all_o man_n judge_v that_o then_o only_o be_v any_o thing_n prove_v theological_o when_o they_o prove_v it_o from_o the_o word_n of_o the_o holy_a scripture_n this_o be_v more_o than_o the_o former_a say_v for_o to_o extend_v the_o sufficiency_n and_o necessity_n of_o scripture_n to_o all_o that_o be_v theological_a be_v more_o than_o to_o extend_v it_o to_o matter_n of_o faith_n no_o protestant_a go_v high_a than_o this_o that_o i_o know_v of_o and_o note_v that_o he_o make_v this_o the_o very_a common_a conception_n and_o judgement_n of_o all_o man_n see_v then_o where_o our_o religion_n and_o church_n be_v before_o luther_n even_o among_o all_o christian_n yet_o more_o full_o he_o proceed_v ibid._n hence_o it_o further_o appear_v that_o principle_n of_o theology_n thus_o take_v that_o be_v which_o be_v acquire_v by_o theological_a discourse_n be_v the_o very_a truth_n themselves_o of_o the_o holy_a canon_n because_o the_o ultimate_a resolution_n of_o all_o theological_a discourse_n do_v stand_v or_o belong_v to_o they_o and_o all_o theological_a conclusion_n be_v deduce_v first_o from_o they_o but_o distinguish_v the_o conclusion_n theological_a from_o the_o principle_n i_o say_v that_o all_o truth_n be_v not_o in_o themselves_o formal_o contain_v in_o the_o holy_a scripture_n but_o of_o necessity_n follow_v from_o those_o that_o be_v contain_v in_o they_o and_o this_o whether_o they_o be_v article_n of_o faith_n or_o not_o n_o b_o and_o whether_o they_o be_v knowable_a or_o know_v by_o another_o science_n or_o not_o and_o whether_o they_o be_v determine_v by_o the_o church_n or_o not_o but_o of_o other_o truth_n to_o wit_n not_o follow_v from_o the_o word_n of_o the_o holy_a scripture_n i_o say_v there_o be_v no_o theological_a conclusion_n this_o be_v prove_v etc._n etc._n when_o i_o read_v over_o the_o schoolman_n and_o divine_n of_o all_o sort_n that_o write_v before_o the_o reformer_n fall_v so_o close_o upon_o the_o pope_n and_o find_v how_o general_o even_o the_o papist_n themselves_o maintain_v the_o sufficiency_n of_o the_o holy_a scripture_n just_a as_o the_o protestant_n now_o do_v i_o be_o convince_v 1._o of_o the_o succession_n of_o the_o protestant_n religion_n in_o the_o universal_a visible_a church_n and_o 2._o that_o it_o be_v the_o reformer_n argument_n from_o scripture_n that_o force_v the_o papist_n to_o oppose_v this_o holy_a rule_n as_o to_o its_o sufficiency_n and_o to_o invent_v the_o new_a doctrine_n of_o supplementall_a tradition_n for_o conservative_n ministerial_a tradition_n of_o the_o holy_a scripture_n we_o be_v for_o as_o much_o at_o least_o as_o they_o the_o word_n of_o guil._n parisieâ—sis_n too_o large_a to_o be_v recite_v in_o extol_v the_o fullness_n and_o perfection_n of_o the_o scripture_n even_o for_o all_o sort_n of_o man_n you_o may_v read_v de_fw-fr legibus_fw-la cap._n 16._o pag._n 46._o bellarmine_n de_fw-fr verbo_fw-la dei_fw-la lib._n 3._o cap._n 10._o ad_fw-la arg._n 15._o say_v we_o must_v know_v that_o a_o proposition_n of_o faith_n be_v conclude_v in_o such_o a_o syllogism_n whatsoever_o god_n have_v reveal_v in_o scripture_n be_v true_a but_o this_o god_n have_v reveal_v in_o scripture_n therefore_o it_o be_v true_a though_o he_o require_v another_o word_n of_o god_n by_o the_o pope_n or_o council_n to_o prove_v that_o this_o be_v reveal_v in_o scripture_n but_o if_o so_o then_o scripture_n contain_v all_o that_o be_v true_a in_o point_n of_o faith_n 2._o and_o that_o all_o thing_n that_o be_v reveal_v and_o which_o we_o ought_v to_o believe_v be_v not_o essential_a to_o the_o christian_a faith_n and_o therefore_o that_o all_o be_v of_o the_o church_n that_o hold_v these_o essentials_n and_o that_o such_o a_o distinction_n must_v be_v maintain_v the_o papist_n have_v still_o confess_v till_o late_o that_o dispute_v have_v increase_v their_o novelty_n and_o error_n bellarmine_n and_o costerus_n confession_n i_o recite_v even_o now_o guliel_n parisiensis_fw-la in_o operum_fw-la pag._n 9_o 10_o 11_o 12._o de_fw-fr fide_fw-la industrious_o prove_v the_o necessity_n of_o distinguish_v the_o fundamental_n or_o essentials_n from_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o point_n of_o faith_n and_o it_o be_v they_o that_o constitute_v the_o catholic_n faith_n which_o he_o say_v be_v therefore_o call_v catholic_n or_o universal_a because_o it_o be_v the_o common_a faith_n or_o the_o common_a foundation_n of_o religion_n and_o he_o prove_v that_o hence_o it_o be_v that_o the_o catholic_n faith_n be_v but_o one_o and_o find_v in_o all_o catholic_n these_o fundamental_n be_v find_v in_o all_o by_o many_o argument_n he_o prove_v this_o and_o that_o there_o be_v some_o point_n even_o these_o common_a article_n necessary_a to_o be_v know_v of_o all_o necessitati_fw-la medii_fw-la the_o schoolman_n common_o grant_v as_o aquin._n 22._o q._n 2._o a._n 5._o c._n banne_n in_o 22._o q._n 2._o a._n 8._o etc._n etc._n of_o these_o say_v espencaeus_fw-la in_o 2._o ti._n c._n 3._o dig_v 17._o which_o be_v the_o object_n of_o faith_n per_fw-la se_fw-la and_o not_o the_o secondary_a object_n the_o adult_n must_v have_v a_o explicit_a faith_n and_o the_o collier_n faith_n at_o this_o time_n decantate_n by_o the_o catholic_n will_v not_o serve_v the_o turn_n and_o we_o have_v both_o the_o scripture_n sufficiency_n to_o all_o point_n of_o faith_n even_o the_o low_a and_o also_o the_o foresay_a distinction_n give_v we_o together_o by_o tho._n aquinas_n 22._o q._n art_n 5._o c._n we_o must_v say_v that_o the_o object_n of_o faith_n per_fw-la se_fw-la be_v that_o by_o which_o man_n be_v make_v bless_v but_o by_o accident_n and_o secondary_o all_o thing_n be_v the_o object_n of_o faith_n which_o be_v contain_v in_o the_o holy_a scripture_n see_v the_o judgement_n of_o occam_n canus_n tolet_n and_o many_o more_o cite_v by_o dr._n potter_n and_o yet_o more_o for_o the_o sufficiency_n of_o the_o symbol_n or_o creed_n as_o the_o test_n of_o christianity_n pag._n 89_o 90_o 91_o 92_o 93._o where_o you_o have_v the_o sense_n of_o the_o ancient_n upon_o the_o point_n and_o p._n 102_o 103._o i_o conclude_v therefore_o with_o the_o jesuit_n azorius_fw-la par_fw-fr 1._o lib._n 8._o c._n 6._o the_o substance_n of_o the_o article_n in_o which_o we_o believe_v one_o holy_a catholic_n church_n be_v that_o no_o man_n can_v be_v save_v out_o of_o the_o congregation_n of_o man_n profess_v the_o reception_n of_o the_o faith_n and_o religion_n of_o christ_n and_o that_o salvation_n may_v be_v obtain_v within_o this_o same_o congregation_n of_o godly_a and_o faithful_a man_n and_o as_o to_o the_o essence_n of_o the_o christian_a faith_n and_o church_n we_o say_v with_o tertullian_n of_o the_o symbol_n fides_n in_o regula_n posita_fw-la est_fw-la habes_fw-la legem_fw-la &_o salutem_fw-la ex_fw-la observatione_fw-la legis_fw-la exercitatio_fw-la autem_fw-la in_o curiositate_fw-la consistit_fw-la habens_fw-la gloriam_fw-la solam_fw-la ex_fw-la peritiae_fw-la study_v cedat_fw-la curiositas_fw-la fidei_fw-la cedat_fw-la gloria_fw-la saluti_fw-la corte_z aut_fw-la non_fw-la obstrepant_fw-la aut_fw-la quiescant_fw-la adversus_fw-la regulam_fw-la nihil_fw-la ultra_fw-la scire_fw-la est_fw-la omne_fw-la scire_fw-la that_o be_v faith_n lie_v in_o the_o rule_n here_o you_o have_v the_o law_n and_o salvation_n in_o the_o observation_n of_o that_o law_n but_o it_o be_v exercise_v that_o consist_v in_o curiosity_n have_v only_o a_o name_n or_o glory_n by_o the_o study_n of_o skill_n let_v curiosity_n give_v place_n to_o faith_n let_v glory_n give_v place_n to_o salvation_n let_v they_o not_o prate_v or_o let_v they_o be_v quiet_a against_o the_o rule_n to_o know_v nothing_o further_o be_v to_o know_v all_o thing_n de_fw-fr prescript_n cap._n 13_o 14._o so_o cap._n 8._o nobis_fw-la curiositate_fw-la opus_fw-la non_fw-la est_fw-la post_fw-la christum_fw-la jesum_fw-la nec_fw-la inquisitione_n post_fw-la evangelium_fw-la cum_fw-la credimus_fw-la nihil_fw-la desideramus_fw-la ultra_fw-la credere_fw-la hoc_fw-la enim_fw-la prius_fw-la credimus_fw-la non_fw-la esse_fw-la quod_fw-la ultra_fw-la credere_fw-la debeamus_fw-la that_o be_v as_o for_o we_o we_o need_v not_o curiosity_n after_o jesus_n christ_n nor_o inquisition_n after_o the_o gospel_n when_o we_o believe_v we_o need_v to_o believe_v no_o further_o for_o we_o first_o believe_v this_o that_o there_o be_v nothing_o further_o that_o we_o ought_v to_o believe_v and_o here_o on_o the_o by_o for_o the_o right_a understanding_n of_o tertullia_n book_n the_o prescript_n note_n 1._o that_o the_o rule_n of_o essentials_n extract_v from_o the_o whole_a scripture_n be_v the_o church_n ancient_a creed_n 2._o that_o the_o complete_a rule_n of_o all_o point_n of_o faith_n be_v the_o whole_a scripture_n and_o that_o tertullian_n have_v to_o do_v with_o heretic_n that_o deny_v the_o essential_o and_o desire_v the_o whole_a scripture_n to_o dispute_v their_o case_n from_o both_o because_o they_o have_v question_v or_o reject_v much_o of_o it_o and_o because_o it_o be_v a_o large_a field_n to_o exercise_v their_o
apostle_n and_o this_o be_v but_o to_o know_v their_o doctrine_n deliver_v in_o that_o first_o age_n which_o we_o appeal_v to_o and_o after_o he_o express_o say_v ad_fw-la hanc_fw-la it_z aque_fw-la formam_fw-la provocabantur_fw-la ab_fw-la illis_fw-la ecclesiis_fw-la quae_fw-la licet_fw-la nullum_fw-la ex_fw-la apostolis_n vel_fw-la apostâ—licus_fw-la auctorem_fw-la suum_fw-la proferant_fw-la ut_fw-la multo_fw-la posteriores_fw-la quae_fw-la denique_fw-la quotidie_fw-la institutum_fw-la tamen_fw-la in_o eadem_fw-la fidem_fw-la conspirantes_fw-la non_fw-la minus_fw-la apostolicae_fw-la deputantur_fw-la pro_fw-la consanguinitate_fw-la doctrinae_fw-la the_o apostle_n doctrine_n will_v prove_v a_o apostolical_a church_n when_o ever_o plant_v and_o c._n 38._o he_o draw_v they_o from_o dispute_v from_o the_o scripture_n because_o they_o own_v not_o the_o true_a scripture_n but_o corrupt_v it_o and_o charge_v the_o catholic_n with_o corruption_n sicut_fw-la illis_fw-la non_fw-la potuit_fw-la succedere_fw-la corruptela_fw-la doctrinae_fw-la sine_fw-la corruptela_fw-la instrumentorum_fw-la ejus_fw-la ita_fw-la &_o nobis_fw-la integritaes_fw-la doctrina_fw-la non_fw-la competisset_fw-la sine_fw-la integritate_fw-la eorum_fw-la not_o by_o real_a tradition_n alone_o per_fw-la quae_fw-la doctrina_fw-la tractatur_fw-la etenim_fw-la quid_fw-la contrarium_fw-la nobis_fw-la in_o nostris_fw-la quid_fw-la de_fw-fr proprio_fw-la intulimus_fw-la ut_fw-la aliquid_fw-la contrarium_fw-la ei_fw-la &_o in_o scripture_n deprehensum_fw-la detractione_n well_fw-mi adjectione_n vel_fw-la transumtatione_fw-la remediaremus_fw-la quod_fw-la sumus_fw-la hoc_fw-la sunt_fw-la ab_fw-la initio_fw-la svo_fw-la ex_fw-la illis_fw-la sumus_fw-la antequam_fw-la nihil_fw-la aliter_fw-la fuit_fw-la quam_fw-la sumus_fw-la and_o cap._n 36._o he_o send_v they_o by_o name_n to_o the_o particular_a apostolical_a church_n and_o begin_v with_o corinth_n then_o to_o philippi_n thessalonica_n ephesus_n and_o then_o to_o rome_n of_o who_o sovereignty_n he_o never_o speak_v a_o syllable_n so_o more_o plain_o l._n 4._o contr_n martion_n c._n 5._o because_o martion_n deny_v the_o true_a scripture_n he_o send_v they_o to_o the_o apostolic_a church_n for_o the_o true_a scripture_n first_o to_o the_o corinthian_n then_o to_o the_o galatian_n then_o to_o the_o philippian_n thessalonian_n ephesian_n and_o last_o of_o all_o to_o rome_n but_o it_o will_v be_v tedious_a to_o cite_v the_o rest_n of_o the_o ancient_n that_o common_o describe_v the_o church_n as_o we_o and_o such_o as_o we_o all_o own_o as_o member_n of_o it_o arg._n 3._o if_o the_o roman_a church_n as_o christian_n though_o not_o as_o papal_n have_v be_v visible_a ever_o since_o the_o day_n of_o the_o apostle_n than_o the_o church_n of_o which_o the_o protestant_n be_v member_n have_v be_v visible_a ever_o since_o the_o day_n of_o the_o apostle_n but_o the_o antecedent_n be_v their_o own_o therefore_o they_o may_v not_o deny_v the_o consequent_a the_o consequence_n also_o be_v past_a denial_n 1._o because_o the_o roman_a as_o christian_n be_v part_n of_o the_o universal_a christian_a church_n 2._o because_o they_o profess_v to_o believe_v the_o same_o holy_a scripture_n and_o creed_n as_o we_o do_v so_o that_o though_o they_o add_v more_o and_o so_o make_v a_o new_a form_n to_o their_o church_n yet_o do_v they_o not_o deny_v our_o church_n which_o be_v the_o christian_a church_n as_o such_o nor_o our_o test_n and_o rule_n of_o faith_n nor_o any_o article_n that_o we_o account_v essential_a to_o our_o religion_n so_o that_o themselves_o be_v our_o sufficient_a witness_n well!