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england_n	henry_n	king_n	pope_n	16,586	5	6.9376	4	true

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A71250	A second defence of the exposition of the doctrine of the Church of England against the new exceptions of Monsieur de Meaux, Late Bishop of Condom, and his vindicator, the first part, in which the account that has been given of the Bishop of Meaux's Exposition, is fully vindicated ...	Wake, William, 1657-1737.	1687 (1687)	Wing W260; ESTC R4642	179,775	220

of that very Person whom you quote for your Relation 27. Having thus given us a proof either of your Skill or your Integrity in the account of the first Conversion of our Island under Pope Gregory the Great you next make a very large step as to the progress of your Religion and such as still confirms me more and more how very unfit you are to turn Historian 28. Add pag. 8. Reply This Faith and these Exercises say you taught and practised by St. Austin were propagated down even till King Henry the VIIIth's time Answ In which account whether we are to complain of your Ignorance or your Vnsincerity be it your part to determine this I am sure they cannot both be excused 29. I have already shewn you that that Faith which was found in the Church of England in King Henry the VIIIth's time could not have been propagated down from the time of Austin's coming hither seeing that Monk neither taught nor practised the greatest part of those Corruptions which were afterwards by degrees brought into ours as well as into the other Churches of the Roman Communion But however not to insist upon this Fundamental Mistake Can you Sir with any Conscience affirm that the Doctrine which you now teach was till King Henry the VIIIth's time without interruption received and practised in this Country 30. First For the Brittish Bishops whom you before bring in as submitting themselves to Austin your own Author Bede expresly declares that in his time which was an hundred Years after the Death of Austin they entertain'd no Communion with them Lib. 2. cap. 20. Seeing says he to this very day it is the Custom of the Britains to have no value for the Faith and Religion of the English nor to communicate with them any more than with Pagans Which Henry of Huntingdon thus confirms Lib. 3. Hist That neither the Britains nor Scots i. e. Irish would communicate with the English or with Austin their Bishop any more than with Pagans So that for one Age at least the British Bishops then neither own'd the Authority of your Church nor had any manner of Communion with the Members of it But 31. Secondly Have you never heard of some other Kings of England who with their Parliaments have most stifly opposed the Pretences of the Pope and refused all Messages from Him and made it no less than High-Treason for any one to bring his Orders or Interdicts into the Kingdom What think you of another Henry no less brave than his Successor whom you so revile in his Defence of himself against his Rebellious Subject but your Saint Thomas a Becket I could add many Acts of Parliament made long before King Henry the VIIIth's time to shew you that tho he indeed proved the most successful in his Attempts to shake off the Pope's Authority yet that several other of our Princes had shewn him the way and that the Usurpations of that See were neither quietly own'd nor patiently submitted to by his Royal Predecessors And then 32. Thirdly For the matter of your Doctrine it must certainly be a great piece of Confidence in you to pretend that this came down such as you now believe and practise from the time of Austin the Monk to King Henry the VIIIth's days I speak not now of the great Opposition that was made to it by Wickleffe tho supported by the Duke of Lancaster the Lord Marshall of England and divers others of chiefest note in this Kingdom in the time of Edward the Third and Richard the Second I need not say in how many Points he stood up against the Doctrine of your Church what a mighty Interest he had to support him against the Authority of the Pope and the Rage of the Bishop of London and his other Enemies on that account so as both freely to preach against your Errors and yet die in Peace in a good old Age. The number of his Followers was almost infinite and tho severe Laws were afterwards made against them yet could they hardly ever be utterly rooted out But yet least you should say that Wickleffe was only a Schismatick from your Church which constantly held against him I will rather shew you in a few Instances that even the Church of England it self which you suppose to have been so conformable to your present Tenets was in truth utterly opposite to your Sentiments in many Particulars And because I may not run out into too great a length I will insist only upon two but those very considerable Points 33. The first is the Doctrine of Transubstantiation which as it came but late into the Roman Church so did it by Consequence into ours too Certain it is that in the 10th Century the contrary Faith was publickly taught among us Now not to insist upon