whatsoeuer is within hell is nothing but fire God perfourmeth that hell shall flame with perpetuall fire euen as in many places and hilles of the earth an unwasted store of brimstone is found that euen thence we may gather there may be Riuers and lakes of brimstone in hell All these things the Almightie knoweth how to prepare that these torments may â—…itte both Soules and bodies so that we haue no neede to dispute whether this fire and brimstone be corporall and if it be corporall how it worketh vpon spirituall substances The Lord as I now said can fit all these to either part of man that in truth they may be inflicted as well on the bodies as on the spirits of the damned which here the Prophet foretelleth If thou hadst rather dispute against them and wilt not now beleeue these things doubtles thou shalt one day trie them by experience Gualter vpon the same place Esaie teacheth what heil is The inside thereof is fire that is how deepe and wide soeuer hell is it is all fire and burneth euerlastingly For so he describeth the sharpnes of the punishment which the wicked shall there suffer And lest any should aske what matter can suffice to maintaine such a fire the Prophet saith there is great store of wood He that made hell hath plentifully prouided that the fire there shall neuer goe out For filthie lustes and lewd actes not purged by â—…aith and guiltie mindes yeeld perpetuall matter and maintenance to those flames Yea and the bodies also of the wicked shall be incorruptible that they may suffer continuall fire and flame and dure therein He mentioneth also a streame of brimstone whereof the Apocalypse speaketh that we should remember and consider those things which are in nature For so many ages hath the fire of Aetna continued and still doth casting vp flames of brimstone He then that kindleth these things in nature without the helpe or assistance of men he also can kindle and maintaine the fire of hell that it shall neuer faile Musculus commenting vpon the 25. of Mathew sayth Those who measure all things by the rule of reason and thinke nothing firme that cannot be comprehended by mans witte dispute how it is possible that the body should alwaies burne in hell and not consume which is repugnant to the nature of the body They likewise dispute how fire can burne not onely bodies but also wicked spirits which haue no bodies These curious men thinke that to be against nature which is done by Gods will neither doe they consider the nature of all creatures to haue and be that which they haue and are by Gods commandement Others quarrell with the qualitie of the fire and thinke it no corporall but a metaphoricall fire which they take â—…or an exceeding paine and sorrow of minde This they gather out of the 9. of Marke where Christ saith their worme dieth not and the sire quencheth not Here as by the name of worme no corporall worme is to be vnderstood but a great and continuall remorse of mind so they thinke by the word fire no corporall fire but a metaphoricall must be conceaued I take it to be rashnes and not the part of a christian man thus to dispute of the qualitie of this fire but rather leauing the certaine knowledge thereof to the Iudge to prouide that we trie it not one day what manner of sire it is Zanchius very soberly and learnedly examining this question resolueth in this sort It is certaine the diuels together with all the wicked shall be in euerlasting fire and therein tormented Christ plainely professeth he will say to the wicked depart into euerlasting fire prepared for the diuell and his Angels What manner of fire it shall be I dispute not because the Scripture doth not expresse it but this is without question that not onely the soules of the wicked but also their bodies shall suffer torment FROM THIS FIRE and therefore the fire such as may worke vpon their bodies and inflict on them a farre greater paine then our materiall fire doth impresse on vs. What qualitie soeuer it shall be of it seemeth it shall be altogether a corporall creature which may worke vpon bodies and torment them Which being so IT IS MANIFEST the diuell shall suffer paine and torment from a corporall thing I meane from this sire and that euerlastingly therefore it is called eternall and vnquenchable fire And asking your question How is it possible that spirituall substances should suffer from corporall he answereth We haue an example in our selues in whom the soule suffereth many things from the body by her coniunction with it Againe what can resist the power and will of God Let this doubt therefore depart from the minds of the faithfull I produce these later writers of great learning and good religion as I might many moe to let thee vnderstand gentle Reader that I neither presse the Scriptures nor cite the Fathers to any other purpose but to that which by all their iudgements is Christian and catholike and howsoeuer some men otherwise learned but carried with this new conceite of Christs suffering the essentiall paines of the damned to colour their deuise call these things in question yet the most aduised and sufficient Diuines of our age haue clearely confessed that which I teach to accord with the holy Scriptures and to be held of the godly without contradiction The ancient Fathers of Christs Church vphold the same doctrine and teach the fire of hell to be an externall visible and true fire and not a spirituall and internall paine onely as this Discourser intendeth With no speech sayth Chrysostome can any man expresse it here but els where we shal see it most plainely Set now before thine eyes that horrible way which shal carrie thee headlong to the fire and the deuils readie with torments and the persons deliuered to such cruel tormentors These things shal be in that day Let vs alwayes thinke on these things sayth Austen lest it repent vs too late when we come to the sight of eternal fire For the burning pit of hell shal be laid open there shal be a descent but no ascent Call to minde saith Basil that terrible tribunal of Christ which no creature may indure there must euery one of vs be presented to render an account of his life About those that haue liued wickedly shal stand fearefull and grisly angels beholding the sire and kindling it Then shall they see a deepe gulfe and darkenes that no eyes can pierce through and an obscure fire that with blackenesse hath lost his shining but kept his burning Alas saith Cyril what a place is that where is weeping and gnashing of teeth which is called hell which the deuil himselfe abhorreth Alas what a Gehenne of vnquenched sire is that which burneth and shineth not how venemous is that worme which neuer resteth how terrible is that deepe and euerduring darkenesse how cruel in
works and though his works must alwaies be measured by his wil yet must his power be limited to neither because God is able to doe many things which he neuer did nor will doe And in his works if you bind him with any necessitie to do as he did and leaue him not at libertie to doe all things according to his owne wisdome and will you reuiue the accursed error of the Manichees against whom Saint Austen fully resolueth Nullam ergo necessitatem patitur Deus neque necessitate facit quae facit sed summa ineffabili voluntate ac potestate God then suffereth no necessitie neither doth he the things which he doth with any necessitte but with a supreame and vnspeakeable will and power So that the words of Gregorie Austen and Ambrose are most true that God had other meanes in his power to saue vs then by the death of his owne Sonne but a BETTER or more conuenient way to demonstrate his loue and mercy towards vs and to manifest his wisedome power and iustice against sinne death and Satan he had not for no Question God chose the best And why these words should offend any Christian man I see no cause since they be both sound and sober They oppose Gods power against his expresse and reuealed will You were told it is an error to restraine Gods power to his will as if he could not doe more or otherwise then he hath done but in this you conceiue them not For they doe not say God had meanes to change his will or to alter his promise once published but when he first decreed this way to saue man it was in his power to haue appointed an other way if it had pleased him So that God was not tied to determine this way by any necessitie as if the power of euill preuailed against him or choyse of other meanes failed him but this in the wisedome of God common to all three persons in that most holy Trinitie was allowed as the most honorable and acceptable way to God and most fauorable and comfortable to man And this confession which you so much controle hath beene vsed by Diuines of all ages howsoeuer you know not what to make of it in your new Diuinitie Cyprian before their time Et sine hoc holocausto poterat Deus tantum condonasse peccatum sed facilitas veniae laxaret habenas peccatis effrenibus quae etiam Christi vix cohibent passiones God was able to haue pardoned so great sinne without this Sacrifice but the facilitie of forgiuenesse would loose the raynes to vnbridled sinnes which euen the sufferings of Christ doe skant represse Nazianzene euen with the eldest of them It was possible for God to saue man without taking flesh by his only will as he did and doth worke all things without the helpe of a Body Damascene after them He was not vnable that can doe all things by his Almightie power and strength to take man from the Tyrant that possessed him Bernard likewise Was not the Creator able to restore his worke without this difficultie He was able but he chose rather to wrong himselfe then the most lewd and hatefull vice of vnthankefulnesse should haue any colour in man Zanchius resolueth the same Could not mankind be deliuered by any other meanes then by Christs death who can doubt it Solo nutu iussu ac voluntate diuina poterat It might haue beene deliuered by the onely becke Commandement and will of God Master Caluin whose warinesse you so much commend where he maketh any thing for you doubteth not in this Assertion to ioyne with Ambrose Austen and Gregorie against you Poterat nos Dominus verbo aut nutu redimere nisi aliter nostra causa visum esset The Lord might haue Redeemed vs with a word or a becke of his but that for our sakes he thought good otherwise to doe it The Booke of Homilies on which you would seeme so much to depend goeth farder then either Ambrose or Austen saith Was not this a sure pledge of Gods loue to giue vs his owne Sonne from heauen he might haue giuen vs an Angell if he would or some other Creature and yet should his loue haue beene farre aboue our deserts All these Similitudes of Mediator Redeemer and Suretie may stand very well together in the office of Christ though you would perswade vs the contrarie yea rather they confirme ech other The names of Mediator Redeemer are exactly affirmed of Christ and often authorised in the Scriptures the name of Suretie to God for vs is not he is called Gods Suretie to vs of a better Testament then the Law because God in him and by him hath assured vs of his mercie and grace in this life and of his heauenly kingdome in the life to come And if you will needs vrge the Similitude of Sureties from the course and custome of humane Lawes which appoint and admitte Sureties they vtterly exclude vs in the case that we were in from hauing any Sureties For neither in Capitall crimes nor in Corporall paines doth mans Law allow any Sureties Againe no Suretie standeth bound for a seruant much lesse for a condemned dead person Since then we were not only the seruants of sinne but for haynous offences condemned Soule and Body to euer lasting perdition and already dead in Soule by sinne no course of Law allowed vs Sureties Moreouer the Prince who is the Lord ouer the Law may be no Suretie because he is not chalengable by the Law how then will you bind the King of Kings to be our Suretie as if the most Soueraigne were most subiected to the Law besides Christ freed vs by giuing himselfe and his life for vs. What Sureties doe so Christ bought vs with a Price to be his seruants Doe Sureties buy their debtors to serue them Christ gaue infinitely more then we were worth Is that possible for Sureties Christ did change our punishment in his person from eternall death to the death of the Crosse. Haue Sureties that libertie or authoritie We rested on Gods promise for our Redemption before it was performed Know you not that a bare promise by mans Law doth not bind though God be faâ—…thfull in all his words Albeit then Christ recompenced our debt and voluntarily by his owne death discharged our danger being no way thereto bound yet since he obserued none other conditions of a Suretie and no right or Law did allow vs Sureties I see no cause why you should change the honor of a free Redeemer so much mentioned in the Scriptures into the Thraldome of a Suretie bound with vs as you say to pay our debt which was euerlasting destruction of Body and Soule Our publike Churches Doctrine also auoucheth that â—…e was our Suretie Our Church alloweth that Catechisme to be taught in Schooles to Children with whom it may be you seâ—…ke to be sorted because you
presumptuous follie and other shew of any matter worth the medling with you do make none c Defenc. pag. 91. li. 32. First I heartily intreat the Christian Reader to marke well and to consider how your L. doth contriue three notable equiuocations in these few words Christ suffered in his soule the wrath of God which you seeme to grant but in trueth you doe not And if we adde also the paines of hel then he opposeth a fourth fallacy against vs. And these three or foure are the only pillars of his doctrine I make no pillars of my doctrine but the manifest words of the Holy Ghost teaching vs by the Scriptures the price and maner of our redemption which lest any man should thinke I diuert and wrest to my priuate or secret conceits as you doe I shew the ancient and true Church of Christ did so beleeâ—…e them and expound them before me The pillars of your doctrine are phrases follies and falsities which if you did not hide with generall and ambiguous words the considerate Reader without intreatie would soone marke your mysteries but because you are so kinde as heartily to pray the Reader to marke how you play the man I desire him likewise to obserue how shamefully you come short of your great brags and euen betray your cause to him that well considereth it d Defenc. pag. 91. li. 37. For the three former your first equiuocation is in the word Suffered and about it wee deale in this place e Et pag. 92. li. 19. Now your next equiuocation is in this He suffered in soule Your next in Gods wrath Both which I haue plainly shewed before As also your fourth fallacie which may be called Fallacia accidentis To the three last notable equiuocations as he calleth them here is all that this Defensor speaketh in this place where he would haue thee Christian Reader so considerately to marke some maruellous matters And thus shalt thou often be troubled with his vaine tatling when thou most expectest either his proofs or his promises He sendeth thee backe to peruse his former pages where thou shalt finde as little to the purpose as here thou doest though words he wanted not to couer his conceits Is there be any thing in those pages proued by him which I haue not in the same places confuted I am content to hazzard the perill of thy censure Howbeit I thinke thou mayest perceiue by my carriage that I desire to auoid and preuent all ambiguities as much as in me lieth I speake as plainly as my simple abilitie will suffer me I distinguish thinges as euidently as either the matter permitteth or the trewth requireth And therefore he that in all his defence hath yet vttered not one distinct and cleere sentence touching his cause but clowded and cloaked with proper and meere and such like shifts and shadowes neuer expounded by himselfe and knowen to no man but himselfe hath small reason though as much in this as in the rest to say that fallacies are the Pillars of my doctrine But if thou beleeue Pedlers praising their owne wares then maiest thou credit this booke-maker craking of his cleere and Sunne-shine proofes which he himselfe neither expresseth nor vnderstandeth The equiuocation of the word SVFFERING which in this place his mastershipp will deale withall will giue thee a tast what thou shalt looke for in the rest f Defenc. pag. 92. li 1. The common and ordinarie phrase vnderstandeth herein Christes feeling of paines inflicted on him by way of PROPER punishment and satisfaction for sinne which he vndertooke for vs. Onely this in the ordinarie and vsuall manner of speach is signified by Christes suffering or his passion and so we alwaies vnderstand by it This is one of your enlightned and purified expositions which is as faire and bright as the darknes of Egypt Doe men vsually ordinarily describe Christs passion to be nothing els but the feeling of paines inflictedon him by way of proper punishment who vseth these wordes by way of proper punishment besides your selfe and your adherents who vnder that colour would secretly conuey the paines of the damned into the soule of Christ for what is the proper punishment of sinne that which all sinners not Redeemed by Christ must endure or that which all men being sinners doe endure or that which none endured but Christ alone because it was proper to the dignitie of his person with that punishment which god laied on him by the hands and mouthes of men to satisfie the iustice of God for our sinnes and vtterly to abolish the guilt and wages of our sinne Proper may be either to the damned whose sinnes are neuer pardoned or proper to sinne in all mankinde euer since the first man forsooke his Creator or proper to Christes person and not common to him with the damned Which of all these senses do you containe in the word Proper You spake euen now of equiuocations and made a grieuous complaint to your Reader that I meant to circumuent you with ambiguities and what is this but to turne your Readers eyes aside on me whiles you play your part with the maine worke of Christes passion for mans Redemption how often haue I chalenged in you this shifting with proper and improper when and where pleased you Christes sufferings in all mens speeches saue yours were farre larger than his passion He suffered afliction all the time of his life yea the whole course of his life was a continuall suffering of reproches disdaines dispites besides the naturall infirmities of our flesh as hunger cold wearines weeping and such like which in his person were all sufferings and yet no man calleth his life his passion his passion we take to be the manner of his death and so all his sufferings from the Garden to the graue imposed on him by the hands mouthes or harts of men betraying forsaking or pursuing him were parts of his passion The false accusing and vniust condemning him the mocking reproching and reuiling him to be wicked and forsaken of God were parts of his passion and yet these were no inherent nor sensible paines of which you would seeme to speake when you exclude his affections of feare and griefe of minde as no parts of his passion g Defenc. pag. 91. li. 6. You cunningly take another rare sense of this word as it signifieth the affections of the mind in Christ wholy bent to holines and obedience of god you are a learned Squire that doe not vnderstand the soule suffereth as well by her affections as by her senses and that in Christ the harts and tongues of the Iewes concurred to his passion as well as their hands The affections and perturbations of the soule are vsually and properly called by the Greeke fathers 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and by the Latine passiones passions or sufferings of the minde The Apostles applie the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 SVFFERINGS both in Christ and in vs as euenly and
man of any learning or vnderstanding thus in print and open view of the whole Realme to rage revell rush on with lying craking and facing when he speaketh not one true word for first Sir flincher is this the point heere or any where proposed by me whether Christs sufferings were only bodily did I promise or produce any Fathers to that end is it not the death of the soule and the paines of the damned which I impugned in Christs sufferings haue I not most truely performed which I euer professed that the whole Church of Christ for so many hundred yeeres neuer thought neuer heard of the death of Christs soule in the worke of our redemption but rested their faith on the death of Christs body as a most sufficient price both for the soules and bodies of the faithfull What cunning then is this first to shift your hands of that you can no way prooue though you still doe and must professe it and then to clamour at me for drawing the Fathers cleane from their intent and meaning is this the way to credit your new Creed by such deuices and stratagemes to intertaine the people of God least they should see how farre you be slid from the ancient primatiue Church of Christ take a while but the thought of a sober man and this pangue will soone be ouerpast Did you not vndertake to prooue the death of Christs soule by Scriptures which indeed I first and most required and haue you so donne looke backe to your miserable mistakings and palpable peruertings of the words of the holy Ghost and tell vs what one syllable you haue brought sounding that way are your secrets such that they be no where reuealed in the word of God must all faith come from thence and is your faith exempted that it shall haue no foundation there are men and Angels accursed that preach any other Gospell then was deliuered and written by Christs Apostles and shall you be excused for deuising a new kind of redemption by the death of Christs soule no where witnessed in the Scriptures you see how easie it were to be eloquent against you in a iust and true cause but words must not winne the field What I impugned my sermons will shew what I haue prooued I will not proclaime If I haue failed in that I endeuoured the labour is mine the liberty is the Readers to iudge Let the indifferent read it they shall find somewhat to direct them let the contentious skanne it they shall see somewhat to harle their hast and perhaps to restraine their stifnesse What euer it be I leaue it to others since the discourser hasteth towards an end and so doe I. s Defenc. pag. 146. li. 2 This is the profit that comes by ordinarie flaunting with Fathers which many do frequent in these dayes Thinke they if the Scriptures alone suffice not for things in religion that the Fathers will suffice or if the Scriptures may be wrested by subtle heads that yet the Fathers can not Is it not enough for your selfe to be a despiser of all antiquitie and sobrietie but you must insult at them that beare more regard to either than you do If to flaunt with Fathers be so great a fault which yet respecteth their iudgements that haue beene liked and allowed from age to age in the Church of Christ what is it to fliske with pride and follie grounded on nothing but on selfe-loue and singularitie It were to be wished that euen some of the best writers of our age as they thinke themselues had had more respect to the auncient Fathers then they shew we should haue wanted a number of nouelties in the Church of God which now wee are troubled withall as well in Doctrine as in discipline This course of concurring with the lights of Gods Church before our time in matters of faith though you mislike other manner of men then you are or euer will be haue allowed and followed as u August contra Iâ—…num li. 1. Augustine x Theodor. diol 2. 3. Theodorete y Leo epist. 97. 〈◊〉 Leonem Leo z Cassi. de incarnat Domini li. 7 ca. 5. Cassianus a Gelas. de duabus in Christo natâ—…ris Gelasius b Vigilius li. 5. cap. 6. Vigilius and the two c Hispalensi concilium 2. ca. 13. councels of Hispalis and others not doubting the sufficiencie of the Scriptures but shewing the correspondencie of beleeuing and interpreting the Scriptures in all ages to haue bene the same which they imbraced and vrged And in all euennesse of reason were it better to feede the people with our priuate conceits pretended out of Scripture or to let such as be of iudgement vnderstand that we frame no faith but such as in the best times hath bene collected and receiued from the grounds of holy Scripture by the wisest and greatest men in the Church of God your only example turning and winding the words of the holy Ghost to your owne conceits will shew how needfull it is not to permit euery prater to raigne ouer the Scriptures with figures and phrases at his pleasure and thence to fetch what faith he list If you so much reuerence the Scriptures as you report which were to be wished you would why deuise you doctrine not expressed in the Scriptures Why teach you that touching mans redemption which is no where written in the word of God Indeed the Scriptures are plaine in this point of all others what death Christ died for vs if you did not peruert them against the histories of the Euangelists and testimonies of the Apostles Omit the description of his death so farely witnessed by the foure Euangelists what exacter words can we haue then the Apostles that Christ d Coloss. 1. pacisied things in earth and things in heauen by the bloud of his crosse and reconciled vs which were strangers and enemies in the bodie of his flesh through death Beleeue what you reade and what you reade not in the word of God beleeue not and this matter is ended but by Synecdoches without cause you put to the Scriptures not what you read in them but what you like best and by Metaphores and Metonimies you will take bodie for substance and flesh for soule And so where the Apostle auoucheth that we were reconciled to God through death in the bodie of Christs flesh you tell vs we could not be redeemed without the death of Christs soule and the essence of the paines of the damned suffered by suddaine touches from the immediate hand of God after an extraordinarie manner If you teach no doctrine but deliuered in the Scriptures aband on these deuices not expressed in the Scriptures If you content your selfe with the all sufficient word of God in matters of faith you must relinquish the death of Christs soule and paines of the damned as no part of our redemption since there is no such thing contained in the word of God To me and
