Selected quad for the lemma: faith_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
faith_n	believe_v	church_n	infallibility_n	5,773	5	11.7611	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A30026	De Christiana libertate, or, Liberty of conscience upon it's [sic] true and proper grounds asserted & vindicated and the mischief of impositions amongst the people called Quakers made manifest : in two parts : the first proving that no prince nor state ought by force to compel men to any part of the doctrine, worship, or discipline of the Gospel, by a nameless, yet an approved author [i.e. Sir Charles Wolseley], &c. : the second shewing the inconsistency betwixt the church-government erected by G. Fox, &c., and that in the primitive times ... : to which is added, A word of advice to the Pencilvanians / by Francis Bugg.	Bugg, Francis, 1640-1724?; Wolseley, Charles, Sir, 1630?-1714. Liberty of conscience upon its true and proper grounds asserted and vindicated.; Wolseley, Charles, Sir, 1630?-1714. Liberty of conscience the magistrates interest.	1682 (1682)	Wing B5370; ESTC R14734	148,791	384

them altogether and what serves our turns at some times to oppose others may at last prevail upon our selves And so it is in our Practices reserving any of their Ceremonies may at last bring us to some of their Doctrines He that keeps a Holy-day is within a step of praying to that Saint for whose sake he keeps it especially if he have the wit to consider why he keeps it He that kneels and puts weight upon it is in a fair way to adoration and he that is for joyning the Cross with Baptism may come to do it after Grace and cross himself in time 'T was Bishop Bonner's observation when he saw the Reformation and how many of the Popish Ceremonies were retained being asked what he thought of it If they like saith he the taste of our Broth so well they will eat of our Beef shortly Secondly Liberty of Conscience is the great means to diffuse Gospel-knowledge in divine things and that 's the best and surest way to bar out Popery and lock the Door upon it forever Ignorance is the great and only preparative for implicit subjection Christendom cannot I dare say afford an instance that ever any State or People where Divine-Knowledge by Liberty of Conscience and a Liberty for the Gospel was once spread were in the least danger of turning Apostates to Popery but have grown daily more and more into a detestation of it and generally almost every man amongst them carrying a Weapon in his understanding to defend the Protestant Cause Were Liberty of Conscience granted in Italy and other Popish States we should soon see the Mitre totter upon the Popes Head and probably see as fair Churches there as in any other part of Europe 'T was observed in the Wars of the Low-Countries that when ever any Catholick began to look into the Bible he was not long-liv'd in the Roman Profession Thirdly Liberty of Conscience will breed men up with an irreconcilable dislike to all Imposition in Religion and Conscience and so unite them in a general abhorrence of POPERY as the grand Mother and Author of it all Chistendom over All Principles and Parties born from a Liberty given in Religion have an Antipathy in them to that Romish Yoke and do naturally unite against the Popish Religion as the grand and common Enemy of them all Let Liberty of Conscience once be given in a Protestant-State and though there be never so many differences amongst themselves yet men of all perswasions will concenter in that He that has the freedom of his Religion will be concerned to defend it and look upon Popery as the great Grant he is in danger of Experience and Fact the best of all demonstrations do evidence this Take a view of those places where Liberty of Conscience hath been most given and you will find there the greatest aversion to Popery that is in any parts of Christendom 'T is in other places where other Methods of Imposition and Persecution are used that compliance with Popery hath been attempted and projects set on foot to compound the Protestant and the Papists into an Agreement 'T is Imposition in Religion sweeps the House and keeps the Nest warm for Popery Liberty of Conscience mortally stabs it where that is once given it may be said to the Pope as it was to Belshazzar God hath numbred thy Kingdom and finished it And the place where he once Tyrannized shall know him there no more Lastly If the Church of Rome understand their own Interest as we have good reason to believe they do this Case is determined to our hands for upon every occasion since the Reformation both in Germany France Swisserland and all places where Liberty of Conscience hath been endeavoured the Popes have toto animo every way opposed it and declared it a thing perfectly destructive to the Church and such as where-ever it was suffered would destroy the Roman Faith and in that Maxim I believe their Infallibility is not much to be denied Some are so much otherwise-minded that they believe Liberty of Conscience will be the ready means to induce Popery again amongst us The Reasons of it seem invisible unless it be done by some new Rule of contraries It must either come to pass by giving Liberty in general to Protestants of differing perswasions or else by giving Liberty to the Papists themselves as included in a general Liberty For the first I hope it appears evidently to have another tendency And for the second The giving Liberty to the Papists themselves amongst us no man well informed can imagine that they should be included in any such Liberty First Because in their Practice amongst us they refuse to give that publick assurance every Subject ought to give of his Fidelity that expects the favour due to a Subject And secondly Because their Principles are such that if they understand their own Religion they can never be good Subject to any Protestant State He that knows not this knows not the ROMAN RELIGION And to prove it so by Fact Amongst very many other Instances let what was done here in the time of Queen Elizabeth to her and at the same time in France to Henry the Fourth forever lie upon Record against them Nor can a Papist ever become a true and hearty Subject to a Protestant Prince but by that act he ceaseth to be so And as common Justice does deny them all pretentions to Liberty so common Equity opposeth them for as both they and their Religion abhor giving Liberty to any but themselves so is their practice accordingly for they never give Liberty to a Soul living that differs from them where they are able and dare deny it To say That Liberty of Conscience can have no other effect but to tolerate damnable Heresies and all kind of Sectaries which is the usual way of discoursing it and so to enlarge into all kind of Satyrical Rhetorick upon that Topick is to put a Bears skin upon it and then to bait it 'T will be to impose a thing of a very hard belief upon me to say That Truth never gains by Liberty and that the Imposer is alwayes in the right and the Sufferer in the wrong especially considering he that thinks me an Heretick another thinks him so and a fourth thinks us all so and all the while we are all of us weak imperfect fallible men sitting in judgment and sentencing one another And there can be no other end of it but that he that is strongest makes himself in the right and destroys the rest When ever Truth comes to suffer by Imposition as many times it does and comes afterwards to be so acknowledged the evil of such Imposition carries its own evidence But suppose such Truth never gets any good and Liberty should be only to men under Errors and Mistakes 't were not fit then to deny it that is 't were not fit then to impose upon them for Liberty is nothing but a Negative upon Force and Imposition

