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earth_n bind_v church_n heaven_n 11,478 5 7.0638 4 true
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A35667 Truth outweighing error, or, An ansvver to a treatise lately published by J.B. entituled, A confession of his faith and a reason of his practice, or, With who he can, and with who he cannot hold church-fellowship ... by John Denne ... J. D. (John Denne) 1673 (1673) Wing D1027; ESTC R11873 57,462 128

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text_n say_v no_o such_o thing_n and_o john_n bunyan_n himself_o have_v often_o acknowledge_v baptism_n of_o water_n to_o be_v a_o holy_a ordinance_n of_o christ_n pag._n 123._o general_o practise_v pag._n 92._o and_o then_o if_o one_o baptism_n what_o other_o but_o that_o one_o viz._n baptism_n of_o water_n so_o general_o practise_v by_o all_o disciple_n he_o will_v tell_v we_o the_o baptism_n of_o the_o spirit_n for_o by_o one_o spirit_n be_v we_o all_o baptize_v into_o one_o body_n to_o which_o i_o answer_v the_o baptism_n of_o the_o spirit_n be_v not_o general_a and_o so_o can_v not_o be_v intend_v by_o one_o baptism_n second_o it_o be_v not_o mean_v in_o the_o aforesaid_a text_n which_o say_v by_o not_o with_o one_o spirit_n for_o in_o truth_n those_o that_o be_v baptize_v with_o water_n be_v by_o one_o spirit_n in_o one_o faith_n have_v one_o hope_n in_o one_o lord_n even_o one_o god_n and_o father_n of_o all_o baptize_v with_o one_o viz._n water_n baptism_n into_o one_o body_n and_o fellowship_n which_o ought_v therefore_o to_o be_v keep_v free_a from_o john_n bunyan_n mixture_n his_o three_o reason_n follow_v pag._n 97._o viz._n i_o be_o bold_a therefore_o to_o have_v communion_n with_o such_o because_o they_o also_o have_v the_o doctrine_n of_o baptism_n i_o say_v the_o doctrine_n of_o they_o for_o here_o you_o must_v note_v i_o distinguish_v between_o the_o doctrine_n and_o practice_n of_o water-baptism_n etc._n etc._n they_o have_v the_o best_a of_o baptism_n the_o heart_n of_o water-baptism_n the_o doctrine_n of_o water-baptism_n and_o want_v only_o the_o sign_n the_o outward_a circumstance_n which_o be_v forbear_v for_o want_n of_o light_n answ_n oh_o lord_n what_o delusion_n be_v here_o righteous_a be_v thou_o in_o send_v strong_a delusion_n upon_o they_o that_o receive_v not_o the_o love_n of_o the_o truth_n 2_o thess_n 2.10_o 11._o john_n bunyan_n have_v receive_v baptism_n but_o what_o love_n he_o have_v thereto_o appear_v by_o his_o word_n wherefore_o no_o marvel_n that_o his_o mind_n be_v blind_v and_o his_o understanding_n darken_v that_o he_o may_v believe_v lie_n and_o deceive_v himself_o with_o fallacy_n as_o he_o do_v in_o the_o aforementioned_a reason_n where_o he_o tell_v we_o of_o some_o of_o his_o proselyte_n that_o have_v the_o doctrine_n of_o baptism_n but_o do_v not_o practice_v it_o because_o they_o want_v light_a therein_o what_o a_o contradiction_n be_v this_o if_o they_o want_v light_n they_o can_v have_v the_o doctrine_n if_o they_o have_v the_o doctrine_n they_o must_v have_v light_n so_o far_o as_o to_o know_v it_o and_o therefore_o john_n bunyan_n distinction_n between_o the_o doctrine_n and_o practice_n of_o water-baptism_n will_v nothing_o avail_v we_o ready_o allow_v that_o and_o oftentimes_o find_v that_o many_o have_v the_o doctrine_n although_o not_o without_o light_n without_o the_o practice_n who_o it_o seem_v be_v such_o as_o john_n bunyan_n be_v bold_a to_o have_v communion_n with_o he_o may_v well_o say_v bold_a for_o he_o have_v no_o scripture-warrant_a for_o it_o and_o it_o be_v a_o great_a boldness_n to_o adventure_v in_o