Rome and those in her communion and the Church of England are but severall members of the One Catholick Church That I conceive cannot be 1. For the reasons inferred from the Articles of your Church as above 2. For that the Articles of Faith of both Churches are directly contradictory as appears by many your negative Articles And Mr. Hooker sayes li. 3. fo 84. That the Children of the visible Church are signed with this marke One Lord ONE FAITH One Baptisme 3. Your self Sect. 24. charges the Church of Rome with errors in matters of Faith no lesse then in 4. points viz. Transubstantiation Communion in one kind Invocation of Saints and Adoration of Images and how you do distinguish between errors in matter of Faith pertinaciously as you will say held and Heresie I would willingly hear and if guilty of Heresie then by your sayings out of St. August Haeresis enim Sponsa Christi non est And Haeretici non pertinent ad Ecclesiam Catholicam she is no part of the Catholick Church And in Sect. 11. you charge the Church of Rome That she hath most sacrilegiously robbed the Laity of Christs blood 4. Christs mysticall body is but one and although that body is made up of many members yet all those members must cōmunicate one w th another for if a member be separated but by schism it is like an arm cut off from the body or a branch from the vine your owne similies which makes that arm or branch no part of the body or vine VIII And that the Church of Rome and England are separated by schisme I think none will deny for they doe abhorre mutuall communion in divine worship Sacraments Prayers and holy Rites and no Protestant will frequent Catholick service especially in the holy Sacrifice of Masse Moreover Catholicks excommunicate Protestants every year and Protestants did frequently Catholicks in England And by publick Statutes and Laws of the Land any one who should reconcile one of the Church of England to the Church of Rome is guilty of death but a Priest that shall celebrate Masse is made guilty of high Treason How therefore can One Church Christs mysticall body grow up together of such different members And your self say Sect. 19. that since the Reformation you have not communicated with the Church of Rome IX The Church of Rome and England being thus separated both in Faith and Communion and so not one And the Church of Rome and those in communion with her by your saying not being the Catholick Church my desire to be shewed the Catholick Church or the Church of England distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion for the last 1100 years or for so long as you please to say the Church of Rome hath so grievously erred that you dare not communicate with her is not nor by your Papers can be satisfied Thus beseeching Almighty God to look favourably into the souls deceived by devillish deceits that all hereticall impieties removed the hearts of them that erre may relent and returne to the unity of his truth I humbly take leave and rest Your most unworthy Servant T. B. For Mr. T. B. An Answer to his second Letter SIR I. I Have heretofore manifested that (a) § 2. there were Churches in Judea in Galilee and Samaria before ever there was a Church at Rome 2 ly That (b) Ib. there was a Catholick Church when the Apostles Creed was compiled and beleeved and yet no Church at Rome 3 ly After Rome became a Church she ceased to be Orthodoxe in so much that (c) § 23. in the time of St. Hilary of Poicteurs there was at Rome no Church no Communion of Saints She and those in communion with her were Hereticall and complyed with Arius And yet in France at that very instant there was a Catholick an Orthodox Church as also (d) § 29. at Alexandria and in Sardinia 4 ly (e) § 18.27.29 No Church at Rome under Zepherinus a Montanist Marcellinus an Idolater Liberius an Arian Vigilius an Eutychian and under John the 22. that Monster of Hereticks And yet in those dayes the Church was in Asia Alexandria Sardinia Cappadocia France and other places And all these I hope before Luther and after Rome had been Catholick And yet the effect of all this is a resolution in you that (f) n. 1. there can be no Church shewed through the whole world for many hundred yeers before Luther but the Church of Rome and those in her communion For some hundred yeers then it seems there may and if for some perchance for more 2. All this is to imply as if no Church without Rome as if all these were no Churches because they did not communicate with Rome in her damnable heresies If no Church but Rome and those in her communion then was there no Church at all for many hundred yeers since Rome was no Church while Arian or Eutychian or worse From whence then borrow you these grounds and take up this resolution Because Rome sometimes embraced Montanism sometimes Eutychianism Arianism Apostatism therefore no Church but Rome Or as if Asia Alexandria Sardinia France and Cappadocia were no part of the world For in those places there were Catholick Churches when none at Rome Or else that Church because the Romane was Catholick though never so hereticall Thus the Faith shall be tryed by Rome and not Rome by the Faith Communicate with Rome and all 's well 3. Next therefore you scoffingly adde (g) Ib. for if there could I presume your learning is such you would have known it and your charity such that being desired you would have shewed it me Sir my learning is such I blesse God that I doe know it and my charity such that upon your desire I have shewed it you But your eyes and resolution are such that you will not see it Thus with (h) Senec. ep 51. Harpaste Seneca's wives fool the house is dark when you are blind not casually but wilfully 4. In your former Letter your desire was that I would shew you the Catholick Church distinct from the Church of Rome and those in communion with her This I did in my former Answer plainly and fully § 1.22 23 29. That in this you might receive satisfaction I grant that The Catholick Church was alwayes visible from the Apostles times to this present day even then when there was no Church at Rome § 5. c. Next I have therein proved that (i) § 10. The Church of Rome and those in communion with her are not cannot be the Catholick Church A member indeed of the Catholick Church sometimes she was and sometimes she was not When Orthodox she was a member of the Catholick but while Hereticall or Schismatical she was no Church much lesse the one Catholick That the Romane Church hath been dangerously Hereticall is manifested § 16 17 18 23. That she hath been miserably Schismaticall is acknowledged by your
the means and our charity is manifested by our prayers as heretofore I acquainted you § 19. But your charity is so little that rather then we shall be members of the Catholick ye will be none your selves 33. For (s) n. 7. say you if a member be separated but by schisme it is like an arm cut off from the body or a branch from the vine which make that arm or branch no part of the body or vine Very right it is so not because it is distant from this or that member or unlike either in fashion or comlinesse or office but because it is cut off from the body by which it receives life and strength from the head A Church then must be separated from the mysticall body of Christ before it can be in direct schisme and this must be done by pride or obstinacy in error If ye shall excommunicate any man or Church causelesly the fault is in you not in them though they be under Romes Jurisdiction But ye have no such power over us as is sufficiently proved § 25 26. Say not then though your selves be the hand or the eye that (t) 1. Cor. 12.15 because the foot is not the hand nor (u) Ib. v. 16. the eare the eye it is not therefore of the body God knows (x) Ib. v. 14. the body is not one member but many and each of these receive life from the head though not every one of these so suddenly so immediately Thus (y) Ib. v. 13. by one spirit we are all baptized into one body the mystical body of Christ (z) Ib. v. 27. We are therefore the body of Christ or rather of the body as Corinth was (a) Ib. membra de membro members in part not members of Rome but members of the Western Church And though not Romanists yet are we both Christians and Catholicks Say not because we cannot see Transubstantiation and Purgatory nor weild St. Peter's sword with you that we are no members we can hear the voice of the shepheard and (b) Quid relicto capite membris adhaeres Chrysost in col 2.19 we shall not forsake the shepheard to be in league with the members 34. Now we draw neer your issue which follows thus * n. 8. And that the Church of Rome and England are separated by schisme I think none will deny For they abhor mutuall communion in divine Worship Sacraments and holy Rites and no Protestant will frequent Catholick service especially in the holy Sacrifice of Masse A separation there is indeed between you and us and if you will a schisme the more the pity But (c) Archbishop Lawd § 21. n. 1. the cause of the schisme is yours for ye thrust us from you because we called for Truth and redresse of abuses And not onely so but according to your owne words (d) n. 8. Ye excommunicate us every yeer all Protestants in generall a course unheard of unknown with us For though some one convicted member of yours be excommunicated we use not to excommunicate a whole multitude or Nation We condemne doctrines not persons or if persons for the doctrines sake Care therefore is taken that (e) Can. our Parsons and Curates repair to Recusants houses to confer with them and to convince their errors that so they may be won to Church Neither doe we abhor mutuall communion with you in divine worship but in worshipping or adoration of Images and Reliques We cannot endure that (f) Latria ea dicitur servitus quae pertinet ad colendum Deum Aug. de civ D. l. to c. 1. divine worship be given to any other then to the blessed Trinity 35. We abhorre not your Sacraments but your halfe Communion nor any holy Rites ye have (g) Of Ceremonies before the Book of Common-prayer The excessive multitude of ceremonies within our selves we have pared off (h) Ib. And in these our doings we condemn