the said Record either openly by dispute or publickly by Writing to be contrary to Christs Doctrine and Example and contrary to the Apostles Doctrine and Example and contrary to the Doctrine and Example of Francis Howgil Richard Hubthorn and divers other Friends Testimonies in Print and not only so but Antichrictian and Romish and thereupon do hereby enter my Protestation against the said Record and every part thereof Witness my Hand the 4th of the 10th Month 1678. Francis Bugg All which desire of their proving their Proceedings Apostolical and debating the Matter both by me and others they denyed and utterly refused But I marvail the less since I now understand by the Preface to the Book of W. R. In Five Parts Entituled The Christian-Quaker Distinguished c. That it is the Advice of such an Eminent Man of Party with G. F. that we should not be reasoned with a notable way but methinks very Singular yea so Singular that there is no Profession of People that I know of now extant in England that will refuse to be reasoned with except only the Papists and they are so infallibly sure that upon that Foot they do not doubt nor scruple their Faith and Belief for they Believe as the Church Believes and G. W. says in his Apost Incendi c. p. 16. That the true Church is in the true Faith that is in God and we must either Believe thus as the True Church Believes or else it were but folly and Hypocrisy to profess our selves to be of the True Church Indeed the first part of George his Assertion is true for the Church of God which is made up of faithful Members amongst Episcopalians Presbyterians Independents and Baptists or under any other Denomination whatsoever in any County City Language or People that fear God and work Righteousness these all have their Faith in God but that those with respect to Degrees Growths or Measures do differ and are of different Perswasions in many Points and thereupon ought to bear and forbear Judging one another is manifest as also from the Practise of the Primitive Christians as W. R. and T.C. have fully manifested which not only thwarts G. W's Answer to the four Positions mentioned in the 15th and 16th pages of the said Book But the whole Rubrick Laws and Cannons Ecclesiastical of G. F. and other Innovators who are so infallibly sure of the way and that all that differ from them are in the wrong that as I said they have no will to reason things to debate things but too much like the Papists would have things taken upon trust Implicitely Believe as the Church Believes Practice as the Church Practices and in all Points yield obedience to her Decrees without any Examination Scruple or Doubt Or else why should that Abetter of the Cause of G. F. advise as followeth Viz. Let not this Spirit be reasoned with Enter not into Proposals and Articles with it but feed it with Judgment that is Gods Decree Mark the Nature and Tendency of this Advice for should the Apostles have thus Preached to the Boreans What Liberty had been left for their Search and their further Examination nay Christ himself reasoned in the Synagogue of the Jews and the Apostles did the like nay when any Difference arose amongst themselves a free Debate was admitted which amongst us hath been both by Advice and Practice stiffly denyed as I shall yet more manifest Six Queries propounded by F. B. the 12th Month 1678. Some Qveries propounded to such amongst us as endeavour to impose a Uniformity and Conformity to such Rights and Ceremonies as have ho Foundation in Scripture and to such a Church Discipline as neither the Prophets Christ Jesus nor his Holy Apostles Primitive Christians Saints or Martyrs in any Age or Generation either Commanded or Practised and do expect your Answer according to Scripture for the Scripture testifies of Christ and of his Example and the Apostles who wrote Scripture had the Mind of Christ and his Mind is not variable so let your Answer accord with Scripture And whereas you pretend you are for Holy Orders and good Government in the Church maintain the same by Scripture Proof otherwise we shall look upon your Pretentions altogether vain and your plea no better than that which is commonly used by the Persecuting Papists and degenerated Protestants who when we bid them prove the Use of their Ceremonies and other Observations by plain Scripture they say They need not for the Apostle said Let things be done decently and in order And the Church seeing a Decency in the Vse of these Things She hath a Power committed to Her to impose them on Her Members and by Vertue of Her Authority She commands the strict Observation of them under pain of Her Displeasure and if any will not yield obedience to Her Decretal Orders when once approved on by a General-Council or Synodical-Assembly or question her Authority She hath a Power to Excommunicate and cut off such as Heriticks or Gain-sayers or Men of Opposite Spirits c. Thus says ROME and thus say the Episcopalians thus say all Imposers who have no Authority from Christ Jesus for their un-scriptural Traditions that it begins to be so with us is plain manifest and for a particular Instance view the Case of J. A. who was both judged and Condemned and Recorded out of the Unity at a Quarterly-Meeting or General Council held at Hadenham in the Isle of Ely the 4th of the 7th Month 1678. And in as much as you seem to make G. F. the Author of your Errours it stands him upon finally to reject and to bear a publick Testimony against your New Strange and Dangerous Innovations and Babylonish Inventions and to shew that he hath no Hand in the Introducing and promoting the same WHEREFORE answer these things following that so your Minds Intents and Purposes may be fully and clearly manifest and upon what Bottom you stand and who gave you your Power and whence you derive your Authority and in whose Name you compel a Conformity to your New Invenetd Orders and Rules under Pain of Condemnation QUERY I. Whether Christ Jesus the true God and Eternal Life in whom the Fulness of the Godhead dwelt Bodily be the Head of the True Church OR Whether George Fox who is but a Man unto whom the Spirit is given but by Measure be Head thereof Answer QUERY II. If you say that Christ is the Head thereof as I hope you will not dare to say otherwise then I further Query Whether Christ be not Lawgiver to his Church Answer QUERY III. If you say That Christ is and of right ought to be both Head and Lawgiver to his Church as I presume you will not say otherwise Then I further Query Whether we who profess our selves to be Disciples Followers of Christ ought not to follow and obey the Example Practice Precepts Commands Prescriptions and Exhortations of Christ Jesus our Lord and Master

