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A52138 Plain-dealing, or, A full and particular examination of a late treatise, entituled, Humane reason by A.M., a countrey gentleman. Marvell, Andrew, 1621-1678. 1675 (1675) Wing M876; ESTC R23029 77,401 164

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High-Commission amongst them Was ever man thus confident to assert things thus palpably false which he and every one else must know to be so unless he knows nothing of any History I suppose this was one of those Truths which he smelt out from the bottom viz. That this quiet and happiness which was enjoyed four thousand years amongst the Heathen continued so long and so uninterrupted because every man following the rules of his own judgment allowed that liberty to others which he found so necessary for himself as he saith pag. 9. in fine For the Reason is onely the quite contrary viz. because they were so careful to preserve the Publick Unity of Religion by the execution of their Laws For I think I may justly challenge our Author to shew me if he can any of the ancient Heathens that ever gave a publick toleration of all Religions though if he could prove it Christians ought not to follow their Examples because we have a positive and stated Religion given us by God in a most clear and infallible Revelation which our Governors ought to establish and maintain so that whatsoever he hath said to the contrary it is evident by the consent of the whole World that were there not Laws to restrain particular mens publick discourses there would soon be as many Religions as there are men and so the Argument remains as tragical as ever it did For it appears by the Votes of all Nations that varieties and alterations in Religion were always thought to be inconsistent with the publick peace and safety As for that slie insinuation with which he concludes that Paragraph pag. 10. That even the Stoicks themselves that enslaved the Will durst never attempt this violence to the understanding I would fain know of this Gentleman whether the Church of England goes about to enslave any mans understanding hath not every one in her Communion a liberty of thinking what he pleases All that the Church of England enjoyns us is that we shall worship God decently and orderly and shall consent to the Articles of the Christian Faith and not contradict those few Articles which she hath given us but for peace sake shall quietly submit to them and to her most moderate Discipline I appeal even to this Author himself whether the Members of any Society in the World either Heathen or Christian have a greater freedom of exercising their understandings then those of the Church of England If he cannot produce me any that have then to what purpose doth he talk to English men of violence to their understandings unless it be fortiter calumniari ut aliquid haereret which is a practice so much below a Gentleman that sure our Author should be ashamed of it or else he is a shame to the Honourable Title of an English Gentleman I pray you Sir tell me upon your Reputation what you meant and of whom you spáke those things Pag. 12 13. If you meant the Church of England I must tell you that you do not know any thing of Her though She be your own Mother Doth the Church of England teach her Followers to damn all that are not of their way So far is She from it and so prodigiously charitable that She doth not exempt even those that die in a wilful separation from her unless they be actually excommunicated from Her most Christian Form of Burial in which She professeth to hope of their salvation Is there any Son of the Church of England that believes some Errours that are the inseparable companions of Humane Nature do exclude men from the Communion of the present Church or the hope of the future And as for that which he saith that then we could not be so cruel to persecute those faults to which God is so merciful and from which we our selves are not exempt I answer That our Church punisheth no man for any Errour unless it be accompanied with contumacy and contempt of Authority and does not every Society in the World do the same If then he will needs call this cruelty and Persecution he not onely accuseth our Church but all the Nations of the World of those hard words He might I think well have spared all that Discourse from Pag. 10 to the 14. about the causes of so much bloudshed since the Reformation unless he intended to make the Reformation guilty of all the bloud shed ever since it first-began However sure I am he cannot lay it at the door of our Church since there is none of her true Sons that ever was so mad to be guilty of any of those Causes which he gives of it As for his confident Assertion with which he concludes that Section it is much more applicable to the Papists and Fanaticks then to the truly Reformed For there are no men living that so much tie Infallibility to what they think Truth and Damnation to what they think Errours as they do at Rome and Geneva and such amongst us who have listed themselves under their Banners As for his peaceable Doctrine he so much boasts of Pag. 11 12. viz. That every man should be suffered quietly to enjoy his own Opinion and his own Opinion is this that he should suffer others to do the same As to the first part of it I answer