THE PROGENIE OF CATHOLICKS AND PROTESTANTS Whereby On the one side is proued the lineal Descent of Catholicks for the Roman Faith and Religion from the holie Fathers of the Primitiue Church euen from Christ's verie time vntil these our dayes AND On the other the neuer-Being of Protestants or their nouel Sect during al the foresayd time otherwise then in confessed and condemned Hereticks And al this is conuinced by the manifold and clearest acknowledgements of Protestant Writers both forrain and domesticks By thine owne mouth I iudge thee naughtie seruant Luc. 19.22 At ROVEN By the WIDOW of NICOLAS COVRANT M.DC.XXXIII THE PREFACE TO THE CHRISTIAN READER I Haue euer been of opinion good Christian Reader that as nothing in this world is more pleasing to the eye of a Christian soule then a pure aspect or knowledge of the true Church which is the louelie and most beautiful Spouse of CHRIST himself and the onlie Arke of Man's saluation so is the same neuer more clearly represented vnto vs then in the cristallin glasse of reuerend Antiquitie the puritie and truth wherof was euer so highly esteemed as that it was not only required (1) Censorinus de Die Nat. c. 1. by the Lying Gods of the Gentils that al the firstlings of the people should yearely be offred in Sacrifice vnto them but it was further likewise approued and (2) Exod. 22 29. prescribed by the only-true and euerliuing GOD that the first-fruits yea and the first-borne both of men and beasts in regard of their primacie being his worthiest creatures should peculiarly be applyed offred and deuoted to the highest seruice of his Greatest Maiestie In best proof and example wherof the perfect [3] Coloss 1.15 Image of the inuisible God the first-borne of al creature CHRIST IESVS was not only offred to God himself in the Temple and there redeemed but also offred vpon the Crosse for the Redemption of others as the sweetest Holocaust to his Heauenlie Father Yea this Prioritie or Ancestrie is so specially affected by the wisdome of God and so directly maligned by the Enemie of man as that in the verie first planting of the Church of Christ it is sayd that he first sowed (4) Matth. 13.24.25 good seed in his field and after the enemie came and ouersowed cockle thereby not obscurely intimating vnto vs that true Faith Religion and the Word of God which is this [5) Matth 13.19 Luc. 8.12 good seed was first and ancient to Sects and Heresies And so as in temporal Nobilitie that Stemme is most honourable which is lineally deriued from the ancientest bloud and in earthlie possessions that Title strongest which pleadeth longest Prescription or ancientest Euidence and as also it may not be denyed but that Truth hath precedencie to falshood and substance to shadowes so must it needs be granted or rather supposed as an infallible truth that that Ghospel Faith and Church which is first or eldest is the only true Ghospel Faith and Church of CHRIST and al other Congregations afterwards arising or going out from thence are but only the malignant inuentions of the Enemie who euen from the beginning of the world was chiefly euer busyed in obscuring peruerting and detorting that which at first was alwaies created [6) Genes 1.31 very good very gracious and most pleasing in the al-seing Eye of the Omnipotent Maker In which respect for the euer finding out of the prime truth in al occurring difficulties we are specially forewarned as to recurre to Antiquitie so to suspect Noueltie Moyses a litle before his death desiring to leaue some holesome documents to the Children of Israel directeth them saying (7) Deut. 32.7 Remember the old dayes thinke vpon euerie generation aske thy father and he wil declare to thee thy elders and they wil tel thee In like sort Baldad Iob's friend aduised him in his greatest extremities to (8) Iob 8.8 aske the old generation and search diligently the memorie of the fathers for we are sayth he but as yesterday c. Yea wisest Salomon his aduise is (9) Eccles 8 11.12 Let not the narration of the ancients escape thee for they learned of their fathers because of them thou shalt learne vnderstanding and in time of necessitie to giue answer According to which God himself by the Prophet Hieremie teacheth (10) c. 6.16 Stand ye vpon the wayes and see and aske of the old pathes which is the good way and walke ye in it and you shal finde refreshing to your soules So that the old way is the way of truth and the same is to be learned by our Elders and Fathers Now of the contrarie God reproueth such as (11] Ier 18.15 walke c. in a way not trodden and Salomon's lesson is that thou (12) Prou. 22 28. transgresse not the ancient bounds which thy fathers haue put From whence I take it to be that as in the Scriptures our true God is called (13) Dan. 2.23 