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A25568 An answer to several remarks upon Dr. Henry More, his expositions of the Apocalypse and Daniel, as also upon his Apology written by S.E. Mennonite, and published in English by the answerer ; whereunto are annexed two small pieces, Arithmetica apocalyptica, and Appendicula apocalyptica ... S. E., Mennonite.; More, Henry, 1614-1687. 1684 (1684) Wing A3379; ESTC R10256 245,076 439

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as the Beast was revived when the former Politick state of the Empire was restored in the Ten-horned Beast so when the Pope created a new succession of Emperours it then became a complete Image of the former Beast So that the Beast and his Image are not so denominated from the affairs of Religion but from the Civil state of the Empire yet so as to include Religion as it is complicated with the civil affairs Ans. Here the Remarker again misseth the mark quite by not taking heed to that inviolable Rule in expounding the Opened-book-prophecy viz. that it sets out the state of the Empire in reference to matters of Religion and the pure worship of God and Christ and that these Expositions are the surest that respect that For what cares the Spirit of Prophecy for taking notice of the changes of secular States and Kingdoms but so far as God's true Church and the Purity of his Worship are concerned and consequently those that worship him according to the Laws he has appointed The Pagan Emperours of Rome were Pontifices Maximi as well as Emperours and the Pagan Religion part of the Laws of the Empire it being enacted and ratified by the Supreme Powers thereof as the civil Laws were Wherefore the Pagan Religion equally if not more being the very life and soul of the seven-headed red Dragon that is of the Pagan Empire which would cease to be the red Dragon if the Pagan Religion ceased than the Civil Laws themselves when the Pagan Religion was in a sort abolished by the sixth head of the red Dragon his turning Christian namely the Emperour Constantine c. Certainly that was the Head and then that was wounded to death and wounded to death in the fullest sense that the Opened-book-prophecy can be truly thought to take notice of as chiefly to aim at For what is the Church concerned in the affairs of Kingdoms but so far as they either hinder or further the pure worship of God and Christ And in the same sense that the Head was wounded to death is the Beast said to be wounded in this verse by the sword namely in the red Dragon's fight with Michael and the Martyrs the battel being described in the immediately foregoing Chapter and therefore where should he get his wound but there For the Martyrs sticking close to the truth of the word which is the sword of the spirit got the victory over the Beast they loving not their lives unto the Death Add unto all this that the Beast could not revive before his head wounded to death was cured Neque enim sanatio istaec factum aliquod posterius fuit sed ipsa Nativitas Bestiae novissimae as Mr. Mede judiciously concludes from the genuine sense of the Text of the Prophecy But in this civil or secular sense that the Remarker drives at his head was not cured till Carolus Magnus was made the Western Emperour But he is represented in this Vision in the beginning of it as with ten crowned Horns so with his head cured Such he was when he emerged out of the Sea he was revived again from his deadly wound Therefore the Epocha of this Vision as I noted before commenceth as low as the reign of Carolus Magnus according to the Remarker and the 42 Months of the Beast must end after two thousand years after Christ. And besides this according to the Remarker's sense of the reviving of the Beast and Beast's Head will continue dead near three hundred years after the body of the Beast was revived This it is to attempt to unlock the Apocalypse without that excellent Key the Rule I have so often mentioned Chap. 14. Vers. 7. IF the zeal of those Greek Emperours named were not a sufficient fulfilling of the monition of the first Angel the overrunning of the Empire by the Saracens would be far more proper to make it up both in regard of time and other respects than the subduing by the Turks But neither of them are signified being Visions belonging to the sealed Book Nor needs there any farther fulfilling than what was by those Greek Emperours Ans. The Expositor's words on this verse are these That this Angelical Monition was the most loudly and earnestly urged upon the Christian World at the dreadfull siege and storming of Constantinople and subduing the whole Eastern Church and Empire to the Turk Which makes neither the plague of the Saracens nor Turks to belong to the Opened-book-prophecy but lets them keep their place in the Prophecy of the sealed Book But implies onely that the voice of that Angel is not confined to the Greek Emperours onely but may be stretched to as many either secular Potentates or Prelates or other eminently zealous men and observant of the severe judgment of God against the Idolatrous Greek Church For ought I know those early Evangelici may come in for a share here who were Preachers of the everlasting Gospel that which was purely contained in Scripture and declared against the Idolatries and Superstitions of the Church of Rome and sealed their Testimony with their bloud I mean the Waldenses and Albigenses Who if they made any use of the judgments of God by the Saracens on the Empire as