or_o congregation_n and_o who_o know_v not_o too_o well_o what_o be_v to_o be_v understand_v by_o gathering-churche_n by_o the_o former_a practice_n of_o the_o independent_o but_o more_o especial_o by_o these_o presbyterian_o since_o the_o indulgence_n but_o to_o talk_v of_o gather_v church_n and_o yet_o of_o hold_v communion_n with_o we_o be_v a_o juggle_v unworthy_a our_o author_n who_o either_o do_v or_o shall_v know_v that_o it_o be_v protestatio_fw-la contra_fw-la factum_fw-la &_o questionem_fw-la i_o mean_v it_o be_v general_o so_o i_o have_v as_o you_o can_v but_o see_v both_o in_o the_o question_n as_o propose_v and_o as_o state_v and_o as_o prosecute_v set_v gather_v of_o church_n in_o opposition_n to_o our_o parochial_a congregation_n and_o what_o you_o say_v to_o any_o thing_n else_o be_v not_o to_o the_o point_n and_o the_o general_a practice_n of_o church-gatherers_a too_o well_o satisfy_v the_o world_n what_o they_o intend_v and_o also_o that_o the_o question_n be_v right_o propound_v and_o clear_o state_v to_o any_o unbiased_a and_o unprejudiced_a reader_n what_o ever_o you_o say_v to_o confound_v it_o and_o with_o your_o wont_a elaborateness_n to_o render_v it_o unintelligible_a p._n 40._o and_o then_o complain_v that_o it_o be_v so_o but_o the_o learning_n of_o some_o man_n be_v not_o ill_o compare_v to_o a_o pedlar_n pack_v though_o not_o so_o much_o for_o that_o there_o be_v many_o thing_n that_o be_v difficult_a to_o be_v find_v but_o rather_o because_o if_o they_o look_v for_o any_o thing_n every_o thing_n come_v to_o hand_n but_o this_o be_v far_o from_o our_o author_n to_o who_o we_o must_v now_o hearken_v diligent_o he_o first_o set_v down_o my_o question_n very_a honest_o and_o entire_o p._n 26_o 27._o then_o he_o nibles_fw-fr a_o little_a at_o it_o and_o at_o length_n bite_v and_o tell_v the_o world_n that_o i_o join_v two_o question_n in_o one_o which_o we_o must_v look_v to_o have_v distinct_o answer_v but_o what_o those_o two_o question_n be_v and_o where_o they_o be_v distinct_o answer_v i_o have_v look_v and_o find_v not_o will_v he_o not_o speak_v distinct_o to_o they_o because_o he_o hate_v division_n or_o be_v it_o his_o prudence_n to_o leave_v out_o conscience_n for_o he_o have_v tell_v we_o p._n 21._o that_o to_o decide_v this_o case_n be_v a_o work_n of_o mere_a christian_a prudence_n but_o where_o be_v conscience_n then_o exclude_v by_o what_o law_n that_o shall_v be_v try_v anon_o for_o i_o shall_v now_o address_v myself_o in_o earnest_a to_o review_v the_o whole_a question_n not_o in_o two_o only_a but_o in_o the_o several_a case_n depend_v upon_o it_o a_o just_a examine_v whereof_o will_v give_v i_o occasion_n sufficient_a to_o consider_v all_o that_o he_o have_v say_v to_o the_o purpose_n against_o i_o as_o i_o find_v it_o scatter_v up_o and_o down_o his_o book_n chap._n vii_o gathering-churche_n charge_v with_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o prove_v to_o be_v so_o from_o the_o definition_n of_o this_o church_n wherein_o he_o be_v tell_v what_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o schism_n from_o it_o be_v the_o general_a question_n betwixt_o we_o be_v this_o whether_o it_o be_v lawful_a for_o the_o presbyterian_o to_o refuse_v communion_n with_o our_o parish_n church_n and_o to_o gather_v themselves_o into_o distinct_a and_o separate_a church_n and_o upon_o a_o serious_a review_n of_o it_o and_o consideration_n of_o all_o that_o the_o answerer_n have_v say_v against_o i_o and_o my_o discourse_n upon_o it_o i_o do_v renew_v my_o charge_n and_o positive_o affirm_v that_o it_o be_v unlawful_a and_o as_o it_o be_v general_o practise_v it_o be_v a_o great_a and_o dangerous_a schism_n both_o against_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o particular_a church_n it_o be_v a_o schism_n in_o its_o own_o nature_n and_o sinful_a in_o itself_o it_o be_v a_o schism_n in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o old_a nonconformist_n call_v puritan_n and_o also_o in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o presbyterian_o before_o 1660._o and_o last_o that_o both_o in_o conscience_n and_o prudence_n it_o ought_v at_o present_a to_o be_v avoid_v or_o desert_v by_o all_o such_o especial_o as_o be_v call_v presbyterian_o and_o all_o this_o in_o in_o its_o several_a part_n and_o in_o their_o order_n as_o here_o set_v down_o i_o undertake_v to_o make_v good_a 1._o thus_o to_o separate_a and_o to_o gather_v church_n be_v a_o schism_n with_o respect_n to_o the_o church_n of_o england_n now_o as_o divine_n speak_v of_o a_o schism_n in_o a_o church_n and_o a_o shism_n from_o a_o church_n so_o in_o a_o diverse_a respect_n this_o practice_n be_v guilty_a of_o both_o for_o if_o you_o consider_v the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o particular_a organise_v church_n it_o be_v a_o schism_n from_o but_o if_o as_o part_v of_o the_o universal_a visibe_n church_n only_o as_o the_o nonconformist_n use_v to_o term_v it_o then_o it_o be_v schism_n in_o it_o it_o be_v a_o shism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o such_o by_o divide_v from_o its_o governor_n member_n worship_n and_o assembly_n as_o i_o more_o than_o intimate_v in_o my_o book_n p._n 8._o and_o this_o aught_o to_o have_v be_v distinct_o observe_v at_o least_o by_o my_o answerer_n but_o instead_o thereof_o how_o he_o stumble_v and_o blunder_v look_v careful_o and_o make_v great_a outcry_n after_o that_o which_o i_o lay_v just_a before_o he_o you_o charge_v we_o say_v he_o p._n 37._o with_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n again_o p._n 38._o tell_v we_o what_o you_o mean_v by_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n again_o p._n 35._o we_o be_v tell_v of_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o if_o it_o be_v a_o monstrous_a and_o unheard_a of_o thing_n and_o then_o puzzle_v pitiful_o puzzle_v himself_o and_o his_o reader_n in_o a_o impertinent_a pursuit_n of_o the_o head_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o if_o without_o a_o certain_a and_o infallible_a knowledge_n of_o that_o there_o can_v be_v no_o such_o thing_n as_o a_o church_n of_o england_n or_o schism_n from_o it_o weary_v himself_o for_o five_o or_o six_o page_n at_o his_o old_a game_n of_o nothing_o to_o the_o purpose_n but_o methinks_v he_o labour_v with_o a_o very_a vehement_a desire_n after_o this_o great_a truth_n and_o can_v he_o be_v sure_a to_o have_v it_o he_o will_v not_o say_v how_o much_o money_n as_o well_o as_o pain_n he_o will_v give_v for_o it_o yea_o he_o roundly_o offer_v i_o how_o consistent_a with_o his_o gravity_n i_o do_v not_o observe_v but_o he_o roundly_o offer_v i_o all_o the_o money_n in_o his_o purse_n to_o make_v he_o understand_v but_o what_o the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v p._n 35._o well_o if_o you_o will_v promise_v i_o to_o be_v humble_a and_o teachable_a and_o that_o you_o be_v not_o too_o old_a to_o learn_v though_o i_o have_v no_o mind_n to_o your_o money_n i_o will_v show_v my_o readiness_n and_o charity_n at_o least_o to_o relieve_v you_o in_o so_o great_a a_o straight_a though_o my_o judgement_n may_v fail_v and_o my_o definition_n be_v as_o despicable_a as_o my_o silly_a argument_n the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v a_o community_n consist_v of_o profess_a christian_n unite_v in_o the_o same_o government_n doctrine_n and_o worship_n according_a to_o the_o 39_o article_n and_o homily_n her_o liturgy_n and_o canon_n and_o law_n and_o divide_v into_o parochial_a assembly_n for_o the_o more_o convenient_a worship_v of_o god_n may_v such_o a_o notion_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n have_v supercede_v all_o his_o finesse_n of_o wit_n and_o distinction_n about_o the_o constitutive_a ecclesiastical_a head_n as_o he_o speak_v how_o learned_o i_o leave_v to_o his_o friend_n mr._n bagshaw_n i_o think_v his_o labour_n may_v have_v be_v well_o enough_o spare_v for_o he_o may_v consider_v we_o be_v unite_v in_o the_o same_o government_n and_o the_o pars_fw-la regens_fw-la be_v the_o only_a part_n he_o himself_o require_v to_o be_v add_v to_o the_o pars_fw-la subdita_fw-la to_o constitute_v a_o church_n organise_v in_o a_o proper_a political_a sense_n p._n 38._o now_o you_o will_v not_o deny_v either_o of_o these_o part_n and_o consequent_o you_o have_v find_v the_o whole_a of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o you_o say_v organise_v in_o a_o proper_a political_a sense_n and_o it_o hence_o follow_v that_o it_o be_v material_a to_o our_o point_n to_o determine_v certain_o what_o be_v the_o ecclesiastical_a head_n of_o this_o church_n whether_o we_o that_o be_v member_n of_o it_o be_v all_o unite_a in_o the_o king_n as_o persona_fw-la mixta_fw-la cum_fw-la sacerdote_fw-la and_o not_o mere_o a_o civil_a head_n as_o you_o insinuate_v he_o be_v supreme_a in_o all_o cause_n and_o over_o all_o person_n as_o well_o ecclesiastical_a as_o civil_a or_o whether_o
any_o think_v it_o more_o proper_a to_o radicate_v this_o union_n in_o his_o grace_n of_o canterbury_n as_o primate_n over_o all_o england_n or_o whether_o in_o both_o the_o arch-bishop_n who_o hold_v communion_n in_o the_o same_o doctrine_n worship_n and_o law_n and_o in_o who_o both_o the_o province_n be_v unite_v or_o last_o whether_o we_o be_v not_o rather_o unite_v in_o all_o the_o bishop_n and_o pastor_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o the_o pars_fw-la regens_fw-la and_o our_o government_n in_o the_o church_n consider_v pure_o and_o abstract_o from_o the_o civil_a government_n be_v not_o rather_o a_o aristocracy_n than_o a_o monarchy_n whether_o this_o or_o the_o other_o be_v the_o true_a to_o know_v it_o be_v not_o necessary_a nor_o of_o any_o use_n that_o i_o can_v perceive_v in_o the_o present_a controversy_n but_o it_o be_v a_o certain_a vanity_n to_o say_v because_o i_o can_v find_v the_o head_n i_o will_v deny_v the_o body_n though_o i_o must_v withal_o deny_v my_o own_o sense_n because_o you_o can_v know_v certain_o who_o be_v your_o father_n will_v you_o deny_v your_o mother_n which_o be_v the_o sure_a side_n there_o be_v a_o church_n of_o englâ—nd_n and_o what_o it_o be_v i_o have_v endeavour_v to_o show_v and_o by_o the_o nature_n of_o it_o we_o may_v more_o easy_o conclude_v what_o schism_n from_o it_o be_v and_o who_o be_v guilty_a of_o this_o whether_o such_o as_o separate_a and_o gather_v church_n or_o not_o chap._n viii_o what_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v and_o whether_o gather_v of_o church_n aâ—_n now_o be_v practise_v be_v not_o guilty_a of_o it_o 1._o what_o be_v schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n sure_o it_o be_v not_o a_o deny_v its_o doctrine_n or_o hold_v any_o thing_n contrary_a thereunto_o he_o that_o hold_v perversum_fw-la dogma_fw-la only_o be_v a_o 3._o ad_fw-la tit._n cap._n 3._o heretic_n no_o schismatic_a as_o st._n hierom_n teach_v mr._n newcomen_fw-mi a_o learned_a presbyterian_a as_o i_o observe_v in_o my_o last_o let_v we_o the_o separatist_n know_v that_o their_o agree_v with_o we_o and_o the_o reform_a church_n in_o doctrine_n that_o be_v fundamental_a their_o hold_v one_o head_n and_o one_o faith_n do_v not_o excuse_v they_o from_o be_v guilty_a of_o breach_n of_o unity_n so_o long_o as_o they_o hold_v not_o one_o body_n one_o baptism_n for_o he_o cite_v beza_n another_o learned_a 10._o annotat._n in_o 1_o cor._n 1._o 10._o presbyterian_a so_o that_o you_o may_v be_v willing_a to_o subscribe_v to_o the_o 39_o article_n and_o yet_o be_v schismatic_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n it_o remain_v therefore_o that_o such_o schism_n relate_v to_o the_o other_o band_n of_o our_o union_n and_o fellowship_n with_o this_o church_n to_o wit_n her_o government_n and_o worship_n and_o consequent_a to_o the_o latter_a her_o member_n and_o assembly_n thus_o you_o see_v we_o must_v return_v to_o our_o first_o determination_n that_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v a_o sinful_a divide_v from_o or_o a_o dissolve_v our_o union_n and_o communion_n with_o she_o in_o her_o governor_n and_o member_n worship_n or_o assembly_n this_o be_v the_o least_o that_o we_o mean_v by_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o be_v call_v separation_n or_o schism_n negative_a which_o be_v make_v positive_a and_o more_o formal_o such_o when_o those_o that_o have_v so_o separate_v set_v up_o their_o altar_n against_o she_o and_o erect_v other_o congregation_n in_o opposition_n to_o she_o the_o schismatic_a by_o dr._n hamond_n 40._o of_o schism_n epist_n 40._o out_o of_o ignatius_n be_v describe_v to_o be_v filius_fw-la impius_fw-la etc._n etc._n a_o impious_a son_n which_o have_v contemn_v the_o bishop_n and_o forsake_v the_o priest_n of_o god_n dare_v constitute_v another_o altar_n and_o again_o epist_n 57_o the_o schismatic_n be_v they_o that_o have_v leave_v their_o bishop_n set_v up_o for_o themselves_o abroad_o another_o false_a bishop_n and_o all_o their_o adherent_n be_v involve_v in_o the_o same_o guilt_n who_o join_v with_o the_o schismatic_n against_o their_o bishop_n two_o thing_n here_o must_v be_v suppose_v 1._o that_o we_o be_v the_o pars_fw-la subdita_fw-la and_o do_v owe_v this_o communion_n and_o obedience_n to_o these_o governor_n of_o the_o church_n 2._o that_o they_o impose_v no_o unlawful_a condition_n of_o this_o communion_n upon_o we_o though_o if_o they_o shall_v how_o far_o we_o may_v separate_v must_v take_v its_o measure_n from_o such_o imposition_n which_o be_v another_o question_n to_o be_v discuss_v anon_o in_o another_o place_n and_o at_o present_a i_o shall_v only_o add_v that_o so_o far_o as_o i_o understand_v my_o answerer_n so_o far_o as_o the_o people_n be_v concern_v in_o the_o condition_n of_o our_o communion_n we_o be_v not_o likely_a to_o differ_v much_o in_o this_o point_n but_o for_o the_o first_o of_o these_o supposition_n if_o there_o be_v any_o force_n in_o scripture_n precept_n require_v obedience_n to_o our_o spiritual_a guide_n or_o in_o civil_a and_o ecclesiastical_a law_n which_o be_v very_o severe_a to_o that_o purpose_n nothing_o can_v be_v more_o evident_a than_o that_o all_o english_a christian_n do_v owe_v communion_n and_o obedience_n to_o the_o governor_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n who_o government_n stand_v establish_v by_o both_o sort_n of_o law_n and_o be_v so_o acknowledge_v by_o the_o declaration_n itself_o and_o your_o friend_n mr._n baxter_n be_v 76._o defence_n of_o his_o cure_n p._n 76._o not_o obscure_a in_o this_o point_n we_o must_v own_v say_v he_o a_o national_a church_n as_o it_o be_v improper_o so_o denominate_v from_o the_o king_n that_o be_v the_o civil_a head_n and_o as_o it_o be_v a_o community_n of_o christian_n and_o a_o part_n of_o the_o universal_a church_n unite_v by_o the_o concord_n of_o her_o pastor_n who_o in_o synod_n may_v represent_v the_o whole_a ministry_n and_o be_v the_o mean_n of_o their_o agreement_n he_o say_v we_o must_v own_v the_o national_a church_n i_o say_v than_o we_o must_v not_o disow_v she_o and_o must_v we_o not_o likewise_o own_o the_o king_n as_o the_o head_n thereof_o and_o all_o the_o bishop_n and_o pastor_n and_o governor_n under_o he_o and_o then_o what_o liberty_n be_v leave_v we_o to_o disow_v deny_v or_o renounce_v their_o person_n or_o authority_n let_v such_o especial_o as_o have_v take_v the_o oath_n of_o supremacy_n and_o receive_v ordination_n from_o episcopal_a hand_n yet_o better_a consider_v those_o solemn_a obligation_n upon_o they_o add_v to_o the_o law_n and_o take_v heed_n in_o earnest_n of_o perfidiousness_n and_o perjury_n let_v they_o consider_v what_o be_v to_o renounce_v all_o foreign_a jurisdiction_n and_o to_o their_o power_n to_o assist_v and_o defend_v all_o jurisdiction_n spiritual_a as_o well_o as_o temporal_a grant_v or_o belong_v to_o the_o king_n highness_n and_o how_o well_o a_o renounce_v obedience_n to_o the_o government_n of_o the_o church_n consist_v with_o that_o which_o we_o have_v swear_v therein_o it_o be_v true_a all_o be_v not_o call_v actual_o to_o take_v this_o oath_n yet_o it_o be_v as_o true_a that_o the_o minister_n and_o officer_n of_o all_o sort_n general_o be_v and_o all_o graduate_n in_o the_o university_n and_o for_o other_o as_o they_o be_v the_o king_n subject_n they_o be_v unquestionable_o take_v to_o be_v under_o the_o same_o obligation_n as_o to_o the_o matter_n of_o it_o and_o be_v bear_v to_o the_o duty_n as_o well_o as_o the_o privilege_n of_o subject_n of_o this_o realm_n and_o therefore_o we_o find_v that_o this_o oath_n be_v administer_v not_o only_o to_o oblige_v but_o rather_o as_o a_o test_n to_o try_v and_o also_o to_o secure_v the_o fidelity_n of_o such_o as_o take_v it_o as_o be_v evident_a in_o the_o statute_n again_o let_v all_o minister_n ordain_v by_o bishop_n i_o hope_v i_o have_v now_o to_o do_v with_o one_o in_o the_o name_n of_o god_n serious_o consider_v what_o they_o promise_v to_o do_v at_o their_o ordination_n be_v most_o solemn_o interogated_a by_o the_o bishop_n in_o the_o name_n of_o god_n and_o of_o his_o church_n as_o the_o word_n be_v more_o particular_o the_o bishop_n demand_v will_v you_o then_o give_v your_o faithful_a diligence_n always_o for_o to_o minister_v the_o doctrine_n and_o sacrament_n and_o discipline_n of_o christ_n as_o the_o lord_n have_v command_v and_o as_o this_o church_n and_o realm_n have_v receive_v the_o same_o according_a to_o commandment_n of_o god_n so_o that_o you_o may_v teach_v the_o people_n commit_v to_o your_o cure_n and_o charge_n with_o all_o diligence_n to_o keep_v and_o observe_v the_o same_o what_o answer_n do_v you_o make_v hereunto_o i_o will_v do_v so_o by_o the_o help_n of_o the_o lord_n and_o thus_o you_o at_o once_o acknowledge_v that_o the_o doctrine_n sacrament_n and_o discipline_n
