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A02912 An advertisement or admonition, unto the congregations, vvhich men call the new fryelers in the lowe Countries, wrirten [sic] in Dutche. And publiched in Englis. VVherein is handled 4. principall pointes of religion. 1. That Christ tooke his flesh of Marie, haveing a true earthly, naturall bodie, 2. That a Sabbath or day of rest, is to be kept holy everie first day of the weeke. 3. That ther is no succession, nor privilege to persons in the holie thinges. 4. That magistracie, being an holy ordinance of God, debarreth not anie from being of the Church of Christ. After these followes certen demandes concerning Gods decree of salvation and condemnation. Helwys, Thomas, 1550?-1616? 1611 (1611) STC 13053; ESTC S116912 57,734 190

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their ●aith agree with mens mynds This overthrowes the first beginings of the Religion of God when men will chuse to walke with that people and in that profession of faith that ●est pleaseth their mynds not so much regarding the truth of their faith nor the● holy walkeing therein although they may mislike some thinges yet if some please them well they will not differ for smake matters and when they are once gathered and kn●t together in a multitude then though error after error be discovered and sinne after sinne comitted there may be no breaking vpon anie conditions And this overthrowes all growth of Religion VVee wish you and all great congregations to looke to your selves that you be not more carefull to mainteyne your multitude● thē the lords truth It is not a multitude in error sinne that can please God Noe a fewe walking together in the truth with holines shal be acceptable in his sight if they be but two or three he will be in the midst of them Therefore please not your selves in your multitudes walking in so manie errors as you do for if you repent not of these whereof wee have made mention and of all other your errors and false doctrins mainteyned amongst you the lord will assuredly make you desolate for thus hath he threatned and executed his judgment vpon Pergamus and Thyatira because they repented not and he threatnes and will execute the same judgment vpon you which sinne after the like manner of transgression of you repent not And your gifts and grates being manie lesse then the gifts and graces of those Churches and your false doctrines and sinnes already manie moe the greater and more spedily will his jugdments be vpon you if you repent not which wee vnfainedly disire the lord to give you Grace to do Be warned you that are leaders whilst it is to day harden not your harts why should you perish in your sinnes lead so manie simples soule to destruction with you Thus praying all the gratious harted amongst you to remember that the wise man saith Open rebuke is better then secreet love and the wounds of a lover are faithfull Pro. 27.5.6 And wee will hope that though wee reprove you wee shall at length find more love which is all wee require of you then they that so flatter you with their tougnes The grace of our lord Iesus Christ be with you Amen Cant. 4.8 COme from Lebanon even come from Lebanon and looke from the topp of Amanah from the topp of Shenir and Hermon from the Denns of the Lyons and from the mountayns of the Leopards To all the most vvorthy Governors Learned Teachers and Godly people of all estats and conditions in these vnited Provinces Grace and peace from God the father and our lord Iesus Christ VVEE amonge the rest of the people of God that professe the gospel of Iesus Christ have great cause to praise the lord for the freedome libertie that wee have in these Provinces to professe speake in the name of Iesus and wee are bound and do with all humblenes of hart thankfullie acknowledg it And wee beseech the lord in mercie to recompence it seaven-fold into the bosome of those that are in aucthoritie by whose great fauour wee enioy this blessed and comfortable libertie the which libertie wee have not the least thouhts to abuse neither by the grace and mercie of God will ever willingly do And wee humblie crave now that wee may with favour and good acceptance vse this Christiā libertie thus fair as to propound the ground of Religion by way of question and demaund wee doubt not through the grace of God but it being throughly and faithfullie debated and tryed by the Godly wise ●e learned it will put a short end to that longe continewed controversie of Gods eternall decree of life and d●ath to salvation and condemnation And thus with reverence and due respect vnto all deg●ees of persons wee proceed Our first question and demaund is 1. VVether God decreed not that if Adam did obey he should live Our second 2. VVhether God did not according to this his decree create Adam in his owne jmage Gen. 1.17 In righteousnes true holines Ephe. 4.24 giveing him thereby free will power in and of himself that he might obey live Our third 3. VVhether God did not according to this his d● w●rke of creation give Adam his comaundement 