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doctrine_n	apostle_n	church_n	primitive_a	4,139	5	9.1134	5	true

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A07805	The encounter against M. Parsons, by a revievv of his last sober reckoning, and his exceptions vrged in the treatise of his mitigation. Wherein moreouer is inserted: 1. A confession of some Romanists, both concerning the particular falsifications of principall Romanists, as namely, Bellarmine, Suarez, and others: as also concerning the generall fraude of that curch, in corrupting of authors. 2. A confutation of slaunders, which Bellarmine vrged against Protestants. 3. A performance of the challenge, which Mr. Parsons made, for the examining of sixtie Fathers, cited by Coccius for proofe of Purgatorie ... 4. A censure of a late pamphlet, intituled, The patterne of a Protestant, by one once termed the moderate answerer. 5. An handling of his question of mentall equiuocation (after his boldnesse with the L. Cooke) vpon occasion of the most memorable, and feyned Yorkeshire case of equiuocating; and of his raging against D. Kings sermon. Published by authoritie	Morton, Thomas, 1564-1659.	1610 (1610)	STC 18183; ESTC S112913	342,598	466

particularly examined discussed and prooued to haue beene so many inexcusable slaunders euen in that Booke of Apologie whereof Master Parsons himselfe hath taken particular notice but more fully and exactly in my lass Catholicke Appeale the fift Booke whereof is spent in the confutation of these and otherslaunders which our Romish Aduersaries haue falsly obiected against Caluine and other Protestants Thus we see that his Ponderous Consideration being put into the ballance is found to weigh no more then doth a vaine and fantasticall conceit CHAP. IX Concerning three other corrupted Allegations of Cardinall Bellarmine SECT I. The charge concerning Saint Cyprian in the poynt of Tradition 1. SAint Cyprian stood vpon written Tradition Bellarmine said that he did it in defending an error Therfore no maruaile saith he though Cyprian erred in so reasonning for the which cause Saint Augustine doth worthily refute him In which place S. Augustine seemeth to bee so farre from confuting him for reasoning so that he saith That which Cyprian warneth vs to runne vnto the fountaine that is vnto the Traditions of the Apostles from thence to deriue a Conduict to our times that is chiefly and doubtlesse to be performed The summe of Mr. PARSONS his Reckoning THis was no good forme of arguing in him but in this necessitie for defending this error for first Saint Augustine doth of purpose refute the same and Saint Cyprian doth elsewhere yeeld and allow the vnwritten Traditions I graunt that S. Cyprian saith as Saint Augustine also doth that when any Tradition or Doctrine can bee clearely shewed out of Scripture Optimum est It is questionlesse the best way of all But when there is no Scripture for proofe of it then saith S Augustine Consuetudo illa c. that is The custom which was opposed against Cyprian must be beleeued to haue proceeded from the Apostles as many things else which the Vniuersall Church doth hold and therefore are well beleeued to haue beene commaunded by the Apostles albeit they are not found written The Reueiwe 2. What Saint Augustines iudgement was concerning the sufficiencie of Scripture as it is defended by the Protestants he hath often vnfolded saying that Amongst all things which are contained plainly in Scripture all those things may be found which concerne faith and manners of life And againe Whensoeuer there is a case of greatest difficultie and we haue no cleere proofes of Scriptures for our conclusions so long must mans presumption keepe silence And euen of this question of not rebaptizing he doth refute it out of Scriptures By as he speaketh certaine proofes and not by coniectures as Bellarmine calleth them before the definition of a Councell And heere also although Bellarmine be in part iustifiable yet looke vnto the sentence of Cyprian and you shall find his reasoning negatiuely from Scripture which is condemned by Bellarmine to bee iustified by Saint Augustine although it be there applied by him affirmatiuely SECT II. The second exception against Bellarmine The charge concerning S. Peters Ordination 3. THe summe of the exception standeth thus Bellarmine defended that Saint Peter onely was ordeined a Bishop by Christ and that the other Apostles were ordeined Bishops by Saint Peter and endeuoured to prooue this out of the testimonies of Anacletus Clemens Alex. Eusebius Cyprian Leo Augustine But these Fahers saith their Victoria do not intend that which the Authors of this opinion doe pretend As for other writings which are attributed vnto Clement and Pope Anacletus which are both many and great they are saith their Cardinall Cusanus Apocrypha wherein they who extoll the Romane Sea which is worthy of allpraise do aboue that which is conuenient or meete either wholly or partly rely We are now to Reckon first for the matter it selfe and then for the maner of deliuerance of it in my Preamble Mr. PARSONS his Reckoning ALl this which Mr. Morton alle adgeth heere if it were graunted as it lieth conteineth nothing but two different