Words but if the Demands were read perhaps they would imply nothing less and if so how otherwise to be answered but by the Sword all other Means being first assayed which is ever to be supposed For Sir Henry Vane's and Northumberland's Testimony about perswading of an Offensive War he said he remembred it very well and thought it as free for him to give his Opinion or an Offensive as they for a Defensive War Opinions said he if they be attended with Obstimacy or Pertinacy may make an Heretick but that they ever made a Traytor he never heard it till now nor under favour should I be an Heretick either said he for as I was then so am I now most willing to acknowledge my Weakness and correct my Errors whereof no man hath more or is more sensible of them than I my self yet if that Opinion of mine had been followed it might perhaps have spared us some Money said he and some Reputation too of which we have been prodigal enough For the last about the Ships it proves nothing but he would willingly confess that some Ships were there detained and that by himself and his own Direction as Vice Admiral of Connaugh but it was at the Command of the Lord Admiral the Earl of Northumberland and produced his Letter to that purpose To the English Proof He marvelled much how Sir George Ratcliff's Words could be put upon him Sir George though alledged to be his Bosom Friend yet had thoughts of his own and might have some other thoughts in his Bosom and be to some other Expressions than Sir George Ratcliffe No man said he can commit Treason by his Attorney and should I by my Friend Sir George as by a Proxy For his Brother He never knew him before so rash but that was nothing to him except they could prove a nearer Identity than Nature had instituted and that his Brother's Words and his were â—ll one yet withal he conceived that his Brother's Words might be very well understood of the Scots conquering England but not at all of the Irish and so he wished with all his heart that he had not spoken something which is like a Prophesie To the Primate's Testimony with all Reverence to his Integrity be it spoken he is but one Witness and in Law can prove nothing Add to this said he that it was a private Discourse between him and me and perhaps spoken by me Tentandi gratia and how far this should be laid to a mans Charge let your Lordships judge Yea this seems to me against Humanity it self and will make the Society of men so dangerous and loathsom to us that our Dwelling Houses will be turned to Cells and our Towns to Defarts That which God and Nature our Tongues have bestowed upon us for the greater comfort of venting our own Conceptions or craving the Advice of Wiser and Learnecer men should become Snares and Burdens to us by a curious and needless Fear yet if my Words be taken said he with all that went before and followed after I see no danger in it To the Lord Conway I may reply the same with this Addition That it is a very Natural Motion for a man to preserve himself every Greature hath this Priviledge and shall we deny it to Monarchy provided this be done in a lawful though in an extraordinary way This grain of Salt must be added to season all my Discourse To that of Sir Henry Vane of offering my Service to the King I thank him for the Testimony and think he hath done me much honour thereby but if he or any body else do suspect that his Majesty will employ me in unlawful Enterprizes I shall think them more liable to the Charge of Treason than my self To the subsequent Testimonies I shall not need to wrestle about them much only the last of Sir Henry Vanes pinches and lies sore upon me but to that which the Earl of Clare and I thank him for it hath said already give me leave to add this that the Testimony of one man is not a sufficient Witness nor can a man be Accused much less Condemned of Treason upon this and for that read the Stat. of Hen. 7.12 and of Edw 6.5 Now my Lords said he to give you further satisfaction I shall desire all the Lords of the Councel which were then present only to the number of eight may be examined whether they heard these words or not for the Archbishop and Sir Francis Windebank they cannot be had Sir Henry Vane gives the Testimony I deny it four only remain First The Earl of Northumberlands Testimony which was read had declared expresly that he had never heard those words nor any like them from the Lord Strafford but he spake with great Honour and regard to the Kingdom of England Secondly the Marquess Hamilton who declared upon his Oath that he had never heard such words but that he had heard the Lieutenant often say that the King was to rule his Royal Power Candidè Castè that it would never be well for this Kingdom till the Prerogative of the Crown and the Priviledge