it is granted him For there is no Society in the World that can take notice of matters of meer opinion but when those Opinions break out into practice so as to disturb the publick peace or at least to endanger a disturbance when men make use of them to draw Parties after them and to make Factions in a Nation then those Governours must be blind that will not see to suppress them And this is not punishing men for their Opinions but their Practices in divulging and propagating those Opinions which are contrary to the Laws and publick safety As for the second Part of it that every man should have that Opinion implanted in him to suffer all others to enjoy their Opinions I answer First That it is almost impossible to suppose this to be or that it ever can be the Opinion of every man For if men do sincerely believe that their Opinion is the Truth and necessary to Happiness then they must also think themselves bound to propagate it to all others But Secondly Could we suppose this Opinion to be in every man yet this would not maintain the Peace of a Nation if there were no Laws to restrain men from being led by their Passions and Interest to act contrary to their Opinions For I appeal to themselves to know whether the Papists and Presbyterians do not act contrary to their own Principles in promoting a toleration of all Opinions If they dare deny it it will be easily proved against them For the Grand Turk himself doth not more violently persecute the Christians then both these do all such as differ from them in Religion where they have power enough to do it Witness the Inquisition at this
must be fully satisfied as to this point that there can be no excuse for Atheists Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them for God hath shewn it to them For the invisible things of him are clearly seen from the Creation of the world by the things that are made even his eternal Power and Godhead From whence the Apostle concludes so that they are left without excuse But it is no matter with our Author what the Apostle saith For his Guide i. e. his Reason tells him that Jews Turks Heathens and Atheists are in an equal possibility of salvation with the unerring Christian. Now I may appeal even to this Author himself whether I have done him any wrong in comparing his Book with Fiat Lux since it is so plainly apparent by his words that his Design is if not the same much worse then the Design of that Book For who would have gone about to defend such a Question in a tract so exactly fitted for the reading of the common people that had not a Design to wheadle them into an indifferency in all matters of Religion and even to Atheism it self But surely if they have any consideration left in them this very discourse would be enough to make them mistrustful and fearful of such a Guide which may be so easily mistaken as this of Humane Reason and when it is mistaken does so easily lead them into the most damnable of Errours even into the contempt of all Religion But now we see by this Author what kind of Animals they are who are Factors for Rome and a Toleration and by what excellent means they carry on their Design viz. by first perswading men ●o Atheism by an indifferency in all Religion From whence I cannot but take an occasion to remind our Dissenters how much they promote Popery and destroy Christianity by joyning with the Papists and the debauchees of our Nation in promoting a toleration and our Governours that if they think of keeping their Necks from the Roman Yoke they must then maintain the established Religion of the Church in its true Christian practise and Primitive Discipline For how much Atheism and an Universal neglect of all Religion hath encreased since our Laws have been laid to sleep he must be stark blind that doth not see To our Author I shall onely add this That I am sorry with all my heart that a person of his parts and Reason should give any occasion to be thought a Favourer of Atheism For who can think that he is not very much a well-willer to Atheists who endeavours to prove that they are in an equal possibility of salvation with the unerring Christian It may be he may think to shift off this just suspition of Atheism by the help of his Parenthesis viz. if there be any such For who can suspect him to be an Atheist or a Favourer of them who scarce supposeth that there can be any such men as Atheists in the world But we know every Animal will most strive to defend that part which is sore and will winch and kick when any thing comes near it The Fifth Object which our Author would shake off is that of Schism Which saith he is the ordinary railing word in all Controversies and a slander c. Is there then good Sir no such thing as Schism because that word is often abused and misapplied you might if you had pleas'd as well have said there is no such thing as Humane Reason because your Book hath abused and misapplied those words to countenance your Errours Are all Schismaticks to be excused because some have been slander'd with that Title As well may all Thieves and Murderers be excused because some have been slandered and falsly accused of those Crimes It will be then necessary to know who Schismaticks are and the danger they run themselves and draw others into and then we shall see what an absolute necessity there is to