THE SVRVEY OF CHRISTS SVFFERINGS FOR MANS redemption AND OF HIS DESCENT TO HADES OR HEL for our deliuerance By THOMAS BILSON Bishop of Winchester The Contents whereof may be seene in certaine Resolutions before the Booke in the Titles ouer the Pages and in a Table made to that end ROM 6. v. 10. In that Christ died he died to sinne ONCE ROM 10. v. 6. 7. Say not in thine heart Who shall descend to the bottomlesse deepe That is to bring Christ backe from the dead AVGVST Epist. 99. Quod fuerit anima mortificatus Iesus quis audeat dicere That Iesus was dead in soule who dare auouch Quis nisi Infidelis negauerit fuisse apud Inferos Christum Who but an Infidell will denie Christ was in Hell Perused and allowed by publike Authoritie LONDON Printed by Melchisedech Bradwood for Iohn Bill M. DC IIII. TO THE HIGH AND MIGHTY VVISE AND RELIGIOVS PRINCE IAMES by the grace of God King of Great Brittaine France and Ireland Defender of the true and Christian Faith c. MOst religious and renowned Prince if the Heathen reaching no farther than the light of Nature could leade them sawe those Common-weales would soone flourish whose Gouernors were giuen to the study of Philosophy how much rather must Christians ascribe that to heauenlie Wisdome which they did to earthly and confesse those Realms to be blessed indeed where the chiefe Rulers are carefull to seeke first the Kingdome of God to prefer the loue of true pietie before all respect of humane policie For since Gods purpose and promise is to honour them that honour him and no good thing can be wanting to those that rightly worship him according to his will how liberall benedictions mercifull protections may those Princes hope for at Gods hands who set their hearts wholly to seeke him and make all their wayes straight in his sight This fauour from heauen to be guided by good and godly Princes the Realme of England hath tasted a long time to their no small comfort whiles for these 45 yeeres by the Christian care of a most milde and gratious Queene now with God they haue beene directed to the trueth of the Gospell of Christ and defended in peace from the violence of all impeachers and impugners of either And after her decease though our vnthankfulnesse had prouoked the wrath of God and our vnfruitfulnesse well deserued the Kingdome of God should be taken from vs yet he that is rich in mercie towards all that call on him respecting more the glory of his name lest his enemies should blaspheme than any worthinesse of ours not onely continued but increased his accustomed goodnesse to vs and gaue your Maiestie being the lineall and rightfull heire to the Crowne of this Realme a present and peaceable entrance with the greatest applause of all states sorts and sides that hath beene seene these many ages and specially of the godlie who saw the happinesse of the former gouernment would be doubled by the manifolde gifts and graces of your Christian and Princely integrity clemency bounty wisdome and piety And surely their hope hath not deceiued them for who so hath rightly discerned and duely considered your beâ—…ignesse of nature your ripenesse of iudgement your deepnesse of wisdome your vprightnesse of iustice your readinesse to mercie your bounteousnesse to the best your euennesse to all your desire of peace your care of your people your fauour to your Cleargie and respect to your Church your promptnesse in professing and stedfastnesse in establishing the true seruice of God amongst vs which your Highnesse hath constantly shewed since you came to the Crowne can not but acknowledge that to be iustly applied to your Maiestie which was first sayd of Salomon Blessed be the Lord your God which loued you to set you on the Throne of all Britaine because the Lord loued this land made you King to doe equitie and iustice happie are those your seruants which stand euer before you and heare your wisdome Whereof because it pleased God and your Maiestie I should attend you aswell at your Table in your first Progresse into these Countries of Surrey and Hampshire as at your conference for matters of Religion and assemblie of States for the welfare of this Realme I can beare certaine and assured witnesse as likewise can the rest of your Nobles and Bishops then present who all with no lesse admiration than contentation heard with what sharpnesse of vnderstanding maturenesse of knowledge soundnesse of reason firmnesse of memorie and aptnesse of speech your Highnesse entred debated and resolued the greatest and hardest points of diuine and humane wisdome shewing in euery of them such dexteritie perspicuitie and sufficiencie as I professe before God without flattery I haue not obserued the like in any man liuing As therefore I iudge the whole Realme blessed and beloued of God for giuing them a Prince of such rare prudence intelligence and experience so doe I after the example of the Apostle thinke my selfe happy that I shall this day bring these matters in question before so learned religious and iudicious a King no lesse skilfull in the sacred Scriptures than carefull to continue the true Christian faith thorowout his Dominions without dissenting from the will of God reuealed in his Word or departing from the primitiue Church of Christ in her best and purest times May it then please your excellent Maiestie to be enformed that vpon some mens too much forwardnesse to innouate as well the doctrine as the discipline of the Church of England they thinking those deuices alwayes best which are newest it was rife in Pulpits and vsuall in Catechismes that the death of Christ Iesus on the Crosse and his bloudshed for the remission of our sinnes were the least cause and meane of our redemption but he did and must suffer the death of the soule and the very same paines which the damned doe in hell before we could be ransomed from the wrath of God and this was that descent of Christ to hell which we are taught by the Creed to beleeue This opinion began to preuaile so fast that children were trained to it and the people led to controle the Scriptures as not rightly deliuering the true cause of our redemption by Christ in that they mention no meane to ransome vs from death and hell but the bloud of his crosse and death admitted in the bodie of his flesh and therefore in all such places we must as they say by a kinde of Synecdoche conceiue the death of the damned to haue beene suffered for a season in the soule of Christ and that to be the full and perfect price of our redemption I was much grieued I confesse to your sacred Maiestie to finde this so often in Catechismes and frequent in Pulpits and without iust ground in the Word of God to be so confidently blazed whiles the doctrine of this Realme proposed by publike authoritie to the people in the Booke of Homilies
was neglected and loathed And vpon conference with the most reuerend Father the late Archbishop now with God was aduised in open audience to deliuer what the Scriptures teach touching our redemption by the death and bloudshedding of Iesus Christ the Sonne of God Which accordingly I did declaring by occasion of the Apostles words Be it far from me to reioyce but in the Crosse of Christ first the Contents and then the Effects of Christes crosse In the Contents of Christes crosse I shewed what Christ suffered by the witnes of holy Scripture and what he suffered not and there ioyned this issue That no Scripture doth teach the death of Christs soule or the paines of the damned to be requisite in the person of Christ before he could be the Ransomer of our sinnes and Sauiour of the world And because the proofs pretended for this point might be three Praedictions that Christ should suffer those paines Causes why he must suffer them and Signes that he did suffer them I likewise insisted on all three and shewed there were no such Praedictions Causes nor Signes of the true paines of hell to be suffered in the soule of Christ before he could saue vs. Wherein his Agonie in the Garden and Complaint on the Crosse were examined as well by the rules of holy Scripture as by the maine consent of all the Fathers And lest the death of Christ suffered in the bodie of his flesh on the altar of the Crosse as it is described in the Scriptures and the shedding of his precious bloud should be disabled or distrusted of any as no sufficient meanes or price of our redemption in the Effects of Christs crosse I prooued the merits of Christes suffering to be infinite in respect of his person who was God and of the perfection of his obedience vnto the death of the Crosse the maner of his offering to be bloudie foreshewed by the Sacrifices of the Law and sealed by the Sacraments of the Gospell the power of his death to be mightie as able to conquer Sinne Hell and Satan the comfort of his Crosse to be necessarie to which we must all be conformed to suffer with him before we can raigne with him the victorie thereof to be heauenly in that he rose the third day into a celestiall and eternall life hauing all his enemies vnder his feet Yet for peace sake I yeelded the name of hell-paines might in some sort be tolerated in the sufferings of Christ if we meant thereby great and intolerable paines as the word is sometimes metaphorically taken in the Scriptures at the least by our vulgar translation for the word indeed was Sheôl which is vsed aswell for the graue as for hell and so those speeches of Dauid That the paines of Sheol found him out or compassed him might import the paines of death which brought men to their graues And concerning that Article of our Faith Christ descended to Hell I taught it might not by the course of the Creed be referred to Christ liuing but to Christ dead and safely note the conquest which Christs manhood after death had ouer all the powers of darkenesse declared by his resurrection when he rose Lord ouer all his enemies in his owne person Death Hell and Satan not excepted and had the Keyes that is all power of death and hell deliuered him by God that those in heauen earth and hell should stoope vnto him and be subiect to the strength and glorie of his Kingdome These things were first vttered by speech and after committed to writing that aswell the parts as proofes of euery point might more plainly appeare to all that would examine them My care was in either of these to ioyne with the doctrine prescribed by the booke of Homilies to be taught in the Church of God to the people That there is none other thing that can be named vnder heauen to saue our soules but this only worke of Christes precious offering his bodie vpon the Altar of the Crosse. For so great was Gods wrath and displeasure towards sinne that he could be pacified by no other meanes but only by the sweet and precious bloud of his deere Sonne And so pleasant was this sacrifice and oblation of his Sonnes death which he so obediently and innocently suffered that God would take it for the onely and full amends for all the sinnes of the world As for Christs descent to hell I deliuered the same ends and intents which the booke of Homilies doth where it saith Christes death destroyed death and ouercame the Diuell His death destroyed hell with all the damnation thereof Christ passed thorow death and hell to the intent to put vs in good hope that by his strength we shall do the same He destroyed the Diuell and all his tyrannie and openly triumphed ouer him and tooke away from him all his Captiues meaning all the Elect and hath raised and set them with himselfe amongst the heauenly Citizens aboue These things thus preached and printed by me it may please your excellent Maiestie to vnderstand were first impugned by an hastie and humorous Treatise whiles my Sermons were yet vnder the Presse and after by a larger and warier Defence which is this that I now refute The Treatiser sliding from the things proposed by me wherein he could not open his mouth but with as many vntrueths as words did beare men in hand the question was Whether Christ suffered for vs the wrath of God or no whereas I mooued no such doubt but rather acknowledged That all which Christ suffered in soule or in bodie was the wrath of God against our sinnes if we speake as the Scriptures doe of punishments prouided â—…or this life where Christ did suffer and not of the wrath to come which is the vengeance prepared for the Diuell and the damned in another world And because in this Treatise I found moe distempered pangs of erroneous follie than aduised steppes of learning or religion I refelled the chiefe reasons thereof in a Conclusion added to my Sermons as they were in printing not thinking it worth my time or paines to make any longer resutation of him that remembred so little of that I had vttered and reasoned so loosely for that which he would establish No sooner were those Sermons and that Conclusion published but the curious Brethren seeing their kingdome of conceits impugned made their obseruations on both and sent their collections and reasons to the Treatiser that he might make a fresh Defence correcting in many things his former rashnesse and now leading him rather cunningly to cauill with the Fathers speeches than so proudly to disdaine their testimonies which maketh him not only to change his minde in many matters from that he sayd before but often to crosse himselâ—…e in the selfe same leafe whiles he doth not marke what he sayth out of his owne heart and what he bringeth out of other mens supplies and papers In this Defence for so they
THE CROSSE OF CHRIST should be frustrate For the PREACHING OF THE CROSSE is to them that perish foolishnesse but to vs that are saued it is the power of God Christ crucified then being the very ground of our saluation and the Gospel declaring him to be the power of God to saue all that beleeue euidently the crosse of Christ was the maine doctrine of the Gospell which Paul preached to the Galathians and which the false Apostles mixed with circumcision and the righteousnesse of the law as well for the aduancing themselues being Iewes as for feare of their countreymen who vtterly disdained and egerly pursued all that taught a man hanged on a tree as a malefactor for so the vnbeleeuing Iewes conceiued of Christ to be the Sauiour of the world and complement of all Gods promises made to the seede of Abraham for their euerlasting blisse The rage of the vnbeleeuing Iewes against Paul for preaching the death and blood of Christ to be the Redemption of all the faithfull is manifest in many places of the Actes and of his owne Epistles which furie whiles the false Apostles sought to decline and somewhat to please and pacifie the Iewes they added circumcision and the obseruation of the law vnto the Crosse of Christ as necessary for iustification and saluation without which the death of Christ could doe vs no good This error then newly sowen among the Galathians to whom Paul before had preached Christ crucified as the sole and sufficient meane of their Redemption and Iustification through faith in his blood the Apostle throughout that large Epistle of his written vnto them with his owne hand doth purposely and mightily confute and is so farre from coupling any thing with Christ as requisite for righteousnesse or blessednesse and chiefly the law that he opposeth himselfe against men and Angels for the truth of his doctrine and resolueth cleane contrary to those false teachers and flatterers of the Iewish nation in most vehement manner Behold I Paul say vnto you that if yee be circumcised Christ shall profit you nothing Ye are abandoned from Christ whosoeuer are iustified by the law ye are fallen from grace His reasons are vrgent and euident If righteousnesse could be by the law then Christ died in vaine And that no man is iustified by the law in the sight of God it is plaine for the iust shall liue by faith now the law is not of faith For all haue sinned and are iustified freely by Gods grace through the Redemption that is in Christ Iesus whom God hath set foorth to be a Reconciliation THROVGH FAITH in his blood to declare his righteousnesse by the forgiuenes of sinnes As many then as are of the works of the law are vnder the curse but Christ hath redeemed vs from the curse of the law being made a curse for vs as it is written cursed is euery one that hangeth on a tree that the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentils through Iesus Christ. And that made the Apostle enter this disputation with so sharpe a rebuke to the Galathians for sliding from this Gospel or glad tidings of their saluation in the Crosse of Christ to circumcision and the works of the law O foolish Galathians saith he who hath bewitched you not to obey the truth to whom Iesus Christ was before your eyes described crucified among you And in this confident course he goeth on with plentifull and substantiall proofes that the Redemption righteousnesse blessednesse adoption freedome and sanctification of Gods children proceede from the grace of God and of Christ who gaue himselfe for our sinnes that he might tast death for all and are receiued by faith in the blood of Christ which confesseth him to be the Sonne of God and the only Sauiour of the world What marueile then if in the close of this example when Paul had shewed his care to haue the Galathians persist in this truth in that he wrote so long a letter vnto them with his owne hand which otherwise he did not vse he did also traduce the pride and pollicie of the false Apostles who partly to aduance themselues because they were Iewes partly to shunne the enuie of their countrimen frustrated the Crosse of Christ by adding circumcision and the obseruation of the law vnto it not that they themselues kept the law but only because they would not suffer persecution for preaching the Crosse of Christ which the vnbeleeuing Iewes so egerly resisted and impugned and withall professed of himselfe that howsoeuer they reioyced in the flesh that is in the circumcision of the Gentils yet God forbid that he should reioyce but in the crosse of Christ as the most sufficient meane of mans Redemption by which he was crucified to the world and the world to him what persecution soeuer he suffered for it And the verses following which you peâ—…uishly pull to patience in persecution pertaine directly to establish the truth and force of Christs Crosse. For in Christ Iesus saith he that is to attaine saluation by Christ crucified neither circumâ—…sion anâ—…leth any thing nor vncircumcision but a new creature that is Regeneration in Christ when the inward man of the hart is renued by faith through the operation of the spirit And as many as walke according to this Rule of doctrine by preaching and beleeuing the crosse of Christ for many walke after an other rule of whom I haue often told you that they are the enimies of the crosse of Christ peace be vpon them and mercy and vpon the Israell of God that is vpon as many as be Iewes within and not without and haue the circumcision of the hart in the spirit not in the flesh whose praise is not of men but of God And therefore from hence forth let no man put me to businesse as if I liked or allowed circumcision when and where pleased me For if I yet preach circumcision why doe I yet suffer persecution the slâ—…inder of the Crosse is abolished and the Iewes haue no cause of offence against me But of the Iewes fiue times receiued I fortie lashes sane one I was thrise beaten with rods I was once stoned I haue beene in stripes aboue measure in prison frequent in death often I beare in my body the markes of the Lord Iesus that is the signes of these persecutions suffered for his cause which prooue that in preaching the crosse of Christ I goe not about to please men but God For if I would please â—…en I were not the seruant of Christ. There is no miscoherence with the Text nor dissidence from the truth in this exposition which not my selfe alone but the auncient Fathers and best Diuines both olde and new haue imbraced yea it fully agreeth with the maine intent of Paul in this Epistle with the perpetuall vse of his words and with the cleare light of other places where
gloriae ducunt à me vero procul sit caeterarum rerum iactantia Licet in vna Christi cruce morte admodum gloriars They sayth Paul count circumcision a glorie farre be it from me to boast in other things It is lawfull for me thorowly to reioyce only in the crosse and dâ—…ath of Christ Iesus Some will aske How or why doest thou reioyce in the Lords crosse For that he was crucified for my sake which aâ—… no bodie and loued me so deerely that he offered himselfe to death for me Oecumenius What is this reioycing in Christs crosse which Paul speaketh of That for vs who were vnworthy Christ would be crucified for that is the cause we haue to glorie Haymo vpon the same place in the person of Paul sayth I will not reioyce in the riches and dignities of this world but in the crosse of Christ that is I will reioyce in his passion which was celebrated on the crosse whence is my redemption and saluation Moe I might easily bring but these for antiquitie may suffice The grauest and exactest of the new writers agree with the Fathers Bullinger Whereas Paul might haue vsed a simple kinde of affirmation ONLY THE DEATH OF CHRIST is sufficient for me to saluation he chose rather to expresse it by the way of detestation and to say Farre be it from me to reioyce but in the crosse of our Lord Iesus Christ. Where againe the second time by the crosse he meaneth the death sacrifice and expiation of the Lord Christ and the whole worke of our redemption Gualter in his 59. homilie vpon that Epistle sayth Now Paul opposeth himselfe to those false teachers declaring how he himselfe is affected and vpon that occasion repeateth the Summe of his doctrine touching the redemption and saluation of mankind in these words Be it farre from me to reioyce but in the crosse of our Lord Iesus Christ. He might haue sayd simply I reioyce only in Christ crucified in whose crosse I know there is reposed for me life and saluation But he vseth such a kind of speech as teacheth vs their insolencie was an abominable and capitall offence Caluin a man for his great paines in the Church of God worthy of great praise where he steppeth not too much aside from the ancient Fathers expounding these words of Paul sayth To reioyce in Christs crosse is as much as in Christ crucified but that it expresseth more for it signifieth that death of Christs which was full of reproch and shame and was accursed of God That death then which men abhorre and whereof they are ashamed in that death Paul sayth he reioyceth because he hath perfect blessednesse therein Piscator in his Scholies vpon Pauls Epistle to the Galathians noting what crosse of Christ it was for which the false teachers would not suffer persecution sayth Ob crucem Christs id est ob doctrinam Euangelij de salute part a per solam Christi crucem they would not suffer persecution for the crosse of Christ that is for the doctrine of the Gospell teaching saluation to be purchased by the crosse of Christ only There is not a new writer of any iudgement or diligence which ioyneth not with these and howsoeuer some of them withall auouch that Paul meant to shew by this opposing himselfe to these false teachers that hee shunned not persecution for the crosse of Christ as they did but reioyced in the doctrine of the crosse by which the elect are saued what affliction soeuer befell him therefore yet they deriue that part of Pauls meaning not from the confused signification of Christs crosse as you doe but either from the EFFICACIE thereof by which Paul was crucified to the world and the world to him in neglecting the flattery and enduring the fury of such as opposed themselues against Christ or from the CONFORMITIE to it that as he desired to reigne so he was willing to suffer with Christ and therefore reioyced as well in the fellowship as in the force and effects of Christes sufferings on the crosse or lastly from the CONTRARIETIE to the false teachers that though they adulterated the true doctrine of Christes crosse because they would decline persecution it was Paulâ—… ioy to teach sincerely the power of Christ crucified whosoeuer pursued him for so doing This sinceritie and duetie of the Apostle I am farre from denying but the crosse of Christ I constantly referre to the doctrine of mans redemption and saluation by the crosse of Christ that is by his personall sufferings on the crosse as all those old and new writers do and not to the troubles and afflictions of the godly to which if this Discourser dare ascribe the meane or merit of mans redemption or saluation he falleth from puritie to poperie and from the Christian faith to open heresie Thou seest then gentle Reader how sure ground and iust reason I had to propose that sense of my text which I did as also how vntruely vnwisely and headily this fellow ranne first to the challenging of my text and still vpholdeth his humour with his priuate dreame of Christs crosse conteining ioyntly together all the afflictions of Christ and his members from the beginning of the world to the ending thereof and maketh the false teachers as fearing persecution for the commending of his conceit to ioyne circumcision to the doctrine of the Gospell and so by altering and interlacing Pauls words after his owne fansie hee hath hatched at last an exposition without head or heele which no man vnderstandeth besides himselfe and the Diuines of all ages both new and olde do contradict But I committed another great ouersight in handling my text which was to take occasion from the text to speake of any thing for you count them the faithfullest and wisest handlers of Scripture which conclude euen from their text firmly and first of all what soeuer they afterwards teach thereupon Indeed I thinke your maner be to conclude all that you afterward say euen from your text without the helpe of any other places of Scripture You be so fast in your conceits and so loose in your conclusions that you can inferre any thing of euery thing Euery word you speake you tie to your text as firmly as flax to fire but if you would take the paines once to proue that you say and not only to say that which you should prooue you would finde great difference betwixt the firmnesse of a fansie in which you be so resolute and of an argument which for ought I yet see in your writings you scant make not vnderstand And where you quarrell with such handling of texts as is vsuall in these dayes but no good nor commendable vse your reading must be greater and iudgement better before you take vpon you to controle the Preachers of England for mishandling their texts Many hundreds there are of whom you may learne both how to diuide and how to pursue your theme your skill is not such
Prophets not as wanting soueraigntie and sufficiencie in himselfe aboue all Prophets but leading them that knew him not to consider better of those Scriptures which they knew It is as true of Pauls writings as of the rest of the Apostles and Prophets which S. Augustine affirmeth De quorum scriptis quòd omni errore careant dubitare nefarium est Of whose writings to doubt whether they be free from all error is plaine wickednesse Neuerthelesse I well perceiue that all this great shew of cleauing to the Fathers iudgements is but coloured in you For in other points againe we see when they speake not to yoúr liking the case is altered I see in this booke where you forsake the ancient and learned Fathers that is as you speake in my case you conâ—…mne despise them The more vniust then and iniurious was your slander that I went about by the vse of one word which olde and new Diuines vsed in like sort before me to make the Fathers of equall authoritie with the Scriptures since now you can both obserue and obiect that euen in this booke which you impugne I say and do the contrarie And though I be farre from repenting or misliking any thing that I sayd touching the prerogatiue of the sacred Scriptures and their irrefragable authoritie against all the words and wits of men yet can I not chuse but note your negligence that marke neither what nor of whom I speake Had I brought Fathers in matters of faith against or without the Scriptures you had some colour to choake me with mine owne words but taking care as I did that in cases of faith the Scriptures should be plaine and perspicuous for my purpose before I cited them and the testimonies of the Fathers euident and concurrent with the Scriptures how doe I crosse any of those places which you quote out of my writings touching the authoritie and sufficiencie of the Scriptures in points of faith or what agreement hath your dissenting from the Scriptures and Fathers in the chiefest keyes of Christian religion with my leauing them in some expositions and positions not pertinent to the faith nor generally receiued of them all It is vanitie enough to dreame of contradictions where none are and as great infirmitie not to see that which lieth before your eyes but to pronounce that you know how wauering and slipperie I am for the most part therein when you neither consider nor conceiue what I say that is more than childish temeritie As I sayd so I say againe In Gods causes Gods booke must teach vs what to beleeue and what to professe and therefore what I reade in the word of God that I beleeue what I reade not that I doe not beleeue Yea I adde thereto S. Basils conclusion If all that is not of faith be sinne as the Apostle sayth and faith commeth by hearing and hearing by the word of God all that is without the Scripture inspired from God as not being of faith is sinne This confession I constantly holde and as in the first booke which you quote I directly and expresly defend that no point of faith should be beleeued without Scripture so in my Sermons I no where varie from it how slipperie soeuer your tongue be to tell a tale in stead of a trueth I doe reiect Austens opinion in three speciall points and diuers Fathers in two other cases and some of those things I affirme against all the Fathers and almost against all the Church and yet I bitterly reproue you for vsing the like libertie Doe I any where reiect S. Augustine or all the Fathers in any point of doctrine necessarie to our saluation as you do in the chiefest grounds of our redemption And when I let the Reader vnderstand that the reasons which some Fathers bring to fortifie their priuate opinions are not sufficient for to force consent to be giuen vnto them doe I call them fond absurd without reason or likelihood and paradoxes in nature as you do These two things I iustly reproue in you which I my selfe doe not fall into for all your fitning In the maine principles of Christian religion and our redemption you make the best learned Fathers ignorant of their Creed and Catechisme and when their expositions of the Scripture crosse your imaginations you Reuell against their Iudgements as void of sense and reason This doâ—… I not In the rule of faith I renounce not their maine consent nor vndoubted maximes least I conclude them or my selfe to erre in faith In other questions of lesâ—…e importance wherein they differ sometimes from ech other sometimes euen from themselues I let the Reader see their reasons and leaue him free to follow what he liketh or to suspend his iudgement if he find cause therefore This libertie I neuer take from you nor mislike it in you but when you pronounce all to be absurd fond and foolish that yeeld not to your fansie wherein you doe not onely proudly aduance your owne dreames as necessary Doctrines but reprochfully preiudice the freedome of others This difference is not my deuise the auncient consent of Godly Fathers saith Vincentius is with great care to be searched and followed of vs not in all the questions of the Diuine Law but onely or chiefly in the Rule of Faith Whether therefore the bodies of such as arose and came out of their graues after Christs resurrection returned againe to corruption or still kept the honor of immortalitie which was bestowed on them as also when Christ said to the theefe on the Crosse this day shalt thou be with me in Paradise whether Christ ment the presence of his humane soule or of his Diuine glory should be that day in Paradise and so whether the soules of the faithfull dâ—…parting this life goe straight to heauen or stay in a place appointed them of God till the day of iudgement and likewise whether Abrahams bosome were a receptacle for soules within the earth and neere to hell or far aboue the earth and lastly whether the loosing of Adam from hell by Christs descent thither which the whole Church almost seemed to hold by tradition freed onely the person of Adam from the place of hell or both him and his posteritie from all feare and danger of hell These be things that may be liked disliked or suspended without any manifest breach of faith and wherein Saint Austen probablely disputeth but determineth nothing for certaintie to be beleeued alwaies tempering his words in these cases with Ego quidem non video explicent qui possunt nondum intelligo nulla causa occurrit nondum muâ—… I see not how let them declare it that can as yet I vnderstand it not I conceaue presently no cause as yet I find it not cleere If I then laboured with respectiue words and other places of the same Fathers to shew wherein they doubted or dissented who but a light head and slipper tongue would call this