no other Nation much lesse abhorre them nor prescribe any thing but to our owne people onely observe that Yet (i) Ib. such ceremonies we have retained which doe serve to a decent order and godly Discipline and such as be apt to stir up the dull mind of man to the remembrance of his duty to God as also (k) Ib. to the reducing of the people to a most perfect and godly living without error or superstition And they that know any thing cannot deny but (l) Socrat. l. 5. c. 21. Sozom. l. 7. c. 19. many Rites and observations there were in the East which were not received in the West And in the West they were not alike in all places Of these St. Ambrose speaks thus (m) Ambros de Sacrament l. 3. c. 1. In omnibus cupio sequi Ecclesiam Romanam Sed tamen nos homines sensum habemus Ideo quod ALIBI RECTIUS SERVATUR nos recte custodimus Desirous I am saith he to follow the Church of Rome in all things And yet we are men of understanding What therefore IS MORE RIGHTLY OBSERVED IN OTHER PLACES that doe we rightly keep And is it not as lawfull for us to doe so Perfection is not at Rome some observations may be more convenient yea better in other places And I remember St. Austin tells us that (n) Aug. ep 118. c. 2. it was a rule of St. Ambrose to observe the customes of that Diocese wherein we reside to have an eye upon the Bishop and to doe as he does This St. Austin took to be counsel from heaven what ever you think I would to God we were so humble and so flexible as to submit to this counsel 36. And whereas you adde that no Protestant will frequent Catholick service I must tell you that we of this Church frequent no other And our Book of Divine service is Catholick in all things but in this that it is not Romane Were it in the Latine tongue with a prayer for the Pope by name and your half Communion then it would be Catholick enough though the people went home never the wiser never the better I challenge the most able of your faction to shew me any one passage in our Common prayer Book that is not Catholick I know you cannot I know it is as agreeable as possibly may be to the Catholick faith I speak not this at hap-hazard or out of blind affection but as St. Austin so I (o) Aug. de Verbis Dom. Ser. 63. c. 2. Fides nostra id est fides vera fides recta fides Catholica non opinione praesumptionis sed testimonio lectionis collecta Our faith that is the true the right the Catholick faith which is not collected out of an opinion of presumption but testified unto us by our serious reading the Scriptures Councels and Fathers (p) Nec haereticâ temeritate incerta sed Apostolicâ veritate fundata hoc insinuat hoc novimus hoc credimus Ib. neither wavering through hereticall rashnesse but founded
one or more branches be broken off The fountain flows comfortably though a rivulet be cut off The reason is because (m) Jer. 2.13 Christ and no particular Church is the fountain of living waters (n) 8. Jo. 4.14 that spring up into everlasting life and they that seek to him for this water as they ought shall be sure to have it Or as St. Cyprian speaks the Church is (o) Cypr. de unit Eccles luce Domini perfusa she hath her light not from Rome but from (p) S. Jo. 1.9 that true light which enlightens every man that comes into the world And we shall be no longer (q) S. Mat. 5.14 the light of the world then we are furnished with this light 23. So then since you will needs have it so the time was when there was a necessity for the Catholick Church not onely to be distinct but diverse from the Church of Rome and those in her communion otherwise there had been no Church I shall give you a satisfactory instance When Liberius Bishop of Rome turned Arian to recover liberty and an honorable Bishoprick when all Italy and Spain sided with him in that heresie then was the Catholick distinct from Rome and those in her communion For these if we may beleive (r) Haeretici non pertinent ad Ecclesiam Catholicam Aug. Locut de Deut. l. 5. c. 10. St. Austin and (s) Si Haeretici sunt Christiani esse non possunt Tertul. de Praescript c. 37. Tertullian had no share in the Church they were not so much as Christians because Hereticks St. Hilary of Poictieurs lamented the infamous lapse of this Bishop professing publickly thus (t) Hilar. Pict de Synodis p. 287. Ex eo intra nos tantum communio Dominica continetur from that time forward the Lords communion is continued AMONG US ONELY Onely us And who are these that he clears suddenly after in these words (u) Ib. p. 288. Quidam ex vobis firmissima fidei constantia INTRA COMMUNIONEM SE MEAM CONTINENTES SEACAETERIS EXTRA GALLIAS ABSTINUERUNT Some of you with a most firm constancy of faith containing themselves within my communion abstained from others without France Here then was no communion with Rome unlesse you can prove Rome to be in France and yet I hope a Catholick communion Boast not then too much of the Romane Church Wee see in what state it hath been and into the same state without Gods great mercy it may fall again And when such cause is given it shall be lawfull for us in like manner to hold communion within our selves in the three Britains even in England onely And now I think I have shewed you the Catholick Church distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion such a one as would have nothing to doe with Rome while Hereticall 24. I have done with the Propositions your desire remaines which requires a large library and a younger man for your words are these Wherefore I desire to be shewn the Catholick Church distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion for the last 1100 years What will no lesse serve the turn then 1100 years and those together what 's the meaning of this I never undertook any such thing neither as I know hath this Church or any of the Fathers thereof said any such thing (x) Art 19. Our Articles acknowledge the Church of Rome to be a Church and call her so But withall we say that (y) Ib. those of her communion have erred not onely in their living and manner of ceremonies but also in matters of faith And this hath been prettily well proved out of your own men So a Church it is though erronious We have never declared her to be no Church neither have our Articles hitherto charged her with Heresie but (z) Art 22. with fond doctrines vainly invented and founded upon no warranty of Scripture Yea something we blame you with (a) Art 29. that is repugnant to the plain words of Scripture Foure opinions of this kind my Lord of Canterbury taxeth you with viz. (b) Archbishop Lawd §. 33. n. 13 1. Transubstantiation 2. The administration of the blessed Sacrament to the Laity in one kind 3. Invocation of Saints and 4. Adoration of Images Ye have not hitherto quitted your selves of this Inditement and while his book stands unconfuted I shall beleeve that ye are justly charged with these unsound and uncatholick doctrines 25. Besides we acknowledge that (c) Art 26. in the visible Church the evill be ever mingled with the good That sometime the evill have chiefe authority in the ministration of the Word and Sacraments These we deny not to be visible members of the Church but grant that (d) Ib. the effect of Christs Ordinance is not taken away by their wickednesse Though these be bad in and to themselves oft-times their calling does good to others like (e) S. Mat. 23.2 c. the Scribes and Pharisees in Moses chaire We are not then so forward to make a separation as ye are taught to beleeve Indeed hardly any but the Church of Rome hath been so touchy as to excommunicate whole Churches upon slight occasions (f) Euseb hist l. 5. c. 24. What a stir did Bishop Victor keep about the observation of Easter He excommunicated divers Churches because they would not stoop to his lure (g) Ib. Verum ista caeteris omnibus parum placebant but this was little pleasing to the rest of the Bishops and among them to that famous Bishop of Lyons Ireneus Who with divers other (h) Victorem graviùs acerbiùs coarguebant Ib. sharply checked and reproved him for it These consider'd that no member can cut off another without mischief to the whole body even to it self And the hand ought not to doe it without a commission from the head For (i) Neque quisquam nostrum Episcopum se esse Episcoporū constituit aut tyrannico terrore ad obsequendi necessitaiem collegas suos adegit Cypr. in Conc. Cart. ag there is no Bishop of Bishops as ye conceive neither may any one Bishop excommunicate another of his own proper authority (k) Apost Can. 34. Cod. Eccles Vnivers Can. 88. This is the work of a Synod of Bishops Whoever does it of his own head offends against the practise of the Church the Canons and Scripture it self 26. Thus also (l) Euseb hist l. 7. c. 4. Bishop Steven though otherwise a good man carried himself very high about re-baptizing Hereticks Whether zeal or that vain conceit of St. Peter's Chair transported him I know not but this I am sure of he excommunicated all those that re-baptized Hereticks But what said that great Bishop of Cappadocia Firmilianus (m) Firmilian apud Cyp. ep 75. Teipsum excidisti noli te fallere mistake not thy self thou Bishop of Rome while thou goest about to cast out others by this
