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england_n	antichristian_a	church_n	zion_n	69	3	11.2561	5	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A02522	A common apologie of the Church of England against the vniust challenges of the ouer-iust sect, commonly called Brownists. Wherein the grounds and defences, of the separation are largely discussed: occasioned, by a late pamphlet published vnder the name, of an answer to a censorious epistle, which the reader shall finde in the margent. By I.H.	Hall, Joseph, 1574-1656.; Robinson, John, 1575?-1625. Answer to a censorious epistle.	1610 (1610)	STC 12649; ESTC S103653	113,921	160

be iudge So doe we value your detestation as you his It were well for you if you eschued these enormities lesse and hell more Your sinfull subiection to these vnchristian humours will proue more fearefull then to our Antichristian enormities SECTION XXII The Church of England is the Spouse of Christ. SHE may be your Mother you say and not the Lords Wife It is a good Mother that hath Children and no husband Why did you not call her plaine whore Your old Embleme is As is the Mother so is the Daughter These are the modest circumlocutions of a good sonne who cares not to proue himselfe a bastard that his mother may bee mark't for an Harlot Be you a true Lo-ammi but England shall neuer I hope proue an Apostate Israel We haue no Calues in our Dan and Bethel none of Iero●oams Idolatry VVee haue still called God Ishi and neuer burnt incense to Baalim It is your sinagogue that hath fallen away from vs as Israel from Iuda But these children were bidden to plead Gods command shields them from the note of vngracious Abraham must sacrifice his sonne and this sonne must condemne his Mother shew vs either our equall desert or your equall warrant VVhere hath God proclamed our Church not his By whose hand hath he published her diuorce You haue shamed her wombe not she her bed not God her demeanure Your tongues are your owne who can forbid you VVe know you will plead and excuse and censure and defend till all the world be weary we may pray with Hierome to this sense that of the Psalmist Increpa Domine bestias calami yet wee see your pens tongues and presses busie and violent I will not apply to you that which Augustine of his Donatists Though truth compell you to be dumbe yet iniquitie will not suffer you to be silent But if you write whole Marts and worlds of volumes you shall neuer be able either to iustifie your innocence or excuse your fault In the meane time the noyse of your contentions is so great that your truth cannot bee heard Learned Iunius and our learnedst Diuines and neighbour Churches haue oft heard your clamors neuer your truth So little haue you of this and so much of the other that we are ready to wish as he of old either our selues deafe or you dumb SECTION XXIII How the Church of England hath separated from Babylon THe spirit of your Proto-Martyr would hardly haue digested this Title of Babylon Mother of Gods people a murdering Step-mother rather She cannot be a Mother of Chil●ren to God and no Church of God Notwithstanding Gods people would he say may be in her not of her So Babylon bore them not but Sion in Babylon But I feare not your excesse of charity You fly to your Doctors challenge and aske what we say against you for vs which Rome wil not say for her selfe against vs Will you iustifie this plea of Rome or not If you will why doe you reuile her If you will not why doe you obiect it Heare then what we say both to you and them our enemies both and yet the enemies of our enemies First we disclaime and defie your Pedigree and theirs The Church of Rome was neuer our Mothers Mother Our Christian faith came not from the seuen-hilles Neither was deriued either from Augustine the Monke or Pope Gregory Britanny had a worthy Church before either of them look't into the world It is true that the ancient Roman Church was Sister to ours here was neare kindred no dependance And not more consanguinitie then while she continued faithfull Christian loue Now she is gone a whoring her chast Sister iustly spitteth at her yet euen still if you distinguish as your learned Antagonist hath taught you betwixt the Church and Papacy Shee acknowledges her Sisterhood though she refraines her cōuersation as she hath many slauish and factious abettors of her knowne and grosse errors to whom we deny this title affirming them the body whereof Antichrist is the head the great whore and mother of abhominations so againe how many thousands hath shee which retayning the foundation according to their knowledge as our learned Whitakers had wont to say of Bernard follow Absolom with a simple heart all which to reiect from Gods Church were no better thē presumptuous cruelty It were well for you before God the world if you could as easiely wash your hands of vn-naturall impiety and trecherousnesse as we of bastardy vniust sequestration There can be no bastardy where was neuer any motherhood wee were nephews to that Church neuer sons vnlesse as Rome was the Mother citie of the world so by humane institution we suffered our selues to bee ranged vnder her