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A41594 A discourse of the use of images in relation to the Church of England and the Church of Rome in vindication of Nubes testium against a pamphlet entitled The antiquity of the Protestant religion concerning images, directed against some leaves of that collection. Gother, John, d. 1704. 1687 (1687) Wing G1328; ESTC R15744 20,616 40

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ipsa Apostolorum aetate neque enim contrarium ostendi potest existimationem peperit Honorificam The Honor and Esteem shewn to the NAME of the CROSS did produce even in the Age of the Apostles an honorable Esteem likewise for the SIGN of the Cross neither can any thing contrary to this be prov'd What can be plainer than that according to this Canon 't is the Sense of the Church of England that the Primitive Christians were taught by the Apostles not only to Honor the Name of the Cross but likewise the SIGN of the Cross And certainly if according to this Church the Apostles taught their Followers to honor in their Hearts and Souls the Sign of the Cross it can neither be contrary to the Apostles nor this Church to do so now and to express this Honor outwardly which they are thus taught to conceive inwardly and entertain in their hearts 'T is an Absurdity sure too great to fall upon the Church of England thus absolutely to approve the Affection of Honor and Esteem towards the Sign of the Cross in Christians Hearts as both a Christian Duty and an Apostolical Doctrin and then afterwards to condemn the same Honor and Affection of the Soul as Idolatry and Superstition when 't is express'd Outwardly either in Words or Gesture For how is it possible that what is Apostolical in the Heart should by being express'd outwardly become Idolatrous This Doctrin is deliver'd more expresly by Mr. Montague who in his Book call'd a New Gag thus declares the Express Tenet of Catholics and of his own Church p. 318. You say the Pictures of Christ the Blessed Virgin and Saints must not have Latria So We. You give them Dulia I quarrel not the Term tho' I could There is a Respect due unto and Honor given Relatively to them If this you call Dulia We give it too Let Practice and Doctrin go together We agree Nay he shews farther 't is impossible to keep or set up the Pictures of Christ or his Saints without having a REVERENCE and HONOR for them in due kind Hear him in his own words in his Appeal to Caesar c. 21. But it has distasted some says he that RESPECT and HONOR should be given unto them Images of Christ Strange it should displease any that can approve of any be it but a Civil use of them I cannot tell unless Men would ins●●ntly have them pull'd down in all places demolish'd stamp'd to powder whosesoever whatsoever wheresoever The setting of them up suffering them to stand using them for Ornaments for helps of Memory of Affection of Rememoration cannot be abstracted to my Vnderstanding from Reverence and Honor Simply in due kind Can a Man have the True Representation of his Prince Parents Patrons c. without Awe Respect Regard Love Reverence moved by Aspect and wrought in him I profess my Imperfection or what they will call it it is so with me Unco impacto in Latrinas in Gemonias in malam Crucem the Pictures Statues Paintings Representations of Christ the Virgin Apostles Martyrs Holy Men and Women unless the very having and preserving of them do in some sort imply RESPECT REGARD and HONOR done unto them without offence justly given without Scandal or Inclination to Impiety Then he urges the Truth of this Doctrin with the words of Junius Junius says he was no Papist not in your opinion I hope He in his Animadversions upon Bellarmin de Imaginibus says Hoc nemo NOSTRVM dicit non esse COLENDAS nec ullo modo Suo modo COLI probamus velut Imagines at non religioso cultu qui aut superstitiosus est aut impius nec cùm aliorum scandalo sive Cultus separatus sive conjunctus cum eorum Cultu intelligatur quorum sunt Imagines None of us say that Images are no ways to be worship'd We prove that they are to be worship'd in a way peculiar to them as Images but not with a Religious Worship which is either Superstitious or Impious Neither to the scandal of others whether the Worship be understood the same or different from that which is given to the things Represented by them Thus this Learned Man delivers and defends the Doctrin of his Church in relation to the Images of Christ and his Saints against the Arguments of some Informers which he thinks to be no other than Puritans and at best some FVRIOVS