opinions between learned men in a disputable question Whether Christ did immediately and by himselfe consecrate all or some of his Apostles Bishops or one onely with authoritie to consecrate the rest Turrecremata and Bellarmine doe hold the one for more probable but Victoria Cusanus and some other do allow rather the other What wilfull falsehood is there in this Or is it not singular folly to call it by that name The Reueiwe 4. If all this were graunted Mr. Parsons Then I can tell you you must either renounce the iudgement of Bellarmine or else recant your owne Reckoning you haue graunted first that Bellarmine did prooue out of Turrecremata that Christ did make onely Saint Peter Bishop with authoritie to consecrate the rest Secondly that Victoria thinketh the contrary opinion to be more probable and aunswereth the argument of Turrecremata saying that the Fathers cited for the same Reuerà non significant id quod Authores huius sententiae volunt That is That in trueth they doe not signifie so much as the authoritie Mr. Parsons should haue said Authors of this opinion would haue them Lastly that Cardinall Cusanus here cited doth to the like effect aunswere the same arguments 5. In all these confessed points consisteth the maine matter of my former exception Notwithstanding this euidence Mr. Parsons saith If it were graunted c. What tricke shall we call this Yet thus much being graunted marke Master Parsons what will follow hereupon viz. that the Church of Rome hath lost her supposed Motherhood For Bellarmine presuming that all auncients held the Church of Rome to bee the Mother-church addeth in these words Quod non videtur c. that is Which seemeth not to be true saith he except in that sense because Peter who was the Bishop of Rome had ordeined all other Apostles Bishops either by himselfe or by others See this and blush at your ignorance Bellarmine reasoneth thus Except Peter did ordaine the rest of the Apostles Bishops your Church of Rome cannot be truely called the mother-Mother-church but that Peter ordained the rest of the Apostles Bishops Mr. Parsons doth hold it to be a matter disputable their Cusanus thinketh it to be improbable their Victoria concludeth pro certo that Certamly Peter did not ordaine them Bishops The conclusion will follow of it owne accord which is this viz. It is therefore but Disputable or Improbable yea an Incredible doctrine to say that the Church of Rome is the Mother-church When Mr. Parsons shall consider this I thinke he will repent him of this Reckoning 6. May I be furthermore so bold with Mr. Parsons as to demand why he did translate Authores eius sent entiae that is The Authors of this opinion into The authoritie of this opinion I say what authoritie had he for these trickes for of his purpose we will make no question For he was loath that the opinion of Bellarmine should be held by

Senensis nor any Romanist durst euer say that Saints and Martyrs did euer take their voyage vnto heauen by hell Thus then the Vide of Senensis bringeth no doubt in the cause for it is stil plain by the contexts that by it is not meant your Purgatory-fire 8. Finally to Mr. Parsons demaunding why I should ascribe more vnto the iudgement of Senensis then vnto Bellarmine I answer because Bellarmine did write in his heate of altercation but Senensis in the calme of contemplation By which distinction Senensis himselfe discerneth betweene the more and lesse iustifiable sentences of holy Fathers Albeit indeede I doe yeelde to Senensis especially because of the euidence of his proofe SECT IIII. The next Charge against Bellarmine 9. IT follweth in the Preamble Lastly hee professeth to confirme the Doctrine of Purgatory out of most of the Greeke and Latine Fathers And an other Iesuit saith more largely Of all the Greeke Fathers which is an Assertion as false as peremptorie euen by the confession of their owne Bishop saying that There is very rare mention of Purgatory in the Greeke Fathers and that the Latine Fathers did not all at first apprehend the doctrine thereof Mr. PARSONS his Reckoning THis is vnderstood by him as well of the name of Purgatorie not then so much in vse as that the most Ancient writers next after the Apostles time when many things were not discussed so exactly as in processe of time they were did not so clearely handle that matter Nemo iam dubitat orthodoxus saith he an Purgatorum sit de quo tamen apud priscos illos nulla vel quàm rarissima fiebat mentio No rightly beleeuing Christian doth now doubt whether there be Purgatorie or no Of which notwithstanding there was none or very rare mention made among those Ancient Fathers Whereof hee giueth diuers reasons and indeede the same may be said of sundry important other Articles of Catholicke Religion For so much as in the first Primitiue Church when the said Fathers were vnder Persecution and occupied in other weightie affaires against Heretickes and Persecutors they had not time nor occasion to discusse many things which the holy Ghost did afterward make more cleare to the Church by successe of time And yet doth not B. Fisher say that there was no knowledge of this Article of Purgatorie in the very first Fathers but onely his meaning was that the name