the publique Prayers also the forme and manner of things with what authority then do our brethren take vpon them to traÌ„spose in the Church of England that which the Church of England hath disposed with what authority can they abrogate or alter the dayes and times of preaching administring the sacraments that the Church of Engl. in like maner by her authority hath disposed with what authority can they dispose assemblies commâ—â—gs together of the people to bee made in other places than to that purpose are disposed with what authority can they controul or disobey the form manner of the publike praiers vsing those thingâ— in the ordinary seruice that the church of Eng. hath disposed to be vsed yet they wil not only refuse to vse thosethings the form manner of publike prayers nor only deface reuile them as naught but set forth oppose against that which by the churches autority is disposed another forme maner of publike prayers of their own disposing Yea if wee were disposed to examine better their owne positions how standeth this with their prayer on the other side of the leafe pag. 69. saying God graunt therfore that in steed of ordinary formes of praier we may haue preaching in all places If the church haue authority to dispose for publike prayer the form manner so that al things be done comely agreeable to order but especially that in all thinges principal regard be had to edification then not only a forme of publike praiers hindreth no whit but furthereth comlines order edificatioÌ„ but also the church vsing her authority in disposing of an ordinary form of publike praiers so well as in disposing the daies times places for preaching it cannot be that preaching in all places shoulde bee had in steed of publike praiers but that both of them should stil continue in their dayes and times places forme and manner by the Churches authority disposed And what followeth hereupon but that either our brethren must denie the Church of England to be the Church and so not to haue authority of their disposing of these things or els granting it to be the Church that is to say a particuler Church for I think they wil not say that they mean this only of the vniuersal church nor yet of euerie seueral congregation for so our Bre. assertion were not true but speaking heere indefinitely that the church hath authority to dispose these thinges they mean euery whole state of any true particular Church in Christendome As the Church of England in Engl. the Scottish Church in Scotl. the Heluetian the Geneuian the French and the Dutch Church in their owne states Which being confessed our Brethren beeing neither the Church vniuersall nor the whole state of the particular Church of England but priuate members in the Church of England and though some numbers of them heere and there collected may make some seuerall congregations yet are they not of sufficient authority no not so to collect themselues or haue any autority of making any assemblings or commings together at all in any place being but priuate persons without the disposing of them that haue autoritie in the Church or of the whole estate of the church of England therunto then must they néedes confesse withall that they doe greatly offende in going about to gaine-say and ouerthrowe this authority of the whole Church of England which hath by her authority so much as in her lies disposed ordeined and established these thinges as touching the circumstaunces for order and comelinesse sake but cheefely for edification as the dayes and times of preaching and administring the sacramentes the places meete for the same and for publike prayers also for the form and manner of vsing those things that all thinges be done comely and agreeable to order but especially that in all things principal regard bee had to aedification Nowe when the Church of Englande hath by her authority and by the authority of the supreme gouernor of her vnder Christe and of all the gouernors ecclesiasticall or politicall of her whole estate thus disposed these thinges Is it lawfull for any priuate persons bee they learned or vnleâ—rned be they few or many in the same Church to resist this autority whether this be to resist euen God or no and whether that which Saint Paule wrot to the Romaines Chapter 13. charging them beeing Christians to obey their Ciuill Magistrates though euil and Heathen in ciuill and indifferent matters do not much more binde euery particular priuate Christian all Christian subiects to obey their Christian Magistrates and all good Christian both Ecclâ—siastical and politike gouernors the whol particular estate autority of their own church wherof they are but priuate members I refer it to euery indifferent readers iudgement to our Bre. own answere on better aduisement of these thinges If our Bre. deny that they haue euer done or yet doe resist the Church of Englands authoritie in disposing these things what was all this that was last spoken of against the ordinary form of publike praier diuine seruice besides the authority it selfe of the ecclesiasticall gouernors and many other things of circumstances for dayes times places and administrations of Sacraments that they so vehemently impugne If they say that herein yet they doe not resist nor speake against the Church of Engl. for her authority to dispose these things but resist and speak against her onely for this that the she hath abused her authority and that she hath encroched further than shee hath lawfull authority to warrant her doing for that her authority as touching these circumstaunces is but for order and comelinesse sake and cheefely for edification and that it is to bée restrained with this limittation So that all thinges bee done comely and agreeable to order but especially that in all thinges principall regarde bee had to edification which S. Paule so often and so precisely vrgeth in the 14. Chapter of the Cor. Neither do we desire to haue the Churches authoritie in these circumstances to bee enlarged one inche further And euen so God bee praysed hath the Church of Englande had and especiall consideration of al these 3. points of comlinesse of order and of edification If they thinke not so acknowledging her to bee a true Church except they can proue it better than hitherto they haue done and yet should they prooue the same also if they coulde with more modesty and humility than they attempt to doe they both offer too great an iniury to their true and louing Mother the Church of England whose Children if any children of the Church they be and bewray too great a partiality to their owne opion And more séemely of the twain it might be thought to all good men that as they confesse their Mother hath authoritie giuen vnto her by their Faâ—her of disposing these circumstances to these ends and
is decreed amongst themselues that must be called the determination of the whole Synode I meruell that our Bretheren shamed nor feared not to stuffe their learned discourse with so many manifest vntrueths It is most euident that nothing is or can bee decreed in the name of the whole Synodes determination without the whole Synode comprehending at least the greatest number for the whole haue decreed and determined the same So that say they no man must bee suffered to speake any thing agaynst it bee it neuer so reasonable or agreable to the worde of God This is another most great and manifest vntrueth sclaunderous to the Bishoppes and reproachfull to the whole Conuocation There is none of the house but that may in any matter that is propounded to bee debated vppon yea any other though not of the house being knowne to be a reuerent godly wise and learned person either of the Ministerie yea in some cases though he were not any Ecclesiasticall person yet might he also bee freely admitted according to the auncient Canons to speake before the house in such sorte and manner as the order of the house requireth for those that bee or should bee learned men to speake their minde in the Latine tongue for feare some young Sir Iohn lacke latine would bee ouer busie and so to reason freely pro contra obseruing alwaies that modestie and reuerence which beseemeth the assemblie of graue and learned men And in this maner many haue propounded and reasoned vpon diuers matters as those that are auncients in the Conuocations heretofore can witnesse Yea saye they whosoeuer will not subscribe to all such thinges as they decree must bee excluded out of the Conuocation as was practised and threatned in the Conuocation at the foresayde Parliament vnto diuers godly and learned Preachers that offered to speake agaynst diuers grosse and palpable errors that had escaped the Bishops Our Bretheren hauing so often broken the squire of trueth in these matters doe here waxe bold to rappe out vntrueths now by huddles What one Preacher hath bene excluded out of the Conuocation for this that he would not subscribe to all such thinges as the Bishoppes among themselues haue decreed Or can they bring any instance but of such one threat made vnto them And albeit a threat differeth from the putting it in practise yet this also is a notorious sclaunder There was no such thing either practised or threatned at any tyme in our Conuocations namely at that tyme they mention which I remember well and so doe many others when some speaking in English began to bee ouer busie and to vse disordered behauiour with vnreuerent termes they were by the Prolocutor as moderator commaunded to silence or els to departe and not to disturbe the house nor alter the lawdable orders thereof except they would and that in seemely modestie speake in Latine which these godly and learned Preachers that our Bretheren commende liked not to doe Neuerthelesse other being indeede godly and learned Preachers did very reuerently and with great learning discusse those matters And so with generall consent either of all or which sufficed of the most and best parte those Articles were condescended vpon and approoued for good and sound doctrine And so I hope will stand for any thing that our Bretheren or any other shall euer bee able to say agaynst them As for any and much lesse diuers grosse and palpable errours that escaped the Bishops I remember none nor can learne of any The Decrees conteyned in the articles aforesayd are published to the open viewe of of euery man if our Bretheren as yet can burthen them with any grosse or palpable errour or with any errour at all though not grosse nor palpable or but with apparance or suspition of errour it were worth the hearing But if there bee no such errour in them who are then worthie the punishing or at least worthie to acknowledge with repentaunce and reuoking this so great a sclaunder For it toucheth not our Bishoppes and the Conuocation onely but béeing established also as is aforesayde by act of Parliament and so the professed doctrine of all the Realme and Church of England how are wee not all hereby defaced to maynteyne grosse and palpable errours and that in no small poynts of doctrine If Papistes had sayd this it had bene lesse meruell which hate our doctrine and count it stuffe full of errours and heresies too But they neuer were nor are nor euer shall bée God willing able to prooue that we mainteyne any one errour in any one article of doctrine but agree in all the substance of Religion with the true and syncere worde of God Yea our Bretheren their selues bearing vs witnesse who in the Preface of this learned discourse confesse that for the substance of Religion it is resolued and now publikly maynteyned for our true and holy faith How could this bee true if those articles namely these which here they note being matter of faith and publikely maynteyned and resolued by all the Church of England to bee true and holie