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england_n book_n church_n time_n 2,893 5 3.6141 3 false
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A78612 A pretended voice from heaven, proved to bee the voice of man, and not of God. Or, An answer to a treatise, called A voice from heaven, written by Mr. Gualter Postlethwait, an unordained preacher, taking upon him to exercise the pastoral charge, in a congregation at Lewis in Sussex. Wherein, his weakness, in undertaking to prove all protestant churches to bee antichristian, and to bee separated from, as no true churches of Christ, is discovered; and the sinfulness of such a separation evinced. Together with, a brief answer inserted, to the arguments for popular ordination, brought by the answerers of Jus Divinum Ministerii Evangelici, in their book called The preacher sent. By Ezekiel Charke, M.A. and rector of Waldron in Sussex. Imprimatur, Edmond Calamy. Charke, Ezekiel. 1658 (1658) Wing C2069; Thomason E959_5; ESTC R207673 108,343 141

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swerve_v from_o his_o institution_n as_o of_o those_o that_o seek_v he_o in_o a_o way_n conformable_a to_o his_o institution_n i_o suppose_v you_o will_v answer_v negative_o but_o now_o through_o god_n goodness_n we_o be_v able_a to_o say_v that_o god_n be_v and_o have_v be_v as_o much_o find_v of_o we_o in_o our_o church_n and_o way_n and_o our_o minister_n have_v receive_v as_o glorious_a a_o seal_n of_o their_o ministry_n as_o any_o church_n that_o we_o know_v of_o since_o the_o apostle_n day_n and_o far_o more_o than_o our_o congregational_a brethren_n themselves_o in_o their_o way_n who_o although_o they_o deal_v out_o this_o hard_a measure_n to_o we_o to_o cry_v down_o our_o ministry_n and_o church_n as_o antichristian_a owe_v most_o of_o they_o that_o be_v renew_v their_o conversion_n unto_o god_n unto_o our_o ministry_n as_o the_o instrument_n for_o it_o in_o god_n hand_n themselves_z being_z judges_z though_o they_o have_v ten_o thousand_o independent_a instructor_n yet_o can_v they_o not_o say_v they_o be_v their_o father_n for_o in_o christ_n jesus_n the_o ministry_n of_o our_o church_n have_v beget_v they_o to_o the_o gospel_n if_o i_o be_o become_v a_o fool_n in_o glory_v they_o have_v compel_v i_o object_n 4_o but_o there_o may_v be_v and_o have_v be_v good_a do_v this_o way_n error_n suppress_v etc._n etc._n and_o those_o that_o reject_v it_o now_o 61._o p._n 61._o make_v use_v of_o it_o once_o answ_n the_o good_a that_o god_n bring_v out_o of_o evil_a be_v not_o to_o be_v construe_v into_o a_o divine_a approbation_n of_o it_o nor_o the_o use_n that_o have_v be_v make_v by_o good_a man_n of_o a_o false_a way_n of_o church_n to_o be_v draw_v into_o a_o argument_n to_o continue_v in_o it_o answ_n what_o good_a there_o have_v be_v do_v by_o reform_a church_n few_o can_v be_v ignorant_a of_o what_o good_a have_v be_v do_v by_o independent_a church_n have_v not_o yet_o much_o appear_v that_o some_o of_o their_o flock_n be_v pure_a they_o owe_v to_o our_o church_n as_o have_v be_v say_v error_n have_v be_v indeed_o suppress_v by_o we_o but_o not_o by_o they_o it_o appear_v therefore_o they_o have_v make_v but_o a_o bad_a exchange_n but_o cherish_v by_o many_o of_o they_o who_o have_v be_v to_o they_o as_o city_n of_o refuge_n and_o out_o of_o which_o they_o have_v swarm_v abundant_o into_o all_o part_n of_o the_o land_n and_o for_o this_o the_o land_n groan_v and_o think_v mr._n p._n to_o put_v off_o this_o so_o slight_o with_o his_o beg_a supposition_n of_o the_o truth_n of_o the_o church_n of_o his_o way_n and_o the_o falseness_n of_o we_o sure_o the_o beat_n down_o of_o error_n and_o the_o promote_a of_o truth_n be_v no_o contemptible_a note_n of_o a_o true_a church_n though_o some_o corruption_n be_v find_v in_o it_o rev._n 2.2_o 4._o and_o on_o the_o contrary_a etc._n etc._n that_o those_o that_o own_v our_o church_n once_o have_v now_o reject_v they_o i_o judge_v from_o the_o word_n to_o be_v their_o sin_n they_o shall_v have_v continue_v in_o they_o since_o christ_n have_v not_o divorce_v they_o though_o he_o have_v somewhat_o against_o they_o and_o have_v endeavour_v to_o reform_v they_o but_o they_o have_v not_o labour_v to_o heal_v yea_o they_o have_v widen_v and_o increase_v our_o wound_n and_o then_o they_o insult_v over_o we_o antichristianize_v we_o separate_v from_o we_o and_o draw_v away_o the_o best_a of_o our_o flock_n boast_v in_o other_o man_n line_n of_o thing_n make_v ready_a to_o their_o hand_n