his_o thought_n to_o the_o state_n of_o our_o church_n heretofore_o as_o in_o the_o former_a he_o strike_v at_o the_o popish_a the_o learned_a amesius_n who_o principle_n be_v somewhat_o congregational_a have_v say_v much_o to_o the_o same_o purpose_n in_o a_o few_o word_n separation_n from_o a_o true_a church_n schism_n case_n dâ—_n schism_n be_v sometime_o lawful_a if_o one_o can_v remain_v in_o its_o communion_n sine_fw-la communicatione_n in_fw-la peccatis_fw-la without_o communicate_v in_o her_o sin_n if_o there_o be_v manifest_a danger_n of_o seduction_n and_o if_o we_o be_v compel_v to_o depart_v by_o oppression_n and_o persecution_n thus_o he_o and_o we_o may_v suppose_v he_o think_v he_o make_v a_o full_a enumeration_n of_o all_o the_o just_a cause_n of_o depart_v from_o a_o true_a church_n and_o that_o in_o any_o other_o case_n separation_n be_v unlawful_a other_o indeed_o have_v more_o compendious_o and_o full_o draw_v all_o the_o rule_n in_o this_o case_n into_o one_o point_n separation_n be_v unwarrantable_a if_o communion_n with_o the_o church_n may_v be_v without_o sin_n and_o indeed_o what_o can_v justify_v a_o practice_n so_o contrary_a to_o love_v and_o peace_n and_o of_o so_o dangerous_a consequence_n but_o the_o avoid_n of_o sin_n our_o general_a answer_n to_o the_o charge_n of_o schism_n by_o the_o papist_n be_v we_o must_v not_o partake_v with_o your_o sin_n and_o i_o think_v all_o party_n consent_v in_o this_o common_a proposition_n where_o the_o condition_n of_o communion_n with_o a_o church_n be_v sinful_a we_o be_v not_o bind_v to_o that_o communion_n for_o we_o must_v obey_v god_n rather_o then_o man_n i_o be_o sure_a this_o be_v current_a doctrine_n with_o the_o nonconformist_n 22._o his_o â—â—fence_n 2._o par._n 22._o call_v puritan_n heretofore_o in_o the_o defence_n of_o communion_n with_o the_o church_n of_o england_n let_v the_o abuse_n say_v mr._n ball_n be_v many_o or_o great_a yet_o if_o i_o may_v be_v present_a at_o the_o true_a worship_n of_o god_n without_o sin_n consent_n unto_o or_o approbation_n of_o such_o abuse_n or_o corruption_n in_o voluntary_a separation_n i_o sin_n against_o god_n his_o church_n and_o my_o own_o soul_n this_o be_v also_o undoubted_a by_o the_o late_a presbyterian_o in_o stead_n of_o many_o let_v mr._n cawdrey_n against_o dr._n owen_n schism_n independ_v a_o great_a schism_n be_v hear_v for_o methinks_v he_o speak_v to_o the_o purpose_n it_o be_v say_v he_o no_o duty_n of_o christ_n impose_v no_o privilege_n of_o his_o purchase_n either_o to_o deprive_v a_o man_n self_n of_o his_o ordinance_n for_o other_o man_n sin_n or_o to_o set_v up_o a_o new_a church_n in_o opposition_n to_o a_o true_a church_n as_o no_o church_n right_o constitute_v for_o want_n of_o some_o reformation_n in_o lesser_a matter_n and_o mr._n corbet_n and_o the_o author_n of_o evangelical_n peace_n and_o unity_n if_o i_o understand_v he_o put_v the_o whole_a debate_n upon_o the_o same_o issue_n with_o we_o so_o bagshaw_n also_o etc._n etc._n among_o these_o light_a cause_n which_o will_v by_o no_o mean_n warrant_v a_o separation_n mr._n baxter_n have_v labour_v to_o 291._o cure_v of_o church_n division_n 291._o throw_v down_o these_o four_o superstitious_a as_o he_o call_v they_o which_o some_o religious_a people_n have_v bring_v up_o 1._o that_o we_o be_v guilty_a of_o the_o sin_n of_o all_o unworthy_a communicant_n if_o we_o communicate_v with_o they_o though_o their_o admission_n be_v not_o by_o our_o fault_n 2._o that_o he_o who_o judgement_n be_v against_o a_o diocesan_n church_n may_v not_o lawful_o join_v with_o a_o parish_n church_n if_o the_o minister_n be_v but_o subject_a to_o the_o diocesan_n 3._o that_o whatsoever_o be_v unlawful_o command_v be_v 194._o see_v cure_n of_o church_n division_n p._n 194._o not_o lawful_a to_o be_v obey_v 4._o that_o it_o be_v unlawful_a to_o do_v any_o thing_n in_o the_o worship_n of_o god_n which_o be_v impose_v by_o man_n and_o be_v not_o command_v itself_o in_o the_o scripture_n but_o enough_o of_o the_o false_a ground_n of_o separation_n that_o render_v it_o causeless_o for_o that_o they_o be_v either_o real_o none_o or_o else_o light_a or_o insufficient_a the_o second_o exception_n against_o separation_n be_v take_v from_o the_o undue_a manner_n of_o proceed_v in_o it_o for_o which_o it_o be_v term_v rash_a and_o therefore_o schismatical_a though_o the_o ground_n be_v just._n that_o be_v as_o mr._n brinsly_n explain_v himself_o p_o 25._o when_o it_o be_v sudden_a and_o heady_a without_o due_a endeavour_n and_o expectance_n of_o reformation_n in_o the_o church_n it_o be_v then_o rash_a and_o consequent_o a_o unwarrantable_a separation_n in_o as_o much_o as_o it_o be_v opposite_a to_o charity_n mr._n baxter_n advice_n be_v excellent_a here_o if_o corruption_n blemish_n and_o dishonour_v the_o congregation_n do_v not_o 80._o cure_v of_o church_n diu._n p._n 80._o say_v let_v sin_n alone_o i_o must_v not_o oppose_v it_o for_o fear_n of_o division_n but_o be_v the_o forward_a to_o reduce_v all_o to_o the_o will_n of_o god_n and_o yet_o if_o you_o can_v prevail_v as_o you_o desire_v be_v the_o backwarde_a to_o divide_v and_o separate_a and_o do_v it_o not_o without_o a_o certain_a warrant_n and_o extreme_a necessity_n resolve_v with_o austin_n i_o will_v not_o be_v the_o chaff_n and_o yet_o i_o will_v not_o go_v out_o of_o the_o floor_n though_o the_o chaff_n be_v there_o never_o give_v over_o your_o just_a desire_n and_o endeavour_v of_o reformation_n and_o yet_o as_o long_o as_o you_o can_v possible_o avoid_v it_o forsake_v not_o the_o church_n which_o you_o desire_v to_o reform_v as_o paul_n say_v to_o they_o that_o be_v to_o forsake_v a_o sea-wracked_a vessel_n if_o these_o abide_v not_o in_o the_o ship_n you_o can_v be_v save_v many_o a_o one_o by_o unlawful_a fly_n and_o shift_v for_o his_o own_o great_a peace_n and_o safety_n do_v much_o more_o hazard_v his_o own_o and_o other_o 3._o ames_n give_v i_o occasion_n to_o hint_n one_o thing_n more_o secessio_fw-la vero_fw-la totalis_fw-la etc._n etc._n a_o total_a secession_n or_o separation_n with_o absolute_a renounce_n or_o reject_v all_o communion_n can_v be_v lawful_o practise_v towards_o a_o true_a church_n but_o partial_a only_o quatenus_fw-la communio_fw-la so_o far_o as_o communion_n can_v be_v exercise_v without_o sin_n case_n de_fw-fr schis_fw-la 307._o i_o wish_v hearty_o my_o brethren_n will_v consider_v whether_o not_o only_o renounce_v all_o communion_n with_o but_o set_v up_o other_o church_n against_o our_o church_n be_v not_o in_o his_o sense_n a_o total_a separation_n and_o consequent_o sinful_a or_o whether_o you_o that_o so_o use_v we_o do_v yet_o retain_v communion_n with_o our_o parish-church_n so_o far_o as_o you_o know_v you_o may_v without_o sin_n but_o this_o by_o the_o way_n the_o sum_n be_v when_o the_o church_n give_v no_o such_o cause_n of_o offence_n as_o may_v justify_v separation_n when_o the_o condition_n of_o her_o communion_n require_v nothing_o of_o her_o member_n whereby_o if_o they_o communicate_v they_o shall_v be_v actual_a sinner_n when_o person_n let_v the_o cause_n be_v never_o so_o just_a shall_v unadvised_o without_o due_a endeavour_n and_o patient_a expectance_n of_o a_o reformation_n last_o when_o they_o shall_v for_o some_o few_o thing_n at_o which_o they_o take_v offence_n total_o forsake_v communion_n with_o a_o true_a church_n and_o gather_v themselves_o into_o anti-churche_n they_o be_v in_o all_o these_o case_n guilty_a of_o schism_n in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o most_o nonconformist_n of_o all_o sort_n and_o indeed_o of_o all_o man_n that_o have_v consider_v the_o point_n and_o the_o nature_n of_o schism_n the_o assumption_n we_o shall_v make_v hereafter_o and_o at_o present_a only_o take_v notice_n of_o what_o the_o answerer_n have_v say_v to_o prevent_v it_o he_o give_v we_o p._n 16_o 17._o eight_o difference_n betwixt_o the_o old_a separatist_n and_o the_o present_a nonconformist_n and_o then_o conclude_v in_o all_o these_o they_o differ_v from_o separatist_n though_o they_o gather_v church_n these_o difference_n be_v particular_o consider_v hereafter_o the_o first_o three_o of_o these_o difference_n be_v a_o compliment_n to_o we_o and_o our_o parish_n the_o four_o next_o be_v a_o compliment_n to_o themselves_o in_o the_o last_o i_o think_v he_o be_v in_o earnest_n for_o himself_o but_o he_o have_v to_o do_v with_o a_o headstrong_a party_n that_o will_v not_o obey_v either_o his_o word_n or_o example_n in_o desire_v nothing_o more_o than_o with_o love_n and_o concord_n to_o carry_v on_o with_o we_o the_o same_o work_n of_o christ_n but_o what_o be_v all_o this_o to_o excuse_v they_o from_o be_v separatist_n that_o run_v away_o from_o we_o and_o draw_v desciple_n after_o they_o that_o refuse_v i_o be_o sure_a in_o fact_n what_o ever_o some_o may_v say_v the_o least_o communion_n
have_v do_v upon_o less_o provocation_n that_o you_o may_v have_v ground_n to_o run_v out_o upon_o i_o as_o a_o enemy_n to_o tolerate_a preach_v you_o express_o affirm_v p._n 2._o that_o you_o find_v i_o exhort_v you_o to_o desert_n your_o office_n and_o that_o it_o seem_v p._n 60._o that_o acknowledge_v we_o true_a church_n will_v not_o satisfy_v we_o without_o what_o actual_a hear_v we_o we_o will_v stroke_v you_o into_o silence_n and_o the_o neglect_n of_o your_o office_n p._n 25._o you_o ask_v p._n 58_o 59_o whether_o it_o be_v sin_n in_o you_o to_o preach_v and_o labour_n much_o in_o the_o proof_n of_o the_o necessity_n of_o your_o preach_v and_o you_o intimate_v that_o if_o the_o non_fw-fr conformist_n shall_v not_o preach_v they_o shall_v be_v idle_a cruel_a sacrilegious_a and_o perfidious_a as_o be_v your_o word_n p._n 27_o 28._o now_o sir_n in_o my_o silly_a way_n of_o reason_v i_o must_v demand_v whether_o you_o do_v indeed_o find_v those_o word_n for_o which_o you_o persecute_v i_o throughout_o your_o book_n in_o my_o book_n or_o not_o if_o you_o shall_v say_v you_o do_v find_v those_o word_n or_o word_n to_o that_o effect_n i_o be_o not_o satisfy_v unless_o you_o tell_v i_o where_o for_o i_o solemn_o protest_v i_o know_v not_o why_o do_v you_o not_o name_v the_o page_n where_o they_o be_v to_o be_v find_v as_o in_o other_o case_n you_o general_o do_v especial_o this_o be_v the_o main_a matter_n of_o offence_n to_o you_o that_o provoke_v you_o to_o so_o much_o severity_n throughout_o your_o book_n against_o i_o for_o you_o begin_v your_o book_n to_o this_o purpose_n that_o if_o it_o have_v be_v all_o my_o endeavour_n that_o the_o toleration_n shall_v not_o be_v abuse_v you_o shall_v earnest_o have_v second_v i_o but_o when_o you_o find_v that_o i_o have_v the_o faâ—e_n to_o exhort_v you_o to_o desert_n your_o office_n etc._n etc._n that_o i_o come_v to_o you_o in_o god_n name_n to_o charge_v you_o to_o forbear_v his_o work_n then_o you_o say_v your_o conscience_n bid_v you_o help_v to_o save_v the_o weak_a sort_n that_o need_v from_o such_o pernicious_a fallacy_n sir_n i_o do_v with_o all_o earnestness_n and_o yet_o meekness_n let_v you_o know_v that_o i_o expect_v you_o shall_v make_v good_a your_o charge_n show_v i_o these_o word_n or_o word_n that_o carry_v the_o same_o sense_n in_o any_o place_n of_o my_o book_n or_o confess_v you_o have_v wrong_v i_o and_o i_o be_o satisfy_v but_o yet_o turn_v the_o table_n and_o ask_v yourself_o serious_o what_o lash_v you_o will_v have_v censure_v i_o worthy_a shall_v i_o have_v deal_v so_o with_o you_o take_v a_o instance_n of_o your_o spirit_n and_o charity_n upon_o a_o far_o less_o occasion_n give_v you_o as_o you_o conceive_v in_o my_o book_n when_o upon_o a_o misinformation_n at_o most_o i_o only_o ask_v a_o question_n in_o a_o matter_n of_o no_o great_a moment_n viz._n whether_o the_o presbyterian_o do_v not_o heretofore_o refuse_v the_o comprehension_n because_o they_o can_v not_o have_v it_o without_o a_o general_a toleration_n see_v how_o you_o fly_v upon_o i_o with_o all_o fury_n and_o say_v p._n 62_o 63_o 64._o this_o have_v no_o bound_n and_o it_o grieve_v i_o to_o read_v it_o o_o posterity_n how_o will_v you_o know_v what_o to_o believe_v you_o shall_v not_o by_o question_n have_v vent_v such_o a_o falsehood_n and_o yet_o notwithstanding_o all_o this_o vehemence_n in_o the_o next_o page_n you_o seem_v yourself_o to_o intimate_v in_o my_o weak_a opinion_n ground_n sufficient_a for_o the_o rumour_n and_o suspicion_n and_o consequent_o the_o question_n but_o i_o be_o not_o obstinate_a in_o my_o own_o defence_n leave_v my_o question_n and_o your_o censure_n upon_o it_o with_o your_o discourse_n and_o concession_n about_o it_o to_o the_o mercy_n of_o the_o reader_n who_o will_v judge_v betwixt_o we_o whether_o we_o will_v or_o not_o however_o thanks_o be_v to_o god_n though_o by_o your_o charge_v i_o to_o have_v write_v thing_n that_o i_o have_v not_o write_v contrary_a to_o plain_a truth_n and_o justice_n you_o have_v give_v i_o far_o great_a provocation_n yet_o i_o say_v thanks_o be_v to_o god_n you_o have_v not_o tempt_v i_o to_o turn_v your_o own_o word_n upon_o you_o and_o to_o say_v to_o you_o as_o you_o do_v to_o i_o repent_v of_o such_o calumny_n and_o study_v not_o to_o aggravate_v your_o