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england_n book_n church_n rome_n 3,625 5 7.0618 4 false
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A30189 An answer to two treatises of Mr. Iohn Can, the leader of the English Brownists in Amsterdam the former called, A necessitie of separation from the Church of England, proved by the Nonconformists principles : the other, A stay against straying : wherein in opposition to M. Iohn Robinson, he undertakes to prove the unlawfulnesse of hearing the ministers of the Church of England ... / by the late learned, laborious and faithfull servant of Jesus Christ, John Ball. Ball, John, 1585-1640.; Ashe, Simeon, d. 1662. 1642 (1642) Wing B558; ESTC R3127 281,779 264

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in_o ordinatione_fw-la hujusmodi_fw-la personarum_fw-la sit_fw-la praetermissus_fw-la ac_fw-la violatus_fw-la sicut_fw-la perspicue_n apparet_fw-la denique_fw-la &_o senatui_fw-la ecclesiastico_fw-la &_o populo_fw-la christiano_n jus_o omne_fw-la suum_fw-la atque_fw-la suffragium_fw-la misere_fw-la sit_fw-la hac_fw-la ratione_fw-la &_o in_fw-la hoc_fw-la genere_fw-la vocationum_fw-la ecclesiasticarum_fw-la ademptum_fw-la &_o in_o unum_fw-la quendam_fw-la episcopum_fw-la magnâ_fw-la tyrannide_fw-la atque_fw-la abusu_fw-la translatum_fw-la dominus_fw-la deus_fw-la talibus_fw-la corruptionibus_fw-la quae_fw-la adhuc_fw-la in_o ecclesiis_fw-la ipsius_fw-la supersunt_fw-la &_o defenduntur_fw-la mederi_fw-la magna_fw-la sva_fw-la misericordia_fw-la dignetur_fw-la &_o velit_fw-la quae_fw-la tandem_fw-la certè_fw-la magnam_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la dei_fw-la rvinam_fw-la secum_fw-la trahent_fw-la &_o ipsum_fw-la sacrosanctum_fw-la verbi_fw-la ministerium_fw-la reddent_fw-la efficientque_fw-la 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vitium_fw-la quod_fw-la in_o eorum_fw-la personis_fw-la &_o electione_n inhaeret_fw-la damnare_fw-la oportet_fw-la &_o quantum_fw-la possumus_fw-la tum_fw-la emendare_fw-la tum_fw-la etiam_fw-la emendatum_fw-la velle_fw-la hac_fw-la ratione_fw-la fit_a ut_fw-la etiam_fw-la a_o sacrificulis_fw-la papisticis_fw-la collatus_fw-la baptismus_fw-la non_fw-la sit_fw-la in_o ecclesia_fw-la dei_fw-la repetendus_fw-la &_o pro_fw-la nullo_n habendus_fw-la etsi_fw-la enim_fw-la in_o ecclesiae_fw-la dei_fw-la illegitimam_fw-la vocationem_fw-la papistici_fw-la sacrificuli_fw-la habent_fw-la tamen_fw-la ex_fw-la consensu_fw-la populi_fw-la habent_fw-la aliquam_fw-la est_fw-la autem_fw-la aliud_fw-la ut_fw-la ait_fw-la august_n 13._o august_n contr_n parmenian_n l._n c._n 13._o aliquid_fw-la prorsus_fw-la non_fw-la habere_fw-la aliud_fw-la auten_fw-mi aliquid_fw-la perniciosè_fw-la habere_fw-la aliud_fw-la auten_fw-mi aliquid_fw-la salubriter_fw-la habere_fw-la quod_fw-la tertium_fw-la solum_fw-la 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273._o they_o grant_v that_o we_o have_v the_o true_a church_n of_o god_n but_o that_o for_o want_n of_o those_o ordinance_n which_o it_o shall_v have_v and_o through_o certain_a the_o deform_a rag_n of_o popery_n which_o it_o shall_v not_o have_v the_o church_n do_v not_o appear_v in_o her_o native_a colour_n and_o so_o beautiful_a as_o it_o be_v meet_v she_o shall_v be_v prepare_v to_o so_o glorious_a a_o husband_n as_o the_o son_n of_o god_n master_n cartwright_n severe_o reprehend_v the_o abuse_n of_o the_o ignorant_a minister_n which_o in_o respect_n of_o the_o place_n which_o they_o occupy_v be_v idol_n because_o they_o stand_v for_o that_o and_o make_v show_v of_o that_o which_o they_o be_v not_o and_o thereupon_o he_o add_v admit_v you_o they_o as_o often_o as_o you_o will_v the_o lord_n pronounce_v that_o they_o shall_v be_v no_o minister_n to_o he_o which_o have_v no_o knowledge_n this_o you_o cite_v many_o time_n but_o in_o two_o thing_n master_n cartwright_n explain_v himself_o first_o that_o through_o ignorance_n of_o that_o which_o they_o do_v some_o