3.26.52 1. Tim 4 10 the God of the Fathers and of the Faithful so false Gods and new doctrines are termed (14) Deut. 32.17 New and fresh ones whome their fathers worshipped not Agreably heerunto S. Paul likewise aduiseth S. Timothie (15) 1. Tim. 6.20.21 to keepe the Depositum auoyding the prophane nouelties of voices and oppositions of falsely called knowledge which certain promising haue erred about the fayth thereby shewing prophane innouation to be the shipwrack of fayth Vpon which place likewise thus writeth that worthie Patron of Antiquitie Vincentius Lyrinensis (16) lib. aduers proph nouit He sayd not antiquities he sayd not Ancientnes but prophane Nouelties For if noueltie is to be auoyded antiquitie is to be kept if noueltie be prophane ancientnes is holie sacred And againe This with al Heresies is as it were solemne and allowed that in prophane nouelties they may alwaies reioyce and scorne the decrees of Antiquitie But on the contrarie to Catholicks this is almost proper to keepe the things left and committed by holie Fathers and to condemne prophane nouelties c. Wherupon he sayth of Nouelists What doe they promise but new and vnknowne doctrine For you may heare some of them to say Come ô you foolish and wretched who commonly are called Catholicks and learne the true fayth which none but we do know which for manie former ages lay hid but now of late is reuealed and shewen c. Are not these the words of that Drab sayth Vincentius But indeed it was ordinarie with the ancient Fathers to confute Hereticks by their owne Innouation So Tertullian vpon this ground reproueth the Nouellists of his time for their then vsurping and intruding by their latter vpstart doctrine vpon the then more ancient Catholick possession saying to that end vnto them (17) De Prescrip c. 37. Who are you When and from whence came you What do you in my grounds not mine By what right Marcion dost thou cut downe my woods By what
Church or rather only seduced and withdrawen from the ancient Catholick Faith by secondarie Innouation As in like resemblance after (29) Math. 13.25 The good seed was sowne in the field the Enemie came and sowed tares among the wheat In which respect Tertulian (30) l. de Prescrip c. 42. sayth excellent wel of al Nouelists that Their Endeauour is not to conuert the Heathen but to ouerthrow ours who are conuerted They glory more to cast those downe who stand then to lift vp those who lye Wherefore Protestants are so farre from conuerting any one Heathen Countrey to Christian beleef that their diuided Church neuer yet before or since Luthers time so much as but passed the Seas with taking hold in anie one Countrey of Asia Africk or America the three greatest knowne parts of the world No Protestant as yet euer being able to giue the least instance of their Church in anie one of al these three parts Yea it remayneth as now though being in its greatest height of encrease so narrowly shut vp or confined within our Northern parts of the world being but an only corner of Europe the fourth and incomparably the least part of al the rest that euen in the farre greater part of this one least part is not so much as anie appearing profession either of Lutherans or Caluinists knowne to be remayning or in being Yea it is most worthie of al diligent obseruation that wheras certaine Protestants haue endeauoured the Conuersion of some Heathen NatioÌ„s the euent was euer such through their owne demerits either of mutual dissentions amongst themselues in matters of Faith Religion or of foule enormous and most scandalous life and conuersation that their trauail and labour was euer spent without fruit and commodity and their returne accompanyed with shame and disgrace In this time is right famous the endeauour made of late times by Caluin the Church of Geneua in their sending Richerus the Caluinist whom (31) In Icon. Beza tearmeth a man of tryed godlines and learning into Gallia Antartica to conuert the Heathens there (32) In Calu. Epist ep 237. But how voyd of al successe it was and that to their lasting discredit is plainly related and confessed by their owne Brethren for first Richerus 32 himself writeth thus vnto Caluin concerning the people of that Country They are ignorant whether there be a God so far are they from keeping his Law or admiring his power and goodnes whereby we are deuoyd of al hope of gayning them to Christ c. But much more fully is this reported by Villegaignon who being then chief Captaine of the French Nauie and one so feruent and forward in planting Protestancie in those Countries that the next day after his arriual he not only as (33) Ibid. p. 438. Richerus mentioneth commanded the Word of God to be publickly preached and the week following the holie Supper of the Lord to be