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A68818 A discourse plainely prouing the euident vtilitie and vrgent necessitie of the desired happie vnion of the two famous kingdomes of England and Scotland by way of answer to certaine obiections against the same. Thornborough, John, 1551-1641. 1604 (1604) STC 24035; ESTC S107314 12,497 44

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A DISCOVRSE PLAINELY PROVING the euident vtilitie and vrgent necessitie of the desired happie Vnion of the two famous Kingdomes of England and Scotland by way of answer to certaine obiections against the same AN CHO RA SPEL LONDON Printed by Richard Field for Thomas Chard 1604. TO THE KINGS MOST EXCELLENT Maiestie James by the grace of God King of England Scotland France and Ireland c. YOVR most excellent Maiestie being graciously pleased to reade and approoue the written Copie of that J haue now printed and withall to declare your princely pleasure sufficient warrant for publishing the same J haue thought meete in all humblenesse of dutie to your Maiestie and in all truth of zeale to my countrey by this meanes to endeuour to resolue them which doubted to perswade them which denied and to confirme them which applauded the most happie intended Vnion of your Highnes two most famous kingdomes of England and Scotland J was not ignorant that the copies of the obiections against it were this Tearme caried into most parts of those your Maiesties Realmes and I suppose also beyond the seas which might in time without answer seeme to preiudice your Maiesties honor vniustly with scandale abroade and murmure at home Therefore though I be most vnworthy to publish to the world my meane vnderstanding in a matter of such graue consideration and great consequence yet haue I rather chosen to hazard my poore credit subiect to each sensure then suffer a cause in its owne worth so precious to sustaine wrong by generall silence for obiections are of force where no answer doth refute Onely I humbly craue your Highnesse pardon for my bold presumption and will euermore with hands and heart lift vp to heauen pray to God for the preseruation of your gracious Maiestie and of your royall issue in all honor health and happinesse Your Maiesties faithfull subiect and humble seruant Ioh. Bristol A Discourse plainely prouing the euident vtilitie and vrgent necessitie of the desired happie vnion of the two famous Kingdomes of England and Scotland by way of answer to certaine obiections against the same IT was long before the Obiections against the intended happy vnion of both the Realmes came to my handes but hauing read them I could not hold my hād frō writing to remoue cleare them esteeming them onely as great shew of big logges laid in the way betweene the two eminent markes shot at by the soueraigne Vnitor namely honor and happinesse the one inseparably inherent in his most royall person the other assuredly intended for Subiects benefite which things in apparant vtilitie or vrgent necessitie the Obiectors desire to be shewed them for whose satisfaction I haue briefly examined and answered euery obiection The Obiectors find no president at home nor abroad of vniting or contracting of the names of two seuerall Kingdomes or States into one name where the Vnion hath growne by mariage or bloud and say that the examples which may be alleaged are but in case of conquest But I remember that Charles of Fraunce the eighth as Comineus Proofe by mariage mentioneth taking to wife the heire of litle Btitaine annexed it to the Crown of France ruled it by lawes customes and priuiledges of Fraunce and gaue the Nobles thereof place in Parliament in Fraunce for vnion is a strong keeper of imperiall Soueraigntie and is the very sinewes of weale publique But as Tacitus saith by diuers lawes ouer diuerse nations subiect to one King Quicquid est authoritatis crebris destruitur contradictionibus Charles the fift vnited in the common name of Spaine diuers other his kingdomes wherof two of them namely Aragon and Castile Proofe by bloud descended to him in right of bloud For he well knew that the most eminent in dignitie is most honoured by Vnitie and that this is truely called Prudence euen the electing or reiecting the continuing or chaunging of formes and vniting kingdomes according to time place or persons which great vertue is not alwaies contained in certaine and the same bounds but altereth it selfe as occasion serueth in respect of forenamed circumstance But the Obiectors acknowledge vniting of kingdoms in case of conquest I maruell they do it not much more by right of bloud for in that vnion of constraint there is euer doubt and dread for continuance therof as is well said Malus custos diuturnitatis metus but in this by