right_a religion_n else_o the_o heretic_n in_o england_n will_v never_o have_v receive_v so_o much_o of_o it_o for_o some_o have_v avouch_v it_o to_o my_o face_n say_v the_o author_n of_o the_o curtain_n of_o church-power_n that_o the_o service_n there_o be_v nothing_o to_o the_o mass_n in_o the_o english_a other_o that_o it_o want_v nothing_o but_o the_o pope_n consecration_n these_o thing_n thus_o retrive_v it_o be_v also_o think_v that_o popish_a king_n and_o prince_n will_v be_v the_o less_o offend_v what_o marvel_n see_v the_o jesuit_n themselves_o be_v so_o well_o please_v with_o the_o ceremony_n and_o service_n that_o i_o hear_v one_o of_o they_o god_n be_v my_o witness_n herein_o make_v it_o his_o hope_n that_o the_o maintenance_n of_o they_o against_o the_o puritan_n will_v make_v england_n the_o soon_o return_v to_o rome_n in_o the_o rest_n 4._o qu●vadis_fw-la sec_fw-la 4._o my_o eye_n and_o ear_n say_v bishop_n hall_n can_v witness_v with_o what_o approof_n and_o applause_n 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this_o effect_n speak_v bristol_n and_o harding_n if_o these_o thing_n be_v right_a why_o not_o the_o rest_n it_o shall_v not_o be_v amiss_o to_o mark_v one_o occurrence_n in_o queen_n elizabeth_n time_n who_o be_v interdict_v by_o the_o pope_n bull_n secretary_n walsingham_n try_v a_o trick_n of_o state-policy_n to_o reverse_v the_o same_o he_o cause_v two_o of_o the_o pope_n intelligencer_n at_o the_o pope_n appointment_n to_o be_v bring_v as_o it_o be_v in_o secret_a into_o england_n to_o who_o he_o appoint_v a_o guide_n be_v a_o state_n intelligencer_n who_o shall_v show_v they_o in_o canterbury_n and_o london_n service_n solemn_o sing_v and_o say_v with_o all_o their_o pomp_n and_o procession_n which_o order_n the_o popish_a intelligencer_n see_v and_o so_o much_o admire_v they_o wonder_v that_o their_o master_n will_v be_v so_o unadvised_a as_o to_o interdict_v a_o prince_n or_o state_n who_o service_n and_o ceremony_n so_o symbolise_v with_o his_o own_o so_o return_v it_o the_o 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note_v to_o entreat_v your_o serious_a reexamination_n of_o what_o you_o have_v do_v and_o now_o i_o come_v to_o the_o argument_n here_o propound_v whereunto_o i_o make_v answer_n as_o you_o relate_v it_o for_o i_o have_v not_o the_o d._n book_n to_o search_v out_o what_o he_o have_v write_v the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n be_v twofold_a conciovalis_fw-la &_o judicialis_fw-la as_o it_o be_v usual_o call_v the_o first_o consist_v in_o the_o preach_n of_o the_o gospel_n wherein_o the_o kingdom_n of_o heaven_n be_v open_v to_o the_o penitent_a sin_n remit_v life_n promise_v and_o heaven_n shut_v to_o the_o obstinate_a which_o be_v the_o sword_n and_o the_o sceptre_n of_o christ_n whereby_o he_o save_v his_o people_n 1.16_o 2_o cor._n 1.21_o 2_o cor._n 10.4_o isa_n 11.4_o rom._n 1.16_o and_o conquer_v his_o enemy_n beat_v down_o every_o strong_a hold_n p●ireeth_v to_o the_o division_n of_o foul_a and_o spirit_n and_o of_o the_o joint_n and_o marrow_n and_o judge_v the_o very_a cogitation_n 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and_o in_o this_o you_o do_v not_o pretend_v the_o nonconformist_n principle_n as_o you_o do_v in_o the_o former_a the_o exception_n also_o which_o you_o take_v against_o they_o be_v not_o in_o respect_n of_o gift_n learning_n or_o diligence_n nor_o that_o they_o be_v bring_v into_o the_o church_n by_o antichrist_n but_o chief_o in_o respect_n of_o the_o office_n and_o ministry_n itself_o that_o which_o you_o object_v concern_v the_o name_n that_o it_o be_v new_a as_o you_o do_v before_o against_o parson_n vicar_n and_o curate_n that_o they_o be_v popish_a be_v too_o slight_a to_o be_v insist_v upon_o for_o these_o and_o divers_a other_o name_n or_o title_n give_v to_o the_o preacher_n of_o the_o word_n do_v not_o note_v different_a ministery_n for_o substance_n and_o kind_n but_o different_a accident_n whereby_o the_o minister_n be_v distinguish_v and_o sometime_o the_o employment_n whereabout_o they_o be_v principal_o exercise_v but_o the_o ministry_n which_o be_v exercise_v under_o 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and_o essential_a part_n be_v that_o very_a ministry_n which_o christ_n have_v institute_v and_o ordain_v in_o the_o new_a testament_n and_o which_o he_o have_v bless_v for_o the_o gather_n and_o build_v forward_o of_o his_o church_n in_o faith_n and_o holiness_n it_o be_v not_o then_o the_o common_a judgement_n of_o the_o reformist_n nor_o