hierom_n and_o evag._n tell_v we_o of_o viz._n that_o the_o presbyter_n of_o alexandria_n till_o the_o day_n of_o heroclas_n and_o dionysius_n take_v one_o from_o among_o themselves_o and_o make_v he_o a_o bishop_n therefore_o they_o may_v make_v presbyter_n which_o be_v less_o be_v not_o the_o bishop_n wont_a to_o have_v presbyter_n to_o join_v with_o they_o in_o this_o work_n have_v not_o a_o sheet_n of_o this_o reverend_a bishop_n write_v for_o accommodation_n at_o the_o isle_n of_o wight_n hint_v this_o to_o be_v his_o judgement_n ask_v the_o more_o moderate_a presbyterian_o if_o they_o can_v not_o close_o with_o it_o have_v not_o the_o rubric_n tell_v we_o that_o bishop_n ordain_v as_o presbyter_n doctor_n prid._n in_o his_o fasciculus_fw-la therefore_o subscribe_v himself_o in_o the_o epistle_n dedicatory_a episcopus_fw-la vester_fw-ge &_o sympresbyter_n do_v not_o the_o vindication_n of_o the_o ministry_n by_o the_o london_n minister_n bring_v abundant_a testimony_n of_o this_o last_o ask_v the_o most_o rigid_a episcopal_a man_n in_o england_n and_o try_v if_o he_o will_v not_o say_v that_o minister_n ordain_v by_o presbyter_n be_v more_o lawful_o minister_n than_o those_o that_o have_v a_o pretend_a ordination_n from_o church_n query_n 19_o again_o if_o you_o say_v all_z or_o any_o the_o forementioned_a ordination_n be_v lawful_a then_o how_o vain_a a_o thing_n be_v it_o for_o the_o presbyterian_o to_o throw_v down_o the_o government_n of_o episcopacy_n why_o do_v they_o not_o rather_o reform_v it_o than_o cashier_v it_o see_v it_o be_v a_o power_n by_o which_o minister_n may_v have_v be_v authorize_v to_o preach_v according_a to_o god_n ordinance_n counter-query_a do_v you_o go_v on_o still_o to_o your_o unchristian_a charge_n whereby_o you_o will_v not_o only_o lay_v injustice_n but_o blood_n upon_o the_o head_n of_o presbyterian_o dare_v you_o assert_v speak_v out_o that_o the_o presbyterian_o do_v throw_v down_o the_o government_n of_o episcopacy_n mere_o for_o this_o error_n in_o ordination_n be_v this_o the_o only_a reason_n of_o such_o sad_a misery_n may_v we_o not_o more_o safe_o say_v the_o anabaptistical_n spirit_n which_o usual_o be_v bloody_a witness_v those_o in_o germany_n egg_v on_o to_o ruin_n whilst_o only_a reformation_n be_v intend_v do_v not_o they_o make_v the_o civil_a wound_n turn_v to_o fatal_a death_n do_v not_o they_o blow_v up_o that_o unbrother_o fire_n which_o may_v have_v be_v timely_o quench_v into_o a_o destroy_a flame_n and_o then_o with_o joy_n warm_v their_o hand_n at_o it_o query_n 20._o if_o the_o bishop_n as_o bishop_n have_v this_o lawful_a power_n when_o do_v any_o power_n from_o christ_n divest_v they_o counter-query_a if_o bishop_n not_o as_o bishop_n but_o as_o minister_n have_v this_o lawful_a power_n may_v we_o not_o be_v confident_a that_o christ_n have_v not_o devest_v those_o that_o be_v lawful_o minister_n of_o this_o power_n we_o will_v never_o so_o far_o distrust_v his_o promise_n as_o to_o doubt_v but_o he_o will_v be_v with_o they_o to_o the_o end_n of_o the_o world_n matth._n 28.20_o query_n 21._o if_o episcopal_a authority_n be_v of_o god_n as_o the_o bishop_n pretend_v why_o may_v not_o a_o man_n lawful_o go_v still_o to_o they_o for_o ordination_n in_o case_n this_o authority_n be_v never_o take_v from_o they_o in_o a_o ecclesiastical_a way_n counter-query_a 1_o can_v that_o authority_n which_o be_v found_v upon_o the_o word_n of_o god_n be_v take_v from_o any_o in_o a_o ecclesiastical_a way_n what_o do_v you_o mean_v 2_o be_v not_o this_o episcopal_a authority_n of_o ordain_v as_o minister_n found_v on_o the_o word_n 3_o can_v the_o contrary_a opinion_n either_o of_o the_o ordainer_n or_o the_o ordain_v null_a this_o lawful_a authority_n 4_o may_v not_o a_o man_n lawful_o go_v to_o they_o if_o they_o will_v ordain_v as_o minister_n 5_o if_o not_o ought_v he_o not_o in_o conscience_n since_o no_o necessity_n bind_v now_o to_o the_o contrary_a take_v it_o where_o it_o be_v more_o pure_o administer_v query_n 22._o if_o you_o say_v that_o both_o presbyterian_a and_o episcopal_a ordination_n be_v lawful_a then_o i_o query_n whether_o that_o christ_n ever_o erect_v two_o way_n of_o ordination_n of_o minister_n one_o contrary_a to_o the_o other_o and_o yet_o both_o lawful_a for_o such_o be_v the_o state_n of_o episcopacy_n and_o presbytery_n in_o