any reason or learning ergo Christs dead bodie depriued of soule and sense was the whole Ransom for our sinnes for that he meaneth by Christs death or ergo no action nor passion of Christs soule before or on his crosse was meritorious If I say these conclusions doe necessarily follow out of those words or out of the meaning of them then I must confesâ—…e I am fowly ouershot in my speach But if these be most ignorant and absurd collections from my words and from theirs that vsed that speâ—…ch before me then mayest thou see Christian Reader what meaning this man hath throughout this booke purposely to peruert and misconster all that I say to make thee beleeue I broch some strange and wonderous Doctrine But shifts lâ—… hid but a while the shame in the end will be his How then can that which I sundrie times teach of Christs sufferings in his soule be true if our whole ranâ—…om and propitiation be bodily bloudy and deadly only which is the point â—…here stand on What contradiction finde you in my words that Christ might haue and had sufferings in his soule as feare sorrow and affliction of minde and yet died no death but only a bodilie Only a bodily death doth not exclude all paines which are not bodily but all deaths saue the death of the bodie Wherefore my conclusion is whâ—…re it was That the death which the Mediator must suffer for sinne by the Apostles doctrine must onely be bodily and bloodie and therefore by no meanes the death of the soule or of the damned Yet this â—…as not our whole râ—…some you say nor the whole sacrifice for sinne the sufferings of his soule must be added vnto it When I speake of Christes death I vnderstand that maner and order of his death which the Euangelists describe for so the Scriptures meane when they speake of Christes death and from that death I doe not seuer those sufferings of his soule which the Scripturâ—…s mention because the sharpnesse of that death which his body was to suffer draue him to the deepe consideration of the cause why of the Iudge from whom and the captiue for whom he suffered Christ otherwise had not suffered death as a Redeemer if he had been ignorant of any of these or compelled by force to endure the furie of the Iewes he had power enough to stay their rage decline their bloudie hands yea to auert or decrease the paines as he thought good but because he was to offer himselfe as a willing sacrifice to suffer death to saue vs from the wrath of his Father he layed aside his owne power and submitted himselfe wholly to be disposed at his Fathers will which the Scriptures call his obedience vnto death When therefore he foresaw and felt how sharpe and painfull that death would be and was which he must and did suffer for our sinnes was it possible he should not fully cast the eyes of his â—…inde vpon the horror of our sinnes which did so sting him vpon the fiercenesse of Gods wrath which did so pursue him though he were his innocent and only sonne and vpon the terrible vengeance that rested for vs if he should mislike or refâ—…se to beare the burden of our offences If any man learned thinke it possible for Christ to suffer the one and not in spirit most cleerely to see the other I am content he shall seâ—…er the sufferings of Christs soule from the griefe and anguish of his bodily death but if it be more than absurd so to conceiue then finde we that the sight and sense of Christes extreame torments in bodie caused and vrged his soule thorowly to beholde these things with feare and sorrow which in themselues were most fearefull and could not châ—… but affect Christes soule deeply and diuersly As for the whole ransome of our sinne we shall haue occasion in the next reason more largely to treate of But you haue reasons you say to confirme your maine matter among manie these two the first the Iewish sacrifices shadowing and foreshewing the second the sacraments of Christians testifying and confirming that the true sacrifice for sinne was bodily and bloudy Still what trifling is this doth any in the world denie that the true sacrifice for sinne was the bodie bloud and death of the Redeemer Wherefore the proposition must be as I did set it in your behalfe the Iewish sacrifices were shadowes or figures and our sacraments were signes of our whole and absolute redemption by Christ I say of the whole and entire propitiatorie sacrifice or els you shrinke and leaue the question When I lacke one to set propositions in my behalfe I will send to you for helpe till then spare your paines except you might reape more thanks But you must learne to get you plainer termes or at least more plainly to expound them if you will needs be a setter of propositions for what is the WHOLE sacriâ—…ice propitiatorie and what is our WHOLE redemption By the whole sacrifice meane you the whole person of Christ that gaue himselfe for vs or intend you the whole action whereby he sanctified submitted and presented himselfe as a sacrifice of a sweet smell vnto God or by the whole vnderstand you all that in Christ was deuoted and deliuered vnto death for the satisfaction of Gods iustice And so our whole redemption doe you referre it only to remission of sinnes as the Apostle doth when he sayth We haue redemption through Christes bloud euen the forgiuenesse of sinnes or also to deliuerance from the dominion and infection of sinne and to the abolishing of all corruption in soule and bodie which is our whole and absolute redemption When the powers of heauen shall be shaken and the Sonne of man come in a cloud with power and great glorie then lift vp your heads sayth Christ for your redemption draweth neere You are sealed by the holy Spirit vnto the day of redemption sayeth Paul And Dauid God shall redeeme their soules from deceit and violence that is he shall deliuer their soulâ—…s The Saints as the Apoâ—…e speaketh were racked and would admit no redemption to obtaine a better resurrection where by redemption he meaneth deliuerance As Zacharias sayd God hath visited and sent redemption to his people that is saluation or deliuerance from our enemies and from the hands of all that hate vs to serue him in holinesse and righteousnesse all the dayes of our life So that our whole and absolute redemption compriseth all the degrees and steps of our saluation as iustification sanctification and glorification and these though they were merited and obtained for vs by Christes obedience vnto dâ—…ath yet are they performed and accomplished by diuers other meanes therewith concurring and thereon depending as by the grace of his spirit the working of his power and glory of his comming And therefore the words which you haue set in my behalfe are like their authour that is they are
destruction of body and soule Wee must therefore know that God truely and iustly threatned Adam and in him all mankind to be guiltie of all soâ—…ts of death and to bee thereto subiected as to their due if they transgressed against him but this commination neither included execution of all sorts of death on all mankind nor excluded pardon where pleased God onely thence may rightly bee gathered fiâ—…st that all Adaâ—… of spring should bee condemned and subiected to the guilt of all as deseruing all the one no lesse then the other Secondly that some of Adams issue should effectuall feele the sting of all which God allotted to the reprobate Thirdly that euen the elect as well as the reprobate should beare in themselues the monuments of this transgression by the corruption dissolution of their nature though the one should in this life bee reformed by the working of Gods spirit in them and the other bee restored after this life by the Resurrection from the dead All these wee finde performed by God in the trueth of his iudgements and therefore we may be sure they were intended at the time of his threatning And consequently this collection is very true that God threating Adam with these words Thou shalt die the death purposed if Adam transgressed that none of his posteritie should escape the death of their bodies to which God foorthwith punishing sinne irreuocably subiected Adam and all his children as Gods owne words declare when he said to Adam and in him to all men Dust thou art and to dust shalt thou returne The iudges reuenge then for sinne which we deserued and to which we were iustly condemned was temporall eternall death of the body and soule heere and in hell But this was not executed on all because some were freed by the fauour of God in Iesus Christ though none excused from a corporall death which prooueth my position the truer that God neuer released sinne to any no not to his owne Sonne without some kind of death It must not be forgotten that here you renounce all satisfaction for sinne in respect of merite as from Christes soule vtterly If you meane I vtterly renounce all satisfaction for sinne as from the death of Christs soule I easily graunt it and would gladly heare what you can say against it because the soule of Christ as I beleeue could not die the death of spirits But if you conceiue that Christes soule had neither part sense nor merit in the death of his body by which satisfaction for sinne was fully made it is the weamishnesse of your wit to mistake so much and vnderstand so little I attributed all sense of paine as well in death as other wise to the soule of Christ and the death of his body I communicated to his soule by reason it is a separation of the soule from the body not thereby to bee depriued of sense or grace which Christes soule could not be but therein to feele the paine and sting which the death of the body brought with it I tolde you but the leafe before out of Austen that the paine which is called bodily belongeth rather to the soule and that the paine of the flesh is only the offending or afflicting the soule by the flesh Wherefore I made the soule of Christ to be the principall agent in all his meriting and patient in all his suffering and though the soule of Christ could not pay the satisfaction for our sinnes by her death because shee could not die yet that is no impediment but the soule of Christ might haue and had the chiefest paine sense and merit in the death of Christes bodie by which the whole person made full satisfaction for the sinnes of the world And this is so farre from renouncing all merit of satisfaction from the soule of Christ as you conceiue that it ascribeth the whole power and force thereof to the obedience and patience of Christes soule and maketh the bodie the instrument ordeined of God to conuey paine vnto the soule and to lie dead when the soule is departed from it As for Bernards words which I alledge if you did or could tell how they crosse mine I would take the paines to reconcile them now you say they sute not with mine but awake out of your wonted maze and you shall see that I giue the chiefe place and part in the meritorious sacrifice vnto the soule of Christ which you dreame I doe not as also that you neither like nor allow of Bernards words For he declaring the cause and maner why and how Christes minde was afflicted in his passion sayth it was with a double affection of most humane compassion on the one side for the vncomfortable griefe of the holy women on the other for the desperation and dispersion of his disciples These causes you reiect as fond and absurd and now you would seeme to ioyne with Bernards words But you must say of him as you doe of Ambrose and pray that mens authorities may be omitted in this case for all the Fathers of Christes church are vtter strangers or enemies to your new doctrine That nothing may satisfie for sinne but death is not sound the Scriptures doe shewe indeede that Christ should not satisfie without death but they denie not that there are other parts of Christs satisfaction which differ from his death as his bloodshedding his shame his reproches his apprehension his buffeting and besides that pouertie hunger and wearines These doubtlesse yea all other sufferings of Christ what soeuer small or great are satisfactorie and meritorious That all Christes actions and passions were meritorious with God I haue no doubt but that all his sufferings as well naturall as voluntarie did euery one small or great satisfie for sinne This is a speech of yours which except it be well qualified hath in it an whole heape of absurdities and contrarieties For if the least and the first thing that Christ suffered either naturally or voluntarily did satisfie for sinne superfluous were all the rest to our redemption when God was once satisfied And so by his birth or circumcision you graunt a Supersedeas to all his life and death as needelesse to our redemption Then the which what can be more repugnant to the word of God and faith of Christ and euen to your selfe who by this meanes make your hell paines of no importance to our saluation By satisfaction you meane not full satisfaction but that which any way tendeth to satisfaction or is requisite before satisfaction can be made It is easie and often with you to abuse words though you talke much of their proprietie What is Satis in Latine whence to satisfie commeth but enough and what is enough for sinne but after which more is not requisite If then Christ satisfied that is did or paide enough for sinne by the first of his sufferings then all that followed as I inferred were more then enough and consequently
with both parts as well with bodie as with soule and so Christ if your proportion were any thing needfull which I wholly reiect as needlesse in the Sonne of God by this reason of yours needed no proper sufferings of the soule without and besides the bodie Paul vnderstoode Rom. 7. vers 7. when hee became a Christian that the desiring of euill is sinne before the outward act bee consummate You alleage Saint Paul as you doe the rest for matters that he neuer meant Paul speaketh not there of the actuall desire of euill when the will hath thereto consented such as was in Adam when hee resolued to eate the forbidden fruite but of the naturall inclination and first motions to sinne which are in vs after Adams disobedience but were not in him before his fall For that precept thou shalt not lust conuinceth and condemneth our nature to be corrupt and sinfull to which originall concupiscence the roote and spring of all sinne in vs cleaueth so fast that euen in our cradles this corruption excludeth vs from the kingdome of God if we be not regenerate in Christ by water and the holy Ghost In Adam besore sinne there was no such thing his nature was vpright and sincere as it was first created and voide of all concupiscence intended by this precept as the best learned of our time teach till by his transgression sinne entred and infected both body and soule Neither doe you conceiue right of Paul as he was a Pharisee when you suppose he tooke the outward fact of sinne onely to bee sinne Neuer read he thinke you when he was a Pharisee the words of Esay Aram hath taken wicked counsell against thee but it shall not stand Nor of Salomon The thoughts of the wicked are an abomination to the Lord and the euill thought of a foole is sinne Could hee not tell what to iudge of Hamans thoughts against the Iewes or of Achitophels purpose against Dauid or of Balams counsell against the Israelites The very heathen Philosophers placed vertues and vices in the minds of men and the prophane Poets would haue mens enterprises measured by the intent not by the euent The Pharisees were neuer so blinde as to thinke all counsels thoughts desires and lusts to bee lawfull against the manifest and expresse words of the law and Prophets but they blindly mistooke the law of God as forbidding externall facts onely which are hurtfull to others vpon paine of malediction and damnation They rather stood vpon the Popish opinion of veniall and mortall sinnes and did not thinke that veniall sinnes did exclude them from the righteousnesse of the Law nor from the kingdome of heauen Of that opinion was Paul when he was a Pharisee but vpon his conuersion and better instruction by the spirit of Christ hee vnderstoode that not onely euill desires and thoughts were forbidden by the seueral precepts of Gods law as deadly sinnes which the Pharisees would not admit to vphold their owne righteousnesse but that euen the secret tentation to sinne and the inward propension and corruption of our hearts are interdicted and condemned by this precept thou shalt not lust as sinne sufficient to exclude vs from the kingdome of God Your doctrine is very strange where you teach that the soule properly committeth no sin but by with the body that is the soule in it selfe by it selfe alone sinneth not You say all prouocations and pleasures of sin the soule taketh from her body all acts of sin she committeth by her body which speeches are exceeding vntrue and hurtfull To him that either fully can not or rightly will not vnderstand what is said all things seeme strange otherwise set aside your olde ordinarie phrases of proper and meere without which you can say nothing and the matter which you so much maruaileat is very plaine as well by the rules of Scripture as proofes of nature Is it so strange a doctrine with you that the whole man and not this or that part of man is by the word of God charged with the committing of euery sinne and guiltie thereof in such sort that the whole person is defiled therewith and shal be condemned therefore Depart from me Lord saith Peter to Christ for I am a sinfull man Blessed is the man saith Dauid to whom the Lord imputeth no sinne O God be mercifull vnto me a sinner saith the Publicane Tribulation and anguish vpon the soule of euery man that worketh euill saith the Apostle By which as by infinite other places of Scripture wee are taught that the whole person which is man himselfe is the sinner by which part so euer he sinneth Euery one that committeth sinne is the seruant of sinne saith our Sauiour Can the soule be in bondage for sinne and the body bee free Cursed is the man saith Moses that keepeth not all the words of the law to doe them Can the soule bee accursed for sinning and the body be blessed as not sinning The wages of sinne is death saith the Apostle Shall death preuaile against the Soule for sin and the Body escape death as voyd of sinne Surely no. Sinne defileth the whole Man by what part soeuer it is committed yea the very thoughts of the hart coinquinate the whole man When the Pharisees held opinion that meate eaten with vnwashen hands defiled the Body our Sauiour reprooueth that error in them and teacheth his Disciples that nothing without a man can defile him when it entreth into him but the things which come foorth of him are they that defile the Man For from within out of the hart of Man come foorth euill thoughts couetousnesse wantonnesse a wicked eye pride foolishness All these euils come from within and defile a Man Where we see that enuie which Christ noteth by a wicked eye and pride and such like inward sinnes yea and euill thoughts defile the Man that is as well the Body which the Pharisees tooke to be defiled with vncleane hands as the Soule The Apostle stretcheth the infection of sinne farder euen to the meates them selues that are eaten of the wicked All things saith he speaking of meates which the Iewes counted vncleane are cleane to the cleane but to the vncleane and vnbeleeuers nothing is cleane but euen their minde and conscience is vncleane So that the vncleannesse of the inward Man defileth the outward Man and all things which the outward Man vseth This is so true that not onely the guiltinesse and filthinesse of sinne is in this life communicated from the Soule to the Body but both shal be therefore condemned in the righteous iudgement of God to euerlasting fire We must all appeare before the tribunal of Christ euery man to receiue the things done by his Body Where all sorts of sinnes in thought word or deede are by the Apostle called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or as others read 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 things done
of Christ on the Crosse. Now the relatiue following QVOD enim must either be referred to all that went before and so not to malediction apart from the rest or to that which went next before which is the chasticement of our peace And so either way you were ouer bold with your Author to referre his words whether pleased you And farder answere to Ierom there needed none For to no proofe needed no answere And yet what better answere could you haue then for Ieroms meaning since his words are not generall to haue Ieroms conclusion in that very place brought you which best serueth to shew Ieroms intent Of Christs hanging on the Crosse Ierom speaketh noting that to be a cursed kinde of death out of the Apostle which I am farre from denying So doth he of digging Christs hands and feete out of the Psalme and of the rest of Christs wounds and stripes by which we were healed out of the Prophet whom hee expoundeth All which Christ suffered for vs being in deed due to vs for our sinnes Leaue out your falsifying of Ieroms words and sense that whatsoeuer curse was due to vs for our sinnes Christ suffered for vs and I see no cause why Ieroms words should neede any answere That this place of Esaie and the whole Doctrine which I auouch touching these fufferings of Christ may be the better receaued let vs note that the publike Doctrine appointed by Authoritie to be taught throughout England expresseth the same Namely Nowels Catechisme Since the Scriptures which plentifully and plainly teach vs the true price and meanes of our saluation giue no warrant of your new found Doctrine and the whole Armie of Auncient and learned Fathers who could ill instruct the people committed to their charge if they themselues were ignorant of the true meaning of their Creed and Catechisme neuer heard nor thought of your late deuised Redemption by Christs suffering the very paines of hell and the same which the damned doe suffer without any dispensation or Qualification for so it liketh you to speake if you could produce moe new writers of your mind then you doe or can they must pardon me for not admitting any Doctrine touching our Redemption but what I see grounded on the plaine euidence of the Sacred Scriptures and so receaued in the Church of Christ before our Age. I list not to deuise or approue a new Saluation vnknowen till our time and if any man be otherwise minded he shall goe alone for me God grant me to be a member of that Church which hath reuerently receaued and faithfully beleeued the simplicitie of the Scriptures touching our Redemption by the death and bloud of Christ Iesus Howbeit I see many men speake diuersly that meane nothing lesse then your late found hell inflicted by the immediat hand of God on the Soule of Christ. Where then you dreampt in your Treatise as you still doe in your Defence that whosoeuer named the wrath of God in Christs sufferings or called his Crosse a cursed kinde of death was wholy of your side I did in few lines reprooue that folly of yours and since you quoted no speciall words neither out of Master Nowels Catechisme nor out of the Bible appointed publikely to be read in the Churches of this Realme nor out of the Booke of Homilies that were worth the standing on there was no cause why I should wast time to hunt after your meaning If you would haue an answere it was meete you made your Arguments and pressed your Authorities as well as you could and then you should soone see what I said vnto them But as I then foretold so you now performe Your buzzing head no where findeth the wrath of God or horror of Iudgement against our sinne to be apprehended by Christ but you straightway conclude all your conceits from the first to the last These words when I reade them in any man offend not me as they helpe not you except you wrest them after your manner to hide vnder them your new found hell and the rest of your presumptuous and irreligious humours Begin with the Catechisme and see what choise you haue made thence There it is thus taught He payd and suffered the paine due to vs and by this meanes deliuerd vs from the same With Christ as our suretie God dealt as it were with extremitie of law Christ therefore suffered and in suffering ouercame death the paine appointed by the euerliuing God for mans offence What of all this What one worde is here sounding towards the death of the soule or the death of the damned after this life The Catechisme in the very same sentence expressely speaketh of the painefull and reprochfull death which the Iewes inflicted on Christ the manner whereof is orderly described in the next answere before These things sayth the Catechisme the Iewes did vnto him cruelly maliciously and wickedly but Christ willingly of his owne accord suffered ALL THOSE THINGS from the Iewes to appease with this most sweete sacrifice his father offended with mankinde vtque paenas nobis debitas dependeret persolueret atque nos ex illis hoc modo eximeret and to pay and satisfie the punishments due to vs thereby to exempt vs from them Cum Christo quasi sponsore pro nobis sic passo Deus summo quasiiure egit God dealt after a sort seuerely with Christ as with a surety suffering thus for vs but to vs whose sinnes deserued punishments and due paines transtulit in Christum hee transferred on Christ God shewed singular mercie and clemencie All this is plainely referred to the punishments and paines which Christ suffered at the hands of the Iewes by the secret counsell and appointment of God that thereby he might pacifie the wrath of his Father and deliuer vs from the shame paine and death due to our sinnes which God transferred and remoued from vs to Christ that he might suffer them and we be freed both here and hereafter for them Wherein great fauour and mercie were shewed to vs and Christ as it were a Suretie subiected for vs after a sort to the rigour of the Lawe What hurt is there in these wordes if you leaue haling and pulling them from their right sense The Authour of the Catechisme warily forbeareth the generall which you seeke after so greedily and when hee commeth to the places that might seeme harsh he qualifieth them with quasi as it were not meaning to presse those phrases as you doe to the vttermost Wherefore he saith that Christ was quasi sponsor a kinde of suretie suffering for vs and that God dealt with him Quasi summo iure as it were with riger in respect of the lenitie shewed to vs. Which speeches if you poyson them not with your bitter conceits I mislike not so long as they be stretched no further then to SIC passo pro nobis Christ THVS suffering for vs at the hands of the Iewes to which the writer of the Catechisme wisely