〈◊〉 obey live Gen. 2.16.17 Our fovvrth 4. God then decreeing that if Adam did obey he 〈◊〉 live and giveing him freewil power 〈◊〉 of hims●lf that he might obey live and 〈…〉 him to they live Our demaund 〈…〉 ●nderstanding it can be 〈…〉 that God decreed Adam should disob● 〈◊〉 were not this to make God in his de● 〈◊〉 worke in his comaundment contrary to himself doth God decree that if Adam did obey he should live decree that he should disobey dye doth God create Adam after his owne jmage with power will to worke righteousnes decree that he should worke vnrighteousnes sinne doth God comaund Adam to obey decree he should disobey wee demaund how these thinges can agree Our fift 5. VVhether God ever made anie other decree with man-kind concerming life death salvation condemnation but that he made with Adam Then God not decreing Adam to sinne by whome sinne entred Rom. 5 1● Nor Adam to be condemned by whose sinne condemnaton came on all men Rom. 5.18 hovv can it be said that God hath decreed anie man to sinne or anie man to condemnation Our Sixt. 6. VVhether Gods decree vvas not frō before all beginings That if Adam desobeyed sinned he should dye Gen. 2.17 hovv then is it said that it vvas Gods decree that he should disobey dye both these cannot stand can the first be denyed Our Seaventh 7. If anie should through vnadvisednes not knovving God or of vvilfull vvickednes deny Adam before his fall to have freevvill povver to vvorke righteousnes vvee demaund of them vvas not his vnderstanding holy his vvill holy and all the faculties povvers of his soule bodie holy had he not povver to vse them holily If all these thinges vvere not so hovv is that true vvhich God hath said In the jmage of God created he him Our Eight 8. VVhether Adam before his fall did not vse all the faculties povvers of his soule body vvholy to Gods glory vvhen the lord brought vnto him all the foule of heaven every beast of the feild to see hovv he vvould call them and he gave names vnto all cattle to the foules of heaven to every beast of the feild as also vvhen the lord brought the vvomā he had made to Adā Adam said this novv is bone of my bone flesh of my flesh she shal be called vvoman because she vvas taken out of man VVee demaund vvhether it be not heare most evident plaine
heaven for in heaven there is no imperfection not imperfect thinge And wee demaunde can heavenly bodies be weary can they be hungrie can they be trobled and their soules be in heavines or are they weake and mortall then is there miserie in heaven which cannot be Therefore it is to be concluded never to be denyed by anie that have Grace that Christ brought not his Flesh from heaven in that there was infirmitie and weakenes which is imperfection in his Flesh And heere haveing so fitt occasion let us pe●e a word by the way to them in whose sinne death hell hath consented which say that God was turned into or made Flesh How could God be made weake Flesh whch was full of infirmities as hath bene shewed by the scriptures Christs Flesh was And whereas some of these say that all that Christ suffered and did in the Flesh was but in shewe it shal be unto them according to their faith if they repent not for they shall have a Saviour but in shewe and though the wilfull perverse stiffnes of these mē promi●se littile hope yet let us say what by the Grace of God wee are anie way able if wee might by our best endeavours stopp men from runing so violently to condem●●●ion in this accursed iudgment that they hold which say all that Christ suffered and did heare upon earth was but in shewe And for this purpose wee will commend the godly disposed Reader unto the xv th Chap. of the first to the Corinths where Thappostle declares unto them againe the Gospell which he had formerly preached and which they had received and whereby they were saved except they had beleeued in vaine And he sheweth that first of all he had delivered unto them that Christ died for their sinnes and that he was buried rose again the third day So wee preach ad so have you beleved saith Thapostl not with standing a●l this some Corinthians were fallen to say that there was no resurerection of the dead with whome Thappostle because he knewe that they had recevid and beleeved that Christ died and was raised againe reasoneth thus If there be no resurrection of the dead then is Chrst not risen and if Christ be not risen then is our preaching vaine and your faith is also vaine and wee are found also false witnesses of God for wee have testified of God that he hath raised up Christ whome he hath not raised up if so be the dead be not raised Ior if the dead be not raised then is Christ not raised and if Christ be not raised your faith is vaine ye are yet in your sinnes and they that are a sleepe in Christ are perished and if in this life onely wee have hope in Christ wee are of all men most miserable The Appostle by these undenyable arguments and reasons proves Christs death and resurrection First that Christ died ver 3. And for profe of that he takes the testimony of the scriptures