own Hand would neither Answer the Letter nor so much as Discourse me but when I had given them the Letter C. T. bad me be gone All which shews the Author to the Accuser his Pretentions to an Accommodation Condiscention to be fallacious Deceitful and Hypocritical Object BY this time some may be ready to object and say It is true these Things as Stated cannot be denyed but to have used a more private way might have been as convincing and not have ministred that occasion to such as are Enemies to all Religion as this way of Proceeding perhaps may especially since the Author of the Accuser says p. 127. We can the more easily concur and accord as to Circumstances and Outward Methods and in the Wisdom of God so condiscend one to another and accommodate Matters as not to divid about them Answ That I with many other have used private meanes for about the space of four years without any Redress nay not so much as a Christian Answer and that the Pretence of the Author of the Accuser to Condiscention and Accommodation is fallacious and false and a meer piece of feigned Hypocrisy to amuse his Reader and delude the World I shall make evidently appear before I pass this Chapter especially considering what meanes I used at our Quarterly-Meeting in the Case of J. A. made mention of in the third Chapter both by Letters and Queries First then see a Letter that eleven Friends belonging to our Meeting in Milden-Hall sent to our Quarterly Meeting who were so far from Condiscention Accommodation as that they refused to have it read amongst them but said We were all deluded A Copy whereof followeth To Friends at the Quarterly Meeting in Hadenham the 4th Mo. 80. Dear Friends THese Lines are to put you in Mind that many Friends belonging to our Meeting as well as in divers other Places are offended and burthened by reason of the continued Record against John Ansloe which exclude him what in you lye out of the Unity of Friends which is nothing less than Excommunication to the utmost of your Power whereby we are constrained to visit you in this manner entreating you to race out the said Record out of your Quarterly Book Indeed had J. A. denyed Marriage the very forbidding of which is a Doctrine of Devils you might justly have thrown him out for Marriage is Gods Ordinance But the Controversy is not here but about manifesting his Intention to Marry Behold the Crime as you account it and consider of it we beseech you for Peace sake and lay not such a Stress where Christ nor his Primitive Followers laid none And that thereunto you may be encouraged ponder the saying of W. P. in his Address to Prot. p. 77. I beseech you Protestants by the Mercies of God and Love of Jesus Christ ratified to you in his most precious Blood FLY ROME AT ROME Look to the Enemies of your own House have a care of this Presumption carry it not too high lay not Stress where God hath laid none The Impositions of such Opinions is the Priviledge of Hypocrites and the Snare of many honest Minds And p. 93. If we consider the Matter well I fear saith W. P. it will be found that the occasion of Disturbance in the Church of Christ hath in most Ages been found to lye on the Side of those who have had the greatest Sway in it And Pag. 94. If the Spiritual Guides and Fathers of the Church would be a little sparing of incumbring Churches with needless Supersluities there were far less danger of Schism and Superstition And Pag. 144. Nay Christ himself to whom all Power was given in Heaven and Earth submitted himself to the Test He did not require them to believe him because he would be believed he refers them to the Witness that God bore of him saying If I bear witness of my self my witness is not true He also sends them to the Scriptures but an Imposing Church bears witness of her self and will be both Party and Judge require Assent without Evidence and Faith without Proof therefore false But Christian Religion ought to be carryed on only by that way by which it was Introduced which was Perswasion If any Man will be my Disciple let him take up his Cross and follow me Pag. 146. For if I believe what the Church believes only beause She believes and not because I am convinced in my Vnderstanding of the Truth of what She believes my Faith is false though hers be true I say 't is not true to me I have no Evidence of it And Pag. 141. The Apostle became all unto all that he might win some but this is becoming all unto none to force all he therefore recomends the utmost Condiscention that can be lawful he stooped he became all unto all that is he stooped to all Capacities and humbled himself to those Degrees of Knowledge that Men had and valued that which was good in all These Allurements were all his Injunctions nay in this Case he makes it an Injunction to use no other Let us therefore saith he as many as be perfect be thus minded and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded God shall reveal even this unto you you shall not be Imposed upon Stigmatized or Excommunicated for want of full satisfaction or because you do not consent before Conviction Thus far William Penn. Now let us a little animadvert upon this Noble Mans Words Lay no Stress saith he where God hath not laid Stress as if he should have said Friends God never laid any such Stress about publishing the Intent of Marriage Why then do you Have a care of this Presumption carry not things too high neither Smite Record nor Excommunicate one another about such Things which are at best but Mens Traditions and Impositions which may prove a Snare to the Honest and Conscientious but a seeming Priviledge to the conformable Hypocrite for you see that such as have the greatest Sway in the Church are evermore the cause of these Disturbances who pretending themselves Fathers and Spiritual Guides are not sparing of cumbring the Churches with needless Superfluities and such Orders as Christ never commanded nor his Apostles ever practised which had they been so useful as you pretend they be surely Christ and his Apostles would not have been so forgetful of Prescribing such Outward Observations nay but on the contrary they have told us in Holy Writ The Kingdom of Heaven comes not that way neither consists in such things You also may perceive that Christ was such an Example of Meekness and Self-denyal and so far and free from Force and Imposition that he only said If any Man will be my Discipie let him take up his Cross and follow me but an Imposing Church bears witness of her self and though She sets up such Orders as Christ never commanded yet She requires assent without Evidence and Faith without Proof for She will be both Party and Judge

