Oxford-Oath in the Act of Confinement and the Subscription in the Act of Vniformity M. I have told you fully before Not because we differ in Doctrine but in expounding the words of that Oath and Subscription 2. Were neither Arch-bishop Abbot nor his Clergy nor the Parliaments of those times of the Church of England as well as Sâ—bthorp and Mainwaring Were not the Laws made by those Parliaments made by the Members if not Representatives of the Church of England You know that our late great Defenders of the Church describe the Church of England to be those that Worship God according to the Law And were the Parliaments that made those Laws none of the Church themselves Chillingworth would not Subscribe without a limitting Profession Was he therefore none of the Church Was Bishop Bilson none of the Church Was R. Hooker none of the Church The first dedicated his Book to Queen Elizabeth and the latter is Dedicated to our King Charles the second and Praised by his Father And yet the Author of the Holy Common-wealth hath larglier than any man confuted Hooker's Popular Principles When William Barclay a Lawyer defended the King of France his Temporal Power against the Popes Usurpation of a Power to depose and restrain him he is fain to profess that the contrary opinion was so common that he was taken to speak some strange and singular thing And yet none doubts but he was of the same Church of Rome I again challenge you to name that point in which we differ in this Doctrine from the true Church of England L. You hold that Kings may be resisted by Arms. M. Not so much as the aforesaid Bishop and Doctors of the Church of England did or the Parliaments that made church-Church-Laws Again See our second Plea for Peace how far we disclaim it I profess that I am acquainted with no meer Non-Conformist Ministers that hold it at all lawful for Subjects to resist the King or any Supream Power by a War except in case that he notoriously declareth that he will if he can destroy the Common-wealth or deliver it up to a foreigner or destroyer that hath no right L. Sure the cry would never be for Extirpating the Dissenters for this Plot and their disloyalty if they were not guilty M. Nay if that be your argument Strangers to them say they are disloyal and guilty ergo they are so I leave you to God's answer for I will not undertake to answer you But will you use Sobriety a little further 1. It is now twenty seven years since they were ejected and cast out of maintenance and countenance and left to beg or crave their bread Long have they been laid in Gaols and fined deeply the Law laying on them twenty and forty pound a Sermon Their Goods Beds Books taken from them and they left destitute How many in all these years have ever been accused and proved guilty of one disloyal or seditious Sermon or Word I know of none Certainly it was not for want of will in the Accusers Those that by Oaths have brought them under Convictions and Warrants for distress of five ten and much more forfeitures even divers hundred pounds at once before they were ever summoned to speak for themselves would sure have sworn some disloyal Words against them had they been able And can many hundred Ministers have a fuller proof of their innocency than that they had no such prosecution twenty seven years from such a sort of Adversaries in so great Sufferings 2. And now this Plot is detected It is divers Months since and many Countries and Corporations have accused the Dissenters of it and cry them down to Extirpation And to this day I cannot hear of any one English Minister or at most not of two that is either an Episcopal or Presbyterian Non-Conformist so much as accused or named as guilty The French and Dutch Churches in London are Dissenting Presbyterians Yet no man accuseth any of them for being in Plots and yet must they also be destroyed But Sir if any one or more of the Episcopal or Presbyterian Non-Conformists Ministers or People had been found guilty would you condemn thousands or any of the guiltless for their sakes On what account Is it for their Relation to them They are mostly strangers to one another Come and let us try your rule of Justice I. Is there any Relation nearer than that of Father and Son And can any Minister be supposed to have more interest in or influence on his Hearers than a Father hath on his Son And you know that the chief man accused is the Kings eldest Son I hope you will not for this charge the King as if he principled him for Treason against himself Nor as if he were to suffer for his Sons faults II. The Judges have oft declared that many Iesuits and Papists were Plotters and Traitors and they died for it I hope you will not make all Papists guilty of their crime nor extirpate them for it And yet the Papists are Conventicling Dissenters too III. The Lords and great Men accused of this Plot and Treason how justly God knoweth were of the Church of England and shall all the Church of England be destroyed for their sakes Dr. Whitby and others now blamed by the Oxford-Convocation and Bishop Bilson Mr. Hocker c. were of the Church of England and shall all the English Clergy be accused of their words IV. Many of the accused were Hobbists and Infidels and some common ill-living Protestants Shall all the Hobbists and Infidels and ill-living Protestants be extirpated for their faults V. Many Gentlemen of some late Parliaments are accused not yet tried and proved guilty Shall all the Parliament-men therefore be extirpated as guilty VI. Some Lawyers and Students at Law are accused Shall all Lawyers and Students therefore be extirpated VII Divers of the Nobility are accused Must all Noble-men be therefore reproached VIII Some that have been of the Kings Privy Council were accused Is his Council therefore to be disgraced or destroyed IX Formerly many Judges have been guilty Are Judges therefore to be dishonoured X. By this justice you may next conclude They were Englishmen that were accused therefore let all English-men be rooted out Or they were Protestants and Christians therefore away with all Protestants and Christians Whereas I think it an unjust conclusion that because they were Irish-men and Papists that murdered two hundred thousand in Ireland therefore root out all Irish-men and Papists unless you will inferr They are men that commit all sin therefore root out mankind If it had been men that hate serious Godliness and are the seed of the Serpent and of Cain that are at deadly enmity to the true fear of God and thirst for the blood of the innocent that are accused of this Plot and if People had petitioned to have all this sort of men rooted out for it it would have fallen on more than you and I are willing to name or
place in the Ministry without Presbyters Ordination and who then durst not be twice Ordained And for Churchmen that must be strictly Religious to suffer on such terms I cannot speak against But we secular men think these too little things to suffer for M. If your consciences can call such prophanation of Gods Name such condemnation of Protestant Churches such strengthening the hands of a little thing they shall be no measure for our consciences For we believe that we must die and that there is a God and a righteous final Judgment CHAP. VI. II. Of the Covenant and Oath of Canonical Obedience to our Ordinary or Bishop L. WHat harm is there in your promising or swearing obedience to your Ordinary in things Lawful and Honest. What a man should do he should not refuse to swear or promise M. I will first tell you the words imposed and then I will state the Controversie and then I will tell you our Reasons The Words at Ordination are these 1. On Deacons and Priests Will you reverently obey your Ordinary and other chief Ministers to whom is committed the Charge and Government over you following with a glad Mind and Will their godly Admonitions and submitting your selves to their godly Iudgments Answ. I will so do the Lord being my help The Form of the Oath which they use to impose is this Ego A. B. Iuro quod praestabo Veram Canonicum Obedientiam Episcopo Londinensi ejusque successoribus in omnibus licitis honestis And little know we of What Religion their Successors will be or who will have the choosing of them I 'le not swear to I know not who The Bishops themselves also must take this Oath of due Obedience to the Arch-bishop In the Name of God Amen I N. chosen Bishop of the Church and See of N. do profess and promise all due reverence and obedience to the Arch-Bishop and to the Metropolitan Church of N. and to their Successors So help me God through Iesus Christ. L. What is your Controversie against any of this M. 1. We do not question the duty of obeying the King and all his Officers governing as Magistrates by the power of the Swords which the King may commit to them If Bishops or Lay Chancellors be made Magistrates we will obey them as such And therefore when they summon us we appear and answer because the King authorizeth them And many Non-conformists have defended the taking the Promise as supposing that the Word Ordinary signifieth only the Judge of a Court set up by the King as Supream Governor by the Sword in matters and over persons Ecclesiastical as well as Civil according to the true sence of the Oath of Supremacy 2. We do not refuse to promise and swear due Obedience to such as are our Lawful Pastors ruling the Church by the power of the Keys according to the Word of God Though we think that requiring such Oaths is an irregularity in them against the ancient Canons and a farr higher presumption than the Independents Covenant 3. We do not deny a patient and quiet submission to unlawful persons and acts of Government not owning their sin our selves and doing no evil at their command But these are the things which we are not satisfied in I. Obedience hath essential Relation to the Laws and Mandates of those that we obey And the Canons of England are the Laws by which they openly profess to Rule the Church And therefore they call it the Oath of Canonical Obedience that is of obeying the Church Government according to the Canons And when we know the Canons before-hand we know what Government and Obedience is meant And we swear fraudulently if we take not the Oath in the sence of the Imposers And they commonly tell us that this is the meaning of Due Obedience and if Godly Admonitions or in licitis honestis be put in that doth but suppose that Obedience according to the Canons is Godly and licitum honestum and not that we are left to choose which Canons we will obey All Bishops I doubt not will stand to this Exposition of the sence Now there are abundance of things in the Canons which we think to be greater sins than we think meet to call them II. We know that the Rule of the Bishops is by Chancellors Courts and other such where Lay-men exercise the Church Keys by Decretive Excommunications and Absolutions which wise men think to be sacrilegious Usurpation and a Prophanation of a dreadful part of Christs Government And Lawyers and Civilians tell us that the word Ordinary signifieth the appointed Ordinary Judge of the Court and so that we swear or Covenant to obey Lay-Civilians using the Keys And other chief Ministers can mean no less than all the Archdeacons Officials Commissaries Surrogates c. whom we covenant to obey not in civil things or the circa Sacra belonging to Magistrates which we refuse not but in the exercise of the Church Keyes III. They that think they have fully proved that Diocesans Ruling many hundred Churches without any Bishops under them are an Office in Specie contrary to Gods Word and the practice of the Primitive Church and that it corrupteth or excludeth true Church Discipline do think it a sin to conform by an Oath of Allegiance or Obedience to them though they live peaceably under them IV. They that think that by Scripture and Reason and Universal Church Customs and Canons they are no Bishops or Pastors that come in by Magistrates without the Election or consent of the Flocks and Clergy think that to swear Obedience to them is to be guilty of their Usurpation These four be the things refused in this Oath and Covenant of Obedience L. And what have you against obeying according to the Canon M. I. You may gather it from the foregoing enumeration of the Canonical Impositions Many things of a heinouser nature than Liturgies Ceremonies or things Indifferent 1. We dare not obey an Order for Excommunication according to the 4th Canon against any man that affirmeth that the Book of Cammon-Prayer containeth any thing in it that is repugnant to the Scriptures Judge that by the proof that I shall anon give 2. The same I say of the Excommunication in Can. 5 6 7 8. and many others which are after to be particularly mentioned 3. And there are many things in the Canons which we dare not practice and therefore dare not swear Canonical Obedience L. That Oath doth not oblige you to approve of all that is in the Canons no more than a Iustices Oath to execute the Laws doth bind him to approve of or execute every Law. M. We would not be guilty of an over rigorous Exposition But had it been in the days of Queen Mary when the Six Articles and other Lawes for Murdering Innocents were on foot and were actually expounded by Execution I would not have been one of the Justices that should have sworn to execute them Though a Justice