were grosse and palpable errours But to shewe both vnto them and to all the worlde least the Papistes should take holde hereon when they heare of this our owne Bretherens accusation which will bee euen meate and drinke to them béeing glad to feede vppon such sclaunders that as wee are sounde GOD bée blessed for it in all other articles of doctrine so in these wee maynteyne no errour at all but a most sure and syncere trueth let vs come to the viewe of these two Articles that here they mention for example As for the distinction saye they of Canonicall and Apocryphall bookes Although this bee a matter wherein good and godly Fathers haue had some difference yet for our Bishoppes and Conuocations decree thereon I see not how our Bretheren shall bee able to finde that wee holde any error in that matter It is the sixth Article the wordes whereof are these Holy Scripture conteyneth all things necessarie to saluation so that whatsoeuer is not read therein nor may bee proued thereby is not to be required of any man that it should bee beleeued as an article of the faith or bee thought requisite or necessarie to saluation In the name of the holy Scripture wee doe vnderstand those canonicall bookes of the old and newe Testament of whose authoritie was neuer any doubt in the Church Of the names and number of the Canonicall bookes Genesis Exodus Leuiticus Numeri Deuteronomie Iosue Iudges Ruth The first booke of Samuell The 2. booke of Samuell The first booke of Kings The 2. book of Kings The 1. booke of Chroni The 2. booke of Chroni The 1. booke of Esdras The 2. booke of Esdras The booke of Hester The booke of Iob. The Psalmes The Prouerbes Ecclesiast or preacher Cantica or songs of Sal. 4. Prophets the greater 12. Prophets the lesse And the other bookes as Ierome
causes or permitters of their tempestes which they complaine they haue suffered or that her Maiestie and her most honorable Counsell haue not extended their clemency vnto them as they ought to haue done in not satisfiyng the hope and expectation of these Ministers But besides that thus no lesse vndutifully then vntruly our brethren do burden her Maiesty and her most honorable Counsel not so content they charge them further and in a higher matter saying But most especially according to their holy and zealous care which ought to abouÌ„de for the cleane driuing out of the Cananits c. No â—oubt her Maiesties her most honorable counsels care is both zealous and holy because it is so it hath we trust to their habilities abounded in performing that they ought to haue done héerein and euen therfore our brethren offer thâ— another iniury Yea if the driuing out of the Cananits had bene indéede their hope and expectation it had bene satisfied long a-go What Cananits are there remayning that should haue bene driuen out that in such sortâ— as they ought to do and might haue done they haue not done it and who are these Cananits Do they meane the Papists but they are more aptlâ— compared to the Idolatrous Israelits and Iewes not to the Cananits that were méere heathen And although in some sense they may be so coÌ„pared yet were not the Cananites so vtterlye to be driuen out but that if anyâ— would become in religion true Israelits as Rahab and the Gibeonits c. they were permitted to abide notwithstanding the expresse commaundement giuen them to the contrary Whereas Christians haue no such especiall or generall charge to driue cleane out all that haue beene Papistes or superstitious or Idolatrous or Heritikes or Insidels if they were truely conuerted to the faith and religion of Iesus Christe or else how haâ— Christ translated his Church from the Iewes to the Gentiles And so God be praised for it hath he conuerted in these last daies infinite Papists to the Gospell But if they meane those that remaine Papists I doe not thinkâ— that they can shew any such to be maintained in the Ministery Although their wordes runne at large of the cleane driuing out of all Cananits or Papistes out of the realme of what state or condition soeuer they be How much better is it in my opinion and more agréeable to the mercye of the Gospell and to the clemency of her Maiesties most holy zealous care so to abound that her Maiesty hath assayed to haue woonn those Cananits to the Gospell by letting them abide so driue out from them their Cananitisme rather than to driue out al the Cananits except they obstinatly professe themselues to be Cananites to driue out such at least out of al authority and publike Ministery Ecclesiasticall or ciuill or to restraine or punish them otherwise as they deserue although dissembling Cananits can neuer sufficiently be cleane driuen out that shew such outward conformity to the Gospell that they deceaue her Maiesty her most honorable Counsell al other saue God only Quis hominuÌ„ scit quae sunt hominiâ— nisi spiritus hominis qui in eo est As for planting hedging pruning continuall preseruing of the Lords vine-yard from foxes yea little foxes we trust also as becommeth vs and as we haue found by the benefite therâ—f good cause so to thinke that her Maiesties and her most honorable couÌ„sels holy and zealous care hath not a little abounded héerein And this before we shall enter into this learned discourse is a good hearing that they acknowledge her Maiestie ought to haue with her most honorable counsell a holie and zealous care to abounde in the planting hedging pruning and continuall preseruing of the Lords vine-yarde from foxes yea little foxes For when we shal come to this learned discourse we shal there sée that our brethren so abridge restraine this their authority héere in that they their selues haue bene a great occasion if there haue bene any defect that the Lords vine-yard hath not bene planted hedged pruned continually preserued with so full effect as her Maiesties and her most honorable Counsels holy care zeale hath endeuored to bring to passe For vnder pretence of these Cananits and foxes great or little our brethren meane not indeede so much to challenge the Papists as our Bishops and Prelates to be the great foxes and other the poore ministers of gods word the little foxes and in generall al those to be Cananits bee they neuer so zealous protestantes if they acknowledge the lawes and orders of our Church of England by her Maiesty established And to shew this they mention not the open warre with the common aduersary which is the Papist but say they this ciuil warre as a man may say of the church wherein so much of that bloud whereof S. Paule speaketh is powred to the ground should by their holy and iust authority fully be ended And so say I it might haue bene ended long ago had it not bene more by the importunity of our brethren themselues who as the old saying accordeth the Foxe the first fynder haue both made continually reniued this ciuil warre more then either the Bishops or any of vs who haue bene and are conformable to the lawes nowe established or any negligence in the behalfe of her Maiestie or of her most honorable Counsel that thei should be thus wrongfully burdened to haue bene the nourishers as it were of this ciuill warre but haue still employed all their holy and iust authority to the full ending of it And sith they giue it rightly this tearme of ciuill warre which is a great deale more daungerous warre than the forren warre with the open and common aduersarie who hath raysed this so daÌ„gerous ciuill warre We that in all due obedience acknowledge the lawes and orders established of the Churche of England Or they that haue and doo impugne them and who hath contended against her Maiesties and her most honorable Counsels holy and iust authority we or they yea indéede they haue not onely not yeelded to her Maiesties supreme authority herein but they plainly deny the full ending and determining of this ciuil warre consisting in these controuersies to appertaine vnto them but onely to themselues as God willing we shall see when wee come in this learned discourse to the examining of the authority that they giue to the ciuill Christian Magistrates in these matters Now say they when as wee at this time are subiect almost vnto all the afflictions which can come vnto a church blessed of God with such a Christian and happie regiment as to the prophane scoffing of the Hâ—monits at the building of the church as at a wall which a foxe shoulde destroy to the conspiracies of the Arabies and those of Asshod to the false charges of sedition contempt of all good lawes and proceedings like to that
shoulde either there must neuer bee assemblies and Councels such as were at Ierusalem among the Apostles for then their-selues confesse there can-not bee aequalitye Wee confesse say the Learned discoursers pag. 114 that in euerye assemblie or company some one of necessitie must haue this prerogatiue to order and dispose the same with reason So that if one muste haue preeminence aboue the residue then is there not so much equality as before and after And so for that time wherein of all other they shoulde bee moste Euangelicall by this moste greate aequality among them beeing left off they should not bee Euangelicall at all And therfore they may be Euangelicall well inough both in suche assemblies and without them hauing not suche most great aequality as is héere imagined Neither can I sée how this summa equalitas this most greate aequalitye can at anie time consist among the Pastors For if Caluines reason bee good vpon Galath 2. ver as we haue heard that greater honor speaking there of the honor of dignity should be geuen to those Pastors that haue greater gifts and all the Pastors in one Citie haue not giftes alike then not onely this inequality of dignity must bee of the Pastor to the people but also of the inaequality of the Pastors ariseth an inequality of the honor in dignity among the Pastors The reasons that our little English booke of the iudgement of a most reuerend and Learned man c. alleageth for the Bishop of God to bee all one with Pastor are the places cited already by our owne Learned discoursers alleaged as Ephes. 4.11 1. Tim. 3. Phil. 1.1 and therefore I passe them ouer to the places where they are aunswered come to the 2. kinde of Bishop the Bishop of man for on him lyeth now all the controuersie The humain saith Danaeus is when vnto some one out of the pastors there is giuen vpon the residue of the men which are also of the same order that is vpon other pastors and priestes of the Church a power or prelacy which is not indeed the chiefe but some it is If the bishoprick of man be no worse than this definition maketh it I sée not but that it is a good bishoprick yea why may it not be counted all one with the Euangelicall bishopricke Shall I say as much nay more then that which is most equall with all the pastors For this wee haue shewed by manifest prooues out of the word of God it self euen in the example of Tim. by the example of Iames Act. 15. 