with both parts as well with bodie as with soule and so Christ if your proportion were any thing needfull which I wholly reiect as needlesse in the Sonne of God by this reason of yours needed no proper sufferings of the soule without and besides the bodie Paul vnderstoode Rom. 7. vers 7. when hee became a Christian that the desiring of euill is sinne before the outward act bee consummate You alleage Saint Paul as you doe the rest for matters that he neuer meant Paul speaketh not there of the actuall desire of euill when the will hath thereto consented such as was in Adam when hee resolued to eate the forbidden fruite but of the naturall inclination and first motions to sinne which are in vs after Adams disobedience but were not in him before his fall For that precept thou shalt not lust conuinceth and condemneth our nature to be corrupt and sinfull to which originall concupiscence the roote and spring of all sinne in vs cleaueth so fast that euen in our cradles this corruption excludeth vs from the kingdome of God if we be not regenerate in Christ by water and the holy Ghost In Adam besore sinne there was no such thing his nature was vpright and sincere as it was first created and voide of all concupiscence intended by this precept as the best learned of our time teach till by his transgression sinne entred and infected both body and soule Neither doe you conceiue right of Paul as he was a Pharisee when you suppose he tooke the outward fact of sinne onely to bee sinne Neuer read he thinke you when he was a Pharisee the words of Esay Aram hath taken wicked counsell against thee but it shall not stand Nor of Salomon The thoughts of the wicked are an abomination to the Lord and the euill thought of a foole is sinne Could hee not tell what to iudge of Hamans thoughts against the Iewes or of Achitophels purpose against Dauid or of Balams counsell against the Israelites The very heathen Philosophers placed vertues and vices in the minds of men and the prophane Poets would haue mens enterprises measured by the intent not by the euent The Pharisees were neuer so blinde as to thinke all counsels thoughts desires and lusts to bee lawfull against the manifest and expresse words of the law and Prophets but they blindly mistooke the law of God as forbidding externall facts onely which are hurtfull to others vpon paine of malediction and damnation They rather stood vpon the Popish opinion of veniall and mortall sinnes and did not thinke that veniall sinnes did exclude them from the righteousnesse of the Law nor from the kingdome of heauen Of that opinion was Paul when he was a Pharisee but vpon his conuersion and better instruction by the spirit of Christ hee vnderstoode that not onely euill desires and thoughts were forbidden by the seueral precepts of Gods law as deadly sinnes which the Pharisees would not admit to vphold their owne righteousnesse but that euen the secret tentation to sinne and the inward propension and corruption of our hearts are interdicted and condemned by this precept thou shalt not lust as sinne sufficient to exclude vs from the kingdome of God Your doctrine is very strange where you teach that the soule properly committeth no sin but by with the body that is the soule in it selfe by it selfe alone sinneth not You say all prouocations and pleasures of sin the soule taketh from her body all acts of sin she committeth by her body which speeches are exceeding vntrue and hurtfull To him that either fully can not or rightly will not vnderstand what is said all things seeme strange otherwise set aside your olde ordinarie phrases of proper and meere without which you can say nothing and the matter which you so much maruaileat is very plaine as well by the rules of Scripture as proofes of nature Is it so strange a doctrine with you that the whole man and not this or that part of man is by the word of God charged with the committing of euery sinne and guiltie thereof in such sort that the whole person is defiled therewith and shal be condemned therefore Depart from me Lord saith Peter to Christ for I am a sinfull man Blessed is the man saith Dauid to whom the Lord imputeth no sinne O God be mercifull vnto me a sinner saith the Publicane Tribulation and anguish vpon the soule of euery man that worketh euill saith the Apostle By which as by infinite other places of Scripture wee are taught that the whole person which is man himselfe is the sinner by which part so euer he sinneth Euery one that committeth sinne is the seruant of sinne saith our Sauiour Can the soule be in bondage for sinne and the body bee free Cursed is the man saith Moses that keepeth not all the words of the law to doe them Can the soule bee accursed for sinning and the body be blessed as not sinning The wages of sinne is death saith the Apostle Shall death preuaile against the Soule for sin and the Body escape death as voyd of sinne Surely no. Sinne defileth the whole Man by what part soeuer it is committed yea the very thoughts of the hart coinquinate the whole man When the Pharisees held opinion that meate eaten with vnwashen hands defiled the Body our Sauiour reprooueth that error in them and teacheth his Disciples that nothing without a man can defile him when it entreth into him but the things which come foorth of him are they that defile the Man For from within out of the hart of Man come foorth euill thoughts couetousnesse wantonnesse a wicked eye pride foolishness All these euils come from within and defile a Man Where we see that enuie which Christ noteth by a wicked eye and pride and such like inward sinnes yea and euill thoughts defile the Man that is as well the Body which the Pharisees tooke to be defiled with vncleane hands as the Soule The Apostle stretcheth the infection of sinne farder euen to the meates them selues that are eaten of the wicked All things saith he speaking of meates which the Iewes counted vncleane are cleane to the cleane but to the vncleane and vnbeleeuers nothing is cleane but euen their minde and conscience is vncleane So that the vncleannesse of the inward Man defileth the outward Man and all things which the outward Man vseth This is so true that not onely the guiltinesse and filthinesse of sinne is in this life communicated from the Soule to the Body but both shal be therefore condemned in the righteous iudgement of God to euerlasting fire We must all appeare before the tribunal of Christ euery man to receiue the things done by his Body Where all sorts of sinnes in thought word or deede are by the Apostle called ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã or as others read ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã things done
which he so much denieth The death of the body which the godly doe suffer is to this day an euill of it selfe and the punishment of sinne but God of his mercie towards his hath giuen such grace not to death but to their faith that by suffering death patiently they shal be the more plentifully rewarded But as no wise man will say the Law is euill when the wicked abuse it to kindle their lusts so may no sober man say that the death of the faithfull is good in it selfe though by Gods goodnesse it bee made to them a triall of their patience and a passage to a better life You say the nature of death is changed and not to the faithfull any longer an euill or part of the punishment and curse which was laide oâ⦠sinne S. Austen saith the contrarie It is still an euill as it was and the nature thereof is not changed though the vse thereof be changed by faith and the consequents altered by Gods goodnesse Now things must bee esteemed by their nature and not by their vse as Austen teacheth For euill men vse good things euilly yet that maketh not good to bee euill because their vse is inuerted and euen so saith Austen good men haue a good vse of death which is euill yet that maketh not the death which they suffer to be good in it selfe or in nature to bee such as by Gods fauour it is to them When the death therefore of the faithfull is said by Saint Austen or any others to be good they meane the vse and not the nature thereof and when they say it is euill or a curse they meane the nature and not the vse For touching the nature thereof the Apostle who must be heard saith fully and resolutely Death is an enemie that must be destroyed euen in the godly And touching the vse thereof the same Apostle saith To mee Christ is life and to die is gaine Against this you neither doe nor can bring ought besides waste words and places either not vnderstood of you or wrested by you as spoken of the nature of death when they meane the vse of death which the faithfull haue by Gods abundant blessing Your selfe doe say The vengeance of the Law once executed on the suertie can no more in Gods iustice be executed on vs. In the vengeance of the law is comprised corporall spirituall and eternall death The whole Christ neither did nor could taste and bee a Sauiour A part he therefore tasted which was the death of his body and thereby freed vs from the rest which was due to our sinnes From the death of the body he hath not as yet wholly deliuered vs but hee will and in the meane time hee hath broken the linckes of death whereby those three were coupled together first in his owne person who suffered the first kinde of death and neither of the other and by vertue thereof hath done the like in all his Saints leauing their bodies for a season vnto death as his was that he may raise them after with greater power and glorie then if they had neuer died What doeth this hinder but death may truely bee called a Curse as in Christ so in his members and though execution of vengeance be restrained from vs yet imitation of Christ is not excluded neither is the generall sentence pronounced against the sinne of all mankinde To dust thou shalt returne reuoked but by the resurrection from the dead how then was it vengeance on Christ if it were due to mans nature Death was due to mans nature for sinne and consequently not due to Christ that had not sinned When therefore it was laide on him that deserued it not it must be taken as the wages of our sinne in his person and so was a wound to him though a medicine to vs because hee was wounded for our transgressions and wee were healed by his stripes Our publike doctrine in England set foorth by Master Nowel confirmeth as much To the faithfull death is now not a destruction but a changing of life and a very sure and short passage to heauen Euery thing that is licensed or liked as profitable to bee publikely read or taught is not by and by authorised in all things nor made the publike doctrine of this Realme You would faine oppose Master Nowel to Saint Austen who if hee were liuing would giue you no thanks therefore Saint Austens Faith hath beene allowed and receiued by all Synods and Councels since his time and by the whole Church of Christ as fit to guide and leade not onely learners but makers of Catechismes and therefore the match if they were repugnant is somewhat vnequall but indeede you haue neede to bee taught how to vnderstand your Catechisme That death is a destruction to the godly can you tell who saith so except it bee your selfe That it is a changing of life and short passage to heauen if you meane to the soules of the faithfull as the Caââ¦echisme doth no man doubteth thereof if you meane to their bodies that they by death change life and so haue a short passage to heauen it is a notable falsitie and heresie gainsaying the verie grounds of the Christian faith For priuation of sense and corruption to dust is no life much lesse an heauen except you will multiplie heauens as you do helles without reason or trueth It is most true which the Catechisine intendeth that death is this to the souls of the faithful but not to their bodies as yet till the generall day of resurrection and then the destruction of death in their bodies shall bring them to the full possession of heauenly glory prouided both for soule and bodie till that time their bodies lie vnder the dominion or power of death which is not yet destroied in euery part of vs because of sinne dwelling in our bodies though it throughly be conquered in the person of Christ and shall be likewise in vs at his appointed time As little to the purpose is that which you cite next out of the Catechisme that Death which before was a punishment is now become a vantage For he meaneth that death before had nothing in it nor after it but punishment and so was wholly and onely punishment which now by Christ is altered and made an aduantage to vs as well in respect of the manifold miseries and offences of this life from which we are deliuered as in regard of the felicitie and securitie which the soules of the Saints decââ¦ased enioy but this is nothing to their bodies which lie depriued of life and corrupted to dust till the finall restitution Neither is this a comparison with our condition before sinne in which we were created when soule and bodie should iointly haue beene translated to the kingdome of heauen without any sense or touch of death if we had stood fast in obedience but this noteth what death is after sinne committed without Christ and rightly saith that when
So that all your platforme is quite ouerthrowen by the direct words of the Apostle freeing Christ and all his elect euen in this life from all power of the second death And therefore you set your selfe in this section euidently to confront the holy Ghost when you seeke to proue that Christ suffered the second death of the soule as the Scripture speaketh And besides the Scriptures if you talke of second deaths you may as well tell vs tales of a new world as of an other word without the witnesse of Gods spirit But you haue found out many places of Scripture where this last kinde of death is so called and named Eight you quote by the side in your margine but take not the paines to discusse one of them onely you pronounce after your stately manner that those places of Scripture prooue that which you meane to bee the death of the soule Now what if not one of them speake any such thing is not your Reader sure to find you a true man of your word when you quote eight places and not one of them to your purpose but this is your perpetuall course to mistake and misuse Scriptures at your pleasure and then to say you haue soundly prooued it On the contrary I affirme that none of these places intend any such thing as you imagine of your terrestiall and temporall hell but they exactly conclude against you that damnation is eternall and no death of the soule which is not euerlasting is expressed or intended in any of those Scriptures or in any other that you or your friends are able to picke out And though it may suffice me as well to say nay as you to say yea yet for the Readers better resolution I will not bee grieued to run through all these places as much as shal be needfull The first is l Ezech. 18. ver 4. the soule that ââ¦inneth it shall die These words may signifie either subtraction of grace in this life which is consequent to sinne in the wicked or exclusion Eight places of Scripture abused for the temporall death of Christs soulâ⦠from glory in the next world which is the iust and full wages of sinne But that euery soule which sinneth hath felt or shall feele in this life your temporall hell or the pains of the damned this is a grosse error to be fathered on those words and repugnant not onely to the trueth of this text but euen to the sense and experience of all the Godly and such as your selfe dare not auouch since you qualifie your conceit in that behalfe with these words that m Defenc. pag. 134. li. 15. some in some measure are conformed with Christ in these his sufferings But if God by Ezechiel ment your earthly hell then absolutely all men children not excepted must feele in this life paines equall with the damned for so much as they haue sinned and deserued euerlasting damnation The second is the commination that God made to Adam n Genes 2. ver 17. Whensoeuer thou ââ¦atest thereof thou shalt die the death or surely thou shalt die Here are all sorts of deaths threatned but not to be executed either on all men nor in this present life God reseruing to himselfe power and libertie to dispose of all mens soules according to his determinate counsell though they should all be guiltie and liable to all kinds of death by vertue of those words vpon the transgression of the first man This exposition the Apostle giueth when he saith o Rom. 5. The offence of one came on all men to condemnation which is the verifying of these words that all men died in Adam to wit were subiect to death not onely by dying the death of the bodie which is appointed for all men but to the guiltinesse of euerlasting death not executed on all though deserued by all The third which is the p Rom. 6. Apostles conclusion is either generally ment of all kinds of death which came in by sinne as the rewards and punishments thereof and then it is nothing to your intention or else it expresseth the full wages of sinne to be euerlasting death by opposition to eternall life mentioned in the next wordes following For eternall life is the gift of God as eternall death is the wages that is bothe the desert and repayment of sinne Take which you will either the generall or speciall construction of death it is no way pertinent to your purpose Lesse is the fourth that the Apostles were the q 2. Cor. 2. vers 16. sauour of death vnto death in them that perished as they were the sauour of life vnto life in them that were saued For the preaching of the Gospell which the Apostle meaneth in that place doeth not proclaime a terrestiall or temporall heauen to them that beleeue in Christ but life eternall and consequently neither doth it denounce a temporall death to them which refuse Christ but euerlasting death And therefore there can be nothing more absurd then to conuert these places to the proofe of your temporall hell for so you should doe the reprobate a very good turne if you could shew that the death threatned them for not beleeuing in Christ were to dure but for a time or in this life only where your new found hell hath power and place and no where else With like successe you note for your fifth that the r 2 Cor. 3. vers 7. ministration of death was glorious the Apostle so calling the law because it denounced death not temporall but eternall to all transgessours So that if the full wages of sinne be eternall death by the word of God then did the law not denounce a temporall death due to all men by course of nature be they good or bad though euen that at first entered as a part of the punishment of sinne but euerlasting death which is the second death is reserued as S. Iohn writeth for all sorts of sinners and liers Saint Iames is the sixth who sayth s Iames 5. He that conuerteth a sinner erring from the trueth shall saue a soule from death If a man conuerted shall be saued from your temporall hell which you here would intend by the death of the soule then much more the Conuerter and he that neuer erred from the trueth shall be free from your hell and consequently Christ was most free who was trueth it selfe and neuer erred But as trueth is the way to euerlasting life and freeth men from all bondage of sinne and Satan so errour and infidelitie haue another maner of death than your terrestiall hell which you make common to Christ and some of his members and he that is conuerted from errour or sinne shall be saued from euerlasting perdition which indeed is the death of the soule depriuing it of all blisse and ioy for euer The seuenth and eigth you take out of Saint Iohn who sayth t 1. Ioh. 5. vers 16 17. There is sinne vnto
giue aduise we will send for you to make comments vpon their counsels Where you make Athanasius say Christ was held in this death till ââ¦e spoiled and conquered it which you conclude cannot be hell out of question You speake not one true word Athanasius hath no such words that Christ was held in death Of mans soule he saith ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã that was held in death but of Christ in that very sentence he auoucheth the cleane contrary saying ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã be could not be held in death Secondly that hades was spoiled of all his power right and claime to or ouer all Christs elect and we deliuered thence Athanasius as well as the rest beareth plentifull witnesse But that Christ spoiled heauen or Paradise where the soules of the Saints were seuered from their bodies brought vs thence is not onely a false fable but a pestilent error Christ raising his body from the graue by Athanasius iudgement gaue vs hope of the resurrection of our bodies and bringing backe his soule from hades as not onely vntouched of any death there but also loosing the bands ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã of soules surprised by hades he made vs partakers of his immortality which the strength of hades could not touch Descending to hades Christ brought vs backe saith Athanasius of himselfe and of all Christs members as then not borne Christ did not bring all the faithful of the old Testament from the condition of death much lesse brought he the rest thence that were not either dead or borne We die still and so the condition of death is common to vs after Christs resurrection as it was to the fathers before Christs death and birth but hell hath now no right to vs nor power ouer vs since Christ our head conquered and spoiled Satan of all interest and chalenge to any of his members And where you pretend that hades is spoiled because our soules shal be ioined againe to our bodies at the resurrection know you good Sir that the separation of the soule from the bodie was to dure by Gods ordinance but for a time as well in the wicked as in the godly that is vntil the generall iudgement And you that defend a resurrection and immortality as well of the wicked in hell as of the Saints in Paradise what reason can you giue why the condition of the soule separated from the body is more conquered by Christ for his members then by Satan for his partners for that separation shall cease in both and consequently the force of death seuering the soule from the body is spoiled aswell for the reprobate as for the elect Yea the continuing of the godly soules asunder from their ââ¦odies till the last day is rather a furnishing and storing of your hades then a conquering and spoiling of it And therefore mocke not with these matters they be of more importance then that they may be thus idlely caried Hilarie verily hath this meaning also saying this is the law of humane necessity that their bodies goe downe to the graue their soules to the world of the dead ad inferos Which descent the Lord did not refuse that he might prooue himselfe in euery point to be true man And this for his soule to come vnder the power of death was indeed the law of humane necessity after the like phrase as Iustine Irenaeus and Tertullian also speake but not to goe to hell Your head is so fraighted with falseshoods that trueth can take no place there and so little is your skill though your pride be great that you doe not know for ought that I see how necessity of death came into mans nature Whiles man was free from sinne he was free from death By sinne came death When man lost his innocencie he lost his liberty and fell both within the seruitude of sinne and necessity of death Now death being the wages of sinne reacheth aswell to the soule after this life as to the body to be depriued of this life By one offence came guiltinesse on all men vnto condemnation The law then of humane necessity for sinne without Christ Iesus in whom we recouer liberty is for the body to goe to corruption and for the soule to descend to destruction and not onely to be seuered from the body as you would faine mistake the words of Hilarie It is no part of humane necessity for the soule seuered from the body to ascend to heauen or to Paradise that is the honour and fauour of our Redemption purchased by Christ our Sauiour but necessity of death in vs which is the reward of sinne draweth the whole man body and soule vnto condemnation This you might haue found to be Hilaries meaning by the words precedent which occasioned this conclusion Si descendero in infernum ades If I goe downe to hell thou art there Which Hilarie sheweth to be verified in Christ by the words that you bring meaning that as men by sinne came to this necessitie that their bodies lying in the graue their soules descended to hell So Christ the redeemer of man refused not euen this descent to hell ad consummationem veri hominis to consummate true man or to recouer and restore both parts of man to witte body and soule whereof a true man consisteth That Christ should descend to places vnseene and vnknowen to prooue himselfe a true man what sense can this haue since no man liuing was present to see the proofe thereof and he that doubted whether Christ liuing were a true man would much more doubt whether Christ rising in that glorious bodie which neuer man saw before noâ⦠the like were a true man or no. I thinke therefore by your leaue that as Christ died not to prooue himselfe a true man but to ransome our sinnes so he descended to the places below not to make proofe to vs that he was a true man but to worke our saluation and consummation as elswhere the same Father saith Crux mors inferi nostra salus est Christs crosse death and descent to inferi are parts of our saluation And of Christ he voucheth mortem in inferno perimens he killed death in hell And yet if with you we should take consummation for demonstration which is farre fet and say Christ reââ¦used not that descent to shew himselfe a true man it nothing hurteth me since that burden of necessity lay on all men for desert of sinne till they were deliuered by Christ to haue their bodies goe to the graue and their soules to the place of punishment both which Christ refused not though he were in the one without any corruption in the other without any condemnation but as conquerour of both Of Iustine Irenaeus Tertullian we haue spoken before we shall not need to iterate your ouersights Iustine speaketh of no law at all Irenaeus noteth the law of the dead to be this that they must stay a time dead before their
