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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A09102	The iudgment of a Catholicke English-man, living in banishment for his religion VVritten to his priuate friend in England. Concerninge a late booke set forth, and entituled; Triplici nodo, triplex cuneus, or, An apologie for the oath of allegiance. Against two breves of Pope Paulus V. to the Catholickes of England; & a letter of Cardinall Bellarmine to M. George Blackwell, Arch-priest. VVherein, the said oath is shewed to be vnlawfull vnto a Catholicke conscience; for so much, as it conteyneth sundry clauses repugnant to his religion.; Judgment of a Catholicke English-man, living in banishment for his religion	Parsons, Robert, 1546-1610.	1608 (1608)	STC 19408; ESTC S104538	91,131	136

strong effectes both in iudgments and affections Admiration for that no such thing was euer expected vnder his Maiesties gouernment for many causes strong effectes for that they worke great alterations both in the one and the other In iudgment for that wise men fynd not any reason eyther of Religion or State why such extremityes should be pursued with such rigour at the instigation of partyes interessed to the euident danger of so great and honorable Kingdomes who if in wills they were vinted as they are in one Prince and Gouernour their forces were both admirable and dreadfull In affections for that the compassion which naturally doth accompany our brethrens afflictions especially for a cause that we most esteeme and loue to wit our Religion must needes worke the contrary effect of inward auersion both in Princes people abroad notwithstāding they hold externall amity and friendship for the tyme. LXXXVIII I let passe the generall obloquies and murmurations that are to be heard euery where almost in Christendome vpon this manner of proceeding and much more the publicke and priuate complaints outcryes and praiers that are made and offered daylie to heauen throughout all Catholicke Kingdomes lightly in all particuler Congregations Oratoryes Chappels meetings of zealous men that pray instantly to Almighty God for some remedy of these oppressions and persecutions of English Catholicks sufficiently as they thinke declared vnto thē to the whole world by the very printed Catalogues of English Statutes extant in Print against them for profession of their Religion for that by the view of those Statutes they do easily conceaue what enormous effectes do and must follow in the execution therof albeit they did not both heare see daily so many lamētable presidēts spectacles therin LXXXIX As for example there haue not passed many moneths since there were seene some threescore Priests more or lesse to omit others cast into banishmēt about one tyme wandring vp and downe throughout Christēdome according as euery man had occasion or necessity for their mayntenance gaue a lamentable spectacle to all nations to see mē of so good partes amiable aspects sweet behauiour naturall borne subiects of the Lād the most of them of very worshipfull parētage all of learned education cleere and deuoyd of any suspition of crymes that could be obiected vnto them for otherwise they should not haue bene dismissed in the flower of their age to be cast out of their natiue soyle for professing that Religion only wherby their said Countrey was first made Christian so continued vnder all their noble Princes Kings Queenes and Soueraignes Nobility and Communatly from the beginning of their Conuersion vnto this our age XC This spectacle I say presented to the eyes of most Nations of Europe moued men not a litle especially hearing them protest their duetifull affections to his Ma. tie and Realme in all Cyuill Temporall respects without seeking of any preferments dignityes riches or other emoluments by staying at home but only the rest vse of their owne Consciences in matters of Religion which Protestāts in many other Catholicke Countryes are suffered to inioy though with farre lesser reason in regard of the ancient right possession which ech part pretendeth for the vse of their said Religion XCI And since this tyme agayne there hath beene seene very lately another spectacle not much vnlike to the former though much more markable to wit a like number of Noble and Gentlemen with their followers and trayne passing in very good sort through sundry Countryes being lately retyred out of his Ma. ties Kingdome of Irelād for the selfe same cause of their Consciēce and Religion which when men do behold and heare them otherwise to speake honourably of his Ma. tie the State ascribing rather their afflictiōs to some vnder Magistrates in Ireland and Ministers that set them on it moueth more compassion and maketh men thinke and muse what may be the end of all this and whereunto fynally it may grow Whether the like may not be expected in tyme or doubted out of other partes also of his Ma. ties dominions vpon like angariatiō of Consciēces which