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A30810 The scornfull Quakers answered and their railing reply refuted by the meanest of the Lord's servants Magnus Byne. Byne, Magnus. 1656 (1656) Wing B6402; ESTC R30264 132,489 135

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and so not for Christ but for your selves And surely so long as so much of thy self lives that thou must needs be Christ not with him or in him but he himself all this while thou dost not suffer thy self to come under the Crosse of Christ Further know friend what it means to be saved by hope to hope for that we see not and so with patience to wait for it Ye know Pauls desire was to be dissolved and to be with Christ and he cries out if in this life onely wee have hope in him we are of all men most miserable therefore wait the day and time of your dissolution Read 2 Cor. 5. 1. to 10. The life of hope is a sweet life seeing the grace came from heaven looks back into heaven and never leaves groaning and longing till it return into the bosom of the Father and the earthly house be changed into the heavenly Therefore be not over-hasty thou knowest the men that would enter in without God were slain therefore be not high-minded but fear It 's a sad thing to be undone by our own works undone by Religion observation abstinence as many an Hermit Monk and man hath been Be as holy as thou wilt in the holy place in Christ onely glory not in thy formall holinesse Thou dreamest thou art Christ and in the holiest and yet all can see thee in weaknesse darknesse and in infirmities like other men But I would not break thy neck but rebuke thee with patience though all this will provoke thee to scorn and to turn again and rent me And therefore I 'le let thee alone to be discovered by the light and day of God Repl. Thou goest on to spend a little more breath against Tythes and Tythepriest and hirelings who denie Christ Answ This is no news therefore I 'le let it passe in silence till we come more fully to speak of Tythes But thou sayest Repl. Vnto us a reed is given like unto a rod and the Temple of God we know and the Altar and them that worship therein and thee to be in the Gentiles court I see among the prophane Answ Here thou wilt be measuring though thou want the rod of strength that is out of Sion and so knowest not how to measure the Temple and the Altar and the worship that God sets up in Sion What is below thee thou mayest measure but what is above thy reason thou canst not see to measure well till thou art born into it Therefore be not wise in thine own conceit boasting of things beyond thy measure seeing not hee who commends himself is approved but whom the Lord commendeth That I am in the Gentiles Court by nature I know is true But that God hath led me out to worship in his Temple and to sacrifice upon his Altar according to the measure of his son in me this thou canst not see and yet I dare not commend my self as thou dost knowing I have nothing but what I have received and so must not glory in my self but in the Lord But thou sayest Repl. I have slain the witnesse which quickened shall be and kindle my torment and none shall quench it Answ The witnesse that was living in me is living still he is not slain and dead but alive to reprove me when I wander and to heal and revive me again with the sweetnesse and comelinesse of his voice and countenance And by this faithfull and true witnesse the false witnesse is slain the floud of the Dragon swallowed up and though he be quickned in thee and others to affright me yet he torments me not his fire is quenched by the Lords goodnesse and mercy and so I shall dwell in the house of the Lord for ever Repl. But death hath passed over me and reigns over me thou sayest Answ Yet can see deliverance from his sting and power in my spirit though I know he dwels in my flesh and reigns there and so he doth in thee And notwithstanding thy passing the first and second resurrection yet there is a resurrection which yet remains and a last day too which thou shalt know to thy torment and wo who knowest not the Scripture in this nor the power of God Repl. Thou sayest further Them which sin not after the similitude of Adams transgression I know not nor what it is that death hath passed over and so am I reasoning and ghessing it may be infants in yeares who have death written in their natures and thou biddest me shew such a Scripture that infants have death written in their natures else the plagues I must have Rev. 22. 18. Answ What I spake of Infants was and is a clear truth they sin not as Adam did and yet they die And that they have death written in their natures I wonder with what face thou canst deny Doth not their dayly dying shew that this enemy death lives in their natures And for Scripture to prove this what thinkest thou by Davids Childe by Bathsheba that died 2 Sam. 12. 18. Was not death written in this Childs nature See how wise thou art But thou goest on to tell me Repl. I say it may be Infants in knowledge and here I am ghessing which shews forth another spirit then wrote the Scriptures and so thou sayest neither of Infants in year nor of Infants in knowledge did Paul speak but said death reigned from Adam to Moses even over them c. Rom 5. 14. But that them I know not therefore put my ghessings and meanings to the Scripture Answ That which I spake concerning Infants in knowledge is a truth too who though they have not such knowledge as Adam had and so their sin be not so great because their light is not so great yet they have a light which being sinned against that sin lets in death upon them To confute this thou bringest nothing but thy bare word that it is not so and so let it go I could have told thee that that Scripture was to be understood of your fruitfull generation as you call it that death reigns over you even you also that have not sinned after the similitude of Adams transgression that are not so bad as Adam found sinning and eating of the forbidden Tree yet even you must dye This I know you dream is the truth of that Scripture yet this is but a ghesse too and as little true as mine Understand it of whom you will you must put your own meaning when you are asked who is meant by that particle them seeing the Scripture doth not there dete●mine it And if your meaning may go why not anothers that hath as much face of truth as yours But when you discover your selves I shall know better what to reply unto Further thou tellest me Repl. Once there was some tendernesse in me because of sin some groaning for deliverance setting my feet in a way that leadeth out of Egypt but a Captain I chose wheeled about into Egypt and in the lusts