of the Subject went in one pace together and that Parliaments were the happiest way to keep a correspondency between the King and People The very same was delivered by the Lord Treasurer and the Lord Cottington Now my Lords you may mervail how these words rested only on the ears of Sir Henry Vane but my Lords said he that I may remove all scruple from you I will make it evident that there was not the least intention that the Irish Army should set a foot in England and then I hope you will conceive that I had no meaning to reduce this Kingdom This he made clear by the Testimony of Northumberland the Oaths of Marquiss Hâ—milton Lord Cottington Lord Treasurer Sir Thomas Lucas who only were private to that matter For other of my words my Lords said he I desire you would not take them by halves if so who should be free from Treason Certainly if such a precident take sooting Westminster-hall shall be more troubled with Treason then with Common-Law look therefore to the Antecedents and Consequents of my Speeches and you shall find the state of the question clearly altered the Antecedents were upon an absolute or inevitable necessity upon a present Invasion when the remedy of a Parliament cannot be expected the Consequents for the defence of the Kingdom which acompts afterward to the Parliament The qualifications too in a lawful convenient and ordinary way so far as the present necessity can permit Add but these and which of you are not of my mind Is the King endowed with no power from the Lord Is he not publicus inspector Regni Stands it not him in hand to do something on present necessities And that these were his words he often proved over and over again by the Marquess by the Lord Treasurer Cottington Sir Tho. Jermine My Lords what I have kept to the
my Guilt If your Lordships will conceive of my Defences as they are in themselves without reference to either and I shall endeavour so to present them I hope to go away from hence as clearly justified as I am now in the testimony of a good conscience by my self My Lords I have all along my Charge watched to see that poysoned Arrow of Treason that some men would sain have to be feathered in my Heart and that deadly Cup of Wine that hath so intoxicated some petty misalleaged Errors as to put them in the Elevation of High Treason but in truth it hath not been my quickness to discern any such Monster yet within my Breast though now perhaps by a sinistrous Information sticking to my Clothes They tell me of a two-fold Treason one against the Statute another by the Common-Law this direct that consecutive this individual that accumulative this in it self that by way of construction For the first I must and do acknowledge that if I had the least suspicion of my own guilt I would spare your Lordships the pains cast the first Stone at my self and pass Sentence of condemnation against my self And whether it be so or not I refer my self to your Lordships Juâ—gment and Declaration You and only you under the favour and protection of my gracious Master are my Judges under favour none of the Commons are my Peers nor can they be my Judges I shall ever celebrate the Providence and Wisdom of your noble Ancestors who have put the Keys of Life and Death so far as concerns you and your Posterity into your own hands not into the hands of your inferiours None but your own selves know the rate of your noble Blood none but your selves must hold the Ballance in dispensing the same I shall proceed in repeating my Defences as they are reduceable to these two main points of Treason and for Treason against the Statute which is the only Treason in effect nothing is alleaged for that but the fifteenth two and twentieth and twenty seventh Articles Here he brought the sum of all his Replies made to these three Articles before and almost in the same words as before only that testimony of Sir Henry Vane's because it seemed pressing he stood upon it and alleaged five Reasons for the nullifying thereof First That it was but a single testimony and would not make Faith in a matter of Debt much less in a matter of Life and Death yea that it was expresly against the Statute to impeach much less to condemn him upon High Treason under the testimony of two famous Witnesses Secondly That he was dubious in it and exprest it with an as I do remember and such or such like Words Thirdly That all the Councel of eight except himself disclaim the words as if by a singular providence they had taken hold of his Ears only Fourthly That at that time the King had levied no Forces in Ireland and therefore he could not be possibly so impudent as to say to the King that he had an Army there which he might imploy for the reducing this Kingdom Fifthly That he had proved by Witnesses beyond all