well as others might do of his judgments by the Turks and it can be made out I am not against it And from the end of the Albigensian War which was finished Anno 1242 to the taking of Constantinople which was in the year 1453 in that Interval there were many famous men declaring for the everlasting Gospel against the Antichristian doctrines and practices and they making the Pope of Rome the Antichrist could not but denounce this approaching judgment You may see their names in Alstedius and David Pareus And upon the taking of Constantinople by the Turk the voice of this first Angel would be louder in preaching the everlasting Gospel and denouncing the fall of Antichrist or Babylon till the second Angel could tell the news that it was done See Alstedius his Chronologia testium veritatis where you may easily make Collections to this purpose Vers. 8. The fall of Babylon viz. the commencement of it is most aptly applied to the separation of the Albigenses and Waldenses from the communion of it to which may be added the separation of the Greek Church from it before the subduing of the Empire by the Turks But to apply this to the Reformation will clash with the admonition of the third Angel Ans. The Waldenses and Albigenses could not be the Angel that declared that Babylon was fallen but were a people that were aggrieved that it stood but were an holy good people and truly Evangelical and preachers of the Everlasting Gospel and denouncers of the judgments of God against Babylon predicting that it would fall and therefore belong to the first Angel And though Mr. Mede would draw the affairs of the Waldenses and Albigenses to the voice of the second Angel yet he has not the confidence to say
Bloud of the Lamb so as to be exalted to the Heavenly station of ruling by the Man-child being caught up unto God and his Throne c. and obtained sentence against their Adversary to be cast out c. yet was that sentence executed as before by the War v. 7. Ans. See what head-strong prejudice will doe As if the Remarker shou'd say though this eleventh verse does imply that the War was betwixt the Primitive Christians and their Persecutors yet it was not But it does most certainly demonstrate that the War was betwixt the Primitive Christians and their Persecutors For the words are these For they overcame viz. the red Dragon by the bloud of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony and they loved not their lives unto death What can be a more express description of Martyrdom than this This is not a description of a War of Emperours against Emperours with their armies in the field where they fight upon equal terms but of Martyrs with the word of their testimony passively undergoing for their witnessing to the truth what their cruel Persecutors would inflict upon them Vers. 12. The Dwellers in Heaven are bid to rejoice by reason of the salvation and strength and Kingdom of God and power of his Christ which was to come and therefore surely must signifie them to whom the same came whose particular concern this matter of joy was whereas Angels and Martyrs are no farther concerned in it than in general as they are concerned for the welfare of the Church Nor can those that were exalted by preferments to the Political Heaven of the Empire be concerned in it farther than they were in such a state as to have the coming of salvation and strength and the Kingdom of God fulfilled in them For it onely respects those that are in such a state who are called dwellers in Heaven in respect of the Heavenly station that they were exalted to thereby after the Devil and his Angels were cast out and the autority of Christ established as Prince of the World For then they became the joyfull company with the Lamb on Mount Sion singing the Song of the victory c. who as they are there markt on their foreheads for preservation so they are the worshippers in the Temple and Altar or the two Witnesses meted for the same purpose and are the same that are called dwellers in Heaven Ch. 13.6 and are thus distinguished from those dwellers on Earth against whom the woe is pronounced by reason of the power the Devil will have over them still after he is cast out Ans. The Expositor has taken in both senses of Heaven political and natural they being both sure and consistent one with another and the joy of Angels and Martyrs at the welfare of the Church is too great to be slighted or omitted But to ramble into mystical senses and reach out to the company of the Lamb on Mount Sion is not to interpret by rule but to trifle All Apostolick Christians were concerned in this victory of the Church and most of those in high place in the Empire turned Christian. But the foregoing verse so plainly determining this joy to the victory of the Church in the times of Constantine which shews that the Kingdom of God and power of his Christ was come already and is said to be so v. 10. