Selected quad for the lemma: doctrine_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
doctrine_n	know_v	scripture_n	tradition_n	2,389	5	9.3614	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A45214	A defence of the humble remonstrance, against the frivolous and false exceptions of Smectymnvvs wherein the right of leiturgie and episcopacie is clearly vindicated from the vaine cavils, and challenges of the answerers / by the author of the said humble remonstrance ; seconded (in way of appendance) with the judgement of the famous divine of the Palatinate, D. Abrahamvs Scvltetvs, late professor of divinitie in the University of Heidelberg, concerning the divine right of episcopacie, and the no-right of layeldership ; faithfully translated out of his Latine.	Hall, Joseph, 1574-1656.; Scultetus, Abraham, 1566-1624. Determination of the question, concerning the divine right of episcopacie.	1641 (1641)	Wing H378; ESTC R9524	72,886	191

could not but bleed to see but withall desired to have had them lesse publique your charity accuseth mee of excusing them and blaming my humble motion of Constantines example professe to desire the blazoning of them to the World Whether of us shall give a better account of our charity to the God of peace I appeale to that great Tribunall In your next Section like ill-bred sonns you spit in the face of your mother A Mother too good for such sonnes The Church of England and tell us of Papists that dazle the eyes of poore people with the glorious name of the holy Mother the Church If they bee too fond of their Mother I am sure your Mother hath little cause to be fond of you Who can and dare compare her to those Aethiopian strumpets which were common to all commers For your whole undutifull carriage towards her take heed of the Ravens of the valley As if wee were no lesse strangers then you enemies to the Church of England you tell the World that wee know not who she is and that we wonder when wee are askt the question and run descant upon the two Archbishops Bishops Convocation Even what your luxuriant wit shall please and at last you make up your mouth with a merry jest telling your Reader that the Remonstrant out of his simplicity never heard nor thought of any more Churches of England then one Ridiculum caput Sit you merry Brethren but truly after all your sport still my simplicity tells mee there is but one Church of England There are many Churches in England but many Churches of England were never till now heard of You had need fetch it as farre as the Heptarchie And to shew how far you are from the objected simplicity yee tell us in the shutting up that England Scotland and Ireland are all one Church Nullum magnum ingenium sine mixtura dementiae But now take heed of Obelisks You professe you for your parts do acknowledge no Antiprelaticall Church I am glad to heare it nor I neither but I beseech you if you make and condemne a Prelaticall Church of England what shall bee the other part of the Contradistinction The Remonstrant tels you of further divisions and subdivisions which upon this ground you must necessarily make of the Church your deepe wisdomes take this as of his upbrading of the divisions in the Church in meer matter of Opinion and fly out into the censures of the Prelaticall party as the cause thereof and would have them say Mitte nos in Mare non erit tempestas The truth is the severalties of Sects and their separate Congregations about this Citie are many and lamentable I doe not upbraid but bewaile them The God of Heaven be Iudge where the fault rests and if it bee his holy will finde some speedy redresse but in the mean time one casts it upon faction another upon ungrounded rigour wheresoever it bee Woe bee to those by whom the offence commeth Lay you your hands on your hearts onwards and consider well Whether your fomenting of so unjust and deep dislikes of lawfull government have not been too much guilty of these wofull breaches As one that love that peace of the Church which you are willing to trouble I perswading an unity ask what bounders you set what distinction of Professors you make what grounds of Faith what new Creed what different Scriptures Baptisme means of salvation are held by that part which you mis-call the Prelaticall Church You answer according to your wonted Charity and Truth What bounds Those you say of the sixth Canon from the high and lofty Promontory of Archbishops to the Terra incognita of an c. Witty again Alas brethren if this bee all the Lists are too narrow Here are but four ranks of Dignities and few in each put if that inclusive c. reach far yet what will you make of all this Doe you exclude Bishops Deans Archdeacons c. from being members of the Church of England sure you dare not bee so shamefully unjust If therefore that they have an interest in the Prelacy cannot exclude them for their interest in the Church What becomes of your bounders This is fit work for your Obelisk What distinction you say worshiping to the East bowing to the Altar prostituting perhaps you meane prostrating themselvs in their approches into Churches and are these fit distinctions brethren whereupon to ground different churches if they difference men doe they difference Christians What new Creed you say Episcopacie by divine right is the first article of their Creed For shame brethren did ever man make this an article of faith who will thinke you worthy to have any faith given you in the rest of your assertions you adde absolute and blind obedience to all the commandements of Bishops Blush yet again Bretheren blush to affirme this when you well know that the words of the oath of Canonicall obedience run only In omnibus licitis honestis mandatis in all lawfull and honest commands You adde Election upon faith foreseene What nothing but grosse untruths Is this the doctrine of the Bishops of England have they not strongly confuted it in Papists in Arminians have they not cry'd it downe to the pit of Hell What means this wickedly false suggestion judge Reader if here bee not work for Obelisks What Scripture you say Apocrypha and Traditions unwritten Mark I beseech you unwritten Traditions are Scriptures first then Apocrypha and why I pray you is it more our Apocrypha then yours Are all our Bibles Prelaticall too Shortly all those Churches and houses and persons that have the Apocrypha in their Bibles belong to the Church Prelaticall what have wee lost by the match What Baptisme What Eucharist You tell us of the absolute necessity which some Popish fooles have ascribed to the one and of an Altar and table set Altarwise in the other What are these to the Church of England doth the errour of every addle head or the sight or posture of a Boord make a different Church What Christ You answere near to a blasphemy A Christ who hath given the same power of absolution to a Priest that himselfe hath This can be nothing but a slanderous fiction No Christian Divine ever held that a Priests power of absolution was any other then ministeriall Christs Soveraign and absolute If you know the man bring him forth that he may be stoned What Heaven you say such as is receptive of Drunkards Swearers Adulterers Brethren take heed of an Hel whiles you fain such an Heaven and feare lest your uncharitableness will no lesse bar you out of the true Heaven above then you bar Prelaticall sinners from their accesse thereinto but if you had rather goe on still in your owne way separate your selves from us that professe wee are one with you Charge upon us those doctrines and opinions which wee hate no whit lesse then your selves fasten upon the Church of England those

