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england_n child_n church_n zion_n 22 3 8.8306 4 false
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A92925 Schism dispach't or A rejoynder to the replies of Dr. Hammond and the Ld of Derry. Sergeant, John, 1622-1707. 1657 (1657) Wing S2590; Thomason E1555_1; ESTC R203538 464,677 720

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moderation_n that_o she_o forbear_v to_o censure_v other_o again_o they_o grant_v we_o to_o be_v of_o christ_n flock_n already_o &_o in_o a_o capacy_n to_o be_v save_v whereas_o those_o they_o pray_v for_o here_o be_v suppose_v reducible_a to_o christ_n flock_n that_o be_v not_o yet_o of_o it_o and_o by_o be_v thus_o reduce_v capable_a of_o salvation_n that_o be_v incapable_a of_o it_o before_o they_o be_v thus_o reduce_v none_o of_o these_o therefore_o be_v competent_a to_o we_o nor_o be_v we_o pray_v for_o there_o as_o heretic_n if_o his_o own_o ground_n &_o his_o own_o pretend_a moderation_n be_v to_o be_v hold_v to_o by_o himself_o much_o less_o will_v he_o say_v we_o be_v pray_v for_o there_o under_o the_o notion_n of_o jew_n turcks_n or_o infidel_n for_o this_o be_v to_o censure_v we_o worse_o nor_o be_v ever_o pretend_v by_o protestant_n it_o follow_v then_o that_o our_o conversion_n in_o particular_a be_v not_o there_o pray_v for_o at_o all_o but_o that_o there_o be_v such_o 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practice_n and_o the_o common_a principle_n of_o government_n it_o be_v equal_o evident_a that_o the_o church_n in_o all_o age_n take_v this_o course_n with_o obstinate_a adversary_n of_o faith_n as_o it_o be_v that_o society_n in_o the_o world_n can_v subsist_v without_o put_v a_o distinction_n and_o separate_n avow_a enemy_n and_o rebel_n from_o true_a subjets_fw-fr &_o friend_n if_o then_o they_o hold_v we_o heretic_n and_o unless_o they_o hold_v we_o such_o they_o do_v not_o pray_v for_o we_o in_o particular_a as_o be_v pretend_v they_o ought_v in_o all_o reason_n to_o excommunicate_v as_o indeed_o sometime_o they_o do_v some_o particular_a catholic_n in_o their_o church_n though_o not_o all_o our_o church_n in_o general_a their_o new_a start_v congregation_n be_v conscious_a to_o herself_o that_o she_o have_v no_o such_o authority_n which_o make_v she_o also_o instead_o of_o those_o word_n in_o our_o good-friday_n prayer_n ad_fw-la sanctam_fw-la matrem_fw-la ecclesiam_fw-la catholicam_fw-la atque_fw-la apostolicam_fw-la revocare_fw-la digneris_fw-la recall_v they_o to_o our_o holy_a mother_n the_o catholic_a &_o apostolic_a church_n vary_v the_o grave_n and_o too_o authoritative_a phrase_n too_o loud_o alas_o for_o she_o as_o take_v in_o contra_fw-la distinction_n to_o we_o into_o that_o dwindle_n pule_a puritanical_a expression_n of_o one_o flock_n the_o rem_fw-la nant_fw-la of_o the_o true_a israelite_n one_o fold_n under_o one_o shepherd_n etc._n etc._n equal_o pretendable_a if_o take_v alone_o by_o quaker_n as_o by_o they_o since_o they_o include_v no_o visible_a mark_n in_o their_o notion_n which_o can_v satisfy_v we_o of_o any_o distinction_n between_o the_o one_o &_o the_o other_o the_o three_o proof_n of_o their_o moderation_n be_v that_o they_o add_v