ministred which himself with some of his familie religiously receaued c. but withal gaue certaine yong men to the people of that Nation to be instructed in their Language that so they might afterwards preach vnto them This so zealous a Ghospeller (34) Epist before his book intituled Les Propositions ConteÌ„tienses c. written after his Returne from Gallia Antarctica relateth the bad successe and cause therof in these words Christian Reader M. Iohn Caluin vnderstanding that I was gone to Brasile with intent to plant the Faith there moued with the old acquaintance had between vs sent vnto me as wel in his owne as in the name of the whole Cittie of Geneva certaine Ministers of his Religion the best learned that could be found with certaine crafts-men in their companie wel furnished with al such books as Caluin had written or anie other which might serue for their people As they passed by Paris certaine other Protestants ioyned with them and among the rest a reuolted Iacobin named Iohn Comtate a man of prompt and subtil wit These men coming to Brasile adorned themselues with a faire Title calling themselues The Reformed Church By reason wherof they were of me receaued with al possible curtesie hoping they would haue been profitable to me in my enterprise But wheÌ„ they began to execute their fuÌ„ction I then found they had vsurped a wroÌ„g Title c. They agreed not amoÌ„g themselues nor continued long in their owne doctrine but as they learned euerie day so they stil added something thereto The Iacobin would follow a doctrine by himself vndertaking to defend and publish the Confession of Augusta and without dissimulation to impugne the Doctrine of Caluin wherby the contention among them grew so great that no other remedie could be had but by sending away one of the Ministers of Geneua But Villegaignon himself discerning through their mutual disagreements and inordinate accomplished (35) See Launay En la Replique Chrestienne l 2. c. 16. f 251. And VillegaignoÌ„ aduers Art Richeri l. 1. c. 90. lusts not to be named the whole action of conuerting that Countrey to be frustrated receiued thereupon sufficient motiue to abandon their Religion To the same effect it is reported by D. Philip Nicolai (36) CoÌ„meÌ„t de Regno Christi l. 1. p. 395. that the French men hauing for their Captayne Nicolas Villegaignon being happily arriued in Brasile through fatal mis-fortune and dissension lost their Regiment and Castle built therin being cast out by the Spaniards As in like sort afterwards when with a new Armie they came to Florida Iohn Ribautius being their Captaine c. The English also Forbisher being Captayne opened the Northern side of the new world but they returned home c. And of the bad successe of this Sir Martin Forbisher other English in the Conuersion of the remote Northern Nations M. Hacklute 37) Voyâ—ges Discoueries c. p. 680. writeth thus The euents do shew that either Gods cause hath not been chiefly preferred by them or els God hath not permitted so abundant grace as the light of his Word and knowledge of him to be yet reuealed to those Infidels before the appoynted time And wheras some Protestants in Germanie did insinuate with the Church of Greece writing to the Patriarch in this humble manner with title of Direction (38) Acta Theol. Witemb Patriaâ— hae Conâ—tantin c. p. 2. To the most Holie and Oecumenical Patriarch the Lord Hieremie Archbishop of Constantinople of New Rome a pious Lord And renewing againe (39) Ibid. p. 144. the same Direction in steed of Pious Lord they adde our most Reuerend Lord (40) Ib. p. 4 Concluding with farewel most Holy Lord c. and vouchsafing vs pardon and receiuing vs fauourably into thy Fatherlie care c. with much more insinuating submission and desire of Communion with him Al this yet notwithstanding after much conference writing and labour in vanie spent the Patriarch reiected them as most vnworthie (41) Ibid.
did formerly auouch that the sayd Rule was of Credit euen with the Protestant Writers of our time namely with M. Suinglius M. Caluin and M. Gualter and that he thinketh no learned man doth dissent from them Yet M. Morton who would take it vnkindly and that deseruedly to be censured for Vnlearned doth thus far aduenture directly to discredit and disauthorize the foresayd Rule as shamefully to curtle it both in bredth and depth The (44) Ibid. p. 345. bredth sayth he though most vntruly reacheth no further then vnto matters of Ceremonies and other Customes of the Church c. Secondly the depth of the same position if it be rightly sounded wil be found to be a truth of strong Probabilitie only and not of an absolute infallibilitie which is to say in good English that the sayd Rule only concerneth trifles and matters of smal moment as also that it is not