for these last yeares no Praise or Speaking of Christ at all How is it credible For being but a maÌ„ how should he not by all likelihoode folow the common course of men And if he would needes be Singular how could he discerne betwene the true and the false Opinions of the first six hundred yeres whereas he should finde Examples and Wrytings of both Or not able to discerne betwene them how could he fasten his minde and beleife vpon any one of them bothe except he were A Singular one in deede For wisemen doe not lightly take that way in which they see not either the Towne plainely before them or some Cawsey Pathes or Steps of feete to direct them Neither doe they vse when they goe in the right way and come at lenght to some turning or duble waie to go forward I can not tell how without loking backe if any folow Or loking about if any be within sight but either rest themselues vntill they spie of whome to aske Or goe so doubtefully forward in that which leeketh them that if better Counsell and teaching come vnto theÌ„ they wil be returned and ordered And if it be so in A corporall and visible way ought it not to be much more so in folowing the right way vnto truth of vnderstanding and knowledge And when the whole world taketh one waie Or diuerse cumpanies in the world folow diuerse waies would any man of Discretion be so Bolde or Foolishe as to goe peaking alone by himselfe in such an Opinion or Imagination as no man byside himselfe aloweth And so directly go in it that to liue and die he would not be brought from it If therefore these fortie yeres last past or what so euer it be more that M. Iewel hath liued in the world nor Christ had bene Preached nor the Primitiue Churche commended he could not vndoubtedly by any good Occasion or Reason haue estemed the Christian wryters of a thousand yeres sens Or geauen any Faith vnto Christ. Except we should thinke otherwise than y â— Apostle hath taught vs y â— faith commeth without hearing Or that no man sent for him yet by some Miracle perchannce he was brought vnto Christ. Of which two both are out of course And without some Extraordinary way of making them likely vnto vs both are Unreasonable both are Incredible The present Fame then Renoume Testimonie of this Age drawing men of this Age vnto Christ yet doth M. Iewel so litle set by it as though it were worthy of litle credite or rather none And he so cleaâ—eth vnto those vj. C. yeres past A thousaÌ„d yeres almost sens as though he could be sure of the Catholike true Faith that was then w tout the Testimonies of the Catholike Church now Or as though some secrete Mistery or Securitie were in them to further him in vnreueled Conclusions And exempt him from all Iurisdiction In so much that although in xv C. yeres rekening which the Church hath continued in as it shall to the worldes end viij yeres can not greatly hurt the Accompt Yet so true an Audite of theÌ„ is kept by M. Iewel that he wil not receiue the Testimonies of the viij yeres next after the first vj. C. but noteth in his Booke their cumming to late though they came very nigh His wordes be these M. Harding knoweth wel that this grauÌ„t to be called The Head of al Churches was made vnto Bonifacius the third which was Bisshope of Rome in the yere of our Lord vj. C. and viij Euen at the same very time that Mahomete first began to plant his Doctrine in Arabia And therfore maketh nothing to this purpose as beiâ—g without the cumpasse of six hundred yeres As who should thinke that within those viij yeres on this side the six hundred The Pope and Emperour with the whole world were Sodainely and Straungely conuerted from the Faith and Order which they were of viij yeres before And no Historie mentioning it were made of Pure Protestants Grosse Papists Yea not only of viij yeres aboue the vj. C. he maketh a sad rekoning towards his Uantage but of the vj. C. yere it self if he can bring D. Hardings testimonie so low he so vaunteth and braggeth as though either himself had the Uictorie Or els nothing should be won or lost For whereas D. Harding for profe of y â— Church Seruice in a Straung Tongue and vnknowen to the Uulgare people and that also within the first vj. C. yeres alleaged the cumming of S. Augustine the Monke and our Apostle into England which was by his accompt the 14. yere of Mauritius Emperor the 596. of our Lord. Master Iewel in answering it sayeth Of the 600 â–ª yeres after Christ whervpon Iioyne wish him issue Liberally and of his owne accord he geueth me backe fiue hundred foure scoare and sixtene And of so greate a number as 600. are reserueth vnto himself foure POORE YERES and yet is not very certaine of the same And then it foloweth But if Marianus Scotus accompt be true that Augustine came into this Realme not the fourtienth of the Emperour Mauritius but four yeres after which was iust the six hundred yere after Christ then he reserueth not one yere to himselfe but yeldeth me backe altogeather Loe what a wise contention here is And how sadly M. Iewel foloweth it Did he thinke with himselfe that none but Children or Idiotes would Reade his Replie And if he prouided to make it so as not only Wisemen should consider it but the Aduersarie also might â—e answered by it how could he for shame of the world so Trifle and Wrangle and Set furth himselfe so much vpon so litle occasion For if the vj. C. yeres shall trie the mater he that cometh four yeres before they be ended commeth time inough to confute M. Iewel And his Cause therefore being lost Or his Bragging at least confounded if in any time before the vj. C. yeres expired the contrarie to this Assertion may be proued Why should he call them foure Poore yeres or set them at naught which making to the number of the first 600. yeres are part of the yeres vpon which he ioyned Issue and are by his apointement of greate Authoritie The crake herein is like as if one should say In all S. Augustines workes you shal not finde this worde Missa and thervpon I wil ioyne with you as though a great point of Diuinitie consisted herein An other answeareth yeas Mary I finde the worde in such and such Sermons Then Replieth the ChalleÌ„ger Of so great a number of Tomes as S. Augustine hath writen of so many bokes in euery Tome c. as far as his Rhetorike permitteth you geaue me backe Liberally And of your owne accord al the sort of them almost and reserue vnto your selfe two POORE SERMONS and yet are you not very certaine of them whether they be S. Augustines or â—oe As if he should say I layed