exceptions Marquess Hamilton the Lord Treasurer the Earl of Northumberland Lord Cottington Sir William Pennyman and Sir Arthur Terringham that there was never the least intention to land those Forces in England He went on So much for the Articles that concern Individual Treason To make up the Constructive Treason or Treason by way of Accumulation many Articles are brought against me as if in a heap of Felonies or Misdemeanors for in their conceit they reach no higher some prolifical seed apt to produce what is treasonable could lurk Here I am charged to have designed the ruin and overthrow both of Religion and State The first seemeth rather to have been used to make me odious than guilty for there is not the least Proof alleaged concerning my confederacy with the Popish-faction nor could there be any indeed never a Servant in Authority beneath the King my Master was ever more hated and maligned by those men than my self and that for an Impartial and strict executing of the Laws against them Here your Lordships may observe that the greater number of the Witnesses used against me either from Ireland or from York-shire were men of that Religion But for my own Resolution I thank God I am ready every hour of the day to Seal my disaffection to the Church of Rome with my dearest Blood But my Lords give me leave here to pour forth the grief of my Soul before you these proceedings against me seem to be exceeding rigorous and to have more of prejudice than equity that upon a supposed Charge of my Hypocrisie or Errors in Religion I should be made so monstrously odious to three Kingdoms a great many thousand Eyes have seen my Accusations whose Ears shall never hear that when it came to the upshot I was never accused of them Is this fair dealing amongst Christians But I have lost nothing by that Popular applause was ever nothing in my conceit the uprightness and integrity of a good Conscience was and ever shall be my continual Feast and if I can be justified in your Lordships judgments from this grand imputation as I hope now I am seeing these Gentlemen have thrown down the Bucklers I shall account my self justified by the whole Kingdom because by you who are the Epitomy the better part yea the very Soul and Life of the Kingdom As for my Design against the State I dare plead as much Innocency here as in matter of my Religion I have ever admired the wisdom of our Ancestors who have so fixed the pillars of this Monarchy that each of them keep a due proportion and measure with other and have so handsomly tied up the Nerves and Sinews of the State that the straining of any one may bring danger and sorrow to the whole Oeconomy The Prerogative of the Crown and the Propriety of the Subject have such mutual Relations this takes protection from that that foundation and nourishment from this And as on the Lute if any one string be too high or too lowly wound up you have lost the Harmony so here the excess of a Prerogative is oppression of pretended Liberty in the Subject Disorder and Anarchy The Prerogative must be used as God doth his Omnipotency upon extraordinary Occasions the Laws answerable to that potentia ligata in Creaturis must have place at other times And yet there must be a Prerogative if there must be extraordinary occasions the Propriety of the Subject is ever to be maintained if it go in equal pace with this They are fellows and Companions that have and ever must be inseparable in a well governed Kingdom and no way so fitting so natural to nourish and entertain both as the frequent use of Parliaments By those a commerce and acquaintance is kept betwixt the King and Subject These thoughts have gone along with me these fourteen
AN IMPARTIAL ACCOUNT OF THE Arraignment Trial Condemnation OF THOMAS Late EARL of STRAFFORD And Lord LIEVTANANT of IRELAND BEFORE The PARLIAMENT at WESMINSTER Anno Dom. 1641. LONDON Printed for Joseph Hindmarsh at the Black Bull near the Royal Exchange in Cornhil 1679. TO THE READER AMongst the Superfoetations of the Press I hope you will have no Cause to reckon this small Collection either if you respect the Matter of it I mean the Pleadings in it or the Great Personage concerned in them I am apt to perswade my self it may not altogether be unseasonable in the present Conjuncture of Affairs or unbeneficial to the Reader who shall carefully peruse it The Case it self as well as the Actor the Great and Noble Earl of â—trafford have somewhat more than ordinary and peculiar in them and as this Great and Solemn Trial is so Paramount in the Equipage of all its Circumstances that as former Ages have been unable so future are unable to produce its Parallel To give you though but a Rude Draught of this Great Master of Defence who so easily put by the Thrusts of his