Selected quad for the lemma: doctrine_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
doctrine_n	believe_v	faith_n	justification_n	2,510	5	8.9827	5	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A83515	The third part of Gangræna. Or, A new and higher discovery of the errors, heresies, blasphemies, and insolent proceedings of the sectaries of these times; with some animadversions by way of confutation upon many of the errors and heresies named. ... Briefe animadversions on many of the sectaries late pamphlets, as Lilburnes and Overtons books against the House of Peeres, M. Peters his last report of the English warres, The Lord Mayors farewell from his office of maioralty, M. Goodwins thirty eight queres upon the ordinance against heresies and blasphemies, M. Burtons Conformities deformity, M. Dells sermon before the House of Commons; ... As also some few hints and briefe observations on divers pamphlets written lately against me and some of my books, ... / By Thomas Edvvards Minister of the Gospel.; Gangraena. Part 3	Edwards, Thomas, 1599-1647.	1646 (1646)	Wing E237; Thomason E368_5; ESTC R201273	294,455	360

more no more night nor day summer nor winter 2 Pet. 3. 7 10 11 12. The heavens and the earth which are now are reserved unto fire against the day of judgement the heavens shall passe away the elements shall melt with fervent heat the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burnt up all these things shall be dissolved and whatever hath a being after the day of judgement is eternall and for ever so Revel 10. 6. there should be time no longer which some interpret there shall be no time because time shall be finished and this variety of dayes and nights moneths and years and an unchangeable eternity shall follow in the dayes of the seventh Angel but whether that be the meaning or no of the place this is certain that after the end of this world and the generall Judgement there will be an abolition of time and an eternity follow and therefore eternall fire and eternall chains both for devills and ungodly men cannot be meant of a long time but simply of eternall à parte post Thirdly there 's the same reason in every respect why eternall for judgement fire destruction should be taken in the same sense that eternall is when joyned to life kingdome c. but there 't is taken not for a long-lasting time but properly for everlasting and therefore must of necessity be so here and whatever colour glosse or evasion can be brought to evade that of hell torments damnation that they should not be eternall the same will lie as strong against the eternall life and kingdome given to the Saints but they overthrow the whole doctrine of faith break that golden chain of salvation in the eighth of the Romanes in all the links of it Election Vocation Justification Glorification nay further these Errors as they are laid down doe not onely crosse expresse Scriptures and Articles of our Faith but they deny salvation to all men who beleeve not those wicked doctrines making them the great Antichrist formall beleevers and putting the cause of all damnation to devills and men viz. for so long as they are damned upon the not-beleeving and receiving these wicked doctrines That all devills and men shall be saved and that Christ paid the price laying down his bloud for the pardon of all reprobated Men and Angels and that the beleeving of these doctrines is the only true Christian working faith commended so much by the Holy Ghost and of such an efficacy that this faith being but in two or three in the whole world shall yet save all the rest of the Creation then which Doctrines and Positions nothing can be more repugnant to the Christian faith and may properly be call'd doctrines of devills 33. The Trinity of Persons came downe in Christ to suffer Father Sonne and Holy Ghost suffered for their transgressing creature 34. There is a private Kingdom of Christs justice in which he sat Judge over the quick and dead to condemne and execute torments on the rebellious whom he held as prisoners for a time and there is Christs publick Kingdome to which the Private Kingdome must give place and as the Father hath given it to Christ to rule it for ever so Christ hath committed it to the Holy Ghost to enliven all things to bring up all to life and immortality and the Holy Ghost for the Father and the Son shall execute the judgement of love and mercies unto all for the destroying of death of hell 35. That t is unlawfull to pray unto God kneeling 36. That Organs are a sanctified adjunct in the service of God now under the Gospel and that if any man in the Church had a gift of making Hymner he might bring them in to be sung with Organs or other Instruments of musick In severall ages of the Church wanton men who could not be content with the simplicity of the Gospel have brought both into doctrines of Faith and Worship such opinions and practises still as have been most suitable to their genius and education to the principles of such Arts and Sciences in which they were versed as Origen and some others versed in Plato's Philosophy brought in opinions into the Church according to Plato's doctrine Some who have been much addicted to Painting and Imagery they have brought in Images into the Church and now some of our Independents having fancies in Musick singing taking great delight in that way they have pleaded for and brought into the Church Hymnes and Musick 37. That Adultery is no Sin and that Drunkenesse is none neither but a help to see Christ the better by it 38. Though consent of Parents unto Childrens marriage was commanded under the Law to them that lived then yet because that was but a ceremony t is now