bodie which is not performed before the bodie rise to glorie you turne it as if I professed our redemption from hell to be imperfect till the last day And when I mention with Saint Paul the redemption of our bodies from corruption which shall not be before the resurrection you would inferre thereupon if you could tell how that the bodies of the Saints remaine subiect to the power of hell to the curse of the law and to the claime of Satan Thus you runne on like a riotous spaniel chalenging vpon euery foote but finding nothing With like wit and trueth you inferre vpon my wordes where I say the death of the body was inflicted on mankind as part of the wages of sinne that therefore the godly must pay a part of their owne redemption and satisfaction for sinne and then Christ was not our onely and absolute redeemer But which way doth this follow can you tell punishment for sinne is in our persons neither redemption nor satisfaction for sinne in Christs person it was both Know you not the difference betwixt Christs person and ours But I say pa. 216. that the bodies of the dead Saints are in the possession of hell and in the handfact of hell In wresting and wrangling is all your grace Where some auncient writers seeme to say that Christ deliuered some of the Saints out of the present possession of hell all the defence I said that could any way be made out of the Scriptures to excuse this was to take hell improperly for the sting and wound of bodily death which Satan the ruler of hell procured to man by sinne For sinne death and corruption are the workes of the Diuell which Christ came to dissolue God made not death as the wiseman obserueth but created man without corruption and through the enuie of the Diuell came death into the world This then being one of the wounds which Satan through sinne gaue vnto our first father and all his ofspring this is not perfectly cured but with the resurrection of our bodies to eternall life though the poyson of this wound bee in the meane time allayed and the danger secured And thus whiles I seeke to mitigate other mens wordes and to extenuate the name and power of hell vnderstanding thereby nothing but the dissolution of mans life and corruption of mans bodie which Satan occasioned by sinne you make the Reader beleeue I take the name of hell properly for the power and right that hell hath ouer the bodies of the wicked and teach that the Saints are not deliuered from hell till their bodies rise from death which when you list you can find to bee refuted elswhere by me and therefore to be no part of my meaning heere How death is an enemie which must be destroyed aswell as sinne and hell we neede not your commentarie except it were stoared with better Diuinitie It hindreth the Saints you graunt from enioying their appointed felicitie yet as a peaceable and quiet stop Ascribe you this peace and quietnesse to their bodies voide of life and sense or to their soules staied from the full fruition of eternall glorie by that meanes And troe you the soules of the Saints be well and quietly content to lacke their appointed felicitie not at all to desire it or not earnestly to pray for it were plainly to loath it and not obediently to expect it Wherefore they exceedingly affect and instantly pray for the destruction of this enemie that keepeth their bodies in dishonour and corruption and hindereth their spirits from enioying that glorie which shal be reucaled in the last time which appeareth by their vehement prayer in the Reuelation how long O Lord holy and true doest thou not iudge and auenge our bloud on them that dwell on the earth Where they in heauen seeke not reuenge on them for whom they prayed in earth but they expresse their continuall and ardent desire for that day when they shall be wholy conformed to Christ their head And when they are willed to rest for a season they gladly submit themselues to the will and wisedome of God but meane while they hate death as an hinderer of that blisse and ioy which they so much loue and long for and shall no doubt reioyce exceedingly when this last enemie is swallowed vp in victorie as the rest were before But let death be an enemie which way you will how doth this conclude that Hades here 1. Corinth 15. in no sort signifieth hell The very text seemeth thus to expound it selfe saying where is thy sting O Hades the sting of death is sinne Where the later seemeth a direct exposition of the former noting these two wordes Hades and death as Synonymas for one thing being applied to men When you talke of the text of holy Scripture you should not leaue the wordes that are extant in all our printed copies retained and alleaged by the best and most of the Greeke Fathers as likewise of our new writers and cleane to the single conceite of some one man taking vpon him to correct all the printed copies that euer he saw and of his owne authoritie to alter the Originall I doe not therefore by your and his leaue admit this for Saint Pauls text since it is his priuate change of the wordes in the Greeke against all the copies that are either manu-scripts or printed at this day His owne confession is this Contrario ordine legunt hunc locum non modo Graeci omnes codices quos inspeximus sed etiam Syrus Arabs interpretes Not onely all the Greeke copies that we haue seene but the Syriack Arabick Interpreters read this place in a contrarie order that is they put these words ô Hades where is thy victorie in the last place which you set in the first and the other words ô death where is thy sting they set first which you will haue to be last Thus then stand the Apostles wordes cleane contrarie to that which you bring ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã O death where is thy sting O Hades wher is thy victorie And in this order doe Luther Erasmus Zuinglius Peter Martyr Caluine Bullingere Gualtere Aretius Hemmingius Hyperius Osiander Marlorate and I know not how many more both keepe and cite that text in Latin vbi tuus mors aculeus vbi tua Inferne victoria Where is thy sting O death where is thy victorie O hell And touching the Greeke copies and Fathers that are auncient and obserue the same order of the wordes for the Apostles text we haue Origen Athanasius Nazianzene Nyssene Epiphanius x Chrysostome x Oecumenius and though the translatours of x Theodoret and x Theophylact retaine the wordes of the old Latin Bible in this place for the text yet there is no likelihood that these two in their own tongue varied from the rest specially Theophylact who in his commenting
ordained to be damned for vs. 364 Dauid neuer felt the true paines of hell 453 Dauids feare vnlike to Christs 442 What Death Christ died 19 A threefold death the wages of sinne 13â⦠Corporall death in all men is the punishment of sinne 149. 150. 151. 176 Death in Christ was the satisfaction for sinne 176 Euerlasting death the wages of sinne which Christ could not suffer 226 The death of the body is euill in it selfe though God to his make it a passage to life 244. 245 The consequenââ¦s after death doe not proue death to be good 246 The nature of death not changed in the godly 252 God so hââ¦teth death that he will destroy it as an enemie 254 Naturall death came not by the sentence of Mosâ⦠Law 261 Thââ¦e is no death of the Soule without sinne 366 All feele the sting of death which Christ expressed before he died 389 The death and life of the soule here on earth mistaken by the Defender 430 What the second death is in the Scriptures 492 Eight pââ¦es of Scripture abused for the death of Christs Soule 493 By one lande of death Christ freed vs from all kinds of death 504 To be vtterly forsaken of God is the death of the Soule 517. 518 The extreamest degree of pains where grace doth not faile is no death of the Soule 524 What things the death of the body doth import 649 The Defender grosly peruerteth my words 44. 45 The Defender contââ¦adicteth himselfe 56. 57 The Defender contemneth the Fathers and their iudgements 82 The Defender deuiseth shifts to decline Scriptures and Fathers against him 94 The Defender would make the maner of Christes dying onely vnusuall 95 The Dââ¦fender doth grossely mistake the reiection of the Iewes to be the meaning of Christes complaint on the crosse 98 The Dââ¦fender not able to support his errors doth quarrell with the question 99 The Defender eludeth the Scriptures with his termes of single and meere 125. 126. 127 The Defender clouteth one conclusion out of diuers places 146 The Defender maketh the sufferings of Christs flesh needlesse to our redemption 168. 169 The Defender peruerteth the doctrine of the Homilies 224. 225 The Defender maketh Christ sinfull accursed and defiled 265 The Defender would not faile to cite Fathers if he had them 273 The Defender compareth Christ in want of comfort with the damned 291 The Defender vainly presumeth all places of his vnanswered to be granted 319 The Defender hath deuised torments for Christs soule 323 The Defender controleth the words of the holy Ghost by his new phrases 413 The Defender in steed of proouing falleth to granting his owne positions 5ââ¦3 The Defender misciteth S. Iohns words and on that error groundeth all his reasons 644 The Defender giuing a reason of nââ¦thing asketh a reason of all things 415 The Defender claimeth like reuerence to his words as to the Scripture 325 The Defender saith the Scriptures are ordinarilie true that is sometimes false 367 The Defender doth euery where mistake and misapply what is said 384 The Defender forgeth a pace new parts of the Christian faith 393 The Defender taketh the parts of Christs agonie for the causes thereof 401 The Defender is somewhat pleasureable 528 The Defender corrupteth S. Luke 402. 403 The Defender ascribeth a liuely affection to Christs dead flesh 422 The Defender vttereth a flat contradiction to his owne doctrine 422. 423 The Defender confesseth the Fathers prooue my meaning 425 The Defender is driuen to contrarieties 431 The Defender taketh from Christ inward sense and memory in his sufferings 440 The Defender yeeldeth perfect knowledge to Christ in his amazednesse 481 The Defender foolishly prooueth the death of Christs soule 495. 496 The Defender abuseth the Scriptures 534. 535 The Defender cannot discerne a conclusion from a quotation 568 The Defendours foure restraints of hell paines 4 The Defendours disdaine of the fathers 98 The Defendours vaine shifts 114. 115 The Defendours skill in framing arguments 327 The Defendours absurd deuises 490 The Defendours manner of reasoning as illogicall as his matter is false 336 Dereliction in the Scriptures neuer implieth the paines of the damned 415 Deepe what it signifieth 566 To what Deepe Christ descended after death 565 567 The true sense of Paul and Moses words Rom. 10. concerning the Deepe 568 The whoââ¦e church taught that Christ after death descended to hell 544. 545 New Writers teach Christs descent to hell 546. 547 Christ needed no long time to descend to hell 551 Of Christs descending and ascending 553 Christ aescended and ascended to be Lord ouer all 563 To what deepe Christ descended after death 565 567 Descending is to places below 569 How long this clause of Christs descent to hell hath been in the Creed 653. 654 What Ruffinus meaneth by Christs descent to hell 655 Descending to hades was not the buriall of Christs body 556. 557. 558 The causes of Christs descent to hell 666 Desââ¦ending to hell was a part of Christs exaltation 671 The descent of Christ to hell confessed by the Catechisme 677 The Lawes of this land doe binde all to beleeue Christs descent to hell 678 Desperation in hell is no sinne 71 Desperation is the sorest torment in this life 238 A small Difference of wordes may quite alter the sense 199 Difference of Christs offering and suffering 276 Difference of outward and inward temptatioÌs 314 Difference betwixt Gods threats iudgements 472 How the Diuell may discerne and incense our affections 192 The Diuell tormented not Christes soule on the Crosse. 295 Christ suffered as deepe paines but not as deepe Doubts as we may 321 E. ELect Who is enemie to Gods Elect. 233 The Elect are neuer truely accursed 252 The Elect cannot perish 364 Erasmus fouly mistaken by the defendor 653 Foure notable Errors grounded by the defendor vpon the facts of Moses and Paul 363 The first 363 The second 365 The third 367 The fourth 368 What impressions Euill maketh in the soule of man 341 Euill past present or to come worketh sorrow paine and feare in the soule of man 341 ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã what it importeth 485 Is contrarie to feare 501 Esay doth not touch the death of Christes soule 526. 527 Esay 14. Shcol for hell 559. 560 Eusebius report of Thaddeus allowed by the best historiographers 660 F FAthers their iudgements may be called Authorities 83 The Fathers may be left in some priuate opinions 84 I leaue not the Fathers in the grounds of faith 85 The Fathers doc not teach that Christ suffered all which we should haue suffered 138. 139 The Fathers disclaime all necessitie in the death of Christ. 285 The Fathers determine not the exact cause of Christs Agonie 371 Wherein we should follow the Fathers 415 Some Fathers expound me in Christs wordes for my members 416 No Father auoucheth the death of Christs Soule 142. 143 Diuerse Fathers euidently corrupted for the death of Christs Soule 428. 429 By the iudgement of the Fathers Christ died
They inherite both sinne and death from their Parents and so of necessity must die and putrifie in the graue he did inherite neither but being free from both yeelded himselfe to die that he might purge and abolish sinne Death wresteth our soules from our bodies be we neuer so patient whiles sence doth last he breathed out his soule powerfully and willingly which none could take from him except he would lay it downe of his owne accord Our bodies doe rot in the graue and lye in corruption which is the dominion of death till the time they shall be restored his body could not be dissolued to ashes because neither part of his humane nature might perish after it was once vnited to his Diuine but lay in the graue without corruption resisting death and rose with speede in glory ouerthrowing death first in him selfe and after in all his members at their appointed time So that death is now a necessarie consequent to our sinfull nature his voluntary death was the satisfaction for our sins and pacification of Gods wrath restoring vs againe to Gods fauour which through sin we had lost Thus haue you both swarued very far Sir Desender from your owne question which your selfe put in your first Treatise though wide from our purpose and wholy misreported the doctrine which I formerly auouched by Scriptures and Fathers giuing small hope you will deale more sincerely in the rest that enter so corruptly at the first but you will now open the whole state of the Question which we are content to heare The opening of the whole state of the Question For the better vnderstanding whereof we must note these principall things What you calâ⦠the opening of the Question I may better call the darkning and obscuring of the Question with many trifling and tedious obseruations with many new found farre fet and ill applyed phrases with many bold and false assertions powred out of your owne braines without any shew or so much as pretence of holy Scripture And if you may be suffered thus to raigne and reuele in matters of Religion at your pleasure it is an easie way for you to conclude any thing without any great paines or proofes For you bring vs a world of wordes warranted by no mans authoritie but by your owne and out of them you frame false positions fitte for your fancie and vtter them as vndoubted principles of Christian Religion which indeede haue in them neither truth nor sence when they come to be examined As is your matter so is your method tumbling and tossing too and fro like the vnsettlednesse of your head and spending twentie pages in meere confusion and contradiction for which cause I must be driuen to recall your conceits to some speciall heads least in pursuing your steps I loose both my selfe and the Reader The things which you disorderly shuffle and I shall be forced more largely to handle concerne either the offender which is man or the offence which is sinne or the Iudge which is God or the punishment which is death or the ransommer and redeemer which is Christ. I meane to meddle with no more in any of these but what directly pertaineth to this question and serueth aptly to exclude your conceits and truely to establish the collections which I make First then 1 touching MAN who consisteth of body and soule the doubt will be whether the whole man sinned in Adam that the whole might suffer in Christ or whether the soule onely sinned that the soule of Christ onely must suffer Secondly in 2 SINNE must be remembred how it commeth and what it bringeth Sinne is either COMMITTED as by Adam or INHERITED as by vs all or ASSVMED as by Christ who tooke vpon him the punishment of our sinnes though neither committed nor inherited by him And of it selfe sinne breedeth in the offendor where it is not remitted clensed and remooued by the blood of Christ POLLVTION of the whole man STING of conscience and REVENGE of Gods wrath in this life and the next Thirdly for the 3 IVDGE which is God we must learne from what ground within him the punishments of his elect in this life doe proceede whether from his Iustice or from his loue or from both mixed together by whom he executeth his iustice in earth and in hell whether by his immediate hand or by inferiour ministers and meanes with what measure he proportioneth it as well to the faithfull in this life as to the faithlesse till the number of their sinnes be full and lastly to what purpose he directeth it either to reuenge sinne as in the wicked and damned or to represse sinne as in the godly or to declare his iustice as in Infants baptized or to perfit his graces as in the best of his Saints here on earth or to purge and abolish sinne and to prooue obedience as in the person of Christ Iesus Fourthly 4 DEATH which is the wages of sinne and includeth all the punishments prouided here and elsewhere for sinners is either corporall parting the soule from the bodie or spirituall separating the soule from the life and grace of God or eternall excluding both bodie and soule from the ioy and blisse of Gods heauenly kingdome and wrapping them both in the darkenesse fire and horrour of hell for euer That all the paynes and griefes of this life are the seedes of death and wayes to death and so come vnder the name of death which driueth the soule from the bodie is now presumed and shall be prooued in place conuenient Fiftly concerning the 5 REDEEMER which is Christ to whose sufferings all that is aforesaid must in some sort be referred the question is in what part and how farre he suffered feared or apprehended the wrath of God against our sinnes but without question we must know and beleeue that his person was naturally and infinitely beloued of God all the elect being imbraced and accepted onely for him and in him and that the dignitie of his person and depth of his fauour with God when hee submitted himselfe to shew his obedience and maintaine Gods iustice by the shame and sharpenesse of the Crosse receiued in his humaine nature was the right ground and true cause of our Redemption and Reconciliation to God whose patience vnto death was a greater and acceptabler sacrifice to God for sinne then all the world yea then all earthly and heauenly creatures were worth And to increase or strengthen this voluntary sacrifice for sinne the paines of hell were no way needfull since Christ was to shew his obedience in this life onely and after death to rise and raigne with glory and by that which he suffered on the Crosse he was to learne the obedience of a Sonne and not the vengeance due to deuils In all these issues if I would take the Discoursers trade to affirme what I list without any further proofe I could end the whole cause in as fewe wordes as I haue expressed it but since that will neither
punishment and payment and vengeance for sinne such as the godly doe in no wise suffer Christ onely hauing wholy suffered that for vs all Therefore indeede his sufferings proceded from Gods proper wrath and were the true effects of Gods meere Iustice bent to take recompence on him for our offences Thou hast in these words Christian Reader the bulwarke of this mans cause concluding that Christ suffered the MEERE IVSTICE PROPER VVRATH and very CVRSE of God for sinne The frame of his reason if I vnderstand it as who vnderstandeth his mysteries but himselfe is this All paine in man is from God either as correction of sinne or as punishment for sinne In Christ there was no â cause and so no neede of â correction his sufferings therefore were the punishments of sinne They were punishments for sinne Ergo they were the true punishment proper payment wages and vengeance of sinne which proceeded from Gods proper wrath and were the true effects of Gods mââ¦ere iustice bent to take recompence on him for our offences His termes of TRVE PROPER and MEERE ioyned to the PVNISHMENT VVRATH and IVSTICE of God are not warranted by any Scripture much lesse referred to the sufferings of Christ nor so much as prooued by any testimony defined with any certaintie directed by any part or expounded by any meanes but onely proiected as Ridles and laberinthes to weary the wise to angle the simple and to refuge himselfe when he shall be pressed with the falsitie and impietie of his assertions Least therefore we wrangle about words in vaine which is his desire and deuise that he may seeme to say somewhat and carry the Reader into a forest of strange and vnknowen phrases where he shall hardly discerne what either side saith I thââ¦nke it needefull first to declare what the Scriptures meane by the wages of sinne and wrath of God and so to trie in what sense and with what truth his termes may be added to them and applyed to the sufferings of Christ. The wages of sinne is death saith S. Paul God himselfe foretold Adam it should be so Whensoeuer thou catest of the forbidden tree thou shalt die the death Then how many kinds of death are by God threatned and inflicted on sinners so many parts must the wages of sinne containe Now those are three the death of the Soule in this life which I call spirituall the death of the body leauing this life which I call corporall and the death of both in the next world which I call eternall For as man had two parts by which he did liue Soule and body and two places wherein he might liue if he obeyed God earth for a time and heauen for euer so disobedience depriued either part of man in either place of the life which he should haue enioyed and subiected him to the feares griefes and paines of death both here and in hell for euer The life of the body is the vnion of the Soule with the body the effects whereof are sense and motion to discerne obtaine and performe that which is needfull or healthfull for the body And as the presence of the Soule bringeth life to the body so the departing of the Soule taketh life from the body and leaueth it dead that is voide of all action motion and sense as to euery mans eyes is apparent in dead bodies The Soule therefore in the Scriptures is vsually taken for the life of the body which proceedeth from the Soule and is maintained by the Soule And these phrases to seeke a mans Soule tolay downe his owne Soule or to giue it for another to powre out his Soule vnto death with such like doe properly expresse the death of the body quickned by the Soule because men loose or leaue this life when they loose or leaue their Soules And where God threatned death to Adam euen the very same day in which he should transgresse we must not thinke that God either delayed the punishment longer or extended it farder then his words at first imported When therefore the very same day that they sinned God said to the woman increasing I will increase thy sorrow and to the man In sorrow shalt thou eate all the daies of thy life we must acknowledge that from that time forward death began to take hold and worke on both their bodies though not by present separation of the Soule from the body for Adam liued after that 930. yeeres yet by mortalitie mutabilitie miserie and namely by sorrow and paine as the instruments and agents of death Worldly sorrow causeth death as Paul witnesseth and a broken hart saith Salomon drieth the bones yea sorrow hath slaine maxy And were it not so written yet experience and nature teacheth vs that griefe of mind and paine of body where they continue or increase consume the flesh and hasten death so that when God the same day that they sinned subiected them to sorrow and paine which before they felt not He made way for death that it might continually worke in them and ââ¦ken them till they returned to dust The tiââ¦e of this life saith Austââ¦n is nothing elsâ⦠but a race to death and truely after a mââ¦n begiââ¦th to be in this bââ¦dy he is in death The life of the soule is not her vnderstanding and will which she can neuer lose no not in hell but onely the trueth and graââ¦e of God by whose spirit she receiueth the light of faith to direct her and the strength of loue to stirre and iââ¦cite her in tââ¦is life to beholde desire and embrace the holinesse and goodnesse of Gods blessed will and promise for her euerlasting happinesse which with patience and comfort of the Holy ghost she expecteth till Gods appointed time do come The lacke or losse of this inward sense and motion of Gods spirit which only can quicken the soule is the death of the soule depriued of her life which is God and left to herselfe in blindnesse and hardnesse of heart and giuen ouer vnto a reprobaââ¦e minde and vile affections to worke wickednesse euen with greedinesse till contempt of Gods will and desperation of his mercy doe fearefully end her miserable time in this life and violently draw her from hence to see and suffer the terrible iudgements of God prouided for sinne in another world Life euerlasting is the perfect and perpetuall vision and fruition of Gods glorious presence in the heauens where vnspeakable light and honour ioy and bliââ¦e shall compasse and replenish bodie and soule in the fellowship of Christ and his elect angels for euer The exclusion and reiection of the wicked from this heauenly fââ¦licity together with the shame and confusion of sinne wounding and stinging the conscience without ease or rest and the dreadfull horror of hell the place of darknesse and diuels hauing in it continuall flames of intolerable and vnquenchable fire eternallie tormenting the soules and bodies of the damned the Scriptures call the sââ¦cond death
submission and patience of his Sonne on the Crosse. More then this if you will vrge on the person of Christ as needefull for our Redemption first proue it and then professe it at your pleasure otherwise if you boldly and vainely presume it your addle and idle wordes can not preiudice the setled and vndoubted principles of the Christian faith warranted by the word of God and fully receaued by the Church of Christ euen from the beginning To your maimed and ruinous foundation that Christ must suffer all and the very same punishment wages and vengeance of sinne which the damned doe suffer and we should haue suffered had we not beene excused by his suffering it for vs I haue plainly and sadly answered I know not how often it is a false and lewd imagination and so impious that your selfe dare not in your late Defence offer it to vew without many bridles to holde it from horrible blasphemie But Sir discourser why coyne you conclusions in christian Religion that must haue three or foure exceptions to saue them from open impietie and why see you not that your speciall reseruations ouerthrow the truth of your owne assertion for where the true and proper punishment wages and vengeance of sinne in all the wicked is spirituall corporall and eternall death in your limitations at last which you forgate at first you except Christ from spirituall death which is sinne and from eternall death which is damnation of body and soule to hell fier yet you still affirme that Christ suffered the full proper punishment wages and vengeance of sinne as though these two spirituall and eternall death were no parts of the punishment vengeance due to sin or these being excepted as vnfit for Christ to suffer you could truely say Christ suffered the full and proper punishment and vengeance of sinne which consisteth of these three kinds of death And who but you would send vs such headlesse and senselesse resolutions in Diuinitie as these are I affirme that Christ suffered all gods proper wrath and vengeance for sinne I say all that the very damned do suffer namely so described and limited as is aboue said And againe He suffered from Gods hand euen as the damned doe namely in these points which are both possible and reasonable Were you some new Euangelist or vpstart Apostle it were euen enough for you to referre Christs sufferings to your description and your limitation without any farther authority but when you take vpon you with your bare word to broch so many nouelties in Christian religion without one line or letter of holy writ to vpholde your dreames and deuices who can chuse but deride your follie You pinne mens faiths for the ground of their saluation to your descriptions and your limitations to possibilitie and reason measured by your rule without any text or title of Scripture to warrant your words and then you thinke the maine question is profoundly and fully handled but your sober and wise Reader will presently finde the lamenesse or leudnesse of your grand conclusion For if Christs person not only by your possibilitie and reason but by the soundnesse of trueth and sincerenesse of faith must be exempted from sinne which is the death of the soule and from damnation which is euerlasting death why write you so boldly that Christ must suffer all Gods proper wrath euen all that the damned do suffer whereas apparently those two being excepted Christ could suffer no kinde of death but only a corporall And if by your so describing and so limiting the matter you draw Christ within the staine or guilt of sinne or within the compasse or danger of damnation hope you to finde any Christian eares so patient that will endure that monstrous and sacrilegious indignitie But you will inuent a new hell for Christ which shall haue the substance but not the circumstance of damnation and shal be inflicted by Gods immediate hand properly ye a only in the verie soule of Christ which Gods owne infinite wrathfull power and iustice can inflict for satisfaction where and how it pleaseth him The question good Sir is not of Gods power what he can do but of his will reuealed in his Word and of his promise performed in the person of his sonne for our saluation and testified by the mouthes and pennes of the Prophets and Apostles that were guided by his holy spirit to speake and write the trueth I make no doubt but God can create another heauen another earth and another hell as quickly and as easily as he did these that now are yet if any man affirme that God will so do or hath so done I must holde him for an Infidell because he gainsayth Gods trueth and belieth Gods will by pretending Gods power Talke not therefore what God can doe shew rather by the word and witnesse of trueth what God hath done to that must we trust to that are you bound and from that are you slipt You haue not so much as any colour of Scripture for these desperate nouelties and vanities I will giue them no woorse words lest you complaine of my bitternesse and if any man be but so wise as to let your proue these things before he beleeue them he is safe enough for euer admitting them I may spare my paines in refuting them yet because destitute of all other helpe you appeale to possibilitie and reason to fourbish your new inuention of another hell let vs see how handsomely you hale it onward By the law of our creation as we are men hauing a soule besides our bodie so our soule hath in it a threefolde facultie of suffering paines First that which is proper and immediate iustly so called proper because it is proper only to reasonable and immortall spirits Immediate two wayes First because it can and doth receiue an impression of sorrow and paines made from God only by and in it selfe without any outward bodily meanes thereunto Secondly it is also an immediate punishment or els correction of sinne it commeth not for any other cause at all So that thus we meane when we speake of the soules proper and immediate suffering The soules second facultie of suffering paines is not proper but common to vs with beasts namely that which is by sympathie and communion with and from the body A third kinde of painfull suffering the soule hath namely her vehement and strong affections are painfull whether they be good or euill as zeale loue compassion pitie care c. neither are these immediatly for sinne whether punishments or corrections neither are they punishments or corrections at all properly in themselues accidentally they may be when they grow so strong that they paine and grieue the soule If the walles and roofe of your new hell rise no fairer nor stand no faster then your foundation doth a weake puffe of winde will blow all away If a man should shortly answer you That the soule of man hath but one