the_o private_a opinion_n of_o any_o particular_a man_n of_o that_o mind_n that_o i_o have_v see_v or_o hear_v of_o that_o the_o office_n or_o call_n of_o a_o lecturer_n be_v utter_o to_o be_v condemn_v who_o the_o author_n be_v or_o what_o the_o work_n which_o you_o quote_v entitle_v the_o necessity_n of_o discipline_n i_o know_v not_o nor_o what_o he_o say_v perhaps_o you_o allege_v he_o as_o you_o have_v do_v other_o wrongful_o it_o may_v be_v he_o speak_v of_o some_o circumstance_n not_o of_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o call_n if_o he_o go_v any_o further_a it_o be_v his_o private_a conceit_n and_o must_v not_o be_v impute_v to_o the_o 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macarius_n until_o his_o death_n and_o augustine_n valerius_n and_o if_o the_o pastor_n be_v careless_a or_o negligent_a it_o be_v lawful_a for_o the_o people_n to_o provide_v for_o themselves_o by_o the_o best_a mean_n that_o they_o can_v or_o god_n be_v please_v to_o afford_v unto_o they_o that_o they_o may_v be_v teach_v and_o instruct_v in_o the_o way_n of_o holiness_n three_o pastor_n be_v to_o feed_v the_o flock_n commit_v unto_o their_o care_n yet_o so_o as_o many_o pastor_n may_v be_v set_v over_o one_o flock_n which_o they_o must_v feed_v in_o common_a and_o to_o this_o purpose_n some_o write_v 170._o a_o dispute_n par_fw-fr 3._o cap._n 8._o pag._n 170._o that_o the_o apostolic_a and_o primitive_a time_n know_v neither_o parishional_a nor_o diocesan_n church_n but_o christian_n live_v then_o in_o city_n only_o not_o in_o village_n because_o of_o the_o persecution_n 12._o act._n 20.27_o 28._o phil._n 1.1_o 1_o thes_n 5.12_o act._n
long_o ago_o another_o in_o the_o book_n which_o you_o pretend_v to_o answer_v and_o in_o these_o very_a page_n he_o most_o shameful_o and_o lewd_o as_o a_o man_n void_a of_o all_o common_a honesty_n and_o grace_n make_v the_o minister_n of_o lincoln_n to_o affirm_v that_o the_o prelate_n be_v revile_v to_o be_v great_a antichrist_n and_o their_o ministry_n and_o constitution_n to_o be_v great_a troubler_n of_o the_o church_n at_o this_o day_n and_o that_o it_o can_v but_o be_v very_o sinful_a and_o hurtful_a to_o retain_v or_o communicate_v with_o they_o word_n can_n stay_v §._o 3._o p._n 59.69_o rai●old_n de_fw-fr idelo●l_fw-fr 2._o c._n 1._o §._o 2._o bilson_n christ_n subj_fw-la part_n 3._o pag._n 269._o the_o devil_n himself_o can_v show_v no_o great_a malice_n than_o to_o pervert_v that_o which_o be_v well_o speak_v and_o to_o force_v a_o lewd_a senes_fw-la of_o his_o own_o or_o another_o man_n word_n the_o devil_n himself_o will_v have_v be_v ashamed_a in_o this_o open_a manner_n to_o have_v tell_v such_o a_o lie_n and_o therefore_o he_o be_v to_o be_v trust_v no_o further_o than_o he_o be_v see_v this_o you_o pass_v over_o in_o silence_n and_o if_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o accusation_n be_v apply_v unto_o yourself_o i_o know_v not_o what_o apology_n you_o can_v make_v christ_n say_v rainolds_n as_o you_o quote_v he_o the_o pastor_n of_o his_o church_n do_v tell_v we_o that_o he_o feed_v not_o in_o antichristian_a assembly_n in_o the_o den_n of_o thief_n neither_o be_v it_o his_o will_n that_o his_o flock_n shall_v there_o rest_v at_o noon_n but_o in_o the_o pleasant_a pasture_n by_o the_o still_a water_n that_o be_v in_o the_o shadow_n of_o the_o true_a christian_a church_n detest_a idolatry_n but_o d._n rainolds_n word_n be_v not_o in_o caetibus_fw-la papisticis_fw-la speluncis_fw-la idol●latrarum_fw-la etc._n etc._n but_o in_o untbraculis_fw-la orthodoxorumcatuum_fw-la whether_o this_o change_n of_o antichristian_a assembly_n for_o popish_a assembly_n and_o true_a christian_a church_n for_o orthodox_n assembly_n 2●4_n can_n stay_v §_o 3._o p_o 22._o d._n 〈◊〉_d by_o word_n and_o letter_n testimonial_a 2●4_n w●_n make_v in_o simplicity_n be_v judge_v yourself_o you_o may_v easy_o conjecture_v your_o credulous_a reader_n may_v conceit_n our_o assembly_n to_o be_v antichristian_a and_o not_o true_a church_n but_o popish_a assembly_n and_o not_o orthodox_n he_o can_v not_o imagine_v they_o to_o be_v you_o allege_v d._n amos_n say_v it_o can_v be_v a_o true_a church_n that_o want_v order_n for_o by_o this_o the_o part_n and_o