Here 's no judging murmuring complaining dividing persecuting murdering These are the wayes of Egypt and Babell In Canaan there is rest from all the works of Egypt and darknesse Here 's unity in the midst of variety Here all are looking into the onenesse into the pure image and nature of the Father and this light keeps harmony and agreement between all the sons of Canaan And so in Canaan there 's joy melody singing Halleluja's Here the world is not mentioned flesh and bloud is not at all remembred with delight the former things are passed away and all is become new God alone is made mention of to be Lord and King and set up upon the Throne for ever Quest What is the vail which divides between the holy and most holy Answ It 's the flesh of Christ and all outward dispensations which divide and keep Saints whilest in weaknesse and bondage though holy in some measure from entring into the most holy into the substance truth it self or into the choisest glory of the father This vail of flesh in Christ was rent when he suffered death or was crucified in the flesh Through which death or rending of the vail of flesh he entred himself and made way also for us to enter into glory Heb● 10. 19. 20. Having therefore boldnesse to enter into the holiest by the bloud of Jesus by a new and living way which he hath consecrated for us through the vail that is to say his flesh And when this vail of flesh of letter and shadows and outward dispensations is rent and crucified by the eternall spirit in the true Christian then he the Christian enters into the holiest into the glory and joy of his Father Quest What is the death which over all men is passed and how camest thou to live Answ It 's first the breaking of the body or this earthly Tabernacle which comes upon all without exception for sin Rom. 5. 12. Secondly it's the dying unto Paradise and the Kingdom of God which man hath drawn upon himself by his lusting after and eating of the fruit of the four elements By this lusting and eating he becomes infected poysoned in his minde and will with the fruit of the Sun and Stars And this is the taking and eating of the Tree of temptation and his leaving the Tree of life and the heavenly fruit And thus he becomes an earthly man and dead Death stickes in his minde and soul and man is dead to all feeding upon God and the Son of God who is the Tree of life Man can no more feed upon the fruit which grows upon this Tree of life which is Christ till Christ awake and arise in the center of his soul and carry him through all the Trees of temptation or the pleasures pompe and glory of the outward world into the inward or holy pure element of this spirituall body and pure nature and there awaken him to eat of the Tree of life and live for ever And this is the way whereby I and all the Sons of God come to passe from the spirituall death into the spirituall life in the pure nature of Jesus Christ Quest What is deaths reign from Adam to Moses And to Moses how didst thou come Answ From Adam to Moses there was no law written without all the law was within upon the conscience here was the rule or law which God gave the worlds to walk by Now the world acting against this light and law within kept sin in the world from Adam to Moses for till the law viz. given out by Moses sin was in the world Rom. 5. 13. Now sin alwayes brings men under the reign of death and so death reigned over all from Adam to Moses All had a law given within otherwise they could have had no sin for where there is no law there is no transgression Now mens breaking of this inward law was their sin and this their sin brought them all under the power and reign of death And thus it is still though there had been no Moses to write Gods commands in outward tables or Scripture yet the law being written within upon the conscience by the finger of God we sinning against this law do plunge our selves into the reign of death wrath and condemnation we kindle the Root of the fire and that being awakened makes our Hell or self-comdemnation within because we have sinned against our light Now by this light and law within we come to know Moses and that all the law she hath written are holy just and good because we finde the same within that he hath written without and nothing without but what is in spirit and power within Quest. Who are they which sin not after the similitude of Adams transgression which till Moses death reigned over Answ They are infants in years according to some who although they sin not actually after the manner of Adam yet they have sin and death written in their nature according to the weaknesse of this creation Or they are infants in knowledge who although they have not such full discoveries of the minde of God and such strength to stand as Adam had and so their sin be not so great as Adam which is to sin after his similitude yet they have a plain law within as before which bids them not act or eat that which the Lord forbids They living contrary unto this law fall into sin and death And in this childish condition are we all sound till the Lord quicken and save us Quest Art thou called immediately by the great God of Heaven and earth into the Ministery yea or nay Answ That Ministery I act in I have the anointing of the Spirit which doth sufficiently warrant my call But as for those who are called through Arts and Sciences and mens ordinations without this anointing I know they are the Pillars of Antichrist which I cannot own for the Apostles of Christ My calling teacheth me to renounce my fleshly wisdom and to live upon the grace and love of God commending that manifestation of the truth that is in me to every mans conscience in the sight of Christ Quest Hast thou seen Gods face yea or nay Answ To see the invisible God with carnal eyes I never did nor shall for no man hath heard his voice nor seen his shape but with the enlightned minde I have in some measure seen his face nay his heart in the precious revelations and discoveries of his Son towards me in love which Son is the face and heart and brightnesse of God opened in love wherein he shews and speaks forth plainly his exceeding kindnesse and goodnesse to all his Children This face of God I have thus seen which is more to me than a thousand vvorlds Quest Hast thou heard Gods voice immediately from Heaven and earth yea or nay Answ I have heard his voice as I have seen his face viz. inwardly spiritually which voice of his hath fetched me out of the grave of darknesse sin