nor to refuse or delay to baptize in private in case of danger who ever desireth him to do it 2. The Twenty nine Canon saith No Parent shall be urged to be present nor be admitted to answer as Godfather for his own Child Nor any Godfather or Godmother shall be suffered to make any other answer or speech than by the Book of Common-Prayer is prescribed in that behalf The Parent may say what he will to God in secret But at the Christening of his Child if he should but say I believe God's promise to the faithful and their seed I do devote my Child to Christ and engage him in his Covenant or I promise to educate him to Christianity he breaketh the Canon and goeth against the Churches Law. I did before the Bishops at the Savoy 1661. put the case to them thus without fiction An Infidel of my Parish that useth openly to talk against the Scripture and Life to come to avoid inconveniencies resolveth to send his Child to be baptized and I must not refuse it by the Law Hath the Child right to Baptism and is it undoubtedly saved Dr. Sanderson in the Chair answered nemime contradicente that if he brought him with Godfathers according to the Church of England I need not doubt it But there were but two in the Parish that openly declared themselves to be of his opinion and those two being his familliers are likest to be the Godfathers If the Child have not Right for Infidel Parents sake how can Infidel neighbours called Godfathers give him right L. But the Canon saith that the Godfathers shall be only such as have received the Sacrament M. Alas none are forwarder than these to receive the Sacrament and laugh at it and say they will obey the Church Yet I doubt not but a faithful Parent may be present if he will and may tell the Godfathers in private that his presence shall signifie his devoting act and when the Priest speaketh to the Godfathers he may bow his head whether the Priest will or not to signifie that act of his But this is nothing to the sense of the Church nor to our Assent and Consent to their exclusion of the Parent L. I confess it sounds to me as unnatural But what is your other reason against our sort of Godfathers M. Iâ— My second Reason is that it is a prophanation of this great and sacred Ordinance to invest those in the visible state Christianity and Salvation pretendedly that have no right to such investiture so they have but Godfathers they are to baptize the children of any Jews or Heathens or open enemies to Christ as well as of Christians which is a manifest prophanation L. What is the fault of it M. 1. It supposeth a false Doctrine that Infidel Children are within the Covenant and may be baptized as well as Christians which in the Books aforecited I have fully disproved 2. It is a dangerous adding to God's word and worship 3. It is a deceiving of mens Souls as to childrens state to make them believe that their children dying when baptized are all saved how bad soever the Parents be 4. It is a dreadful belying of God and prophanation of his name if men shall in the name of God pronounce pardon and salvation to those whom he never gave them to L. But God will not punish the Children for their Parents sin M. Not those that see their fathers sins and forsake them and live not as their Parents did and that 's all that the Scripture saith for such But if you will read my two foresaid Disputations for Original sin you will see it fully proved that God punisheth Infants because they are the guilty and corrupt seed of guilty and corrupt Parents Do you believe our Church Articles and yet deny original sin If Infants have no guilt and sin what need have they of Baptism or of a Saviour If they have need of both sure it is for no actual sin done by them was not the World lost for Adam's sin Was not Cain's posterity cursed for his sake Were not all the Infants of the old World and all the Infants of the Sodamites burnt with fire from Heaven and the Infants of the Canaanites and Amalakites c. killed for their Parents sin Did not Christ tell the Jews Mat. 23. that all their Forefathers persecutions should be punished on that Generation The Jews knew this that said His blood be on us and on our Children Our Liturgy saith Remember not Lord our offences nor the offences of our Forefathers c. 2. And yet I tell you that it is for their own sin that the seed of the wicked perish sin is made their own when soul and body were for guilty corrupt Parents made such by themselves I do not say that God imputeth their Parents infidelity to them But this infidelity is the reason of their not being delivered from their own original guilt If Rebels forfeit Life and Estate and so their Children live in beggery and the King offer to restore Father and Children if the Father will thankfully accept his grace If the Parent refuse this his Children will be beggars Not because the King punisheth them for their Fathers fault but because he first deprived himself of the Estate which he should have left them and next because he refused to deliver them If a Father will set the Pox on his children and after refuse a Physician that would cure him and them the Physician doth not punish the children All Scripture and Nature tell the world that it is so deep an interest that Parents have in children as being causes of their very essence by Communication from their own essence and it is so natural a power that Parents have over their children that it should seem no strange thing to Christians or Infidels that God maketh a very great difference between the seed of the faithful and of the Infidels and wicked And its strange that any men should rather lay their title to pardon and salvation upon a meer neighbour or stranger that perhaps is a wicked wretch himself than on the Parents of the child L. But will God save children for their Parents Faith M. If he destroy Infants for Adam's sin do you think that Justice is so much more extensive then Mercy that he will shew no mercy for Parents sake But the case is this Christ the Second Adam hath merited pardon and salvation to be given conditionally to all Not absolutely for then all would be saved What the condition is to the adult we are agreed viz. Faith and Repentance and Dedication to Christ by covenant consent And do you think that Infants pardon and salvation hath no condition If none than all Infants are saved if any condition what is it 1. Is it barely that they be baptized without any right but what all have This is an injurious fiction God never said it And it s an unreasonable imputation on God as if he would
the young Clergy that can talk thus shew us by any good evidence that in other things they are so much Wiser Learneder than the Dissenters Are they all of greater Learning than Iohn Reignolds or better Hebricians than Hugh Broughton or better Logicians than Sadeel or Ramus or Sohnius or of greater Reading than Blondel c. 3. Do they know us better than we our selves We offer our Oaths that we hold what we do by the Cogency of appearing Evidence and are willing to know the truth 4. Have I here and elsewhere given no Reasons for our Dissent Have they answered my Treatise of Episcopacy my First and Second Plea for Peace my Apology my Treatise of the Terms of Church-Concord or any one thing that I have written for our Cause save two or three by disputes which when I have vindicated they have let fall the Disceptation What front have these men then that say we Dissent without giving Reason for it But you know how long the Press was shut against our Writings and yet then they that would not endure us to Speak accused us for being Silent L. Obj. IV. They say you are Non-Conformists meerly to make good your former Errours because you will not confess that you did amiss but will make the People justify you M. 1. What are those Errours If it be our dislike of any of the things before described I confess it is because we will not renounce them If it be an errour to be against their Church-corruptions and cruel Excommunications and denying Christendom to the Seed of the Faithful and Communion to faithful Christians I confess we will not recant these errours till they have better proved them such The Papists that swarm with Errours as a Beggar doth with Lice yet burn the Protestants as for Errour 2. I pray you wish those infallible men that in the ditch of dirt are delivered from all the uncleanness of errour to send only those those that are without errour to cast the first stone at us or those that have no worse errour than ours to silence excommunicate and destroy us 3. Have we given them no reasons of our dissent 4. Do they not know that the argument that hath brought us all into the case that we are in was thus given us 1664. and oft since in Print If we abate them any thing they will say that our Church was faulty and needed that Reformation who then is it that hath divided us to avoid confession of any former faultiness Tho' good Bishop Hall pronounceth a heavy Sentence on them that will justify the miscarriages of the Prelates L. Obj. V. They say that you took part with the Parliament against the King and involved the Land in Blood and have still the same rebellious principles M. 1. I confess there were some among us that were of the mind of Hooker Bilson Grotius Barclay and the common sort of Casuists Politicks c. and that thought that as in a doubt about Physick the College of Physicians were most to be trusted so in a doubt about Law the Parliament had been most credible And when the Irish had murdered two hundred thousand Protestants falsly pretending that they had the Kings Commission and threatning to finish their works in England there were many formerly tempted to fly in fear to the Parliament for safety being ignorant that the Kings bare word notwithstanding the Papists strength and interest was more to be trusted with our Laws Lives and Religion than all the Lawyers Courts and Pariament and that if all the Protestants in England had been used as those in Ireland they ought to have died patiently unless the killers would have given them time to send to the King to know whether he would have them live or die They were ignorant that a Lord Proprietor may do with his own as he list Who accuseth the owner for killing his own Sheep But the times of this ignorance are past The Long Parliament that made the Act of Vniformity cured it And shall not the Act of Oblivion be permitted to reconcile us and continue our peace 2. But Sir Who be they that were thus deceived I told you 1. That of near ten thousand that had Churches under the Parliament and Cromwel there was but two thousand that refused to Conform And is not seven thousand Conformists more than two thousand Dissenters 2. Many that were in the Parliament's Army Conformed and some that were for the Kings Death when the generality of those called Presbyterians abhorred it and the Engagement and brought in the King on reasons of meer Conscience 3. I have told you that we will take it thankfully if only those were silenced that had any hand in that War believing that it will not now be twenty Ministers in England And why are the rest that were Boys at School accused for other Mens opinions or actions For the time to come you need not fear them I heard some tell the Members of the Long Parliament that called them Rebels for saying that a Parliament may use defensive Arms against the Kings Commissioned Souldiers that if that would serve they would promise that if the King would but send a dozen Irish-men to kill them all in the house they would never be guilty of taking Arms to defend them nor perswading any else to do it L. Obj. VI. But they say that these Non-Conformists tho' they had no hand in the late War yet have the same Principles that caused it and that is Non-Conformity M. This is an argument a baculo ad angulum A man is against the Cross in Baptism or a Lay-Chancellor's excommunicating Men for a Ceremony c. ergo he is against the King and for Rebellion The other side say that the Irish Principles and the Popish were the cause and must we therefore conclude all Irish or Papists to be against the King They were Papists that raised the Wars on both sides in the aforesaid days of King William K. Stephen H. 1. and H. 3. and Ed. 2. and Rich. 2. and H. 6. and Rich. 3. and Ed. 4. c. Doth it follow that all rapists are rebels 2. But I have elsewhere fully proved that the Parliament when that War began were of the Church of England and Conformists and it 's strange that any should have the face to deny it while so many are yet living that know them Whitlocke tells us in his Memorials that they voted that every County should have a Bishop and his Presbytery And were those then against Episcopacy One would think that a County should be big enough to keep Episcopacy from dwindling to nothing every Bishop of old had but one City Many Counties have ten or near twenty Towns that were then called Cities But when Papists dare say that all are against Kings that are against the Pope who is the ruler and deposer of Kings it 's no wonder if every Bishop or Chancellor or Official c. will say If