the_o lord_n judge_n between_o we_o and_o they_o object_n 5._o and_o 6._o but_o shall_v we_o do_v it_o without_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o magistrate_n 64_o p._n 62_o 63_o 64_o without_o the_o consent_n of_o the_o church_n answ_n that_o which_o be_v press_v be_v but_o the_o do_n of_o the_o duty_n that_o lie_v upon_o every_o christian_n to_o separate_v from_o unwarrantable_a society_n the_o text_n have_v no_o such_o proviso_n if_o the_o magistrate_n bid_v or_o give_v you_o leave_v then_o come_v out_o of_o babylon_n therefore_o we_o be_v to_o resolve_v with_o peter_n martyr_n and_o with_o wollebius_n etc._n etc._n after_o god_n have_v make_v know_v his_o truth_n say_v the_o first_o we_o must_v not_o delay_v consent_v indeed_o be_v to_o be_v expect_v if_o the_o matter_n be_v dubious_a and_o obscure_a to_o wit_n to_o he_o to_o who_o it_o be_v reveal_v as_o the_o course_n of_o his_o speech_n make_v manifest_a answ_n the_o magistrate_n be_v as_o no_o body_n with_o you_o unless_o you_o have_v he_o on_o your_o side_n and_o then_o you_o can_v change_v your_o note_n but_o we_o hold_v that_o very_o much_o respect_n be_v to_o be_v have_v to_o the_o magistrate_n in_o this_o matter_n and_o all_o mean_n possible_a be_v to_o be_v use_v to_o engage_v the_o magistrate_n to_o carry_v on_o the_o work_n of_o reformation_n give_v i_o but_o one_o example_n in_o all_o the_o old_a testament_n of_o any_o considerable_a reformation_n in_o the_o church_n without_o the_o interposition_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o magistrate_n or_o one_o example_n of_o it_o in_o ecclesiastical_a history_n in_o a_o time_n when_o there_o be_v christian_a magistrate_n can_v our_o magistrate_n endure_v that_o their_o authority_n and_o power_n shall_v be_v contemn_v as_o it_o be_v i_o hope_v they_o will_v not_o but_o that_o they_o will_v exert_v it_o for_o the_o good_a of_o the_o church_n in_o discountenance_v restrain_v and_o punish_v man_n of_o corrupt_a mind_n principle_n and_o practice_n lead_v to_o separation_n blasphemy_n error_n and_o rebellion_n shelter_v themselves_o under_o this_o notion_n that_o the_o magistrate_n have_v nothing_o to_o do_v with_o church-matter_n and_o that_o all_o man_n be_v therein_o to_o be_v leave_v to_o their_o liberty_n and_o the_o dictate_v of_o their_o own_o spirit_n the_o place_n that_o you_o pick_v out_o of_o martyr_n and_o wollebius_n favour_v not_o your_o fancy_n the_o place_n of_o wollebius_n take_v in_o his_o sense_n i_o ready_o yield_v to_o that_o when_o religion_n be_v deprave_v it_o be_v to_o be_v reform_v by_o the_o magistrate_n but_o if_o reformation_n can_v be_v obtain_v of_o the_o magistrate_n he_o be_v a_o enemy_n to_o the_o church_n than_o reformation_n lie_v upon_o those_o who_o god_n have_v furnish_v with_o necessary_a gift_n for_o it_o neither_o be_v the_o consent_n of_o roman_a bishop_n to_o be_v expect_v for_o if_o our_o father_n have_v do_v so_o say_v he_o there_o will_v have_v be_v no_o reformation_n and_o he_o produce_v the_o example_n of_o gideon_n jehoiada_n the_o maccabe_n the_o apostle_n etc._n etc._n to_o make_v good_a his_o assertion_n now_o when_o you_o shall_v have_v prove_v 1_o that_o the_o supreme_a magistrate_n be_v a_o enemy_n of_o religion_n the_o church_n and_o reformation_n 2_o that_o the_o way_n of_o reformation_n you_o contend_v for_o be_v indeed_o the_o way_n of_o god_n 3_o that_o all_o lawful_a mean_n have_v be_v use_v and_o notwithstanding_o reformation_n can_v be_v obtain_v at_o the_o magistrate_n hand_n 4_o that_o england_n condition_n and_o the_o state_n of_o the_o church_n in_o the_o time_n of_o gideon_n jehoiada_n the_o maccabe_n the_o apostle_n and_o protestant_a reformer_n be_v alike_o 5_o that_o you_o have_v instrument_n that_o have_v the_o like_a call_n from_o god_n and_o be_v furnish_v with_o such_o ability_n for_o reform_v as_o they_o have_v and_o be_v then_o i_o confess_v this_o place_n will_v speak_v something_o for_o you_o 6_o the_o reformation_n wollebius_n speak_v of_o refer_v chief_o to_o essential_o in_o religion_n and_o that_o he_o be_v a_o antagonist_n to_o your_o way_n of_o separation_n from_o reform_a church_n appear_v sufficient_o in_o his_o book_n martyr_v you_o much_o mistake_v also_o 1_o the_o reformation_n he_o press_v refer_v chief_o to_o fundamental_o in_o religion_n 2_o those_o who_o consent_n he_o say_v be_v not_o to_o be_v expect_v be_v the_o roman_a bishop_n who_o he_o call_v swear_v enemy_n to_o the_o truth_n 3_o he_o do_v not_o incite_v and_o stir_v up_o the_o