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england_n	according_a	advice_n	affair_n	23	3	6.4850	4	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A85090	The false and scandalous remonstrance of the inhumane and bloody rebells of Ireland, delivered to the Earl of St. Albans and Clanrickard, the Earl of Roscomon, Sir Maurice Eustace Knight, and other His Majesties Commissioners at Trim, the 17. of March, 1642. to be presented to His Majesty, by the name of The remonstrance of grievances presented to His Majestie in the behalf of the Catholicks of Ireland. ... Together with an answer thereunto, on behalf of the Protestants of Ireland. Also a true narration of all the passages concerning the petition of the Protestants of Ireland. ... August 27. 1644. It is this day ordered by the Committee of the House of Commons in Parliament concerning Printing, that the books, intituled, An answer presented to His Majestie at Oxford, unto the false and scandalous remonstrance of the inhumane and bloody rebells of Ireland; together with A narration of the proceedings at Oxon, be forthwith printed and published: John White.		1644 (1644)	Wing F343; Thomason E255_2; ESTC R210053	139,001	137

with instructions from His Majesties protestant subjects of Ireland and had exhibited a petition and propositions to his Majesty who had promised them a gracious hearing and that they heard that the Rebells Agents were somewhat neare a dispatch and therefore entreated them who as they understood were to be admitted to attend the Lords of the Committee for Irish affairs that afternoone that they would move their Lordship that the protestant Agents who had diver a things of great consequence to offer to their Lordships might be admitted to a full hearing before matters proceeded too farce His Majesty having promised them a gracious hearing and they having attempted many other meanes to obtaine the same and that their Lordships would admit the said protestants Agents to see a copy of what was moved by the rebells being also ready to deliver a Copy of the Protestants Agents propositions The next day Sir George Radcliff sent for the Protestant Agents and in the presence of Sir William Stewart and the rest of the Gentlemen aforenamed he told them that they had acquainted the Lords of the Committee with their desires and that their Lordships commanded them to returne this answer that their Lordships tooke it ill that the said Agents were so forward in prejudicating the Kings Justice and their Lordships and that they should be heard at large before any conclusion were and said further that themselves were thought too forward to present such a request but as to the Protestants Agents desire of having a coppy of the rebells propositions they received no answer The first of May the Protestant Agents were commanded to attend the said Committee for Irish affaires at the audit Chamber in Oxford which accordingly they did The Lords of the Committee then present being the Lord Cottington the Earle of Bristol the Earle of Portland the Lord George Dagby Sir Edward Nicholas Sir Iohn Culpepper and Sir Edward Hade At which time their Lordships caused to be read the Protestants Petition and their propositions presented to His Majesty and the Instructions from the Protestants of Ireland and the order of the Commons house of the Parliament of Ireland of the 17 of February 1643. Declaring the concurrence of that house to the said petition but the Collections made in answer of the Remonstrance of the Irish which would have disproved their untrue pretences was not read Then the E. of Bristol told the said Agents that both the King and themselves were sensible of the prejudicate opinion which the said Agents had of their Iustice by their pressures to be heard and by their beliefe of vulgar reports That the said Agents could not be more carefull of the Protestants and Protestant Religion then their Lordships were To which the said Agents answered that if they had erred in pressing to be heard it was but out of their zeale to the service and for the preservation of the remnant of the poore Protestants of Ireland who intrusted them and out of a desire that His Majesty and their Lordships might be rightly informed of the past sufferings and present deplorable condition of the Protestants there which the said Agents humbly desired might be no otherwise represented to his Majesty and that they might be admitted to the proofe of the particulars contained in the said Protestant Petition which they humbly conceived to be of greatest concernment to them in discharge of their trust whereupon the said Agents were bidden to withdraw and soone after were called in againe and commanded to subscribe the propositions which they had formerly presented to His Majesty and were that day read before their Lordships which they did and the same day they were appointe in the afternoone to attend the Lord Priimate the Lord Bishop of Downe Sir Geo. Radcliff and others and there Sir George Radcliff cold them that they were commanded by the Committee for Irish affaires to let them know how ill they tooke the height and