the extreamest part of his passion Gods wrath against mans sinne was indeede the cause of all that Christ suffered and not the extreamest part onely of his sufferings by which you would extenuate the rest as not extreame enough till that were added But the Booke of Homilies teacheth you no such Doctrine that proposeth the death of Christ suffered in his Body on the Crosse for the FVLL and ONLY satisfaction or amends of all our sinnes Heare the words that the Reader may see what a counterfeite pretence you make of publike Authoritie as if it were consonant to your new conceited errours when it plainly impugneth them So pleasant was this Sacrifice and oblation of his Sonnes death which he so obediently and innocently suffered that God would take it for the ONLY and FVLL AMENDS for all the sinnes of the world No tongue surely is able to expresse the worthinesse of this so pretious a death Yea there is none other thing that can be named vnder heauen to saue our Soules but THIS ONLY VVORKE of Christs pretious offering of his Body vpon the Altar of the Crosse. The death of Christs Body you thinke did not manifest the wrath of God against our sinnes the death of the Soule and paines of hell must be added before the wrath of God will appeare in Christs Crosse. So teach you but the Booke of Homilies teacheth the cleane contrarie Christ being the Sonne of God and perfect God himselfe who neuer committed sinne was compelled to come downe from heauen and to giue his Body to be brused and broken on the Crosse for our sinnes Was not this a manifest token of Gods great wrath and displeasure towards sinne that he could be pacified by NO OTHER MEANES but ONLY by the sweete and pretious bloud of his deare Sonne Therefore in the Booke of Homilies as there is no mention so is their no intention that Christ suffered spiritually the proper wrath of God which our sinnes deserued These are your phrases and fansies added to the booke of Homilies which neither speaketh nor meaneth any such thing as you idlely inferre Againe Christ bare all our sinnes sores and infirmities vpon his owne backe no paine did he refuse to suffer in his owne bodie But as he felt all this in his bodie so he must feele the greatest part primarily and much more deeply in his soule ergo he refused not to suffer all the paines of the wrath of God both in bodie and soule This kinde of ergoing passeth mine vnderstanding To the first proposition taken out of the booke of Homilies that Christ bare all our sores and infirmities vpon his owne backe refusing no paine in his owne bodie to deliver vs from euerlasting paine you put what pleaseth you without any proofe and then you inferre what you list without any sequele of reason or trueth For how hangeth this geere together Christ bare all our sores and infirmities in his owne bodie ergo he suffered all the paines of Gods wrath both in bodie and soule Are there none other paines of Gods wrath but the sores and infirmities of our bodies And if Christ did suffer all bodily paine incident to men heere on earth doth it therefore follow that he suffered all the paines both of bodie and soule that Gods wrath here and els where hath prouided for sinners If a man would set himselfe purposely to crosse the booke of homilies I know not how he might do it more directly then you do to conclude expresly the contrary to that which is there deliuered It is no maruell that so manie writers are of your side as you say when you can enlarge them and interlace them after this sort but you shall doe well to thinke that your Reader now hearkeneth after the publike doctrine of this Realme authorized by the lawes thereof in the booke of homilies as you professed and not after your secret conceits intercepting and peruerting the trueth there taught by your pernicious and erroneous glozes Christ you say must feele the greatest part of his bodily paines primarily in his soule Haue you not brought vs monsters enough in matters of faith but you must hatch vs more Must bodily paines for of those speaketh the booke of homilies as appeareth by the next words Christ refused no paine in his owne bodie and the first wordes are he bare all our sores and infirmities on his owne backe must I say bodily paines be felt primarily in the soule If you shift all sense to the soule then the bodie beareth that is feeleth nothing and so you refute the booke of homilies you follow it not If you allow sense to the bodie tell vs I pray you how violence first offered to the bodie is primarily felt in the soule It may be betwixt first in English and primus in Latine you haue found some deepe difference The soule you thinke doth primarily consider of the paines of her bodie that you meane by feeling Then leaue you to the bodie a second consideration of his owne paines and so you giue reason and memorie to the bodie distinct from the soule which well becommeth a man of your wisdome That Christ duely considered of the cause for which he suffered and of the Iudge by whose appointment he suffered these things in his bodie from the Iewes I haue often sayd it and you haue often reiected it as not sufficient to satisfie the wrath of God against our sinnes and therefore you euery where vrge the proper punishment and iust reward of sinne due to vs on the soule of Christ and when you come to proue it you rest on the religious consideration that Christ had of his sufferings and call that the wrath of God as if you might choppe and change the wrath of God to your best liking and neuer be constant in any thing Howbeit the question now is what the publike homilies teach the people to beleeue of the worke of their saluation and not how you can shift and sheere wordes to make them sort with your errours Shew therefore somewhat out of the booke of Homilies established by the lawes of this realme that may cleerely confirme or concurre with your doctrine and sell vs not the verdiuyce of your owne deuices in stead of good wine allowed by publike authoritie Christ tooke vpon him the reward of our sinnes the iust reward of sinne But the same homilie sayth the reward of our sinne was the iust wrath and indignation of God the death both of bodie and soule Therefore by the homilie Christ tooke on him for vs the iust wrath and indignation of God the death of the bodie and soule Your trade of iugling will but shame you if you can shift hands no cleanlier then here you doe Your first and second propositions here cited out of the Booke of Homilies are so curtayled by you that they seeme nothing lesse then that they are in their right places The writer of the Homilies hauing taught
redeeming Captiues is either to free Prisoner for Prisoner or to take money for the ransome of libertie neither of which tooke place in our redemption and therefore the common custome of redeeming of men taken in warre hath no likenesse with the redeeming of the world since God tooke no money for our ransome as men vse to do for their Prisoners but the life of his only Sonne for the libertie of his rebellious seruants which men vse not to doe Neither did Christ offer a price proportioned to our value or abilitie but farre excelling our persons and exceeding our power It was therefore a very colde comparison to resemble the freeing of mens bodies for golde and siluer which Captaines esteeme more than they doe Prisoners to the redeeming of their soules by the precious bloud of Christ and such as S. Peter reiected before me in euident words Yee were not redeemed with corruptible things as siluer and golde but with the precious bloud of Christ as of a lambe vndefiled and vnspotted And for you or any man els to say that Christ suffered no lesse nor none other than we should haue suffered or payed no more than we should haue payd is to subiect the soule of Christ to our deserued confusion and condemnation and to euen our persons who are wretched and sinfull men with his who is the true and eternall sonne of God either of which is a sensible defacing of his dignitie innocencie and obedience wholly requisit to our redemption and vtterly impossible to our condition You seeme to inferre that I forsooth doe holde with your opinion that Christ payed the price of our redemption properly to the diuell and not to God If you should leaue belying and falsifying of other mens speeches you should leaue one of your chiefest defences For when you can take no aduantage of my words you sticke not to straine them to your bâ—…nt and as though mistaking and wresting were not wrongs enough you inlarge them and interlace them not only with things neuer intended by me but with plaine contrarieties to that which is conteined in my words To shew how full and perfect our redemption is by the bloud of Christ in my sermons I say The bloud of Christ doth redeeme cleanse wash iustifie and sanctifie the elect it doth pacifie and propitiate the Iudge it doth seale the couenant of mercie grace and glorie betwixt God and man it doth conclude and binde the diuell And lest any man should mistake that I sayd The price was so sufficient that it did not onely pacifie and propitiate the Iudge but conclude and binde the diuell that otherwise had a challenge to vs as to the seruants of sinne and corruption I added It was an iniurie to Christ for vs to thinke his bloud was shed to satisfie the diuell but Christ offered his bloud as a sacrifice to God his Father to satisfie the iustice of God prouoked with our sinnes and yet Satans extreme rage against the person of Christ in conspiring and compassing his death with all contumelie and crueltie turned to his vtter ruine God raising againe the Lord Iesus from death and giuing him power to spoile the kingdome of the diuell in recompence of the wrong which he receiued at Satans hand Thus was the bloud of Christ a price most sufficient for all the world the voluntarie offering whereof by Christ himselfe was the sacrifice that appeased the wrath satisfied the iustice and purchased the fauour of God towards vs and the wrongfull spilling whereof which Christ with patience endured did exclude the diuell euen by Gods iustice from all the challenge that otherwise he had vnto vs. Doth this make the pâ—…ce of our redemption which was the bloud of Christ to be payed properly to the diuell and not to God or rather cleane contrarie that this price was willingly offered and so properly payed to God for the satisfaction of his iustice and by no meanes yeelded or payed to satisfie the diuell but the iniurious shedding thereof by the procurement of Satan did iustly discharge all the members of Christ from the power and challenge of the diuell who afore possessed them by the rule of Gods iustice And to this sense I did restraine the words of Ambrose to make him accord with the rest of the Fathers who with one voice confesse that God would not vse power alone but euen iustice to the diuell in taking man out of his hand and therefore ordered the price of our redemption in such sort that it should not only fully satisfie and pacifie his owne wrath by a willing and precious oblation but iustly exclude all the power and possession of darknesse from the elect by Satans malitious and contumelious attempt against the person of the Sonne of God Neither is this doctrine so strange as you would make it but only to those that neuer waded farther then the mire of their owne inuentions Irenaeus that ancient Father vrgeth this as a râ—…ason why Christ must be man as well as God that the diuell might be conquered by iustice Christ therefore sayth he coupled and vnited man to God Si â—…nim homo non viâ—…isset inimicum hominis non iuste victus esset inimicus For if a man had not vanquished the enemie of man the enemie had not beene iustly vanquished So Theodoret When the Creator saw our nature of it selfe to ioyne with that cruell Tyrant the diuell and to fall into the deepe pit of wickednesse he wrought our saluation wisely and iusâ—…ly For neither would â—…e vse his POVVER alone to free vs nor arme his MERCIE alone against him that had 〈◊〉 mans 〈◊〉 vnder serâ—…itude leâ—…t he should exclaime of this mercâ—… as vâ—…iust but God tâ—…oke a 〈◊〉 with clemencie and adorned with iustice The effect whereof for the whose discourse is somewhat long we may perceiue by the words which Theodoret ascribeth to the person of Christ for thus hee maketh Christ to speake to the diuell Because thou who receiuedst power against sinners 〈◊〉 touched my bodie that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of no sinne forfeit thy power and cease thy tyrannie I 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 all 〈◊〉 from death 〈◊〉 simply vsing the power of a Lord but a righteous power I 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 death I haue suffered death and not subiâ—…ct to death I did admit 〈◊〉 No way guiltâ—…e I was reckened with the guiltie and being free from debt I was numbred 〈◊〉 Sustaining therefore an vniust death I dissolue the death that is deserued and imprisoned wrongfully I free them from prison that were iustly detained And lest you should say of him as you doe of Ambrose and Austen that he doth but play with the figure â—…e â—…airely preuenteth that idle shift of yours in these words Let no man thinke that herein wee dallie or trifle for by the sacred Gospels and doctrines of the Apostles we are taught that these things are so Leo likewise not once or twice publikely teacheth
that doctrine to the people The iust and mercifull God did not so vse the iniurie of his will those are his words that to restore vs hee would only shew the power of his clemenâ—…ie but because it was a consequent that man committing sinne should be the seruant of sinne God so fitted the medicine to the sicke the pardon to the guiltie and redâ—…mption to the captures that the iust sentence of condemnation should be dissolued by tâ—…e iust worke of the 〈◊〉 For if only the Godhead should haue opposed it selfe for vs sinners not so much reason as power should conquer the diuell The Sonne of God therefore admitted wicked hands to be layed on him and what the rage of the persecutors offered with patient power he suffered This was that great mysterie of godlinesse that Christ was euer loaden with iniuries which if he should haue repelled with open power and manifest vertue he should haue exercised onely his diuine strength but not regarded our cause that were men For in all things which the madnesse of the people and Priests did reprochfully and 〈◊〉 vnto him our sinnes were wiped away and our offences purged The diuell himselfe did not vnderstand that his crueltie against Christ should ouerthrow his owne kingdome WHO SHOVLD NOT LOOSE THE RIGHT OF HIS FIRST FRAVD IF HE COVLD ABSTAINE FROM THE LORDS BLOVD But greedie with malice to hurt whiles he rusheâ—…h on Christ himselfe falleth whiles he taketh he is taken and persuing him that was mortall he lighted on him that was the Sauiour of the world Iesus Christ being lifted vp on the tree returned death vpon the Authour of death and strangled all the principalities and powers that were against him by obiecting his flesh that was possible giuing place in himselfe to the presumption of our ancient enemie who raging against mans nature that was subiect vnto him durst there exact his debt where he could finde no signe of sinne Therefore the generall and mortall hand-writing by which we were solde was torne and the contract of our captiuitie came into the power of the Redeemer The person of the Sonne tookâ—… vpon him properly the reparation of mankinde that whose maker he was he might be their restorer so directing his counsell to effect that to destroy the kingdome of the diuell he rather vsed the righteousnesse of reason then the power of his might For whiles the diuell raged on him whom he held by no law of sinne he lost the right of his wicked dominion I repeat the more to let the Reader see that the Fathers in this case doe not play with figures as this Discourser dreameth but they consonantly propose and vrge with earnest and euident words a great point of Christian pietie Gregorie teacheth the same lesson When Satan tooke Christes bodie to crucifie it he lost Christes elect from the right of his power And by Gods speech to Satan concerning Iob Beholde he is in thine hand but saue his life hee thus declaâ—…eth Gods Commission to Satan touching Christ Tâ—…ke thou power against his bodie and lose the right of thy wicked dominion ouer his â—…lect Damascene also noteth that one respect why Christ was made man was to stoppe the diuels murmuring if God should haue taken man out of his hands by the power of his Deitie Christ was made man sayth he that that which was conquered might conquer God was not vnable who is able to doe all things by his almightie power and force to take man from the Tyrant that helâ—… him but that would haue beene a cause of complaint to the Tyrant that had conquered man if he were forced by God Therefore God who pitied and loued vs willing to make man that was fallen the conqueror of Satan became man restoring the like by the like that is man by man And in this sayth Damascene appeareth Gods iustice that man being ouerthrowen he would haue none other besides man to conquer the Tyrant neither would he by violence take man from death but whom death had of old brought into bondâ—…ge by sinne eâ—…en him would the gracious and righteous God make conquer againe What reason then haue you to reuell at Saint Augustine and Saint Ambrose in such sort as you doe that their names are of no waitht to warrant such a Doctrine as those words of theirs pretend Or what teach they different from the rest of the Fathers if their words be rightly taken and not wrested aside to your crooked conceiâ—…s That the bloud of Christ was so sufficient a price for vs that not onely the voluntarie sacrificing thereof throughly satisfied the displeased Iustice of God and obtained remission of all our sinnes but eâ—…en the wrongfull shedding thereof by Satans instigation wrought the subuersion of Satans power and right in all the â—…lect God by the rule of Iustice giuing vnto Christs manhoode the spoyle of Satans kingdome â—…or the patience which Christ shewed whiles Satan by the mouthes and hands of the wicked spoyled Christs humane nature of honor and life for the time what danger is there in this to the Christian Faith or what repugnancie to the sacred Scriptures THEREFORE VVILL I giue him his part in many things â—…aith God of Christs manhoode and he shall deuide THE SPOYLE of the mightie or with the mightie because he powred forth his Soule vnto death this the Apostle shâ—…weth was executed against the Diuels them selues Christ SPOYLED Principalities and Powers and made a shew of thâ—…m openly triumphing ouer them in his owne Person According as God threatned the Serpent vpon his first deceauing the woman I will put enmitie betweene thy seâ—…de and her seâ—…de he shall bruize thine head and thou shalt bruize his heele Where God expresseth plainly the Recompence that the seed of the woman should haue for suffering Satan to bruize his heâ—…le euen the bruizing of the Serpents head For nothing is more equall with God then to remâ—…ate the same measure to men and Angels that they mâ—…te to others It was therefore a thing most iust in the sight of God as he subiected Man to Satans power when by sinne he first conquered Man so he subiected Satan to the will and power of Christs manhoode when by righteousnesse Christ conquered the diuell And as Christ patiently endured to be wrongfully depriued of his life by the meanes and members of Satan so in requitall of that presumption and iniurie Christ powerfully and iustly depâ—…ed Satan of all his â—…ight and interest to the Elect for whose sakes Christ gaue his life This excludeth not the voluntarie seruice and sacrifice of Christs obedience vnto death wherewith the Iustice of God was satisfied and appeased but this sheweth that as God had chiefe regard of his owne Iustice and mercie towards man in giuing his owne Sonne to be the pacification of his wrath and propitiation of our sinnes so he dealt iustly with the diuell in causing the
spoyler to be spoyled and for the wrongfull and spitefull inuasion that Satan made against his Lord and Master to loose all the Dominion and power that otherwise he claymed ouer Christs elect And so the Price of our Redemption whatsoeuer you trifle to the contrarie did not onely discharge the guilt of our sinnes and our debt to Gods iustice by Christs willing obedience to God euen vnto death but the furious and iniurious intermedling of Satan therewith so closeth his mouth that he seeth and knoweth our deliuerance and his destruction to be iust I am out of doubt that the Fathers doe but play with figures or if they meane indeede to teach such a Doctrine we are to learne by their good leaues how to speake and thinke more wholesomely then they doe out of the Scriptures Whether they play with figures or no I referre it to the Iudgement of indifferent Readers that will take the paines to peruse the places It is a good signe they speake in earnest when they double it and treble it in their open Sermons and writings and render the causes thereof pithâ—…ly and plentifully as Theodoret and Leo doe and chiefly Saint Austen in foure whole Chapters of his Booke de Trinitate whose learning and iudgement though you set light by because they sort not with your fansies I confesse I reuerence for that the whole Church of Christ hath done the same before me and I see nothing in the word of God repugnant to their Doctrine truely conceaued But you haue learned to speake more wholsomely as you thinke out of the Scriptures I pray you then let vs heare your wholesome speech I vrge that the enemie must haue a price for his Captiue I pray who is that enemie which must be satisfied the Diuell God forbid Gods Iustice onely is that offended Enemie to whom our Ransome was paid the Diuell was but Gods slaâ—…e and Executioner There is no man for ought that I know which saith the Diuell must be satisfied it is your partiall humor that leadeth you so to surmise my Sermons professe it were an Iniurie to Christ for vs to thinke his bloud was shed to satisfie the Diuell but the enemie to Christs elect which is the diuell and not God must be conquered and spoyled though not satisfied And that as S. Austen rightly obserueth God would haue done first by Iustice and then by power Because the Diuell by his peruersenesse was a desirer of power and a forsaker and impugner of Iustice and men did so much the more imitate him how much the more neglecting or hating Iustice they did studie to be mightie and were either inflamed with the getting or delighted with the hauing thereof It pleased God that for the taking of Man out of the diuels power the diuell should not be conquered by power but by Iustice and so men imitating Christ should seeke to ouercome the diuell by Iustice and not with power By him that dyed and was so mightie to vs that were mortall and altogether weake both Iustice was commended and power promised Of these twaine the one Christ performed dying the other rising For what is more iust then to come willingly to the death of the Crosse for righteousnesse And what is more mightie then to rise from the dead and ascend vp to heauen with the same flesh which was slaine First then by righteousnesse and after by power Christ Conquered the diuell It is no hard matter to perceaue the diuell to be conquered by power when Christ who was slaine by the diuell rose againe that is harder and deeper to be vnderstoode that the diuell was conquered when he seemed to himselfe to be the Conquerer to wit when Christ was slaine For then Christs bloud because it was his that had no sinne was shed for the remission of our sinnes that whom the diuell iustly detained and tied to the condition of death as guiltie of sinne those he might iustly loose through Christ whom being guiltie of no sinne he vniustly put to death With this Iustice was the Diuell vanquished and with this bond was the strong man bound that his things should be taken from him which were with him the vessels of wrath and bee turned to vessels of mercie And after proofe made out of the Scriptures that we are translated from the power of darknesse and of the diuell to the kingdome of God and of his beloued in whoâ—… we haue Redemption for remission of sinnes then follow the words which you so highly chalenge In this Redemption the bloud of Christ was giuen for vs as a Price QVO ACCEPTO which being taken that is wrongfully pursued and vsurped as the diuels manner is to take things which are not his and not willingly offered or lawfully receaued as God did accept the same at the hands of his Sonne the diuell was not enriched but fast tyed that we should be loosed from his bands The bloud of Christ patiently shed vnto death was the Price of our Redemption by the witnesse of the whole Scriptures which Christ obediently and voluntarily offered to his Fathers will for the full remission of our sinnes and our perfect reconciliation with God This bloud could not be iustly shed by any because it was innocent and holy They must therefore be iniust and wicked that should shed the righteous bloud of that vndefiled Lamb. Wherefore the secrete counsell and iustice of God deliuered Christ being thereto willing into the hands of sinners and permitted him to the power of darknesse with all reproch shame and torture to take his life from him This obedience and patience of the Redeemer in suffering the rage and violence of Satan and his members God so highly accepted and recompenced that not onely his wrath was appeased and our sinnes remitted but all power in heauen and earth as well ouer Satan as ouer all his kingdome was giuen vnto the manhood of Christ to take from the power and feare of the diuell whom Christ would and to adiudge that cruâ—…ll and bloudie tyrant with all his adherents to euerlasting destruction For though the Diuine nature of Christ in that hee was the Sonne of God were a rightfull and powerfull Lord ouer Satan and his whole kingdome sinne death and hell not excepted to dispose thereof at his pleasure yet the humane nature of Christ had of it selfe no such right or prerogatiue in respect it was a creature and so lower and weaker then the condition of Angels sauing for the personall vnion thereof with the Godhead of Christ. And therefore as the wisedome of God thought it no match nor honour for the diuine Maiestie of Christ to spoyle the diuell that was but a base and vile seruant in comparison of his Almightie power so the iustice of God would not aduance the manhood of Christ to the heigth of his kingdom to rule all things in heauen earth and hell till hee had humbled himselfe to the death of