people_n to_o set_v upon_o the_o work_n without_o the_o consent_n of_o the_o magistrate_n but_o the_o inferior_a magistrate_n to_o endeavour_v in_o their_o place_n a_o reformation_n of_o religion_n in_o banish_v the_o impure_a mass_n out_o of_o their_o city_n etc._n etc._n and_o how_o do_v this_o reach_n your_o case_n 4_o the_o cause_n he_o say_v be_v clear_a and_o such_o as_o be_v confess_v to_o be_v god_n and_o delay_n may_v endanger_v the_o loss_n of_o a_o good_a cause_n consent_v indeed_o say_v he_o be_v to_o be_v expect_v if_o the_o matter_n be_v dubious_a and_o obscure_a and_o here_o you_o bring_v in_o your_o shameful_a parenthesis_n to_o wit_n to_o who_o it_o be_v reveal_v which_o parenthesis_n spoil_v and_o abuse_v peter_n martyr_n text_n for_o his_o
ministry_n from_o antichristianism_n as_o i_o be_o confident_a can_v never_o be_v fair_o answer_v mr._n p._n as_o his_o manner_n be_v in_o other_o point_n take_v no_o notice_n of_o what_o they_o or_o other_o have_v say_v in_o this_o argument_n but_o cry_v out_o antichristian_a minister_n antichrist_n broker_n etc._n etc._n how_o easy_a be_v it_o but_o how_o unreasonable_a and_o absurd_a thus_o to_o keep_v fresh_a and_o renew_v charge_n without_o remove_v the_o answer_n that_o have_v take_v they_o off_o and_o upon_o what_o ground_n can_v man_n that_o act_n so_o expect_v that_o any_o notice_n be_v take_v of_o what_o they_o say_v but_o one_o good_a turn_n be_v that_o mr._n p._n in_o this_o charge_v book_n answer_v himself_o and_o say_v that_o which_o do_v in_o effect_n establish_v the_o mention_a plea_n for_o the_o validity_n of_o our_o ordination_n and_o ministry_n when_o ordinance_n say_v he_o page_n 53._o be_v but_o circumstantial_o corrupt_v we_o can_v reject_v they_o no_o more_o than_o the_o israelite_n can_v reject_v the_o ark_n because_o it_o be_v carry_v in_o a_o cart_n of_o the_o philistines_n make_v and_o he_o instance_v in_o baptism_n in_o which_o though_o much_o be_v add_v as_o anoint_v cross_v etc._n etc._n yet_o the_o essential_o be_v retain_v whilst_o it_o always_o be_v administer_v by_o wash_v sprinkle_v or_o dip_v in_o water_n in_o the_o name_n of_o the_o father_n son_n and_o holy_a ghost_n let_v any_o man_n now_o apply_v this_o to_o our_o ordination_n and_o ministry_n and_o see_v whether_o it_o will_v not_o fit_v they_o as_o well_o as_o baptism_n the_o essential_o of_o ordination_n have_v be_v always_o retain_v minister_n be_v ordain_v by_o minister_n of_o the_o gospel_n with_o prayer_n and_o imposition_n of_o hand_n according_a to_o christ_n institution_n act._n 13.1_o 2_o 3._o 1_o tim._n 4.14_o &_o 5.22_o therefore_o though_o some_o circumstantial_a corruption_n cleave_v to_o our_o ordination_n receive_v through_o rome_n yet_o according_a to_o mr._n p_n own_o conclusion_n we_o may_v not_o renounce_v it_o neither_o can_v he_o say_v any_o thing_n against_o the_o validity_n of_o ordination_n so_o receive_v which_o will_v not_o equal_o strike_v at_o baptism_n receive_v through_o rome_n also_o our_o minister_n be_v no_o more_o antichristian_a minister_n or_o antichrist_n broker_n because_o they_o receive_v their_o ordination_n through_o rome_n than_o those_o that_o have_v undergo_v the_o ordinance_n of_o baptism_n among_o we_o and_o mr._n p._n among_o they_o be_v antichrist_n christian_n or_o antichristian_a baptise_a person_n because_o the_o ordinance_n come_v to_o they_o through_o rome_n we_o must_v say_v he_o own_o our_o baptism_n receive_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o be_v there_o not_o as_o much_o ground_n to_o say_v we_o must_v own_v our_o ordination_n receive_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n especial_o in_o england_n which_o have_v a_o true_a and_o pure_a ministry_n in_o primitive_a time_n as_o the_o congregational_a brethren_n confess_v now_o this_o ministry_n for_o the_o essentialness_n of_o it_o have_v be_v derive_v successive_o to_o our_o time_n wherein_o it_o be_v purge_v from_o those_o corruption_n that_o do_v during_o the_o prevalency_n of_o popery_n cleave_v unto_o it_o and_o our_o ministry_n thus_o derive_v can_v no_o more_o be_v call_v a_o antichristian_a ministry_n than_o the_o ministry_n and_o priesthood_n of_o those_o priest_n under_o the_o law_n that_o be_v consecrate_v during_o the_o prevalency_n of_o idolatrey_n in_o that_o church_n or_o of_o those_o that_o succeed_v they_o can_v be_v call_v when_o the_o service_n of_o the_o lord_n be_v restore_v in_o purity_n and_o they_o attend_v upon_o it_o a_o heathen_a ministry_n or_o priesthood_n 2_o though_o