member_n thereof_o be_v knit_v together_o but_o this_o be_v not_o to_o be_v find_v in_o the_o place_n mention_v but_o d._n aines_n move_v the_o question_n whether_o it_o be_v lawful_a to_o stick_v to_o that_o church_n from_o who_o power_n of_o remove_v scandal_n and_o purge_v out_o the_o ungodly_a be_v take_v away_o he_o answer_v that_o power_n ejure_v &_o quoad_fw-la actum_fw-la primum_fw-la can_v be_v separate_v from_o the_o true_a church_n because_o immediate_o and_o necessary_o it_o flow_v from_o the_o essence_n itself_o for_o it_o be_v contain_v in_o that_o covenant_n whereby_o the_o faithful_a be_v gather_v into_o a_o church_n the_o use_n of_o this_o power_n can_v be_v take_v away_o without_o the_o great_a sin_n of_o they_o that_o take_v it_o away_o and_o the_o heinous_a injury_n of_o they_o from_o who_o it_o be_v take_v neither_o ought_v the_o church_n to_o rest_v in_o this_o that_o she_o see_v herself_o unjust_o oppress_v of_o other_o for_o it_o belong_v to_o the_o office_n of_o the_o church_n to_o defend_v that_o liberty_n where_o with_o she_o be_v endow_v of_o christ_n but_o yet_o if_o the_o faithful_a contend_v for_o their_o liberty_n can_v obtain_v their_o right_n in_o that_o part_n nor_o without_o grievous_a inconvenience_n come_v to_o a_o more_o free_a church_n and_o can_v keep_v themselves_o from_o the_o approbation_n of_o evil_a and_o do_v also_o study_v as_o much_o as_o in_o they_o lie_v to_o supply_v that_o want_n they_o sin_v not_o if_o they_o join_v themselves_o to_o such_o a_o church_n or_o continue_v in_o it_o thus_o d._n ames_n clean_o contrary_a to_o that_o which_o you_o make_v he_o affirm_v master_n baines_n as_o you_o allege_v he_o writes_z diocesan_n can_n stay_v sect_n 2._o p._n 55._o bain_n diocesan_n that_o no_o people_n can_v worship_n god_n in_o repair_v to_o any_o church_n or_o ministry_n without_o warrant_n of_o the_o word_n let_v the_o reader_n note_v it_o say_v you_o and_o if_o it_o be_v wise_o note_v it_o make_v nothing_o against_o partake_v in_o our_o assembly_n in_o the_o ordinance_n of_o grace_n because_o that_o be_v warrant_v approve_a command_v of_o god_n in_o his_o holy_a word_n but_o master_n baines_n word_n be_v no_o people_n can_v worship_n god_n in_o repair_v to_o this_o place_n and_o ministry_n without_o warrant_n of_o his_o word_n and_o he_o speak_v of_o a_o diocesan_n worship_n and_o ministry_n peculiar_o appropriate_v to_o that_o place_n as_o it_o be_v at_o jerusalem_n which_o be_v nothing_o to_o your_o purpose_n you_o pretend_v that_o you_o have_v take_v your_o principle_n out_o of_o the_o nonconformist_n ever_o the_o chief_a of_o they_o which_o for_o learning_n read_v can_n neces_fw-la of_o separ_fw-la to_o the_o read_v zeal_n judgement_n holiness_n of_o life_n etc._n etc._n have_v ever_o hold_v that_o cause_n but_o some_o thing_n bring_v in_o their_o name_n be_v neither_o the_o opinion_n of_o all_o nor_o of_o the_o most_o nor_o of_o the_o best_a learned_a nor_o of_o many_o but_o either_o the_o private_a opinion_n of_o some_o one_o or_o the_o conceit_n of_o such_o indeed_o as_o be_v separate_v from_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o not_o from_o the_o abuse_v only_o which_o be_v in_o the_o church_n you_o cite_v master_n penry_n say_v 252._o can_n stay_v sect_n 3._o p._n 57_o m._n penry_n of_o the_o ministry_n of_o the_o church_n of_o engl._n p._n 37.38_o can_n neces_fw-la of_o separ_fw-la p._n 16_o 28.43_o exhortation_n to_o the_o government_n of_o wales_n 42_o 46_o 26_o can_n neces_fw-la of_o separation_n epist_n to_o the_o reader_n can_n neces_fw-la of_o separ_fw-la p._n 252._o it_o be_v most_o certain_a satan_n rule_v in_o the_o conscience_n of_o man_n not_o only_o by_o false_a doctrine_n but_o also_o by_o his_o false_a power_n and_o ordinance_n his_o kingdom_n of_o darkness_n not_o only_o consist_v in_o the_o lie_v false_a doctrine_n and_o worship_n which_o he_o have_v coin_v but_o also_o in_o the_o false_a and_o antichristian_a ordinance_n which_o he_o have_v invent_v for_o the_o rule_n of_o his_o idolatrous_a den_n and_o therefore_o the_o child_n and_o saint_n of_o god_n aught_o to_o avoid_v both_o the_o one_o and_o the_o other_o but_o whatsoever_o his_o meaning_n be_v in_o that_o or_o other_o passage_n cite_v master_n penry_n be_v