21. Gal. 2. euē out of Caluine Beza and by the exposition of manie the auncient and best approued Fathers by the track of the vniuersal practise from in the Apostles times by the testimonies of more than 2. or 3. most auncient credible witnesses that the bishop of man as he is héere defined is the very bishop of God also As for the 3. bishop of the Diuell let him go to the Diuell from whence he came We haue God be praised nought to do with him And howsoeuer our Br. might warble at the bishop if any were so euil a man that he might be called the Diuel himself as Christ called Iudas yet was his bishoprike of God We haue none to whome is giuen the summa potestas We acknowledge it to be only in Iesus Christ which is the only high bishop of our soules If he be the bishop of the Diuel to whom alone is giuen ouer other churches imperatoria dictatoria potestas an imperiall dictatorial power then be our bishops in England no bishops of the Diuel which haue no such most high imperial or dictatorly power Whosoeuer should so say of them should most manifestly slaunder them of whom a sclaunderer is that let the Etymology of the name Diabolus tel you As for our bishops they are of the number of those bishops of God Of whom this most reuerend man saith That the same were subiecte to Magistrates thoughe prophane appeareth not onely by the example of Christ the highest Prieste and of the Apostles but also by the expresse words of Paule 1. Tim. 2 Luke 12.13 and such God be praised bee our bishoppes and such were all these holy and auncient bishops that I haue mentioned Howbeit though the Pope may go in this crewe whether this definition suffice for all Popish Arch-bishops and Popish B I doubt mée of it For they haue no such highest power though they would But they are rather his slaues that hath it so it comes all to one reckoning for them so long as they like it and maintaine it in him and serue vnder him and as néere as they can or dare aspire to some part of his tyrannicall pride and diuelish vsurpation But God forbid that we shoulde so thinke when we cannot so say except we say amisse of any of our Reuerend Fathers bishops ouer vs that haue renounced him nor taken anie such power on them ouer either prince pastor or people in their gouernmēts But to annswere Danaeus with the iudgement of as reuerend and learned a man as is himselfe Let Danaeus his selfe aunswere himselfe what manner of superiority he alloweth in Bish. For writing vpō the 5. chapter of the 1. Tim. ver 22. Vnto whome the election of a pastor doth belong After hee hath taken it from prince from patrone from praelate neither yet that it perteyneth to all the Church alike whiche were to disturbe all thinges neither to anie one because none in the Church saue only Christe is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the gouernour by himselfe alone but of his arguments of election we shall sée God willing afterwarde at the length he saithe Neque eriam obstat c. Neither also doth this let it that the Bishop is of the fathers called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 President as though hee onely might order the whole Church after his fancy and therein aduāce whome he pleased for that worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a Praesident declareth onely an order that he which was called the Bishop ought to sitte among his colleagues and fellow Priestes or Elders but it giueth not vnto him a kingly or a chiefe and Pretor-like power vppon the Church Ambrose in lib. de dignitate Sacerdotum cap. 6. doth confirme that whiche wee saye If thine eye shal be simple thy whole bodie shal-be cleare that is If that the B. which deseued to rule the bodie be bewtified with holy simplicitie and innocēcie all the Church shineth with the brightnes of the light But if thy eie be euil c. That is if the B. which seemed to giue light to the body subiect to him be shadowed with the blindnesse of wicked behauiour what shal the other mēbers do that are bereft the light of the eies That is to say what shall the seculer multitude do whē with vnlawfull actions forbiddē the B. shal prouoke the
Church For some of these and such like meanes it hath pleased God alreadie to graunt that they may and doe take place and woulde take more place were it not for their importune hindering as I sayd before not so much of the open aduersaries of the Gospell as of our owne Brethren that fauour and professe it and yet preposterouslie doe stop the course thereof As for some of these meanes heere deuised it hath pleased God in his greate wisedome not to graunt them And therefore when we sée the will and graunt of God alreadie it were fitter we applied our wâ—lls to his than to wish hiâ— contrarie to his ordinance to become appliable vnto our wils And wheâ—e our Brethren would haue God graunt these their petitâ—ons to take place by the high authoritie of our dreade Soueraigne the Queenes Maiestie sith we manifestlie sée that by her Maiesties high authoritie GOD hath graunted such good successe to his Gospell and repaired his Church by such lawfull means of discipline as God hath both allowed and blessed which withall is by her Maiesties high authoritie established and confirmed amongst vs what a tentation is this to God not to bee content but to craue that he would graunt other new meanes And what obedience is this to her Maiesties high authoritie If her Maiestie herein haue any authoritie at all why do not we obey it If her Maiesties authoritie héere be high why doe we abase and bring it lowe If shee bee our dread Soueraigne why dreade we not thus to ouerthwart al her lawes and ordinances and without all dreade to contemne them and to cast forth such contumelious and slanderous spéeches on all the state of the Church to be most corrupt If her Maiestie be the Soueraigne that is the Supreame gouernor under Christ of this portion of the Church How doth not this defamatioÌ„ more blemish her Maiesties gouernment thaÌ„ al these faire spéeches can suffer to salue it And how call they her Maiestie Soueraigne and not acknowledge her soueraigntie or supremacie And if we inioy this coÌ„fortable peace vnder her most gracious gouernmeÌ„t why do not we coÌ„tinue it and be thankfull to God and to her Maiestie for it Why disturbe wée it and make it vncomfortable To conclude if it be a most gracious gouernment how is the state of the Church being gouerned vnder her Maiestie most corrupted Can most gracious and most corrupt agrée together What fellowship hath righteousnesse saith Saint Paule 2. Cor. 6.14 with vnrighteousnesse and what communion hath â—ight with darknesse what concord hath Christ with Belial Or hath her Maiestie no gouernment at all ouer the Church but onelie ouer the Realme and ciuile pollicie Are these tearmes then giuen her as a méere ciuile Prince or is her Maiestie acknowledged indeede the supreame gouernour in all Ecclesiasticall causes in the Church of England If she be how doth shee looke vnto her gouernment in the Church of England the state of the Church standing most corrupt These things hang together like Germaines lippes Who seeth not that they speak cleane contradictions in this stammering While they woulde thus plaie on both handes and giue onelie these fayre titles to her Maiestie for fashion sake and to auoide suspition or to winne fauour but if in verie déede they meant as they saie they woulde neuer thus impugne the established gouernment orders lawes and proceedings of her Maiestie They confesse that vnder her most gracious gouernment the time hath alreadie prosperouslie passed and yet they inferre vnder hand that it hath passed so vnprosperouslie that in lesse than halfe the time they dare ieopard their liues if they might haue their deuises broght to passe that the necessitie of learned Preachers shall bee so well supplied as wee shall haue no great cause to complaine for lacke of them And yet withall they saie her Maiesties raigne is most honourable and glorious Which if it be then haue they no cause to complain But they complaine of these things with great outcries and saie they haue great cause to complaine as though her Maiesties raigne were so dishonourable and ignominious that it nothing tended the honour and glorie of God which they saie they onelie seeke in this their Ecclesiasticall regiment So that in commending her Maiesties most honourable and glorious raigne what meane they but of such an externall honour and glorie of the world as little or nought respecteth the honour and glorie of the Lorde This is not well done of our Brethren thus to slander her Maiesties gouernment and the whole state of the Church of England vnder these faire and coulourable spéeches least our Breth might séeme in anie shew to come néere to those dissembling hypocrites whome Dauid so grieuouslie complaineth on Psal. 54. saying If mine enimie had defamed me I could haue borne it and if mine aduersarie had exalted himself against me I would haue hidden me from him But it was thou O man euen my companion my guide and my familiar which diddest eate sweete meate together with mâ— yea wâ— walled together in the house of God as companions And shall it be sayde of those that not onelie liue in one Realme and are or should be gouerned by one lawe vnder one most gracious Soueraigne yea her Maiestie and wee and all vnder one Iesus Christ in profession of our religion and of one Church of God that we deale thus one against another and that as Dauid there saich verse 21. The wordes of his mouth were softer than butter and yet warre in his heart his wordes â—ere more gentle than oyle and yet they were swoordes Now as these things beséeme not the â—hildren of God so is not this commendable in our Brethren that to set the better face of zeale vppon these foresayde spéeches thus tempered with no lesse gall than honie they offer thus freshlie to ieopard their liues that this which they promise and imagine shal be done in lesse than halfe the time that is alreadie passed Well may our Brethren blemish the time that is alreadie passed as not verie prosperouslie passed though for a shewe they saie so but to determine De futurâ— contingenti for that which may happe to come to passe hereafter and to prescribe it a time saue that they presume of her Maiesties clemencie not to take the aduantage of the forfaiture they might peraduenture hazarde too farre theyr best ioyntes if theyr happe were not better in this bargaynes euent than eyther theyr learning or their wisedome in the bargens making But what good lucke so euer would betide them to haue their desires graunted or their hope and promise come to passe yet their words sauour so suspitiouslie that for all this they would not holde themselues fullie satisfied For when they saie The necessitie of learned Pastors shall be so well supplied as we shall haue no no great cause to complaine for lacke of them they séeme in these words