i_o account_v that_o answer_n good_a and_o strong_a and_o believe_v that_o our_o accuser_n will_v never_o be_v able_a to_o remove_v it_o yet_o i_o conceive_v we_o need_v not_o grant_v they_o so_o much_o as_o that_o our_o ministry_n be_v descend_v to_o we_o through_o rome_n the_o congregational_a brethren_n say_v some_o of_o they_o that_o we_o be_v antichristian_a minister_n because_o we_o receive_v our_o ordination_n from_o rome_n papist_n say_v we_o be_v not_o christian_a minister_n because_o we_o do_v not_o receive_v our_o ordination_n from_o rome_n well_o let_v those_o two_o party_n dispute_v it_o out_o we_o need_v not_o trouble_v ourselves_o with_o the_o controversy_n we_o may_v assert_v the_o christianity_n of_o our_o ministry_n upon_o another_o account_n which_o be_v this_o the_o minister_n of_o the_o protestant_a reform_a church_n have_v their_o doctrinal_a and_o lineal_a succession_n from_o the_o hand_n of_o christ_n and_o his_o apostle_n from_z and_o through_o the_o hand_n of_o the_o witness_n prophesy_v in_o sackcloth_n during_o antichrist_n reign_v to_o evidence_n this_o let_v it_o be_v consider_v 1_o that_o there_o have_v be_v true_a church_n of_o christ_n in_o the_o world_n yea_o in_o the_o territory_n and_o nation_n where_o antichrist_n have_v prevail_v more_o or_o few_o all_o along_o the_o time_n of_o his_o reign_n to_o this_o last_o age_n maintain_v the_o profession_n and_o ordinance_n of_o the_o gospel_n of_o christ_n in_o opposition_n to_o his_o corruption_n though_o he_o have_v persecute_v and_o seek_v to_o destroy_v they_o for_o it_o and_o among_o these_o those_o of_o bohemia_n and_o the_o waldenses_n and_o albigenses_n be_v famous_o know_v to_o have_v continue_v a_o long_a while_n enemy_n themselves_o acknowledge_v concern_v these_o last_o that_o in_o all_o likelihood_n they_o have_v their_o beginning_n though_o possible_o under_o other_o name_n near_o the_o time_n of_o the_o apostle_n 2_o that_o in_o these_o church_n consider_v in_o their_o order_n of_o time_n there_o be_v both_o a_o doctrinal_a and_o lineal_a succession_n from_o christ_n and_o his_o apostle_n unto_o the_o rise_n of_o the_o church_n call_v protestant_n 3_o that_o the_o protestant_a reformer_n and_o the_o church_n that_o withdraw_v with_o they_o from_o rome_n do_v own_o the_o same_o fundamental_a truth_n in_o doctrine_n and_o discipline_n that_o those_o do_v as_o sufficient_o appear_v by_o the_o history_n of_o the_o waldenses_n and_o the_o conference_n that_o pass_v between_o the_o protestant_a reformer_n and_o they_o about_o it_o 4_o that_o although_o whereas_o it_o be_v certain_a that_o the_o waldenses_n be_v by_o persecution_n scatter_v do_v sow_v the_o seed_n of_o the_o true_a religion_n in_o sundry_a country_n where_o afterward_o protestant_a church_n be_v establish_v which_o do_v lay_v a_o groundwork_n for_o their_o arise_v we_o have_v not_o much_o evidence_n of_o the_o protestant_a minister_n receive_v ordination_n from_o their_o minister_n yet_o we_o be_v assure_v from_o the_o history_n of_o those_o time_n that_o there_o be_v a_o very_a cheerful_a and_o unanimous_a consent_n between_o those_o waldensian_a church_n and_o the_o protestant_a church_n and_o a_o full_a concur_v in_o matter_n of_o doctrine_n worship_n discipline_n and_o ministry_n as_o also_o there_o be_v for_o the_o main_a between_o the_o protestant_a church_n beyond_o the_o sea_n and_o we_o afterward_o in_o england_n in_o their_o time_n of_o reformation_n now_o in_o case_n so_o extraordinary_a as_o those_o of_o the_o protestant_a church_n in_o their_o first_o rise_n be_v the_o right_a hand_n of_o fellowship_n which_o some_o of_o the_o congregational_a brethren_n judge_v in_o ordinary_a case_n sufficient_a be_v give_v in_o effect_n to_o the_o ministry_n of_o beyond-sea_o protestant_a church_n by_o the_o ministry_n of_o those_o former_a church_n and_o to_o the_o ministry_n of_o our_o church_n by_o the_o ministry_n of_o those_o protestant_a church_n may_v well_o be_v think_v enough_o to_o supply_v the_o want_n and_o stand_v in_o the_o room_n of_o formal_a ordination_n from_o they_o and_o this_o ministry_n of_o protestant_a church_n receive_v from_o christ_n through_o the_o witness_n prophesy_v in_o sackcloth_n have_v be_v since_o continue_v by_o formal_a ordination_n both_o beyond_o sea_n and_o among_o we_o as_o that_o which_o in_o fix_a church_n and_o where_o it_o may_v be_v have_v complete_o be_v of_o necessity_n according_a to_o the_o rule_n of_o the_o word_n to_o be_v maintain_v and_o use_v formal_o for_o the_o