nature and circumstance thereof was not so well discussed and consequently the thing more seldome mentioned by them then afterward by the subsequent writers And he after proueth it out of many Greeke and Latine Fathers and out of Scriptures The Reueiwe 10. Their Bishop Roffensis confesseth that among the Greeke Fathers there is Rarissima mentio that is Most rare mention of Purgatorie M. Parsons translateth Rarissima very rare which is but a tricke of a nibler Againe M. Parsons will haue vs to vnderstand Rosfensis so as though he had onely meant that The name nature and circumstances were not so well discussed or mentioned by ancient Grecians But Roffensis speaking of Purgatorie it selfe saith that Aliquandiù incognitum fuit serò cognitum vniuersae Ecclesiae c. This is the confession of their owne Bishop Roffensis That is Purgatorie was for a while vnknowen and not till of late knowne to the vniuersall Church With what assurance can the Romanists call the Doctrine Catholicke that is Vniuersall which was not knowne vniuersally in the Primitiue Church of Christ Yet hath Rome adopted this Article of Purgatorie and suffered this Creeper to come into her newe Creede vnder the title of a doctrine necessarie to saluation But more of this hereafter SECT V. The next Charge 11. IF any shall but obserue in this one Controuersie the number of witnesses brought in for confirmation of this their new Article in the name of Ancient Fathers which are by the confession of our Aduersaries meerely counterfeit as Clemens his Constitutions Clemens his Epistles Athanas in Quaestion Eusebius Emissenus Iosephus Bengorion Hieron in Prouerb August ad fratres in Eremo the Liturgies of S. Iames and others All which as they are vrged for proofe of Purgatorie so are they reiected by their owne men I desire to be challenged for proofe hereof as Forged or Corrupted or Apocrypha c. M. PARSONS his Reckoning HE cannot be trusted in any thing he saith For these are not so much as named by Bellarmine except onely the two fitst in a word or two much lesse are they brought in for principall Authors in the Catalogue of Ancient Fathers whose Authorities hee setteth downe for proofe of Purgatorie So as this is one deceitfull vntrueth to make his Reader beleeue that these are our chiefe Authors whereas Bellarmine besides these doeth alleadge twentie viz. Ten of the Greeke Church and as many of the Latine The Reuiew 13. But if this Answere of M. Parsons bee fraught with grosse vntrueths what faith shall any man giue vnto him First I named not Bellarmine in that place but spake in generall of the ordinarie practise of our Aduersaries in alleadging corrupt and counterfeit writers Secondly I called not the foresaid Authors either chiefe or principall as M. Parsons pretendeth And lastly in saying that Bellarmine nameth but the two first of the foresaid Writers viz. Clemens his Constitutions and Athanasius is a notable falshood for Bellarmine alleadgeth Eusebius Emissenus Iosephus Bengorion and S. Iames his Liturgie So that I know not what M. Parsons meant by his denying of this except happily he laid some wager of falsifying and meant to winne it Mr. PARSONS his Reckoning and Charge against his Aduersarie SEcondly it is an other manifest vntrueth to say that our Doctors do confesse all these Authors to be meerly counterfeit For albeit some of them be excepted against or called in question by some Writers whether they be the true workes of the Authors whose names they beare or not and thereof all reputed Apocryphall that is hidden or 〈◊〉 Yet it followeth not that they are meerely counterfeit for that they may bee ancient workes and not to be contemned though not of those Authors The Reueiwe 14. M. Parsons is so transported with passion that hee hath forgotten the last clause which I vsed concerning these Authors to wit that they are either forged or corrupted or Apocrypha and so Apocrypha as being sometime not Obscure onely but euen to be contemned Whereof in these and others I shall giue him such a taste before we end our Reckoning as may I thinke soone set his teeth on edge SECT VI. The last Charge 15. IF he shall furthermore marke said I how true Fathers and Scriptures are instanced in for proofe of the same Article whereof when I speake of Fathers most of them when I speake of Canonicall Scriptures all of them are found by the iudgement of their owne Doctors to be tortured wrested and

any man reade the booke and chap of Barclay and he will woonder at the impudencie of this vaunter for he speaketh no one word of gathering Councels or comparison of spirituall authoritie between the Pope and Emperour concerning their gathering of Councels or Synods but of a quite different subiect of taking armes by subiects against their lawful temporall Princes And what will our Minister then answer to this manifest calumniation so apparently conuinced out of Doctor Barcley The Reuiew 12 The Minister will answer that M. Parsons was scarse sober when he called either my allegation a calumniation or his answer a conuiction for in that place of Full Satisfact part 3. chap. 10. pag. 27. I did not produce the testimonie of Barkley for the point of Gathering of Councels but for the generall matter