a true and corporall punishment appointed by God for sinne though mans error inflict it on innocents or true repentance abolish the rest that would follow after this life if God were not reconciled vnto vs. In the wicked then which persist in their mischieuous purposes without repentance your reason taketh place that hanging to them is a part of that true and terrible curse the whole whereof shall be executed on them for their sinnes but in repentants it is starke false and in Christ of whom this question riseth it is irreligious and impious to say that he suffered the whole curse of the Law prouided for sinne or the death of the soule and of the damned which is properly due to sinners Now vnderstand Chrysostome thus as we before haue distinguished the punishment of Christ and of the damned and then we differ not Suppose Chrysostome to teach falsly and talke absurdly as you doe and then you may soone bring him to weare your badge but leaue him at libertie to tell his owne tale and hee is farre enough from your follies He sayth they were dâ—…erse curses in Christ and in the damned to signifie diuerse manners of one and the same curse in Nature He speaketh not of the damned at all he speaketh of the whole people of the Iewes which were vnder the curse of the Law for sinne till they were thence deliuered by Christ which the damned neuer were nor shall be His words are The people were in danger of another curse which saith Cursed is euery one which abideth not in the things written in the booke of the Law For not one of them had obserued the whole Law Christ then since he was not subiect to the curse of transgression admitted this curse to hang on the Crosse in steede of that to loose the people from their curse Chrysostome truely learnedly and consonantly to the rest of the ancient Fathers distinguisheth two kindes of EVILS or CVRSES incident to men which are sinne and the punishment of sinne The one is an vniust action pleasing man but displeasing God the other is a iust passion pleasing God but displeasing man Mala dicuntur Delicta Supplicia The OFFENCE and the REVENGE are both called â—…uils sayth Tertullian Duo sunt genera malorum peccatum poena peccati there are two sorts of Euils sayth Austen Sinne and the punishment of sinne For by Gods prouidence ruling all things as man doth the euill which he will so he suffereth the Euill which he will not Then sinne is not onely euill before it be punished but a greater euill then the punishment is since it is an euill in his owne nature repugnant to the righteousnesse of God Now as God is all good and therefore all blessed so sinne forsaking God falleth from goodnesse and so from blessednesse and is consequently more accursed with God then punishment is and ought so to be with men if they be rightly aduised as being the cause and continuance of their punishment For accursed signifieth as well detested and depriued of blessednesse as subiected to miserie or deuoted to destruction So that sinne in it selfe is a curse with God that is hated and detested of God and depriuing man of all communion and participation with the fountaine of blessednesse though no punishment did follow Yet because men would with neglect and despâ—…ght of God abide and reioyce in their wickednesse if sense of grieâ—…e and paine did not force them to feele theiâ—… wretchednesse therefore the wisedome and iustice of God pursueth such as dwell and delight in their sinnes with sharpe and bitteâ—… plagues that locâ—…ing on their miserie they may timely repent or eternally lament their obstinacie To these two kinds of curses Chrysostomes wordes and proofes doe leade The whole people were not damned as you deuoutly dâ—…eame but they had sinned and so were subiected to the danger of Gods displeasure foâ—… sinne and of his indignation against sinne From this Christ was free for he did not sinne 〈◊〉 was guile found in his mâ—…uth as Chrysostom concludeth out of the Scriptures Since then Christ was not subiect to the curse of Transgression he admitted â—…other Curse euâ—…n the punishment of sinne which is a curse also for sinne though of an other Nature then the committing of sinne by one to dissolue the otheâ—… that is by his owne paine to abolish the guilt of our sinne Chrysostomes woâ—…ds are as plâ—…ne as his proofes The curse of transgressing was another curse and not the 〈◊〉 which Christ suffered Yea Christ might not be subiected to that curse to which the people were for transgressing the law but changed that for another and so loosâ—…d their curse 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 another and not the same be as forciâ—…le woâ—…ds to shew different natures and persons as any the Greeke tongue hath and your shift of diâ—…erse degrees in the same nature is a childish toy since much and little like and vnlike sâ—…ew diuers degrees or measures in one nature but another and not the same thing directly noteth the substance or nature to be diuers Austen on whom you triumph is stretched beyond his meaning he deaâ—…eth against a Mainichâ—…e who denied that Christ had true human flesh Now he proueth that Christ truely died because the Apostle saith he was made a curse for vs in that he hanged on a Tree I haue cause to content my selfe that so leaâ—…ned and religious a Father as Saint Augustine was so highly reuerenced in the Church of God did more then twelue hundred yeers since in his conflicts with Hereticks refute the greatest part of your positions as repugnant to the faith of Christ and the soundnesse of the Sacred Scriptures And I thinke few men so foolish as in the grounds of our Redemption and saluation by Christ to reiect the Doctrine which he taught as false and receaue your scambling conceits as true And in my Iudgement you were best to take heed least if the resolutions which Saint Austen and other Catholike Fathers made against Heretickes disprooue your new found faith you be taken tardy with bringing Baggage into the Church of Christ long since condemned and banished from the Creede of all Christians What Saint Austen proueth you are no fit reporter except you did read more attentiuely and iudge more sincerely For did you euer peruse the words wrong course in so wise a Father if he meant purposely to prooue against the Manichees that Christ truely died for vs and not in shew onely as they supposed to ouerskip all the Testimonies and circumstances of Christs true death recorded in the Scriptures as his giuing vp the Ghost Pilates examining and the Centurions confessing the truth thereof as also the Souldiers perceiuing him alreadie dead and so not breaking his lâ—…gges but pearcing his side with a speare and the* gazing and watching of his â—…nemies and of the whole multitude ouer him
which he so much denieth The death of the body which the godly doe suffer is to this day an euill of it selfe and the punishment of sinne but God of his mercie towards his hath giuen such grace not to death but to their faith that by suffering death patiently they shal be the more plentifully rewarded But as no wise man will say the Law is euill when the wicked abuse it to kindle their lusts so may no sober man say that the death of the faithfull is good in it selfe though by Gods goodnesse it bee made to them a triall of their patience and a passage to a better life You say the nature of death is changed and not to the faithfull any longer an euill or part of the punishment and curse which was laide oâ—… sinne S. Austen saith the contrarie It is still an euill as it was and the nature thereof is not changed though the vse thereof be changed by faith and the consequents altered by Gods goodnesse Now things must bee esteemed by their nature and not by their vse as Austen teacheth For euill men vse good things euilly yet that maketh not good to bee euill because their vse is inuerted and euen so saith Austen good men haue a good vse of death which is euill yet that maketh not the death which they suffer to be good in it selfe or in nature to bee such as by Gods fauour it is to them When the death therefore of the faithfull is said by Saint Austen or any others to be good they meane the vse and not the nature thereof and when they say it is euill or a curse they meane the nature and not the vse For touching the nature thereof the Apostle who must be heard saith fully and resolutely Death is an enemie that must be destroyed euen in the godly And touching the vse thereof the same Apostle saith To mee Christ is life and to die is gaine Against this you neither doe nor can bring ought besides waste words and places either not vnderstood of you or wrested by you as spoken of the nature of death when they meane the vse of death which the faithfull haue by Gods abundant blessing Your selfe doe say The vengeance of the Law once executed on the suertie can no more in Gods iustice be executed on vs. In the vengeance of the law is comprised corporall spirituall and eternall death The whole Christ neither did nor could taste and bee a Sauiour A part he therefore tasted which was the death of his body and thereby freed vs from the rest which was due to our sinnes From the death of the body he hath not as yet wholly deliuered vs but hee will and in the meane time hee hath broken the linckes of death whereby those three were coupled together first in his owne person who suffered the first kinde of death and neither of the other and by vertue thereof hath done the like in all his Saints leauing their bodies for a season vnto death as his was that he may raise them after with greater power and glorie then if they had neuer died What doeth this hinder but death may truely bee called a Curse as in Christ so in his members and though execution of vengeance be restrained from vs yet imitation of Christ is not excluded neither is the generall sentence pronounced against the sinne of all mankinde To dust thou shalt returne reuoked but by the resurrection from the dead how then was it vengeance on Christ if it were due to mans nature Death was due to mans nature for sinne and consequently not due to Christ that had not sinned When therefore it was laide on him that deserued it not it must be taken as the wages of our sinne in his person and so was a wound to him though a medicine to vs because hee was wounded for our transgressions and wee were healed by his stripes Our publike doctrine in England set foorth by Master Nowel confirmeth as much To the faithfull death is now not a destruction but a changing of life and a very sure and short passage to heauen Euery thing that is licensed or liked as profitable to bee publikely read or taught is not by and by authorised in all things nor made the publike doctrine of this Realme You would faine oppose Master Nowel to Saint Austen who if hee were liuing would giue you no thanks therefore Saint Austens Faith hath beene allowed and receiued by all Synods and Councels since his time and by the whole Church of Christ as fit to guide and leade not onely learners but makers of Catechismes and therefore the match if they were repugnant is somewhat vnequall but indeede you haue neede to bee taught how to vnderstand your Catechisme That death is a destruction to the godly can you tell who saith so except it bee your selfe That it is a changing of life and short passage to heauen if you meane to the soules of the faithfull as the Caâ—…echisme doth no man doubteth thereof if you meane to their bodies that they by death change life and so haue a short passage to heauen it is a notable falsitie and heresie gainsaying the verie grounds of the Christian faith For priuation of sense and corruption to dust is no life much lesse an heauen except you will multiplie heauens as you do helles without reason or trueth It is most true which the Catechisine intendeth that death is this to the souls of the faithful but not to their bodies as yet till the generall day of resurrection and then the destruction of death in their bodies shall bring them to the full possession of heauenly glory prouided both for soule and bodie till that time their bodies lie vnder the dominion or power of death which is not yet destroied in euery part of vs because of sinne dwelling in our bodies though it throughly be conquered in the person of Christ and shall be likewise in vs at his appointed time As little to the purpose is that which you cite next out of the Catechisme that Death which before was a punishment is now become a vantage For he meaneth that death before had nothing in it nor after it but punishment and so was wholly and onely punishment which now by Christ is altered and made an aduantage to vs as well in respect of the manifold miseries and offences of this life from which we are deliuered as in regard of the felicitie and securitie which the soules of the Saints decâ—…ased enioy but this is nothing to their bodies which lie depriued of life and corrupted to dust till the finall restitution Neither is this a comparison with our condition before sinne in which we were created when soule and bodie should iointly haue beene translated to the kingdome of heauen without any sense or touch of death if we had stood fast in obedience but this noteth what death is after sinne committed without Christ and rightly saith that when
and yet none of them maketh Christ sinfull hatefull or defiled which is your vncleane doctrine We affirme sayth Austen that Christ had no sinne neither in soule nor flâ—…sh and yet in taking flesh after the likenâ—…sse of sinfull flesh by sinne he condemned sinne Which being somewhat obscurâ—…ly spoken by the Apostle may be two wayes opened either because the similitudes of things vse to be called by the names of the things themselues and in that respect the Apostle would call the similitude of sinfull flesh Sinne or els because the sacrifices for sinnes in the Law were called sinnes all which were the figures of Christs flesh the true and only sacrifice for sinne A third way is that the punishment of sinne is after a sort called sinne as being a consequent to sinne which S. Austen before testified and in that respect as well mortalitie as all other miseries and infirmitâ—…s that inuaded mans nature for sinne may be called sinne that is the effects of sinne The wrongfull and shamefull death of Christ Chrysostome Theodoret Theophylact and others take to be the punishment of our sinnes in the flesh of Christ and in that regard they thinke Christ was made sinne that is punished as a sinner though he were innocent and righteous Him that was righteousnesse it selfe God made sinne that is he suffered him to be condemned as a sinner and to die as one accursed for accursed was he that hung on a tree Christ sayth Theodoret when he had fulfilled all righteousnesse and not admitted any blemish of sinne and yet as a sinner sustained the death of sinners he reproued the iniustice of sinne that deliuered his bodie to death no way deseruing it and dissolued both sinne and death Theophylact as his maner is followeth Chrysostome almost word for word The Sonne who knew no sinne and was righteousnesse it selfe the Father made to die for vs as if he had beene a sinner and malefactour S. Austen ioyneth with them Christ had the similitude of sinfull flesh because his flesh was mortall sinâ—… vllo omnino peccato but vtterly without any sinne that by sinne for similitude he might condemne the sinne that is in our flesh through true iniquitie True iniquitie in Christ there was none mortalitie there was Peccatum non suscepit sed poenam peccati suscepit Suscipiendâ—… sinâ—… culpâ—… poenam poenam saâ—…it culpam Christ tooke not our sinne vnto him he tooke the punishment of our sinne And taking the punishment without any fault he healed both the punishment and the fault I leaue the Reader to his choise which of these he will embrace or whether he will conioyne them all together for the one impugneth not the other they all impugne the Defenders false collections and lewd surmises out of these places that Christ when he is called sinne is intended by the Scriptures to be defiled with our sinnes and hatefull to God and accursed of him for our sinnes which the Church of Christ did neuer endure to heare Master Caluin warily enough sayth Vt personam nostram suscepit peccator erat maledictionis reus As Christ tooke vpon him our person he was a 〈◊〉 and guiltie of the curse I had rather you had commended Master Caluins wisdome to ioyne with the whole Church of God in giuing Christ his due then his warinesse in going a by-way without all the learned and Catholike fathers to hemme Christ within the guilt of our sinne and curse Master Caluin truely I honour for his great gifts and paines in the Church of God but I may not take him for the first founder of Christian religion and therefore where he dissenteth from the worthie Pillers of Christs Church in matters of Doctrine I dissent from him And I more commend his warinesse elsewhere and thinke it fit that when his speech soundeth somewhat hard or offensiue to the Godly it should be expounded by other places of his writings least you make him in so waightie points as these are very inconstant or very inconsiderate This therefore which you bring I interpret by none other then himselfe vsing the very same words of the very same matter in his Commentaries vpon the very next Epistle of Saint Paul before this which you quote You shall haue it in Latine because you shall see how he qualifieth these very words which you would presse to your aduantage PERSONAM nostram QVODAMMODO suscepit vt reus nostro nomine fieret tanquam peccator iudicaretur non proprijs sed alienis delictis quum purus foret ipse immunis ab omni culpa paenamque sâ—…biret nobis non sibi debitam Christ tooke vnto him our Person AFTER A SORT that he might be accused or Iudged in our Name and condemned as it were for a Sinner not for any of his owne offences but other mens since he himselfe was pure and FREE FROM ALL FAVLT or guilt and suffered the punishment due to vs not to him Take these mitigations from Master Caluins owne mouth and then your labour is lost in putting his words to the Racke and these are farre truer then your whirlegigges set running by the businesse of your Braine Christ was AFTER A SORT A SINNER Saith Caluine that is Christ presented the Persons and procured the cause of vs â—…at were sinners and was guiltie that is accused condemned or punished in our steedes Reâ—… doth not alwaies import an offender if you know what Latine meaneth it noteth one â—…uius res agitur whose cause is handled or brought into Iudgement whether he be guiltie or innocent And when it goeth farder then iudiciall inquisition it may be applied either to the fault which is conuinced or to the Iudgement which is decreed or to the punishment which is deserued or appointed And so the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in Greeke which the new Testament vseth for guiltie or worthie of or subiected to punishment is as much as fast held either by the Crime committed or by the sentence pronounced or by the punishment prepared and assured Thus you see Caluins words limited by himselfe make nothing for you and howsoeuer you rack the word Reus you may not thereby bring Christ to be defiled or hatefull with our sinnes except mercie humilitie and charitie by your learning defile the Sonne of God and make him hatefull to his Father Euen as by Gods true and reall imputation not by any iâ—…hesion we now in this life are iust holy and blamelesse before God so was he sinfull and defiled by Imputation not inherently This is neither the Apostles speech nor sense it is your soone-come and soone-gone gathering from the Apostles words The one is the cause of the other but the one is not in all points proportioned to the other God made him Sinne for vs that we might be made the righteousnesse of God in him Thus speaketh the Apostle Omit Christs Sacrifice for sinne whereby our sinnes were pardoned and
neuer waded any farder vnlesse in one or two new writers that fit your fansie It doth approue likewise and appoint Erasmus Paâ—…aphrase to lâ—…e openly in the Church for euery man that doubteth of any thing in the nâ—…we Testament to reade for his instruction and yet you will not take euery word in Erasmus Paraphrase for the publike Doctrine of the Church of England For so you should â—…oone exclude the most of your new conceits But what saith the Catechisme that Christ was bound to suffer for vs or did endure the same damnation which we dâ—…serued It sayth that Christ was our Suretie The Catechisme goeth not so farre but sayth God dealt cum Christo quasi sponsore with Christ as it were with a Suretie Christ then did voluntarily assume some similitude but not the strict and exact condition of a Suretie euen by the tenor of the words which you cite though you guilefully translate them as if Christ had beene our Suretie It is one thing to hold Christ was our Suretie and ioyntly bound with vs by law to pay our debts which is your errour and another thing to say Christ was as it were a Suretie or did of his owne accord discharge our debts for vs. The Catechisme in this very section precisely noteth that he was not bound as Sureties be but of his owne will suffered for vs the cruell and wicked rage of the Iewes in putting him to death Haec quidem illi in eum crudeliter malitiose atâ—… impiè perpetrarant verum ipâ—…e sua sâ—…onte ac volens haec omnia perpeâ—…s atâ—… perfunctus est These things before described the Iewes did cruelly malitioâ—…ly and impiouâ—… against him but he OF HIS OVVNE ACCORD and good will not bound suffered all these things And before he commeth to your words he sayth but it iâ—… not vnusuall amongst men that one should vndertake and suffer for another By which he doth not meane that by right or law one man may be bound to suffer or die for another but by liking or loue men are sometimes thereto led Otherwise the law both of God man is directly against all such suffering Sancimus ibiesse poenaÌ„ 〈◊〉 est Peccata suos teneant authores nec vlterius progrediatur metus quam reperiaâ—…r delicium We appoint say the Emperours Arcadius and Honorius that punishment shall be there where the fault is Let offences binde their committers and let no feare of punishment extend farther than to such as be guiltie of the crime Gods law doth ratifie the same The wickednesse of the wicked shall be vpon himselfe The sonne shall not beare the 〈◊〉 of the father neither shall the father beare the iniquitie of the sonne but the same soule that sinneth shall die Wherefore the Catechisme if he vnderstood what he said as I truely thinke he right-well did could not deriue Christes bodily sufferings from any band or Suertiship allowed amongst men by Law but onely from Christes loue and will which is aboue all law by which indeed he humbled and emptied himselfe to the death of the crosse for our sakes when there was neither law nor band to compell him to it Also Cyprians words are plaine and can not beare any other sense than I make of them that Christ was a verie Suretie for his people and suffered such a forsaking of God touching sense of paine and want of present feeling of comfort in his paines as the damned doe I did well to say you neither vnderstood nor liked the meaning of Cyprian for where there is nothing in Cyprians words that bolstereth your error you haue made such a construction of them or rather such a contradiction to them that few men besides you could deuise the like For by them you bring the person of the Sonne of God in his humane nature that was alwayes full of grace and trueth To haue no MORE SENSE NOR COMFORT OF GOD for the time THAN THE DAMNED HAVE From which pâ—…stilent position though you kisse your hand in it I wish all the godly to blesse themselues But let vs first see on which words of Cyprian you graffe this golden fruit and then how true it is and agreâ—…able to the faith Your foundation â—…s because Cyprian sayth of Christ Thou diddest shew anxietates illius querimoniae verba esse dilâ—…ctorum tuorum quorum personam causam assumpseras the pensiuenesse of that complaint My God my God why hast thou forsaken me to be the words of thy beloued whose person and cause thou hadst assumed What is this to your purpose or how doth this patronize your violent and wicked assertion The dolors of Christs complaint on the Crosse that he was forsaken were the words of his beloued that is Christ spake those words in the name and behalfe of his Elect that they were forsaken of God not of his owne person as Austen saith of the same That was the voice of Christes members not of the head And Leo Sub redemptorum suorum voce clamabat Christ cried those words vnder the voice of his Redeemed Now this being Cypâ—…ans plaine speech that those were the words of his Elect finding themselues for their sinnes worthie to be forsaken of God how come you to turne Christ into his beloued that is the head into the members and his beloued into the damned and then to conclude of Christ that he had no more sense nor comfort of God in his paines than the damned haue Such another leape will easily bring you and your followers from faith to infidelity and if you take not heed the sooner from the number of the Elect to the rancke of the Reprobate which take so light occasion to draw Christ into the same desperation for the time with the damned Cypriâ—…ns words you say can not beare any other sense It is not enough for you shamefully to peruert Cyprians words but you must proudly proclaime in print that they can haue none other sense than you list to like of when his speech expresly doth import the contrarie If you had auouched so much of Christes words we would desire no better interpreter then Cyprian who saith those were the wordes of Christs beloued and so that forsaking had no direct application to Christes person but a mercifull relation to his members who might often inwardly feele that they were forsaken of Gods fauor and assistance for the time though not as the damned are MEE you thinke in Christes words must signifie his person and not his members But Cyprian is expresly opposite to you in that point and saith MEE there is as much as MY BELOVED or chosen members And for this exposition Cyprian hath the manifest precedence of the sacred Scriptures in which Christ often speaketh of his members as of himselfe by the verie same words Saul Saul why persecutest thou mee that is my members whom I loue and esteeme as my selfe and this is no cauilling euasion the Iudge at the last
So that in all his Infirmities affections Temptations and afflictions he was still free from sinne which may be the Apostles mâ—…aning in the laâ—…r place to note that how diuâ—…rs soeuer Christs Temptations were yet he was tempâ—…d in all things without sinne Then all such feares and sorrowes as hâ—…ue in them any doubt or distrust of Gods fauour aud Christs Saluation are vtterly excluded from him by the Apostles owne limitations and therefore you loose but your labour by pretence of these words to bring Christ within the compasse of your 〈◊〉 feares and sorrowes a Defenc pag. 86. 〈◊〉 2â—… Hereto â—…erueth our publike Doctrine Diram execrationem in se suscepit You handle the 〈◊〉 as you doe the Scriptures and Fathers turning them from their right What Christ 〈◊〉 for 〈◊〉 sense to serue your priuate Doctrines Christ vndertook our curse saith the Caâ—…isme what then Christ vndertooke all our sinnes and all the punishment due vnto them not to 〈◊〉 it in the same kinde but to dissolue it in his Person and to discharge vs of it Yea he vndertooke our reiection confusion and damnation to satisfie them not to beare them to clâ—… them not to beare them So that hence you may conclude a Satisfaction and dissolution made by Christ of all these things that were due to vs but you may not inferre that he was vtterly reiected inwardly confounded or eternally condemned as we should haue beene and the damned are Againe he tooke vpon him the Satisfaction and recompence of all our sinnes and paines But where Saint Peterâ—…aith Christ bare our sinnes in his Body on the Tree and Saint Paul saith b 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 2. Christ 〈◊〉 things in 〈◊〉 and things in heauen by the bloud of his Crâ—… and reconâ—… c 〈◊〉 2. vs in the Body of his flesh Christ vndertooke then to abolish our curse and condâ—…tion but in the Body of his flesh where he reconciled vs vnto God So that you must bring 〈◊〉 words out of the Catechisme before your Doctrine will 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 drawen And by your leaue I take the Catechisme permitted to be taught in Schooles but not Authorized for the publike Doctrine of this Realme Neither are you the Man that so much respect authoritie farre more publike then this where it sorteth not with your fansies But here you haue caught a word or two that may be misused and that is the cause the Catechisme is so much magnified by your priuate Authoritie as to be the publike Doctrine of this Realme Which I speake not to disgrace the Booke but to make difference betwixt your verdict and the Iudgement of the whole Realme d Defenc. pag. 87. li. 7. You might haue giuen a good sense of my words if you had any mind 〈◊〉 as of those generall and large words of the Scripture whereupon I grounded my selfe It is more then time we should yeelde such a ghest as you are the same submission and reuerence that we giue to the Sacred Scriptures specially when you abuse the words of the holy Ghost to your priuate vnsound conceits In the word of God I am bound to looke to the meaning of the Writer who could not erre and therefore howsoeuer the words if they were another mans might be reiected yet in the Scriptures they are to be receaued with all Religion because he endited them that is â—…e Spirit of truth and he hath a found and euident Doctrine in them though we vnderstand it not And therefore we must seeke to other places of like sense or more light that we may learne the meaning of the holy Ghost Expect you the like dâ—…tie when you deâ—…iue your sullaine and vnsauorie fansies by false and loose consequents from the words of holy write as if you were not bound to beware how you abuse the Scriptures but we must looke on and hold our peaces whiles you peruert the words of the Prophets and Apostles at your pleasure You made a number of false Propositions and Conclusions without all waâ—…ant of the word of God as e Trea pa. 46. li. 10. Thus doe the members of Christ suffer therefore of nâ—… 〈◊〉 Christ our head suffered the like yea farre greater terrors of God and assaults of the diuell And so you Reason f Ibid 〈◊〉 32. pag. 47. li. 1. which can not be refuted by the witte of Man 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 vs not but wherein he had experience of our Temptations but he succoureth 〈◊〉 in these 〈◊〉 Temptations of feeling the sorrowes of hell Therefore he himselfe haâ—… experience of the sâ—…me Where to shew your witte you ioyne an affirmatiue conclusion â—…o a negatiue maior and in defiance of all truth and reason you make this childish and ignorant manner of reasoning to be irrefutable And so your pleasant Electuaâ—… that g Trea pag. 45 li. 33. of all absurditiâ—…s this is the greatest that meere men should suffer more deepely and more bitterly the sorrowes and paines of hell then Christ did All these you build vpon this foundation Christ was h Heb. 4. Tempted in all things after alikenâ—…sse but without sinne noâ—… that â—…he â—…is any such intention or direction in the Apostles words but that you will makâ—… such a Construction of them and no man must say nay To let you see your folly and 〈◊〉 iu this point I i Coâ—…lus pa. 283. shewed you many corporall paines and sorrowes and likewise many spirituall which Christ neuer felt as touching the causes and obiects of those afflictions though I did not exempt him from the generall sense of those affections In the Body of Man I named blindnesse dumbnesse lamenesse sicknesse breaking of bones burning of fire and such like which Christ neuer suffered and yâ—…t in all these he can and doth succour others In the Soule I reckned blindnesse and hardnesse of hart vnbeliefe desperation frensie and vexation with diuels all which Christ hath often cured and healed and readily can though he were neuer plunged into these as men are Wherefore your maine and immooueable Collection out of the Apostle as you dreame that Christ succoureth vs not but wherein he had experience of the same was a blind and false inâ—…sion of yours vtterly mistaking the Apostles words and meaning To this what reply you k Defenc. pag. 87. li. 18. The Apostle and 〈◊〉 both doe speake of the sufferings of mankind in generall and of each part of nature apt to suffer but not of euery particular in each of them or which each meeteth withall You are where you would be when you and the Apostle goe hand in hand as you make your selfe beleeue though you come nothing neere the Apostles speech oâ—… sense Then since it sufficeth for the truth of the Apostles words that Christ felt feare sorrow shame paine and death which are common to all men and there was no neede that Christ should haue all the same causes of feare sorrow shâ—…me and paine which euery man hath or may