points seeme to be of no small consideration and consequence to wise men though those that be the immediate causes therof will and must make light of all but the naturall yssue of such euentes are not vnknowne And if the occasioners therof were guylty of no greater fault but only to cast his Ma. tie the State into perpetuall cares about the same his Royall nature being inclined otherwise to sweetnes peace and tranquillity it were a great synne in them and scarce sufferable XCII Nor is the remedy heere attēpted by our Minister-Apologer of denying all and saying that there is no persecution nor hard dealing with any for matters of Religion no not in the late Queenes dayes when so many were so rackt and rented for the same any remedy at all but rather a doubling of the iniury to the afflicted with encrease of exasperation auersion of myndes as also a leesing of all credit with others that heare it eyther at home or abroad for that facts contrary to wordes do preponderate with all sober men and preuaile against the same XCIII And truely I cannot but wonder why this late Apology hath beene so greedily published by the Apologer both in English and Latyn to the world for that the Popes Breues being but written priuatly to the Catholicks of England for informing their Consciences in a matter of necessary doctrine about the lawfulnes or vnlawfulnes of taking the Oath and the Letter of Cardinall Bellarmyne being directed only to a priuate friend both of them might haue remayned also priuate if this attempt had not byn made of publishing the same But now being drawne by the Apologer into the Vniuersall Theatre of the world besydes that diuers will hold themselues obliged or at leastwyse prouoked to answere the same it will follow also that the vnlawfulnes of the said Oath to Catholicke Consciences will more be seene disputed condemned by all Vniuersityes Schooles Bookes Treatises of particuler learned men throughout all Countryes of Christendome that professe Catholicke Religiō Whervpon also the vniust violence inforcing men to sweare the same Oath vnder so rigorous paynes as are the losse both of goods libertie and therwithall to sweare in like manner that they do it willingly freely and without coaction will be censured no doubt for one of the greatest contradictions in it selfe and the most iniurious manner of proceeding with Christian men that euer perhaps was heard of in the Christian world XCIII And this now occurred to me deare Syr to write to you cōcerning my iudgmēt vpō this matter What more may be said to this Apologie when it shall come into the handes of learned men you will easily ghesse by these few notes that I haue heere laid togeather which conteyne but little in respect of that which may be written of

or vnder pressures still as hath bene said But for others of the same Religion that cannot frame their Consciences to take the said Oath and yet would gladly giue his Royall Maiesty contentment satisfaction so farre as they might without offending God I can assure yow that it is the greatest affliction of mynd among other pressures that euer fell vnto them For that no violence is like to that which is laied vpon mens Consciences for so much as it lyeth in a mās owne will resolutiō to beare all other oppressions whatsoeuer whether it be losse of goods honours dignityes yea● of life it self but the oppression of the Conscience no man may beare patiently though he would neuer so faine For if he yield therein he offendeth God and leeseth his soule neyther doth Metus cadens in constantem virum feare that may terrify euen a constant man excuse in this behalfe as appeareth by the example of the auncient Martyrs who were forced vnder paine of damnation to stand out to death against all humaine power vexations torments and highest violence rather then to doe say or sweare any thing against their Conscience To all these men then which are thowsands in our Countrey that neuer thought otherwise then to be good Subiects to his Maiesty the deuising of this new Oath was no blessing but an vnspeakeable affliction and angariation of mynd XXXIV To the exhibitours also I see not what blessing it could be or can be so extremely to vex other men without any profit or emolument to themselues or to his Maiestyes seruice which herin they would pretend to aduaunce For if there be any cause of doubt of loyall good will in them that are forced to sweare against their consciences much more cause and reason may there be of like doubt after they haue so sworne then before For that the griefe of their new wound of conscience remayning full within them and stirring them to more auersion of hart for the iniury receaued must needes worke contrary effects to that which is pretended And whosoeuer will not sticke to sweare against his conscience for feare fauour or some other like passion may be presumed that he will as easily breake his Oath after he hath sworne vpon like motiues if occasions doe mooue him