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. not yet to come it is a strange vagary to ramble from the Antemedial synchronals to the middle synchronals which undoubtedly the company on Mount Sion belong to And for the Remarker's groundless conceit touching the worshippers in the Temple and Thysiasterion the vanity thereof has been above sufficiently shewn And for the dwellers in Heaven Ch. 13. v. 6. we shall consider it when we come at it But for this present place if the Dwellers in Heaven be those in high degree the Dwellers on Earth must naturally signifie those in low degree or common people as the Expositor has interpreted it Vers. 15. Arianism cannot be here intended more than the Catholick doctrine they both running into extremes and each maintaining their cause with like fumous Animosity But by the Serpent's casting out water like a floud seems to be signified the frequent tumultuating of the common people and Magistrates that continued Pagans against the Christians whereby great outrages were oft committed But such Arians and Catholicks may be also included who under a cloak of Religion did violently prosecute each other out of enmity or self-interest to the great reproach and ruine of Religion Ans. The contention betwixt the Arians and Catholicks is most certainly included and is that which History most of all rings of and most highly concerned the Church and therefore could not be omitted in this Opened-book-prophecy which concerns the state of the Church As for any other contests less notable betwixt Christians and Pagans they were such as could not hazard the Woman's being 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 her being carried away with the sloud None but a contention betwixt the Christians themselves and such as shaked the very foundation of their Religion could put her in that hazard So that this is a very lank sense which the Remarker gives of this passage Vers. 16. The Earth that helped the woman by swallowing the sloud may signifie the sober stayd sort of people who being either seasoned with principles of Religion or being of peaceable spirits and obedient to authority did endeavour to asswage all such tumults and discountenance and oppose all such furious Animosities and were for composing all differences in a legal orderly and peaceable manner Ans. Undoubtedly that sloud of contention was the hot Contest betwixt the Arians and Catholicks Could therefore the soberer sort of common people Christians or Pagans compose this difference What an absurd conceit is this The Earth that swallows up this sloud does not signifie the common people here though sometimes it is a Symbol of them But the sense is onely this That this floud of contention was swallowed down and dried up by the help of Oecumenical Councils as some rapid Torrent is suck't down by the gaping of the Earth This is enough But farther curiosity might invite a man to fanfie that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which is included in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 whence Oecumenical comes is alluded to or Earth in general put for clayish Earth which in Daniel is a symbol of the Ecclesiastical Power of which Councils did consist And then it fits obviously and exquisitely Chap. 13. Vers. 1. THE name of Blasphemy if it does intend Idolatry yet it hath a farther signification as All sins and blasphemies shall be forgiven men but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost c. Where the malignant reproach of God's Spirit evidencing it self in the works of our Saviour is said to be unpardonable blasphemy And the like reproaching of the holy Spirit manifesting it self in the Saints is likewise blasphemy though not of so heinous a
fall there were no Deceivers nor Devils And the Devil when he is restrained to his Infernal confinement yet all that then can be said is but this Let no man when he is tempted say I am tempted of the Devil for he during his infernal confinement tempteth no man But every man is tempted when he is drawn away of his own lust and enticed c. Iam. 1.13 And certainly in the Millennium men are not born without Original sin nor is their body of flesh less subject to various lusts than the Aethereal bodies of Angels were So that what is here produced is mere Rhetorical colour no solid or substantial Argument Vers. 3. This conceit of iron adamantine rigid Laws c. and these to be in a time when there will be so little need of them does shew an imagination much upon the rack If the wicked in the Millennium are to be kept under such Laws they will have little heart to join in that Song Blessing honour glory and power c. be unto him that sitteth on the throne and unto the lamb for ever Which is said every Creature in Heaven and Earth shall doe ch 5. But these will be times for which Paul says The earnest expectation of the creature waiteth and wherein it shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God it being not made subject unto vanity willingly but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope Rom. 8. viz. That wickendess which Iohn says the whole world lyes in being the result of its thraldom and delusion under the power of the Devil which lapsed man became subject unto yet in hopes to be delivered therefrom they becoming in this Millennial State partakers of their hopes having all stumbling-blocks of iniquity taken away and receiving all advantages to further them in the ways of righteousness they will joyfully walk therein and through the blessings they find do attend their so doing will be moved to join in the said Song of Blessing honour glory and power c. Ans. Here 's but the Repetition of the same things in the beginning of this Remark which were in the former and therefore they need no new Answer But afterwards he offers at two new Arguments against this conceit as he calls it of iron adamantine rigid Laws For if there be such in the Millennium the wicked will have little heart says he to join in that Song chap. 5.13 Blessing honour glory and power c. Whenas it is said Every creature