Irish Statute or Custom Object But it will be said that Writs of Error are only upon failure of justice in Ireland and that suits cannot originally be commenced here for things done in Ireland because the Kings Writ runs not in Ireland Answ This might be a good Plea in the Kings-Bench and inferior Courts at Westminster-Hall the question is Whether it be so in Parliament The Kings Writ runs not within the County-Palatine of Chester and Durham nor within the Five Ports neither did it in Wales before the Union of Henry the 8th's time after the Laws of England were brought into Wales in King Edw. the 1. time Suits were not originally commenced at Westminster-Hall for things done in them yet this never excluded the Parliament-suits for Life Lands and Goods within these jurisdictions are determinable in Parliament as well as in any other parts of the Realm Ireland as appears by the Statute of the Thirtieth year of Henry 3. before-mentioned is united to the Crown of England By the Statute of the Eight and twentieth year of Hen. 6th in Ireland it is declared in these words That Ireland is the proper Dominion of England and united to the Crown of England which Crown of England is of it self and by it self wholly and intirely endowed with all Power and Authority sufficient to yield to the Subjects of the same full and plenary remedy in all Debates and Suits whatsoever By the Statute of the Three and twentieth year of Henry the 8th the first Chapter when the Kings of England first assumed the Title of King of Ireland it is there Enacted that Ireland still is to be held as a Crown annexed and united to the Crown of England So that by the same reason from this that the Kings Writs run not in Ireland it might as well be held that the Parliament cannot originally hold Plea of things done within the County-Palatine of Chester and Durham nor within the Five Ports and Wales Ireland is a part of the Realm of England as appears by those Statutes as well as any of them This is made good by constant practice in all the Parliament Rolls from the first to the last there are Receivers and Tryers of Petitions appointed for Ireland for the Irish to come so far with their Petitions for Justice and the Parliament not to have cognizance when from time to time they had in the beginning of the Parliament appointed Receivers and Tryers of them is a thing not to be presumed An Appeal in Ireland brought by William Lord Vesey against John Fitz-Thomas for Treasonable words there spoken before any Judgment given in Case there was removed into the Parliament in England and there the Defendant acquitted as appears in the Parliament Pleas of the Two and twentieth year of Edw. 1. The Suits for Lands Offices and Goods originally begun here are many and if question grew upon matter in Fact a Jury usually ordered to try it and the Verdict returned into the Parliament as in the Case of one Ballyben in the Parliament of the Five and thirtieth year of Edw. the 1. If a doubt arose upon a matter tryable by Record a Writ went to the Officers in whose custody the Record remained to certifie the Record as was in the Case of Robert Bagott the same Parliament of the Five and thirtieth year of Edw. the 1. where the Writ went to the Treasurer and Barons of the Exchequer Sometimes they gave Judgment here in Parliament and commanded the Judges there in Ireland to do execution as in the great Case of Partition between the Copartners of the Earl-Marshal in the Parliament of the Three and thirtieth of Edward the 1. Where the Writ was awarded to the Treasurer of Ireland My Lords The Laws of Ireland were introduced by the Parliament of England as appears by Three Acts of the Parliament before cited It is of higher Jurisdiction Dare Leges then to judge by them The Parliaments of England do bind in Ireland if Ireland be particularly mentioned as is resolved in the Book-Case of the First year of Henry the Seventh Cook 's Seventh Report Calvin's Case and by the Judges in Trinity-Term in the Three and thirtieth year of Queen Elizabeth The Statute of the Eighth year of Edward the 4th the first Chapter in Ireland recites That it was doubted amongst the Judges whether all the English Statutes though not naming Ireland were in force there if named no doubt From King Henry the 3d his time downwards to the Eighth year of Queen Elizabeth by which Statute it is made Felony to carry Sheep from Ireland beyond Seas in almost all these Kings Reigns there be Statutes made concerning Ireland The exercising of the Legislative Power there over their Lives and Estates is higher than of the Judicial in question until the 29th year of Edward the 3d erroneous Judgments given in Ireland were determinable no where but in England no not in the Parliament of Ireland as it appears in the close Rolls in the Tower in the 29th year of Edward the 3d. Memb. 12. Power to examine and reverse erroneous Judgments in the Parliaments of Ireland is granted from hence Writs of Error lye in the Parliament here upon erroneous Judgments after that time given in the Parliaments of Ireland as appears in the Parliament Rolls of the Eighth year of Henry the 6th N o 70. in the Case of the Prior of Lenthan It is true the Case is not determined there for it 's the last thing that came into the Parliament and could not be determined for want of time but no exception at all is taken to the Jurisdiction The Acts of Parliament made in Ireland have been confirmed in the Parliaments of England as appears by the close Rolls in the Tower in the Two and fortieth year of Edward the 3d. Memb. 20. Dorso where the Parliament in Ireland for the preservation of the Countrey from Irish who had almost destroyed it made an Act That all the Land-Owners that were English should reside upon their Lands or else they were to be forfeited this was here confirmed In the Parliament of the Fourth year of Henry the 5th Chap. 6. Acts of Parliament in Ireland are confirmed and some priviledges of the Peers in the Parliaments there are regulated Power to repeal Irish Statutes Power to confirm them cannot be by the Parliament here if it hath not cognizance of their Parliaments unless it be said that the Parliament may do it knows not what Garnsey and Jersey are under the Kings subjection but are not parcels of the Crown of England but of the Duchy of Normandy they are not governed by the Laws of England as Ireland is and yet Parliaments in England have usually held Plea of and determined all Causes concerning Lands or Goods In the Parliament in the 33 Edward 1. there be Placita de Insula Jersey And so in the Parliament 14 Edw. 2. and so for Normandy and Gascoigne and always as long as any part of
Treasons are commited in Ireland therefore not tryable here Answ My Lords Sir John Parrot his Predecessor 24 Ed. was tryed in the Kings-Bench for Treason done in Ireland when he was Deputy and Oruche in the 33 year of Queen Elizabeth adjudged here for Treason done in Ireland Object But it will be said these Tryals were after the Statute of the 34th year of Henry the 8th which Enacts that Treasons beyond Sea may be tryed in England Answ My Lords his Predecessor my Lord Gray was tryed and adjudged here in the Kings-Bench that was in Trinity-Term in the 33 year of Henry the 8th this was before the making of that Statute Object To this again will we say That it was for Treason by the Laws and Statutes of England that this is not for any thing that 's Treason by the Law of England but an Irish Statute So that the question is only Whether your Lordships here in Parliament have cognizance of an offence made Treason by an Irish Statute in the ordinary way of Judicature without Bill for so is the present question For the clearing of this I shall propound two things to your Lordships consideration Whether the Rule for expounding the Irish Statute and Customs be one and the same in England as in Ireland That being admitted whether the Parliament in England have cognizance or jurisdiction of things there done in respect of the place because the Kings Writ runs not there For the first in respect of the place the Parliament here hath cognizance there And Secondly If the Rules for expounding the Irish Statutes and Customs be the same here as there this exception as I humbly conceive must fall away In England there is the Common Law the Statutes the Acts of Parliament