ONES of his own Church or SINGVLAR ILLUMINATES as he terms them ib. c. 20. And now what great difference here in this Point between the Two Churches The Council of Trent says that Images of CHRIST c. ought to be set up in Churches and DVE HONOR and VENERATION given them The Church of England by Mr. Montague says that the Images of Christ the Blessed Virgin Mary and Saints may be set up in Churches RESPECT and HONOR may be given them in Due kind The using them for helps of Memory of Affection of Rememoration cannot be abstracted from REVERENCE and HONOR simply in DVE kind The Catechism ad Parochos says These Images are set up in Churches ut Colantur that they may be Honor'd or Worship'd that is in due kind The Protestants say by Junius None of us deny but they may be Honor'd or Worship'd in their kind Nay more We prove They are to be Worship'd in some manner that is as Images Both Churches then agree that Sacred Images may be set up in Churches that a Respect Honor and Reverence is due to them in their kind and both concur in terming this Honor or Reverence Cultus or Worship i. e. in it's kind Suo modo Junius expressing it due velut Imagines as they are Images The Council of Trent because they Represent Christ c. which is upon the very same reason and ground Besides this 't is agreed by both Churches that this Reverence shewn to these things is founded purely upon the Relation they have to God and is terminated finally upon him This as to the Church of Rome appears from what is already quoted out of the Council of Trent And as to the Church of England from the words of Montagu above mention'd And from Bishop Jewel who in Rep. ag Hard. says We Worship the Sacrament the Word of God we Worship all other things in such Religious wise to Christ belonging And then afterwards giving the Reason The Sacraments be Ador'd says he but the whole Honor resteth not in them but is passed over from them to the things Signified Which is the very Relative Honor mention'd so often by Catholic Divines And this Divinity is found likewise in some Modorn Church-Men as Dr. Stillingfleet who in his Def. ag T. G. pa. 600. says that Altho' no Irrational or Inanimate Being be capable of that real Excellency to deserve any Honor from us for it 's own sake yet such things may have a Relation to matters of so High a Nature as to deserve a different Vsage and Regard from other things And this
afterwards he terms a Reverence and if I may so call it a Religious Respect to Sacred Places and Things In which words tho' there 's some Mincing it yet it delivers in some manner the whole Doctrin of Catholics The two Churches thus agreeing in the lawfulness of placing Images in Churches and that an Honor or Reverence or even Worship in it's kind is necessarily due to them as they serve for helps to Piety of Affection or Rememoration and have Relation to God. The Answerer of these leaves of Nubes Testium lets fly at all this like one of Montagu's FVRIOVS ONES or SINGVLAR ILLVMINATES He runs it down under the Name of IMAGE-WORSHIP and is sure with this very Word alone so far to prevail upon the Ignorant and Vulgar at least with whom by his loose arguing he seems chiefly concern'd as to gain their Votes in crying down the Papists for Idolaters and then his Business is done Upon this strain he runs to the end of his Pamphlet proving that Image-Worship is contrary to Fathers to Antiquity to Councils Image-Worship Image-Worship is all the Cant But never tells what this Image-Worship is and never reflects that his own Church is for an Image-Worship too Thus unhappily in the midst of Dust and Noise he manages the Controversie with the Papists without ever Stating the Question or declaring what the Papists hold unbecoming a Scholar and multiplying many Needless Contentions unbecoming a Christian If he had examin'd the Doctrin of his own Church and understood what Catholics teach he would have soon discover'd the vanity of this Engagement and found that after so much bustle upon this matter there 's but little more in 't besides Fighting about Names and Words and that however tolerable this may be in a School for a Logic Dispute 't is unworthy of a Divine who pretends to be a Preacher of the Gospel of Peace 'T is already here made out to any unprejudic'd Considerer that according to the Doctrin of Protestants especially those of the Church of England 't is impossible to separate even the Historical Use of Holy Images from a Respect and Reverence which necessarily follows them Much less can they serve as Helps to Piety for the exciting Devotion and