not_o a_o nonconformist_n but_o a_o separatist_n by_o your_o own_o confession_n and_o therefore_o his_o say_n be_v not_o to_o be_v receive_v for_o the_o nonconformist_n principle_n master_n br._n say_v it_o be_v lawful_a to_o communicate_v in_o that_o worship_n where_o the_o ceremony_n be_v use_v but_o we_o can_v believe_v he_o say_v you_o for_o his_o brethren_n both_o affirm_v and_o prove_v the_o contrary_n and_o here_o now_o be_v a_o fit_a place_n to_o write_v down_o the_o word_n whereof_o mention_n be_v make_v in_o p._n 99_o partly_o because_o the_o author_n be_v a_o principle_n nonconformi_v and_o partly_o to_o discover_v the_o rashness_n and_o folly_n of_o this_o inconsiderate_a man_n which_o dare_v without_o any_o reason_n more_o than_o boldness_n still_o justify_v the_o very_a thing_n which_o his_o brethren_n by_o many_o sound_a argument_n have_v manifest_v to_o be_v evil_a and_o unlawful_a and_o then_o you_o go_v on_o to_o rehearse_v the_o word_n of_o the_o author_n of_o a_o dispute_n upon_o communicate_v at_o confuse_a communion_n pag._n 68.69_o who_o that_o author_n be_v i_o know_v not_o the_o book_n i_o have_v not_o see_v but_o by_o the_o word_n which_o you_o relate_v it_o appear_v he_o be_v no_o english_a nonconformist_n neither_o do_v he_o speak_v of_o communicate_v in_o our_o english_a society_n and_o if_o he_o do_v he_o speak_v but_o his_o private_a opinion_n and_o not_o what_o be_v the_o judgement_n of_o nonconformist_n it_o may_v be_v question_v whether_o master_n br._n book_n be_v not_o pen_v and_o publish_v before_o he_o can_v either_o see_v or_o think_v of_o the_o other_o but_o whatsoever_o be_v to_o be_v think_v in_o that_o particular_a m._n br._n know_v it_o to_o be_v the_o common_a practice_n and_o uniform_a judgement_n of_o all_o nonconformist_n in_o england_n both_o heretofore_o and_o at_o that_o present_a when_o he_o write_v that_o it_o be_v lawful_a 75.76_o a_o dispute_n against_o engl._n part_n 1._o ca._n 9_o sect_n 3._o
be_v excuse_v in_o some_o thing_n which_o they_o judge_v to_o be_v amiss_o in_o the_o admonition_n present_v to_o the_o parliament_n an._n 1570._o thus_o they_o profess_v we_o have_v at_o all_o ●imes_n bear_v with_o that_o which_o we_o have_v can_v not_o amend_v in_o this_o book_n and_o have_v use_v the_o same_o in_o our_o ministry_n so_o far_o forth_o as_o we_o may_v reverence_v those_o time_n and_o those_o person_n in_o which_o and_o by_o who_o it_o be_v first_o authorise_v though_o therefore_o they_o write_v 135._o admonit_fw-la 1._o pag._n 9_o park_n of_o the_o cross_n part_n 1._o ca._n 3._o sect_n 6._o pag._n 135._o that_o it_o be_v take_v out_o of_o that_o popish_a dunghill_n the_o portius_fw-la and_o vile_a mass-book_n that_o the_o papist_n suck_v no_o little_a advantage_n out_o of_o our_o commumon-booke_n which_o they_o term_v a_o english_a translation_n out_o of_o the_o mass-book_n and_o out_o of_o the_o difficulty_n whereby_o it_o come_v in_o 2._o parson_n of_o the_o 3._o conversion_n of_o england_n pag._n 2._o many_o protestant_n themselves_o adjudge_v that_o the_o stable_n of_o popish_a superstition_n be_v not_o thorough_o purge_v out_o of_o it_o that_o bristol_n draw_v the_o likeness_n of_o our_o service-booke_n to_o the_o countenance_v of_o their_o mass-book_n 5._o brist_n motiv_fw-la 34._o rhem._n in_o john_n 20._o sect_n 5._o and_o the_o rhemist_n the_o absolution_n of_o the_o sick_a prescribe_v in_o our_o communion-booke_n to_o a_o approbation_n of_o their_o absolution_n auricular_a confession_n and_o sacrament_n of_o penance_n howsoever_o they_o disallow_v the_o service_n as_o it_o be_v practise_v in_o visitation_n and_o enjoin_v in_o the_o late_a canon_n which_o deni_v liberty_n not_o only_o to_o omit_v a_o ceremony_n but_o also_o to_o add_v alter_v 19_o park_n of_o the_o cross_n par_fw-fr 2._o ca._n 5._o sect_n 11._o pag._n 19_o or_o omit_v any_o one_o word_n of_o the_o whole_a liturgy_n when_o we_o affirm_v the_o word_n of_o the_o lord_n prayer_n and_o the_o form_n in_o baptism_n and_o the_o supper_n may_v be_v alter_v without_o fault_n though_o in_o these_o thing_n they_o take_v exception_n against_o the_o book_n and_o the_o manner_n of_o urge_v it_o yet_o they_o never_o dislike_v the_o use_n of_o it_o altogether_o much_o less_o condemn_v it_o