_o but_o this_o will_v not_o satisfy_v the_o papist_n unless_o we_o show_v a_o succession_n of_o our_o church_n as_o protestant_a 1._o this_o we_o need_v not_o any_o more_o than_o a_o sound_a man_n late_o cure_v of_o the_o plague_n do_v need_n to_o prove_v that_o he_o have_v ever_o be_v not_o only_a sanus_fw-la but_o sanatus_fw-la a_o cure_v man_n before_o he_o be_v sick_a how_o can_v there_o be_v a_o church_n protest_v against_o a_o universal_a vicar_n of_o christ_n before_o any_o claim_v that_o vicarship_n 2._o and_o when_o the_o vicarship_n be_v usurp_v those_o million_o abroad_o and_o even_o within_o the_o roman_a territory_n that_o let_v the_o pretend_a vicar_n talk_v and_o follow_v their_o own_o business_n and_o never_o consent_v to_o his_o usurpation_n be_v of_o the_o very_a same_o religion_n with_o those_o that_o open_o protest_v against_o he_o and_o so_o be_v those_o that_o never_o hear_v of_o his_o usurpation_n object_n but_o at_o least_o say_v they_o you_o must_v prove_v a_o church_n that_o have_v be_v without_o the_o universal_a vicar_n negative_o though_o not_o against_o he_o positive_o answ._n 1._o in_o all_o reason_n he_o that_o affirm_v must_v prove_v it_o be_v not_o incumbent_n on_o we_o to_o prove_v the_o negative_a that_o the_o church_n have_v not_o such_o a_o roman_a head_n but_o they_o must_v prove_v that_o it_o have_v object_n but_o they_o have_v possession_n and_o therefore_o you_o that_o will_v dispossess_v they_o must_v disprove_v their_o title_n ans._n 1._o this_o be_v nothing_o to_o most_o of_o the_o catholic_a church_n where_o they_o have_v no_o possession_n therefore_o with_o they_o they_o confess_v themselves_o oblige_v to_o the_o proof_n 2._o this_o be_v a_o mere_a fallacious_a diversion_n for_o we_o be_v not_o now_o upon_o the_o question_n of_o their_o title_n but_o the_o matter_n of_o fact_n and_o history_n we_o make_v good_a the_o negative_a that_o they_o have_v no_o title_n from_o the_o law_n of_o christ_n himself_n and_o so_o will_v not_o dispossess_v they_o without_o disprove_v their_o pretend_a title_n but_o when_o the_o question_n be_v de_fw-fr facto_fw-la whether_o they_o have_v ever_o have_v that_o possession_n from_o the_o apostle_n day_n they_o that_o affirm_v must_v prove_v when_o we_o have_v disable_v their_o title_n from_o the_o law_n 2._o but_o what_o must_v we_o prove_v that_o all_o the_o church_n have_v be_v guiltless_a of_o the_o papal_a usurpation_n or_o only_o some_o in_o every_o age_n of_o all_o its_o no_o more_o necessary_a to_o we_o then_o to_o prove_v that_o there_o have_v be_v no_o heresy_n since_o the_o apostle_n if_o a_o piece_n of_o the_o church_n may_v turn_v heretic_n or_o but_o schismatic_n as_o the_o novatian_o and_o african_a donatist_n why_o may_v not_o another_o piece_n turn_n papist_n 3._o what_o will_v you_o say_v to_o a_o man_n that_o know_v not_o a_o protestant_n nor_o a_o papist_n or_o believe_v only_a christianity_n itself_o and_o meddle_v not_o with_o the_o pope_n any_o further_a than_o to_o say_v i_o believe_v not_o in_o he_o jesus_n i_o know_v and_o the_o apostle_n and_o scripture_n and_o christianity_n i_o know_v but_o the_o pope_n i_o know_v not_o and_o suppose_v he_o never_o subscribe_v to_o the_o augustane_n english_a or_o any_o such_o confession_n but_o only_o to_o the_o scripture_n and_o the_o apostle_n and_o nicene_n and_o other_o ancient_a creed_n by_o what_o show_n of_o justice_n can_v you_o require_v this_o man_n to_o prove_v that_o there_o have_v be_v no_o pope_n in_o every_o age_n 4._o the_o foundation_n of_o all_o our_o controversy_n be_v doctrinal_a whether_o the_o papal_a sovereignty_n be_v essential_a to_o the_o church_n or_o necessary_a to_o our_o membership_n we_o deny_v it_o you_o affirm_v it_o if_o it_o be_v not_o essential_a it_o be_v enough_o to_o we_o to_o prove_v that_o which_o be_v essential_a to_o have_v be_v successive_a we_o be_v not_o bind_v in_o order_n to_o the_o proof_n of_o our_o church_n itself_o to_o prove_v the_o succession_n of_o every_o thing_n that_o make_v but_o to_o its_o better_a be_v yet_o profess_v that_o we_o do_v it_o not_o as_o necessary_a to_o our_o main_a cause_n we_o shall_v ex_fw-la abundanti_fw-la prove_v the_o negative_a that_o the_o catholic_a church_n have_v not_o always_o own_v the_o papal_a sovereignty_n and_o so_o that_o there_o have_v be_v man_n that_o be_v not_o only_a christian_n but_o as_o we_o christian_n without_o popery_n and_o against_o it_o and_o so_o shall_v both_o prove_v our_o thesis_n and_o overthrow_v they_o arg._n 4._o if_o there_o have_v be_v since_o the_o day_n of_o christ_n a_o christian_a church_n that_o be_v not_o subject_a to_o the_o roman_a pope_n as_o the_o vicar_n of_o christ_n and_o universal_a head_n and_o governor_n of_o the_o church_n then_o the_o church_n of_o which_o the_o protestant_n be_v member_n have_v be_v visible_a both_o in_o its_o be_v and_o its_o freedom_n from_o popery_n but_o the_o antecedent_n be_v true_a therefore_o so_o be_v the_o consequent_a i_o shall_v prove_v the_o antecedent_n and_o therein_o the_o visibility_n of_o our_o church_n and_o the_o nonexistence_n in_o those_o time_n of_o the_o papacy_n arg._n 1._o my_o first_o argument_n shall_v be_v from_o the_o general_a council_n of_o chalcedon_n if_o the_o privilege_n of_o the_o roman_a sea_n be_v give_v to_o it_o by_o the_o bishop_n consequent_o because_o of_o the_o empire_n of_o that_o city_n and_o therefore_o equal_a privilege_n after_o give_v to_o constantinople_n on_o the_o same_o
not_o at_o this_o day_n abhor_v the_o read_n of_o the_o office_n so_o that_o here_o be_v all_o invent_v new_a by_o gregory_n which_o be_v hardly_o receive_v in_o spain_n and_o yet_o that_o change_v since_o arg._n 9_o if_o the_o generality_n of_o christian_n in_o the_o first_o age_n and_o many_o if_o not_o most_o in_o the_o late_a age_n have_v be_v free_a from_o the_o essential_o of_o the_o papist_n faith_n â—hen_o their_o faith_n have_v have_v no_o successive_a visible_a church_n profess_v it_o in_o all_o age_n but_o the_o christian_n that_o be_v against_o it_o have_v be_v visible_a but_o the_o antecedent_n be_v true_a as_o i_o prove_v in_o some_o instance_n 1._o it_o be_v a_o article_n of_o their_o faith_n determine_v in_o a_o general_n council_n at_o lateran_n and_o florence_n that_o the_o pope_n be_v above_o a_o council_n but_o that_o this_o have_v not_o be_v successive_o receive_v the_o council_n of_o basil_n and_o constance_n witness_n make_v it_o a_o new_a heresy_n 2._o it_o be_v a_o article_n of_o their_o faith_n that_o a_o general_n council_n be_v above_o the_o pope_n for_o it_o be_v so_o determine_v at_o basil_n and_o constance_n but_o that_o this_o have_v have_v no_o successive_a duration_n the_o council_n of_o lateran_n and_o florence_n witness_n 3._o it_o be_v a_o article_n of_o their_o faith_n that_o the_o pope_n may_v depose_v prince_n for_o deny_v transubstantiation_n and_o such_o like_a heresy_n and_o also_o such_o as_o will_v not_o exterminate_v such_o heretic_n from_o their_o dominion_n and_o may_v give_v their_o dominion_n to_o other_o and_o discharge_v their_o subject_n from_o their_o oath_n and_o fidelity_n for_o it_o be_v determine_v so_o in_o a_o council_n at_o lateran_n but_o this_o have_v not_o be_v so_o from_o the_o beginning_n not_o when_o the_o 13._o chapter_n to_o the_o roman_n be_v write_v not_o till_o the_o day_n of_o constantine_n not_o till_o the_o day_n of_o gregory_n that_o speak_v in_o contrary_a language_n to_o prince_n and_o goldastus_n his_o three_o volume_n of_o antiquity_n show_v you_o that_o there_o have_v be_v many_o church_n still_o against_o it_o 4._o it_o be_v a_o article_n of_o their_o faith_n that_o the_o body_n and_o blood_n together_o with_o the_o soul_n and_o divinity_n of_o our_o lord_n jesus_n christ_n be_v true_o real_o and_o substantial_o in_o the_o eucharist_n and_o that_o there_o be_v a_o change_n make_v of_o the_o whole_a substance_n of_o bread_n into_o the_o body_n and_o of_o the_o whole_a substance_n of_o wine_n into_o the_o blood_n which_o they_o call_v transubstantiation_n so_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n but_o the_o catholic_n church_n have_v be_v of_o a_o contrary_a judgement_n from_o age_n to_o age_n as_o among_o many_o other_o edm._n albertinus_n de_fw-fr eucharist_n have_v plain_o evince_v though_o a_o quarrel_n have_v deny_v it_o and_o little_a more_o and_o it_o be_v prove_v in_o that_o successive_o they_o judge_v sense_n and_o reason_n by_o it_o a_o competent_a discerner_n of_o bread_n and_o wine_n 5._o it_o be_v now_o de_fw-la fide_fw-la that_o the_o true_a sacrament_n be_v right_o take_v under_o one_o kind_n without_o the_o cup_n as_o the_o council_n of_o constance_n and_o trent_n show_v but_o the_o catholic_n church_n have_v practise_v and_o the_o apostle_n and_o the_o church_n teach_v otherwise_o as_o the_o council_n of_o constance_n and_o their_o writer_n ordinary_o confess_v 6._o it_o be_v a_o article_n of_o their_o faith_n as_o appear_v in_o the_o trent_n oath_n that_o we_o must_v never_o take_v and_o interpret_v scripture_n but_o according_a to_o the_o unanimous_a consent_n of_o the_o father_n but_o the_o catholic_n church_n before_o these_o father_n can_v not_o be_v of_o that_o mind_n and_o the_o father_n themselves_o be_v of_o a_o contrary_a mind_n and_o so_o be_v many_o learned_a papist_n 7._o it_o be_v a_o article_n of_o their_o faith_n that_o there_o be_v a_o purgatory_n and_o that_o the_o soul_n there_o detain_v be_v holpen_v by_o the_o suffrage_n of_o the_o faithful_a but_o the_o latter_a be_v strange_a to_o all_o the_o old_a catholic_n church_n as_o bishop_n usher_n and_o other_o have_v prove_v and_o the_o very_o be_v of_o purgatory_n be_v but_o a_o new_a doubtful_a indifferent_a opinion_n of_o some_o very_o few_o man_n about_o augustine_n time_n 8._o it_o be_v now_o a_o article_n of_o their_o faith_n that_o the_o holy_n catholic_n church_n of_o rome_n be_v the_o mother_n and_o mistress_n of_o all_o church_n but_o i_o have_v show_v here_o and_o elsewhere_o that_o the_o catholic_n church_n judge_v otherwise_o and_o so_o do_v for_o the_o most_o part_n to_o this_o day_n 9_o it_o be_v now_o a_o article_n of_o their_o faith_n that_o their_o tradition_n be_v to_o be_v receive_v with_o equal_a pious_a affection_n and_o reverence_n as_o the_o holy_a scripture_n but_o the_o catholic_n church_n do_v never_o so_o believe_v 10._o the_o council_n of_o basil_n make_v it_o de_fw-fr fide_fw-la that_o the_o virgin_n mary_n be_v conceive_v without_o original_a sin_n but_o the_o catholic_n church_n never_o judge_v so_o 11._o it_o be_v determine_v by_o a_o council_n now_o that_o the_o people_n may_v not_o read_v the_o scripture_n in_o a_o know_a tongue_n without_o the_o pope_n licence_n but_o the_o catholic_n church_n never_o so_o think_v as_o i_o have_v prove_v disp._n 3._o of_o the_o safe_a religion_n 12._o the_o book_n of_o maccabee_n and_o other_o be_v now_o take_v into_o the_o canon_n of_o faith_n which_o the_o catholic_n church_n receive_v not_o as_o such_o as_o dr._n cousin_n and_o dr._n reignolds_n have_v full_o prove_v to_o this_o i_o may_v add_v the_o novelty_n of_o their_o worship_n and_o discipline_n but_o it_o will_v be_v too_o tedious_a and_o i_o have_v say_v enough_o of_o these_o in_o other_o write_n see_v dr._n challoner_n pag._n 88_o 89._o in_o 16._o point_n dr._n challoner_n prove_v your_o novelty_n from_o your_o confession_n indeed_o his_o book_n de_fw-fr eccles._n cath._n though_o small_a be_v a_o full_a answer_n to_o your_o main_a question_n arg._n 10._o if_o multitude_n yea_o the_o far_o great_a part_n of_o christian_n in_o all_o age_n have_v be_v ignorant_a of_o popery_n but_o not_o of_o christianity_n then_o have_v there_o be_v a_o succession_n of_o visible_a professor_n