purposes that withall they should rather render her this honor being known otherwise to be a true reuerent and chast mysticall wife vnto her spowse husband and to bee a naturall and tender mother to her children hauing â—â—urished theÌ„ with the pure milk of Gods word and brought them vp to that knowledge of God which they now haue to think that she hath vsed her authoritie well in disposing these circumstances to these ends accordingly and submit themselues to her disposing of them than to accuse her to theire father or make an outcry of her to the world that she hath abused her authority in these thinges and that these circumstances are not disposed to these 3. ends neither by her nor by any for her that either their father or she hath committed her authority of disposing them vnto except they be a new disposed transposed in such order as they the priuate children shal conceiue to bee more agreeable to these endes What an vnnaturall part were this yea how is it not as great fault on the contrarie as the aduersaries that extolled and honored their mother too much giuing her equal authority with God whom they pretended to be their father not onely in circumstances but in pointes of religion and making her to alter Gods commandements thus aduanced they their mother which was and is notoriously conuicted of most manifest spiritual fornication And wee nowe that professe our selues to be children of her whom we al acknowledge to be the true wife and chast matron of the L. Shal we thus on the other side dishonor her that when we cannot deny her authority in these circumstaÌ„ces we shal say she vseth theÌ„ not to the end for which they are giueÌ„ her As for that which Paul so often and so precisely vrgeth 1. Cor. 14. In all these verses so precisely quoted 23 24 25 26 31. What is there anie thing in anie one of all these Verses to the purpose that heere our Brethren speake of saue that onelie in the end of the 6. vers Paul saith Let al things be done to edifying which precept I know not nor it is yet prooued that this our mother the Church of Englande in disposing any of these forenamed circumstances doth transgresse and abuse this her authorie As for the other place here also cited 1. Cor. 11.17 is nothing likewise to the present purpose Now in this saith S. Paule that I declare I prayse you not that ye come together not with profite but with hurte Except that it maketh more against our Brethren them selues than it doth anie whitte against the Church of Englande for any circumstance of these things that by her authority she hath misdisposed True it is the church of Corinth beganne to abuse and dispose amisse diuerse thinges which S. Paule disswading them from teacheth them in what comely sort the men and women among them should pray or prophecie Which when he had declared preuenting such contentious persons as would vnnecessarilie disturbe quiet comely and indifferent orders he sayth ver 16. immediatly before that which our Brethren alleage but if any man be contentious we haue no such custome neither the Churches of God Upon which generall admonition Caluine sayth He is contentious that is stirred vp with a lust of mouing strifes neither regardeth hee that place should be giuen to the truthe Such are all they that vpon no necessitie would ouerthrowe pull vp or destroy all good and profitable rites or customes which moue coÌ„trouersies of matters not doubtfull which holde not themselues contented with reasons which suffer not themselues to be restrayned into order such are also 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 those that are vnciuile or not able to be kept companie withall who with a foolish affection are carried into a forme that men are not accustomed vnto Paule vouchsafeth to giue those men an aunswere because contention is a pernitious thing and therefore it ought to bee driuen awaie from the Churches Wherein he teacheth that such frowarde persons and desirous of brawling should rather bee kept vnder with authoritie than with long disputations to be refelled For there will neuer be an end of contentions if by striuing thou wouldest ouercome a quarellous man For he will neuer be tyred although he be ouercome an hundred times Let vs diligently therefore note this place least wee should suffer our selues to be caried away with superfluous disputations notwithstanding so that we shall knowe howe to discerne contentious persons For we must not alwayes holde him contentious that yeeldeth not to our decrees or that dare gain-say vs but where a lust and an obstinacie appeareth then let vs say with Paule contentions ought to be farre off from the custome Ecclesiasticall Thus sayth Caluine whether it touch our Brethren or vs néerer let other iudge Paule nowe vpon the occasion of these contentious men sayth in the next verse which by our Brethren here is quoted Nowe in this that I declare I prayse ye not that ye come together not with profice but with hurt Fâ—r first when ye come together into the Churche I heare that there are dissensions among you and I beleeue it in some parte These dissensions raysed among them by dissentious persons that vnnecessarily disturbed the peace of God and quiet of the Church hindred indéede their aedification in their Ecclesiasticall assemblies And it hath not a little hindred the aedification of the Churche among vs. For what is aedifying but the building vp of the mysticall bodie of Christe that is his Churche And if all assemblies and comminges together ought therefore to serue that wee may be better that we may be taught that wee may be aedified doe not our assemblies and comminges together meaning of our Ecclesiasticall assemblies serue to the same purposes If they take not alwayes nor in all the parties that come together in those assemblies the effect for the which they serue shall wee blame the Churches disposing of the assemblies Or not rather the defaultes of the assembled persons and especially these makers of vnnecessarie dissensions in the assemblies Which if they were repressed with authoritie and the assembled parties do their duties as the Church hath well disposed these assemblies to serue to these good purposes so they would be farre more effectuall then they be And therefore I like better of Caluines note hereon from whoÌ„ our Brethren séeme to take this saying For sayth he if we respecte what should bee doone in the Church no comming together ought to want frute There is the doctrine of God heard prayers are made the mysteries are celebrated The frute of the worde is that the trust and feare of God should be encreased in vs that proceedinges forward may be made in holines of life that more and more we may put off the olde man and profitte in newnesse of life and the other mysteries tend hereunto that they may exercise vs in godlines and
nothing can be spoken more absurd But farre greater errours haue sprong out of the same fountaine First that by those authors it was beleeued that the Salike lawe did appertaine to the publik right of a Citie and Empire or gouernmeÌ„t of the hereditarie successioÌ„ of a kingdoÌ„e For the Tables of the Salike law were found and brought forth to light not many yeres hence By the inscription of which it is knowen that they were first written and set out about the age of Pharamund But in those ther is extant this one Chapter Title 62. No portion of the inheritance of the Salike land passeth to a woman but this the mans sexe doth obtaine that is the sonnes succeede in the same inheritance But where among the nephues their children after long time contention is raised De allode terrae of the own-ship or right of the land Non per stirpes sed per capita diuidatur Let it bee diuided not by the stockes for issues but by the polles The like Lawe is extant apud Ripnaries Tit. 58. and also apud Angliâ—s Tit. 7. Where it is so far off froÌ„ that that it was ordained of the inheritances of kingdoÌ„es that those laws appertain not so much to the successions of fees but onlie of ownships or the things that are ones owne although indeed a dowrie was assigned vnto the woman out of those ownships Thus saith Hottoman of this Salike lawe whereof the French erre so foulie and make such a boasting As for that he addeth Howsoeuer it be first this is euident that although there be extant neither anie Chapter of the lawe Salike nor yet of the French lawe by which women are put backe from the inheritance of the kingdome notwithstanding the institutions and manners of the nation kept with such a consent of ages holde the force of a lawe written This is vltimum refugium and the strongest string that Hottoman when all is done can finde to vphold all that controuersie withall â—ut sith that string hath bene so often crackt as we haue seene alreadie by the French owne Chronicles both Hottoman and Bodinus may be now dismissed in good peace for that matter and likewise Danaeus with all due reuerence By whole Caluines Questions about womens gouernment we have discoursed out thus far from our Brethrens Learned discourse upon occasion to answere our Brethren for that they note of S. Paules reprouing the vncomly disorder of womens speaking in the Church of the Corinthians By the which searching after my plaine and ordinarie manner what Caluine Beza and Danaeus said on this matter and at the first chop méeting with such their foresaid arguments I thought it verie necessarie albeit Impar congressus Achilli Troilus yet thus farre forth to oppose my selfe euen to so famous men in these matters Which I haue the rather hazarded my selfe vnto onely least anie scruples of these inuectiues against Womens gouernment might sticke in anie of our Brethr. mindes by mistaking the Apostles words through ouermuch credit of these most famous writers I meane speciallie Caluine Beza and Danaeus If our Brethren shall saie that all this was the more néedlesse sith they which make this Learned discourse doe acknowledge her Maiesties publike and supreame gouernment in the Church of England Would God they did so as they ought to do Then indéed we should not néed these questions but ioyne together in al dutiful obedience vnder God to her Maiesties lawes in these matters But to our grief we sée yea to our shame al the world cries out theron it is not so It is but nice daliance We grant a forme of wordes as we saw both in Caluine a Danaeus we impugne the matter Nowbeit because to our greater griefe we shall yet sée this more more throughout all this Learned Discourse Let vs now returne heare agains our Brethren the Learned Discourses The argument of the 10. Booke THe 10. Booke concerning the Ceremonies of our Church for the fruitfulnesse vse and vrging of them Wether confirmation of children by the Bishop and the churching or solemne thankesgiuing of women after child-birth be vtterlie to be reiected Whether the dead should be buried without anie ceremonie forme of seruice or sermon or presence of the Pastor c. For hot contentions in small matters of a true pastors dutie about the Churches constitutions Of the Pastors authoritie in common with the elders Of the power of order and iurisdiction Of Timothies authoritie of the gouerning Elders authoritie How vnnecessarie and daungerous to the state and magistrates the erecting of these supposed Seniors would be Of the remouing all vsurped authoritie What kind of mastership and office of being greatest Christ allowed and of tyrannizing in the Church Whether all the rules of gouernment and pollicy be set downe and prescribed in Gods worde as the dostrine of faith and precepts of morall life are Whether a Bishop haue any separate authoritie froÌ„ others or the Apostles had any such authoritie and whether Paul deliuered anie such to Timothie Whether his rules to Timothie be generall rules to all Bishops of their authoritie and manner of ordaining Ministers iudging of them Of Paul and Barnabas elections and ordeinings Whether separate authoritie inferre sole and absolute Monarchicall authoritie What regiment Christ left to his church and of his sentence Matth. 18. ver 15. for the consent of the household seruants and whether we should consent vnto our Breth or our brethren to vs in these ceremonies Whether all that consent haue authority that equal Of the difference of the churches and of the Persons authorities in them BY which it is euident that Saint Paules wordes are wreasted of some cleane contrarie to his meaning to make him a patrone of idle if not hurtfull ceremonies maintained more vpon will than reason or graunted of Gods word vnder the coulour of order and decencie not onelie with neglect but also with great hinderance of Gods building by spoiling the Church of so many learned pastors TO applie Saint Paules sentence Let all things bee done according to order to the patronage of hurtfull or of idle ceremonies I graunt were an euident wreasting of his wordes But this would be proued and not sayd onelie that we so doe Wlée haue seene and proued too euidentlie howe our Brethren are ouerbolde to wreast Saint Paules wordes otherwise than either he spake or meant As for vs we maintaine no idle Ceremonies much lesse hurtful If anie such shall be shewed we are as readie as anie our Brethren in all humble and dutiful manner to desire the abolishing of them But wée hope all suth are by law and order alreadie remoued Would God our Br. would remeÌ„ber by whose indeauour they are taken awaie and in thankfulnesse be contented For what ceremonies can they proue are by anie authoritie commaunded to be vsed that are idle and hurtfull Haue we anie at al