fault_n by_o excuse_n we_o lament_v his_o want_n of_o common_a sense_n or_o modesty_n what_o deal_v be_v to_o be_v expect_v from_o such_o man_n with_o what_o forehead_n be_v this_o humility_n or_o ministerial_a fidelity_n to_o begin_v your_o book_n with_o so_o direct_a a_o untruth_n and_o to_o stand_v to_o it_o and_o repeat_v it_o so_o often_o in_o the_o face_n of_o the_o world_n lord_n what_o have_v i_o ever_o say_v or_o do_v in_o order_n to_o the_o silence_v of_o non_fw-fr conformist_n as_o you_o frequent_o seem_v to_o charge_v i_o yea_o what_o have_v i_o not_o do_v or_o say_v as_o i_o be_v able_a and_o have_v any_o opportunity_n that_o their_o mouth_n may_v be_v open_v the_o world_n know_v my_o several_a public_a endeavour_n to_o that_o purpose_n i_o do_v not_o say_v my_o silly_a argument_n as_o you_o meek_o call_v they_o but_o perhaps_o my_o mediation_n as_o some_o person_n will_v more_o ingenious_o acknowledge_v for_o the_o peaceable_a nonconformist_n from_o the_o king_n return_v to_o the_o day_n of_o the_o indulgence_n and_o since_o too_o have_v not_o be_v altogether_o ineffectual_a and_o perhaps_o consider_v all_o that_o have_v be_v too_o much_o and_o my_o superior_n have_v be_v very_o candid_a if_o they_o have_v not_o think_v it_o troublesome_a i_o must_v take_v the_o boldness_n to_o add_v that_o be_v i_o conscious_a to_o myself_o that_o any_o thing_n i_o ever_o say_v or_o do_v have_v be_v so_o great_a a_o remora_n in_o the_o way_n of_o accommodation_n betwixt_o nonconformity_n and_o the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o the_o boisterous_a reason_n and_o desire_n of_o some_o man_n i_o fear_v i_o shall_v carry_v it_o with_o sorrow_n to_o my_o grave_n if_o i_o err_v in_o this_o censure_n i_o beg_v the_o pardon_n both_o of_o god_n and_o they_o chap._n iu._n it_o be_v not_o fair_a to_o charge_v consequence_n for_o doctrine_n much_o less_o to_o say_v the_o consequence_n be_v assert_v let_v the_o answerer_n be_v judge_n mr._n baxter_n be_v not_o abuse_v i_o observe_v that_o you_o charge_v i_o untrue_o with_o dissuade_v you_o to_o desert_n your_o office_n and_o have_v cause_n to_o fear_v you_o will_v make_v excuse_n yourself_o although_o you_o will_v not_o allow_v it_o in_o other_o and_o i_o can_v but_o expect_v you_o will_v say_v thus_o or_o to_o this_o effect_n that_o though_o i_o do_v not_o assert_v in_o plain_a term_n or_o in_o word_n thaâ—_n will_v admit_v or_o bear_v that_o sense_n yet_o the_o consequence_n of_o my_o discourse_n be_v to_o take_v you_o off_o from_o preach_v while_o i_o will_v dissuade_v you_o from_o gathering-churche_n for_o i_o find_v after_o i_o have_v read_v long_o in_o your_o book_n and_o even_o towards_o the_o latter_a end_n of_o it_o you_o have_v patience_n thus_o far_o to_o explain_v yourself_o because_o say_v you_o p._n 57_o i_o will_v prove_v your_o separation_n sinful_a i_o will_v therefore_o prove_v your_o preach_v sinful_a again_o p._n 59_o if_o god_n say_v preach_v and_o the_o law_n say_v preach_v not_o in_o temple_n we_o may_v conclude_v we_o must_v preach_v out_o of_o the_o temple_n and_o because_o i_o speak_v against_o erect_v separate_v congregation_n to_o yourselves_o you_o say_v p._n 70._o i_o mean_v it_o be_v sin_n in_o you_o to_o exercise_v your_o ministry_n i._n e._n you_o mean_v this_o be_v the_o consequence_n of_o what_o i_o say_v against_o your_o separation_n for_o can_v we_o preach_v as_o you_o add_v without_o auditor_n and_o can_v these_o auditor_n be_v no_o congregation_n thus_o you_o do_v pardon_v i_o if_o i_o think_v not_o very_o accurat_o mend_v the_o matter_n nor_o very_o intelligible_o explain_v your_o meaning_n but_o i_o remember_v you_o tell_v i_o p_o 33._o the_o presbyterian_o do_v not_o love_v confusion_n and_o also_o p._n 4._o that_o you_o be_v no_o presbyterian_a but_o my_o brother_n i_o must_v needs_o mind_v you_o that_o whether_o this_o consequence_n be_v strong_a or_o not_o i_o be_o sure_a the_o excuse_n be_v weak_a and_o unwarrantable_a by_o the_o law_n of_o all_o sober_a disputation_n 1._o for_o admit_v the_o consequence_n to_o be_v fair_a and_o just_a your_o deal_n with_o i_o be_v neither_o when_o you_o charge_v i_o with_o a_o assertion_n which_o only_o follow_v or_o may_v be_v draw_v from_o my_o proposition_n it_o be_v not_o allowable_a to_o say_v the_o consequent_a of_o my_o opinion_n be_v my_o opinion_n and_o that_o i_o hold_v it_o much_o
of_o christ_n as_o receive_v by_o this_o church_n be_v according_a to_o god_n commandment_n and_o that_o you_o will_v give_v your_o faithful_a diligence_n always_o so_o to_o minister_v they_o as_o this_o church_n have_v receive_v they_o and_o last_o that_o with_o all_o diligence_n you_o will_v teach_v your_o people_n to_o observe_v the_o same_o again_o the_o bishop_n demand_v will_v yoll_n reverent_o obey_v your_o ordinary_n and_o other_o chief_a minister_n unto_o who_o be_v commit_v the_o charge_n and_o government_n over_o you_o follow_v with_o a_o glad_a mind_n and_o will_v their_o godly_a admonition_n and_o submit_v yourselves_o to_o their_o godly_a judgement_n what_o do_v you_o answer_n to_o this_o i_o will_v do_v so_o the_o lord_n be_v my_o helper_n wherein_o you_o both_o acknowledge_v the_o government_n of_o the_o church_n over_o you_o and_o promise_v obedience_n thereunto_o and_o it_o be_v no_o pleasure_n to_o i_o to_o observe_v that_o one_o that_o i_o dare_v not_o suspect_v not_o to_o be_v thus_o ordain_v shall_v notwithstanding_o these_o sacred_a obligation_n seem_v even_o to_o print_v to_o glory_n that_o he_o never_o take_v the_o oath_n of_o canonical_a obedience_n which_o be_v to_o obey_v his_o ordinary_a in_o all_o honest_a and_o lawful_a thing_n thus_o for_o the_o minister_n and_o for_o the_o people_n be_v they_o not_o general_o baptise_a by_o the_o minister_n and_o according_a to_o the_o order_n and_o in_o the_o public_a place_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n have_v they_o not_o since_o give_v their_o consent_n as_o member_n by_o their_o public_a attendance_n upon_o the_o worship_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n have_v they_o not_o general_o own_v for_o a_o considerable_a time_n together_o some_o many_o year_n that_o relation_n to_o their_o particular_a church_n and_o pastor_n be_v all_o this_o nothing_o to_o signify_v their_o union_n with_o our_o church_n and_o obligation_n to_o her_o government_n be_v it_o nothing_o in_o our_o author_n judgement_n i_o can_v believe_v it_o i_o be_o sure_a it_o be_v something_a in_o mr._n baxters_n opinion_n as_o i_o shall_v show_v anon_o but_o wherein_o be_v we_o oblige_v to_o obey_v our_o governor_n as_o we_o be_v member_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n the_o measure_n of_o this_o obedience_n be_v the_o law_n and_o canon_n and_o the_o rubric_n in_o the_o liturgy_n and_o the_o main_a scope_n and_o intention_n of_o all_o these_o be_v to_o direct_v you_o how_o you_o be_v to_o worship_n god_n in_o our_o parochial_a assembly_n as_o also_o to_o demean_v yourselves_o in_o all_o due_a reverence_n to_o your_o superior_n and_o brotherly_a love_n and_o fellowship_n together_o as_o member_n of_o the_o same_o body_n the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o to_o dissolve_v or_o renounce_v this_o our_o communion_n with_o our_o brethren_n as_o well_o as_o with_o governor_n in_o those_o assembly_n and_o in_o that_o worship_n be_v so_o far_o to_o renounce_v that_o communion_n which_o we_o owe_v and_o be_v due_a from_o we_o all_o to_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o be_v that_o thing_n which_o be_v deserve_o brand_v with_o the_o black_a name_n of_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n which_o be_v the_o other_o branch_n of_o that_o schism_n before_o mention_v especial_o if_o the_o derider_n proceed_v to_o the_o erect_v of_o anti_n church_n as_o mr._n baxter_n proper_o call_v they_o for_o our_o several_a parochial_a assembly_n be_v part_n and_o member_n of_o the_o great_a body_n of_o our_o church_n into_o which_o the_o church_n be_v divide_v for_o our_o convenient_a worship_v of_o god_n as_o you_o hear_v in_o the_o definition_n wherein_o all_o individual_a person_n be_v bind_v to_o attend_v upon_o god_n worship_n according_a to_o the_o foresay_a rule_n quatenus_fw-la member_n of_o this_o church_n of_o england_n but_o i_o shall_v have_v a_o occasion_n to_o speak_v large_o of_o schism_n from_o particular_a congregation_n in_o another_o place_n and_o at_o present_a will_v fain_o hope_v that_o some_o thing_n have_v be_v say_v to_o show_v what_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v this_o be_v the_o sum._n schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v a_o sinful_a divide_v from_o she_o in_o her_o governor_n member_n worship_n or_o assembly_n which_o and_o much_o more_o be_v do_v by_o those_o that_o despise_v her_o government_n renounce_v her_o worship_n and_o communion_n with_o her_o momber_n in_o the_o public_a place_n of_o it_o and_o erect_v new_a congregation_n for_o a_o new_a manner_n of_o worship_n and_o discipline_n under_o other_o governor_n in_o opposition_n thereunto_o according_a to_o the_o laudable_a practice_n now_o on_o foot_n by_o this_o time_n i_o hope_v my_o answerer_n see_v after_o his_o long_a and_o range_v scrutiny_n for_o the_o discovery_n of_o this_o schism_n and_o all_o in_o vain_a how_o pertinent_o he_o demand_v p._n 38._o be_v every_o difference_n in_o thing_n unnecessary_a from_o the_o major_a part_n a_o schism_n from_o they_o again_o p._n 39_o it_o be_v our_o disobedience_n to_o the_o church_n that_o be_v our_o schism_n this_o he_o say_v and_o then_o quick_o wipe_v it_o off_o with_o his_o own_o pleasant_a answer_n but_o fidelity_n to_o our_o king_n command_v the_o disow_n of_o usurper_n but_o i_o may_v spoil_v his_o mirth_n shall_v i_o examine_v his_o meaning_n again_o p._n 40._o he_o cry_v out_o whoever_o take_v any_o act_n of_o disobedience_n in_o a_o circumstance_n to_o be_v a_o schism_n but_o in_o earnest_n have_v not_o these_o little_a frisk_n and_o extravagancy_n be_v happy_o prevent_v have_v he_o heed_v i_o at_o first_o be_v a_o sinful_a divide_v from_o the_o church_n in_o her_o government_n and_o worship_n and_o set_v up_o church_n in_o opposition_n to_o she_o in_o both_o be_v this_o no_o more_o than_o a_o difference_n in_o thing_n unnecessary_a from_o the_o major_a part_n or_o than_o a_o bare_a act_n of_o disobedience_n in_o a_o circumstance_n i_o know_v you_o will_v not_o say_v it_o and_o it_o be_v vain_a to_o say_v that_o you_o intend_v no_o more_o i_o write_v against_o those_o that_o do_v what_o have_v he_o more_o to_o answer_v why_o the_o schism_n i_o mention_v p._n 39_o be_v not_o such_o as_o martin_n and_o gildas_n make_v what_o then_o if_o it_o be_v worse_o it_o be_v not_o such_o you_o shall_v rather_o have_v compare_v your_o brethren_n in_o this_o new_a work_n to_o the_o other_o martin_n call_v mar-prelate_n but_o this_o martin_n you_o say_v renounce_v communion_n with_o the_o bishop_n and_o their_o synod_n all_o his_o life_n who_o have_v prosecute_v the_o prissillianist_n with_o the_o secular_a sword_n and_o gildas_n pronounce_v he_o no_o excellent_a christian_n that_o call_v the_o british_a clergy_n in_o his_o time_n priest_n or_o minister_n and_o not_o traitor_n as_o he_o do_v himself_o yet_o neither_o of_o these_o holy_a man_n be_v call_v separatist_n or_o schismatic_n what_o follow_v may_v they_o not_o be_v schismatickâ—_n though_o they_o be_v not_o call_v so_o you_o will_v find_v some_o advantage_n by_o the_o argument_n for_o i_o have_v not_o call_v you_o so_o yet_o perhaps_o gildas_n may_v be_v bold_a with_o his_o brethren_n and_o call_v they_o traitor_n but_o if_o unjust_o it_o be_v ill_o do_v though_o no_o schism_n if_o just_o there_o may_v be_v proditores_fw-la find_v of_o your_o acquaintance_n too_o i_o make_v no_o doubt_n though_o if_o you_o do_v not_o urge_v i_o much_o i_o shall_v not_o call_v they_o so_o you_o do_v not_o think_v that_o time_n be_v return_v upon_o we_o and_o that_o he_o have_v not_o the_o character_n of_o a_o excellent_a christian_a that_o have_v not_o the_o gift_n of_o call_v the_o priest_n traitor_n so_o much_o for_o gildas_n but_o for_o his_o companion_n martin_n i_o may_v have_v give_v he_o courser_n entertainment_n have_v it_o not_o be_v for_o the_o kindness_n of_o another_o gildas_n that_o not_o long_o since_o speak_v more_o in_o his_o favour_n than_o you_o do_v now_o his_o word_n on_o his_o behalf_n be_v these_o i_o have_v tell_v you_o in_o the_o story_n of_o martin_n how_o he_o separate_v from_o the_o synod_n of_o those_o individual_a 76._o baxter_n defence_n p._n 76._o bishop_n and_o from_o their_o local_a communion_n without_o separation_n from_o the_o office_n the_o church_n or_o any_o other_o bishop_n and_o then_o for_o aught_o i_o know_v martin_n may_v be_v a_o good_a honest_a fellow_n do_v you_o all_o the_o rest_n that_o he_o do_v and_o by_o my_o consent_n you_o shall_v be_v excuse_v from_o sit_v in_o synod_n for_o martin_n it_o seem_v deny_v not_o communion_n with_o the_o church_n much_o less_o set_v up_o a_o altar_n and_o church_n of_o his_o own_o in_o opposition_n to_o they_o if_o he_o have_v do_v so_o i_o will_v have_v say_v he_o have_v be_v a_o rank_a schismatic_a though_o i_o spare_v you_o it_o be_v confess_v that_o the_o