the Authority of Bede who in several parts of his Works plainly shews how little he believed your Doctrine of Transubstantiation this is undeniably evident from the Saxon Homily translated by Aelfrick and appointed in the Saxons time to be read to the People at Easter before they received the Holy Communion and which is from one end to the other directly opposite to the Doctrine of the Real Presence as establish'd by your Council of Trent And the same Aelfrick in his Letters to Wulfine Bishop of Scyrburne and to Wulfstane Archbishop of York shews his own Notions to have been exactly correspondent to what that Homily taught The Housell says he is Christes Bodye not bodelye but ghostlye Not the Bodye which he suffred in but the Bodye of which he spake when he blessed Bread and Wyne to Housell a night before his suffring and said by the blessed Bread Thys is my Bodye and agayne by the holy Wyne This is my Bloud which is shedd for manye in forgiveness of Sins Vnderstand nowe that the Lord who could turn that Bread before his suffering to his Bodye and that Wyne to his Bloude ghostlye that the self-same Lorde blesseth dayly through the Priestes handes Bread and Wyne to his ghostlye Bodye and to his ghostlye Bloud All which he more fully explains in his other Letter H. de Knyghton de Event Anglice l. 5. p. 2647 2648. Nay it appears by a Recantation of Wickleffe mention'd by Knyghton that even in the latter time of that Man's Life there was no such Doctrine then in England as Transubstantiation publickly imposed as an Article of Faith. By all which it is evident that your great Doctrine of the Real Presence with all its necessary Appendages was not as you pretend propagated down from Austin's to King Henry the Eight's time but brought in to the Church some hundreds of Years after that Monk died 34. The other Instance I shall offer to overthrow your Pretences is no less considerable viz. the Worship of Images It is well known what Opposition was made not only by the Emperor Charles the Great and the Fathers of the Synod of Franckfort but by the French

Clergy in their Synod at Paris and by almost all the rest of the Bishops of the Western Church against your pretended General Council of Nice wherein this Doctrine was first establish'd The Definitions of this Council being sent to the Emperour out of the East he transmitted a Copy of them into England Hereupon Alcuinus who had formerly been his School-master wrote an Answer to him in the Name of the Clergy of England to declare their dislike of this Doctrine and the account of which our ancient Histories give us in these words In the Year from the Incarnation of our Lord 792 Charles King of France sent to Britain a Synode Booke which was directed unto him from Constantinople Hoveden Annal ad Ann. 792. Simeon Dunelm Hist p. 111. Mat. West ad An. 793. Spelm. Conc. Tom. 1. p. 306. in the which Book alas many things unconvenient and contrarye to the true Fayth were found in especial that it was establyshed with a whole consent almost of all the Learned of the East no less than of three hundredth Bishops or more that Men ought to worship Images the whiche the Churche of God DOTH VTTERLYE ABHORRE Against the whiche Alcuine wrote an Epistle wonderouslye proved by the Authoritye of Holy Scripture and brought that Epistle with the same Booke and Names of our Byshops and Princes to the King of France And thus neither was this Doctrine nor Practice propagated down from Austin to King Henry the Eighth but on the contrary unknown to Austin and rejected as you see by the Church of England almost 200 Years after his first Conversion of it 35. Ibid. And this may suffice to shew both your Skill in Church-History and the little pretence you have for that vain and most false Assertion that your Religion was taught and practised by S. Austin and propagated down even to King Henry the Eighth 's time whereas indeed it is made up of such Corruptions as crept into it long after his Decease Your next business is to rail at King Henry the Eighth which you do very heartily See Thuanus tho let me tell you that better Men than you are even of your own Commuion and who were much more acquainted with the Affairs of those Times speak better things of him And had he been as bad as you are able to represent him yet I could send you to some of the Heads of your Church who have as far excell'd him in Wickedness as ever any of your Canonists have pretended they did in Authority But the Merits of Princes as well as ordinary Persons are measured by some Men not according to their real worth but as they have served their Interests or opposed the Usurpations And tho King Henry the Eighth be now such a Monster yet had he not thrown off the Pope's Supremacy you would have made no difficulty to have forgiven him all his other Sins whilst he lived and would have found out somewhat to justify his Memory now he is dead We know how one of the best Popes of this last thousand Years called Heaven and Earth to celebrate the Praises of a Traytor that had murder'd his Master and possess'd himself of his