and Recorder out of the Unity at her pleasure which manifests her to be the false Church for the true Christian Religion was introduced by Perswasion and ought to be so carryed on for if I believe and practice only because the Church doth so ad not from a convincement in my self my Faith and Obedience would be false and Idolatrous The Apostles who had the Mind of Christ became all unto all stooped to all Capacities to all Degrees of Knowledge valued what was good in all these were his Injunctions who said As every Man is fully perswaded so let him walk for what is not of Faith is Sin He did not Record out of the Unity such as saw not so clear as himself but became all unto all that he might save some but you that would force all become all to none you will not stoop at all nor condiscend at all but exalt and magnifie your Orders and written Prescriptions how many weak Brethren soever you offend You value not the good in any but Conformity to your Humour and to your Will and though some are otherwise minded about Discipline and Church-Government you will not let them alone but you will impose upon them Stigmatise and Record them out of the Unity which is no less than Excommunication Wherefore take W. P's Advice FLY ROME AT HOME and lay not Stress where God lays not Stress Thus twice over as it were have you herein the genuine sense of Dear W. P. And Oh! that every one concerned would make a diligent search in his own Heart and like the beloved Disciple smite upon his Breast and say Is it I Is it I that am guilty of this Severity of this Presumption if carrying things too high of setting up such Orders as prove a Snare or at least a burthen to the Conscientious yea of laying a Stress and a great Stress where God never laid any One that am the Cause of this Disturbance in the Church One that bears witness of my self and that will be both Party and Judge Oh! let me a little Examine my self Am I One that cannot become all unto all One that cannot condiscend at all to my Brother One that will value not the good in any but Conformity to my Will and Humour One that would have all believe and practice as I do whether I convince their Vnderstanding of the Truth of what I believe and practice or not and if not condemn them for Hereticks without any more a do I say Oh that every one would thus reflect upon himself that so you might consider of these things for many are offended and grieved with the continuance of the aforementioned Record against J. A. And again beseech and intreat you to reverse the same that so Love and Good-will Unity and Concord may spring amongst us as in the Beginning which is heartily desired by your Friends who subscribe their names hereunto Francis Bugg Elizabeth Bugg Joseph Masson Jane Masson Joseph Ellington Rachel Ellington John Thrift Joseph Tetsall William Bellsham Phillip Wing Mary Huggins Sarah Bird. Dated the 15th of the 3d. Month 1680. Note That John Thrift who carried the recited Letter to the Quarterly-Meeting said that they would not suffer it to be read but cryed out You are deluded Which by the Second-days Meetings own Rule if they approved W. P's small Tract Entituled A Brief Examination and State of Liberty Spiritual is a mark of Imposition For in the said Tract p. 4. 't is thus written I ask thee May I not exhort thee to the Practice of that I am moved to press thee to the Practice of If not thou are the Imposer by restraining me from my Christan-Liberty and not only so but away goeth Preaching and with it the Scriptures that are both appointed of God for Exhortation Reproof and Instruction Their Proceedings herein need no Comment being worse than the Magistrates ever served me who do as really believe me to be deluded as they could pretend to any such Thing and yet they will often hear and do Justice too And after I had waited more than a Year and saw no Redress I then wrote to W. P. thinking he might be an Instrument to compose things but what he did whether any thing or nothing I never had any Answer to this Day A Coppy of which now followeth Viz. This for W. P. with Care c. Dear Friend VVHen I consider the Nature of the Controversy betwixt W. R. and G. F. and the multitude of Friends on each side in almost all Counties together with the lamentable Consequences which will unavoidably follow the same if not timely put a stop to by a Brotherly Condiscention I am even bowed down and grieved to behold the same and under a sense thereof I desire to lay before thee my Apprehension both of the Cause and Cure that so thou together with G. W. to whom I have already wrote may endeavour a Composure of this Controversy and in remembrance of what thou didst declare at the Meeting at Devonshire House the 27th of the 3d. Month last after the Debate gives me Incouragement so to do as also they Printed Addr. to Prot. for saidst thou If I knew of such a Design as is surmised to bring in an Implicit Faith and Blind Obedience by forcing a Conformity before Conviction I would oppose it with my at most Endeavour or to that effect Now that thou mayst know if yet thou dost not as that thou shouldst not by thy positive Assertions in Alexander the Copper Smith pag. 10. 12. 15. I will give thee a Copy of Orders Recorded as our Cannon or Rule to walk by in the Quarterly Book for the Isle of Ely Verbatim Parenthesis excepted Viz. It is ordered at this Quarterly-Meeting and agreed upon that no Friends may for time to come permit or suffer Marriages without the consent of Friends at two Mens and Womens-Meetings and the Man and Woman to come both to the said two Meetings to receive the Answer of Friends that so no disorderly a notable Hedge without parrellel I presume or Indirect Proceedings may be carryed on any more and yet never more disorderly than since contrary to the Vnity of Friends Written at a Quarterly Meeting in Hadenham the 1st of the 10th Month 1675. Behold the Nature Manner and Form of these Orders and compare them with the Condemnation of J. A. for not coming up to a strict Conformity who was Recorded out of the Unity the 4th of the 7th Month 1678. in the same Book as may be seen for not proceeding in his Marriage according to the Orders Now see whether we do not first make a Rule or Cannon to walk by and compel a Conformity to the same before Conviction nay not only so but pass Diffinitive Sentence too for Nonconformity to the utmost of our little Power we have and when any Body questions the Authority of these Orders and Practices G. F. is presently quoted and that being as some say moved to