right of bloud God giueth blessing to natures worke first in the greater maiestie of the high and supreme gouernor where one mightie Monarch is of more commaund and power then a king of diuers distinguished kingdomes Secondly in the more facilitie of the gouernment where people vnder like lawes are more easily ruled then vnder diuers lawes And thirdly in the more securitie of the gouerned who being led with like equitie of lawes will one loue and strengthen the other but being deuided do oftentimes vndermine and practise subuersion one of the other Vires imperij in consensu sunt obedientium tolle Liuy vnitatem omnis imperij contextus in multas partes dissidet VVhich consideration made king Henrie the eighth rightfully assuming the title of King of Ireland by voluntarie Vote in Parliament of the Lords and Commons of that kingdome albeit the Kings of England were before that time but called Lords of Ireland yet now changing his Stile to endeuour by iust lawes to cause the Irish chaunge as well their apparel as language and diuers their old formes and former lawes and to reduce them into forme of English fashion euen against their former customes and conditions It is then a matter not onely of vtility and necessitie but also of reason and iustice that a King in right of bloud holding two kingdomes or States do vnite and contract them into one name and nature specially kingdomes of one continent and which in auncient times were but one till ambition and contention deuided them And this may stand for answer to the Obiectors first maine head of matter of estate inward Now where it is farther alleaged that the alteration of the name of the King doth ineuitably and infallibly draw on an erection of a new kingdome and a dissolution and extinguishment of the old herein verily I think the matter is much mistaken for the change of name is not so rightly to be tearmed alteration or new erection as restitution and reparation both of name and honor for diuers his Maiesties most noble Progenitors haue heretofore bene entitled as Chronicles tell vs Kings of all Britaine as Henry the second King of al Britaine Duke of Gascoine Guien and Normandie whose sonne king Iohn had also in his coine stamped as is to be shewed Iohannes Rex Britonum And before the conquest of the Saxons it is certaine that the whole Ile was called by the name of Britain But Saxons entring at disaduantage of that mightie nation consumed by death and famine conquering the remnant of people of famous Britaine enforced them
title reformatiō of law Vnion of kingdōs And ancient Records do no more leese their force by the chaunge of England into Britaine then by change of Queene Elizabeth into king Iames. And there is no more incertaintie of pleadings instruments and writs then when a plaintiffe deceasseth after seuen yeares suite his heire is put to begin and commence his suite anew and in other name The heart of obiections against Vnion being halfe broken let vs enter into the third cōsideration of matter of State inward where is obiected a possibilitie of alienation of the Crowne of England to the Crowne of Scotland in case his Maiesties Line should determine But blessed be God our gracious soueraigne King is blessed with a plentifull issue and hath yet much farther hope And I hope for which I pray night and day that his Maiesties royall Issue shall not faile so long as the Sunne and Moone indureth Neuertheles if some will not labor of the common bane of good wits which is rather to dispute then obey and rather to reason beyond reason then yeeld to reason more magis quàm iudicio they may herein also easily answer thēselues that in vniting the two kingdomes the second place in stile may be rather drawne to the next of bloud in our Land then the kingdome of England be transferred to one farther off from this Stemme VVhich thing neither Henry the seuenth nor Henry the eighth doubted the one seeking to marie his eldest daughter Lady Margaret to king Iames the fourth of Scotland hoping if his heire male failed by that means to vnite Scotland to England And the other hauing his whole drift to match his sonne Prince Edward to Queene Mary foreseeing in his prouidence the inestimable benefite of vniting the two kingdomes for which cause many of the Nobles of Scotland gaue faith to do their best indeuours But it is a strange doubt and cast beyond the Moone to imagine that Vnion of the two kingdomes doth so confound the State and change the tenure to bring it so into case of purchase as it will necessarily subiect England to Scotland especially if his most excellent Maiesty of his singular tendernes loue to this his realme of England be pleased to effect establish that in case his royall Issue which Almighty God of his infinit mercie