england_n one_o say_v that_o the_o presbytery_n have_v no_o power_n to_o ordain_v the_o other_o say_v they_o have_v counter-query_a be_v not_o both_o episcopal_a and_o presbyterian_a ordination_n the_o same_o as_o to_o the_o substance_n as_o be_v already_o hint_v and_o as_o esteem_v lawful_a the_o same_o as_o to_o purity_n only_o differ_v in_o circumstance_n how_o irrational_a then_o and_o i_o think_v if_o logic_n be_v rational_a illogical_a be_v it_o to_o say_v there_o be_v contrariety_n where_o there_o be_v but_o one_o thing_n viz._n ordination_n by_o minister_n sure_o only_a two_o distinct_a thing_n can_v be_v call_v contrary_n must_v you_o not_o bring_v better_a argument_n the_o next_o time_n to_o prove_v this_o then_o to_o say_v because_o some_o circumstance_n differ_v therefore_o there_o be_v a_o contrariety_n etc._n etc._n because_o episcopal_n and_o presbyterian_a minister_n contradict_v one_o another_o therefore_o ordination_n by_o each_o be_v contrary_a each_o to_o other_o if_o there_o be_v such_o a_o essential_a agreement_n and_o only_o a_o circumstantial_a difference_n what_o reason_n then_o for_o such_o a_o query_n whether_o do_v christ_n erect_v two_o way_n of_o ordination_n query_n 23._o if_o it_o be_v that_o ordination_n that_o be_v among_o the_o independent_o than_o we_o have_v that_o we_o run_v for_o then_o if_o one_o have_v their_o suffrage_n and_o ordination_n and_o this_o be_v lawful_a which_o i_o think_v you_o will_v not_o say_v then_o wherein_o be_v master_n brooks_n in_o this_o to_o be_v condemn_v counter-query_a have_v you_o urge_v any_o thing_n yet_o that_o shall_v force_v we_o to_o own_o any_o ordination_n among_o independent_o but_o what_o be_v according_a to_o the_o gospel-rule_a viz._n by_o minister_n will_v you_o make_v the_o world_n believe_v you_o run_v for_o independency_n be_v you_o not_o pass_v it_o and_o get_v to_o anabaptism_n will_v you_o not_o fain_o have_v this_o as_o a_o cloak_n that_o your_o design_n may_v be_v the_o more_o plausible_a or_o be_v it_o that_o you_o tun_n for_o the_o defence_n of_o mr._n brook_n only_a must_v we_o not_o necessary_o hence_o suspect_v either_o that_o mr._n brookes_n or_o his_o church_n be_v stagger_v and_o that_o they_o get_v you_o to_o be_v their_o patron_n or_o that_o you_o be_v guilty_a of_o presumption_n by_o intrude_a into_o their_o cause_n uncalled_a query_n 24._o again_o if_o you_o say_v that_o ordination_n by_o the_o presbytery_n be_v the_o only_a ordination_n then_o where_o be_v a_o ordination_n to_o be_v have_v in_o england_n thirty_o year_n ago_o counter-query_a since_o ordination_n as_o i_o have_v say_v be_v by_o minister_n be_v there_o not_o true_a and_o lawful_a minister_n in_o england_n thirty_o year_n ago_o do_v you_o think_v so_o easy_o by_o your_o sophistry_n to_o persuade_v we_o there_o can_v be_v a_o true_a ministry_n under_o the_o name_n of_o episcopacy_n and_o presbytery_n as_o if_o bishop_n thirty_o year_n ago_o can_v not_o be_v true_a minister_n and_o ordain_v true_a minister_n or_o as_o if_o presbyter_n now_o can_v be_v true_a minister_n nor_o ordain_v true_a minister_n prove_v this_o by_o the_o next_o query_n 25._o be_v it_o not_o very_o strange_a that_o you_o shall_v tell_v the_o people_n they_o sin_v in_o hear_v those_o that_o be_v not_o ordain_v when_o you_o never_o tell_v they_o whether_o you_o mean_v any_o ordination_n may_v serve_v nor_o what_o ordination_n of_o those_o divers_a kind_n it_o be_v that_o god_n approve_v of_o counter-query_a how_o mr._n ives_n darenot_v you_o thus_o charge_v mr._n willes_n either_o you_o hear_v he_o all_o his_o sermon_n there_o or_o not_o if_o not_o how_o dare_v you_o say_v that_o he_o never_o tell_v the_o people_n what_o ordination_n he_o mean_v if_o you_o do_v hear_v he_o then_o how_o dare_v you_o false_o charge_v he_o with_o that_o that_o hundred_o of_o people_n can_v witness_v against_o do_v he_o not_o public_o declare_v that_o they_o ought_v to_o hear_v none_o but_o minister_n ordain_v by_o minister_n and_o that_o he_o be_v rigid_o neither_o for_o the_o aforesaid_a independency_n presbytery_n or_o episcopacy_n but_o for_o a_o moderation_n see_v they_o differ_v in_o this_o but_o circumstantial_o and_o that_o he_o hold_v ordination_n perform_v by_o minister_n of_o any_o of_o these_o three_o way_n to_o be_v valid_a and_o good_a be_v not_o a_o tale-bearer_n and_o take_v not_o up_o a_o false_a report_n against_o thy_o neighbour_n query_n 26._o since_o you_o say_v that_o none_o ought_v to_o preach_v but_o they_o must_v be_v ordain_v