Preacher or Catechize who doth not subscribe these words Ex animo That the Book of Common-Prayer and of Ordaining of Bishops Priests and Deacons containeth in it nothing contrary to the Word of God and that it may lawfully be used and that he himself will use the Form in the said Books prescribed in publick Prayer and administration of the Sacraments and no other V. No man is to be Ordained a Minister nor have any place or Benefice or Cure that doth not openly and publickly before the Congregation declare his unfeigned Assent and Consent to the use of all things in the said Book contained and prescribed in these words and no other I A. B. Do here declare my unfeigned Assent and Consent to all and every thing contained and prescribed in and by the Book entitled The Book of Common-Prayer and Ordaining And every Lecturer also the first Lecture and every Month must publickly and openly declare his Assent to and Approbation of the said Book and to the use of all the Prayers Rites and Ceremonies Forms and Orders therein contained and prescribed VI. By this all must Assent and Consent to this Article of Faith or Doctrine It is certain by the Word of God that Children which are Baptized dying before they commit actual Sin are undoubtedly saved Not excepting any though the Children of Atheists Infidels or Sadducees VII We must Assent and Consent that at publick Baptism persons called Godfathers and Godmothers who take not the Child for their own do in the name of the Child Covenant with God without the Parents who are forbidden to be Godfathers or Godmothers or to speak one word nor must be urged to be present nor may the Godfathers c. speak one word but what is written in the book And they are there not only to promise for the future but to profess in the Name of the Child at present I renounce them all the Devil World and Flesh and All this I stedfastly believe and to be baptized This is my desire and for obedience I will. And these Godfathers also engage as their parts and Duty to see that this Infant be taught so soon as he shall be able to learn what a solemn Vow Promise and Profession he there made by them And that they call on him to hear Sermons and chiefly that they provide that he may learn the Crede the Lord's Prayer and the Ten Commandments in the vulgar Tongue and all other things that a Christian ought to know and believe to his Soul's health and that the Child may be vertuously brought up to lead a godly and Christian life All this these three persons must promise as before God and the Church but the Parent is not only excused from any such promise but forbid it by the Canon VIII We must Assent and Consent to refuse to baptize the Child of any godly Christian who bringeth not his Child to be baptized with such undertaking Godfathers either because he can get none that will seriously promise him to do what they must Vow to do and so dare not draw them into sacrilegious perfidiousness or because he thinks it his own part to enter his Child into God's Covenant and thus to promise for its Education IX We must Assent and Consent to sign the Infant with the transient Image of the Cross In token that hereafter he shall not be ashamed to confess the Faith of Christ crucified and manfully to fight under his Banner against Sin the World the Devil and to continue Christs faithful Souldier and Servant to his lives end Which the Canon farther expounds thus To dedicate them by that Badge to his Service whose benefits bestowed on them in Baptism the name of the Cross doth represent an honourable Badge whereby the Infant is dedicated to the Service of him who died on the Cross. X. VVe must Assent and Consent to Baptize none publickly without this Sign but to deny Christendom to all that dare not receive it and their Children XI VVe must Assent and Consent to reject all that dare not receive it Kneeling from the Sacramental Communion of the Church XII VVe must Assent and Consent to a false Rule to find out Easter-day for ever in these words Easter-day on which the rest depends is always the first Sunday after the first full Moon which happens next after the one and twentieth day of March. The common Almanacks tell you it is often false XIII VVe must Assent and Consent to use words at the Burial of all except the Vnbaptized Excommunicate and self-murtherers which plainly pronounce them saved viz. For asmuch as it hath pleased Almighty God to take to himself the Soul of our dear Brother here departed And we give thee thanks for that it hath pleased thee to deliver this our Brother out of the miseries of this sinful world and that we may rest in him as our hope is this our Brother doth XIV VVe must Assent and Consent to read publick Lessons out of Iudith Bell and the Dragon Tobit and other Apocryphal books from Sept. 28. till Nov. 24. every day except some proper Lessons interposed XV. VVe must Assent and Consent to all the mistranslations of the Psalms c. and not only use them which we refuse not but subscribe that none of them are contrary to the word of God. XVI We must Assent and Consent to admit none to the holy Communion till such time as he be Confirmed or be ready and desirous to be Confirmed that is by Bishops in the English method XVII We must Assent and Consent that such ornaments of the Church and of the Ministers thereof at all times of their ministration shall be retained in use as were in this Church of England by that authority of Parliament in the Second year of Edward VI. XVIII We must Assent and Consent to give an account within fourteen days of every one that we keep from the Sacrament to the Ordinary And that the Ordinary proceed against the offending person according to the Canons XIX We must publish all such Excommunications and Absolutions as are according to the Canons decreed by Lay Chancellors XX. This binds us to consent and publish the Excommunication of all that affirm that the Liturgy containeth any thing in it that is repugnant to the Scriptures And the Oath of canonical Obedience binds us to such publication if it be commanded us XXI And we are both these ways bound to publish all Excommunicate ipso facto if commanded who affirm any of the Rites and Ceremonies such as may not be approved and used lawfully XXII And all that say any of the Thirty Nine Articles in any part may not be subscribed though it be but about Traditions or Ceremonies XXIII And we must if required publish all ipso facto Excommunicate who say the Church Government by Arch-Bishops Bishops Deans Archdeacons and the rest that bear Office is against God's word XXIV We must if commanded publish all Excommunicate who affirm
any School-master but an Usher or Monitor or any Physitian or any Mayor or Justice under him 6. That they have set up a false humane Discipline before described instead of Christ's which they have taken down And all this we dare not justifie by a confederacy by Oath IV. And we think that the fourth thing which we stick at needs no other reason suppose the species of Diocesans were of God's appointment and only the numerical Bishops usurpers we can submit and live peaceably but we cannot swear obedience to them They plead more than we for the power of ancient Councils and Canons I have elsewhere fully proved as Paul of Venice hath done and Mr. Clarkson and Dr. Burnet and many others that many great Councils nullified the Episcopacy of all that came in without the election or consent of the Clergy and Flocks And we our selves cannot conceive how any man can be the Pastor of those that consent not though we can easily conceive that Dissenters may oft be obliged to consent when they do not so may a Son or Daughter be obliged to obey their Parents in consenting to Marry such as Parents choose for them when yet it is no marriage till that consent How few in a Diocese ever know of the Bishops Election till it's past and how few consent I need not tell We can submit to these but not swear Allegiance to them V. And in all the foresaid cases we have another disswasive 1. It is so much of the King's Prerogative that all Subjects must swear Allegiance and Fidelity to him that in almost all Nations it hath been thought dangerous to make the Subjects also swear obedience to every Justice or inferior Officer lest it should make them too like Kings 2. Lest the Subjects should be entangled between their Oath to the King and their Oaths to all these Officers in case of the Officers contradiction to the King 's 3. Lest so many Oaths should make that Government a snare to the conscientious which should be for their ease and safety 4. Lest so much swearing make Oaths contemptible and bring in perjury and endanger the King who should by our Oaths be secured 2. And I have elsewhere named many Councils and Canons which prohibit Bishops this practice of making the Clergy swear fidelity to them and have condemned it as of dangerous consequence And they that are for Councils should not engage us causelesly against them 3. The present Impositions greatly stop us till we better know what it is that we must do We have cause to make a stand when we are all sworn never to endeavour any alteration of the Government of the State which we readily obey and yet seem to be called to do that which we are told by some is an alteration of it That is the making of our present species of Archbishops Bishops Deans Archdeacons yea Chancellors Officials Commissaries c. as unchangeable a part of the Government as Monarchy it self is and so disabling the King to make any alteration in them For set all this together and consider 1. All the Clergy is bound or sworn to obey both Bishops and every Ordinary 2. The Canon ipso facto Excommunicates every man that affirmeth that the Church Government under his Majesty by Archbishops Bishops Deans Archdeacons and THE REST THAT BEAR OFFICE in the same is repugnant to the word of God so that all the Lords and Gentlemen in England that have affirmed that the Government by the Keys as used by Diocesans over hundreds of Churches or by Archdeacons Lay Chancellors c. is repugnant to God's word being already ipso facto Excommunicate how far they are capable of being Parliament-men I know not but I suppose if in Parliament they shall affirm any such repugnancy they are Excommunicate and without the Act of King and Parliament no alteration can be made 3. And now to fix them all the Kingdom is sworn never to endeavour any alteration in the Church Government viz. In the Corporation Act the Militia Act the Vestry Act the Oxford swearing Act after the Act of Vniformity And is not every Chancellor or Archdeacon or Bishop now made as immutable necessary a part of the Kingdom as the King L. You speak ignorantly for want of acquaintance with the Law Do you think King and Parliament oblige themselves It is only particular subjects out of Parliament that they oblige M. I. But when the Parliament is dissolved are they not all particular subjects save the King. And are they not all then hereby bound And do you think that it was the meaning of the Act that they who swear never to endeavour alteration may yet endeavour it if they be chosen Parliament men I will manifestly disprove it All these Oaths do joyn the Government of Church and State together Yea and put the Church-Government first as if it had the preeminence But it was never the meaning of the Oath that the Parliament may endeavour to alter Monarchy which is the State-Government Ergo it meant not that they may endeavour to alter Prelacy or Church-Government II. But suppose it be as you say They that know the present thing called the Church of England know that their Writers openly maintain that the Obligation of the Canons depends not on the Parliament save only as to the forceable execution of them but on the authority of the Church as a Society empowred by Christ And therefore that King or Parliaments at least may be Excommunicated by them as well as others All are Excommunicate men that do but call their Government sinful CHAP. VII II. Of the restraint of Ordained Ministers from Preaching and expounding any Scripture or Matter or Doctrine Can. 49. L. WHat is it that you have against Conformity in this M. I. That men are at once made Christ's Ministers and forbid to exercise that which they are Ordained to II. That we are laid under the hainous guilt of breaking our Vow when they have engaged us to make it and of betraying mens Souls by omitting a vowed duty 3. That we are forbidden that which is the duty of every Lay Christian that is able as if they would suppress Religion and Charity it self L. But you do not swear or subscribe to this Canon M. 1. But we are bound by them to obey this Canon for it is the Law of the whole Church of England 2. I have shewed you that swearing obedience to them must mean obeying their Laws which are far more of weight than particular mandates L. But as long as you may have Licenses how doth this put you on any sin of omission or commission M. Both their words and their deeds tell us that they Ordain more than they Licence to Preach or Expound any Doctrine And is it no sinful omission think you for all the rest to forbear all this 2. And many were Ordained heretofore who by the new Act of Uniformity are denyed Licenses without new Professions and Covenants