bringing to mind the Persons Represented but they force from the beholders an Interior Love and Honor so that as 't is impossible for a Good Subject to have by him the Picture of his Prince and of a Traytor without being differently affected in his Soul towards them even in the very same manner as he is to the Persons they Represent So neither can a Faithful and Good Christian behold the Pictures or other Representations of Christ of Judas of Mahomet but his Soul will be differently mov'd towards them with Love Respect Honor Veneration on the one side with Indignation and Contempt on the other as he finds himself affected to the Persons Represented by them Thus far is acknowledg'd by Protestants and may be gather'd from what is above cited out of Montagu and Junius Catholics say the same and so cannot be censur'd or condemn'd for this What then is their Crime The Charge urg'd against them is that they shew this same Honor and Veneration outwardly to these Holy Images of Christ the Apostles c. They kiss them pull off their Hats they Bow they Kneel Burn Tapers Incense and Pray before them This is the Crime this the Image-Worship and Idolatry of the Catholics And here in their behalf and to bring this Voluminous Controversie into a Narrower Compass I must ask of the Answerer If it be lawful for Protestants and Catholics to have an INTERIOR Respect Honor and Reverence for Holy Images as appears evidently confess'd above how comes it to be so Vnlawful and Abominable for Catholics to signifie and express outwardly this same Respect Honor and Reverence which is so Commendable for all Christians both Catholics and Protestants to have Inwardly in their Souls Certainly That Honor and Reverence which in the Heart is Christian cannot but be Christian in the Expression And 't is very absur'd to think a Duty can become Idolatry by professing it If a Christian has a greater Reverence in his Soul for the Book of the Holy Scriptures than for any other Book whatsoever may not he lawfully express this Reverence by Kissing it If the Woman in the Gospel respects and Honors in her Heart the Hem of our Saviours Garment is the Kissing that Hem any more Idolatry than was that Affection and Reverence she had in her Soul towards it If a Christian has a Respect and Reverence even for the House of God or Church above other Houses that are not Dedicated to his Service may not he shew this Respect by Vncovering his Head If a Christian Honors the Communion-Table above other Prophane Tables may not this Honor be exteriourly profess'd by setting Candles on it and Plate and adorning it with Hangings and then Bowing to it without a Crime If a Christian Reverences and Honors in his Heart the NAME of Jesus or of the Cross as the Church of England says the Apostles did can it be Idolatry outwardly to profess this same Honor by Bowing or Bending the Knee And if he Respects the Sacrament may not he shew this exteriorly by receiving it Kneeling And if these Exterior Professions and Acknowledgments of the Interior Respect Honor and Reverence that is due to these things may be thus commendably shewn by Kissing Vncovering the Head by Tapers Ornaments Bowing and Kneeling without any Abomination in the sight of God or just Scandal to our Neighbor why may not the like Interior Respect and Honor acknowledg'd due to Holy Representations of Christ or his Saints be profess'd outwardly by the same Visible Expressions of Respect and Reverence Especially since what is done to all these things is upon no other account than the Relation they have to God and as appertaining to him and his Service Neither let the Answerer think to take Sanctuary in calling this Veneration shewn to Pictures and Images of Christ a Worship as an Image-Worship For however this may work upon the Mobile and Unthinking Crowds and fill their heads with a Notion of Idolatry yet every Man of Sense and unbiass'd Judgment knows that this word Worship is equivocal and that 't is not every thing is presently made an Idol of which is any ways said to be Worship'd As is shewn at large in The Pap. Misrep 2. Part. c. 5 6. For 't is not only the Honor which Catholics shew to Holy Images is call'd a Worship but likewise that is a Worship which Protestants give as is own'd by Junius above so that in this Sense Protestants may be said and prov'd to be Image-Worshipers too The Reverence likewise shew'd by Protestants to the Sacrament is call'd by Jewel Rep. to Hard. a Worship The Honor given to the Bible he stiles a Worship In the same way of speaking the Respect to the Communion-Table may be