presbyterian_o do_v general_o agree_v that_o the_o disciplinary_a part_n or_o form_n of_o government_n 173._o vid._n cawdry_n independ_v schism_n page_n 172_o 173._o be_v not_o essential_a to_o a_o national_a church_n yet_o they_o affirm_v that_o the_o verity_n of_o a_o natioanal_a church_n consist_v in_o its_o agreement_n in_o the_o same_o doctrine_n and_o worship_n and_o consequent_o though_o difference_n in_o doctrine_n be_v not_o yet_o a_o breach_n of_o its_o unity_n and_o make_v division_n in_o a_o point_n of_o worship_n be_v a_o plain_a schism_n from_o a_o national_a church_n according_a to_o the_o principle_n of_o the_o presbyterian_o mr._n cawdrey_n speak_v not_o his_o own_o peculiar_a opinion_n when_o he_o say_v p._n 178._o i_o believe_v those_o man_n that_o raise_v difference_n in_o a_o reform_a church_n he_o mean_v this_o national_a church_n and_o persist_v in_o keep_v open_a those_o division_n separate_v also_o into_o other_o new_a church_n do_v as_o well_o deserve_v the_o name_n of_o schismatic_n as_o those_o that_o make_v difference_n in_o one_o particular_a church_n upon_o the_o whole_a then_o you_o perceive_v how_o apt_o you_o ask_v p._n 42._o whether_o a_o minister_n may_v not_o remove_v from_o one_o parish_n to_o another_o or_o any_o man_n remove_v his_o dwell_n into_o another_o parish_n etc._n etc._n and_o be_v no_o schismatic_a a_o old_a objection_n of_o dr._n owen_n and_o answer_v by_o mr._n cawdrey_n that_o they_o remove_v to_o church_n of_o the_o same_o constitution_n a_o thing_n never_o question_v but_o always_o allow_v both_o by_o the_o union_n and_o custom_n of_o this_o national_a church_n again_o and_o alike_o pertinent_o you_o ask_v whether_o a_o separation_n of_o one_o parish_n from_o another_o be_v schism_n or_o whether_o i_o mean_v by_o it_o a_o local_a separation_n only_o as_o you_o grave_o inquire_v p._n 33._o or_o whether_o little_a difference_n in_o the_o mode_n of_o worship_n particular_o in_o the_o manner_n of_o the_o minister_n prayer_n and_o he_o shall_v have_v add_v in_o divide_v his_o text_n be_v schism_n but_o he_o prevent_v my_o answer_n by_o deny_v these_o himself_o those_o that_o differ_v thus_o he_o say_v and_o thereby_o doubtless_o very_o wise_o and_o to_o general_a satisfaction_n determine_v these_o say_v he_o p._n 34._o be_v not_o separate_v church_n any_o otherwise_o than_o local_a and_o in_o such_o modal_a difference_n thus_o what_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o what_o schism_n from_o it_o be_v but_o at_o the_o begin_n of_o the_o discourse_n it_o be_v hint_v that_o if_o we_o will_v consider_v the_o church_n of_o england_n not_o organice_n but_o entitative_a as_o some_o speak_v that_o be_v as_o it_o be_v a_o part_n or_o member_n of_o the_o universal_a visible_a church_n even_o in_o this_o consideration_n of_o it_o separation_n and_o the_o present_a practice_n of_o gather_v church_n be_v a_o schism_n in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n if_o not_o so_o from_o it_o and_o by_o those_o intestine_a rupture_n and_o rent_n it_o be_v cause_v in_o the_o midst_n of_o she_o give_v she_o too_o much_o cause_n to_o complain_v o_o my_o bowel_n my_o bowel_n while_o it_o tear_n in_o piece_n her_o old_a and_o state_v congregation_n trample_v upon_o her_o liturgy_n defy_v her_o worship_n renounce_v her_o pastor_n throw_v down_o all_o her_o ancient_a landmark_n and_o laudable_a bound_n of_o her_o particular_a church_n and_o endeavour_v every_o where_o to_o erect_v new_a altar_n and_o separate_a church_n that_o be_v never_o before_o hear_v of_o in_o the_o christian_a world_n but_o among_o wild_a and_o desperate_a and_o schismatical_a sectary_n but_o this_o will_v meet_v we_o in_o the_o next_o chapter_n when_o we_o speak_v of_o schism_n from_o particular_a congregation_n chap._n ix_o gather_v church_n a_o schism_n from_o particular_a parochial_a church_n the_o general_a nature_n of_o schism_n the_o present_a practice_n of_o gather_v church_n be_v not_o only_o a_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n but_o a_o schism_n also_o from_o our_o particular_a parochial_a congregation_n this_o come_v now_o to_o be_v evince_v and_o i_o shall_v take_v my_o advantage_n for_o the_o do_v of_o it_o from_o a_o observation_n of_o mr._n cawdrey_n against_o dr._n owen_n and_o the_o 177._o independ_v great_a schis_n p._n 177._o independent_o there_o be_v say_v he_o and_o be_v another_o church-state_n in_o england_n in_o our_o particular_a church_n from_o these_o also_o they_o have_v most_o of_o they_o as_o once_o of_o they_o or_o they_o have_v be_v once_o of_o they_o palpable_o separate_v i_o be_o now_o to_o charge_v the_o present_a practice_n of_o our_o new_a church_n gatherer_n and_o their_o neâ—_n church_n with_o the_o like_a schism_n from_o particular_a parochial_a church_n whereof_o they_o be_v or_o late_o be_v member_n and_o aught_o so_o to_o have_v continue_v to_o cut_v our_o work_n as_o short_a as_o may_v be_v i_o shall_v confine_v my_o strength_n within_o one_o argument_n which_o i_o conceive_v the_o clear_a and_o most_o likely_a to_o put_v a_o end_n to_o the_o matter_n in_o debate_n and_o it_o be_v take_v from_o the_o nature_n and_o definition_n of_o schism_n wherein_o we_o shall_v show_v what_o we_o be_v to_o understand_v by_o schism_n and_o how_o the_o present_a gather_v of_o church_n out_o of_o our_o church_n agree_v with_o it_o not_o doubt_v but_o then_o the_o conclusion_n will_v find_v its_o own_o way_n well_o enough_o what_o be_v schism_n then_o i_o shall_v give_v you_o the_o easy_a and_o the_o least_o controvert_v definition_n of_o it_o and_o such_o as_o be_v never_o except_v against_o by_o any_o presbyterian_a that_o i_o ever_o hear_v of_o it_o be_v this_o schism_n be_v a_o causeless_a or_o as_o other_o a_o voluntary_a unwarrantable_a separation_n from_o a_o true_a church_n here_o be_v two_o part_n to_o be_v consider_v in_o the_o general_a separation_n from_o a_o true_a church_n and_o the_o formal_a special_a and_o distinguish_a part_n of_o it_o couch_v in_o the_o word_n causeless_a or_o unwarrantable_a and_o voluntary_a 1._o schism_n be_v a_o separation_n from_o a_o true_a church_n it_o be_v so_o in_o the_o proper_a and_o peculiar_a notation_n of_o it_o the_o word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d schism_n schis_fw-la cameron_n cap._n de_fw-fr schis_fw-la be_v a_o stranger_n to_o profane_a author_n and_o the_o old_a testament_n and_o be_v only_o to_o be_v find_v in_o the_o new_a testament_n so_o that_o it_o only_o intend_v something_o about_o the_o christian_a church_n and_o what_o that_o be_v must_v be_v understand_v by_o the_o new_a testament_n and_o ecclesiastical_a writer_n who_o have_v take_v it_o thence_o it_o be_v common_o affirm_v that_o in_o the_o scripture-use_a of_o it_o it_o sometime_o signify_v division_n among_o christian_n in_o opinion_n only_o but_o i_o have_v observe_v that_o usual_o those_o opinion_n be_v such_o as_o have_v a_o tendency_n to_o division_n in_o practice_n as_o i_o be_o of_o paul_n etc._n etc._n but_o it_o be_v general_o acknowledge_v that_o difference_n in_o practice_n especial_o touch_v divine_a worship_n whether_o from_o the_o signification_n of_o the_o word_n which_o be_v proper_o a_o rent_n or_o division_n or_o whether_o from_o the_o more_o frequent_a use_n of_o it_o that_o way_n in_o scripture_n or_o for_o some_o other_o reason_n i_o say_v difference_n in_o practice_n about_o divine_a worship_n have_v long_o since_o obtain_v and_o appropriate_v to_o itself_o the_o name_n of_o schism_n sometime_o such_o division_n in_o the_o church_n when_o there_o have_v be_v no_o actual_a separation_n from_o the_o church_n be_v conceive_v to_o be_v call_v schism_n in_o scripture_n 10._o 1_o cor._n 1._o 10._o and_o this_o notion_n exclusive_a of_o all_o other_o kind_n of_o schism_n in_o scripture_n dr._n owen_n espouse_v contrary_a both_o to_o scripture_n reason_n and_o the_o general_a apprehension_n of_o the_o ancient_n and_o modern_a divine_n as_o mr._n cawdrey_n have_v sufficient_o argue_v separation_n from_o a_o church_n be_v a_o more_o obvious_a division_n and_o consequent_o a_o more_o notorious_a kind_n of_o schism_n and_o it_o seem_v more_o reasonable_a to_o argue_v if_o the_o holy_a ghost_n call_v the_o first_o bud_n and_o beginning_n of_o separation_n by_o the_o name_n of_o schism_n it_o be_v to_o deter_v the_o divider_n from_o the_o sin_n in_o its_o ripeness_n and_o accuse_v fruit_n which_o more_o heinous_o merit_v that_o black_a title_n as_o our_o saviour_n call_v lust_n adultery_n schisma_fw-la separate_v ab_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la schism_n separate_v from_o the_o church_n say_v st._n hierom._n to_o proceed_v this_o separation_n from_o the_o church_n as_o a_o learned_a presbyterian_a assert_v be_v from_o the_o church_n as_o catholic_n which_o he_o call_v donatism_n or_o from_o a_o particular_a church_n and_o that_o faith_n he_o be_v proper_o seperatism_n last_o this_o schismatical_a separation_n be_v negative_a or_o positive_a the_o former_a
with_o we_o in_o our_o public_a assembly_n and_o gather_v new_a church_n for_o themselves_o out_o of_o they_o this_o they_o do_v though_o you_o know_v we_o general_o have_v not_o give_v they_o cause_n to_o do_v it_o and_o they_o do_v it_o rash_o and_o total_o and_o all_o your_o little_a device_n will_v never_o alter_v the_o nature_n of_o thing_n or_o excuse_v it_o from_o gross_a schism_n in_o the_o judgement_n of_o all_o that_o be_v not_o separatist_n and_o speak_v their_o mind_n before_o the_o present_a temptation_n dazzle_v man_n eye_n it_o be_v in_o vain_a to_o fly_v to_o your_o common_a refuge_n the_o strength_n of_o this_o argument_n will_v not_o suffer_v you_o to_o be_v quiet_a in_o it_o who_o ever_o before_o you_o make_v this_o a_o warrantable_a ground_n of_o separation_n that_o they_o may_v serve_v god_n better_o if_o find_v positive_a fault_n in_o our_o worship_n will_v not_o excuse_v they_o heretofore_o much_o less_o will_v negative_a one_o excuse_v you_o from_o separation_n but_o they_o think_v those_o be_v fault_n and_o just_a cause_n of_o separation_n which_o be_v not_o true_a and_o they_o be_v mistake_v but_o yet_o they_o have_v more_o to_o say_v for_o themselves_o it_o seem_v than_o you_o have_v who_o do_v the_o same_o thing_n without_o allege_v so_o much_o ground_n and_o think_v to_o be_v whole_o free_a from_o the_o same_o charge_n sir_n schism_n consist_v in_o practice_n and_o whatever_o you_o think_v on_o it_o or_o however_o you_o will_v palliate_v the_o matter_n where_o that_o practice_n that_o true_o answer_v the_o definition_n of_o schism_n be_v find_v it_o will_v be_v schism_n do_v what_o you_o can_v be_v there_o any_o institution_n of_o christ_n that_o they_o must_v gather_v church_n out_o of_o true_a church_n to_o make_v a_o pure_a church_n ans_fw-fr mr._n cawdrey_n indep_n p._n 198._o but_o i_o prevent_v my_o design_n shism_n we_o have_v show_v be_v a_o causeless_a unwarrantable_a separation_n and_o it_o be_v true_a and_o so_o my_o answerer_n may_v have_v understand_v i_o and_o his_o brethren_n in_o my_o last_o i_o speak_v in_o the_o language_n of_o the_o presbyterian_o and_o a_o little_a candour_n will_v have_v suppose_v that_o both_o i_o and_o they_o intend_v by_o gather_v church_n out_o of_o church_n such_o as_o be_v causeless_a unwarrantable_a and_o unnecessary_a for_o that_o they_o be_v still_o ready_a if_o need_v require_v to_o prove_v the_o independent_a separation_n such_o as_o i_o shall_v be_v anon_o to_o do_v you_o it_o be_v therefore_o some_o trouble_n to_o i_o to_o hear_v you_o ask_v as_o if_o something_o of_o argument_n be_v lodge_v in_o it_o whether_o a_o person_n removal_n from_o one_o parish_n to_o another_o to_o inhabit_v there_o be_v schism_n p._n 48._o and_o yet_o i_o conceive_v you_o have_v it_o more_o than_o twice_o over_o in_o your_o book_n you_o ask_v again_o must_v no_o church_n be_v gather_v out_o of_o rome_n i_o fear_v not_o many_o for_o you_o but_o for_o a_o full_a and_o plain_a answer_n to_o this_o i_o remit_v you_o to_o mr._n baxters_n cure_n of_o church_n division_n p._n 81_o 82_o 83._o which_o if_o it_o seem_v not_o plain_a and_o full_a to_o you_o it_o be_v because_o you_o understand_v not_o christian_a sense_n and_o reason_n again_o p._n 44._o do_v not_o the_o parliament_n take_v a_o church_n out_o of_o a_o church_n when_o they_o separate_v covent-garden_n from_o martin_n parish_n doubtless_o it_o be_v either_o with_o cause_n or_o not_o it_o be_v warrantable_a or_o not_o it_o be_v necessary_a or_o not_o but_o the_o jest_n be_v spoil_v if_o it_o be_v a_o church_n of_o the_o same_o constitution_n with_o consent_n of_o the_o person_n concern_v &_o by_o lawful_a authority_n have_v you_o no_o place_n to_o argue_v schismatical_a but_o coventgarden_n i_o will_v advise_v you_o as_o a_o friend_n to_o take_v a_o little_a more_o heed_n what_o you_o say_v about_o that_o place_n for_o fear_v of_o one_o of_o those_o schismatic_n which_o in_o other_o place_n you_o honour_n as_o usurper_n concern_v in_o your_o next_o section_n but_o behold_v the_o man_n at_o arm_n full_o accoutre_v without_o all_o fear_n but_o a_o great_a deal_n of_o wit_n and_o courage_n make_v a_o challenge_n to_o the_o faction_n disputer_n as_o his_o catholic_n language_n be_v and_o it_o be_v this_o as_o you_o may_v read_v it_o under_o his_o own_o hand_n obj._n i_o undertake_v say_v he_o to_o prove_v that_o dr._n manton_n dr._n seaman_n etc._n etc._n with_o the_o people_n subject_n to_o they_o as_o pastor_n be_v true_a church_n prove_v you_o if_o you_o can_v that_o on_o aug._n 24_o 62._o they_o be_v degrade_v and_o these_o church_n be_v dissolve_v in_o any_o reason_n which_o any_o church_n for_o 600._o year_n after_o christ_n will_v if_o not_o you_o seem_v yourself_o to_o accuse_v their_o successor_n of_o schism_n for_o draw_v part_n of_o the_o people_n from_o they_o mere_o by_o the_o advantage_n of_o have_v the_o temple_n and_o tithe_n and_o so_o gather_v church_n out_o of_o true_a church_n ans_fw-fr a_o marvellous_a undertaker_n he_o will_v undertake_v to_o prove_v one_o proposition_n and_o let_v the_o rest_n shift_n for_o themselves_o dr._n manton_n and_o dr._n seaman_n and_o their_o people_n be_v true_a church_n and_o this_o he_o will_v prove_v but_o what_o if_o a_o man_n shall_v venture_v to_o disappoint_v he_o and_o not_o deny_v it_o again_o prove_v if_o you_o can_v that_o these_o pastor_n be_v degrade_v and_o these_o church_n dissolve_v aug._n 24._o 62._o but_o what_o if_o a_o man_n have_v a_o mind_n to_o be_v friend_n with_o he_o here_o too_o and_o shall_v grant_v that_o those_o minister_n be_v not_o degrade_v then_o but_o only_o eject_v and_o inhibit_v the_o exercise_n of_o their_o ministry_n within_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o that_o those_o church_n be_v not_o dissolve_v by_o have_v new_a pastor_n no_o more_o than_o the_o kingdom_n when_o the_o king_n die_v and_o yet_o certain_o the_o king_n and_o people_n be_v as_o much_o the_o constitutive_a part_n of_o a_o kingdom_n as_o pastor_n and_o people_n of_o a_o church_n who_o will_v say_v that_o consider_v what_o he_o say_v that_o a_o particular_a church_n be_v dissolve_v by_o the_o death_n or_o removal_n of_o the_o pastor_n the_o river_n be_v the_o same_o though_o the_o land_n on_o each_o side_n change_v their_o proprietor_n but_o what_o then_o suppose_v all_o this_o be_v quiet_o grant_v he_o what_o then_o then_o those_o that_o succeed_v they_o be_v schismatic_n or_o you_o seem_v to_o accuse_v they_o of_o schism_n how_o so_o for_o draw_v away_o part_n of_o the_o people_n from_o they_o whither_o to_o another_o manner_n of_o worship_n which_o the_o law_n require_v and_o which_o the_o eject_v refuse_v but_o how_o do_v they_o draw_v the_o people_n by_o do_v their_o duty_n in_o the_o temple_n as_o by_o good_a authority_n institute_v and_o induct_v thereunto_o institute_v as_o pastor_n to_o have_v the_o cure_n of_o soul_n and_o induct_v into_o the_o temple_n and_o tithe_n but_o last_o why_o do_v you_o say_v they_o draw_v a_o part_n of_o the_o people_n only_o and_o not_o the_o whole_a ought_v not_o the_o whole_a worship_n god_n undivided_a and_o with_o one_o accord_n in_o the_o temple_n or_o must_v the_o place_n be_v remove_v with_o the_o pastor_n i_o choir_n not_o who_o make_v the_o difference_n but_o i_o know_v who_o make_v the_o division_n let_v they_o answer_v it_o how_o they_o can_v to_o god_n and_o the_o king_n the_o church_n and_o their_o successor_n those_o pastor_n be_v eject_v out_o of_o the_o temple_n by_o lawful_a authority_n the_o people_n be_v bind_v to_o worship_n god_n in_o the_o temple_n as_o they_o have_v opportunity_n and_o no_o where_o else_o in_o opposition_n to_o the_o public_a worship_n the_o consequence_n here_o i_o think_v may_v vie_v with_o you_o above_o therefore_o these_o pastor_n have_v no_o opportunity_n to_o exercise_v their_o pastoral_n office_n to_o those_o people_n and_o where_o there_o be_v no_o opportunity_n there_o be_v no_o duty_n in_o mr._n baxters_n divinity_n second_o admon_n to_o bagsh_n 96._o but_o you_o say_v you_o must_v preach_v the_o reverend_a dr._n gouge_n say_v no._n the_o inhibition_n of_o idolator_n and_o infidel_n make_v simple_o against_o preach_v of_o the_o gospel_n because_o they_o 570._o whole_a armour_n of_o god_n 570._o will_v have_v it_o utter_o suppress_v in_o this_o case_n he_o say_v no_o sufficient_a inhibition_n to_o bind_v the_o conscience_n it_o be_v direct_o and_o apparent_o contrary_a to_o god_n word_n but_o when_o christian_a magistrate_n inhibit_v minister_n to_o preach_v it_o be_v because_o they_o think_v they_o unfit_a and_o unmeet_a either_o for_o some_o notorious_a crime_n or_o for_o some_o erroneous_a opinion_n to_o exercise_v their_o ministerial_a function_n in_o these_o case_n such_o as_o be_v so_o inhibit_v