church-communion_n beyond_o what_o be_v write_v yea_o contrary_a to_o what_o be_v write_v for_o our_o saviour_n say_v luk._n 12.47_o he_o that_o know_v his_o lord_n will_n that_o have_v the_o doctrine_n of_o a_o duty_n and_o prepare_v not_o himself_o to_o practise_v neither_o do_v according_a to_o his_o will_n shall_v be_v beat_v with_o many_o stripe_n and_o as_o such_o as_o neglect_v their_o duty_n be_v thus_o threaten_v so_o evil_a be_v declare_v to_o persecute_v those_o that_o teach_v man_n so_o and_o encourage_v they_o therein_o matth._n 5.19_o wherein_o what_o john_n bunyan_n may_v expect_v i_o wish_v he_o serious_o to_o consider_v he_o seem_v pag._n 122._o to_o be_v conscious_a to_o himself_o that_o some_o may_v judge_v he_o guilty_a thereof_o who_o mouth_n he_o will_v stop_v by_o his_o equivocation_n etc._n etc._n but_o at_o the_o last_o day_n such_o thing_n will_v stand_v in_o no_o stead_n reas_n 4._o i_o come_v now_o to_o his_o four_o reason_n pag._n 99_o i_o be_o bold_a to_o hold_v communion_n with_o visible_a saint_n as_o aforesaid_a viz._n unbaptise_v because_o god_n have_v communion_n with_o they_o who_o example_n in_o the_o case_n we_o be_v straight_o command_v to_o follow_v receive_v you_o one_o another_o as_o christ_n jesus_n have_v receive_v you_o say_v paul_n rom._n 15.1_o 6._o to_o the_o glory_n of_o god_n yea_o though_o they_o be_v saint_n of_o opinion_n contrary_a to_o you_o though_o it_o go_v against_o the_o mind_n of_o they_o that_o be_v strong_a we_o that_o be_v strong_a aught_o to_o bear_v the_o infirmity_n of_o the_o weak_a what_o infirmity_n say_v john_n bunyan_n those_o that_o be_v natural_a be_v incident_a to_o all_o they_o be_v infirmity_n then_o that_o be_v sinful_a all_o such_o infirmity_n be_v lay_v upon_o christ_n pag._n 100_o wherefore_o vain_a man_n think_v not_o by_o the_o straightness_n of_o thy_o order_n in_o outward_a and_o bodily_a conformity_n to_o outward_a and_o shadowish_a circumstance_n that_o thy_o peace_n be_v maintain_v with_o god_n for_o peace_n with_o god_n be_v by_o faith_n in_o the_o blood_n of_o his_o cross_n who_o have_v bear_v the_o reproach_n and_o error_n of_o you_o both_o thou_o err_v in_o a_o substance_n he_o err_v in_o a_o circumstance_n upon_o who_o must_v these_o error_n fall_v pag._n 101._o must_v they_o for_o this_o be_v cast_v out_o of_o the_o church_n no_o these_o be_v all_o yea_o those_o reproach_n wherein_o the_o wisdom_n of_o heaven_n be_v reproach_v be_v fall_v upon_o christ_n pag._n 102._o wherefore_o god_n have_v receive_v he_o christ_n have_v receive_v he_o wherefore_o do_v you_o receive_v he_o there_o be_v more_o solidity_n in_o this_o argument_n than_o if_o all_o the_o church_n of_o god_n have_v receive_v he_o will_v any_o say_v we_o can_v believe_v that_o god_n have_v receive_v any_o but_o such_o as_o be_v baptize_v i_o will_v not_o suppose_v a_o brother_n so_o stupefy_v and_o therefore_o to_o that_o i_o will_v not_o answer_v answ_n in_o the_o answer_n to_o this_o long_a reason_n wherein_o john_n bunyan_n have_v run_v himself_o out_o of_o breath_n consider_v first_o that_o those_o scripture_n allege_v by_o john_n bunyan_n nothing_o concern_v the_o matter_n in_o hand_n for_o they_o be_v write_v to_o baptize_v person_n by_o his_o own_o confession_n pag._n 92._o as_o also_o appear_v by_o the_o apostle_n word_n rom._n 6.3_o 4._o second_o that_o receive_v there_o speak_v of_o do_v not_o intend_v the_o receive_n into_o fellowship_n for_o that_o be_v already_o do_v but_o a_o holy_a reception_n in_o the_o bowel_n of_o love_n and_o tender-heartedness_n that_o so_o with_o one_o mind_n and_o with_o one_o mouth_n thy_o might_n