Was it possible such Bishops should reforme abroad what they practised and countenanced at home In those drowsie illiterate and Apostaticall times John 22. broached his damnable heresies And in those times in all probability were those strange doctrines hatched and many of those abuses induced we now protest against Somewhere then the Church was visible when invisible at Rome And occasion is given us to presume that in this very Island it was visible since Erasmus professeth that in all his travels he found learned Bishops in England onely And for many yeers we know the Greek Church had small correspondence or communion with the Latines and yet a visible Church for all this Neither can I doubt but in other countries even in Italy there were some learned Bishops that knew the Canons of the Church and full well understood that (a) Conc. Ephes can 1. heresie discharges not onely the Bishop from his Metropolitan but (b) Ib. can 3. the Clark from subjection to his Bishop The Church of Rome then must pardon us if we withdrew our selves from her Bishops when they fell into Apostasie or heresie And all good men will acquit us for reforming abuses at home according to our duty We have good warrant for what we doe even the authority of the whole Church representative Sir I have done If you be offended that I have stirred too much in these loathsome puddles consider I beseech you that you set me upon this unpleasing â—ask What I have done was at your desire and according to your directions Christ knows I have no private or by end in these my writings it is your satisfaction and salvation which I desire and endeavour God of his mercy give a blessing to these my labours and to you an humble and discerning spirit that you may see the truth and embrace it So prayes Your unworthy friend Edward Boughen Ab adversario mota quaestio discendi existit occasio Aug. de Civit. Dei l. 16. c. 2. Where was our Church before Luther It was just there where yours is now One and the same Church still no doubt of that One in substance but not one in condition of state and purity your part of the same Church remaining in corruption and our part of the same Church under reformation The same Naaman and he a Syrian still but leprous with you and cleansed with us The same man still Archbishop Lawd Ep. Ded. § Now one thing For Edward Boughen Doctor in Divinity These are SIR I. YOur papers I received some moneths since and for your great pains therein I humbly thank you The effect of them is this viz. a Resolution that there can be no Church shewed through the whole world for many hundred years before Luther but the Church of Rome and those in her communion for if there could I presume your learning is such you would have known it and your charity such that being desired you would have shewed it me II. My originall doubt was that sith the Catholick Church must be alway visible and that I could not by my best enquiry finde that a succession of men professing the doctrine of the Church of England had been alway visible that that Church was not the nor any part of the Catholick Church To this doubt at our conference you endevoured my satisfaction by attempting to prove that though the Church of England had not been alway visible at least not seen yet seeing she is but a member of the Catholick Church of which the Church of Rome is another it was sufficient that the Catholick Church had been alway visible in the Church of Rome and other particular Churches though not in the Church of England III. That discourse then did give me no satisfaction because although you said that the Church of Rome was a member of the Catholick yet the 19 th Article of your Church sayes That the visible Church of Christ is a Congregation of faithfull men in the which the pure Word of God is preached and the Sacraments be duly administred according to Christs ordinance in all those things that of necessity are requisite to the same And in divers other your Articles your Church condemnes the Church of Rome for not preaching the pure Word of God As in the 22 th concerning Purgatory Pardons Worshipping of Images and Reliques and Invocation of Saints And in the 24 th concerning the Publick prayers in the Church and the ministring of the Sacraments in a tongue not understood of the people In the 31 th concerning the Sacrifice of the Masse for quick and dead which that your Article calls blasphemous fables and dangerous deceits IV. And for not duly administring the Sacraments In the 30 th Article you say The Cup of the Lord is not to be denied to Lay-people For both the parts of the Lords Sacraments by Christs ordinance and commandement ought to be administred to all Christian men alike So then by the Articles of your Church the Church of Rome doth neither preach the pure Word of God nor duly administer the Sacraments and that in those things that are of necessity requisite for the same as appeares by your separation for your beloved * fo 195. or 7. against Fâ—sher Archbish Lawd says it is not lawfull to make a separation for points not necessary And if you say you did not make the separation but the Church of Rome then Luther Tindall c. did not goe out of the Church of Rome but the Church of Rome out of them V. Therefore I had reason still as in my Letter to demand a Church distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion of which no man that reads your answer can thereby I think receive satisfaction For the whole drift and scope of your papers is either to prove First that the Church of Rome and those in her communion is not the Catholick Church or else Secondly that the Church of Rome and those in communion with her and the Church of England are but one that is severall members of one Church VI. For the first that the Church of Rome and those in communion with her was not the Catholick Church for that time I required you shew no proof that I doe finde but that some of the Popes have been either Hereticks or Schismaticks which if admitted though it is not to be so in some of them for that time yet it doth not make that whole Church to be Hereticall or Schismaticall For I beleeve you will yeeld that the King of England or Archbishop of Canterbury may be an Heretick or Schismatick and yet the Church of England be still part of the Catholick Church But if it were granted that the Popes of Rome being Schismaticks or Hereticks should annihilate that Church yet that could give me no satisfaction who required not where is not the Catholick Church but where it is that I might communicate with it 2. For the second that the Church of
own men § 3. Thus that Church hath grievously erred and in more then one fundamentall And yet the Catholick hath been alwayes visible though oft-times invisible at Rome unlesse errors and heresies prove Catholick because professed at Rome 5. All this your Tutors reply not to nor hardly take notice of but have directed you to fall from your former desires upon new questions tempting me as the Pharisees did our Saviour but resolving to receive no answer Thus you put me to more trouble not with a mind to be satisfied but meerly to cavill and to slide over those arguments and testimonies which they are not able to answer or disprove Is not this to speak nothing lest you should seem to be silent Are these things which I have delivered true or false If true (k) A quâ—cunque verum dicitur illo inspirante dicitur qui ipse veritas est Aug. ep 28. let truth prevaile If false disprove them if impertinent manifest it Otherwise if you thus seek evasions you will enforce me to acquaint the world with your shifts and shufflings by publishing these papers that every eye may discern what is the weaknesse of your cause and what your obstinacy 6. Your intent being to decline what you cannot answer you divert me from the former businesse thus (l) n. 2. My originall doubt was say you that sith the Catholick Church must be alway visible and that I could not by my best inquiry finde that a succession of men professing the doctrine of the Church of England had been alway visible that that Church was not the nor any part of the Catholick Church What have I to doe with your originall doubt Your Letter and the expression of your desire I looked upon I endeavoured to satisfie your request and I presume a satisfactory answer was given to your demands that so I might win a soul not so much to our Church as to the Communion of Saints and to lead you out of error into the way of truth That the Catholick Church is hath been and must be alway visible is agreed on both hands But by your best enquiry you could not finde that a succession of men professing the doctrine of the Church of England had been alway visible No more could the Pharisees see the Prophesies that concerned our Saviour though never so visible Alas poore Gentleman little Learning are you troubled with you are not able to search the Scriptures Councels and Fathers as you ought and your enquiry hath been of such as are either ignorant or wilfully blinde and bent to misguide you 7. The doctrine of the Church of England is cleare in our Book of Common-prayer that is the rule for the Laity and such as the true Catholick Church hath alwayes imbraced and continued All therein is positive The Book of Articles is a rule for the Clergy to preserve them from error and much therein is negative He that means sincerely to instruct you so in the right way that you may be a guide to others must give you directions to avoyd the by-paths The positive doctrine of this Church was ever professed and is visible in all Catholick writers But you insist upon no particulars and guile lurks under generalls But I beseech you before you turned over to the Church of Rome why did not you make the like enquiry to finde out a succession of men professing the doctrine of the Church of Rome in those particulars wherein we dissent from them of that Communion If thus you had done you might easily have discerned that that Church is not the nor any part of the Catholick Church if wee goe by your line For the most skilfull of your party are not able to shew such a succession of men in the first 700 years of Christianity 8. But you are pleased to adde that (m) n. 2. to this doubt at our conference I endeavoured your satisfaction by attempting to prove that though the Church of England had not been alway visible at least not seen yet seeing she is but a member of the Catholick Church of which the Church of Rome is another it was sufficient that the Catholick Church had been alway visible in the Church of Rome and other particular Churches though not in the Church of England Good God what foreheads have men Is this could this possibly be my answer Who alwayes justifie that this Church hath been visible since the first or second Conversion though not alwayes under Reformation And for Rome I have demonstrated that the Catholick Church was not alway visible in that City or Diocese § 22 23 29. As also what kind of Church yee had for 450 yeers together § 33. when hardly the form either of Religion or a Church was there to be seen Yet visible it was here when