nothing_o but_o take_v away_o only_o from_o the_o former_a doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n which_o he_o express_v by_o say_v they_o pluck_v up_o the_o weed_n but_o retain_v all_o the_o plant_n of_o save_a truth_n i_o answer_v that_o to_o take_v away_o goodness_n be_v the_o great_a evil_n etc._n etc._n he_o reply_v that_o he_o speak_v of_o take_v away_o error_n no_o my_o l_o d_o this_o be_v not_o the_o intent_n of_o your_o discourse_n there_o both_o because_o you_o pretend_v there_o to_o prove_v something_o whereas_o i_o conceive_v to_o rely_v on_o only_o the_o cheap_a say_n that_o all_o be_v erroneous_a you_o take_v away_o prove_v nothing_o but_o be_v a_o mere_a self_n supposition_n as_o also_o because_o it_o be_v not_o a_o proof_n of_o moderation_n to_o take_v away_o error_n but_o a_o rigorous_o requisite_a act_n of_o justice_n your_o intent_n then_o be_v to_o show_v the_o moderation_n in_o your_o method_n of_o proceed_v which_o you_o pretend_v all_o the_o way_n long_o to_o have_v be_v that_o you_o add_v no_o new_a thing_n but_o only_o take_v away_o something_o of_o the_o old_a this_o i_o glance_v at_o as_o a_o fond_a and_o idle_a pretence_n since_o till_o you_o prove_v evident_o and_o demonstrable_o from_o your_o new_a rule_n of_o faith_n that_o the_o former_a of_o immediate_a tradition_n which_o assert_v those_o point_n deny_v by_o you_o do_v there_o in_o err_v the_o presumption_n stand_v against_o you_o that_o it_o be_v christ_n doctrine_n which_o you_o maim_v by_o thus_o detract_n from_o it_o or_o if_o you_o suppose_v gratis_o that_o it_o be_v not_o christ_n doctrine_n but_o error_n &_o falsehood_n than_o it_o be_v not_o proper_a to_o call_v it_o moderation_n but_o rather_o a_o act_n of_o necessary_a charity_n to_o root_v it_o out_o i_o know_v it_o be_v a_o easy_a matter_n to_o call_v all_o weed_n which_o your_o nice_a stomach_n can_v digest_v but_o if_o that_o point_n of_o immediate_a tradition_n renounce_v by_o you_o which_o only_o can_v ascertain_v we_o that_o there_o be_v any_o such_o thing_n as_o christ_n or_o god_n word_n be_v a_o weed_n i_o wonder_v what_o can_v deserve_v to_o be_v call_v a_o flower_n what_o he_o vapour_n of_o hold_v what_o the_o primitive_a father_n judge_v necessary_a and_o now_o catholic_a church_n do_v be_v a_o empty_a brag_n &_o vanish_v into_o smoke_n by_o itself_o since_o as_o shall_v short_o be_v show_v their_o ground_n can_v never_o determine_v what_o be_v the_o catholic_a or_o universal_a church_n in_o order_n to_o the_o same_o proof_n of_o his_o moderation_n i_o likewise_o answer_v that_o he_o who_o positive_o deny_v ever_o add_v the_o contrary_a to_o what_o he_o take_v away_o and_o that_o he_o who_o make_v it_o a_o article_n that_o there_o be_v no_o purgatory_n no_o mass_n no_o prayer_n to_o saint_n have_v as_o many_o article_n as_o he_o who_o hold_v the_o contrary_a he_o reply_v that_o he_o know_v the_o contrary_a instance_v that_o they_o neither_o hold_v it_o a_o article_n of_o faith_n that_o there_o be_v a_o purgatory_n nor_o that_o there_o be_v none_o i_o ask_v what_o kind_n of_o thing_n be_v their_o thirty_o nine_o article_n be_v they_o of_o faith_n or_o opinion_n only_o i_o conceive_v his_o lp._n will_v not_o say_v they_o