of Temporall subiection due vnto Emperours by all persons Which Argument Barkley prosecureth at large in the place alleged being lib. 6. cap. 26. pag. 521. confuring the common answer which is vsed by the Romanists which is this that Although Christ and Iohn Baptist and other Apostles did not teach that wicked Kings ought to be remoued in the first plantation of the Church among Infidels yet afterwards this was the doctrine when Kings should become noursing Fathers Their owne Barkley in the sentence which was alleged confuteth that thus This ought to be vnto vs saith he a weightie argument to know that neither any of the holy Fathers or any orthodoxall Writer for the space of a full thousand yeers and more although the Church did abound with troups of armed souldiers and the number of tyrants was great is red to haue taught any such thing either in word or writing Adding concerning the times of Emperours which professed Christ although heretically Why did not then those excellent Pastors and Fathers excite the people against Valens Valentinian the yonger Heraclius and other wicked Princes 13 Who yet againe in his late booke Depotestate Pontificis writing professedly against Bellarmine by whom the Pope is held to haue a supreme power Indirectly in temporall causes doth cap. 34. argue thus The Pope hath not now greater power ouer temporall Princes than he had before he was a temporall Prince but before he was a temporall Prince he had no temporall authoritie any way ouer Kings therefore now he hath no such power any way ouer them This Confession of their Barkley must needs choake the Romish vsurpation By which my Reader may obserue the impotencie I forbeare to quit him with his owne word of impudencie of this calumniation and his notable falshood in dissembling the opinion of Barkley Now we come to Card. Bellarmine M. PARSONS his Reckoning He vseth heere afarre greater immodestie or rather perfidie in mine opinion The Reuiew 14 These are fearefull termes Will you stand to them Let vs then trie your exceptions which concerne first words and then matter but first let vs examine the materials the summe whereof followeth The summe of M. PARSONS Reckoning The drift of Bellarmine is wholly against M. Mortons assertion for that he denieth that euen the Emperour had any spirituall authority for calling of Councels but onely that they could not well in those dayes be made without them and that for foure seuerall causes The first because the old Imperiall lawes made by the Gentiles were then in vse whereby all great meetings of people were forbidden for feare of sedition except by the Emperours knowledge and licence The second because the Emperors being then Lords of the whole world the Councels could not be made in any city without their leaue The third for that the Councels being made in those dayes by publike charges and contributions of cities and especially of Christian Emperours themselues it was necessarie to haue their consent and approbation in so publike an action And the fourth and last cause for that in those dayes albeit the Bishop of Rome were head in spirituall matters ouer the Emperours themselues yet in temporall affaires he did subiect himself vnto them as hauing no temporall state of his owne and therefore acknowledging them to be temporall Lords he did make supplication vnto them to command Synods to be gathered by their authoritie and licence But since those times saith Bellarmine Omnes iste causae mutatae sunt All those causes were changed The Pope himselfe being now a temporall all Lord also as other Kings and Princes are which was brought to passe saith he by Gods prouidence that he might haue more freedome and libertie to exercise his Pastorship The Reuiew 15 This relation of M. Parsons is very true and my drift was only to shew how that Popes were anciently subiect in temporall matters which is Bellarmins flat assertion wherein then haue I abused his meaning M. PARSONS Reckoning Let vs consider the varietie of sleights and shifts which this our Minister hathvsed first hauing said that generall Councels were not gathered without the Emperours cost he addeth presently of his owne and with their consent which is not in the Latine The Reuiew 16 I will not trouble M. Parsons his patience with any quittance of like language although I am often prouoked therunto by his rigid and vnconscionable taxations whereof this must needs be one For the Latine words of Bellarm. are these Non poterant aliquid facere inuito Imperatore that is They viz. the Popes could doe nothing without the Emperours consent Yet this deuout olde man feareth not to say that I added these words of mine owne albeit he himselfe confesseth the necessitie that then was to haue the Emperours consent This is my kinde Reckoner But let him proceed M. PARSONS his Reckoning Then he cutteth off the cause of the Popes subiecting themselues in those daies touching the temporality which was because they had no temporall state of their owne The Reuiew 17 I alwaies thought it lawfull for mee to make vse of an Aduersaries confessed conclusion such as this is Popes were formerly subiect vnto Emperours without the expressing of his causes especially seeing that the