then one or two Relations yet in the descending from the superiour to the inferiour there might appeâ—re a shew of likelyhod But this Logike passeth in deede for it is M. Iewels that Paulinus whiche was borne three hundred yeres after Ireneus vseth the worde principalis in this sense Ergo Principalitas of which Ireneus speaketh stoode not in the Bishope that professed Christe but in the Emperour that was an heathen Thus thou maise see Indifferent Reader what fowle shifts and deuises and lyes M. Iewel had made to turne awaie the Authoritie of Ireneus that it should not be taken for the Principalitie of the Church of Rome But his conclusion is notable To be shorte saieth he If the Church of Rome would nowe faithfully keepe the Traditions and Doctrine of the Apostles we would fraÌ„kely yeld her all that honour that Ireneus geueth her but she hath shaken of the yoke of Christ. O good men It was then by likelihod for pure loue of God and godlines that you are departed from the See of Rome There were so fewe Sacramentes and those of so litle effecte there was so litle Fasting Watching Praying so litle chastitie Discipline and Order that you could not abyde to lyue so loosely but would needes take an yoke vpon you to keepe your bodies low by carying your yokeâ—elowes about the Countries with you beâ—ides other burdens And to keepe your spirits humble by obeying neither spiritual nor temporal Iurisâ—iction For the Saxons in Germanie the Hugonots in France the Guses in Flaunders and Brabant which of late because the yoke was not heauie inough vpoÌ„ their shoulders haue I can not tel for what penaÌ„ce sake made themselues great fardels and packes of Church goodes and sweate againe with the carriage of them awaie were not they and are not these Cusson germans vnto you But you wil do more for Christs sake than this You wil be content I perceaue to go euen to Rome it selfe vpon certaine conditions And what are they Forsoth if y â— church of Rome would keepe the Traditions doctrine of the Apostles then â—o you wold frankly honour it And is this possible Traditions you knowe are verities and orders not written in the Scriptures but deliuered without writing And is there any thing which you wil fâ—ankely beare except it be writen in expresse Scriptures Surely I can 〈◊〉 beleue it yet if ye would vpon conditions geue y â— honour to the Church of Rome which S. Ireneus absolutely gaue without any such cautels you are not so vnlike to be a Papist as I thought you were For let vs suppose it that as you would with so al the Traditions and Doctrine of the Apostles were faithfully kept in Rome would ye frankly yeld her al honour that Ireneus geueth her â—elme then if 〈…〉 or any other Heretikes would deuise 〈◊〉 of their owne trouble the Church of England with them wold ye go to Rome for the mater and aske of the Ciuile Estate there â–ª Or the Emperor if he were a heathen Or of the persequutours or Ennemies of the Church yf such felowes had dominion there wold ye aske of them what should be thought of the Olde Heretiques newly vpstarted Yf ye would go to them that haue no Religion to 〈◊〉 counsel of them about For concerning plaine beâ—â—sies we are now so accustomed to read them heare them that thei are not straunge vâ—to vs but when hypocrisie is ioyned with heresie Or wheÌ„ veritie is disseÌ„bled through â—eare or 〈◊〉 there we are desirous to haue the partie examined And conâ—â—reâ—ned either â—laâ—â—ly to confesse his hereâ—â—e Or faithfully to stand with y â— veritie Shortly therfore to you M. Iewel Yf you would honour the Church of Rome in like sorte as S. Iraeneus chargeth al the faithful to doe how 〈◊〉 ye geue to the â—â—nges of England and that by the â—â—â—esse â—criptures as you interprete them such Supremacie in maters eccleâ—â—â—â—ical as can not stand possibly with the going to Rome in any question of Faith For by Aet of Parlement and your owne othâ—â— and the practise of the Realme there is no 〈◊〉 power that hath to do with the Church of England And therefore were Rome neuer so perâ—â—â—â— no greatâ—r Principalitie could be attributed to the Church of Rome than the â—ing of England hath whom you byhold to be 〈…〉 On the other side if ye wil defend stil that which hitherto ye haue set â—â—rth by Lawes Othes Sermons 〈…〉 c. What an Hypocrite are you so to speake as though ye would as frankelie yeld to the Church of Rome principal honour as â—renâ—us both earâ—estly require it that for the 〈…〉 al Churches 〈◊〉 for trial of true doctrine resorte vnto it 〈…〉 you of these daies haue them in coÌ„tempt dishonour therfore you speak of no more then y â— TeÌ„ples built in their remembraÌ„ce And yet this very building of Temples in the honour of Martyrs it seemeth not that you like very wel wheras vnto any one of your so stinking a cuÌ„pany of Martyrs we hearâ— of no groâ—nd y â— you haue meatâ—â— out as yeâ— to laiâ— therein y ◠〈◊〉 of any Pulpit House or 〈◊〉 of your Champions Now to the sense of S. 〈◊〉 wordes Vvhy do they not goe to the Marâ—â—â— Vvhy 〈◊〉 they not to the Church That is â–ª as you M. Iewel vnderstand him 〈◊〉 Receiue they at home and not at Church But this is not S. Hieroms meaning For he reproueth not their Receiuing at home but their Receiuing at home the next day that folowed their nightes pleasure taking of their Wiues Marke that Circumstance and you shal quickly perceiue that you are deceiued or haue deceiued For take the whole Sentence with you I knovv saith S. Hierome â—hat this Custome is in Rome that the faithful do receiue daily the Body of Christ. And what say you than to that Custome He Answereth Qâ—â—d nec reprehend◠〈…〉 which thinge I neither reproue nor alowe for euery man abundeth in his owne sense What shal we say then to this case If a man be sufficiently prepared and 〈◊〉 the SacrameÌ„t in his owne house at home and neuer goe to the 〈…〉 for it perteyned not to the question of 〈…〉 of which he there consâ—â—eth Yet M. Iewel thinketh that S. Hierome Answereth this foresaied question and that he maketh a ful determination thereof with an ernest reprouf of the parties offending against it As if S. Hierom should say to the Romaiâ—ts what meane you to doubt in this plaine mater Or why should ye thinke that Receauing at home were lawfull Do ye not know that the Lordes supper is â— Communion and must not be taken of one alone Why dare ye not goe to the Temples of the Martyrs â–ª Are ye afraied of 〈◊〉 Why goe ye not to the Church Is not that the proper place to Receaue the Communion in Such a Comment would M. Iewel make vpon
to haue that bâ—ougâ—t oâ—t of any Olde Catholique Doctour or Father â–ª or any Olde General Councel c What other thing is this but a Mountebankes Preface to commend his wares vnto the Audience As if he should say in plainer woordes 〈◊〉 to them 〈◊〉 beloued in the Lorde you mâ—y tâ—ke me perchaunce for a Benchwhistâ—er or a man of litle knowledge and practise and altogeather vnhable to reproue the General and Catholique Doctrine of the whole world and to draw you from those Maisters and Teachers which alwaies hitherto ye haue ben ruled â—y But I shal tel you deere brethren I haue seene and readen as much as any man yea as all the learned men aliue I haue trauailed vnto the very Primitiue Church it selfe I haue bene conuersant with Old Catholike Doctors and Fathers and old General Councels As for these Priests Cardinals and Popes whom you folowe they bring nothing but Conclusions of Scholemen and deuises of Later Doctours and Ceremonies of their owne making c. But I will bring you no other thing but that which is Auncient I wil bring you back to the Institution of Christ himself You shal haue al things ministred vnto you as they were in the time of the Apostles You shal heare God himself speake vnto you The Priestes shall robbe you no more of halfe the Sacrament You shall knowe what you heare readden in the Church Ye shal haue no Supremacie of Pope no Real Presence of Christs body in the Sacrament Ye shal be brought to Old Customes which y e Councel of Nice would haue to preuaile And Tertullian shal teach you how that is true that was first ordeined And as I saied before so say I now againe If