your vntuned and hie strained cratchets That Christ must and did breake the knot betwixt death and hell which otherwise were fast clasped together and by receauing the one in his owne person did free all his members from the other is no question neither with me nor I thinke with any Christian man The iust vengeance deserued and prepared for sinne which was temporall and eternall death the Redeemer must throughly know least he should ransome vs he could not tell from what Wherefore not your new found hell but the wages of our sinne which was eternall death vsually called hell in the Scriptures might not be hidde from the eâ—…es of Christ but euen the iust and full reward of our iniquities was to be presented to the sight and spirit of the Redeemer that in the presence of God he might behold the waight of our sinne the greatnesse and iustnesse of Gods anger against it and accordingly conceaue how deare the price and how sharpe the paine must be that should quitte vs from this debt and yet how pretious his person and infinite his obedience was that by one death should excuse vs from the other Whether these things were reuealed and shewed to Christ by sight as the terrors and torments of hell might be or by vision or in spirit I dare not pronounce I meddle not so farre with Gods secrets God hath waies enough to propose the Iudgemets of the next world to men here liuing when and how pleaseth him but of none of these might Christ be ignorant least we make him a Sauiour at peraduentures as not knowing all things that directly belonged to his office and sacrifice and to the causes effects of our Redemption That therfore Christ must haue a perfect knowledge and liuely sight and view of all these things pertaining to the waight and burden of mans deliuerance chiefly now when he appeared in Gods iudgement where nothing is couered to performe the fame I may safely grant but that he felt or suffered eternall death or the paines of the damned or the full wages of our sinnes this you shall neuer prooue how much soeuer you presume with licentious but irreligious words to couer it and conuey it into the Creed of Christians k Defenc. pag. 103. li. 29. He did not contemplate and looke on them a farre of nor had to do with one more then the other but by suffering one he felt both and by enduring one he endured both Your speaches are false absurd and impious howsoeuer you will qualifie them when you come to the point with the substances but not with the circumstances of eternall death and damnation First shew that the Scripture teacheth any such thing of Christ The Defender forgeth apace new parts of the Christian faith as that he suffered the second death or the paines of the damned Next that your deuice of this new second death which dureth but for a moment and proceedeth from Gods owne hand agreeth with the word of God And Thirdly that God did thus torment the soule of his sonne with his immediate hand either in the garden or on the crosse All these things are your owne dreames plainly plastered to the Christian faith with figures and phrases of your owne coining and yet you thinke you haue wrong if you be not suffered to change the whole Creede and outface the Scriptures with your idle fansies That Christ should and did suffer a bodily death on the crosse the Prophets did forshew the Euangelists doe witnesse and the Apostles doe confirme That he died the second death in the garden before the first or that this death came to him by fitts and dured but the turning of an hand and was inflicted on his soule by Gods immediate hand as the other death was on his body by the Iewes what Prophet what Euangelist what Apostle did euer teach or write And how hang your owne words with your owne conceits by suffering the one Christ felt both you say and by enduring the one he endured both Then in the Garden when as yet he suffered not the death of the body he felt not your second death and Gods immediate hand did cease if by the one which the Iewes inflicted he endured both If you fly to Christes fearing and apprehending the second death by the first then are you farre from his suffering and enduring it and this apprehension which was not erroneous in Christ as it is in you might offer him a feare of Gods power which is more infinite then the manhoode of Christ could comprehend and so might be terrible to him as it is to all the godly when they finde or feele Gods anger against sinne but it could breed no perswasion or distrust that God would destroy him for our sinnes since he perfectly knew God would saue vs by his sufferings l Defenc. pag. 104. li. Also you forget my argument that Christ alwayes charged his Disciples not to take their bodily death heauily for righteousnesse sake ergo he himselfe would neuer be so dismáyed with the feare of it As I did not professe in my conclusion to refute all your follies which were both trifling and tedious so if I had purposed any such thing I should haue skipped this as an argument rather of your ignorance and vanitie than of any force or veritie For first where did I defend in my Sermons that Christes bodilie death was the cause of this agonie recken my sixe causes on your fingers ends if your memorie be so fickle that refuting them you can not tell what they are and see whether Christes bodily death be any of them or no if it be none how doth this argument conclude any thing against me who shew so many things which might concurre in Christes feare besides his bodily death Wherefore your conclusion if it were good is no way preiudiciall to me nor beneficiall to your hell paines For though Christ feared somewhat els there is a large leape betweene somewhat els and the death of the damned But what was it that Christ willed his Disciples to feare Christ teacheth all his to feare Gods power as himselfe did in the garden Gods purpose meaning to condemne Christians to hell or his power that was able to destroy soule and bodie in hell Did Christ teach in these words a desperation of Gods fauour or submission vnder the mighty hand of God and a religious feare not to displease him To feare religiously not distrustfully Gods power since they were persuaded of Gods goodnesse whom Christ calleth his friends and so not to prouoke him considering the mightinesse of his arme is the summe of Christes doctrine in that place as God himselfe by the Prophet Esay taught all the faithfull saying m Esa. 8. Sanctifie the Lord of hosts and let him be your fearâ—… and let him be your dread A deepe impression of this feare commended to all the Elect whiles heere they liue Christ himselfe might haue and shew in the
patience whereby we might be assured that he felt his afflictions on the Crosse with quicker sense and greater paines then we are able with any patience to endure And is this all that now you would say that Christ found no ioy in his paines what Cow-keeper doth not know that paine is paine and not ioy but was Christes paine such that it excluded his soule from the remembrance or sense of all Gods graces so richly powred on him and promises so faithfully made vnto him you were best come in with your mooueable fittes of astonishment and tell vs that in one and the same sentence when Christ said My God my God he was in full and perfect assurance and assistance of Gods fauour whom els he could not call his God if he felt no comfort in him that is the God of all comfort and when he pronounced the next syllable why he presently fell into a sudden pangue where he was forsaken and left all comfortlesse and alone according to your deuices And if any man be so wise to let you lead him through such thornes as to graunt in Christ on the Crosse sometimes hope of glorie and sometimes feare of confusion sometimes comfort and suddainly distrust of his saluation sometimes Gods fauour and full assistance as in affliction and by and by the second death and the paines of the damned he may dally with faith and infidelity with heauen and hell with Christ and Beliall as you doe But if it were not possible for Christ crucified being the wisdome and power of God to be tossed and tumbled with such contrarie blasts then hath the forsaking which he complained of an other manner of sense then you imagine And whatsoeuer meaning you ascribe vnto it you may not with a word that admitteth diuers interpretations impugne the plaine and open wordes and deeds of our Sauiour in which is no question As when the high Priest asked him e Mar. 14. art thou Christ the sonne of the blessed Iesus said I am and ye shall see the sonne of man sit at the right hand of power and come in the cloudes of heauen And when the Theefe that was crucified with him said vnto him f Luc. 22. Lord remember me when thou comest into thy kingdome he answeared Verily I say vnto thee to day shalt thou be with me in Paradise As also breathing out his soule he said g Ibidem Father into thine hands I commend my spirit If to be the sonne of God and to sit at Gods right hand in glory if to dispose of Paradise at his pleasure and to commit his spirit into his Fathers hands be no signes nor proofes of comfort and ioy then let your exposition beare some shew but if these be more then arguments of most excellent honour and glory not onely reserued for him and confirmed vnto him but assumed and professed by him euen when he was condemned and crucified who that had any care of trueth or respect to reason would auouche that Christs h Defenc. pag. 108. li 9. godhead gaue him for that season of his passion no sense nor feeling of comfort and ioy neither in spirit soule nor body i Defenc. pag. 108. li. 16. This was that extreame humiliation and exinâ—…nition of nature wherein God spared not his sonne and wherein Christ spared not himselfe If you may sit iudge not only ouer Prophets and Apostles but ouer Christ himselfe you will soone appoint him to suffer what pleaseth you but when you come to make proofe thereof you betray the violence of your spirits that must haue all thinges giue way to your wills and the weakenesse of your iudgements that discerne not humility from infidelity nor religious patience from hellish astonishment k Philip. 2. Exinanition and humiliation the Apostle nameth in Christ but either voluntary and either in comparison of his diuine glory and maiesty wherein being equall with his father he tooke on him the forme of a seruant and Christ emptied himselfe of glory not of gracâ—… humbled himselfe becomming obedient to the death of the crosse The Apostle neither saith nor meaneth that Christ emptied himselfe of all grace or comfort in his whole humane nature but laid aside the vse and shew of his diuine power and honour whiles for loue to vs he performed the worke of our redemption in the shape of a seruant and became obedient vnto the death of the crosse which was painefull and shamefull but not astonished with the paines of the damned nor subiected to the second death This is your yarne which you would faine weaue into the Apostles words but truth and falshood haue no fellowship no more haue your dreames and the Apostles doctrine As much it maketh for you that God spared not his owne sonne but gaue him for vs all whence you may as well conclude that God adiudged his sonne to euerlasting destruction and damnation for that were indeed not to spare him as that he inflicted on him the true paines of hell least he should seeme to spare him The Apostles wordes expound themselues God spared not his sonne but gaue him for vs This giuing him into the hands of sinners for our sakes was Gods not sparing him otherwise that God spared him in nothing which either his power was able to impose or our sinnes did deserue this is doctrine for him that meaneth to be an Apostata from all faith and trueth to set the father at as great enmity with his sonne as our sinnes did deserue or could prouoke The higth of Christs not sparing himselfe was as the Apostle teacheth his obedience vnto the death of the Crosse if you will haue Christs obedience stretch to the second death of the damned you must get you some new Scriptures these that are already written witnesse no such thing How beâ—…t you will lacke no Scripture For rather then you will acknowledge your want in that behalfe you will make euery Chapter throughout the Bible to speake of your dreames For euen * 〈◊〉 pag. 〈◊〉 heere you quote Deutero 10 17 and Luc 16 17 in the first of which places the Scripture saith l Deut. 10. 17. The Lord your God is God of Gods and Lord of Lords a great God mightie and terrible which accepteth no persons nor taketh rewards What is this to Christes sufferings or to the paines of the damned was it after noone or after midnight when you quoted these places you knew not why nor wherefore So play you with Luc 16 17. where it is said m Luc. 16. 17. It is more easie that heauen and earth should passe away then that one tittle of the Law should fall Will you hence inferre which is the thing that you should prooue ergo Christ was forsaken of all outward and inward comfort and ioy besides you no man hath the grace to make such faire and cleare demonstrations of your doctrine n Defenc pag. 108. li. 21. This forsaking or
when I came I should haue SOROVV of them of whom I should haue ioy When the rest of the seruants saw what the euill seruant that was pardoned of his master the great debt of 10000 talents did to his fellow that ought him an hundred pence n Matth 18. vers â—…1 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 they were very sory And when Christ sayd to his Disciples One of you shall betray me o Matth. 26. vers 22. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 they were exceeding sorowfull and bâ—…ganne euery onâ—… to say Master is it I As also when â—…e tolde them of his departure and their troubles he added p â—…ohn 16. Because I haue spoken these things vnto you 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 sorow hath filled your hearts And generally thorowout the New Testament 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 doeth no where signifiâ—… actuall and absolute paâ—…ne but griefe and sorow of minde And therefore your wresting of our Sauiours words with a false translation in saying My soule is full of paines intending thereby the paines of the damned inflicted by Gods immediaâ—…e hand is a false and lewd corruption q Defenc pag. 116. li. 34. Here we will remember againe what is taught by authoritie in England The rather for that you take on as a man impatient because I doe affirme that our doctrine not yours hath the publiâ—…e authoritie for it You call it an egregiouâ—… lie an insolent and impudent speach well becomming â—…n alchouse c. and yet in the very next page in plaine termes you graunt the same to be taught in our hâ—…milie of Christs Passion The way to mend a lie is not to double it and â—…riple it but to see your error that you may acknowledge the trueth Iâ—… I had then cauâ—…e to dislike the egregious lie which I iustly challenged I haue now more whâ—…n to saue your â—…elfe from some impudencie you â—…hew more then stupidity You would needes in your treatise amongst other vntrueths auouch that your doctrine 〈◊〉 the r Treatis pa. 89 li. 13. publike authorised doctrine of England deliuered in the booke of homilies I told you then which yet is true that this as well as others was an insolent and impudent speach You aske s Defenc. 〈◊〉 â—…7 〈◊〉 30. who is that egregious lier now t Defenc. 〈◊〉 â—…7 〈◊〉 35. you hope you are cleare from it Euen he that was before and you are cleare from it as Iudas was from betraying Christ by â—…aying is it I master to cleare your selfe you now say your exposition of those words My God my God why host thou forsaken me is found in the booke of Homilies and that I my selfe in plaine wordes confesse so much Then are you the verier lyer to say this is your doctrine which I impugned or that our maine question was about the exposition of those words Christs complaint on the crosse I sayd did not prooâ—…e your hell-paines nor the second death to be suffered in Christs soule which way soeuer you expounded it so you followed any example of Scripture vsing that word To reprobation or desperation if your conscience did thereto stretch you might applie this word by some examples of Scriptures but not to reall and actuall damnation no not in the most wicked castawayes that â—…uer were The sundry senses which I gaue out oâ—… the Fathers shew the wâ—…aknesse of your illation from those words they directly touch not the maine point of doctrine questioned betwixt vs and amongst theâ—…e senses this was one which the booke of Homilies seemeth to follow The direct cause of Christs feare sorrow and bloodie sweate since the Scripture concealed it I sayd could not be certainly concluded thence what is that to Christes complaint on the crosse whose words though they may be extended to expresse his paines yâ—…t your doctrine is no whit the truer for all that nor the more confirmed by the lawes of this Realme So that the lie by your leaue doth lye where it did only you haue furnished the former lie with two or three fresher and as your vse is you correct matters amisse by making them worse then they were u Defenc. pag. 117. li. 6. Here I am sure you thinke not that our Homilie maketh Christes pietie or pitie nor yet his meere bodily paine to force him thus farre Nor in these words next following there O that mankind sâ—…ould put the euerlasting sonne of God in such paines for the grieuousnesse of our sinnes Are you sure what I thinke well fare your wisedome yet that when you should prooue your doctrine to be receaued and authorized by the publike lawes of this Realme you are sure I am of your mind This is not onely a childish fainting but foolish dallying to cleere your selfe from a notorious lie by assuring your selâ—…e what I thinke If you will needes know what I thinke first it is euident to him that readeth these homiliâ—…s that the whole summâ—… and meane of our redemption being theâ—…e purposely deliuered neither of these homilies speaketh one word of your hell-paines nor of the second death to be suffered in the soule of Christ. Againe it is as euident that the suffering of a shamefull and painfull death in Christs body is there taught to be the only sacrifice for our sinnes The wordes are x 1. Sermon of the Passion pa. 5. There is none other thing that can be named vnder heauen to saue our soules but this only worke of Christs pretious offering of his body on the Altar of the Crosse. What paines Christ suffered on the Crosse whether the paines of the damned or of his body bruised and broken on the Crosse the booke it selfe doth plainly witnesse c Christ being the sonne of God and y 2. Serâ—…on of the Passion pa. 9. perfect God himsâ—…lfe who neuer committed sinne was compelled to come downe from heauen and to giue his BODY TO BE BRVISED AND BROKEN ON THE CROSSE for our sinnes Was not this a manifest token of Gods great wrath and displeasure towards sin that he could be pacisied by none other meanes but ONLIE BY THE SWEET AND PRETIOVS BLOVD of his deare sonne If you teach this that the bruising and breaking of Christs body on the Crosse and the shedding of his pretious bloud was the ONLIE MEANE to pacifie Gods wrath against sinne then I did you wrong to call your speach impudent but if this be the new doctrine which I defend and you impugne then doe you deserue not only the termes which I gaue but worse so openly and obstinately to resist deface and belie publicke authority z Defenc. pag. 117. li. 12. Adde herâ—…unto the full and large declaration hereof in the authorised Catechisme Christ suffâ—…red not only a common death in the sight of men but also was throughly touched with the horror of eternall death c. When he did take vpon him and beare both the guiltines and iust paine of mankind damned and lost he was afflicted with
so grieuous feare trouble and sorow of mind or soule that he cried out My God my God why hast thou forsaken me I make good difference betwixt the Booke of Homilies confirmed as well by the publicke authority of Prince and Parliament Anno Reginae 13. ca 12 as by the generall subscription of the vpper and neather house in the conuocation Anno 1571 to a In the 35. article of Homilies containe godlie wholesome and necessarie doctrine and the Catechisme then licenced to be taught in Schooles to yong scholers but without any such autoritie as the former is Shew the like approbation and you shall freely call it the publike autorized doctrine of England till you doe so giue me leaue to tell you that the one is indeede by publicke authority receaued and ratified euen as the articles are the other was by priuate discretion permitted and tolerated to be taught in Grammar schooles but publicke authority of the whole Realme you may chalenge none vnto it And therefore I take my selfe in matters of faith not bound vnto it farder then it accordeth with the manifest trueth deliuered in the â—…acred Scriptures Againe your selfe doâ—… more impugne the Catechisme then I doe For if your owne wordes be true that Christ when he vttered those b Defenc. pag. 110. li. 28. 34. words spake in his mind of his constant and continuall ioy in God and was in exceeding generall and constant ioy What place leaue you for any of those wordes which you cite out of the Catechisme to haue any trueth in them since they speake of exceeding and horrible feares and sorrows which I thinke are contrarie to your triumphant generall and constant ioy And although I thinke it no reason that a thing priuatly permitted should abrogate the full and maine consent of the learned and auntient Fathers as you would haue it to doe and therefore make it free when the Carechisme swatueth from their sense and interpretation to be of another mind yet I condemne nothing in it as wicked but wish that soâ—…e few places had been more cleerly and more particularlâ—…e deliuered and expressed to auoid such cauillers as you and some others are But you with open mouth reiâ—…ct euen those places which now you produce as passing strange doctrine and simply impossible For where the Catechisme here in these words which you alleage saith Christ was Aeternae mortis horrore perfusus perfused or wholy touched with an horror which is a trembling feare of eternall death you not only reason against it that c Defenc. pag. 9â—… li. 13. Christ could not feare that which he perfectly knew concerned him not at all and by no meanes could euer possibly come neere him but you make it d li. 12. passing strange doctrine and simply impossible that Christ should feare or pray against the whole and intire cup of eternall death And yet the Catechisme saith he trembled and was ouercast with the horror of it You misâ—…ike that the Catechisme saith except you may peruert it to your pleasure and in steed of fearing eternall death you say Christ suffered the second death which is die death of the damned and so refusing the Catechisme for saying so much you say more and thinke the Catechisme is of your mind But sir tell vs how Christ could be stroken with the HORROR OF ETERNALL DEATH for those aâ—…e the wordes of the Catechisme and not how he suffered your new made hell which the Catechisme neuer speaketh of I haue deliuered two senses to salue the Catechisme which you impugne The first that Christ in respect of his members to whom that death was due might in loue and pietie towards them inwardly tremble at the punishment deserued by them since mercie maketh vs truely feele the very smart of other mens harmes and dangers and where we hartily loue no lesse then if they were imminent ouer our owne heads The second that Christ fearing the power of Gods wrath against sinne which is infinite may in a sort be sayd to tremble at the effects thereof by reason he trembled at the cause thereof And in this sense the consideration and apprehension of Gods infinite power and displeasure against sinne might brâ—…ede those horrible feares and sorrowes which the Catcchisme talketh of Otherwise I must be plaine the Catechisme sayth more then can be prooued by any Scripture or any learned and auncient Father and more then you your selfe allow or like saue that you would out of his vehement speaches make some aduantage to your cause though in substance you wholy dissent from the maker thereof For he speaketh of feare and sorrow you of re 〈◊〉 al solute suffering he of eternall death due to sin you of a new found hell from the immediate hand of God which is no part of the Catcchisers meaning since he plainely nameth future and euerlasting death due to sinners and not a present and temporall hell which is not the full wages of sinne nor of the damned The like I say for the notes added by the Printer or correctour to the great Bible whose text is authorized to be read in the Church but not the notes to be of equall credit or authoritie with the text And if you may turne of the whole aâ—…ay of auncient and Catholike Fathers because they diflent from your conceits how much lesse am I bound to correctours or Printers adding often times to other mens workes and labours what pleaseth themselues Though the note be not such but that it may receiue the former construction and be tolerated welâ—… enough Wherefore I meane euen the same giddy spirit which before I did buzzing in the eares of the people his owne fancies against the Scriptures against the Fathers and against the doctrine of this Realme confirmed by publike authoritie of Prince and Parliament The recollecting of your former reason so lately and largely answered I omit as tedious trifling and since you say no more then is before refuted what should I trouble my selfe and the Reader with repeating the same things so often iterated e Defenc pag. 118. li. 10. You haue yet heere and there some exceptions against this our doctrine which are not to be cleane neglected First you say I extend Christs agonie to farre because I will haue is proceede from the intolerable sorrowes and horrors of Gods siery wrath equall to â—…ell I shew not there the cause of Christs agonie and feare I shewed it of purpose in the beginning Why did you not refuse that You extend it so farre according to my wordes yea your maine purpose is to make that the cause of Christs agonie in the garden and on the crosse onely you would vse some cunning in the carriage of it first to make sorrowes and feares the cause thereof and at the next step to aske what sorrowes and feares could those be but the intolerable sorowes and horrors of Gods fierie wrath equall to hell And to this end you quote both the