bid you observe any particular Thing or Duty that Christ Commanded do it with a Reverend Regard but if they begin once to extol their Written Traditions above the Holy-Scriptures you will have good and warrantable ground to testifie against their Innovations and if for this they call you Hereticks or Schismaticks answer them in the words of St. Augustine Errare possum Hereticus esse non possum In an Errour I may be but an Heretick I cannot be for there are three things necessary for just Proof of Heresie First That it be an Errour that I hold Secondly That it be an Errour against the Truth of Gods Word for otherwise every Errour maketh not a Man a Heretick And Thirdly That it be stoutly and wilfully maintained otherwise an Errour against Gods Truth without wilful Maintenance is not Heresy There is the Sixth Branch of the Grant and Confirmation mentioned in the Second Chapter about Sufferings which as Stated is not warrantable which for brevity sake I pass by until an Opportunity offer it self and then I may unriddle the meaning and perhaps discover the Effects thereof Effectually And thus I rest your Friend Milden-hall the 9th of the 1st Month 1682. F. B THE Post-script AS it was the manner of the Pharisees to propound Insnaring Questions to Christ Jesus in the Day of his Flesh tempting him endeavouring to entangle him in his Talk when otherwise they were not able to Confute him Even so hath it been the manner of some amongst us to come to me since I sent the forgoing in Manuscript to the Press Questioning me in order to insnare or intangle me in my Talk instead of proving their Proceedings Apostolical and their Force and Compulsion in their Church Procedure warrantable WHEREFORE my further Advice to the Reader is To frequent the Holy Scriptures and read them diligently as also the Works of R. Hubberthorn F. Howgil other Antient Friends and the foregoing Tract and then see and consider whether there be not Violence done to our first Principles of Union whereby Tyranny instead of Order is introduced For it is a Protestant Principle to read all Authors to search out the Truth of Things in Controversy to endeavour after a right Understanding to prove all things and hold fast that which is good and hereby will Implicit Faith and Blind Obedience be excluded Knowledge increased and true Conviction become the ground of our Conformity and the Bereans Example become our daily Practice But it is a Popish Principle To believe as the Church believes barely because She so believes to take all for granted our Leaders say without any further Examination to read no Books but what are Licenced and approved on by this General Council or that Second-Days Meeting to Pin my Faith on their Sleeves to see with their Eyes instead of my own Oh this Implicit Faith this Blind Obedience this Idolizing the Wisdom and Conduct of the Multitude and refusing the use of our own Reason Sense and Understanding is no less than the Product of a Popish Principle and ought to be avoided Object But some may object and say That although things be thus which being upon Record cannot without great Impudence be denyed yet to publish them we think very hard measure c. Answ If no private meanes had been used then indeed this Objection had been of some weight but in regard so many private Endeavours have been used for four Years together and all avail nothing it is but just and equal as for Example Let any of the Hearers be found guilty of Misdemeanors although no other Crimes than the Leaders and Teachers themselves are guilty of it is usual to go to such and admonish them if they persist in the Evil then admonish them again and if after all private Meanes they will not be reclaimed then it hath been usual to give out Papers of Condemnation against them that the World may see we do not own them in their evil Practices c. Even so it is but just and reasonable that if our Leaders and Church-Governours as they count themselves who pretend to see for the Body shall Erect such a way of Church-Government and Discipline as neither Christ nor his blessed Apostles never commanded nor Practised and bring in and set up other Traditions than the Apostles delivered and then compel according to that little Power they have a Uniformity and Conformity to them then it is but just to call these Leaders to account and admonish them again and again and shew them their Errour and the Mischief of their Impositions and if after all private Endeavours for three or four Year together these Church-Governours will not be reclaimed nor in any wise perswaded to make void such Edicts such vain Traditions and useless Ceremonies nor yet be content that as many as have freedom to use them may and that others that are otherwise minded may be let alone and left to their Christian-Liberty whether to Conform or not Conform then it is but just to bear a Publick Testimony against them their Impositions their Prescribed Rules and Cannons their Written Orders their Antichristian way of Church-Procedure that the World may know we do not own them and that G.F. G. W. and those of Party with them have been call'd to account have been admonished again and again Is fully manifest by what is set forth in this Treatise together with what is written by W.R. in his Book Entituled The Christian-Quaker Distinguished In Five Parts c. Milden-Hall the 22. of the 3d. Mon. 1682. F. Bugg The Labouring-Mans Caveat Concerning Womens-Meetings TAKE heed beware of Novelty And of Female Authority That they into the Church ben't brought And thereby such Divisions wrought Through Craft of the Old Enemy Who is profound in Subtilty As may cause Bitterness to Spring Which is a very hurtful Thing And more thereby's defil'd within Than Women can wash clean again But rather take the Good Old Way As God Commanded Paul doth say That Women in subjection be And not usurp Authority Nor in the Church permitted speak Whereby they should good Order break Except to Pray or Prophesy By Power given from on High Otherwise they 'l Confusion make And cause the Hearts of Friends to ake But rather all with one Accord Let Male and Female Serve the Lord That as Partakers of one Grace They meet together in one Place And not distinct as George doth say At the Tenth Hour of the Day Nor yet devided one from th' other Lest that Division breeds another But as the Children of one Father Brethren and Sisters both may gather Together in one Place to see What may to others needful be And helping their necessity May serve each other in Unity And Mens Invented Novelties With Womanish Formalities What ' ere defiles may out be swept And all Things sweet and clean be kept Who first convinc't us by his Light To lead us on may have his Right And following Him as Children Dear