defend shold faile that then by this happie intended Vnion the Realme of Scotland should for euer be and continue indissolubly vnited and annexed to the lawfull and rightfull inheritance and succession of the Crowne of England in the bloud royall of the same Now touching matter of State forreine in answer to the first obiection I am well assured that our forreine affaires were at worst in the opinion of all at the decease of our late Queene and our entercourse vtterly decayed with many Princes so as we neede a kind of present renewing which may be concluded as well vnder title of King of all Britaine as of England To the second it is easily answered that the King loseth no precedencie of place as is imagined specially antiquitie as in the Obiections is alleaged guiding it and not greatnesse For the Successor to king Arthur of Brittaine will be worthie in the opinion of the whole world of better place then king Egbert of England To the third that if the name of England as is imagined be obscured the name of famous and great Britaine will be illustrate memorable in times past to all the then knowne nations of the earth Touching matter of Honor it is certaine and euident that the name of England though it hath bene worthily most famous and great yet is not equal to the title of great Britaine when England and Scotland are reunited either by reason of honor or of power All Histories remembring vnto vs that the Brittaines long time resisted the mightie force of Romaines Lords and Conquerors of the world And albeit some fathers can be content to disinherite their owne daughters to continue their names as is inferred in the obiections and therefore inforced should be much more in States specially where the name hath bene famous yet for my part I account such parents vnkind and vnnaturall where selfe loue of their name maketh them forget themselues and forsake their owne flesh I will not vrge here the law of God of nature and of most nations where daughters inherit and names grow extinguished But this is a vaine respect onely of name wherof is spoken to get a name on earth and to thinke their name should neuer be put out whereas so many countries so many people so many persons haue either lost or left their former name and most willingly haue bene called by another name Gaudet cognomine Virg Aen. 6. terra that countrie reioyced to be called by a new name how much more shold our land imbrace this name of Britaine and yet not new but indeed his old proper name renewed and as it were rediuiued and restored frō the dead Or be it simply losse only of a bare transitorie name yet as the Prophet Isay Isa 56. 3. speaketh Let not the Eunuch say Behold I am a drie tree my name shall perish with me Let vs rather regard that name which God promiseth to them that serue him saying Isa 56. 5. Euen vnto them will I giue in my house and within my pallaces a place and a name better then of sons and of daughters I will giue them an euerlasting name which shall not be put out The Argument of Obliuion deserueth no answer but silence and forgetfulnesse and yet I doubt not but famous acts of Noble English men will as well by Chronicle be remembred to posteritie as the glorie of renowmed Britaine Record remaineth to this day neither will either be forgotten to the worlds end The Stile of England now placed before Scotland doth no way preiudice the Vnion by losse of precedencie for when all is one there is no subsequence onely Honor is due to him who is to be honored and much honor to him that is much to be honoured which thing in the Vnion may easily be prouided for and other pretended inconueniences preuented Lastly the Preiudicating the popular opinion to whom as is obiected chaunge of name will be harsh and vnpleasing is in mine opinion a wrong done and imputation laid vpon the people who I know for the most part being a wise nation and I am sure most louing subiects to the kings Maiestie haue learned obedience and dutie and will therefore rather ioy in the content of their good and gracious King then any way murmure at his demand knowing that the Empire as Liuie speaketh is firmi●ssimum when eo gaudent obedientes who doubtlesse with one voice and heart submit themselues and say to their Soueraigne Esto nobis solus arbiter rerum iure nomine regio And as for Harshnesse of the strange name vse will easily make it familiar He said Multa renascentur quae iam