most applaudedly Skilful and Dexterous Adversaries will require an Abler Pencil than mine Take then his Character in this Book from his own Mouth seeing otherwise whatsoever may be spoken of him is beneath what was spoken by him and instead of those Strange and Unheard of Monopolies laid to his Charge in this his Trial he may seem a greater himself in engrossing so much of Worth and Ability in his own Bosom As to the Matter of these Collections you have in them a Fine and Pleasant Intermixture of Points of Law and Matters of State You may thereby understand the Constitutions of the two Kingdoms which were then in a strange and most preter-natural Fermentation a Sick Stomach nauseating at Pleasant and Wholsome Meat the Body Politick growing Hot and Feavourish in strange Jactations and Unquietnesses wilfully refusing and scorning the Help and Advice of a most Skilful Aesculapius The Collector you will find hatâ— very well discharged his Part Ne quid Falsi dicere audax ne quid Veri dicere non audax Herein is nothing false Reported no material Truth Omitted and nothing Trivial to swell the Book and make it more Chargeable and less Vseful to the Peruser is for any private End or Design of the Publisher's Gain here set down or observed So that I may compare this Collection to a well-made and easily manageable Net that as Nothing Considerable escapes its Draught so there is no great Pains or Toil in the Cleansing of it no Sticks Stones or Small Fish to give thee any Trouble to return them whence thou hadst them To be short In the Perusal of this Brief but Full Account of this Great Transaction â—s thy Pains will not be Great so thy Charge but not Advantage will be Inconsiderable Farewell THE PROCEEDINGS AGAINST THOMAS Earl of STRAFFORD Lord Lieutenant of IRELAND in the Parliament at Westminster Anno Dom. 1641. Sir YOu have here the Diurnal of the whole Process against the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland it was taken by the hand of a ready Writer a faithful Ear and an understanding Head He was present at all the Action and I make no doubt of the Fidelity of his Relation Which beginneth thus THE House for the Appearance of the Lord Lieutenant was the great Hall in Westminster where there was a Throne erected for the King on each side thereof a Cabinet enclosed about with Boards and before with a Tarras Before that were the Seats for the Lords of the Upper House and Sacks of Wool for the Judges before them ten Stages of Seats extending farther than the midst of the Hall for the Gentlemen of the House of Commons at the end of all was a Desk closed about and set apart for the Lord Lieutenant and his Councel Monday Morning about seven of the Clock he came from the Tower accompanied with six Barges wherein were one hundred Souldiers of the Tower all with Partizans for his Guard and fifty pair of Oars At his Landing at Westminster there he was attended with two hundred of the Trained Band and went in Guarded by them into the Hall The Entries at White-Hall King Street and Westminster were guarded by the Constables and Watchmen from four of the Clock in the Morning to keep away all base and idle persons The King Queen and Prince came to the House about Nine of the Clock but kept themselves private within their Closets only the Prince came out once or twice to the Cloth of State so that the King saw and heard all that passed but was seen of none Some give the reason of this from the received practice of England in such Cases Others say that the Lords did intreat the King either to be absent or to be there privately lest Pretentions might be made hereafter that his being there was either to threaten or some otherwise to interrupt the course of Justice A third sort That the King was not willing to be accessary to the Process till it came to his Part but rather chose to be present that he might note and understand what Violence Rigor or Injustice happened When the Lieutenant entred the Hall the Porter of the Hall whose Office it is asked Mr. Maxwel whether the Axe should be carried before him or no who did answer That the King had expresly forbidden it nor was it the Custom of England to use that Ceremony but only when the Party accused was to be put upon his Jury Those of the Upper House did sit with their Heads covered those of the Lower House uncovered The Bishops upon the Saturday before did voluntarily decline the giving of their Suffrages in Matters Criminal and of that Nature according to the provision of the Cannon-Law and Practice of the Kingdom to this day and therefore would not be present yet withal they gave in a Protestation that their Absence should not prejudice them of that or any other Priviledge competent to them as the Lords Spiritual in Parliament