so_o far_o forth_o as_o they_o be_v inhibit_v ought_v not_o to_o preach_v neither_o be_v particular_a and_o private_a man_n much_o less_o the_o party_n inhibit_v to_o judge_n of_o the_o cause_n of_o the_o inhibition_n whether_o it_o be_v just_a or_o unjust_a but_o as_o they_o who_o be_v appoint_v by_o the_o present_a government_n to_o ordain_v minister_n be_v to_o judge_n of_o their_o fitness_n thereunto_o so_o likewise_o of_o their_o unfitness_n i_o have_v think_v hitherto_o that_o distinction_n of_o the_o office_n and_o of_o the_o exercise_n of_o that_o office_n have_v go_v uncontrole_v among_o presbyterian_o and_o that_o though_o the_o minister_n of_o christ_n depend_v not_o even_o upon_o the_o christian_a magistrate_n for_o their_o office_n and_o he_o can_v degrade_v they_o yet_o quoad_fw-la exercitium_fw-la as_o to_o the_o exercise_n of_o it_o within_o his_o dominion_n they_o do_v and_o that_o he_o have_v power_n to_o silence_n such_o as_o he_o judge_v unmeet_a to_o preach_v mr._n baxter_n do_v much_o encourage_v i_o to_o persist_v in_o the_o same_o opinion_n more_o than_o once_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o king_n and_o lawful_a 117_o second_o admon_n to_o bag._n 117_o magistrate_n say_v mr._n baxter_n be_v more_o about_o the_o circumstantial_o of_o worship_n as_o whether_o abiathar_n shall_v be_v high_a priest_n etc._n etc._n then_o the_o false_a teacher_n be_v about_o that_o doctrine_n he_o more_o than_o intimate_v that_o the_o magistrate_n power_n extend_v to_o the_o appoint_v who_o shall_v be_v high_a priest_n and_o who_o doubt_n but_o that_o he_o have_v equal_a power_n to_o appoint_v who_o shall_v be_v pastor_n of_o covent-garden_n again_o hear_v mr._n baxter_n what_o he_o say_v more_o large_o upon_o the_o point_n disput_fw-la 223._o doubtless_o the_o magistrate_n himself_o have_v so_o much_o authority_n in_o ecclesiastical_a affair_n that_o if_o he_o command_v a_o qualify_a person_n to_o preach_v the_o gospel_n and_o command_v the_o people_n to_o receive_v he_o i_o see_v not_o how_o either_o of_o they_o can_v be_v allow_v to_o disobey_v he_o though_o yet_o the_o party_n ought_v to_o have_v recourse_n also_o to_o pastor_n for_o ordination_n and_o people_n for_o consent_v where_o it_o may_v be_v do_v and_o grotius_n commend_v the_o say_n of_o musculus_fw-la that_o he_o will_v have_v no_o minister_n question_v his_o call_n that_o be_v qualify_v have_v the_o christian_a magistrate_n commission_n and_o though_o this_o assertion_n need_v some_o limitation_n yet_o it_o be_v apparent_a that_o the_o magistrate_n power_n be_v great_a about_o the_o office_n of_o the_o church_n for_o solomon_n put_v out_o abiathar_n from_o the_o priesthood_n and_o put_v zadock_n in_o his_o place_n 1_o king_n 2._o 27_o 35._o david_n and_o the_o captain_n of_o the_o host_n separate_v to_o god_n service_n those_o of_o the_o son_n of_o asaph_n and_o of_o heman_n and_o jeduther_n who_o shall_v prophesy_v with_o harp_n etc._n etc._n 1_o chron._n 16._o 4._o and_o so_o do_v solomon_n 2_o chron._n 8._o 14_o 15._o they_o be_v for_o the_o service_n of_o the_o house_n of_o god_n according_a to_o the_o king_n order_n 1_o chron._n 25._o 1_o 6._o and_o methinks_v those_o those_o man_n shall_v acknowledge_v this_o that_o be_v wont_a to_o style_v the_o king_n in_o all_o cause_n and_o over_o all_o person_n the_o supreme_a head_n and_o governor_n so_o far_o he._n and_o indeed_o i_o dare_v almost_o challenge_v this_o answerer_n or_o any_o man_n to_o prove_v that_o ever_o any_o learned_a protestant_n in_o this_o church_n whether_o episcopal_a or_o presbyterian_a do_v make_v it_o a_o question_n i_o mean_v before_o the_o king_n happy_a return_n whether_o solomon_n have_v not_o sufficient_a authority_n to_o put_v out_o abiathar_n from_o the_o priesthood_n and_o put_v zadock_n in_o his_o place_n or_o whether_o any_o may_v modest_o say_v such_o must_v preach_v and_o that_o those_o be_v schismatic_n and_o usurper_n that_o do_v exercise_v their_o office_n according_a to_o law_n in_o the_o place_n of_o such_o as_o be_v remove_v by_o the_o virtue_n of_o a_o act_n of_o parliament_n of_o unquestionable_a authority_n and_o we_o must_v preach_v though_o the_o law_n forbid_v we_o as_o for_o dr._n gunning_n dr._n wild_n preach_v fourteen_o or_o fifteen_o year_n ago_o which_o you_o so_o often_o hint_n at_o it_o be_v sufficient_o know_v it_o be_v in_o such_o a_o time_n when_o the_o case_n be_v far_o otherwise_o both_o with_o the_o church_n and_o state_n in_o many_o notorious_a circumstance_n both_o as_o to_o person_n law_n government_n and_o worship_n and_o they_o can_v easy_o answer_v their_o so_o do_v if_o it_o be_v not_o a_o matter_n too_o much_o below_o the_o eminency_n both_o of_o their_o person_n and_o place_n we_o must_v proceed_v chap._n xi_o provision_n for_o the_o proof_n of_o the_o assumption_n by_o four_o proposition_n that_o schism_n be_v a_o causeless_a separation_n from_o a_o true_a church_n and_o what_o separation_n from_o a_o true_a church_n be_v and_o when_o it_o be_v causeless_a have_v at_o large_a appear_v and_o there_o seem_v nothing_o leave_v to_o prevent_v or_o remove_v the_o charge_n of_o schism_n from_o the_o practice_n we_o oppose_v but_o to_o plead_v either_o that_o our_o church_n be_v no_o true_a church_n or_o that_o you_o be_v not_o of_o they_o and_o owe_v they_o no_o communion_n or_o that_o you_o do_v not_o separate_a from_o they_o or_o if_o you_o do_v you_o have_v cause_n sufficient_a and_o your_o separation_n be_v not_o rash_a or_o groundless_a that_o the_o contrary_a to_o all_o these_o be_v the_o very_a truth_n i_o be_o now_o to_o manifest_v the_o proposition_n according_o be_v these_o four_o pro._n 1._o that_o our_o parochial_a congregation_n be_v true_a church_n 2._o that_o the_o people_n of_o england_n be_v or_o aught_o to_o be_v member_n of_o our_o parochial_a congregation_n 3._o that_o the_o present_a practice_n of_o gather_v church_n out_o of_o they_o be_v separation_n 4._o that_o such_o separation_n be_v rash_a and_o without_o just_a ground_n and_o all_o these_o shall_v be_v prove_v not_o only_o from_o the_o nature_n of_o the_o thing_n and_o the_o judgement_n or_o other_o but_o from_o the_o public_a judgement_n of_o the_o former_a nonconformist_n and_o presbyterian_o and_o then_o i_o hope_v my_o bold_a undertake_n will_v be_v find_v excusable_a chap._n xii_o parochial_a congregation_n true_a church_n his_o exception_n especial_o about_o parish_n bound_n examine_v first_o i_o affirm_v that_o our_o parochial_a congregation_n be_v true_a church_n they_o have_v the_o matter_n of_o true_a church_n profess_v christian_n baptise_a they_o have_v the_o fâ—rm_n of_o true_a church_n be_v society_n of_o such_o as_o ames_n say_v in_o order_n to_o the_o worship_n of_o god_n and_o these_o fix_a and_o state_v and_o ordinary_o assemble_v actual_o together_o for_o that_o end_n according_a to_o our_o author_n they_o have_v general_o both_o the_o essential_a and_o constituent_a part_n of_o true_a church_n pastor_n to_o govern_v and_o people_n to_o be_v govern_v by_o they_o in_o order_n to_o god_n glory_n and_o their_o salvation_n and_o as_o their_o end_n so_o the_o mean_n and_o their_o work_n in_o their_o public_a assembly_n be_v such_o as_o be_v proper_a and_o peculiar_a unto_o and_o true_a and_o undoubted_a indication_n and_o note_n of_o true_a church_n the_o ordinance_n of_o god_n and_o their_o ordinary_a attendance_n thereupon_o in_o know_v public_a and_o fix_v place_n consecrate_v and_o set_v a_o part_n for_o that_o end_n wherein_o also_o there_o be_v nothing_o practise_v much_o less_o allow_v that_o be_v contrary_a to_o these_o mean_n or_o do_v pervert_v that_o end_n or_o with_o any_o pretence_n or_o colour_n of_o reason_n can_v be_v think_v to_o destroy_v their_o be_v or_o their_o truth_n as_o church_n of_o god_n for_o this_o we_o have_v abundant_a suffrage_n voluntary_o give_v by_o nonconformity_n itself_o from_o time_n to_o time_n and_o that_o not_o only_o in_o the_o acknowledgement_n but_o even_o in_o the_o defence_n of_o they_o against_o their_o enemy_n of_o the_o separation_n and_o what_o need_v more_o if_o mr._n ball_n mr._n hildersham_n of_o old_a and_o mr._n bagshaw_n and_o his_o friend_n the_o answerer_n be_v hear_v for_o the_o rest_n mr._n ball_n be_v express_v for_o himself_o and_o his_o brethren_n the_o nonconformist_n say_v he_o can_v not_o only_o acknowledge_v but_o prove_v the_o religion_n and_o worship_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n to_o be_v of_o god_n not_o by_o petty_a reason_n and_o colourable_a 3._o ans_fw-fr to_o can._n part_n 2._o p_o 3._o show_n which_o they_o leave_v to_o they_o which_o maintain_v a_o bad_a cause_n but_o by_o pregnant_a evidence_n from_o the_o word_n of_o truth_n even_o by_o plain_a text_n of_o scripture_n and_o sound_a reâ—son_n deduce_v therefrom_o against_o which_o the_o gate_n of_o hell_n shall_v never_o prevail_v mr._n hildersham_n come_v not_o a_o
whit_n behind_o he_o there_o be_v nothing_o do_v say_v he_o in_o god_n public_a 3_o on_o john_n 4._o p._n 3_o warship_n among_o we_o but_o it_o be_v do_v by_o the_o institution_n and_o ordinance_n and_o commandment_n of_o the_o lord_n as_o he_o very_o industrious_o and_o learned_o prove_v by_o a_o enumeration_n of_o the_o particular_n of_o our_o worship_n and_o thence_o press_v the_o people_n not_o only_o to_o attend_v it_o but_o to_o come_v to_o the_o begin_n of_o it_o mr._n bagshaw_n himself_o acknowledge_v the_o same_o and_o therefore_o plead_v that_o they_o do_v not_o separate_v but_o forbear_v 6._o antidote_n p._n 6._o communion_n because_o of_o some_o conditim_n require_v and_o so_o indeed_o do_v doctor_n owen_n and_o all_o sober_a independent_o and_o therefore_o i_o need_v not_o observe_v that_o those_o eminent_a presbyterian_o that_o write_v the_o epistle_n before_o mr._n ball_n answer_v to_o cann_n do_v own_o or_o that_o mr._n cawdry_n and_o other_o presbyterian_o have_v make_v it_o the_o foundation_n of_o all_o their_o argument_n against_o independent_a gather_a church_n that_o our_o church_n be_v true_a church_n our_o author_n do_v not_o so_o much_o as_o question_v the_o truth_n of_o our_o church_n in_o general_n what_o exception_n notwithstanding_o he_o have_v scatter_v about_o it_o we_o shall_v brief_o examine_v object_n 1._o page_n 10._o he_o tell_v we_o like_o a_o oracle_n among_o the_o rest_n of_o their_o purpose_n and_o desire_n which_o be_v not_o a_o few_o and_o they_o none_o of_o the_o best_a that_o the_o nonconformist_n think_v that_o a_o parish_n quatenus_fw-la a_o parish_n be_v not_o a_o church_n nor_o a_o parishioner_n as_o such_o a_o church-member_n well_o and_o who_o ever_o say_v they_o think_v otherwise_o in_o some_o thing_n it_o seem_v they_o think_v as_o other_o do_v yet_o we_o know_v and_o they_o ought_v to_o think_v at_o least_o that_o a_o company_n of_o christian_n live_v within_o parish_n bound_n and_o ordinary_o attend_v upon_o god_n public_a worship_n in_o the_o place_n set_v a_o part_n to_o that_o end_n be_v a_o church_n object_n 2._o but_o they_o think_v also_o that_o parish_n bound_n of_o church_n be_v of_o humane_a prudential_a constitution_n and_o not_o of_o divine_a institution_n or_o unchangeable_a but_o pray_v think_v again_o for_o you_o ought_v to_o think_v that_o co-habitation_n of_o the_o member_n of_o a_o parochial_a church_n be_v according_a to_o the_o law_n of_o nature_n and_o so_o divine_a and_o that_o person_n who_o providence_n have_v so_o place_v together_o be_v bind_v to_o worship_n god_n together_o in_o some_o public_a way_n by_o virtue_n of_o the_o law_n of_o natural_a religion_n as_o much_o as_o family_n among_o themselves_o be_v there_o no_o other_o institution_n of_o god_n or_o man_n in_o the_o case_n moreover_o they_o ought_v to_o think_v that_o co-habitation_n of_o church_n member_n be_v so_o far_o of_o divine_a institution_n as_o the_o example_n of_o church_n in_o scripture_n always_o so_o bound_v amount_v to_o divine_a institution_n which_o be_v almost_o as_o much_o as_o be_v usual_o urge_v for_o the_o divine_a institution_n of_o the_o lord_n day_n this_o be_v the_o current_a argument_n of_o the_o presbyterian_o heretofore_o against_o the_o attempt_n of_o independent_o to_o break_v these_o bound_n and_o to_o glean_v up_o member_n in_o other_o field_n no_o matter_n what_o distance_n to_o make_v up_o their_o church_n church_n and_o city_n in_o the_o scripture_n be_v commensurate_a be_v not_o pag._n cawdrey_n schys_n pag._n the_o church_n of_o jerusalem_n and_o corinth_n so_o call_v from_o the_o place_n they_o ought_v further_o to_o think_v that_o the_o ground_n of_o suâ—h_n parochial_a church_n be_v lay_v in_o reason_n and_o scripture_n example_n though_o we_o be_v actual_o divide_v long_o since_o and_o that_o our_o parish_n bound_n in_o the_o general_a intention_n and_o scope_n of_o those_o that_o first_o appoint_v they_o notwithstanding_o some_o error_n which_o will_v always_o happen_v in_o such_o public_a case_n be_v make_v upon_o the_o say_v reasonable_a and_o scripture_n ground_n of_o co-habitation_n they_o ought_v also_o to_o think_v that_o though_o prudence_n at_o first_o discern_v these_o ground_n and_o according_o set_v these_o bound_n of_o parish_n church_n yet_o it_o be_v not_o the_o prudence_n of_o the_o people_n but_o their_o governor_n who_o have_v not_o now_o leave_v it_o in_o the_o people_n liberty_n or_o prudence_n whether_o they_o will_v ordinary_o keep_v these_o bound_n or_o not_o but_o have_v also_o bound_v that_o vulgar_a extravagancy_n by_o the_o law_n both_o of_o church_n and_o state_n to_o the_o contrary_a yet_o again_o they_o ought_v to_o think_v that_o they_o owe_v obedience_n to_o their_o governor_n in_o these_o law_n which_o obedience_n be_v certain_o of_o divine_a institution_n though_o i_o can_v hardly_o find_v it_o in_o all_o your_o book_n you_o ought_v last_o to_o think_v of_o the_o fearful_a consequence_n of_o tear_v these_o hedge_n and_o ancient_a bound_n and_o thereby_o make_v inlet_n or_o outlet_n or_o both_o to_o all_o kind_n of_o licentiousness_n in_o religion_n and_o confusion_n in_o the_o church_n while_o you_o thus_o expose_v parochial_a congregation_n to_o the_o direct_v mean_n of_o their_o dissolution_n o_o that_o you_o will_v lay_v to_o heart_n those_o serious_a word_n of_o mr._n baxter_n the_o interest_n of_o the_o christian_n protestant_n religion_n in_o england_n must_v be_v keep_v up_o by_o keep_v up_o as_o much_o of_o truth_n piety_n and_o reputation_n as_o be_v possible_a in_o the_o parish_n church_n his_o defence_n of_o his_o cure_n p._n 36._o for_o the_o last_o word_n that_o parish_n bound_n be_v not_o unchangeable_a it_o be_v acknowledge_v if_o the_o cause_n be_v just_a and_o coventgarden_n be_v not_o schysmatical_a yet_o still_o the_o rule_n of_o co-habitation_n ought_v to_o be_v observe_v and_o then_o our_o design_n be_v half_o spoil_v especial_o if_o we_o add_v as_o we_o needs_o must_v that_o this_o change_n or_o alter_v of_o parish_n bound_n lie_v not_o in_o the_o pleasure_n of_o private_a person_n be_v not_o to_o be_v attempt_v without_o the_o order_n of_o superior_n nor_o to_o the_o prejudice_n of_o god_n public_a worship_n wherein_o if_o all_o order_n be_v not_o quite_o forget_v the_o practice_n of_o the_o people_n shall_v not_o ordinary_o excee_v that_o which_o the_o know_a union_n and_o communion_n of_o parish_n in_o the_o same_o worship_n and_o government_n and_o the_o common_a custom_n and_o consequent_o allowance_n of_o the_o place_n intend_v will_v warrant_v wherein_o london_n perhaps_o if_o what_o you_o say_v be_v true_a may_v claim_v some_o privilege_n he_o say_v he_o do_v allow_v our_o parochial_a church_n to_o be_v true_a church_n viâ—_n 35._o p._n 35._o those_o of_o they_o that_o have_v true_a minister_n other_o wise_a not_o so_o that_o where_o there_o be_v no_o minister_n and_o where_o their_o minister_n be_v not_o true_a there_o the_o parish_n be_v not_o church_n it_o be_v likely_a some_o few_o small_a place_n especial_o cure_n have_v no_o settle_a minister_n but_o the_o law_n require_v their_o communion_n with_o their_o mother-church_n of_o which_o in_o a_o sense_n they_o be_v reckon_v member_n if_o they_o be_v curacy_n and_o i_o hope_v there_o be_v few_o false_a minister_n than_o your_o charity_n suppose_v how_o far_o the_o people_n be_v bind_v to_o communicate_v with_o such_o as_o you_o call_v intolerable_a shall_v be_v examine_v in_o the_o next_o chapter_n but_o if_o this_o be_v all_o to_o be_v find_v at_o the_o bottom_n of_o your_o exception_n as_o it_o seem_v to_o be_v why_o do_v not_o your_o brethren_n confine_v their_o labour_n to_o such_o destitute_a place_n especial_o if_o this_o be_v the_o great_a reason_n why_o they_o must_v preach_v at_o least_o their_o charity_n shall_v see_v they_o first_o provide_v for_o sure_o their_o voice_n will_v hardly_o reach_v to_o they_o from_o â—ities_n and_o corporation_n and_o place_n usual_o furnish_v well_o enough_o without_o they_o though_o here_o they_o general_o pitch_v their_o tabernacle_n you_o and_o they_o must_v think_v again_o and_o again_o before_o you_o will_v be_v able_a to_o defend_v these_o practice_n upon_o such_o principle_n chap._n xiii_o the_o people_n of_o england_n member_n of_o parochial_a church_n objection_n answer_v especial_o that_o from_o serve_v god_n better_a the_o people_n of_o england_n general_o be_v or_o aught_o to_o be_v member_n or_o minister_n of_o our_o parochial_a church_n and_o consequent_o be_v bind_v to_o atttend_v upon_o the_o public_a worship_n of_o god_n in_o our_o temple_n ordinary_o i_o mean_v i_o be_o not_o so_o strict_a to_o think_v that_o they_o ought_v never_o to_o be_v absent_a if_o they_o have_v reason_n as_o the_o statute_n intimate_v or_o that_o they_o may_v never_o go_v out_o of_o their_o own_o parish_n to_o hear_v a_o seâ—mon_a provide_v always_o