raging lustes and vntamed affections as he did in Cain Saul Achitophel Iudas and dayly doth in all the wicked In the outward punishments of this life where God turneth the furie and violence of his creatures to reuenge sinne and the seruice of men Angels and deuils to pursue the wicked to their destruction and to chastise his owne to their conuersion the hand of God doth euery where appeare by the Scriptures but that is nothing to your immediate suffering of the soule For first in them God vseth his creatures as his agents and instruments and where his immediate hand may happily be conceaued to worke without meanes there he punisheth the soule by the bodie which by your owne position is not the proper and immediate suffering of the soule In the feare shame and griefe which the soule here conceaueth vpon the denouncing conuicting or beholding of her owne vncleannesse and the terrible iudgements of God against sinne the power trueth and iustice of God are euident but not that immediate hand of God which you imagine For in this case God punisheth the soule by her selfe that is by her intellectiue or sensitiue faculties letting her plainely perceiue what ioy is lost and what vengeance is prouided for all the workers of wickednesse The losse of which blisse and terrour of which vengeance apprehended by outward sense or inward intelligence cannot but mightily grieue and afflict the soule And the greater the losse that is irreuocable as also the soarer the mischiefe that is ineuitable the deeper is the wound that either of them make in the heart of man But this feare and griefe whiles here men liue proceede from the cogitation and perswasion of the minde and conscience and not from the immediate hand of God And in the world to come the horrour of hell and rage of fire which God hath ordained to punish the soule shall inflict an intollerable torment not rising from the minds and wils of the wicked as in this world it doth but impressed by an externall and violent agent which is the meanes that God hath prepared to execute vengeance on men and deuils How beit in none of all these appeareth that immediate suffering of the soule from the hand of God alone which you so much talke of and to which you would so faine subiect the soule of Christ to make him suffer the substance of that which the damned according to your dreame doe feele in hell For in your conceit of the soules immediate suffering from the hand of God the soule must onely be a patient and no agent and God must inflict the paine on the soule with his owne hand and not by any meanes without or within the soule onely the soule must feele and discerne the present and inherent paine by her passiue power and facultie by which she is capable of all paine whence soeuer or howsoeuer it commeth This kind of suffering you euery where affirme you no where prooue and that which is most absurd you presume against the cleare words of the holy Ghost continually naming the fire of hell and threatning the wicked with it to allegorize the Scriptures at your pleasure and in stead of fire which God hath ordained and armed as a most dreadfull meanes to take vengeance of sinne you suppose a certaine paine which God with his immediate hand will inflict on the soules of the damned and that you make the substance of hell paines and fasten it to the soule of Christ for the time before he could worke our redemption or suffer the punishment of our sinnes But sir Discourser this is rather dreaming then debating of matters of faith to allegorize whatsoeuer standeth in your way and in stead thereof to imagine what you please without either proofe or pretence out of the word of God as if your mouth were the rule of Religion or the trueth of God would vanish by your fantasticall figures and shadowes Wherefore leaue your deuising and auouching what best liketh your vnquiet humour in so weightie matters of mans Redemption and tye your tongue if not your heart to the wordes of the holy Ghost that at least you may beare the shew if not the sense of a Christian man For I vtterly denie that God is either the immediate tormentour of soules in hell which is your idle and absurd imagination or that with his immediate hand God did torment the soule of his Sonne at any time here on earth as the soules of the damned are tormented in hell which is your witlesse and wicked assertion For proofe you produce the words of ââ¦say affirming of Christ that the Lord layed vpon him the punishment of vs all but in this as your maner is you hit neither the words nor the meaning of the Prophet The word is HAAVAH to be crooked or to go aââ¦rie and so by translation signifieth the crookednesse oâ⦠wickednesse of mans life which the Prophet testifieth was layd vpon Christ in saying the Lord layd vpon him the iniquitie of vs all But grant it may sometimes by the ioyning of other words import anie punishment allotted to wickednesse doth the Prophet say that God layed all the punishment due to sinne vpon Christ or that God layed it vpon the soule of Christ both which you inferre out of the Prophets words though neither be there expressed or thence to be concluded S. Peter will tell you on what part of Christ God layd our sinnes euen on his bodie Himselfe bare our sinnes saith Peter in his bodie on the tree Now where Christ did beare them there God did lay them Christ bare them in his bodie as Peter affirmeth God therefore layd our sinnes on his bodie that by suffering death on the Crosse which was the wages of sinne Christ might make the purgation of our sinnes in his owne person Againe the sense which you would sowe to the Prophets words that God layd vpon him all our punishment that is as you would haue it all the punishment which we should haue suffered is false and wicked For so Christ must haue suffered reiection desperation and eternall damnation which the damned doe suffer and we should haue suffered had we not beene redeemed If you meane no more than the Scripture intendeth that what Christ suffered for vs in the bodie of his flesh on the Crosse was the full redemption and satisfaction for all our sinnes then are you wide from concluding out of these words that Christ suffered the paines of hell or the full vengeance due to our sinne by the immediate hand of God which is the chiefe point that you aime at This is all the proofe you offer out of the Scriptures for the immediate suffering of the soule of Christ from the hand of God and what sturdie stuffe this is the rudest reader that lighteth on your pamphlet of Defence will soone conceiue If you keepe this course in the rest of your positions the world will soone be wearie of your new-found fansies if
members and vitall parts is so weake that they are not able to sustaine the force which bringeth great or most sharpe paine Which Chrysostome also confiââ¦meth Name fiââ¦e if thou wilt the sword or wilde beasts and if any thing be more grieuous than these yet are these scant a shadow to the torments of hell And these when they grow vehement are easiest and soonest dispatch men the body not sufficing to suffer a sharpe paine any long while Your hell paines then are not very sharpe which the wicked may suffer so many yeres in this life and not forsake either food or sleepe Yet Christ did feele you say Gods very wrath and proper vengeance for sinne and that only you know though you cââ¦n not expresse the maner or measure of his feeling it And it was discerned and conceiââ¦ed by Christ to be such and so did wound the soule properly yea chiefly though it were outwardly executed on his bodic The wrath and vengeance of God due to sinne and generally to all mankinde for sinne is spirituall corporall and eternall death with all the seeds and fruits of death that is the losse of all earthly and heauenly blessings in this life and the next and the depth of perpetuall miââ¦ery in body and soule here and in hell This is the true wages and full payment of sinne and though God of his bountie and patience do often remit to the wicked in this life a great part of this ãâã in things tempo all yet when he inflicteth on them the miseries and calaââ¦ities of this life he giueth them their due And as for spirituall and eternall death now and hereafter it is so proper and certaine to the reprobate that not one of them shall eââ¦cape eââ¦ther Spirituall death is blindnesse and hardnesse of heart working all vncleââ¦nnesse euen with greedinesse which sheweth men to be strangers from the life of God and ãâã ãâã as past all sense and feeling of God Eternall death the Scripture calleth WRATH TO COME because no man suffereth the full force and waââ¦ght thereof in this life but as it is the second death so it followeth in men after the first death which ââ¦euereth the soule from the bodââ¦e Yee vipers broââ¦d sayd Iohn Baptist to the Pharises and Sadduââ¦s who hath taught you thus to flââ¦e from the wrath to come Iesus sayth Paul deliuereth vs from the wrath to come In this life the wicked may haue a fearefull expectation but no present execution of this iudgement there is a day of ââ¦rath euen the reuelation of the ââ¦st iudgement of God when euery man shall be rewarded according to his works and a violent fire shall dââ¦uoure the aduersaries This wrath by the Scriptures is reserued for the vessels of wrath for euer and shall be executed on them with indignation furie and fire not onely because the wrath of God against the wicked burneth lââ¦ke fire but for that it shall be powred on them with flaming and euerlasting fire The effects whereof are reiection malediction confusion desperation and such lââ¦ke which neuer accompanie saluation To say that Christ suffered this kinde of wrath which is the true and proper wages of sinne is horrible and hellish blasphemie which I hope no Christian man will aduenture From the spirituall death of the soule which is the wrath of God reuealed from heauen against all vngodlinesse and vnrighteousnesse of men and bringeth with it the losse of all grace and goodnesse in this life and consequently leaueth the pollution and dominion of sinne in the soule of man our Lord and master must be as free as from damnation the one being alwayes a necessary consequent to the other Displeasure and wrath against Christes person God neuer had nor could haue any Christ being his owne and only sonne and so deerely beloued that for his sake Gods most iust and most heauie wrath against the sinnes of all his elect did calme and asswage for Gods inward loue doth not admit contrarieties or changes as mans doth all Gods counsels wayes and wo kes being absolutely perfect and constant chiefly towards his owne sonne whom he naturally infinitly and euerlastingly loueth in the same degree that he doth himselfe and therefore no more possible there should be in god any displeasure or dislike conceiued of his sonne for bearing the sinnes of the world or for what cause soeuer than of himselfe And since the humane nature of Christ was by Gods owne wisdome will and worke ioyned into the vnitie of the person of his sonne and made one and the same Christ with his Godhead no cause nor course whatsoeuer could alter or diminish the exceeding loue and fauour of God towards the very manhood of Christ but as God did inseparably knit it to the person of his sonne so did he make it fully partaker of that infinite loue wherewith he embraced his sonne To confirme this to all the world God did often from heauen pronounce with his owne voice This is my beloued sonne in whom I am well pleased as he forespake by his Prophet Beholde mââ¦e elect in whom my soule delighteth This vnspeakable loue of God towards the person of his Sonne now being God and man is the chiefe ground of our election and redemption For wee were adopted through Iesus Christ and made accepted in his beloued by whom wee haue redemption through his blood euen the forgiuenesse of sinnes according to the riches of his grace So that we were neither elected nor redeemed but by the infinite loue of God towards his sonne for whose ââ¦ake we were adopted to be the sonnes of God and to whose loue the fierce wrath of God prouoked by our sinnes did yeeld and giue place neither may he beare the name of a Christian man that otherwise teacheth or beleeueth of our election and redemption Now iudge thou Christian Reader whether it were wrath or loue in God towards his sonne that pardoned all our sinnes for his ââ¦ake and accepted the voluntarie sacrifice of his bodie and blood for the redemption of the world through whoââ¦e death we are reconciled to God and cleansed by his blood from all our sinnes Then as in God there neither was nor could be any displeasure against the person of his Sonne nor against any part thereof for what cause soeuer nor any chaunge or decrease of the loue which God with his own mouth professed from heauen towards Christ incarnate so could not Christ without plaine infidelitie conceaue or beleeue that God was inwardly displeased or angrie with ââ¦im no not when he presented him ââ¦elfe to God his Father vnder the burden of all our ââ¦innes knowing that neither sin from which he was ââ¦ee being the innocent and ââ¦mmaculate ââ¦amb of God noâ⦠Gods most holy dislike or iust pursuite of sinne could diminish Gods fatherly affection and most constant loue to him For though he were not ignorant that God in his holinesse did hate
of Christ the perfection of whose confidence and patience hee would demonstrate to Angels and men and propose him a paterne to all the Sonnes of God how to humble themsââ¦lues vnder the mightie hand of God and accept his obedience vnto death as a most precââ¦ous and pleasing satisfaction and sacrifice for the sinnes of his elect and reward his humilitie with vnspeakeable honour in making him Lord and Iudge of all both men and Angels not onely to confound the pride and suppââ¦esse the power of Satan but to adiudge him to euerlasting torments with all the wicked and accursed Against the tenor and effect of this Christian confession which I referre to the iudgements of all that be learned rightly instructed in the sacred Scriptures I neuer speake any one word to my knowledge I cannot in euery sentence repeate euery circumstance nor of euery page make a paire of Indentures much lesse may I forsake the forme of holsome words deliuered in the Scriptures But the maine summe and scope of this doctrine being so fully declared and so often repeated by me I had no reason to feare the capacity or doubt the memorie of any heedfull Reader And howsoeuer some shallow trifler may picke out a word heere and there to carpe at yet are there so many cleere places to direct all doubts that no man needeth to stumble but he that will not or can not stand vpright For let the Christian Reader looke but to the marke at which I aime in euery place and remember these two rules that of three sorts of death which onely are mentioned in the Scriptures as the wages of sinne to wit corporall spirituall and eternall death I alwayes remoue the two last from the person of Christ by describing or naming the first which was his corporall death and in that I conteine the whole course and maner of his death that is the feares forrowââ¦s shames temptations derisions smarts and paines which the Scriptures record in the history of his death and all my words will prooue plaine and easie which this maâ⦠thinketh so false in themselues so contrary to themselues Examine my words which he hath brought for examples of contradiction and falsity and see whether his labour be any more than meere nugation and vanitie Aââ¦ouching and prouing that Christ could not suffer eternall damnation which is the full wages of sinne nor the death of the soule which by the Scriptures must exclude Christ from the fauour and grace trueth and spirit of God and giuing the reasons why sinne could not preuaile vpon his person as it did vpon others I conclude What maruell then if sinne which should haue wrought in vs an eternal destruction both of bodie and soule could not farther preuaile in him that is to none other kinde of death but to the wounding of his flesh and shedding of his blood for the iust and full satisfaction of all our sinnes euen in the righteous and sincere iudgement of God In this I free Christ from eternall destruction or death of bodie and soule which was the wages of sinne in our persons but could not take holde on his as the difference there betwixt him and vs declareth I exempted him by proofs in the page precedent from the death of the soule which was the maine scope of that section and so leââ¦t him subiect onely to the third kinde of death which was corporall and might be suffered not onely without all taint of sinne losse of grace and change of Gods fauour but euen with great manifestation of Gods power and wisdome in his death and commendation of Christs obedience and patience vnto death That third kinde of death I doe not name but describe by the wounding of Christes flesh and shedding of his blood the rest of his paines and griefes that went bââ¦fore not being excluded as superfluous but continued and increased by that sharpe and ââ¦xtreame martyrdome which he endured on the crossâ⦠as my caueat touching Christs Crosse did plainly admonish And since the whole maner of Christes dââ¦ath and shedding his blood expressed in the Scriptures is the thing that I alwayes intend and the word doth import when I name or touch the death of Christ all that he voluntarily or violently suffered when he yeelded himselfe to be put to death ââ¦s comprised in the mention of his death Besides that Christ by his bloody sweat in the garden beganne of his owne accord in some sort to effuse his blood for our sakes and safeties and the efore it could haue no iust reason to imagine that my words exclude his agonie and other passions of the soule mentioned in the Scriptures specially my very next words affirming that the same part might and did suffer in Christ which sinned in man to wit the soule though by no meanes it could receiue the same wages which we should haue receiued But I professe by the generall title of my Sermons the full redemption of mankinde by the death and blood of Christ and commend the jââ¦ce and fruit of his bodily death as most sufficient That indeed is very dangerous to your fansie who hold the ioynt sufferings of Christes soule from and by his body not properly to pertaine to mans redemption for that they are common to men with beasts and therefore labour to frustrate all the words of the Holy Ghost deliuered in the Scriptures as improper and impertinent to our saluation but to me there can be no danger in the trueth nor doubt of the fruit or force of those things which the spirit of God so often and euidently commendeth vnto vs in the ââ¦acred Scriptures as the price of our redemption and meanes of our reconciliation to God In Christ sayth Paul we haue redemption by his blood euen the remission of our sinnes Redemption by Christs blood you will and must gââ¦ant the Holy ghost doth directly auouch it but whether that redemption be full and most sufficient which is purchased by the blood of Christ you doe make some doubt or els you need not sticke at my words which import so much Of that if you doubt you must beare the name of some other sect and not of a Christian for no Christian may doubt whether the redemption which we haue by the blood of Christ be fââ¦ll and suffââ¦cient or no. To make Christ in part a Sauiour is to make him in part no Sauiour contrary to S Peter who sayth There is no saluation in any other If you will deââ¦iue our whole redemption from him but not from his blood shed for vs then giue you S. Iohn the lie who sayth The blood of Iesus Christ clenseth vs from all sinne Clensing from all sinne is full and perfect redemption from sinne and sinne being fully remitted and purged there is no cause of breach betweene God and vs that should hinder our saluation Christ by his owne blood sayth Paul entred once into the holy place hauing purchased eternall
ambiguous and quarrellous The whole propitiatorie sacrifice are words as doubtfull as the other for since Christ was the Priest who by his eternall spirit offered himselfe vnspotted to God and gaue himselfe for vs to be an offering and sacrifice of a sweet smel vnto God his innocence and obedience chiefly rested in his soule thence sanctified his bodie which suffered death for the ransome of our sinnes Though then all things in Christ were holie and acceptable vnto God and so sacrifices most meritorious yet nothing did fully satisfie the iustice of God for sinne nor make a perfect reconciliation for vs with God but his obedience vnto death For that which must satisfie for sinne must be death other ransome for sinne God neither in his wisdome and counsell would nor in his trueth and iustice could accept after his will once determined and declared It was the first wages appointed and denounced by God to sinne In the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt die the death or certainly thou shalt die the doubling of the word noting the inflexibilitââ¦e of Gods counsell and iustice The Apostle witnesseth the same when he sayth The wages of sinne is death Then as sinne was irreuocabââ¦e rewarded with death so must it necessarily be redeemed by death Which rule stood so sure that when the Sonne of God would giue himselfe for vs to redeeme vs he could not do it by reason of Gods immutable counsell and decree but by death Wherefore the Apostle calleth him the Mediator of the New testament through death for the redemption of transgressions And where a testament is there MVST BE sayth he the death of the testator He contenteth not himselfe to say there was but there must be the death of the testator before we could be redeemed A necessitie not simplie binding Gods power but plainly declaring his counsell to be fixed and his will reuealed Since then Christ was to taste death for all men that through death he might destroy him which had power of death euen the diuell and deliuer vs who were reconciled to God by the death of his sonne the point which indeed wee both must stand on is what death Christ suffered to redeeme vs from sinne and to reconcile vs vnto God whether it were the death of the damned which is the second death or the death of the soule or as I auouch the death of the bodie only Other parts of Christes person and beames of his vertues and kinds of his sufferings are not to this quââ¦stion ââ¦arther than they commended and presented to God Christes death which must ransome our sinnes but the scope to which all the rest was referred and the ââ¦lose which consummated all the rest was death and therefore no sufferings of Christ were parts of the propitiatorie sacrifice which ransomed sinne but such as ended in death or tended to that sorrowfull shamefull and painfull death of Christ which by order of Gods iustice was appointed to satisfie for sinne The fulnesse of which satisfaction consisted in death and therefore the death and bloud of Christ though they were not the whole sacrifice yet were they the full and perfect ransome and price for sinne because without them the rest could not preuaile and to them all the rest was directed If then you will deale plainly as you pretend or not forget your duetie to God and his trueth you must leaue cauilling with the words of the Holy Ghost and go soberly to consider not whether any other sufferings but whether any other death of Christes be mentioned in the Scriptures to ransome our sinnes besides the death of his bodie If you finde any other there professe ââ¦t in Gods name if you finde none but only that described or mentioned in the Scriptures leaue snarling at the depth and bredth of those words which the Spirit of God hath authorized and learne rather to vnderstand them truely than vainly to oppose against them In sense and substance there is no difference betwixt these words the death bloud and crosse of Christ the crosse noting the tree whereon Christ died a reprochfull and cruell death for vs and his bloud expressing the maner of his death by sundrie sorts of shedding the same as by whipping piercing his head with thornes boaring his hands and feet to fasten him to the crosse and hanging him thereon three houres by the sorenesse of his wounds till his soule departed from his bodie To make these iarre one with the other which the holy Ghost had knit together is the signe of a busie but not of godly wit and howsoeuer you and your adherents can flourish with figures of Grammar you were best take heede that you turne not your eares from the trueth of God The bodily death which Christ died to ransome our sinnes the holy Ghost doth note sometimes by his Flesh sometimes by his Body sometimes by his Blood and sometimes by his Crosse and these either ioyned or seuered and sometimes also by his soule or life laide downe or powred out vnto death for vs. We finde them ioyned when Paul saith It pleased God by Christ to reconcile all things to himselfe and to pacifie by the BLOOD of his Crosse through him both things in earth and things in heauen And you which in times past were strangers and enemies hath he now reconciled in the BODY OF HIS FLESH through death Seuered are they when Peter saith You were redeemed by the precious blood of Christ as a Lambe vndefiled Who by his owne blood saith the Apostle entered in once into the holyplace and obtained eternall Redemption And so when Iohn saith The blood of Iesus Christ clenseth vs from all sinne As likewife Paul We haue Redemption through his blood euen the Remission of sinnes Of his body himselfe saith This is my body which is giuen for you and my flesh will I giue for the life of the world so are we sanctified by the offering of the body of Iesus Christ once Likewise of his soule by which the Scripture meaneth his life for that life wholy dependeth vpon the presence of the soule in the body My Father loueth me sayth Christ because I lay downe my soule or life The sonne of man came to giue his soule or life as a ransome for many And Esay foreshewed that Christ should diuide the spoyle of or with the mightie Because he powred out his soule vnto death which seuereth the soule from the body and so made it an offering for sinne by laying it downe of himselfe that death might seaze on his body This then being the maine foundation of the Gospel which the Apostle receiued that Christ died for our sinnes according to the Scriptures the Question still standeth as I first set it What death Christ died for our sinnes by the witnesse of holy Scriptures and not what sufferings went before or what other things ioyned with his death which is