which was accepted The Earl of Arundel as Lord High Steward of England sate apart by himself and at the Lieutenants Entry commanded the House to proceed Mr. Rym being Speaker of the Committee for his Accusation gave in the same Articles which were presented at his last being before the Upper House which being read his Replies were subjoyned and read also the very same which were presented before in the Upper House Some give the Reason of this because the Lower House had not heard those Accusations in publick before 〈◊〉 others that the Formality of the Process required no les however that day was spent in that Exercise The Queen went from the House about eleven of the Clock the King and Prince stayed till the Meeting was dissolved which was after two The Lieutenant was sent to the Tower by his Guard and appointed to return upon Tuesday at nine of the Clock in the
Defence and Protection yeâ— though he had done it by himself alone yet he conceived he had so much power by his Commission causing the Commission to that effect to be read That albeit he should mistake his Commission and do some inferiour Act beyond it because Military proceedings are not alwayes warranted by the Common Law yet it should not be imputed as an Act of Treason to him And to this effect read a Statute of the Seventh of Henry the Second To the Proofs First Colonel Pennyman's Warrant or Sir Edward Osburnes it nothing concerned him and he doubted not but these worthy Gentlemen could justifie their own Act and that he had enough to do to answer his own Misdemeanors Secondly For Sir John Burrowes he was at Rippon when that Proposition was made Thirdly That as the Warrant so neither the Execution troubled him at all Fourthly For Sir William Ingram he was but a single Testimony and that such an one too as he could produce an Evidence to testifie he had mistaken himself in his Testimony upon Oath if it were not to disadvantage the Gentleman He concluded That he had done nothing in that Business but upon the Petition of that County the King 's special Command the Connivance at least of the Great Council and upon a present necessity for the Defence and Safety of the County And so much for Wednesday Upon Thursday the Committee for the Charge declared that they had done with all the Articles and were content to wave the last for Reasons best known to themselves only Sir Walter Earles added that he had some Observations to bring forth upon the two and twentieth Article which he conceived might do much to prove the Earl of Strafford's Designs for Landing the Irish Forces in England And they were First That in his Commission he had Power to Land them in Wales or in any part of England or in Scotland which were altogether superfluous unless there had been some purpose for the same Secondly That within two days before the Date of the Commission Letters were sent to the Lord Bridgewater and Pembroke from Sir Francis Windebank to assist the Earl of Worcester in Levying Forces for the Kings Service and these might be supposed to have intended a joyning with the Irish Thirdly That the Lord Ranelaugh at the raising of the Irish Army did fear such a Design as this Fourthly That the Town of Ayre in Scotland where the Lord Strafford pretended he would Land those Forces was fortified with a Bulwark a Garrison and Block house which would prohibit Landing there that the Earl of Argile's Bounds were divided thence by the Sea and that the Barr or Entry into the Town was very dangerous and shallow The Proofs were only the Reading of the Commission granted to the Lord Strafford The Lieutenants Reply First That his Commission was the same Verbatim with Northumberland's for England and and that it was drawn up by the Council-Board here and sent over unto him so no more Design in him than in the Gentlemen of the English Army nor no larger than that was put upon him Secondly That this was the first time he heard of any such Letters nor did they concern him more than any of the House Thirdly That he was not bound to purge the Lord Ranelaugh from all his Fears and that he had his own Fears too which God forbid should be Evidence of Treason against any man whatsoever Fourthly That it seemed the Gentleman had better Information from that Kingdom than himseâ—f yet he would be confident to say at Ayre there was never such a thing as a Block-House or Garrison But to remove all Scruples for indeed the Road or Landing-place is not there safe he declared that it was his intention to have Landed some Miles above Ayre and made only his Magazine of that Town To the Earl of Argiles Bounds he hoped the Gentleman knew they came not on foot out of Ireland but had Ships to wast and transport themselves and that one of his prime Houses Rosneth was within