be_v mere_a opinion_n but_o contra-distinctive_a of_o the_o protestant_a faith_n from_o we_o at_o least_o the_o good_a simple_a minister_n be_v make_v believe_v so_o when_o they_o swear_v to_o maintain_v they_o and_o unless_o they_o have_v certainty_n as_o strong_o ground_v as_o divine_a belief_n for_o those_o point_n or_o article_n how_o can_v they_o in_o reason_n reject_v the_o contrary_a tenet_n which_o they_o hold_v by_o divine_a belief_n now_o the_o 22._o article_n define_v the_o negative_a to_o purgatory_n &_o three_o other_o point_n of_o our_o doctrine_n yet_o this_o ill-tutoured_a child_n tell_v his_o old_a crazy_a mother_n the_o church_n of_o england_n that_o she_o lie_v &_o that_o he_o know_v the_o contrary_a now_o his_o reason_n be_v better_a than_o his_o position_n it_o be_v this_o because_o a_o negative_a can_v be_v
term_v fortify_v with_o what_o incomparable_a be_v he_o clear_v himself_o of_o another_o and_o how_o he_o total_o neglect_v the_o whole_a question_n &_o the_o duty_n of_o a_o controvertist_n in_o impugn_v opinion_n acknowledg'd_o hold_v only_o by_o some_o in_o stead_n of_o point_n of_o faith_n hold_v by_o the_o whole_a church_n hhis_n eight_o chapter_n pretend_v to_o prove_v the_o pope_n &_o the_o court_n of_o rome_n most_o guilty_a of_o the_o schism_n which_o he_o make_v account_v he_o have_v do_v so_o strong_o that_o he_o need_v not_o fortify_v any_o thing_n yet_o he_o will_v needs_o do_v a_o needless_a bufine_n and_o go_v about_o to_o fortify_v as_o he_o call_v it_o in_o his_o way_n not_o with_o stand_v to_o the_o first_o argument_n say_v he_o he_o deny_v that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v but_o a_o sister_n or_o a_o mother_n and_o not_o mistress_n to_o other_o church_n which_o be_v first_o flat_o to_o falsify_v my_o word_n to_o be_v see_v schism_n disarm_v p._n 327._o which_o never_o deny_v she_o to_o be_v a_o mother_n but_o a_o sister_n only_o and_o this_o be_v his_o first_o endeavour_n of_o needle_n fortify_v next_o whereas_o the_o word_n mistress_n may_v signify_v two_o thing_n to_o wit_v a_o person_n that_o imperious_o and_o proud_o command_v in_o which_o acception_n it_o be_v the_o same_o with_o domina_fw-la and_o correlative_a to_o serua_n a_o slave_n or_o hire_v ling_n slave_n or_o else_o a_o teacheress_n as_o i_o may_v say_v or_o one_o which_o instruct_v and_o so_o be_v coincident_a with_o magistra_fw-la and_o correlative_a to_o discipula_fw-la a_o disciple_n or_o scholar_n again_o it_o be_v evident_a both_o out_o of_o the_o council_n of_o florence_n where_o it_o be_v define_v romanam_n ecclesiam_fw-la esse_fw-la matrem_fw-la magistramque_fw-la omnium_fw-la ecclesiarum_fw-la and_o also_o out_o of_o common_a sense_n that_o we_o take_v it_o in_o this_o latter_a signification_n the_o quibble_n bp._n take_v it_o in_o the_o former_a that_o be_v not_o as_o understand_v by_o we_o but_o by_o himself_o and_o then_o impugn_v his_o own_o mistake_n cite_v s._n bernard_n who_o exhort_v pope_n eugenius_n to_o humility_n bid_v he_o consider_v that_o the_o roman_a church_n ecclesiarum_fw-la matrem_fw-la esse_fw-la non_fw-la dominam_fw-la be_v the_o mother_n not_o lady_n of_o all_o church_n and_o this_o be_v another_o attempt_n of_o his_o