Nor did I ever to this day know one man or woman that performed this which all three undertake A very few I have known that will ask How doth my Godson and say you must be a good Boy and learn your Book and perhaps give him a piece of Silver But usually they never look after them I confess with shame that I have been Godfather to four to one when I was a Child and knew not what I did but thought it was only to be a Witness of Baptism And to three more when I was twenty three years of age of all which I agreed beforehand with the Parents to be but a Witness and that they should stand there themselves as the undertakers and signifie it Two of these I never saw since a third now dead I never saw since his Infancy till a little before he dyed and the fourth never since till that lately he came a begging to me I confess one Bishop told me once that he knew one or more that had performed this Vow so did never I who have lived in many parts of the Land. Those that perform it not sure are guilty of heinous perfidiousness as breaking so solemn a Vow to God. And if this be so common in England that to this Age I could never know of one performer is not the case doleful and dreadful that the Nation should by such perfidiousness be made Christians L. But this is the Parents or Godfathers fault what 's this to the Minister or to your Assent and Consent M. If it be not nothing to the Canons and to the Liturgy it is not nothing to him that must Assent and Consent to all things in that Liturgy and must swear Canonial obedience And 1. Do you think that the Nation can so commonly live in this sin and the Church Governours and Orders be innocent in it Can those Canons and Orders be blameless that without any more opposition let such perfidiousness go to our Christening Can the medicine be laudable that so many miscarry in the use of it 2. By the Canon all men are constrained to get some Godfathers and they can force none that is unwilling 3. No Conscionable persons will Promise and undertake that which they never purpose to perform I never in all my life met with one godly man that if you opened all the undertaking plainly to him would say seriously I am resolved to do all this but would refuse the office when he knows it is expected 3. If there be hundreds or thousands in a Parish that are grosly ignorant of the nature of Baptism and what they do or that ere Atheists Infidels wicked men not Excommunicate the Minister can not deny to take them for Godfathers if they did but ever once receive the Sacrament And to this 68th year of my age I never knew one Godfather or Godmother questioned or refused by any Minister 4. If the Parent can get no man to stand he shall be ruined for it as not bringing his Child to be Baptized according to the order of the Church 5. Rich men will not give up their Children to the God-father's propriety or education Poor mens Children none will take And is it lawful to Assent and Consent to such orders of Baptism as cherish this If Parents were the undertakers we might urge them to performance But from such others who can expect it CHAP. XI Point VIII Of refusing to Baptize without such Godfathers L. YOV have been long on this Point I pray you be shorter on the next M. It needs not many words it is so gross We dare not Assent and Consent to deny Baptism to all Children of godly Parents that have not such Godfathers and Godmothers while the Parent offereth to do his own part professing his faith and dedicating his Child to God and promising a faithful education L. How prove you that you must put away all such M. 1. Did you ever know any baptized otherwise in the Church 2. The words of the Rubrick are There shall be for every Male Child to be baptized two Godfathers and one Godmother and for every Female one Godfather and two Godmothers 3. The Godfathers and Godmothers only are to speak and covenant without which it is no Baptism Meer washing without Covenanting is no Christian Baptism so that the Church of England doth make Godfathers essential to it And what it is to add to the Essentials of so great an Ordinance of God as was instituted by Christ's own mouth for so high an use as our Espousal to himself judge you 4. The Canon to which all must subscribe saith that he himself will use the form in the said Book prescribed in publick prayer and administration of the Sacrament and no other 5. The Act of Conventicles maketh it 20 l. the first time and 40 l. every time after for above four to meet to worship God otherwise than according to the Liturgy and practice of the Church of England And to baptize without Godfathers is otherwise 6. And then the Oxford Act banisheth them five miles from Corporations Is not here sufficient proof L. And why should any scruple so small a matter M. 1. Did I not before tell you why 2. Suppose they scrupled it through mistake shall every mistake or errour of Parents deprive the child of Baptism I 'll tell you why I dare no more Assent and Consent to this than I dare consent to cut off a hand or foot of every such child 1. Baptising is Christening and dare I causelessly deprive a Soul of visible Christianity 2. They themselves make it an Ascertaining means of Salvation as the forementioned Rubrick sheweth And would they have us shut Infants from Salvation for nothing yea they seem to confine Salvation only to the baptized while they conclude that they are saved as baptized ones and except the unbaptized from Christian Burial The best can be but to leave them as without any promise of life from Christ And how can we believe that God will give them that which he never promised them And shall I damn souls for want of a humane unnecessary if not corrupt invention 3. It is against the interest of Christ and the Church shall I make a Covenant to rob Christ and the Church of visible Members for nothing Murthering Infants is death by God's Laws and mans And Innocents day is one of the Christmas Holy days And is it a thing indifferent for me and all the Ministers of the National Church to make a solemn bargain that we Assent and Consent to keep out all from the Church and from the Covenant and in their sense the hope of Salvation on such an account as this L. The thing were dismal and unexcusable if it were as you make it But how can you say that they shut them out when they force all Parents to bring them in and to submit to their way when did you ever know any child refused on this account M. Many a hundred in my
one and twentith day of March. L. It is true for the most part though not always M And we will Assent that it is true for the most part but not always L. This is but a mere mistake and can you scruple Conformity for such a trifle M. Is it lawful deliberately to lie in a trifle In them it was but an untruth for they wrote what they thought had been true But it would be a wilful lying in me who know it to be false L. But you may in your Subscribing or Declaring except that which you know the Authors would have excepted had they known them to be false M. Say you so Then I may except all the rest which I here except against For Truth is so naturally the object of the Intellect that I may suppose that the Convocation would have put none of them on us had they known them to be false Do you mean that I may except them in words or writing or only mentally If the first I have offered them to declare my Assent and Consent to all things in the Book in which the Authors were not mistaken But that is refused with derision and is contrary to the Act of Uniformity which saith They shall declare in these words and no other If you mean mentally then a man may Covenant or swear any falsehood with a mental exception and so any 〈◊〉 may subscribe or covenant what you will. L. But you know those two most knowing men Grotius de Iure Beili and Bishop Jer. Taylor Duct Dubit maintain that useful Lying which hurts no one is no sin A man's Life may be saved by a lie M. And in my Housholders Catechism on the ninth Commandment I have fully confuted it to which I refer youâ— No man's private commodity or life must be preferred before the common welfare of mankind Why do Souldiers hazard their lives and Malefactors lose them but for the common good and safety But if men had leave to lie when it is for their safety or commodity it would utterly overthrow all humane converse and Societies by over-throwing all Trust and Justice Rulers and Subjects Preachers and Hearers Judges Jurors Witnesses Traders Contractors would all find some reason from their commodity to Lie. Laws are made chiefly for the common safety and profit and must not allow a single persons to the common hurt L. I confess the reason is weighty But most men will but laugh at you to suffer ruine rather then to Assent to so harmless a Lie as that is M. It is to God's judgment that we stand or fall who hath decreed to cast out of his Kingdom all Lyars Rev. 21 and 22. L. It 's a wonder to me that all the Bishops Doctors and Church of England should publish and impose such a mistake and never a man of them examine it and detect it And yet a greater wonder that the Lords and Bishops and Commons in Parliament should pass and impose it without examination M. Neither of them is any wonder to me considering who the men were and in what circumstances and what moved them No more than that they would rather England were in the case it is in than to have forborn any of their impositions called Things indifferent or than the King's Declaration of Ecclesiastical Affairs should have healed us But do you think that such mens Volumns are like to be so infallible in matters of Faith Doctrine and Right who no more examine plain Matters of fact as that all the Clergy may boldly declare Assent and Consent to all contained in and â—â—escribed by their book And that before they ever see it And did not Convocation Parliament and the whole Declaring Clergy go one way and notably Trust some body And are we not excusable for trying further Doth this common belief deserve honour and preferment and our unbelief of such things deserve silencing and ruine L. I marvail what they say to this who expound their Assent and Consent as to the Use If they Use this Rule we must keep two Easters oft one at a right time and another at a wrong M. It 's enough to justifie themselves to call Refusers Schismaticks Rogues and disobedient to Government as the poor Protestants are called in France CHAP. XVI Point XIII Of Pronouncing all saved that are Buried except the Vnbaptized Excommunicate and Self-murtherers L. WHat are the words hear that you dislike M. I told you before For as much as it hath pleased Almighty God to take to himself the Soul of our dear Brother here deceased and We give thee thanks for that it hath pleased thee to deliver this our Brother out of the miseries of this sinful world and That we may rest in him as our hope is this our Brother doth L. What harm is in these words must not charity be used in our judging of all mens final state M. We like all the Office and these words very well if used over the Corpse of capable persons and if true Discipline in the Church did make a just Separation of the capable and uncapable L. Then the fault is not in the Liturgy but the Government M. It only follows that the fault is Primarily in the Governours corruption and neglect of Discipline but it 's next also in the Liturgy For the matter of fact and right is presupposed to the Declaration of it And it followeth not that because I may speak well of good men I may do so of bad Christ will condemn those that feed not visit not harbour not his Servants Mat. 25. All men ought to be his Servants and deserve this Yet multitudes in Scotland suffer now for feeding and harbouring rebellious subjects Suppose they say now that the fault was not in us that fed them but in them that were Rebells we were bound to feed honest men and they were bound to be honest and charity judgeth the best I think this will not save some from the gallows I think if the Bishops were but to bury Souldiers killed in fighting against the King and at the Grave should pronounce them all good Subjects it would be ill taken much more is it to pronounce them saved Charity is no excuse for dangerous errour and falshood It must not follow a blind understanding I am sure that the Clergy in their Sermons and Writings condemn abundance whom at the Grave they pronounce saved L. But what danger is it to judge too charitably M. It hath all these dangers 1. The guilt of speaking falsely to God. 2. The contradicting of God's Word which saith that no Whoremonger Drunkard Railer Murtherer shall enter into the Kingdom of God and that the impenitent shall perish 3. The hardening of ungodly men against all fear of God when they hear that the same men that in the Pulpit threaten damnation to them recant it all in their Application at the Grave and pronounce them saved How could they more dangerously deceive men who take that in deeper usually that is