And among all other passions none is more strong then that of reuenge for oppressions receaued So as we read of the whole Monarchy of Spaine ouerthrowne and giuen to the Mores for one passion of Count Iulian wherby he desired to be reuenged of his King ●oderiquez Nothing then is gotten in this behalfe of loyall good will by such extreame pressures but much rather lost XXXV But besides all this is the grieuous sinne which they commit who force presse other men to sweare against their consciences then which almost nothing can be imagined more heinous for it is to thrust men headlong especially such as are fearfull into the very precipitation and downfall of hell it selfe For it is the highest degree of scandall actiue so much condemned and detested in Scriptures and so dredfully threatned by our Sauiour to be seuerely punished in the life to come for that scandalizing properly is nothing else but laying a stumbling-block for other men to fall and breake their necks And such a one is this formall Oath which conteyneth diuers things lawfull for a Catholicke to sweare and other things vnlawfull and he is forced by terrour to passe ouer and swallow downe the one with the other without distinction with mani●est repugnance of his Conscience which repugnance to him is alwaies a synne damnable in such a publicke and weighty action though the matter were lawfull in it self and consequently also vnto them that force him to the same eyther knowing or suspecting his said repugnance of Conscience For he that should force a Iew or Turke to sweare that there were a blessed Trinity eyther knowing or suspecting that they would doe it against their Conscience should synne grieuously by forcing them to committ that synne This is Catholicke doctrine which I also thinke the learned Protestants themselues will not deny XXXVI Here if any man obiect that among vs also men are vrged to take Oathes and to abiure their opinions in the tribunalls of Inquisitions and the like and consequently in this Oath they may be forced vnder punishment to abiure the Popes Temporall Authority in dealing with Kings I answere first that if any Hereticke or other should be forced to abiure his opinions with repugnance of conscience it should be a synne to the inforcers if they knew it or suspected it Neyther is it practised or permitted ●n any Catholicke Court that euer I knew But yow will reply that if he doe it not he shall be punished by death or otherwise as the crime requireth and Canons appoint and consequently the like may be vsed towards Catholickes that will not renounce their old opinions of the Popes Authoritye but heere is a great difference for that the Catholicke Church hath Ius acquisitum auncient right ouer Hereticks as her due Subiects for that by their Baptisme they were made her Subiects and left her afterward and went out of her and she vseth but her auncient manner of proceeding against them as against all other of their kynd and quality from the beginning But the Protestant Church of England hath Nullum Ius acquisitum vpon Catholicks that were in possession before them for many hundred yeares as is euident Neyther was there euer any such Oath exacted at their hands by any of their Kings in former Catholicke tymes Neyther is there by any Catholicke forreyne Monarch now liuing vpon earth and consequently by no reason or right at all can English Catholicke men be eyther forced or pressed to this Oath against their Conscience or be punished beaten or destroyed if for their Conscience they refuse to take the same humbly offering notwithstanding to their Soueraigne to giue him all other dutifull satisfaction for their Temporall Obedience and Allegiance which of loyall Catholicke Subiectes may be exacted And this shall suffice for this first point concerning the contents and nature of the Oath Now shall We passe to say somewhat of the Breues and answere made thereunto CONCERNING THE POPES TVVO BREVES AGAINST The receauing of the Oath Paragr II. THE summe of the Popes two Breues the first of the 21. of September Anno 1606. the second of the 21. of August the next yeare following is this That wheras he had heard that the Catholicks of England were very sorely pressed with a new deuised Oath against their Consciēces concerning certayne poyntes appertayning to the Authority of the Sea Apostolicke in some cases he wrote the first Breue to admonish comfort and direct them signifying his harty sorie for their long continued afflictions and exhorting them to patience and constancy in defence of the integrity of Catholike faith and the purity of their owne consciences