indeed reueale some reall tast of his heauenly ioies to his children euen in this life I haue already shewed but am not answeared You slide from some blessed men to all the children of God to whom you affirme God doth reueale indeed some reall tast of his heauenly ioies euen in this life What you meane by a reall tast we must learne from your owne mouth by such doubtfull phrases which you may after wrangle about you vse to deliuer your doctrine If you meane ioy in the holy Ghost whiles by hope we expect the promises of God at his determined time that indeed is common to all the children of God in their measure but that teacheth a maine difference betwixt the things heere enioined and reserued for vs in heauen and quite crosseth the new heauen which you would establish For we learne by the Scriptures that our z Coloss. 3. Life is hid in Christ and when Christ who is our life shall appeare then shall we also appeare with him in glory a 1 Iohn 3. Now we are the sonnes of God but yet it doth not appeare what we shal be and we know that when he shall appeare we shal be like him for we shall see him as he is Our knowledge loue and ioy of God and in God beginne heere by the preaching of the Gospell and the working of his spirit but the Scripture neuer calleth those the ioies of ueauen though they shall there continue yet so augmented and accompanied with heauenly brightnesse and glory that they shall not be the same they were For as our naturall vnderstanding and sense and corporall life and flesh shall not be abolished in heauen but abide and be glorified and yet no man is so senselesse as to thinke or say the glory of our creation is the glory of our resurrection so our knowledge loue and ioy which heere are weake and wanting all perfection as being mixed with ignorance and error lust and vnlawfull desires feare and griefe and often obscured and almost ouerwhelmed with infirmity iniquity and misery no wise man will defend to be the ioies of Gods heauenly kingdome where is no want nor defect of any good nor feare nor doubt of any euill inward or outward but as God shall then be all in all so shall we be filled with the sight and fruition of God our loue and ioy increasing according to our knowledge which then shal be the manifest vision of God face to face who is the vnceasing and vnsearchable fountaine of all goodnesse and blessednesse The b Treatis pa. 80 proofe on which you stand as yet not answered is a place of the Apostle to the Corinths applied by many men to the preaching of the Gospel then it maketh nothing for your purpose but if it be referred to the ioyes of heauen as you would haue it it maketh quite against you For c 1. Cor. 2. eye hath not seene saith the Apostle neither eare hath heard neither hath mans heart conceaued the things which God hath prepared for them that loue him If those be the ioyes of heauen which the Apostle there meaneth then is it euident that men are not capable of them whiles they are compassed with sinne and infirmitie but God hath reserued them in the heauens for vs when we shall come to his presence though in the meane time d 1. 2. he hath reuealed to vs by his spirit that such things are kept in store for vs which then shall appeare that is be apparently and perfectly bestowed on vs and we euerlastingly inuested with them The Reuelation which the Apostle here speaketh of is the reuelation of knowledge whereby these things are promised and assured vnto vs not the reuelation of glory whereby we shall see that which we now hope for and enioy that which we now expect This doctrine howsoeuer you would delude it with your reall tasts is plainely deliuered in the Scriptures When Moses besought God to shew him his glory God answered e Exod. 33. ver 20. Thou CANST NOT SEE my face and liue for there shall no man see mee and liue Where God doth not meane that men shall not see him in heauen when they come to be f Matth. 22. as the Angels of God who g Mat. 18. v. 10. alwayes behold the face of God in heauen his owne sonne hath sayd h Matt 5. blessed are the pure in heart for they shall see God and his Apostle likewise i 2. Cor. 13. Now we see through a glasse darkely then shall we see face to face But he meaneth that no man liuing in this mortall flesh can see his face Otherwise it is the cleere resolution of the Scriptures that we k 1. Iohn 3. shall see him as he is that is not by faith as now we doe nor by some created shew of his glory as Moses Elias Esai and other the Prophets and Patriarkes did see him for the confirmation of their callings or consolation of their miseries but as the Apostle speaketh face to face Vpon these words of S. Iohn we shall see him as he is S. Austen learnedly and truely sayth l August in 〈◊〉 Iohan. Tract 101. Ista visio non est huius vitae sed futurae non temporalis sed aeterna Hunc totius laboris sui fructum Ecclesia nunc parturit desiderando tunc paritura cernendo This vision of God as he is is not in this life but in the life to come not temporall but eternall This fruite of her whole labour the Church now trauelleth with by desiring it but then shall attaine by beholding it Now if the sight of God himselfe face to face that is of his substance and glory in plaine full and perfect manner and measure be the same with the darke and enigmaticall beholding his graces and promises by the glasse of faith then haue you some reason to say the ioyes of heauen may be had in this life but if in the manner measure obiects and effects of our sight of God in this life and the next there be so great difference then you deceiue both your selfe and your Reader to affirme we haue the ioyes of heauen heere in this life when not onely our sinne our ignorance our miserie mutabilitie and mortalitie but euen our faith and hope do clearely prooue that we haue not that which we desire nor as yet enioy that which we expect and beleeue wee shall haue m August epist. 112. Non corda munda suae substantiae contemplatione fraudauit cum haec magna summa merces Deum colentibus diligentibus promittatur dicente ipso Domino quando corporalibus oculis visibiliter apparebat inuisibilem se contuenaū mundis cordibus promittebat qui diligit me diligitur a Patre meo ego diligam eum ostendā meipsum illi God hath not defrauded cleane harts of the sight of his substance since that is promised to those which serue
not worth thankes except he suffered in hell amongst the diuels where indeede are the paines of the damned which you haue lately deriued to the earth vpon your authoritie shall this impietie also goe for good religion because the more Christ suffered for vs the more we are and ought to be beholding vnto him we shall doe well to thinke that we can neuer giue thankes sufficient for the least of his mercies and not take vpon vs to determine what recompence God must exact of his sonne for our sinnes except he will be vniust which is a most pestilent presumption and intrusion vpon the secret counsels and iudgements of God but rather learne to lament our owne vnworthinesse and wickednesse and not delight or dwell in sinne which God so hated and abhorred that nothing could appease his wrath against our vncleannesse but onely the death and bloud of his owne Sonne i Defenc. pag. 128. li. 2. Remember your owne wordes out of Austen that there is in some men INSIPIENS HONORIFICENTIA a fond intent of honoring Christ. If there be any such surely this is one point thereof which you maintaine You applie Fathers as you doe Scriptures and call S. Austen foole as well as all the rest of the learned and auncient pillars of Christs Church because they reject your hellish confusion by which you ouerwhelme all the powers of Christs soule and senses of his bodie rather then you will yeeld him vnderstanding and remembrance in his prayers S. Austen saith indeed of the Manichees that were loath to confesse Christ truely died a bodily death on the crosse for feare of bringing him within the curse of a corporall death since the death of mans bodie first proceeded from Gods curse against sinne and therefore defended that Christ seemed there to die in outward shew but indeede did not die on the crosse S. Austen I say affirmeth that they with a foolish pretence of honour vnto Christ denied the loue of Christ towards vs and the trueth of Christ who professed that he should and would lay downe his life a ransome for many What is this to the paines of the damned or to the death of the soule of which S. Austen saith k August epist. 99. who dare auouch it and yet ment not so foolishly to honour Christ as thereby to denie or impugne the trueth of Christian religion l Defenc. pag. 128. li. 5. Master Caluine a worthy minister of Christ and a pillar of the Church is bold and saith we confesse indeede such is the basenesse and follie of Christes crosse that proude men cannot away with it If master Caluine meane as the Apostle doth that the heathen not knowing the wisedome power of God in the crosse of Christ counted it meere folâ—…y for him that was God to become man and in the bodie of his flesh to endure so vile and shamefull a death I account him no Christian that is not of that mind with master Caluine but if he call them all proud that did not like his new deuice of Christs suffering hell on the crosse which you haue stretched and drawen to many degrees and points aboue master Caluine then let him looke whether it be pride to beleeue the plaine and faire doctrine of trueth deliuered in the Scriptures as all the Fathers of Christes Church did or for men to adde thereunto their owne deuices as you and some others haue done For my part as I loue and honour master Caluines name and like well his resolutions where he contented himselfe in the grounds of doctrine and discipline to ioyne with the auncient and primatiue Church of Christ so when he leaueth them vpon some liking of his priuate deuices I must leaue him I so honour him that I will not for loue to him dishonour all antiquitie as if Christ had neuer any Church nor faithfull or learned minister therein before master Caluine And were it worth the while I could easily shew many great and maine differences betwixt master Caluines conceit of hell suffered in the soule of Christ and yours but because it hath occasioned and hatched your amplified error of an other hell from the immediate hand of God I will not trouble my selfe nor the Reader with sifting or censuring that which I am not bound to beleeue no more then I am yours till it be proued by more substantiall grounds then master Caluins good liking of it m Defenc. pag. 128. li. 10. In another place where I shewed from the more to the lesse how Christ might haue for the sodaine the powers of his mind astonished and yet no decay in him of faith nor obedience nor patience Like as there is not in a man a sleepe or amazed with a blow on the head hereupon you aske me scoffingly was Christ a sleepe or in a swoune Your answere was indeed drawen from the lesse to the more that is from the lesser vanity and falsity to the greater and therefore my question which you call a skoffe was a sound refutation of such ignorant misapplying of things impertinent vncoherent For what if a man in his sleepe or in a swoune retaine habituall faith obedience and patience doth that prooue that Christ awaked and well aduised might pray he knew not what and yet haue actuall faith obedience and patience If a man should babble in his sleepe or grone in a swoune before he recouer sense or vnderstanding would you cal that faith or praier though the habite of faith were then in him no more doth that example prooue any actuall faith obedience or patience in Christ at the time of his often and earnest praiers in the garden if all that while you make him all confounded in all the powers of his soule and so astonished that he could not or did not remember his Fathers oft reuealed and oft repeated will nor his owne person nor office who came vnto this houre of purpose to performe his Fathers will And therefore you must get you some better patterns for the vse and acts of faith obedience and patience in Christes astonishment then sleeping or swouning or els ech Christian Reader will soone perceaue you to be worse then a sleep when you dreame of a n Defenc pag. 128. li. 26. farre greater astonishment in Christ at the time of praiers then is to be seâ—…ne in any man els that euer was or shall be And yet you defend there might be actuall faith obedience and patience in Christ because men in sleep or in a swoune retaine the habits or gifts of those vertues o Defenc. pag. 128. li. 21. As you grant that amazednesse and astonishment commeth naturally from sorowes and feares so I thinke in Christ both the one and the other was in the extreamest and most violent degree that might be Then must you also thinke that Christ had not the free vse of speach memory and vnderstanding nor of sense nor motion for the time that he was in that amazednesse For it
lachrymas modo oculis sed sanguinis guttas è corpore exprimit seria deuota oratio vt in trepidatione Christi est cernere Serious deuote praier doth not onely draw teares from the eyes but a bloudie sweate from the bodie as we see in Christes Agonie And surely the writer of the Epistle to the Hebrewes must either not collect this from the Scripture but report it besides the Scripture which is somewhat dangerous os else by the sweate of Christes face trickling downe to the ground he collected that in that in entiue and vehement prayer teares ran downe as fast as sweate and ioyntly with sweate and other sound gathering it from the Scriptures there is none And this collection if you graunt that the Apostle from the vehemencie of Christs prayer obserued the cause of the one to be the cause of the other since it was not possible the face should runne with sweate through the feruencie of prayer and not the eyes with teares then graunt you that it may soundly be gathered from the Scriptures that zeale of prayer and not heate of paine was the cause of Christs bloudy sweate z Defenc. pag. 132. li. 34. The Apostle in all reason may be vnderstoode to haue respect to all the woefull times and cries of our Sauiour as on the crosse and in the 12. of Iohn There is no reason to extend the Apostles wordes to Christs praier in the 12. of Iohn for there the Scripture doth not mention either strong cries or teares which are the Apostles words On the crosse he vsed a loud voice but teares he shed none neither was the sense of his prayer there to be freed from death but rather to hasten his death to which he had now wholy submitted himself according to his Fathers will And therefore your stretching the Apostles wordes to all those times to make Christs agonie if you could tell how to continue on the crosse wanteth all reason His paine most increased on the crosse and his sorow rising thence could not decrease but neither his astonishment nor that which the Scripture calleth his agonie accompanied with his bloodie sweate continued on the crosse You thinke it vnreasonable to say that Christ on the crosse had persistance in ioy and beheld God alwayes fauourable and faithfull vnto him a Defenc. pag. 132. li. 38. without intermission or obscuration though his flesh in which sinne was condemned and his body where he bare our sinnes were subiected to most shamefull and cruell torments fâ—…om the hands of the wicked what vncoherence is there in those wordes or what disagreement from the Scriptures I saw the Lord alwayes before me said Dauid concerning Christ. For he is at my right hand that I should not be moued If this beholding of God were b Sermon pâ—… 116 li. 25. alwayes then was there no intermission if before his face then was there no obscuration These are my words which why you should dislike or how you can refute I doe not see You can touch nothing which you one way or other turne not out of his right course Firmenesse of faith and assurance of hope I giue vnto Christ on the Crosâ—…e and either of those bring with them inward ioy of mind how much soeuer our outward state be troubled or our flesh afflicted Neither are these such contraries as cannot stand together since they are both in diuers parts and for diuers respects S. Peter saith c 1. Peter 1. we reioyce in the faith of saluation though for a season wee are in heauinesse through manifold temptations S. Iames saith my d Iames 1. brethren count it an exceeding ioy when ye fall into diuers tentations S. Paul saith e Rom. 5. we reioyce vnder the hope of the glory of God neither so onely but also we reioyce in tribulation knowing that tribulation bringeth foorth pâ—…tience experience and hope which maketh not ashamed Then as it is no absurditie that the spirit should be readie and the flesh weake nor that the inward man should be renewed when the outward man perâ—…sheth no more is it any repugnancie that Christ should haue ioy in the holy Ghost and in hope when he found and felt exceeding affliction in his flesh and as the Apostle teacheth f Hebr. 12. for the ioy set before him endured the crosse and despised the shame thereof If then there be ioy in hope how could Christ want ioy if he wanted not hope and hope if you take from him you leaue him in despaire which is the losse of hope which whether you will adde to the rest of your vnsound faith I leaue it to your choice Notwithstanding your selfe in this very booke allow to Christ on the crosse and in his agonie by reason of the very same wordes which I cite page 116. not onely g Defenc. pag. 110. li. 28. 34. constant and continuall ioy in God but exceeding and generall ioy with which whether your hell and perpetuall extreme agonie as well on the Crosse as in the Garden may stand I referre it to the sober and wise Reader h Defenc. pag. 133. li. 3. 1. How vaine is this consequent how false are these sayings and contrarie to the Scripture in the circumstances that his astonishment must continue eighteene houres from his entering into the garden to the ending of his life the next day at three of the clocke afternoone Indeed it is most absurd and openly repugnant to the Scriptures and to all the circumstances thereof to defend that Christs agonie which you say was the cause of his astonishment or his astonishment which was the effect thereof continued on the Crosse and yet such is your error that you make Christs spirituall paines on the crosse to be greater then in the Garden and his astonishment to be lesse because you doe not find that on the crosse where his paine was present and most sharpe he prayed ought against the knowen will of God as you auouch he did in the Garden Your supposing and presuming without all warrant of holie Scripture that God with his immediate hand inflicted the paines of the damned on the soule of Christ i Defenc. pag. 133. li. 9. 10. sometimes more sometimes lesse and sometimes more suddainly then at other times and sometimes staying it and this variablenesse of Gods hand to be the true cause of Christs astonishment is a saucie senselesse and shifting imagination aggrauating easing and iterating Gods hand at your pleasure and yet such is the folly and fâ—…lshood of your doctrine that without this desperate deuice euery child would crie shame on you For where on the Crosse by your owne confession Christes meere spirituall paines most increased euen there his astonishment was none at all and though you teach it not possible for Christ not to sinke and k Treat pag. 54. li. 28. not to be confounded vnder the burden yet when he l Ibid. pag. 63. li. 15. came to
z Defenc. pag. 134. li. 33. Eternall continuance in hell paines is not of the essence or nature of hell tormâ—…nts So haue you said page 12. though page 53. as you often quote it there is no such thing but euen there also haue I shewed that this you say out of your owne braine the Scriptures affirme no such thing Secondly I answered you that the horror of the paines of the damnâ—…d did admit no ioy for in hell I hope there is no ioy Christ then by your owne doctrine hauing constant continual exceeding generall ioy was neither in the true paines nor in the true terrors of hell vnlesse in defence of your deuices you will now make your new heauen and your new hell to be all one For ioy in the holy Ghost you directly make to be the substance of heauenly bliâ—…ie Now if in Christ and all his members you put at one and the same time the true terrors of hell and the true ioy of the holy Ghost what misse you of mixing heauen and hell at one instant in Christ and all the faithfull A third replie I gaue in that very place to this obiection which you say I neither doe nor can answere and that was a Serm. pag. 135. li. 3. since it is no where witnessed in the Scriptures that Christ suffered the paines of hell why striue you to establish a meere conceit of men neither written nor spoken before our age All these are no answeres with you and only because you haue deuiced a new hell from the immediate hand of God with which you delude as your maner is all that the Scriptures speake of the paines of the damned But glory not in your deuice to inuent a new faith it is as much sinne as to renounce the true Christian faith which indeed is auncient and in substance as old as the Scriptures since they serue to testifie from the beginning Gods blessed will and promise of saluation vnto man through the death of Christ which God first named the Serpents biting the heele of the womans â—…eed b Defenc. pag. 135. li. After this you set vâ—…hemently against my last argument that Christ suffered not in some sort the death of the soule first if we should speake strictly after the manner of death in the bodie then no man is so mad or foolish as to say that any mans soule can die at all that is want life and sense as a dead bodie doth You be come now to the vpshot of all your defence and doctrin whether the Scriptures do any where teach that Christ died the death of the soule or the second death for our redmption and here shall we find nothing but an heape of words broched out of your braines and so tempered with your conceits that when you haue all said you say nothing with any substance or shew of holy Scripture You disclaime that the soule is at any time deuoide of life and sense as dead bodies are as if that were ought to your purpose but yet the death of the soule hath a resemblance and concordance with the death of the bodie as spirituall things may haue with corporall And therefore as the bodie being once dead wanteth all sense and motion which are the parts or effects of life from the soule quickning the bodie so the soule being dead to God who is her life hath no sense nor motion of Gods grace in this life nor sight nor hope of glory in the life to come but destitute of the one here on earth which is grace hath no desire nor feeling of God and in the next world depriued of all possibilitie of glory is subiected to eternall and intolerable miserie from the presence of God d Defenc. pag. 135. li. 24. Such a death as immortall soules are subiect vnto is Gods separation from them this is two fold the first death and the second death as the Scripture speaketh The first is the separation of them from Gods grace which is in this life by sinne raigning in them The soule loaden with sinne in this life is not vtterly dead so long as it retaineth any sense or motion of Gods grace So that sorow for sinne ioyned with any desire of true repentance is a plaine signe of life in the soule though sorrow for sinne without hope be plaine despaire and death of the soule And therefore the soule of man finding the danger of sinne and desiring to be deliuered from it yet liueth whiles she apprehendeth affecteth or seeketh the grace of God but if she want all sense of God by faith and motion to God by hope and desire she is wholy dead to God that is void of the life of God which is deriued from God vnto the soules of men As for the second death of the soule the Scriptures indeed speake thereof but you erre groslely in this second death the execution whereof alwayes followeth the first death as well of the bodie as of the soule though the guiltinesse and condemnation thereof by a mans owne conscience may be found heere in this life And therefore the second death by the open and euident wordes of the holy Ghost is called the d Reuel 20. lake of fire or the e 19. 21. lake burning with fire and brimstone which is not in this life And consequently your next collection that the second death is Gods leauing them in the feeling of the most sharpe and most vehement paines inflicted by Gods iustice for sinne is as false as it is defectiue not agreeing in one word with the tenor of the sacred Scriptures which you pretend to follow f Defenc. pag. 1â—…5 li. 30. This last kind of death is so called and named in many places of Scripture The second death is expresly named but in foure places of the Scripture The first g Reuel 2. v. 11 Be thou faithfull to death and I will giue thee the crowne of life He that ouercommeth the first death shall not be hurt of the second death The second h Reuel 20. v. 6 blessed and holy is he that hath part in first resurrection of the soule vnto the life of grace on such THE SECOND DEATH hath no power The third i Ibid. v. 14. Death and hell were cast into the lake of fire THIS IS THE SECOND DEATH The fourth k Reuel 21. v. 8 The fearefull vnbeleeuing the abominable and murderers and whoremongers and sorcerers and idolaters and all liers shall haue their part in the lake that burneth with fire and brimstone WHICH IS THE SECOND DEATH Saue in these places the second death is neuer expresly named in the Scriptures and in these most apparantly the second death followeth after the death of the bodie and is euerlasting And neither on Christ who is the first resurrection vnto grace and the second resurrection vnto glorie nor on any of his members hath the second death any power by the plaine words of Saint Iohn
death for which we must not pray But whosoeuer is borne of God sinneth not that sinne and so neither Christ who was the true Sonne of God nor any of his chosen who are the children of God by adoption can sinne that sinne nor die that death because he that is begotten of God liueth by God who is eternall life to all that know him and cleaue vnto him without separation If then the sinnes of the Elect be not vnto death but such as we in pietie may and in charitie must pray for consequently the death of the soule here meant by Saint Iohn is such as is not incident to any of the sonnes of God and so not the temporall hell which you communicate to Christ and his members Heere are your eight places of Scriptures proouing as you pretend the second death of the soule which you ascribe to Christ in euery one of which saue the first and second there can be no question but euerlasting damnation is intended and in those two the guiltinesse of eternall death which is due to sinne may be comprised in the name of death which the Apostle iustifieth when he sayth t Rom. 5. v. 12. The offence of one came on all men vnto condemnation which is in effect that he sayd before Death went ouer all men forasmuch as all men haue sinned But that any of these intend your temporall hell brought into this life not by snares and feares working on the soules of men but by substance and essence and not eternall death in hell fire with the Diuell and his Angels you nor all your adherents shall euer be able by any ground of holy Scripture to make it appeare And therefore your presuming it vpon the bare shew of places concluding no such thing is a pestilent intrusion vpon the word of God whiles you sticke not to couple your conceits which are false and erroneous with his vndoubted and vndefiled trueth x Defenc. pag. 135. li. 31. First ordinarily and commonly it belongeth only to the damned wherewithall are the ordinarie accidents and concomitants desperation induration vtter darknesse c. with perpetuitie of punishment and that locally in HELL Generally and truely the Scriptures neuer vse the name of the second death but for the lake burning with euerlasting fire into which the Diuell and all the Reprobate shall be cast and whatsoeuer you otherwise pretend is your owne absurd deuice without the Scriptures and against the Scriptures to keepe your doctrine from open derision and detestation And since your selfe acknowledge that this is the ordinarie and vsuall doctrine of the Scriptures it shal be needfull for your Reader to hold you to that till you fully proue your extraordinarie deuice by the same Scriptures by which the other is euidenly confirmed and so much openly confessed by you y Defenc. pag. 135. li. 36. In this sense the Fathers generally do take it where they denie that Christ suffered the death of the soule and so do we If your cause haue so little holde in the Scriptures it hath lesse in the Fathers who in the necessarie worke of our redemption thought it sacriledge to say any thing that was not apparently proued by the Scriptures And as you light not on a true word when you come to deliuer vs the mysteries of your new hell so this is patently false that the Fathers generally take the death of the soule for eternall damnation only when they denie that Christ died the death of the soule They speake as the Scriptures leade them and confessing two deaths of the soule as the Scriptures doe which are sinne excluding all grace and the wages of sinne euen euerlasting damnation they generally denie that Christ died any death of the soule and haue for confirmation of their doctrine therein the whole course of the sacred Scriptures concurring with them x Defenc. pag. 135. li. 37. Secondly the death of the soule or the second death may be extraordinarily and singularly considered namely to imply no more but simply the very nature and essence of it You broach two apparent and euident vntrueths which you make the whole foundation of your presumptuous errour First that either Christ or his Elect in this life did or do suffer the very nature and essence of the second death Next that the Scriptures do singularly and extraordinarily reserue that kinde of second death for Christ and his members Shew either of these by the word of God before you make them grounds of your doctrine or els any meane Reader may soone conceiue you meane to teach no trueth confirmed in the Scriptures but a bolde and false deuice of your owne which you would extraordinarily intrude vpon the word of God a Defenc. pag. 136. li. 5. This is a death to the soule as before we haue shewed according to this sense the Scriptures and Fathers before noted may rightly be vnderstood not to denie it in Christ. When you glaunced before at the death of Christes soule you prayed vs to haue patience When the Defender shouâ—…d proue the death of Christs soule he sayeth bee hâ—…th proued it already till you came to the place where we should receiue a reasonable satisfaction and now you are come to the place where you should make iust and full proofe thereof you send vs backe againe and say you haue shewed it before What meaneth this doubling and deceiuing of your Reader but that you would seeme to haue many proofs when indeed you haue none and therefore you post vs to and fro to seeke for that we shall neuer finde In the 113. Page of this Defence you went about by your miserable misconstruing of certaine wordes vsed by some of the Fathers to enforce a shew of a death on the soule of Christ but against the haire as there I haue proued and therefore stand not on your former vnfortunate aduentures but either heere make proofe by the Scriptures that Christ died the death of the soule or leaue prating and publishing it so confidently as you and your adherents do for the chiefe part of mans redemption The Scriptures and Fathers you say before noted may rightly be vnderstood not to denie it in Christ. Is this all you haue to say for the death of Christes soule that the Scriptures and Fathers may be vnderstood not to denie it The Scriptures must affirme it before you can make it any point of Christian religion or part of our reconciliation to God b Rom. 10. Faith is by hearing and hearing by the word of God and not by not denying If that be your course to put any thing to the Creed which you list to say the Scriptures doe not denie you may quickly haue a large Creed containing all things which the Scriptures abused with your figures and wrested to your fansies shall not in expresse words as you thinke denie c Defenc. pag. 136. li. 9. Moreouer let it be obserued that if we had no proofes at all