lawfull to marry without their consent because we live under the Gospel 39. Christs death and sufferings were endured for to be our example not to purchase heaven for us 40. That 't is not lawfull for Christians to take an oath no not when they are called before Authority and brought into Courts 41. That Christ would destroy not only unlawfull Government but lawfull Government not only the abuse of it but the use of it he was destroying both Monarchy and Aristocracy 42. That the Saints besides the spirituall Kingdome and Government of the Church of Christ must have an externall Kingdom to possesse that this is the time that the Kingdome viz. England Scotland and Ireland is to be taken from him who shall arise and subdue three Kingdoms thinking to change times and Lawes and shall be given to the Saints 43. Gracious Lords or Favourable Lords are titles that cannot be proper amongst Christians but are marks of Gentiles 44. 'T is an utter disfranchisement of the people and a meer vassalage for a man to Petition to Courts of Judicature as the House of Peers for his right and to have justice done him 't is no better then a branch of tyranny to force a man to turn Supplicant for his own and of self-robbery to submit thereto 'T is an inslaved and intolerable condition of this Nation that indeed they cannot have their own naturall Rights and Immunities but they must be actuall Petitioners as if their own were not their own of right but of favour 45. That for Crimes and Offences committed in a Common-wealth there should not be certain penalties appointed by Lawes to which the Governours and Magistrates should be tyed but it should be lest to the discretion and wisdome of the Magistrates to inflict what they thought fit in case of such and such Crimes and this liberty should be left that a Magistrate might exercise his gifts of Government which if he were kept strictly to the Law how should his wisdom and gifts be manifested 46. That Protestant States and Parliaments have no power nor liberty to confirm and enact by Law Worship and Church-Government

as is evident by these words Neither shalt thou take a Wise to her Sister to vex her to uncover her nakednesse besides the other in her life time that is either thou shalt not take one wife to another marrying another wife having one or else marrie the sister of thy wife whether she be sister by mother or by the father Againe the holy Ghost in this Chapter forbids that which is unlawfull with some kind of persons and not with all and at some times and not at others therefore limits it to such a sort of persons such degrees of bloud but now fornication is unlawfull with all and at all times a man may not uncover the nakednesse that is commit fornication with those who are remotest in bloud or affinity and that it must be understood so is evident from the 19. verse Thou shalt not approach unto a woman to uncover ●er nakednesse as long as she is put apart for her uncleanesse that is every man was to abstaine from his own wife during the time of her monthly fluors which necessarily showes t is meant of a mans wife for from all other women a man must abstaine alwayes and t is never lawfull to approach to them but even from a mans owne wife over who●e body he hath power at other times he is then to abstaine Lastly the holy Ghost comes to speak of fornication verse 20. Thou shalt not lie carnally with thy neighbours wise There he forbids fornication but in the former part of the Chapter he for bad Incest and Incestuons marriages The other Scripture is in the New Testament Mark 6. 17 18. verses where John tell● Herod t is not lawfull for him to have his brother Philips wife and this cannot be evaded by saying John reproved Herod taking her by force or living in fornication with her but not barely for marriage with her For the text faith expresly he had married her and she was willing to it as appears by the story because she had a quarrell against John Baptist and would have killed him for preaching to Herod against it and afterwards watched her opportunity of revenge against John verse 19. 24 preferring his head before halfe of the Kingdome I have been the larger in this Animadversion because divers Sectaries a● guilty of Incestuous marriages I have the names of three Independents given me out of one County who have married incestuously 4. That our common food ordinary eating and drinking is a Sacrament of Christs death and a remembrance of his death till his coming againe 5. That the Souls of the Saints departed now in Heaven are on Earth everywhere present with their friends and with all the affairs of this world seeing and knowing them though in a spirituall manner and not in so grosse a way as when they were living upon earth for look as the Saints whilst they were on earth in their bodies yet were in Heaven in their Conversations So now though they ●e in He 〈…〉 yet they are on Earth with their friends and know their state and condition Doth not this Doctrine open a gap for prayer to the dead what bred and nourished prayer to Saints departed but this and is not this a great ground of it among the Papists at this day if this were true would it not put men upon praying to Saints whom they familiarly knew and were interrested in as their fathers mothers c. A godly and able Minister who was at this Sermon professed to me and another Minister discoursing of the Sermon That if he beleeved this Doctrine to be true he should pray to his Father to remember and pray for him and the Papists generally as Bellarmine and others urge this as an argument for Prayer to Saints because they know our affairs and the condition of things belowe unto which the Protestants