glorify_v god_n chap._n 15.6_o whereto_o they_o be_v persuade_v from_o the_o consideration_n of_o god_n bounty_n and_o the_o grace_n of_o our_o lord_n jesus_n christ_n extend_v to_o they_o 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they_o shall_v bind_v or_o loose_v on_o earth_n matth._n 18._o shall_v be_v bind_v or_o loose_v in_o heaven_n god_n himself_o have_v great_a respect_n to_o his_o church_n but_o to_o return_v if_o i_o shall_v grant_v that_o god_n have_v communion_n with_o many_o of_o they_o be_v not_o john_n bunyan_n strange_o stupefy_v as_o to_o reason_n from_o thence_o yea_o to_o account_v it_o a_o argument_n of_o so_o great_a solidity_n that_o the_o church_n ought_v therefore_o to_o have_v communion_n with_o they_o have_v not_o god_n communion_n wi●h_v many_o that_o the_o church_n may_v not_o have_v communion_n with_o the_o apostle_n speak_v rom._n 2.14_o of_o some_o gentile_n which_o have_v not_o the_o law_n be_v a_o law_n unto_o themselves_o who_o do_v show_v the_o work_n of_o the_o law_n write_v in_o their_o heart_n with_o such_o person_n sure_o god_n have_v communion_n for_o he_o do_v
5.11_o they_o shall_v speak_v all_o manner_n of_o evil_n against_o you_o false_o for_o my_o name_n be_v sake_n which_o to_o effect_v he_o be_v bold_a to_o affirm_v that_o christian_n have_v be_v the_o cause_n of_o all_o the_o judgement_n we_o have_v feel_v and_o do_v groan_n under_o it_o be_v no_o new_a thing_n the_o heathen_n of_o old_a be_v of_o the_o same_o mind_n and_o thereby_o raise_v the_o primitive_a persecution_n and_o we_o see_v the_o devil_n play_v the_o same_o game_n now_o whereto_o i_o shall_v only_o say_v in_o the_o word_n of_o michael_n jud._n 9_o the_o lord_n rebuke_v thou_o i_o come_v now_o to_o his_o 10_o and_o last_o reason_n pag._n 128._o which_o be_v ground_v partly_o upon_o the_o thought_n of_o the_o world_n and_o partly_o upon_o a_o suppose_a condescension_n so_o far_o as_o to_o commit_v our_o soul_n to_o the_o ministry_n of_o unbaptised_a person_n whereto_o i_o shall_v answer_v as_o to_o the_o first_o we_o ought_v to_o obey_v god_n rather_o than_o to_o please_v 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christian_n that_o in_o the_o primitive_a time_n remain_v dark_a about_o it_o than_o he_o will_v show_v the_o christian_n that_o be_v receive_v into_o fellowship_n without_o it_o well_o say_v mr._n bunyan_n when_o the_o sky_n fall_v you_o will_v catch_v lark_n you_o have_v already_o tell_v we_o the_o primitive_a christian_n all_o believe_v it_o yea_o the_o unconverted_a know_v as_o you_o say_v it_o do_v belong_v to_o the_o disciple_n of_o christ_n and_o yet_o you_o will_v now_o know_v the_o christian_n that_o be_v dark_a therein_o and_o in_o that_o you_o know_v that_o to_o be_v impossible_a if_o your_o own_o word_n be_v true_a therefore_o you_o offer_v if_o we_o do_v that_o than_o you_o will_v show_v the_o christian_n that_o be_v receive_v without_o baptism_n which_o you_o well_o know_v be_v also_o impossible_a to_o be_v do_v wherefore_o to_o show_v your_o resoluteness_n right_a or_o wrong_n we_o have_v this_o thesis_n from_o you_o pag._n 82._o that_o if_o you_o shall_v grant_v which_o you_o say_v be_v more_o than_o can_v be_v prove_v but_o it_o be_v but_o your_o say_n so_o baptism_n to_o be_v a_o initiate_a ordinance_n and_o that_o it_o do_v as_o circumcision_n of_o old_a give_v a_o be_v of_o membership_n to_o the_o partaker_n yea_o set_v the_o case_n man_n be_v forbid_v to_o enter_v into_o fellowship_n without_o it_o yet_o the_o case_n may_v so_o be_v that_o these_o thing_n notwithstanding_o man_n may_v be_v receive_v into_o fellowship_n without_o