a certain true Rule but peraduenture true and peraduenture false which strongly implyeth that our Doctour in matters of faith and moment now disputed between Catholicks and Protestants would be loath to be squared and tryed thereby And so in substance acknowledgeth that which he reproueth in M. Carthwright that thereby a window is open to bring in al Poperie So euidently in deed doth the forsayd Rule prescribed by S. Austin and approued by so manie of the learned Protestants strongly confirme and conuince the vninterrupted Current and continuance of our Roman Religion from the Apostles themselues to these our dayes Agreably to the premisses (45) Consideration of the Papists supplication p. 43. M. Powel expresly and ingenuously confesseth We can not tel by whom or at what time sayth he the enemie did sow the Papists Doctrine c. Neither indeed do we know who was the first Authour of euerie one of your blasphemous opinions (46) Reioynder to Bristow p. 265. D. Fulk answering to the demand of the Roman Churches change sayth thereto I answer my Text sayth it was a mysterie not reuealed and therefore could not be at first openly preached against c. And though D. Whitaker taught before that No man denyed but that it much auayled for the confuting of Heresies to haue knowne their beginning Yet the same (47) Resp ad Rat. Comp. p. 101. D. Whitaker is inforced to confesse that The time of the Roman Churches change can not easily be told Yea to such absurdities are Protestants brought in this poynt that Vrbanus Rhegius being vrged to shew wherin the Roman Church had changed her Faith at last betaketh himself to this desperat boldnes saying (48) In lib. Apologet. p. 192. But to conclude though it were true that the Roman Church had changed nothing in Religion would it therefore presently follow that she were a true Church I think not sayth he And yet I think hardly any one Protestant can be picked out so ignorant or impudent as wil openly auouch that the Roman Church was not a true Church when S. Paul writ vnto the Romans in these words (49) Ep. Ad Rom c. 11. vers 5.6.7.8.9.11.12 By Christ we receaued Grace and Apostleship for obedience to the Faith in al Nations c. among whom are you also the called of Iesus Christ. To al that are at Rome the beloued of God called to be Saints Grace to you and Peace from God our Father and our Lord Iesus Christ. First I giue thanks to my God c. for al you because your Faith is renowned in the whole world c. without intermission I make a memorie of you alwayes in my prayers c. And I desire to see you that I may impart vnto you some spiritual grace to confirme you that is to say to be comforted togeather in you by that which is common to vs both your Faith and mine Now if the Roman Churches Faith was once thus the same with S. Paules Faith then if she neuer changed her sayd Faith as this Protestant supposeth she must needs continue a true Church Al this Sun shine notwithstanding D. Morton wil needs defend his brother Rhegius herein because (50) Prot. App. p. 675. diuers Hereticks who liued in the Apostles times such as were the Simonians Basilidians Nicolaitans albeit they liued in the dayes of the Apostles yet did they not professe the Doctrine of the Apostles which sufficiently demonstrateth the infirmitie of the Consequence But I must confesse I did not expect such weake Demonstrations from D. Morton for the Consequence was not that Hereticks liued in the Apostles dayes therefore their Doctrine is the doctrine of the Apostles as our Doctour would abuse an vncautelous or vnlearned Reader but as himself before thus confessed The Church of Rome hath not altered anie article of Faith since the Apostles times ergo the now Faith of the Church of Rome is the same with that which was taught by the Apostles This Consequence is so cleer supposing that the Church of Rome in Saint Pauls time professed the true Faith which I haue formerly proued and no Protestant dare deny as that al further proof would discouer no lesse tediousnes in the Writer then the denying therof hath bewrayed ignorance and temeritie in M. Doctour So cleer it is that no Protestant whosoeuer is able to assigne anie knowne beginning of our Roman Religion since the Apostles times Wherefore in playne tearmes they ascribe the beginning therof to S. Pauls time To this effect sayth D. Willet (51) Synopsis Controu 2. q. 3. p. 56. Therefore S. Paul calleth Papistrie a mysterie of iniquitie which began euen to work in his dayes M. Midleton (52) Papisto-mastix p. 193. auoucheth that we are sure that the Mysterie of inquitie did work in Pauls time and fel not a sleep so soone as Paul was dead waking againe 600. yeares after when this Mysterie was disclosed c. And therfore no maruaile though perusing Councels