invisible at Rome For you can never shew that this Church was overrun with Montanism Arianism or Eutychianism Yea this was a learned and pious Church when yours was miserably possest with ignorance and impiety Look upon your owne Mr. Pits his Catalogue of our Writers and this will manifestly appeare 9. However then (n) n. 3. that discourse which I sent unto you gave you no satisfaction yet it abundantly clears the questions proposed in your Letter Neither can I possibly expect to withdraw you from that faction who are resolved to receive no satisfaction unlesse we grant that the Church of Rome and those in communion with her are the onely Catholick Church And yet I never reade in Fathers or Councels that to communicate with Rome is either a sure or any token of a good Catholick St. Austine assures us that (o) Aug. quaest Evangel secund Mat. c. 12. they are good Catholicks qui fidem integram sequuntur bonos more 's who hold the undefiled Faith full and whole and observe good manners and those that endevour not to doe this are much to blame While then thus we doe we are good Catholicks But that Faith which we have received from the Apostles and Councels and Fathers we keep whole and undefiled without alteration addition or diminution While they are right we are so If they be out of the way we are content to erre with them Catholicks we are true right Catholicks by Lirinensis rule (p) Vincent Lirin c. 25. Gods truth the Church the body of Christ we love We prefer no mans no Churches authority no affection no wit no eloquence no philosophie nothing whatsoever before Divine Religion and the Catholick Faith These things we set light by and being fixed firme in faith we have determined by Gods grace to hold and beleeve that and that onely which we know to have been held by the Catholick Church universally of old from the beginning of Christianity And whatever new or unheard of doctrine we shall perceive to have been induced by any particular man or Church besides or against all the holy men of God this we understand to proceed from
a separation for points not necessary I freely subscribe to what he says But withall he tells us that (x) Archbishop Lawd §. 23. In the Church of Rome there are errors in Doctrine and some of them such as most manifestly endanger salvation And I hope it is lawfull to separate from these especially since your most able friends grant that (y) A. C. p. 56. Error in the doctrine of Faith is a just cause of Separation But the same Bishop hath proved that (z) Archbishop Lawd §. 33. n. 13. the Church of Rome hath erred in the doctrine of Faith and dangerously too in severall particulars In those his words then which you mention he touches not us but you not us who are separated passively but your Church which hath actually actively separated and excommunicated us for points not necessary not to be endured in an Orthodoxe Church Thus the cause the fault rests upon you not upon us 15. Whereas then you tell us (a) n. 4. If we say we did not make the Separation but the Church of Rome then Luther Tindall c. did not goe out of the Church of Rome but the Church of Rome out of them What consequence is this or what is this to us What Tindall did I know not neither does it concern us What Luther did I know if the History of the Councel of Trent misguide me not He humbly acquainted you with your errors and enormities and desired redresse and for this ye most unchristianly thrust him forth of your communion resolving rather to persevere in error then to amend what was and is amisse For my part I am resolved not to justifie any man or act against the consent and rules of the ancient Church But our Reformation was legall and canonicall as is fully proved § 20.21 We went not out of the Church to make a Reformation but this we did in the Church according to the laudable customes and canons of the ancient Church And whoever condemnes us for this he condemnes himselfe of grosse ignorance or malice I may justly therefore say with Moses (b) Num. 16.7 Ye take too much upon you ye sons of Levi Ye men of Rome ye transgresse the 92. 165. canons of the Catholick Church by medling beyond your bounds as also by imposing upon us and other Countreys the Creed of Pius Quartus which is contrary to the 177. Canon of the same Code 16. Yet as if no satisfaction were given to your demands you proceed thus (c) n. 5. Therefore I had reason still as in my Letter to demand a Church distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion of which no man that reads your answer can thereby I think receive satisfaction So you think and some that have read it think otherwise and conceive that I have given full satisfaction to your demands though you be resolved to turn your eares another way For I have demonstrated that when the Church of Rome and those in her communion were no members of the Catholick Church there were at that very time severall Orthodoxe Churches in France § 23. in Asia Sardinia Aegypt and at Constantinople All which at the same instant abhorred those heresies which Rome professed and would have no communion with her or her heresies 17. But say you (d) Ib. the whole drift and scope of my Papers is either to prove First that the Church of Rome and those in her communion is not the Catholick Church Secondly that the Church of Rome and those in communion with her and the Church of England are but one that is severall members of one Church To these in their order For the first you speak truth The Church of Rome and those in her communion is not the Catholick Church this is both said and proved § 12 c. There my minde may be fully seen and till that be disproved I shall adde onely thus much If the Church of Rome be not the Catholick as I affirm and yet the Catholick alwayes visible then was there a Church distinct from the Romane Church when Rome it selfe was not Catholick But there was a time when Rome was not Catholick not Orthodoxe as is proved in my former Papers § 18 23 27 29. 18. Your reply to that which I wrote before is this (e) n. 6. For the first That the Church of Rome and those in communion with her was not the Catholick Church for that time I required you shew no proofe that I doe finde but that some of the Popes have been Hereticks or Schismaticks Proofe then is shewed for this and this I take to be proofe enough For if the head be amisse the whole body is out of tune But the Bishop is (f) Concil Nic. Diatyp 2. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the head or as the head of that Church whereto he is prefer'd over which he is placed For (g) Episcopus est in Ecclesia Ecclesia in Episcopo Cypr. ep 69. n. 31. as the Bishop is in the Church so is the Church in the Bishop and such as the Bishop is such is the Church presumed to be till it renounce the Bishops errors for h by the Bishop every Church communicates with other Churches Hence it is that at the ordination of a Bishop the Metropolitan or other Bishops of that Province acquaint the Primate therewith and he the other Bishops within his Diocese that so they might know with and by whom they ought to communicate with other Churches This is to be seen in St. Cyprian (i) Cyp. l. 4. ep 8. by the ordination of Cornelius as also (k) Euseb hist l. 7. c. 24. by the deposition of Paulus Samosatenus by the ordination of Domnus into the See of Antioch (l) Ib. This intelligence was given that so they might know to whom to write and from whom to receive Letters of communion 19. That some yea divers of your Popes were Hereticks or Schismaticks is throughly manifested out of your own men § 18 32 c. And while Hereticks (m) Cod. Eccl. Vnivers Can. 171. both themselves and all that side with them are secluded from Ecclesiasticall communion every way (n) Ib. All their Episcopall acts are made void and (o) Ib. Can. 172. those Bishops which adhere to them are to be degraded from their Episcopacy While therefore your Bishops were Hereticall your Church was in an ill case it could not possibly be Catholick when all Episcopall acts were void Is not this a main evidence against you (p) § 23. Some proofe there is also from St. Hilary who professeth that in these Western parts there was in his time no Christian communion but in France This touches not onely the Bishop but the whole Church of Rome and all that adhered to him or that 20. For all this as if it were doubtfull whether your Bishops were such you adjoin (q) n. 6. Which if admitted though it is not to
perchance in all parts of the habitable world at the same time (n) 1. Cor. 12.12 One it is but many members As the body is one and hath many members so is Christ (o) Chrysost in loc Pro Ecclesia posuit Christum for the Church he sets down Christ since the Church is his body (p) 1. Cor. 12.13 into which we are all baptized This body hath many members these members are diffused from sea to sea over the whole earth So the Church is in Greece Italy Spain France England Polonia and * Unus spiritus inesse omnibus infusus membris una anima meritò dicitur quia una in omnibus fides unus ab omnibus colitur Deus atque ex uno ore hymnos omnes concinunt Deo Ruffin hist l. 9. c. 10. whereever the Catholick faith and Apostolicall government are continued Thus we acknowledge Rome to be a Church as St. Paul did Corinth though an erroneous and superstitious Church You see now where you may communicate with the Catholick but it is left to your discretion to choose whether you will communicate with a reformed or a superstitious Church 24. Now to the second where I say That the Church of Rome and those in her communion and the Church of England are but severall members of the one Catholick Church You reply thus (q) n. 7. That I conceive cannot be 1. For the reasons inferred from the Articles of your Church as above 2. For that the Articles of faith of both Churches are directly contradictory as appears by many your negative Articles I look not upon your conceits but upon your reasons inferred from the Articles of our Church which are already satisfied § 12 13. And whereas you adde that the Articles of faith of both Churches are directly contradictory I hope it is not so If