serious manner for transition into the State of Adult Communicants it would be the greatest means of a true Reformation and of Union with the parties that now differ about Church order that can be used Divers of the highest Episcopal Divines write as earnestly for this as any of us Especially Mr. Elderfield and Dr. Hammond and yet were it to prevent our continued division and our ruin there is no hope of obtaining it L. Why what hinders if all sides desire it M. It is desired as Holiness is desired seriously by the serious reservedly and by halves by the half Christian and only the Name Image and Ceremony by the gross Hypocrite who hateth it at the Heart because it is above him and against his carnal mind and interest And indeed it is here made impossible to be done any otherwise ordinarily than as a Ceremony For 1. The Diocesses are so vast that the Bishop cannot do this and other his Offices for the hundredth part of his undertaken Flock Suppose this Diocess have but five or six hundred thousand Souls for when an hundred thousand died the last Plague I hope it was not above the â—ixth part Do you think that the Bishop is able did he work as hard as any Nonconformist to confirm six hundred thousand Persons or the twentieth part of them or the hundredth in that serious manner as belongs to the binding of a Soul to Christ in so solemn a Covenant It becometh me not to inquire whether Bishops be men that are for so much seriousness in Christianity themselves and so much labour to attain it Some are far better than others You know them as well as I. But I must say 1. That as far as I can learn there is not one of an hundred confirmed at all 2. All the thousands that are unconfirmed live in the Parishes as reputed Christians and may come to the Sacrament when they will. 3. I never knew one Minister of all that Covenanted it to keep one man from the Sacrament for not being Confirmed or not being desirous of it nor one Neighbour that ever was examined on this Point whether he were Confirmed or were ready and desired it 4. Some few elder Votaries to the Bishops perhaps may be serious in it but what a mere running Ceremony it is usually made I need not tell you I have formerly said that I was at 15 years of Age Confirmed my self by Bishop Morton one of the Learned'st and best Bishops that ever I knew and we ran thither from School without the Minister's knowledge or one word from our Master to tell us what Confirmation is and in a Church yard in the Path-Way as the Bishop past by we kneeled down and laying his Hands on every Boys Head he said a few words I knew not what nor did any one of my School-fellows as far as I could perceive know what he said nor know what Confirmation is any more than to have the Bishop's Blessing nor were we ask'd by him or any whether we stood to our Baptismal Covenant save only by saying by rote the Catechism to our Master nor did I see any one make any more than a Ceremony of it When the Bishops were down I saw it made a serious Work by divers Ministers who instructed Young Men till they found them seriously resolved for Christ and then taking the best of Confirmation and Penitence caused them publickly before the Congregation to profess their Faith and Repentance and to renew the Covenant they made in Baptism to Christ. And were it made the work of Godly Ministers to do it or to prepare Men personally for it and not make it a Game for Boys much good might be done by it L. Well What have you against it besides Abuse which no body desireth you to subscribe to M. Were I a publick Minister I should be glad of that Rubrick to enable me to keep away the grosly Ignorant which I know no other Clause that enableth me to do But I durst not use it to turn from Communion all Godly Persons whom it excludeth nor can I consent so to do L. What can make Godly Persons scruple it as sinful M. Many things 1. The words make it seem to some to be yet made a Sacrament which are Vpon whom after the example of thy holy Apostles we have now laid our hands to certifie them by this sign of thy favour and gracious goodness toward them Here is an outward visible sign of an inward and spiritual Grace given to them said to be done in imitation of Christ's Apostles as a means whereby they receive the same and a â— ledge to assure them thereof as the Collects with it shew which is the Catechisms Definition of a Sacrament 2. They that are against our Diocesan sort of Prelacy dare not seem to own it by coming to them for Confirmation appropriated to them 3. Those that think that a great and holy Duty is made a mere Mockery to delude Souls and corrupt the Church while every one in England that will but take this Ceremony is pronounced to God in Prayer to be Regenerate by the Holy Ghost and all their Sins forgiven them these dare not joyn themselves with the Prophaners in their delusory way Be these Scruples just or unjust while the same Persons are willing to own their own Baptismal Covenant understandingly and seriously before the Church and their own Pastors and to know those that labour among them and are over them in the Lord and esteem them in Love for their Works sake and to be at Peace among themselves I dare not for scrupling this Diocesan Ceremony cast them from the Communion of the Church of Christ. And therefore I dare not Approve of the Order that requireth it nor Assent and Consent to it nor Subscribe that it is not contrary to the Word of God. Chap. XX. Point XVII Of Consenting to all the Ornaments of Church and Ministers that were in use in the Second year of King Edw. 6. L. VVHat have you against this M. The words are That such Ornaments of the Church and of the Ministers thereof at all times of their Ministration shall be retained in use as were in this Church of England by the Authority of Parliament in the Second year of King Edw. 6. Against this we have these Exceptions 1. We know not what was then in use and therefore cannot consent to we know not what 2. We are told that the Albe and many other Ornaments were then in use that are since put down and we must not consent to restore them without more reason than we hear And the Canon enumerating the Ornaments now we suppose the addition of all those will Contradict it 3. We meet with few Conformists that know what was then in use And we see that all those that Subscribe or Consent to this yet use them not And we will not run for Company into a solemn Covenant-Consent to the use of those things that we see
no body use The second year of King Edw. 6. was the minority of the Reformation and before we consent to make it our pattern we must know what it was and whether no Act of Parliament have since reversed that which then was used Chap. XXI Point XVIII Of giving an Account to the Ordinary of all that we keep from the Sacrament that he may Proceed against them according to the Canons L. VVHy cannot you Approve of and Consent to this M. For many and great Reasons 1. From the Ordinary 2. From our Selves and our Ministry 3. From the People 4. From the Church 5. From the Nature of the Matter L. I. What have you against it from the Ordinary M. I told you before that 1. Some of the Ordinaries are Lay-Men sitting in Corners to Decree Excommunications and Absolutions proper to the Clergy And we ought not to consent to the guilt of this 2. Other Ordinaries are single Presbyters that have no Power of the Keys from Christ over their Brethren and over a multitude of Churches 3. Other of the Ordinaries are Diocesans over Hundreds of Churches that have no Bishops of their own under these And we ought not to own any of all these L. II. What Reasons have you from your selves M. If we should accuse to the Ordinaries all that we ought to keep away it will utterly destroy our Ministry 1. We are bound to keep away all that desire not Episcopal Confirmation 2. All Ignorant Persons that are unready to be Confirmed 3. All Atheists Infidels Hereticks scandalous Sinners and that live in malice to others much more to the generality of Godly Men. 4. All the Nonconformists whom they call Schismaticks that Kneel not c. And in a Parish of 30000 or 40000 in London it 's well if of all these sorts there be not many Thousands And 2. The Ordinaries Courts are full of other Work And in the Countrey they are oft far from most Ministers 3. Ministers have usually much more Work than they can do at home and less Money than they need And the Prosecution of all these and bringing up Witnesses will take up all their time and leave them none for their Studies or many other Offices at home And it will undo them in their Estates 4. It will make the People so much to hate them that their Preaching will do little good 5. And when they know all this none of the Ministers will practice it as Experience tells us and so they will all live in the breach of the Covenant which they made and when to get a living they have falsly professed Consent to all this Accusation and Prosecution Self-love will not suffer them to do what they consented to L. III. What are your Reasons against it from the People M. 1. The Multitude that makes it unpracticable 2. The greatness of some of them that will ruine the Ministers 3. But especially because it will cross the just end of our Ministry and make them uncapable of receiving any Profit by us And our Power is given us for their Edification and not for their Destruction This will but harden them against our Doctrine L. Do not you by this Condemn your selves that desire a stricter Discipline which would offend them more M. No for 1. We would not turn our Churches into Prisons nor bring in any under our Discipline but consenting Volunteers 2. We would have no Lay-men or forced Ordinaries to do this but Pastors of their own choice whom they well know 3. We would have nothing done against any sinner Magisterially and forcibly by the abuse of the Keys but only humble Ministerial convincing them by Gods word of sin and of Gods wrath and praying for their repentance and meek and patient warning them and waiting till they prove obstinately impenitent And then only an Exclusion of them declaratively from that Communion from which they exclude themselves without any force on their Goods or Persons L. IV. What are your reasons from the Church M. 1. We ought not to consent to so great a corruption of its Discipline 2. Nor to a course that will render it odious to men 3. And deprive it so much of the true work of a faithful Ministry L. 5. What mean you by your reasons from the matter M. The ordinary proceeding according to the Canons must cast out a multitude of truly godly Christians and then they must be further prosecuted and ruined as we shall see anon under the particulars And we cannot Covenant and Consent to be prosecutors of such men before such Judges for such an end and to such direful Effects Chap. XXII Point XIX Of Publishing the Lay-Chancellors Excommunications and Absolutions according to the Canons L. HOw are you bound to publish their Excommunications M. 1. By our Ordination-Covenant to obey the Ordinary 2. By the Oath of Canonical Obedience 3. By this assent and consent to the words last mentioned to accuse them that the Ordinary may proceed against them according to the Canon 4. By constant custom If we do it not we shall be suspended or cast our L. But the Oath of Canonical Obedience is but in licitis honestis M. I told you before it implyeth that all that is Canonical is licitum honestum And they will not allow us to be Judges but will suspend us if we refuse their commands as unlawful and dishonest And the Canon it self ipso facto Excommunicateth all that say any of their Governing Offices are contrary to the Word of God or that the Canons bind not Dissenters And so far is the Church from taking this for unlawful or dishonest as that it expresly commandeth it in these words Can. 65. All Ordinaries shall in their several Jurisdictions carefully see and give order that as well those who for obstinate refusing to frequent Divine Service Established by publick Authority within this Realm of England as those also ESPECIALLY OF THE BETTER SORT and Condition who for notorious contumacy or other notable crimes stand lawfully Excommunicated be every six Months ensuing as well in the Parish Church as in the Cathedral by the Minister openly in time of Divine Service upon some Sunday denounced and declared Excommunicate that others may thereby be admonished to refrain their Company and excited the rather to procure out a Writ de Excommunicato capiendo so that no man can be a Minister that will not practise it L. And what have you against the practice of it M. 1. To be the Agent of Lay-mens Excommunicating 2. And the Instruments of godly mens Excommunications and Ruins You may as well ask us why we dare not oppress and destroy men without cause the Publishers cannot be Innocent Chap. XXIII Point XX. Of Publishing Excommunications according to the 4th Canon M. THE Fourth Canon saith Whosoever shall hereafter affirm that the Form of Gods Worship in the Church of England Established by Law and contained in the Book of Common Prayer and Administration of Sacraments