to distinguish and deuide themselues by flying into mountaines and fortified places And afterward king Egbert vtterly to roote out the remembrance of great Brittaine commaunded that the Land should be called no more by that name but England and the people Englishmen But Egbert is dead his power weake nay none at all let none therefore feare to restore his countrie to his old name and auncient honor for Egbert I say is dead and king IAMES liueth viuat vincat Rex Iacobus This I say and enforce againe is a matter also reasonable iust vtile and necessarie seeing the Soueraigne bringeth in no innouation of a new name but restitution of the old no dissolution but fortification whereto I know none will subscribe which either enuy the Kings greatnesse or kingdomes happinesse But let none maruell why it hath not this long time bene reduced into his former name for the diuersitie of kingdomes being made diuers by warre and conquest and hauing heretofore diuers kings could not in reason or iustice indure it nor vnder any colour of vtilitie or necessitie vndergo or conclude it But now seeing our soueraigne Lord the king being rightfully descended of all those kings and princes which heretofore raigned and ruled in England Scotland or VVales as he only hath power to restore all into one to former title and dignitie so let none think this his princely and iust pleasure a new erection but restitution of old where it is more reasonable and iust to extinguish the name of lesser continuance then the name which had continued bene famous by the space of 1137. yeares before Christ and 688. after his incarnation which whole computation cometh to 1825. yeares And where it is most honorable by iust descent in right of bloud not onely to change but to abolish the name imposed by a Conqueror to the dishonor of a Nation and where for ought I vnderstand the matter is not so difficult nor of that inconuenience and danger but may with much ease and safetie be done with saluo iure or other reseruation and explanation as the wise and learned in the lawes can at large deuise when they lift siue noua excogitent siue antiqua restituant But for example I bring the vniting of Dane-Lex and Mercia-lex by Edward the Confessor which was not preiudicial to any that euer I could reade but profitable and needfull to all in the abolishing of diuers old lawes and ordaining diuers new and making lawes to all all one done no doubt with due respect to weale publike with needfull limitation and due consideration of men matter time place and other circumstance Neither doth any new erection and extinguishment of old so necessarily conclude inconuenience full of repugnancie danger of construction and confusion as is pretended but may in this case vbi beata omnium vita moderatori est proposita as easily be cleared and auoyded as it was when the principalitie and countrie of VVales was by Parliament incorporated and vnited vnto the kingdome of England and all the inhabitants thereof made equall in freedomes liberties rights priuiledges lawes and in all other respects to the natural subiects of England and all inheritances made of English tenure to descend without diuision or partition after the maner of England and the Lawes Statutes and Ordinances of the Realme of England commaunded to be executed and put in practise within the countrie and Principalitie of VVales So as now in this new erection and dissolution of the old the VVelshmen with vs and we with them acknowledge ioyfully one onely Gouernor and one only gouernment where the maiestie of the Gouernour is equally supra nos and the iustice and equitie of the gouernment equally pro nobis where is certus ordo in iubendo parendo VVhich certaine and the same course and order of commaunding by the king and by his lawes and of obedience in subiects is a strong tye and as it were a vitall spirit holding in one infinite thousands where Regere as the Philosopher speaketh is reckened inter necessaria Arist 1. Pol. cap. 3. and Regi inter vtilia Againe could seuen kingdomes of Saxons be reduced into one and in good time all their diuers Lawes whereby the diuerse subiects of those seuen diuers kingdomes were diuersly gouerned be brought into one form of ciuill gouernment without repugnancie ambiguitie or danger and shall we thinke it a matter of such difficultie to vnite onely two kingdomes which do not much differ in manners lawes and customes sauing such lawes and customes as were formerly ordained on each part one against another when they were enemies or scarce friends one to the other VVhich lawes doubtlesse all will say must be abrogated that in further proceeding to vnion wise men with graue consideration may conclude it for good of both nations without offence as in former times much more hath bene done with lesse ado An Empire of many kingdomes thus reduced into one is not vnlike the firmament of heauen which God hath adorned with the two great lights the Sunne and Moone and other Starres euen the whole army and harmonie of the heauens in one firmament VVho so throweth a stone against heauen saith the VVise man