generally Answer That the Saints departed know not our wants nor what is done in the earth and in Answer to that Argument The Saints on earth pray for one another Ergo much more we should desire the prayers of the Saints departed Among other Answers they still give this We may request the prayers of one another because we know our mutuall necessities but the Saints departed know not what things are done here upon earth neither are every where present to hear ou● prayers The holy Ghost tells us Isaiah 63 16. that Abraham is ignorant of us and Israel knows us not Upon which Augustine writes thus If so great Patriarck● were ignorant what became of the people which were borne of their loi●es how is it like that other dead can be present to understand and be helping to mens affairs So Job saith of them who are dead His sonnes come to honour and 〈◊〉 knoweth it not and they are brought lowe but be perceiveth it not Job 14. verse 21. But for confutation of this Popish opinion I referre the Reader to Willets Synopsis the much generall Controversie concerning the Saints departed quest 3. to Amesius his Bellar. E●ervatus Tom. 2 〈…〉 de Invocatione Sa●ctorum and to learned Rivers Catholicus Orthodoxus Tract 2. Quest 48. 6. The glorified Souls now in Heaven see in Christ as in a glasse the state of the whole Church on Earth all their joyes to rejoyce with them and all their griefs and troubles though not to greive with them This is B 〈…〉 nes opinion an brought by him as a ground for the Invocation of Saints became at once they see in God as in a glasse all things here belowe and so the prayers of the faithfull directed to them Of the manner how the Saints in Heaven know the prayers of the living Bellarmine sets down four opinons of the wayes how 1 Some say they know them by the relation of Angels 2 Others say the Souls of the Saints by their wonderfull celerity and agility are in a sort every where and so know 3 Many hold the Saints see at once in God as in aglasse all things which concerne them and so the prayers directed to them I astly others say they know them by speciall revelation from God when they are prayed as Elisha knew Ge●azies corruption and Samuel knew Sauls estate Now the Third the beholding in God as in a glasse the prayers of the living Bellarmine adheres to as the most probable so that this 6th Error and Bellarmines agrees fully but for confutation of this Error let the Reader read our Protestants in Answer to Bellarmine upon this question As Amesius Bellar. Enervat Willets Synopsis with many others 7 The glorified Souls who are in Heaven doe now with Christ govern and rule the Kingdomes of the Earth and all the affairs here belowe for proofe of which was brought these Texts as I remember Revelation 3. 21. To him that overcometh will I grant to ●it with me in my throne Rev. 2. 26. And he that overcometh to him will I give power over the nations This also is a Popish Errour

is a Master Sectarie a man of great power among them and hath Emissaries under him whom he sends abroad and commands to go into severall parts as Syms Row c and supply his place in his absence and as you have heard of him formerly so since my second part of Gangraena came abroad a godly Minister out of the West writ thus to me of Collier He was driven out of the Island of Garnesy because of his opinions and turbulency as a godly Minister of that Island told me and he could not deny it himself when I asked him the question He hath done much hurt in Limington Hampton Waltham and all along this Country I had once a conference with him upon two questions for five houres space sufficient time for one to trouble himself with such a vain unruly taulker First concerning the Morality of the Sabbath Secondly concerning Baptisme in both which he denyed I affirmed It would require ●great deal of time to give you an account of all particulars and the truth is if I should some passages would have an ill reflex upon some men of note and power with whom perhaps it will not be safe for me to meddle And in a Letter from the same Minister printed in this third part of Gangraera page 40. 41 Collier being mentioned he is said to be the first that sowed the seeds of Anabaptisme Antisabbatarianisme and some Arminianisme among the rest in these parts A Copie of a Letter to a tittle sent from some of the Inhabitants of Devizes to a worthy Member of the House of Commons Right Worshipfull MAy it please you to be certified by us of certain passages this day at the Church in the time of Divine service That is our Minister Master Sheappard being in the Pulpit was commanded by one Captaine Pretty who is under the command of Colonell Ireton and who with his souldiers are to our great burthen quartered with us to be silent and to come forth of the Pulpit saying in threatning termes he was unfit to preach and that he was yesterday being Satturday druncken which evidently can be proved to the contrary the Gentleman being to our knowledge a very temperate and Religious Divine This Captaine was assisted with one Master Ives and Master Lambe who are as they say Preachers and divers souldiers armed in a most irreverent manner to the abominable disturbance of the whole Congregation and as we conceive to the great abuse and disgrace of the Honourable Parliament By meanes where of our Preacher fearing as was too too much cause what dangerous effects such indecent and impious demeanours might produce was enforced to depart and dares not to come in sight so that we were destitute of preaching this day Whereof we thought good being thereto as we beleeve bound in duty and good conscience to acquaint your Worship withall hoping by your industrious meanes