any man aliue be hable to reproue me I will become his obedient Scholer But I know there is not one that is able to doâ— it and because I know it therefore I speake it So beginneth the Mountebanke But in further processe he is proued to be so vaine in Craking So crafty in Shifting So demure in CouÌ„terseiting So false in Affirming So desperate in Abusing of his Aduersarie of old Councels and Doctours yea and of new also that it is perceiued wel inough euen of them that say God saue you my Lorde vnto him that al is not so as he saith Neuerthelesse they haue a good sporte to see the prety Shiftes and Defenses and Scapes that the Mountebanke canne make And though it be euident that he liâ—â—h yet they thinke not these maters to be so great or necessary but men may suffer them wel inough to be mainteined how so euer it be as long as neyther Trade of Merchaundise nor Study of Temporal Law nor Pastime abrode nor Pleasure at home is hindered by it For like as we may vnderstand by the maâ—ket folkes how the market goeth So when it is in sight that in Countries and Cities of greatest policy priuate mens goodes are not without punishment touched but the Common Churches of the whole Countrie are openly spoyled And when Papistes are neither suffred to speak â–ª nor to go abrode but Caluinistes Lutherans and Anabaptistes are not only suffred to speake but to speake one against the other And in one Citie or Countrie to set furâ—h and maintaine contrary Doctrines it is easy to perceiue that The vvisedome of God is but folly emong men And that al is for Policie and nothing for Religion and that men haue so forsaken the old Faith that they are not sâ—ttled in any new And that Faith in deede is almost extinguished by to much folowing of Carnal Reason and that Reason in thousandes is vtterly blinded because thei haue put from them the Obedience vnto Faith Yet this Corruption notwithâ—tanding I haue taken some paines in â—erswading with thee Indifferent reader to BEVVARE of M. Iewel Fearng in deede least to many be so in Indifferent that they passe not whether he say true or false And praying to God that they may haue A desire to know the Trueth which as yet care not for it and that other may haue a constancie to confesse the Truth when they know it And that the rest condemne not the the Truth before they know it Farevvel From Louane Quaâ—doquidem liber hic tertius contra M. Ievvellum à viris Linguae Anglicanae Sacrae Theologiae eruditissimis probatus est iudico eum tutô posse distrahi euâ—lgari Ità testor Cunerus Petri Pastor S. Petri. Louanij 3. Nouemb. 1566 ¶ Faultes escaped in the Printing Folio Page Line Fault Correction 6. 2. 1. Latines Laâ—enesse 40. 2. 12. ye he 47. 1. 6. Degrees Decrees 63. 1. 13. Dionysi of Dionysius 63. 2. 19. them then 80. 2. 2. tel lyes to tel lies 118. 2. 14. CoÌ„staÌ„â—in Constantius 141. 2. 4. y â— visible that a visible 142. 2. 15. he coÌ„clu he were conclu 160. 2. 3. primitiue Primate 181. 2. 16. the coÌ„munioÌ„ praier the Lordes prayer 191. 1. 3. peple vn peple might vn 195. 1. 7. of old Fa. of the old Fa. 197. 1. 14. ValeÌ„tians Valentinians 206. 1. 18. Suprem Preeminence 216. 2. 27. y â— it were that if it were 217. 2. 4. ar bound are not bound Ibid.  24. How say How sayed 221. 2. 10. yet if yet it 225. 2. 11. can say can truly say 230. 2. 8. gather easily gather 234. 2. 16. Trick or two Tricke or Toy In the Margent 172. 1. for is for there is 228. 1. Iew. 21. Ioan. 21. IbideÌ„  taken out of taken of The Third Booke of BEWARE OF M. Iewel IT may seeme by my Two former Bookes y â— I haue detected as great Sophistrie Brauerie Insinceritie of M. Iewels as any man lightly that hath but worldly regarde of his Trueth and Honestie may coulourably venter to practise But in comparison of that which I haue further to obiect the forsaid behauiours may seme to be perdonable For D. Harding is but one man and the same not knowen to the whole worlde and much lesse honoured of the whole He is also his Aduersary and M. Iewel taketh him selfe to be in no point perchaunse of lesse worthinesse And if in some one or two D. Harding farre passâ—th him yet in many moe on the other side he thinketh him selfe to be better And therefore when he doth handle him at his pleasure belye him Contemne him Mocke him and Tosse him without doubting or blusshing although it be very il done yet it is not exceeding il But to despise men without al doubt worthy notable To set light by them whom the whole world hath reuereÌ„ced To interprete Lawes and Canons after his own liking To disanul general couÌ„cels To corrupt Auncient Fathers To set them vp to pul them doune againe To bring them in to thrust them againe out To binde men to the Authoritie of the first six hundred yeares To appeale to the Primitiue Church only in his own cause and to drawe his Aduersarie vnto any State of Churche
within these last fiftene hundred yeares and for aâ—vantage to make the practise thereof a Definitiue sentence This is exceding presuÌ„ptuous and exceding Iniurious and this is that which I shal now laie to M. Iewels Charge ¶ Of M. Iewels exact accompting vpon the vj. C. yeres next after Christ. YOu Appeale M. Iewel most instantly to the Witnesses of the next six hundred yeres after Christ by which you geaue vs to vnderstand that either your giltie CoÌ„science feareth to be tried by God and the Countrie either that your simple vnderstanding conceiueth to helpe your cause by remoâ—ing of it Of which two there is nere a good neither Conscience already condemning you by the verdite of ix C. yeres together Neither lacke of Wit and Consideration mouing you of xv vniforme Witnesses ix put aside to Imagine that the lesser number of vj. only remaining could be so vsed as that they should appeere either contrary to the â—ine Or of more credite and worthinesse then the nine Both which thinges either that the Church of Christe should be contrary to it selfe or in some one part of her Age more worthy of credite than in some other are plainly and vtterly impossible bothe by Faith and by Reason For like as we are assured by right Faith that there is but One God One Iesus Christ God and man One Spirite diuiding vnto eche as he vvill One Bodie One Doue One Louier One Bevvtiful and One Catholik Church so is it impossible by Naturall Reason that of Unitie A Diuision might be made And that one Part might be found contrary to the other or One Part worthier than the other where there is no Partes making at all and therefore no Parts taking at al to cause any Discord Is Christ sayeth the Apostle diuided Is it yea and naâ—e vvith him Yea doth not he himself say Euery kingdom diuided vvith in it seâ—fe shall be left vvaste and desolate And doe not both Testamentes new and old plainely teache that his kingdome is euerlasting How then should his Church be Contrary vnto it self and thereby cumming to Diuision ende afterwardes in Dissolution Againe The Spiritie of Truthe was promised vnto her which should teach her all Truthe and tary also vvith her for euer There be also prouided for her meete Gouernours and Officers to continue with her and serue her to the perfiting of the holy vntill all doe meete togeather in Vnitie of Faith and knovvledge of the Sonne of God so that because of the Authoritie of the Chiefe Master whome it is Impossible to lie And the continuall