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A91473 Independency accused by nine severall arguments: written by a godly learned minister, to a member of Mr. John Goodwins congregation, and acquitted by severall replyes to the said arguments by a member of the same church. In both which, sweetnesse of spirit, and soundnesse of arguments have been endeavoured. Published according to order. I. P. 1645 (1645) Wing P53A; Thomason E296_16; ESTC R200209 27,998 39

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sure we are some have been imprisoned some banished that pleaded Religion and meere conscience and were no otherwise disturbers of the civill peace then the Congregationall Way is like to be here So that if our Magistrates and Presbyters must be ruled by Gamaliels advice and suffer all opinions till God disclaim and fight against them from heaven why is not his advice sent over to them lest they should fight against any Way that calls God father If Old-England be said to persecute for suppressing Sects and Opinions because threatning the truth and civill peace why may not the same name be put upon New-England who are found in the same work and Way and if both he guilty 't were wisdome and piety for our Congregationall Divines to east the first stone at themselves I mean their Congregationall Brethren to convince and perswade them to suffer all Opinions amongst them this would be an argument that they walk in all simplicity and sincerity of spirit preferring Gods will and the naked truth above any ends of their own whereof some suspect them how justly God the searcher of hearts knowes and next their arguments and perswasions would be more easily received at home REPLY THis is an Argument or rather an Insinuation to the accusing of our Brethren then to the finding out the truth but to this I answer First in relation to our Brethrens practice in New-England I answer you in this case as the father of the blind man answered the Pharisees about the manner of procuring his sons sight Job 9.21 He is of age ask him so say I they are able to answer for themselves if not they stand or fall to their own Master But Secondly I suppose it is easier to affirm then to prove that any were imprisoned or banished meerely for their consciences wee have a common Proverb That untruths lose nothing by distance of place and by often reporting some affirm it hath been so as you say others deny the same for my part because I have more reason to believe the one then the other because the Magistrates themselves deny any persecution meerly for a mans private conscience in the case of M rs Hutchison See the book the rise and end of Antinomianisme in New-England p. 46. of the first Edition I had rather looke unto these things that do concern us at home then to go so far to accuse our brethren abroad Thirdly I humbly suppose it is out of your certain knowledge that the Congregationall Divines have not at all written unto their Brethren of New-England about this business and have not received satisfaction herein I suppose likewise I have as much reason if not more to affirm that they have as you that they have not But Fourthly suppose they have not written this will prove but the remisnesse of their duty at the most and will not facilitate and ease the businesse in the least doubtlesse the Presbyterian party in other parts of the world not all things according to the minde of God even in the judgements of the Brethren-Presbyterians of this Nation and if so may not the same thing be retorted upon them which you do here upon these Fifthly As for those jealousies which you say are in some about the Congregationall Brethrens simplicity and sincerity of spirit in preferring Gods Will and the naked Truth above any ends of their own as Gods royall Prerogative in searching all hearts should stifle such misprisions and quit all such unworthy surmisings till better proofe appeare so any mans reasons not mastered with prejudice and discontent should fully discharge all such vain unworthy and uncharitable imaginations concerning their Brethren for except mens ends and aims should be sorrow trouble reproach and contempt perplexity and misery penury and want what other ends can they have Are not some of these for the present and all of them for the future the threatened issues products and consequences of their wayes and practices Surely men should make a better use of their own personall weaknesses viz. their own sinfull ends and aims and by-respects in their own hearts then to make them the measure and rule to judge of their Brethrens hearts by every man should think better of his brother then of himself surely the men of their jealousies are not usually steer'd up and down from one place to another by the golden lure of an hundred or two or three hundred a yeer as many of their censorious Judges are but it is worthy our observation the Saints of our most high God many times are chiefly charged for those things whereof they are least guilty and where they are most innocent and therefore most able to beare the same Thus Joseph for incontinency Elisha for the troubler of Israel though indeed the horsemen and chariots of Israel thus David for seeking Sauls life whose heart smote him for but cutting off one of the skirts of his garment thus Jesus Christ for a deceiver who was the truth it self and for a familiar with the Prince of the Devils who was indeed the great enemy to him and his works and as it was from the beginning so it is now the humble the meek the simple-hearted the peaceable the most forward for reformation yea when their zeale therein cast them into imprisonments sorrows troubles c. these men I say are under jealousies nay evident and expresse censures of being proud perverse deceitfull disturbers of the peace of the State hinderers of Reformation with many such like and unworthy reproaches but the faithfull Witnesse and Judge of all hearts will one day bring forth their innocency as the light and in the mean while support their spirits under all those hard speeches thoughts and calumnies of this world ARGUM. IV. TItus 1.10 11. There are many unruly talkers and deceivers who subvert whole houses teaching things which they ought not whose mouths must be stopped But Church-censure or sentence of non-communion will not stop their mouths for as t is in the Apologeticall Narration they being of another way and judgement it binds not their conscience and so dare pish at the sentence of Non-communion of Excommunication let the Presbyterians pronounce a sentence against Congregationall Churches or let Congregationall Churches pronounce any sentence against Presbyterians Antinomians Anabaptists who will teach things as they thinke which they ought not and see when this sentence stops their mouths But Paul sayes Their mouths must be stopped Church-censure does it not therefore if they must be stopped the civill Magistrate must strike in to stop them else they will ever be open to subvert whole houses In the Apostles times what Church-censure could not reach to was left to the power and providence of God to subdue and master and supply the office of a Magistrate but now when God has blest a Christian Commonwealth with a Christian Magistrate if Church-censure will not stop deceivers mouths but still they will subvert mens precious soules the Magistrate must exercise