some few Miles of the same Frith The Lord Digby finding Sir Walter Earles on ground did handsomly bring him off and told the Lords that all their proofs for that Article were not yet ready and that this was a Superfoetation only of the Charge and that in such a Business ac the Plotting of Treason they must be content sometimes with dark Probabilities Then Mr. Glyn desired the Lieutenant to resume his Defence that they might give a Repetition of their Charge and so close the Process so far as concerned the matter of Fact He replied that in his Case all slackness is speed enough the matter touched him narrowly even in his Life and Estate yea in that which he esteemed above thâ—m both his Honour and Posterity and therefore he confessed he had no desire to ride post in such a Business That he knew the Gentlemen at the Bar if they were in his Case would think the time little enough except their more able Judgments could sooner dispatch the matter in hand and therefore he humbly intreated that that day might be granted to him for strengthening himself and recollecting his Thought and Spirits and to morrow he would be ready with his last Replies for himself which after a little Ceremony and Contestation was condescended unto by the House of Commons Upon Friday Morning about Eight of the Clock the Lieutenant of the Tower and my Lord's Chamber-Groom came to the Hall and gave information to the House upon Oath That the Lord Strafford was taken with an exceeding great pain and fit of the Stone and could not upon any conditions stir out of his Bed Mr. Glyn replied That it was a Token of his wilfulness not his weakness that he had not sent a Doctor to testifie the same The Lord Steward made answer that a Doctor could not be had perhaps so soon in a Morning nor was it possible for any Physician to give a certain judgment concerning a man's disability by the Stone because there is no outward Symptomâ— that appear Mr. Glyn excepted That if he did not appear upon Saturday Morning he should lose the privilege to speak in his own defence afterwards and they permitted to proceed The Lord Steward replied That the Lords had appointed four of their Number to go to the Tower and learn the just cause of his Stay and if by any means he were able he should be obliged to come then if not Humanity and common Equity would excuse him In the Afternoon it was reported that he was dead of which there can be no better reason given than the Humour and Genius of the Times that dally with nothing oftner than untruths and calumnies and certainly there are many men of shallow understanding and weak affections who either will not or cannot understand the Gentlemans worth but out of fearful and needless apprehensions are so desirous to hear of his Ruin
Monarchical Government and were only to be answered by the Sword Thirdly That he had caused some Scottish Goods and Ships to be seized on in Ireland Fourthly That he had engaged the Irish Parliament by their Declaration in that War against the Scots Fifthly That by all possible means he had put had thoughts and Suspicions into his Majesty against his Scottish Subjects and laboured to make a National quarrel between them and England which if the Kings Piety and the Prudence of better affected States-men had not prevented could not have been sâ—erd up again without much Blood Concerning England his Speeches were either before or after the Parliament First Before his Creature and Bosom friend Sir George Ratcliff he had said to Sir Robert King when he was doubting how the King might have Monies to pay his Armies that the King had four hundred thousand pounds in his Purse thirty Thousand Men in the Field and his Sword by his side and if he wanted Money afterwards who will pitty him Secondly That his Brother Sir George Wentworth had said to Sir Robert Beâ—ington upon the dissolution of the last Parliament that seeing the English would not grant supply to the King it seems they were weary of their Peace and desired to be conquered a second time Thirdly That he himself upon a discourse with the Primate of Ireland had said that he was much of the mind of those English Divines who maintained it lawful for a King having tried the affection and benevolence of his People and then denied their help upon an inevitable necessity and present danger of the Kingdom that he might use his Prerogative for his own supply and the defence of his Subjects Fourthly To the Lord Conway in a Discourse he had said That if the Parliament meaning the last Parliament should not grant a competent Supply that then the King was Acquitted before God and Man and might use the Authority put into his hands Fifthly That he did say at the Council Board If the Parliament should deny to help the King he would