succession of Ushers vnder him whome he maketh to teach as he Inspireth the Lessons which at this day are readen in the Church ought to be in deede of as greate Credite emong vs as any of the Primitiue Churches lessons Except perchaunce the Sprite be so blinde or blasphemous in any person as to deny his Almightinesse in making of such as dwel in his house of One minde and Accorde Of whose Promise Prouision and Charitie towardes hys church we haue so infallible testimonies Therefore as the Scriptures perswade our vnderstanding to beleue that the Church is One That it shall Continue for euer That it shall neuer Erre in Doctrine so Reason concludeth by this gift and light of Faith that because it is ONE it must either be NONE at all or continue ONE And because IT CONTINVETH FOR EVER it can not therefore be NONE Remaining then ONE it is to be credited without al doubt because it hath the Sprite of Truthe with her and can not erre And as well to be credited now as it was xv huÌ„dred yeres sense because it is ONE and the selfe same nowe as it was then concerning Assistance of the Holy ghost Priuileges of Honour Infalliblenesse of Truthe Or any other like parteining to the very Substance and nature as I may say of the Church of Christ. Like as in your self M. Iewel Or in any of vs the same Reasonable Soule and Sensitiue life that we receyued of God and our Parents at our beginning continueth yet stil w t vs the Self same in substance Notwithstanding many thousand Alterations in Affections of minde and Disposition of body which haue in the meane time chaunced vnto vs And chainged vs in the chaunce so notwithstanding many Alterations which haue bene in the Church of Christ these xv C. yeres concerning external Gouernment thereof and Ecclesiasticall Orders The life yet Soule and Sense therof is of the same making and worthinesse in all Times and Circumstancies In the Opinion and Imagination of fainte harted and weake Christians it appeareth I graunt to be of more Authoritie If Christ in his owne person speaketh than if S. Paule his Apostle by his will and commaundement speake it And no doubt they haue a good Zeale therein often times and Deuotion but they haue not alwaies good knowledge and UnderstaÌ„ding The Maries brought tidinges vnto the Apostles of the Resurrection of our Sauiour and though they were but Women yet they were deuout Wise and blessed women And their sayinges agreed with the woordes of Christ himselfe spoken vnto them before his Passion so that they might well and should haue bene credited Neuerthelesse their wordes seemed vnto the Apostles no better than A Doting and vaine tale And S. Peter ranne to the Sepulchre to see perchaunce whether he coulde finde a better Argument or Testimonye of the Resurrection than the Maries had brought vnto him and his fellowes Which Argument when it was the selfe same daie made after the best maner vnto them that is by Christes owne presence and wordes yet S. Thomas being at that time absent and hearing at his Returne of the sight and ioye which his fellowes had Except I see quod he the print of the nailes and put my hand into his side I vvill not beleue As who should say that he alone could see more in such a matter than ten other Or that if he once tried iâ— and beleued it him self then it were to be bidden by but if he lerned and receiued it of other mens Report and knowledge then loe it was not clear and out of question Yet the Truthe is alwaies Oâ—e And as faithfully it was to haue bene beleued y t which the Maries or Apostles saw and heard As that which S. Thomas not only saw or hard but fealt also Now in these foresaid Persons and Examples the inward and harty deuotion did somewhat extenuate the Carnalitie of the Affection Mary in other Cases it is grosser and viler As when A Noble and Honorable man speaketh A wise worde it is regarded and remembred but when a poore and Simple Soule doth speake the like it lacketh the same Grace and strength with the hearers Yet the Trueth and wisedome of the saying being on both sides all ONE in goodnesse it might well become all men to honor it without Respect of
seeme the lesse No remedy M. Iewel hath so appointed Againe Bessarions Authoritie in this case can not seeme greate bothe for other sundry causes which you leaue And Also which must needes be a good cause and not forgoten for that he liued at the least fourtene hundred yeres after Christ. And againe Pope Nicolas was the second Bishop in Rome after Pope Iohane the Woman Note here that Other men recken from S. Peter downeward this man compteth from Pope Iohane An English woman as the reporter of the tale sayth borne at Magunce in Germany Which was almost nine hundred yeres after Christ. Wherfore his Authoritie might well haue bene spared Thus we see then by manifest Examples the exact Accompt that you make of the first six hundred yeres after Christ As though the whole Truthe of A mater were lost if it come to knowledge any long time after the thing was done Let vs consider now Whether any honest Cause and Reason may be alleaged for your so doing Or whether you did it without cause Or els were sturred vp with some vnlawfull Affection and Reproâ—eable Cause And here now take no skorne M. Iewel if I appose you in a few Questions For either you be hable to Answer them and that shall be to your worship either not Answering them you shall occasyon Trueth therby to be knowen And that shall be to Gods glorie and the Cumfort of the doubtfull Surely if it were to my selfe and if so much might be obtained that I should be Answered in some One thing thoroughly and be bid to choose out of all that which I haue to demaunde that One thing which seemeth strongest agaynst my Aduersary and surest of the Catholikes I would be glad of the Occasion and all other maters quite and cleane put to Silence I would speake of these fewe poyntes which folow And either wythout more wordes holde my peace If in them I were satisfied Or requâ—re that our Aduersaries neuer trouble their hearers or Readers any further with other conclusions before these fâ—we questions were Answered Therefore I pray the Indifferent Reader to consider thys plaâ—e which foloweth though thou Reade no more of all the Booke First I aske of you M Iewel whether you haue any Faith at all or no If you haue none what meddle you with any Religion except it be for Ciuil Policie sake For which to doe as you doe though it would proue you lesse mad or vnreasonable yet should you be for lacke of Faith as deade in soule and as Godlesse as any Infidel in al the world If ye haue any how came you by it for we are not borne Christians but Regenerate neither doe we receiue faith by Nature but by Teaching And faith is by hearing sayeth the Apostle Of whome then haue you heard and lerned your Faith Of them that liued and died before you were borne Or of such as preached and taught in the world sens your selfe were of remembrance If you lerned of the first how could they teache without A tongue Or how could you heare without an care For they were now deade in body and cleane dissolued and you were not yet made of body and soule nor had any instruments of senses If you lerned of the Quicke and Liuing your self also quicke and liuing were those your Teachers of such Authoritie with you that you submitted your senses and vnderstanding