these our most intolerable griveances may be taken into Religious consideration and we thereof eased which we earnestly begg of you our approved good friend and Countryman may be effected These aforesaid abuses can be if occasion witnessed by the whole Congregation From the Devizes this present Sunday the 6. of September 1646. I Have received lately certaine Information from some who are come out of Wales that a Trooper of Colonell Riches Regiment hath been for divers weeks last past in Wales in Radnorshire and Brecknockeshire a preaching and dipping where he hath vented many Doctrines of Antinomianisme and Anabaptisme and rebaptized hundreds in those Countries Among others one woman whom he dipped he held so long under water that what with the water getting into her and cold she died of it within a day or two This Trooper going from these Countries into Mongomeryshire another Countie of Wales to preach and dippe some in command and Armes for the Parliament seized on him and committed him to prison but within a while after this commitment by meanes used by some in the Army there comes an order from higher Authority to those who committed him to release him and so he was set free A Religious Commander who comes from thence tells me the preaching and dipping of this Trooper and other such makes the Countries being newly reduced have an ill opinion of the Parliament and many of the people say these are your Preachers at London and such Preachers as the Parliament sends for they being ignorant people think verily these men are sent forth by the Parliament to preach to them This Commander tells me also there is a strong report in those Countries of Wales where he hath been that there are some Sectaries preach for Circumcision and that some have been Circumcised but the truth of that he cannot assert as of the rest but must have more time to find it out There is a Minister now in London or here abouts who going to a meeting of the Sectaries heard one of them in his Exercising and preaching to the company assembled affirme that he was Jesus Christ whereupon this Minister spake to him and said how can you be Jesus Christ where are the prints of the nailes in your hands unto which this wicked Sectarie replyed showing him his hands here they are and in one of his hands there were some markes which he said were the prints of the nailes but said this Sectarie for all this you will not beleeve me to be Christ unlesse you saw Miracles and turning over his Bible to the Book of the Revelations this Sectary quoted a place that Miracles were wrought to confirme the Doctrine of Divells which saith he you would have me to shew to confirme the truth This is a most certain story related by an eare and eye witnesse to a Noble Earle of this Kingdom and to some others and the place where this Sectary dwells related also with many circumstances Some of the Sectarian souldiers quartering very dately at a Towne in Lester shire upon the Lords day some of them shooed their horses others who came into the Church disturbed and affronted a godly Minister one Master Boh●mus Minister of the place put in by the meanes of Sir Arthur Hazelrig to whom he had formerly relation who as he was reading in the Scriptures that passage The secret of the Lord is with them that feare him some of them stood up and said that was a lye and so insolent was their carriage that this good Minister was glad to get him out of the way And as their carriage was so in the Church so a Townsman who rented the Tythes being upon horse in the field looking after his Tyth corne some of these souldiers coming into the field asked who that was and being told he was a man that came to gather Tyths they came to him and one took one leg and another the other and others laid hands on him in other parts and threw him off his horse abusing him and hazarding the limbs of the man because he renting the Tythes came to look

is in man and whether it be any part of man and how or when man is first possessed of it and how it comes to be guilty of Adams sin and what promise of Salvation is made unto it in Scripture and how it is redeemed by Christ and now desiring you will make it good by Scripture what you do affirm that so your Christian Brother may receive satisfaction I rest and shall be thankfull unto you Yours Thomas Sidebothom This was delivered me July 28. 1646. This is the Originall Mr. I Received your Note and for answer thereto hoping you are not of the spirit of those which sent to Christ to intangle him in his words neither am I afraid to declare what my Faith is for I beleeve the word of God contained in the Old and New Testament to be a truth yet in them I cannot find that man or any part of man is Immortal but that he is wholly Mortal even whole man is wholly Mortal and ceaseth to have any lively Being betwixt Death and the Resurrection Now if this be an Errour thus to beleeve I require you as you are a Christian and spiritual to restore such a one in the spirit of mee●nesse and to convince by sound Doctrine the gainsayer proving by scripture what you do affirm and if you do affirm a Mortal soule that you will according to rationality give Answers to those Queries you have and then I will Reply that so we may bring it unto the ballance and weigh the scriptures on both sides and so hoping in a loving and Christian way to bring the grounds of these to light I rest Thomas Sidebothom This was delivered me Aug. 3. 