of_o christianity_n that_o be_v no_o papist_n but_o the_o antecedent_n be_v true_a therefore_o so_o be_v the_o consequent_a in_o this_o age_n it_o be_v a_o apparent_a thing_n that_o the_o far_o great_a part_n be_v ignorant_a of_o formal_a popery_n 1._o they_o confess_v themselves_o that_o the_o common_a people_n and_o most_o of_o the_o nobility_n of_o habassia_n armenia_n greece_n russia_n and_o most_o other_o eastern_a church_n that_o be_v not_o papist_n be_v ignorant_a of_o the_o controversy_n 2._o they_o use_v to_o tell_v we_o here_o among_o protestant_n that_o there_o be_v not_o one_o of_o many_o that_o know_v what_o a_o papist_n be_v 3._o we_o know_v that_o of_o those_o that_o go_v under_o the_o name_n of_o papist_n there_o be_v not_o one_o of_o a_o multitude_n know_v we_o hear_v it_o from_o the_o mouth_n of_o those_o we_o speak_v with_o i_o have_v not_o meet_v with_o one_o of_o ten_o of_o the_o poor_a sort_n of_o they_o even_o here_o among_o we_o that_o know_v what_o a_o papist_n or_o popery_n be_v but_o they_o be_v teach_v to_o follow_v their_o priest_n and_o to_o say_v that_o they_o be_v the_o true_a church_n and_o old_a religion_n and_o to_o use_v their_o ceremonious_a worship_n and_o to_o forbear_v come_v to_o our_o church_n etc._n etc._n and_o this_o be_v their_o religion_n and_o in_o ireland_n they_o be_v yet_o far_o more_o ignorant_a and_o it_o be_v well_o know_v to_o be_v so_o in_o other_o part_n their_o priest_n they_o know_v and_o the_o pope_n they_o hear_v of_o as_o some_o person_n of_o eminent_a power_n in_o the_o church_n but_o whether_o he_o be_v the_o universal_a vicar_n of_o christ_n and_o be_v over_o all_o other_o as_o well_o as_o they_o &_o whether_o this_o be_v of_o god_n institution_n or_o by_o the_o grant_n of_o emperor_n or_o council_n etc._n etc._n they_o know_v not_o and_o no_o wonder_n when_o the_o papist_n think_v that_o the_o council_n of_o chalcedon_n speak_v false_o of_o the_o humane_a original_a of_o the_o primacy_n in_o the_o imperial_a territory_n and_o when_o the_o council_n of_o basil_n and_o constance_n know_v not_o whether_o pope_n or_o council_n be_v the_o head_n and_o that_o the_o people_n be_v as_o ignorant_a and_o much_o more_o in_o former_a age_n they_o testify_v themselves_o and_o before_o gregory_n day_n they_o must_v needs_o be_v ignorant_a of_o that_o which_o be_v not_o then_o rise_v in_o the_o world_n yea_o dr._n field_n have_v large_o prove_v append_v lib._n 3._o that_o even_o the_o many_o particular_a point_n in_o which_o the_o papist_n now_o differ_v
from_o we_o be_v but_o the_o opinion_n of_o a_o faction_n among_o they_o before_o luther_n and_o that_o the_o western_a church_n before_o luther_n be_v protestant_n even_o in_o those_o particular_a controversy_n though_o this_o be_v a_o thing_n that_o we_o need_v not_o prove_v and_o as_o dr._n potter_n tell_v they_o pag._n 68_o the_o roman_a doctor_n do_v not_o full_o and_o absolute_o agree_v in_o any_o one_o point_n among_o themselves_o but_o only_o in_o such_o point_n wherein_o they_o agree_v with_o we_o in_o the_o other_o dispute_v between_o we_o they_o differ_v one_o from_o another_o as_o much_o almost_o as_o they_o differ_v from_o we_o he_o appeal_v for_o this_o to_o bellarmine_n tome_n though_o i_o can_v undertake_v to_o make_v this_o good_a in_o every_o point_n yet_o that_o proper_a popery_n be_v hold_v but_o by_o a_o faction_n in_o the_o western_a church_n even_o at_o its_o height_n before_o luther_n be_v easy_o make_v good_a he_o that_o read_v but_o the_o writer_n before_o luther_n and_o in_o history_n note_v the_o desire_n of_o emperor_n king_n and_o university_n and_o bishop_n for_o reformation_n of_o the_o thing_n that_o we_o have_v reform_v may_v soon_o see_v this_o to_o be_v very_o true_a it_o be_v avitas_fw-la leges_fw-la &_o consuetudines_fw-la angliae_fw-la as_o rog._n hovedâ—n_n and_o matth._n paris_n in_o h._n 2._o show_n that_o the_o pope_n here_o damn_v and_o anathematise_v all_o that_o favour_a and_o observe_v they_o o_o tender_a father_n even_o to_o king_n o_o enemy_n of_o novelty_n the_o german_a history_n collect_v by_o reuberus_n pistorus_fw-la freherus_fw-la and_o goldastus_n show_v it_o as_o plain_a as_o day_n light_n that_o a_o papal_a faction_n by_o fury_n and_o turbulence_n keep_v under_o the_o far_o great_a part_n of_o the_o church_n by_o force_n that_o indeed_o dissent_v from_o they_o even_o from_o hildebrand_n day_n till_o luther_n or_o near_o say_v the_o apologia_fw-la henrici_fw-la 4._o imperat._v in_o m._n frâ—heri_fw-la tom._n 1._o p._n 178._o behold_v pope_n hildebrand_n bishop_n when_o doubtless_o they_o be_v murderer_n of_o soul_n and_o body_n such_o as_o deserve_o be_v call_v the_o synagogue_n of_o satan_n yet_o they_o write_v that_o on_o his_o and_o on_o their_o side_n or_o party_n be_v the_o holy_a mother_n church_n when_o the_o catholic_n that_o be_v the_o universal_a church_n be_v not_o in_o the_o schism_n of_o any_o side_n or_o party_n but_o in_o the_o universality_n of_o the_o faithful_a agree_v together_o by_o the_o spirit_n of_o peace_n and_o charity_n and_o p._n 179._o see_v how_o this_o minister_n of_o the_o devil_n be_v beside_o himself_o and_o will_v draw_v we_o with_o he_o into_o the_o ditch_n of_o perdition_n that_o write_v that_o god_n holy_a priesthood_n be_v with_o only_o 13._o or_o few_o more_o bishop_n of_o hildebrand_n and_o that_o the_o priesthood_n of_o all_o the_o rest_n through_o the_o world_n be_v separate_v from_o the_o church_n of_o god_n when_o certain_o not_o only_o the_o testimony_n of_o gregory_n and_o innocent_n but_o the_o judgement_n of_o all_o the_o holy_a father_n agree_v with_o that_o of_o cyprian_a that_o he_o be_v a_o alien_n profane_a a_o enemy_n that_o he_o can_v have_v god_n for_o his_o father_n that_o hold_v not_o the_o unity_n of_o the_o church_n which_o he_o after_o describe_v to_o have_v one_o priesthood_n et_fw-fr p._n 181._o but_o some_o that_o go_v out_o from_o we_o say_v and_o write_v that_o they_o defend_v the_o party_n of_o their_o gregory_n not_o the_o whole_a which_o be_v christ_n which_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n of_o christ._n and_o p._n 180._o but_o our_o adversary_n that_o go_v from_o we_o not_o we_o from_o they_o use_v thus_o to_o commend_v themselves_o we_o be_v the_o catholic_n we_o be_v in_o the_o unity_n of_o the_o church_n so_o the_o writer_n call_v they_o catholic_n and_o we_o that_o hold_v the_o faith_n of_o the_o holy_a father_n that_o consent_n with_o all_o good_a man_n that_o love_n peace_n and_o brotherhood_n us_o he_o call_v schismatic_n and_o heretic_n and_o excommunicate_a because_o we_o resist_v not_o the_o king_n and_o p._n 181._o isidore_n say_v etym._n l._n 8._o the_o church_n be_v call_v catholic_n because_o it_o be_v not_o as_o the_o conventicle_n of_o heretic_n confine_v in_o certain_a country_n but_o diffuse_v through_o the_o whole_a world_n therefore_o they_o have_v not_o the_o catholic_n faith_n that_o be_v in_o a_o part_n and_o not_o in_o the_o whole_a which_o christ_n have_v redeem_v and_o must_v reign_v with_o christ._n they_o that_o confess_v in_o the_o creed_n that_o they_o believe_v the_o holy_a catholic_n church_n and_o be_v divide_v into_o party_n hold_v not_o the_o unity_n of_o the_o church_n which_o unity_n believer_n be_v of_o one_o heart_n and_o one_o soul_n proper_o belong_v to_o the_o catholic_n church_n so_o this_o apol._n one_o objection_n i_o must_v here_o remove_v which_o be_v all_o and_o nâ—thing_n viz._n that_o the_o armenian_n greek_n georgian_n abassine_n and_o many_o other_o here_o name_v differ_v from_o protestant_n in_o many_o point_n of_o faith_n and_o therefore_o they_o can_v be_v of_o the_o same_o church_n ans._n 1._o they_o differ_v in_o nothing_o essential_a to_o our_o church_n or_o religion_n nor_o near_o the_o essence_n 2._o protestant_n differ_v in_o some_o lesser_a point_n and_o yet_o you_o call_v they_o all_o protestant_n yourselves_o 3._o i_o prove_v undeniable_o from_o your_o own_o pen_n that_o man_n differ_v in_o matter_n of_o faith_n be_v all_o take_v to_o be_v of_o your_o church_n and_o so_o of_o one_o church_n and_o therefore_o you_o contradict_v yourselves_o in_o make_v all_o point_n of_o faith_n to_o be_v essential_o of_o the_o christian_a religion_n or_o church_n 1._o the_o council_n of_o basil_n and_o constance_n differ_v the_o fide_fw-la with_o the_o popâ—_n and_o the_o council_n of_o lateran_n and_o florence_n they_o express_o affirm_v their_o doctrine_n to_o be_v de_fw-fr fide_fw-la that_o the_o council_n be_v above_o the_o pope_n and_o may_v depose_v he_o etc._n etc._n and_o the_o contrary_a heresy_n and_o pighius_fw-la hierarch_n eccles._n lib._n 6._o say_v that_o these_o council_n go_v against_o the_o undoubted_a faith_n and_o judgement_n of_o the_o orthodox_n church_n itself_o 2._o their_o saint_n tho._n aquinas_n and_o most_o of_o their_o doctor_n with_o he_o differ_v from_o the_o second_o council_n of_o nice_a in_o hold_v the_o cross_n and_o image_n of_o christ_n to_o be_v worship_v with_o latria_n which_o that_o council_n determine_v against_o see_v more_o argument_n in_o my_o key_n for_o cath._n p._n 127_o 128._o and_o after_o i_o will_v now_o add_v a_o testimony_n sufficient_a to_o silence_v papist_n in_o this_o point_n and_o that_o be_v the_o determination_n of_o the_o theological_a faculty_n of_o paris_n under_o their_o great_a seal_n against_o one_o johan._n de_fw-la montesono_fw-it ordinis_fw-la praedic_fw-la as_o you_o may_v find_v it_o after_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o error_n reject_v by_o that_o university_n in_o the_o end_n of_o lombard_n print_v at_o paris_n 1557._o pag._n 426._o their_o 3._o conclusion_n be_v that_o saint_n thom._n aquin._n doctrine_n be_v not_o so_o approve_v by_o the_o church_n as_o that_o we_o must_v believe_v that_o it_o be_v in_o no_o part_n of_o it_o erroneous_a de_fw-fr fide_fw-la in_o matter_n of_o faith_n or_o heretical_a they_o prove_v it_o because_o it_o have_v many_o contradiction_n even_o in_o matter_n of_o faith_n and_o therefore_o they_o ought_v not_o to_o believe_v it_o not_o heretical_a here_o fol._n 426_o 427._o they_o give_v six_o example_n of_o his_o contradiction_n and_o therefore_o they_o conclude_v that_o though_o he_o be_v no_o heretic_n because_o not_o pertinacious_a yet_o they_o ought_v not_o to_o believe_v that_o his_o doctrine_n be_v in_o no_o part_n heretical_a or_o erroneous_a in_o the_o faith_n they_o further_o argue_v thus_o if_o we_o must_v believe_v his_o doctrine_n not_o heretical_a etc._n etc._n this_o shall_v be_v chief_o because_o it_o be_v approve_v by_o the_o church_n but_o there_o be_v some_o doctrine_n much_o more_o approve_a by_o the_o church_n than_o the_o doctrine_n of_o s._n tho._n which_o yet_o be_v in_o some_o part_n of_o it_o heretical_a or_o erroneous_a in_o the_o faith_n therefore_o the_o minor_a they_o prove_v by_o many_o example_n the_o first_o be_v of_o peter_n doctrine_n gal._n 2._o i_o own_v not_o this_o by_o cite_v it_o the_o second_o be_v of_o cyprian_a the_o three_o of_o hierom_n and_o they_o add_v that_o the_o same_o may_v be_v say_v of_o augustine_n and_o many_o more_o approve_a doctor_n the_o four_o example_n be_v lombard_n himself_o who_o they_o say_v have_v somewhat_o erroneous_a in_o the_o faith_n the_o five_o be_v gratian_n who_o have_v he_o pertinacious_o adhere_v to_o his_o doctrine_n they_o say_v have_v be_v a_o manifest_a heretic_n and_o say_v they_o some_o say_v the_o