it_o where_o be_v we_o now_o what_o be_v john_n bunyan_n not_o content_a to_o set_v his_o post_n by_o the_o lord_n post_n but_o antichrist-like_a he_o must_v needs_o advance_v himself_o above_o god_n 2_o thess_n 2.4_o give_v new_a law_n contrary_a to_o what_o the_o god_n of_o heaven_n have_v give_v in_o his_o son_n jesus_n christ_n if_o baptism_n be_v a_o initiate_a ordinance_n and_o give_v a_o be_v to_o membership_n yet_o all_o that_o avail_v nothing_o with_o j._n bunyan_n he_o will_v receive_v member_n without_o it_o and_o that_o in_o despite_n of_o god_n although_o he_o have_v forbid_v it_o what_o doctrine_n be_v this_o will_v you_o know_v a_o reason_n of_o his_o practice_n which_o he_o pretend_v to_o show_v you_o in_o short_a it_o be_v his_o will_n maugre_o all_o opposition_n even_o of_o god_n himself_o for_o set_v the_o case_n man_n be_v forbid_v by_o the_o lord_n to_o enter_v into_o fellowship_n without_o baptism_n yet_o j._n bunyan_n will_v receive_v they_o but_o let_v we_o hear_v what_o he_o pretend_v as_o his_o warrant_n pag._n 83._o and_o that_o be_v first_o the_o example_n of_o the_o jew_n in_o the_o wilderness_n who_o say_v he_o notwithstanding_o circumcision_n give_v a_o be_v to_o church-membership_a without_o which_o it_o be_v if_o you_o will_v believe_v john_n bunyan_n positive_o command_v none_o shall_v be_v receive_v into_o fellowship_n yet_o for_o all_o this_o more_o than_o six_o hundred_o thousand_o be_v receive_v into_o the_o church_n without_o it_o and_o also_o retain_v there_o and_o that_o even_o by_o moses_n and_o joshua_n answ_n to_o this_o position_n i_o shall_v say_v first_o circumcision_n never_o give_v a_o be_v to_o church-membership_a neither_o be_v there_o any_o such_o positive_a command_n as_o be_v pretend_v that_o none_o shall_v be_v receive_v into_o the_o church_n without_o it_o john_n bunyan_n i_o suppose_v will_v grant_v the_o contrary_a for_o sure_a he_o will_v allow_v holy_a woman_n to_o be_v church-member_n second_o the_o six_o hundred_o thousand_o be_v not_o receive_v into_o fellowship_n by_o moses_n and_o joshua_n neither_o be_v they_o any_o way_n account_v by_o they_o church-member_n but_o as_o they_o be_v the_o natural_a seed_n of_o abraham_n to_o who_o the_o promise_n be_v make_v three_o their_o neglect_n of_o circumcision_n be_v a_o evil_a and_o a_o reproach_n to_o they_o which_o be_v say_v to_o be_v roll_v away_o in_o their_o circumcision_n josh_n 5.9_o wherefore_o whatsoever_o be_v the_o impediment_n it_o matter_n not_o it_o be_v a_o sin_n in_o they_o and_o a_o reproach_n unto_o they_o although_o j._n bunyan_n pretend_v they_o have_v a_o legal_a reason_n to_o excuse_v it_o which_o also_o as_o he_o think_v or_o at_o least_o say_v pag._n 94._o many_o have_v in_o these_o day_n to_o neglect_v baptism_n although_o a_o enjoin_v duty_n a_o holy_a ordinance_n of_o god_n what_o excuse_n i_o mean_v legal_a can_v that_o be_v he_o say_v the_o want_n of_o light_n our_o brethren_n say_v he_o have_v a_o manifest_a reason_n a_o invincible_a one_o one_o that_o all_o the_o man_n on_o earth_n or_o angel_n in_o heaven_n can_v remove_v for_o it_o be_v god_n that_o creat_v light_a wherefore_o if_o moses_n and_o joshua_n think_v fit_a to_o communicate_v with_o the_o uncircumcised_a as_o aforesaid_a why_o may_v not_o i_o have_v communion_n yea_o the_o close_a communion_n with_o visible_a saint_n although_o they_o want_v light_n in_o and_o can_v submit_v to_o that_o meaning_n baptism_n i_o shall_v therefore_o say_v he_o hold_v communion_n with_o such_o answ_n who_o can_v ever_o have_v think_v that_o john_n bunyan_n shall_v have_v preach_v the_o doctrine_n of_o