put a stop to them both for their own good and the good of the Church The First this Gentleman tells us himself p. 37. They are truly guilty of Schism the word it self bearing witness against them who break the precious Unity of the Christian Church They therefore that break the Unity of the Christian Church either by enjoyning new Articles of Faith or things sinful in their practise contrary to the Doctrine and Practise of the Universal Church in its Primitive purity are guilty of Schism as the Romanists are who amongst the rest which are many more enjoyn the Beleif of Transubstantiation as an Article of Faith which was never heard of in the Christian Church for many hundred years and the worshipping the Host as the consequence of that Doctrine together with Prayers to Saints and the half Communion c. which are practices no less sinful and novel then the former Doctrine Secondly They are Schismaticks who separate from that particular Christian Church into which they were baptized when it commands nothing that is sinful in it self as all those are who separate from the Church of England For they can never excuse themselves from Schism unless they can prove which I challenge them to do if they can that our Church enjoyns them any thing that is a sin but neither would this excuse them from communicating with her in things lawful that are commanded by both their temporal as well as their spiritual Governours Now that Schism is a very heinous sin is most evident because it is a breach of all those commands of the Gospel that enjoyn us Peace and Unity then which I scarce know any more frequently repeated in the New Testament and it will be most evident from the words of St. Paul 1 Cor. 3. 4. For there the Apostle saith that Schismaticks are carnal For saith he while one saith I am of Paul another I am of Apollos are ye not carnal By which interrogation he doth most strongly affirm it and make themselves the Judges in that Case against themselves From whence we may thus argue That if the Apostle saith that the Corinthians were carnal for dividing themselves into Factions and espousing particular Names and Parties though they chose no other persons then himself and Cepbas and Apollos then those that divide the Church into Parties and espouse particular Names and Persons in opposition to the Church of God into which they were baptized and set up a Church within a Church and particular ways of publick worship contradictory to those that are enjoyn'd by that Church of which they are Members without any just cause of separation from her are guilty of carnality by the judgment of the Apostle St. Paul whatsoever their pretensions are of piety in themselves or of powerfulness and godliness in their Teachers And the greatness of the sin of these persons doth appear in that the Apostle calls them carnal since the same Apostle Rom 8. 6 7. makes any canal sin to be mortal and damnable For to be carnally
rib-roasted by his Master for searching for the Hare at the top of the House because he did not look for her in the proper place to find her The third Reason p. 68. Because we ought not to believe Errours of faith to be damnable But if these Errours be fundamental and obstinately continued in against plain means of conviction in opposition to authority in spight of our Authors Reason I must believe them damnable Oh! no saith he for this is most wildly uncharitable but why so because this was to damn millions of men for one that shall be saved But this damns none but such as wilfully and obstinately continue in their errours and thereby become Hereticks nor them neither for it is possible they may live to repent and amend but if they die in heresie that they die in damable sins we must believe if we will believe either St. Paul Gal. 5. 19 20 c. who reckons up Seditions and Heresies amongst the rest of the Black Catalogue which shall shut us out from the Kingdom of Heaven or S Peter who plainly tells us that there are damnable Heresies 2 Pet. ● 1. Now if this be contrary to charity to assert I cannot help it I have very good company in my uncharitableness for S. Peter and S. Paul are both guilty of it as well as I. Oh uncharitable Apostles that had no more pity nor love nor compassion in you to those millions of dissenters that were hereticks in your time but that you must not onely believe but pronounce the Errours in faith of the greatest part of the World to be damnable Heresies even shift for your selves good Apostles for this Author hath charged you home with wild uncharitableness His fourth Reason Ibid. and p. 69. We ought not to teach men that any Errours in belief overthrow our hopes of salvation unless we could give them a catalogue of those Errours that do so But why Because this would be more uncomfortable then the other is uncharitable for it would necessarily lead men into despair What then Must we teach them to throw away their Bibles and renounce all the Articles of the Christian Faith and wholly to commit themselves to the guidance of their own Reason as our Author seems to do p. 65. and that then they shall be safe enough and need not further trouble their heads with matters of Faith or Religion No surely there is a middle way which is plain for all men to walk in which ought to be shewn them i. e. this That some errours