Empire And Cromwell himself tho a Usurper and Heretick yet wanted not his Panegyrists among those pretenders to Loyalty who now cannot afford a good word to the Honour of a Prince from whose Royal Line their present Sovereign at this day derives his Right to the Crown he wears 36. But however were the Vices of that Prince otherwise never so detestable yet I shall leave it to the World to judg who proceeded with the most Care and Sincerity in the Point you insist upon of his Divorce with Q. Catherine the King who consulted almost all the Learned Men as well as the most famous Vniversities of Europe and then acted according to their Determination Or the Pope who by his notorious jugling with him in the whole process of that Affair shew'd that he resolved to decide it not by any Laws of God or the Church but meerly as his greater Interests with the Emperor or the King should move him to do 37. Ibid. The next step you make is from King Henry to his Son King Edward the Sixth And here you tell us Reply p. 8. That as Schism is commonly follow'd with Heresy so now the Protector who was tainted with Zuinglianism a Reform from Luther endeavour'd to set it up here in England In which you again discover your Zeal against us but not according to Vnderstanding There is hardly any one that knows any thing of the beginning of this Reformation but will be able to tell you that the chief Instrument of it was one whom you have not once mentioned Arch-bishop Cranmer I will not deny but that the Protector concur'd with him in his design but whether he was Zuinglian or what else neither you nor I can tell Dr. Heylin See your Hist Coll. p. 103. who on this occasion is usually your Oracle seems rather to think he was a Lutheran tho easie to be moulded into any form But this I know that had you been so well vers'd in these things Hosp Hist Sacram par 2. p. 33. Lampadius par 3. p. 439. Scultetus Annal. ad An. 1616. as one who pretends to write Historical Remarks ought to be you would have spared that idle Reflection of Zuinglius's being a Reform from Luther it being evident to those who understand his History that neither himself nor the Cantons in which he preach'd were ever Lutherans But on the contrary whereas Luther appear'd but in the Year 1517 Zuinglius began to preach against the Corruptions of the Church of Rome some Years before when the very Name of Luther was not yet heard of And had several Conferences with Cardinal Matthews then in Switzerland to this purpose before ever the other appear'd in publick against them So unfortunate a thing is it for Men to pretend to be witty upon others without considering their own blind side But you go on 38. Ad pag. 9. Reply And from that time the Catholick Doctrine which had been taught by our first Apostles and propagated till then began to be rejected and accused as Erroneons Superstitious and Idolatrous and they who profess'd it persecuted Answ This is still of the same kind as false as it is malicious How false it is that the Doctrine you now profess was either planted here by our first Apostles or propagated till this time in the Church of England I have already shewn And for the Persecution you speak of methinks you should have been asham'd to mention that word being to name Q. Mary's Reign in the very next Line But what at last did this Persecution amount to Were any Roman Catholicks banish'd or put to death for their Religion Were the Laws turn'd against them or any Dragoons sent to convert them No Bonner and Fisher and two others Heath Bishop of Worcester and Day Bishop of Chichester

fifty Years after that Austin the Monk came into England 2dly you say that Austin found only two Customs among the Christians here that he could not tollerate 'T is true indeed upon the second meeting that he had with the Brittish Bishops Bede Lib. 2. c. 2. he told them That though in many things they were contrary to the custom of his Church yet if in those two mentioned they would obey him and joyn with him in preaching the Gospel to the Saxons he would bear with them in the rest But did they therefore acknowledg his Authority in complying with his Desires so you would make us believe They were Obstinate say you TILL God was pleased to testify his Mission and the Authority he came with by the Authentick Seal of Miracles As for his Miracles we have no great Opinion of their Authority since we read in the passage to which I just now referr'd you that Antichrist himself shall come with this Attestation Gal. 1.9 It is the Doctrine that must give credit to the Miracles not these to the Doctrine Should an Angel from Heaven preach any other Gospel than that which we have received St. Paul has commanded us for all the Wonder to bid him be Anathema But I return to the History in which you so notoriously prevaricate that I cannot imagine how one that pretends in this inquisitive Age to deliver the Antiquities of his own Country durst betray himself so notoriously ignorant of it See Sir Bede Loc. cit the words of your own Author Bede expresly contrary to your Allegation But they answer'd that they