Instance in that Law about putting Idolaters to Death where if we consider the circumstances attending it we shall find it impossible nay unlawful now to be executed Whosoever tempted another to Idolatry was not to be conceal'd but the Person tempted was obliged to kill him himself whether he were his Brother Son Wife or whatever Relation it were In the 13th of Deut. vers 9. Thou shalt surely kill him thy hand shall be first upon him and then the hand of all the People and they shall stone him And afterwards we find there whole Cities of Idolaters are to be raced to the ground and their Children and Cattel utterly destroyed These are Laws that cannot be now executed under the Gospel nay they are forbidden for we are bid to walk in Wisdom to those that are without to do good to all men and to give no offence neither to Jew nor Gentile Nay Believing Husbands and Wives are bid to live with their Unbelieving Relations in hopes to convert them Who can avoid seeing that these Punishments as well as Promises were relative to that People and that state of things to preserve them from the rest of the World and expired with the distinction of Jew and Gentile Thus I have endeavour'd to oppose the Magistrates using the civil Power to force Religion under the Gospel First because 't is against the Light of Nature And secondly 't is not only without but against the Command of the Gospel so to do Famous is that saying of Tertullian to Scapula It appertaineth unto the Authority of the Law of Man and Nature that every man Worship as he thinketh good and one mans Religion doth not hurt nor profit another Neither is it any piece of Religion to inforce Religion which must be undertaken by a mans own accord and not through Violence So thought Turtullian antiently So saith Lactantius Who shall inforce me either to believe what I will not or not to believe what I will So saith Cassdor Religion cannot be forced And Bernard hath an excellent saying to the same purpose Faith is to be planted by Perswasion not obtruded by Violence Bede tells us That here in England so soon as King Ethelbert was converted by Austin the Monk he made a Law That none should be compelled to Religion having understood that Christ's Service ought to be voluntary and not compelled A third Reason against using Force Compulsion about things under the Gospel is Because 't is not adequate to the Malady for if the meaning be to make a man forsake Error and imbrace the Truth 't is no Remedy suitable to the Disease nor will it ever reach such a Distemper or effect such a Cure The Disease lies in the Soul and in the Understanding the compelling and punishing the Body will never help it the end will be wholly lost A man can never be forced to alter or imbrace an Opinion he may deny it or conceal it But if he had a desire through fear or other slavish considerations to do it yet he cannot and so a man is compelled to an impossibility This usually makes Hypocrites and at last Atheists but never makes a right Convert So the Souls of men this way are endangered the Devils Interest promoted but neither the Salvation of Souls nor the Honour of God by enlarging Truth any way furthered He that useth no other Medium but force to me makes a Lyon and a Mastiff-Dog as capable of converting me and giving Laws to my Understanding as he We are bid to restore Persons fallen into Error by a Spirit of Meekness considering our selves lest we also be tempted So Paul to Timothy The Servant of the Lord must not strive but be gentle to all men in Meekness instructing those that oppose themselves if God peradventure will give Repentance No man ever yet did any good to himself or others by forcing a man against the Law of his own Light and Reason How many that through fear and oppression have gone against their Light have repented openly to the shame and disgrace of those who violently obtruded Principles upon them contrary to what was natively and properly their own Take amongst many one famous instance recorded by Socrates in his Ecclesiastical History The Emperor Valens by threats and menaces to confiscate and banish him made Elusius Bishop of Cyzicum turn Arrian and approve the Decrees of the Council of Arminium The effect of it was Elusius presently fell into horror of Conscience openly at Cyzicum recanting what he had done crying out of the Emperors unjust cruelty and made all men loath such a proceeding A late Author undertakes to justifie the use of Force in Religion from the Opinion of Saint Austine whose Opinion at first as is well known was That it was no way lawful to use Force to men of differing Opinions in Religion The retraction of that and the change of his mind was occasioned by a particular accident at Hippo and it may be if we consult all circumstances we shall find his last Opinion had more need of a retractation than his first and yet at last he is very positive against all capital punishment his words are Nullis tamen bonis 'T is a thing says he that pleaseth no good man that any Heretick should be put to death We may see by this how men do curtail and enlarge these things according to their interests and particular affections and set bounds at their own pleasure some are for one kind of temporal severity and some for another and so when we leave the Scriptures that give no direction for any we lose our selves and wander as the fancies and interests of men lead us But the Authors words are these Though Force saith he will not remove the Error yet it may prevent its spreading though it doth not take away the Cause yet it hinders most of the mischievous Effects The mischievous effects of an Opinion is considered as it relates to a man himself who is possessed with it and as it relates to others who may be by him infected with it Force doth in no wise hinder the spreading of an Opinion for if a man be punished for declaring to others what he thinks is right and he thinks himself bound in Conscience to declare others are more easily taken and by his Sufferings made more pleased with his Notion and sooner become his Proselites In the other case he that forceth me to deny my Opinion sins in doing it but I sin likewise if I comply with him for such mischievous effects as relate to the Person himself possessed with an Opinion hinders them not at all unless you can convert him by it for it either confirms him in one Error or leads him into a worse If he stand it out and suffer he will be the more rooted in his perswasion by it and be apt to think want of Arguments brings men to Club-Law If he comply against his Light he runs then into an apparent and