unreasonablenesse of their said Propositions and to deliver them this ensuing message First that their Lordships did not think that the Propositions presented by the pretestant Agents to His Majesty and that morning read before their Lordships were the sence of the Protestants of Ireland Secondly That those Propositions were not agreeable to the Instructions given the said Agents by the protestants of Ireland Thirdly That as those Propositions were drawn they would lay a prejudice on His Majesty and His Ministers to posterity these remaining on record if a Treaty should go on and a peace follow which the Kings necessity did enforce and that the Lords of the Committee apprehended the said Agents did flatly oppose a peace with the Irish Fourthly That it would be impossible for the King to grant the Protestant Agents desires and grant a Peace to the Irish Fifthly That the Lords of the Committee desired the protestant Agents to propose a way to effect their desires either by force or treaty considering the condition of His Majesties affaires in England To which Message the Protestant Agents gave Answer to this effect TO the first that they humbly conceived that the Propositions which they had presented to his Majesty were the sense of the Protestants of Ireland To the second that the propositions were agreeable to the Instructions given to the said Agents by the protestants of Ireland and conduced to the well settlement of that Kingdome To the third that they had no thought to draw prejudice on His Majesty or their Lordships by putting in those propositions neither had they so soone put in propositions had not his Majesty by his Answer to the Protestant petition directed the same To the fourth the said Agents humbly conceived that they were imployed to make proofe of the effect of the protestants Petition to manifest the inhumane Cruelties of the Rebells and then to offer such things as they thought fit for the security of the protestants in their Religion lives liberties and fortunes That the said Protestants had no disaffection to peace so as punishment be inflicted according to law as in the propositions are expressed and that the said pretestants might be repaired for their great losses out of the estates of the rebells not formerly by any Acts of this present Parliament in England otherwise disposed of which the said Agents desired might be represented to his Majesty and the Lords of the Committee accordingly To the fifth that the said protestant Agents were strangers to his Majesties affaires in England and conceived that part more proper for the advice of his Councells then the said Agents and therefore desired to be excused from medling in the Treaty further then the manifesting of the truth of the protestant petition and proposing in the behalfe of the protestants according to the Instructions given them which the said Agents were ready to preforme whensoever they should be admitted thereunto And having read them before their Lordships c. Sir George Radcliff told the said Agents that while they continued so

from the Lords Justices Notification to be given to the Countrey of your Majesties goodnesse and bounty intended and shewed to the people which might have tended to their great satisfaction Whereas the Lords Justices never denyed them any such thing But De facto did forthwith write to all the Ports in the Kingdome with briefes of those graces concerning matters of Customes which that season most required Commanding the Officers punctually to obey those his Majesties directions They also published Proclamations for the sending away of Wooll and what Customes was to be paid for the same And sent severall Letters to all the Ports of the Kingdome to publish the same And sent warrants for free entries of all Tobacco brought in or to be brought in at all the Ports and what Custome to be paid They gave order for drawing a Bill for repeale of the preamble of the Act of Subsidies They also desired Sir Iames Montgomerie and Sir William Cole two of the Committee then returned if they could overtake the Assises in the Counties of Vlster to give publicke notice to all the undertakers what your Majestie had graciously granted and intended to them which they undertook to doe They had formerly sent over the Bill for the generall pardon which was all that for that short time could be done specially the Terme and the next Session being so neere aswell for passing the Acts then newly come over as upon deliberate consultation in the meane time to prepare for an orderly execution and publication of the rest of those graces Most of the rest of the graces being to be executed there in Dublin and in the Courts The Committee also and the few others of the Members of the House remaining then in Dublin being very urgent to goe to their houses which they suddenly did But it appeared soone after that those Remonstrants and their party had other intentions and determined to be their owne carvers aswell of your Majesties Rents and Subsidies then in the Collectors hands as of all the goods substance and estates of your Majesties Brittish and Protestant subjects which