the_o corruption_n of_o the_o corrupt_a popish_a receiver_n of_o ordination_n and_o the_o corruption_n of_o the_o corrupt_a popish_a dispenser_n of_o it_o ever_o since_o can_v not_o break_v off_o the_o line_n of_o succession_n because_o it_o have_v not_o its_o foundation_n in_o man_n but_o in_o the_o word_n of_o god_n then_o our_o first_o reformer_n must_v needs_o be_v true_a minister_n by_o succession_n and_o the_o present_a ministry_n of_o england_n true_a as_o have_v receive_v it_o from_o they_o be_v not_o the_o ordinance_n and_o ministry_n of_o rome_n the_o ministry_n and_o ordinance_n of_o christ_n so_o far_o as_o they_o be_v according_a to_o the_o word_n object_n but_o may_v you_o say_v this_o be_v it_o i_o wish_v for_o than_o my_o sixteenth_o query_n be_v not_o answer_v may_v we_o not_o go_v lawful_o then_o to_o rome_n to_o be_v ordain_v a._n view_v my_o sixteenth_o counter-query_a 1_o dare_v you_o say_v it_o be_v lawful_a to_o submit_v to_o such_o corruption_n that_o lead_v to_o popery_n 2_o since_o we_o know_v it_o 3_o and_o that_o there_o be_v no_o necessity_n for_o it_o but_o it_o may_v be_v have_v pure_a here_o be_v not_o this_o a_o unpardonable_a sin_n in_o the_o israelite_n to_o offer_v sacrifice_n under_o every_o green_a tree_n when_o there_o be_v a_o temple_n to_o sacrifice_n in_o remember_v therefore_o these_o thing_n 1_o that_o ordination_n be_v a_o ordinance_n found_v upon_o the_o word_n 2_o that_o the_o corruption_n of_o receiver_n or_o dispenser_n can_v null_a it_o 3_o that_o our_o first_o reformer_n be_v lawful_o ordain_v by_o the_o corrupt_a popish_a bishop_n because_o it_o be_v a_o case_n of_o ignorance_n or_o necessity_n 4_o that_o it_o be_v exceed_o sinful_a and_o unlawful_a to_o receive_v ordination_n now_o from_o popish_a bishop_n because_o no_o such_o excuse_n a_o second_o argument_n to_o prove_v the_o line_n of_o succession_n not_o to_o be_v break_v since_o christianity_n be_v profess_v can_v you_o say_v there_o be_v not_o a_o company_n of_o true_a believer_n a_o church_n for_o so_o many_o year_n that_o england_n be_v under_o popery_n if_o there_o be_v a_o church_n than_o she_o have_v minister_n or_o not_o if_o no_o minister_n what_o become_v of_o that_o promise_n ephes_n 4.11_o 12_o 13._o that_o the_o saint_n shall_v have_v a_o ministry_n till_o they_o come_v to_o a_o perfect_a man_n etc._n etc._n if_o there_o be_v a_o true_a ministry_n than_o they_o be_v ordain_v once_o or_o unordain_v once_o if_o ordain_v one_o we_o have_v that_o we_o run_v for_o viz._n that_o the_o line_n of_o succession_n be_v not_o break_v off_o if_o unordained_a one_o show_v we_o it_o where_o they_o preach_v in_o what_o church_n who_o they_o be_v give_v we_o a_o instance_n in_o one_o during_o all_o that_o time_n query_n 28._o whether_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v not_o as_o good_a a_o church_n when_o your_o predecessor_n leave_v she_o as_o she_o be_v when_o they_o receive_v ordination_n from_o she_o which_o be_v but_o a_o little_a before_o counter-query_a probably_n she_o be_v as_o good_a what_o then_o we_o leave_v she_o not_o as_o she_o be_v the_o spouse_n of_o christ_n but_o as_o she_o be_v a_o harlot_n we_o leave_v not_o her_o ordinance_n as_o they_o be_v christ_n but_o her_o corruption_n and_o idolatry_n query_n 29._o if_o you_o shall_v say_v here_o be_v a_o succession_n of_o british_a minister_n in_o england_n before_o the_o papal_a power_n have_v to_o do_v here_o or_o before_o gregory_n the_o pope_n send_v austin_n the_o monk_n to_o convert_v the_o saxon_n than_o i_o query_n whether_o all_o those_o minister_n be_v not_o bring_v into_o subjection_n to_o the_o papal_a power_n and_o so_o be_v swallow_v up_o in_o the_o see_v of_o rome_n if_o not_o then_o counter-query_a do_v not_o gildas_n report_v of_o a_o ministry_n in_o england_n before_o austin_n the_o monk_n be_v send_v over_o may_v there_o not_o then_o be_v thousand_o that_o have_v not_o bow_v the_o knee_n to_o baal_n 1_o king_n 19.14_o and_o we_o not_o know_v of_o it_o query_n 30._o whether_o there_o be_v any_o succession_n of_o a_o true_a church_n in_o england_n who_o be_v separate_v from_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n if_o there_o be_v show_v