continuation_n of_o a_o gospel_n ministry_n sect_n 12._o a_o question_n discuss_v whether_o any_o unordained_a person_n among_o we_o be_v lawful_a and_o complete_a minister_n of_o the_o gospel_n with_o a_o answer_n to_o the_o six_o argument_n for_o popular_a ordination_n bring_v by_o the_o answerer_n of_o jus_n diu._n min._n evangelici_fw-la in_o their_o book_n call_v the_o preacher_n send_v while_o mr._n p._n and_o the_o congregational_a brethren_n of_o his_o form_n be_v so_o forward_o to_o condemn_v our_o ministry_n as_o antichristian_a it_o will_v be_v hard_a for_o they_o to_o free_v their_o own_o from_o that_o charge_n this_o proposition_n i_o will_v engage_v to_o make_v good_a those_o preacher_n that_o be_v
to_o humour_v the_o people_n in_o their_o lust_n since_o among_o they_o they_o live_v and_o with_o they_o they_o have_v continual_o to_o do_v whereas_o patron_n most_o of_o they_o live_v not_o in_o the_o place_n to_o which_o they_o present_v and_o have_v no_o power_n to_o put_v out_o who_o they_o have_v once_o present_v so_o that_o the_o power_n which_o he_o claim_v for_o the_o people_n be_v far_o more_o likely_a to_o produce_v that_o evil_a than_o be_v the_o power_n of_o patron_n and_o instance_n may_v be_v give_v that_o it_o have_v do_v so_o but_o i_o forbear_v recriminate_v sect_n 8._o of_o tithe_n mr._n p_n four_o injunction_n to_o the_o magistrate_n be_v concern_v tithe_n away_o with_o tithe_n that_o old-testament_n maintenance_n plain_o distinguish_v from_o the_o new-testament_n maintenance_n 1_o cor._n 9.13_o 14._o it_o be_v plain_a he_o argue_v a_o simili_fw-la and_o like_a be_v not_o the_o same_o gospel_n maintenance_n differ_v from_o law_n maintenance_n in_o the_o very_a kind_n tithe_n be_v a_o legal_a jewish_a popish_a way_n of_o maintenance_n either_o tithe_n be_v pay_v by_o the_o light_n of_o nature_n or_o moral_a command_n or_o else_o by_o a_o ceremonial_a precept_n but_o not_o by_o either_o of_o the_o two_o former_a the_o instance_n of_o abraham_n and_o jacob_n pare_n they_o before_o the_o law_n be_v not_o sufficient_a for_o circumcision_n and_o sacrifice_n be_v then_o and_o yet_o part_v of_o the_o ceremonial_a ●aw_v and_o the_o institution_n of_o our_o saviour_n luke_n 10.7_o urge_v 1_o c●r_n 9.14_o and_o explain_v gal._n 6.6_o will_v not_o stand_v with_o tithe_n these_o be_v out_o of_o the_o seed_n of_o the_o land_n the_o fruit_n of_o the_o tree_n or_o the_o herd_n or_o the_o flock_n the_o gospel-maintenance_n be_v raise_v out_o of_o all_o good_a thing_n therefore_o tithe_n belong_v to_o the_o ceremonial_a law_n which_o to_o practice_v be_v to_o dig_v christ_n out_o of_o his_o grave_n and_o a_o character_n of_o antichrist_n neither_o will_v it_o avail_v for_o any_o to_o say_v that_o they_o take_v they_o not_o as_o tithe_n for_o the_o corinthian_n can_v not_o be_v so_o excuse_v as_o to_o their_o eat_a thing_n sacrifice_v to_o idol_n etc._n etc._n mr._n p._n know_v or_o may_v know_v that_o there_o be_v several_a plea_n for_o tithe_n as_o the_o minister_n maintenance_n the_o power_n and_o law_n of_o the_o magistrate_n the_o right_a of_o donation_n and_o the_o divine_a right_n and_o therefore_o since_o he_o think_v fit_a to_o give_v a_o reason_n of_o his_o excommunicatory_a sentence_n against_o they_o with_o relation_n to_o the_o last_o of_o those_o plea_n he_o shall_v have_v do_v it_o in_o relation_n to_o the_o rest_n also_o else_o though_o it_o shall_v happen_v that_o his_o strong_a argue_v may_v cause_v man_n to_o quit_v they_o with_o one_o hand_n on_o the_o last_o account_n yet_o the_o other_o plea_n be_v not_o impugn_a by_o he_o in_o particular_a they_o may_v hold_v they_o with_o the_o other_o hand_n on_o their_o account_n and_o so_o his_o away_z with_o tithe_n may_v lose_v its_o labour_n two_o cord_n may_v hold_v they_o though_o the_o edge_n of_o his_o argue_v shall_v be_v so_o keen_a as_o to_o cut_v the_o other_o 1_o the_o magistrate_n power_n and_o authority_n be_v general_o acknowledge_v to_o have_v be_v give_v they_o by_o god_n in_o relation_n to_o the_o good_a of_o the_o church_n and_o can_v fair_o be_v deny_v to_o extend_v itself_o by_o his_o appointment_n to_o the_o teacher_n as_o well_o as_o to_o the_o teach_v in_o it_o those_o must_v live_v and_o be_v maintain_v as_o well_o as_o these_o the_o text_n he_o quote_v evince_v this_o 1_o cor._n 9.13_o 14._o and_o magistrate_n be_v to_o take_v care_n that_o what_o god_n have_v appoint_v may_v be_v perform_v how_o be_v they_o else_o minister_n of_o god_n for_o good_a without_o exception_n or_o restriction_n