you once denie it For where you affirme that certaine Sacrifices of the Iewes set foorth those sufferings of Christs soule which you meane and I vtterly denied that any sacrifices of the Iewes did shew the suffering of hell paines in Christs soule or any other kind of death besides the death of the body only you take not the paines to make any proofe of that you aââ¦rme but stand in your state and say you deny my assumption As if the negatiue being mine and the affirmatiue yours you were not by all rules of Rââ¦ason to prooue your aââ¦atiue and it sufficed me to stand on the negatiue till you made iust proofe of the contrary Here you will say you doe bring proofe for your assertion Here indeed you spend three leaues in talking of it as your manner is howbeit your word is here as throughout your writings the best warrant you offer vs for this cause But let vs heare your examples and proofes First that sacrifice consisting of two goats a slaine and a scape-goat You obiect heere against first that I abuse the Text. That were a great fault but let vs view the Text. Against your instance of the Scape-goat figuring as you would haue it the suffeââ¦ings of Christs soule I made three exceptions First that the Scripture did not call the Scape-goat a Sacrifice for sinne Secondly that no proofe was or could be made that the Scapegoat signified the soule of Christ Thirdly that if both those were granted which were no way proued the Scape-goat suffering nothing but being let loose into the wildernesse did rather inferre that Christes soule was freed from all such sufferings as you would force vpon it To the last which is the chiefest you take the paines to say little and so giue the Reader to vnderstand that your bolde assertion is the best foundation of your proofe for if you can not shew as you neither doe nor can that the Scape-goat by the Scriptures suffered any thing how will you bring it about that the Scape-goat figured the sufferings of Christes soule shall no suffering be a figure of suffering such may your figures be but the wisdome of God maketh figures for similitude and resemblance to the trueth and not for contrarietie to it as you do The chiefest point then you cleane slide from and take holde on some words in Moses text about which you thinke you may wrangle with some more likelihood The verie expresse wââ¦rds of the text you say are these Aaron shall take of the people two goats for a sinne offering And verie good reason must I bring to frustrate so plâ⦠a speech I am farre from bringing any thing to frustrate the Scriptures but if the Scripture expresse it selfe I preferre that before your misapplying the words to your will Aaron shal take of the congregation of the children of Israel two goats for sinne So stand the words if you will needs appeale precisely to the text Here is a taking of two goats and an intent for sinne declared in generall but the particular maner of vsing and ordering either of them according to Gods appointment followeth in distinct and direct wââ¦ds Aaron shall take the two goats and make them stand before the Lord at the doore of the Tabernacle And Aaron shall giue lots vpon both goats one lot for the Lord and another for the Scape-goat And Aaron shall make the goat on which the lâ⦠fell for the Lord to draw neere and shall make him reddie or sacrifice him for sinne For here is AASA'HV added which in the Scriptures vsually signifieth to make readie a Sacrifice And he shall kill the goat that is for sinne for the people and bring his bloud within the vaiââ¦e In as plaine words as the former be or any can be that goat on which the lot fell for the Lord must be made readie that is sacrificed for sinne of which he spake at first and that which was the peoples sinne-offering must be slaine and his blood brought within the vaile But neither of these agree to the Scape-goat therefore the Scape-goat was not the sinne offering for the people which the Scripture in that place mentioneth These words you say proue not that the Scape-goat was no sinne-offering at all These particular circumstances doe plainly proue which of the two goats was made the peoples sinne-offering and so conuince that you inlargc the words of Moses without any iust ground to serue your owne conceit Two sinne-offerings were not taken from the people but two goats were taken for sinne and one of them sacrificed for the people as was after prescribed and performed and Aaron commanded for him and his house to offer a bullocke for his sinne-offering So that where the Scripture mentioneth no moe sinne-offerings for the people but one neither vseth the word AASA but to one of them that one was prepared and slaine by Gods commandement as a sinne-offering for the people where the Scape-goat was preserued aliue and sent away into the wildernesse to shew the force of the former sacrifice by carying with it the sinnes of the people I take a sacrifice and offering in the largest sense as signifying any consecrated thing giuen to God to appease him for sinne And such vnbloudie sinne-offerings very manie we shall finde in Moses Law Wherefore the Scape-goat may be a sinne-offering though it were not slaine or bloudie That the word Sacrifice may be diuersly taken and applied to things vnbloudie and ghostly I haue no doubt but that one and the same word in one and the same place should import both a bloudie and vnbloudie sacrifice for sinne is a shift of yours without all sense it hath no shew in the sacred Scriptures Againe the sacrifices for sinne were they bloudie or vnbloudie which are mentioned in Moses law and namely in all those places which you quote in your margin they were all without exception OFFERED to God by FIRE the things liuing suffered first death by effusion of bloud the things without life as flowre oyle wine and such like were cast into the fire where the bloudie sacrifices were burned and so without bloud or fire no sacrifice for sinne is appointed in Moses law Since then the Scape-goat was neither slaine nor touched with fire but sent forth aliue into the wildernesse what do those examples of things vnbloudie yet offered by fire helpe you to proue that the Scape-goat liuing was such a sinne offering as many are found in Moses law Can there be any thing in the world more full and strong to prooue that the Scape-goat also was a true sinne-offering or rather a true part of this whole and entire sinne-offering consisting and being compleat in both these goats the slaine and the Scape-goat For as the slaine so the Scape-goat we see was CONSECRATED to the Lord and here OFFERED to make reconciliation by him and separated from men and barâ⦠vpon him all the sinnes of the
bodilie death which God had irreuocably pronounced and executed on Adam and his ofspring by returning him and them to the earth for manie thousand yeeres before Christ came but rather in that to partake with vs that he might saue vs from the rest which in all the wicked did accompany this death and in the end to raise vs againe to a better life lest we should faint vnder the hand of God who fastneth vs to the afflictions of this life by the example and fellowship of Christs sufferings For if we suffer with him we shall raigne with him and we must first die in Adam before we can be quickned againe in Christ. They are now profitable for vs you will say and so rather helpe vs than hurt vs in this corruption of sinne with which we are compassed I doubt not thereof and so were they from the first instant that they were imposed on Adam but how came this corruption of our nature if not as a punishment of sinne in Adam and consequently the remedies thereof do also witnesse Gods displeasure against sinne though they be farre more holesome for vs than to rot in the sores of our inward corruption Can any man doubt but God was and is able to cleere vs though neuer so corrupt from the infection and dominion of sinne by the working of his Spirit more mightilie and casilie than by troubles and griefs if it had so seemed good to his wisdome and iustice And had he determined to shew vs onlie loue without all regard to his iustice how readie was it for him in Christ to haue released as well all corporall and temporall affliction to his elect as he did spirituall and eternall But he resolued otherwise in his most wise counsell for the conseruation of his iustice and so now healeth our corruption with the salue of affliction to let vs haue continually presented before our eyes and impressed in our bodies what our sinne at first did and still doth deserue though he neuer withdrew his mercie from vs which in the end shall most abundantly recompense all Wherefore it is no reason that because troubles are profitable or necessarie for our corrupt state therefore they are not effects of Gods displeasure against sinne yea rather because God could haue otherwise cured sinne in vs and would not but by perpetuall affliction it is an argument that God so hated sinne in our first parents that he would haue the verie remembring curing thereof to be alwayes in this life painfull and grieuous to our outward man though he would also comfort vs in Christ whiles heere we liue and heereafter crowne vs with glorie for Christes sake Neither is this a question of words whether they be proper or improper in the Scriptures but a point of doctrine necessarie to be receiued of all men that the corruption and dissolution of our nature and life in this world doth manifest the exceeding hatred that naturallie God hath of sinne who rewarded it in all mankinde so seuerely that he spared neither the bodies soules states nor liues of his elect from sensible signes of his detesting sinne in them though for his sonnes sake in whom they were beloued and adopted he would by his wonderfull power rather further than indanger their saluation euen by those maladies and corrosiues of sinne This sheweth the greatnesse of Gods power and goodnesse of his mercie towards vs but this altereth not the iudgement which God pronounced and punishment which he inflicted on Adam and all his ofspring for sinne The corruption and infection of sinne which naturally and continually dwelleth in all the godly called by Diuines concupiscence is it no punishment of sinne because the guilt thereof is remitted in Baptisme and now it is left in vs to humble vs and awake vs to call for grace and to resist sinne that striuing with it we see not only the danger of sinne assaulting vs but the Spirit of God assisting vs and bountie of God rewarding vs The actuall sinnes of the faithfull shall we thinke them no sinnes but fauors from God because by them God worketh repentance submission conuersion yea faith zeale ioy and thanksgiuing in his elect God worketh sayth Austen all things for the good of those that loue him and so farre forth vtterly all things that if any of them stray and for sake the right way euen that God turneth to their good because they returne more humble and better taught The like I say of death and other miseries of mans life pronounced first by Gods mouth and still inflicted by Gods hand They are as they were degrees or effects of Gods anger against sinne in Adam pursuing him and all his posteritie for the confirmation of his iustice though by Gods mercie towards his they now serue as they did euen at the first in Gods children to represse sinne to worke repentance to raise confidence in God and contempt of all earthly things and to exercise the graces of Gods Spirit giuen them as patience obedience and such like and to giue them assurance of a better life The Church of Christ euer was and is of the same minde with me that the death of the bodie with her seeds and fruits in this life first entred and still remaineth as a PVNISHMENT of sin Men shunned saith Austen the death of the flesh rather than the death of the spirit that is the punishment rather than the cause of the punishment We came vnto death by sinne Christ by righteousnesse ideo cum sit mors nostra poena peccati mors illius facta est hostia pro peccato and therefore where our death is the punishment of sinne his death was the sacrifice for sinne Theodoret speaking of the separation of bodie and soule wherby that which is mort all sustaineth death the soule remaining free from death as being immortall asketh his aduersarie ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã Doest thou not thinke death to be a punishment Who answering The Diuine Scripture teacheth so much Theodoret inferreth Is death then the punishment of sinners The other yeelding that this is granted of all men Theodoret concludeth Why then since both the soule and bodie sinned doth the bodie alone sustaine the punishment of death Fulgentius Nisi praecessisset in peccato mors animae nunquam corporis mors in supplicio sequeretur Except the death of the soule had gone before by sinne the death of the bodie had neuer followed after as a punishment And therefore of our flesh he sayth Nascitur cum poena mortis pollutione peccati It is borne with the punishment of death and pollution of sinne And of yoong children By what iustice is an infant subiected to the wages of sinne if there be no vncleannesse of sinne in him or how do we see him strooken with death if he felt not the sting thereof which is sinne Maxentius in the confession of his faith We beleeue sayth he that not only the death of
no sinnes but onely such as Adam did and we still doe commit ioyntly with Soule and body though most properly in the soule the body being her Instrument or accessarie to follow her direction and will And would you wrie and wrangle neuer so much from sinnes common to Soule and Body most proportionably followeth punishment likewise common to Soule and Body though in that common punishment the Soule perceiueth and feeleth greater and grieuouser hurt and smart then the body can doe If now you adde a farder meaning then you there expressed your reason remaineth as weake as it was at first and your new meaning must haue a new answere For which I must pray the Reader to stay till we haue more fully examined Adams fact where you first began and wherein you would seeme to haue some great aduantage Howbeit if you marke well either your own purpose which you offer to prooue or your Assumption which you bring for proofe thereof or my words depending thereon you will haue but a cold suite of all this hoate challenge Your purpose was to prooue that Christs sufferings for sinne must be proper to the Soule and not with from or by the Body which you reiect as common to vs with beasts The reason which you brought for it was that Adam first we euer since so sinned that is MOST PROPERLY in our Soules our Bodies being but the Instruments of our Soules to follow the Soules direction and will Now because your wonted phrase MOST PROPERLY is so loosely set in your assumption that a Man can not tell whether you meane most properly in the Soule together with the Body being the Instrument of the Soule as your words lye or else most properly in the Soule without and besides the Body which is it that you intend must conclude before you can thence inferre the proper sufferings of Christs soule without and besides his body I asked you which of these twaine you ment If the former then Adam first and we euer since committed sinne ioyntly with Soule and Body the Soule being the Principall and the Body her Instrument and accessarie This I said was most true but repugnant to your purpose as I before haue shewed But if you ment OTHERVVISE that Adam transgressed the Commandement of God MOST PROPERLY in his Soule without his Body concurring to the same transgression which is more pertinent to your purpose then you contradicted the fact of Adam and Gods precept both which doe plainly witnesse that Adam disobeyed as well by Body as by Soule If you will needs examine my words vpon this your intention and assumption I am well content That Adam sinned in soule and bodie I say is most true There is my full resolution Against this I neuer goe But if you meant OTHERVVISE that Adam brake the commandement of God not by his body properly but by his soule only as your words most properly might intend then your assumption was a manifest contradiction to the fact of Adam and to the precept of God That the bodie alone without the soule doth or can commit actuall sinne which hath neither life sense motion nor action without the soule is a position so absurd and false that I thought it not woorth the mentioning I asked you then whether you meant that Adam brake the commandement not by his bodie properly as by an instrument to his soule which is proper to the bodie as your selfe confesse but by his soule without his bodie that is by his soule onely For what is by the soule and not by the bodie but by the soule onely I asking you that question of your meaning you as eclipsed of your wits suppose that I say Adam sinned onlie by his bodie and not by his soule as if Adam when he sinned were a body without a soule or his bodie did any thing without the direction and operation of his soule This is therefore a verie foolish dotage of yours to dreame that I defend Adam sinned by his bodie without his soule when I prooue and inferre by Adams fact and Gods precept that Adam transgressed not by his soule only but by his bodie also euen as in murder theft and adulterie these facts men commit by their bodies as instruments and not by their soules alone or without their bodies For can men commit these facts without their bodies or are their bodies requisite as well as their soules before they can commit these facts Adam was as well forbidden ââ¦o desire or like that fruit as to eat it which you denie To proue that Adam sinned not onely by his soule but also by his bodie I brought the words of Gods precept Thou shalt not eat thereof Which commandement since Adam wholly transgressed the words had more in them than the prohibition of desiring or liking and Adams sinne reached farder than to liking or lust euen to the complete fact whereby the commandement of God was thorowly in euerie part of man broken which could not be done without the ioynt actions of Adams bodie Wherefore take backe the heresie of the Pharisees to your ââ¦elfe and bestow it among your friends that haue lent you their labours in this Defence I am not to seeke that Gods law is transgressed as well with heart and tongue as with hand and deed Howbeit I distinguish facts from words and thoughts and auouch that FACTS can not be performed without the bodie And yet are there speciall reasons which you see not why the wisdome of God would not giue this commandement without euident mention of an outward fact For the breaking of this precept was the transgression that should subiect Adam and all his posteritie to the dominion of sinne and death in euerie part of bodie and soule Wherefore God would not haue the first sinne to be secret within the soule alone that all Adams of-spring should openly behold and confesse the wickednesse vnworthinesse and vnthankfulnesse of their first parents that so lightly regarded and presently transgressed the charge and precept that God gaue vnto them Secondly since Adams cariage in this case should be the retaining or loosing of all Gods graces and blessings for him and his children bestowed on man in his first creation the transgression must reach to all the senses and faculties of bodie and soule that should infect and corrupt all the parts and powers of bodie and soule Thirdly the first sinne was to extend as well to bodie as to soule lest the soule sinning should be adiudged to euerlasting death and the bodie not sinning reserued for eternall life and so man be diuided contrarie to his creation the one part in hell and the other in heauen which was vtterly impossible And if Adam after liking had yet remembred Gods precept and threat and so refrained the eating of the forbidden fruit it would trouble your wits to make a true answer whether Adam had obeyed or transgressed the commandement But it sufficeth for my purpose that Adam sinned ioyntly
times ouercame me When I repressed him I afflicted my selfe for I receiued backe the griefe when I cherished him I was impugned by him enduring his wanton assaults Therefore assigne not me alone to punishment ó Lord but either free me together with the bodie from these straits or cast that together with me into torment Howbeit the Iudge needeth no such supplication but as he gouerneth wisely so he iudgeth iustly restoring the bodie to their soules and so giuing to euerie one according to their deserts Damascene alledgeth the coniunction of the soule with the bodie and the cooperation of both in all vertues and vices as causes sufficient why the bodie must be iudged and rewarded together with the soule If the soule alone sustained the trials of vertue alone shall she be crowned and if she alone were intangled with pleasures iustly she alone must be punished ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã but because she had no seuerall being from the bodie neither passed thorowe vertue or vice without the bodie iustly shall both together receiue rewâ⦠of good or bad For the better conceiuing the trueth of these speeches we must know what these Fathers meane by the bodie and what powers and faculties of man they comprise in that name and why so shall wee the sooner discerne what cooperation in sinne mans bodie hath with his soule The bodie as it is the instrument or seruant of the soule to do good or euill is no dead nor senselesse lumpe of flesh but hath annexed vnto it besides life both sense and motion and those as well inward as outward For externall and internall sense and motion are not only performed by vitall and animall spirits which are plainly corporall though their vigor and force be from the soule which bringeth life and sense but so affixed to the bodie that they die with the bodie and are not found in the soule so long as she is separated from the bodie Those faculties these Fathers ascribe the rather to the flesh because in some sort they be in beasts who in their kinde haue sense and motion both outward and inward and sensitiue desires and affections depending thereon which all must needs be corporall for that brute beasts ledde only by sense to desire and delight in things present before them haue no spirituall nor immortall part from which they should proceed The same powers of sense and sensitiue appetites and affections in mans bodie these learned Fathers account and call corporall not that they discerne or moue without the soule but that the sensitiue and inferiour powers of the soule are mixed with corporal spirits in man and by them apprehend and desire externall sensible things by which corruption of senses and affections the soule is drawen to diuers delights and desires that are continuall occasions and inducements to sinnes Therefore Theodoret nameth ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã the desires affections assaults and conflicts of the bodie seeking by pleasures and sundrie lusts to conquer the soule Neither want they the warrant of holy Scripture in so speaking Let not sinne reigne in your mortall bodies sayth Paul to obey it in the lusts thereof neither giue your members to be weapons of vnrighteousnesse vnto sinne So that the members of our mortall bodie are called by the Apostle the weapons of vnrighteousnesse by which sinne fighteth against the soule Whence are warres and strifes in you sayth Iames not hence euen from the pleasures which fight in your members Abstaine sayth Peter from carnall desires which fight against the soule I delight in the law of God sayth Paul according to the inward man but I see another law in my members fighting against the law of my minde and leading me captiue to the law of sinne which is in my members O wretched man that I am who shall deliuer me from the bodie of this death Where the inward man which is the mind lightned and the will directed by grace is diuided against the outward man which must nââ¦eds be the inferior powers of the soules ioyned with the parts and spi it s of the bodie wherâ⦠and whereby sinne still dwelling in our earthly aud irregenerate members iusteth agaââ¦nst the spirit and striueth against the minde which Peter calleth fighting against the soule To strengthen this doctrine which you thinke so strange it shall not be amisse to consider somewhat further what communion the soule hath with the bodie that thereby we may perceiue what vse the soule hath of her bodie in well or euill doing The habitation of the soule in the bodie and her coniunction with the bodie making one man of two contrarie parts mortall and immortall visible and inuisible reasonable and vnreasonable is so wonderfull a worke of God that the manner thereof wholly pasââ¦eth our vnderstanding onely by consequents and effects wee gather what she vseth in the bodie what she perceiueth by the bodie and what she imparteth to the bodie Howbeit her habitation in the bodie and vnion with the bodie composing one person of both called man is sufficient by the Scriptures if we knew no more of the communion that is betwixt them to make both parts guiltie of all sinne committed and liable to the punishment thereof both in this world and in the next And so much the Scriptures teach vs when they require confession of our sinnes or promise remission of our sinnes or threaten vengeance for our vnrighteousnesse wherein the bodie is not seuered nor excepted from the soule but both are conââ¦oyned in one person to whom and euery part of whom either mercie is afforded vnto saluation or iustice awarded vnto damnation And yet because the communion which is betwixt the soule and bodie will giue vs some light how the soule vseth the helpe of her bodie in accomplishing her actions I may not omit to speake thereof though happily it will be somewhat obscure to the simple and more remote from their vnderstanding then in this case I could wish As man was ordained of God to haue in him the seuerall operations of life of sense of reason so was the soule created with three diuerse faculties answerable to those three functions to wit with a vitall or vegetatiue for the first with a sensitiue and motiue for the second with a reasonable or intellectiue for the third The vitall facultie prouided for the quickning nourishing increasing and preseruing of the bodie in moderate strength to the discharge of our dueties to God and our neighbour is so fastned to the bodie that without the bodie it hath neither vse nor action The second facultie called sensitiue was giuen of purpose to the soule not onely to perceiue by sense the natures helpes and vses of all externall and sensible things and by voluntarie motion to pursue that which was profitable for vs but chiefly that by seeing the workes hearing the words of God we should come to the knowledge of his will and open our lippes to praise his name and to
the people that Christ came to saue the house of Israell by giuing his life for their sinnes and that sinne caused the onely Sonne of God to be crucified in the flesh and to suffer the most vile and slaunderous death of the Crosse and consequently willed them to remember how grieuously and cruelly Christ was handled of the Iewes for our sinnes and to set before their eyes Christ crucified with his body stretched on the Crosse his head crowned with sharpe thornes his hands and his feete pearced with nayles his heart opened with a speare his flesh rent and torne with whips his browes sweating water and bloudâ⦠by this stirreth vp the hearers to the hatred of sinne that was so grieuous in the sight of God that he would not be pacified but onely with the bloud of his owne Sonne And though there were a thousand examples in the Scripture shewing how greatly God abhorred sinne yet this one is of more force then all the rest that the Sonne of God was compelled to giue his body to bee bruised and broken on the Crosse for our sinnes After these premonitions follow your words Christ hath taken vpon him the iust reward of sinne which was death not the whole reward of sinne which is an vtter exclusion from all grace and glorie and the eternall damnation of body and Soule in hell fire but the death of his body bruised and broken on the Crosse by the cruell rage of the Iewes which is particularly and plainely before described Now the death of the body inflicted on all mankind for sinne is the iust though not the full reward of sinne and by suffering that Christ freed vs from all condemnation of sinne which otherwise in vs would haue beene euerlasting And this explication the same Homily addeth to the former words which you cite though you purposely suppresse it When all hope of righteousnesse was past on our part and wee had nothing whereby wee might quench Gods burning wrath and worke the saluation of our Soules Then euen then did the Sonne of God come downe from heauen to be wounded for our sakes to be reputed with the wicked to be condemned vnto death to take vpon him the reward of our sinnes and to giue his body to be broken on the Crosse for our offences Here are both the places which you patch together the one noting Death to be the iust reward of sinne the other expressing what kind of death Christ suffered for vs as the reward of our sinne euen the breaking of his body on the Crosse for our offences In the second proposition you shew more deprauing of the publike doctrine of this Realme For where the second Homily saith in expresse words that our Grandfather Adam by breaking Gods commaundement in eating the Apple forbidden him in Paradise purchased not onely to himselfe but also to his posteritie for euer the iust wrath and indignation of God who condemned both him and his to euerlasting death both of body and Soule you transferre this iudgement from Adam to Christ which the Homily doeth not and least you should bee taken tardie with open blasphemie you leaue out the word EVERLASTING which is euident in the Homily and vpon those maimed and forged collections you inferre that by the Homily Christ tooke on him for vs the death both of body and Soule Why say you not Christ tooke vpon him EVERLASTING death both of body and Soule which was the iust and due purchase or wages of our sinne by the plaine words of that Homilie You feared blasphemie and therefore you chose rather to falsifie the place then to want some defence for your Doctrine Christ you will say died that death which was the reward of our sinne by the Booke of Homilies To belie publike Authoritie so grossely in so great causes is a quadruple iniquitie What death Christ died for our sinnes is openly professed and euen pictured before our eyes in this very Homilie the words I repeated in the Section before What death was the wages of our sinne if the word euerlasting did not fully declare the same Homilie in the same Section whence your words are taken doth twice most abundantly teach Adam tooke vpon him to eate of the tree forbidden and in so doing he died the death that is to say he became mortall he lost the fauour of God he was cast out of Paradise he was no longer a Citizen of heauen but a fire brand of hell and a bond-slaue to the Diuell And sixe lines after So that now neither Adam nor any of his had any right or interest at all in the kingdome of heauen but were become plaine Reprobates and cast-awaies being perpetually damned to the euerlasting paines of hell fire It would fairely fit your new Doctrine to defend that Christ was a Reprobate and a Cast-away yea a fire-brand of hell and a bond-slaue to the Diuell perpetually damned to the euerlasting paines of hell fire And though I be perswaded you detest these diuelish impieties and hellish blasphemies yet you regard little your cause or your conscience which vouch in Print that Christ suffered that reward of sinne which by the Booke of Homilies was due to vs all those things by the same Booke in the same place being due to vs. You will shift of this matter as if these things might be granted in substance not in circumstance and in our countenance not in his But such shifts are so shamefull and sinfull in this case that I thinke your owne friends wil altogether mislike your flying to the Booke of Homilies for the death of the Soule or the iust reward of sinne in all mankind there mentioned to be suffered in the Soule of Christ. Also our great Bible appointed by Authoritie to be read in publike Churches expresly saith as much It is a poore pittance when you finde no helpe for your new made hell in the whole Text of the Bible to run to the Printers additions set by the sides of the Booke who often annexe things in the Margine for direction or explication as they thinke good which declare the Printers or Correctors but not the Authors nor Translators mind Your wits I trust be not so weake but you can discerne between the English translation of the Text commaunded to be publikely read in the Church and the Marginall notes added by others without any warrant of publike Authority for ought that I see And therefore I take not my selfe nor any man else to be bound to those notes farder then they euidently concurre with the truth of the Text though they may be sometimes profitable for the opening of hard places That Christ was in an Agonie the Euangelist affirmeth and the English Translator hath done his duetie in expressing so much but what the cause was of that Agonie is beyond the Commission of a Translator to specifie since the Scripture concealeth it and so publike Authoritie which appointed