intenon they within a few dayes after fully put in practise As to the prodigious tale mentioned in the eight Article of dangerous 8. Article and pernitious Petitions to the Parliament in England pretended to be contrived by the foure persons named in this Article and signed by many thousands of a malignant party which Petitions they say were made knowne at Assizes and other publicke places containing as they pretend matters destructive to the Catholiques their Religion lives and estates This allegation exceeds all the rest in malice and untruth and certainly if ever there were such a Petition as there was not it is wonderfull being signed as they say it was by many thousands that to this houre no Copy thereof can be shewed by any But these Remonstrants care not what detractions how untrue and improbable soever they print or publish against those they hate for the truth is those foure persons never contrived or advised joyntly or severally and such Petitions or indeed any Petitions to that Parliament But to open this Trojane Hourse the truth is That about the thirteenth of August 1641. The Lords Justices and Counsell having intelligence out of the County of Tyrone that a Petition to the Parliament of England framed as it after appeared by some Protestants in Dublin was carried up and downe in those parts to gather hands their Lordship 's not knowing what it was and doubting it might be some such thing that might breed distemper in those Inhabitants Did by their Letter dated the said thirteenth of the same August pray and require the Lord Bishop of Clogher to take that Petition and carry it to the Justices of Assize then in the Countrey and to wish them to proceed thereupon as they should thinke fit according to law And after the Assizes ended to send it up to the Lords Justices and Counsell All which was done and the Petition then sent up and ever since remaines in the hands of the Clerkes of the Counsell Now lately in the yeare 1643. it was discovered to the Commissioners for Ecclesiasticicall causes That one Partington of Dublin had a Petition framed in the name of severall Inhabitants in and about the Citie of Dublin and some few parishes within the Diocesse of Laughlyn whereupon he being cited and examined produced the draught of that Petition which upon view appeared to be the same in substance with that which remaineth in the Clearke of the Counsells hands which Petition contained no matter destructive to the said Catholiques their Religion lives or estates but doth rather lay accusations of some disorders and remissnes in the Protestant Clergie as appeares by the Copie of the said Petition which followeth in these words To the Honourable the Knights Citizens and Burgesses of the Commons House of Parliament assembled in England The humble Petition of severall the Protestants inhabiting and now residing in and about the City of Dublin and in some few Parishes within the Diocesse of Laughlin and Fearnes in the Realme of Ireland In all humblenesse sheweth THat whereas the Protestant Religion was generally received in the said Realme of Ireland in the beginning of the raigne of our late Soveraigne Lady Queene Elizabeth of famous memorie as by severall good Lawes and Statutes then made and established by Parliament for restoring the Crowne to the Antient Iurisdiction over the estate Ecclesiasticall and Spirituall for abolishing all Forraigne power and authoritie out of the said Realme and for uniformity of Prayer and administration of the Sacraments within the said Kingdome may appeare By which Lawes all Ecclesiasticall persons and Officers Iudges Iustices Mayors and temporall Officers are enjoyned to take the Oath of Supremacie and all persons mhatsoever required on Sundayes and Holidayes to repaire to Church upon the severall paynes therein limited and expressed And whereas ever since the making of the said Statutes it hath beene the care of our dread Soveraigne the constant Defender of the Faith and his most noble Predecessors tohave his people governed according to those and other the laudable Lawes of England and Ireland And whereas both the Protestants Clergie and Laitie have heretofore contributed to his Majesties occasions towards the free Gifts of one hundred and fifty thousand pounds and likewise by an other gift of one hundred and twenty thousand pounds more during the Government of the Lord Viscount Fauckland as largely as the Papists and after in or about the next ensuing Government of Lords Iustices to the Gift of forty thousand ounds and the Protestant Laytie likewise contributed to the six intire Subsidies in the tenth yeare of his Majesties reigne which Subsidies in the Collection amounted to two hundred and fiftie thousand pounds besides the eight intire Subsidies of foure shillings in the pound granted to his Majestie the same yeare by the Protestant Clergie In all which payments as in all other publike charges