Offices as a Body of many Members or a Chain of many Links as we say Bonum est ex Causis integris And he that wounds any one Member wounds the Man and he that breaketh one Link breaketh the Chain And he that accuseth any one part of the Government accuseth the Government thereby And there is no doubt in the World but they so intended that made this Canon L. And what have you against your Obedience to this M. You may easily know what by what is already said 1. I have fully proved as aforesaid in my Treatise of Episcopacy that if Episcopacy were never so certainly of Divine Institution this Form of Diocesan Prelacy deposeth quantum in se the old Church Form the old Episcopacy the old Presbytery and almost all true Discipline and in stead of each sets up that which is repugnant to the Word of God. And must we all confederate to maintain this Church Corruption and all agree to renounce Reformation or any Conviction tending to Repentance 2. I have told you what it is for Lay-men and Courts to arrogate the Decretive Power of the Church Keys and for single Priests and Officials to rule all the Clergy and People as under them And for our Prelate to undertake to be the sole Bishop over many Hundred Clergy And then to Govern per alios in a secular manner even by Lay-men that do that in his Name which he knows not of and this in order to Gaols and Ruine If all this be agreeable to God's Word what is contrary to it 3. I have told you what it is to make every Church Officer so necessary as that it should be Excommunication to say Any one of them is sinful when as Learned good Men as most the World hath have written to prove almost all of them sinful corrupt Inventions of Arrogance and that it 's far worse for Men to presume to make new Forms and Offices of Church Government than new Ceremonies 4. The Parliament of England condemned the Oath called the caetera Oath in the Canon of 1640. And the late long Parliament of 1662. never restored it nor any since And was it not formed according to this Canon What 's c. but And the rest that bear Office therein reliquos ad ejusdem gubernaculum constitutos For my part tho' I have oft read over Cousins Tables and the Canons I do not yet know and remember all the Church Governing Courts and Offices How many there be besides the Bishop the Chancellors Court the Arches the Prerogative Court the Arch-deacons Commissaries Officials Surrogates I know not And are every one of these become as necessary to be taken for lawful as the twelve Apostles or the Articles of our Creed For my part I am far from thinking that those Bishops and Doctors should be Excommunicated or Damned who by Faction are drawn to deny the Ministry and Churches that have not Prelatical Ordination and Government and shall all be condemned that think as ill of Civilians Excommunicatings 5. I have told you what it is for every Lord Knight and Gentleman that doth but say that any of these Church Governing Offices are against the Word of God to be ipso facto an Excommunicate man. And for the people to be put to question whether they may chuse them for Parliament men and whether they may sit in Parliament while Excommunicate L. This Canon with the three or four adjoining make me begin to think hardlier of the Canoneers than I thought I should ever have done as to their honesty M. I would not have you think too hardly of them but only to think truly of Nonconformity Chap. XXVII Point XXIV Of Publishing the 8th Canons Excommunications L. VVHat is the Eighth Canon and its Excommunication M. Whoever shall hereafter affirm or teach that the Form and Manner of Making and Consecrating Bishops Priests or Deacons containeth ANY THING in it that is repugnant to the Word of God Let them be Excommunicated ipso facto and not to be restored until he repent and publickly revoke such his wicked Errors L. What have you against the Execution of this M. A great deal In sum it is unrighteous oppressing and dividing to cast out all Persons from the Church of Christ who think that nothing is faulty in the Book of Ordination or in their Principles or Practice there expressed And we dare not curse those that Christ doth bless should we do this for a Benefice in what should we differ from the sin of Balaam who loved the wages of unrighteousness whose iniquity and madness his Ass rebuked saith St. Peter 2 Pet. 2. 15. Yea shall we not be far worse than he that for an House full of Silver and Gold could not go beyond the Word of the Lord and did not curse but bless Gods people And it is not proud malignant Tongues reviling Gods Servants and calling their Opinions wicked Errors that will make Christ disown his Members or will warrant Balaam or us to curse them O how unlike is this to the Spirit and Ministry of Christ for Prelates and Priests to curse and cast out the Children of God for saying that they go against his Law. L. But what is amiss in the Book of Ordination M. I am anon to tell you that But if there were nothing amiss in it yet the belief of its innocency is not necessary to Salvation L. But if every man have leave to accuse the Orders of the Church what Order can be maintained M. 1. Leave modestly to express dissent in a doubtful case may stand with Order 2. If men do it disorderly there be other Penalties besides ipso facto Excommunication Every breach of the peace is not Rebellion nor punisht with Death But I 'll tell you briefly what may occasion good men to say that their Ordinations are sinful 1. In that they thereby obtrude Pastors on the Churches upon the bare choice of a Patron without or against the peoples wills 2. In that they professedly ordain such as their Canon forbids to Preach or Expound any Doctrine 3. In that they determine that Bishops Priests and Deacons are three distinct Orders which yet is an undetermined Controversie among even the Learnedst Papists And must we damn and cut off men for that which the very Papists leave at liberty 4. In that they ordain men to an Office which Scripture maketh no mention of Dr. Hammond saith that it cannot be proved that there were any Presbyters subject to Bishops in Scripture times nor any but Bishops None that had not power of Ordination and the Keys nor any Bishops of a multitude of Churches and Presbyters both which are here ordained 5. In that they Swear Obedience to Arch-bishops and their Sees and make Priests Covenant Obedience to their Ordinaries as aforesaid If a godly man do as Bucer did to King Edward the Sixth as you may see in his Scripta Anglic. and desire some of these faults to be amended doth he deserve
Church Government as fixed must thus be Sworn to as Monarchy is it alter not our Constitution Or at least be not a perillous Innovation 4. If the King and Parliament should command Men to endeavour an Alteration e. g. of Lay-Mens Power of the Keys or the greatness of Dioceses I am afraid of being sworn beforehand to disobey them L. But the Parliament meant not to bind themselves herein M. I grant it Tho' being Church of England men the 7th Canon aforesaid maketh it doubtful But when they have bound all the Subjects in the Land and themselves among others when out of Parliament and when it 's Excommunication to charge any of the Church-Offices with Sin I think the Church-Government is fixed as unalterable I ask you Did the Parliament bind themselves against altering Monarchy or the Succession If they did then it seems they did so by Church-Government when they put it in many Oaths before that of the State. If they did not then they have fixed Monarchy no more than Church-Government by this Oath Therefore when they bind all in the same Oath from endeavouring any Alteration of Church-Government they shew that they intend the fixing of it And tho' some think it leaveth room for Petitioning I do not believe that the Law or Oath leave any Men at Liberty to Petition against Monarchy which is here conjoyned But my great reason of Non-Conformity herein yet remaineth If the faults of Church-Government should prove but the tenth part as great as is feared by many and said by those that write about it what a tremendous thing is it to make a deliberate Solemn Covenant and Oath never to endeavour any amendment of it nor to perswade any man to repent or amend If the Germans who are reported to be addicted to Drunkenness or other Nations to Whoredom or Thievery should take an Oath that they will never repent or amend nor perswade any other to it what a case were this L. I confess if the Corruptions of Church-Government should prove as great Evils as some conceive it would be a heinous Sin indeed to Swear never to repent or to endeavour to amend it The old Nonconformists thought that the frame of English Prelatical Government was far worse than all their Ceremonies and other Corruptions set together They thought it a Platform fitted to exalt Pride and Covetousness and to propagate all ungodliness and to drive serious Piety and Conscience out of the Land upon the accounts before mentioned 1. By the largeness of Dioceses making Discipline impossible and so keeping almost all the wicked in the bosom of the Church secure from the Power of the Keys 2. By putting down all Bishops that should be in all the large Dioceses save that one and restraining all the Parish-Ministers from true use of the Keys unless they will be ruin'd by it 3. By setting up Secular Courts under the name of Ecclesiastick and making it their Employment by 141 Canons which are their self-made Contrivances to hinder and ruine laborious Preachers and Men of tender Consciences and to cherish the contrary sort 4. By putting the decretive Power of the Keys into the Power of these Lay-Men 5. By setting up Pastors over all the Land without the consent of the Flock by the meer Will and Election of Great Men and Patrons 6. By driving unfit and unwilling persons to eat and drink Damnation in the Sacrament 7. By driving multitudes of good People from the needful means of their Salvation 8. By bringing good Men that grieve for all this into Odium for being against it And if this prove the case I had rather lie in Gaol till Death than Swear or Promise never to endeavour that I or any should repent and amend it Do you think it not contrary to our Baptismal Vow in which we promise Obedience to Christ to our lives end I read that the Israelites were greatly reproved for Worship in the High Places and that they seldom repented But I read not that ever they took an Oath or Covenant never to endeavour to amend I find that when Israel was made to Sin by the Calves of Dan and Bethel that they went on and amended not But I read not that they Covenanted or Sware never to amend I find that the Pharisees were heinous Sinners that by their Traditions made void the Law of God But many of them came to Iohn's Baptism and professed some Repentance and tho' obstinacy cut off the Nation of the Iews I read not that they drew the Nation into an Oath or Covenant never to amend When Christ came to save the World it was by a Covenant of Faith and Repentance And if I should see the World once confederate in a Covenant never to believe repent and amend I should call it the Kingdom of Satan and thence date our Accounts Chronological with a Regnante Diabolo as in France they did a while with a Regnante Christo. of which Vide Blondellum I do not say that these old Nonconformists were in the right nor that Bucer did no whit over-value the Discipline which he proposed to King Edward the Sixth nor that this Oath containeth all the foresaid guilt But I say If I should prove so and venture on it in uncertainty when the Judgment of so many Parliaments Lawyers Divines abroad and at home are against such kind of Swearing what a case should I bring my Soul into National Oaths especially such as seem to me to fix every Church-Office from the Arch-Bishop to the Official if not the Apparitor as unalterable in the very Constitution of the Kingdom even putting them before the State are Matters of greater Consequence than to be rashly ventured on by me Even the Long Parliament that made the silencing Acts restored not the Canon and Et caetera Oath of 1640. which bound Men never to consent to such Alteration of Church-Government by Arch-bishops Bishops Deans and Chapters Arch-deacons c. Chap. XXXIX Point XXXVI Of Subscribing and Swearing against the Position as Traiterous of taking Arms ly the King's Authority against those that are Commissioned by him in Pursuance of such Commission L. I Am sure you can have nothing against this unless by forced Exposition of the words M. I am sure that I abhor all forced Expositions and all Treason Rebellion and Sedition But here because you are a Lawyer I will come to you only as a Client or Learner intreating you to resolve all the common Objections that I may do what I do in Truth Judgment and Righteousness L. I doubt not but I shall easily resolve them all M. 1. Do you not believe that the first Clause that it is unlawful to take Arms against the King upon any pretence whatsoever doth extend also to this taking Arms against any Commission'd by him on any pretence whatsoever L. No doubt of it For this of not taking Arms against those Commission'd by him is but Expository of the former not taking Arms against
