Selected quad for the lemma: england_n
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A02848
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An ansvver to the first part of a certaine conference, concerning succession, published not long since vnder the name of R. Dolman
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Hayward, John, Sir, 1564?-1627.
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1603
(1603)
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STC 12988; ESTC S103906
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98,388
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178
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vntil it was violently drawn froÌ„ Sardanapalus to the Medes From them also Cyrus by subuersion of Astyages did transport it to the Persians and from them againe the Grecians did wrest it by conquest After the death of Alexander his captaines without any consent of the people made partition of the empire among them whose successors were afterwards subdued by the armies and armes of Rome And this empire beeing the greatest that euer the earth did beare was in the end also violentlie distracted by diuers seueral either conquests or reuolts Leo After writeth that it is not a hundred yeares since the people of Gaoga in Africk had neither king nor Lord vntill one hauing obserued the greatnesse and maiestie of the king of Tombute did enterprise to attaine soueraigntie aboue them which by violence he effected and left the same to his posteritie And because I will not bee tedious in running through particulars giue you an instance of anie one people which hath not diuers times receiued both Prince and gouernment by absolute constraint Et Phillidasolus habeto and I will yeeld to all that you affirme But failing herein you shall bee enforced to confesse that in manie yea in most if not in all countries the people haue receiued libertie either from the graunt or permission of the victorious Prince and not the prince authoritie from the vanquished people What helpes nowe doe you imagine that the people haue assigned to their Prince The first you affirme to be the direction of lawes But it is euident that in the first heroicall ages the people were not gouerned by anie positiue lawe but their kings did both iudge and commaund by their word by their will by their absolute power and as Pomponius saith Omnia manu a regâ—bus gubernabantur Kings gouerned all things without either restraint or direction but onely of the lawe of nature The first lawe was promulged by Moses but this was so long before the lawes of other nations that Iosephus writeth It was more ancient then their gods affirming also that the word Law is not found in Homer or in Orpheus or in anie Writer of like antiquitie Of this law of nature Homer maketh mention in these words 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 And they who keepe the lawes which God hath prescribed And againe 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Vnciuill and vniust is he and wanting priuate state Who holdeth not all ciuill war in horror and in hate And of the iustice of kings he writeth in this maner 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 In which verses Chrysostome affirmeth by the iudgment of Alexander that Homer hath delineated the perfect image of a King but that hee maketh mention of anie positiue lawes I doe rather doubt then assuredlie denie For Kings in auncient times did giue iudgment in person not out of any formalitie in lawe but onlie according to naturall equitie Virgil saith Hoc Priami gestamen erat cumiura vocatis More daret populis This was the robe which Priamus did alwaies vse to weare When he the people to him called their causes for to heare Which he doth also affirme of Aeneas Dido and of Alcestes The like doth Herodotus report of Midas king of Phrygia who consecrated his tribunall to Apollo and the like also dooth Plutarch of diuers kings of Macedonia Philarchus affirmeth in Athenaeus that the kings of Persia had palme trees and vines of goulde vnder which they did sit to heare causes But because it grew both troublesome tedious for al the people to receiue their right from one man lawes were inuented as Cicero saith and officers also appointed to execute the same Another original of lawes was thus occasioned When anie people were subdued by armes lawes were laid like logs vpon their necks to keepe them in more sure subiection which both because it is not doubtful and to auoid prolixitie I will manifest onlie by our owne example When the Romans had reduced the best part of this Iland into the forme of a prouince as they permitted libertie of lawe to no other countrie vnder their obedience so here also they planted the practise of their lawes and for this purpose they sent ouer manie professors and among others Papinian the most famous both for knowledge and integritie of all the authors of the ciuill lawe Againe when the Saxons had forced this Realme and parted it into seauen kingdomes they erected so manie settes of law of which onelie two were of continuance the Mercian lawe and the West Saxon law After these the Danes became victorious and by these newe Lordes new lawes were also imposed which bare the name of Dane-lawe Out of these three lawes partlie moderated partlie supplied King Edward the confessor composed that bodie of lawe which afterwardes was called Saint Edwards lawes Lastly the Normans brought the land vnder their power by whom Saint Edwards lawes were abrogated and not onlie new lawes but newe language brought into vse in somuch as all pleas were formed in French and in the same tongue children were taught the principles of Grammar These causes wee find of the beginning of lawes but that they were assigned by the people for assistance and direction to their kinges you bring neither argument nor authoritie for proofe it is a part of the drosse of your owne deuise The second helpe which you affirme that common wealthes haue assigned to their kings is by parliaments and priuie councelles But Parliaments in al places haue bin erected by kings as the parliament of Paris and of Montpellier in Fraunce by Philip the Faire the parliament in England by Henrie the first who in the sixteenth yeare of his raigne called a councell of all the states of his realme at Salisburie which our Historiographers do take for the first Parliament in England affirming that the kings before that time did neuer call the common people to counsell After this the priuie councell at the instance of the Archbishop of Canterburie was also established and since that time the counsellors of state haue alwaies bin placed by election of the Prince And that it was so likewise in auncient times it appeareth by thaâ— which Homer writeth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 First hee established a councell of honorable old men And likewise by Virgill gaudet regno Troianus Acestes Indicitque foru et patribus dat iura vocatis Acestes of the Troiane bloud in kingdome doth delight He sets a Court and councell cals giues ech man his right I will passe ouer your course foggio drowsie conceite that there are few or none simple monarchies in the world for it would tire any â—to toyle after your impertinent errours and wil now rip vp your packet of examples whereby you indeuour to shew that the power of kings hath bin brideled by their subiects But what do you infer hereby What can you inforce will you