and by the same profe and warrant he proves that ●e was buried and ros againe and for further confirmation of his being raised from the dead Thappostle produceth the witnes and testimony of Cephas saw him and of the twelve and he was seene of more then fyve hundreth brethren at once and after of Iames Then of all the Appostles and l●st of all of himself and he addeth for further proofe hereof their preaching so wee preach saith Thappostle and he appealeth unto their owne consciences for this truth of Christs death and resurrection in saying unto them so have you beleeved Heare Thappostle that they might be brought to the sight of the depth of the iniquitie of this their error declares unto them what doth necessarily followe if there be no resurrection and so Ch●ist be not raised from the dead And first concerning us saith Thappostle you that say there is no resurrection and so that Christ is not risen From the dead this followeth you make all our preaching vaine and so are wee preachers of vanie thinges And you make us also false witnesses of God for wee have testified of God that he hath rased up Christ from the dead and this reproach do you cast upon us And upon your selves this evill do you b●ing in saing there is no resurrection and so that Christ is not risen From the dead your owne faith is in vaine you have a vaine faith and you are yet in your sinnes all your sinnes rest upon you further more by his your saying you bring this iudgment upon all that are dead in Christ that they are all perished and all the faith full in Christ that are leveing you make them of all men most miserable And haveing thus layde before them all the evill of this there saying there is no resurrection he concludes but now is Christ risen from the dead and was made the First fruits of them that sleepe To turne all this evill that Thappostle hath Heere shewed unto the Corinthians that said there was no resurrection where by it followed that Christ was not risen upon all those that say Christ died but in shewe and so died not at all in truth it is most plaine that all this evill comes upon their heads for in that they say Christ died but in shewe they must needs say he did rise againe but in shewe and so was there no resurrection in truth And here do they most miserable men that they are all make Thappostles preaching most vaine for then are they preachers of vanities and shadowes if Christ be dead but in shewe so do they make them false witnesses of God for they have testified of God that he rasied up Christ from the dead whome he hath not raised up if so it be he died not Then is the faith of the faith full in vaine and their sinnes are yet them if Christ be not dead and risen againe then are all that are a sleepe in Christ perished and all the faithfull liveing are of all men most miserable But we conclude against them all that say Christ died but in shew with the same words that the Apostle concludes against the Corinthians But now Christ died and is risen againe from the dead and was made the first fruts of them that slept And therefore Thappostles preachinges are not vaine neither are they false witnesses of God And the faith of the faithfull is not in vaine neither are any parte of there sinnes abidinge or remayning yet vpon them And the faithfull that are a sleepe are not perished neither are the faithfull in this life of all men most miserable But all this is their portion that say Christ died but in shewe which is not at all their preaching is vaine and they are preachers of most vaine thinges And they are false witnesses of God in that they testifie that Christ died not and so that God raised him not vp from the dead their faith is vaine and they are yet in their sinnes and all that are dead in this
and allowe of some that hold and mainteyne no faith concerning where Christ had his Flesh and so do you approve and mainteyne them in their sinne for whatsoever anie holds or mainteynes not of saith is sinne and to be ignorant of anie part of that the scriptures hath manifested is sinne and to determyne to remaine ignorant and so to continewe unto the end is death for without repentance anie one sinne is death as Thappostle Iames sheweth Iam. 2.10 VVho soever shall kepe the whole law and yet faileth in one point he is giltie of all Deceyve not simple soules then by noriushing them in their sinne which you do in saying it is not needfull to salvation to knowe whence Christ had his Flesh as though there were anie part of the law or gospell not needfull to salvation And if there be anie part of the law not needfull then Christ need not to have come to fulfill the whole law which he did as he saith Mat. 5.17 And if there be anie part of the gospel of salvation which Christ hath purchased with his blood Ephe. 1.13.14 not needfull to salvation then Christ hath purchased more then is needfull In the feare of God walke not thus by your owne inventions leading and suffering simple soules to walke in the waies of death and condemnation Of the day of rest The second is that manie among you