we_o where_o that_o church_n be_v all_o the_o time_n the_o papal_a power_n be_v exercise_v here_o and_o who_o be_v they_o that_o govern_v it_o and_o also_o how_o your_o ordination_n proceed_v from_o this_o reform_a rather_o than_o from_o the_o papal_a line_n counter-query_a if_o as_o before_o may_v not_o there_o be_v a_o succession_n from_o such_o and_o we_o not_o know_v of_o it_o be_v not_o god_n wont_a to_o make_v his_o own_o way_n to_o flourish_v most_o though_o many_o time_n secret_o aught_o you_o not_o to_o believe_v that_o god_n have_v order_v all_o for_o the_o best_a it_o be_v more_o become_v we_o to_o wonder_v at_o then_o search_v admire_v then_o sound_v the_o secret_a work_n of_o god_n query_n 31._o if_o you_o say_v it_o come_v from_o rome_n and_o not_o from_o that_o presuppose_a succession_n then_o i_o query_n if_o rome_n be_v a_o little_a before_o henry_n the_o eight_o time_n entrust_v with_o the_o administration_n of_o christ_n ordinance_n as_o a_o church_n of_o christ_n whether_o it_o be_v not_o your_o sin_n to_o leave_v she_o as_o a_o cage_n of_o every_o unclean_a thing_n counter-query_a but_o if_o it_o come_v from_o rome_n and_o the_o sacred_a ordinance_n of_o god_n be_v there_o may_v not_o rome_n notwithstanding_o be_v account_v a_o cage_n of_o every_o unclean_a thing_n what_o if_o a_o thief_n have_v a_o bible_n in_o his_o pocket_n be_v he_o not_o therefore_o a_o thief_n can_v the_o possession_n of_o ordinance_n make_v holy_a then_o never_o a_o minister_n can_v be_v a_o unholy_a man_n if_o rome_n be_v unclean_a notwithstanding_o those_o ordinance_n as_o indeed_o she_o be_v ought_v we_o not_o then_o to_o depart_v from_o her_o corruption_n numb_a 16.37_o the_o censer_n of_o korah_n and_o his_o company_n wherein_o they_o burn_v incense_v to_o the_o lord_n be_v holy_a yet_o the_o israelite_n be_v to_o separate_v from_o they_o that_o they_o may_v be_v destroy_v query_n 32._o if_o you_o say_v true_o of_o she_o as_o indeed_o you_o do_v that_o she_o be_v the_o cage_n of_o every_o unclean_a thing_n how_o then_o can_v she_o dispense_v at_o that_o time_n so_o sacred_a a_o ordinance_n as_o ordination_n of_o gospel-minister_n be_v by_o you_o judge_v to_o be_v counter-query_a be_v it_o not_o strange_a that_o you_o ask_v such_o a_o query_n and_o not_o show_v any_o reason_n why_o why_o can_v she_o not_o dispense_v such_o a_o sacred_a ordinance_n as_o ordination_n notwithstanding_o her_o uncleanness_n must_v those_o account_n in_o your_o book_n which_o you_o know_v to_o be_v just_a and_o right_o be_v null_v and_o may_v other_o disowne_v their_o debt_n there_o because_o through_o the_o fault_n of_o your_o boy_n they_o be_v naughty_o write_v or_o blot_v and_o blur_v will_v you_o serve_v god_n as_o you_o will_v not_o be_v serve_v query_n 33._o if_o you_o say_v she_o have_v power_n as_o a_o church_n and_o you_o do_v separate_v because_o of_o her_o corruption_n that_o you_o may_v serve_v the_o lord_n with_o more_o purity_n then_o i_o query_n whether_o you_o be_v not_o guilty_a of_o that_o evil_n yourself_o if_o yet_o it_o be_v a_o evil_a which_o you_o charge_v upon_o mr._n brooks_n in_o separate_v from_o the_o halt_n and_o maim_a counter-query_a if_o we_o say_v she_o have_v power_n as_o a_o church_n why_o do_v you_o not_o disprove_v it_o for_o if_o she_o be_v a_o church_n than_o her_o minister_n be_v true_a minister_n though_o corrupt_a and_o the_o succession_n be_v not_o break_v off_o to_o what_o end_n then_o have_v all_o your_o former_a query_n be_v reader_n thou_o may_v be_v the_o more_o convince_v that_o the_o line_n of_o succession_n be_v not_o break_v because_o the_o adversary_n yield_v up_o his_o own_o weapon_n thus_o thou_o may_v see_v he_o have_v more_o of_o subtlety_n to_o puzzle_v than_o of_o strength_n to_o convince_v but_o sir_n do_v you_o think_v by_o your_o yield_a to_o draw_v we_o into_o ambush_n that_o mr._n brooks_n may_v separate_v as_o well_o from_o the_o halt_n and_o maim_a as_o we_o from_o papist_n consider_v either_o he_o acknowledge_v his_o parishioner_n of_o margarets-new-fish-street_n to_o be_v a_o church_n or_o not_o if_o not_o 1_o must_v he_o not_o condemn_v then_o mr._n froysell_n and_o other_o godly_a minister_n that_o have_v acknowledge_v they_o a_o church_n and_o upon_o that_o account_n be_v their_o minister_n and_o give_v they_o the_o sacrament_n 2_o must_v he_o not_o prove_v that_o such_o a_o company_n of_o believer_n that_o have_v be_v baptize_v &_o thereby_o admit_v member_n of_o a_o visible_a church_n that_o will_v still_o public_o own_o this_o baptism_n that_o be_v never_o