now_o the_o even_o so_o in_o this_o text_n leave_v his_o apprehension_n of_o the_o far_a sense_n of_o it_o to_o be_v consider_v under_o the_o last_o plea_n imply_v clear_o that_o a_o set_v determinate_a and_o sufficient_a maintenance_n be_v to_o be_v assign_v and_o pay_v to_o the_o minister_n of_o christ_n and_o establish_v for_o they_o for_o such_o a_o one_o there_o be_v enjoy_v by_o the_o minister_n of_o holy_a thing_n under_o the_o law_n and_o sure_o the_o effect_n of_o this_o fall_v under_o the_o christian_a magistrate_n care_n and_o be_v within_o the_o verge_n of_o his_o power_n but_o now_o certain_o there_o be_v no_o reason_n why_o the_o magistrate_n may_v not_o appoint_v as_o well_o a_o ten_o as_o a_o nine_o or_o a_o eleven_o to_o be_v the_o minister_n maintenance_n and_o have_v so_o fair_a a_o precedent_n before_o they_o as_o the_o determinate_a proportion_n once_o allot_v by_o god_n to_o his_o minister_n n._n a_o ten_o and_o no_o other_o mention_v in_o scripture_n no_o reason_n can_v be_v give_v suppose_v they_o not_o to_o consider_v that_o allotment_n as_o bind_v now_o why_o they_o shall_v not_o pitch_v upon_o this_o rather_o than_o any_o other_o the_o equity_n of_o that_o proportion_n do_v undoubted_o still_o remain_v it_o be_v the_o proportion_n which_o the_o wisdom_n of_o god_n choose_v and_o he_o have_v no_o where_o forbid_v they_o to_o pitch_v upon_o that_o proportion_n or_o point_v out_o any_o other_o therefore_o that_o proportion_n they_o may_v best_o pitch_v upon_o and_o establish_v to_o be_v the_o minister_n maintenance_n this_o proportion_n christian_a magistrate_n and_o we_o in_o particular_a have_v pitch_v upon_o and_o establish_v by_o law_n to_o be_v the_o minister_n maintenance_n and_o that_o out_o of_o the_o increase_n of_o the_o land_n which_o may_v easy_o be_v prove_v to_o be_v the_o most_o fit_a certain_a maintenance_n the_o most_o suitable_a to_o all_o incident_a condition_n of_o the_o land_n that_o can_v be_v find_v and_o why_o upon_o this_o account_n may_v not_o tithe_n be_v appoint_v and_o maintain_v by_o the_o magistrate_n require_v by_o the_o minister_n and_o pay_v by_o the_o people_n what_o law_n of_o god_n do_v those_o or_o these_o sin_n against_o herein_o suppose_v the_o determinate_a proportion_n and_o way_n of_o maintenance_n not_o express_v and_o determine_v by_o god_n now_o in_o new-testament-day_n but_o only_o that_o there_o shall_v be_v a_o fit_a maintenance_n do_v not_o the_o determine_n of_o the_o way_n and_o proportion_n of_o maintenance_n belong_v to_o the_o magistrate_n and_o be_v this_o way_n and_o proportion_n jewish_n when_o they_o pitch_v not_o upon_o it_o on_o the_o jewish_a account_n as_o any_o way_n a_o part_n of_o or_o subservient_fw-fr to_o the_o ceremonial_a law_n or_o be_v it_o oppressive_a and_o unreasonable_a as_o some_o complain_v see_v it_o be_v the_o equitable_a way_n which_o the_o wisdom_n of_o god_n once_o appoint_v for_o his_o minister_n maintenance_n be_v not_o here_o a_o sufficient_a bottom_n for_o any_o man_n spirit_n to_o rest_v upon_o in_o relation_n to_o tithe_n but_o if_o this_o be_v not_o enough_o 2_o none_o can_v deny_v that_o man_n may_v give_v away_o and_o perpetual_o bequeath_v to_o other_o the_o ten_o part_n of_o the_o profit_n of_o their_o good_n land_n and_o inheritance_n if_o any_o man_n of_o mr._n p_n congregation_n shall_v bequeath_v to_o he_o and_o his_o successor_n the_o future_a pastor_n of_o that_o congregation_n the_o ten_o part_n of_o his_o own_o proper_a revenue_n for_o ever_o may_v not_o he_o and_o his_o successor_n lawful_o claim_v and_o enjoy_v it_o will_v not_o their_o title_n be_v good_a to_o it_o now_o thus_o it_o be_v in_o the_o case_n of_o minister_n claim_v and_o take_v tithe_n in_o england_n as_o be_v sufficient_o know_v to_o any_o that_o know_v any_o thing_n to_o purpose_n in_o this_o matter_n the_o first_o monarch_n of_o this_o nation_n when_o all_o the_o land_n in_o england_n be_v their_o demesn_a demise_v the_o ten_o of_o all_o the_o profit_n of_o they_o to_o the_o minister_n of_o holy_a thing_n i_o shall_v here_o transcribe_v something_o of_o what_o be_v unquestionable_o record_v about_o it_o etc._n mr._n treleyny_n of_o tithe_n p._n 13_o etc._n etc._n tithe_n be_v legal_o the_o minister_n own_o not_o give_v to_o he_o by_o the_o subject_a as_o be_v now_o pretend_a but_o pay_v unto_o he_o as_o a_o rent-charge_n lay_v upon_o the_o land_n and_o that_o before_o the_o subject_n either_o lord_n or_o tenant_n have_v any_o thing_n to_o do_v in_o the_o land_n at_o all_o it_o appear_v say_v sir_n edward_n coke_n by_o the_o law_n and_o ordinance_n of_o ancient_a king_n and_o especial_o of_o king_n alfred_n that_o the_o first_o king_n of_o this_o realm_n have_v all_o the_o land_n of_o england_n in_o demesne_n and_o at_o this_o time_n it_o be_v when_o all_o the_o land_n of_o england_n be_v the_o king_n demesne_n that_o ethelwolph_n the_o second_o monarch_n of_o the_o saxon_a