in Heaven Earth and under the Earth c. shall join in it In answer to which I onely demand Whether the old Serpent in his Infernal confinement which is under the Earth will either join in or say Amen to that Doxology In what sense he will the wicked will also The other Reason is That this is the Time viz. the Millennium wherein the Creature shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the Sons of God But I here demand first Whether all the Creatures or all men will be thus delivered from the bondage of corruption nay whether all men that live in the same Countries that they that belong to the new Ierusalem do I suppose the Remarker will not adventure to assert it Wherefore there being those among the Saints that are not Saints themselves these rigid Laws are fit to bridle them But then secondly I deny that this place of Rom. 8. refers to the Millennium but to the state of the Resurrection For then onely will this deliverance from the bondage of corruption be and the attainment of the freedom of the Sons of God which is the Title of the Angels For then in our glorified bodies we shall become 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 equal to the Angels And this is the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which is mentioned v. 23. which we groan after and wait for viz. the Redemption of our bodies that they may be glorified and made Angelical such as the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 have the Angels or Sons of God Vers. 4. The first Resurrection is not a Revivification into their glorified bodies to reign in Heaven For there Saints cannot be said to reign there being none there to be Subjects to them And that State is not attainable till the Resurrection at the last day when Christ hath promised to raise up those that believe in him Iohn 5.28 29. Also the following words Blessed is he that hath part in the first Resurrection on such the second Death hath no power do shew that the first Resurrection is not an emerging above the Regions of Mortality by being revivified into glorified bodies for then the pronouncing the second death to have no power over them would be needless Which is also farther evidenced by the reign in the first Resurrection being a thousand years whenas the Heavenly state is everlasting And it 's a great violation of Scripture to make a thousand years when spoke of the Resurrection to signifie Symbolically when it 's so oft in the Chapter used Numerically and by coherence of the discourse must every-where needs have the same signification Therefore the first Resurrection is a Privilege of the Martyrs that suffered under Antichrist to reign in the Millennial State as the Powers of the Air viz. the Devil and his Angels did among the worldly Powers till he was bound in the bottomless pit Ans. I answer Saints may be said to reign in Heaven 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 at least if not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Besides what will the Remarker say to that Text 2 Tim. 2. If we suffer we shall also reign with him And to Rom. 8. Heirs of God and joint-heirs with Christ if so be we suffer with him that we may be also glorified with him that is partake of his glorious Kingdom according to that Mat. 25. Come ye blessed of my father inherit the Kingdom prepared for you c. Whence it is plain that the Saints may be said to reign in Heaven according to phrase of Scripture And if there be a Polity in Heaven as most certainly there is the Martyrs may have several Provinces to rule over in a Briathick State as the Cabbalists seem to call it And that the Heavenly State is not attainable before the general Resurrection is against the opinion of the ancient Fathers as you may see in Mr. Mede And the last day reaches from the beginning of the Millennium to the end of the World or general Resurrection as I have discoursed this point more copiously in a Letter to a friend and therefore am loth to repeat it here The adding to the mention of the first Resurrection that the second death has no power over them is not needless both because it more manifestly imports that this Resurrection is not meant of a Political Resurrection but a Physical and also that it assures us of the sense of that passage in the Epistle to
For if those many were the greater number then the Laodicean state would not be applicable thereto if the less then the Titles of the Camp of the Saints and beloved City would not agree therewith and the purity of their external worship in all will not mend the matter unless Hypocrisie may entitle one to Saintship Ans. That the Church of Philadelphia though degenerated into a Laodicean state may be called in these straits the Camp of the Saints and the beloved City appears out of ch 11. The City is there called holy though trampled down and polluted by the Gentiles Nor is it any straining of the Text to make them called the Camp of the Saints because there were many Saints there though not all such whenas the greater part according to several degrees of Saintship might be Saints and these less degrees of Saintship an effect of the degeneracy and that the external worship in all was still pure and incorrupt and they that used it did it out of judgment and conscience being sincerely pleased in that they thought God was pleased with it this adds a farther weight to make the City both holy and beloved especially in comparison of the rabble of their enemies And therefore it was not Hypocrisie