of Faith are damnable though not all and we may easily give them a general Catalogue of what errours are so by which they may judge of particulars Those Errours of Faith are damnable which are wilfully run into and all such as are continued in in opposition to the Authority of the Church perversly and obstinately and thus our Author hath a general Catalogue of what Errours are damnable let him make what use of it he can The fifth Reason p. 69. and 70. is this Because we cannot know our fault and therefore have no means of repenting of it and consequently cannot expect pardon for it there being no forgiveness without repentance and repentance impossible without knowledge of our fault But if this be true it would damn all mankind For who is there that hath ever had a particular knowledge of all the sins that he hath committed so that there must be many of them according to this Gentlemans reason unrepented off and consequently unpardoned What 's become of this Gentlemans great charity which he hath always boasted of for this opinion is much more uncharitable then any of those whose uncharitableness he hath so much declaimed against But thanks be to God this is not true For sure we are David doth repent him of those faults which he had no knowledge of Ps. 19. 12. in that Prayer of his who can understand his errours cleanse thou me from my secret faults By which the Royal Prophet must mean such faults as he himself had forgotten and had no knowledge of else the first part of the verse which is the reason of the following petition could have no coherence with the latter which is the petition it self grounded upon the former Besides Why can we have no knowledge of our fault unless it be committed against our own Reason For though we err only against Authority and are for a time blinded with prejudice so that we cannot at present see our errour is it not possible that the prejudice afterwards may be removed by a du● information from others or by our own serious consideration assisted by the Grace of God If it is possible then there is nothing of truth nor consequence in this Reason His sixth Reason p. 70. is this The great probability of truth on all sides even the erring ones ought to make us believe that God will not punish those that err To this I answer If our errours be such as are not the effects or causes of any sin in us we have no reason to think but God will pardon them But if our errours are the effects of wilful ignorance pride or idleness or if they have led us into schism and heresie and contempt of authority then we can have no hopes of pardon without amendment wherefore sin being most commonly either the cause or the effect of our errours or both it proves that there is no small danger in them But there is no such great danger from errours saith this Gentleman p. 71. For it is not consistent with the goodness of God to have made truth so difficult to be found out if he intended to punish the miss of it with eternal punishments To this I answer That where the difficulty surpasseth the helps that God hath given us we need not fear that God will punish us eternally for not finding out such truths For if they had been necessary to be known for our salvation they should have been suited to our capacity But if we are wilfully ignorant of any necessary truths then it is not contrary to the goodness of God to punish us eternally for it as well as for any other sin which we die in without repentance For the same thing might as well be urged to free men from eternal punishment for most other sins as well as this of wilful errour For since it is so very difficult to flesh and blood to abstain from those sins which profit and pleasure tempts us to and so easie to run into them nay since there is but one way of exact vertue which is the middle way for those many hundreds that lead to vitious extreams and as he saith of truth there is no certain mark set upon that one to distinguish it from others he may therefore as well think it inconsistent with the divine goodness to punish men eternally for their vices as for their errours since the reason is the very same in both But now supposing it
probable that they whose business it is to study those things must know them more certainly then I who have never had time nor convenience to study them But supposing they should deceive me as long as I am in this life I shall always be subject to errour and if I do follow these directions sure I am it is their fault and not mine if they l●ad me into errour for I have done what I could to prevent it and sure I am I cannot this way be led into Popery Infidelity and Atheism as I may be if I wholly commit my self to the sole guidance of my own reason since our Church hath so plainly guarded us against the Idolatry of Rome in its plain Homilies and against Infidelity and Atheism by her full and short Catechism and by allowing us the use of the Scriptures I dare confidently aver that there is no ways in the world left for us that are unlearned to keep us without a miracle from Heresie and Schism or Popery and Atheism but only by this method that I have now laid down If I am mistaken I shall be very thankful to any one that will shew me wherein If I am not mistaken I must desire our Author to give me leave to think that the Authority of the