the Ransomer which the captiue otherwise should You reason from the willes of men which preferre money before captiues to the will of God who regardeth no money which kind of reasoning I reiect as nâ⦠way matching our redemption and yet if it were admitted exchanges recompences and conclusions of peace which are no way in the prisoners powers are amongst men as vsuall as Ransomes It is therefore no way needefull by this similitude that our Redeemer should suffer the selfe same paines which we should haue suffered A recompence aboue our power and so not possible to vs was easie to him that so farre exceeded our condition and that by your owne similitude might more then suffice for the prisoner For though men will not take lesse then the worth of their Captiues as they conceiue their abilities or likelihoodes of seruice yet that doeth not hinder the Sonne of God to giue for vs farre more then our value could or can reach vnto because he had infinite riches of holinesse righteousnesse and obedience in his power which we haue not He might not therefore giue lesse then we were worth but more he might and did giue not by suffering hell paines in a sharper sense greater measure then we can endure which is your fansie but because those things which he suffered were of infinite price in his person which in ours would amount to no such rate From the sorowes which Christ did beare for our sakes you came in your second reason to the curse which hee tasted for our sinnes and because the Apostle saieth Christ was made a curse for vs in that he hanged on a tree to redeeme vs from the curse of the Law you would thence conclude that Christ suffered for vs the verie paines of hell and the death of the soule as part of that curse which the Law denounceth to all sinners You were answered by me that before your conclusion would any way follow vpon your premisses you must make your first proposition generall that the whole curse of the Law and all the parts thereof were suffered by Christ. Now this generall assertion that Christ suffered the whole curse of the Law and euery part thereof was not onely false and farre from the Apostles words but so wicked and impious that without horrible blasphemie it might not be affirmed of Christ. For the whole curse of the Law plainely compriseth in it excecation induration desperation confusion a finall priââ¦ation of all grace and glorie and euerlasting damnation of bodie and soule to hell fire none of which our Sauiour could suffer To this what now reply you Christ suffered our whole curse onely so farre as possibilitie of things could admit that is with those three limitations which are before expressed You litle thinke the discreet Reader smileth at your proud and foolish presumption that in the Apostles name and vnder the Apostles wordes would canonize your owne pelting conceites and then blow and suppe with a breath denying that which you affirme and affirming that which you denie For what haue the Apostles words to doe with your three limitations And if there be no possibilitie to draw Pauls speech to the WHOLE CVRSE of the Law without apparant and palpable falsitie and impietie why striue you for the generall that you dare not stande to without three limitations which prooue the generall not to be simply true First then in steede of Pauls warrant you obtrude your owne and imagine your naked speech to be an armed proofe Next you say Christ suffered the WHOLE CVRSE of the Law saue three exceptions which denie the whole and so in effect you affirme Christ suffered the whole curse of the law and yet not the whole but onely so farre as possibilitie could admit that is in plaine termes or in plaine trueth it was not possible Christ should suffer the WHOLE CVRSE of the Law due to sinners since by that suffering he could neither saue vs nor be saued himselfe This gappe was so great that you foresaw euery man would eye it and therefore you brack it vp with an other bush euen as good as the former For in this wise you seeke to preuent that obiection But you will say Thus we make it not the whole curse of the Law Yes we call it rightly the whole curse for as much as Christ suffered it in his whole manhood euen in all the powers of his spirit and soule and bodie Here we see what your wisedome doth and sayth but what saith the Apostle Did he speake or thinke as you doe His words we haue farre different from yours now your proofe of his meaning were worth the hearing Christ you say suffered it in his whole manhood What then Ergo he suffered the whole curse You must found a new Vniuersitie where your Logicke must get grace to proceede by it selfe without controle it is so repugnant to all rules knowen to vs that we can not so much as conceaue it For thus you reason The whole manhood of Christ suffered the curse that is some parts of the curse Ergo Christ suffered the whole curse As well you may reason the whole man in all Gods seruants performeth some parts of the Law ergo all the seruants of God performe the whole law You would be loth to be answered your debts if you haue any with such accounts for if a man did owe you ten pounds and with all his heart and both his hands did bring you ten pence your reason here will conclude he hath payd you the whole though that I thinke would scant content you if you were a Creditour You be neerely driuen when such shifts must serue you or els be taken with a non-plus What els is this but a cleere confession that Christ could not suffer the whole curse of the law when you dare not otherwise defend it but that the whole manhood of Christ suffered some parts of the curse It was you say in nature and veritie the true and proper curse of the Law which Christ was made for vs. You be safe now you ââ¦e come to your accustomed anker of PROPER and VERIE holde you fast there and you may be sure no man shall hale you out of this harbour till you list to tell what you meane by proper and verie which you will neuer doe But in the meane time how proue you that Christ did suffer the whole curse of the Law due to vs which is a false and wicked assertion leudly fathered by you vpon the Apostles words And if you recant that generall proposition what handfast hath your conclusion For if you reason thus Christ suffered some parts of the curse which the law threateneth for sinne ergo he suffered the true paines of hell your Reader will assoone inferre ergo you haue neither learning nor vnderstanding There is no colour to make the curse which Christ suffered for our sinnes like to the curse which senselesse creatures doe sometimes beare for
hanged as also he may bee iustly hanged and yet not truely or properly accursed of God The penitent thiefe on the Crosse came deseruedly to his death as himselfe confessed and yet was not thereby truly accursed since he was that day receiued into Paradise His death was an accursed kind of death as also Christes was though the one did blesse and the other was blessed euen vnder that punishment which Christ did willingly and the thiefe patiently suffer Paul saith not as you affirme that Christ was made that curse only that iudiciall curse whereof onely Moses speaketh Much lesse doth Paul say as you teach that Christ suffered the whole proper curse of the law I measure Pauls meaning by his proofe you extend it to your fansie So that as I say Paul prooueth that he meaneth as you say Paul meaneth that hee prooueth not Which of our constructions commeth neerest the Apostles mind the Reader will soone perceiue Paul handling before generally Gods curse and the punishment of the Law against sinne and shewing we are redeemed from it by Christs being made the same for vs he confirmeth it by applying Moses iudiciall punishment against certaine transgressours being it seemeth a figure of Christ herein If you may adde what fansies and falsities you list to the Apostles words you will make at length some shew of proofe if not from Pauls text yet out of your owne trifles There is not one true word in all this Preface of yours to Pauls proofe for neither doth the Apostle in that place handle generally the punishment of the Law against sinne nor shew that Christ was made the same for vs neither did Moses appoint hanging by any iudiciall Law against transgressours neither were oââ¦enders so punished a figure of Christ herein Paul in that place handleth the righteousnesse of faith in Christ as bringing the blessing of Abraham and freeing from sinne which the law conuinced and accursed The law threatneth a curse vpon euery breach thereof but it inflicteth not actuall punishment vpon euery sinner And therefore the curse of the law in Pauls first words is either the DETESTATION which God hath of sinne and sinners whom in time appointed he meaneth euerlastingly to destroy or the OBLIGATION to temporall and eternall euill which sinne hath in it Neither of which Christ was made for vs since hee tasted not the same but another kind of curse which was the temporall punishment of sinne by the hands of men and by that obedience to the will and counsell of God hee freed vs from the guilt and wages of sinne which the law denounced To note the differences of those two curses the Apostle putteth the Article to the first for the more vehemencie and not to the second saying Christ redeemed vs from that curse of the law being made a curse for vs. The curse then or punishment of sinne in the person of Christ was hanging on a tree to which Moses by his iudiciall law adiudged no man Worshippers of other Gods blasphemers breakers of the Sabbath disobeiers of parents and Adulterers were to bee stoned to death by the law of Moses Murderers were to loose bloud for bloud and false witnesses to suffer that they meant to others whether it were eye for eye hand for hand or life for life But by no iudiciall law that I reade did Moses appoint any transgressours to be hanged By the expresse commandement of God who is aboue the law Moses tooke the chiefe of the people that coupled themselues with Baal Peor and hanged them vp before the Lord against the Sunne And Ioshua vsed the same kind of death in some that were strangers and not Israelites otherwise Moses neuer commanded but onely permitted the Magistrate to hange transgressours yet so that the body should not remaine all night vpon the tree but be buried the same day because the curse of God was executed on him that was hanged So that God not appointing any man by his law to bee hanged but leauing that libertie to the Magistrate so to reuenge malefactours where the law did not specifie their punishment they could bee no figures of Christ as well in respect they were wicked that must be so vsed who were not fit to be figures of that innocent vndefiled Lambe as also that men had no power to erect figures of Christs death passion but must leaue that to God to represent the sufferings of his Sonne as he saw cause They that were hanged by the iust sentence of the Law they were herein accursed that is they herein sustained the lawes true and deserued punishment But if they were INNOCENTS oppressed by vnrighteous iudgement which is no newes among men as we see by the death of our Sauiour or if they were PENITENTS though their punishment were neuer so deserued neither of these could be truly accursed before God yet might be hanged and so subiected to the corporall curse of the Law For though Moses had no meaning to haue men vniustly hanged yet had he lesse purpose to pronounce them damned that died for their sinnes if they repented and therefore he commmandeth the bodies to be buried the same day because the Curse that is the Rigour and Reuenge of the Law was executed on them and consequently Moses extendeth not this curse farther then this life which maketh nothing to the paines or perpetuall curse of the damned And here the Reader may plainly perceiue you to sincke in the sands of your owne subtilties for here you confesse that deserued hanging is a TRVE CVRSE and PVNISHMENT notwithstanding if the guiltie repent as the Theefe did on the Crosse I hope you will leaue him the child of Gods mercie whom Christ receiued into Paradise And consequently by your owne confession the paines and afflictions of this life when they are deserued are curses and true punishments of sinne to Gods children though their soules be blessed by their submission and conuersion vnto God Which ouerthroweth all that you formerly haue said touching the troubles and vexations of this life and that you presently meane to conclude of Moses curse applied to Christ. By applying this text of Moses in this sense and in this respect to Christ it is well confirmed to be in nature and veritie the true and proper curse of the Law which Christ was made for vs for such also in deede was the nature of that iudiciall curse of Moses Moses we see had no meaning to make their soules accursed whose bodies were hanged on the tree by the iust iudgement of the Magistrate if the malefactours truely repented their wicked offences How much lesse then ment he to subiect the Sonne of God to the internall or eternall curse of the Law for that he was vniustly and wrongfully hanged on a tree by the malice and spight of his Enemies And yet in both as well poenitent as innocent hanging is called a curse that is
a true and corporall punishment appointed by God for sinne though mans error inflict it on innocents or true repentance abolish the rest that would follow after this life if God were not reconciled vnto vs. In the wicked then which persist in their mischieuous purposes without repentance your reason taketh place that hanging to them is a part of that true and terrible curse the whole whereof shall be executed on them for their sinnes but in repentants it is starke false and in Christ of whom this question riseth it is irreligious and impious to say that he suffered the whole curse of the Law prouided for sinne or the death of the soule and of the damned which is properly due to sinners Now vnderstand Chrysostome thus as we before haue distinguished the punishment of Christ and of the damned and then we differ not Suppose Chrysostome to teach falsly and talke absurdly as you doe and then you may soone bring him to weare your badge but leaue him at libertie to tell his owne tale and hee is farre enough from your follies He sayth they were dââ¦erse curses in Christ and in the damned to signifie diuerse manners of one and the same curse in Nature He speaketh not of the damned at all he speaketh of the whole people of the Iewes which were vnder the curse of the Law for sinne till they were thence deliuered by Christ which the damned neuer were nor shall be His words are The people were in danger of another curse which saith Cursed is euery one which abideth not in the things written in the booke of the Law For not one of them had obserued the whole Law Christ then since he was not subiect to the curse of transgression admitted this curse to hang on the Crosse in steede of that to loose the people from their curse Chrysostome truely learnedly and consonantly to the rest of the ancient Fathers distinguisheth two kindes of EVILS or CVRSES incident to men which are sinne and the punishment of sinne The one is an vniust action pleasing man but displeasing God the other is a iust passion pleasing God but displeasing man Mala dicuntur Delicta Supplicia The OFFENCE and the REVENGE are both called ââ¦uils sayth Tertullian Duo sunt genera malorum peccatum poena peccati there are two sorts of Euils sayth Austen Sinne and the punishment of sinne For by Gods prouidence ruling all things as man doth the euill which he will so he suffereth the Euill which he will not Then sinne is not onely euill before it be punished but a greater euill then the punishment is since it is an euill in his owne nature repugnant to the righteousnesse of God Now as God is all good and therefore all blessed so sinne forsaking God falleth from goodnesse and so from blessednesse and is consequently more accursed with God then punishment is and ought so to be with men if they be rightly aduised as being the cause and continuance of their punishment For accursed signifieth as well detested and depriued of blessednesse as subiected to miserie or deuoted to destruction So that sinne in it selfe is a curse with God that is hated and detested of God and depriuing man of all communion and participation with the fountaine of blessednesse though no punishment did follow Yet because men would with neglect and despââ¦ght of God abide and reioyce in their wickednesse if sense of grieââ¦e and paine did not force them to feele theiâ⦠wretchednesse therefore the wisedome and iustice of God pursueth such as dwell and delight in their sinnes with sharpe and bitteâ⦠plagues that locââ¦ing on their miserie they may timely repent or eternally lament their obstinacie To these two kinds of curses Chrysostomes wordes and proofes doe leade The whole people were not damned as you deuoutly dââ¦eame but they had sinned and so were subiected to the danger of Gods displeasure foâ⦠sinne and of his indignation against sinne From this Christ was free for he did not sinne ãâã was guile found in his mââ¦uth as Chrysostom concludeth out of the Scriptures Since then Christ was not subiect to the curse of Transgression he admitted ââ¦other Curse euââ¦n the punishment of sinne which is a curse also for sinne though of an other Nature then the committing of sinne by one to dissolue the otheâ⦠that is by his owne paine to abolish the guilt of our sinne Chrysostomes woââ¦ds are as plââ¦ne as his proofes The curse of transgressing was another curse and not the ãâã which Christ suffered Yea Christ might not be subiected to that curse to which the people were for transgressing the law but changed that for another and so loosââ¦d their curse ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã another and not the same be as forciââ¦le woââ¦ds to shew different natures and persons as any the Greeke tongue hath and your shift of diââ¦erse degrees in the same nature is a childish toy since much and little like and vnlike sââ¦ew diuers degrees or measures in one nature but another and not the same thing directly noteth the substance or nature to be diuers Austen on whom you triumph is stretched beyond his meaning he deaââ¦eth against a Mainichââ¦e who denied that Christ had true human flesh Now he proueth that Christ truely died because the Apostle saith he was made a curse for vs in that he hanged on a Tree I haue cause to content my selfe that so leaââ¦ned and religious a Father as Saint Augustine was so highly reuerenced in the Church of God did more then twelue hundred yeers since in his conflicts with Hereticks refute the greatest part of your positions as repugnant to the faith of Christ and the soundnesse of the Sacred Scriptures And I thinke few men so foolish as in the grounds of our Redemption and saluation by Christ to reiect the Doctrine which he taught as false and receaue your scambling conceits as true And in my Iudgement you were best to take heed least if the resolutions which Saint Austen and other Catholike Fathers made against Heretickes disprooue your new found faith you be taken tardy with bringing Baggage into the Church of Christ long since condemned and banished from the Creede of all Christians What Saint Austen proueth you are no fit reporter except you did read more attentiuely and iudge more sincerely For did you euer peruse the words wrong course in so wise a Father if he meant purposely to prooue against the Manichees that Christ truely died for vs and not in shew onely as they supposed to ouerskip all the Testimonies and circumstances of Christs true death recorded in the Scriptures as his giuing vp the Ghost Pilates examining and the Centurions confessing the truth thereof as also the Souldiers perceiuing him alreadie dead and so not breaking his lââ¦gges but pearcing his side with a speare and the* gazing and watching of his ââ¦nemies and of the whole multitude ouer him
will not distinguish what death is in it selfe euen to the godly and what is consequent after it by Gods mercie towards his Saints And heerein I say you want both trueth and iudgement for things are to be named by their natures and not by the sequents which often God sendeth cleane contrarie to the purposes and practises of Satan and his members Tyrannie shall it be no crueltie because it maketh Martyrs Sinne shall it not be displeasing to God because it humbleth the faithfull by repentance The corruption of mans nature shall it not be sinne because thereby God exerciseth his Saints to watchfulnesse and prayer Euen so the death of the bodie which God at first inflicted on all his Elect for sinne shall it be no punishment for that God doth comfort his in death and reward them after death I affirme death to the godly is no curse properly And I aââ¦irme that when you can not tell how to start from the force of truth you do nothing but lie or flie to your phrases of proper and verie which here as in other places do you no good In the fifteenth line of this page you say the death of of the godly may IN NO SORT be called a Curse or Accursed In the sixteenth whiles you offer to proue those words you confesse them to be false Death to the ãâã ãâã no Curse properly you say but a benefit and aduantage then improperly death is a curse and before you sayd It may in no sort be called a Curse to them If in no ââ¦rt then neither properly nor improperly What then is that Enemie that must be destââ¦oyed a cursing or a blessing Can it be an enemie to Christ and yet a blessing to the godly I cannot better refell your folly then S. Austen doth in this verie case If death be a bleââ¦ing to the bodies of the godly neuer desire to be deliuered from it what nââ¦ed you beleeue or loue the resurrection of the flesh which is the destruction of death in the bodie it death be a benefit to the bodie But if this be repugnant to Christian religion then hath death in it euen a shew of Gods curse on the bodie for sinne which must be destroyed before Christ can fully reigne in all his Saints Yet is it to the godly no curse properly The heigth of your learning hangeth on the helpe of this word PROPERLY we yet came to no point in all our defence but when you see your selfe pressed you straightwayes post to PROPER and VERY and yet you neuer define either nor take the paines to expound your selfe lest you should be taken with open heresie and blasphemie in applying one and the same curse properly and truely to Christ and the damned You say I am to young a Doctour to controll Saint Austen herein and I say you are a Doctour not olde enough to prooue Austen contrarie to me in this point A farre younger then I am will soone discerne by that I haue sayd that S. Austen is repugnant in this point to your proper and verie nouelties for where you say Death to the godly may in no sort be called a curse S. Austen thus expoundeth Christes words to the godlie Feare not those which kill the bodie as if Christ had sayd Nolite timere male dictum mortis corporalis quod temporaliter soluitur Feare not the CVRSE of a bodily death which in time is dissolued And so when he resolueth Moses had none other meaning in this sentence Cursed is euerie one that hangeth on a tree then if he had sayd Mortall is euerie one that hangeth on a tree Poterat enim dicere maledictus omnis mortalis aut maledictus omnis moriens For Moses might haue sayd Cursed is eââ¦ry mortall man or cursed is euerie man that dieth If Moses might truely haue so sayd as it is euident by S. Austens position then I trust death in some sort may be iustlie called a Curse euen to the godlie But S. Austen sayth that the death of the bodie is good to the good and euill to the euill That speech S. Austen sayth may be tolerated not in respect of death it selfe which is euill but of the mercies of God which follow the faithfull after their deaths His words which you skippe as your maner is to do when any thing maketh against you are Dici potest It may be sayd But vpon that speech he presently moueth this question in the beginning of the next Chapter If the death of the bodie be good to the good quo modo poterit obtineri quòd etiam ipsa sit poena peccati how may it be resolued that it is also the punishment of sinne His resolution you did not reade or not regard because it resisted your fansie but thereby the Reader may see what credit is to be giuen to your words when you crake of Fathers We must confesse sayth Austen that the first men were so created that if they had not sinned they should haue tasted no kinde of death but the verie same being the first sinners were so punished with death that whatsoeuer should spring from their root should be held subiect to the same punishment And discussing the question proposed more at large he resolueth Sic per ineffabilem Dei misericordiam ipsa pââ¦na vitââ¦orum transit in arma virtutis fit meritum iusti etiam supplicium peccatoris So by the vnspeakeable mercie of God the punishment of vice becommeth the armour of vertue and the reuenge of a sinner is made the merit of the iust Non quia mors bonum aliquod facta est quâ⦠antea malum fuit sed tantam Deus fidei praestitit gratiam vt mors quam vitae constat esse contrariam instrumentum fieret per quod transiâ⦠in vitam NOT THAT DEATH IS BECOME ANY GOOD which before was euill but so great fauour God hath yeelded vnto faith that death which most certainly is contrarie to life is made an instrument for the good by which they passe vnto life And to make men the better to vnderstand the effect of his speech he bringeth an example out of the Scriptures where the law is called the strength of sinne Why sayth he rehearse ââ¦e this Because that as the Law is not euill when it increaseth the lust of sinners so death is not good when it augmenteth the glorie of the sufferes but as the vniust doe eââ¦lly vse not onely euill but also good things so the iust doe well vse not onely good but euen things that be euill Hence commeth it that the wicked vse the Law ill though the Law be good BONI beââ¦Ã¨ moriantur quamuis sit mors malum and the good die well though death be euill I haue toucheâ⦠at large Saint Anstens reasons and resolutions in his owne words because the Reââ¦der should the more cleerely conceiue him and the discourser see him contrarie to his conceits euen in this point