wit not onely fayre in shewe nor onely profitable in the aduantagâ—â—ut whether it be a vertuous a iust a true lawfull and righteou◠〈◊〉 yea or no. The contrary whereof to wit vnhonest is not onely â—npleasant or incommodious but vitious vniust false vnlawfull and vnrighteous Of which sort of euill if it were being a matter pertaining not to a fewe persons but to whole estates and of such importance as concerneth gouernment in their greatest and moste necessary affayres it is likely that it shoulde be but disputed vpon of some or rather cried out vpon of all nor to be suffered in any place as contrary to the expresse law of God and to the vniuersall lawe of nature if those places Gen 3.1 Cor. 14. and this 1. Tim. 2. be against it And so by no maner of meanes to be suffered and then indéed had Caluin said the truth that al wise men did alwaies refuse it as a monstrous thing beeing against the Lawe of God and nature But sith those places as we haue prooued Danaeus granteth do not medle therewith and much lesse any other place in all the scripture hath any apparance to condemne it as a dishonest matter can we think that a matter of such moment not onely for the publike state in matters of policy in morall conuersation yea conseruation of mans life and preseruation of Gods Church and withall so often mentioned in the scripture both for the persons and for the office and for the authority of princes publike gouernors that it shoulde haue neuer directly and peremptorily bin forbidden nor haue béene pronounced to bée a thing vnhonest yea rather doth not this silence of the scripture cleare acquite it of all suspition of dishonesty And in very déede albeit some more curious and newfangled than sober or circumspect haue called the honesty thereof in question yet for the most and best and wisest part of men the honesty therof hath not bin called into question but thought to be where there is occasion thereof and that the lawes and customes beare it a good a iust a lawfull a true a right a vertuous honest matter And for proof hereof as Danaeus héere beginneth well if he would in this point so hold out and not yéelde to much to these disputers or not rather giue occasion matter for them to dispute vpon he doth mightely in my opinion confirme the honesty of it in saying that this thing hath place in Spayne England Scotland and diuers other regions For were there no moe regions where the regiment of women as lawful iust right true vertuous and honest hath place but these 3. here specified it is ynough sufficiently to enforce the honesty of it except wee shall vtterlye dishonest all these states which when such regiment hapneth chiefelye vnder GOD depende thereon As our estate dothe nowe in â—ngland and Irelande vnder our moste gratious soueraine Queene Eliâ—abeth And shoulde we nowe admit these certaine or some disputers or any other to haue it called in question whether the state and Lawes of our realme euen in the greatest matter of the gouernment thereof do mainteine a thing that is vnhonest or against the Lawe of God and nature For if it be against these places Gen. 3.1 Corin. 14.1 Tim. 2. or these places against it how is not against the Lawe of God and nature what a perillous matter were this and not onely moste daungerous iniurious dishonest and dissloyall against our lawfull soueraigne by whose happy gouernment God hath so blessed vs and doth so gratiously guide vs and defende vs and so many yeares hath done and shoulde wee nowe call her state and right into so high question by somes disputing if it might not better be called dispiting as whether it were honest or no to her Maiesties more then dishonor besides her ouerthrowe and withall our owne destruction but that also vnder pretence of the Gospell we shoulde mainteine an inconuenience worse than a mischeefe and go about to shatter all the groundes and principles of the Lawe it selfe bothe of the realme yea and of nature for the right and inheritance and call in Question euen in the greatest matter of estate sithe Englande mainteineth the inheritaunce and right of Womens regiment whether it mainteine honesty or dishonesty yea or no and whether her Maiesty and other Women princes in our and these specified regions haue or doe rather rule De facto as vsurpers than de iure as Godly and lawfull princes shoulde we not herein go far beyond the very traytors that oppose theÌ„selues only against the princes persons And what should driue any Questionists to this disputation by reason of this place the first of Timothy the second Chap. Which is but haled and wrested to this regiment Howe much better therefore is it especialle for vs whom so néerely it toucheth that as Danaeus confesseth the honesty and right of Womens regiment hath place heere with vs in Englande So with all obedience ioyfulnesse thankefulnesse and conscience to God to acknowledge the same And not vpon such bious occasions to vndermine it pretending a quarrell against Womens publique teaching which neuerthesse must must needes followe For Looke wherein their regiment consiâ—â—es therein dothe an authoritys of teachinge euen of consequence also followe If our Brethren replye that admitting a Woman to haue supreme gouernment ouer all ecclesiasticall matters so well as ciuill then may shee preach also and minister the Sacramentes I aunswere this obiection which is more fitte for papistes â—han protestantes is but a meere cauil For we say not the prince hath all the gouernment either of all ecclesiasticall matters or ciuill in his or her person to do them or to put theÌ„ in action but the Prince hath a supreme gouernment in his or her dominions next and immediate vnder God onely to ouersée to appoint to giue charge and to commaund that all those matters be duely executed and orderly put in action by all these persons to whome of duty by their functions they appertaine And so the Prince he or she without the breach of S. Paules precept or of the lawe of God may lawfully and with authority both speake and teach euen in the greatest assembly of the congregation For his or her gouernment consisteth as much in the authority of their lawfull commandementes as in any thing else belonging to their supreme regiment And take awaye the right of their so speaking which quickneth and giueth life vnto the lawes politike that they make to wit their roial assent and commanding and ouerthrowe al their gouernment And if this regiment be right and honest in England then was it neuer against the lawe of God and nature in any land And if it be so now then of his owne nature and de iure it was so euer thogh it were not euer so de facto And we haue no cause but to prayse God that Ius factum in this
And yet must these be added to the residue that the Churching or thankesgiuing of women after their child-birth might altogether be omitted and that among the superstitions vsed in buriall no kinde of praying nor preaching should be vsed If preaching be the soules foode who did last forbidde it And besides these thinges what sturre and hote contentions haue béene raysed vp for a number of other thinges which in regarde of preaching though otherwise in their kindes and degrées they be comely and decent yet in that respect may be accounted for small trifles And therfore I would wish our Brethren to take good héede what here they say that they are not to be excused if any for small trifles only rayse vp hote contentions sith this toucheth themselues néerer than they wéene What maketh them to cast foorth these spéeches But that they thinke eyther these matters for which they thus contende are matters of great importaunce or else that not they but we rayse vp suche hote contentions for them And indéede though in their owne nature many of them be indifferent yet being by lawefull authoritie ordeyned to be vsed for publike order and for comelinesse they are become hereby more important than that it may be lawefull to any priuate man at his owne voluntarie to shake them off except by the like lawefull authoritie whereby they were brought in they shall be remooued Yea in this case we are bounde to be hoate for defence of them also so wée excéede not the boundes of Christian charitie both for obedience to the lawefull authoritie that made them and also for the order and comelinesse sake for which they were authorized not to sée them impugned sithe that in the impugning of them not onely the obeyer yéelding to them is defaced but the lawes and Magistrates authoritie in making them is violated and indaungered Wherein although the defenders be hoate yet properly not the defenders but the impugners are indéede the verie raysers of these hoate contentions And therefore by this their owne saying our Brethren are not in this behalfe to be excused but rather with griefe and in charitie be it spoken to be accused yea they accuse in these wordes their owne selues as disturbers of the Churches quiet Neither can they shelter themselues vnder this worde onely saying they raise not vp this hote contentions for small trifles onely but that among their quarells there are some of great importance For let anie of thē be of what importance soeuer they shal be found to be ought they only or not only to raise such hote contentions for any suche small trifles Now as in this point they plainly make themselues not excusable so much more in adding these wordes So haue they much to answere before God that suffer the people of God to lacke the only food of their soules for such humane cōstitutiōs Verily this goeth néerer to the quicke For howsoeuer we may shufle out aunsweres one to another when we shall come to aunswere before God we can not so answere before him For if none should suffer the people of God to lacke the only foode of their soules for such humane constitutions shall our Brethren be excusable that being lawfully called to the office of distributing this only foode of our soules do altogether with drawe themsemselues and that onely if they will afforde them no better title for such humane constitutions But they say the fault is not in them for they would gladly continue in feeding the people of God if they might be suffred Yet doth this their owne saying still make them vnexcusable For séeing they be but such humane constitutions as should be rather suffered than that they should suffer the people of God to lacke the only foode of their soules they suffring this for not suffring the other do invincibly recharge themselues that herein they haue much to aunswere before God If our Brethr. reply that these humane constitutions for which they suffer the people of God as farre as in them lyeth vtterly to lacke the onely foode of their soules be such as by no meanes are sufferable and can not be ioyned with the deliuery of the worde of God this requireth to be better proued than yet it is Which if they can proue then wee must néedes yéeld the fault to be in vs and that we haue much therein to aunswere before God and to crie God heartily mercy and ioyne them And also I hope vpon such proofe euery good man will do But for my part I could neuer yet sée this proued As for any humane constitution that our cōmunion booke and the Eccl. gouernment of our Church of England doth require of them hath bin further by others I also I trust haue euidently sufficiently proued for those that as yet we haue séene that they are none other humane constitutions but such as may well stande with the Pastors feeding the people of God with the onely foode of their foules to wit the word of God And therefore they haue much to aunswere who by their not yéelding to them but rather cleane forsaking the Pastorship cōmitted to them