse vntill the contrarye be shewed for it maye be that Esdras and Nehemias speake bothe of one tyme and the other exposition seruethe T. C. purpose euen as well For in that place the former ages are reproued yf for not omittinge yet for not so solemplye kepinge that feaste as they shoulde haue downe by the Lawe 2 Iosias is alleadged for Ezechias pag. 10. 2 This might be the faulte of hym that coppyed out thee fyrst wrytinge or the faulte of the prynter or yf it were the faulte of T. C. it is confessed by M D to be a lyght ouersight and suche as he hym selfe hathe triped in once or twyse 3 This worde especially is added to the texte 1. Cor 10. pag. 86. 3 Yt is a great faulte to adde any thinge to the Scriptures But he that giueth the true meaninge in other wordes dothe nether adde to the Scriptures nor chaunge them His words 〈◊〉 these That they offende not anye especiallie the Churche of god S. Paule sayeth Be suche as giue no offence nether to the Iewes nor to the grecians nor to the Churche of God Now whether those that are weake in the Churche of God are especially to be consydered rather then Iewes or Gentills whiche are out of the Churche is all the question M. D. sayeth they that are out of the Churche are especiallye to be regarded But he onelye sayeth it without other reason or auctorytie For reason of the contrarye syde this maye be sayde that as charytie is the chiefe rule in auoydinge offences and charytie regardeth especially those that are of the how shoulde of faythe so we muste haue especiall care not to offende them The Apostle also speaketh moste of them teachinge to auoyde offences calling them thy brother thy weake brother those for whom Christ dyed c Rom 14 1. Cor 8. 4 He opposeth Ignatius and Tertullian to Ambrose and Augustine as thoughe Ambrose and Augustine shoulde thinke it to be lawefull to faste on the Lords daye and the other two should wrytte the contrarie whereas Ambrose and Augustine fullye agree with Ignatius and Tertullian in that matter pag 99. 4 The wordes of T. C. be these I will not enter nowe to discusse whether it were well donne to faste in al places accordinge to the custome of the place you oppose Ambrose and Augustine I coulde oppose Ignatius and Tertullian whereof the one sayeth that it is nefas a detestable thinge to faste vpon the Lordes daye the other that it is to kill the Lorde and this is the inconuenience that commeth of suche vnlearned kinde of reasoninge Sainte Ambrose sayethe so and therfore it is true In the 99 pag this is noted to be an vntruthe procedinge of ignoraunce but in deede this a false and a proude Censure proceding of malyce and arrogance as thoughe T. C coulde not tell what difference is betwene the Sabbat and the Lordes daye I shoulde haue reade these wordes an hundreth tymes and neuer vnderstoode that he opposeth Ignatius and Tertullian to Ambrose and Augustine but to M. D. Whytgifte and his kinde of reasoninge as M. Whytgifte opposeth Ambrose and Augustine to his aduersarye For yf the auctoryties of Ambrose and Augustine be irrefragable for fastinge one satterdaye then the auctoryties of Ignatius and Tertullian are the lyke touchinge fastinge one Sondaye which notwithstanding are meare absurdities But as it is not so haynouse an offence to faste on Sondaye because Ignatius and Tertullian saye so So no more is the rule of fastinge one satterdaye true because Ambrose and Augustine saye so 5 He mangleth sainte Augustines words bothe before behinde and in the middest pag 107. 5 This is a friuolous quarellinge for T. C. pretendeth not to recyte the wordes of Augustine nor to translate them into Englysh but onlye to giue the somme of his meaninge whiche he dothe sufficientlye to showe that M. D. hathe no greate grounde in that epistell ad Ianuarium c. 6 Pag 144 he falsefyeth the woords of saint Paule 1. Tim 3. and vntruelye translateth them 6 Yt is no smale offence to falsefye the worde of God and therefore M. W. shoulde be well aduised before he accuse his brother of so horrible a crime God forbyd that euery one whiche erreth in translation shoulde be a falsefyer of Godes worde muche lesse he that giueth suche a translation as the originall worde will beare whiche I thinke T. C. dothe in this place his wordes are pag. 144. And beinge tryed lett them execute there functions as longe as theye remaine blameles Firste he translateth not worde for worde for then he woulde haue sayd and lett them be tryed fyrste and then lett them minister beinge blamelesse So that it maye well be that he mente onlye to gather an argument of the Apostles wordes who yf he will not haue Deacons admitted to minister before they be tryed and in try all founde blameles no more woulde he haue them permitted to remayne in that office yf they do not contynewe blameles What falsefyinge is here ether of the wordes or of the meaninge of the Apostle But yf he ment to translate those wordes ' anegclytoi ' ontes so longe as they remaine blameles Theye are better Grecians then M. D. is compted to be that thinke it maye stand bothe with signification of the worde and with the circunstaunce of the place for S. Paule dothe not only speake of election of Deacons but also of suche qualities as shoulde contynewe in them after they be chosen Therefore yf it be an errour whiche wil be harde for M. D. to proue it is no errour in matter but in translation and no falsification except M. D. wil be compted a falsefier for reading out of the 12. of the Apocalypse verse 11 and expoundinge it also accordinge to his readinge by the worde of his testimonie wher he shoulde haue sayde by the worde of ther testimonye Yt is lyke he dyd reade it out of Erasmus translation whiche is propter sermonem testimonii sui whiche yf a man marke not the reciprocation of sui maye deceaue hym beinge not a verye cunninge Grammarian This was vttered within these two or thre yeres in a sermon at Paules crosse and noted by manye learned man whiche had there greake Testaments whereof one syttinge by me sayd that before that tyme he thought M W had been a verye good Grecian ▪ but nowe he perceyued the contrarye that he coulde not so muche as reade his texte in Greeke whiche yf he had doen he coulde not haue been deceyued And yet in my conscience as I am suer he dyd erre in translatinge so woulde I not iudge hym to be a falsefier of Gods worde because I thinke he erred of symplicitie and not of malice 7 He sayeth that Israelites when they worshipped