and Customs peculiar to certain places differing from the Common-Law If any question arise concerning either a Custom or an Act of Parliament the Common-Law of England the First the Primitive and the General Law that 's the Rule and Expositor of them and of their several extents it is so here it is so in Ireland the Common-Law of England is the Common-Law of Ireland likewise the same here and there in all the parts of it It was introduced into Ireland by King John and afterwards by King Henry 3. by Act of Parliament held in England as appears by the Patent Rolls of the 30 year of King Henry 3. the first Membrana the Words are Quia pro Communi Vtilitate terrae Hiberniae unitate terrarum Regis Rex vult de Communi Concilio Regis Provisum est quod omnes Leges Consuetudines quae in Regno Angliae tenentur in Hibernia teneantur eadem terra eisdem legibus subjaceat per easdem Regatur sicut Dominus Johannes Rex cum ultimò esset in Hibernia statuit fieri mandavit quia c. Rex vult quòd omnia brevia de Communi Jure quae currunt in Anglia similiter currant in Hibernia sub novo sigillo Regis mundatum est Archiepiscopis c. quod pro pace tranquilitate ejusdem terrae per easdem leges eos regi deduci permittant eas in omnibus sequantur in cujus c. Teste Rege apud Woodstock Decimo nono die Septembris Here is an union of both Kingdoms and that by Act of Parliament and the same Laws to be used here as there in omnibus My Lords That nothing might be left here for an exception that is That in Treasons Felonies and other capital offences concerning Life the Irish Laws are not the same as here therefore it is enacted by a Parliament held in England in the 14th year of Edw. 2. it is not in print neither but in the Parliament Book that the Laws concerning Life and Member shall be the same in Ireland as in England And that no exception might yet remain in a Parliament held in England The 5th year of Edw. 3. it is Enacted Quod una eadem Lex fiat tam Hibernicis quam Anglicis This Act is enrolled in the Patent Rolls of the 5th year of Edw. 3. Parl. membr 25. The Irish therefore receiving their Laws from hence they send their Students at Law to the Inns of Courts in England where they receive their Degree and of them and of the Common Lawyers of this Kingdom are the Judges made The Petitions have been many from Ireland to send from hence some Judges more learned in the Laws than those they had there It hath been frequent in cases of difficulty there to send sometimes to the Parliament sometimes to the King by advice from the Judges here to send them resolutions of their doubts Amongst many I 'll cite your Lordships only one because it is in a case of Treason upon an Irish Statute and therefore full to this point By a Statute there made the fifth year of Edw. 4. there is a provision made for such us upon suggestions are committed to prison for Treason that the party committed if he can procure 24 Compurgators shall be bailed and let out of prison Two Citizens of Dublin were by a Grand-Jury presented to have committed Treason they desired benefit of this Statute that they might be let out of prison upon tender of their Compurgators The words of the Statute of the 5th year of Edward 4th in Ireland being obscure the Judges there being not satisfied what to do sent the case over to the Queen desired the opinion of the Judges here which was done accordingly The Judges here sent over their opinion which I have out of the Book of Justice Anderson one of the Judges consulted withal The Judges delivered their opinion upon an Irish Statute in Case of Treason If it be objected That in this Case the Judges here did not judge upon the party their opinions were only ad informandam Conscientiam of the Judges in Ireland that the Judgment belonged to the Judges there My Lords with submission this and the other Authorities prove that for which they were cited that is that no absurdity no failure of Justice would ensue if this great Judicatory should judge of Treason so made by an Irish Statute The Common-Law rules of Judging upon an Irish Statute the Pleas of the Crown for things of Life and Death are the same here and there this is all that yet hath been offered For the Second point That England hath no power of Judicature for things done in Ireland My Lords the constant practice of all ages proves the contrary Writs of Error in Pleas of the Crown as well as in Civil Causes have in all Kings Reigns been brought here even in the inferior Courts of Westminster-Hall upon Judgment given in the Courts of Ireland the practice is so frequent and so well known as that I shall cite none of them to your Lordships no president will I believe be produced to your Lordships that ever the Case was remanded back again into Ireland because the question arose upon an
Disloyalties I will omit and passing by as well particular Bishops and Prelates as Stephen Arch-Deacon of Norwich and others as also of them in general I will only relate one villanous passage of Trayterous Disloyalty whereof as good Authors deliver the Archbishops and Prelates were principal Abettors and Conspirers The King being at Oxford the Bishops and Barons came thither with armed Multitudes without number and forced him to yield that the Government should be swayed by 25 Selected Peers Paris Thus one of the greatest Soveraigns was but the Six and twentieth petty King in his own Dominions c. To him Succeeded his Son K. H. 3. who being at Clerkenwel in the House of the Prior of Saint John's was told by him no less sawcily than disloyally if I may not say traiterously That he should be no longer King than he did Right to the Prelates Whereto he answered What do you mean to deprive me of my Kingdom and afterward Murther me as you did my Father And indeed they performed little less as shall hereafter appear But now to take the particular passages in order In this King's Reign Stephen then Archbishop of Canterbury as we read was the Ring-Leader of Disorders both in Church and State and no better was Peter Bishop of Winchester But not to speak of them in particular but of them all in general and that in Parliament at Oxford saith Matth. Paris and Matth. Westm came the Seditious Earls and Barons with whom the Bishops Pontifices ne dicam Pharisei those were his words had taken Counsel against the King the Lord 's Anointed who sternly propounded to the King sundry traiteterous Articles to which they required his Assent but not to reckon all the Points you shall hear what the same Authors deliver of their Intent I will repeat the words as I find them These turbulent Nobles saith M. West had yet a further Plot than all this which was first hatched by the Disloyal Bishops which was That four and twenty Persons should there be Chosen to have the whole Administration of the King and State and yearly appointment of all great Officers reserving only to the King the highest Place at Meetings Primus Accubitus in Coenis and Salutations of Honour in Publick Places To which they forced him and his Son Prince Edward to Swear for fear as mine Author saith of Perpetual Imprisonment if not worse for the Traiterous Lords had by an Edict threatned Death to all that resisted And the Perfidious and wicked Archbishop and Bishops Cursing all that should rebel against it Which impudent and Traiterous Disloyalty saith Matth. Paris and Matth. Westm the Monks did detest asking With what fore-heads the Priests durst thus impair the Kingly Majesty expresly against their sworn Fidelity to him Here we see the Monks more Loyal and Honest than the Lord Bishops we have Cashiered the poor Monks and are we afraid of the Bishops Lordliness that they must continue and sit in Parliament to the Prejudice of the King and People And so we may observe That this * This which he accounts Treason in the Bishops was no more than this Man and his fellow-Members would have imposed upon the King in the 19 Propositions Traiterous Bishop did make this King as the former had done his Father meerly Titular From him I pass to his Son Edward the First In his Reign Boniface was Archbishop of Canterbury and Brother to the Queen what he and the rest of the Prelates did in prejudice to the Regal Authority and Weal Publick I will pass over the rather for that they declare themselves in his Son's Reign so wicked and disloyal that no Age can Parallel of which thus in