consideration serue for all That after all her afflicting Catholicks and by that exercise vpon the egging of others more then of her owne propension she was drawne into continuall suspitions ●eares and frights of her mynd and spirit euen in the midst or all these sensuall delights contentments admired so much by her Attorney which draue her to a point wherunto by nature she was not thought much inclyned and by profession and protestations she most condemned in others to wit Cruelty which in effect was such out of the fore said feares towards Catholicke Religion as neuer perhaps yea without perhaps were so many seuerall lawes punishments deuised by any one persecutour nor many putt togeather as are extant of hers in Print against the pro●essours of that Religion wherof herselfe had byn one and in secret or priuate speaches also would not deny to be in sundry poyntes euen to her dying day And was not this a great in felicity When strāgers do read behold her Edicts Statutes wherin not only the whole vse of Catholicke Religion is condemned and vnder greiuous punishment prohibited but men are forced also by rigorous penall lawes to go to the Churches of a contrary Religion to communicate with them to do acts and sweare against their owne Religion faith and Consciences that there are seuere punishments of losse of goods and lands for receyuing an Agnus Dei or a Medall or Crucifix greiuous punishments for keeping of a Catholicke seruant or Schoolemaister to teach and bring vp their children or to send them ouer seas to Catholicke Schooles yea that it is the payne of death it selfe to be reconciled by confessing his synnes to the Roman Church or to the vnion of ●aith with the Head therof or to perswade another to be a Catholicke or do the same When they read these things I say and many others which for breuity I pretermitt and that all this notwithstanding she would not haue it said That she persecuted any for Religion which in manner this Apologer sticketh not to auouch nor put any Priest to death for that cause in deed wheras notwithstāding she shed the bloud of aboue one hūdred and thirty that might haue had their lyues euen at the last cast if in this one point of Religion they would haue yielded neuer so little All this I say being read and considered seemeth vnto forreiners a strange infelicity both of body and soule XIII Especially when it is considered to what perpetuall iealosy at length she was brought vnto of all sorts of people Puritans Papists yea of her owne dearest as the death of the Earle of Essex and his followers doth easily declare Neyther was there any weeke lightly but that she had some new feares of some Priest or Iesuite or Catholicke soldiours sent from Flanders France or Italy to kill her by violence others from Spayne and other Countryes to poyson her or at at least her Chaire And vponsuch fancyes men must be made away for greater terrour yea Iewes must be brought in also in this kynd of pretended poysoning as the case of Doctor Lopez well declareth Nay further this gryping passion of feare and iealosy did so vexe consume her inwardly as she was neuer well vntill she had made away against all law of Nature and Nations the nearest vnto her in Royall bloud that lyued vpon earth and coequall with her in dignity if in sundry respects not Superiour I meane his Ma. ties noble renowned Mother Queene of France Scotland that by force of the former Statute which declared this other for illegitimate and incapable of the Crowne as now yow haue heard should haue enioyed the Crowne of England presently after the death of Q. Marie consequently his Ma. tie had enioyed the same 38. yeares at least before he came vnto it after her death who of all other lyuing Creatures is knowne most hartily to haue hated that yssue succession And as she went about to disinable the same in the very roote foūtayne it selfe by seeking the disgrace of the ofspring by dishonour of the origen so neuer ceased she afterward to continue practises against them both vntill she had wracked the one and brought the other also to great probability therof if she might haue lyued to her will or haue dyed with such vse of senses and iudgment as might haue made way to her bad affections in that behalfe XIV Well then all this I haue beene inforced to speake vpon this occasion first to represse somwhat therby the insultation of our foresaid Orator in calling her The happy Queene the blessed Queene whose vnmatched wisedome and vnconquered prowesse to vse his words crowned her the peerlesse wonder of her sexe All which tendeth to the exprobration of Catholicks for hauing had so happy peerles a persecutour and to the insultation also ouer the Pope for calling her in his Breue as he saith Miseram Foeminam a miserable woman which how true or false it is I leaue to the prudent Reader out of the former discourse about her byrth youth age and end to censure XV. Secondly I do heerin but imitate the first ancient Fathers that wrote for defence of those holy Martyrs that dyed for Christian Religion in the Primitiue Church as namely Iustinus Martyr Irenaeus Tertullian and others who to comfort the afflicted and to honour more their cause did put them in mynd what manner of people their first persecutours were as namely Nero and Domitian what lyfe they led what end they