council_n of_o nice_a that_o many_o prince_n be_v subject_v to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n by_o ecclesiastical_a custom_n and_o no_o other_o right_n the_o synod_n shall_v do_v the_o great_a injury_n to_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n if_o it_o shall_v attribute_v those_o thing_n to_o he_o only_o from_o custom_n which_o be_v his_o due_n by_o divine_a right_n this_o citation_n i_o take_v from_o bishop_n bromhall_n have_v not_o see_v the_o book_n myself_o the_o popish_a bishop_n of_o calcedâ—n_n survey_v cap._n 5._o to_o we_o it_o suffice_v that_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n be_v saint_n peter_n successor_n and_o this_o all_o the_o father_n testify_v and_o all_o the_o catholic_n church_n believe_v but_o whether_o it_o be_v jure_fw-la divino_fw-la or_o humano_fw-la be_v no_o point_n of_o faith_n a_o ingenuous_a confession_n destroy_v popery_n see_v aubert_n miraeus_n notitia_fw-la episcopat_fw-la where_o in_o the_o ancient_a notit_fw-fr and_o leunclavius_n record_n of_o leo_n philos._n impera_fw-la there_o be_v none_o of_o the_o abassine_n or_o other_o extramperial_a nation_n under_o the_o old_a patriarck_n cassander_n epist._n 37._o d._n ximenio_n operum_fw-la p._n 1132._o say_v of_o that_o learned_a pious_a bishop_n of_o valentia_n monlucius_n so_o high_o commend_v by_o thuanus_n and_o other_o learned_a man_n that_o he_o say_v si_fw-mi sibi_fw-la permittatur_fw-la in_o his_o tribus_fw-la capitibus_fw-la viz._n forma_fw-la publicarum_fw-la precum_fw-la de_fw-la ritibus_fw-la baptismi_fw-la de_fw-la formâ_fw-la eucharistiae_fw-la sive_fw-la missae_fw-la christianam_fw-la formam_fw-la ad_fw-la normam_fw-la priscae_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la institutam_fw-la legi_fw-la conâ—idere_fw-la se_fw-la quod_fw-la ex_fw-la quinquaginta_fw-la mill_n quos_fw-la habet_fw-la in_o suâ_fw-la dioecesi_fw-la à _fw-la praesenti_fw-la disciplina_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la diversos_fw-la quaùraginta_fw-la millia_fw-la ad_fw-la ecclesiasticam_fw-la uniâ—nâ—m_fw-la sit_fw-la reducturus_fw-la that_o be_v if_o he_o have_v but_o leave_v in_o these_o three_o head_n the_o form_n of_o public_a prayer_n of_o the_o rite_n of_o baptism_n and_o the_o form_n of_o the_o eucharist_n or_o the_o mass_n to_o follow_v the_o christian_a form_n institute_v according_a to_o the_o rule_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n he_o be_v confident_a that_o of_o fifty_o thousand_o that_o he_o have_v in_o his_o diocese_n that_o differ_v from_o the_o present_a discipline_n of_o the_o church_n he_o shall_v reduce_v forty_o thousand_o to_o ecclesiastical_a union_n by_o this_o testimony_n it_o be_v plain_a that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n have_v forsake_v the_o ancient_a discipline_n and_o worship_n of_o the_o church_n by_o innovation_n and_o that_o the_o protestant_n desire_v the_o restitution_n of_o it_o and_o will_v be_v satisfy_v therewith_o but_o can_v obtain_v it_o at_o the_o papist_n hand_n so_o cassâ—nder_v himself_o epist._n 42_o p._n 1138._o i_o will_v not_o despair_v of_o moderation_n if_o they_o that_o hold_v the_o church_n possession_n will_v remove_v some_o intolerable_a abuse_n and_o will_v restore_v at_o tolerable_a form_n of_o the_o church_n according_a to_o the_o prescript_n of_o the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o of_o the_o ancient_a church_n especial_o that_o which_o flourish_v for_o some_o age_n after_o constantine_n when_o liberty_n be_v restore_v which_o if_o they_o will_v not_o do_v and_o that_o betimes_o there_o be_v danger_n they_o may_v in_o many_o place_n be_v cast_v out_o of_o their_o possession_n still_o you_o see_v rome_n be_v the_o innovator_n and_o it_o be_v restitution_n of_o the_o ancient_a church-form_n that_o will_v have_v quiet_v the_o protestans_fw-la which_o can_v never_o be_v obtain_v so_o again_o more_o plain_o epist._n 45._o p._n 1141._o whether_o heretic_n be_v in_o the_o church_n when_o i_o come_v to_o london_n i_o inquire_v after_o mr._n johnson_n to_o know_v whether_o i_o may_v at_o all_o expect_v any_o answer_n to_o the_o forego_n paper_n or_o not_o and_o at_o last_o instead_o of_o a_o answer_n i_o receive_v only_o these_o ensue_a line_n pag._n 5._o part_n 1._o you_o say_v i_o reply_v first_o have_v not_o you_o despair_v of_o make_v good_a your_o cause_n you_o shall_v have_v go_v by_o argumentation_n till_o you_o have_v force_v i_o to_o contradict_v some_o common_a principle_n now_o i_o have_v by_o argumentation_n force_v you_o to_o this_o if_o you_o will_v maintain_v what_o after_o you_o seem_v to_o assert_v in_o divers_a passage_n viz._n that_o heretic_n be_v true_a part_n of_o christ_n catholic_n church_n for_o thus_o you_o write_v p._n 11._o some_o be_v call_v heretic_n for_o deny_v point_n essential_a to_o christianity_n those_o be_v no_o christian_n and_o so_o not_o in_o the_o church_n but_o many_o also_o be_v call_v heretic_n by_o you_o and_o by_o the_o father_n for_o lesser_a error_n consistent_a with_o christianity_n and_o these_o may_v be_v in_o the_o church_n and_o p._n 12._o you_o answer_v thus_o to_o your_o adversary_n whereas_o you_o say_v it_o be_v against_o all_o antiquity_n and_o christianity_n to_o admit_v condemn_v heretic_n into_o the_o church_n i_o reply_v first_o i_o hate_v their_o condemnation_n rather_o than_o reverence_v it_o where_o you_o say_v nothing_o against_o their_o admittance_n into_o the_o church_n seem_v to_o grant_v it_o i_o therefore_o humble_o entreat_v you_o to_o declare_v your_o opinion_n more_o full_o in_o this_o question_n whether_o any_o profess_a heretic_n proper_o so_o call_v be_v true_a part_n of_o the_o universal_a visible_a church_n of_o christ_n so_o that_o they_o compose_v one_o universal_a church_n with_o the_o other_o visible_a part_n of_o it_o junii_fw-la 6_o to_o william_n johnson_n the_o answer_n answ._n my_o word_n be_v plain_a and_o distinct_o answer_v your_o question_n so_o that_o i_o know_v not_o what_o more_o be_v needful_a for_o the_o explication_n of_o my_o sense_n unless_o you_o will_v call_v we_o back_o from_o the_o thing_n to_o the_o mere_a name_n by_o your_o proper_o so_o call_v you_o be_v answer_v already_o but_o i_o will_v speak_v as_o plain_o as_o i_o can_v and_o if_o it_o be_v possible_a for_o i_o to_o be_v understand_v by_o you_o i_o shall_v do_v my_o part_n 1._o it_o be_v suppose_v that_o you_o and_o i_o be_v not_o agree_v what_o the_o universal_a visible_a church_n itself_o be_v while_o you_o take_v the_o pope_n or_o any_o mere_a humane_a head_n to_o be_v a_o essential_a part_n which_o be_v a_o assertion_n that_o with_o much_o abhorrence_n i_o deny_v you_o think_v each_o member_n of_o that_o church_n must_v necessary_o ad_fw-la esse_fw-la be_v a_o subject_n of_o the_o pope_n and_o i_o think_v it_o enough_o that_o he_o be_v a_o subject_n of_o christ_n and_o to_o his_o orderly_a and_o well-being_n that_o he_o hold_v local_a communion_n with_o the_o part_n within_o the_o reach_n of_o his_o capacity_n and_o be_v subject_a to_o the_o pastor_n that_o be_v set_v over_o he_o maintain_v due_a association_n with_o and_o charity_n to_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o more_o distinct_a member_n as_o he_o be_v capable_a of_o communion_n with_o they_o at_o that_o distance_n so_o that_o when_o i_o have_v prove_v a_o person_n to_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n it_o be_v not_o your_o catholic_n church_n that_o i_o mean_v no_o â—ound_a christian_n be_v a_o member_n of_o you_o it_o be_v heretic_n in_o the_o soft_a sense_n that_o be_v its_o matter_n it_o be_v necessary_a therefore_o that_o we_o first_o agree_v of_o the_o definition_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n before_o we_o dispute_v who_o be_v in_o it_o 2._o your_o word_n proper_o so_o call_v be_v ambiguous_a refer_v either_o to_o the_o etymology_n or_o to_o some_o definition_n in_o a_o authentic_a canon_n or_o to_o custom_n and_o common_a speech_n of_o the_o first_o we_o have_v no_o reason_n now_o to_o enter_v controversy_n for_o the_o second_o i_o know_v no_o such_o establish_v definition_n that_o we_o be_v agree_v on_o for_o the_o three_o custom_n be_v so_o variable_a here_o not_o agree_v with_o itself_o that_o what_o be_v to_o be_v denominate_v proper_a or_o improper_a from_o it_o be_v not_o to_o be_v well_o conjecture_v however_o all_o this_o be_v but_o de_fw-fr nomine_fw-la and_o what_o be_v the_o proper_a and_o what_o the_o improper_a use_n of_o the_o word_n heretic_n be_v no_o article_n of_o faith_n nor_o necessary_a for_o our_o debate_n therefore_o again_o you_o must_v accept_v of_o my_o distinguish_n and_o give_v i_o leave_v to_o fly_v confusion_n 1._o the_o word_n heretic_n be_v either_o speak_v of_o one_o that_o corrupt_v the_o doctrine_n of_o faith_n as_o such_o or_o of_o one_o that_o upon_o some_o difference_n of_o opinion_n or_o some_o personal_a quarrel_n withdraw_v from_o the_o communion_n of_o those_o particular_a church_n that_o before_o he_o hold_v communion_n with_o and_o gather_v a_o separate_a party_n such_o be_v most_o usual_o call_v schismatic_n but_o of_o oâ—d_n the_o name_n heretic_n be_v oft_o apply_v unto_o such_o 2._o the_o word_n heretic_n in_o the_o
follow_v query_n of_o r._n b._n on_o these_o definition_n with_o mr._n johnsons_n answer_n and_o my_o reply_n mr._n j._n the_o catholic_n church_n of_o christ._n the_o catholic_n church_n of_o christ_n be_v all_o those_o visible_a assembly_n congregation_n or_o community_n of_o christian_n who_o live_v in_o unity_n of_o true_a faith_n and_o external_a communion_n one_o with_o another_o and_o in_o dependence_n of_o their_o lawful_a pastor_n r._n b._n of_o the_o church_n qu._n 1._o whether_o you_o exclude_v not_o all_o those_o convert_v among_o infidel_n that_o never_o have_v external_a communion_n with_o nor_o be_v member_n of_o any_o particular_a visible_a church_n of_o which_o you_o mâ—ke_v the_o catholic_n to_o be_v constitute_v mr._n j._n answ._n it_o be_v sufficient_a that_o such_o be_v subject_a to_o the_o supreme_a pastor_n and_o in_o voto_fw-la quantum_fw-la in_o se_fw-la est_fw-la resolve_v to_o be_v of_o that_o particular_a church_n actual_o which_o shall_v or_o may_v be_v assign_v for_o they_o by_o that_o pastor_n to_o be_v include_v in_o my_o definition_n r._n b._n reply_n q_o 1._o repl._n ad_fw-la 1_o m_o 1._o you_o see_v then_o that_o your_o definition_n signify_v nothing_o no_o man_n can_v know_v your_o meaning_n by_o they_o first_o you_o make_v the_o catholic_n church_n to_o consist_v only_o of_o visible_a assembly_n and_o after_o you_o allow_v such_o to_o be_v member_n of_o the_o church_n that_o be_v of_o no_o visible_a assembly_n 2._o you_o now_o mention_v subjection_n to_o the_o supreme_a pastor_n as_o sufficient_a which_o in_o your_o description_n or_o definition_n you_o do_v not_o 3._o if_o to_o be_v only_o in_o voto_fw-la resolve_v to_o be_v of_o a_o particular_a church_n will_v serve_v than_o inexistence_n be_v not_o necessary_a to_o be_v only_o in_o voto_fw-la of_o the_o catholic_n church_n prove_v no_o man_n a_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n but_o prove_v the_o contrary_a because_o it_o be_v terminus_n diminuens_fw-la see_v then_o by_o your_o own_o confession_n inexistence_n in_o a_o particular_a church_n be_v not_o of_o necessity_n to_o inexistence_n in_o the_o catholic_a church_n why_o do_v you_o not_o only_o mention_v it_o in_o your_o definition_n but_o confine_v the_o church_n to_o such_o will_v you_o say_v you_o mean_v in_o voto_fw-la who_o then_o can_v understand_v you_o when_o you_o say_v they_o must_v be_v of_o visible_a assembly_n and_o mean_v they_o need_v not_o be_v of_o any_o but_o only_o to_o wish_v desire_v or_o purpose_v it_o 4._o but_o yet_o you_o say_v nothing_o to_o my_o case_n in_o its_o latitude_n many_o a_o one_o may_v be_v convert_v to_o christ_n by_o a_o solitary_a preacher_n or_o by_o two_o or_o three_o that_o neâ—er_o tell_v he_o that_o there_o be_v any_o supreme_a pastor_n in_o the_o world_n how_o then_o can_v he_o be_v subject_a to_o that_o suppose_a pastor_n that_o never_o hear_v of_o he_o the_o english_a and_o dutch_a convert_v many_o indian_n to_o the_o faith_n of_o christ_n that_o never_o hear_v of_o a_o supreme_a pastor_n 5._o if_o it_o be_v necessary_a that_o a_o particular_a church_n must_v be_v assign_v for_o such_o member_n by_o the_o supreme_a pastor_n than_o they_o be_v yet_o little_a the_o better_a that_o never_o have_v any_o such_o assignation_n from_o he_o as_o few_o have_v r._n b._n qu._n 2._o what_o be_v that_o faith_n in_o unity_n whereof_o all_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n do_v live_v be_v it_o the_o belief_n of_o all_o that_o god_n have_v reveal_v to_o be_v believe_v or_o of_o part_n and_o what_o part_n mr._n j._n answ._n of_o all_o either_o explicit_o or_o implicit_o r._n b._n reply_n reply_v ad_fw-la 2m._o your_o second_o answer_n further_o prove_v that_o your_o