brief Doth not Thomas de la More call the Bishop of Hereford Arch-Plotter of Treason Omnis mali Architectum and not to speak of his contriving the Death of the late Chancellor and other particular Villanies he is Branded together with Winchester then Chancellor and Norwich Lord Treasurer to occasion the dethroning of this Prince Nay after long Imprisonment his very Life taken away by Bishop Thorlton's Aenigmatical Verse though he after denied it Edwardum Occidere nolite timere bonum est But this Adam de Orleton alias Torleton and his fellow Bishops in this King's Reign I may not slightly pass over Therefore I desire we may take a further view of them First of this Adam Bishop of Hereford we find that he was stript of all his Temporalties for supporting the Mortimers in the Barons Quarrel He being saith Thomas de la More a Man of most subtil Wit and in all wordly Policies profound daring to do great Things and Factious withal who made against King Edward the Second a great secret Party To which Henry Burwash Bishop of Lincoln for like Causes deprived of his Temporalties joyned himself as also Ely and others Walter Stapleton Bishop of Exeter a Turn-Coat left the Queen and came to England to inform the King of his Queens too great familiarity with Mortimer which afterward cost him his Head Perhaps some now as Thomas de la More will say he was therein a good Man yet I will take leave to think not do I fear to speak it This was no part of Episcopal Function But I will pass him by not concluding him either good or bad every Man may think as he pleaseth I will declare the Traiterous and Disloyal Actions of the other Bishop formerly mentioned This Bishop of Hereford whom I find called the Queens bosom Councellor Preaching at Oxford took for the Text My Head my Head aketh 2 Kings 4.19 concluding more like a Butcher than a Divine that an Aking and Sick Head of a Kingdom was of necessity to be taken off and not to be tampered with by any other Physick whereby it is probable that he was the Author of that Aenigmatical Verse formerly recited Edwardum occidere c. And well may we believe it for we find that he caused Roger Baldock Bishop of Norwich the late Lord Chancellor to die miserably in Newgate Not much better were Ely Lincoln Winchester and other Bishops that adhered to the Queen Mortimer and others of her part Nor can I commend those Bishops that were for the King and the Spencers The Archbishop of Canterbury and his Suffragans decreeing the Revocation of those Pestilent Peers the Judgment given against them judged as Erronious Thus these Lord Bishops as all in a manner both before and after instead of Feeding the Flock of Christ only Plotted dismal Wars Death and Destruction of Christians I might tell you how in this King's Reign as in others * Certainly this was made a President for such were the Pretences and Practises of this Man and his Associates they perswaded the Lords and Peers of the Realm that they had Power and Right not only to reform the King's House and Council and to place and displace all great Officers at their Pleasure but even a joynt Interest in
the Wars with France Hall in 8 R. 2. by declaring the King 's Right thereunto to the effusion of much Christian Blood and to the loss of all we had there To expiate which he built a Colledg in Oxenford to pray for the Souls Slain in France Though what he did then deliver was true of the King 's Right much Christian Blood and to the loss of all we had there To expiate which he built a Colledg in Oxenford to pray for the Souls Slain in France Though what he did then deliver was true of the King 's Right of France as was also the other of John Arch-Bishop of the same See in Edw. the Third's time and no less true was that of Carlisle against H. 4th's Title Yet I may say it was not the Office or Function of a Bishop to incense Wars Domestique or Foreign Nay this Bishop did set this War on foot to divert the King from Reformation of the Clergy For in that Parliament held at Leicester there was a Petition declaring that the Temporal Lands which were bestowed on the Church were superfluously and disorderly spent upon Hounds and Hawks Horses and Whores which better imployed would suffice for the maintenance of 15 Earls 1500 Knights 6200 Esquires and hundred Alms-houses and besides of Yearly Rent to the Crown 20000 pounds From him I come to his Son Henry the Sixth H. 6 I read many Accusations that Glocester the good Protector did lay to the Charge of Beaufort the Cardinal of Winchester and Lord Chancellor Fox Mart. in H. 6. Great Uncle to the King Living Son to John of Ghent alledging him a Person very dangerous both to the King and State his Brother of York a Cardinal also together with other Bishops no better For we read of Arch-Bishop Bourchier and other Bishops that they did shamefully countenance the distraction of the time These as I delivered before though bad in Parliaments yet too great to put out I will not now speak of many other Particulars that I might either in this King's Reign or his Successors to King Henry the Eighth for that I desire to declare what they did since the Reformation yet therein will be as brief as I may having already too much provoked your Patience for which I crave humble Pardon To Henry the Sixth succeeded Edward the Fourth E. 4 who indeed had the better Title to the Crown notwithstanding Arch-Bishop Nevil Brother to the King Maho Warwick with others did Conspire and attempt his Dethroning and after took him Prisoner and kept him in his Castle of Midleham and after in Parliament at Westminster did they not declare him a Traytor and Usurper confiscate his Goods revoke abrogate and make frustrate all Statutes made by him and intayl the Crown of England and France upon Henry and his Issue-Male in default thereof to Clarence and so disabling King Edward his Elder Brother But to hasten I will pass over Edw. the Fifth E. 3 whose Crown by means of the Prelates as well as the Duke of Buckingham was placed on the head of his Murtherous Uncle that Cruel Tyrant for had not the Cardinal Arch-Bishop by his perswasion with his Mother taken the Brother Richard Duke of York out of Sanctuary the Crown had not been placed on his Uncle's Head nor they lost their Lives and not to speak of Doctor Pinker and Doctor Shaw's Sermons and other foul passages of Prelates as Morton and others who sought also the destruction of King Richard and that when his Nephews were dead R. 3 and none had Right before him to the Crown which he then wore what disloyal long Speeches made he to the Duke of Buckingham to perswade the said Duke to take the Crown to himself From Richard I pass to Henry the Seventh I told you before H. 7 that Morton would have perswaded Buckingham to dethrone King Richard the Third and take the Kingdom to himself to which he had no Right and failing therein he addressed himself to Henry then Earl of Richmond and as by his Counsel he prevailed with him so he prevailed against and won from Richard the Garland This perswader and furtherer of bad Titles was advanced to the See of Canterbury his desire whereof perhaps caused his disloyalty and being in high favour with this Prince by his special Recommendations procured one Hadrian de Castello an Italian to be made first Bishop of Hereford after of Bath and Wells who also was made Cardinal by that Antichristian Goodw. Catal. of Bishops in Bath c. pag. 309. Paulus Jovius and devilish Pope Albert the Sixth and as Moreton had endeavoured the dethroning of his Lord and King so did the other Conspire the Murther of Pope Leo the Tenth when he was told by a Witch That one named Hadrian should succeed him As to Henry the Eighth I need not speak much of his Opinion of Bishops who he saith were but half Subjects if Subjects at all to him when he caused Sir Thomas Audeley Speaker to Read the Oath of Bishops in Parliament Spede And that it was so appeared when Wolsey and Campeius refused to give Judgment for the Unlawfulness of the Marriage of H. 8. and thereupon a Divorce whereupon the Duke of Suffolk said and that truly It was never merry in England since Cardinal Bishops came amongst us It were too large to repeat all the Petitions and Supplications and Complaints of Divines against them in this King's Reign as of Doctor Barnes Latimer Tindall Beane Barns Supplic alii and others This last named