Fââ¦st the dislike of God refusing them the sting of sinne defiling them the sting of death excluding them from all ioy and peace rââ¦st and ease of soule and bodie for euer Applie this to Christ and his members and we shall presently finde by the rules of our Christian faith how farre they agree to either No true curse can be ascribed to Christ which shall seuer him from God without apparent impietie for neither the fauour of Gods fauour towards his manhood nor the fulnesse of grace and trueth in his soule nor the stedfast and most assured expectation of euerlasting ioy and glorie set before him euen in his greatest afflictions and temptations may be doubted of by any that will retaine the name of a Christian besides the perpetuall and personall vnion of his manhood with his Godhead to which was consequent such a communion with God and fruition of God as no elect man or angell euer had or can haue Wherefore you must either defend that the true curse of God did not seuer him from God but that one and the same nature in him might be truely blessed and yet truly accursed of God at one and the same time which are monsters meet for your doctrine or els you must wholly forbeare to affââ¦rme any true curse of Christ that shal separaââ¦e him from God and what other true curses you will attribute to him I would gladly heare The like though in farre lesse measure I yeeld to the membeââ¦s of Christ for since they were before all worlds beloued elected and blessed with all spirituall blessings in Christ and the foundation of God standeth sure hauing this Seale the Lord knoweth who are his yea the gifts and calling of God are without repââ¦ntance And the Apostle is fully perswaded that neither death nor life nor angels ââ¦r principalities nor things present nor things future nor heigth nor depth nor any other creature shall be able to separate vs from the loue of God which is in Christ Iesus but that whom God did predestinate those he called and whom he called those he iustified and whom he iustified those he glorified I see no true curse no not sinne it selfe that can fasten on Christes members to their destruction but howsoeuer by nature tââ¦ey were the children of Gods wrath as well as others yet by grace they are saued and all things shall woâ⦠for the best to them that loue God and are loued of him They may want theââ¦e gââ¦ft and graces for a time and so not feele the fruits of Gods election and vocââ¦tion but with God they are truely blessed because they are surely setled in hiâ⦠fauour and fore-appointed to be heires of Saluation though they lie censââ¦ed ãâã ãâã for a while in the masse of Adams condemnation The loue and ãâã then of God is the originall of all true blessing and since that is vnmoueaââ¦le towards the ââ¦lect how much soeuer they be sometimes plunged by sinne and Satan into feares and doubts of their saluation all that is to humble them and not to destroy them and with God who is trueth it selfe they are truely blessed as being adopted in Christ though in mans iudgement and euen to themselues they seeme neuer so much accursed What curses you aske then may be on the godlie Gods loue which is the ground of all true blessing can not varie towards them it is euerlasting and immutable like himselfe All other blessings saue this they may want for a season in this world as before they are lightned and called to the knowledge of God they haue no blessing in them more then the very Reprobate haue After they are engrassed in Christ they may be tosââ¦ed and turmoyled with the very same eââ¦ernall and corporall plagues and punishments that the wicked are and often times with greater and thaââ¦-per but then they are supported with inward grace and comfort which others are not and when by ignorance feare or infirmitie they fall they shall not perish Where then in the Curses of God inflicted on the wicked in this world and the next three things must be marked their Dââ¦PRIVANCE of his blesââ¦ings of all sorts their COHERENCE together and CONTINVANCE for euer the godly communicate with the wicked in some part of the first that is they may be sequestred from such externall and corporall blessings as this life requireth but of spirituall they can not vtterly be depââ¦ued because they must be regenerated and renued in the inward man to the Image of God and sealed by the holy spirit of promise that they may be partakers of Christ here in this world in whom they haue Redemption euen the Remission of sinnes according to the riches of his grace In the rest they may not communicate with the wicked For where the Curses of God doe FOLLOVV one another vpon the Reprobate and abide for euer in the highest degree from this the godly are wholy free as DELIVERED by the mercies of God in Christ from this present euill world and from the wrath to come If then we be saued from these things by Christ how much more must Christ him selfe be saued from them before he could saue others So that Christ as I said at first by submitting him selfe to a part of the curse of the Law which depriueth vs of all earthly and bodily blessings and of life it selfe quenched the whole Curse of the Law and by his shamefull wrongfull and painefull death quited vs from euerlasting death which was the iust reward of our sinnes You say if by the Resurrection of Christ the Nature of death were changed then till Christ was risen death was a punishment to the faithfull themselues I wonder what meaning there is in this Argument As well you may say that none were saued till Christ was risen Wonder then at your owne conceits reasons and Authorities For if the nature of Death were changed as you suppose it was since it was first inflicted on Adam I asked you how and when before the change you doe not doubt but it was a punishment you must graunt to the godly for Christ neuer changed the Nature of Death to the wicked Then if the change were made by Christs dying and rising from the dead how thinke you doth it not follow vpon this confession that death BEFORE it was changed in the godly by Christs Resurrection was a punishment euen to the godly And to this end you bring the Catechisme in this very Section Death which BEFORE was a punishment is now by Christ become a vantage If death were neuer but a vantage to the godly euen when it was first inflicted then the change that you dreame to be made of death in the Godly is but a fansie If NOVV it be so which BEFORE it was not then BEFORE what else could it be to the godly but a punishment of sinne My Resolution was and is that Christ was first promised by Gods
men as a sinfull and accursed wretch and saith Christ was content so to be made a curse for vs when indeed he was none by the wrong which he suffered at mens hands to free vs from the iust desert of our sinnes with God Which exposition I bring to let the Reader see how much the learned and godly Fathers detested your proper and true curses in the whole manhood of Christ. But we shall haue fresh proofe That your speech was sound your reason euident and that I openly peruerted your words You were neuer brought vp belike but where will went for reason and speech for proose you tell vs so often of sound and euident reasons when you bring nothing besides your naked and absurd fansies Your speech you say was sound that Christes dying simply but as the godly die might in no sort heere be called a curse Take home your As that you set running abroad to breed a brabble and your speech hath neither soundnesse nor sense in it That Christ died the same kinde of death which the godly die I meane the death of the bodie and not of the soule nor of the damned is a plaine position of the Scriptures We are afflicted persecuted and deiected saith Paul euerte where we beare about in our bodies the dying of the Lord Iesus and againe I count all things losse that I may be CONFORMED to his death Christ laid downe his life for vs saith Saint Iohn and we ought to lay downe our liues for our brethren Ibi mortuus est Christus vbi tues moriturus there or in that part Christ died in which thou shalt die Hactenus morerentur ad Christi gratiam pertinentes quatenus pro illis ipse mortuus est Christus carnis tantum morte non SPIRITVS We are Redeemed that such as pertaine to Christes grace should so farre forth die how farre forth Christ himselfe died for them that is onely the death of the bodie and not of the SPIRIT So that the godly are conformed and matched with Christ as touching the kind of death which must be common to both and that being a punishment and curse on our nature for sinne why is it not truely saide of Saint Austen that Christ receaued our curse that is a bodily death to free vs from euerlasting death which is the true curse of body and soule The reason is euident because the text heere doth speake and treat of the curse of the Law against sinne such therefore was Christs curse which he sustained The text speaketh of the curse of the Law pronounced against vs for violating the Law That curse the Apostle doth not applie to Christ as you doe but bringeth another text of the Law where the violent and shamefull punishment of hanging on a tree is called a curse To which since Christ submitted himselfe for our ââ¦akes and so suffering a curse of punishment he discharged vs from the whole curse of the Law due to vs for transgressing Wherefore your leaping from the one curse to the other and from a part to the whole is no euident reason but an euident falsehood which Chrysostome Augustine Ambrose Nazianzene Epiphanius and Cyrill doe mightely impugne and your selfe in the end doe yeeld Christ may be rightly called sinne and so a curse in that he was a sacrifice for sinne and for the curse which is as cleane contrary to your Assertion heere as holinesse and righteousnesse is to vncleannesse and wickednesse You openly peruert my words affirming that I say death here that is Christes death noted Galat. 3. vers 13. may in no sort be called a curse when I expresly euen there and euery where say the contrarie You are very iealous that I goe about to cleare you from your absurd and false conceits without your consent but your feare is needlesse as your quarrell is causelesse I applied not HERE to Christes death as you most fondly mistake and inuert my report of your words but I referre HERE to the curse there mentioned obseruing in you that you defended Death which all the godly haue common with Christ as touching their bodies might in no sort here be called a curse that is the curse which the Apostle here nameth I am so far from enuying your glorie in this point though I pitie your folly that where you make Christes Afflictions euerie one both small and great from the day of his birth to the houre of his death to bee proper punishments and so true curses and effects of Gods very wrath in him for our sinne I will adde if you will that Christes hunger wearinesse weeping and growning in spirit for these are afflictions brought into mans nature by sinne are likewise defended by you to be true curses in Christ. Howbeit you shall doe well in all these miseries and infirmities of our life and nature to finde out Christes most blessed humilitie and charitie not refusing them for our comforts and leaue the proper and true curses of God for the diuell and his associates Your greatest exception is that this curse laide on Christ cannot bââ¦e vnderstood of the whole curse of God or of the law The exception is such that withall the wits and shifts you haue you shall neuer auoide it For where the whole curse of the Law hath in it corporall spirituall and eternall death well deserued by sinne and most iustly inflicted on sinners as we see in the wicked and reprobate who for sinne are subiected to these three deathes or curses the two last which are spirituall and eternall death you can not offer to Christ without hereticall and diabolicall blasphemie and to draw the Apostle into that societie were arrogant and impudent impietie Since then there are so notorious impediments why Christ neither did nor could suffer the whole curse of the Law denounced to sinne and prouided for sinne with what face and conscience you shift and shuffle this geere let the Reader iudge if he haue either godly wisdome to which you appeale or but humane sense from which I doe not appeale Your conueiance is as weake as your cause is wicked Christ you say suffered the whole curse of the Law saue what you excepted thence onely so farre as possibilitie of things could admit that is which you saw was impossible he should suffer And so wee haue here your owne confession that possibilitie of things could not permit Christ to suffer the whole curse of the Law and yet you make the Apostle to meane all these impossibilities For he maketh none of your exceptions But looke somwhat neerer and you shall see greater barres to that totall assertion then impossibilities euen horrible impietie and blasphemie which if they barre not you from your boldnesse they terrifie me and all good Christians to come within the sound of them This shift being shameââ¦l you slide to another as absurd and impertinent to your purpose as the former For were it granted
which yet is no way prooued that Christ suffered some parts of the curse in his whole manhood will you thence inferre that he suffered the whole curse By what hold-fast hangeth this together but by your headynesse that will say any thing If a man should thus reason Paul with his whole manhood wrote part of the Scriptures Ergo hee wrote the whole Scriptures or Nymrod and his companie laboured with all their might and skill to build part of the Tower of Babel Ergo they built the whole tower of Babel notwithstanding God skattered them would you not deride these reasons Yours is as ridiculous In other respects this suffering of Christ may ââ¦ell be called the whole curse or punishment of sinne Your other respects since you thinke them not worth the repeating I thinke them lesse worth the refuting If you haue said ought before touching this matter I haue not left it vnsifted and as you send mee to prie after your proofes I send you to toote after my answeres Onely this is worth the noting that where you referre your selfe to your eleuenth page among others I finde nothing there to this purpose but that you say namely of Reiection malediction and dereliction o In Christ could vtterly be none of these and here you say the whole Malediction of sinne and of the Law was truly and properly suffered by Christ. Such graces you haue to declare your meaning by plaine Contradictions Marke if our publike Doctrine be not the same Diram execrationem suscepit I marke well enough how you wrest and wrong the Catechisme to force it to your error The Chatechisme saith that kind of death was aboue all others execrable and detestable which yet Christ chiefly would suffer for vs that he might receaue that grieuous Curse which our sinnes had deserued on him selfe and so quite vs from it That kinde of Death which all men iustly detested and abhorred Christ would chiefly chuse that thereby he might receaue on himselfe the grieuous Curse that was due to vs and so quench it The Catechisme then graunteth this was all the kinds of Death that Christ suffered for vs which because it was full of shame and paine he calleth a greeuous Curse or punishment What is this to the whole Curse of the Law in which the death of the Soule by want of grace and the death of the damned which is the second death are comprised You would faine haue all men of your mind and that maketh you thinke euery man speaketh in your sense otherwise the Catechisme if you peruert it not is cleere enough from your conceits of hell inflicted by Gods immediate hand on the Soule of Christ though it talke sometimes of things not altogether so fit for Childrens vnderstanding And had the Catechisme gone farder to mention other degrees of our Curse yet so long as in se suscepit is not precisely to suffer the same but to vndertake and to discharge all that is due to vs Christ might well and did take vpon him in his Body to pay the Price and amends of our whole Curse but not to suffer all the parts thereof which were spirituall and eternall death though he gaue Recompence and satisfaction euen for those when he quited vs from them After this you thinke it strange that I say Christ suffered and dyed iustly and was hanged on the Tree by the iust sentence of the Law and that so he was by imputation of our State and Condition vnto him sinnefull defiled hatefull and Accursed You coyne so many fresh and false presumptions and positions that I thinke nothing strang in you so you may flie to a Phrase or cast a countenance on the matter at the last Howbeit I take indeede these two positions of yours to be very contumelious and iniurious to the person and death of Christ and no way iustifiable by the sacred Scriptures And therefore you had neede looke to your proofes that they be sound a needlesse reproch to the Sonne of God is some sinne I can tell you All which I auouch because he vndertooke by Gods ordinance as our Surety to receaue our condemnation vpon him so far as his ownâ⦠nature and condition could possibly admit If vouching were proouing this matter were at an end but it will cost more then hoate liquor before all this be rightly concluded out of the Scriptures You soake it out from a poore similitude of a Surety ioyntly bound with the Debtor to pay the whole and the vââ¦ry same in which the Debtor is condemned but the word of God will allow you no such Thraldome in Christs Suertiship much lesse our whole Condemnation to be any way possible in his person He discharged he whole from vs that is as well spirituall as eternall death and satisfied for both by a iust exchange but he suffered neither of them because the Sonne of God by no rule of Gods Iustice could be voide of grace nor condemned to euerlasting fire as we most iustly were You did well therefore to bind your owne Similitude to a Post least it should fall on the Rocks of open heresie and blasphemie but your restraining of it least it should be both false wicked sheweth the ââ¦tude to haue no iust ground in the word of God though some Resemblance thereof may be tolerated so long as iâ⦠is not vrged to conclude any more then the Scriptures confesse For similitudes in Gods causes are so farre alââ¦owed as they are exprâ⦠applied by the spirit of tââ¦h and no ââ¦arder otherwise by pretence of a Parable we may prooue what we list but you were best deuide your Assertions and so we shall the sooner dispatch them Agââ¦st my Assââ¦on yoâ⦠say by no sentââ¦nce of the Law Christ hanged on a Tree I say so still For the sentence of the Law peââ¦mitting or prescribing men to ââ¦e hanged touched no man besides the offender and not him but vpon desert iustly prooued before them that had the exââ¦on of the Law in charge ââ¦hus Christ was not hanged but most iniuriously ouerwhelmed with the outââ¦ies and tumult of the people when the Iudge professed him innocent as indeede he was before God and Man I answere to dââ¦e for sinne was a necessarie part of the generall Cursâ⦠vpon all sinners And I reply you know not what you answââ¦e The Law of Moses appointed death to no Man by the course of nature but by the violent hands of others that were Magistrates The Naturall death which followeth all men was inflicted by Gods owne voice on Adam in Paradiââ¦e as a punishment of sinne and is irreuocably inherited by all Adams Children not by the sentence of Moses Law which came more then two thousand yeeââ¦es after Adams fall but by the order of Gods Creation which deriued from the Parents to the Children the branches as well of obedience as disobedience The sentence of Moses Law Decreed not death against all offences though it pronounced the Curse
vpon all but against Idolaters blasphemers disobeyers of Parents Murderers Adulterers and such like to whom there were no Sacrifices prescribed but death awarded These two deaths then a Naturall by the hand of God on all men and a violent by the hands of the Magistrate on some certaine offenders haue difference enough a man would thinke so that when the one is proposed for you to runne to the other is a manifest faile in your answere and a flat confession that you can not prooue Christ was iustly hanged by the sentence of the Law And yet you mistake your selfe euen in that to which you flie for helpe For Christ was not subiect by Nature but onely by will to the death of the Body because he was cleere from actuall and originall sinne by which death first entred into the world and inuaded all men Now in the violent death which Christ receaued from publike Authoritie by the sentence of Pilate the Iudge perceaued aââ¦d not once nor twice pronounced him faultles and when he could not otherwise appease the rage of the People but by condemnââ¦ng Christ to death Pilate tooke Water and washed his hands before the Multitude saying I am innocent of the bloud of this Iust Man looke you to it With what face then can you being a Christian auouch that Christ was iustly hanged by the sentence of the Law when God so prouided that he which gaue the sentence should often and earnestly witnesse the Contrarie What say you then to Christes death did he die iustly if he died by the rule of Gods iustice then he died iustly I say the longer you reason the farder you straie from the Question and yet conclude nothing God hath a double rule of his punishing Iustice the one rââ¦aled by which we must be gouerned the other reserued to himselfe which we must reuerence because it cannot be but iust in him though it be hid from vs. The sentence of the Law is the reuealed will of Gods reuenging Iustice by that I vtterly denie that Christ any way deserued to be hanged And thus much Saint Peter affirmeth when he saith Christ suffered the iust for the vniust that he might present vs to God If Christ by Gods reuealed will suffered iustly then Christ himselfe must be vniust But if he were iust euen when and as he suffered then were his sufferings vndeserued euen by the sentence of the Law which is the will of God prescribed vs that we must follow Otherwise who can suffer as Martyrs or innocents if we speake of Gods secret Iustice since he hath cause enough to deliuer all men for their due deserts to death when pleaseth him though he be graciously content that his seruants shall die most innocently in respect of his will reuealed that is not for any offence which their persuers can iustly chalenge and most gloriously when they giue testimonie to his trueth with their bloud who yet in his sight may not nor can not iustifie themselues This therefore is another leape of yours to start from the sentence of the Law to the secrets of Gods counsell and most vntruely and iniuriously to pronounce men that are sinners before God to be innocents in their deaths and Christ that was truely innocent before God and man to be iustly hanged by the sentence of the Law As you misse the Rule so doe you the Iustice of Gods will and that which you would make to be the curtaine of your cause I take to be the very puddle of your error For where you would insinuate that either Christ was iustly put to death or els God did vniustly deliuer him to death your ignorant abusing or aduised inuerting the name of Gods Iustice breadeth in you this sensible ouersight The Scriptures most truely confesse that God is iust in all his waies not in punishing onely mens offences but in giuing grace forgiuing sinne promising and performing life eternall and generally whatsoeuer he doth in him is iust and holie There is as great iustice that God should doe with his owne what he will as that he should repay men their deserts For if we ascribe no iustice to God but in rewarding our works then was he vniust in creating vs of nothing when we could deserue nothing then is he vniust in sauing vs when he condemneth others since we deserued no better then others Accursed be that mouth and minde which calleth or counteth the fauour and loue of God wherewith he embraceth his the grace and mercie which he affoordeth his the glorie and blisse which he will giue to his to be vniust Yet were none of these things deserued by vs though he be most iust in giuing what and where pleaseth him It is a righteous thing saith Paul to recompence rest to you which are troubled and yet no way deserued If we confesse our sinnes he is faithfull and iust sayth Iohn to forgine vs our sinnes We need not woonder at this how God is iust in punishing sinne and also iust in forgiuing sinne he vseth his right in the one as master of his owne and repaieth men their deserts in the other which is their due Since all the waââ¦es of ââ¦he Lord saith Austen are mercie and trueth neither can his grace be vnâ⦠nor his Iustice be cruell Can we then finde how God is iust in giuing vs good things which we neuer meââ¦d and doe we stagger how he might be iust in deliuering Christ to corporall and externall paines and death which he neuer deserued It is no wrong you say for the Lââ¦w to lay the penaltie on the suertie Much lesse was it vniust with God to receauâ⦠recompense for our sinnes at the hands of his owne Sonne who was willing and able to make it when we were not But he must be guiltie of our sinnes before he could be iustly punisââ¦d for our sinnes Who tolde you so Your similitude of a Suretie bound to see the debt discharged Keepe your bonds to hang abont your heeles A man may discharge anothers debts and beare anothers burden as well willingly and freely as vrged and arrested by the law What iustice hath mans law to accept the suretie for the debtour but the will of the offerer How much more then was it a righteous thing with God to accept a satisfaction for our sinnes at the hands of his owne Sonne not because he was thereto bound or any way guiltie with vs but only because he was able and willing to beare our burden when we were weake and rebate the rigour of Gods vengeance by the innocencie and dignitie of his person which was farre aboue our power For if amongst ââ¦en it be an honorable iustice for the stronger to helpe the weaker and the richer to relieue the poorer and the lesse we be bound as to our Enemies the more willing the more righteous who that hath but one spaâ⦠of Christian sense will doubt whether it were most iust with God to
admit the ransom which his own Sonne most willingly offered for vs when we were his Enemies or will conclude that Christ must iustly desââ¦e death because he did willingly die for vs You see now what I say to Christes death he died most iustly to God because most willingly for vs and yet most vndeseruedly because most innocently If Christ died not by Gods iustice then woe and thrice woe to vs for it can not be but Gods iustice must be executed If Gods iustice against vs were not satisfied by his Sonne and so appeased wo were it with vs but if any man be so madde headed that either the Sonne of God or himselfe must be euerlastingly damned for the full execution of Gods iustice against sinne then woe indeed to that hellish infidelitie and blessed for euer be Gods loue and mercie towards vs that accepted the death of his Sonne for our sinnes which Christ willingly offââ¦red as the price of our redemption when he could by no sentence of the law be thereto bound Therefore my Father loueth me sayth Christ because I lay downe my life for my sheepe None taketh it from me but I lay it downe of mine owne selfe And so the Prophet foretold of him If he will or shall lay downe his soule or life for sinne he shall see his seed prolong his dayes and the will of the Lord shall prosper in his hands What if hanging on a tree were no necessarie part of the gââ¦erall curse it was neuerthelesse iust from God vpon him as well as his death Neither ââ¦th nor hanging nor any part of Christes punishment was iust from God as deserued by Christ either in respect of his nature or of his office but all was most iust with God euen on Christ in respect of Christs owne free willingnesse to reconcile vs to God with his death rather then we should perish And if both these were iust in Gods secret Counsell by reason of Christs good liking so to ransome man what is that to the sentence of the Law which Iudgeth euery man according to his works and punisheth only the transgressour out of which number Christ is excepted by the continuall Caueats of the holy Scriptures Still I meane iustly in respect of God alone And still I say iustly in respect of Christs willingnesse only which is nothing to the sentence of the Law For the law respecteth the euill desert of the Transgressour and not the good will of the Redeemer or Suretie You mislike that Christ should suffer iustly because he suffered willingly for vs which hindreth not at all Since that was most iust with God in his secret counsell whereto his Sonne was most willing I vtterlie misliked as the whole Church of Christ before me did that the Sonne of God should be thought to be bound to death who must be most free or deseruing death by the sentence of the Law punishing sinners because he was willing to beare our burden And if you looke well about you you shall find the second person in Trinitie vndertooke to ransome vs from our sinnes long before his manhood was borne euen from the foundation of the world and to lay any band vpon the Sonne of God besides his owne good will and pleasure aduise you whether it tendeth And since God would not haue the death of Christes manhood but as a sacrifice most freely willingly offered vnto him for sinne least there should appeare any constraint or necessitie layd on the person of Christ let the Reader iudge with what trueth you not onely bind the second person in Trinitie to be subiect to the sentence of the Law but taint the soule of Christ with the vncleannesse of our sinne because he suffered the punishment thereof in our steedes The voluntarie suertie beareth his penaltie iustly when he sustaineth that which the Debtour by Law should sustaine It is a penaltie to patience to heare you talke so vnwisely and vniustly of Iustice. Shall mercie and charitie in Christians that ease other mens shoulders or pay other mens debts be taken now with you for the iust desert of a penaltie How much lesse then may the loue and fauour of God redeeming vs with his owne blood and ââ¦aling vs with his owne stripââ¦s be called a ââ¦ust and well deserued punishment Mans law may exact the debt where the Suertie standeth bound to the ââ¦aw to see it satisfied From one freely offering to pay another mans debts the Law may iustly receiue it because he is willing but the Law cannot exact it because he is at libertie which is the true difference betwixt a Suertie bound and a free Ransommer and yet neither is guiltie of the prisoners offences You say no Law you are sure not Gods law alloweth a murderer or like offender to be shared and another that is willing to be hanged in his steede You haue all this while dallied with Gods iustice you now begin to play with Gods Law that where trueth faââ¦th you you may yet at least make some shew with wordes as all wranglers doe when they be driuen to the wall whereof the discreet Reader may take a sensible obseruation in this place You haue bene spuddling here and spending more then two leaues to prooââ¦e that Christ bare the true curse of the Law which was due to vs for sinne and that the Apostle speaking thereof Galat. 3. could haue none other meaning and therefore you resolued that Christ was hanged by the iust sentence of the Law which otherwise must light on vs if it were not laid on him What Law ment you all this while or what Law doth Paul dispute of in that place Not of that Law which accurieth and punisheth sinne That Law I said admitted no Suerties but reuenged the malefactours themselues and therefore by the sentence of that Law Christ could not be iustly accursed or hanged in our steedes Against this when you can say nothing you get you to the Gospell of Christ which proposeth glad tydings of our Redemption from the burden of our sinnes and from the curse of the Law by the most willing and innocent death of the Sonne of God for our sakes and by that Lawe you say Christ might and did die for vs as our Suertie I aske the indifferent Reader whether this be not a plaine running from the question and a resigning of all that you haue said before touching tââ¦e ââ¦es accursing of Christ as our Suertiâ⦠For the Gospell I trust doth not pronounce Christ to be either accursed for our sinnes or defiled with our sinnes but shewed him to be the blessed Seede that bruized the Sââ¦pents head and the vndefiled and vnspotted Lambe that tooke away the sinne of the world with his most innocent and precious blood This shifting therefore which is so vsuall with you that as long as you can wrench a word you will not yeeld to the trueth will breake the necke of your cause in the end with all