made and the like And that indeed they were fit instruments to be the first in such a worke And the like we may say to Catholicks of Q. Elizabeth that she being the strangest woman that euer was borne for diuers circumstances now partly touched and the first absolutly of that sexe eyther Christian or created that tooke vpon her Supreme power in Spirituall and Ecclesiasticall matters it must needes be some comfort to Catholicke people that God chose such an instrument to be their first scourge out of all woman kynd XVI And lastly for that this Apologer will needs take vpon him to sacrifice to her Manes I thought my selfe obliged to offer some incense in like māner to the same for mitigating the euill sent which that notorious vntrue assertion must needs import to the senses of all vnderstanding Readers That Queene Elizabeth neuer punished any Papist for Religion Nor made any rigorous law against them before Pius Quintus his Excommunication nor since that tyme but vpon priuate plots machinations c. For cleare confutation wherof I remit those of the elder sort that lyue in England to their owne eyes eares and other externall senses and those of yonger age to the books of Statutes of Q. Elizabeths tyme Iohn Stowes Chronicle and other such publicke Records And so much of this poynt XVII Next after these exaggerations of the clemency and indulgence of Q. Elizabeth towards Catholicks

and honoured receyued so gladly and with vniuersall ioy meant to serue faithfully trusted that as he had vnited the two Kingdomes in one Obedience by his Succession so would he by his liberality vnite and conioyne the harts of all his Subiects in bearing a sweete and equall hand towards them all From such a King I sa● or vs to expect liberty of Consciēce and equality with other Subiects in this poynt at least of freedome of soule what height of pryde may it be called May it not rather seeme height of pryde in this Minister his ●ellowes that hauing byn● o●d enemyes and alwayes borne a hard hate u●●hand and tongue against his Ma. tie both in their Sermons Bookes Speaches all the tyme of the late Queenes raigne now vpon the suddayne sine vllis meri is praecede●●ious will needs be so priuiledged assume vnto themselues such a confident presumption of his Ma. ties speciall fauour as to suffer no man to stand by them but to hold it for height of pryde in vs to hope ●or any freedome and liberty o● our Conscience at al● What is height of pryde and so●l● i● this be not XXIV But his Ma. tie is wise will as we hope according to his prudence in tyme looke into this sort o●men and manner of proceeding And to returne to the Apologer he reckoneth vp therby to exaggerate the more our ingratitude the particuler fauours his Ma. tie did vnto vs at his first entrance as That he did honour diuers Catholicks with Knighthood being open Recusants That he gaue audiece indifferently to both sydes bestowed equally fauours and honours vpon both professions gaue free con●inuall accesse to all rankes and degrees of Papists in his Court and company freeing Recusantes from their ordinarie payments gaue order to his Iudges with his owne mouth to spare execution of all Priests though they were conuicted gaue libertie by his gracious Proclamation to all Priests not taken to go out of the Countrey by such a day and all Priestes that were taken were sent ouer and sett at liberty and many other gracious fauours benefittes VVhich saith he tyme and paper would fayle me if I would make enumeration of them all in recounting wherof euery scrape of my pen so vse his words would serue but for a blott of the Popes ingratitude and iniustice in meating his Ma. tie with so hard a measure for the same So as I thinke quoth he I haue sufficiently wiped of the teares from the Popes eyes for complayning vpon such persecution c. XXV Thus writeth this man who in naming the Popes ingratitude must much more include ours that are Catholicks for that these benefitts such as they were appertayned nothing to the Pope but only in Christian charity as a common spirituall Father and Pastour he being otherwise a stranger vnto vs in bloud and for other worldly respects And as for Catholicks they accept gratefully whatsoeuer least fauour hath byn or is done vnto them and do not doubt but that if his Ma. tie had not bene preuented by sinister information persuasion of others they had tasted of much greater as due vnto them in that they are naturall borne Subiects of the Realme most loyall in hart affection neuer meaning otherwise but to liue in most orderly and dutifull Subiection and Obedience to his Highnes as to their liege Lord and Soueraigne XXVI And wheras this man for proofe of the contrary nameth the powder-treason of a few therby to discredite the whole though this calumniation haue beene answered before yet now I ad further as one said Distingue tempora scripturam concordabis If there had bene no persecution before that treason this might haue beene assigned