definition_n signify_v just_a nothing_o they_o must_v live_v in_o unity_n of_o the_o faith_n that_o be_v either_o with_o faith_n or_o without_o it_o with_o a_o belief_n of_o what_o goâ—_n have_v reveal_v to_o be_v believe_v or_o without_o it_o for_o to_o believe_v any_o point_n implicit_o in_o your_o ordinary_a sense_n be_v not_o to_o believe_v it_o but_o only_o to_o believe_v one_o of_o the_o premise_n whence_o the_o conclusion_n must_v be_v infer_v but_o why_o do_v you_o not_o tell_v i_o what_o you_o mean_v by_o a_o implicit_a faith_n faith_n be_v call_v implicit_a in_o several_a sense_n 1._o when_o several_a truth_n be_v actual_o understand_v and_o believe_v in_o confuso_fw-la or_o in_o gross_a in_o some_o one_o proposition_n which_o contain_v the_o substance_n of_o they_o all_o but_o not_o with_o accurate_a distinct_a conception_n nor_o such_o as_o be_v ripe_a for_o any_o fit_a expression_n this_o indistinct_a immature_n imperfect_a kind_n of_o apprehension_n may_v be_v call_v implicit_a and_o the_o distinct_a and_o more_o digest_v conception_n explicite_fw-la 2._o when_o a_o general_a proposition_n be_v believe_v as_o the_o matter_n of_o our_o faith_n but_o the_o particular_n be_v not_o understand_v or_o not_o believe_v as_o to_o believe_v that_o omne_fw-la animal_n vivit_fw-la not_o know_v whether_o you_o be_v animal_n or_o cadaver_n or_o to_o believe_v that_o all_o that_o be_v in_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o true_a but_o not_o to_o know_v what_o be_v in_o the_o scripture_n 3._o when_o it_o be_v only_o the_o formal_a object_n of_o faith_n that_o be_v believe_v without_o understand_v the_o material_a object_n the_o first_o sort_n of_o these_o i_o confess_v be_v actual_a belief_n though_o indistinct_a but_o i_o suppose_v you_o mean_v not_o this_o 1._o because_o it_o be_v not_o the_o ordinary_a sense_n of_o your_o party_n 2._o because_o else_o you_o damn_v either_o all_o the_o world_n or_o most_o of_o your_o own_o professed-party_n at_o least_o as_o no_o member_n of_o the_o church_n for_o few_o or_o none_o have_v a_o actual_a understanding_n and_o belief_n of_o all_o that_o ever_o god_n reveal_v to_o they_o because_o all_o man_n or_o most_o at_o least_o have_v be_v sinful_o negligent_a in_o search_v after_o and_o receive_v truth_n and_o so_o be_v sinful_o ignorant_a no_o man_n know_v all_o that_o god_n have_v reveal_v or_o that_o he_o ought_v to_o know_v 3._o because_o by_o this_o rule_n it_o be_v impossible_a for_o you_o or_o any_o man_n to_o know_v who_o be_v indeed_o a_o member_n of_o your_o church_n for_o you_o can_v know_v man_n confuse_a knowledge_n or_o know_v that_o it_o extend_v to_o all_o reveal_v for_o if_o you_o speak_v of_o all_o reveal_v in_o general_a or_o in_o scripture_n you_o still_o damn_v all_o or_o most_o in_o your_o own_o sense_n for_o none_o as_o i_o say_v understand_v it_o all_o to_o a_o word_n but_o if_o you_o speak_v of_o all_o which_o that_o particular_a man_n have_v have_v sufficient_a mean_n to_o know_v it_o be_v then_o impossible_a for_o you_o to_o make_v a_o judgement_n of_o any_o man_n faith_n by_o this_o for_o you_o can_v never_o discern_v all_o the_o mean_n internal_a or_o external_a that_o ever_o he_o have_v much_o less_o can_v you_o discern_v whether_o his_o faith_n be_v commensurate_a to_o the_o truth_n so_o far_o reveal_v so_o that_o by_o this_o course_n you_o make_v your_o church_n invisible_a i_o pray_v tell_v i_o how_o you_o can_v avoid_v it_o 2._o the_o second_o sort_n of_o implicit_a belief_n be_v no_o belief_n of_o the_o particular_n at_o all_o a_o animal_n may_v live_v and_o yet_o it_o follow_v not_o that_o you_o be_v alive_a or_o a_o animal_n if_o this_o be_v your_o meaning_n then_o either_o you_o mean_v that_o it_o be_v enough_o if_o all_o be_v believe_v implicit_o beside_o that_o general_a proposition_n or_o you_o mean_v that_o some_o must_v be_v believe_v explicit_o that_o be_v actual_o and_o some_o implicit_o that_o be_v not_o at_o all_o if_o the_o former_a be_v your_o sense_n than_o infidel_n or_o heathen_n may_v be_v of_o your_o church_n for_o a_o man_n may_v believe_v in_o general_a that_o the_o bible_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o true_a and_o yet_o not_o know_v a_o word_n that_o be_v in_o it_o and_o so_o not_o know_v that_o christ_n be_v the_o messiah_n or_o that_o ever_o there_o be_v such_o a_o person_n but_o if_o somewhat_o must_v be_v explicit_o that_o be_v actual_o believe_v the_o question_n that_o you_o shall_v have_v answer_v be_v what_o be_v it_o for_o till_o that_o be_v know_v no_o man_n can_v know_v a_o member_n of_o your_o church_n by_o your_o description_n 3._o if_o you_o take_v implicit_a in_o the_o three_o sense_n then_o implicit_a faith_n be_v either_o divine_a or_o humane_a divine_a when_o the_o divine_a veracity_n be_v the_o formal_a object_n humane_a when_o man_n veracity_n be_v the_o formal_a object_n which_o may_v be_v conjunct_a where_o the_o testimony_n be_v so_o conjunct_a as_o that_o we_o be_v sure_a it_o be_v god_n that_o speak_v by_o man_n who_o be_v therefore_o credible_a because_o god_n infallible_o
be_v of_o your_o church_n because_o it_o be_v so_o little_a catholic_a i_o be_o of_o the_o one_o universal_a church_n which_o contain_v all_o the_o true_a christian_n in_o the_o world_n and_o you_o be_v of_o a_o party_n which_o have_v separate_v itself_o from_o most_o of_o the_o christian_n in_o the_o world_n i_o be_o of_o that_o one_o body_n that_o be_v centre_v in_o christ_n the_o head_n you_o be_v of_o a_o piece_n of_o this_o body_n that_o have_v centre_v in_o a_o man_n and_o oft_o a_o confess_v heretical_a wicked_a man_n who_o you_o take_v while_o he_o live_v to_o be_v the_o infallible_a judge_n and_o foundation_n of_o all_o your_o faith_n and_o hope_n and_o when_o he_o be_v dead_a perhaps_o pronounce_v he_o to_o be_v in_o hell_n as_o bellarmine_n do_v pope_n sixtus_n and_o other_o common_o i_o know_v as_o every_o sect_n have_v a_o kind_n of_o unity_n among_o themselves_o however_o divide_v from_o all_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o church_n so_o also_o have_v you_o but_o nothing_o will_v satisfy_v i_o but_o a_o catholic_a unity_n church_n and_o faith_n so_o much_o be_v premise_v i_o answer_v your_o question_n quest._n 1._o whether_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v a_o true_a church_n in_o the_o apostle_n day_n answ._n the_o word_n church_n signify_v more_o thing_n than_o one_o 1._o sometime_o it_o be_v use_v to_o signify_v the_o whole_a mystical_a body_n of_o christ_n contain_v all_o and_o only_o those_o that_o be_v justify_v who_o bellarmine_n call_v live_v member_n and_o in_o this_o sense_n the_o church_n of_o rome_n in_o the_o apostle_n day_n be_v not_o the_o church_n but_o the_o justify_v member_n be_v part_n of_o the_o church_n 2._o sometime_o it_o be_v use_v to_o signify_v all_o that_o profess_v true_a christianity_n in_o the_o world_n and_o thus_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v not_o the_o church_n but_o part_n of_o it_o 3._o it_o be_v oft_o use_v by_o your_o writer_n to_o signify_v one_o church_n that_o by_o prerogative_n be_v the_o head_n or_o mistress_n of_o all_o christian_n in_o the_o world_n to_o which_o they_o must_v all_o be_v subject_a and_o from_o which_o they_o must_v receive_v their_o name_n as_o the_o kingdom_n of_o mexico_n of_o tripoli_n of_o fez_n etc._n etc._n be_v so_o call_v from_o the_o chief_a city_n of_o the_o same_o name_n and_o from_o which_o they_o receive_v their_o faith_n and_o law_n as_o the_o body_n have_v life_n and_o motion_n from_o the_o head_n or_o heart_n in_o this_o sense_n the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v no_o church_n in_o the_o apostle_n day_n 4._o sometime_o it_o be_v use_v to_o signify_v one_o particular_a church_n associate_v for_o personal_a communion_n in_o worship_n and_o thus_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v a_o true_a church_n in_o the_o apostle_n day_n 5._o sometime_o it_o be_v use_v to_o signify_v a_o collection_n or_o conjunction_n of_o many_o particular_a church_n though_o not_o all_o under_o the_o bishop_n of_o one_o church_n as_o their_o patriarch_n or_o metropolitan_a and_o thus_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v no_o church_n in_o the_o apostle_n day_n but_o about_o two_o hundred_o year_n after_o christ_n it_o be_v it_o be_v only_o the_o church_n in_o the_o three_o of_o these_o sense_n that_o be_v in_o controversy_n between_o the_o roman_a and_o reform_a church_n now_o to_o your_o next_o question_n quest._n 2._o when_o be_v it_o that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n cease_v to_o be_v a_o true_a church_n answ._n in_o the_o first_o second_o and_o three_o sense_n it_o never_o cease_v to_o be_v a_o true_a church_n for_o it_o never_o be_v one_o in_o the_o first_o and_o second_o sense_n it_o never_o be_v one_o either_o in_o title_n or_o claim_n i_o hope_v in_o the_o three_o it_o be_v never_o one_o in_o title_n nor_o yet_o in_o claim_n for_o many_o hundred_o year_n after_o christ_n but_o now_o it_o be_v therefore_o the_o question_n between_o we_o shall_v not_o be_v when_o it_o cease_v but_o when_o it_o begin_v to_o be_v such_o a_o capital_a rule_v church_n essential_a to_o the_o whole_a in_o the_o five_o sense_n it_o never_o cease_v otherwise_o then_o as_o it_o be_v swallow_v up_o in_o a_o high_a title_n it_o begin_v to_o be_v a_o patriarchal_a church_n about_o two_o or_o three_o hundred_o year_n after_o christ_n and_o it_o cease_v to_o be_v mere_o patriarchal_a when_o it_o arrogate_a the_o title_n of_o universal_a or_o mistress_n of_o all_o in_o the_o four_o sense_n the_o question_n be_v not_o so_o easy_a and_o i_o shall_v thus_o answer_v it_o 1._o by_o speak_v to_o the_o use_n of_o the_o question_n 2._o by_o a_o direct_a answer_n to_o it_o 1._o it_o be_v of_o small_a concernment_n to_o my_o salvation_n or_o you_o to_o know_v whether_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v a_o true_a particular_a church_n or_o not_o no_o more_o then_o to_o know_v whether_o the_o church_n of_o thessalonica_n or_o ephesus_n or_o antioch_n be_v now_o a_o true_a church_n in_o charity_n to_o they_o i_o be_o bind_v to_o regard_v it_o as_o i_o be_o bind_v to_o regard_v the_o life_n of_o my_o neighbour_n but_o what_o do_v it_o concern_v my_o own_o life_n to_o know_v whether_o the_o mayor_n and_o alderman_n of_o worcester_n or_o gloucester_n be_v dead_a or_o alive_a so_o what_o do_v it_o concern_v my_o salvation_n to_o know_v whether_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v now_o a_o true_a particular_a church_n if_o i_o live_v at_o the_o antipode_n or_o in_o aethiopia_n and_o have_v never_o hear_v that_o there_o be_v such_o a_o place_n as_o rome_n in_o the_o world_n as_o many_o a_o thousand_o christian_n doubtless_o never_o hear_v of_o it_o this_o will_v not_o hinder_v my_o salvation_n as_o long_o as_o i_o believe_v in_o the_o bless_a trinity_n and_o be_v sanctify_v by_o the_o spirit_n of_o grace_n so_o that_o as_o i_o be_o none_o of_o their_o judge_n so_o i_o know_v not_o that_o it_o much_o concern_v i_o to_o know_v whether_o they_o be_v a_o true_a particular_a church_n save_v for_o charity_n or_o communion_n 2._o yet_o i_o answer_v it_o more_o direct_o 1._o if_o they_o do_v not_o by_o their_o error_n so_o far_o overthrow_v the_o christian_a faith_n which_o they_o profess_v as_o that_o it_o can_v practical_o be_v believe_v by_o they_o then_o be_v they_o a_o true_a particular_a church_n or_o part_n of_o the_o universal_a church_n 2._o and_o i_o be_o apt_a to_o hope_v at_o least_o of_o most_o that_o they_o do_v not_o so_o hold_v their_o error_n but_o that_o they_o retain_v with_o they_o so_o much_o of_o the_o essential_o of_o religion_n as_o may_v denominate_v they_o a_o true_a profess_v church_n more_o plain_o rome_n be_v consider_v first_o as_o christian_a second_o as_o papal_n as_o christian_n it_o be_v a_o true_a church_n as_o papal_a it_o be_v no_o true_a church_n for_o popery_n be_v not_o the_o church_n according_a to_o christ_n institution_n but_o a_o dangerous_a corruption_n in_o the_o church_n as_o a_o leprosy_n be_v not_o the_o man_n but_o the_o disease_n of_o the_o man_n yet_o he_o that_o be_v a_o leper_n may_v be_v a_o mâ—â—_n and_o he_o that_o be_v a_o papist_n may_v be_v a_o christian_n but_o 1._o not_o as_o he_o be_v a_o papist_n 2._o and_o he_o be_v but_o a_o leprous_a or_o disease_a christian._n so_o much_o to_o your_o question_n by_o this_o much_o you_o may_v see_v that_o it_o no_o way_n concern_v i_o to_o prove_v when_o rome_n cease_v to_o be_v a_o true_a church_n for_o if_o you_o mean_v such_o a_o church_n as_o corinth_n philippi_n ephesus_n etc._n etc._n be_v that_o be_v but_o a_o part_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n so_o i_o stick_v not_o much_o save_v in_o point_n of_o charity_n whether_o it_o be_v true_a or_o false_a but_o if_o you_o mean_v as_o your_o party_n do_v a_o mistress_n church_n to_o rule_v the_o whole_a and_o denominate_v the_o catholic_a church_n roman_a so_o i_o say_v its_o usurpation_n be_v not_o cease_v that_o be_v the_o misery_n and_o its_o just_a title_n never_o do_v begin_v and_o its_o claim_n be_v not_o of_o many_o hundred_o year_n after_o christ_n so_o that_o your_o question_n require_v no_o further_a answer_n but_o what_o if_o you_o have_v put_v the_o question_n at_o what_o time_n it_o be_v that_o your_o church_n begin_v to_o claim_v this_o universal_a dominion_n i_o shall_v give_v you_o these_o two_o answer_n 1._o when_o i_o understand_v that_o it_o be_v of_o any_o great_a moment_n to_o the_o decision_n of_o our_o controversy_n i_o shall_v tell_v you_o my_o opinion_n of_o the_o man_n that_o first_o lay_v the_o claim_n and_o the_o year_n when_o 2._o but_o it_o be_v sufficient_a for_o i_o to_o prove_v that_o from_o the_o beginning_n it_o be_v not_o so_o little_o do_v the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n before_o constantine_n day_n dream_v of_o govern_v all_o