by the infinite dignitie of his person able to support the one and abolish the other and that the rather because euerie part of Christes manhood was holie and vndefiled and so by the rule of Gods iustice no part of him could be pressed with spirituall and eternall death Which is a plaine proofe that the guilt of our sinnes tooke not hold on him For then as well spirituall as eternall death which both are due to sinne must haue fastned on Christ which we see to be false yea the death of the bodie could not wrest his soule from him but he must lay it downe of himselfe And if the desert of a corporall death did not binde him how should the guilt of eternall death be due to him which was the ââ¦ust wages of our sinne but no way due to his person since he did assume our sinnes to cleere vs from them and not to subiect himselfe to the guilt or filth of our sinne though he were content to make full satisfaction for them but not to defile himselfe with any pollution of them How could he be by God properly and truly punished and cursed for sinne but that he was sinfull hatefull Nay how could he either clense vs or reconcile vs to God if he were sinfull hatefull to God as well as we As we had Christ for our Redeemer because we weââ¦e hated of God for sin so if you bring Christ within the same danger displeasure with God he must haue another to mediate to God for him God respecteth not those whom he hateth nor heareth any that is sinful without some other to propiââ¦e for him And where you quote Scriptures to vphold your wicked follies and phrases they prooue the cleane contrarie The soule that sinneth the same shall dic saith God by Ezechiel But Christes soule did not die either by want of grace or losse of glorie which are the deaths proper to sinners Christes soule therefore by the verie place which you cite was not sinnefull Shail nââ¦t the Iudge of all the world doe right saide Abraham to God What right is there ment but that God will not destroy the righteous with the wicked as Abrahams words before import Since then Christ was not destroââ¦ed either in soule or bodie but by death made conquerer of death and a Sauiour to all his what a venemous mouth haue you to match him with the wicked or to make thââ¦s destruction And heere the Reader may obserue how religiously you wrest the Scriptures to reproch the Sonne of God and where you can by no sufficient testimonie prooue Christ to haue beene sinnefull or hatefull to God as you dââ¦fend when he died for our sinnes you sort him with the reprobate and damned and then ââ¦ge the Scriptures against him that directly speake of them I wish you to leaue this lewd deuotion and not to thinke to shift off all this with a pretended imputation Our sinnes God did impute that is impose on Christ for ââ¦e bââ¦re them in his bodie on the ââ¦ee but this was right with God because Christ was both willing and able to beare them and an honour to the humane nature of Christ to be made l ord ouer all his enimies for the short affliction which he suffered at their hands and Sauiour of all beleeuers for the submission and obedience which he performed on the crosse in which Gods exceeding mercy towards vs and loue towards him did most manifestly appeare Did not God then hate our sinnes when he punished his owne Sonne for them If that ground of Christian religion could haue contented you that God throughly hated our sinnes which Christ assumed and yet so loued the person assuming them that the fauour he bare to the one ouer-rulââ¦d his anger due to the other and therefore after sharpe chastisement on the person least wee should thinke our transgressions to be lightly regarded with God and yet such as the sufferer willingly reââ¦ued to maintaine the iustice of his Father exalted him with infinite honour and gaue him all power in earth and heauen and made him onely Lord ouer all both men and Angels If this confession of true Religion had pleased you you neuer needed to haue defiled your pen with these sinfull hatefull and accursââ¦d termes But haââ¦ing itching eares and humorous heads you measure the greatest mysteries of our saluation by the similitude and proportion of humane reason and actions and thence deââ¦iue according to your fantasies that which Scriptures and Fathers doe vtterly disclaime It is written God sent his Sonne in the likenesse of sinfull flââ¦sh for sinne and condemned sinne in his flesh in which likenesse he stoode before God The Scripture teacheth that Christ was made like to his brethren in all things and did partake with them in flesh and bloud but the same Scripture addeth without sinne So that the likenesse of sinfull flesh excludeth all touch or taint of our sinne though it admit the likenesse of our flesh in Christ. And indeede betweene his and ours there was no difference saue the corruption of sinne which dwelleth in ours and did not in his You doe therefore learnedly collect out of the Apostles words that where he saith Christ was sent in the likenesse of sinfull flesh for that he had true flesh and no sinne you make Christ to be defiled and accursed with sinne for hauing the likenesse of our flesh But the Syriacke translation saith God condemned sinne in Christes flesh The condemning of sinne in the flesh of Christ was the cleansing and abolishing of sinne by the body of Christ which the Apostle calleth ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã the destroying and taking away of sinne by the sacrifice of himââ¦elfe The text doth notsay that God condemned Christ for sinne but contrarie that God condemned sin that is pardoned the guilt weakned the power remooued the sting and abandoned the memoriall of all our sinnes for the obedience and patience which Christ shewed in his flesh So that it is you and not the Apostle nor the Syriacke translator which would faine bring Christ within the compasse of condemnation for sinne where they say quite otherwise that not hee but sinne was condemned that is destroyed in or by his flesh Chrysostome saith rightly Thou seest sinne euery where condemned not the flesh which was crouned and obtained iudgement against sinne And Austen taketh libertie to expound the Text against your Syriacke translation By the similitude of sinfull flesh saith he which was Christes God condemned sinne in the flesh of sinne which was ours God made him sinne for vs that we might be made the rightcousnesse of God in him Other men read the Scriptures to learne thence all thanks submission and seruice to the Sonne of God for his vnspeakeable loue and mercie towards vs in taking the burden of our sinnes and laying it on his owne shoulders You thresh and winnow the Scriptures to catch vp chaffe
and yet none of them maketh Christ sinfull hatefull or defiled which is your vncleane doctrine We affirme sayth Austen that Christ had no sinne neither in soule nor flââ¦sh and yet in taking flesh after the likenââ¦sse of sinfull flesh by sinne he condemned sinne Which being somewhat obscurââ¦ly spoken by the Apostle may be two wayes opened either because the similitudes of things vse to be called by the names of the things themselues and in that respect the Apostle would call the similitude of sinfull flesh Sinne or els because the sacrifices for sinnes in the Law were called sinnes all which were the figures of Christs flesh the true and only sacrifice for sinne A third way is that the punishment of sinne is after a sort called sinne as being a consequent to sinne which S. Austen before testified and in that respect as well mortalitie as all other miseries and infirmitââ¦s that inuaded mans nature for sinne may be called sinne that is the effects of sinne The wrongfull and shamefull death of Christ Chrysostome Theodoret Theophylact and others take to be the punishment of our sinnes in the flesh of Christ and in that regard they thinke Christ was made sinne that is punished as a sinner though he were innocent and righteous Him that was righteousnesse it selfe God made sinne that is he suffered him to be condemned as a sinner and to die as one accursed for accursed was he that hung on a tree Christ sayth Theodoret when he had fulfilled all righteousnesse and not admitted any blemish of sinne and yet as a sinner sustained the death of sinners he reproued the iniustice of sinne that deliuered his bodie to death no way deseruing it and dissolued both sinne and death Theophylact as his maner is followeth Chrysostome almost word for word The Sonne who knew no sinne and was righteousnesse it selfe the Father made to die for vs as if he had beene a sinner and malefactour S. Austen ioyneth with them Christ had the similitude of sinfull flesh because his flesh was mortall sinâ⦠vllo omnino peccato but vtterly without any sinne that by sinne for similitude he might condemne the sinne that is in our flesh through true iniquitie True iniquitie in Christ there was none mortalitie there was Peccatum non suscepit sed poenam peccati suscepit Suscipiendâ⦠sinâ⦠culpâ⦠poenam poenam saââ¦it culpam Christ tooke not our sinne vnto him he tooke the punishment of our sinne And taking the punishment without any fault he healed both the punishment and the fault I leaue the Reader to his choise which of these he will embrace or whether he will conioyne them all together for the one impugneth not the other they all impugne the Defenders false collections and lewd surmises out of these places that Christ when he is called sinne is intended by the Scriptures to be defiled with our sinnes and hatefull to God and accursed of him for our sinnes which the Church of Christ did neuer endure to heare Master Caluin warily enough sayth Vt personam nostram suscepit peccator erat maledictionis reus As Christ tooke vpon him our person he was a ãâã and guiltie of the curse I had rather you had commended Master Caluins wisdome to ioyne with the whole Church of God in giuing Christ his due then his warinesse in going a by-way without all the learned and Catholike fathers to hemme Christ within the guilt of our sinne and curse Master Caluin truely I honour for his great gifts and paines in the Church of God but I may not take him for the first founder of Christian religion and therefore where he dissenteth from the worthie Pillers of Christs Church in matters of Doctrine I dissent from him And I more commend his warinesse elsewhere and thinke it fit that when his speech soundeth somewhat hard or offensiue to the Godly it should be expounded by other places of his writings least you make him in so waightie points as these are very inconstant or very inconsiderate This therefore which you bring I interpret by none other then himselfe vsing the very same words of the very same matter in his Commentaries vpon the very next Epistle of Saint Paul before this which you quote You shall haue it in Latine because you shall see how he qualifieth these very words which you would presse to your aduantage PERSONAM nostram QVODAMMODO suscepit vt reus nostro nomine fieret tanquam peccator iudicaretur non proprijs sed alienis delictis quum purus foret ipse immunis ab omni culpa paenamque sââ¦biret nobis non sibi debitam Christ tooke vnto him our Person AFTER A SORT that he might be accused or Iudged in our Name and condemned as it were for a Sinner not for any of his owne offences but other mens since he himselfe was pure and FREE FROM ALL FAVLT or guilt and suffered the punishment due to vs not to him Take these mitigations from Master Caluins owne mouth and then your labour is lost in putting his words to the Racke and these are farre truer then your whirlegigges set running by the businesse of your Braine Christ was AFTER A SORT A SINNER Saith Caluine that is Christ presented the Persons and procured the cause of vs ââ¦at were sinners and was guiltie that is accused condemned or punished in our steedes Reâ⦠doth not alwaies import an offender if you know what Latine meaneth it noteth one ââ¦uius res agitur whose cause is handled or brought into Iudgement whether he be guiltie or innocent And when it goeth farder then iudiciall inquisition it may be applied either to the fault which is conuinced or to the Iudgement which is decreed or to the punishment which is deserued or appointed And so the word ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã in Greeke which the new Testament vseth for guiltie or worthie of or subiected to punishment is as much as fast held either by the Crime committed or by the sentence pronounced or by the punishment prepared and assured Thus you see Caluins words limited by himselfe make nothing for you and howsoeuer you rack the word Reus you may not thereby bring Christ to be defiled or hatefull with our sinnes except mercie humilitie and charitie by your learning defile the Sonne of God and make him hatefull to his Father Euen as by Gods true and reall imputation not by any iââ¦hesion we now in this life are iust holy and blamelesse before God so was he sinfull and defiled by Imputation not inherently This is neither the Apostles speech nor sense it is your soone-come and soone-gone gathering from the Apostles words The one is the cause of the other but the one is not in all points proportioned to the other God made him Sinne for vs that we might be made the righteousnesse of God in him Thus speaketh the Apostle Omit Christs Sacrifice for sinne whereby our sinnes were pardoned and
as often to feare sorowes rebukes reproches losses and such like griefs of minde as to stripes and other violences profered to the body Manifest proofes thereof are euery where occurrent in the Scriptures h Heb. 10 v. 32 Remember the former dayes sayth the Apostle to the Hââ¦brewes wherein you sustained ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã a great conflict of sufferings partly whiles ye were made a spectacle with reproches and troubles partly whiles you did communicate with them that were so vsed ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã for you had a ioynt feeling of my bands and receiued with ioy the spoiling of your goods Yet had they i Hebr. 12. not as yet resisted vnto bloud by striuing against sinne So Peter k 1. Pet. 4. Wherein you communicate ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã with the sufferings of Christ reioyce that in the reââ¦elation of his glorie you may be glad and ioyfull If you be reproched for the name of Christ blessed are you and the spirit of glorie resteth on you And againe l 1. Pet. 2. This is thanks with God if a man for conscience to God endure sorrowes ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã suffering vniustly Pauls afflictions which he calleth his infirmities euen as he sayth m 2. Cor 13. Christ was crucified through infirmitie are reckened in many places by himselfe amongst which are n 2. Cor. 6. Reproch infamy want sorow feare of o 11. danger o 11. care affection and o 11. zeale for others o 11. weakened or o 11. offended whereby it may be seene what was meant by the words of Christ touching Pauls sufferings p Acts 9. I will shew him how many or how great things he shall suffer for my name and by his owne I reioyce q Coloss. 1. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã in my sufferings for you Yea not only feare and sorow of minde which are the painfnll affections of our nature but euen corporall affections though naturall were sufferings in Christ. Damascene writing of the naturall and innocent yet painfull passions and sufferings which Christ tooke vnto him sayth r Damascen orthodoxae fidei li. 3. ca. 20. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã naturall and innocent passions or sufferings are those what soeuer which entred into mans life by the condemnation of the first transgression as hunger thirst wearinesse labour weeping vexation declination of death feare agonie and such like which are naturally in all men These all Christ tooke vnto him that he might sanctifie all And how can it be otherwise since the soule feeleth paine and griefe as well by her vnderstanding and will as by her senses and that in other mens dangers and troubles where loue and pittie preuaile with vs no lesse then in our owne s August de ciuitate Dei li. 14. ca. 6. what is feare and sorrow sayth Austen but the will dissenting from those things which displease vs and generally according to the varietie of things which are desired or shunned as the will is pleased or offended so is it changed aââ¦d turned into these or those affections Then as nature teacheth vs to feare our owne dangers foreseene by sense or vnderstanding and to sorrow for our present miseries or losses so loue teacheth vs to do the like in other mens harmes either present or approching whose persons the more we embrace their perils and ouerthrowes the more we lament Now he that is t De ciuitate Dââ¦i li. 12. ââ¦a 16. affected suffereth sayth Austen Neither are the violences offered to the bodie called paines but because the soule by nature disliketh them howsoeuer by faith she may be content to endure them for Gods cause and so the impressions of feare and sorrow in that they are painfull they are sufferings of the soule though charitie perswade them in other mens troubles or necessitie impose them in our owne cases or pietie raise them in respect of God u Psal. 51. A broken heart and contrite spirit is it not a suffering because it is a sacrifice vnto God x Philip. 2. Workâ⦠your saluation sayth the Apostle with feare and trembling Are these no sufferings because they tend to saluation y Matth. 5. Blessed are you when men reproch you and pursue you and speake all euill against you falsly for my sake Reioice and be glad for great is your reward in heauen so pursued they the Prophets before you This is a great blessednes and yet a great suffering of minde to be reuiled and slandered and therefore holinesse in Christ as in the Saints did not exclude but rather commend and aduance Christes sufferings z Dââ¦fenc pag. 92. li. 12. Speake plainly I beseech you and deceiue vs not Call not this his soules suffering but his ââ¦oules holines and righteousues I call that SVFFERING in Christ which was painefull and grieuous vnto him though withall it were righteous and holy a Matth. 11. Blessed are they that suffer persecution for Righteousnes Shall it be no persecution or no suffering All Christes sufferings were rigââ¦teous and holy by reason the cause is righteous and holy for which the godly do suffer and their patience and submission to god in their troubles are dueties of holines all sufferings in Christ were most righteous and holy for in them he shewed not only voluntarie patience and obedience but innocence also Doth this make his stripes woundes or death to be no sufferings because he b 1. Pet 3. Suffered the iust for the vniust Deceaue not your selfe and I see no man els that goeth about to beguile you I speake not of those workes of piety and charitie which Christ performed to God and man with ioy and delight I speake of those infirmities temptations and affections which were grieuous and painfull vnto him though the suffering and enduring thereof were most religious and righteous in him And you that seuer his holinesse and righteousnesse from his sufferings as if he were defiled and accursed with them lewdlie abuse both the word of God and faith of Christ which containe no such thing c Defenc. pag. 92. li. 10. Christes exact and perfect keeping of Gods iust law and his sufferings are two parts of Christes mediation greatly differing and ought not both in trueth be called his passion or satisfaction for sinne His passion I call the things suffered at or about the time of his death because not the instant of breathing out his soule but the whole order and maner of comming to his death after his last supper is by the Scriptures inclosed in the name of his death and by all sober and aduised writers called his Passion or suffering of death His whole life besides was full of sufferings and euen those naturall infirmities of hunger thirst wearinesse and such like were voluntarie sufferings in him because he had power enough in himselfe to represse or exclude those punishments inââ¦licted for sinne on our nature and
v. 17. 18. God willing saith the Apostle more abundantly to shew the stablenesse of his counsell bound himselfe with an othe that by two immutable things his promise and his othe wherein it is impossible that God should lie we might haue strong comfort So that howsoeuer you in your irreligious sophistrie doe say God Omnipotent may inflict damnation vpon men for others If you meane vpon his Elect such as Moses and Paul were whose examples and words you would seeme to follow you defend an open and exact Impossibilitie Note and heresie speaking of damnation as the Scriptures doe and as you doe in this place where you say those holy men Moses and Paul x Defenc. pag. 96. li. 5. Earnestly and constantly wished Gods eternall wrath might come vpon themselues that the Iewes might scape it Will you flie from the elect to the reprobate and say that God may inflict damnation on them for other mens sinnes Then are you cleane gone from your examples of Moses and Paul for they were no reprobates and as farre from all regard of Gods Iustice who eternally condemneth no man but for sinne permanent and inherent as in all the reprobate For though God doe saue without merite for his mercies sake yet he condemneth no man eternally but for sinne and that either committed or inherited y Genes 18. Be it farre from thee saith Abraham to God to slay the righteous with the wicked and that the righteous should be euen as the wicked be it farre from thee Shall not the Iudge of the world doe iudgement If it be simply impossible for Gods elect to perish as our Sauiour witnesseth what hainous and horrrible falsitie and impietie is it to say The Sonne of God might be damned for sinners And though you shift sides and say z Defenc pag. 96. li. 29. Much rather then maâ⦠God doe this to Christ yet if you hold either to your former examples whence you deduce this or to your words in this very sentence whence you draw this comparison you must say much rather then may God inflict damnation and his eternall wrath on Christ which whether it may not rightly be called one of your hellish mysteries I leaue to all Christian men to iudge Such wicked obseruations when you make from so weake and false foundations the Reader may soone see what a notable Diuine you are and how likely to teach the truth that pretend Gods power against his will for the vtter ruine os all Religion Christ you say was ordained for that purpose Christ was not ordained to be damned for vs. What to be damned for others or rather to beare the chastisment of our peace that we might be healed with his stripes The Prophet Esay saith he was wounded for our transgressions and bruized for our iniquities But you are the first supplanter of all Patriarkes and Prophets that say Christ was damned for our sinnes You will come in with your temporall and substantiall damnation to which you subiect the Soule of Christ But Sir if you beleeue and teach the same truth which the holy Ghost doth in the word of God Why swarue you so much from the words and grounds of the Sacred Scriptures Why doth nothing please you in mans Redemption but hell and damnation inflicted on Christ where you neuer learned any such lesson out of the Prophets or Apostles And here your abused and vnaduised examples which you pretend for this purpose import no such thing but rather the cleane contrarie For if it were not possible for Moses and Paul euerlastingly to perish because they were elected in Christ how infinitely more impossible was it that Christ should perish in whom all are elected And how Christ could perish but either by the dissolution of his person or else by the ioynt condemnation of the second person in the most glorious Trinitie to the fire of hell I doe not see since these are such blasphemies as hell neuer hatched the like a Defenc. pag. 96. li. 31. That which there you mention is the ordinarie and common rule The Soule that sinneth it shall die but in Christ this was extraordinarie and singular that the iust died for the vniââ¦st The wordes which I cited are sufficient to reprooue the first of your foure notable obseruations as starke false For there God sweareth by himselfe that the b Ezech. 18. Soule which sinneth that shall die and consequently the Sonne shall not beare the iniquitie of the Father neither shall the Father beare the iniquitie of the Sonne much lesse shall Moses and Paul beare the iniquitie of the whole people as you dreame they might And so much Gods answere to Moses importeth * Exod. 32. whosoeuer hath sinned against me I will wipe him and none other out of my Booke As for Christ since he was God as well as man his person could not be tied to the Lawes and Rules appointed for men but what he himselfe would admit in his owne person to that by willing obedience he submitted himselfe namely in his Manhood to die the death of the Crosse for our sinnes according to the Scriptures but not to be damned for vs nor to die the death of the Soule mentioned in the Scriptures to whose Doctrine we must stand and not to your deuices when we speake of Gods iudgements against sinne or of the purgation of our Soules Wherefore that God himselfe by his owne body would be the Price of our Redemption was indeed a thing proper and singular to the person of Christ wherein neither Moses nor Paul could be partakers with him or examples of him and therefore your fitting their prayers to his Passion to make your hel paines thereby possible is a thing far fet no way pertinent to this purpose c Defenc. pag. 96. li 22. I take it plaine enough that these sinned not in their desire and I suppose you take it so too in that you alleadge them and ground your Reasons of comparison vpon them They sinned not because their desires were conditionall submitted to Gods good pleasure with reseruation of their dueties otherwise if they thought that possible which they desired as you doe by their destruction who were the chosen vessels of mercie to excuse the reprobate from damnation deserued by obstinacie and infidelitie they not only erred from the truth but sinned in praying to haue their wils take place before and against the will of God But Moses in loue to Gods glory and care for his charge desired to be partaker of such temporall vengeance as should befall the whole people of God and Pauls words that are potentiall must be conditionall otherwise he needed not to haue said I could wish but I doe wish The which because he doth not but onely shew his desire were it possible and pleasing to God therefore he may be well excused from sinne though you condemne this in him and that in Moses as a d Defenc. pag. 95.