take any other way be could for his Majesties Service and Assistance His Expressions after the Parliament were two First That the Parliament had forsaken the King and that the King should not suffer himself to be over-mastered by the frowardness obstinacy and stubbornness of his People Secondly That if his Majesty pleased to employ Forces he had some in Ireland that might serve to reduce this Kingdom The Proofs for the Scots Particulars were these First The Lord Traquiere who was indeed very favourable to the Lord Lieutenant and spake nothing to his Disadvantage but what was scrued from him with much difficulty he told them That when he gave in the Demands he heard him say that it was high time for the King to put himself into a posture of War but that first all the Council of England said the same as well as he secondly That it was a double Supposition 1. That the Demands were truly given in 2. That there was no other Remedy left but Arms to reduce them Secondly The Earl of Morton's Testimony being sick himself was produced and it was one and the same with the Article Thirdly Sir Henry Vane was examined who declared That he had heard the Lieutenant to advise the King to an Offensive War when his own Judgment was for a Defensive Fourthly The Testimony of the Earl of Northumberland was produced which was the very same with Sir Henry Vane's Fifthly The Treasurer of England deposed the same with Traquiere Sixthly One Beane from Ireland told That he had known Ships seized on there but by whose Procurement or Warrant he knew not To the Articles about England First Sir Robert King and the Lord Renelaugh deposed the same that Sir Robert King and the Lord â—enelaugh had heard Sir George Ratcliffe speak those words in the Article Secondly Sir Robert Barrington of Sir George Wentworth Thirdly The Primate's Testimony who is sick was the same with the Article Fourthly The Lord Conway deposed the same with the Article Fifthly Sir Henry Vane deposed He had heard those Words spoken at the Council-Board For the Words spoken after the Parliament To the first Sir Tho. Jermyne Lord Newburg Earl of Bristol Earl of Holland were Examined Bristol did mince the Matter but Holland's Testimony was express because of the exceeding great Love he carried to the Man For the last which were the most dangerous Speeches about the reducing of this Kingdom there was only Sir Henry Vane's Testimony who declared only thus That he had either those Words or the like Here some of the Lieutenants Friends shewed themselves 1. The Lord Savil who desired of Sir Henâ—y Vane to know whether he said their or this or that Kingdom and withal said it was very hard to condemn a man for Treason upon such petit Circumstances 2. The Earl of Southampton desired to know whether Sir Henry Vane would swear those words positively or not Sir Henry Vane said positively either them or the like The Earl replied that under favour those or the like could not be positive 3. The Earl of Clare desired to know what could be meant by this Kingdom for his part he said he thought it meant of the Kingdom of Scotland to which the Word this might very well be relative that Kingdom being only mentioned in the preceding Discourse And that he was the more ready to be of that Opinion because he could not see by what Grammatical Construction it could be gathered from his words that he meant to reduce England which neither then was neither is now God be thanked out of the way of Obedience nor upon Rebellious Courses They at last concluded the Charge That the Words were so monstrous that to aggravate them was to allay them and therefore they would simply leave them to the Judgment of the Lords The Lieutenant's Reply was That though the heaping up of those Articles had put him to a great Confusion yet he would endeavour to bring his Answer into the best Method he could and first he would reply to the Prooâ— then add something in general for himself in what a hard taking and lamentable Condition he was to have his private Discourses his most intimate and bosome friends search'd and sisted to the least Circumstance that he might seem guilty of that which by God's assistance he should never be To the Lord Traquieres and the Deputies Depositions he thought their Proofs did not much stick upon him for upon the Suppositions first That the Demands were true secondly That they were not justifiable thirdly That no other Course could prevail He could not see what other Advice he could possibly give the King than to put himself into a posture of War especially seeing then there was frequent Reports of the Scots invading or entring into England nor was he of any other mind than all the rest of the Council-Board For that of Morton's he doth not positively remember the