pope_n have_v make_v it_o a_o article_n of_o their_o faith_n that_o the_o whole_a substance_n of_o the_o bread_n and_o wine_n be_v turn_v into_o the_o body_n and_o blood_n of_o christ_n so_o that_o there_o be_v leave_v no_o bread_n or_o wine_n but_o only_o that_o colour_n quantity_n and_o taste_n that_o before_o belong_v to_o it_o and_o if_o you_o know_v not_o bread_n when_o you_o eat_v it_o or_o wine_n when_o you_o drink_v it_o and_o when_o the_o sense_n of_o all_o the_o sound_a man_n in_o the_o world_n concur_v with_o you_o be_v it_o not_o vain_a for_o i_o or_o any_o man_n to_o dispute_v with_o you_o can_v you_o have_v any_o thing_n bring_v to_o a_o sure_a judgement_n then_o to_o all_o your_o sense_n and_o yet_o no_o doubt_n but_o your_o seducer_n can_v say_v something_o to_o prove_v that_o bread_n be_v not_o bread_n when_o you_o see_v and_o eat_v it_o no_o wonder_n then_o if_o they_o can_v confute_v i_o but_o do_v they_o indeed_o believe_v themselves_o how_o be_v it_o possible_a there_o be_v no_o exercise_n of_o reason_n and_o belief_n that_o suppose_v not_o the_o certainty_n of_o sense_n if_o i_o can_v know_v bread_n and_o wine_n when_o i_o see_v touch_n â—ast_v they_o then_o can_v i_o know_v the_o pope_n the_o council_n the_o scripture_n the_o priest_n or_o any_o thing_n else_o if_o you_o think_v to_o let_v go_v this_o point_n of_o popery_n and_o hold_v the_o rest_n you_o know_v not_o what_o popery_n be_v for_o a_o pope_n and_o council_n have_v determine_v it_o you_o be_v damn_v by_o they_o for_o deny_v the_o faith_n and_o if_o you_o depart_v from_o the_o infallibility_n of_o their_o rule_n and_o judge_v in_o point_n of_o faith_n or_o at_o least_o from_o the_o obligation_n of_o it_o in_o one_o thing_n they_o will_v confess_v to_o you_o that_o you_o may_v as_o well_o do_v it_o in_o more_o false_a in_o this_o and_o certain_a in_o nothing_o be_v their_o own_o conclusion_n sir_n i_o have_v not_o be_v unwilling_a to_o know_v the_o truth_n have_v a_o soul_n to_o save_v or_o lose_v as_o well_o as_o you_o and_o have_v as_o much_o reason_n to_o be_v loath_a to_o perish_v if_o you_o have_v so_o far_o forfeit_v the_o grace_n of_o god_n as_o mere_o to_o follow_v the_o pride_n of_o a_o pretend_a vice-christ_n that_o have_v turn_v doctrine_n into_o error_n worship_n into_o superstition_n and_o dead_a formality_n light_n into_o darkness_n discipline_n into_o confusion_n mix_v with_o tyranny_n if_o mere_o to_o set_v up_o one_o tyrant_n over_o the_o conscience_n and_o body_n too_o of_o all_o believer_n in_o the_o world_n you_o can_v fall_v into_o a_o sect_n deny_v scripture_n reason_n the_o judgement_n and_o tradition_n of_o most_o of_o the_o church_n and_o your_o own_o and_o all_o man_n eyesight_n taste_n and_o other_o sense_n the_o lord_n have_v mercy_n on_o you_o if_o you_o be_v not_o pass_v it_o i_o have_v do_v with_o you_o yet_o remain_v a_o unfeigned_a desirer_n of_o your_o welfare_n and_o lamenter_n of_o the_o apostasy_n and_o giddiness_n of_o these_o time_n richard_n baxter_n may._n 18._o 1659._o do_v you_o know_v what_o it_o be_v by_o loose_a and_o false_a allegation_n to_o be_v put_v to_o read_v so_o many_o volume_n in_o great_a part_n in_o folio_n to_o try_v whether_o the_o alledger_n say_v true_a or_o false_a you_o will_v not_o expect_v that_o i_o shall_v return_v a_o answer_n and_o read_v so_o much_o of_o so_o many_o folio_n in_o any_o less_o than_o ten_o or_o eleven_o day_n which_o i_o think_v have_v be_v all_o that_o i_o have_v have_v to_o write_v and_o read_v so_o much_o the_o reader_n must_v take_v notice_n that_o i_o write_v the_o former_a letter_n to_o the_o person_n that_o send_v mr._n jonson_n letter_n with_o a_o charitable_a jealousy_n that_o if_o he_o be_v himself_o in_o doubt_n he_o may_v be_v resolve_v but_o in_o his_o return_n he_o full_o disclaim_v popery_n and_o assure_v i_o that_o it_o be_v for_o the_o sake_n of_o some_o friend_n that_o he_o desire_v my_o labour_n and_o not_o for_o his_o own_o r._n b._n the_o reply_n to_o mr._n jonson_n second_o paper_n sir_n the_o multitude_n and_o urgency_n of_o my_o employment_n give_v i_o not_o leave_v till_o this_o day_n may_n 2._o so_o much_o as_o to_o read_v over_o all_o your_o paper_n but_o i_o shall_v be_v as_o loath_a to_o break_v off_o our_o disputation_n as_o you_o can_v be_v though_o perhaps_o necessity_n may_v sometime_o cause_v some_o week_n delay_n and_o again_o i_o profess_v my_o indignation_n against_o the_o hypocrital_a juggle_a of_o this_o age_n do_v provoke_v i_o to_o welcome_v so_o ingenuous_a and_o candid_a a_o disputant_n as_o yourself_o with_o great_a content_n but_o i_o must_v confess_v also_o that_o i_o be_v the_o less_o hasty_a in_o send_v you_o this_o reply_n because_o i_o desire_v you_o may_v have_v leisure_n to_o peruse_v a_o book_n which_o i_o publish_v since_o your_o last_o a_o key_n for_o catholic_n see_v that_o i_o have_v there_o answer_v you_o already_o and_o that_o more_o large_o than_o i_o be_o like_a to_o do_v in_o this_o reply_n for_o the_o sharpness_n of_o that_o i_o must_v crave_v your_o patience_n the_o person_n and_o cause_n i_o think_v require_v it_o ad_fw-la 1m._o what_o explication_n be_v make_v to_o your_o friend_n of_o your_o thesis_n i_o can_v not_o take_v notice_n of_o who_o have_v nothing_o but_o your_o writing_n to_o answer_n 2._o if_o you_o will_v not_o be_v precise_a in_o argue_v you_o have_v little_a reason_n to_o expect_v much_o less_o so_o strict_o to_o exact_v a_o precise_a answer_n which_o can_v be_v make_v as_o you_o prescribe_v to_o a_o argument_n not_o precise_a 3._o i_o therefore_o expect_v according_o that_o the_o unlearned_a be_v not_o make_v the_o judge_n of_o a_o dispute_n which_o they_o be_v not_o fit_a to_o judge_v of_o see_v you_o desire_v we_o to_o avoid_v their_o road_n 4._o again_o i_o say_v if_o you_o will_v not_o be_v precise_a in_o argue_v i_o can_v hardly_o be_v so_o in_o answer_v and_o by_o a_o congregation_n of_o christian_n you_o may_v mean_v christians_o political_o relate_v to_o one_o head_n whether_o christ_n or_o the_o pope_n but_o the_o word_n assembly_n express_v their_o actual_a assemble_v together_o and_o so_o exclude_v all_o christian_n that_o be_v or_o be_v member_n of_o no_o particular_a assembly_n from_o have_v relation_n as_o member_n of_o christ_n our_o head_n or_o the_o pope_n your_o head_n and_o so_o from_o be_v of_o the_o congregation_n as_o you_o call_v the_o church_n universal_a 5._o i_o have_v great_a reason_n to_o avoid_v the_o snare_n of_o a_o equivocation_n or_o ambiguity_n of_o which_o you_o give_v i_o cause_n of_o jealousy_n by_o your_o whatsoever_o as_o i_o tell_v you_o as_o seem_v to_o intimate_v a_o false_a supposition_n to_o your_o like_a i_o answer_v it_o be_v unlike_a and_o still_o more_o intimate_v the_o false_a supposition_n whatsoever_o congregation_n of_o man_n be_v the_o commonwealth_n of_o england_n be_v a_o phrase_n that_o import_v that_o there_o be_v a_o congregation_n of_o man_n which_o be_v not_o the_o commonwealth_n of_o england_n which_o be_v true_a there_o be_v more_o man_n in_o the_o world_n so_o whatsoever_o congregation_n of_o christian_n be_v now_o the_o true_a church_n do_v seem_v to_o import_v that_o you_o suppose_v there_o be_v a_o congregation_n of_o christian_n univocal_o so_o call_v that_o be_v not_o the_o true_a church_n which_o you_o will_v distinguish_v from_o the_o other_o which_o i_o only_o let_v you_o know_v at_o the_o entrance_n that_o i_o deny_v that_o you_o may_v not_o think_v it_o grant_v yet_o i_o must_v tell_v you_o that_o nothing_o be_v more_o ordinary_a then_o for_o the_o body_n to_o be_v say_v to_o do_v that_o which_o a_o part_n of_o it_o only_o do_v as_o that_o the_o church_n administer_v sacrament_n discipline_n teathe_v etc._n etc._n the_o church_n be_v assemble_v in_o such_o a_o council_n etc._n etc._n when_o yet_o it_o be_v but_o a_o small_a part_n of_o the_o church_n that_o do_v these_o thing_n and_o when_o bellarmine_n gretser_n etc._n etc._n say_v the_o church_n be_v the_o infallible_a judge_n of_o controversy_n of_o faith_n they_o mean_v not_o the_o whole_a church_n which_o contain_v every_o christian_a when_o they_o tell_v you_o that_o it_o be_v the_o pope_n they_o mean_v and_o therefore_o i_o have_v reason_n to_o inquire_v into_o your_o sense_n unless_o i_o will_v wilful_o be_v overreach_v you_o now_o satisfy_v i_o that_o you_o mean_v it_o universal_o viz._n â—ll_o that_o congregation_n or_o church_n of_o christian_n which_o be_v now_o the_o true_a church_n of_o christ_n do_v acknowledge_v etc._n etc._n which_o i_o tell_v you_o i_o deny_v 6._o to_o my_o follow_a distinction_n you_o say_v that_o all_o the_o world_n know_v that_o whatsoever_o be_v acknowledge_v