saith That the Bishops alone have the Keys of the English Kingdom hanging at their Girdles and what they traiterously Conspire among themselves the same is bound and loosed in Star-Chamber Westminster-Hall Privy Council and Parliament This and much more he But as their sitting there hath been obnoxious so it is useless as may appear by the Statute of 31 H. H. 8.31 8. yet in force where it is Enacted That as the then Lord Cromwell so all other that should thereafter be made Vice-Gerents should sit above the Arch-Bishop in Parliament Nay hold general Visitations in all the Diocesses of the Realm as well over the Arch-Bishops Bishops Arch-Deacons as Laiety to enquire and Correct their Abuses to prescribe Injunctions Rules and Orders for Reforming of Religion for abolishing Superstition and Idolatry and Correction of their Lives and Manners c. And read we not that in the 37 of the King's Reign Letters Patents were granted to Lay-men to exercise all manner of Ecclesiastical Jurisdiction H. 8.37 as the King's Officers not the Bishops Thus we see the Government of Bishops as well as their Sitting in Parliament may be spared And that neither have nor heretofore had any Ecclesiastical Jurisdiction in making of Canons or Constitutions Henry 8.25 but by the King 's Writ nor Promulge or Execute any such without the King 's Royal Assent and Licence under Pain appears by the Statute of
said That thereby he gave them leave to put Royal Manacles upon Majestie and an opportunity after having bound him to despoil him of his Crown and Life But besides if there were any weight in this Reason it must always have had the same force and strength against Ecclesiasticks in any Age or Under any Government intermedling in Secular and Civil Affairs since it could not but be as much a hinderance to those of former Ages in the Exercise of their Ministerial Function as to these But the constant Usage of all Ages Places Times and Nations both Barbarous and Civil Pagan Jew and Christian manifest that the Universal Wisdom of Mankind has been of a Contrary Opinion Religious Persons having ever had an Extraordinary Deference paid them and having always been accounted Worthy for their Abilities Wisdome Learning and Integrity to be admitted into the Councils of Princes and having constantly had a great share and interest both in the framing Laws and managing the Civil Polities and Governments of Nations And more particularly the Sacred History gives us a clear account that in the Government of the Jewish Nation formed by God himself the chief Priest was not only the Supreme Governor of that People as well in things Sacred as Civil but the inferior Priests under him were the Judges of Temporal as well as Ecclesiastical matters brought before them and the same Objection lying as naturally and forceably against them as against these cannot Excuse these Objectors from affronting the Wisdom of the Divine Legislator who Expresly Ordered it to be so and truly it is but in other Words the Objection of Corah and his Accomplices against Moses and Aaron Ye take too much upon you ye Sons of Levi. To the Second which is the Solemn promise they who Enter into Holy Orders make That they will give themselves wholly to that Vocation The clear sense of that is That they will principally apply themselves to the Duties of their Calling and not to any Secular Imployments as Husbandry Merchandizing or other Mechanical Callings so as to hinder the performance of their Duty in the Offices of their Function which as before I have shewed the Bishops by Sitting and Voting in Parliament cannot be said to do And to make this Evident I will give a clear instance in the inferior Clergy for suppose any one of them by his frugal Parsimony hath got a Sum of Mony he may lawfully bargain purchase take and keep a Temporal Estate for the future subsistence of his Family he may lawfully Lett Sett Build Lease Receive Rents for such Estate or any one descending to him by Inheritance and manage it to his best advantage without the least danger of violating or intrenching upon this promise made at his Ordination and yet all these are Secular Affairs which he may do without prejudice to his ingagement so long as still he makes the Vocation which he undertook at his receiving Holy Orders the main scope of his Life and Actions and I think none will deny I am assured no person will be able to prove the contrary but that the Bishops notwithstanding the use of their Peerage yet make the Exercise of their Episcopal Function the main and principal business of their lives And so for the Third That Canons and Councils in several Ages do forbid them to meddle in Secular Affairs It is well known that even those who made those Canons were themselves at the same time Councellors to Princes and particularly that Arch-Bishop who made the Constitutions of Westminster mentioned by Linwood upon which these People were perpetually harping was a Peer who himself sate in Parliament and of the King 's Privy Council from which it is evident that by those Canons there was no design to intrench upon the Peerage of the Bishops but to prevent the inferiour Clergy from neglecting their Duty and entring upon the more gainful and tempting employs of Secular Persons besides that those Canons since the Reformation were not binding either to Bishops or Clergy As to the Fourth Fifth Sixth Seventh Reasons they are rather sly Insinuations and Calumnies then Reasons and such as having no substantial matters in them worth answering I shall therefore pass them over without any further notice then that admitting all for Truth there Objected which yet was most notoriously False yet they are but personal Crimes and therefore in Justice could only reach to those particular Bishops but not to the Function it self or the Successors of those Bishops and if personal failings had been a ground to disable the Members of Parliament from the Right of sitting and voting in that Assembly both for the present and future Succession 't is not impossible to be supposed but that a far greater number would for ever have been excluded out of the Commons House then these 26 Bishops out of the House of Peers And for the Eighth which is partly made up of Calumny and partly of the Example of Scotland in abolishing Episcopacy it is certainly the worst way of Reasoning in the World to argue a facto ad jus And the way of Tumults Treason and actual levying War against their undoubted Lawful Sovereign by which they got Episcopacy abolished were such methods as certainly no sober Christians can think justifiable either before God or Man and therefore no perswasive Reasons in their own Nature to do the same in England The Ninth and Last Reason is of the same Leaven with the former as if the promotion of those Reverend Prelates to those high Offices and Honours must of necessity blow them up with the vain Tumor of Pride The truth is the Covetousness of some of the Laity who greedily longed to devour the Revenue of the Church and the Pride and Envy of the Factious Presbyterian and other dissenting Ministers and not the Exaltation of the Bishops were the true Reasons of their discontent and of all the disquiets and great disorders which ensued this troublesome and restless Temper of the Non-conforming Ministers and of all the dreadful Revolutions which happened in these miserable Kingdoms to the utter Ruine and Overthrow both of Church and State and to the Eternal infamy of these Pretenders to Reformation and the True Protestant Religion That which seems to have the most force and weight and is therefore reserved to the last is taking away the Votes of the Abbots in the time of King Henry the Eighth upon the Dissolution of those Religious Houses To which notwithstanding the great strength it seems to have that for the same Reason the Bishops might also be removed from the Peerage of England it is easily answered That though some Abbots were Barons in Parliament and part of the Lords Spiritual yet the taking away their Voees did no more destroy the third Estate in Parliament then the Attainders of divers of the Nobility and Temporal Lords and thereby taking away their Votes did abolish the whole Order of the Peerage another of the Three Estates