third in Leinster about Dublin and those parts when the Castle and Citie of Dublin was preserved there was a generall change in all former Counsells yet afterwards the said Garrett Barry and all his men went into Rebellion and so did most of the souldiers and officers of the other two Regiments Besides on the twenty third day of October one thousand six hundred forty one The Rebells in Vlster when they spoiled and murthered the English said with one voyce that Dublin was taken Also are to bee remembred the severall Antecedents to this Rebellion aswell in print as in words uttered by Romish Clergie men and some Laicks that within three yeares a generall Rebellion should be in Ireland mentioned in the printed Deposition of Doctor Iones And in the moneth of October before the execution of this Plott It was consulted in a great Assembly in the Countie of Westmeath at or neere Multifernam consisting as well of the prime Popish Clergie as of the lay Gentrie what should bee done with the Brittish and Protestants whether to murther and kill them all or to kill some and spoile and banish the rest or only to spoyle pillage and banish all And how your Majestie should be limmited in your Revenewes Rights and Authorities as more at large appeares in the said Doctors examination The like Discoveries of the generall Combination appeares in the Digest framed and collected by the Commissioners for examining the spoyles and murthers committed upon the Protestants by the Rebells tendered there by Master Watson and others of those Commissioners and sent over to your Majesties principall Secretarie It appeares also by examinations sent up by the late Lord President of Munster in the beginning of this Rebellion that about the twenty three of October 1641. the taking of the Castle of Dublin and other your Majesties Forts in Vlster c. was then muttered in that Province for a while after in shew quiet And the like in Connaught though at that time neither of those had heard any thing of the discovery from Dublin nor many dayes after By all which is somewhat plaine That the Conspiracy was generall and that the three Provinces stood not so cleare and quiet in November as in this Article is insinuated The Remonstrants being carefull to leave nothing unobjected that malice or Art can invent doe suggest that the Lords Justices and their adherents who those were is not yet knowne well knowing that many powerfull members of the Parliament in England stood in opposition to your Majestie made their principall addresses to them full fraught with calumnies against those Catholiques First it is conceived that there was no such opposition given to your Majestie as in the Article is mentioned when this Rebellion began your Majesty being then in Scotland bestowing your Grace and Royall presence on your Subjects there Neither at that time was any difference heard there betweene your Majesty and your Parliament in England save what concerned the Earle of Strafford whom the Remonstrants most violently prosecuted Secondly the Lords Justices and Counsell did first addresse their advertisement of this Rebellion not to the Parliament of England as the Remonstrants pretend but to your Majestie on the twentie five of October 1641. And to your Majesties then Lievtenant of that Kingdome to whom all addresses thence were to bee made by your Majesties Order A Copie of which Letters to the Lord Lievtenant they then sent to your Majesty and by the answer of that dispatch they were advertised that your Majesty had sent to the Parliament of England concerning that affaire and that your Majesty doubted not of their speedy resolution for releife of your Majesties faithfull Subjects The next dispatch sent away by the Lords Justices and Counsell into England or Scotland was on the fift of November 1641 at which time they directed letters to the Lords of your Majesties privy Counsell in England and considering that your Majesty was then in Scotland and that it then became of absolute necessity to invoke all the powers that might stand with your Majesties honour and good pleasure from whom any deliverance could come to assist for preservation of your Majesties Crowne and Kingdome They then also and not before directed letters to the speakers of both houses of Parliament in England referring the particulars to the Lords of the Counsells letters and moving for succours and then also they sent a dispatch to your Majesty into Scotland and enclosed therein copies of their severall letters to the Lords of the Counsell and both the Speakers and then also signified by their letters to the Lords of the Counfell that they had so written to both the Speakers And touching the denying of Armes to the Catholiques and arming the Malignant party who in the Remonstrants esteeme are all your Majesties Brittish and Protestant Subjects in Ireland though there never appeared any Malignity in them in the least degree either to your Majesty or your government or to these pretended Catholiques quatenus Catholiques True it is that many Roman Catholiques aswell as Protestants were armed by the Lords Justices and Counsell when they were listed into your Majesties Army to defend your Majesties Kingdome rights and government against those confederate Catholiques in the beginning of this Rebellion whose plot and designe was to surprise your Majesties Castle