it be I am certaine one of these is no Church For then (r) 1. Cor. 3.11 we build not both upon the same foundation (s) Colos 2.19 we hold not the head from which all the body receives nourishment and is knit compacted together by joynts and bands Quid itaque relicto capite membris adhaeres Why then do you leave the head to cleave to the members corrupt putrified members He that builds upon the rock builds upon sure grounds (t) Aug. de verb. Domini Ser. 45. c. 7. Veni ergo mecum si vis superpetram noli mihi velle esse pro petra if then you befor the rock go along with me and seek not to be the rock to me Behold we build upon the rock we beleeve in God the Father in God the Son and God the holy Ghost I hope ye doe so too We also beleeve the Unity in Trinity and Trinity in Unity And do not ye so too Hitherto we are both upon the Rock We beleeve the * We devoutly professe and in all points follow the faith which is contained in the three Creeds that is to say of the Apostles of the Councel of Nice and of Athanasius The Protest of Bishop Scory c. Book of Mart. p. 2119. three Creeds and in the same sense the Primitive Church received them which ye doe not but give some of the Articles a new another sense Here then ye are beside the Rock 25. Thus we agree and yet not agree we agree in the foundation not in the superstruction in the letter not in the exposition And we are sorry to see you forget your selves so much as to infringe so memorable so necessary a Canon as that of the Councel of Ephesus which decrees that (u) Conc. Ephes Can. 7. It is not lawfull for any one to bring to write or compose any other Creed besides that which was agreed upon by those holy Fathers assembled in the holy Ghost at Nice He that offends in this kind against this Canon is deeply censured If a Bishop he is to be deprived of his Cure if a Clergy-man of his function but if a Lay-man he is to be turned out of the Churches communion But ye have imposed a new another Creed of Pius Quartus upon the Church which whosoever will not subscribe to he is at least no good Catholick w th you 26. Say not that these are expositions they are dangerous additions and though I cannot say ye have altered the letter yet I dare be bold to say ye have strangely alter'd the sense (x) Tertul. de Praescrip c. 38. auferendo proprietates singulorum verborum adjiciendo dispositiones non comparentium rerum by taking away the proper sense of severall words and by inserting imaginations of such things as have no footing in holy Writ Whereas we as we ought take the rule of Faith in the literall sense (y) Quae nullas habet apad nos quaesliones nisi quas haereses inferunt quae Haereticos faciunt Ib. c. 14. and that raiseth no controversies with us but such as heresies bring in and such as make Hereticks Your selves your own Church ye may charge with contradictions this Church ye cannot This is the plea we stand upon (z) Ib. c. 21. Communicamus cum Ecclestis Apostolicis quod nulla vel in nullo doctrina diversa hoc est testimonium veritatis we cannot but communicate with the Primitive the Apostolick Churches whose doctrine is in nothing different from theirs This is such a testimony of the truth that it is above all exception And resolved I am with Gods blessing to be no longer of this communion then I shall be able to make this good 27. And whereas (a) n. 7. Mr. Hooker sayes That the Children of the visible Church are signed with this mark One Lord ONE FAITH one Baptisme I presume you make no doubt of this Neither can I think but that you are resolved whoever denies the Lord of life or renounceth the Catholick faith or is baptized into any other Baptism then that one which our Saviour instituted or is a second time baptized he is no childe of the visible Church since that hath taught us to beleeve one Baptism for the remission of sins He then that forsakes this faith forsakes the Church 28. Thirdly you adde that (b) Ib. I my selfe charge the Church of Rome with errors in matters of faith no lesse then in foure points viz. Transubstantiation Communion in one kinde Invocation of Saints and Adoration of images As if I were the first or the onely man that charged you with these errors whereas (c) Art 22 28 30. this is done by our whole Church and the Inditement is made good by that learned Archbishop of B. memory The Church saith that these doctrines are (d) Art 22. fond things grounded upon no warranty of Scripture but rather repugnant to the Word of God The Archbishop hath charged it home and you know not how to shift it off It would well therefore become a Christian Church to redress these and your other
lead we know it by his Will give us that which ye received and not gilded stuffe in stead of gold If ye tender to us that which is unwarrantable we are resolved (b) Gal. 1.8 9. with the vessel of Election to denounce to you or any other an Anathema we shall not we must not endure novum dogma any new Article If new it can never be right (c) 2 Tim. 3.15 The Scripture is able to make us wise unto salvation that we set before us and are resolved by Gods grace to accept of nothing but what is deduced from thence or proved thereby according to the interpretation of the ancient Fathers and Councels While our Church does thus in spight of malice she shall be Catholick (d) Dediscam benè quod didicerunt non benè Vincent Lirin c. 25. If we chance to learn any thing contrary to this we are bound in Christianity to cast it by though it come from Rome and to (e) Ib. betake our selves into the bosome of our Catholick Mother as into the safest harbor There we are sure to find the living waters and tree of life 45. Your desire is behind but differing from the former Before your desire was to be shewn the Catholick Church distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion for the last 1100 years To this satisfaction is given § 29 32 c. But now (f) n. 9. your desire is to be showed the Catholick Church or the Church of England distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion for the last 1100 years or for so â—â—ng as I please to say the Church of Rome hath so grievously erred that we dare not communicate with her This desire of yours according to your own words is not nor by my Papers can he satisfied Is it not enough to manifest that your present errors are so grosse and grievous that we dare not communicate with the Church of Rome but we must look back to former centuries In my former Papers I have done it but you will not see it Other eyes I presume will discern this done § 32 33 34. in my former answer Of these you take little notice because you are resolved with the self-conceited Pharisee to be what you are And with (g) §. 11. that Lady I spake of you ask not this or any other question as if you meant to be satisfied with what is or can be said Surely we did not communicate with Rome in the time of Zepherinus Marcellinus Liberius Vigilius Honorius and those (h) Genebrard Chron. l. 4. Ann. 991. 50 Apostaticall Popes whom Genebrard speaks of And great reason for it since in those dayes ye separated your selves from the Church Catholick to side with Hereticks and worse if worse may be Then was this Church distinct from yours because yours was divided from that Church (i) 1. Tim. 3.15 which is the pillar and ground of truth If ye depart from the truth we shall and must depart from you (k) Hos 4.15 Though Israel transgresse yet must not Judah sin We must not be naught for company (l) Exod. 23.2 neither may we follow a multitude to doe evill Your Letters are answered and your desires I hope satisfied beyond your desire Your conclusion I like so well it shall be mine With you therefore I beseech Almighty God to look favourably into the souls deceived by devillish deceits that all hereticall impieties removed the hearts of them that erre may relent and return to the unity of his truth and become one fold under one shepheard Jesus Christ our Lord to whom with the Father and the holy Ghost be all honor and glory world without end Amen Placet vobis quaestio proposita Deus adjuvet ut placeat soluta Ecce quod dico ut liberet me vos 1. In una enim fide stamus in nomine Christi 2. in una domo 3. sub uno Domino vivimus 4. in uno corpore membra 5. sub uno capite sumus 6. uno spiritu vegetamur Aug. de Verb. Domini Ser. 63. c. 3. FINIS
die so 19. But I know what you drive at You were pleased to ask where our Church was before the Reformation It was answer'd in the Catholick Next you inquired whether the Catholick were alwayes visible The reply was affirmative both here and in other places But before the Reformation we communicated with Rome and since we have not That 's no fault of ours yee will no suffer us to communicate with you unlesse we communicate with your errors And yet we shall maugre Satan communicate with the Catholick Church while (u) Ro. 15.6 with one mind and one mouth we glorifie God even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ according to this the Nicene and the Apostles Creed While we pray for the Church Universall and for all Bishops Pastors and Curates thereof While we pray for all Gods people for all that have erred and are deceived even for our enemies persecutors and slanderers While we continue the Apostolick government and while we not onely receive but administer the Sacraments according to Christs holy Ordinance we shall be in the communion of the Catholick Church 20. Truth it is as that judicious Bishop told Mr. Fisher (x) Archbishop Lawd § 21. n. 1. the cause of the Schisme is yours for yee thrust us from you because we called for Truth and redresse of abuses What was then to be done must we swallow untruths and wink at abuses that we may collogue and communicate with you It had not wont to be so every Province had wont to reform it selfe And so she did not transgresse the Faith or Canons of the Church Catholick the reformation was both legall and commendable We did so with our Provinces following therein the ancient Canons of the Church which assure us that (y) Concil Constantinop can 2. every Provinciall Synod is to order all things within the Province And for full satisfaction