and how farr you are all poluted wee knowe not but have great cause to feare do professe practice not to kepe the seaventh day a day of rest holy vnto the lord abolishing herein the law which was given in the mount out of the midst of the fire in the day of the assemblie and which was written in the Tables with the finger of God as is shewed Exod. 20.8.9.10.11 and Deut. ● 10 Of all wch whole law our saviour Christ saith Ma● 5 17.18 I am not come to distroy but to fulfill for truely I say vnto you till heaven and earth perish one jot● or one title of the law shall not scape till all thinge● be fulfilled not with standing all the spoken by God the father Iesus Christ his sonne manie of you with an high hand 〈◊〉 out and distroy one of these Ten Commandements written by the finger of God Exod. 34.28 and you will have but Nyne ren●g a sunder the law of God and casting away what is not pleasing vnto you Not holding the examples of the disciples of Christ a sufficient rule of direction for you who as is shewed Act. 20.7 and 1. Cor. 16.1 2. The first day of the weake came together to breake bread Vpon euery vvhich first day of the weeke when they were come together Paul ordeyned in the Churches that every one should lay aside for the necessitie of the Saincts that there might be no gathering when he came How will you be able to stand before the lord herein● H● hath established a law the which it is more easie that heaven and earth should passe away then that one title of the law should fall Iuc 16.17 And if you now be able to shewe which God forbid that anie should be so wicked as to enterp●ise that all these words spoken and written by God himself Remember the Sabath day to keepe it holy be no part jot nor tittle of this law then you have some cullor for the evill you practice and professe herein but dare anie moueth of blasphemy speake it or anie hand of blasphemy write it wee hope no why then give glory to God repent of this your sinne and pray the lord that if it be possible the thoughts of your harts the blasphemy of your mouethes and the wickednes of your hands may be forgiven you And sinne not as you do against God in turning away your feet from the Sabath of the lord and doeing your owne wills on his holy day wherein also you do wronge to man and beast to whome the lord hath in mercie given a speciall day of rest But yet further to shewe you that wich you shall never be able to annswere Our Sauiour Christ Mat. 24.20 speakeing of the distruction of Ierusalem which was to come to passe did long after his death saith Pray that your flight be not in the winter nor on the Sabath day sheweing vndenyably that ther should still remaine a speciall day of rest for the people of God to worship him on vpon which day Christs bidds them pray that their flight be not that they might not be forced to flie whē they should rest and worshipp God And if our Saviour Christ had ment that his disciples should have bene of your iudgment it had bene all one vpon what day their flight had bene God give you grace to see your great error herein that you may not still be hate full to God and men and Beasts And thus much of this except further occation be offered Omitting to shewe you all the confusion you bring into the Church when there shal be no day certen whereon the disciples ought to come together to edifie one an other to breake bread to pray and to gather for the Saincts if your rule be true which is as false as God is true they chuse whether they will come at all except you have authoritie to make a law to bind them which sure you have not from God even so do you confound hereby all due proceeding in the rule of admonition by the Church if there be no certen day when the Church are bound to meet But wee wi●l passe by this hopeing you will fall vnder the former ground and then you will easily see through the grace of God all these thinges and manie mo●e which accompanie that your error that do vtterly destroy all godlines Religion and the holy communion of Saincts Therefore repēt and forsake this your error for if you do thus distroy the lawe of God there can be no Religion of God in you Of Succession T● 〈…〉 your Leaders are 〈…〉 them that mainteyne a Succession and that 〈…〉 and you will have all 〈…〉 and tongues to come to you and 〈…〉 Ordinances of Christ and 〈…〉 administer in the holy 〈…〉 to you and 〈…〉 and 〈◊〉 power and all the holy 〈…〉 with the man of sinne 〈…〉 called o● God and 〈…〉 vnder the 〈…〉 vnder the 〈…〉 Rom. 3.1.2 〈…〉 because 〈…〉 of God 〈…〉 your 〈…〉 manner of way 〈…〉 of credit to 〈…〉 but 〈…〉 confess● 〈…〉 and the 〈…〉 vnto 〈…〉 proceed from 〈…〉 Ierusalem 〈…〉 call your 〈…〉 you and 〈…〉 do to your 〈…〉 them to it and to them everlasting distruction in so d●ing and suffering them selves to be to dra●n Thus then 〈…〉 speake of the heavenly 〈…〉 And 〈◊〉 people shall 〈…〉 vp to the mountaine of the 〈◊〉 to the 〈…〉 of the God of 〈…〉 will 〈…〉 S●on and 〈…〉 manner speaketh 〈…〉 ●rd shall send the 〈…〉 these Prophecies 〈…〉 〈…〉 become 〈…〉 you this 〈…〉 〈◊〉 taught the 〈…〉 when he said 〈…〉 word of