to theyr iudgment Or examined you by your selfe their Doctrine and Sayinges If you the Scholer did iudge of the Master you were without all doubt a Malapert and Folishe Scholer Malapert because you would breake order and proudly goe before him whome you ought meekly to haue folowed And Folishe because in maters of Faith of which we now speake all Wit and Reason of man is altogeather vnworthy and vnable to Iudge of that which is Proponed If you then folowed their Authoritie and submitted your vnderstanding and will vnto their Doctrine without Mouing or Mistrusting any doubt about it VVhat were they in all the world vnto whome you gaue such credite I aske you not this question for the time of your Childhode in which though true Faith be Habitually in them that are Baptised yet there is not that Discretion or Consideration by which they may returne their mindes vpon theyr ownâ— actes Or put a difference betwene their GraÌ„dmothers tale of Bloudy bone Raw head Bloudelesse and Ware woulf and the Churches Doctrine of Hell and the Deuill But I speake now as to one that hath Understanding and knowledge of his owne state And Experience of many thinges And Lerning inough for the purpose And such a one whose part and profession it is to be able to geaue a good Cause and Reason for the Faith and Religion which he foloweth Of you therefore I aske what Authority that was Or is which moued you to be and continue A Christian Here you must not say vnto me that you considered the wrytinges of the Fathers of the first six hundred yeres And that you gaue your minde to Reading of the Scriptures c. For what so euer such tale yoâ— tell me it will alwaies remaine to be Answered of you what Instruction or Authoritie that was which either Taught you Or 〈◊〉 you to esteeme those Auncient Doctors of the Christian Religion Or these Scriptures of which you make your self so certaine For by your selfe you could no more know the difference betwene Writers and Writers or true Scriptures and lying Fables than A Blinde man caÌ„ iudge of Colours Or a Stranger know the right way in A Wildernesse or he Rede that knoweth no letter on the booke You are not I am sure wiser thaÌ„ S. Augu. Neither haue you better thought vpoÌ„ these maters than he did He saith of himself y â— concerning the Faith which he had in Christ. He savv himselfe to haue beleued none but the established opinion of Peoples Nations and the very Common and renoumed Fame of him Than which cause if you can geue any better it is time y â— you shew it As for vs neither we finde any like And we neede not be ashamed to be perswaded by it which moued S. Augustine him selfe to come vnto Christ. And I think verely that neither you studying neuer so much for it can bring any so perswasible a Reason why you beleued Christ as this is that So many Nations and peoples of the world doe beare witnesse to him For this is so Great and so Stronge to induce vs into Faith that we should not now be desirous of visible Miracles for Prouing Or Confirming of it S. Augâ—stine moste wisely and Reasonably warning vs Quisquis adhuc prodigia vt credat inquirit magnum est ipse prodigium Qui MVNDO CREDENTE non credit VVho so euer doth yet seeke after Straunge and vvonderfull thinges to make him beleue he is himselfe a straunge felovv or Greate
hard to his charge and there was but two poore places betweene me and the victorie which although he hath ouer me yet it shal not be saied that I lost it easely and he shal not crake or triumph that he came lightly by it Confer now this Example with M. Iewels forsaied wordes The place is before thee and being so plaine as it is it greueth me to spend time in Repeâ—ing and Applying it But M. Iewel goeth further he will not leaue so much as one yeres vantage to D. Harding For If Marianus Scotus accompt be true Note here that you know not your selfe what to answer absolutely then M. Harding reserueth not one yere to himself but yeldeth me backe altogeather Goe to M. Iewel be it so Let D. Harding geaue â—uer all other vantage and let it be supposed which yet is most false that he had brought nothing for the profe of the Publike Seruice in the Uulgare Tonge biside this Historye of S. Augustines planting the Christian Religion in England Thus much only then is concluded y â— iust in the vj. C. yere after Christ what so euer it was before The Publike Seruice was in some place in such a tongue as the vulgare people did not vnderstande And what now shall we say to it Where is the Uictorye On your side or D. Harding But first it would be knowen whether you at the beginning did take the vj. C. yeres Exclusiue or Inclusiue And whether you meant that if to the last day of the six hundred yere any thing should be founde against you you would subscribe Or els that if your Aduersaries Reason were not of an higher Date than the first day of the last yere of the vj. hundred you would vtterly refuse it Well how so euer it be it seemeth now that it is but a deade victorie Or a Stale and that he which will checke M. Iewel must begin againe If Marianus Scotus accompt be true â–ª c. As on the other side if it be false then is he ouercummed by four pore yeres yet as he termeth theÌ„ But consider now Indifferent Reader whether this be manly Dealing or no To refuse the Authoritie that is at this present in the world To set light by the Practise and Iudgement of the Church for ix hundred yeres space To pare euery thing so precisely by the firste six hundred yeres that If it be but a daie longer it must be cut awaie And if it be a few yeres shorter it must be the lesse estemed And if it answer iustly with the yere it self it weigheth in no side What Reason hath M. Iewel or what Example and Scripture for him Is the Truthe of God bound to the first six hundred yeres And must it not passe that cumpasse which M. Iewel hath apointed vnto it Is God a God of six hundred yeres only and not of all time and all worldes Was the Holyghost promised to tary with vs til vj. C. yeres were come and gone and not to the end of the world The kingdome of Christ which should be euerlasting and his power which should not be takeÌ„ awai must it be interpreted now to haue theyr full terme out in vj. C. yeres only What Grace haue the first vj. C Or what curse of God haue these last .ix. C. yeres Now know you also when the first vj. C. ended Or what trust haue you in them which number the yeres vnto you Some Historiographers recken one way Other recken an other way What certaintie then can you haue of theÌ„ Again those writers whome you folow either do at this present liue Or he commended vnto you by them that now line And how dare you trust either those that nowe liue and write of thinges so long sens past Or those that a greate while sens are deade your selfe not then borne to liue with them and examine their doinges Consider also how many haue wryten within the space of these last nine huÌ„dred yeres how perfite in life how Excellent in knowledge how Painfull in studies how Worthy in their owne dayes How Famous with the Posteritie How mete witnesses in the cause of God and triall of a Pure and holy Religion Abbates Monkes Friers are in these new Gospelling dayes termes of great shame and Ignominie yet what sayeth and honest Protestant against S. Bernard Rupertus Thomas Aquinas Bonauenture Dionysius the