needle_n fortify_v my_o l_o d_o of_o derry_n may_v please_v then_o to_o understand_v that_o when_o we_o say_v that_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v mother_n &_o mistress_n of_o other_o church_n we_o take_v the_o word_n mother_n as_o relate_v to_o her_o government_n or_o power_n of_o govern_v who_o correlative_a be_v a_o sweet_a subjection_n not_o a_o hard_a or_o rigorous_a slavery_n and_o the_o word_n mistress_n as_o express_v her_o power_n of_o teach_v or_o if_o the_o bp._n be_v loath_a to_o grant_v the_o word_n mistress_n take_v in_o our_o sense_n which_o yet_o he_o never_o go_v about_o to_o impugn_v or_o disprove_v let_v he_o but_o allow_v &_o stand_v to_o what_o the_o testimony_n himself_o bring_v here_o avouch_v to_o wit_n that_o she_o be_v mother_n of_o other_o church_n and_o that_o she_o have_v right_a to_o rule_v and_o teach_v her_o child_n as_o a_o mother_n shall_v do_v &_o it_o be_v as_o much_o as_o we_o desire_v now_o let_v we_o apply_v this_o &_o see_v how_o rare_o the_o bishop_n have_v clear_v himself_o of_o schism_n &_o lay_v it_o at_o our_o do●e_n he_o have_v bring_v a_o testimony_n which_o assert_n the_o church_n of_o rome_n to_o be_v the_o mother_n of_o other_o church_n and_o so_o of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n too_o if_o she_o be_v church_n nor_o do_v himself_o in_o this_o place_n deny_v she_o that_o title_n but_o seem_v to_o grant_v it_o but_o it_o be_v manifest_a de_fw-fr facto_fw-la and_o by_o their_o solemn_a ordinance_n &_o public_a write_n that_o her_o good_a daughter_n the_o church_n of_o england_n tell_v she_o flat_o she_o will_v not_o ought_v not_o obey_v she_o and_o thus_o by_o the_o bp_o '_o s_o logic_n she_o become_v acquit_v of_o schism_n which_o i_o must_v confess_v be_v not_o only_o a_o needle_n but_o a_o sleeveles_a manner_n of_o fortify_v again_o schism_n involve_v in_o its_o notion_n disobedience_n and_o the_o bishop_n in_o this_o chapter_n pretend_v to_o show_v her_o schismatical_a that_o be_v disobedient_a to_o do_v which_o he_o bring_v we_o a_o testimony_n which_o assert_v our_o church_n to_o be_v mother_n of_o other_o church_n and_o then_o conclude_v the_o mother_n schismatical_a because_o she_o be_v disobedient_a to_o her_o daughter_n pithy_a nonsense_n or_o if_o make_v sense_n flat_o accuse_v their_o church_n of_o schism_n for_o disobey_v her_o mother_n and_o this_o deducible_a clear_o from_o that_o very_a testimony_n he_o bring_v to_o prove_v the_o contrary_a which_o kind_n of_o argue_v be_v in_o the_o bp_o s_o phrase_n call_v needle_n fortify_v his_o pretence_n of_o a_o new_a creed_n which_o be_v his_o second_o argument_n to_o prove_v we_o schismatical_a make_v by_o pope_n pius_n the_o four_o be_v already_o show_v sect._n 1_o to_o be_v a_o calumny_n to_o which_o i_o add_v that_o our_o creed_n be_v the_o point_n of_o our_o belief_n or_o faith_n since_o then_o it_o be_v know_v that_o each_o point_n in_o that_o profession_n of_o faith_n put_v out_o by_o he_o be_v hold_v as_o of_o faith_n by_o the_o former_a church_n ere_o he_o thus_o collect_v they_o it_o be_v a_o contradiction_n to_o pretend_v that_o he_o make_v a_o new_a creed_n till_o it_o be_v show_v that_o any_o of_o those_o point_n there_o contain_v