Fathers and Stories from the Apostles forward we find the print of the Popes feet c. M. Parkins desiring 53 Reformed Cath. p. 329. To stop the mouths of Papists who demand of vs sayth he where our Church was foure-score yeares before Luther They are answered sayth he that our Church hath been since the dayes of the Apostles and that in the verie midst of the Papacie So supposing the Papacie or Roman Church to haue continued since the dayes of the Apostles Lastly the truth hereof is so certayne that the same is acknowledged by our seuerest (54) Suruey of the BooK of common prayer in the Preface to the King p. 18. Puritans who speaking to the Kings Maiestie giue this wholsome persuasion Let not your Maiestie be now deceiued by the Popish Argument of supposed Antiquitie as Ioseph was with the old and mouldie bread of the Gibeonites c. And the rather ô christian King take heed because Antichrist began to work euen in the Apostles dayes So vndoubted and to be supposed it is that the Argument drawne from
true Church then which what can be vrged more material either in our defence or more disgraceful against al Protestants But the truth hereof is so palpable as that the learnedst Protestants in colour and excuse of their Church not departing out of the knowne visible Church do chiefly vrge and pretend their owne communion with the Roman Church in al Ages whatsoeuer So M. Bunnie verie wisely teacheth that 27) Treat to pacific see 18. p. 108. Of departing from the Church there ought to be no question at al amongst vs c. we 28) Ib. p. 113. are no seueral Church from them nor they from vs and therefore there is no departing at al out of the Church for anie to depart from them to vs nor from vs to them Al the difference between vs is concerning the truer members whether we or they may be found more worthie of that account As for the other we allow no such question In so much that he affirmeth that 29) Ib. p. 109. it was il done of them who first vrged such a separation coÌ„fessing further our aduantage 30) Sec. 15. p. 92. giuen therby for that 31) â—b p. 96. sayth he it is great probabilitie with them that so we make ourselues answerable for to finde out a distinct and seueral Church from them which continued from the Apostles Age to this present else that needs we must acknowledge that our Church is sprong vp of late or since theirs So earnestly doth he labour his Churches not Departing from the Roman Church and thereby supposeth the Roman Churches neuer departing from anie other for if the Roman Church had euer departed her self then were it no proofe but rather a conuiction of the Protestant Churches most certaine departure But insteed of al such pretended departure D. Field acknowledgeth further That 32) Of the Church p. 88. the Roman Church held stil Communion with those other Churches which neuer fel into errour and so were both of one Communion Which euidently proueth she neuer went out of the true Church but stil preserued Communion and Societie with her So euident it is that our Roman Church is freed from that infamous Marke of Heresie of Going out of the Church which yet Protestants haue so cleerly done going out of our Roman Church and that our honour and their infamie therin is proclaymed to the world by men condemned thereby euen by Luther Caluin Osiander Pantaleon Clapham Alison Mason Fox Rainolds Iewel Fulk Sutclif Knewstubs Powel Bunnie and Field But to giue M. D. Morton yet another scantling whether Catholicks or Protestants be truly Hereticks It is a supposed principle taught by S. Hierome 33) Ad Ctesiphont and Vincent Lyri cont haereses c. 4. That to reduce an Heresie to it beginning is a confuting of it Thus S. Ireneus refuted the Valentinians and Marcionists saying 34) L. 3. c. 4. Before Valentine there were not anie which are from Valentine neither before Marcion were they which are from Marcion And D. Whitaker auoucheth That 35) Cont. Duraeum l. 7. p. 479. no man denyeth but that it much auayleth to the confuting of Heresies to haue knowne their beginning In like sort D. Fotherbie in behalf of the Crosse argueth thus If 36) Answ to obiect against the Crosse in Bap. p. 26. it be but an humane inuention let vs know I pray you the first Inuentour of it and when it was first decreed and how it came so soone to be so generally obserued which if you cannot shew vs I think we may with greater probabilitie esteeme it to be an Apostoltcal Tradition D. Sarauia sayth vpon an other occasion 37) In def Tract de diuers minist Grad c. 23. p. 361. I answer it is not enough to say so but it must be shewed out of Histories which were those schismes and where and when they sprong vp and how from thence so general a custome came Agreably writeth M. Bel 38) RegimeÌ„t of the Church p. 26. 