Carthusian and other such Can M. Iewel finde any fault in theyr life by any Report of brute or Fame Or any Irreligiousnes in their bookes and wrytinges which are extant for hym to consider Let him say his worst Let him leaue poring in Gloses of no Authoritie to finde some mad thing or other against the wisedome of the Church And let him confer his leisure to Reading or Examining rather of these Witnesse according to the State he taketh vpon him whose sayinges he knoweth we esteeme as we ought to doe O sayeth he these were of late daies I graunt â–ª And not only that but also and you will that they were in euyll and corrupt daies But were they corrupted in them Did they not write against corrupt liuing Did they suffer new Preachers and Apostolikes to goe out of the Church or come against y e church by their euil Doctrine Or did they communicate with Pope Cardinals Bishops Abbots or any other of all the world in their liuing Seing they neither fâ—ared hatred nor curred Fauour why should not their Testimonie be receiued no other exception being brought against them but that they liued in so late daies or such A world All is Ungodly All is Unreasonable All is Uaineglorious to appeale to the times so long past As though that God at this present had not his Church in the world Or as though ye could well folow any other but such as you heare with our owne eares Or as though the good and Lerned men of these Later yeres departed this world hundred of yeres sens were not as nigh to the first six hundred yeres as ye are and as ready to folow the best waie as ye Or as though it were A Ioly mater and a compendious waie to the Gospell to contempne all Christendome that now is and holde with that Christendome that was almoste a thousand yeres sens not knowing yet what Christianitie meaneth Nor Daring to trust it if ye knew it were it not for the Authoritie which is at this present in Christendome the Greatnesse of which hath moued you to beleue what so euer you beleue vpon any good ground Here therfore M. Iewel defend your doinges And shew vs the cause wherefore you doe or should refuse the Testimonie of the last ix hundred yeres which are against you If it be not for Childeshnesse or Wantonesse or Unsensiblenesse that you will none of so many and so graue Witnesses yet except you alleage some honest cause and reason It will remayne I beleue that you doe it vpon a very blinde Stomake and
Decree sâ—â—aitwaies it is blasphemie against the holy ghost to breake any of the holy Canons Such Hypocrits and wranglers and braggers Gospellers by whose meanes new Contentious and troubles are reised aâ—d coÌ„tinued in y â— world it is pitie to speake the least y â— euer they were admitted before thei were examined or that now stil they shoulde be credited aâ—â—er that they be detected How M â–ª Iewel allegeth to smal purposes such Authorities of Fathers as do plainly coÌ„found y â— procedings BUt what shal we say We are not Masters of other mens wils neither do we beleue that this creature man whom God hath made after his owne Image should lacke that power of his soule and gift of God which consisteth in free wil. If therfore men wil not Beware wheÌ„ they may what should we do I haue already declared in special chapiters such mater against M. Iewel that of al men that euer yet wrote there was neuer any of lesse Grauitie Sinceritie or CoÌ„science in his writing To him that hath a wil to saue his soule so much is sufficient to make him seke after better InstructioÌ„ To him that thinketh onely of Ciuile Policie or of Temporal life and liuing and wil not trouble his head with the euerlastingnes of the Soule and a worlde to come no Argumentes against M. Iewel can be sufficient But concerning them which would in sad earnest saue one and are not fully resolued that M. Iewel behaueth himself vnreasonablie wickedly may it please them to consider how he shal be yet better taken in his Hypocrisie To Antiquitie he appealeth And because he would be sene to deale plainly he apointeth out the first six hundred after Christ for trial of the mater Now when some witnesses of that time come against him he wil not yet allow them And yet when he hath taken them away from his Aduersarie him selfe for al that wil afterwards allege them And of these points we haue spokeÌ„ already but what may be added more to the discouering of his behaâ—iour Mary this much I can say proue more that such testimonies of Holy Fathers CouÌ„â—els as he bringeth in against the Catholiques do in the self same sentence y â— he allegeth geue a great wound to his ReligioÌ„ So greedy he is of troâ—bling y â— Catholikes peace that to make some of them shrinke as if in deede a blowe were coÌ„ming he is content him selfe to bring his owne cause into y â— danger that he y â— wil take the aduaÌ„tage may quikly so strike it y â— it wil neuer be good after And not only so but so litle fauored he is of Antiquitie y â— in veri mani places he cannot vtter the ful senteÌ„ce but it shal straitwaies be perceiued that y â— late procedings do impugne directly the orders practise and Religion that were vsed in the Primitiue Church As in Example M. Iewel thinking to destroy therby the Sole Receiuing of the Priest proueth it that in the Primitiue Church they which would not Communicate were bidde to auoide For It is Decreed saith he by the Canons of the Apostles that al faithful that enter into the Churche and 〈◊〉 are the Scriptures and do not continue out the prayers nor receiue the CoÌ„munion should be excoÌ„municate as men vvoorking the trouble aâ—d disorder of the Church Againe If thou be not vvorthy to receiue the Commmunion then arte thou not vvorthy to 〈◊〉 presâ—â—â— at the prayers Therfore M. Harding should driue his vnworthy people from the Churche and not suffer them to heare his Masse Let me aske you then one question M. Iewel Why do you constraine by feare of high displeasure â–ª Losse of goodes and imprisonment such as neuer were yet of your Religion to come into your CoÌ„gregations to receiue also w t you You woulde haue D. Harding to driue them out which are vnworthy by the authoritie of this saying of S. Chrysostom Should not you by the same reason cease to drawe them into your Congregation which are no brothers of your Religion D. Hard. gathering it of your Sermon that you should be of the mind to haue al the people to Receiue Or them y â— would not to be driuen out of the Church you cry out and say O M. Harding how long wil you thus wilfully peâ—uert the waies of the Lord You know this is neither the doctrine neither the practise of the Church Howebeit the Auncient Doctours haue both taught so and also practised the same Anacletus de Cons. dist 1. Episcopus Calixtus de cons. dist 2. Peracta But O M. Iewel why say you so Doe you confesse that auncient Fathers haue vsed it and yet dare you Proteste that your Church hath no such practise Where is your Reuerence now to the first six hundred after Christ Where is your bringing al thinges to the first Paterne I perceaue by this what your answere wil be to my question out of S. Chrysostome You wil plainely say that your Church foloweth him not And wherefore then doe you make out of him Rules to the present Churche whome your selfe wil not folowe in the selfsame sentence which you lay against vs O M. Iewell how long wil you