as_o a_o false_a devise_v and_o idolatrous_a worship_n their_o profession_n and_o practice_n from_o time_n to_o time_n both_o before_o and_o since_o the_o controversy_n be_v move_v about_o the_o book_n speak_v plain_o in_o this_o matter_n 125._o can._n neces_fw-la of_o separate_a pag._n 125._o judge_v then_o yourself_o whether_o it_o be_v not_o a_o notorious_a calumny_n in_o you_o to_o write_v that_o our_o stint_a service_n devise_v by_o the_o bishop_n and_o translate_v from_o the_o mass_n be_v affirm_v by_o our_o own_o writer_n to_o be_v a_o false_a and_o forge_a worship_n and_o that_o it_o be_v even_o so_o i_o appeal_v to_o many_o of_o your_o conscience_n for_o why_o do_v you_o loath_a to_o use_v the_o same_o in_o your_o family_n but_o because_o you_o know_v it_o be_v not_o the_o incense_n make_v by_o fire_n from_o the_o altar_n of_o the_o lord_n be_v it_o a_o small_a thing_n thus_o to_o slander_n and_o reproach_v the_o servant_n of_o christ_n contrary_a to_o their_o writing_n profession_n and_o practice_n and_o your_o own_o conscience_n and_o what_o a_o vain_a surmise_n be_v this_o that_o because_o they_o forbear_v to_o use_v it_o in_o their_o house_n therefore_o in_o conscience_n they_o know_v it_o to_o be_v strange_a incense_n as_o if_o many_o thing_n may_v not_o be_v forbear_v which_o in_o themselves_o be_v lawful_a in_o read_v the_o scripture_n a_o christian_a may_v use_v one_o translation_n when_o he_o do_v not_o condemn_v other_o as_o abomination_n i_o may_v presume_v in_o private_a you_o make_v not_o use_v of_o the_o lord_n prayer_n and_o so_o of_o some_o other_o and_o yet_o you_o will_v not_o that_o another_o shall_v fit_v in_o your_o 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great_a part_n pick_v and_o cull_v out_o of_o the_o mass-book_n but_o it_o follow_v not_o thence_o that_o either_o it_o be_v or_o be_v esteem_v by_o they_o a_o devise_v or_o false_a worship_n for_o many_o thing_n contain_v in_o the_o mass-book_n itself_o be_v good_a and_o holy_a a_o pearl_n may_v be_v find_v upon_o a_o dunghill_n we_o can_v more_o credit_v the_o man_n of_o sin_n than_o to_o say_v that_o every_o thing_n in_o the_o mass-book_n be_v devilish_a and_o antichristian_a for_o than_o it_o shall_v be_v antichristian_a to_o pray_v unto_o god_n in_o the_o mediation_n of_o jesus_n christ_n to_o read_v the_o scripture_n to_o profess_v many_o fundamental_a divine_a truth_n necessary_a to_o salvation_n if_o any_o have_v mislike_v the_o book_n because_o it_o have_v too_o much_o likelihood_n to_o the_o mass-book_n that_o have_v not_o be_v the_o judgement_n of_o the_o nonconformist_n alone_o other_o have_v say_v and_o write_v as_o much_o who_o never_o yet_o condemn_v the_o use_n of_o the_o book_n or_o all_o thing_n therein_o contain_v popery_n be_v a_o scab_n or_o leprosy_n which_o cleave_v unto_o the_o church_n it_o stand_v most_o in_o erroneous_a faulty_a gross_a and_o abominable_a superstruction_n upon_o the_o true_a foundation_n whereby_o they_o poison_n or_o overthrow_v the_o foundation_n itself_o but_o take_v away_o the_o superstruction_n and_o the_o foundation_n remain_v remove_v the_o leprosy_n and_o the_o man_n be_v sound_a many_o supernatural_a divine_a truth_n of_o god_n be_v mix_v in_o the_o popish_a synagogue_n as_o pure_a gold_n with_o much_o dross_n or_o earth_n which_o the_o refiner_n be_v to_o purge_v and_o separate_v but_o not_o to_o cast_v away_o our_o service_n be_v pick_v and_o cull_v out_o of_o the_o mass-book_n you_o say_v and_o so_o it_o may_v and_o yet_o be_v free_a from_o 〈…〉_o and_o tincture_n from_o all_o show_n and_o appearance_n of_o evil_a though_o the_o mass-book_n itself_o be_v fraught_v with_o all_o manner_n of_o abomination_n for_o if_o antichrist_n fit_a in_o the_o temple_n of_o god_n and_o profess_v himself_o the_o servant_n of_o jesus_n christ_n of_o necessity_n some_o treasure_n riches_n and_o jewel_n of_o the_o church_n must_v be_v gather_v into_o his_o den_n which_o be_v collect_v purge_v and_o refine_a may_v serve_v to_o adorn_v the_o chaste_a spouse_n of_o christ_n neither_o in_o so_o do_v do_v the_o church_n honour_n antichrist_n but_o challenge_v she_o own_o right_a if_o she_o retain_v aught_o that_o belong_v to_o antichrist_n that_o be_v her_o stain_n and_o blemish_n but_o