and Deputy-Lieutenants how affected to the Religion and to present their Names to the House and that where there is want that Arms and Ammunition may be supplyed By this Means they got a true account of all those who were their Friends and who their Enemies who were therefore to be displaced as disaffected to Religion and Popishly inclined as all those who were for Episcopacy were vogued to be and besides hereby they gave a General Alarm and Amazement to the Whole Nation to believe that those Fears and Jealousies with which they bewitched the People into Rebellion were grounded upon the foundations of Truth and real Danger which was the Occasion of this Inquiry into the state of the Militia Upon this a Message was sent to the Lords to acquaint them with a dangerous Conspiracy to seduce the Army against the Parliament and to increase the Fears and Jealousies among the People Message to the Lords about the Conspiracy to seduce the Army an Order was sent from the Commons to the Lord Mayor of London to take care of the City Guards The Message to the Lords was in haec verba Mr. Hollis who carried up the Message read it in these words Message about the Conspiracy of the Army That the House of Commons hath received such Information as doth give them just cause to suspect that there have been and still are secret practices to discontent the Army with the proceedings of Parliament and to ingage them in some Design of dangerous Consequence to the State and by some other mischievous ways to prevent the happy success and conclusion of this Parliament And because the timely discovery and prevention of these dangerous Plots doth so nearly concern the safety both of * Yet afterwards they did all that was possible to persuade the People that the King was in this Conspiracy King and Kingdom they desire your Lordships would be pleased to appoint a select Commitee to take the Examinations upon Oath of such persons and Interrogatories as shall be presented unto them by the Directions of the House of Commons and in the presence of such Members of that House as shall be thereunto appointed with Injunction of such Secrecy as a business of this nature doth require They have Ordered That such Members of their House as shall be thought fit shall upon notice be ready to be Examined and they desire your Lordships would be pleased to order the like for the Members and Assistants of your own House And further it is desired That your Lordships will forthwith send to his Majesty to beseech him in the Name of the Parliament upon this great and weighty occasion that no Servants of his Majesties of the Queen or Prince may depart the Kingdom or otherwise absent himself without leave from his Majesty with the humble advice of the Parliament until these Examinations be perfected Whereupon it was Ordered That this House will joyn with the House of Commons in all that they desire and these Lords following were Deputed to take the Examinations Earl of Bath Earl of Essex Earl of Warwick Earl of March Viscount Say and Seal Lord Wharton Lord Paget and Mr. Serjeant Glanvile and Mr. Attorney General to write and set down the Examinations There being never a Bishop in the Committee A Salvo for the Bishops a Memorandum was entered in the Journals MEmorandum Whereas none of the Lords the Bishops are joyned with the aforesaid deputed Lords it was declared by the House that it should be no prejudice to the Lords the Bishops This being done the Lord Great Chamberlain the Lord Steward the Lord Chamberlain the Earl of Dorset and the Earl of Newcastle were appointed to wait on his Majesty with the aforesaid request of the Parliament to which they brought this Answer THat his Majesty hath willingly granted it The Kings Answer concerning his Servants and gave a present Command to the Lord Chamberlain the Earl of Newcastle and the Earl of Dorset to give notice hereof to all under their Charge that none do depart the Kingdom without the King's License but to be forth-coming upon demand which accordingly they have already done After which the Oath of Secrecy was given to Serjeant Glanvile and Mr. Attorney in these words YOV shall Swear The Oath of Secrecy given by the Lords to Serjeant Glanvile and Mr. Attorney assistant to the Committee of Lords to Examine the Conspiracy The Persons accused That in your writing and setting down of the Examination of the Witnesses to be produced before the Lords deputed to take Examinations upon Interrogatories to be produced by the House of Commons concerning the English Army in the North and in all things concerning the same You shall well truly and faithfully behave your selves and not discover the same before the end of this Parliament or Publication granted or leave of this House first obtained The Persons Accused of this Design of seducing the Army against the Parliament were Sir John Suckling Mr. Henry Percy Brother to the Earl of Northumberland Mr. Henry Jermyn Colonel Goring Mr. William Davenant Captain Palmer Captain Billingsley and Sir Edward Wardourn and Warrants were issued out against them to bring them under the Examination of the House of Commons This day there passed little of Moment Thursday May 6. the Commons being taken up with Reading several Bills one for the security of the True Religion the Safety and Honour of his Majesties Person the just Rights of the Subject and the better discovering and punishment of Popish Recusants as also another Bill for Subsidies With which guilded baits they not only Angled for Popular Favour but also endeavoured to hide their Antimonarchical Designs against his Majesty by these specious pretences of endeavouring to study his Safety and Honour The House was this day informed That the Persons against whom the Warrants were Issued upon the Accusation of their endeavouring to seduce the Army were not to be found whereupon at a Conference it was desired that all the Ports might be stopped upon which the Lords made this Order Ordered The Order of the Lords for stopping the Ports That all the Ports of England shall be forthwith stopped until the pleasure of this House be further known and none to depart the Kingdom except Sir Thomas Roe and such as he will be answerable for who is to give in their names to this House And in particular stay is to be made of Henry Percy Esq Henry Jermyn Esq Sir John Suckling Knight William Davenant and Captain Billingsly that they depart not out of this Kingdom but are to be apprehended and safely conducted with all speed unto this House Directed To the Right Honourable Algernon Earl of Northumberland L. High Admiral of England To James Earl of March Lord Warden of the Cinque-Ports To Jerom Earl of Portland Captain and Governour of the Isle of Wight To George Goring Esq Governour of Portsmouth After which Sir Philip Carteret Lieutenant
Barcock George Ewer George Pitcher Tho. Low The Names of those that committed the Disorder in the Church of St. Olaves in Southwark in time of administring the Communion Robert Wainman _____ Bonace Hugh Evans John Moor. Ordered That the persons aforenamed be sent for to appear before this House as Delinquents to answer their several Offences The Commons fell this Day upon the Root and Branch Bill Friday June 11. Debate about the Bill for abolishing Episcopacy c. and the House being resolved into a Grand Committee of the whole House the Title of the Bill was first Voted and many Speeches and Arguments were on both sides Urged for and against it but it is my Misfortune as I must always complain as well as the Reader 's loss that he can hear little of the matter but Ex parte for such was then the prevalency of the Faction that what Ever was spoken in the behalf of Episcopacy was stifled discouraged and suppressed and in this small Tract of time since the Revolution utterly lost and forgotten whereas all the Speeches of the Leading Men of the Faction were either by their own or by the Order of the House Printed Published and Dispersed throughout the Kingdom by which Art they did not only then persuade the Nation who saw nothing in Answer to these Libellous Speeches that their Reasons were unanswerable but they came by falling into so many hands to be preserved I hope as Eternal Monuments of Infamy to their Authors and Excellent Cautions to future Ages who will Easily be able to Judge when they hear of the like Speeches what a kind of Reformation and what defences of Liberty and Property they are to Expect from such pretended Patriots and Speech-makers who pull up the very Foundations of the Government under the pretence that it is Unsound and Rotten And indeed were it not that these Collections are generally like to fall into such Judicious hands as will be able to separate the insinuating Malice and Poison from them and thereby make them Useful by framing Arguments against them and winnowing the Chaffy part of their reasoning from them I could not judge it Expedient to transmit these four Grapes to Posterity nor to revive them did I not believe they might serve as useful precautions to preserve their Teeth from being set on Edge Upon this subject Sir Henry Vane who was now become not only the Proselyte but Favourite of the Faction for the Famous Blow he had given the Earl of Strafford made this insuing Speech at the Committee of the whole House Mr. Hide being in the Chair Mr. Hide THE Debate we are now upon is Sir Henry Vane's Speech against Episcopal Government June 11. 