those_o person_n against_o who_o he_o have_v so_o frequent_o manifest_v inveterate_a hatred_n he_o have_v often_o cry_v out_o against_o other_o for_o say_v the_o light_n within_o be_v the_o rule_n for_o christian_n to_o walk_v by_o but_o now_o he_o himself_o confident_o affirm_v it_o yea_o in_o opposition_n to_o positive_a command_n and_o express_v prohibition_n make_v it_o the_o great_a reason_n for_o and_o against_o a_o practice_n yea_o such_o a_o one_o as_o neither_o man_n or_o angel_n can_v remove_v but_o this_o be_v no_o strange_a thing_n herod_n and_o pilate_n two_o great_a enemy_n agree_v in_o one_o against_o christ_n but_o let_v i_o ask_v j._n bunyan_n whether_o light_n make_v a_o thing_n to_o be_v a_o duty_n or_o no_o duty_n be_v god_n law_n subservient_fw-fr to_o our_o light_n i_o suppose_v he_o must_v answer_v yea_o for_o it_o be_v congruous_a with_o his_o reason_n that_o what_o god_n command_v be_v no_o duty_n to_o those_o that_o have_v no_o light_n therein_o or_o at_o least_o the_o want_n of_o light_n be_v a_o sufficient_a excuse_n for_o the_o neglect_n thereof_o for_o say_v he_o pag._n 94._o god_n create_v light_a i_o suppose_v he_o mean_v therefore_o if_o they_o have_v no_o light_n it_o be_v because_o god_n have_v not_o give_v it_o etc._n etc._n well_o will_v it_o be_v if_o this_o be_v so_o for_o the_o great_a part_n of_o man_n to_o have_v such_o a_o advocate_n as_o john_n bunyan_n at_o the_o last_o day_n to_o plead_v on_o the_o behalf_n of_o their_o disobedience_n that_o they_o want_v light_a to_o do_v otherwise_o yea_o that_o god_n never_o give_v they_o light_n if_o the_o rich_a man_n we_o read_v of_o luke_n 16._o have_v but_o in_o this_o condition_n have_v john_n bunyan_n to_o plead_v for_o he_o his_o mouth_n will_v not_o have_v be_v so_o soon_o stop_v but_o stay_v i_o remember_v christ_n say_v unto_o the_o unprofitable_a servant_n luk._n 19.22_o out_o of_o thy_o own_o mouth_n will_v i_o judge_v thou_o and_o what_o if_o it_o shall_v be_v so_o say_v to_o john_n bunyan_n where_o will_v he_o be_v then_o and_o what_o will_v become_v of_o his_o brethren_n under_o who_o armhole_n he_o have_v sow_v pillow_n do_v not_o he_o say_v pag._n 45._o i_o believe_v jesus_n christ_n by_o the_o word_n of_o the_o scripture_n will_v judge_v all_o man_n at_o the_o day_n of_o doom_n and_o if_o so_o the_o word_n of_o the_o scripture_n say_v luk._n 12.48_o he_o that_o know_v not_o his_o lord_n will_n viz._n have_v no_o light_n in_o it_o shall_v be_v beat_v and_o good_a reason_n for_o the_o want_n of_o light_n be_v through_o their_o own_o neglect_n the_o light_n shine_v in_o darkness_n but_o the_o darkness_n comprehend_v it_o not_o joh._n 1.5_o it_o have_v be_v before_o prove_v that_o this_o be_v the_o condemnation_n that_o light_n be_v come_v into_o the_o world_n but_o man_n love_v darkness_n rather_o than_o light_n joh._n 3.19_o will_v j._n bunyan_n think_v it_o a_o sufficient_a reason_n against_o faith_n for_o a_o man_n to_o say_v i_o have_v no_o light_n if_o it_o be_v a_o good_a reason_n in_o one_o thing_n it_o be_v good_a in_o all_o paul_n once_o say_v rom._n 7.9_o i_o be_v alive_a without_o the_o law_n at_o least_o he_o think_v so_o when_o he_o do_v not_o know_v sin_n which_o by_o john_n bunyan_n reason_n be_v a_o sufficient_a excuse_n for_o any_o evil_n if_o i_o want_v light_n to_o do_v otherwise_o but_o sure_o john_n bunyan_n be_v conscious_a to_o himself_o that_o notwithstanding_o what_o he_o have_v pretend_v concern_v the_o weight_n of_o the_o aforesaid_a reason_n which_o he_o say_v be_v invincible_a yea_o so_o that_o all_o the_o man_n on_o earth_n or_o angel_n in_o heaven_n can_v remove_v