causes whatsoeuer they were are likewise confessed to haue beene since changed Was little Dauid to blame for cutting off Goliah his head with Goliahs his owne sword because he did not first tell what mettall was in it and who was the maker thereof Ridiculous And as fond is his next exception M. PARSONS Reckoning Bellarmine said that Popes made supplication to the Emperors to command Synods to be gathered which T. M. translateth that they would gather Synods as though Bellarmine did affirme that Empersrs had right to doe it The Reuiew 18 As though Emperors may not bee said to doe that which they commanded to be done Iosuah commanded the Tribes of Israel to be assembled and yet it is written that He assembled the Tribes of Israel Or as though the Emperors had not right to doe that which the Pope did by Supplication intreat him to doe

altered in the Conclusion into Are then the which there cannot be a greater absurdity in Syllogismes This was we see the deepest charge and the most vgly deformity in his Syllogisme which I expressed to the full and made it palpable by the like example of changing the verbe Maketh into Are thus Euerie man in framing his owne will and Testament maketh his owne Executor but P. R. frameth his last will and Testament Ergo P. R. is his owne executor And now Mr. Parsons doth nimbly skippe ouer the fourth and principall part of my challenge I will not vpon this aduantage prosecute him with his owne tearmes of Witting fraude cousenage and grosse lying I am glad to perceiue in this his dessembling that he hath so much grace as to be ashamed of his ignorance I tooke vpon me to reforme Mr. Parsons his Syllogisme by one more perfect which hee would gladly reproue The summe of his answere followeth Mr. PARSONS his Reckoning IF his owne new Rule may take place that euery distinct clause must be held for a distinct Terminus it will not onely haue two but foure or fiue termini at least and so will the Reader finde by looking onely vpon it And I would prosecute the matter more at large but I see we haue spent too much time about these trifles The Reuiew 17. Is this all the Reckoning which you can make to call a matter in question to put vs off only with Ifs and And 's viz. If you would prosecute it at large c. Heretofore wheresoeuer you thought there was a cause of some reprehension of a Syllogisme you could take the paines to reade a Lecture instructing your Reader in the knowledge of the partes and termes of a Syllogisme setting before him a scurrill example fraught with ridiculous scofferie yet now after you haue bin more then ordinarily prouoked to proue your Syllogisme legitimate or else to admit of mine for your better instruction you reserue the disquistion hereofvnto your Reader I say no more but that you are wise 18. And so it might haue become you to haue beene in not reprehending my Reprehension of your subdiuision which stood thus Alying Equiuocation is that which is knowne to bee such vnto the speaker and this is to be subdiuided for it is Either a material lie which is when the thing spoken is a lie in it selfe but not so vnderstood of the speaker Or A formall lie when the speaker doth know it to be fals Here M. Parsons exacteth that I should haue said A materiall lying Equiuocation A formall lying Equiuocation and the omission hereof he termeth craft but hee will finde out his owne folly I doubt not after that he hath more soberly considered that these words Alying Equiuocation being subdiuided into these members Materiall Formall the Genus viz. A lying Equiuocation doth necessarily inferre the members and betoken the Materiall lying Equiuocation as for Example Euery man is eyther Sober or Distempered Will any say that it is a craftie Diuision because it was not expressed thus Euery man is eyther aSober man or a Distempered man I pray you good Master Parsons giue mee not such Reckonings which when they come to be scanned must make me be indebted vnto you for correcting of your ignorance euen in Triuiall points and in plaine Dunstable high-way The foure next charges 19. The foure next points wherein M. Parsons hath beene charged with falshood as first concerning the allegation of the text of Esay secondly the testimony of Carerius about Verè and Verò thirdly the testimony of Dolman alias Parsons about the admitting of a King fourthly the testimony of Otto Frisingensis about Pope Gregory the seuenth alias Hildebrand are by him repeated afterwards in their more proper places whether we also referre them that we may auoyde superfluous repetitions and finde and examine all matters at their owne proper homes CHAP. III. About the Question of Rebellion especially concerning the Title of M. Parsons booke of Mitigation SECT I. The Preface of M. PARSONS HE bringeth in a scornefull fixion in stead of sound arguments by feigning a ridiculous conference or Colloquie in a Stage-play betweene the Mitigator and Moderator wherein he himselfe may seeme to play the Vice c. The Reuìew 1. In that Colloquie was set downe not my fixion but that I may so speake the faction of M. Parsons and his fellow for both M. Parsons did commend the Moderate Answerer for his learned Answer and the same Moderate Answerer did condemne all others