be_v not_o former_o of_o faith_n and_o prove_v satisfactory_o that_o the_o apostle_n contain_v all_o necessary_a point_n of_o faith_n which_o will_v be_v manifest_v at_o the_o greek_a calend_n his_o three_o argument_n be_v because_o we_o maintain_v the_o pope_n in_o a_o rebellion_n against_o a_o general_a council_n to_o this_o he_o say_v i_o answer_v not_o a_o word_n let_v we_o see_v whether_o it_o deserve_v a_o word_n of_o answer_n the_o difference_n between_o a_o controvertist_n and_o a_o schoolman_n be_v the_o same_o as_o be_v between_o a_o church_n &_o a_o school_n controvertist_n therefore_o of_o several_a church_n defend_v those_o point_n &_o impugn_v the_o contrary_a one_o which_o be_v hold_v by_o those_o church_n as_o church_n that_o be_v as_o congregation_n rely_v upon_o their_o rule_n of_o faith_n either_o then_o let_v he_o show_v that_o our_o church_n hold_v as_o of_o faith_n or_o as_o receive_v upon_o her_o rule_n of_o faith_n the_o pope_n supremacy_n to_o a_o general_a council_n else_o in_o impugn_v that_o point_n he_o total_o prevaricate_v from_o the_o office_n of_o a_o controvertist_n have_v do_v nothing_o which_o be_v his_o duty_n and_o so_o merit_v no_o answer_n save_v only_o this_o that_o if_o he_o will_v dispute_v against_o private_a opinion_n he_o must_v cite_v his_o author_n &_o argue_v against_o they_o not_o the_o church_n who_o belief_n be_v contain_v in_o the_o decree_n of_o council_n and_o universal_a consent_n of_o father_n &_o doctor_n which_o answer_n i_o then_o give_v he_o express_o schism_n disarm_v p._n 327_o now_o to_o show_v the_o vanity_n of_o this_o three_o argument_n let_v he_o either_o manifest_a that_o our_o church_n press_v upon_o they_o this_o point_n of_o hold_v the_o pope_n above_o council_n so_o as_o to_o excommunicate_v they_o upon_o their_o contrary_a tenet_n else_o all_o pretence_n of_o our_o cause_v the_o schism_n be_v avoid_v for_o in_o case_n it_o be_v not_o thus_o press_v his_o argument_n stand_v thus_o very_o many_o schoolman_n &_o a_o great_a party_n among_o they_o hold_v that_o opinion_n where_o upon_o we_o leave_v their_o church_n ergo_fw-la they_o be_v most_o guilty_a of_o the_o schism_n which_o be_v as_o senseless_a a_o paralogism_n as_o a_o sleepy_a brain_n can_v have_v stumble_v on_o for_o why_o shall_v any_o break_v church-communion_n as_o long_o as_o he_o can_v keep_v it_o with_o conscience_n or_o how_o be_v my_o conscience_n concern_v in_o other_o man_n opinion_n as_o long_o as_o they_o permit_v i_o to_o hold_v the_o contrary_n now_o that_o our_o church_n permit_v the_o contrary_a tenet_n and_o deny_v none_o communion_n for_o it_o himself_o testify_v vindication_n p._n 200._o where_o he_o put_v down_o as_o one_o of_o the_o tenet_n of_o the_o now-french_a church_n that_o general_a council_n be_v above_o the_o pope_n and_o may_v depose_v he_o etc._n etc._n the_o bishop_n be_v conscious_a that_o he_o have_v neglect_v the_o office_n of_o a_o controvertist_n by_o impugn_v schoolman_n lawyer_n &_o courtier_n instead_o of_o our_o church_n and_o a_o opinion_n hold_v by_o many_o instead_o of_o a_o point_n of_o faith_n hold_v by_o all_o to_o delude_v the_o reader_n &_o in_o reality_n to_o oppose_v the_o former_a which_o belong_v not_o