of Dublin and your Monition and stores there and all the rest of your Forts and stores in that Kingdome to extirpate all your Majesties Brittish and Protestant Subjects by death or exile and further as is before mentioned Note there were but ●00 armes in the store It is true also that the Lord Justices and Counsell did deliver Armes and Ammunition as farre as they could possible spare aswell to the Roman Catholiques as Protestant Subjects for defence of their houses in severall parts and in great numbers They did also deliver to the five Counties of the Pale Armes and Ammuniton for 1700 men for defence of those Countryes although your Majesty was no way bound to furnish them with armes for their owne defence and some of those armes upon notice of the defection of those trusted with them were recovered and brought backe and the rest soone after imployed by the confederats to fight against your Majestie and your Armyes And for the Cotholiques in the City of Dublin of whose ancient fidelity in the beginning of this Rebellion the Lords Justices and Counsell were fully perswaded they were not disarmed till most of the Catholiques of the Pale declared themselves in open Rebellion against your Majestie which the Lords Justices and Counsell finding and considering that those Inhabitants of Dublin were for the most part allied matched with the gentry and considerable Inhabitants of the Pale That some of them sent daily intelligence to the Rebels sent them provisions of victualls and otherwayes and sundry of them of good substance went to the Rebels with their goods That great numbers of the Popish prentizes servants and

call by the name of publique uses to be in equall degree to the debts owing by the Rebels and by them all forfeited and many of them by Law duely levyed which is a most unequall and unjust thing and the said Proposition cannot nor doth make offer to have the popish Confederates cut off from the debts due to them which they have justly forfeited but onely for a colour of consideration to have the Protestants lose such debts justly due to them as have been unjustly taken from them who have done no act at all to forfeit them 6. Proposition That the late Offices taken or found upon feigned or old titles since the yeere 1634. to entitle your Majestie to severall Countreys in Connaught Thomond and in the Counties of Typperarie Limrick Kilkenny and Wickloe be vacated and taken off the file and the possessors setled and secured in their ancient estates by Act of Parliament And that the like Act of limitation of your Majesties titles for the security of the estates of your Subjects in that Kingdom be passed in the said Parliament as was enacted in the 21 yeere of His late Majesties Raigne in this Kingdom Ans Wee know not of any Offices found on feigned Titles nor what the Confederates may demand in respect of any graces promised by your Majestie which we intend not nor have any occasion to dispute but wee humbly conceive that all those who have committed Treason in the late Rebellion subsequent to your Majesties promise of those graces have thereby forfeited the benefit thereof together with the Lands to which the said graces might else have related and so their whole estates are now justly fallen to your Majesty by their Rebellion which wee conceive is of great importance for your Majesties service to be taken into consideration As first with regard to the Statutes made in the present Parliament of England Secondly by the necessary encrease of your Revenue decayed by the present Rebellion Thirdly the abolishing of the evill customes of the Irish and preservation of Religion Laws and Government there Fourthly the satisfaction of your Protestant Subjects losses in some measure Fiftly the Arrers of your Majesties Army and other debts contracted for that warre and for preservation of that Kingdome to your Majestie Sixtly the bringing in of more Brittish upon the Plantations Seventhly the building of some walled Towns in remote and desolate places for the security of that Kingdome and your good Subjects there Eightly the taking of the Natives from their former dependencie on their Chieftains who usurped an absolute power over them to the diminution of your Regall Power and to the oppression of the Inferiours 7. Propos That all marks of incapacity imposed upon the Natives of that Kingdome to purchase or acquire Lands Leases Offices or Hereditaments be taken away by act of Parliament and the same to extend to the securing of Purchases Leases or Grants already made And that for the education of Youth an Act be passed in the next Parliament for the erecting of one or more Inns of Court Vniversities Frée and Common Schools Ans This we conceive concerneth some of the late Plantations and no other part of that Kingdome and that the restriction herein mentioned is found to bee of great use especially for the indifferencie of Trialls strength of the Government and for Trade and Traffique And we humbly conceive that if other Plantations shall not proceed for the setling and securing of that Kingdome and that no restraint be made of Papists buying or purchasing