as insufficient who being without the Kingdome of Great Britaine should as M. Parsons doth attempt to write of these our English cases by implication censuring M. Parsons to be no better then the Dauus in the olde Comedie that is a busie and troublesome body Such an one as their owne Priest hath expressed M. Parsons to be calling him a Great Polypragmon So that he shall not neede to seeke abroad for a Vice Well it were if he plaid that part in iest and not in earnest that so he might proue onely ridiculous and not obnoxious also as we shall presently demonstrate The third Inquirie 2. Whether Mr. Parsons did not betray his cause euen by the title of his Mitigation saying It is not possible for his Romish Clients to liue in obedience and subiection vnder his Maiestie of Great Britaine This I iudged to be a Title maruelously preiudiciall vnto them in whose behalfe hee published his Mitigation Let vs see how soberly M. Parsons will discharge himselfe Master PARSONS his Reckoning THis Inference is a meere cauilling of a seditious spirit for that my writing aunswereth directly vnto the purport of his seditious Booke saying that it was impossible for Catholicke subiects to liue quietly in his Maiesties Kingdome My aunswere being then contradictorie to Mr. Mortons assertion conteining so much as was needfull to haue bene said vnto his negatiue he saying that it was impossible and I aunswering that it was not impossible A Reueiwe 3. Soberly quietly good M. Parsons so shall you beter remember that which I told you before in the preamble and which you haue forgottē to wit that howsoeuer this answer if it were true might confront your Aduersary T. M. against whom you writ who said that It is impossible forthem whom you haue inspired to performe due subiection yet could it not satisfie the States of our land to whom you writ who seeke in a dutifull Allegeance not a constrained but a voluntarie nor a suspicious but a religious possibilitie of subiection which alwayes according to the Oath of Allegeance inferreth an impossibilitie of being rebellious nor can they be contented with your may but with a must be subiect as then I told you out of the Apostles doctrine commaunding Euery soule to submit it selfe vnto the powers that be explained by Saint Augustine The Apostle saying saith he that It is necessarie

ouerthrow my whole Treause as euer perhaps he found in any man professing wit and learning The Reuiew 3. I haue seene your Reckoning Master Parsons wherein with the sweate of your braines you haue forced your wit to defend a desperate cause with no small confidence In the which cause there is more neede of Grace then of Wit but I am willing to ioyne issue with you and to stand vnto the tryall of any indifferent Reader Let vs begin at a beginning Mr. PARSONS his Reckoning HE beginneth his Confutation thus How now would my Reader heare this noble Equiuocator confuted By Fathers or by his owne Doctors or by sensible Reasons This will be no hard matter to performe as I hope God willing to auouch in due time So he And this you see is no otherwise then if a bare and broken Debtor hauing beene long called vpon to pay his debts should step forth at length in a vaunt before a multitude saying to his Creditor Come Sir What sort of gold will you be paid in Will you haue it in Spanish Pistolets Portugall Cruzadoes French Crownes Zechnies of Venice Dallers of Germanie or English Angels And his Creditor shall answere him Sir any kind of coyne would content mee although it were but half-faced groats or single-pence so I might haue it And that then the other shold replie as M. Morton doth here Well I hope God willing to pay you in time so leaue him with lesse probability of paymēt then euer before And were this now substantial dealing for satisfaction of his creditors And doth not Mr. Morton the very like that asking heere the Reader whether he would haue Fathers Doctors or Reasons for proofe against me produceth neuer a one but saith that he hopeth to doe it in time The Reueiwe 4. Take heed M. Parsons your Reader will suspect that you will turne a Trapezita and Bancker for you are so skilfull in coyne as though you had serued some apprentishippe in the trade but I feare rather that you will turne a Coyner yet not of money but of phantasticall conceits for which cause you haue beene noted by your owne fellowes for The abstract quintessence of all coynes and coggeries one point wherof you haue bewrayed euen in this your ridiculous figment For after my demand How my Reader would haue the Equiuocator confuted Whether by Doctors or Fathers or Reasons I added that for the present I thought it a more glorious Victorie to confute him that is M. Parsons by his own Assertion Wherein I dealt with M. Parsons not as with a Creditor for alas what credite is there in an AEquiuocator but as a man would doe with a cousener whom although I might haue conuinced by witnesses and sound Arguments yet I thought it sufficient for the present especially in a Preamble to confute him as Christ did the Seruus nequam by the wordes of his owne mouth 5. Notwithstanding M. Parsons a sober Reckoner forsooth hath called this kind of dealing an Arte of Mountebankes But I hope he will