live in Peace and Christian Piety if all yea all Bishops and Priests were but agreed at the Heart what it is to be a Christian and whether the Gospel be certainly true and whether Christ be the Son of God or a deceiver and whether there be a Life after this and a Judgment of all according to their works Yea were they but heartily agreed that there is a God who is the Rewarder of them that diligently seek him and a punisher of the wicked The dispute seems to me to be whether we shall be Christians indeed or worldly Hypocrites called Christians and whether we shall use the Name of God Christ and Religion for Christ and Holiness or for the Flesh against Christ. L. You are very severe in your Censure M. I doubt some will find Christ more severe and be less able to endure his Censure than mine when he shall call some men to account for turning sacred Names and Offices and Ordinances against him to banish Conscience and serious Godliness to say nothing of Veracity common Honesty and Humanity out of the Church and turn his House of Prayer into a place of Merchandise and a Den of Thieves and tempt Turks and Heathens to hate Christians for their wickedness and to fly from the Christian Church lest they should lose all Religion Trustiness and Honesty or the Reputation of them But I speak not now of our Governours whom I leave to God. Chap. XLIII Point XL. Of forsaking our Ministry and ceasing to Preach the Gospel and Banishment Five Miles from Corporations M. THE last part of Ministerial Conformity which I named to you is that if we cannot conform to all aforesaid for fear of Damnation we must cease our Ministry and must not Preach Christs Gospel to any more than four besides our Family nor perform any Worship of God with more but in their way and we must neither dwell nor come within Five Miles of any Burgess Corporation or any place where-ever we lived or travelled and preached since the Act of Oblivion Otherwise we must lye in the common Goal L. Doubtless they that made this Law against you thought you very wicked intolerable men and thought your Preaching very dangerous And indeed so they say of you in the Preface of the Oxford Act. M. They do so and I am glad to find that falseness and wickedness as such is yet disowned in the World and that men do not glory in the very names of them It is a notable evidence that there is a Life of retribution that naughtiness is disowned by all Mankind and the worst would be thought and called honest and true and good and that the World would not Crucifie Christ nor Persecute and Murder his Apostles under the name of righteous holy men but under the name of Malefactors Enemies to Caesar Breakers of the Law and Pestilent Fellows that troubled the Peace and turned the World upside down The Devil himself dare not own the name of Lying Malignity and Murder nor of Persecuting Men for Truth and Goodness and Gods Cause And verily it seemeth the Controversie of many in this Age whether they that scarce speak of God but in Swearing and Cursing nor of Religion but in scorning or threatning the serious practisers of it and that savour little but Eating and Drinking to the full and Playing and getting Riches and hateing all that are stricter than they or those that make Gods Law their rule and Obedience to him the work of their Lives and his serious Worship their delight and Heaven their hope and dare not wilfully sin against God nor be Perjured or Lie I say which of these be the honester Men L. Put you cannot deny that your party hath preached the Nation into Rebellion for the Parliament against the King and therefore are justly sâ—spected till they repent M. 1. What mean you by our party If you mean Nonconformists to the present Laws of Conformity you are easily confuted For the Rebellion was over and the King restored before the present Conformity was Enacted And when there was no such Law there were no Nonconformists to it nor any such Party in being If you mean the old Nonconformists I answer you 1. They were part for the Parliament part against their War and part Neuters 2. There was a multitude of Conformist Ministers for the Parliament for one Nonconformist I have oft proved that there was at the beginning of that Parliament not many more Nonconformist Ministers left in England than were Counties if so many In the Westminster Asâ—eâ—ly there were but seven or eight Englishmen Most of the Sermons before the Parliament which are now most blamed were Preached by Conformists 3. Such as kept in and obeyed the Parliament and Usurpers did most of them Conform of 9000 or 10000 Ministers there were but two thousand that Conformed not And did meer turning to Conformity manifest Repentance 4. But I have oft and oft said if they will silence all that had any hand in Wars except the Conformists and no more we will thank them with great joy For I do not think there are forty that I say not twenty silenced Ministers alive in all England that had any hand in the War against the King. And it 's an odd kind of Justice that should eject and accuse so great a number for other mens Actions 5. But if our Doctrine be Seditious why should not we be allowed rather to Preach openly where Witnesses may convict us and the Law take hold on us than in secret to four where none can convict us 6. And how comes it to pass that whilst so many hundred Ministers are hunted and ruined for Preaching we hear of none at all punished for any False or Seditious Doctrine Do those that watch accuse and ruin us want will to find out our false or ill Doctrine while I am writing this the common talk is two poor Fellows accused such a one and two Beggars or poor Women that stood at the doors took their Oaths against such and such and such many Warrants granted to distrain for Forty Pound or Sixty Pound a Sermon on Ministers and People the Citizens Goods seized and carryed away their Shops made bare many laid in Jayls and thousands waiting for utter ruin of all they have and all this on the account of their Preaching and Hearing as without the Common Prayer and not a word among all these of any False Doctrine spoken 7. And Gods great mercy having of late years opened the Press the Nonconformists have Printed abundance of their Sermons that the World may see what Doctrine they Preached There are two Volumes of Morning Lectures at one place and two at another and one Volume of Lectures against Popery There is a great Volume of Mr. Charnock's Sermons and a great one and maâ—y lesser of Dr. Manton's many Folioâ—s of Mr. Anth. Burgesses divers of Dr. Bates divers of Mr. Richard Alleine's Dr. Gilpin of Temptations and abundance more You
just occasion to seek it 3. They say that there is no Church without a Bishop and that the Diocesan-Church is the least true political Church And if so he separateth not from any Church that separateth not from the Diocesan 4. These foresaid persons do nothing to forfeit the Communion of neighbour Churches therefore it is a sin and wrong to deny it them If it were proved an errour to avoid that as a sin which they avoid all mankind hath errours and to be over-fearful of Fire or Water or Plague or Poyson is a tolerable safe weakness and not like the sins that swarm in multitudes of tolerated Parishioners L. That which is not so immoral as Fornication Drunkenness Cursing and Swearing may be more hurtful to the Church and so deserve greater severity from Governours M. The Church-Keys are to be used with due relation to Heaven and those are to be taken in or cast out that Christ will take in or cast out from Heaven And if you think he will damn an obedient godly Christian for fearing to partake of the sin of wicked Priests or for fearing to be poysoned with love-killing Doctrine or for fearing the vain Worship of mens traditions rather than a prophane derider of Conscience and a filthy Fornicator Drunkard or Blasphemer I shall not think it worth my labour to dispute with you But men that take the Churches welfare to lie in the wealth and domination of such as they more than in the Holy Obedience Conscience and Piety of the People will object the same that you now do CHAP. LIII POINT X. Of Swearing never to endeavour any alteration of Government in the Church M. HOW far this extendeth objectively I before proved X. by 1. The words of the Oaths 2. The consent of the Bishops 3. And the words of the seven Canons and the Et Caetera Canon in 1640. so that there is no doubt of it 2. How far it extendeth as to the persons obliged I before told you and you may read 1. In the Corporation Act which imposeth it on all Corporations 2. In the Vestry Act which imposeth it on all Church-Vestries 3. In the Act of Vniformity which imposeth the subscription on all the Clergy 4. In the Oxford Act of Banishment which imposeth the Oath on Non-conformists and more 5. In the Militia Act which imposeth it on all the Military Commanders and Souldiers in the Land so that you may well say that is a National Covenant or Oath 3. What is amiss in the Church-Government that needeth an amending alteration I have so often told you that I will not repeat it Judge then what this Oath importeth L. It could never be the meaning of the Parliament that no man shall endeavour to amend the faults of any Officers Courts or Actions for they often amend their own Acts of Parliament and they reserve a Power in King and Parliament to make alterations even in Church Governments But that belongs not to the People nor should they endeavour it M. 1. I hope you will not confound Stated Offices and Mens Exercise of them in Practice I grant that they do not bind us by Oath never to endeavour that Bishops and all the Officers of their Courts may be honest men and slander and injure no man against Law c. But it is the Offices as here stated that are made thus far unalterable named in the Canon Arch-Bishops Bishops Deans Arch-Deacons and the rest that bear Office therein 2. I grant that the Law is made to bind none but Subjects and that an altering power is reserved to King and Parliament But it doth not follow that all the Subjects be not bound by it Though They may change Laws yet We may not And as you say They suppose that it belongeth not to the People to endeavour it Which We grant as to any Rebellious Seditious or otherwise unlawful Endeavour But whether God bind not all men in their own Place and Calling by Prayer Conference Elections of Officers Petition c. to endeavour to amend all Crying Dangerous Common Sins is a farther Question L. They cannot mean to exclude Petitioning for that is the Subjects Right and is by them allowed with Restraints M. 1. It is meant in opposition to the Scots Covenant which tyed men to oppose Popery Prelacy and Schisme only in their several Places and Callings 2. It is expres'd in the most universal terms without the least Exception by men that knew how to speak 3. Reasons were given in Parliament against any Limitation and those Reasons carryed it 4. They were Men that were wholly for the Church of England whose Canon had before Excommunicated themselves and all men that accused any Office in the Church Government as sinful And they knew that should any of them when the Parliament is risen yea or there so say he is an Excommunicate Man. 5. It is most certain that they intended to bind all Subjects on whom these Oaths are imposed even from petitioning or any other Endeavour of Alteration though they allow petitioning in other Cases for they intended to fix and secure the Church-Government against all Alterations 6. Therefore as I said before they joined it with yea and set it before State-Government in all their Oaths and Covenants And do you think in Conscience they left men at liberty to petition against Monarchy or against the Life or Power or Honour of the King Far be it from us to think so ill of them I must profess to you that I do not think half so ill of well-order'd Monasteries of Men or Women as I do of our large Diocesses or our Lay-Excommunicators according to the Canons And yet even in the Times of Popery the Nation was not Sworn never to endeavour any alteration of Monasteries If you would have all Corporations Soldiers Vestries Ministers sworn never to endeavour to cure the Sick to relieve the Poor to seek more Wealth to reform all Play-houses Ale-houses and Taverns to Catechize their Families c. I would not join with you National Oaths and Covenants are Matters of great moment We have deeply suffered by rashness in such already And should any of them prove false and wicked and the Nation be stigmatized with Perjury you might more sadly write Lord have Mercy on us on the Land than on the Doors where the most dreadful Plague prevaileth CHAP. LIV. POINT XI Of Swearing an Abhorrence of taking Arms against any Commissionated by the KING M. THis also I have said enough of in the Case of the XI Ministers and told you that we are far from scrupling it in Disloyalty but in Loyalty only 1. Lest the Keepers of the Seals may by Commissions depose the King or deliver up the Kingdom to whom they please 2. Because the Authority of a Commission as above and against the King 's own Law is not a matter that Lawyers and Judges themselves are agreed of and therefore unfit for the unskilful Vulgar to determine by their