Imperially alow and refuse the Authoritie of auncient Doctors al at wil and pleasure Lykewise to proue that which no maâ— denieth that in the primitiue Church the people dyd communicate with the priest M. Iewell declareth the maner of their assemblies saying out of Iustinus Martyr Before the end of our praiers 〈◊〉 kisse eche of vs one an other Then is ther brought vnto him that is the chief of the bretherne bread and a cup of Vvine and vvater mingled together Vvhich hauing receiued he praiseth God and geaueth thankes a good space And that done the vvhole people confirmeth this praier saieing Amen After that they that among â—s be called Deacons â–ª geue vnto euery of theÌ„ that be present part of the bread and likevvyse of the vvine and vvater that are consecrate vvith thankes geuing and ary he same home vnto them that happen to be absent Againe speakinge of the effect of the Sacrament by which we are made al one in Christ and all one emong our selues he allegeth S. Chrysostome Propterea in mysterijs c. For that cause in the tyme of the mysteries vve embrace one an other that being many vve may become one Againe speaking of the people receiuing of the Sacrament in their owne handes which is also a mater indifferent in it selfe he saieth to proue it I speake of him whose coâ—â—e of peace ye receiued at the ministration and at whose handes ye layed the Sacrament The Testimonies are of your owne bringing and therefore I would thinke of your owne alowing Where then is your mingling of wine and water together â–ª in your Mysteries Where is the embracing of one an other and the Cosse
Sacrament of our â—ord From henceforth therefore vvhatsoeuer Priest shal come to the Diuine Aultar to offer vp Sacrifice and vvithhold himselfe from the Communion let him knovv that for one yeres space he 〈◊〉 repelled froÌ„ the grace of the Câ—Ì„munioÌ„ of vvhich he hath vnsemely depriued him selfe For vvhat maner of sacrifice shal that be of vvhich no not he that doth Sacrifice is knovven to be partaker Therefore by all meanes it must be obserued that as oft as the Sacrificer doth offer and Sacrifice vpon the Aultar the bodie and bloud of our Lord Iesus Christ so ofte he geue himselfe to be partaker of the bodie bloud of our Lord Iesus Christ. Hitherto the Councel of Toledo How thinke we then Hath not M. Iewel properly alleged it for his purpose could he haue brought a place more plaine against himselfe M. Iewel saieth that Sacrifice and Receiuing are sundrie thinges And meaneth thereby that the priest may do y â— one leaue the other that is Offer and not Receiue the Councel defineth that what so euer Priest do Offer and not Receiue he shal be kept away from the Communion a tweluemonth togeather And what other thing is this to say then that Sacrifice and Communion are so sundrie that the Priest for al that can not put them a sunder Or do one without the other Thus hath M. Iewel to put more weight to his seely reason confirmed it by a fact condemned by the same Councel in which it is fouÌ„d reported And this is one way of Abusing of Councels In an other kinde it is an abusing of Councels when that is Attributed vnto them which at al is not in them As in Example The Intention saith M. Iewel of the Churche of Rome is to woorke the Transubstantiation of bread and wine The Grek church had neuer that IntentioÌ„ as it is plaine by the CouÌ„cel of Florence Thus you say M. Iewel and in the Margin you referre vs to the last session of the Councel of Florence but in that Session there is no mention at al of TraÌ„substantiation Or Intention The greatest and the only mater therein Discussed and defined was concerning the Prâ—ceding of God the Holyghost from the Father and the Sonne in which point the Grecians then were at one w t the Latines It folowed then after a few dayes that the vnion was made that the Bishop of Rome sent for the Grecians and asked of them certaine questions concerning their Priestes and Bishopes and Anoynting of their dead Praiers in theâ—â— Liturgie and choosing of their Patriarches But it was neither Demaunded of them what Intention they had in Consecrating Neither Aunswered they any thing to any such effect Neither did the Bishop open vnto them his Faith and beliefe therein So that altogether it is a very flat lye that M. Iewel here maketh vpon that Councel Except he meane the Doctrine that there foloweth geauen to the Armenians in which TraÌ„substantiation and Intention both is coÌ„prehended whâ—revnto the Sacred CouÌ„cel wheâ—â—of the Grecians were a parte gaue their consent A third maner of Abusing Councels is to allege them truely in dede as they say but yet to allege them to no purpose As in example The fourth Councel of Carthage decreed that in certaine cases the Sacrament should be powred into the sicke mans mouth of which worde powred being proper only to thinges that are fluent and liquide D. Harding gathereth that the Sacrament whiche they receaued was in the forme of winâ— and not of bread Herevpon M. Iewel commeth against him and he calleth it a Gheasse that the bread can not be powred into a sicke mans mouth But howe proueth he it to be but a Gheasse Or what sayeth he to the contrarie It foloweth And yet he maie learne by the thirde Councel of Carthage and by the abridgement of the Councel of Hippo that the Sacrament was then put into dead mens mouthes Your Argument then is this One y â— is so foolish or superstitious may put the Sacrament into a dead mans mouth Ergo D. Harding doth not gheasse wel that bread can not be powred into a sicke mans mouth But al thinges are here vnlike both Persons and Actes and Termes First of al dead men are distincted from Sicke men and the dead you may order violentlie but the sicke wil be vsed Reasonablie except none but Enemies be about them Then in the one side the Act is vnlauful to put the Sacrament in a dead mans mouth On the other it is lauful to power it into a sicke mans mouth Beside this Putting is one thing and Pouring is an other and whether it be bread or wine you may be suffered to say that they are put into the mouth but how bread should be poured into ones mouth except in al haste you minded to choke him or fil him I can not tel Last of al the terme Sacrament which is forbidden to be put in the dead mans mouth may signifie any of the two kindes That is either of Bread or wine â–ª but in naming the Bread you are bound to that one kinde only of the Sacrament and must not meane thereby wine So that there is neither Rime nor Reason in it to tel vs ful solemlie that the Sacrament was put in dead mens mouthes the PropositioÌ„ which you therby would disproue being onely this that Bread can not be poured into sicke mens mouthes And therefore to speake the least and best of it this is a very vain and idle Abusing of the Authorities of Councels But of al other it passeth when M. Iewel taketh as much as pleaseth him of any Canon of Councel and maketh a ful point before he come to the end of the Sentence Mainteining his Heresie by that Peece which he pulleth away And dissembling that which remaineth by which his Obiection should be straitwaies refelled For otherwise to reherse no more of a Canon than serueth our purpose it is coÌ„mon and tolerable But when that point which an Heretike leaueth out pertaineth to the qualifying of that other Peece which he would haue to be vnderstand absolutely that is such a point of an Heretike as may wel cause any reasonable maÌ„ to BEVVARE of him But is it possible that M. Iewel maie be taken in this fault If he be not then wil I graunt that he hath not in as Ample and Shamfull maner abused Councels as any of the most Desperate of all that euer wrote And if he be I aske nomore but that he may goe for such as he is The Example shal make this plaine In the Councel of Laodicea it is decreed like as also in the Councell of Carthage that nothing be readde in the Church vnto the people sauing only the Canonical Scriptures I wonder then what your Homelies doe in the Church except you thinke that they be Canonical Scriptures Or els that you so precise folowers of Antiquitie are not bound to