1641. Whether the Government by Archbishops Bishops Chancellors c. should be taken away out of the Church and Kingdom of England For the right stating whereof we must remember the Vote which passed Yesterday not only by this Committee but the House which was to this Effect That this Government hath been found by long Experience to be a great impediment to the perfect Reformation and Growth of Religion and very Prejudicial to the Civil State So that then the Question will lie thus before us Whether a Government which long Experience hath set so ill a Character upon importing Danger not only to our Religion but the Civil State should be any longer continued amongst us or be utterly abolished For my own part I am of the Opinion of those who conceive that the strength of Reason already set down in the Preamble to this Bill by Yesterdays Vote is a necessary decision of this Question For one of the main Ends for which Church-Government is set up is to advance and further the perfect Reformation and Growth of Religion which we have already Voted this Government doth contradict so that it is destructive to the very end for which it should be and is most necessary and desireable in which respect certainly we have cause enough to lay it aside not onely as useless in that it attains not its end but as dangerous in that it destroyes and contradicts it In the second place we have Voted it prejudicial to the Civil State as having so powerful and ill an influence upon our Laws the Prerogative of the King and Liberties of the Subject that it is like a spreading Leprosie which leaves nothing untainted and uninfected which it comes near May we not therefore well say of this Government as our Saviour in the Fifth of Matthew speaks of Salt give me leave upon this occasion to make use of Scripture as well as others have done in this Debate where it is said that Salt is good But if the Salt hath lost its savour wherewith will you season it It is thenceforth good for nothing but to be cast out and trodden under foot of men So Church-Government in the general is good and that which is necessary and which we all desire but when any particular Form of it hath once lost its savour by being destructive to its own ends for which it is set up as by our Vote already passed we say this hath then surely Sir we have no more to do but to cast it out and endeavour the best we can to provide our selves a better But to this it hath been said That the Government now in question may be so amended and reformed that it needs not be pulled quite down or abolished because it is conceived it hath no original sin or evil in it or if it have it is said regeneration will take that away Unto which I answer I do consent that we should do with this Government as we are done by in regeneration in which all old things are to pass away and all things are to become new and this we must do if we desire a perfect Reformation and growth of our Religion or good to our Civil State For the whole Fabrick of this Building is so rotten and corrupt from the very Foundation of it to the top that if we pull it not down now it will fall about the Ears of all those that endeavour it within a very few years The universal rottenness or corruption of this Government will most evidently appear by a disquisition into these ensuing particulars First Let us consider in what Soil this root grows Is it not in the Pope's Paradise do not one and the same Principles and Grounds maintain the Papacy or universal Bishop as do our Diocesan or Metropolitan Bishops All those authorities which have been brought us out of the Fathers and Antiquity will they not as well if not better support the Popedome as the Order of our Bishops So likewise all these Arguments for its agreeableness to Monarchy and cure of Schisme do they not much more strongly hold for the acknowledgment of the Pope than for our Bishops And yet have Monarchies been ever a whit the more absolute for the Pope's universal Monarchy or their Kingdoms less
there were a General at New-Castle they were pleased to give report that I should be General of the Horse but I protest neither to the King nor any else did I ever so much as think of it my Lord of Holland was made General and so all things were laid aside And this is the truth and all the truth I knew of these proceedings and this I will and do protest unto you upon my Faith and Wilmot Ashburnham and Oneale have at several times confessed and Sworn I never said any thing in the business they did not every one agree unto and justify This Relation I sent you rather to inform you of the truth of the matter that you may the better know how to do me good but I should think my self very unhappy to be made a betrayer of any Body What concerned the Tower or any thing else I never medled withal nor ever spake with Goring but that night before them all and said nothing but what was consented unto by any Party I never spake one word with Suckling Carnarvan Davenant or any other Creature Me thinks if my Friends and Kindred knew the truth and justice of the matter it were no hard matter to serve me in some measure Upon the reading the Transcript of this Letter of Mr. Percy 's to the Earl of Northumberland in the House of Commons Commissary Wilmot Capt. Munday June 14. Commissary wilmot Col. Ashburnham Col. Pollard imprisoned upon suspition of H. Treason Ashburnham and Capt. Pollard being found to be concerned in this matter of the Army were sent Prisoners Wilmot to the Tower Ashburnham to the Kings-Bench and Pollard to the Gatehouse for suspition of High-Treason †Sir John Berkley Mr. Dan. Oneal sent for as Delinquents upon the same account Sir John Berkley and Mr. Daniel Oneal were ordered to be sent for as Delinquents upon the same account * Sir will Widdrington and Sir Herbert Price discharged from the Tower Sir William Widdrington and Mr. Herbert Price were this day Discharged from their Imprisonment in the Tower and restored to their Siting as Members in Parliament a Afternoon-Sermons Voted to be in Cathedrals A Vote passed this Day That in all Cathedral Churches there should be Sermons in the Afternoons b Report of the Conference about Disbanding the Armies The Earl of Bath Reports the Conference Yesterday with the House of Commons delivered by Sir John Hotham to this Effect That the House of Commons had taken into Consideration the Vast Charge that the Kingdom lyes under by maintaining the Two Armies that they have used their utmost Endeavours in providing Mony for Disbanding them That Necessity Enforceth them to Disband the King's Army by Parts as they shall be able to provide Money and the Scottish Army wholly and altogether That in Disbanding the Army they will first disband those that lye in the most Southern Parts That they intend to Disband Five Regiments whereof they intend that the Regiment of Hull shall be the first then the Earl of Nidesdale 's Company which is put under the Regiment of Sir Charles Vavasor and so other Regiments shall march first to give way for the rest to march and that they shall not march above 300 in a Company The Earl of Bristol Reported Heads which the Lords Committees drew up in the Morning to be propounded at a Conference touching the Disbanding of the Armies viz. That a Total Disbanding be propounded as that which is thought necessary in the first place to be desired if for doing this they are not