but a solid ground that entitled this Camp to Saintship And if we should suppose the most degenerate part to have listed themselves in the Army of Gog and Magog as it is exceeding probable the Holy City seeming in such imminent danger this is manifestly consistent with the Camp being called the Camp of Saints and the City the beloved City and likewise with the degeneracy of those times I mean the Laodicean degeneracy at once those degenerate persons being now drained out of the Holy City into the Army of Gog and Magog and so the City lest fit to retain the Title of holy and beloved still without any scruple or exception Vers. 13. Death and Hell are here made one to be the Species of the other viz. The first to signifie those dead by diseases and the other the whole Region of Mortality But surely it will be a better account of the Text to suppose this to be a like distribution of the damned into two parts as the twenty four Elders and the four Beasts is of the Saints viz. into the Governours and governed and that Hell signifies those children of wrath who have been Rulers in the World under the Powers of darkness and Death those that died in their sins in their private condition but were not publick Instruments of evil as to others And that this distinction of them is made by reason of the different state or degrees of punishment that befalls them after this life according to that saying The Lord soon pardoneth the mean but the mighty shall be mightily tormented This sense will well agree with v. 14. viz. Death and Hell were cast into the lake of fire but so will not the other sense For not all that dye of diseases much less shall the whole Region of Mortality be cast into the lake of fire c. Ans. Death and Hell are not here made the one the species of the other but rather the one a part of the other 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which is translated Hell signifies the dark invisible Receptacle of the deceased and Hell has its name from an Anglosaxon word that signifies to cover 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 therefore which is here rendred Hell is the common or universal Receptacle of all the deceased The Sea gave up the dead that were in it and Death and Hell delivered up the dead that were in them There was begun an Enumeration of the Receptacles of the deceased or by a Prosopopoeia of the Keepers of these Deposita viz. the deceased The Sea is one Those places that take in the bodies of those that dye of diseases another but to be short he abruptly names that common Receptacle or Keeper of all the deceased 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which is translated Hell This is the plain meaning of the Text. But the Remarker's two parts are out of doors because if Death and Hell make two parts Sea will come in for the third and so spoil the conceit which otherwise had no harm in it For whereas he most of all applauds his exposition as so well agreeing with v. 14. Death and Hell were cast into the lake of fire if he take in Sea too to cast into the lake of fire it will make strange work But the Interpretation of v. 14. by the Expositor does not suppose Death there to signifie either all that dye of diseases or none but those that dye of diseases but to signifie Death it self and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Hell to signifie this Region of Mortality wherein he reigns as you may see in his Exposition where the sense is sufficiently clear and smooth Chap. 21. Vers. 1. SEA does not signifie here the unquiet multitude of the wicked but as it does in the second Trumpet and the second Vial viz. The over-spreading of worldly Dominion that does overflow and overwhelm men with power as the Sea overflows the Earth Ans. The nature of the Sea is to be tossing unquiet and moving which therefore very well sets off the disposition of the Mobile vulgus especially the wicked part of them that are easily ruffled into seditions and rebellions But when this new Heaven and new Earth that is this New-Ierusalem-Polity is settled there will be no such thing as the appearance of a fluctuating Sea or of a Sea by invasion breaking in upon the Land but all will be in settled peace and quietness as the Expositor has explained this passage But to interpret Sea and Waters not of multitudes of people but of worldly Dominions the ruling Part is quite out of the road of the Prophetick style But the worldly Powers and worldly Dominions hugely fill the Remarker's fancy Vers. 2. The New Ierusalem coming down from Heaven is not a Polity to be settled on Earth by Councils but it is God's taking up his abode among men to rule and govern them by his truth and life dwelling in them whereby they shall walk in the light of life and so not need the constitutions of Councils Ans. The New Ierusalem come down from Heaven is the new Heaven and the new Earth and a new Heaven and a new Earth in the Prophetick style is a New Polity See the Alphabet of Iconisms in Heaven and Earth And besides in that it is the City Ierusalem in opposition to the City Babylon it must be a Polity antistoechal to a Polity City signifying a Polity in the Prophetick style And a Council and Laws will be requisite yea necessary in the Millennium for there will be Draconists and Bestians though under the Hatches mingled within the Dominions of the Kingdom of Christ. And it is a childish conceit to think that through so vast a Dominion as the Millennial will be there will be none but