him and that the Author of the Accuser c. in Answer to W. R's Book may not say to me as he in pag. 86. Viz. Howbeit W. R. produceth not any now Prescriptions Methods Rules Orders and Forms of Church-Government Now saith the said Author of the Accuser c. Now he should have produced some new Orders and Forms of Church-Government Introduced amongst in since that time meaning the Year 1673. to prove his Charge of Apostacy and Innovation against G. F. and those he calls his Party c. And Pag. 133. We affirm that his meaning W. R. crying out Impositions Form of Church-Government Orders Prescriptions c. in general is no Answer nor any Proof of his Charge of Apostate and Innovator against us let him either specifie saith this notable as well as confident Author of the Accuser c. the Particulars thereof that he condemns us for as Apostates and that we practice as Church Discipline or else for ever be ashamed c. And Pag. 3. And what New and Unchristian Doctrines and Practices are they meaning G. F. and his Party fallen into we find no Proof nor Discovery thereof in all his Books c. And Pag. 128. of the said confident Author of the Accusers c. We do profess seriously a notable serious George if we may believe him we see no real Cause or valid Reason our Opposer meaning W. R. shews for the great Noyse and Rumble he makes about Outward Laws Prescriptions Orders Edicts or Decrees Outward Form of Government Apostacy Innovation Impositions Lording over Faith over Conscience c. whil'st he shews us no unjust no unlawful nor uncomly Order or Proceedings amongst us as a People nor yet gives us any Instances or Catologue of those Impositions Innovations New Doctrines or Practices brought in and received amongst us which are inconsistent with our First Testimony to the Light and Grace of God within and Teachings thereof c. I say things considered as practised amongst us I marvel that the said Author which is said to be G. Whitehead should have the Confidence thus to call for a Proof to call for a Catologue of the New Orders that are Introduced amongst us when he at the time of his Writing could not be ignorant of the Things complained of by W. R. who 't is probable thought there was no need to produce such Proof such a Catalogue and such manifest Instances to prove the same and that none would have the Confidence or rather Impudence to deny such Things as are every Month put in Practice amongst us But as I said that be may not say so to me I will bring him both Proof and President and if he will call them a Catologue he may But first the Confirmation of the Foundation of the Womens-Meetings Namely George Fox his Order above recited by a General Council held at London Anno 1675. Concerning Propounding Marriages London the 27th of 3d. Mon. 1675. IT is our Judgment that for better Satisfaction to all Parties that there may be due time for Inquiry of clearness of the Persons concerned it is convenient that Marriages be at twise propounded to the Meetings that are to take care therein both to the Mens and Womens Meetings where both are Established before they are accomplished and when Things are cleared that the Marriage be accomplished in a Grave and publick Assembly of Friends and Relations Observations And now set the Authority and Confirmation of the Womans Meetings and how G. F. his pretended Motion is corroborated and strengthed I am necessitated to transcribe more of the Transaction of this notable if not Universal Council than I am willing lest G. Whitchead should again call for a Proof or Catologue of their new stamped Government c. Concerning Mens and Womens-Meetings IT is our Judgment and Testimony in the Word of Gods Wisdom that the Rise and Practice Setting up and Establishment of Mens and Womens-Meetings in the Church of Christ in this our Day and Generation is according to the Mind and Counsel of God and done in the ordering and leading of his Eternal Spirit and that it is the Duty of all Friends and Brethren in the Power of God in all Places to be diligent therein and to incourage and further each other in that blessed Work and particularly that Friends and Brethren in their respective Countries incourage their Faithful grave Women in the Settlement of the said Meetings and if any professing Truth shall either directly or indirectly discountence a notable Warning and little obeyed except by G. F. his Men of War or weaken the Hands of either Man or Woman in the VVork and Service of the Lord let such be admonished according to the Order of the Gospel and if they receive it not but resist Counsel and persist in the work of Division we cannot but look upon them as therein not in Unity with the Church of Christ and Order of the Gospel Therefore let Friends go on in the Power of God and in that Work for Him his Truth and People and not to be swayed or hindred by them or their Opposition Observations Behold the difference between this Decree and the Letter of Advice and Counsel in the First Chapter of this Treatise that hath a particular relation to the Scripture and the Practice of the Holy Men recorded therein but this is wholly a stranger to any such Authority yet that was not proposed otherwise than Advice and Counsel and not as a Form or Rule to walk by notwithstanding there was so much in it to justifie the pressing of it both as being bottom'd on Scripture Authority and the Practice of the holy Men of God recorded in Scripture but this no relation to Scripture Authority Precept or President no relation to the Example of the holy Men of God recorded in Scripture nor any Command of God or Jesus Christ who is Head of the true Church and Lawgiver too but notwithstanding the Authors of this Decretal Order are peremptory and positive none must refuse a Complyance none must discountenance the Observatition of it directly or indirectly for if they do they are not to be lookt upon in Unity with the Church that is not to be lookt on as Christians and Members of Christs Church and so at once made Heathens by this new fashoned Edict But to make good Provision against any that shall yet dare to slight this new Model or new found Method of Church-Government or call in question their Power or Authority See what a strict and severe Admonition is uttered forth even as if it had come from the Popes Council of Jesuits and crafty Fryars I Know that some will be mighty angry and sore displeased with me for transcribing so much of their hidden Mysteries but in my apprehension there is no reason for it for if Womens-Meetings be of such Excellency and their Government and Jurisdiction so vertuous amiable as that whoever comply and yield obedience to them are in