race_n his_o father_n egbert_n be_v the_o first_o which_o bring_v the_o former_a heptarchy_n under_o one_o sole_a prince_n confer_v the_o tithe_n of_o all_o the_o kingdom_n upon_o the_o church_n by_o his_o royal_a charter_n king_n ethelwolph_n say_v ingulph_n with_o the_o consent_n of_o his_o prelate_n and_o prince_n which_o rule_v in_o england_n under_o he_o in_o their_o several_a province_n do_v first_o enrich_v the_o church_n of_o england_n with_o the_o tithe_n of_o all_o his_o land_n and_o good_n by_o his_o charter_n royal._n he_o give_v say_v ethelward_n the_o tithe_n of_o his_o possession_n for_o the_o lord_n own_o portion_n and_o order_v it_o to_o be_v so_o in_o all_o part_n of_o the_o kingdom_n he_o discharge_v say_v florence_n of_o worcester_n the_o ten_o part_n of_o his_o realm_n of_o all_o tribute_n and_o service_n due_a unto_o the_o crown_n and_o by_o his_o perpetual_a charter_n offer_v it_o to_o the_o three-one_a god_n the_o charter_n make_v it_o evident_a that_o the_o king_n do_v not_o only_o give_v de_fw-fr facto_fw-la the_o tithe_n or_o ten_o part_n of_o his_o whole_a realm_n to_o the_o use_n of_o the_o clergy_n but_o that_o he_o have_v a_o right_a and_o a_o power_n to_o do_v it_o as_o be_v not_o only_o the_o lord_n paramount_n but_o the_o proprietary_n of_o the_o whole_a land_n the_o lord_n and_o great_a man_n of_o the_o realm_n not_o have_v then_o a_o property_n or_o estate_n of_o permanency_n but_o as_o accomptant_n to_o the_o king_n who_o the_o whole_a land_n be_v and_o this_o appear_v yet_o further_o by_o a_o law_n of_o king_n athelstanes_n make_v in_o the_o year_n 930._o about_o which_o time_n not_o only_o the_o prelate_n of_o the_o church_n as_o former_o but_o the_o great_a man_n of_o the_o realm_n begin_v to_o be_v settle_v in_o estate_n of_o permanency_n and_o to_o claim_v a_o property_n in_o those_o land_n which_o they_o hold_v of_o the_o crown_n and_o claim_v so_o begin_v it_o seem_v to_o make_v bold_a to_o subduct_v their_o tithe_n for_o remedy_v whereof_o the_o king_n make_v this_o law_n command_v all_o his_o minister_n throughout_o the_o kingdom_n that_o in_o the_o first_o place_n they_o shall_v pay_v the_o tithe_n of_o his_o own_o estate_n which_o he_o hold_v in_o his_o own_o hand_n and_o have_v not_o estate_v out_o to_o his_o lord_n and_o baron_n and_o that_o the_o bishop_n do_v the_o like_a of_o what_o they_o hold_v in_o right_a of_o their_o church_n and_o his_o noble_n and_o officer_n of_o that_o which_o they_o hold_v in_o property_n as_o their_o own_o possession_n or_o inheritance_n so_o then_o the_o land_n be_v charge_v thus_o with_o the_o payment_n of_o tithe_n come_v with_o this_o clog_n unto_o the_o lord_n and_o great_a man_n of_o the_o realm_n and_o have_v be_v so_o transmit_v and_o pass_v over_o from_o one_o hand_n to_o another_o until_o it_o come_v to_o the_o possession_n of_o the_o present_a owner_n who_o whatsoever_o right_o they_o have_v to_o the_o other_o nine_o part_n either_o of_o fee-simple_n lease_n or_o copy_n have_v certain_o none_o at_o all_o in_o the_o tithe_n or_o ten_o which_o be_v no_o more_o they_o or_o to_o be_v so_o think_v of_o than_o the_o other_o nine_o part_n be_v the_o clergy_n for_o in_o whatsoever_o tenure_n they_o hold_v their_o land_n they_o purchase_v they_o on_o this_o tacit_n condition_n that_o beside_o the_o rent_n and_o service_n they_o pay_v to_o the_o lord_n they_o be_v to_o pay_v to_o the_o clergy_n or_o those_o who_o succeed_v in_o their_o right_n a_o ten_o of_o all_o the_o fruit_n of_o the_o earth_n and_o of_o the_o fruit_n of_o their_o cattle_n and_o all_o creature_n tytheable_a and_o by_o how_o many_o act_n of_o parliament_n tithe_n have_v be_v confirm_v to_o the_o clergy_n on_o this_o account_n in_o the_o reign_v of_o several_a of_o our_o prince_n unto_o this_o day_n appear_v full_o in_o the_o treatise_n of_o learned_a lawyer_n as_o also_o what_o care_n have_v be_v take_v for_o the_o true_a payment_n of_o they_o these_o thing_n consider_v it_o be_v evident_a that_o by_o donation_n the_o ministry_n of_o england_n have_v as_o good_a a_o civil_a right_n to_o the_o tithe_n as_o any_o other_o person_n