Selected quad for the lemma: doctrine_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
doctrine_n	ancient_a	church_n	hold_v	2,250	5	6.2009	4	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A23611	A defence of true Protestants, abused for the service of popery, under the name of Presbyterians in a dialogue between A. and L. two sons of the church : where it is debated, whether discenting Presbyterians be as bad or worse than papists : and other popish assertions are detected.		1680 (1680)	Wing A1; ESTC R21360	17,633	34

is saies he that the truth in these Opinions not being so generally entertain'd among the Clergy nor the Arch-Bishop and the greater part of the Prelates so inclinable to them as to venture the determining of these Points to a Convocation How far then were these Opinions from being counted the Doctrine of our Church when there was no expectation that they would be accounted Truths by our Church representative Sure they act more agreeably to the sense of the Church of England thus far who reject these Arminian Tenets then they who embrace them L. But though the Presbyterians hold all the points of the Protestant Religion yet they maintain other Opinions besides such as are pernicious to Civel Government and Secular Princes upon this account they may be said to be worse than Papists their Principles of this nature being more dangerous A. I have heard some such thing said diverse times but I must do them this right as to declare that I never saw it proved nor ever expect it Upon a strict Inquiry I find their principles about Civel Government to be no other than what the eminentest of our Prelates and learned Divines such as Bishop Jewel Mr. Hooker Bishop Bilson Bishop Morton c. have owned or defended so far is it from being true that their opinions herein are as bad or worse than the Papists And they may challenge all the Papists in England masqued and unmasqued to make it good from the Writings of any considerable Divines approved by those of that Denomination But that you may have a more particular satisfaction let us take a view of some Popish Principles respecting Civel Government and Humane Societies some wherein we are particularly concerned and then compare them with those charged on the Presbyterians by their bitterest enemies They hold That all Protestants are Hereticks and as such excommunicated and accursed That no sort of Protestant Magistrates or others have any just Title to Estate Liberty or Honour but may lawfully be stript of all That they ought to be put to death and burnt alive when they are in their Power That when they can't proceed judicially against them they ought to destroy them by open Wars and Massacres or Assassinations That all Lawes Divine and Humane will have them destroyed That it is not only lawful but a Pious and Meritorious Act to slaughter them That it is no more sin to kill them than to kill a Wolf or a Dog That by what obligations soever either of Kindred Friendship Loyalty or Subjection they be bound unto them they may or rather must take Arms against them being Hereticks and then must they take them to be Hereticks when their lawful Popes adjudge them to be so That those who will not promote the Catholick Interest by Warrs and Arms ought to be proscribed and a Reward proclaimed to those that kill them That they are worser than Turks and that it is more just and necessary to exterminate them by force of Arms than to overcome the Turks That no Peace is to be made no Commerce to be kept with them That no Faith is to be kept with them though confirm'd with Oaths That a forreign Bishops is supream Governour of these Dominions in all matters Ecclesiastick and in temopral matters also in order to Spiritual Concerns That England is the Popes Kingdom and the King of England is the Popes Subject even in Temporals and holds his Dominions of him in Fee That no Maegistrate among us hath any Jurisdicton That they are not obliged to Answer their Interrogatories nor owe them any more reverence or subjection than to meer private Persons That they may delude them with Equivocations in Assertions or Oaths and may usesuch Equivocations when they are sworn before the Magistrate not to Equivocate That it is no Mortal Sin to Charge false Crimes upon or bear False Witness against any in their own Defence That it is no Sin to kill those who go about to discover the Crimes they are guilty of That Bishops are not the Subjects of Secular Princes That they cannot be Guilty of Treason That Churchmen are exempted from all Jurisdiction of Civel Magistrates That the Pope may exempt Lay-men as well as the Clergy That no Protestants Nobles or Commons can be Members of Parliament That Laws not agreeable to the Roman Decrees are of no moment That since a Wife owes no Conjugal Duty to an Husband who is not a Papist nor a Slave any Service to his Master and Parents loose the Superiority and Dominion which they have by the Law of Nature over their Children therefore no man should wonder that in the like case a Soveraign should loose his Superiority and Right over his People and Kingdomes That the Pope may command