27. If anie man deny this old custome let that man shew when it came in And D. Iewel vrgeth D. Harding concerning an errour of former times alleaged by him 39) Reply p. 112. If there had been anie shew of truth in it M. Harding would haue layd out al the Circumstances when this strange errour first began where and how long it continued who wrot against it c Verily this great silence declareth some want D. Bilson sayth (a) Suruey of Christs suffâ—ings p. 660. The report of Eusebius proueth this clause of Christs descending to Hades to haue been anciently and openly professed in the primitiue Church otherwise the Religious of those Ages that liued with and after Eusebius if he had broached anie new point of Faith as in dutie they were bound so no doubt they would haue refuted and resisted them D. Whiteguift defending Cathedral Churches against M. Cartwright demandeth accordingly of him 40) Denfen p. 747. From what Pope they came or in what time they were first inuented Yea he further teacheth 41) Ibid. p. 351. That as for so much as the original and begining of these names Metropolitan Archibishop c. such is their antiquitie cannot be found so farre as I haue read it is to be supposed they haue their original from the Apostles themselues for as I remember S. Austin hath this Rule in his 118 Epistle And 42) Ibid. p 352. It is of credit with the writers of our time namely with M. Zuinglius M. Caluin and M. Gualter and surely I think no learned man doth dissent from them Lastly sayth D. Morton (a) Prot. Appeal p. 465. We willingly ioyne issue and if we cannot proue that the Roman Church hath in manie weightie points of Religion degenerated from herself then shal we no more decline from her as from a malignant stepdame but deuoutly yeeld vnto her al due acknowledgement as vnto a Mother-church And now to ioyne issue herein with M. Doctour and so to square hereby the truth of Roman or Protestant Religion Our Catholicke Faith is so confessedly free from anie knowne beginning since the Apostles and so wholy agreable with S. Austins foresayd Rule as that 43) Ib. Thereby in M. Cartwrights opinion a window is open to bring in al Poperie yea 44) Ibid. p. 103. I appeale to the iudgement of al men if this be not to bring in Poperie againe to allow of S. Austins saying So euident it is that Poperie is without anie knowne beginning and consequently no Heresie In like sort M. Powel being prouoked that if 45) Consideration of the Pap sts Supplic p. 43. our Doctrine be errour then to tel vs when it came in who was the Authour of it c. answereth therto directly in our behalf saying We cannot tel by whom or at what time the Enemie did sow it c. Neither indeed do we know who was the Authour of euerie one of your blasphemous epinions
ancient Papists In like for argueth Mr. Carth wright saying That (9) Reply part 1. p. 18. the argument of the authoritie of men which haue interpreted the Scriptures is the best reason in Controuersies of Diuinitie was neuer heard of but by Papists whose strongest towers are in the testimonies of the Doctours c. There is nothing more Papistical then this Assertion So that if Protestants commit themselues to the trial by Fathers they yeeld themselues prisoners to the strongest Towers and Castles of the Papists their Enemies wherin what can they expect but ruine and confusion D. Whitaker affirmeth (10) Cont. Dur. li. 6. p. 423. The Popish Religion to be a patched couerlet of the Fathers errours sowed togeather Wel then if our Religion was beleeued by the Fathers from them deliuered to vs I am perswaded that D. Whitaker admitting this would place litle hope in appealing to Fathers for Confutation of Popish Religion And though he falsely tearmeth our Religion the Fathers errours yet therby he plainly granteth the Fathers to haue beleeued and taught the same Religion which we now professe and Protestants impugne Now the ancient Fathers being thus acknowledged for Papists I do not wonder that Protestants contemne their authoritie and seeke their disgrace with al contumelies possible Why may not D. Luther affirme (11) To. 2. Wittemb l. de Seruo Arb. p. 434. And the same booke printed in 8. p. 72. 73. 276. 