Man as the Author to the Accuser did in Expunging the Doctrines and Opinions of those Books c. I could also tell you the Story of the cruel Sufferings of Thomas Green for spreading Books in Queen Marys Reign but you may read it at large in p. 218. of the Sp. Mar. Revived c. Object But some may perhaps say That though the Papists were against the spreading of these kind of Schismatical Books yet they allowed or at least permitted wicked Books and that doth not G. Fox or his Party c. Answer This I confess was an Objection which had some place in my Mind But being in London in the Month of February last after I had seen the Excommunication against J. B. I was resolved to try the Truth of the matter and so I went to Benjamin Clark who is a great Man for G. F and his Party and sells the Answers to W. R. his Book but I suppose 't is against his Conscience to sell one of W. R. his Books although it hath more Divinity Truth and Reason in it than all the Books extant against it yet inasmuch as G. F. is therein Detected their Church-Government reprehended and R. B. his Book of Government Anatomised the said B.C. will not sell one of them However I went to his Shop as a Country-man and Stranger and asked if they sold no pritty Books for Children no pritty Play-Books or Papists Books in short I had all sorts brought to my view and as wicked Books yea such as I never saw that I remember which if they desire a Proof of their Badness I may for ought I know afterwards have occasion to produce one out of them Oh gross Deceit and manifest Hyppocrisy Were ever more vain Pretences amongst the Papists than are now entred this sort of New Church-Governours Oh! How did G. Fox Buffet Thomas Vincent who had rather that his Hearers should go to a Bawdy-House than to a Quakers Meeting in his Epistle to the Book Entituled The Divinity of Christ c. Put forth by G.W. yea the whole People saying How now Presbyterians High Priests What Is this your Doctrine that you Preach up for your Hearers to go to a Bawdy-House c. Over and over they are pelted as if that kind of Wickedness the Presbyterians had been Principled in because T. V. in his over hot Zeal might use such an unjustifiable Expression and now may they say to G. F. How now G. F. What Hadst thou rather that B. Clark and J. Bringhurst should sell Papists Books Play-Books Jesting-Books nay 〈…〉 Books rather than that Book of W.R. because it discovers the Naked Truth of your New-Model of Church-Government c. Object Perhaps some may object and say as B. A. or J. F. or one of them said to me Viz. Well but suppose all that you say or suggest be true admit that were granted yet to publish it that is abominable and wicked Or words to that purpose c. Answ Indeed if things were not true and that what we suggest had no bottom but barely our own Apprehension and Suspition then to publish things of this nature thereby to Expose and falsly Represent a People this would be very wicked and such a Practice is and ever was hated of God and good Men but admitting they be real Truths and no Fictions which I hereby expose as that I stand ready to make appear then upon that Foot and upon that Bottom I do account it both Just Reasonable and a Christian Duty in three Respects First To reprove the Erronious by shewing them their Errours if not then were the Apostles Martyrs and the whole Line of Protestants in the wrong and under Blame greatly Secondly To undeceive the World and the credulous People therein who are very apt to be led aside by the Flourishes and fair Pretences of Men and not like the Noble Bereans search the Scriptures in Order to examine things relating to Life and Salvation and the Doctrine and Discipline their Teachers lay down to be indispensibly obeyed Thirdly To manifest the right Way both to the Erring Persons and the Ignorant World of Implicit Professors and this to be done for the Good of Souls for the Increase of Knowledge and Gods Glory and that this is my main End and peculiar Intent I appeal to God the Searcher of all Hearts and knows the Intents thereof c. A Word of Advice to the Pensilvanians FRiends you have the Advantage of those that went into New-England Barbadoes and other Plantations formerly you may perceive the Rock upon which they have miscarryed what hath been an Impediment to the Increase of Love and Charity amongst them to wit Impositions on the Consciences of those that differ from them in some Religious Point of Church-Discipline or other How hath New-England that fled from hence under a Complaint of the Bishops Tyranny made their Little-Finger as heavy as their Loynes Witness the Sufferings of our Friends to Death under their Tyranny And Secondly Enquire and see how sweetly our Friends lived in Barbadoes in Love and Charity one towards another until G. F. his Law came to take place there Insomuch as that at length at a Quarterly-Meeting at Ralph Fretwells House in Barbadoes the 23d of the 10th Month 1680. Where the Sum of their Testimony amounted to a Choice to be made Viz. Whether Friends would cleave abide to theVniversal Spirit Viz. in the Mens and Womens-Meeting c Or Whether to their particular Measures c. A strange kind of Proposition And after many Testimonies given to the further Opening the Question the Judgment underneath was written and voluntarily Subscribed by both the Men and Women c. That is to say I Desire to give up my whole Concern if required both Spiritual and Temporal unto the Judgment of the Spirit of God in the Mens and Womens-Meetings as believing it to be more according to the Universal Wisdom of God than any particular Measure in my self or any particulars with which the Mens and Womens-Meetings have not Unity Subscribed by 39 Men 43 Women Total 82. Thus Implicit Faith and Blind Obedience for the magnifying of G. F. his Laws and Orders began to spread far and near but this Papistical Judgment and Erronious Opinion stands Answered by T. C. in a Small Tract Called Babells-Builders Unmasking themselves c. Also you have the Advantage of seeing the Effects of G. F. his Laws here in England Wherefore in short this is my Advice to you Keep the Holy Scriptures in Esteem amongst you and if any would lay a Foundation for Church-Government that is not warranted by the plain Text thereof and would compel you to a Conformity to the same slight it and never submit to such an Yoak neither be intangled thereby though there may be a Shew of Wisdom in them as the Apostle said Gal. 5. Heb. 9 10. Isaiah 29.13 Mat. 15.9 I say keep the Scpipture in great Esteem if your Teachers