Church is a safer Guide to me then my own Reason and consequently that all his boast of safety is nothing else but meer impertinence and falshood Several things it is possible will be objected against this method which I have laid down for the safety of all private Gentlemen and men of ordinary capacity especially for common people which was this That every one should rely upon the Church of England and those Guides of Conscience which she hath authorized in all difficult cases and doubtful matters which surpass his own abilities to judge of Against this it may be objected First That this is ro run into the same implicit Faith which we condemn in the Romanists and put out our own eyes that we may see with other mens I answer Not at all for I allow every one the free use of the Scriptures and their own Reasons in all matters that are within the reach of their capacity and within their proper sphear of Action and for all others that are above them I have shewn them I am sure the safest guide I can possibly find If any body can produce a safer Iet them and they will do very good service to the publick Secondly It may be objected That by this Direction they that are Papists especially the common sort of them are in no possibility to be freed from the Roman Yoke and consequently must continue in Idolatry and therefore in most imminent peril of damnation I answer I gave not this direction to Papists or those that are without our Church For what have I to do to judge them that are without But to those who are or ought to be obedient Children of the most Christian and tender Mother the Church of England who is guilty of no corruption from the Primitive Christianity either in Doctrine or Worship who enjoyns the Belief of no new Articles of Faith nor no Idolatrous Worship nor commands any thing that is sinful to be obeyed the contrary to which the Church of Rome is most apparently guilty of Now I refer it to any man or to all mankind to judge which is the safest way for us of the Church of England whether to perswade all of our Communion to be governed by their own Reason and so to endanger the loss of the greatest part of them that are now free and must continue so so long as they continue in obedience to our Church from all fear of Popish Idolatry and thereby to expose them not onely to all false Religions but even to be of no Religion at all for fear of using such Arguments to secure them as might if used to ignorant Papists continue them in their Errours and obstruct their conversion to our Church of which we cannot have half so great a probability as there is of losing or at least hazarding their Souls who now are not nor never can be in any danger so long as they continue in obedience to their own Church or whether it is safer for them to be kept by Laws in the Communion of the Church of England and in obedience to her Injunctions in all honest and lawful things which is all that our Church requires even of the Clergy themselves Thirdly Another Objection may be this That possible it is our Church may in time as well as the Church of Rome which formerly was a Church as free from all corruption as ours is now degenerate into the very same Crimes which we now blame Rome for I answer That then our Church must be quite altered from what it is at present and I onely propose my Method of Safety to all illiterate Persons in Her present Communion and therefore am not at all concerned for future contingencies But if ever She should be changed from her Primitive Purity which God forbid then and not till then will this Objection deserve an Answer For if possibilities of Errour may render Separation allowable we must never be fixt in any Church till we can come to that which is triumphat in Heaven nay neither can any man be free from a possibility of Errour as long as he is here on Earth let him propose to himself what Guide he can And I dare appeal to any man that is rational whether he must not think that his own Reason may in all probability lead him into Errours much sooner then the Guides of the Church especially in such things as he is not a capable Judge of For surely every mans own Reason is much more subject to a possibility of Errors then an whole Church is to a possibility of a total change and alteration So that it must still remain much safer to rely upon the Church according to the Rule I have laid down then it is to rely wholly upon our own Reason 4. The last Objection I shall answer is this That if we that are illiterate must rely upon our Church in all things above our capacity that then we ought to have practised the same Rule when we were Members of the Church of Rome and consequently ought never to have separated from it and therefore that our Reformers were Schismaticks To this I answer That the Romish Doctrine of Transubstantiation and their Idolatry in worshipping the Host c. besides the Popes Usurpation upon our Regal Authority was so directly contradictory to the Word of God that he must needs see it that doth not wilfully shut his eyes Secondly Our Reformation was carried on not by Private Persons but by the Publick Power of the Nation and by all the wisest and most learned Men in it And consequently it could be no Schism it being granted upon so warrantable a Cause and done in so orderly a manner To conclude