Patriarchall authority as being the most famous Church of the West a matter of courtesie and pretended Order no necessity no spirituall obligation As for our sequestration your mouth and theirs may be stopt with this answer As all corrupted Churches so some things the Church of Rome still holds aright a true God in three persons true Scriptures though with addition a true Christ though mangled with foule and erroneous consequences true Baptisme though shamefully deformed with rotten traditions many other vndenyable truths of God some other things and too many her wicked Apostasie hath deuised and maintained abhominably amisse the body of her Antichristianisme grosse errours and by iust sequel heresies their Popes supremacy infallibility illimitation transubstantiation idolatrous and superstitious worshippe and a thousand other of this branne In regard of all these latter we professe to the world a iust and auncient separation from this false faith and deuotion of the Romish Church which neither you will say nor they shall euer proue faulty yea rather they haue in all these separated from vs who stil irrefragably professe to hold with the auncient from whom they are departed In regard of the other we are stil with them holding and embracing with them what they holde with Christ neither will you I thinke euer prooue that in these we should differ As for our communion they haue separated vs by their proude and foolish excommunications if they had not wee would iustly haue begunne from their Tyranny and Antichristianisme from their miserable Idolatrie but as for the bodie of their poore seduced Christians which remaine amongst them vpon the true foundation as doubtlesse there are thousands of them which laugh at their Pardons Miracles Superstitions and their trust in merites reposing only vpon Christ we adhere to them in loue and pitty and haue testified our affection by our blood ready vpon any iust call to doe it more neither would feare to ioyne with them in any true seruice of our common God But the full discourse of this point that honourable and learned plesses hath so forstalled that whatsoeuer 〈◊〉 say would seeme but borrowed Vnto his rich Treatise I referre my Reader for full satisfaction

by our holy Martyrs fol. 62. What separation England hath made fol. 63. The maine grounds of Separation fol. 65. The truth and warrant of the Ministery of England fol. 66. Confused Communion of the prophane fol. 70. Our Errours intermingled with Truth fol. 71. Whether our Prelacie be Antichristian fol. 74. The iudgement and practise of other Reformed Churches fol. 77. Our Synodes determination of things indifferent fol. 78. Sinnes sold in our Courts fol. 81. Our loyaltie to Princes cleared theirs questioned fol. 84. Errours of Free will c. fained vpon the Church of England fol. 86. Kneeling at the Sacrament of the Lords Supper fol. 87. Whether our Ordinarie and Seruice-Booke be made Idols by vs. fol. 89. Marriage not made a Sacrament by the Church of England fol. 95. Commutation of Penance in our Church fol. 98. Oath ex Officio fol. 99. Holy-daies how obserued in the Church of England 100. Our approbation of an vnlearned Ministery disproued fol. 102. Penances inioyned in the Church of England fol. 103. The practises of the Church of England concerning the Funerals of the dead fol. 104. The Churches still retained in England fol. 108. The Founders and Furnitures of our Churches fol. 110. On what ground Separation or Ceremonies was obiected fol. 112. Estimation of Ceremonies and subiection to the Prelates fol. 114. The state of the Temple and of our Church in resemblance fol. 117. Whether Ministers should endure themselues silenced fol. 119. Power of reforming abuses giuen to the Church and the issue of the neglect of it fol. 121. The view of the sinnes and disorders of others wherupon obiected and how farre it should affect vs. fol. 124. The nearenesse of the State and Church and the great errours found by the Separatists in the French and Dutch Churches fol. 127. Conuersation with the world fol. 132. The impure mixtures of the Church of England fo 133. The iudgement of our owne and our neighbours of our Church fol. 137. The issue of Separation fol. 140 The Brownists scornefull opinion of our people fol. 143. The Conclusion from the fearefull aunswere of Separation fol. 144. Errata Read welbeloueds for welbelouedst Epist pa. vlt. Con●iction for coniunction pag. 32. line 19. Vncharitablenesse for vnchariblenesse pag. 47. line 18. Optat. lib. 3. for Opt. lib. 30. marg pag. 49. Rules of Christ for rules Christ. pag. 50. line 1. Places onwards for places onwards pag. 66. line 18. Our Ministerie for your Ministerie pag. 67. line 8. That houses for what houses pag. 80. line 16. waryof for weary of pag. 88. line 16. shrifte for strife pa. 99. l. 12 Enuie for annoy pag. 103. line 13. Ingenuously for ingeniously pag. 104. line 19 which are in for which are in pag. 107. line 13. Besides many quotations in the margent are misplaced the matter will leade the Reader to the right place The words of the aduersarie are onely those which haue this Note of Sep. set before them Meam iniuriam patiētertuli impietatem contra Spōsam Christi ferre non potui Hier ad Vigilant Zach. 8. 