they_o keep_v within_o the_o bound_n of_o that_o latitude_n which_o the_o communion_n of_o parish-church_n and_o the_o custom_n of_o the_o place_n as_o in_o london_n if_o it_o be_v so_o there_o as_o our_o answerer_n affirm_v will_v warrant_n as_o i_o say_v before_o but_o that_o general_o the_o people_n be_v of_o the_o parish_n church_n and_o ordinary_o aught_o to_o communicate_v with_o they_o there_o be_v hardly_o any_o thing_n more_o evident_a in_o reason_n or_o sense_n and_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o nonconformists_a for_o they_o be_v baptize_v into_o these_o particular_a church_n as_o well_o as_o into_o the_o universal_a and_o the_o know_a law_n both_o of_o church_n and_o state_n oblige_v their_o conscience_n to_o communion_n with_o they_o beside_o if_o they_o be_v not_o of_o the_o particular_a church_n wherein_o they_o live_v they_o be_v of_o none_o but_o their_o ordinary_a attend_v upon_o the_o public_a worship_n as_o they_o general_o do_v or_o have_v do_v conclude_v they_o by_o their_o own_o consent_n to_o say_v nothing_o now_o of_o the_o inconvenience_n that_o follow_v separation_n from_o they_o a_o argument_n not_o to_o be_v despise_v till_o it_o be_v better_o consider_v and_o censure_v mr._n baxter_n speak_v very_o well_o and_o home_o to_o the_o point_n thus_o he_o that_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o universal_a church_n be_v fit_a to_o be_v receive_v into_o a_o particular_a 89._o cure_v of_o ch._n div_o p._n 89._o church_n and_o there_o want_v no_o more_o but_o mutual_a consent_n and_o if_o he_o have_v stated_o join_v with_o a_o particular_a church_n in_o ordinary_a communion_n consent_n have_v be_v manifest_v and_o he_o be_v a_o member_n of_o that_o particular_a church_n thus_o in_o thesi_fw-la then_o he_o subjoine_v this_o be_v the_o common_a case_n in_o england_n the_o person_n who_o be_v baptize_v in_o infancy_n be_v at_o once_o receive_v into_o the_o universal_a church_n and_o into_o some_o particular_a church_n and_o have_v hold_v communion_n at_o age_n with_o both_o etc._n etc._n in_o a_o case_n so_o plain_a in_o the_o writing_n of_o the_o old_a nonconformist_n i_o shall_v only_o give_v you_o mr._n baxters_n testimony_n for_o they_o all_o especial_o find_v a_o emphasis_n in_o his_o word_n which_o be_v these_o speak_v to_o his_o brethren_n say_v he_o much_o more_o shall_v you_o have_v endure_v 14._o defence_n of_o his_o cure_n p._n 14._o such_o as_o the_o nonconformist_n of_o that_o age_n who_o use_v parish_n communion_n and_o plead_v for_o it_o against_o the_o separatist_n fâ—r_o sharp_a language_n than_o ever_o i_o use_v as_o their_o book_n against_o johnson_n and_o cann_n and_o brown_n and_o ainsworth_n do_v yet_o visible_o declare_v hence_o it_o be_v that_o worthy_a non_fw-fr conformist_n mr_n hildersham_n do_v not_o only_a judge_n it_o lawful_a and_o a_o duty_n to_o attend_v upon_o the_o parish_n congregation_n but_o use_v many_o argument_n against_o the_o ordinary_a leave_v our_o own_o minister_n to_o hear_v more_o able_a man_n in_o other_o parish_n and_o for_o john_n upon_o the_o four_o of_o john_n our_o come_n reverent_o and_o at_o the_o begin_n of_o the_o service_n and_o mr._n baâ—ter_n persuade_v with_o many_o argument_n to_o communion_n with_o the_o parish_n church_n which_o he_o will_v not_o have_v do_v if_o he_o have_v not_o think_v it_o not_o only_o to_o bâ—_n lawful_a but_o a_o duty_n yea_o he_o say_v express_o that_o to_o sâ—me_v it_o be_v a_o duty_n to_o join_v with_o some_o parish_n church_n in_o the_o lord_n supper_n three_o time_n a_o year_n defence_n of_o his_o cure_n p._n 38._o which_o he_o say_v he_o prove_v by_o twenty_o reason_n and_o by_o his_o own_o example_n avow_v in_o public_a and_o his_o constant_a resolution_n so_o to_o do_v he_o add_v much_o weight_n to_o his_o say_a reason_n and_o to_o give_v my_o answerer_n his_o due_a in_o this_o as_o he_o do_v not_o deny_v the_o truth_n of_o most_o of_o our_o church_n so_o he_o do_v much_o persuade_v both_o by_o reason_n and_o his_o own_o example_n to_o communion_n with_o they_o and_o therefore_o he_o believe_v as_o i_o believe_v of_o he_o that_o it_o be_v a_o duty_n but_o for_o the_o presbyterian_o and_o their_o judgement_n in_o the_o point_n before_o 143._o ind._n schys_n pag._n 143._o 1660_o let_v mr._n cawdrey_n be_v hear_v at_o large_a speak_v against_o the_o independent_n separation_n say_v he_o if_o they_o do_v not_o suppose_v themselves_o to_o be_v of_o some_o particular_a church_n it_o be_v their_o error_n and_o their_o fault_n their_o error_n because_o all_o the_o people_n of_o the_o nation_n be_v confine_v to_o that_o church_n where_o they_o live_v and_o liable_a to_o censure_v for_o leave_v that_o church_n for_o partake_v of_o ordinance_n and_o the_o minister_n for_o admit_v they_o their_o fault_n because_o they_o be_v bind_v by_o way_n of_o duty_n both_o by_o the_o law_n of_o the_o nation_n and_o also_o by_o the_o law_n of_o god_n to_o be_v of_o one_o or_o other_o particular_a congregation_n mean_v parochial_a object_n but_o what_o say_v our_o answerer_n against_o all_o this_o he_o yield_v much_o no_o doubt_n pag._n 41._o where_o he_o say_v the_o old_a nonconformist_n hold_n lay_v communion_n with_o parish_n church_n lawful_a and_o so_o do_v we_o answ_n but_o do_v not_o they_o also_o hold_v it_o a_o duty_n prove_v the_o contrary_a if_o you_o can_v i_o challenge_v he_o to_o show_v in_o any_o of_o they_o one_o word_n signify_v it_o lawful_a to_o hold_v communion_n with_o any_o other_o state_v church_n in_o england_n beside_o the_o parochial_a or_o that_o ever_o they_o preach_v in_o house_n as_o you_o unfair_o intimate_v when_o the_o people_n shall_v be_v in_o the_o parish_n church_n or_o that_o any_o learned_a presbyterian_a say_v so_o before_o 1660_o if_o not_o what_o signify_v all_o your_o new-coined_a distinction_n pag._n 34_o 35._o object_n but_o in_o some_o place_n we_o can_v profit_v by_o the_o minister_n aâ—sw_n you_o may_v profit_v by_o the_o prayer_n and_o sacrament_n the_o old_a nonconformist_n will_v not_o endure_v the_o objection_n against_o all_o or_o against_o airy_a weak_a if_o honest_a minister_n let_v mr._n hildersham_n reason_n against_o it_o be_v examine_v say_v he_o our_o shame_n our_o sin_n and_o just_a cause_n of_o humble_v to_o we_o if_o we_o can_v profit_v by_o the_o mean_a minister_n 226._o on_o john_n 4._o p_o 225_o 226._o that_o god_n have_v send_v and_o the_o power_n of_o the_o ministry_n depend_v not_o on_o the_o excellency_n of_o the_o teacher_n gift_n but_o upon_o god_n blessing_n though_o sometime_o he_o think_v people_n may_v go_v to_o hear_v other_o minister_n of_o better_a gift_n object_n but_o some_o minister_n be_v intolerable_a answ_n i_o grant_v the_o nonconformist_n and_o particular_o mr._n hildersham_n do_v allow_v the_o people_n in_o such_o case_n to_o go_v from_o their_o own_o parish_n yet_o he_o put_v in_o three_o rule_n to_o the_o case_n that_o it_o be_v do_v without_o open_a breach_n or_o contempt_n to_o the_o church_n order_n without_o contempt_n of_o their_o own_o pastor_n and_o without_o scandal_n and_o offence_n to_o they_o and_o their_o people_n but_o if_o no_o minister_n be_v intolerable_a but_o such_o as_o our_o answerer_n describe_v to_o be_v so_o i_o hope_v there_o be_v but_o few_o such_o in_o our_o day_n what_o ever_o there_o be_v in_o mr._n hildershams_n time_n by_o intolerable_a say_v he_o i_o mean_v 1._o such_o as_o be_v ignorant_a of_o or_o erroneous_a advice_n advice_n against_o the_o essential_o of_o christianity_n 2._o such_o as_o be_v unable_a to_o teach_v they_o other_o 3._o such_o as_o malignant_o preach_v down_o the_o practice_n of_o a_o holy_a life_n or_o in_o a_o word_n such_o who_o ministry_n real_o tend_v to_o do_v more_o hurt_n than_o good_n these_o be_v intolerable_a indeed_o and_o if_o there_o shall_v chance_v to_o be_v find_v one_o or_o two_o such_o within_o a_o province_n i_o hope_v not_o so_o many_o sure_o some_o duty_n we_o owe_v concern_v they_o but_o what_o be_v that_o in_o the_o first_o place_n we_o be_v certain_o bind_v to_o endeavour_v his_o amendment_n if_o that_o be_v not_o to_o be_v do_v but_o he_o be_v find_v incurable_a he_o be_v the_o more_o intolerable_a and_o our_o next_o duty_n to_o endeavour_v to_o remove_v he_o so_o far_o mr._n baxters_n advice_n be_v wholesome_a and_o apposite_a use_v all_o your_o diligence_n 106._o cure_v of_o ch._n div_o p_o 106._o to_o amend_v he_o and_o if_o you_o can_v do_v that_o use_v all_o your_o interest_n to_o get_v he_o out_o and_o get_v a_o better_a indeed_o he_o add_v if_o you_o can_v do_v that_o deliver_v your_o own_o soul_n from_o he_o by_o remove_v to_o a_o better_a if_o you_o be_v free_a he_o mean_v if_o you_o be_v not_o under_o the_o command_n of_o other_o remove_z to_z another_o parish_n which_o
there_o be_v let_v he_o come_v forth_o to_o own_o it_o that_o advise_v with_o his_o parish-minister_n about_o his_o departure_n or_o be_v so_o civil_a to_o take_v his_o leave_n much_o less_o show_v he_o any_o just_a occasion_n of_o his_o so_o sudden_a resolution_n or_o what_o give_v he_o the_o offence_n in_o the_o person_n or_o administration_n of_o his_o pastor_n or_o in_o the_o worship_n and_o communion_n or_o conversation_n of_o his_o fellow_n member_n and_o move_v or_o dispose_v he_o thereunto_o before_o he_o do_v actual_o separate_v much_o less_o do_v he_o exercise_v any_o patience_n or_o long-suffering_a in_o order_n to_o his_o own_o satisfaction_n or_o the_o reformation_n of_o the_o church_n of_o which_o he_o be_v a_o member_n in_o what_o he_o think_v amiss_o if_o such_o separation_n be_v not_o rash_a and_o sudden_a if_o it_o fail_v not_o in_o the_o due_a manner_n of_o proceed_v show_v your_o reason_n or_o else_o bear_v the_o censure_n and_o charge_n of_o schysm_n from_o all_o sound_n and_o judicious_a casuist_n let_v the_o pretence_n or_o cause_n otherwise_o be_v never_o so_o great_a and_o just_a indeed_o they_o general_o give_v up_o themselves_o with_o all_o manner_n of_o diligence_n to_o obtain_v their_o licenses_fw-la to_o contrive_v their_o house_n to_o appoint_v their_o meeting_n conspire_v in_o this_o as_o appear_v by_o their_o practice_n that_o they_o will_v hold_v their_o assembly_n at_o the_o same_o hour_n with_o the_o parochial_a the_o direct_v method_n they_o can_v imagine_v to_o be_v opposite_a to_o we_o yet_o not_o so_o well_o consider_v what_o may_v be_v the_o consequence_n as_o one_o of_o the_o sober_a of_o their_o minister_n complain_v who_o observe_v it_o too_o late_a which_o have_v they_o have_v patience_n and_o wisdom_n first_o to_o have_v consult_v my_o answerer_n may_v in_o all_o likelihood_n in_o many_o place_n at_o least_o have_v be_v happy_o prevent_v 2._o but_o alas_o this_o be_v not_o the_o burden_n of_o ephraim_n their_o separation_n fail_v in_o the_o foundation_n and_o ground_n of_o it_o it_o be_v not_o accountable_a upon_o any_o term_n of_o charity_n justice_n or_o christian_a sobriety_n strict_o the_o church_n from_o which_o they_o separate_v have_v not_o give_v they_o any_o such_o offence_n or_o cause_n of_o offence_n sufficient_a to_o justify_v their_o separation_n either_o in_o truth_n or_o in_o the_o judgement_n of_o any_o but_o themselves_o much_o less_o the_o old_a nonconformist_n and_o presbytâ—rians_n as_o will_n soon_o appear_v in_o full_a light_n our_o answerer_n have_v set_v you_o a_o hard_a game_n to_o play_v here_o for_o you_o must_v show_v we_o such_o reason_n why_o you_o leave_v we_o as_o will_v excuse_v you_o from_o separation_n and_o yet_o justify_v your_o gather_a church_n which_o upon_o the_o supposition_n already_o prove_v that_o our_o church_n be_v true_a church_n that_o you_o be_v or_o aught_o to_o be_v member_n of_o they_o and_o to_o continue_v in_o communion_n with_o they_o while_o you_o live_v in_o they_o if_o we_o have_v give_v you_o no_o just_a occasion_n to_o discontinue_v it_o seem_v to_o be_v a_o plain_a contradiction_n and_o your_o new_a church_n be_v no_o better_a than_o state_v separation_n but_o lay_v aside_o all_o little_a insignificant_a artifices_fw-la and_o modern_a evasion_n the_o question_n in_o short_a be_v this_o whether_o we_o can_v have_v any_o just_a plea_n for_o separation_n from_o any_o church_n of_o which_o we_o be_v member_n while_o we_o may_v communicate_v with_o it_o without_o communion_n in_o sin_n the_o negative_a have_v appear_v all_o set_a party_n have_v subscribe_v the_o negative_a and_o hardly_o any_o but_o yourselves_o ever_o question_v it_o if_o yet_o you_o do_v so_o the_o protestant_n by_o the_o papist_n the_o brownist_n by_o the_o puritan_n the_o anabaptist_n independent_a and_o interpendent_a by_o the_o presbyterian_a be_v all_o charge_v with_o shysm_n and_o all_o without_o scruple_n put_v their_o controversy_n to_o this_o issue_n if_o you_o that_o charge_v we_o with_o schysm_n can_v prove_v that_o we_o may_v hold_v communion_n with_o you_o without_o sin_v we_o acknowledge_v the_o charge_n therefore_o they_o always_o defend_v their_o separation_n by_o charge_a sin_n upon_o their_o communion_n from_o who_o they_o separate_v also_o on_o the_o other_o hand_n they_o endeavour_v to_o make_v the_o charge_n of_o schysm_n upon_o those_o that_o separate_a by_o answer_v the_o objection_n of_o sin_n against_o their_o several_a communion_n so_o that_o