guide_v or_o inspire_v he_o this_o be_v at_o once_o to_o believe_v a_o humane_a and_o divine_a veracity_n if_o any_o of_o this_o be_v your_o meaning_n the_o last_o question_n remain_v still_o to_o be_v resolve_v by_o you_o a_o man_n may_v believe_v that_o god_n be_v true_a and_o that_o his_fw-la prophet_n or_o inspire_a messenger_n be_v true_a and_o yet_o not_o understand_v a_o word_n of_o the_o message_n so_o that_o still_o if_o this_o will_v serve_v a_o man_n may_v be_v of_o your_o church_n that_o know_v not_o that_o ever_o there_o be_v such_o a_o person_n as_o jesus_n christ_n or_o that_o ever_o he_o die_v for_o our_o sin_n or_o rise_v again_o or_o that_o we_o shall_v rise_v and_o be_v infidel_n of_o your_o church_n while_o you_o be_v argue_v we_o out_o but_o if_o there_o be_v some_o truth_n beside_o the_o veracity_n of_o god_n and_o his_o messenger_n that_o must_v be_v believe_v you_o must_v show_v what_o it_o be_v or_o your_o church-member_n can_v be_v know_v tell_v i_o therefore_o without_o tergiversation_n what_o be_v the_o reveal_v truth_n that_o must_v actual_o be_v believe_v or_o what_o be_v the_o faith_n material_o in_o unity_n whereof_o all_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n do_v live_v i_o pray_v fly_v not_o but_o plain_o tell_v i_o and_o if_o again_o you_o fly_v to_o uncertain_a point_n because_o of_o the_o diversity_n of_o mean_n of_o information_n and_o say_v it_o must_v be_v so_o much_o to_o every_o man_n as_o he_o have_v mean_n to_o know_v i_o again_o answer_v you_o 1._o if_o a_o man_n have_v no_o mean_n to_o know_v that_o there_o be_v a_o christ_n it_o seem_v than_o he_o be_v one_o of_o your_o church_n 2._o you_o still_o damn_v all_o your_o own_o there_o be_v not_o a_o man_n that_o know_v all_o that_o he_o have_v mean_n to_o know_v because_o all_o have_v culpable_o neglect_v mean_n and_o so_o you_o have_v no_o church_n 3._o still_o you_o make_v your_o church_n invisible_a if_o you_o have_v any_o for_o no_o man_n can_v tell_v as_o i_o say_v who_o know_v in_o full_a proportion_n to_o his_o help_n and_o mean_n do_v you_o not_o see_v now_o whither_o your_o implicit_a faith_n have_v bring_v you_o r._n b._n qu._n 3._o be_v it_o any_o lawful_a pastor_n or_o all_o that_o must_v necessary_o be_v depend_v on_o by_o every_o member_n and_o who_o be_v these_o pastor_n mr._n j._n answ._n of_o all_o respective_o to_o each_o subject_n that_o be_v that_o the_o authority_n of_o none_o of_o they_o mediate_a or_o immediate_a be_v reject_v or_o contemn_v by_o he_o that_o be_v a_o true_a member_n of_o the_o church_n r._n b._n reply_n ad_fw-la qu._n 3._o r._n reply_n 1._o here_o still_o you_o tell_v i_o that_o your_o description_n signify_v nothing_o you_o tell_v i_o that_o the_o member_n must_v live_v in_fw-la dependence_n on_o their_o lawful_a pastor_n and_o now_o you_o tell_v i_o that_o their_o authority_n must_v not_o be_v reject_v or_o contemn_v and_o indeed_o be_v dependence_n and_o non-rejection_n all_o one_o the_o million_o of_o heathen_n that_o never_o hear_v of_o the_o pope_n or_o any_o of_o your_o pastor_n reject_v they_o not_o nor_o contemn_v they_o be_v they_o therefore_o fit_a matter_n for_o your_o church_n 2._o if_o you_o say_v that_o you_o mean_v it_o of_o such_o only_a as_o have_v a_o sufficient_a revelation_n of_o the_o authority_n of_o these_o pastor_n i_o further_a reply_n 1._o it_o seem_v than_o it_o be_v not_o only_o the_o pope_n but_o every_o priest_n respective_o that_o be_v a_o essential_a member_n of_o your_o church_n or_o to_o who_o each_o member_n must_v be_v subject_a necessary_o add_v esse_fw-la if_o so_o than_o every_o man_n that_o by_o fall_v out_o or_o prejudice_n do_v culpable_o reject_v the_o authority_n of_o any_o one_o pastor_n or_o priest_n among_o a_o swarm_n be_v damn_v or_o none_o of_o the_o church_n though_o he_o believe_v in_o the_o pope_n and_o in_o twenty_o thousand_o priest_n beside_o 2._o and_o then_o have_v we_o not_o cause_n to_o pray_v god_n to_o bless_v we_o from_o the_o company_n of_o your_o priest_n or_o at_o least_o that_o we_o may_v not_o have_v too_o many_o when_o among_o a_o multitude_n we_o may_v be_v in_o danger_n of_o reject_v some_o one_o and_o then_o we_o be_v cast_v out_o of_o the_o church_n what_o if_o a_o gentleman_n shall_v find_v some_o such_o as_o watson_n or_o montaltus_n describe_v in_o bed_n with_o his_o wife_n or_o a_o prince_n find_v a_o garnet_n a_o campion_n or_o a_o parson_n in_o a_o treason_n and_o by_o such_o a_o temptation_n shall_v be_v so_o weak_a as_o to_o contemn_v or_o reject_v the_o authority_n of_o that_o single_a priest_n while_o he_o honour_v all_o the_o rest_n be_v it_o certain_a that_o such_o a_o man_n be_v none_o of_o the_o catholic_a church_n for_o that_o how_o hard_o be_v it_o in_o france_n and_o italy_n then_o to_o be_v a_o catholic_a where_o priest_n be_v so_o numerous_a that_o its_o ten_o to_o one_o but_o among_o the_o crowd_n the_o authority_n of_o some_o one_o may_v be_v reject_v 3._o but_o be_v it_o all_o the_o priest_n that_o we_o never_o know_v or_o know_v not_o to_o be_v priest_n that_o we_o must_v depend_v on_o or_o be_v it_o only_o those_o who_o authority_n be_v manifest_v to_o we_o by_o sufficient_a evidence_n doubtless_o you_o will_v confine_v our_o dependence_n to_o these_o only_a or_o else_o no_o man_n can_v be_v a_o christian_n and_o if_o so_o you_o know_v we_o be_v never_o the_o near_o a_o resolution_n for_o your_o answer_n till_o you_o yet_o tell_v we_o how_o we_o must_v know_v our_o pastor_n to_o have_v authority_n indeed_o what_o if_o they_o show_v i_o the_o bishop_n order_n and_o i_o know_v that_o many_o have_v have_v forge_v order_n be_o i_o bind_v to_o believe_v in_o his_o authority_n what_o if_o i_o be_v utter_o ignorant_a whether_o he_o that_o ordain_v he_o be_v himself_o ordain_v or_o have_v intentionem_fw-la ordinandi_fw-la how_o shall_v i_o then_o be_v sure_a of_o his_o authority_n that_o be_v ordain_v and_o how_o can_v the_o people_n be_v acquaint_v with_o the_o passage_n in_o election_n and_o ordination_n that_o be_v necessary_a to_o the_o knowledge_n of_o their_o authority_n especial_o of_o the_o pope_n and_o prelate_n and_o what_o if_o you_o tell_v i_o your_o own_o opinion_n of_o the_o sufficient_a mean_n by_o which_o i_o must_v be_v convince_v of_o the_o pope_n and_o priest_n authority_n how_o shall_v i_o know_v that_o you_o be_v not_o deceive_v and_o that_o these_o be_v the_o sufficient_a mean_n indeed_o unless_o a_o general_n council_n have_v define_v they_o to_o be_v sufficient_a and_o if_o they_o have_v if_o it_o be_v not_o as_o a_o article_n of_o faith_n you_o will_v say_v i_o be_o not_o bind_v of_o necessity_n to_o believe_v their_o definition_n and_o what_o if_o i_o have_v sufficient_a mean_n to_o know_v the_o authority_n of_o a_o thousand_o priest_n but_o be_o culpable_o ignorant_a of_o it_o in_o some_o few_o through_o my_o neglect_n do_v it_o follow_v that_o therefore_o i_o be_o out_o of_o the_o church_n be_v my_o obedience_n to_o each_o priest_n as_o necessary_a as_o my_o belief_n of_o every_o article_n of_o my_o faith_n if_o so_o i_o know_v not_o whether_o your_o multiply_a article_n or_o multiply_a priest_n do_v fill_v hell_n fast_o if_o man_n must_v be_v judge_v by_o your_o law_n but_o it_o be_v our_o allegiance_n to_o our_o sovereign_n that_o be_v the_o character_n of_o a_o subject_a in_o the_o commonwealth_n and_o not_o our_o allegiance_n or_o duty_n to_o every_o inferior_a magistrate_n the_o rejection_n of_o one_o of_o they_o may_v stand_v with_o subjection_n though_o not_o with_o innocency_n it_o be_v not_o treason_n to_o reject_v a_o constable_n why_o then_o shall_v more_o be_v necessary_a to_o our_o church-membership_a and_o salvation_n but_o still_o you_o make_v your_o church_n invisible_a for_o as_o no_o man_n can_v know_v that_o live_v in_o the_o remote_a part_n of_o the_o world_n whether_o your_o pope_n themselves_o be_v true_o pope_n as_o be_v due_o qualify_v and_o elect_v nor_o which_o be_v the_o true_a pope_n when_o you_o have_v oft_o have_v more_o than_o one_o at_o once_o so_o you_o can_v never_o know_v concern_v your_o member_n whether_o their_o dependence_n on_o their_o pastor_n be_v extensive_o proportionate_a to_o the_o mean_n that_o discover_v their_o authority_n and_o whether_o their_o disobedience_n unchurch_n they_o or_o no_o i_o earnest_o crave_v your_o answer_n to_o the_o thirty_o uncertainty_n which_o i_o have_v mention_v in_o my_o safe_a religion_n p._n 93_o to_o 104._o and_o tell_v we_o how_o all_o our_o pastor_n may_v be_v know_v and_o whether_o every_o particular_a sin_n unchurch_n man_n and_o if_o not_o why_o the_o contempt_n or_o rejection_n of_o a_o drunken_a priest_n do_v it_o while_o
jure_fw-la divino_fw-la you_o confess_v you_o be_v but_o a_o humane_a policy_n or_o society_n and_o therefore_o that_o no_o man_n need_v to_o fear_v the_o loss_n of_o his_o salvation_n by_o renounce_v you_o r._n b._n qu._n 2._o how_o shall_v we_o know_v who_o have_v this_o power_n what_o election_n or_o consecration_n be_v necessary_a thereto_o if_o i_o know_v not_o who_o have_v it_o i_o be_o never_o the_o better_a mr._n j._n answ._n as_o you_o know_v who_o have_v temporal_a power_n by_o a_o universal_a or_o most_o common_a consent_n of_o the_o people_n the_o election_n be_v different_a according_a to_o different_a time_n place_n and_o other_o circumstance_n episcopal_a consecration_n be_v not_o absolute_o necessary_a r._n b._n reply_n qu._n 2._o repl._n 1_o how_o now_o be_v all_o the_o mystery_n of_o your_o succession_n and_o mission_n resolve_v into_o popular_a consent_n be_v no_o one_o way_n of_o election_n necessary_a do_v you_o leave_v that_o to_o be_v vary_v as_o a_o thing_n indifferent_a and_o be_v episcopal_a consecration_n also_o unnecessary_a i_o pray_v you_o here_o again_o remember_v then_o that_o none_o of_o our_o church_n be_v disable_v from_o the_o plea_n of_o a_o continue_a succession_n for_o want_v of_o episcopal_a consecration_n or_o any_o way_n of_o election_n if_o our_o pastor_n have_v have_v the_o people_n consent_n they_o have_v be_v true_a pastor_n according_a to_o this_o reckon_n and_o if_o they_o have_v now_o their_o consent_n they_o be_v true_a pastor_n but_o we_o have_v more_o 2._o by_o this_o rule_n we_o can_v know_v of_o one_o bishop_n of_o a_o hundred_o whether_o he_o be_v a_o bishop_n or_o no_o for_o we_o can_v know_v that_o he_o have_v the_o common_a consent_n of_o the_o people_n yea_o we_o know_v that_o abundance_n of_o your_o bishop_n have_v no_o such_o consent_n yea_o we_o know_v that_o your_o pope_n have_v none_o of_o the_o consent_n of_o most_o of_o the_o christian_n in_o the_o world_n nor_o for_o aught_o you_o or_o any_o man_n know_v of_o most_o in_o europe_n it_o be_v few_o of_o your_o own_o party_n that_o know_v who_o be_v pope_n much_o less_o be_v call_v to_o consent_v till_o after_o he_o be_v settle_v in_o possession_n 3._o according_a to_o this_o rule_n your_o succession_n have_v be_v frequent_o interrupt_v when_o against_o the_o will_n of_o general_a council_n and_o of_o the_o far_o great_a part_n of_o christian_n your_o pope_n have_v keep_v the_o seat_n by_o force_n 4._o in_o temporal_n your_o rule_n be_v not_o universal_o true_a what_o if_o the_o people_n be_v engage_v to_o one_o prince_n and_o afterward_o break_v their_o vow_n and_o consent_n to_o a_o usurper_n though_o in_o this_o ease_n a_o particular_a person_n may_v be_v oblige_v to_o submission_n and_o obedience_n in_o judicial_a administration_n yet_o the_o usurper_n can_v thereby_o defend_v his_o right_n and_o justify_v his_o possession_n nor_o the_o people_n justify_v their_o adhesion_n to_o he_o while_o they_o lie_v under_o a_o obligation_n to_o disclaim_v he_o because_o of_o their_o preengagement_n to_o another_o though_o some_o part_n of_o the_o truth_n be_v find_v in_o your_o assertion_n r._n b._n qu._n 3._o will_v any_o diocese_n serve_v ad_fw-la esse_fw-la what_o if_o it_o be_v but_o in_o particular_a assembly_n mr._n j._n answ._n it_o must_v be_v more_o than_o a_o parish_n or_o then_o one_o single_a congregation_n which_o have_v not_o different_a inferior_a pastor_n and_o one_o who_o be_v their_o superior_a r._n b._n reply_n qu._n 3._o repl._n this_o be_v but_o your_o naked_a affirmation_n i_o have_v prove_v the_o contrary_a from_o scripture_n father_n and_o council_n in_o my_o disputation_n of_o episcopacy_n viz._n that_o a_o bishop_n may_v be_v and_o of_o old_a ordinary_o be_v over_o the_o presbyter_n only_o of_o one_o parish_n or_o single_a congregation_n or_o a_o people_n no_o more_o numerous_a than_o our_o parish_n you_o must_v show_v we_o some_o scripture_n or_o general_a council_n for_o the_o contrary_a before_o we_o can_v be_v sure_a you_o here_o speak_v truth_n be_v gregory_n thaumaturgus_n no_o bishop_n because_o when_o he_o come_v first_o to_o neocaesarea_n he_o have_v but_o seventeen_o soul_n in_o his_o charge_n the_o like_a i_o may_v say_v of_o many_o more_o mr._n j._n tradition_n i_o understand_v by_o tradition_n the_o visible_a delivery_n from_o hand_n to_o hand_n in_o all_o age_n of_o the_o reveal_v word_n of_o god_n either_o write_v or_o unwritten_a r._n b._n of_o tradition_n qu._n 1._o but_o all_o the_o doubt_n be_v by_o who_o this_o tradition_n that_o be_v valid_a must_v be_v by_o your_o pastor_n or_o people_n or_o both_o by_o pope_n or_o council_n or_o bishop_n disjunct_n by_o the_o major_a part_n of_o the_o church_n or_o bishop_n or_o presbyter_n or_o the_o minor_a and_o by_o how_o many_o mr._n j._n answ._n by_o such_o and_o so_o many_o proportionable_o as_o suffice_v in_o a_o kingdom_n to_o certify_v the_o people_n which_o be_v the_o ancient_n universal_o receive_v custom_n in_o that_o kingdom_n which_o be_v to_o be_v moral_o consider_v r._n b._n reply_n of_o tradition_n qu._n 1._o repl._n i_o consent_v to_o this_o general_a but_o then_o 1._o how_o certain_o be_v tradition_n against_o you_o when_o most_o of_o the_o christian_a world_n yea_o all_o except_o a_o interest_v party_n do_v deny_v your_o sovereignty_n and_o