haue cause to say I deale not vnhonestly with him when I pay him with his owne coyne that is whilst I confute him with his owne Answeres albeit they are sometimes I confesse more bare then halfe-faced groats SECT II. The state of the Question 6. COncerning the answere of Saphyra in the Acts of the Apostles who being demaunded by Saint Peter whether she Sould the land for so much answered yea for so much reseruing in her minde as it was supposed To giue in common or To tell it vnto you M. Parsons vpon supposall of this her Reseruation answered notwithstanding that she lyed and that No clause of Reseruation could free her speech from a lie I was right glad to heare our AEquiuocator confesse thus much and hereupon haue aduentured to call his doctrine of Mentall Equiuocation the Arte of lying And so I hope I shall proue it to be before that we haue ended this peece of our Reckoning Mr. PARSONS his Reckoning BBut first how doth he proue that she had this meaning of Reseruation in her minde it is but Mr. Mortons imagination to ascribe it vnto her for it may more probably be thought that she had neuer any such cogitation to make her speech lawfull by Reseruation but absolutely to lie which is most conforme to the text it selfe of holy Scripture c. The Reuiew 7. This first obiection M. Parsons himselfe knoweth to be an idle 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for as much as we were both of vs contented to suppose that this woman did vse a Mental Reseruation and also to graunt that notwithstanding this her Reseruation her speech was a Lie 8. The reason why I thought she vsed a Mentall Reseruation in this clause With purpose to tell it vnto you or such like is this because euery one in suppressing a truth doth therby purpose not to tell it vnto him whom he would deceiue and therefore cannot choose but retaine that clause of Reseruation To tell it vnto you c. 9. Howsoeuer Mast. Parsons could not but vnderstand that a true argument may be grounded vpon a bare supposition as when the Apostle said If an Angell from heauen shall preach otherwise then that which we haue preached vnto you let him be accursed It would not haue become any to repile vpon the Apostle saying How doe you imagine that an Angel from heauen can preach false doctrine because the foundation of his exhortation was not an Assertion that an Angell from heauen could preach otherwise but a supposition that If or Although an Angel from heauen should so doe Wherefore we agreeing in the supposall to wit that she vsed a Mentall Reseruation let vs see whether our next Reckonings will agree Master PARSONS his Reckoning BVT not to cut him off so short and put him to a non-plus on the sudden I am content to doe him this pleasure as to suppose with him that the poore woman might haue some such reseruation in her minde as M. Morton imagineth to wit that as the Priest saith truly I am no Priest with obligation to tell it vnto you so shee might meane that I haue solde it for no more to acquaint you withall and then I say albeit we should admit this supposall it is denied by vs flatly that these two examples were alike as now I haue declared The Reuiew 10. I thanke you that you are pleased not to recall what you haue already graunted I hope that you will be furthermore so good as to declare more plainely why albeit the Priest and the Woman vsed the same kinde of Reseruation yet the one may be thought to haue spoken a Truth and the other a Lie Mr. PARSONS his Reckoning THere was obligation in Saphyra to aunswere the truth and in the Hearer lawfull authority to demand it for that hee was lawfull Iudge but neither of these two things is in the Priest that is

their Barkley in lib. 3. cont Monarchom cap. 2. I let passe diuers such particular persons and chuse rather to obserue his want of dutie or els of abilitie in answering for his headfather the Pope M. PARSONS his notable Omissiens in forsaking the necessarie defence of Popes §. IV. 18 The Oration of Pope Xistus Quintus is famous for commending Iacob Clemens who was the murtherer of Henry 3. King of France and for that cause was that Pope propounded as the Patron and indeed paterne of all rebellious Doctors Which doctrine was likewise obiected to the Moderate Answerer but he very moderatly forbare euen to taste or touch it After him M. Parsons the Mitigator beheld the vgly spectacle and swallowed this whole Camell Now at length he commeth in with a new Reckoning but doth not reckon for this his grandfathers debt Boucher also was brought in by Barkley lib. 6. contr Monarchom c. 28. pag. 536. commending the act and reioycing thereat whom the foresaid Barkley doth therefore condemne pag. 535. 