of the Protestants out of their former Plantations where they were prudently setled though now cast out of their estates by the late Rebellion and unable to Plant the same again for want of meanes and therefore probably upon easie termes will part with their estates to the Confederates that those Plantations will be destroyed to the great prejudice of your Majesties service and endangering of the safety of that Kingdome Touching bearing of Offices wee humbly conceive that their non-conformity to the Laws and Statutes of that Kingdome is the onely mark of incapacity imposed upon them and wee humbly conceive that they ought not to expect to bee more capable there then the English Natives are here in England in like case For Schooles in Ireland there are divers setled in all parts of that Kingdome already by the Laws and Statutes of that Realme And if any person well affected shall erect and endow any more Schooles there at their own charges so that the School-master and schollers may be governed according to the Laws Customs and orders of England and the best of Free-schools here wee cannot apprehend any just exceptions thereunto But touching Universities and Inns of Court we humbly conceive that this part of the Proposition savoureth of some desire to become Independant upon England or to make a separation in the Religion and Laws of the Kingdome which can never bee truely happie but in the good unitie of both in the true Protestant Religion and in the Laws of England For as for matter of charge such of the Natives as are desirous to breed their sonnes for learning in Divinity can bee well contented to send them to the Universitie of Lovain Doway and other Popish places in Forraign Kingdomes And for Civill-law or Physick to Padua and other places which draws a great treasure yearly out of your Majesties Dominions but will send few or none of them to Oxford or Cambridge where they might as cheaply be bred up and become as learned which course we conceive is holden out of their pride and disaffection towards this Kingdome and the true Religion here professed And for the Laws of the Land which are for the Common-law agreeable to England and so for the greatest part of the Statutes the Innes of Court in England are sufficient and the Protestants came thither without grudging And it is a means to civilize them after the English Customes to make them familiar and in love with the Language and Nation to preserve the Law in the purity when the Professours of it shall draw from one originall fountain and see the manner of the practise of it in the same great Channells where his Majesties Courts of Justice of England do flow most clearly whereas by separation of the Kingdoms in the places of their principall instruction when their foundations in learning are to be laid a degenerate corruption in Religion and Justice may happily be introduced and spread with much more difficulty to be corrected and restrained afterwards by any discipline to be used in Ireland or punishments there to be inflicted for departing from the true grounds of things which are best preserved in unity when they grow out of the same root then if such Universities and Innes of Court as are proposed should be granted All which we humbly submit to your Majesties most pious and prudent confideration and judgement 8. Propos That the Offices and places of Command Honour Profit

and Trust within that Kingdome be conferred upon Romane Catholiques Natives in equallity and indifferencis with your Majesties other Subjects Answ We humbly conceive that the Romane Catholique Natives in Ireland may have the like Offices and Places as the Romane Catholiques Natives of England here have and not otherwise Howbeit we conceive that in the generallity they have not deserved so much by their late Rebellion Therefore wee see not why they should be endowed with any new or further Capacities or Priviledges then they have by the Laws and Statutes now in force in that Kingdome 9. Propos That the insupportable oppression of your Subjects by reason of the Court of Wards and respit of homage be taken away and a certain Revenew in lieu thereof fetled upon your Majestie without diminution of your Majesties profits Answ We know of no oppression by reason of the Court of Wards and we humbly conceive that the Court of Wards is of great use for theraising of your Majesties Revenews the preservation of your Majesties Tenures and chiefly the education of the Gentry in the Protestant Religion and in civility of learning and good manners who otherwise would be brought up in ignorance and barbarisme their estates be ruined by their kindred and friends and continue their dependencie on the chief Lords to the great prejudice of your Majesties service and Protestant Subjects And there being no colour of exception to your Majesties just Title to Wardships we know not why the taking away of your Court concerning the same should be so pressed unlesse it bee to prevent the education of the Lords and Gentry that fall Wards in the Protestant Religion For that part of this Proposition which concerneth respit of Homage we humbly