the King's Subjects not to Obey him That he may Compel them into Rebellion That he can absolve Subjects from the Oaths of Allegiance and Obedience to their Prince and the Princes from Oaths Oblieging them to their Subjects That an Heretical or Protestant King is no King That he is a Tyrant and Usurper and may be used accordingly That to acknowledge such a King is to advance a Dog to be Soveraign over Men. That he hath no real Majesty or Soveraignty That no Treason can be committed against him That he can enact no Laws nor is capable of any Acts of Sovereignty That Acts of Jurisdiction done by his Authority are Void and Null by the Law of God and Man That no War can lawfully be denounced or waged by him though the Cause be never so just That no Leagues Treaties Confederacies for his advantage as a Heretick however confirmed do obliege Catholicks That they may lawfully betray their Trust and deliver up to the Enemy what their Prince commits to their Charge Garrisons Troops Magazines Treasure c. That a Prince falling from Popery looseth all his Authority and Dignity even before Sentence That after Sentence no Man can lawfully Serve or give Aid unto such a Prince That he not only may lawfully but ought in Conscience to be Dethroned Subjects being bound to it by the Divine Precept and upon their Salvation That it is the Subjects Duty to take up Arms against him That the Pope may Depose a King not only for Heresy or Tyranny or Sacriledge or Perjury or Breach of Promise or Effeminacy or any of these many Faults which are liable to Excommunications but also for favouring Heriticks or tolerating Schismaticks or for Profuseness in spending the Publick Treasure yea or for Ignorance or Negligence or Insufficiency or Weakness of Mind or Body That if a Prince be never so well qualified for Religion or other Accomplishments the Pope may Dethrone him if his Holiness think it but Expedient Nay he may do it without any Cause and dispose of his Kingdom as he lists That if Princes be Protestants he hath as much Right to throw them out of their Thrones as we have to drive away Wolves or Mad Dogs or Wild Asses That

or two Instances upon a Mistake too that the Laws did warrant them Compare these Cases impartially and you will find that upon the same ground you condemn these Protestants others may as justly condemn our Church all even the best of Kings and the most innocent Part of the World L. This seems specious but may we not upon the same Plea acquit the Papists A. In no wise The Case is vastly different in every Point All the Papists are engaged in continued Treasonable and Rebellious Practices against Protestant Princes and States by the Laws and Rules of their Religion Their Principles oblige them to it Universally under pain of Damnation It will be a Damnable sin not to be Rebells and Traytors when they have Power and Opportunity and hopes of Success Those who to the utmost endeavour not to exterminate them fall under the damning Censure of the Church nor are they to desist from such Practices while there are any Hereticks Kings or Subjects left alive And those that perish in such attempts how Treacherous and Bloody soever are assured of the Rewards and Priviledges of Martyrs None can have reason to doubt of any of these but those that are strangers to the Decrees of their Popes and Councils the Positions of their approved Writers and the Histories of former or latter times L. You say something that requires further consideration A. Pray consider further of it and suffer not your self to be transported with unreasonable Heats against true Protestants so as to be exposed to the Subtilties of Counterfeits or to be Surprized with the sly insinuations of others which may insnare you in Popery before you are aware L. You spake before of some Protestants of a new Edition pray who do you mean A. I mean such who profess themselves to be Protestants but entertain themselves and instill into others such Principles as are like to betray them to Popery when occasion serves One of them we have discoursed of already Another is this that they are no true Churches who have not Diocesan Bishops By this the far greatest Part of Protestants are cut off from being True Churches while the Church of Rome is allowed this Honour and happiness And so it is and will be Inferred that it is better for those of the Reformation to turn Bapists then to continue in their Present State And if it be better for them it will be as good for us of the Church of England for the difference cannot be great where the ground of it is so small and of so little concern that most both Papists and Protestants count it no Part of Religion Upon this account also there will be no reason left why we should not turn Papists but because we have Diocesans and this can be no reason to those who know they may have them in the Church of Rome If all that Protestants do beleive and Practice as Christians and Protestants is not Sufficient to make them true Churches without such a sort of Officers it will be concluded that the meer retaining of such Officers will scarce make us in England a True Church