it will fall vpon his own head And if any one standing alone from the rest speaketh against and oppugneth this Vnion better it were sauing my charitie that vnus ille periret quàm Vnitas Touching the enumeration and recitall of the speciall or seuerall confusions incongruities and mischiefes which in the Obiections are in the second place of matter of Estate inwarde pretended I briefly answer that there is no feare of confusion in true and perfect Vnion VVhich thing the mightie Alexander renowmed for fortitude and pollicie well knewe who is much commended by Plutarke that Plut. de fortuna Alexandri where Zeno chiefe of Stoickes framed an Idea of best Common wealth such as was not deuided by countreyes and contrarie customes but was as all one of one kinde of life and as one flocke feeding in one pasture vnder one shepheard Alexander I say put that in practise which Zeno but imagined for saith Plutarke Not as Aristotle Alexanders Maister taught him so did he liuing as a father to the Graecians and cruell Commander ouer Barbarians respecting some and neglecting others but he reconciled all into one mixing mens liues lawes names and mariages together and perswading that none were Aliens and strangers among his subiects but such as were euill men accounting all good men as one man Now I conclude this point that there is no confusion incongruitie or mischiefe to be feared in that Vnion where our most rightfull King sitteth not by conquest of sword but by right of royall bloud in the seate of his most noble Progenitors and not as Alexander who by conquest sate in the seate of Darius among Persians nor as Xerxes Herod lib. 7 who ioyned Asia and Europa together with a woodden bridge ouer
cecidere cadentque Horace Quae nunc sunt in honore vocabula si volet vsus This pretended vnpleasing harshnesse is no more then the nicenesse of a virgin who is as loth and maketh it daintie to leaue her fathers name yet afterward maried to a husband taketh greatest comfort in the name of her husband in whome she glorieth and by whom she enioyeth all her worldly ioy And yet need not England be so nice as if she were a virgin who like a widdow hath so often chaunged her name but may take pride as widdowes do to be called by her most honorable and most glorious name Thus hauing briefly run ouer the obiections and withall caried in open view in mine answer due consideration both of euident vtilitie and vrgent necessitie I will be bold with additions of more reasons yet a litle farther to proceed in the perswasion of this desired happie Vnion God alwaies blessed and to be honored for euermore who is Trinitie in Vnitie and Vnitie in Trinitie three persons and but one God doth by influence of his holy Spirit giue diuers gifts and graces to beleeuers of what countrie or condition soeuer they be and gouerneth them by one holy law and vniteth them in the same faith though diuersly scattered among all the nations of the Christian world that hereby the gods on earth whom he hath placed to rule ouer many and diuers kingdoms vpō earth might learne by the same lawes in things humane and same religion in matters diuine to preserue VVeale publike and Christian Societie among men But the ambition and frowardnesse of many desirous rather to be distracted into diuers names and countries and to be ruled by diuers lawes and customes do oft times hazard the common good and peace of the VVeale publique where two kingdoms so deuided vnder one Soueraigne are not vnlike the rich treasures of pearle and gold laid vp in one shippe by contrarieties of diuers winds to be driuen vpon rockes with extreamest danger as is said in Tully of deuiding Defin. and distinguishing desires into seueral parts and members in such diuersities and differences Hoc est dissipare non distinguere frangere non diuidere VVhich thing is to be feared by not vniting but keeping the two kingdomes still in parts when vpō euery discontent in Scotlād as at a backe dore passage may be giuen for forreine enemie soone to weaken a deuided power as Cyrus the Persian soone emptied Herodot 1. that great and deepe riuer otherwise vnpassable for his souldiers by drawing it into diuers chanels And why should not we feare such and greater euils if as Virgil laid infamy vpon vs calling vs toto diuisos orbe Britannos so we be content to adde greater infamie to our selues and become toto in orbe diuisi deuided within our selues in the sight and view of the whole world But I hope and wish for better things that by Vnion in name of Britains we may leaue to be any longer deuided into English and Scottish as riuers of diuers names meeting in the sea receiue one and the same name the rather because the elements of fire and water of earth and aire being of repugnant qualities