and ministerie of the word and sacraments are the cause their selues that they be not suffred to preach and so suffer the people to lacke the only foode of their soules for thinges which are in comparison farre inferiour matters But to conclude say our Brethren it is the dutie of euerie true Pastor to obserue those things that are concluded by the lawfull authoritie of the Church concerning ceremonial matters for order and comelines sake and for aedification and not to controll publike order by his priuate iudgement but vpon great and waightie causes This is a good conclusion that our Brethren do here make of all these matters But do they not yet sée how flatly withall they conclude against themselues For we are now in hand with ceremoniall matters And the whole Church o◠England hath fully concluded long since that by lawfull authority that these things are to be obserued cōcerning ceremoniall matters for order and comelines sake for aedification What foloweth then But as our Brethr. here do say it is the dutie of euery true Pastor to obserue those thinges and not to controll publike order by his priuate iudgement How then doe our Brethren in controlling and not obseruing those things obserue the dutie of true Pastors Do they think that their iudgement is not priuate iudgement But what is it else For although they were some greater number of Pastors thā they be yet being compared to the lawfull authority of the whole Church of Englande they are but priuate Pastors and their iudgement priuate especially beeing depriued by lawfull authoritie of their Pastorship or rather exauthorating themselues of the ministery Do they think this exception which they reserue for the last cast and place it as a rereward in the end of this conclusion but vpon
great and waightie causes will be a sufficient starting hole to saue all vpright themselues froÌ„ pronouncing the definitiue sentence against themselues that their doing is not the dutie of true Pastors No that will not helpe them For these matters beeing but ceremoniall matters as they call them and so not great and waightie what great waightie causes should moue a true Pastor by his priuate iudgement to controll publike order in those thinges that are concluded by lawefull authoritie of the Church concerning ceremonial matters for order and comlines sake for aedification Shal any priuate man thinke if he think them to be indéede the Church of God that the Churches concluding of those thinges by lawefull authoritie proceeded not of greater and waightier causes than his controllment And therefore except men shall make so litle light account of the true Church of God and of her conclusions and orders by lawefull authoritie as to preferre euerie priuate mans or Pastors priuate iudgement before hers our Brethren by this their owne conclusion must either néedes yéeld to the Church of Englandes publike conclusion and lawfull authoritie concerning these ceremoniall matters that they are to be obserued for order and comelines sake and for aedification as the Church of England hath decréed them and not to controll publike order by priuate iudgement or else let our Brethr. herken to their owne conclusiue sentence and determination that they do not the dutie of true Pastors And thus much also for these ceremonies We haue hetherto intreated of the proper dutie of a Pastor himselfe now it followeth that we likewise set foorth his authoritie in common gouernement with the Elders But least any man should mistake that which we purpose to say of his authoritie we haue need to expresse what we meane by this worde authoritie For euen those things that we haue shewed before to be the dutie of a Pastor may also be called his authoritie as to preach and teach wherein is included his authoritie to forgiue and reteine sinnes Also his authoritie to minister the sacraments and to doe other thinges in the Church which none may doe but he But in this place we vnderstande authoritie for power of gouernement in the Church Whereof the Apostle speaketh that it is one of the graces and giftes of God necessarie for the building of his Church This authority of regiment we haue declared that it ought not to be a Lordly ruling neither ouer their flocke nor yet ouer their fellow seruants and brethren and least of all that they ought to haue dominion or Lordship ouer the faith of the Church Our Brethren here promise to sette foorth that part of the Pastors authoritie which they say he hath not of the proper dutie of a Pastor himselfe but in common gouernement with the Elders But because these wordes as they are grounded on the presupposall of that Eldershippe which they make one part of their Ecclesiasticall Tetrarchie not dealing with the woorde so promising â—o treate of the authoritie of the Pastor in common gouernement they séeme their selues to doubt that except they should expounde what they meane thereby it might easily bee mistaken what they meant Neither doubt they this mistaking without a cause which of purpose shunne the plaine and vsuall approoued distinction of the authoritie or power of the order and of the iurisdiction But what-so-euer authoritie of the Pastor they will nowe sette foorth and make playne what they meane thereby when as they faye For euen those thinges which wee haue shewed before to be the dutie of a Pastor may also bee called his authoritie as to preache and teach wherein is included his authoritie to forgiue and retaine sinnes if this authoritie of the Pastor to forgiue and retayne sinnes bee included in his authoritie of preachinge and teaching and withall this bee a thing appertaining to the proper dutie of a Pastor himselfe as also is his authoritie to minister the Sacramentes and to doe other thinges in the Churche which none may doe but hee then haue not the Elders to deale in the authoritie of forgiuing and retayning sinnes For if they shoulde they shoulde intermeddle with the worde For this is included in preaching and teaching But our Brethren exclude the gouerning Elders from preaching and teaching therefore withall they exclude them from the authoritie of forgiuing and retayning sinnes And this by the way is not vnnecessarie to bee héere obserued because afterwarde they giue authoritie of forgiuing and retayning sinnes vnto the gouerning Elders which they confesse are not Teachers nor Preachers nor dealers at all with the worde But doeth not this authoritie of the Pastor belong to iurisdiction And therefore not onely the authoritie of his order to which properly preaching and teaching and ministring the Sacramentes doe appertayne but the authoritie also of iurisdiction to which the power of forgiuing and retayning sinnes appertayneth is the proper dutie of the Pastor himselfe which none may doe but he and is an authoritie separate from that his authoritie which is in common gouernment with the Elders or with any other which are not Pastors in the Church And as for that power of gouernment in the Church whereof the Apostle speaketh 1. Cor. 12.28 That it is one of the graces and gifte of God necessarie for the building of his Church S. Paule maketh not all the graces and giftes of God which there he speaketh of necessarie for the building of his Church if we speake of such perpetuall necessitie as that the Church can neuer be without them For S. Paul reckoneth vp there great offices graces and giftes of God that are not necessarie in that sense As euen the first office that he beginneth there withall of Apostles besides the giftes of healinges the giftes of powers or of working mightie myracles and the gifts of diuerse kinds of languages All which are not now so necessary in our dayes nor many hundreth yeres sithence to the building of Gods Church Neither is it agréeed vppon by the best interpreters what manner of grace and gift of God this power of gouernment in the Church was which S. Paule in that place speaketh of For albeit Beza say he declareth the order of Elders that were keepers of the Discipline and policie Ecclesiasticall yet sayth Aretius it is a politicall facultie of administring the common weale and of ruling others commodiouslie and of conseruing them in order which gift is necessarie in Magistrates And while the Churche wanted a politique Magistracie certaine choosen Elders gouerned the assemblyes of the faithfull as it were an ordinarie Magistracie Héere in déede hée sayeth this gifte is necessarie but he addeth in whome to witte in Magistrates and yet he specifieth in what kinde of Magistrates to witte politicall and in the administring of the common wealth not the Ecclesiastical discipline And withall he limiteth a time how long this gift of
diuers peoples are gathered together into one bodie with the same things also we beleeue that they are conserued being vnited and do more and more growe together Sith therefore the gathering together of the Church is not made nor conserued properly by ceremonies but by the holy Ghost but by the word but by faith but by charitie but by obseruance of the commaundements of God we doubt not but that also by the same things the vnitie thereof is to be reteyned and cherished When as the Apostle also to the Ephesians where he treateth of the vnitie of the Church teacheth that it consisteth in these things no mention being made of ceremonies In the meane season we denie not but that vnitie euen in ceremonies themselues and in the rites of euerie Church so farre-foorth as by conscience it may be done is to be reteyned and to be reuerenced For there are two kyndes of thyngs wherein the vnitie of the Church may bee the things that are deliuered in the word of God and the things that are not expressed in the word such as are many externall rytes and ceremonies Ecclesiasticall In those things deliuered in the word we beleeue that vnitie euery where and alwayes is very necessary but in these things although by it selfe it be not necessarie but that according to the diuersitie of places and according to the diuers coÌ„sideration of the time it is profitable to haue diuers rites notwithstanding where any thing concerning these matters is ordeyned and receyued for the edification of the Church there we thinke that vnitie also in such kinde of rites is of euerie bodie to be reteyned and the orders Ecclesiasticall are not to be disturbed According to the Apostles rule all things in the Church ought to be done in order decently and to edification of which matters we do very greatly allow and embrace the two Epistles of Augustine written to Ianuarius The wisedome of the Synode therefore ought to haue such regard of all Churches that they haue speciall respect to euery one Héere is all of the wisedome of the Synode but nothing of the authoritie of the Magistrate of the Synodes such regarde of all Churches and speciall respect to euery one that to the Christian Magistrate there is héere neyther any regard nor respect had or mentioned eyther generall or speciall is this the wisedome and equall dealing of our Brethren betwéene the Magistrate and the Synode for this authoritie Howbeit this also is not true that for the speciall respect to euery one the Decree of the Synode in one Prouince may not runne in generall alike to all the Churches in that one Prouince For if euery one Church in one Prouince may varie from another the same may be sayd by as good reason of euery person in euery one Church Also that the Synode should haue a speciall respect of euery one of them and so in deede our Brethrens words may be vnderstood saying not to euery one Church but to euery one so that euery one differing from another it were best to make no Decree at all but let euery man do as he best liked hand ouer head without any order of vniformitie in ceremonies at all and so to make short