those Fathers of Constantinople justifie this Canon by the Decrees of the Nicene Councel Indeed sometimes (z) Ib. can 6. it may happen that the businesse will prove to be of such consequence and circumspection that a Provinciall Synod is not fit to determine it What is then to be done That very Canon says (a) Ib. in such a case we must not make our addresse to a Generall Councel but to a greater Synod of the Bishops of that Diocese called together for that purpose But we must observe that in the ancient both Civil and Ecclesiastical acceptation (b) Dixcesis multas sub se habet provincias Balsam in conc Chalced. Can. 9. a Diocese contains in it many Provinces This Councel we ought not to decline by molesting the Emperour or any secular Magistrates with complaints as our late Ministers have done This is not canonicall and the complaint is not to be admitted We are therefore to take notice that (c) Notit Imp. l. 2. c. 48. the three Britains were a Diocese of themselves and had a Praefectus Praetorio for Civil and a Primate for Ecclesiastical affaires (d) Cantuariae prima sedes Archiepiscopi habetur qui est totius Angliae Primas Patriarcha Guil. Malmesbur in Prologo l. 1. de Gest Pontif. Angl. p. 195. The Primate or Patriarch is the Archbishop of Canterbury So then our Reformation is not after any new or lately invented model it is according to the ancient course and canons of the Church and therefore justifiable If we had taken any other course in our Reformation we had done amisse For according to the Councel of Constantinople (e) Concil Constantinop can 6. we had run into an high contempt 1. by slighting all the Bishops of this Diocese 2. by injuring the Canons and 3. by subverting the Ecclesiasticall order and government 21. In submission to these Canons the Church did usually reform both in manners and faith by Diocesan or Provinciall Councels as is to be seen in the Code of the Vniversal Church in the African-Code in Balsamon and Zonaras in the Councels of Spain and in the Councels of England set forth by that pious and worthy Knight Sir Henry Spelman Much in this kind is readily presented to every eye by our learned Archbishop § 24. n. 4. Where you may see this course approved by your own learned men (f) Alb. Mag. in 1. Dist 11. A. 9. Albertus Magnus and that (g) Gerson de Gen. Concil Vnius obedien part 1. p. 222. famous Chancellour of Paris to be not onely lawfull but sometimes necessary Indeed to what purpose is it to justifie that to be (h) Perfecta Synodus illa est cui interest Metropolitanus Episcopus Cod. Eccles univers Can. 95. a full a perfect Synod wherein a Metropolitan is present if it may not upon just occasion amend what is amisse within her own precincts What is it then a perfect Synod for Otherwise Israel must not have reformed without Judah nor Judah without Israel Neither must Laodicea have cast off her wicked courses unlesse the rest of the Churches in Asia would have joyned in the Reformation They that dare say this are wiser then God Almighty For he calls to every one of these in particular to repent and amend with in themselves what is faulty And though Timothy had failed of his duty at Ephesus it had been no excuse for Titus to wink at abuses and disorders in Crete (i) Hos 4.15 Though Israel transgresse yet let not Judah sinne 22. Hitherto my Propositions as you terme them from whence you inferre as a necessary consequence thus Then by your own saying The Inference the Catholick Church must be distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion It must be so just as a reasonable creature is distinct from Socrates the species from the individuum or particular person Socrates is a reasonable creature but not all not the onely reasonable creature every individual person is as much man as much a reasonable creature and hath as much of man in him as Socrates This will be the more easily discerned if we look upon St. Paul's comparison (k) 1 Cor. 12. who likens the Church to a body consisting of many members One member is not the body nor the body one member but many The body receives not life from the members but every member from the body The body can live without the hand or foot or eye indeed without all these but none of these can live when sever'd from the body The Catholick Church hath subsisted without the Church of Rome but the Church of Rome cannot subsist without the Catholick The Church did stand without Rome before Rome was a Church And the Church was visible in the time of Marcellinus Liberius and John 22. when Rome was no member thereof (l) Cypr. de unit Eccles Adulterari non potest Sponsa Christi though Rome defile her selfe the Spouse of Christ is not cannot be made an Harlot The tree is sound though the leaves fall and
be so in some of them for that time yet it doth not make that whole Church to be Hereticall or Schismaticall Sir though not admitted by you and your Masters yet it is acknowledged by your own learned men Lyra Stella Almain Platina Onuphrius and others that some of your Bishops have been Hereticall and some Schismaticall And that not for a small time as you seem to imply but for many generations (r) Aventin Annal. Boior l. 5. p. 447. for 450 yeers together they were an infamie to their Order as Aventinus testifies God forbid that I should passe sentence upon every particular person but as a City is rebellious when the Governour and the party prevalent withstand and affront the Prince though many loyall subjects be in that City so when the Bishop and the prevailing part with him fall into heresie that Church is adjudged Hereticall and the denomination is taken from the more eminent and potent faction Thus (s) Socrat. l. 3. c. 29. Sozom. l. 4. c. 10. Rome it selfe was accounted Arian while Bishop Felix communicated with Arians and ordained divers of that persuasion Ministers of that Church And yet blessed be God (t) Theodoret. l. 2. c. 17. Rome at that time had many good people that would not communicate with that Bishop 21. But in the words following it is little lesse then confessed that your Bishops were such as I have related (u) n. 6. For as your next words speak I beleeve you will yeeld that the King of England or Archbishop of Canterbury may be an Heretick or Schismatick and yet the Church of England be still part of the Church Catholick Sir we must distinguish between a professed and close Heretick Those that communicate with a professed Heretick are as he is Hence is it that (x) Theodoret. l. 2. c. 17. Sozom l. 4. c. 10. Felix Bishop of Rome though inwardly Orthodox was adjudged Hereticall for holding communion with the Arians But with a close a concealed Heretick we may communicate and be guiltlesse Thus (y) Act. 8.13 St. Philip communicated a while with Simon Magus (z) 1 Tim. 1.20 St. Paul with Hymeneus and the rest of the Apostles with Nicolaus and were blamelesse But this is to perswade us that your Church was Catholick when your Bishop an Heretick Thus the Popes infallibility is shrunk into heresie it is fallen out of the chaire into the body of the Church and the head shall receive health from the members not the members from the head Whereas anciently the Saints of God judged of the Church by the Bishop not of the Bishop by the Church Yea (a) Concil Nic. Can. 5. the communion of the Church is estimated by communicating with the Bishop and (b) Cod. Eccles Univers can 169 if any whether Priest or other shall sever themselves from their Canonicall Bishop and shall call a Congregation against him or without his directions they are censured to be Hereticks The reason is because (c) Concil Nic. Diatyp 2. the Bishop is as it were the head the life of his Church and (d) Concil Nic. Can. 4. ought not to be ordained without the approbation of all the Bishops of that Province And I know Liberius was ordained with this circumspection Thus the Bishop elected is presumed to be of the same Religion with the rest of the Province and the Province with the Metropolitan Provided therefore it is that (e) Cod. Eccles Univers Can. 5.99.104 the Synod of that Province censure him if he faile of their expectation and depart from the Orthodoxe faith And (f) Ib. Can. 171 172. if they do not they are alike guilty and all that adhere to him or them 22. And for the parties instanced the King of England and Archbishop of Canterbury I beleeve that either or both of them may be Hereticks and this Church not so since it is not their being but our complying that makes us hereticall But if all our Bishops be of the same Religion with them this Church is in an ill case You or I may save our owne soules by not communicating with them by dissenting from them and by protesting against their unsound doctrine But the Church is not to be judged of by you or me but by those that sit in Moses chaire and are (g) 2. Cor. 2.16 either the savour of life unto life or the savour of death unto death For (h) St. Mat. 5.13 if the salt lose its savour wherewith shall it be salted how mended how recovered Surely (i) Ib. it is to be cast forth of the Church out of the dignity it is in and trampled upon as good for nothing This was spoken to the Apostles and with them to their successors But when the King and Priest joyne together it hath a strange influence upon the People for good or bad (k) 4. Reg. 16.10 c. When King Ahaz and Vrijah the Priest professed Idolatry with open face though many good men were resident among them yet was that City and People accounted Hereticall The power of the sword drawes some to sympathize and too many to temporize This is to be seen under the reign of (l) Ista edictorum Imperatoris vi quae in partes Occidentis miserat confecta sunt Socrat. l. 2. c. 29. Constantius Julian Valens and others where we see Religion much depend upon the Imperiall breath But if Prince and Bishop concurre in Religion they hardly meet with opposition Look upon Antioch under Constantius the Emperour and Leontius the Bishop upon Constantinople under Valens and Bishop Eudoxius and you shall see how suddenly they were overrun with heresie Now if it should fall out so unhappily with any or all the Cities of this Kingdome the Diocesan or Nationall Church so infected shall be deemed Hereticall Under K. Edward VI. and Queen Mary the Religion of this Church was judged of by the Governors and thus shall we deal with Rome 23. (n) 6. But if it were granted say you that the Popes of Rome being Schismaticks or Hereticks should annihilate that Church yet that could give me no satisfaction who required not where is not the Catholick Church but where it is that I might communicate with it And I say if the Church of Rome bee annihilated by the Popes Heresie or Apostasie she shall be no Church much lesse the Catholick What then shall become of those Churches in her communion surely they are all in an ill in the same case with her Grant but this and the controversie is at an end You have satisfaction and I ease But this will not serve your turn who now require not where is not but where is the Catholick Church Well if this will give you satisfaction I shall tell you this too The Catholick Church is where ever the Catholick faith is preserved and Apostolick government continued (m) Chrysost in 1. Cor. 12. It hath been dispersed through the whole world though not