19. Matth. 18. 7. Otho Frising ex Philon. Vr. Chaldaeorum Ruffiin Eccl●s hist. l. 2. c. 26. Dan. 3. Vid. Treatis of certain● godly Minist ag Barr. 1. Retorted S●p It is a hard thing euen for sober minded men in cases of controuersie to vse soberly the aduantages of the times vpon which whilst men are mounted on high they vse to behold such as they oppose too ouerlie and not without contempt and so are oft times emboldened to roule vpon them as from aloft very weake and weightlesse discourses thinking any sleight and slender opposition sufficient to oppresse those vnderlings whom they haue as they suppose at so great an aduantage Vpon this very presumption it commeth to passe that this Author vndertaketh thus solemnly and seuerely to censure a cause whereof as appeareth in the sequell of the discourse hee is vtterly ignorant which had he beene but halfe so carefull to haue vnderstood as hee hath beene forward to censure hee would either haue beene I doubt not more equall towards it or more weightie against it * 2. Confuted * Hier. Marco presbyt De cauernis cellularum damnamus orbem in sacco cinere volutati de Episcopis sententiam ferimus Quid facit sub tunica paenitentis regius animus Cypr. l. 3. Ep. 9. Haec sunt initia haereticorum vt sibi placean vt praepositum superbo tumore contemnant Harison once theirs in Psal. 122. of Brown Antichristian pride and bitternes Bredw pref M Brinsly his pref to the 2. part of the VVatch. Optat. Mil. de Donat. Collegae non eritis si●o litis fratres estis c. Disclaimed by themselues Answer against Broughton page 21. Separat schism M. Giff. an ignorant Priest Barr. p. 64. Confer of D. And. M. Huchius with Barrow M. Spr. 3. 〈◊〉 siderat Iren. l. 1. Per singulos dies nouum aliquod adsectant c. * Bar. Confer with Hutchins fo 1. Browne estat● of true Christians Defence of true Christians against the Doct. of Oxford Iohnson against Iacob passim Barr. against Gyfford Sepa As this Epistle is come to mine hands so I wish the answere of it may come to the hands of him that occasioned it Intreating the Christian Reader in the name of the Lord vnpartially to behold without either preiudice of cause or respect of person what is written on both sides and so from the Court of a sound conscience to giue iust iudgement To M. Smith and M. Rob. Ring-leaders of the late separation at Amsterd Charact. of the Beast written by M. Smith Pref. Be it knowne therefore to all the separation that we account them in respect of their constitution to be as very an Harlot as either her Mother the Church of England or her Grandmother Rome is c. Iterato Baptizatus scienter it erato Dominum crucifigit De consecr dist 4. Qui vis c. * The crime of separation how great Sep. The crime here obiected is separation a thing very odious in the eyes of all them from whom it is made as euermore casting vpon them the imputation of euill whereof all men are impatient And hence it commeth to pass● that the Church of England can better brooke the vilest persons continuing communion with it then any whomsoeuer separating from it though vpon neuer so iust and well grounded reasons Vid. Iohnson Preface to his Inquirie Esay 5. 20. M. Penry in his Disc. of this subiect Num. 16 31. ●xod 32. 30. Prou. 21. 2. Sepa And yet separation from the world and so from the men of the world and so from the Prince of the world that raigneth in them and so from whatsoeuer is contrarie to God is the first steppe to our communion with God and Angels and good men as the first steppe to a Ladder is to leaue the earth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Num. 18. 14 Num. 16. 9. Deut. 10. 1. Exod. 13. 12. Leuit. 15. 21. Deut.

and liuely stones 1. Kin. 5. 17. 18 6. 7. 1. pet 2. 5. and of the Cedars Firs and Thyne trees of Lebanon 2. Chr. 2. 8. framed and set together in that comely order which a greater then Salomon hath prescri●ed vnto which God hath promised his presence But whilst we take it to be as it is a confused heape of dead and defiled and polluted stones and of all rubbish of Bryers and brambles of the wildernesse for the most part fitter for burning then building we take our selues rather bound to shew our obedience in departing from it then our valour in purging it and to follow the prophets councel in flying out of Babylon as the hee goats before the flock Ie● 50. 8 Sep. And what I pray you is the valour which the best hearted and most zealous Reformers amongst you haue manifested in driuing out the Mony-changers doth it not appeare in this that they suffer themselues to be driuen out with the two stringed Whippe of Ceremonies and subscription by the Mony-changers the Chancellers and Officials which sell. sinnes like Doues and by the chiefe priests the Bishoppes which set them on worke so farre are the most zealous amongst you from driuing out the Mony-changers as they themselues are driuen out by them because they will not change with them to the vtmost farthing Bar. Refor without Tar. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 VVee charge him not to serue any more So Can. 15. Can. 25. Cum compertū fuerit deponatur Can. 10. De Clericatus honore periclitabitur Can. 2. E clero deponatur sit alienus a Canone Can. 17. et Can. 18. A ministerio cessare debuerit Concil Sardic c. 4. Cōcil Carth. 4. c. 48. 56. 57. Leo. Ep. 1. Sect. 5. Cypr. l. 3. Ep. 9. S●cr l. 2. c. 21. Bar ag Gyff p. 27. 88. Sep. For the Wafers in Geneua and disorders in Corinth they were corruptions which may and doe or the like vnto them creep into the purest Churches in the world for the reformation wherof Christ hath giuen his power vnto his Church that such euils as are brought in by humane frailty may by diuine authority bee purged out This power and presence of Christ you want holding all by homage or rather by vilenage vnder the Prelates vnto whose sinfull yoake you stoup in more then Babylonish bondage bearing and approuing by personall communion infinite abhominations Troubl Excom at Amsterd An tu solus Ecclesia es Et qui te offenderit a Christo excluditur Hieron Eriphan Cypr. Solus in caelum ascend Pupianus Et ad Acesium Nouatianum Constant. Erigito tibi scalam Acesi ad caelum solus ascendito Socr. l. 1. C. 7. Bar. Gyff ref So some of their owne haue termed their excommunication Confess by M. Iohns Inqu p. 65 Col. 1. 18. Sep. And in these two last respects principally your Babylonish confusion of all sorts of people in the body of your Church without separation and your Babylonish bondage vnder your spirituall Lords the Prelates we account you Babylon and flie from you Amari Parens Episcopus debet non timeri Hier. ad Theophilum Sep. M. H hauing formerly expostulated with vs our supposed impietie in forsaking a ceremonious Babylon in England proceeds in the next place to lay downe our madnesse in chusing a substantiall Babylon in Amsterdam and if it be so found by due trial as he suggesteth it is hard to say whether our impiety or madnes be the greater Sep. Belike M. H. thinkes we gather churches here by towne-rowes as they doe in England and that all within the parish procession are of the same Church Wherefore else tels hee vs of Iewes Arrians and Anabaptists with whom we haue nothing common but the streetes and market-place It i● the condition of the Church to liue in the world and to haue ciuill society with the men of this world 1. Cor. 5. 10. Ioh. 17. 13. But what is this to that spirituall communion of the saints in the fellowshippe of the Gospell wherin they are separated and sanctified from the world vnto the Lord Ioh 17. 16. 1. Cor. 1. 2. Cor. 6. 17. 18. Separation from the world how required Ioh. 17. 16. 1. Cor. 1. 2. 1. Cor. 3. 3. Sep. We indeed haue much wickednes in the Citie where we liue you in the Church ●ut in earnest doe you imagine we account the Kingdome of England Babylon or the citie of Amsterdam Syon It is the Church of England or state Ecclesiasticall which we account Babylon and from which we withdraw in spirituall communion ●ut for the common-wealth and Kingdome as we honor it aboue all the states in the world so wold we thankfully embrace the meanest corner in it at the extreamest conditions of any people in the Kingdome Cassand de Offic boni viri Bellar. de Laicis Euseb. in vita Const. Fr. Iohns Articles ag the Fr● and Dutch Churches Bar. ag Gyss Counrtepoys Sep. The hellish impieties in the citie of Amsterdam doe no more preiudice our heauenly communion in the Church of Christ then the frogs lyce flyes moraine and other plagues ouerspreading Egypt did the Israelites when Goshen the portion of their inheritance was free Exod 8. 19. nor then the deluge wherewith the whole world was couered did Noah when he and his family were safe in the Arke Gen. 7. nor then sathans throne did the Church of Pergamus being established in the same citie with it Re● 2. 12 13. Sep. It is 〈◊〉 will of God and of Christ that his Church should abide in the world and conuerse with it in the affaires therof which are common to both But it is the Apostasie of Antichrist to haue communion with the vvorld in the holy things of God which are the peculiars of the Church and cannot without great sacriledge be so prostituted and prophaned Duobus mod● non te ma●ulat malus vid●licet si non consentis si redarg●is d. 23. q. 4. a malis Sep. The ayre of the Gospell which you draw in is nothing so free and cleare as you make shevv it is only because you are vsed to it that makes you so iudge 1. Canons Sep. The thicke smoake of your Canons especially of such as are planted against the Kingdome of Christ the visible Church and the administration of it do both obscure and poyson the ayre which you all draw in and wherein you breath 2. Sinne vncensured Sep. The plaguy-spirituall-leprosie of sinne rising vp in the foreheads of so many thousands in the Church vnshut vp vncouered infects all both persons and things amongst you Leu. 13. 45. 46. 47. 2. cor 6 17. Certe nullius crimen maculat nescientem Aug. Ep. 48. 1. Reg. 19. 18. 3. Heirarchy Sep. The blasting Hierarchie suffers no good thing to grow or prosper but withers all both budde and branch 4. Seruice-booke Sep. The daily sacrifice of the seruice-booke which in stead of spirituall prayer sweete as incense you offer vp morning and