1646. and is the Original A Copy of a Letter written to me out of Lancashire SIR THe bearer having a great desire to see you my self a greater desire to serve you from whose faithful labours in the ministry I have formerly received much good I make bold to trouble you with these rude lines the inclosed will faithfully informe you of a sad accident fallen out in York-shire if the knowledge of it have not come to you from better hands my self and some others are here ingaged with you in the quarrell against the Sectaries and shall indeavour to serve you and the Church of God according to your desires expressed in your Gangraena I hope ere long to present you with a true relation of the Independents gathering and constituting their Church at Sawerby in York-shire which will not be unworthy your consideration we have for the present only one Independent congregation in all Lancashire which never yet had Officers it consists not of above thirty persons most women all of mean quallity Mr. Eaton of whose activity to promote this way I beleeve you are not ignorant hath been the great apostle to promote their design in these parts all our Godly Ministers generally stand right and in their course preach a weekly Lecture in Manchester against Independency If I might have a few lines of direction from you by this bearer how I and the rest of my friends might best serve you you should not fail of the faithfull indeavours of him who is Your reall servant to love you and serve you May 25. 1646. Though I be a stranger to you and unknown yet Mr. can inform you what credit you may give to me and what I shall write Some passages extracted out of a Letter written to me from out of the Northern parts THe Church at Sawerby since our conference in March hath been blasted in its growth only one and she a woman hath been added The Church at Birch which is but two miles and a half from Manchester growes in number but yet hath no Officers as I can hear of I shall hereafter give you a particular account of the Church of Duckenfield the ruling Elder there is a Sequestrator in Cheshire and their Deacon a Sequestrator in Lancashire The Deacon I shall speedily bring upon the stage and make a notable discovery of his knavery in couzening the state Your reall friend to love and serve you August 3. 1646. A Copy of a Letter written out of Yorkshire concerning an Independent Church in that Country SIR MUch respected I give you many thanks for your love when I was with you since we have spoken to Mr. Roats about a conference but as yet have no satisfying Answer So soon as we heard of their intention to chuse their Officers we sent a Note to him to this effect That whereas we heard it was their resolution so to do such a day that we desired him if that so he could with conveniency to forbear and suspend the doing thereof for a time in regard that we desired that there might first be a conference in the place by some Godly Ministers that if it might be the true way might be more cleerly found out that those that are deceived or misled might be undeceived so as we might assent to them or they to us so far as truth might appear so his Answer was first before any thing was done that they might have satisfaction given for what wrongs they had sustained And 2dly he would allow us to propound some questions provided they might do the like against our way so seeing no better answer could be had and that they resolved still to go on still in their businesse It was thought fit by the Inhabitants of the place for that day to lock the Chappel door to testifie their not approving their way and so it was done the which doth much incense them and the last Sabboth they had the liberty of the Chappel wherein they began their Election by the Deacons And in the forenoon such words as these was expressed in his Sermon as it was given in to me by an honest understanding man that was present in an Use of exhortation to those that are joyned together in Societies in a visible Church viz. You must de●end one another as Abraham did Lo● when he armed those that was born in his house and brought up with him to defend him and as Moses did the Hebrew against the Egyptian and as those who defended Paul when he was in Prison against those that had taken an Oath c. And denounced the punishment threatned Zac. 14. 18 19. against those who will not joyn into the visible Churches saying It is a Gospel Text see the which me thinks are strong applications and may prove of dangerous consequence I cannot yet send you nor Mr. Holinworth the Questions that are to be discussed nor certainly the day when or whether or no but Mr. is to be with us next Sabbath and then if any thing can be pitched you shall hear by the first I pray you remember my respects to Mr. and desire him to take so much pains if that we do send directions to come and also I pray write me in two words by the first what was the issue of your conference at Bi●tch

he which broached the Error had done in promoting it for he did beleeve a man might serve God better in an Error then he who was in the truth Here is a brave Patron of Error and a fine fetch to plead for and uphold it for if Errour must not be condemned till men have taken so much paines it may never be spoken against or at least not till 't is grown to such a head that 't is past help For a Heretick who broaches any Doctrine against the Scripures the Trinity the humane nature of Christ Justification may say to him who opposes these Doctrines I have studied this twenty yeares these points when you have studied them as long then preach 〈◊〉 against them but not before Besides this implies as if Ministers and Christians could not be sure any Doctrines were Errors without long searching whether they were so or no and as if there were no received known principls and Doctrines of Christian Religion lay'd down so plainly and clearly in Scriptures that when errors were published