errors that we and others who protest against these unwarrantable doctrines may communicate freely with you 29. (e) n. 7. You would therefore willingly hear how I distinguish between errors in matters of faith pertinaciously held and heresie What 's this to the point in hand This is but onely to tempt me into another discourse nothing to our purpose As there is great difference between error and pertinacy so is there also between errors in faith and errors in matters of faith Errors in faith are such as are against the Creed errors in matters of faith I understand to be such as concern the faith in points of lower moment that deny not the letter of the text but give and impose for by-ends some unwarrantable expositions unknown to antiquity Such is that which was (f) Cod. Eccles Vniver can 177 brought in by Charisius and such are yours which the Church of England nominates Though these with the former batter not the foundation yet they endanger the out-works and will in time make way to undermine some of the necessary forts 30. 'T is very true that an error in faith pertinaciously maintained is no lesse then heresie but we say not so of errors in matters of faith (g) Quid faciat Haereticum regulari quâdam definitione comp ehendi sicut ego existimo aut omnino non potâ—st aut difficillime potest Aug. Praefat. ad li. de Haeres St. Austin was very cautelous in defining an Heretick and I shall be wary how I determine what heresie separates from the Catholick Church And yet your Masters cannot deny but St. Cyprian not St. Austin as you mistake resolves thus (h) Cypr. Pompeio ep Haeresis Christi sponsa non est Heresie is not the spouse of Christ But every thing that is called heresie by you or error in doctrine with us will not separate from the Catholick communion St. Austin therefore limits it thus (i) Aug. de Fide Symb. c. 10. Haeretici de Deo falsa sentiendo ipsam fidem violant Quapropter non pertinent ad Ecclesiam Catholicam every violation of the faith cuts not off from the Catholick Church but a false opinion of God does beware of that take heed how you think amisse of the blessed Trinity or any person therein And in this sense is that of Tertullian to be understood (k) Tertul. de Praescrip c 37. Si Haeretici sunt Christiani esse non possunt where an heresie is against any person of the Trinity there 's no Christianity That Great Athanasius therefore tells us that (l) Athan. de Spiritu sancto p. 202. 203. this beliefe in the Father the Son and the holy Ghost Christ gave to be setled in the Church as a foundation to the Church the foundation of faith and the faith of the Catholick Church And (m) Ib p. 204. whoever divides the Son from the Father or reckons the holy Ghost among creatures he neither hath the Father nor the Son sed impius est sine Deo infideli deterior quidvis potius quam Christianus but he is an impious man without God worse then an Infidel and any thing rather then a Christian. And if no Christian no member of the Church * Hilar. Pict ad Constant Aug. p. 273. Catholicus sum nolo esse Haereticus Christianus sum non Arianus Thus far I dare goe with these Fathers but no further But if as you will have it every error in matters of faith pertinaciously held be an heresie and separate from the Catholick Church Rome hath been in an ill case for many yeers For those foure errors mentioned § 29. ye have held with pertinacy enough and yet are they by the Archbishop strongly proved to be errors though your stomachs be too high to retract them 31. But you would fain have me doe what our Church hath never done that is to charge your Church with heresie for say you (n) n. 7. if the Church of Rome be guilty of heresie she is no part of the Catholick Church But I never said she was guilty of heresie and till I have just cause to say so I shall forbear to say that she is no part of the Catholick Church And I shall be as tender as my betters have been to set down (o) Archbishop Lawd §. 11. n. 1. what errors in doctrine may give just cause of separation in this bedy or the parts of it one from another I have satisfied my selfe that the Reformation of this Church was Canonicall and is justifiable and that she was and is a very member of the Catholick in whose communion I have ever lived wherein also by Gods grace I am resolved to die And it were wisdome in you to see your Church justified from those foure errors before you enter into further controversies As for that (p) n. 7. which you produce out of the 11 Sect. there it is sufficiently proved that your Church hath most sacrilegiously robbed the Laity of Christs blood This is not denyed I take it therefore for confessed and hope your Masters will see it mended 32. Well if we will not declare yours to be no Church you will prove yours or ours to be no Church and upon these grounds (q) Ib. 4 ly say you Christs mysticall body is but one and although that body is made up of many members yet all those members must communicate one with another for if a member be separated but by schisme it is like an arm cut off from the body or a branch from the vine which make that arm or branch no part of the body or vine What though all this be granted will this make one of the two no Church I beleeve not That Christs mysticall body is but one the Scripture speaks more then once 1 Cor. 12.13 Eph. 1.23 Col. 1.18 That may not be denyed or questioned That this body is made up of many members is liwise testified Ro. 12.4 5. 1. Cor. 12.12 c. And we know all those members must communicate one with another and wherein (r) 1. Cor. 12.25 26. in the same care one for another in the same sufferings and rejoycings one with another We are not bound to communicate with you in the same ceremonies gesture superstition or error no more then the hand is bound to communicate with the foot in going the heels with the ears in hearing or either with the other in the gout or any other disease The difference between you us is this we love the body and hate the disease but you love the body so that ye love and foster the disease hate those that are not visited with the like contagion We communicate with you in the necessaries in Faith Hope and Charity as also in all things essentiall to a Church We beleeve the Scriptures and the three Creeds with you though not alwayes in the same sense Our hopes are the same with yours though we something differ in
upon Apostolicall truth insinuates this unto us thus we know it thus we beleeve it And for the Sacrifice of the Masse as ye call it we acknowledge it to be a Commemorative Sacrifice Let us have the Communion in both kindes presse us not to beleeve Transubstantiation or any of your late inventions and I know no reason but we may frequent that which ye call the Sacrifice of the Masse I shall not quarrel the word when the main matter is agreed upon 37. Heretofore whatever you think so little exception was there to our Divine Service Worship Sacraments Prayers and holy Rites that those two memorable Bishops (q) Bo. of Mar. Bonner and Gardiner communicated with us in them and so did most of the Romane Catholicks of this Nation for ten yeers under Queen Elizabeth till that terrible Bull of Pius Quintus came thundering out Yea Bishop Gardiner subscribes that the Common-prayer book is a devout a godly a Christian Book and Order c. * Ib. p. 1357. But as it was with the Donatists so is it much alike with you (r) Aug. de Verb. Dom. Ser. 49. c. 10. they in the height of pride trumpeted it out Nos sanctificamus nos justificamus nos facimus justos we are the men that sanctifie we are the men that justifie we make you just Ecce quo ascenderunt Behold to what an height they were grown And are not ye ascended to a strange height to say Nos facimus Catholicos Wee are they that make men Catholicks Side with us and ye are Catholicks differ from us in the least point and ye are Hereticks St. Paul is of another minde (s) Ro. 14.3 4. in meats in matters of indifferency in such things that are not of necessity to be done we are not to judge one another (t) Phil. 3.15 16. If in these kinde of things and such as tend to perfection of life we be otherwise minded God shall reveal even this unto us so that we walk by the same rule whereto we have attained That is (u) Chrysost in loc so we preserve the same faith and keep the same commandements So St. Chrysostome These these are the rule we must be sure to walke by 38. From Divine service you descend to the publick Statutes and Laws of the Land whereby it is enacted (x) n. 8. that any one who should reconcile one of the Church of England to the Church of Rome is guilty of death And reason good since ye have so many traitrous principles against the Oaths of Allegiance and Supremacy against the honor and safety of Princes Indeed what is this reconciling to Rome which by the Laws is condemned but a withdrawing of the people from their obedience to give that to the Pope which is due to their Prince This is plain by the Statute whose words are these (y) 3. Jac. 4. That