notice_n of_o what_o answer_n have_v be_v give_v unto_o this_o as_o well_o as_o other_o query_n be_v it_o not_o vainglory_n to_o make_v the_o world_n believe_v that_o the_o london_n minister_n in_o their_o jus_o divinum_fw-la min._n ch_n 6._o from_o p._n 95._o to_o 103._o that_o mr._n collins_n in_o his_o vindication_n min._n from_o p._n 49._o to_o 56._o that_o mr._n thomas_n hall_n p._n 56_o to_o 59_o and_o many_o other_o who_o write_v concern_v this_o text_n have_v do_v nothing_o worthy_a mr._n ives_n his_o regard_n of_o it_o 1_o be_v not_o a_o extraordinary_a call_n by_o extraordinary_a gift_n such_o a_o authority_n from_o god_n that_o no_o ordinary_a gift_a brother_n as_o such_o may_v presume_v to_o have_v 2_o be_v not_o these_o in_o 1_o cor._n 14_o thus_o extraordinary_o call_v 3_o be_v they_o not_o express_o call_v prophet_n which_o be_v a_o office_n improper_o so_o call_v pro_fw-la tempore_fw-la 4_o you_o may_v all_o prophesy_v can_v this_o be_v mean_v of_o any_o but_o prophet_n be_v it_o a_o argument_n then_o for_o gift_a brethren_n but_o you_o say_v then_o be_v all_o the_o church_n exhort_v to_o covet_v after_o extraordinary_a office_n answ_n the_o word_n office_n here_o be_v somewhat_o improper_a again_o it_o be_v but_o temporary_a and_o well_o may_v it_o be_v say_v that_o they_o all_o ought_v to_o seek_v after_o these_o extraordinary_a gift_n which_o thus_o qualify_v they_o when_o a_o judge_n place_n fall_v all_o the_o sergeant_n in_o town_n may_v lawful_o seek_v for_o it_o though_o all_o can_v obtain_v it_o god_n have_v promise_v such_o gift_n and_o ought_v they_o not_o to_o seek_v for_o they_o query_n 14_o if_o it_o shall_v be_v say_v that_o prophesy_v here_o be_v a_o ordinary_a office_n than_o it_o follow_v that_o the_o whole_a church_n be_v exhort_v to_o covet_v to_o be_v ordinary_a officer_n which_o will_v be_v to_o make_v the_o whole_a body_n of_o christ_n monstrous_a if_o it_o shall_v be_v say_v that_o they_o be_v not_o exhort_v to_o prophesy_v as_o extraordinary_a or_o as_o ordinary_a office_n then_o i_o query_n whether_o they_o be_v not_o to_o do_v it_o as_o gift_a brethren_n since_o we_o never_o hear_v of_o any_o other_o way_n counter-query_a this_o query_n be_v worth_a nothing_o only_o i_o query_n why_o may_v not_o your_o whole_a church_n covet_v to_o be_v all_o ordinary_a officer_n as_o well_o as_o to_o be_v preach_v gift_v brethren_n if_o because_o it_o be_v monstrous_a to_o have_v so_o many_o roll_a head_n be_v it_o not_o as_o monstrous_a to_o have_v as_o many_o speak_a tongue_n in_o the_o body_n of_o christ_n query_n 15._o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o none_o ought_v to_o preach_v but_o those_o that_o be_v ordain_v except_o as_o before_o except_v i_o query_n among_o those_o several_a ordination_n that_o be_v in_o christendom_n which_o of_o those_o whether_o some_o one_o of_o they_o or_o all_o of_o they_o be_v that_o which_o christ_n approve_v of_o if_o you_o say_v all_o of_o they_o and_o that_o the_o error_n of_o the_o administrator_n in_o some_o circumstance_n do_v not_o make_v the_o ordination_n a_o nullity_n counter-query_a 1_o be_v not_o this_o the_o essential_a of_o ordination_n viz._n a_o set_n apart_o man_n to_o the_o ministry_n by_o minister_n 2_o be_v not_o this_o the_o purity_n of_o it_o viz._n when_o fit_a person_n be_v due_o set_v apart_o by_o gospel_n minister_n in_o that_o gospel_n way_n and_o for_o those_o gospel_n end_v a_o ministry_n be_v appoint_v there_o be_v no_o superstitious_a corruption_n accompany_v this_o ordinance_n 3_o may_v there_o not_o be_v some_o circumstantial_a difference_n even_o among_o those_o that_o practice_n this_o purity_n in_o this_o ordinance_n 4_o may_v we_o not_o say_v then_o that_o all_o the_o ordination_n in_o christendom_n be_v approve_v by_o christ_n that_o differ_v but_o thus_o circumstantial_o as_o well_o as_o man_n of_o opinion_n different_a in_o many_o thing_n be_v accept_v by_o he_o query_n 16._o whether_o one_o may_v not_o by_o this_o opinion_n be_v lawful_o ordain_v at_o rome_n counter-query_a 1_o dare_v you_o say_v that_o rome_n observe_v that_o gospel_n purity_n in_o this_o ordinance_n 2_o though_o the_o