would do nothing of all this nor receive him for an Arch-Bishop Insomuch that Austin came to high words with them threatning them with that Destruction which they afterwards to their cost met with from his new Saxon Converts And your illustrious Annalist Card. Baron Annal. Tom. 8. An. 604. Baronius cannot forbear making some severe Reflections upon the State of our Island at that Time as if God had therefore given it into the hands of the Barbarians because of the refractory and schismatical Minds of these Bishops 23. Ibid. Reply Your Adversaries you say acknowledg that when St. Austin came into England he taught most if not all the same Doctrines the Roman Catholick Church now teaches c. 24. Answ If S. Austin as you call him taught the same Doctrine which Pope Gregory the Great taught who sent him hither and whose Disciple we are told he was I must then put you in Mind that a very Learned Man has lately shew'd you and I may reasonably presume you could not but know it that he did not teach most much less all the Doctrines which you now teach No Sir the Mystery of Iniquity was not yet come to Perfection and tho your Church had even then in many things declined from its first Faith yet was it much more pure than now it is Protestants Apology p. 57 c. 2d Edit Had you when you took this Pretence from your Friend Mr. Brerely look'd into the Answer that was at large made to it I am perswaded you would have been asham'd to have again advanced so false and trifling an Objection Look Sir I beseech you into the Protestants Appeal Prot. Appeal lib. 1. cap. 2. or if that be too much for one of your Employments look into the Treatise to which I refer you There you will find 1. Vind. of the Answ of some late Papers p. 72 c. That the Scripture was yet received as a perfect Rule of Faith. 2. The Books of the Maccabees which you now put into your Canon rejected then as Apochryphal 3. That Good Works were not yet esteem'd meritorious Nor 4. Auricular Confession a Sacrament That 5. Solitary Masses were disallow'd by him And 6. Transubstantiation yet unborn That 7. The Sacrament of the Eucharist was hitherto administred in both kinds And 8. Purgatory it self not brought either to certainty or to perfection That by consequence 9. Masses for the Dead were not intended to deliver Souls from those Torments Nor 10. Images allow'd for any other purpose than for Ornament and Instruction 11. That the Sacrament of Extreme Vnction was yet unform'd and even 12. The Pope's Supremacy so far from being then establish'd as it now is that Pope Gregory thought it to be the fore-running of Antichrist for one Bishop to set himself above all the rest These are the Instances in which you have been shewn the vast difference there is between Pope Gregory's Doctrine and that of the Council of Trent and which may serve for a Specimen to satisfie the World with what Truth you pretend that we acknowledg that S. Austin when he came into England taught most if not all the same Doctrines that you now teach And this may also suffice for your next Argument founded upon it viz. 25. Add pag. 7 8. Reply That these Doctrines and Practices were either then taught and exercised by the British Christians also or they were not If they were not taught by them certainly we should not have found them so easily submitting to them If they were taught by the British Bishops also then they were of a longer standing than S. Austin's time and we must either grant they were introduced by the first Preachers of the Gospel here or evidently shew some other time before St. Austin when this Church embraced them 26. Answ A Dilemma is a terrible thing with Sense and Truth but without them 't is a ridiculous one as I take this to be For 1. It is evident from what I have before said that Austin did not teach the same Doctrines nor establish the same Practices that you do now teach and establish but did indeed in most of your Corruptions differ from you So that like the unwise Builder you have erected a stately Fabrick and founded it upon the Sand. 2. Had he been as very a Romish Missionary as your self yet is your Argument still inconclusive For whereas you suppose the Brittish Bishops submitted to him they were on the contrary so far from either obeying his Authority or following his Prescriptions that as I have shewn you they utterly rejected both and I will presently add that for above a hundred Years after his Death they utterly refused so much as to communicate with his Proselytes nor esteem'd them any more than Pagans So that I may now turn your own Argument upon you that seeing they had such an Abhorrence for Austin and his Followers that they look'd upon them no better than Heathens it very probably was because they neither approved what he taught nor saw any cause to submit to that Authority to which he pretended You see Sir what an admirable Argument you here flourish with and how little cause we have to expect any great Sincerity from you in other matters when in the very History of your own Country you so wretchedly prevaricate and against the express Authority