plead_v tradition_n against_o it_o and_o how_o lame_a be_v your_o tradition_n when_o it_o be_v carry_v on_o your_o private_a affirmation_n and_o be_v nothing_o but_o the_o unproved_a say_n of_o a_o sect_n r._n b._n qu._n 2._o what_o proof_n or_o notice_n of_o it_o must_v satisfy_v i_o in_o particular_a that_o it_o so_o past_a mr._n j._n answ._n such_o as_o with_o proportion_n be_v a_o sufficient_a proof_n or_o notice_n of_o the_o law_n and_o custom_n of_o temporal_a kingdom_n r._n b._n reply_n qu._n 2._o repl._n but_o be_v it_o necessary_a for_o every_o christian_a to_o be_v able_a to_o weigh_v the_o credit_n of_o contradict_a party_n when_o one_o half_a of_o the_o world_n faith_n one_o thing_n and_o the_o other_o another_o thing_n what_o opportunity_n have_v ordinary_a christian_n to_o compare_v they_o and_o discern_v the_o moral_a advantage_n on_o each_o side_n as_o in_o the_o case_n of_o the_o pope_n sovereignty_n when_o two_o or_o three_o part_n of_o the_o christian_a world_n be_v against_o it_o and_o the_o rest_n for_o it_o can_v private_a christian_n try_v which_o party_n be_v the_o more_o credible_a or_o be_v it_o necessary_a to_o their_o salvation_n if_o so_o they_o be_v cast_v upon_o unavoidable_a despair_n if_o not_o must_v they_o all_o take_v the_o word_n of_o their_o present_a teacher_n then_o most_o of_o the_o world_n must_v believe_v against_o you_o because_o most_o of_o the_o teacher_n be_v against_o you_o and_o then_o it_o seem_v man_n faith_n be_v resolve_v into_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o parish-priest_n or_o their_o confessor_n the_o law_n of_o a_o kingdom_n may_v be_v easy_o know_v than_o christian_a doctrine_n can_v be_v know_v especial_o such_o as_o be_v controvert_v among_o we_o by_o mere_a unwritten_a tradition_n kingdom_n be_v of_o narrow_a compass_n than_o the_o world_n and_o though_o the_o sense_n of_o law_n be_v oft_o in_o question_n yet_o the_o be_v of_o they_o be_v seldom_o matter_n of_o controversy_n because_o man_n converse_v constant_o and_o familiar_o with_o each_o other_o may_v plain_o and_o full_o reveal_v their_o mind_n when_o god_n that_o condescend_v not_o to_o such_o a_o familiarity_n have_v deliver_v his_o mind_n by_o inspire_a person_n long_o ago_o with_o much_o less_o sensible_a advantage_n because_o it_o be_v a_o life_n of_o faith_n that_o he_o direct_v we_o to_o live_v mr._n j._n general_n council_n a_o general_a council_n i_o take_v to_o be_v a_o assembly_n of_o bishop_n and_o other_o chief_a prelate_n call_v convene_v and_o confirm_v by_o those_o who_o have_v sufficient_a spiritual_a authority_n to_o call_v convene_v and_o confirm_v r._n b._n of_o a_o general_n council_n qu._n 1._o who_o be_v it_o ad_fw-la esse_fw-la that_o must_v call_v convene_v confirm_v it_o till_o i_o know_v that_o i_o be_o never_o the_o near_o know_v what_o a_o council_n be_v and_o which_o be_v one_o indeed_o mr._n j._n answ._n definition_n abstract_a from_o inferior_a subdivision_n for_o your_o satisfaction_n i_o affirm_v it_o belong_v to_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n r._n b._n reply_n qu._n 1._o repl._n 1_o if_o it_o be_v necessary_a to_o the_o be_v or_o validity_n of_o a_o council_n that_o it_o be_v call_v or_o confirm_v by_o the_o pope_n than_o your_o definition_n signify_v nothing_o if_o you_o abstract_a from_o that_o which_o be_v so_o necessary_a a_o ingredient_n unless_o it_o be_v presuppose_v to_o be_v understand_v 2._o if_o it_o belong_v to_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n to_o call_v a_o council_n as_o necessary_a to_o its_o be_v
issue_n which_o have_v be_v so_o calm_o and_o sober_o prosecute_v i_o be_o a_o enemy_n to_o passion_n and_o as_o i_o have_v hitherto_o find_v you_o sweet_a and_o gentle_a in_o your_o proceed_n towards_o i_o so_o shall_v you_o always_o find_v i_o worthy_a sir_n your_o friend_n to_o serve_v you_o william_n johnson_n may_v 2._o 1659._o sir_n be_v please_v to_o return_v your_o answer_n paper_n or_o letter_n which_o you_o intend_v for_o i_o to_o the_o same_o place_n to_o which_o you_o direct_v your_o former_a by_o which_o mean_n i_o shall_v be_v secure_a to_o receive_v they_o at_o my_o house_n which_o be_v fourscore_o mile_n from_o london_n to_o mr._n t._n l._n who_o call_v i_o to_o this_o work_n sir_n though_o i_o be_o a_o stranger_n to_o you_o i_o think_v meet_v to_o take_v notice_n of_o the_o letter_n which_o you_o send_v your_o friend_n here_o t._n h._n it_o seem_v you_o urge_v hard_a for_o a_o reply_n and_o intimate_v somewhat_o of_o triumph_n in_o my_o delay_n you_o speak_v as_o a_o incompetent_a judge_n god_n be_v the_o master_n of_o my_o time_n and_o work_n and_o he_o i_o must_v serve_v and_o not_o neglect_v his_o great_a work_n for_o such_o trivial_a objection_n as_o your_o friend_n have_v send_v i_o which_o be_v answer_v over_o and_o over_o by_o many_o so_o long_o ago_o have_v you_o read_v blondel_n molineus_n de_fw-fr novitate_fw-la papismi_fw-la whitaker_n sibrandus_fw-la lubbertus_n chamier_n abbot_n crakenthorp_n spalatensis_n or_o one_o of_o many_o that_o have_v confute_v they_o you_o will_v sure_o call_v for_o no_o more_o or_o if_o in_o english_a you_o have_v read_v dr._n field_n dr._n white_a yea_o or_o but_o sir_n humphrey_n lind_n to_o pass_v by_o multitude_n you_o may_v have_v see_v their_o vanity_n yea_o plain_o read_v impartial_o my_o two_o book_n against_o popery_n and_o be_v a_o papist_n if_o you_o can_v but_o it_o seem_v you_o take_v it_o for_o a_o poor_a answer_n to_o be_v refer_v to_o book_n do_v not_o fear_v it_o but_o yet_o let_v i_o tell_v you_o that_o my_o hand_n be_v not_o more_o legible_a than_o my_o print_a book_n and_o if_o i_o have_v send_v you_o this_o in_o print_n will_v that_o have_v make_v it_o a_o poor_a answer_n or_o rather_o be_v not_o this_o a_o poor_a exception_n and_o show_v that_o it_o be_v not_o truth_n that_o be_v look_v after_o for_o truth_n may_v be_v print_v as_o well_o as_o write_v if_o you_o be_v deceive_v by_o the_o man_n of_o the_o papal_a way_n let_v i_o yet_o entreat_v you_o but_o to_o read_v over_o those_o two_o book_n the_o safe_a religion_n and_o the_o key_n for_o catholic_n if_o your_o soul_n be_v not_o worth_a so_o much_o labour_n take_v your_o course_n i_o do_v my_o duty_n but_o i_o must_v say_v that_o it_o be_v doleful_a case_n that_o professor_n be_v so_o ungrounded_a that_o such_o vanity_n shall_v carry_v they_o away_o from_o catholic_a verity_n and_o unity_n to_o a_o faction_n that_o usurp_v the_o name_n of_o catholic_n to_o be_v free_a with_o you_o i_o think_v it_o be_v that_o pride_n and_o levity_n that_o bring_v they_o first_o to_o separation_n from_o our_o church_n into_o sect_n and_o the_o guilt_n which_o they_o there_o incur_v that_o prepare_v professor_n to_o be_v so_o far_o forsake_v of_o god_n as_o to_o be_v give_v up_o to_o believe_v a_o lie_n and_o to_o turn_v papist_n o_o dreadful_a case_n that_o one_o bishop_n can_v swell_v in_o pride_n but_o man_n must_v make_v a_o religion_n of_o his_o pride_n yea_o and_o make_v a_o catholic_a church_n of_o it_o yea_o and_o plead_v for_o it_o and_o make_v the_o sin_n their_o own_o yea_o condemn_v all_o christian_n that_o list_v not_o themselves_o under_o this_o prince_n of_o pride_n he_o be_v culpable_o if_o not_o wilful_o blind_a that_o have_v read_v scripture_n and_o church_n history_n and_o know_v not_o that_o the_o pope_n for_o three_o hundred_o year_n after_o christ_n be_v not_o the_o creature_n that_o now_o he_o be_v nor_o have_v for_o most_o of_o that_o time_n any_o more_o government_n over_o other_o bishop_n than_o i_o have_v over_o neighbour_n pastor_n and_o after_o that_o time_n he_o be_v no_o more_o a_o universal_a head_n or_o governor_n or_o vicar_n of_o christ_n than_o the_o archbishop_n of_o canterbury_n be_v have_v indeed_o a_o far_o large_a diocese_n than_o he_o but_o never_o be_v more_o than_o the_o swell_a primate_n of_o one_o national_a imperial_a church_n when_o synod_n begin_v to_o be_v gather_v out_o of_o a_o principality_n the_o emperor_n desire_v that_o mean_n of_o unity_n within_o their_o empire_n the_o pride_n of_o the_o prelate_n set_v they_o present_o a_o strive_v for_o superiority_n who_o shall_v sit_v high_a and_o write_v his_o name_n first_o and_o have_v the_o large_a diocese_n &_o c_o and_o now_o man_n make_v a_o religion_n of_o the_o fruit_n of_o this_o abominable_a pride_n what_o be_v all_o their_o dispute_n for_o and_o all_o this_o stir_n that_o they_o make_v in_o the_o world_n but_o to_o set_v up_o one_o man_n over_o all_o the_o earth_n and_o that_o to_o do_v a_o spiritual_a work_n which_o consist_v not_o with_o force_n but_o be_v manage_v on_o conscience_n one_o wretched_a man_n must_v govern_v the_o antipode_n on_o the_o other_o side_n of_o the_o earth_n that_o be_v indeed_o uncapable_a of_o true_o and_o just_o govern_v the_o city_n of_o rome_n itself_o pope_n that_o their_o own_o council_n have_v condemn_v for_o ravish_a maid_n and_o wife_n at_o their_o door_n for_o murder_n simony_n drunkenness_n heresy_n deny_v the_o resurrection_n and_o the_o life_n to_o come_v that_o be_v be_v no_o christian_n these_o forsooth_o must_v be_v the_o universal_a governor_n or_o we_o be_v all_o undo_v and_o we_o be_v damn_v if_o we_o believe_v it_o not_o o_o how_o dreadful_a be_v the_o effect_n of_o sin_n and_o how_o great_a a_o judgement_n be_v a_o blind_a mind_n this_o come_v of_o fall_v into_o sect_n and_o party_n which_o lead_v man_n into_o the_o gulf_n of_o the_o most_o odious_a schism_n even_a popery_n in_o the_o world_n but_o if_o you_o be_v engage_v in_o this_o party_n it_o be_v two_o to_o one_o but_o you_o be_v present_o make_v partial_a and_o will_v not_o so_o much_o as_o read_v what_o be_v against_o they_o or_o will_v believe_v they_o if_o they_o do_v but_o tell_v you_o that_o we_o write_v lie_n when_o they_o be_v thing_n do_v in_o the_o open_a sun_n and_o which_o they_o can_v confute_v nor_o dare_v attempt_n leâ—t_v they_o manifest_v their_o shame_n take_v from_o they_o their_o clergy_n vast_a dominion_n principality_n land_n and_o lordship_n riches_n and_o worldly_a honour_n with_o which_o they_o so_o much_o abound_v and_o then_o try_v how_o many_o will_v plead_v for_o the_o pope_n then_o they_o will_v say_v if_o baâ—l_v be_v a_o god_n let_v he_o plead_v for_o himself_o but_o i_o confess_v i_o have_v little_a hope_n of_o turn_v any_o of_o they_o though_o i_o can_v show_v it_o they_o write_v by_o a_o angel_n from_o heaven_n that_o popery_n be_v a_o deceit_n for_o the_o scripture_n that_o be_v above_o angelical_a authority_n declare_v it_o and_o by_o make_v it_o a_o nose_n of_o wax_n they_o take_v it_o as_o if_o it_o be_v not_o sense_n nor_o intelligible_a without_o the_o pope_n interpretation_n which_o in_o difficult_a case_n he_o dare_v not_o give_v they_o cry_v up_o the_o church_n and_o when_o we_o will_v have_v they_o stand_v to_o the_o church_n they_o shameful_o turn_v their_o back_n and_o when_o two_o or_o three_o part_n of_o the_o church_n through_o the_o world_n be_v against_o the_o papal_a sovereignty_n they_o refuse_v they_o as_o heretic_n or_o schismatic_n they_o cry_v up_o tradition_n and_o when_o we_o offer_v they_o in_o the_o main_a point_n to_o be_v try_v by_o it_o they_o disclaim_v the_o tradition_n of_o two_o or_o three_o part_n of_o the_o universal_a church_n as_o be_v all_o heretic_n and_o may_v not_o any_o sect_n do_v so_o too_o as_o honest_o as_o they_o yea_o among_o the_o ignorant_a that_o know_v not_o chaff_n from_o corn_n â—hey_n have_v some_o of_o they_o the_o face_n to_o persuade_v they_o that_o their_o church_n be_v the_o great_a half_n of_o the_o christian_a world_n when_o they_o know_v they_o speak_v notorious_o false_o or_o else_o they_o be_v unworthy_a to_o speak_v of_o such_o thing_n that_o they_o understand_v not_o but_o to_o what_o purpose_n shall_v any_o word_n be_v use_v with_o man_n that_o have_v teach_v so_o great_a a_o part_n of_o the_o world_n not_o to_o believe_v their_o eye_n and_o other_o sense_n can_v any_o writing_n make_v any_o matter_n plain_o to_o you_o than_o that_o bread_n be_v bread_n and_o wine_n be_v wine_n when_o you_o see_v they_o and_o taste_v and_o eat_v and_o drink_v they_o and_o yet_o their_o general_a council_n approve_v by_o the_o