others that beleeue the words of Paul are sufficient declaring this to be the very ground of the Gospell which hee receiued and deliuered that Christ e 1. Cor. 15. died for our sinnes according to the Scriptures and that he was buried and that hee arose the third day according to the Scriptures Whence by a full and faire coherence I collect that whatsoeuer died in Christ according to the Scriptures that was buried and raised the third day according to the Scriptures But it is more then manifest by the Scriptures that the soule of Christ was neither buried nor raised from death the third day but onely his bodie It is therefore as plaine to me by the all sufficient word of God that the soule of Christ died not for our sinnes according to the Scripture Your f Defenc. pag. 146. li 23. section touching materiall fire in hell I haue sifted at large before I shall not neede to say any more of it Your hemming in all the world on your side g Defenc pag. 147. li. 25. not some nor the most or best but euen all and euery one both Churches and writers in the world who are Protestants leauing none to vphold the doctrine which I deliuer but Papists Iesuites and Friars is as I told you before and must tell you againe an egregious lie so loud and leud that all the belles in London if they should iarre together could not yeeld a more offensiue sound That euery new writer speaketh of some feares sorrowes temptations or painefull sufferings in the soule of Christ neuer was nor is by me denied neither doe I in my Sermons take vpon me to determine what feares temptations paines and sorrowes Christ might and did suffer in his soule onely I added that we must beware we diminish not his faith hope loue confidence obedience patience and other gifts and graces of the spirit of God in the soule of Christ which the Scripture cleerely maketh to be without want defect or measure in him Shunning those sands I left euery man to his libertie to speake or write of Christes feares and sorrowes as farre as any circumstance of holy Scripture did duely enforce but the death of the soule the paines of hell and of the damned and the second death if any sought to fasten on the soule of Christ whosoeuer they were they did it by their owne surmises they had no warrant for any of those in the word of God except they tooke the paines of hell figuratiuely for great and intolerable such as sometimes the Godly in their humane weakenesse thinke and complaine they feele or feare though they come nothing neere the true paines of hell which cannot be endured in this mortall life and flesh by the euidence of nature and Scripture This being my constant course as my Sermons printed doe apparently witnesse what folly what madnesse is this so egerly and often to chalenge me for contradicting the whole world when it is but your immoderate greedinesse or giddinesse to thinke that everie man who writeth any thing of the feares or sufferings of Christs soule doth presently teach as you doe the death of Christs soule and the substance of the most vehement paines of the damned yea the second death to be a necessary part of our redemtion which Christ must suffer before he could ransome vs To censure mens priuate opinions I take no pleasure some men otherwise very learned and laborious haue dipped too deepe in that die as your selfe proue and pronounce by reiecting and reselling the horror of eâ—… nâ—… death in the soule of Christ though Master Caluin say Christ CONFLICTED therewith and the Catechisme auouch Christ was therewithall Pâ—…VSED If you may thus renounce and refute the first deuise and spredders as you thinke them of your proper and spirituall temptations and torments in the soule of Christ giue others leaue to receaue them no farder then they concurre with the Scriptures and with the primatiue church of God I find diuers men speake diuersly but very few and these late that light on the death of Christs soule and suddaine touches of the essentiall paines of the damned from the immediate hand of God which is your fresh and new deuice yea many that are caried away with the generall termes of Gods wrath and horror of his dreadfull iudgements against sin no way like the death of Christs soule and by speciall words debarre all mention of the second death in the sufferings of Christ and those as well English as others How false and soolish your vaunt is of all and euerie church and writer in the world that are Protestants to be of your minde will soone appeare to any that will reade and waigh the workes and wordes of Zuinglius Musculus Martyr Bullinger Aretius 〈◊〉 new 〈◊〉 teach the sufferings of Christs soule without the paines of hell Zanchius and of sundry others as sound in faith as ripe in iudgement as diligent in reading and sufficient in all kinde of learning as the best you can name either broching or bowing towards your late conceits who though they teach that Christ suffered in soule and body as I doe yet they assigne farre other sufferings in the soule of Christ then your essentiall paines of the damned I may not stand to make new discourses touching new writers a place or two shall serue for all and so an end of this matter Bullinger vpon those words of Esay Christ layd downe or made his soule a sacrifice sor sinne saith h 〈◊〉 in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 â—…3 To make his soule a sacrifice for sinne is to offer himselfe to be a sacrifice to Purge sinnes And he saith Christs soule and not his flesh not that the flesh of Christ was not offered for vs but that whole Christ body and soule offered himselfe to God and that willingly from his heart and of his owne accord and whole Christ was the expiation of our sinnes licet interim neque diuinit as sit passa neque anima mortua sed caro de quare beati Patres Vigilius Fulgentius contra Haereticos religiose disputarunt Though during that time neither his diuinty suffered NOR HIS SOVLE DIED but his flesh whereof the blessed fathers Vigilius and Fulgentius haue religiously discoursed against Heretickes Zanchius whose learned workes are to me in steed of many writers that are caried with faction and affection to vphold whatsoeuer some other men say though he could not for his often and great labours get time to finish his purposed treatise of mans redemption in that exact manner that he hath donne the rest yet commenting on S. Paules Epistles as occasion was offered he fully deliuereth the matter and manner of our redemption to be the only sacrifice of Christs body and bloud other propitiatory sacrifice for sinne then that he acknowledgeth none though he ascribe to the soule as well her sufferings as her sacrifice i Zanchius in ca. 2. epist. ad Philip. v. 8. All things
is thrâ—…wen downe to Hades For he that minded neuer any high or heauenly thing 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 was woorthy of the lowest place In saying then he was buried the Lord secretly signifieth that his soule had the place that was lowest and darke And though hee there shew the opinion of some that thought hades to be rather the condition of the soule after death then a place yet he himselfe resolueth the coÌ„trary 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 What is hades Some say it is a place of darkenesse vnder the earth others say Hades is the change of the soule from sensible to obscure and vnseene And though the wordes of our Sauiour determine that doubt who maketh the rich man call it 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 this place of torment yet Theophylact himselfe reasoning there against Origen out of Abrahams wordes saith As it is then vnpossible for any of the iust to passe to the place of sinners so Abraham teacheth vs it is impossible 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to passe from the place of punishment to the place of the righteous And since their names doe not appeare that were of this opinion and being latter in age deserue not the same credite for their iudgements that the auncient and learned Fathers doe I omit these petite masters whom no man knoweth as fansing somewhat if they could prooue it and will goe forward with the maine consent as of all Greeke diuines that are extant so of the best and eldest commentators and expounders of Greeke words to shew that Hades is a place of darkenesse vnder earth for soules where now none but wicked are contained and there punished Eustathius Archbishop of Thessalonica a man of no meane skill in the Greeke tongue as appeareth by his commenting vpon Homere saith Haïdes which is Hades is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a darke place vnder earth vnseene and appointed for soules Phauorinus Bishop of Nuceria in his commentaries of the Greeke tongue saith likewise 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Hades is a place vnder the earth secret and hidde which hee also calleth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a place without light and filled with eternall darkenesse The great Etymologist of the Greeke tongue concurreth with them 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Hades is a place void of light and full of euerlasting darkenesse and mists I shall not neede with many wordes to vrge the properties and conditions of the place which these Greeke Fathers call Hades It is apparent to any who will pâ—…ruse them that they auouch it to be a place of darkenesse opposed to heauen and Paradise and vnder the earth where Diuels are keepers and tormentors of soules and where the wicked after this life are kept prisoners and suffer punishments according to their deserts which Christ destroyed and spoiled by his descent thither deliuering thence that is from the feare power and danger thereof all such as before or after did or should beleeue in him And though some of these writers did happily thinke the soules of the godly deceased before Christes death were kept in a part thereof in hope of their deliuerance thence yet with one consent they witnesse it to be nothing lesse then heauen or Paradise or the state of the dead common to good and bad after Christs resurrection as likewise they teach that Christ deliuered thence not onely such of his elect as were dead before that time but all the faithfull aswell then liuing as yet vnborne And therefore a deliuerance thence doth not exactly conclude a locall detention and inclusion there but a quiting and disloluing of all the right interest and challenge that hell or Satan had for sinne vnto the seruants and members of Christ whensoeuer they liued or died Onely Tertullian is opposite to them all who dreampt that the soules of all the faithfull saue Martyrs were kept in places vnder the earth which he calleth inferi till the generall resurrection wherein as in many other points deliuered in his booke de Anima he goeth a priuate way by himselfe without and against the maine resolution of the rest of the Fathers He doth not montanize in this as you obiect but consenteth with Irenaeus before and with others after him as shall appeare who were no Montanists Your mistaking Irenaeus here as you did before little helpeth your market and others when you bring them shall haue an answere fitting them In the meane while where you be so zealous to saue Tertullian from Montanisme he must haue a better proctor then you are to vphold his cause or els it will soone fall to the ground That none but Martyrs are in Paradise and all other the faithfull departing this life are in prisons and places vnder the earth till the day of iudgement this is not onely repugnant to the Scriptures and the rest of the Fathers but a plaine branch of Montanus heresie which Tertullian deriueth from no grounds of holy Scripture whence all trueth must be fet but from certaine Reuelations Prophesies different from the Scriptures which Montanus and others published as made by the holy Ghost after the writing of the Scriptures and which Tertullian in his writings coloureth with the name and pretence of the Paraâ—…te calling the true Christians that refused his new found doctrine Psychicos naturall men and not ledde by the latter direction of the spirit as Montanus and others were whom in exacting chastitie abstinence and Martyrdome more strictly then the Church of Christ did he followed And therefore not onely his doctrine in this place allowing Paradise to none besides martyrs but his alleaging Montanus verie words and pretending the Paraclete for his conceit no where written in the Scriptures declare him expresly in this to be a Montanist For plainer proofe whereof first Tertullian speaking of himselfe when he forsooke the rest of the Christians to cleaue to the reuelations of Montanus and his adherents saith Et nos quidem postea agnitio Paracleti atque defensio disiunxit a Psychicis The agnising of the Paraclet in the prophesies of Montanus and defending thereof did afterward disioine vs from the carnall men So he termed the Church of Christ for refusing the new prophesies of Montanus as appeareth euidently by his booke De ieiunio aduersus psycâ—…cos of fasting against the carâ—…all men which Saint Ierom saith was written specialiter aduersum ecclesiam particularly against the Church Where he likewise taxeth the Christians for resisting the Paraclet or new prophesies of Montanus couering them vnder the name of the Paraclet and interpreting the one by the other Hiparaeleto controuer siam faciunt propter hoc nouae prophetiae recusantur non quod alium Deum praedicent Montanus Priscilla Maximilla sed quod plane doceant saepius ieiunare quaÌ„ nubere These â—…arnall men quarrell with the Paraclet and therefore are the new prophesies refused not that Montanus Priscilla Maximilla preach another God but that they plainly teach oftner
take hold on the word soule as if that must be either in the graue which is absurd or in the hand of Inferi which is that you would haue your hastie head doth not perceiue that take the word SOVLE which way you will either for the life of man which is an vsuall speech in the Scriptures or for the soule properly neither of them doth steede you a rush For no man can preserue his life from the graue that he shall not die neither can any man withstand the hand or power of death that it shall not seuer the soule from the bodie since that is the ordinance of God against all men Saint Austen giueth you a third sense taking the soule there for the soule separate from the bodie which is more then euer you would be able to prooue and yet that maketh nothing to your purpose The rest of the faithfull saith he shall rise from the dead and liue for euer and not see death and yet can they not deliuer their owne soules from the handes of hell He which deliuered his owne soule from the hands of hell he hath deliuered the soules of his faithfull they cannot deliuer themselues This S. Austen could obserue though he regarded none of your vaine supposals And where you say Austen himselfe elsewhere graunteth the iust in peace might bee in infernus after death You might haue obserued the difference betwixt a condition and a position which you doe not and therefore you wrong him the more in saying that he graunteth any such thing He saith Si non absurde credi videtur if it seeme to be beleeued without an absurditie not affirming it might be beleeued without an absur ditie but respecting it with a conditionall least he should shew himselfe ouer peremptorie in condemning others that were of that opinion Otherwise his owne assertion and conclusion are earnest enough Non vtique sinus ille Abrahae aliqua pars inferorum esse credenda est The bosome of Abraham is not to be beleeued to be any part of inferi In his ipsis tanti Magistri verbis satis vt opinor apparet non esse quandam partem quasi membrum inferorum tantae illius felicitatis sinum In these very wordes of so great a teacher as Christ it appeareth sufficiently as I thinke that the bosome of so great felicitie is not any part or member of hell In Christs descent to hell Saint Austen is more resolute Of that he pronounceth Satis constat it is cleare enough Yea he putteth more waight vnto it and saith For neither can the Prophesie be contradicted which sayd thou wilt not leaue my soule in hell nor Peters words by which he affirmeth Christ loosed the sorrowes of hell wherein it was not possible he should be held And so concludeth who then but an infidell will denie Christ was in hell And againe Euidentia testimonia insernum commemorant dolores Euident testimonies of the Scriptures mention both hell and the paines thereof These be no coniecturall inclinations they bee iudiciall assertions whatsoeuer you say to the contrarie Fulgentius denieth not inferos to the godly deceased nor that Christ was locally only with them in inferis So that in saying he was where the wicked are tormented he meaneth that in respect of the common place which in the whole he calleth infernum Heere is a hole where through your wit is wholy runne and not your wit alone but your religion learning and conscience are runne after Plainer wordes then those of Fulgentius I neither doe nor can speake any Christus illuc vsque descendit quousque homo separatus à Deo peccati merito cecidisset id est ad infernum vbi solebat anima peccatoris torqueri Christ descended euen thither whither man seuered from God by desert of sinne was fallen that is to infernus where the soule of a sinner vseth to bee tormented What doth your wisedome answere to this He meaneth that in respect of the common place which in the whole hee calleth infâ—…rnum Is there any one place common to the Saints in heauen and to the damned in hell You haue learned belike of Parmenides the riddle-maker that all is one and because the world is but one that heauen and hell make one common place Whether fell man I pray you by the desert of sinne to heauen or to hell not to heauen I hope for then man sinning should approch to Gods Throne who Fulgentius saith was seuered from God to hell then he fell ergo Christ descended to hell by Fulgentius assertion and that place where the soules of sinners are wont to be tormenmented he calleth Infernum which if you can prooue to bee heauen you shall doe greater wonders then M. Hugh Broughton can doe For he maketh but a great ditch betwixt heauen and hell You fill vp that ditch of M. Broughtons digging and say both hell and heauen are one place common to Saints and Diuels For Infernus is the singular number and by the rules of Grammer if any rules will hold you must note but one place in which if both the blessed and the damned are then heauen and hell are both but one place Againe you farre passe M. Broughtons skill in that he saith they are much deceaued who thinke hell to be below in the earth though Saint Paul distribute all reasonable creatures subiected to Christs kingdome into things in heauen on earth and vnder the earth You change the whole site of the world and say heauen is below For where insernus is deriued from infra which is below if heauen bee called infernus then surely heauen is below and then must the Apostle recall his error in saying seeke the things which are aboue where Christ is sitting at the right hand of God he should haue sayd by your doctrine seeke the things which are below where the soules of the wicked are tormented for that is heauen with you But if at your next exercise you should pray for your Auditorie to come to infernus where the wicked are punished I winne they would thinke you more madde then M. Broughton is Howbe it with this one answere you giue the lie aswell to Prophets as Apostles For where Dauid saith to God Thou hast brought my soule out of infernus that cannot be by your rules since heauen and hell make but one place and the earth being in the midst of them must needes be one place with both extreames and haue the same name with both So that Dauids soule wheresoeuer it was was not out of Infernus Againe where he saith in the person of Christ Thou wilt not leaue my soule in infernus that is false by your doctrine who teach that Christ and all his Saints deceased are yet in a common place with the damned the whole being called Infernus And where before you were very angry That I said you made ascending to be descending and
it aliue and then the words of Peter runne more easily for Christs descent to hell then for his preaching in the daies of Noah There is no doubt but Austens sense hath some difficulties and must haue some open additions to the text before it will agree therewith as by which he went and preached to those that now are spirits in prison and were once disobedient in the daies of Noah Againe neither wicked men liuing on earth are called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 spirits by the course of the Scriptures neither were the despisers of Noahs preaching then in prison when he preached Besides that Peter heere purposely speaking of the death of Christ verse 18. persueth the consequents thereof in order as his descent to the spirits in prison vers 19. his resurrection vers 21. his ascension and sitting on the right hand of God vers 22. The impediment to the former sense is that they onely are mentioned which were disobedient in the daies of Noah where if we make the former words to be generall in which he went and preached to the spirits in prison and the next speciall as the point between may entend and to the disobedient in the daies of Noah or if this example be produced as the most famous wherein the whole and first world was drowned and so likest to the time of preaching the Gospell the contempt whereof should bring destruction on the second world and the iust be saued by water as Noah was through the resurrection of Christ that impediment is likewise remooued Howbeit I leaue it indifferent to euery man to follow what sense he liketh best the rather for that many old and new interpreters referre these words of Peter that Christ preached to the spirits in prison and the Gospell was preached to the dead to Christs descent to those places where these dead were both good and bad though I thought not fit to presse them when Austen had once resigned them And where you cite Master Nowels Caâ—…echisme to prooue that the later Synod misliked not the applying of Peters words to Christs descent to hell what doe you therein but as your manner is take the paines to refute your selfe For if they liked that which Master Nowell hath written of Christs descent to hell they allowed as much as I defend and consequently they did not apparantly renounce the doctrine of Christs going down to the hell of the damned as you did openly I must not say arrogantly pronounce It may be you will turne about when you see your selfe thus angled and say Master Nowell teacheth no more but that the power and efficacie of Christs passion was reuealed to the damned but the first point he teacheth is this ChristuÌ„ vt corpore in terrâ—… visâ—…era it a anima à corpore separata ad inferos descendisse Christ as in body he went to the â—…wels of the earth which was his graue so in soule seuered from his body he descended ad inferos to hell The ends of Christs descent he maketh to be three where he saith Simuâ—… etiam mortis suae virtutem atâ—… efficacitatem ad â—…ortuos atâ—… inferos adeo ipsos it a 〈◊〉 vâ—… incredulorum animae c. And with all that is together with his soule the vertâ—…e â—…nd force of his death so pâ—…arced to the dead and euen to hell it selfe that firsâ—… the â—…ules of the â—…ithlesse pâ—…rceaued the condemnation of their inâ—…delity to be most sharpe but 〈◊〉 iâ—…st Secondly and Satan the ruler of hell saâ—… all the power of his tâ—…ny and of 〈◊〉 to be weâ—…ened 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Thirdly 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and the deceâ—…d 〈◊〉 in their lifâ—… 〈◊〉 beleeue in Christ perceaued the worke of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to be 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 thereof with most sweet and â—…tain conâ—…ort Heere is as much as I desire grant this and I vrge you no farder And thus much the late Synod liked and appâ—…ued if you doe admit as you doe when pleaseth you Master Nowell for their interpreter Neither misliked they his tarying there till his resurrection which also Austen holdeth as firmely as that he was there If you speake of the later Synod you speake more then you can prooue If of others you must tell vs whom you meane It is not true that Austen fastened Christs soule to hell for three daies but rather confessed him to be free amongst the dead and so left to his owne liberty though the Scripture in Austens opinion nameth no place where Christs soule was after death besides hell If the soule saith he be straightway called to Paradise when the body is dead thinke â—…e any man so wiâ—…ked as to dare say that the soule of our Sauiour was for those three dâ—…ies of his bodily death restrained to the custody of hell Gregorius Nyssenus doth the like That the soule of our Lord commended into his Fathers hands quum it a bonum commodum illi visum esset etiam ad inferos descendit went also to hell when it seemed good and coâ—…nient vnto himselfe that 〈◊〉 might publish saluation to the soules in hell and be Lord ouer quicke and dead and spoile hell and might prepare a way for mans nature to returne to life after hee himselfe had beene the first fruits and first borne from the dead may be perceaued by many places of Scripture Anselmus a thousand yeeres after Christ sheweth that the Church in his time held not this so firmely as you imagine For asking by way of a Dialogue whither went Christs soule after death He answereth to the heauenly Paradise as he said to the Thiefe this day shalt thou be with me in Paradise When then went he to hell at midnight before his resurrection at what hower the Angell destroyed Egypt at that houre euen at midnight Christ sâ—…oiled hell and made their dâ—…kenesse as bright as day So that you talke out of time when you talke so much how long time Christ staied in hell The time and manner of his descent we leaue to God â—…t suâ—…iceth vs that the Scriptures witnesse he was there and rose both Sauiour of his owne and Lord of all That our English Clergie generally did or doe beleeue Christs locall descent to hell although they read and rehâ—…arse these words so translated certainly no man will nor ought to acknowledge That al did I neuer sayd we haue to much experience of you and some others that loue alwaies to be opposite to Lawes Creeds Canons and whatsoeuer pleaseth not your fansies but that all should I doe auouch by reason the Church of England in her publike seruice the Synod in their Articles and the Parliament of this Realme in their confirmation of both enioynâ—… all men not onlâ—… to reade those words so translated but to beleâ—…ue that Christ descended to Hell If â—…ou 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 they are bound to belâ—…eue your emphaticall phrase or your phantasticalâ—… imagination oâ—… you know not what generall indâ—…finite