upon this account besides others For whatever is not of Christs appointment cannot make that to be a True Church which would not be so other wise but whether Diocesans of the Roman mode be of Christ's Institution is a Question both in the Church of Rome and England and so it will be questionable at least whether this in England be a True Church consequently no Soul can be unquestionablely safe but in the Church of Rome Not in the Reformed Churches for they are not True Churches with the men of this Principle not in the Church of England for it will scarce be probable that this is a True Church since those Men leave no other Probability for it but what there is for the Divine Institution of such Diocesans and this is denyed by many of the Romanists and by ten to one amongst Protestants that are learned and judicious And who that loves his Soul will run the venture of it on so great odd's So that maxim how much so ever cryed up by some Bigots amongst us razes all other Reformed Churches even to the Foundation betrayes the Church of England under pretence of securing and advancing it by leaving the whole weight of it to lean upon a Straw but is of real and great advantage to the Papists serving to Ferret Unstable Souls out of all other Churches that they may run into that of Rome The Protestant Religion will scarce be thought worth the owning if all the Points of it together be of less weight and value than this one and this such a one wherein Religion is so little concerned Our People are also prepared for Popery by those who would clear the Church of Rome from Antichristianism and Idolatry and Heresy Hereby the Grounds of our Departure from Rome are removed and a plain Way made for our Return and what is there left to deter those from Popery who believe those Suggestions They will charge them with some Superstitions and Errours and what Church is there which hath not some Tincture of these The Antient Churches are complained of on this Account by some of their best Writers and that the Errours in the Roman Church may not seem more or worse they Justify many and excuse others and have devised Shifts to reconcile all in a manner to the Doctrine or Practice of our own Church The direct Tendency hereof is to make People indifferent whether they be Protestants or Papists and to leave them in such a Posture as their Interest may determine them to either Religion and so disarm them of all that might inable them to resist any Temptation to Popery I may also take those into the Reckoning who under the Name of Protestants write Volumes for the Service of Popery One Doctor is notorious for this viz. he that writ a Satyr against our Reformation and miscall'd it a History as he hath served divers others of his Books wherein following Sanders a Roman Priest noted above others as one that had abandoned both Truth and Modesty he hath made such a false and odious Representation of the Protestant Reformation and the Reformers as hath endangered many and quite perverted others particularly two near the Crown have declared the one in Writing the other in Discourse to diverse Persons of Quality that the Book mentioned turned them off from the Protestant Religion to the Communion of the Roman Church Hereby this Historian such as he is for he hath nothing requisite for such a one but his Style and therein may be out-done by a Writer of Legends or Satyrs of which his Books are a Medly hath done more Mischief to the Nation and Church than all the Divines of his Temper and Principles are like to do good To say nothing that a late Popish Scribler hath filled diverse Sheets with Passages in Favour of Popery extracted out of his Histories L. If this be so I hope the Rulers of our Church will set some publick Mark of their Displeasure upon such Books to prevent further Mischief A. The Mischief done already is so great that the Wisdom of the Nation is to seek how it may be repaired But if these who are most significant in the Church would testify their Resentment of it to the World and withal discountenance those who make it their Business to magnify little Differences among true Protestants and would blow up Bubbles into the bulk of Mountaines thereby dividing us one from ancther that we may be ruined together by the Papists who equally design the Destruction of us all If they would abate those Rigours the ill Consequence of which is visible and allay the Heats wherewith men of ill Natures and as had Principles such as neither become good Protestants nor true English Men would enflame them If they would stigmatize such Maxims as under Colour of serving some little Interest slyly undermine our Religion and trapan unwary people into Popery if they would really confute those who are ready to charge many of them as having more kindness for the Roman than the Reformed Churches and being more ready for Accommendations with the former than the latter and as still obstructing what is offered to secure us from the dreadfull return of popish Darkness and Tyranny they would do Justice to themselves and others and good Service to their Country and the Protestant Interest FINIS