contrary to them Ministers and Christians might not condemne them at first but must study and search to know whether they were Errors or no which preaching fits well with many passages in some Books of Cretensis especially his thirtie eight Queres upon the Ordinance against Heresie and Blasphemie Secondly There are many thousand truths both to be beleeved and practised that are not contained in the Scriptures as that Jesus Christ Son of the Virgin Mary was the Son of God as the Resurrection from the dead as Baptizing of Infants womens receiving the Sacrament of the Lords Supper all which could not be proved by Scripture but by a strong hand of Reason deducing them Many other passages I have from good hands of Cretensis preaching of his preferring Reason before Faith in points of Religion of holding the sleeping of the soule till the Resurrection of bodies that dye not rising the same again with divers such but I shall reserve them with the proofs of them both persons times and places till my nex Answer comes out against him and shall now instance only in one Pamphlet lately set forth by him call'd some Modest and humble Quenes upon the late Ordinance against Heresies concerning which I may say as the Holy Ghost doth of Herods imprisoning John he hath added yet this above all to write such a wicked Pamphlet and at such a time there being not a more desperate ungodly Atheisticall peece written by any man since the Reformation I have had occasion to read many Discourses and Tractats of Libertines and Scepticks that have been writ within this last hundred years and have seen much wickednesse in them both in those of other Countries and our own especially those written and newly printed within five years last past but in none of them do I find all things considered such a spirit of Libertinisme Atheisme prophanesse and laying waste of all Religion breathing as in these Queres for besides those evill spirits of Error scoffing disorder confusion irreligion that works in all the other Queres ther 's a Legion of wicked and uncleane spirits seven fold worse then those that have been cast out in that second Quere wherein it will appear manifestly to all who compare the first part of the Ordinance with that Quere that all Christian Religion is overthrown at once yea that principle written in all mens hearts by nature that there is a God for doctrines and opinions contrary unto these for ought any knowes may be the sacred truths of God and the publishers of them our Brethren according to this Quere Now I challenge any man to shew me a more desperate destenctive passage in the writings of any Libertine or Sectary then this How hath the Lord left him to himself to write such Queries I remember that in my Second Part of Gangrana in that part of it which is a Reply to Cretensis in Page 35. I write thus That I feared unlesse God gave him repentance if hee lived but one seven years hee would prove as Arch an Heretick and as dangerous a man as ever England bred and that hee would be another David George Francken Socinus and behold within a few moneths not giving God glory to repent of his evill deeds but going on to write hee hath by these Queries made good what I prophesied of him and hath filled up the measure of his iniquities so that I beleeve hee hath justified Corn●●rt Sebastian Franck Francken S●cinus David George with all the rest of that rabble and I doe not think 't is lawfull for Christians to receive such a one into their house or to bid him God speed but rather if they come where he is to fly from him and not to stay as Saint John did from C●rinthus and for his writing of these Queries I think godly Ministers speaking of him may call him as Polycarpus did Marcion I hope some good hand will make Animadversions upon them and give an Answer to those Queries Now notwithstanding all the desperate opinions and principles he pleads for and the Independent separated Church that hee is Minister of there 's one opinion hee holds and practises accordingly different from the Independent way viz. That Baptisme belongs not onely to the Children of those who are added to a particular Church and that Ministers may not onely baptize the Children of Parents of their own Church but may baptize Children to whom they have no relation viz. in any Parish or place where they are desired and two honest Citizens told me they heard him preach That Baptisme was not a Church Ordinance that required the presence of the members of the Church but might be administred any where either in the same Congregation or in another place And I conceive though he be an Independent yet he holds this and some other things in his Church way different from the other Independents as for this Reason that he may be singular in his way and in something differ from them so that hee might keep a doore open for his profit and gain and hence 't is I have been informed from severall hands that as he is a zealous man for Funerall Sermons so he is a Baptizer generall baptizing in Stepney Parish Hackney severall Parishes of London and baptizes sometimes three or foure in a day going from one place to another and that 't is thought hee many times gets fifty shillings and three pound a day by baptizing children who are not of his Church and I have spoken with some women who have been at such baptizings and have seen the gold put into his hand which I must confesse is a good wise way to the maintenance allowed him by his Church to have this additionall means from them that are without for the more comfortable maintenance of his wife and children But by the way whilst Master Goodwin baptizes those who are not of his Church which surely hee doth no●