and to be partiall to neyther partie to cut off all authoritie quite and cleane both from Magistrate and Synode in these matters and let all be fans caeremonies as the French saith Wherein we of long time in England haue beene caried away with an vntrue principle that vniformitie must be in all places and things alike as though we would feede olde men and sucking infants all with one kinde of meates or as though we would cloath all ages in a robe of one assize and that which is more absurd compell men of ripe age to sucke the dugge to weare their biggins and to carrie rattles and other childish bables If our Brethren by this long time in England meane the time since we haue God be praysed for it receyued the light and libertie of the Gospell then is not this true that heere they say we haue beene caried away with an vntrue principle that vniformitie must be in all places and things alike for we prescribe not to all places nor preiudicate any other Churches that are not in nor off the state of the Churches in England and Ireland neyther yet all of them but that in some things also according to their customes and priuiledges they may differ concerning these ceremoniall constitutions from the generall vniformitie of our Churches But were it lawfull for euerie particular Church in England to alter the ceremonies decreed in our nationall Synodes according to their pleasure or opinion to what purpose neede any Synode at all to be troubled about these or what authoritie at all hath a Synode to make any ceremoniall constitutions if the particular Churches of that nation be not bound vniformally to kéepe them They say that the vniformitie of these things is as though we would feede old men and sucking infants all with one kind of meate Although this similitude â—itteth not their purpose sith it is against or aboue nature for sucking infants to feede on all such kinde of meate as old men can do neyther are these ceremoniall constitutions fet foorth for the soules of the weake and simple people to feede vpon in stead of Gods word or that they should receyue them as any part or substance of their soules nourishment and substance as the meate is that the infants feede vpon yet notwithstanding in the very point indéede wherein our Brethren should applie it if they will applie it at all any thing aptly to the purpose it makes cleane against them For although sucking infants can not feede on all kinde of meate that old men can yet old men can feede well ynough on all such kind of meate as sucking infants can for all they can feede on other stronger meates besides And therefore if our Brethren will needes compare these Ceremonies vnto the meate of the weake although they be ordeyned to farre other vses both for the weake and for the strong also yet why may not the strong feede on them in their kindes so well as the weake may for all they can disgest stronger meate for though the old men feede thereon in another manner and not in sucking the dugge as sucking infants do yet for the meate it selfe which is the milke they may be fedde both of them wellynough with one kinde of meate and many a good old man and yong too will not thinke himselfe ill dealt withall to haue euery morning for his breakfast as good a messe of milke as euen a sucking infant also for the proportion of his strength may feede vpon Sainct Paule writâ—ng to the Corinthians sayth 1. Cor. â— ver 1. I could not speake vnto you Brethren as vnto spirituall men but as vnto carnall euen as vnto babes
as wee may generally call it also his office too yet the office occupation or function ceaseth not in him and if nowe it may bee thus in so manie other offices which notwithstanding take all their denomination euen of the action and exercise of them and of the charge or dutie therein required why may it not and much more be thus in the order or office of the minister Doth his office cease if he be put from his place where he was first appointed to minister If his office should cease with the place then could hee minister in no other place Nay then were hee no minister at all anye longer so that turne him out of his place and turne him cleane out of his ministry if he be preferred to an other place he must be made minister again And is worse then as Chancer saith A Monke out of his cloyster is not worth an oyster for a monke is a monke still but the minister is become no minister and so all his preaching and ministring of the sacraments are a laye mans actions and not a ministers and by their owne consequence no sacraments at all if he do these things where his charge and flocke is not And in deede some of our Bretheren beginne to bée so precise that thinke it scarse lawefull to preach except it bée in their owne proper charges though they bée orderly requested thereunto but they neede not to bée squemish by this rule for there they are not Ministers at all if they do it Now if the office of the ministerie it selfe cease not with the altering of the place where they had a charge much lesse doth the institution and entrie into the office of the ministrie which is the ordeyning or geuing of orders depend vpon or require the necessitie of a place as it doth in the office of a Churchwarden or Counstable or in the offices that haue locall honours and dignities annexed to the degrees or to the offices of them as in Kinges Dukes Earles Lordes c. For these offices beginne togither with the places and charges annexed vnto them but in all the offices of ministrie it is not so And if our Bretheren will so vrge it let them looke to it their selues For I suppose that some of them if I take not my markes amisse and those too whom otherwise I reuerence and honour had not prouisions of place and charge of flocke committed vnto them at their verie first receiuing of their orders but perhaps taried some pretie while after and yet I hope they make account that they were ministers beefore Yea had they not bin ministers at all before and that tryed to bée both learned and presupposed to bée meete men they had not bin capable of those places and Charges And if I should goe further what one of our Bre. were not made simply ministers of the word and sacraments and not ministers condicionall as the ministers of this or of that place charge or flocke although it might bée some of them were alreadye prouides for in that béâ—halfe but their taking of orders or office of the ministrie it selfe dependeth not theron which it muste haue done were the place a parte and that a necessarie parte of the office They say that this their learned discourse is a breefe plaine declaration concerning the desires of all those faithfull ministers that haue do seeke for the Discipline and reformation of the Churche of Englande But if this bee one of the poyntes they desire and seeke for then they desire and seeke for that which ouerthrowes both their owne ministerye and their faithfulnessâ— too For if this rule be true then are they no faythfull ministers nor ministers at all hauing receaued the orders of ministery otherwise than their selues desire seeke for and prescribe that other should doe But they not considering this goe forwarde from their examples of Churchwarden and Constable to prooue it somewhat more Clerke-like For saye they the name of a Pastor Elder or Ouerseer is the name of an office in Act and Esse bicause it is a proper relatiue and not a potentiall ability in the cloudes Are all potentiall abilities in the Cloudes But our brethren were disposed heere to speake in cloudes and to tell the people of offices in Act and Esse of proper relations and of potentiall abilities be like bicause they woulde the worlde shoulde well vnderstande that this is for sooth a learned discourse howbeit all this discourse here is but of the names of this order or office of the ministerye But be they relatiues as proper as they will and the relation also in Act and Esse as they terme it yet doth it not follow that this actuall and essentiall relation must be so strictly related to a place where hée must bée a Pastor or Elder or Ouerseer that hée cannot bée made the Pastor Elder or Ouerseer till hée come thither his selfe and excercise the office actually for if there bée no potentiall abilitye but onely the verye Act and Esse thereof to be considered in the office of a Pastor Elder or ouerseer then is hée not a Pastor Elder or Ouerseer till hée doe feede or teache them gouerne them and ouersee them actually But if heée bée not the Pastor till he come actually his selfe to doe these actions among them then is all the action aforesayde in the Synode fustrate except they goe all home with him and ordaine him onely then and there when and where he must doe the thinges in act and esse that the name of his office hath relation vnto For say they the name of a Pastor Elder or ouerseer is the name of an office in act and Esse bicause it is a proper relatiue and not a potentiall abilitie in the Cloudes Is not this a proper valiance on the name of Pastor and to make it a proper relatiue doe they not make it withall a proper office Yea sée whereunto by this nice valiance on these names and termes this office will come and all bicause it may in no wise suffer a potentiall abilitie And whie so forsooth for feare it would vapour up by and by into the cloudes but admitte this to be true and then it presentlye followeth that when soeuer the officer ceaseth from the very act and doeing of his office as both vppon many occasions hée may sometimes doe and of naturall necessitye he must oftentimes do so often doth he cease to be a Pastor Elder or Ouerseer But because they stand upon these 3. names Pastor Elder and Ouerseer which they make all relatiues alike and to haue like relation unto an office in act and esse For the Esse it is an other matter if they meane the being of the office For assone as the office hath begun his esse or being then his esse or being continueth still in the office in all these 3. names thereof although the act in all