for some probable cause of the subsequent tribulations but all England knoweth that this is not so but that his Ma. ties sweete myld aspect towards Catholicks at his first entrance was soone by art of their enemyes auerted long before the conspiracy fell out For that not only all the most cruell Statutes and penall Lawes made by Q. Elizabeth were renewed and confirmed before this with addition of others tending to no lesse rigour acerbitie but also the exaction of the same was put in practice with great seueritie namely the paymēt of the twenty poundes a moneth or two partes of their goods and landes for Recusants once remitted by his Ma. tie as heere is confessed were not only recalled againe but the arrearages therof in like manner exacted and for leuying wherof throughout sundry shyres of the Realme especially in the North there was such ransacking of mens houses such dryuing away of their Cattell frō their groundes such strayning of their Rents such vexing of their tennants not knowne perhaps to his Ma. tie as if the whole Countrey had byn gyuen ouer to spoyle desolation XXVII Nor were mens goods and persons only afflicted but the lyues also of sundry taken away for cause of their Religion before this powder-treason fell out which desperate treason to ascribe as an effect and fruite of too much clemency in his Ma. tie as this Minister doth is a strange assertion no doubt for so much as such effects do not proceed but of exasperated myndes which clemency worketh not eyther in men or beasts Neyther did euer any learned Philosopher that wrote of the good institution of any Common wealth or of the security of any Prince in his Gouernment put such effects for fruits of clemency but rather of the contrary manner of proceeding And if all the disasterous ends of the most vnfortunate Princes that euer haue byn destroyed should be layd togeather and the causes therof exactly inquired it would be found so and consequently that this Minister is no good Counsellour to his Ma. tie in this so great weighty affayre And we hope that Almighty God by the mercy of his dearest Sonne our Sauiour and through the prayers of his Ma. ties good Mother and other holy Princes of his Royall bloud now in heauen will neuer suffer him at the egging of such exasperating people to follow so violent troublesome and dangerous a course and so contrary to theirs whiles they lyued vpon earth and so alienate from his owne sweete nature and Princely disposition XXVIII But to proceed a litle further in the narration of some poyntes of heauy persecutiō that insued soone after his Ma. ties being in England much before the powder-treason was attempted Who doth not know what afflictions were layd vpon Catholicks euen in the very first yeare of his Ma. ties raigne especially towards the end therof much more throughout all the second yeare before the said powder-treason fell out For then not only in the Shires and Prouinces abroad but euen in London it sel●e and in the eyes of the Court the violence and insolency of continuall searches grew to be such as was intollerable no night passing commonly but

things or not If it be lawfull as I neuer heard or read it doubted of then why is the Pope so vniust and cruell towards his owne Catholicks as to commaund them to disobey their Soueraignes lawfull commandement If it be vnlawfull why hath he not expressed any one cause or reason therof But this Dilemma is easily dissolued or rather falleth of it self both his pillers being but broken reeds framed out of false suppositions For that the Pope neyther denyeth it to be lawfull to obey the Soueraigne in Cyuill and Temporall things nor doth he command Catholicks to disobey their Prince his lawfull commādements but only where they be vnlawful to be performed as he supposeth them to be in the taking of this Oath Wherof he expresseth sundry causes and reasons I meane so many as the Oath it self cōteyneth points cōcerning Religion to which end he setteth downe the whole Oath as it lyeth with intimation that those points cannot be sworne with integrity of Catholicke Religion good conscience which is sufficient for a Iudge who disputeth not but determineth So as hereupon to make illation of the Popes vniust and cruell dealing towards Catholicks by this his decision as though he sorbad Ciuill Obedience is to buyld vpon a voluntary false ground supposing or rather imposing the Pope to say that which he doth not and then to refute him as though he had said it indeed And is this good dealing LVIII But yet he goeth forward vpon the same false ground to buyld more accusations against the Pope saying That if the foundation of his exhorting Catholicks to beare patiently their tribulations be false as this Apologer auoucheth it to be then it can worke no other effect then to make him guylty of the bloud of so many of his sheep whome he doth thus willfully cast away not only to the needles losse of their liues and ruyne of their famylies but euen