have_v to_o the_o other_o nine_o part_n possess_v by_o they_o and_o i_o fear_v therefore_o that_o many_o of_o those_o who_o be_v now_o so_o hot_a for_o the_o abolish_n of_o tithe_n will_v soon_o labour_v if_o they_o have_v power_n in_o their_o hand_n to_o extinguish_v landlord_n rent_n also_o thus_o tithe_n be_v make_v over_o and_o hold_v may_v be_v claim_v and_o aught_o to_o be_v pay_v on_o the_o account_n of_o the_o magistrate_n lawful_a appointment_n determination_n and_o law_n and_o the_o right_n of_o ancient_a donation_n in_o england_n and_o these_o two_o ground_n well-considered_n be_v sufficient_a to_o satisfy_v any_o man_n that_o there_o be_v no_o need_n to_o take_v they_o away_o though_o the_o divine_a right_n of_o they_o shall_v not_o be_v make_v good_a suffice_v there_o be_v a_o firm_a civil_a right_n for_o they_o but_o yet_o because_o mr._n p._n be_v so_o confident_a and_o peremptory_a in_o deny_v and_o oppose_v the_o divine_a right_n of_o tithe_n though_o as_o his_o manner_n be_v he_o answer_v not_o the_o many_o and_o weighty_a argument_n urge_v by_o no_o mean_a divine_n and_o master_n of_o reason_n for_o it_o i_o shall_v view_v what_o he_o say_v to_o that_o plea._n consider_v we_o then_o that_o 3_o some_z plead_v for_o tithe_n upon_o the_o account_n of_o divine_a right_n allege_v that_o this_o way_n of_o minister_n maintenance_n by_o tithe_n be_v appoint_v by_o god_n before_o the_o law_n and_o under_o the_o law_n and_o be_v not_o repeal_v or_o any_o other_o substitute_v in_o its_o room_n by_o the_o gospel_n and_o that_o therefore_o tithe_n be_v due_a by_o a_o moral_a and_o perpetual_o bind_v law_n of_o god_n what_o say_v mr._n p._n to_o this_o it_o be_v a_o old-testament_n maintenance_n be_v it_o so_o this_o be_v that_o be_v plead_v the_o old_a the_o better_o as_o to_o evidence_n if_o it_o be_v not_o repeal_v the_o sabbath_n be_v a_o old-testament_n ordinance_n and_o have_v no_o new-testament_n law_n express_v to_o establish_v it_o will_v he_o therefore_o say_v away_o with_o the_o sabbath_n what_o say_v he_o to_o the_o repeal_n of_o tythe-maintenance_n it_o seem_v to_o i_o plain_o distinguish_v from_o the_o new-testament_n maintenance_n in_o that_o 1_o cor._n 9.13_o 14._o plain_o every_o man_n have_v not_o so_o good_a eye_n as_o mr._n p._n i_o see_v not_o the_o least_o appearance_n of_o any_o such_o thing_n in_o that_o text_n it_o be_v well_o he_o say_v to_o i_o plain_o for_o i_o dare_v engage_v upon_o my_o little_a read_n that_o no_o expositor_n of_o note_n do_v ever_o see_v any_o such_o thing_n in_o this_o scripture_n much_o less_o see_v it_o plain_o some_o of_o they_o have_v think_v they_o have_v see_v the_o contrary_a to_o this_o notion_n in_o it_o and_o have_v plead_v from_o the_o so_o for_o the_o divine_a right_n of_o tithe_n but_o none_o that_o i_o know_v of_o do_v ever_o behold_v the_o maintenance_n plain_o or_o indeed_o at_o all_o distinguish_v in_o it_o this_o sharpness_n of_o sight_n mr._n p._n shall_v carry_v away_o the_o glory_n of_o well_o but_o he_o will_v make_v we_o see_v it_o behold_v we_o then_o it_o be_v plain_a say_v he_o he_o argue_v a_o simili_fw-la from_o the_o like_a and_o like_a be_v not_o the_o same_o now_o it_o be_v plain_a to_o i_o that_o mr._n p._n understand_v not_o the_o text_n and_o that_o he_o abuse_v logic_n though_o not_o out_o of_o ill_a will_n to_o it_o i_o suppose_v the_o logic_n be_v too_o too_o bad_a even_o for_o a_o midsummer_n bachelaur_n for_o the_o axiom_n as_o use_v by_o he_o have_v a_o gross_a fallacy_n in_o it_o a_o dicto_fw-la secundum_fw-la quid_fw-la ad_fw-la dictum_fw-la simpliciter_fw-la it_o be_v true_a that_o like_a be_v not_o can_v be_v the_o same_o numerical_o but_o it_o may_v be_v the_o same_o specifical_o and_o be_v and_o if_o mr._n p._n have_v be_v better_o acquaint_v with_o aristotle_n he_o may_v have_v know_v so_o much_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 3._o 〈◊〉_d 10._o e●_n c._n 3._o like_a thing_n be_v not_o the_o same_o simple_o but_o they_o be_v the_o same_o as_o to_o species_n or_o kind_n suppose_v then_o the_o apostle_n to_o argue_v from_o the_o like_a when_o he_o argue_v for_o a_o gospel-maintenance_n from_o the_o consideration_n of_o the_o maintenance_n have_v under_o the_o law_n do_v it_o follow_v he_o must_v mean_v another_o kind_n of_o maintenance_n by_o that_o which_o he_o plead_v for_o be_v not_o tithe_n pay_v under_o the_o law_n and_o tithe_n pay_v under_o the_o gospel_n alike_o as_o tithe_n pay_v and_o yet_o be_v not_o they_o the_o same_o as_o they_o be_v one_o kind_n of_o