conceive it reasonable that some way may be setled for that if it stand with your Majesties good pleasure without prejudice to your Majestie or your Protestant Subjects 10. Propos That no Lord not estated in that Kingdome or estated and not resident shall have Vote in the said Parliament by proxie or otherwise and none admitted to the House of Commons but such as shall be estated and resident within the Kingdome Answ Wee humbly conceive that in the year 1641. by the graces which your Majestie then granted to your Subjects of Ireland the matter of this Proposition was in a fair way regulated by your utter abolishing of blank Proxies and limitting Lords present and attending in the Parliament of Ireland that no one of them should bee capable of more Proxies then two and prescribing the Peers of that Kingdome not there resident to purchase fitting proportions of Land in Ireland within five years from the last of July 1641. or else to lose their Votes till they should make such purchases which purchases by reason of the troubles happening in that Kingdome and which have continued for two years and a half have not peradventure yet been made And therefore your Majestie may now bee pleased and may take just occasion to enlarge the time for five years from the time when that Kingdome may again bee setled in a happy and firme peace And as to Members of the House of Commons the same is most fit as wee humbly conceive to be regulated by the Laws and Statutes of that Kingdome 11. Propos That an Act bée passed in the next Parliament declaratory that the Parliament of Ireland is a frée Parliament of it self independent of and not subordinate to the Parliament of England And that the Subjects of Ireland are immediatly subject to your Majesty as in right of your Crown And that the Members of the said Parliament of Ireland and all other the Subjects of Ireland are independent and no way to bée ordered or concluded by the Parliament of England and are onely to bée ordered and governed within that Kingdome by your Majestie and such Governors as are or shall be there appointed and by the Parliament of that Kingdome according to the Laws of the Land Answ This Proposition concerns your Majesties high Courts of Parliament both of England and Ireland and is beyond our abilities who are not acquainted with the Records and Presidents of this nature to give any answer unto and therefore we humbly desire your Majesties pardon for not answering unto the same 12. Propos That the assumed power of jurisdiction in the Councell boatd of determining of all manner of Causes be limitted to matters of State and all Pattents Estates and Grants illegally and extrajudicially avoyded there or elsewhere bée left in state as before and the parties grieved their heirs or assignes till legall eviction Answ The Councell-Table hath alwaies exercised jurisdiction in some cases ever since the English Government was setled in that Kingdome and is of so long continuance in cases of some natures as the beginning thereof appeareth not which seemeth to be by prescription and hath always been armed with power to examine upon Oath as a Court of Justice or in nature of a Court of Justice in Cases of some natures and may bee very necessary still in many Cases especially for the present till your Majesties Lawes may more generally bee received in that Kingdome And we conceive that Board is so well limitted by Printed Instructions in your Majesties Royall Fathers time and by your Majesties graces in the 17. year of your Reign that it needeth for the present little or no further Regulating at all howbeit they humbly refer it to your Majesties great wisdome and goodnesse to do therein as to Law and Justice shall appertaine Propos 13. That the Statute of the 11.12 and 13. yéer of Quéen Elizabeth concerning Staple commodities be repealed reserving to his Majesty lawfull and just poundage and a book of Rates to be setled by an indifferent Committée of both Houses for all Commodities Answ The matter of this Proposition is setled in a fitting and good way by your Majestie already as we conceive amongst the graces granted by your Majesty to your people of Ireland in the 17 year of your Majesties Reign to which we humbly refer our selves Propos 14. That in as much as the long continuance of the chief Governour or Governours of that Kingdome in that place of so great eminency and power hath béen a principall occasion that much Tyranny and oppression hath béen exercised upon the Subjects of that Kingdome That your Majestie will be pleased to continue such Governours hereafter but for thrée years And that none once imployed therein be appointed for the same again until the expiration of six years next after the end of the said thrée yéers And that an Act passe to dis-inhable such Governour or Governours during their Government directly or indirectly in Vse Trust or other wise to make any manner of purchase or Acquisition of any Manners Lands Tenements or Hereditaments within that Kingdome other then from your Majesty your heirs or successors Ans We humbly conceive that this Proposition tendeth to lay a fals and scandalous