provided for the present this House will be ready to give them all possible Assistance for perfecting this great Work And that if the Commons shall make an Estimate of what will be wanting to the Total Disbanding the House of Peers will joyn with them most readily for untill a full Disarming and Disbanding of the Armies be Resolved and Declared it is much to be doubted that there will be greater difficulty in raising Money or getting Credit and therefore it is desired to imploy all our Just Endeavours for a Total Disbanding of both Armies If there be not a possibility presently to Disband all the Five Regiments being to be disbanded it is held fit that it be propounded to the Scots That they at the same time retire at least from the River Tees homeward and Ship their Field Ordnance at Newcastle and that the English likewise retire their Ordnance and Train of Artillery Tuesday June 15. Mr. Blany to be brought before the Parliament for Preaching against the Protestation Mr. Allen Blany Curate of Newington in Surrey was this Day ordered to be Summoned to attend the House for Preaching against the Protestation Affirming That the Parliament is able to Confirm a Law but not to Make a Law to bind him against his Conscience and for offering a Protestation of his own to make good the 39th Article to which he subscribed his hand and left it with the Church-wardens The Debate concerning Deans and Chapiters was also Revived upon which occasion Mr. Pury an Alderman of Glocester made this following Speech the House being in a Grand Committee of the whole House Mr. Hide I Rise not up to answer the Argument of the Learned Gentleman of the Long-Robe that spake last the which were to prove some Incoherence of the Preamble Mr. Pury Alderman of Glocester his Speech agaiâ—st Deans and Chapters June 15. 1641. with the body of the Bill concerning the Abolishing of Deans and Chapiters in respect of their Government in the Church of England who have none at all as hath been argued but there are some Reasons stick with me whereby I do conceive that the Deans and Chapiters have been and are part of the Government of the Church of England and that the Preamble and body of this Bill therein may very well stand together for if you take the Deans and Chapiters in their Original who as it was said by a Learned Serjeant over against me were first founded in Superstition alike to your Regular and Secular Monks or if you consider them as an Institution to be Consilium Epis to assist Bishops in their Government and Discipline or if you look upon those Deans and Chapiters of the last Foundation by Henry the Eighth yet certainly they are in all these capacities a part of the Government of the Church of England and as well the Rural as the Cathedral Deans are numbred by our own Writers among Church-Governors and they are in and among themselves a part of the Church-Government and by the Book of Reformation of Ecclesiastical Laws they are to govern them according to their Statutes of Foundation and to keep them pure and entire so far as they are not repugnant to the Word of God and our Constitutions of Religion And for the better satisfaction of this Committee and my self here is a Copy of the Statutes Grant and Foundation of the Dean and Chapter of the
all times not only having made the large Prerogatives and Liberties the very same as I may say with the Possession of their Dominions and amongst the most remarkable and equally necessary that Privilege by which we may receive Letters and send from each Prince or any Person whatsoever without Interruption which is the most principal Office of an Ambassador Which Practice Most Noble Lords is not the Laws of our Nation alone but Vniversal and hath been maintained inviolate by the Kings and the Publick of all Christian Governments no less than amongst the most Barbarous I nevertheless cannot say but I have injoyed in this great Court that just Respect until the last Letters were opened which came from France to me Directed which although they were restored by my Lord Fielding and Sir Henry Vane who upon their Honor assured me that it was a pure Error and not willingly committed which though I do believe yet I could not perswade my self that the Government of England so Noble and Generous should have so inferior a Mind as to open the Letters of an Ambassador and by this means to Violate the Laws and to give an ill Example to the World of so little Respect towards the Ministers of the most Serene Republick of Venice which for so many Ages hath given a Sincere Testimony of Affection and Esteem to this Crown But now fresh Experience to my great Affliction hath given Testimony of the contrary being yesterday all the Letters were opened coming from Venice Antwerp and other Countries and the very Letters writ unto me from the most Serene Republick and the Regal Seal being broken and the Commission sent from my Lords being published and many of my own Letters being taken the Consequences of which cannot be approved of by any I have judged it convenient to give Notice unto your Excellencies by which according to the greatness of your Wisdoms you may take it into Consideration and take such Resolutions therein as you shall judge necessary for maintaining the Honor of this Nation and the Publick Faith under the Protection of which Ambassadors live so that it may be known to all Princes that in England they do not introduce New Laws but that they will maintain the constant Profession of rendring the ancient Respects which are due to the most Serene Republick of Venice Whereupon the House thought it fit and agreed That Satisfaction for this shall be given to the State of Venice and to the Ambassador for the present and the House appointed the E. of Bristol E. of Holland Viscount Say and Seal L. Digby and the L. Newnham to draw up presently what was fit to be given by Way of Answer to the Venetian Ambassador Their Lordships presented a Draught to the House which was read in these Words viz. That four Members of the House of Peers The Answer of the House of Lords to the Venetian Ambassadors Memorial be forthwith sent to the Ambassador's to disavow the Action and to endeavor to give him all the Satisfaction possible by declaring how sensible they are of it as tending to the Breach of Publick Faith and the Law of Nations and to shew further how desirous they are to continue the ancient Correspondency betwixt the King and that State and that the House of Peers are resolved to be humble Suitors to his Majesty to hasten the departure of his Ambassador to make known to that State the same Sense with such other Expressions as may best declare the tender Respect they have to the Honor of that State and the Noble Vsage their Ministers may expect and shall find in their Residence here from the King and Parliament And the Lord Privy Seal L. G. Chamberlain L. M. of Hertford and the L. Newnham were appointed to deliver this Answer to the Venetian Ambassador After this the 13 Bishops which stand Impeached in this House from the House of Commons for Crimes in making the late Canons and Constitutions and granting a Benevolence unto the King being by Order of the House to put in their Answers to the said Impeachment were required by the Speaker in the Name of this House to put in their Answers Their Impeachment brought up from the House of Commons was read and then the Council Assigned the Bishops were called in The Bishops put in their Answer by Plea and Demurrer and demanded to give in the Answers of the Bishops they Answered they had delivered in the said Answer to the Lords the Bishops The Bishop of Winton hereupon delivered his Answer with the rest of the Impeached Bishops in Writing subscribed with all their Hands excepting the Lord Bishop of Glocester who delivered in his by himself by Word of Mouth and pleaded not Guilty Modo Formâ as is charged in the Impeachment Then the Answer of the Bishops was read which consisted of a Plea and Demurrer The Council being commanded to withdraw the House took it into Consideration and resolved to communicate it to the House of Commons which was done accordingly the Message being sent by Serjeant Whitfield and Serjeant Glanvile The House of Commons fell upon the Debate of the Irish Affairs and came thereupon to these Votes Resolved upon the Question That this House holds it fit That