on_o all_o side_n this_o sense_n of_o schysm_n pass_v uncontrolled_a and_o be_v never_o i_o think_v dispute_v or_o doubt_v before_o if_o it_o be_v so_o now_o and_o dr._n ames_n have_v put_v it_o into_o the_o very_a definition_n of_o schysm_n and_o make_v it_o his_o great_a rule_n by_o which_o he_o answer_v the_o case_n about_o it_o but_o to_o prevent_v mistake_n i_o must_v speak_v with_o caution_n by_o discontinue_v communion_n i_o do_v not_o mean_v only_o a_o not_o have_v actual_a communion_n with_o the_o church_n for_o that_o may_v be_v involuntary_a as_o when_o a_o man_n be_v excommunicate_v or_o necessitate_v by_o sickness_n or_o if_o you_o will_v have_v it_o add_v by_o too_o great_a a_o multitude_n of_o member_n yea_o it_o may_v chance_v to_o be_v voluntary_a yet_o not_o proper_o schysm_n when_o we_o do_v not_o attend_v god_n worship_n through_o neglect_n of_o our_o duty_n and_o a_o profane_a principle_n but_o of_o these_o we_o speak_v not_o here_o by_o discontinue_v our_o communion_n i_o mean_v a_o deny_v or_o refuse_v communion_n with_o our_o own_o church_n upon_o any_o dislike_n or_o distaste_n of_o its_o worship_n or_o minister_n or_o member_n now_o whether_o this_o distaste_n arise_v from_o fear_n of_o communicate_v in_o sin_n where_o there_o be_v no_o just_a cause_n of_o or_o without_o such_o fear_n such_o refuse_v or_o deny_v communion_n be_v schysm_n yea_o as_o ames_n advise_v if_o there_o be_v real_a evil_n in_o some_o part_n of_o communion_n in_o a_o true_a church_n to_o depart_v far_o from_o it_o than_o that_o evil_n require_v be_v schysm_n so_o when_o there_o be_v no_o real_a or_o pretend_a sinfulness_n in_o the_o communion_n of_o our_o church_n and_o yet_o we_o take_v dislike_n and_o separate_v and_o total_o separate_v and_o gather_v ourselves_o into_o new_a congregation_n in_o opposition_n thereunto_o who_o dare_v say_v this_o be_v no_o schysm_n it_o be_v not_o worth_a the_o question_n though_o you_o some_o where_o make_v it_o whether_o it_o be_v schysm_n to_o remove_v our_o dwell_n from_o one_o parish_n to_o another_o our_o civil_a necessity_n may_v force_v we_o to_o it_o we_o hold_v no_o such_o matrimony_n between_o pastor_n and_o people_n as_o some_o talk_n of_o but_o upon_o fair_a occasion_n either_o may_v remove_v all_o parish_n be_v in_o communion_n together_o and_o be_v of_o the_o general_a constitution_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n by_o such_o a_o removal_n you_o become_v a_o member_n of_o another_o parish_n church_n and_o be_v bind_v by_o the_o law_n of_o the_o land_n and_o by_o the_o rule_n of_o cohabitation_n of_o membership_n to_o hold_v communion_n with_o the_o church_n in_o which_o you_o live_v you_o have_v still_o real_a communion_n with_o the_o former_a church_n not_o only_o in_o the_o substance_n but_o mode_n of_o its_o worship_n and_o its_o very_a constitution_n but_o by_o remove_v to_o these_o new_a church_n you_o do_v not_o you_o can_v cease_v to_o be_v of_o a_o parish_n at_o all_o nor_o of_o a_o parochial_a church_n without_o schysm_n from_o the_o church_n in_o which_o yoâ—_n live_v and_o from_o all_o the_o parochial_a church_n in_o england_n and_o from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n itself_o i_o mean_v unless_o you_o can_v prove_v that_o something_o be_v require_v in_o our_o way_n of_o worship_n that_o you_o can_v join_v in_o without_o sin_v the_o question_n be_v to_o bring_v the_o point_n home_o what_o sin_n be_v to_o be_v find_v in_o our_o worship_n wherein_o the_o people_n that_o join_v with_o we_o must_v needs_o communicate_v if_o none_o can_v be_v find_v we_o must_v write_v schysm_n upon_o your_o separation_n and_o we_o can_v help_v it_o use_v no_o delatory_a plea_n blind_v we_o not_o with_o wide_a discourse_n about_o what_o be_v fit_a to_o be_v impose_v in_o order_n to_o peace_n etc._n etc._n and_o about_o the_o duty_n of_o superior_n that_o concern_v you_o not_o or_o about_o the_o hard_a condition_n of_o conformity_n upon_o minister_n as_o such_o we_o be_v speak_v of_o lay-communion_n wherein_o all_o that_o be_v not_o in_o the_o place_n of_o minister_n be_v to_o look_v to_o their_o duty_n and_o if_o there_o be_v any_o thing_n require_v of_o they_o in_o order_n to_o their_o communion_n with_o we_o that_o be_v indeed_o sinful_a say_v what_o be_v it_o and_o speak_v to_o the_o point_n in_o this_o case_n sir_n be_v judge_n yourself_o you_o express_o
schysm_n it_o be_v not_o a_o differ_a faith_n but_o a_o break_v the_o fellowship_n of_o communion_n which_o make_v man_n schysmaticks_n yet_o more_o plain_o schysma_n est_fw-la eadem_fw-la opiniantem_fw-la &_o eodem_fw-la ritu_fw-la utentem_fw-la solo_n congregationis_fw-la delectari_fw-la dissidio_fw-la schysm_n be_v when_o a_o man_n that_o profess_v the_o same_o faith_n and_o worship_n be_v delight_v only_o with_o the_o difference_n of_o a_o assembly_n or_o congregation_n you_o may_v have_v advise_v this_o father_n a_o little_a better_o have_v he_o be_v now_o alive_a but_o it_o seem_v your_o objection_n be_v then_o urge_v by_o some_o that_o you_o be_v loath_a to_o own_o and_o this_o same_o notion_n of_o schysm_n keep_v its_o ground_n in_o the_o church_n from_o st._n aug._n to_o beza_n time_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d sive_fw-la 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d est_fw-la etc._n etc._n schysm_n or_o division_n say_v beza_n 10._o an._n in_o 1._o co._n 1._o 10._o be_v this_o when_o man_n be_v so_o addict_v to_o some_o man_n or_o to_o some_o outward_a rite_n that_o though_o they_o do_v agree_v in_o the_o chief_a point_n of_o religion_n yet_o they_o be_v estrange_v in_o their_o mind_n and_o engage_v themselves_o into_o party_n and_o faction_n thus_o beza_n and_o yet_o he_o pass_v for_o a_o presbyterian_a and_o so_o do_v mr._n new_a come_fw-mi who_o use_v all_o these_o place_n of_o authority_n to_o my_o very_a purpose_n against_o the_o independent_o who_o will_v it_o seem_v have_v excuse_v their_o schysm_n from_o the_o moderation_n of_o their_o principle_n and_o the_o soundness_n of_o their_o doctrine_n he_o therefore_o shall_v be_v the_o next_o presbyterian_a that_o we_o shall_v produce_v 14._o new_o come_v sr._n at_o paul_n p._n 14._o for_o this_o notion_n of_o schysm_n not_o necessary_o inclusive_a of_o the_o brownist_n rigid_a principle_n he_o tell_v we_o plain_o as_o i_o observe_v in_o my_o other_o book_n their_o hold_v one_o head_n and_o one_o faith_n with_o we_o do_v not_o excuse_v they_o from_o be_v guilty_a of_o breach_n of_o unity_n and_o downright_a schysm_n as_o long_o as_o they_o hold_v not_o one_o body_n one_o baptism_n as_o if_o he_o have_v say_v let_v your_o principle_n be_v what_o they_o will_v you_o be_v downright_a schysmaticks_n while_o you_o separate_v and_o break_v our_o unity_n as_o for_o separation_n mr._n baxter_n tell_v we_o that_o the_o mischief_n 1669._o ep_v to_o his_o rest_n print_v 1669._o of_o it_o lie_v not_o in_o the_o bare_a error_n of_o judgement_n but_o in_o the_o unchristian_a and_o church-dissolving_a division_n and_o alienation_n which_o thence_o follow_v yea_o let_v we_o know_v the_o man_n that_o do_v ever_o direct_o or_o by_o any_o clear_a consequence_n to_o be_v draw_v from_o his_o word_n print_v such_o a_o notion_n of_o schysm_n as_o include_v the_o brownist_n rigid_a principle_n about_o our_o church_n etc._n etc._n in_o the_o nature_n of_o it_o examine_v cameron_n ames_n hales_n brinsly_n and_o if_o any_o other_o be_v dear_a to_o you_o and_o see_v whether_o their_o definition_n take_v in_o any_o such_o thing_n or_o can_v bear_v such_o a_o exposition_n as_o you_o will_v put_v upon_o they_o see_v how_o mr._n cawdrey_n and_o the_o london_n minister_n at_o zion_n college_n deal_n with_o the_o independent_o in_o the_o point_n and_o whether_o you_o can_v possible_o persuade_v yourself_o to_o continue_v in_o the_o beleif_n that_o for_o the_o reason_n you_o have_v allege_v the_o nonconformist_n may_v gather_v church_n and_o not_o be_v separatist_n in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o presbyterian_o before_o the_o year_n 1660._o or_o any_o of_o the_o old_a nonconformist_n you_o may_v see_v their_o judgement_n in_o general_n by_o a_o few_o quotation_n out_o of_o their_o writing_n chap._n xviii_o testimony_n of_o nonconformist_n for_o the_o same_o give_v i_o leave_v tousher_n in_o this_o worthy_a verdict_n with_o a_o argument_n after_o your_o own_o mode_n i_o will_v undertake_v to_o prove_v that_o the_o nonconformist_n both_o ancient_a and_o modern_a before_o 1660._o hold_v gather_v church_n out_o of_o our_o church_n unlawful_a and_o schysmatical_a and_o that_o absolute_o without_o any_o reference_n to_o the_o principle_n upon_o which_o it_o be_v do_v much_o less_o the_o brownistical_a do_v you_o prove_v afterward_o if_o it_o be_v possible_a that_o they_o suppose_v your_o new_a distinction_n and_o evasion_n or_o that_o they_o at_o any_o time_n let_v word_n drop_v from_o they_o signify_v a_o allowance_n of_o separation_n from_o our_o church_n and_o set_v up_o new_a one_o upon_o such_o weak_a ground_n as_o you_o stand_v upon_o mr._n ball_n i_o have_v mention_v in_o ball._n mr._n ball._n my_o last_o as_o one_o of_o the_o old_a puritan_n that_o have_v write_v for_o communion_n with_o our_o parochial_a congregation_n you_o tell_v i_o subtle_o that_o he_o speak_v not_o against_o nonconformist_n preach_n and_o that_o be_v a_o answer_n but_o i_o must_v now_o add_v that_o that_o great_a nonconformist_n do_v not_o plead_v for_o our_o communion_n as_o lawful_a but_o in_o a_o sort_n necessary_a and_o that_o to_o separate_v from_o we_o be_v a_o sinful_a separation_n he_o tell_v you_o roundly_o that_o such_o separation_n be_v the_o wound_n of_o trial_n ep_v to_o his_o 1._o vol._n friendly_a trial_n the_o church_n yea_o whosoever_o seperate_v from_o the_o body_n of_o the_o church_n seperate_v from_o christ_n in_o that_o respect_n voluntary_a separation_n from_o the_o lord_n table_n and_o the_o prayer_n he_o reckon_v upon_o more_o than_o hear_v sermon_n of_o the_o congregation_n what_o be_v but_o a_o willing_a excommunicate_v of_o ourselves_o from_o the_o visible_a token_n of_o the_o lord_n presence_n and_o love_n be_v it_o not_o a_o great_a sin_n in_o member_n to_o deprive_v themselves_o then_o in_o the_o church_n governor_n to_o deprive_v other_o of_o the_o same_o communion_n for_o small_a occasion_n you_o see_v he_o make_v the_o smallness_n of_o the_o occasion_n of_o separation_n to_o be_v emphasis_n and_o aggravation_n of_o it_o again_o more_o smart_o in_o his_o answer_n to_o cann_n thus_o separation_n from_o the_o true_a church_n of_o christ_n his_o ministry_n epistle_n epistle_n and_o worship_n of_o which_o sort_n i_o shall_v prove_v that_o to_o be_v by_o the_o word_n of_o god_n for_o which_o i_o plead_v mean_v the_o church_n of_o england_n tend_v not_o to_o the_o overthrow_n of_o antichrist_n but_o to_o the_o rent_v of_o the_o church_n the_o disgrace_n of_o religion_n the_o advancement_n of_o pride_n schysm_n contention_n the_o offence_n of_o the_o weak_a the_o grief_n of_o the_o godly_a who_o be_v better_a settle_v the_o harden_v of_o the_o wicked_a and_o the_o recovery_n or_o rise_v again_o of_o antichrist_n 2._o let_v worthy_a mr._n hildersham_n lay_v down_o his_o grave_n and_o weighty_a point_n clear_o and_o bold_o and_o like_o 149._o hildersham_n upon_o 4._o joh._n p._n 149._o himself_o it_o be_v this_o those_o assembly_n that_o enjoy_v the_o word_n and_o doctrine_n of_o salvation_n though_o they_o have_v many_o corruption_n remain_v in_o they_o be_v to_o be_v acknowledge_v the_o true_a church_n of_o god_n and_o such_o as_o none_o of_o the_o faithful_a may_v make_v separation_n from_o he_o will_v not_o allow_v you_o upon_o pretence_n of_o purity_n and_o serve_v god_n better_a in_o your_o way_n to_o separate_v and_o gather_v church_n not_o any_o one_o none_o of_o the_o faithful_a he_o proceed_v to_o prove_v it_o large_o and_o it_o may_v be_v well_o know_v how_o severe_a he_o be_v against_o the_o faithful_a that_o will_v ordinary_o leave_v their_o honest_a minister_n to_o hear_v those_o that_o be_v more_o able_a upon_o pretence_n of_o profit_v better_a by_o they_o which_o be_v yet_o the_o best_a plea_n the_o present_a separation_n have_v for_o itself_o 3._o m._n calvin_n speak_v to_o the_o point_n with_o no_o mean_a authority_n 12._o calvin_n insti_fw-la li._n 4._o c_o 1_o sect_n 9_o 10._o 12._o he_o tell_v we_o that_o wheresoever_o the_o gospel_n be_v pure_o preach_v and_o the_o sacrament_n administer_v according_a to_o the_o institution_n of_o christ_n there_o be_v the_o church_n of_o god_n there_o appear_v neither_o a_o deceitful_a nor_o doubtful_a face_n of_o a_o church_n of_o which_o no_o man_n may_v either_o despise_v the_o authority_n or_o refuse_v the_o admonition_n or_o resist_v the_o counsel_n or_o mock_v at_o the_o correction_n much_o less_o depart_v from_o it_o break_v in_o sunder_o the_o unity_n of_o it_o and_o go_v unpunished_a for_o the_o lord_n so_o high_o esteem_v the_o communion_n of_o the_o church_n that_o he_o count_v he_o for_o a_o traitorous_a runaway_n and_o forsake_v of_o religion_n whosoever_o shall_v stubburn_o estrange_v himself_o from_o any_o christian_a fellowship_n so_o that_o it_o be_v such_o a_o one_o as_o have_v the_o true_a ministry_n of_o the_o word_n and_o sacrament_n the_o fellowship_n of_o such_o a_o church_n be_v