substance_n may_v be_v there_o yet_o be_v it_o not_o exceed_v sinful_a now_o for_o we_o to_o submit_v to_o their_o impurity_n consider_v that_o these_o three_o thing_n only_o excuse_v in_o error_n circumstantial_a 1_o when_o the_o error_n be_v so_o slight_a that_o it_o be_v no_o prejudice_n to_o the_o substance_n nor_o do_v engage_v to_o other_o pernicious_a error_n do_v not_o ordination_n among_o the_o papist_n do_v this_o do_v it_o not_o oblige_v to_o obedience_n to_o and_o mission_n by_o that_o autichristian_a see_v note_v that_o the_o case_n follow_v excuse_n when_o this_o can_v be_v plead_v 2_o when_o a_o sincere_a aim_n at_o the_o substance_n be_v accompany_v with_o ignorance_n of_o the_o error_n in_o circumstance_n can_v we_o plead_v ignorance_n of_o the_o error_n of_o rome_n or_o shall_v we_o say_v that_o man_n have_v a_o sincere_a aim_n that_o shall_v go_v thither_o to_o submit_v to_o it_o now_o 3_o when_o a_o case_n of_o necessity_n be_v viz._n 1_o when_o we_o be_v bind_v to_o have_v the_o ordinance_n its_o self_n 2_o and_o when_o it_o can_v be_v elsewhere_o have_v but_o with_o these_o error_n and_o impurity_n 3_o or_o when_o great_a evil_n than_o those_o error_n will_v follow_v be_v this_o our_o case_n now_o with_o rome_n though_o preacher_n be_v bind_v to_o submit_v to_o that_o ordinance_n of_o ordination_n yet_o can_v they_o not_o have_v it_o else_o where_o than_o at_o rome_n in_o more_o purity_n answer_v sir_n be_v it_o not_o in_o more_o purity_n do_v by_o the_o minister_n in_o england_n than_o by_o those_o at_o rome_n query_n 17._o if_o you_o shall_v say_v the_o protestant-ordination_a be_v lawful_a and_o that_o only_a then_o i_o query_n which_o of_o those_o whether_o the_o episcopal_a presbyterian_a or_o independent_a ordination_n be_v that_o which_o be_v approve_v by_o christ_n to_o empower_v the_o minister_n to_o preach_v since_o all_o these_o be_v protestant_n and_o great_o differ_v in_o this_o thing_n counter-query_a do_v you_o not_o easy_o see_v by_o what_o have_v be_v say_v that_o the_o protestant_a ordination_n only_o be_v acknowledge_v to_o be_v lawful_a to_o we_o now_o do_v you_o not_o as_o easy_o see_v the_o episcopal_a presbyterian_a and_o the_o most_o sober_a independent_a minister_n own_o the_o essence_n of_o this_o ordinance_n viz._n that_o it_o be_v a_o set_n apart_o man_n to_o the_o ministry_n by_o minister_n 2_o that_o they_o practise_v the_o purity_n by_o set_v apart_o fit_a man_n in_o a_o gospel_n way_n for_o those_o gospel_n end_v a_o ministry_n be_v appoint_v without_o superstitious_a intermixture_n 3._o ought_v we_o not_o then_o to_o say_v that_o ordination_n by_o all_o or_o any_o of_o they_o be_v approve_v by_o christ_n and_o true_a christian_n to_o empower_v minister_n to_o preach_v notwithstanding_o they_o may_v differ_v in_o some_o circumstantial_o query_n 18._o if_o you_o say_v all_o of_o these_o be_v lawful_a then_o be_v not_o the_o minister_n of_o the_o episcopal_a way_n great_o out_o in_o cry_v up_o the_o ordination_n by_o bishop_n to_o be_v the_o only_a authoritative_a ordination_n in_o opposition_n to_o that_o of_o the_o presbytery_n and_o that_o they_o do_v so_o will_v appear_v if_o you_o consult_v dr._n jer._n taylor_n chaplain_n to_o the_o late_a king_n in_o his_o book_n call_v episcopacy_n assert_v page_n 120_o 121_o 122._o it_o be_v clear_a say_v he_o that_o bishop_n be_v to_o do_v some_o act_n which_o the_o presbyter_n can_v not_o do_v one_o of_o which_o he_o call_v ordination_n by_o imposition_n of_o hand_n which_o he_o say_v be_v not_o to_o be_v do_v by_o presbyter_n again_o the_o say_a doctor_n say_v that_o the_o apostle_n do_v impose_v hand_n for_o confirmation_n which_o say_v he_o be_v to_o continue_v in_o the_o church_n and_o can_v not_o be_v do_v by_o the_o seventy_o or_o any_o mere_a presbyter_n and_o for_o this_o he_o cite_v the_o constant_a practice_n of_o the_o father_n and_o the_o opinion_n of_o divers_a church_n therefore_o pray_v tell_v i_o if_o this_o be_v that_o ordination_n which_o a_o man_n must_v have_v without_o which_o his_o preach_a be_v sinful_a counter-query_a be_v it_o not_o unchristian_a to_o charge_v the_o error_n of_o one_o man_n though_o a_o worthy_a man_n upon_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o episcopal_a way_n be_v it_o not_o evident_a that_o the_o most_o of_o they_o judge_v themselves_o to_o ordain_v as_o minister_n and_o not_o as_o mere_a bishop_n do_v not_o mr._n baxter_n say_v in_o his_o second_o sheet_n that_o bishop_n usher_n do_v acknowledge_v ordination_n by_o presbyter_n without_o a_o bishop_n to_o be_v vallid_a and_o that_o he_o answer_v king_n charles_n by_o a_o instance_n that_o