337. The Fathers of so many Ages to haue beene plainly blind and most ignorant in the Scriptures to haue erred al their life time and that vnles they were amended before their deaths wherof neuer Protestant had yet the least intelligence they were neyther Saints nor pertayning to the Church but no doubt according to Luther damned Papists Why might not he further auouch That (12) In Colloq mensalibus c. de Patrib Ecclesiae in the writings of Hierome there is not a word of true faith in Christ and sound Religion Tertullian is very superfluous I haue houlden Origen long since accursed Of Chrysostome I make no account Basil is of no worth he is wholy a Monk I weigh him not a haire Cyprian is a weake Diuine c. See how our old Papists are betrampled by a yong Protestant And yet no lesse resolute against them is (13) In Ionam Pomerane Our Fathers whether Saints or no I care not ô zeale and reuerence Protestantical they were blinded with the Spirit of Montanus by humane traditions and the doctrines of Diuels c. they teach not purely of Iustification c. neither are they careful to teach IESVS CHRIST according to his Ghospel Stil are the Fathers reiected as men blinded with Papistical opinions The Centurists endeauouring to discredit the whole multitude of Doctours and Fathers in euerie Age begin euen with the first Age next after the Apostles saying 14) Cent. 2 c. 4. p. 55. Albeit this Age was neerest to the Apostles yet the Doctrine of Christ and his Apostles began to be not a litle darkned therin and many monstrous and incommodious opinions to Protestants are euerie where found to be spread by the Doctours therof Perhaps some cause therof may be for that the guift of the Holie Ghost in these Doctours did begin to decay for the ingratitude of the world towards the Protestant Truth Now as for the Doctours of al Ages succeeding they make a Principle that The 15) Cent 3. c. 4. p. 17. further we go of from the Apostles Age the more stubble shal we find to haue been added to the puritie of Christian doctrine So that al Doctours and Fathers since the very first Age of the Apostles are discarded by the Centurists for stubble and Papistical But Luther wil not rest vntil he hath brought these stubble-Doctours to Hel for teaching Papistrie (16) In Deut. c. 13. p. 102. Sathan sayth he hath hitherto deluded vs by signes and lying wonders c. whilst contrarie to the Ghospel we haue admired Pilgrimages Apparitions of Spirits and cures at certaine Sepuchers in so much that Saints also erred herin as Augustin Bernard Hierome and many others c. certainly damned as Wicclif sayd vnles they repented So that if Papists be damned for beleeuing the Catholick faith they haue for their Companions Hierome Augustin Bernard and many others most renowned Doctours of Christs Church and Saints From this true conceipt of the ancient Fathers being Roman Catholicks Protestants further disclayme from their Interpretations and expositions of Scripture refusing to stand to their iudgments for the true vnderstanding therof Thus then they write The Sacred Scripture saith Polanus (17) Symphonia c. 1. Thes 6. p. 56. is not to be interpreted by Fathers neither is the Interpretation of Scripture to be iudged by Fathers the Fathers are not the rule of expounding the sacred Scripture c. what is here sayd of euerie Father alone is to be vnderstood of al the Fathers ioyned togeather as also of Councels That is though al Fathers and Councels conspire togeather in their Expositions of Scripture agreably to the Doctrine and beleef of the Catholick Roman Church yet Protestants wil not subscribe or admit the same but wil valiantly maintayne al such expositions though most contrarie therto as are last coyned at Geneua or Wittemberg or newliest extracted by some Brother more illuminated In like and most prouident manner argue our English Puritans against Doctour Downham obiecting against them That none of the Fathers did euer vnderstand the Text then in question as Puritans do (18) The Puritans in their answ to D. Downham Doth not Mr. Doctour know say they that to argue negatiuely concerning the sense of Scriptures from the authoritie of Fathers is the practise of Papists only and taxed by learned writers against them c. If that manner of disputing be good we shal often loose more truth in taking their Interpretations c. Carthwright tearmeth the seeking into the holy Fathers writings a 19) In Bancrofts suruey of Pretend Discipl p. 331. 337 and see chap. 4. p. 64. Raking of ditches and the bringing in of their authorities the mouing and summoning of Hel. Parker assureth vs that (20) Pref. to his Answer Limbomastix and see Iacob's Treatise p. 1. 3 54. 81. 68. Bilson's sermons Ps 323. Answ to Broughâ—on's Letter p. 17. If you alleadge the ancient Fathers against them they wil tel you roundly that their opinions are nothing els but the corrupt fancies of vaine Imaginations of men toyish fables fond absurd without sense and reason And some stick not to cal the Fathers of the Latin Church the plague of Diuinitie Hence it is that the French Protestants haue enacted it for a (21) Disciplina Magistrorum Galliae art 4. law that no place be giuen to the writings of the old Doctours for the iudgement ad determination of Doctrine So cleerly is Protestancie at an end if the Fathers Interpretation of Scriptures may stand for