forthwith so many Officers be sent over into the North Parts of Ireland as shall be sufficient to Command 2000 Men. Resolved c. That so many Officers shall be sent into the Province of Munster in Ireland as shall Command a Thousand Foot and a Troop of Horse Resolved c. That it be propounded to the Lords That Order be taken for the securing the several Forts of Ireland viz. of Cork Waterford Limrick Kingsale Youghall Galloway and Baltimore The House was then Resolved into a Grand Committee of the whole House to consider of some Course for providing Present Money for the Service of Ireland and Mr. Hyde reported the Debate Whereupon it was Resolved upon the Question That 200000 l. shall be raised for the Suppressing of the Rebels in Ireland 200000 l. Voted to suppress the Rebels in Ireland for Security of this Kingdom and for payment of Debts Then Mr. Pym Reported from the Committee for Irish Affairs 1. That he was Commanded to present a State of the Army what charge it will be to the Common-Wealth to maintain such Men as will be necessary for the Defence of Ireland Those Gentlemen that are appointed as a Council of War to prepare things for this House have proportioned the Charge in a middle way between 1618 and 1639. That the Pay of a Regiment of 1000 Men The Charge of a Regiment of Horse and Foot with the Field Officers together with the Officers amounts unto 19201 l. per Annum for one Regiment of 600 Horse 37310 l. per Ann. For the general Officers of the Field 19541 l. 8 s. 2 d. per Annum Resolved c. That this House shall insist upon their former Vote of accepting at
sorry for having administred unto their Lordships any Occasion of so high an Offence by letting fall Words touching the Bible of the Church of England and protesteth that his Design was not to affront their Lordships or the professed Religion of this Kingdom and he did assure their Lordships That as all Catholick Subjects have ever done so he did neither refuse to swear upon the English Bible nor held himself disobliged to Answer truely whatsoever was Demanded He therefore humbly beseecheth their Lordships to Pardon his great Offonce upon this his humble Submission and Acknowledgment and to grant his Inlargement assuring their Lordships he is most willing and ready not only to depose the Truth as by his Oath he is bound in whatsoever shall be Interrogated in this particular Cause but also shall ever Pray c. Upon which their Lordships sent a Message to the Commons giving them an account of this Petition and to let them know that having given this Satisfaction they were inclined to Pardon him but will not release him out of his Imprisonment before they had acquainted them therewith according to their Lordships former Ingagement Sir Henry Vane brought up a List of the Names of such Papists as the House of Commons desired should be secured as also an Order for the Lord Admiral to set forth 4 Ships for the Service of Ireland in which they desired the Lords to joyn with them Then were read two Letters from the Lords Justices in Ireland Letters from Ireland dated Nov. 13th 1641. the one to the Lord Keeper the other to the Lord Lieutenant the Purport of which was That some Ships may be appointed to Guard the Coasts of Ireland That the Rebels have taken divers Houses and Castles That they have spoiled the County of Cavan and have made a Remonstrance of the Ground of their Revolt They desire that 10000 Foot and 1000 Horse with Arms and Munition and 100000 l. be presently sent them with a Supply of Victuals and Oats for Horses And lastly they presented an Examination of one William Shales taken the 10th of November upon Oath ministred by the Clerk of the Council of Ireland by Direction of the Board which Examination was read in the House as followeth WIlliam Shales Shales's Accusation of Sir Henry Beddingfield of Oxborough Hall in Norfolk Sergeant of the Foot Company under the Command of Sir Arthur Loftus Knight saith That about the latter End of April last he being then in Norfolk at Oxborough Hall in the House of Sir Henry Beddingfield the said Sir Henry hearing that this Examinant was lately come out of Ireland sent for him in to his Garden whither when he came he found the said Sir Henry walking with one Poole whom this Examinant supposeth was a Priest and saith That as soon as he came into the said Garden the said Sir Henry asked him whether he knew how the state of Ireland then stood To which the Examinant said That he thought that all things were quiet and at Peace there Why quoth Sir Henry doth the Army there do nothing To which the Examinant Replied That they carried themselves quietly and that any man might walk in Ireland with a Thousand pounds and a Wand only in his hand He saith also That the said Sir Henry told him That he was about to take a House in Kilkenny of one of the Butlers for that there was no safety in England for any of his Religion and asked of the Examinant Whether there were any good Hawking thereabouts To which the Examinant said That there was Then the said Sir Henry said That now his Mind was altered and that he meant to stay in England and added That he did believe that before Christmass Day next there should be seen such Combustions in England and Ireland as the like were never seen before and thereupon Cursed the Scots as Authors of these Troubles Jurat Coram nobis Ja. Ware Rob. Meredith William Shales Whereupon it was Ordered That Sir Henry Beddingfield should be sent for in safe Custody by the Gentleman Vsher of the House and none permitted to speak with him but in the presence of the Messengers and that his Study should be sealed up by the two next Justices of the Peace till the further Pleasure of the House be known Sir Thomas Barington brought up a Message from the Commons to desire that Phillips the Priest may not be released of his Imprisonment until they be first made acquainted with it To which the Lords assented and appointed the Earl of Dorset the Queens Chamberlain to give her Majesty an account of these proceedings The List of the Prime Papists who were desired to be secured by the House of Commons Next the List of Recusants Names were read which the House of Commons desire may be secured which were as follows In the County of Lancaster Mr. Preston of the Mannor Mr. Clifton of Litham Mr. Chorley Sir William Gerrard Mr. James Anderton of Clayton Sen. Mr. Blundel of Crosby Mr. Robert Cranfield of Robbs Hall Sir John Talbott Sir Cecil Trafford Mr. Hugh Anderton of Eurton Sir Alexander Barlow In the County of Stafford Sir Richard Fleetwood Baronet Mr. Jo. Wells of Horecross Mr. Dreycott of Painsley Mr. Peter Gifford of Chillington Mr. Tho. Leveson of Ashburn Mr. Francis Harcott In the County of Southampton Lord Stourton Mr. Gage of Bawbridge Mr. John Bishop of Pilewell Lord Baltimore Mr. William Owen of Abberston John Arundell Esquire In the County of Sussex Lord Viscount Mountague In the County of Warwick Robert Throgmorton Esquire Mr. Morgan of Weston Mr. William Sheldon of Weston Sir Charles Smith In the County of Montgomery Sir Piercy Herbert Knight In the County of Worcester The Earl of Shrewsbury Francis Hanford Esquire Mr. Walter Blunt Edward Sheldon Esquire Mr. William Abbington Jun. In the County of Chester Mr. Poole of Poole Mr. Starkey of Darley Mr. Stanley In the County of Monmouth The Earl of Worcester Sir Charles Sommersett Mr. Morgan of Llantern In the County of Pembroke Sir Nicholas Lewis In the County of Suffolk Sir Robert Rookwood In the County of Salop. Thomas Vnton Esquire In the County of Northumberland Roger Widdrington Esquire In the County of Northampton The Lord Brudnell Mr. Poulton Mr. Sanders In the County of Dorsett John Webb of Cansford In the County of Lincoln Sir John Thimbleby Knight Ralph Evers of Washingborough Mr. Townley of Norton Edmond Thorold of Hough Esq Anthony Mounson The Lord Harris Lord Arundel of Wardour Sir Kenelm Digby Sir John Symonds Sir John Winter Sir William Mounteth Lord Herbert Sir Robert Lyme Sir Basil Brook Sir Alexander Gordon Sir William Mounson Sir Henry Gifford After which it was Ordered That the Consideration of this List should be debated upon Munday following In the House of Commons they were still upon the great work of the Declaration of the State of the Kingdom which was not so smoothly carried but that it met with great Opposition even