the_o recovery_n of_o that_o which_o christ_n the_o king_n and_o bridegroom_n of_o his_o church_n have_v give_v as_o her_o wealth_n or_o ornament_n must_v not_o be_v impute_v a_o fault_n christ_n religion_n be_v not_o so_o needy_a or_o unperfect_a of_o itself_o so_o needy_a and_o beggarly_a that_o it_o must_v borrow_v embr_v day_n of_o the_o heathen_a altar_n of_o the_o pope_n 1550._o william_n salisbur_n in_o his_o battery_n 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5._o ca._n 21._o weigh_v and_o not_o number_v and_o that_o the_o error_n of_o all_o these_o sort_n be_v in_o specie_fw-la much_o more_o dangerous_a and_o pernicious_a though_o not_o so_o many_o if_o you_o can_v prove_v any_o one_o error_n in_o specie_fw-la heretical_a to_o be_v teach_v in_o those_o book_n according_a to_o the_o true_a meaning_n and_o intent_n of_o the_o book_n than_o i_o will_v consent_v unto_o you_o that_o he_o which_o administer_v in_o all_o thing_n according_a unto_o they_o be_v not_o a_o true_a minister_n of_o jesus_n christ_n but_o if_o that_o can_v be_v do_v and_o i_o presume_v you_o will_v hardly_o be_v draw_v to_o attempt_v it_o in_o all_o your_o rage_a term_n and_o reproachful_a taunt_n cast_v upon_o our_o worship_n church_n and_o ministry_n you_o do_v but_o foam_v out_o your_o own_o shame_n the_o true_a minister_n of_o christ_n may_v err_v in_o many_o thing_n else_o it_o will_v hardly_o be_v find_v that_o there_o be_v any_o true_a minister_n and_o therefore_o to_o prove_v a_o minister_n to_o be_v a_o false_a prophet_n it_o suffice_v not_o to_o say_v he_o erranti_fw-la he_o cypr._n li._n 2._o ep._n 3._o if_o any_o of_o our_o predecessor_n either_o ignotant_o or_o simple_o do_v not_o observe_v &_o keep_v that_o which_o the_o lord_n by_o his_o example_n and_o authority_n will_v his_o simplicity_n may_v be_v pardon_v by_o the_o goodness_n of_o god_n aug._n ep._n 48._o this_o blemish_n in_o his_o most_o beautiful_a breast_n he_o cover_v with_o the_o tear_n of_o charity_n august_n de_fw-fr baptis_n l._n 4._o cap._n 5._o ignosci_fw-la potest_fw-la simpliciter_fw-la erranti_fw-la err_v in_o many_o thing_n but_o we_o must_v show_v the_o error_n for_o quality_n to_o be_v such_o as_o can_v be_v in_o a_o true_a or_o lawful_a prophet_n of_o the_o lord_n and_o here_o i_o will_v ask_v you_o this_o one_o question_n whether_o there_o be_v any_o true_a ministry_n in_o the_o christian_a church_n within_o the_o space_n of_o the_o four_o five_o or_o fix_v age_n after_o christ_n if_o not_o what_o be_v then_o become_v of_o the_o promise_n of_o god_n make_v to_o the_o church_n of_o the_o new_a testament_n if_o yes_o whether_o be_v not_o their_o course_n of_o administration_n pollute_v with_o as_o many_o or_o more_o dangerous_a error_n than_o can_v true_o be_v name_v in_o all_o the_o book_n foremention_v and_o so_o expect_v your_o resolution_n of_o this_o one_o demand_n i_o proceed_v to_o your_o three_o ground_n of_o separation_n draw_v as_o you_o say_v from_o the_o nonconformist_n principle_n chap._n iii_o sect_n i._o if_o the_o public_a assembly_n of_o england_n have_v not_o the_o power_n of_o the_o censure_n 150._o can._n neces_fw-la of_o separate_a p._n 149_o 150._o and_o excommunication_n but_o stand_v under_o a_o government_n which_o come_v whole_o and_o every_o part_n from_o the_o devil_n and_o antichrist_n then_o be_v their_o condition_n naught_o then_o be_v they_o false_a and_o antichristian_a church_n the_o reason_n be_v because_o this_o power_n be_v of_o absolute_a necessity_n for_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n a_o essential_a property_n thereof_o and_o serve_v not_o only_o for_o their_o well-being_n but_o the_o be_v itself_o for_o without_o this_o there_o can_v be_v no_o couple_v of_o the_o part_n and_o member_n together_o and_o so_o much_o 214._o much_o de_fw-fr consc_fw-fr lib._n 4._o cap._n 24._o pag._n 214._o dr_n ames_n testify_v now_o the_o assembly_n of_o england_n be_v not_o gather_v by_o any_o such_o power_n but_o in_o their_o first_o constitution_n want_v the_o same_o and_o have_v this_o false_a power_n which_o be_v exercise_v at_o this_o day_n as_o the_o nonconformist_n do_v acknowledge_v our_o argument_n which_o we_o have_v use_v in_o this_o point_n have_v be_v to_o this_o effect_n every_o