which before they had receaued â—s wée haue heard Caluines prescription Epist. 373. and so continued still in the office or ministery thus repurged And therefore since the masse was taken away and all â—he other corruptions of the Ministerie that were vsed in the popish priesthood an other Ministration appointed as is sette downe in our booke of publike prayer by the godly lawes of the realme and Church of England established which was done so soone as conueniently it could be done forthwith after her Maiesties moste happy entrance into this kingdome this is not truly sayd that the popish priesthood being the greatest blasphemie that euer was was alowed for a lawfull Ministerie vntill by the godly meaning of the sayd parliament Anno. 13. some brande-marke of shame was sette vppon it As though the sacrificing Priesthoode had continued with allowance therof for thirteene yere together of the Queenes Maiesties raigne which was as long a time as before they mencioned for the inforcing of the ministers to studie Yea by this rule it continueth still though disallowed or rather as they say but noted onely with a brand-marke of shame set vpon it So that this is not the taking of it awaye but the continuing of it with more shame to the parliament and to all the states of the Realmâ— that haue marked it with a brand-marke of shame and yet shame not to continue it though we disallow it And this withall is but a shamefull and vnreuerent terme that here they vse in calling eyther the statute or the booke of articles agreed vppon by all the clergie of the Churche of England and approued in the high courte of parliament by al the states of the realme and by the statute commaunded to be read a brand-marke of shame But our brethren to mittigate the matter say the parliament had a godly meaning in making that statute for Priestes that had bin made in the tyme of Popery to professe their consent to the true doctrine agreed vpon in the booke of articles by their publike reading of the same booke in their benefices Yea verily the parliament had therein a very godly meaning and it was also as godly an act â—s meaning of the parliament But saye they how pitifullye that authority was abused which by the same statute was committed to the Bishops in allowing of Priestes that came to doe their pennance by negligence of the Bishops and bribery of their officers the country cryeth out of it and the state of the Church is little amended by it There is no such crying out in the country as are these outcries of our brethren If it be but little amended yet little is somewhat But if it bee not greate that is not to be unputed to the good lawe but to the euill and indirect accidents For it was not pitifull that that authority was committed to the Bishops in allowing of Priestes that came not as our brethren here say to doe their pennance or to haue a brand-marke of shame set vpon them but the statute it selfe more reuerently and rightly setteth downe the cause and order of their act saying That the Churches of the Queenes Maiesties dominions maye bee serued with Pastors of sound religion be it enacted by the authority of this present Parliament that euerye person vnder the degree of a Byshop which doth or shall pretende to be a priest or Minister of gods holy worde and Sacramentes by reason of anye other fourme of institution consecration or ordeyning than the forme set foorth by Parliament in the tyme of the late King of most worthye memorye King Edwarde the sixte or now vsed in the raigne of our moste gratious Soueraigne Ladye before the feaste of the Natiuitie nexte following shall in the presence of the Bishop or gardian of the spiritualties of some one diocoese where he hath or shall haue ecclesiasticall liuing declare his assent and subscribe to all the articles of religion which onely concerne the confession of the true Christian Faith and the doctrine of the SacrameÌ„ts comprised in a booke imprinted intituled Articles wherupoÌ„ it was agreed by the Archbish. Bish. of both prouinces the whole Clergy in the Conuocation holden at London in the yeare of our lorâ— God 1562. According to the computation of the Church of england for the auoyding of the diuersities of opinions and for the establishing of consent touching true Religion put forth by the Queenes Authoritye And shall bring from suche B. or gardian of Spiritualties in wryting vnder his Seale authentike and testimoniall of such assent subscription openly on some Sonday in the time of publike seruice afore noone in euery church wher by reasoÌ„ of any Ecc liuing he ought to atteÌ„d reade both the said Testimoniall the said articles vpon paine that euery such persoÌ„ which shal not before the said feast do as is aboue appointed shall be ipso facto depriued al his Eccl. promotions shal be voyd as if he then were naturally dead These are the very words of the statute Wherein what could they better haue prouided than whatsoeuer they should ordeyne for the bringing of those persons to the more sure confession and consent of sound Religion firste to come before the Bishoppe or the Gardian of the â—pirituall iurisdiction in the Bishops vacancie in some one Diocoese where hee had any ecclesiasticall promotion or liuing and there before him declare his consent and also subscribe to all the articles of religion which onelye concerne the confession of the true Christian Faith c. Before whom should he haue done this if he should doe it authentically than before the Bishop or the bishops gardian being the publike officers that haue competent authority ouer him in those matters which withall confuteth our brethrens equall authority of all Pastors If the bishops were negligent or the officers take bribes this was the bishops the officers fault not any default in the lawes Wise men should not doe like WilliaÌ„ Summer strike one for another But if the bishops negligence and the bribery of the officers be so great that the countrye cryeth out of it and the state of the Church is little amended it is then so much the easier to be knowne who are the offenders that so pitifâ—lly abused this godly meaning of the statute that authority committed to them and not they to be thus disorderly cried out vpon and that in this vncharitable maner by inuectiue libelles vnder the tytle of learned discourses to be thus discoursed vpon with taunts slaunders defamed to all the worlde so much as lyes in them If the matter be little amended this is not to amend it more but to make it worse for this is naught worth but to norishe malice suspitioÌ„ sclaunder yet the fault not knowne much lesse ameÌ„ded Let the negligence briberies with true desire of reformation as the title of this learned discourse pretendeth
and conuersation Me thinkes rather wee might bee glad to haue some such Chauncellors or Lawyers amongst vs because of their better experience in Ecclesiasticall regiment and in deuising lawes orders and decrees than wee our selues are so well able to conceiue whose onely or principall profession is Diuinitie But say they of these Chauncellors and other Lawyers which being meere lay men and vnlearned in Diuinitie by their own lawe ought to be no members of the Synode If they spared not before to call them popish and prophane no meruell if they call them mere lay men and vnlearned in Diuinitie But see here the indifferencie of these our learned Bretheren When they speake of their gouerning Elders in euery congregation they forsooth are not laye men but persons and officers Ecclesiasticall Although they bee Gentlemen Marchants Artizanes Farmers Husbandmen or what trade soeuer These are forsooth no meere laye men but Presbyters Priestes or Elders And who made them so The Pastor and the Parish haue chosen them to this office And can their choyse make a meere lay man not to be a meere lay man and cannot the choyse of all the Pastors in a whole shire nor the approbation of the whole prouinciall Synode make a Chauncellor or other Lawyer to be no meere lay man in respect of the Ecclesiasticall office that they chose him vnto as well as could that particular Parish or congregation Yea but say they these Chauncellors and other Lawyers they are vnlearned in Diuinitie I meruell that our Bretheren euen for very shame would haue euer obiected this vnto them knowing what great learned men many of their Seniours must needes fall out to bee in many Parishes whom their late olde sir Iohn lacke latine would soone appose for he yet at least could reade his Articles but they could not reade a letter on the booke And yet these men because they bee Seniours must bee counted learned in Diuinitie and how got they on a suddayne all this learning by inspiration with the election of them to the Seniorie or came it by vertue of their Eldership As though learning in Diuinitie were euen tyed to their Consistory As for Chauncellors and other Lawyers Ciuill or Canon for I take it that they speake not so much of the Temporal Lawyers these are meere lay men and vnlearned in Diuinitie What a straunge and high concâ—yte is this of themselues still boasting in the toppe of euery leafe of their learned discourse and often of their graue wise and godly Seniours with contempt of others if they fauour not their deuises bee they neuer so learned men If they say though they bée learned men yet in other things not in diuinitie Is it not more likely that they bee or may bee farre more learned in Diuinitie too professing the studie that is euen next vnto Diuinitie and in a great parte consisteth on Diuinitie than those Temporall men that are altogether or for the most parte trayned vp in worldly matters and in mechanicall occupations and haue little minde or leisure and lesse helpes of fearing to imploye themselues in any deepe studie in Diuinitie yea many of them vtterly vnlearned What a greate vanitie is in this dealing And yet these saye they meaning Chauncelors and other Lawyers will beare the greatest sway in all things in our Synodes These beare little sway GOD knowes and it is apparant at most no more than doth any other particular man in them But in their Synodes though they speake cleane contrary therein vnto themselues yet these their lay rather than Ecclesiasticall Elders either should beare the greatest sway of gouernment or let them lay aside the prerogatiue of this name of Gouernours which title they make more peculier to them than either to the Doctors or to the Pastors But now after the Chauncellors Lawyers which in our Conuocations or generall Synode are very fewe amongst vs except withall they be Ministers of the worde and Sacraments or els Deacons our Bretheren must here there is no remedie haue yet another fling at the Bishops The Bishops say they as though they were greater than the Apostles must haue their seuerall conuenticle If the Bishoppes haue a lawfull superiour dignitie more than the other Priestes or pastorall Elders haue as before at large is prooued why maye they not also haue a superiour place seuerall by themselues to consult vppon matters that are meetest to bee propounded in the whole Synode Doth it therefore followe herevppon that they take vppon them to bee greater than the Apostles or but comparable to them What a friuolous argument is this but what reason haue they for it Whereas say they the Apostles came together with the whole multitude Nay soft Bretheren put vp these words agayne for this time and place with the whole multitude in your purse Adde not to the text The words are these Act. 15. vers 6. Then the Apostles and Elders came together to looke to this matter I graunt he nameth afterward all the multitude ver 12. And yet it seemeth that he ment there none other but all the multitude of the Apostles and Elders that he sayde before vers 6. did come together Although afterward for the sending of chosen men to carrie their decree it is sayd vers 22. that it seemed good to the Apostles and Elders with the whole Church although the whole multitude of the whole Church came not together about that controuersie But it may appeare the Apostles and the other Elders with the multitude were so in one place together that neuerthelesse Luke testifieth Acts. 5. vers 13. saying and of the other meaning besides the Apostles no man durst ioyne himselfe to them And therefore if our Bishoppes haue their seuerall conuenticle or place of comming together by themselues what haue they therein that the Apostles also had not and yet it followeth not that if the Apostles had no seuerall conuenticle or meeting together that they make themselues greater than the Apostles or make any comparison of greatnesse with them But they acknowledge themselues farre inferiour as in giftes so in dignitie also of their function Yea in the order of their Pastorall Eldershippe or Priesthood it selfe they acknowledge themselues to bee but equall and and all one euen the greatest of them not onely with the meanest in the conuocation but with the poorest Priest in Englande Albeit in respect of their lawfull superiour dignities they may well haue a superiour and seuerall conuenticle or meeting place notwithstanding oftentymes both they and all the residue of the conuocation doe ioyntly also in one place assemble altogether And as they are seuered say they in place so will they bee higher in authoritie And good reason too sith as wee haue seene it is not in respect of any higher authoritie in the order of the Eldership but of their higher authoritie of iurisdiction in the Ecclesiasticall regiment So that whatsoeuer say they