example_n to_o a_o believer_n in_o charity_n 1_o tim._n 4.12_o i_o query_n then_o whether_o backbiting_a tale-bearing_a and_o take_v up_o a_o reproach_n against_o your_o neighbour_n be_v not_o contrary_a to_o the_o law_n of_o charity_n and_o whether_o you_o be_v not_o guilty_a of_o this_o when_o you_o tell_v a_o gentleman_n that_o live_v at_o highgate_n who_o be_v ready_a to_o witness_v the_o truth_n hereof_o that_o you_o be_v inform_v i_o be_v a_o jesuit_n and_o therefore_o tell_v he_o he_o will_v do_v well_o to_o apprehend_v i_o true_o sir_n if_o you_o do_v not_o tell_v i_o who_o inform_v you_o i_o shall_v say_v it_o be_v a_o slander_n of_o your_o own_o devise_v either_o thereby_o to_o take_v away_o my_o life_n for_o that_o be_v the_o punishment_n the_o law_n have_v provide_v for_o jesuit_n by_o the_o stat._n of_o eliz._n 27.2_o or_o else_o if_o that_o gentlemn_a will_v have_v be_v rule_v by_o you_o that_o i_o may_v have_v be_v lay_v in_o goal_n right_a or_o wrong_n to_o the_o undo_n of_o myself_o and_o family_n till_o i_o can_v have_v clear_v myself_o of_o the_o suppose_a crime_n in_o open_a session_n this_o must_v needs_o be_v your_o design_n otherwise_o why_o do_v you_o encourage_v he_o to_o apprehend_v i_o as_o a_o jesuit_n but_o more_o of_o this_o in_o a_o more_o convenient_a place_n where_o i_o doubt_v not_o of_o reparation_n only_o let_v i_o tell_v you_o that_o if_o you_o can_v as_o easy_o prove_v the_o affirmative_a viz._n that_o you_o be_v send_v of_o god_n to_o preach_v and_o that_o all_o you_o preach_v be_v true_a as_o i_o can_v prove_v the_o negative_a that_o i_o be_o no_o jesuit_n the_o controversy_n between_o we_o will_v soon_o be_v end_v counter-query_a do_v you_o not_o see_v by_o mr._n willes_n his_o letter_n how_o much_o you_o be_v to_o blame_v thus_o in_o print_n to_o take_v up_o a_o reproach_n against_o he_o and_o that_o upon_o the_o bare_a information_n of_o such_o a_o single_a person_n do_v he_o ever_o assert_v you_o to_o be_v a_o jesuit_n at_o the_o most_o he_o only_o say_v you_o be_v suspect_v and_o this_o he_o speak_v in_o private_a and_o indeed_o who_o will_v not_o suspect_v that_o man_n to_o be_v jesuitical_a who_o be_v cry_v out_o on_o to_o be_v such_o to_o his_o face_n in_o a_o great_a congregation_n at_o clements_n beyond_o temple-bar_n that_o have_v the_o vox_fw-la populi_fw-la to_o accuse_v he_o of_o it_o that_o be_v report_v to_o have_v converse_n with_o jesuit_n that_o live_v a_o conceal_v i_o have_v almost_o say_v a_o suspect_a life_n for_o some_o year_n together_o in_o and_o about_o london_n that_o have_v jesuitical_a opinion_n and_o design_n especial_o to_o pluck_v down_o the_o ministry_n of_o england_n or_o to_o make_v it_o odious_a that_o these_o ground_n of_o suspicion_n may_v be_v have_v concern_v you_o i_o shall_v not_o assert_v but_o only_o wish_v that_o we_o have_v no_o more_o ground_n to_o suspect_v you_o to_o be_v jesuitical_a than_o mr._n willes_n to_o be_v uncharitable_a in_o accuse_v you_o or_o erroneous_a in_o what_o be_v here_o controvert_v and_o i_o make_v no_o question_n but_o you_o will_v in_o your_o next_o subscribe_v yourself_o a_o friend_n to_o mr._n willes_n and_o this_o truth_n in_o some_o measure_n vindicate_v confess_v the_o truth_n and_o glorify_v god_n amen_o reader_n there_o be_v fault_n in_o the_o print_n which_o be_v not_o much_o material_a only_o correct_v p._n 31._o l._n 4._o read_v with_o for_o as_o postscript_n reader_n i_o think_v it_o necessary_a to_o advertise_v thou_o of_o a_o few_o thing_n 1_o that_o to_o i_o it_o be_v a_o great_a sign_n that_o that_o be_v a_o truth_n and_o a_o truth_n of_o great_a concernment_n which_o when_o it_o be_v assert_v or_o teach_v man_n of_o corrupt_a mind_n be_v enrage_v at_o and_o oppose_v they_o will_v have_v the_o servant_n sleep_v that_o be_v their_o time_n of_o sow_v tare_n therefore_o it_o be_v very_o observable_a that_o when_o ever_o godliness_n be_v most_o likely_a to_o increase_v when_o the_o ministry_n have_v be_v most_o famous_a and_o active_a than_o the_o devil_n have_v stir_v up_o deadly_a enemy_n and_o