to the laying on of a perpetuall slander vpon all Papists As it no zealous Papist could be a true Subiect to his Prince and that Religion and the Temporall Obedience to the Cyuill Magistrate were two things incompatible and repugnant in themselues Thus he LIX But who doth not see that these be all iniurious inferences inforced vpon the former false suppositions to witt That Catholicks suffer nothing for their Conscience That there is no persecution at all in England That there is nothing exacted by this last oath but only and meerly Cyuill Obedience and that in this the Pope exhorteth them to disobey the Temporall Prince in Temporall dutyes and thereby giueth iust occasion to the Prince to vse his sword against them and consequently that he is cause of the effusion of their bloud and of the infamy of Catholicke Religion as though no Catholicke by his Religion could be a true Subiect to his Temporall Prince All which suppositions being vtterly mistaken and not true the more often they are repeated the more exorbitant seemeth the ouersight of the wryter And in my opinion the very same might haue bene obiected vnto S. Cyprian and other Fathers of the Primitiue Church that they were guylty of so many Martyrs bloud willfully cast away and of the ruyne of their familyes and other inconueniences by exhorting them not to doe against their Consciences nor to yield to their Temporall Princes Commandements against God and their Religion no not for any torments that might be layd vpon them nor for any losses that might fall vnto them of goods life honour same friendes wife children or the like which were ordinary exhortations in those daies of persecution as by their Bookes yet extant doth appeare LX. Neyther is it sufficient to say that those tymes and ours are different for that the things then demaunded were apparantly vnlawfull but these not for that to vs that are Catholicks these things are as vnlawfull now as those other were then to them for that they are no lesse against our Consciences in matters of Religion For why should it be more damnable then and indispensable to deliuer vp a Byble or new Testament for examples sake when the Emperour commaunded it then now to sweare an Oath against our Conscience and Religion when our Temporall Prince exacteth it For that this perhaps is called the Oath of Allegiance Who knoweth not that the fayrest tytle is put vpon the fowlest matter when it is to be persuaded or exacted And he that shall read the Historyes of that tyme and of those auncient afflictions shall see that Act also to haue beene required as of Obedience and Allegiance and not of Religion being only the deliuery vp of materiall bookes and yet did the whole Church of God condemne them for it that deliuered the same and held for true Martyrs all those that dyed for denying thereof for that they would not doe an Act against their Consciences LXI Well then to draw to an end of this second paragraph about the two Breues of Paulus Quintus two things more writeth this Apologer whereunto I must in like manner say somewhat The first is That Pope Clemens Octauus sent into England two Breues immediatly before the late Queenes death for debarring of his Maiestie our now Soueraigne of the Crowne or any other that eyther would professe or any way tolerate the professours of our Religion contrary saieth he to his manifold vowes and protestations simul eodem tempore and as it were deliuered vno eodem Spiritu to diuers of his Maiestyes Ministers abroade professing all kyndenes and shewing all forwardnes to aduance him to this Crowne c. Wherein still I fynde the same veyne of exaggeration and calumniation continued by the Apologer For hauing procured some knowledge of those two Breues I fynde them not sent into England togeather nor immediatly before the late Queenes death but the one diuers yeares before shee dyed and the other after her death and this to different effects For in the first the Pope being consulted what Catholicks were bound to doe in conscience for admitting a new Prince after the Queene should be dead for so much as some of different Religions were or might be pretenders he determined that a Catholicke was to be preferred not thinking as may be presumed to preiudice therein his Maiesty that now is of whome vpon the relations and earnest asseuerations of those his Maiestyes Ministers abroad who heere are mentioned he had conceaued firme hope that his Highnes was not farre from being a Catholicke or at least wise not altogeather so alienate from that Religion or professours therof as reasonable hope might not be conceaued of his conuersion though in regard of not preiudicing his Tytle in England the said Ministers auouched that it was not thought expedient at that tyme to make declaration therof LXII This was auerred then how truly or falsly I know not But many letters and testifications are extant hereof which were the cause of those demonstrations of Clemens Octauus to fauour