parlament vvas king Richard deposed vvher did the states assemble vvhen did they send for the earle of Richmond to put him down by what decree by vvhat messengers Ther is no answer to be made but one and that is to confesse ingenuously that you say vntrue that it is your vsuall manner of deceiuing to impute the act of a few vnto all to make euerie euent of armes to be a iudicial proceeding of the common wealth For it is manifest that the earle of Richmond had his first streÌ„gth from the king of France that after his discent into England more by halfe both of the nobilitie common people did stand for king Richard then stirre against him You adioyne for a speciall consideration that most excellent princes succeeded these vvhom you affirme to be deposed I vvill nor extenuate the excellencie of any Prince but I hould it more vvorthie to be considered that these disorders spent England a sea of bloud In the ende you conclude that all these depriuations of Princes vvere lawfull Nay by your fauour if you sweat out your braines you shall neuer euince that a fact is lawfull beecause it is done Yes you say for othervvise two great inconueniences vvould follow one that the actes of those that vvere put in their place should be voide and vniust the other that none vvho now pretend to these Crownes could haue any tytle â—or that they descend from them vvho succeeded those that were depriued You deserue now to be basted with words vvell stiped in vineger and salt but I will be more charitable vnto you and leaue bad speaches to black mouthes For the first the possession of the crowne purgeth all defects and maketh good the actes of him that is in authoritie although he vvanteth both capacitie and right And this doth Vlpian expressely determine vpon respect as he saith to the common good For the other point the successors of an vsurper by course and compasse of time may prescribe a right if they vvho haue receiued wrong discontinue both pursuit and claime Pâ—normitane saith Successor in dignitate potest praescribere non abstante vitio sui praedecessor is A successor in dignitie may prescribe notwithstaÌ„ding the fault of his predecessor otherwise causes of vvar should be immortall and titles perpetually remaine vncertaine Now then for summarie collection of all that you haue saide your protestations are good your proofes light and loose your conclusions both dangerous false The first doth sauour of God the second of man the third of the diuell To the fourth Chapter which beareth tytle Wherein consisteth principally the lawfulnesse of proceeding against Princes which in the former Chapter is mencioned What interest Princes haue in their subiects goods or liues How oathes doe binde or may bee broken of subiects towards their Princes and finally the difference betweene a good king and a tyrant HEere you cloase with Billaye vpon two points first vvhether a king is subiect to any law Secondly whether all temporalities are in proprietie the Kings but because these questions doe little perteine to our principall controuersie I vvill not make any stay vpon them it suffiseth that vve may say vvith Seneca Omnia rex imperio possidet singuli domino The king hath empire euery man his particular proprietie in all things After this you proceede further to make good that the Princes before mencioned vvere lawfully deposed and that by all law both diuine and humane naturall nationall and positiue Your cause is so badd that you haue need to set a bould countenance vpon it But what deuine lawes doe you alleage You haue largely beefore declared you saye that GOD doth approoue the forme of gouernmeÌ„t vvhich euery common wealth doth choose as also the conditions and statutes which it doth appoint vnto her prince I must now take you for a naturall lyer when you wil not forbeare to bely your selfe you neuer proued any such matter the contrary is euident that sometimes entire gouernments often customes statutes of state very commonly accidentall actioÌ„s are so vnnaturall vniust that otherwise then for a punishment and curse wee cannot say that God doth approue theÌ„ We haue often heard that the Church cannot erre in matters of Faith but that in matter of gouerment a coÌ„mon wealth cannot erre it was neuer I assure my selfe published before But let vs suppose supposall is free that God alloweth that forme of gouernment which euery common wealth doth choose doth it therfore follow that by all deuine lawes princes may be deposed by their subiects these broken peeces will neuer bee squared to forme strong argument But wherefore doe not you produce the deuine canons of scripture surely they abhorre to speake one word in your behalfe yea they doe giue expresse sentence against you as I haue shewed before Well let this passe among your least escapes in making God either the author or aider of rebellioÌ„ you alledge no other humane law but that princes are subiect vnto law and order I vvill not denie but ther is a duty for princes to performe but how proue you that their subiects haue power to depose them if they faile In this manner As the common vvealth gaue them their authoritie for the common good so it may also take the same away if they abbuse it But I haue manifested before both that the people may so graunt away their authoritie that they cannot resumeâ—t also that few princes in yâ— world hold their state by graunt of the people I will neuer heereafter esteeme a mans valure by his voice Your braue boast of all lawes diuine humane naturall nationall and positiue is disolued into smoake you busie your selfe as the Poets wright of Morpheus in presenting shadowes to men a sleepe But the chiefest reason you say the very ground and foundation of all Soft what reason what ground if you haue alreadie made proofe by all lawes humane and deuine naturall nationall and positiue what better reason what surer ground will you bring Tush these interruptions The chiefest reason you say the very ground and foundation of all is that the common wealth is superiour to the prince and that the authoritie which the prince hath is not absolute but by the way of mandate and commission from the common wealth This is that which I expected all this time you haue hetherto approached by stealing steps you are now come cloase to the wall do but mount into credit and the fort is your owne You affirmed at the first that princes might be deposed for disabilitie then for misgouernmenâ— now vpon pleasure and at will For they who haue giuen authoritie by coÌ„mission doe alwaies retaine more then they graunt are not excluded either froÌ„ commanding or iudging by way of preuention concurrence or evocation euen in those cases which they haue giuen in charge The reason is declared by Vlpian because hee to whom iurisdiction is committed