yet ioyned in one body do agree in one forme as in a medium vniting and mixing them together much more diuers kingdomes oft times heretofore at warre and discord yet now being vnited into one bodie of one name and nature qualified by equall mixture of law manners honors mariages and such like may be made perfect in one forme and haue a being not as English and Scottish but as Brittaines knit together in that third and renowned name that the Maxime may be verified in vs Quae in aliquo tertio conueniunt optimè conueniunt I confesse that some lawes of ours may be thought too streight for them and some liberties of theirs vnfitting vs but let all be wrested alike pulling some vp and letting some downe and in pleasing harmonie we shall find as Tully saith Commune aequabile inter omnes ius where will be no strife as was between Esau and Iacob vndermining and deceiuing one the other of blessing and patrimonie but all loue and vnitie and concord and content as if all were not twins but one man euen one heart in one bodie And now if I phicrates that valiant Leader Plut. were againe liuing and asked whether he were vnder the now imperiall Maiestie this or that English or Scottish or among or ouer them an horseman an archer or a Leader he might truly answer as sometimes he did in like case No not any of these but I am he who knoweth vnder him whom I serue to commaund and gouerne all these as if they were but one man Vnius Ducis imperium simul Sen. Epist sentiunt omnes copiae Thus in war and tumult much more in quiet peace may it be said Diuers subiects ad nutum vnius Regis eiusdem legis omnes simul respondent So powerfull is the force of Vnion that vna Via being director for lawe and Cor vnum performer for obedience the lawe enioyning obedience and obedience executing law the Prince cannot commaund what the people will not obey and the people will obey what the Prince commandeth and Vnitie among them will vphold all Vnum imperij Tacit. An. 1 corpus vnius animo regendum videtur and so likewise Eiusdem iuris esse debent qui sub eodē Rege victuri sunt Q. Cur. 10. But rule of two kingdomes without vniting them is to giue occasion to either part to looke backe for an old grudge Vbi antiqui odij pertinacia in publicum stimulat exitium which I feare would be as the going backe of two Rammes more fearefull to butt at and beate one the other where held both together in like yoke one cannot easily offend or force the other Sic enim immensa multitudo authoritatis Seneca quasi spiritu regitur And where it is of the nature of man not to indure all seruitude nor all libertie but to striue to shake off the one and to be wearie of the other it is certaine that equitie and equabilitie of like lawes to a diuers people vnited in one will make them which otherwise feare seruitude to enioy freedome and those which seeme most free by former priuiledges and immunities to feare seruitude if they transgresse their bounds for such Vnion and equitie is communis custodia principatus reipublicae But faction and ambition are the father and mother of intestine calamitie ciuill warre and deadly feud VVho so loueth this will neuer like that neither is he of the bodie but of the toes and feet of that image which Nabuchodonosor Dan. 2. dreamed of whose head was of fine gold whose breast and armes of siluer whose belly and thighs of brasse whose legs of Iron and whose feet part of iron and part of clay Siluer brasse and iron are mettals easily mixed but iron and clay will not by any meanes melt and ioyne together Kingdoms deuided are prefigured in the iron and clay they are partly warlike and well gouerned and partly weake factious and seditious they agree not to the king their goldē head and though they as the Text saith mingle themselues with the seed of men yet ioyne vers 43. not one with another but are as iron and clay which will not be mixed together The Poets call this latter age Ferrea let vs which liue in it proue them Poets and not Prophets that so being ioyned to our golden head in all obedience and dutie in all loue and zeale to our countrie and in Vnitie among our selues we may liue a blessed life in the golden age of this our happy time and shew our selues well tempered not of brittle but of better clay Queis as the Poet saith meliore luto finxit praecordia Titan. Therefore let Aristides and Themistocles ioyned in one Commission consult vpon the point some for England some for Scotland and for the VVeale publike say one to the other Vis vt hîc deponamus inimicitias why do Plut. we striue together for we are brethren and they cannot but conclude that the VVeale publique was neuer well administred without Vnion and amitie namely Vnion in the gouernment and amitie among the gouerned Joh. Bristol FINIS