the matter or of the men but it did not Sir Edward Coke can tell you that till the eleventh year of Qu. Elizabeth all came to Church Those times knew no Recusant then At last the Jesuitish Casuists finding their great disadvantage by the inoffensive use of our Liturgie determined it utterly unlawfull to joyne in Church-service with Heretiques Hence came this alienation hence this distraction that we have not won more it is not the fault of our publique devotion why do you not impute it to the want or weaknesse in preaching rather But that our Liturgy hath lost any to the Popish part it is not more paradoxe then sclander Those stumbling blocks which you say our Liturgie laies before the feet of many are by many removed and amongst the rest by a blind man whose eie-lesse head directed how to avoid those blocks which these quick-sights will needs see how to stumble at But if there be found ought that may indanger a scandall it is under carefull hands to remove it It is Idoliz'd they say in England they meane at Amsterdam some Separists have made it such never any just Protestant Others say rather that too many doe injuriously make an Idoll of preaching shall we therefore consider of abandoning it and if some one have passed an hyperbolicall praise of it must it therefore be marred in mending Multitudes of people they say distast it more shame for those that have so mistaught them would God too much multitude did not through ill teaching distast the truth of wholsome doctrine and abhorre Communion with the true Church of Christ shall we to humour them abandon both There is a vast difference they say betweene it and the Liturgies of all other reformed Churches A difference wherein not in the essentiall points but in some accidents and outward formalities Whose fault is that ours was before theirs why did not they conforme to us rather then we come back to them I may boldly say ours was and is the more noble Church and therefore more fit to lead then to follow But indeede since our Languages and Regions are different what neede is there our Liturgies should be one and why should we be more tyed to their formes then those of all other Christians Grecians Armenians Cophs Abassine Arabian Egyptian all which differ in no lesse from each other then we from them Consider now brethren whether these reasons of a change be worthy of any consideration The second Quaere is so weak that I wonder it could fall from the pens of wise men Whether the first reformer of religion did ever intend the use of a Liturgie further then to be an helpe in the want and to the weaknesse of the Minister Brethren can ye thinke that our Reformers had any other intentions then all other the founders of Liturgies through the whole Christian yea and Jewish Church the least part of whose care was the help of the Ministers weaknesse and their main drift the helpe of the peoples devotion that they knowing before-hand the matter that should be sued for and the words wherewith it should be clothed might be the more prepared to joyn their hearts to the Ministers tongue and be so much more intent upon their devotion as they had lesse need to be distracted with the doubtfull expectation of the matter or words to be delivered It is no lesse boldly then untruly said that all other Churches reformed though they use Liturgies doe not bind their Ministers to the use of them Binding is an ambiguous word I am sure both the French and Dutch Churches in both which I have been present require their prescribed formes to be used both in Baptisme and in Celebration of the Lords Supper and in solemnization of Matrimony And in what rank will they place the Lutheran Churches And if the Reformed Churches use this liberty what a poore handfull are they to that world of Christian Churches abroad which do both use and injoyn their Liturgie in that first forme we have seen urged in the Melevitane Councell The Rubrick in King Edwards booke is mis-construed which only out of respect to the peoples ease and their more willing addiction to the hearing of Sermons which were then so much more long as they were more rare gave that liberty to Ministers in the use of the Liturgie which divers Ordinaries at this day upon my certain knowledge have often yeelded unto That Rubrick imports no more then our practise neither of them disparages our Liturgie The Homilies are left free they say to be read or not by preaching Ministers why not then the Liturgie And if it can be thought no lesse then sacriledge to rob the people of the Ministers gift in preaching and to tie him to Homilies it can be no lesse to deprive them of their gift in Prayer Did we utterly abridge all Ministers of the publique use of any conceived Prayer on what occasion soever the argument might hold force against us but that being yeelded our Liturgie is untouched Neither were it a lesser sacriledge to rob the people of a set forme by the liberty of a free expression And how doth this argument more strike us then all the Churches of the Christian world whose preaching is out of their conception whiles their Liturgie is injoyned It is a false ground that the imposing of the Book ties godly men from exercising their gift in Prayer An enjoyned Liturgie may well stand with the freedome of a Prayer conceived The Desk is no hinderance to the Pulpit He is wanting to his duty that slackneth either service Much lesse can this be any reason to keep men from their presence at our Church-service that a Liturgie is imposed Tell me Is this Liturgie good or evill If it be evill it is unlawfull to be used If good it is not unlawfull to be imposed And were the imposition amisse what is that to the people It is imposed upon the Minister that whether act or passion rests in him the people are no more concerned in it then if a Minister should tye himselfe to the use of a Prayer of his owne making as I have knowne some of the most famous Divines of this Kingdome constantly do If then there be no way left to recover the people to a stinted Prayer but by leaving it free to use or not to use O● miserably mis-led people whom nothing belike can reclaime after such doctrine instilled but a professed confusion Well may they object to themselves in this way divisions and disturbances following upon a perfect deformity and sooner may they object then avoid them But why more here they say then in other Reformed Churches The difference is evident Our Churches have never been but used to a setled Liturgie which the eares and hearts of our people look for Theirs perhaps began without it Yet so as I doubt not but if any man should now refuse to conforme to their estabilished formes hee should soon feele the