opposer_n this_o have_v be_v in_o all_o age_n this_o we_o sad_o experience_n in_o our_o day_n be_v there_o ever_o a_o more_o learned_a pious_a famous_a ministry_n in_o england_n than_o now_o there_o be_v i_o challenge_v even_o its_o enemy_n and_o among_o they_o mr._n ives_n to_o contradict_v it_o if_o they_o can_v and_o shall_v we_o not_o sigh_v at_o it_o have_v ever_o the_o ministry_n of_o england_n so_o great_a and_o so_o many_o designer_n to_o undermine_v it_o but_o the_o father_n of_o truth_n usual_o so_o bless_v his_o own_o cause_n that_o it_o get_v by_o opposition_n thus_o we_o can_v say_v of_o this_o truth_n of_o ordination_n of_o minister_n which_o in_o my_o knowledge_n have_v get_v ground_n by_o these_o late_a broil_n gather_v yourselves_o together_o and_o you_o shall_v be_v break_v in_o piece_n for_o the_o lord_n be_v with_o we_o isa_n 8.9_o 10._o mat._n 28.20_o 2_o that_o those_o that_o have_v design_n against_o the_o truth_n have_v usual_o some_o plausible_a pretence_n to_o carry_v they_o on_o the_o devil_n have_v get_v the_o art_n now_o adays_o to_o wrap_v himself_o in_o a_o prophet_n mantle_n to_o appear_v as_o a_o angel_n of_o light_n in_o his_o choice_a instrument_n who_o usual_o with_o a_o seem_a religious_a garb_n forth_o up_o with_o soft_a word_n till_o they_o may_v opportune_o change_v their_o courtship_n into_o calumny_n have_v not_o mr._n ives_n worthy_o show_v himself_o for_o ordination_n of_o minister_n as_o he_o pretend_v that_o will_v make_v the_o world_n believe_v that_o the_o present_a godly_a ministry_n be_v antichristian_a if_o he_o can_v and_o that_o have_v thus_o thrust_v himself_o into_o a_o quarrel_n against_o it_o 3_o that_o those_o that_o design_v the_o propagate_a of_o their_o error_n will_v for_o the_o most_o part_n oppose_v their_o hand_n will_v be_v against_o every_o man_n but_o seldom_o assert_v their_o own_o opinion_n and_o prove_v it_o be_v it_o not_o because_o it_o be_v easy_a to_o quarrel_v with_o truth_n than_o to_o prove_v a_o error_n and_o because_o that_o be_v a_o time_n to_o break_v in_o when_o the_o rank_n be_v first_o shatter_v to_o broach_v error_n when_o man_n be_v stagger_v in_o the_o truth_n or_o be_v not_o this_o the_o end_n viz._n to_o be_v always_o accuse_v of_o other_o that_o they_o themselves_o may_v never_o be_v question_v or_o call_v to_o justify_v their_o own_o practice_n have_v not_o mr._n ives_n play_v his_o part_n in_o this_o by_o oppose_v every_o man_n not_o of_o his_o own_o way_n that_o we_o may_v believe_v what_o he_o assert_v to_o be_v truth_n have_v he_o not_o do_v so_o in_o these_o query_n where_o do_v he_o bring_v the_o least_o positive_a truth_n or_o one_o argument_n to_o justify_v his_o own_o practice_n or_o to_o state_n what_o be_v right_a have_v he_o bring_v one_o probable_a argument_n to_o prove_v that_o gift_a brethren_n may_v preach_v or_o that_o people_n may_v hear_v they_o that_o the_o church_n ought_v to_o ordain_v and_o not_o minister_n have_v he_o unfold_v any_o of_o those_o independent_a riddle_n viz._n that_o a_o company_n of_o those_o that_o be_v baptize_v and_o own_o their_o baptism_n be_v not_o member_n of_o a_o visible_a church_n or_o that_o a_o minister_n be_v such_o in_o relation_n to_o his_o church_n act_n no_o long_o as_o in_o office_n than_o to_o his_o church_n and_o that_o at_o one_o and_o the_o same_o time_n and_o place_n he_o preach_v as_o a_o mere_a gift_a brother_n to_o those_o that_o be_v not_o of_o his_o church_n and_o as_o a_o minister_n to_o those_o of_o his_o church_n thus_o thou_o may_v see_v his_o spirit_n of_o opposition_n and_o his_o design_n to_o cry_v out_o on_o other_o that_o none_o may_v suspect_v his_o cause_n as_o cutpurse_n that_o they_o may_v may_v not_o be_v accuse_v ought_v he_o not_o to_o do_v otherwise_o the_o next_o time_n 4_o that_o this_o task_n i_o have_v here_o undertake_v be_v the_o first_o and_o therefore_o may_v be_v guilty_a of_o mistake_n of_o which_o i_o beg_v thy_o pardon_n and_o do_v promise_v thou_o that_o nothing_o but_o what_o be_v more_o than_o ordinary_o material_a shall_v provoke_v i_o to_o spend_v my_o own_o time_n in_o writing_n or_o thou_o in_o read_v be_v zealous_a for_o the_o truth_n pray_v for_o its_o progress_n and_o be_v thankful_a to_o god_n for_o any_o satisfaction_n thou_o shall_v receive_v by_o he_o who_o be_v thy_o conceal_a friend_n n._n e._n finis_fw-la