not_o to_o be_v cast_v off_o although_o it_o swarm_v full_a of_o fault_n though_o there_o be_v fault_n in_o the_o administration_n either_o of_o doctrine_n or_o of_o the_o sacrament_n yet_o we_o ought_v not_o to_o estrange_v ourselves_o from_o the_o communion_n of_o it_o for_o all_o the_o article_n be_v not_o of_o one_o sort_n and_o therefore_o for_o every_o light_a dessention_n we_o ought_v not_o rash_o to_o forsake_v the_o church_n 4._o the_o value_n which_o our_o englesh_fw-mi presbyterian_o just_a before_o the_o war_n have_v of_o our_o church_n and_o its_o lay-communion_n be_v not_o impertinent_a 1643._o letter_n of_o many_o minister_n in_o old_a england_n to_o their_o brethren_n in_o new_a e._n pub_fw-la by_o mr._n ash_n &c_n &c_n 1643._o but_o very_o considerable_a together_o with_o the_o censure_n they_o then_o pass_v upon_o such_o as_o refuse_v it_o they_o speak_v to_o their_o brethren_n in_o new_a england_n thus_o if_o we_o deny_v communion_n with_o such_o a_o church_n as_o we_o there_o have_v be_v no_o church_n these_o 1400_o year_n with_o which_o a_o christian_a may_v lawful_o join_v nay_o that_o if_o such_o scruple_n as_o be_v now_o in_o your_o head_n may_v take_v place_n it_o will_v be_v unlawful_a to_o hold_v communion_n with_o any_o society_n under_o heaven_n 5._o mr._n gifford_n a_o old_a nonconformist_a write_v a_o book_n 1590._o gifford_n printed_n 1590._o call_v a_o plain_a declaration_n wherein_o he_o do_v not_o vindicate_v every_o thing_n in_o our_o church_n but_o that_o there_o be_v no_o sufficient_a cause_n of_o separation_n complain_v thus_o some_o be_v proceed_v to_o this_o that_o they_o will_v come_v to_o the_o assembly_n to_o hear_v sermon_n and_o the_o prayer_n of_o the_o preacher_n but_o not_o to_o the_o prayer_n of_o the_o book_n which_o i_o take_v to_o be_v a_o more_o grievous_a sin_n than_o many_o do_v suppose_v but_o yet_o this_o be_v not_o the_o worst_a for_o sundry_a be_v go_v far_o and_o fall_v into_o a_o damnable_a schysm_n and_o the_o same_o so_o much_o the_o more_o fearful_a and_o dangerous_a in_o that_o many_o do_v not_o see_v the_o foulness_n of_o it_o but_o rather_o hold_v they_o as_o godly_a christian_n and_o but_o a_o little_a over-shot_a in_o some_o matter_n 6._o we_o come_v now_o to_o review_v the_o testimony_n we_o give_v in_o our_o last_o from_o the_o late_a presbiterian_a controversy_n with_o the_o independent_o we_o pitch_v upon_o some_o word_n of_o the_o provincial_a assembly_n in_o london_n and_o the_o argument_n send_v to_o the_o assembly_n of_o divine_n by_o the_o london_n minister_n from_o zion_n college_n two_o eminent_a body_n of_o know_v presbyterian_o and_o we_o yet_o see_v no_o reason_n to_o judge_n but_o their_o word_n and_o argument_n be_v very_o direct_a and_o full_a to_o the_o purpose_n especial_o consider_v the_o most_o pitiful_a shift_n of_o our_o answerer_n about_o they_o as_o to_o the_o word_n in_o the_o divine_a right_n of_o presbytery_n be_v say_v that_o eccl._n jus_fw-la divin_fw-fr reg._n eccl._n book_n be_v suppose_v to_o be_v pen_v by_o dr_n roberts_n now_o a_o conformist_n but_o what_o do_v he_o mean_a be_v he_o a_o conformi_v then_o or_o do_v not_o the_o book_n plead_v for_o the_o presbytery_n and_o its_o jus_fw-la divinum_fw-la and_o in_o the_o same_o sense_n by_o which_o he_o himself_o define_v a_o presbyterian_a yea_o be_v it_o not_o own_v by_o and_o publish_v under_o the_o name_n of_o the_o provincial_a assembly_n of_o presbyterian_o and_o what_o matter_n be_v it_o then_o who_o pen_v it_o the_o like_o deal_v you_o use_v about_o mr._n trapp_n you_o say_v he_o be_v a_o conformist_n what_o then_o have_v he_o not_o give_v a_o just_a account_n of_o the_o book_n write_v by_o the_o london_n minister_n as_o i_o say_v he_o do_v their_o reason_n allege_v by_o i_o be_v allege_v by_o a_o conformist_n yet_o they_o be_v they_o still_o what_o manner_n of_o answer_v be_v this_o it_o be_v not_o pardonable_a with_o some_o adversary_n but_o you_o be_v fall_v into_o merciful_a hand_n the_o authority_n of_o the_o person_n than_o be_v clear_a the_o word_n i_o cite_v out_o of_o the_o preface_n to_o that_o book_n call_v jus_fw-la divinum_fw-la regiminis_fw-la ecclesiastici_fw-la be_v these_o parochial_a church_n be_v receive_v as_o true_a visible_a church_n of_o christ_n and_o most_o convenient_a for_o edification_n gather_v church_n out_o of_o church_n have_v no_o footstep_n in_o scripture_n be_v contrary_a to_o apostolical_a practice_n be_v the_o scatter_n of_o church_n the_o daughter_n of_o schysm_n the_o mother_n of_o confusion_n and_o the_o stepmother_n of_o edification_n observe_v they_o condemn_v gather_v church_n out_o of_o our_o church_n absolute_o and_o without_o any_o respect_n to_o the_o principle_n upon_o which_o it_o be_v do_v particular_o they_o call_v it_o the_o daughter_n of_o schysm_n separation_n in_o order_n unto_o the_o gather_n of_o church_n be_v schysm_n itself_o in_o the_o then_o presbyterian_a opinion_n the_o argument_n i_o take_v out_o of_o the_o letter_n of_o the_o london_n minister_n sion-coll_n sion-coll_n to_o the_o assembly_n be_v these_o the_o independent_o be_v guilty_a of_o schysm_n 1._o because_o they_o refuse_v communion_n with_o our_o church_n in_o the_o sacrament_n 2._o they_o erect_v separate_v congregation_n under_o a_o separate_a undiscovered_a government_n never_o charge_v they_o with_o any_o brownistical_a principle_n but_o the_o fact_n itself_o a_o undoubted_a proof_n of_o what_o they_o undertake_v to_o prove_v again_o to_o the_o same_o purpose_n they_o charge_v they_o with_o three_o great_a scandal_n how_o you_o will_v avoid_v either_o of_o they_o i_o can_v devine_n 1._o that_o they_o separate_v from_o the_o true_a church_n 2._o that_o they_o endeavour_v by_o draw_v member_n out_o of_o it_o to_o make_v up_o their_o separate_a church_n to_o weaken_v and_o diminish_v the_o church_n 3._o that_o they_o endeavour_v to_o get_v a_o warrant_n to_o authorise_v both_o viz._n by_o a_o toleration_n and_o this_o say_v they_o we_o think_v to_o be_v plain_o unlawful_a now_o hereupon_o i_o be_o bold_a to_o challenge_v our_o answerer_n or_o any_o one_o else_o to_o prove_v clear_o that_o any_o one_o eminent_a presbyterian_a before_o 1660._o be_v not_o utter_o against_o all_o the_o three_o against_o such_o separation_n such_o gather_a church_n and_o such_o toleration_n convince_v i_o if_o you_o can_v but_o not_o by_o tell_v i_o they_o be_v now_o for_o they_o all_o that_o they_o will_v tolerate_v thing_n tolerable_a that_o be_v gather_v church_n and_o person_n tolerable_a that_o be_v presbyterian_o as_o you_o speak_v very_o intelligible_o but_o no_o wonder_n they_o be_v change_v in_o their_o thought_n of_o these_o thing_n the_o case_n be_v alter_v as_o you_o hint_n true_o there_o be_v some_o new_a imposition_n upon_o ministerial_a conformity_n but_o other_o alteration_n render_v our_o lay-communion_n more_o easy_o than_o it_o be_v before_o the_o war_n when_o the_o presbyterian_a deny_v it_o not_o as_o be_v note_v out_o of_o mr._n baxter_n before_o who_o also_o assure_v we_o that_o he_o never_o hear_v of_o five_o nonconformist_n beside_o the_o five_o dissent_v 13._o defence_n of_o his_o cure_n p._n 13._o brethren_n in_o the_o assembly_n at_o westminster_n he_o mean_v they_o conform_v as_o minister_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n before_o they_o sit_v there_o however_o that_o church_n may_v not_o be_v gather_v out_o of_o church_n be_v assert_v not_o as_o a_o temporary_a truth_n but_o moral_a depend_v upon_o the_o nature_n of_o a_o church_n which_o never_o alter_v or_o give_v any_o occasion_n of_o change_n in_o the_o judgement_n about_o this_o point_n the_o book_n of_o mr._n cawdrey_n that_o captain_n in_o the_o presbyterian_a cawdrey_n cawdrey_n army_n against_o dr._n owen_n and_o the_o independent_o challenge_v you_o all_o we_o may_v say_v he_o prove_v they_o to_o be_v schysmatical_a 1._o by_o a_o voluntary_a separation_n from_o true_a church_n with_o who_o we_o dare_v say_v they_o may_v communicate_v without_o sin_n and_o so_o consequent_o causeless_o rend_v the_o body_n of_o christ_n 2._o by_o their_o renounce_n communion_n with_o we_o to_o set_v up_o a_o church_n of_o another_o 74_o indep_n further_o proud_a schys_n p._n 73_o 74_o constitution_n and_o so_o condemn_v our_o church_n ipso_fw-la facto_fw-la as_o no_o true_o constitute_v church_n mark_v condemn_v our_o church_n ipso_fw-la facto_fw-la their_o very_a act_n be_v enough_o whether_o they_o avow_v such_o principle_n or_o not_o and_o consequent_o what_o ever_o you_o pretend_v to_o the_o contrary_a your_o very_a departure_n from_o we_o and_o make_v new_a church_n do_v of_o itself_o condemn_v you_o of_o schysm_n he_o conclude_v his_o first_o book_n brave_o they_o say_v he_o that_o schysm_n ind._n great_a schysm_n raise_v difference_n in_o they_o i_o e._n in_o our_o church_n and_o draw_v disciple_n from_o they_o and_o renounce_v communion_n
with_o they_o say_v what_o they_o please_v or_o can_v to_o the_o contrary_n be_v schysmaticks_n quod_fw-la erat_fw-la demonstrandum_fw-la i_o only_o assume_v that_o general_o the_o nonconformist_n make_v difference_n in_o our_o church_n draw_v disciple_n from_o they_o and_o renounce_v communion_n with_o they_o quod_fw-la est_fw-la demonstratum_fw-la and_o now_o i_o beg_v leave_n of_o my_o answerer_n to_o conclude_v with_o the_o word_n in_o my_o last_o that_o so_o much_o offend_v he_o that_o i_o be_o sure_a the_o presbyterian_o if_o they_o walk_v by_o the_o principle_n of_o their_o father_n before_o the_o king_n return_n i_o be_o sure_a i_o say_v that_o they_o have_v no_o reason_n to_o engage_v in_o a_o way_n of_o public_a worship_n contradistinct_a to_o our_o parochial_a congregation_n the_o issue_n of_o the_o travers_n say_v mr._n brinsley_n be_v no_o more_o but_o 53._o of_o schysm_n p._n 53._o this_o if_o there_o be_v among_o we_o a_o separation_n from_o a_o true_a church_n and_o that_o both_o voluntary_a and_o unwarrantable_a as_o the_o present_a practice_n of_o gather_v church_n by_o the_o presbyterian_o be_v which_o i_o suppose_v the_o evidence_n give_v in_o have_v sufficient_o evict_v then_o must_v we_o give_v sentence_n that_o there_o be_v more_o than_o either_o crimen_fw-la nominis_fw-la or_o nomen_fw-la criminis_fw-la no_o less_o than_o a_o schysm_n formal_o and_o proper_o so_o call_v chap._n xxi_o gather_v of_o church_n ought_v not_o to_o be_v practise_v as_o now_o it_o be_v either_o in_o conscience_n or_o prudence_n objection_n answer_v yet_o we_o be_v not_o at_o a_o full_a agreement_n he_o seem_v every_o where_o to_o take_v it_o for_o grant_v that_o we_o be_v now_o at_o perfect_a liberty_n to_o gather_v new_a church_n or_o not_o which_o by_o no_o mean_n i_o allow_v while_o my_o principle_n stand_v undemolish_v such_o as_o these_o that_o our_o church_n of_o england_n be_v a_o true_a church_n that_o our_o parochial_a congregation_n be_v true_a church_n that_o the_o people_n of_o england_n be_v general_o member_n of_o this_o church_n and_o church_n or_o at_o least_o ought_v so_o to_o be_v that_o they_o lawful_o may_v and_o consequent_o be_v in_o duty_n and_o conscience_n bind_v to_o communicate_v with_o they_o and_o therefore_o for_o they_o to_o separate_a and_o to_o gather_v themselves_o into_o new_a congregation_n of_o another_o constitution_n be_v plain_o sinful_a and_o schysmatical_a upon_o the_o premise_n i_o do_v conclude_v that_o conscience_n ought_v first_o to_o be_v consult_v in_o the_o case_n and_o the_o many_o obligation_n thereof_o effectual_o and_o total_o remove_v before_o you_o can_v make_v it_o a_o matter_n of_o indifferency_n in_o itself_o and_o of_o more_o christian_a prudence_n pro_fw-la hic_fw-la &_o nunc_fw-la as_o you_o seem_v to_o affirm_v our_o obligation_n to_o this_o communion_n fall_v many_o way_n upon_o we_o from_o our_o relation_n to_o the_o church_n the_o law_n of_o cohabitation_n of_o church-member_n the_o law_n of_o the_o kingdom_n and_o the_o long_o continue_a practice_n of_o this_o church_n none_o of_o all_o which_o be_v in_o the_o least_o touch_v much_o less_o alter_a or_o repeal_v by_o the_o declaration_n of_o indulgence_n beside_o the_o many_o express_a scripture_n against_o our_o forsake_v our_o wont_a assembly_n separate_v ourselves_o make_v party_n and_o division_n in_o the_o church_n have_v our_o teacher_n in_o too_o much_o admiration_n and_o heap_v they_o up_o to_o ourselves_o and_o receive_v the_o faith_n with_o respect_n of_o person_n and_o draw_v disciple_n after_o we_o in_o all_o which_o both_o the_o present_a case_n and_o the_o several_a conscience_n of_o the_o nonconfomists_a whether_o preacher_n or_o people_n be_v in_o my_o opinion_n not_o light_o concern_v shake_v of_o the_o burden_n as_o well_o as_o you_o can_v until_o these_o thing_n be_v better_a answer_v i_o must_v add_v here_o that_o the_o case_n be_v of_o weight_n in_o pâ—int_n of_o conscience_n as_o well_o as_o prudence_n and_o that_o gather_a church_n as_o now_o you_o do_v be_v a_o breach_n of_o the_o law_n both_o of_o god_n and_o man_n a_o sin_n against_o our_o church_n in_o she_o right_o in_o our_o person_n and_o fellowship_n both_o with_o respect_n to_o our_o pastor_n and_o brethren_n and_o a_o plain_a breach_n of_o our_o covenant_n with_o they_o all_o a_o breach_n of_o the_o church_n unity_n and_o order_n and_o ancient_a bound_n and_o custom_n and_o in_o the_o teacher_n that_o draw_v away_o our_o people_n beside_o all_o that_o have_v be_v say_v a_o plain_a rob_n of_o god_n the_o church_n and_o our_o brother_n to_o conclude_v if_o the_o law_n of_o piety_n justice_n temperance_n or_o charity_n can_v reach_v the_o conscience_n every_o one_o of_o which_o be_v violate_v by_o this_o gather_n of_o church_n the_o case_n be_v not_o a_o work_n of_o mere_a christian_a prudence_n and_o to_o be_v determine_v only_o compare_v the_o good_a and_o evil_a consequent_n together_o as_o you_o say_v p._n 21._o but_o suppose_v my_o foundation_n to_o stand_v firm_a and_o conscience_n in_o the_o point_n well_o secure_v we_o may_v parley_v a_o little_a upon_o it_o in_o point_n of_o prudence_n especial_o see_v you_o affirm_v p._n 21._o that_o he_o that_o through_o imprudence_n mijsudge_v either_o wâ—y_n do_v sin_n moreover_o you_o confess_v that_o the_o case_n be_v now_o of_o so_o great_a moment_n that_o no_o minister_n shall_v rash'y_a determine_v it_o for_o himself_o p._n 20._o nor_o upon_o the_o desire_n of_o some_o of_o the_o people_n only_o but_o shall_v consult_v with_o wise_a and_o sober_a man_n that_o be_v impartial_a but_o if_o the_o case_n be_v so_o difficult_a for_o the_o reader_n who_o you_o say_v must_v preach_v how_o difficult_a be_v the_o case_n for_o the_o people_n for_o it_o be_v no_o where_o say_v they_o must_v separate_v and_o leave_v we_o to_o hear_v you_o yea_o yourself_o teach_v the_o contrary_n you_o state_n your_o nice_a case_n thus_o p._n 17_o 18._o whether_o in_o competent_a parish_n which_o have_v able_a and_o godly_a conformable_a minister_n the_o obligation_n to_o hold_v union_n and_o communion_n with_o the_o parish-church_n or_o the_o obligation_n to_o exercise_v a_o more_o regular_a way_n of_o church_n discipline_n and_o worship_n than_o the_o parish-church_n do_v or_o will_v do_v shall_v be_v judge_v the_o more_o prevalent_a and_o consequent_o whether_o they_o shall_v gather_v church_n out_o of_o church_n in_o this_o a_o case_n not_o so_o difficult_a as_o you_o seem_v to_o make_v it_o if_o there_o be_v as_o you_o have_v hear_v so_o much_o obligation_n upon_o conscience_n to_o the_o former_a part_n of_o it_o touch_v communion_n with_o we_o and_o none_o at_o all_o left_a for_o their_o gathering-churche_n for_o the_o end_v assign_v by_o you_o for_o they_o can_v neither_o leave_v we_o without_o sin_n nor_o gather_v church_n without_o sin_n as_o we_o hope_v it_o have_v appear_v your_o opinion_n be_v give_v upon_o a_o double_a supposition_n and_o both_o of_o they_o false_a 1._o that_o the_o case_n be_v indifferent_a or_o at_o least_o the_o obligation_n to_o both_o so_o equal_a as_o that_o it_o be_v to_o be_v weigh_v only_o by_o prudence_n 2._o that_o it_o be_v lawful_a and_o a_o duty_n to_o be_v a_o member_n of_o such_o a_o parish-church_n only_o when_o we_o can_v have_v and_o do_v no_o better_o i._n e._n in_o our_o own_o opinion_n and_o that_o when_o we_o can_v we_o have_v liberty_n to_o forsake_v our_o own_o church_n though_o i_o confess_v your_o explication_n of_o have_v or_o do_v better_a have_v some_o tendency_n to_o a_o right_a determination_n of_o this_o great_a point_n viz_o you_o say_v we_o can_v have_v or_o dâ—_n better_o when_o it_o can_v be_v without_o a_o great_a hurt_n to_o the_o public_a interest_n of_o the_o gospel_n the_o church_n and_o the_o soul_n of_o man_n than_o the_o benefit_n to_o we_o and_o other_o be_v like_a to_o countervail_v but_o i_o must_v add_v as_o the_o case_n require_v especial_o when_o that_o benefit_n can_v be_v have_v without_o sin_v ourselves_o and_o draw_v other_o to_o sin_v with_o we_o by_o our_o endeavour_n scandal_n and_o example_n which_o i_o think_v we_o too_o plain_o and_o manifest_o do_v by_o gather_v church_n now_o give_v i_o leave_v to_o make_v a_o supposition_n and_o i_o shall_v immediate_o take_v the_o scale_n and_o weigh_v the_o consequent_n as_o you_o say_v on_o both_o side_n my_o supposition_n be_v that_o this_o case_n which_o you_o call_v the_o difficult_a one_o be_v the_o very_a case_n with_o most_o nonconformist_n who_o do_v now_o gather_v church_n for_o as_o our_o parish-minister_n be_v general_o more_o tolerable_a than_o you_o seem_v to_o allow_v they_o so_o especial_o be_v they_o of_o the_o better_a sort_n and_o true_o able_a and_o godly_a and_o our_o parish_n in_o your_o own_o sense_n competent_a enough_o where_o for_o the_o most_o part_n