true_a visible_a church_n have_v a_o power_n immediate_o under_o christ_n to_o execute_v church-government_n but_o the_o public_a congregation_n of_o england_n have_v not_o any_o such_o power_n under_o christ_n to_o execute_v church-government_n therefore_o they_o be_v not_o true_a visible_a church_n what_o they_o will_v say_v to_o this_o i_o know_v not_o but_o hitherto_o they_o have_v be_v silent_a or_o answer_v to_o no_o purpose_n in_o the_o world_n for_o it_o be_v usual_o their_o manner_n to_o tell_v we_o how_o the_o church_n in_o corinth_n pergamus_n thyatira_n etc._n etc._n neglect_v to_o execute_v discipline_n as_o though_o there_o be_v no_o difference_n betwixt_o omit_v to_o administer_v the_o ordinance_n and_o the_o want_n whole_o of_o it_o yea_o and_o to_o have_v a_o antichristian_a and_o devilish_a in_o the_o room_n of_o it_o answer_n you_o undertake_v to_o prove_v the_o necessity_n of_o separation_n from_o the_o nonconformist_n principle_n but_o here_o you_o reject_v their_o principle_n with_o disdain_n and_o build_v your_o responsive_a conclusion_n as_o you_o call_v they_o upon_o your_o own_o foundation_n which_o you_o know_v do_v not_o accord_n with_o their_o principle_n the_o nonconformist_n hold_v discipline_n necessary_a to_o the_o well-being_n of_o a_o church_n the_o safety_n of_o religion_n the_o preservation_n of_o god_n ordinance_n from_o contempt_n they_o compare_v it_o to_o the_o thing_n the_o bilson_n perpet_n ch_n gov_fw-mi ca._n 1._o since_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n be_v the_o house_n of_o god_n the_o city_n of_o the_o live_a god_n and_o the_o kingdom_n of_o his_o well-beloved_a son_n shall_v we_o think_v that_o god_n be_v careful_a for_o other_o &_o careless_a for_o his_o own_o or_o that_o confusion_n ought_v to_o be_v less_o doubt_v and_o fear_v in_o heavenly_a than_o in_o earthly_a thing_n wall_n of_o a_o city_n hedge_n of_o a_o vineyard_n fence_n of_o a_o garden_n and_o bound_n of_o a_o orchard_n but_o never_o say_v it_o to_o be_v of_o absolute_a etc._n absolute_a jewel_n serm._n on_o josh_n 6.1_o 2_o 3._o discipline_n be_v so_o needful_a that_o neither_o without_o it_o shall_v you_o be_v able_a thorough_o to_o discomfort_v those_o that_o seek_v to_o build_v up_o jericho_n etc._n etc._n necessity_n that_o there_o can_v be_v no_o city_n vineyard_n garden_n or_o orchard_n without_o it_o but_o this_o in_o your_o judgement_n be_v broken-stuffe_n not_o worthy_a any_o answer_n for_o where_o do_v they_o read_v say_v 151._o say_v can._n neces_fw-la of_o separate_a pag._n 151._o you_o in_o scripture_n that_o this_o power_n which_o christ_n have_v give_v to_o his_o church_n be_v compare_v to_o a_o wall_n or_o hedge_n etc._n etc._n but_o rather_o it_o may_v be_v liken_v to_o the_o power_n of_o the_o body_n which_o receive_v food_n and_o thereby_o excrement_n be_v purge_v and_o avoid_v the_o want_n whereof_o be_v in_o nature_n prodigious_a neither_o can_v the_o body_n possible_o subsist_v and_o live_v in_o the_o same_o page_n you_o take_v up_o dr_n laiton_n roundly_o after_o your_o manner_n for_o say_v that_o the_o etc._n the_o cypr._n lib._n 1._o ep_v 10._o council_n carthag_n 3._o ca._n 35._o gratian._n decr_n p._n 3._o do_v 2._o cap._n 95_o 96._o bill_n christ_n subject_n part_n 2._o pa._n 335._o i_o do_v not_o mislike_v that_o malefactor_n of_o all_o kind_n not_o only_o drunkard_n railer_n perjurer_n adulterer_n usurer_n and_o such_o like_a but_o also_o thief_n robber_n ravisher_n murderer_n plagiaries_n incendiary_n traitor_n and_o all_o other_o heinous_a offender_n when_o their_o life_n be_v spare_v by_o prince_n shall_v be_v drive_v to_o earnest_n and_o open_a repentance_n before_o they_o be_v receive_v into_o the_o church_n or_o admit_v to_o the_o divine_a mystery_n yea_o rather_o i_o think_v it_o very_o needful_a in_o a_o christian_a commonwealth_n that_o god_n be_v please_v and_o the_o church_n preserve_v from_o all_o communion_n with_o these_o monstrous_a impiety_n etc._n etc._n want_n of_o a_o integrall_a part_n of_o the_o whole_a be_v no_o sufficient_a ground_n of_o separation_n he_o speak_v you_o say_v as_o a_o man_n most_o ignorant_a of_o the_o nature_n of_o church-power_n for_o be_v he_o able_a 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