Corn and Hay are all destroyed and the bloody War that is yet like to follow before the end I say do you think that all these are not a dear price to be paid for hindering men to Worship God only according to the Scripture Would leave to serve God only as Christ and his Apostles appointed and did themselves have cost the Emperour and People dearer than all this amounteth to 5. And the World knoweth that as Cromwel got his strength and usurpation in England by his Liberty of Conscience so the Turks won Constantinople and the Eastern Empire much by this For when their Emperours were become dissolute or cruel killing and deposing one another putting out their eyes and thrusting them into Monasteries forced Saints and when ambitious ungodly Bishops were still striving for superiority and persecuting Dissenters as not Orthodox and mutinous Souldiers pulling down Emperours and setting up others the poor Christians thought that to defend such a Government against the Turks that gave all men the Liberty of their own Religion would cost them dearer than it was worth and so were the more remiss in their resistance and the easilier yielded to the Conquerours Whereas had the Turks done as the Papists who make our extermination by our own Rulers a very part of their Religion the Greeks would have more resolutely resisted them in necessary self-defence And did not the Turks still give Liberty to Christians only restraining them from speaking against Mahometism do you think that the Greeks in all their Dominions would no more strive for their deliverance And that Transilvania Hungary Walachia Maldavia Croates and Cossacks Armenians Georgians Circassians Mengrelians Nestorians and Iacobites in so vast numbers would live so long quietly and patiently under them as they do All the great Conquerours of the World that are famous in History ever observed that sober policy to let Conquered Provinces enjoy their own Religion and mostly their own ancient Laws and inferiour Magistrates And then the People find the change so tolerable in the Supremacy as they the more easily yield with less resistance and continue their subjection with the greater quietness and peace The Iews in Christ's time and till they rebelled afterwards under Vespasian Titus and Adrian had so much of their own Religion and Law allowed them as was no small cause of their Crucifying Christ lest the name of a King sent from God such as they expected the Messiah to be should draw the People to such Insurrections as should provoke the Romans to deprive them of their Temples Religion and Laws and to destroy their place and nation And I hear by travellers that where the Turks yet allow their Provinces as in Transilvania their own Magistrates and Laws Religion prospereth almost as well as under Christian Sovereigns and far better than under the extirpating zeal or rather fury of persecuting Papist Princes I desire you therefore before you plead experience for your desolating way of Concord to study History better and be better informed of the case of the World. When I think but what men Bishop Wilkins and Judge Hale were that on my knowledge drew up an Act for the total cure of our English Church differences to which those called to it by the Lord Keeper Bridgman did on both sides consent I have thought it some defect of humility in some Clergy-men that took themselves to be so much wiser than these rare and excellent men as to judge that all our distractions sufferings and dangers by divisions are not so bad as the effect of these mens counsil would have been But I do with greater confidence ask you Whether those men seem to be serious and understanding Christians who think all the bloody Wars and tormenting Inquisition and the destruction of Love and Justice and good Works which are caused by Church-divisions in the World to be a less Mischief than it would be to ENDVRE CHRISTIANS TO SERVE GOD IVST AS CHRIST PRESCRIBED BY HIMSELF AND HIS APOSTLES AND TO VNITE ON THE TERMS ONLY WHICH HE AND THEY DID ORDAIN AND PRACTISE Shall we tell Turks and Heathens that it is no Wiser a Saviour that we trust in and no Wiser a Heavenly King that we obey And no Wiser Law and Gospel that He hath left us And is it any wonder then if they scorn both Him and us L. You are too hard for me I will talk with you no more M. It is Truth and Light that is too hard for you and woe to the foolish Enemies that are too hard for it and overcome themselves and their own happiness and hopes in overcoming it And woe to the World to Churches and Nations where such prevail L. But I advise you that you never think that all your Truth and Reason will do any great good on those that are against you For you cannot have while to say all this to many that you have said to me and if you should Print all this the contrary minded will scarcely Read the Title page or Contents but scorn it before they know what you have said and if they read it it will be all the way with a militant spirit of prejudice and hatred and only study what to say against it and Ignorance Passion Interest and Prejudice will answer all with Rage and confidence and only conclude that the Author is a Fool or Rogue or Rebel and it 's like enough answer you with an Excommunication or Iail where among Malefactors you shall lie and die If you speak for and not against their prâ—conceived Opinion and Interest they will hâ—ar you but if you speak agaiâ—st any of their worldly Wealth or Honour or Grandeâ—r you may almost as hopefully dispute an hungry Dog from his Carrion and you must not wonder if they snarl or fly upon you and tear you And though I confess that all your Proposals seem very consistent with your Aâ—tagonists wealth and greatness yet remember the truth of Seneca's words That Men that have a sore do not only start and complain when they are toucht but even when they think that they are toucht though it be not so There is no expectation of justice from suspicious Jealousie much less if it be animated by Interest and Malice M. My expectations are not much higher than your description But when my own life is so constantly a painful burden and I am so near the Grave I am utterly unexcusable if I think so short and painful a life too good to sacrifice by way of Obedience to the will of God who hath long and wonderfully preserved it and if I do not live and die with St. Paul's resolution Acts 20. 23 24. Bonds and Afflictions abide me but none of these things move me neither count I my life dear unto my self so that I might finish my Course with Ioy aâ—d the Ministry which I have received of the Lord Iesus to testifie the Gospel of the Grace of God. And indeed if all our bad Laws and Ceremonies
theirs Will you therefore silence all your Teachers and shut up all your Church-doors and give over worshipping God Do you think that your Priests and your Worship are without Fault yea or the Constitution of your Churches We are not able well to know what a Parish-Church is by its Materials that is who are of the Churches and who not 1. If it be all the Baptized Parishioners the Papists and Separatists are your Members If it be all such as are of no other Church then the Atheists Infidels Seducers and others that are of no Church indeed are of it 3. If it be only those that dwell and communicate there how small a part of your great Parishes are of the Church Yet are not these many Thousands declared to be out but are permitted without Censure and may come if they will Not only the Members but the Minister himself knoweth not who are of his Church for the far greater part till he see them come to the Altar and then most if they come must be utter strangers to him whom he never saw before How great a Number of Hobbists Infidels Papists and wicked Livers are amongst us your own Pens proclaim And may not these come to the Altar when they please This is spoken only to convince you that if all this may be born the supposed sin of fearing sin in a thing call'd indifferent deserveth not Excommunication or Destruction Q. 17. Is not the Fear of God the beginning of Wisdom And doth not this contain a Fear of sinning And is not this commendable and to be cherished Is not God above man and first to be obeyed and most feared Hath man any Power but what God hath given him and hath God given any against himself or his own Laws or for destruction of his Fear If Conscience towards God be once driven away is any man to be trusted Will not the unconscionable do any thing for worldly Interest Q 18. Is it not an unmanly sort of impudence in them that many years perswade the world that those same men make Schisms by forbearing only such things as they confess to be no sin who have twenty years ago Protested that nothing but sinning is refused by them and did then give in a Catalogue of several sins which they undertook to prove such And should those same men that have read or may do The King 's Gracious Declaration about Ecclesiastical Affairs 1660. and the London Ministers printed Thanks-giving for it and the many late Books in which we have told men what it is which we dare not conform to I say should these still take on them that they cannot know it and call out still What is it that you stick at And what is it that would satisfy you Yea those that cannot bear that we should tell them Q. 19. Do you think that the King who then past that Declaration in which the Non-Conformists who sought it with thankfulness acquiesc't as in terms of happy Concord and the House of Commons who gave him thanks or the Bishops and Clergy who after rejected it and procured the new Act of Uniformity and such other did take the way to have United Protestants and to have prevented our present sad divisions Q. 20. Hath not Dr. Burnet in his History of the Regale fully proved that the choice of Bishops and Pastors for many hundred years was in the People and the Clergy And do you think in your Consciences that if a good Gentleman build and endow a Church all men must ever after trust the Pastoral conduct of their Souls with such Priests only as his Posterity or any man that will buy the Advowson shall present Will not Drunkards Fornicators malignant haters of Holy Life choose men as fit for their turn as will be admitted And do you think in your Consciences that all the Patrons now in England are either fit or by Christ allowed to be choosers of all those Pastors that all men in England must take up with Do you not know that Preaching converteth not like a Charm nor is the Devil cast out of Souls as by the words of an Exorcist It requireth great skill and care to convince sinners and instruct resolve confirm and comfort Souls There is as great difference of Teachers as of Physicians And Souls are unspeakably more precious than Bodies And it 's said of too many rash and unskillful Physicians that the difference between them and Souldiers is that they kill their Friends who pay them for it when Souldiers kill but their enemies What Power Princes and Patrons have of things Dedicated to God as Temples and Tithes Lands we presume not to dispute But these are not to inseparable from the Pastoral-office that the People must trust their Souls only on their Pastoral care to whom the Patron will give the Tithes and Temples Had men so setled maintenance on Physicians for every Parish we would not therefore trust our lives on the unskillful or negligent because either Prince or Patron choose him And if you would not say to such You shall have the Physician which the Patron chooseth or none Why should you say so of the Pastor Q. 21. Are we not of the same Religion with the Magistrates and Bishops In what one Article of Faith do we differ except the new one of the undoubted Salvation of all dying Baptized Infants not excepting those of Atheists or Infidels and this as certain by God's Word almost all parts of the Christian World Greeks Papists Protestants Nestorians Iacobites Arminians c. do charge one another with Heresy or false Doctrine while Conformists charge no such thing on the Non-conformists but only dissenting from the modes of worship and discipline which they impose And would you have all the Christian World forbid one another to Worship God till they all agree If not where yet their differences are so great why must they be forbidden it who differ not in points of Faith from the Churches Articles at all Q. 22. It is forbidden that more than four meet to VVorship God in other manner than according to the Liturgy and practice of the Church of England If by other manner be meant with any other positive manner of Worship I see none that do it otherwise For Reading of Scripture Praying Preaching Singing Psalms are all done in the Parish-Churches But if oâ—her manner extend to every omission of any appointed part of the Liturgy all Parish-Churches where I come do it in other manner And shall all the Lords Gentlemen and People be therefore punished as Conventiclers The Non-conformists where I come use most of the Liturgy that is The Psalms two Chapters the Lords Prayer the Creed the Commandments the Singing Psalms some of them more Must all go out of the Church if the Curate omit part If by otherwise be meant with any other accidents or circumstances the Church of England agreeth not in all such and can be no rule therein to the Non-conformists Cathedral