person who shall put in practise to absolve perswade or withdraw any of his Majesties Subjects from their naturall OBEDIENCE TO HIS MAJESTY or to reconcile them to the Pope or Sea of Rome or to move them or any of them to PROMISE OBEDIENCE TO ANY PRETENDED AUTHORITY OF THE SEA OF ROME That then every such person their Procurers c. shall be adjudged Traitors and being thereof lawfully convicted shall have judgment and suffer as in cases of High Treason You see the Law and the reason of this Law If this will not satisfie the same Statute sayes moreover that (z) Ib. It is found by daily experience that many his Majesties Subjects that adhere in their hearts to the Popish Religion by the infection drawn from thence and by the wicked and devillish counsel of Jesuites Seminaries c. are so far PERVERTED IN POINT OF LOYALTY and due allegiance as they are ready to entertain and execute any treasonable conspiracies and practises as appears by the Gunpowder-treason By this time you see the reason of this Act and cannot deny it to be just 39. But if you speak truth a Priest that shall but celebrate Masse is made guilty of High Treason So you say but upon search I can find no such Statute Indeed an Act there is that (a) 23. Eliz. 1. Every person that shall say or sing Masse being thereof lawfully convicted shall forfeit the summe of 200 Marks and be committed to prison till he pay this summe And (b) Ib. Every person that shall willingly hear Masse shall forfeit the summe of 100 Marks and suffer imprisonment for a yeer The like penall Laws have been heretofore set forth by the best Christian Emperours (c) Socrat. l. 1. c. 6 Sozom. l. 1. c. 19. by Constantine the Great against the Arians But the Donatists were Schismaticall Sectaries and (d) Aug. ep 48. against these he made also a Decree that so many of those as refused to be united to the Church should forfeit their personall estates Many such Laws are to be seen in the African Code And our Saviours command is that (e) St. Luc. 14.23 the people be compelled to come into his house And this care hath been taken for the good of all sorts of Recusants that so (f) 1. Eliz. 2. 23. Eliz. 1. they might be drawn to Church to serve God with one mind and one mouth which every National Church is bound to doe Care therefore is taken that (g) Cod. Eccles Vnivers can 81 we pray with the people But how doe they pray with the people who pray in a tongue the people understand not (h) Ib. Neither ought we in times of peace to communicate with such as meet in private houses and frequent not the Church prayers (i) Ib. And they that abhorre one Church are not to be received into another Yee therefore that will not communicate in prayers with your own Mother Church ought not to be received by any member of the Catholick And in doing so in receiving such as you are Rome offends against the Laws of the Catholick Church 40. These Canons are little observed little thought of all that is studyed in these dayes is to continue the breach and to make it wider Hence is this exclamation (k) n. 8. How therefore can one Church Christs mysticall hody grow up together of such different members That Christs mysticall body consists and growes up of different members is clear 1. Cor. 12.12 c. and all these receive life and power from the same head even those very members that are distorted or diseased The sound hand therefore cannot say to the lame leg or gouty foot Thou art not of the same body but according to the directions of the head the sound hand provides and applies a plaister to the diseased member Observable it is that between the Eastern Western Churches were many differences viz. 1. About the observation of Easter 2. Rebaptization of Hereticks 3. Procession of the holy Ghost 4. The number of Sacraments 5. The manner of
Ordination 6. The Canonicall Books of the Old Testament and some other And yet for all these they grew up together comfortably and continued in the same body Seldome or never any that offer'd to make a breach or to censure other Churches for these or the like different observations and expressions but two or three Bishops of Rome Such were the humility and charity of those glorious Saints In those purer dayes (l) Neminem judicantes aut a jure communionis aliquem si diversum sensevit amoventes Cypr. in concil Carthag one Bishop was not so forward to censure or excommunicate another Bishop for being of a diverse persuasion No no saith St. Cyprian (m) Ib. Neque quisquam nostrum Episcopum se esse Episcoporum constituit aut tyrannico terrore ad obsequendi necessitatem collegas suos adegit No man in those dayes took upon him to be Bishop of Bishops or to enforce any by tyrannicall terror to subscribe his dictates Then was it lawfull for every one to speak his minde freely when reason not power weight and not number bore the sway 41. But you object that (n) n. 8. I say Sect. 19. that since the Reformation we have not communicated with the Church of Rome Very right I doe so But withall I tell you that this is no fault of ours since ye will not suffer us to communicate with you unlesse we communicate with your errors Is not this to deal with us as the Jews did with the poor man that was born blinde (o) St. Jo. 9.34 while he was blinde the Pharisees communicated with him but when he had gained sight they cast him out they excommunicated him But (p) Ib. v. 35. our blessed Saviour took pity on him and received him into his communion Thus while we were blinde and saw not your errors we were your dear friends but when we discerned them and complained of them hell was good enough for us Yet we doubt not but (q) 1. St. Jo. 1.3 we have communion with Christ since we hold communion with the Apostles by their successors not onely in function but in faith and charity For we receive the two Testaments with the three Creeds in the same sense with the Primitive Church We pray for the whole Church for all Jews Turks Infidels and Hereticks yea for our enemies persecutors and slanderers We anathematize not Churches but errors nor any persons but such as are or ought to be members of this Church and Kingdome we presse not beyond our line If this be the right way to heaven surely we are in the right and ye in the wrong 42. Well (r) n. 9. the Church of Rome and England being thus separated both in faith and communion and so not one and the Church of Rome and those in communion with her by your saying not being the Catholick Church For the separation we must thank you for our faith we blesse Christ What that is the Book of Common-prayer manifests in plain terms and I have shewed that the Pope and his Conclave have incurred Canonicall censures by imposing a new Creed upon us and others That we communicate not with you the fault is yours and Catholicks we shall be able to prove our selves when ye will not be found Orthodoxe But such is that typhus Romanus the infinite pride of Rome that none shal be Catholicks none in communion of the Church nor in the way to heaven that will not stoop to their lure that will not erre with Pius Quartus and the Councel of Trent As if the Romanes were the onely at least had been the first Christians and that St. Peter's keyes were tyed to the Popes girdle to let in and to keep out whom he listed Whereas we know (s) St. Jo. 20.22 23. the keyes were given to all the Apostles alike to St. John for Ephesus as much as to St. Peter for Rome Yea (t) Hieron St. Peter himself provided for Antioch before Rome for he was first Bishop of Antioch The same keyes to all the Apostles for all Nations alike that so all might be admitted by the same keyes into the same (u) 1. Tim. 3.15 house of God which is the Church of the living God the pillar and ground of truth And in this house by Gods grace we shall continue while (x) Col. 2.19 we hold the head and from thence receive nourishment by those joynts and bands which Christ hath ordained And * For the judgment of the whole controversie we refer unto the most holy Scriptures and the Catholick Church of Christ The Protest of Bish Scory c. Book of Mart. p. 2120 were your party contented to be ruled by antiquity we might be one as the house is one 43. That the Church of Rome and those in communion with her are not as you would fain have it the Catholick Church is fully manifested in my former answer § 2 c. 12 22 23 29. And yet there was the Catholick Church at all times since it was first constituted (y) Aug. de Gen. ad lit imperfect c. 1. Mater enim Ecclesia Catholica dicitur ex eo quia universaliter perfecta est in nullo claudicat per totum orbem diffusa est the Mother Church is hence called Catholick because she is universally perfect and halts in nothing and is diffused through the whole world She is not Catholick or sound because she communicates with Rome but Rome is Catholick if she communicate with her and so is every Church We shall therefore communicate with this our Mother that so we may continue Catholick We are sure the Mother halts not though some of the Daughters may That Rome hath halted downright in the prime Articles is too notorious as hath been shewed § 18 27 32 c. and then I am sure she was not Catholick (z) Vincent Lirin c. 14. Nemini enim licet praeter id quod Ecclesia Catholica usquequaque evangelizat accipere for it is not lawfull for her or any other to receive or broach any other doctrine then that which the Catholick Church preaches every where much lesse to enforce it as necessary to salvation Where then ye leave the Church Catholick it is our duty to leave you (a) Estnè aliquis tantae audaciae qui praeter id quod apud Ecclesiam adnunciatum est adnunciet vel tantae levitatis qui praeter id quod ab Ecclesiâ accipit accipiat Ib. This Church he speaks of is not the Romane but the Catholick Church As it is audaciousnesse in you to induce or impose any new Article so were it levity in us to embrace it 44. What we have we have received from our good Mother the Catholick Church and though by you yet not from you Christs legacies they are not yours If ye deliver us these legacies in base or counterfeit coin we shall not accept of it Gold ye received from the Testator and not