539. of treason for patronizing that fact and by doctrine perswading men thereunto 19 There came in also a Canonist who reported the periurie of Pope Gregory 12. whom M. Parsons suffered to die in debt neuer opening his mouth to free him either à toto or à tanto After this the Bull of Pope Paulus 3. against Hen. 8. and another of Pius Quintus against Q. Elizabeth were heard bellowing out a Fulnesse of Apostolicall authoritie for the rooting out of Nations and of Kingdomes according vnto that of Hier. 1. Behold I haue appointed thee ouer Nations to root them vp and to destroy them Which Papall exposition of that text was an impudent glosing M. Parsons can say nothing but that it was spoken by allusion vnto that text of Ieremy which poore ragge can not possibly couer so great a shame for the text of Ieremy was expresly cited in their Bulles for confirmation of their authority by way of interpretation accordingly as their Carerius lib. 1. depotestate Papae had done But it was confuted by the true and proper expositions of Lyra who said that the Prophet Ieremie did not destroy but only denounce they should be destroyed By S. Gregorie who noteth not destruction by fighting but only by preaching But especially by S. Bernard lib. 2. de Consid. ad Eugen. reprouing the Pope for the abuse of this place by turning the spirituall and ministertall rooting out of sinners into a Temporall dominion Heere M. Parsons imitated the AEgyptian dogs Lambunt fugiunt they vsed to lap a little at the riuer Nilus and forth with to run away and all for feare of a Crocodile So heere the Mitigatour tooke a bite but spying Lyra Gregorie and Bernard make against the Popes and perceiuing that his Answer of Allusion was but an Illusion he speedily tooke his course another way 20 For further demonstration of the noueltie and impietie of the Papall claime in temporall affaires for the refusing of Emperours and deposing of Kings from their Soueraignty there was produced the example of Christ who thought his temporall Dominion superfluous for him as Bellarmine confessed then the example of the Apostles who were subiect vnto Heathenish Emperours after that the examples of All Christians for the first two hundred yeares who albeit sometime they had equall force yet they professed subiection vnto temporall Magistrates whereby the doctrine of Christians became glorious as Tolossanus confessed And vnto these were added the answerable Testimonies of Tertullian Cyprian Nazian Athanas. Ambrose Basil Gregory Heere the maine question of Allegeance was handled and prooued from Antiquity heere if euer the Pope did need his helpe But such was the desperatenesse of the cause that M. Parsons would not come off not with so much as a bare-faced groat in part of paiment Finally their Sanders intruded himselfe ' auouching the Donation of Constantine wherin all the kingdomes of the Western world were said to haue beene conferred by the Empetour Constantine vpon Pope Syluester Anno. 300. and vnto him Carerius assented and all for the magnifying of the Papall iurisdiction in temporall things Which other of their Doctors did thus far confute as to grant that The most ancient Histories Authors of best credit and such as did purposely record the Acts of Constantine did not make mention of that Donation So Canus loc Theol. lib. 1. cap. 5. Which Pope Pius Secundus did count to be a counterfeit Donation so Balbus lib. de Coronat seeing that Pope Boniface 9. Anno. 1400. was the first that challenged the Donation of the City of Rome saith the same Balbus Adde we heereunto how Carerius pretended that the Emperor must necessarily haue the Popes Confirmation which dealing their Lupoldus and Balbus both Bishops did prooue to be most false I supposed if his ability had been answerable to his charity he would not haue suffered Iesuits Priests and Popes to languish vnder these Arrests yet all this while we heare not of our friend the Moderate Answerer Will M. Parsons neglect him also The Omissions of M. Parsons in neglecting his peculiar Client the Moderate Answerer leauing him in the conuiction of many foule errours and slanders §. V. 21 This Moderate Answerer is the man that writ against the booke of Discouery of Romish Positions and Practises of rebellion whom therefore M. Parsons hath particularly commended for one who acquitted himselfe learnedly So that this man might seeme to haue a peculiar interest in M. Parsons his partonage Shall we now trie how he is often left in the lurch to shift for himselfe I may not insist in all points yet some few I may not omit 22 The Moderate Answerer answered for his Catholikes in generall that they taught not A power simply ouer Kings in temporall affaires which was prooued to be a singular falshood out of their Bozius and especially out of Carerius who challenged the Common consent of Canonists and Diuines to the contrary He vnder the names of two or three Authors pretended that their Doctors Defended not violent deposing of Kings who are in their opinion Heretikes which is a most prodigall vntruth and so prooued to be by the testimonies of their Moderne Doctors such as were Rainolds Parsons Alen Coster Bellarmine and others He propounded a Canon teaching that No Clerks may take armes neither by their owne nor by the Popes authority as though any such Canon were now in force which was prooued to be a loose ouerlashing by their Rainolds Alan and by Sanders He in the name of all Romanists did teach that they Allow Magistrates who are Protestants to be as competent Iudges in all temporall causes in as ample maner as if they were of their owne Religion before whom iudging according vnto law they may not equiuocate Wherein he was contradicted by Rainolds who absolutely denied that Protestants haue