sacrifice with him But how After the order of Melchisedech Or by their own Act Priesthood as M. Iewel gathereth Surely except Guerricus him selfe had made it plaine in what sense the Priest and the People do offer no doubt but M. Iewel in this place would outface vs that this Abbat meant that men and women were Priestes after the order of Melchisedech Notwithstanding that it is not saied the cuÌ„pani of the faithful do coÌ„secrate as though they might do it by themselues but they consecrate with him the Priest signifieng the Office to be singular And it foloweth in the Sermon Neither the Carpenter alone doth make a house but one bringeth roddes an other rafters an other postes or beames and other things By which Similitude it is manifest that the people consecrate in this sense that they bring sumwhat to that end And what is that By this that foloweth it wil be vnderstanded For thus he concludeth Therefore the standers by ought to haue of their owne euen as the Priest ought What A Cope trow you M. Iewel vpon their backes or a Surplesse like Ministers or power and Authoritie of Priesthod No. but a sure faith a pure prayer a godly deuotiâ—n Where then is the Breade and Wine or the Order of Melchisedech which you would proue to perâ—eine to the common people with Therfore S. Bernard saith or Otherwise called Guerricus Here is a Conclusion without Premisses And a comparison without any likelyhoode And A falsification without truth or honestie Alexander of Hales abused The people taking but one kind only receiueth iniurie as M. Harding may see by Alexander de Hales and Durandus other of his owne Doctours Alexanders wordes be these Licèt illa Sumptio c. Although that Order of Receiuing the Sacrâ—ment â–ª which is vnder one kinde be sufficient yet the other which is vnder both kindes is of greater merite Al this M. Iewel is true but this proueth not that the people haue any iniury done vnto them For to Receiue â—nder one kinde it is sufficient by Alexanders expresse wordes but vndoubtedly if any thing lacked of that which were dâ—e â–ª there wer not sufficieÌ„cy Ergo how proue you by Alexander that the people are Iâ—iuried in receiuing vnder one kinde You wil Replie out of him that it is of greater merite to receiue in both kinds than one And what of â—hat It is a greater merite to Celebrate thrise a day as at Christmasse then once as Ordinarily Priestes do vse Do ye thinke then that any Priestes haue Iniury don vnto them because the Order is otherwise that they say but one Masse in one daie except one daie onely in the yeare Againe I say that Alexander noteth a greater merite to be in Receiuing vnder both than one kind not in respect of the Sacramente which is as perfite in one as both and in the least part of one as the whole but in respect of the Receiuers because their deuotion is encreased and their Faith dilated by longer coÌ„tinuing in thâ— Act of Receiuing and their Receiuing is more Complete as being ministred in both kindes And as the causes on the behalfe of the Receiuer do make it to a person so disposed more effectual to Receiue in both than one So other causes there be which doe make y â— Receiuing vnder one kinde to be to the party so affected more fruietful and meritorious than if he tooke both For he that would say vnto him self I wil content my selfe with the common Order of the Church I wil not make any Sturre about both kindes knowing y â— as much is vnder one as both vndoubtedly such a man should both for his Humilitie and for his Faith deserue more a great deale then if he should Receiue in both kindes and find a certaine sense and tast of Denotion The strength therefore and efficatie which Alexander speaketh of depending vpon the Act of the Receiuer and not vpon the Uertue of y â— Sacrament which is al one in effect whether it be ministred in one or both kindes M. Iewel doth very iniuriously to put a fault herein y â— they Receiue not vnder both to make Alexander of this opinion that to minister in one kinde were an Iniurie vnto the people For this I would aske further of him whether the simple and deuout people are not more stirred vp to remember the Death and Bloâ—d of Christe if they should Receiue in Claret or Red Wine than in White No doubt but the imaginatioÌ„ would be more affected and moued by seeing a like colour vnto y â— which it would conceiue than a contrary or diuerse colour How then Would M. Iewel thinke it an Iniury to minister in white wine vnto the people though thei would be desirous of Red He should not thinke it if he be wise And why so Mary because they haue as much in the White as the Red and to receiue in Red hangeth vpon their priuate deuotion not vpon any precept of the Churche or doctrine of the Apostles or Institution of Christe to which onely the Priest is bound and which if he obserue he doth his duety Be it so then that many good â—olke for diuerse causes should be exceedingly moued and edified by drinking of the Chalice and contemplating of more then is Ordinarie in their minde should they haue any Iniurie done vnto them if they receiued afterwardes when the Priest should iudge it expedient vnder y â— forme of bread only Neyther doth Alexander de Hales so say neither any reason doth make for it But let vs see an other place of Alexander which M. Iewel hath abused The same Alexander againe saith Totus Christus c. Whole Christ is not conteined vnder ech kind by way of SacrameÌ„t but the fleash onely vnder the fourme of bread and the bloud vnder the fourme of wine The woordes can not be denied to be Alexanders but what seâ—se gathereth M. Iewel of them Here M. Hardinges owne Doctours confesse that the people Receiuing vnder one kinde receiueth not the ful SacrameÌ„t nor the bloud of Christe by way of Sacrament You vnderstand not Alexander or you wil not For whereas he saith Christ is not conteined vnder ech kinde Sacramentally he meaneth not that the people Receiue not the Ful Sacrament and their owne Maker Godde and Manne vnder eche kinde but by this woorde Sacramentally he meaneth that concerning the forme of wordes by which consecration is perfited in eche kinde and by external forme of the Signes vnder which Christ is exhibited the flesh only is conteined vnder the forme of Breade and the bloud vnder the forme of Vvine As when Christ said This is my bloud the woordes which we heare doe signify no more than Bloude to be there present And y â— external Signe and liquor of wine doth represent a presence of bloud onely And this is that â—hich Alexander meaneth by the worde Sacramentally when he