your vntuned and hie strained cratchets That Christ must and did breake the knot betwixt death and hell which otherwise were fast clasped together and by receauing the one in his owne person did free all his members from the other is no question neither with me nor I thinke with any Christian man The iust vengeance deserued and prepared for sinne which was temporall and eternall death the Redeemer must throughly know least he should ransome vs he could not tell from what Wherefore not your new found hell but the wages of our sinne which was eternall death vsually called hell in the Scriptures might not be hidde from the eââ¦es of Christ but euen the iust and full reward of our iniquities was to be presented to the sight and spirit of the Redeemer that in the presence of God he might behold the waight of our sinne the greatnesse and iustnesse of Gods anger against it and accordingly conceaue how deare the price and how sharpe the paine must be that should quitte vs from this debt and yet how pretious his person and infinite his obedience was that by one death should excuse vs from the other Whether these things were reuealed and shewed to Christ by sight as the terrors and torments of hell might be or by vision or in spirit I dare not pronounce I meddle not so farre with Gods secrets God hath waies enough to propose the Iudgemets of the next world to men here liuing when and how pleaseth him but of none of these might Christ be ignorant least we make him a Sauiour at peraduentures as not knowing all things that directly belonged to his office and sacrifice and to the causes effects of our Redemption That therfore Christ must haue a perfect knowledge and liuely sight and view of all these things pertaining to the waight and burden of mans deliuerance chiefly now when he appeared in Gods iudgement where nothing is couered to performe the fame I may safely grant but that he felt or suffered eternall death or the paines of the damned or the full wages of our sinnes this you shall neuer prooue how much soeuer you presume with licentious but irreligious words to couer it and conuey it into the Creed of Christians k Defenc. pag. 103. li. 29. He did not contemplate and looke on them a farre of nor had to do with one more then the other but by suffering one he felt both and by enduring one he endured both Your speaches are false absurd and impious howsoeuer you will qualifie them when you come to the point with the substances but not with the circumstances of eternall death and damnation First shew that the Scripture teacheth any such thing of Christ The Defender forgeth apace new parts of the Christian faith as that he suffered the second death or the paines of the damned Next that your deuice of this new second death which dureth but for a moment and proceedeth from Gods owne hand agreeth with the word of God And Thirdly that God did thus torment the soule of his sonne with his immediate hand either in the garden or on the crosse All these things are your owne dreames plainly plastered to the Christian faith with figures and phrases of your owne coining and yet you thinke you haue wrong if you be not suffered to change the whole Creede and outface the Scriptures with your idle fansies That Christ should and did suffer a bodily death on the crosse the Prophets did forshew the Euangelists doe witnesse and the Apostles doe confirme That he died the second death in the garden before the first or that this death came to him by fitts and dured but the turning of an hand and was inflicted on his soule by Gods immediate hand as the other death was on his body by the Iewes what Prophet what Euangelist what Apostle did euer teach or write And how hang your owne words with your owne conceits by suffering the one Christ felt both you say and by enduring the one he endured both Then in the Garden when as yet he suffered not the death of the body he felt not your second death and Gods immediate hand did cease if by the one which the Iewes inflicted he endured both If you fly to Christes fearing and apprehending the second death by the first then are you farre from his suffering and enduring it and this apprehension which was not erroneous in Christ as it is in you might offer him a feare of Gods power which is more infinite then the manhoode of Christ could comprehend and so might be terrible to him as it is to all the godly when they finde or feele Gods anger against sinne but it could breed no perswasion or distrust that God would destroy him for our sinnes since he perfectly knew God would saue vs by his sufferings l Defenc. pag. 104. li. Also you forget my argument that Christ alwayes charged his Disciples not to take their bodily death heauily for righteousnesse sake ergo he himselfe would neuer be so dismáyed with the feare of it As I did not professe in my conclusion to refute all your follies which were both trifling and tedious so if I had purposed any such thing I should haue skipped this as an argument rather of your ignorance and vanitie than of any force or veritie For first where did I defend in my Sermons that Christes bodilie death was the cause of this agonie recken my sixe causes on your fingers ends if your memorie be so fickle that refuting them you can not tell what they are and see whether Christes bodily death be any of them or no if it be none how doth this argument conclude any thing against me who shew so many things which might concurre in Christes feare besides his bodily death Wherefore your conclusion if it were good is no way preiudiciall to me nor beneficiall to your hell paines For though Christ feared somewhat els there is a large leape betweene somewhat els and the death of the damned But what was it that Christ willed his Disciples to feare Christ teacheth all his to feare Gods power as himselfe did in the garden Gods purpose meaning to condemne Christians to hell or his power that was able to destroy soule and bodie in hell Did Christ teach in these words a desperation of Gods fauour or submission vnder the mighty hand of God and a religious feare not to displease him To feare religiously not distrustfully Gods power since they were persuaded of Gods goodnesse whom Christ calleth his friends and so not to prouoke him considering the mightinesse of his arme is the summe of Christes doctrine in that place as God himselfe by the Prophet Esay taught all the faithfull saying m Esa. 8. Sanctifie the Lord of hosts and let him be your fearâ⦠and let him be your dread A deepe impression of this feare commended to all the Elect whiles heere they liue Christ himselfe might haue and shew in the
so grieuous feare trouble and sorow of mind or soule that he cried out My God my God why hast thou forsaken me I make good difference betwixt the Booke of Homilies confirmed as well by the publicke authority of Prince and Parliament Anno Reginae 13. ca 12 as by the generall subscription of the vpper and neather house in the conuocation Anno 1571 to a In the 35. article of Homilies containe godlie wholesome and necessarie doctrine and the Catechisme then licenced to be taught in Schooles to yong scholers but without any such autoritie as the former is Shew the like approbation and you shall freely call it the publike autorized doctrine of England till you doe so giue me leaue to tell you that the one is indeede by publicke authority receaued and ratified euen as the articles are the other was by priuate discretion permitted and tolerated to be taught in Grammar schooles but publicke authority of the whole Realme you may chalenge none vnto it And therefore I take my selfe in matters of faith not bound vnto it farder then it accordeth with the manifest trueth deliuered in the ââ¦acred Scriptures Againe your selfe doâ⦠more impugne the Catechisme then I doe For if your owne wordes be true that Christ when he vttered those b Defenc. pag. 110. li. 28. 34. words spake in his mind of his constant and continuall ioy in God and was in exceeding generall and constant ioy What place leaue you for any of those wordes which you cite out of the Catechisme to haue any trueth in them since they speake of exceeding and horrible feares and sorrows which I thinke are contrarie to your triumphant generall and constant ioy And although I thinke it no reason that a thing priuatly permitted should abrogate the full and maine consent of the learned and auntient Fathers as you would haue it to doe and therefore make it free when the Carechisme swatueth from their sense and interpretation to be of another mind yet I condemne nothing in it as wicked but wish that soââ¦e few places had been more cleerly and more particularlââ¦e deliuered and expressed to auoid such cauillers as you and some others are But you with open mouth reiââ¦ct euen those places which now you produce as passing strange doctrine and simply impossible For where the Catechisme here in these words which you alleage saith Christ was Aeternae mortis horrore perfusus perfused or wholy touched with an horror which is a trembling feare of eternall death you not only reason against it that c Defenc. pag. 9â⦠li. 13. Christ could not feare that which he perfectly knew concerned him not at all and by no meanes could euer possibly come neere him but you make it d li. 12. passing strange doctrine and simply impossible that Christ should feare or pray against the whole and intire cup of eternall death And yet the Catechisme saith he trembled and was ouercast with the horror of it You misââ¦ike that the Catechisme saith except you may peruert it to your pleasure and in steed of fearing eternall death you say Christ suffered the second death which is die death of the damned and so refusing the Catechisme for saying so much you say more and thinke the Catechisme is of your mind But sir tell vs how Christ could be stroken with the HORROR OF ETERNALL DEATH for those aââ¦e the wordes of the Catechisme and not how he suffered your new made hell which the Catechisme neuer speaketh of I haue deliuered two senses to salue the Catechisme which you impugne The first that Christ in respect of his members to whom that death was due might in loue and pietie towards them inwardly tremble at the punishment deserued by them since mercie maketh vs truely feele the very smart of other mens harmes and dangers and where we hartily loue no lesse then if they were imminent ouer our owne heads The second that Christ fearing the power of Gods wrath against sinne which is infinite may in a sort be sayd to tremble at the effects thereof by reason he trembled at the cause thereof And in this sense the consideration and apprehension of Gods infinite power and displeasure against sinne might brââ¦ede those horrible feares and sorrowes which the Catcchisme talketh of Otherwise I must be plaine the Catechisme sayth more then can be prooued by any Scripture or any learned and auncient Father and more then you your selfe allow or like saue that you would out of his vehement speaches make some aduantage to your cause though in substance you wholy dissent from the maker thereof For he speaketh of feare and sorrow you of re ãâã al solute suffering he of eternall death due to sin you of a new found hell from the immediate hand of God which is no part of the Catcchisers meaning since he plainely nameth future and euerlasting death due to sinners and not a present and temporall hell which is not the full wages of sinne nor of the damned The like I say for the notes added by the Printer or correctour to the great Bible whose text is authorized to be read in the Church but not the notes to be of equall credit or authoritie with the text And if you may turne of the whole aââ¦ay of auncient and Catholike Fathers because they diflent from your conceits how much lesse am I bound to correctours or Printers adding often times to other mens workes and labours what pleaseth themselues Though the note be not such but that it may receiue the former construction and be tolerated welâ⦠enough Wherefore I meane euen the same giddy spirit which before I did buzzing in the eares of the people his owne fancies against the Scriptures against the Fathers and against the doctrine of this Realme confirmed by publike authoritie of Prince and Parliament The recollecting of your former reason so lately and largely answered I omit as tedious trifling and since you say no more then is before refuted what should I trouble my selfe and the Reader with repeating the same things so often iterated e Defenc pag. 118. li. 10. You haue yet heere and there some exceptions against this our doctrine which are not to be cleane neglected First you say I extend Christs agonie to farre because I will haue is proceede from the intolerable sorrowes and horrors of Gods siery wrath equall to ââ¦ell I shew not there the cause of Christs agonie and feare I shewed it of purpose in the beginning Why did you not refuse that You extend it so farre according to my wordes yea your maine purpose is to make that the cause of Christs agonie in the garden and on the crosse onely you would vse some cunning in the carriage of it first to make sorrowes and feares the cause thereof and at the next step to aske what sorrowes and feares could those be but the intolerable sorowes and horrors of Gods fierie wrath equall to hell And to this end you quote both the
death for which we must not pray But whosoeuer is borne of God sinneth not that sinne and so neither Christ who was the true Sonne of God nor any of his chosen who are the children of God by adoption can sinne that sinne nor die that death because he that is begotten of God liueth by God who is eternall life to all that know him and cleaue vnto him without separation If then the sinnes of the Elect be not vnto death but such as we in pietie may and in charitie must pray for consequently the death of the soule here meant by Saint Iohn is such as is not incident to any of the sonnes of God and so not the temporall hell which you communicate to Christ and his members Heere are your eight places of Scriptures proouing as you pretend the second death of the soule which you ascribe to Christ in euery one of which saue the first and second there can be no question but euerlasting damnation is intended and in those two the guiltinesse of eternall death which is due to sinne may be comprised in the name of death which the Apostle iustifieth when he sayth t Rom. 5. v. 12. The offence of one came on all men vnto condemnation which is in effect that he sayd before Death went ouer all men forasmuch as all men haue sinned But that any of these intend your temporall hell brought into this life not by snares and feares working on the soules of men but by substance and essence and not eternall death in hell fire with the Diuell and his Angels you nor all your adherents shall euer be able by any ground of holy Scripture to make it appeare And therefore your presuming it vpon the bare shew of places concluding no such thing is a pestilent intrusion vpon the word of God whiles you sticke not to couple your conceits which are false and erroneous with his vndoubted and vndefiled trueth x Defenc. pag. 135. li. 31. First ordinarily and commonly it belongeth only to the damned wherewithall are the ordinarie accidents and concomitants desperation induration vtter darknesse c. with perpetuitie of punishment and that locally in HELL Generally and truely the Scriptures neuer vse the name of the second death but for the lake burning with euerlasting fire into which the Diuell and all the Reprobate shall be cast and whatsoeuer you otherwise pretend is your owne absurd deuice without the Scriptures and against the Scriptures to keepe your doctrine from open derision and detestation And since your selfe acknowledge that this is the ordinarie and vsuall doctrine of the Scriptures it shal be needfull for your Reader to hold you to that till you fully proue your extraordinarie deuice by the same Scriptures by which the other is euidenly confirmed and so much openly confessed by you y Defenc. pag. 135. li. 36. In this sense the Fathers generally do take it where they denie that Christ suffered the death of the soule and so do we If your cause haue so little holde in the Scriptures it hath lesse in the Fathers who in the necessarie worke of our redemption thought it sacriledge to say any thing that was not apparently proued by the Scriptures And as you light not on a true word when you come to deliuer vs the mysteries of your new hell so this is patently false that the Fathers generally take the death of the soule for eternall damnation only when they denie that Christ died the death of the soule They speake as the Scriptures leade them and confessing two deaths of the soule as the Scriptures doe which are sinne excluding all grace and the wages of sinne euen euerlasting damnation they generally denie that Christ died any death of the soule and haue for confirmation of their doctrine therein the whole course of the sacred Scriptures concurring with them x Defenc. pag. 135. li. 37. Secondly the death of the soule or the second death may be extraordinarily and singularly considered namely to imply no more but simply the very nature and essence of it You broach two apparent and euident vntrueths which you make the whole foundation of your presumptuous errour First that either Christ or his Elect in this life did or do suffer the very nature and essence of the second death Next that the Scriptures do singularly and extraordinarily reserue that kinde of second death for Christ and his members Shew either of these by the word of God before you make them grounds of your doctrine or els any meane Reader may soone conceiue you meane to teach no trueth confirmed in the Scriptures but a bolde and false deuice of your owne which you would extraordinarily intrude vpon the word of God a Defenc. pag. 136. li. 5. This is a death to the soule as before we haue shewed according to this sense the Scriptures and Fathers before noted may rightly be vnderstood not to denie it in Christ. When you glaunced before at the death of Christes soule you prayed vs to haue patience When the Defender shouââ¦d proue the death of Christs soule he sayeth bee hââ¦th proued it already till you came to the place where we should receiue a reasonable satisfaction and now you are come to the place where you should make iust and full proofe thereof you send vs backe againe and say you haue shewed it before What meaneth this doubling and deceiuing of your Reader but that you would seeme to haue many proofs when indeed you haue none and therefore you post vs to and fro to seeke for that we shall neuer finde In the 113. Page of this Defence you went about by your miserable misconstruing of certaine wordes vsed by some of the Fathers to enforce a shew of a death on the soule of Christ but against the haire as there I haue proued and therefore stand not on your former vnfortunate aduentures but either heere make proofe by the Scriptures that Christ died the death of the soule or leaue prating and publishing it so confidently as you and your adherents do for the chiefe part of mans redemption The Scriptures and Fathers you say before noted may rightly be vnderstood not to denie it in Christ. Is this all you haue to say for the death of Christes soule that the Scriptures and Fathers may be vnderstood not to denie it The Scriptures must affirme it before you can make it any point of Christian religion or part of our reconciliation to God b Rom. 10. Faith is by hearing and hearing by the word of God and not by not denying If that be your course to put any thing to the Creed which you list to say the Scriptures doe not denie you may quickly haue a large Creed containing all things which the Scriptures abused with your figures and wrested to your fansies shall not in expresse words as you thinke denie c Defenc. pag. 136. li. 9. Moreouer let it be obserued that if we had no proofes at all
resurrection and Tertullian nameth the law either threatning Adam if he sinned or the Law of Moses punishing sinne committed by men either of which stretcheth farder then the separation of the soule from the body As for the law of our nature which you say is to die and no more you talke thereof as if you were rather a prophane Philosopher then anie piece of a Diuine since this law was laid on our nature for sinne and forceth as well our soules to hell if we be not thence redeemed by Christ as our bodies to the graue That in death the whole man is dissolued the soule separated from the body and the bodie left voide of sense and life what is this to your purpose will this conclude that the soule in heauen or in paradise being not onely in rest but in ioy feeleth still the sting of death which she felt at her parting from her body before she tasted the life to come Will you continue the power and sense of death euen in heauen because the soule assured of Gods goodnesse and promise expecteth her body to be partaker of the same blisse with her and to receaue the crowne of righteousnesse laide vp in store for all that loue Christes comming or if you be so venturous in fauour of your owne conceits that you will mingle darkenesse with light death with life and the feare of hell with the ioy of heauen thinke you to finde any man so vnwise as to tread your steppes in these vnchristian deuices Chrysostome and Basil likewise with the rest of the Greekes may be noted how they yeeld Hades to the soules of the godly and iust men deceased remaining in ioyes If you speake of the time afore Christes comming and take Hades for places vnder the earth you may chance to finde some such thing in Chrysostome and Basil but that either of them after Christs resurrection yeeldeth Hades to the soules of the blessed is a manifest vntrueth And since I haue handled these places before I shall not need to repeate them againe Also Ambrose is to be considered who right according to all the rest saith Soules departed from their bodies did goe to Hades that is to an inuisible place which in Latin we call Infernum Could you alleage the Fathers wordes rightly you might happely sometimes vnderstand them but alwaies peruerting them as you doe what maruell if alwaies you misse their meaning Ambrose doth not there deliuer either his owne opinion or the perswasion of any Christians but speaketh of Heathen Philosophers who knew nothing of our saluation by Christ and of them saith Satis fuerat dixisse illis quod liberatae animae de corporibus ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã peterent idest locum qui non videtur quem locum Latine infernum dicimus It had beene enough for them being Pagans to haue said that the soules seuered from their bodies went to Aides that is to a place vnseene which in Latine we call Infernus hell If you be a Pagan we looke for none other confession at your handes he that is ignorant of the faith must needs be ignorant of the trueth but if you be a Christian you may not say as the Pagans did that the soules of the godly who are with Christ goe to Hades or Infernus Ambrose himselfe will tell you so much In Inferno semper est qui non ascendit ad Christum He that ascendeth not to Christ is alwaies in hell As for Christes descending he saith Dominus in Infernum descendit vt illi qui in Infernis erant a perpetuis vinculis soluerentur The Lord descended to hell that they which were in places below might be loosed from perpetuall chaines You haue found out the death of the soule in heauen can you finde vs there perpetuall chaines also And Ierom Infernus is a place where the soules are included either in rest or paines It is no newes for him that hath no sense of trueth to haue no shame of falshood If Ieââ¦om were not plaine enough that he hath no such wordes or meaning as to bestow the soules of the saints in Inferno after Christs resurrection you might be borne with but when expresly he voucheth and prooueth the contrarie what can be in you but precise impudence to outface your Reader with Ieroms name against Ieroms most manifest assertion Porro quòd sancti post resurrectionem Christine nequaquam teneantur in Inferno testatur Apostolus dicens Melius est dissolui esse cum Christo. Qui autem cum Christo est vtique non tenetur in Inferno That the Saints saith Ierom are not after Christes resurrection detained in Infernus the Apostle witnesseth saying it is better to be dissolued and to be with Christ. Now he that is with Christ surely is not held in Infernus And againe Quid simile Infernus regna caelorum what likenesse or neerenesse hath Infernus to the kingdome of heauen and this the situation of Infernus euery where vrged by Ierom will prooue Simul discimus quod infernus sub terra sit dicente scriptura vsque ad fundamenta Laci Withall saith he we learne that Infernus is vnder the earth the Scripture saying euen vnto the bottom of the lake And againe Inferiora terrarum infernus accipitur ad quem Dominus noster saluatorque descendit The lower parts of the earth are taken for Infernus to which our Lord and Sauiour descended Quod autem Infernus in inferiore parte terrae sit Psalmista testatur And that Infernus is in the lower part of the earth the Psalmist testiââ¦ieth saying The earth opened and swallowed Dathan and couered the congregation of Abiram And in an other place we reade let death come vpon them and let them descend aliue to Infernus If you will place the soules of the Saints deceased in Christ below in the earth then may you haue some hold in Ierom that they are yet in Infernus but if that be repugnant to the Scriptures to the Fathers to Ieroms expresse words and euen to your owne positions why vse you or rather so openly abuse you Ieroms speech against so maine and manifest a trueth not distinguishing the time whereof he spake but confounding the old and new Testament together to giue place to your lame collections Ruffinus vpon Descendit ad Inferna giueth this sense Descendit in mortem He submitted vnto death If death had none other sense nor force but the death of the bodie your saying were somewhat but since death for sinne raigneth aswell in hell ouer the Soule as in the graue ouer the body the name of death doth not exclude Christes descent to hell and so much Ruffinus words will easily conuince Eousque ille miserando descendit vsque quo tu peccando deiectus es So farre Christ of mercy descended how farre thou by sinning wast deââ¦ected Now if we by sinning were in danger of none
on this place maketh an exact difference betwixt death and Hades for that Hades containeth soules and deadbodies where the Latin in both places hath death and no more The Latin Fathers you will say doe all follow the old Latin translator and he placeth the word sting last as you do There is no one place in the new Testament that hath receiued more varietie of translating and ordering then this Tertullian citeth it thrice in one booke after this sort Vbi est mors aculeus tuus vbi est mors aculeus Where is thy sting ó death Where is thy strife ô death reading ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã for ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã strife for victorie Cyprian citeth it in the same order and words as Tertullian doth Ambrose returneth neerer to the Greeke and saith vbiest mors stimulus tuus vbi est mors victoria tua ô death where is thy sting ô death where is thy victorie euen as the interpreter of Ireneaus doth though he inuert that order in an other place and follow the Septuagint which Ierom and other of the Latin Fathers also doe And least you should thinke as you doe that the old translator who very scrupulously keepeth the word Infernum for Hades through out the Bible did heere translate it by death you shall see that Eusebius lighted on a Greeke copie where the word Thanatos death was twice repeated and the parts changed as they stand in the Latine ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ô death where is thy victorie ô death where is thy sting Elsewhere the same Author keepeth the word death twice but altereth the order ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ô death where is thy sting ô death where is thy victorie In this diuersitie of reading and relating the Apostles wordes it is eche mans duetie not to runne which way he will though perhaps he may bring some one president for his purpose but to hold that for the true and Authenticke text to which most copies and writers agree And therefore since your exposition of hades death to be Synonymas dependeth vpon your priuate changing the order of the apostles words I see no need to make any answere to it specially when as the Latin translator might and no doubt did light on such a copie as Eusebius did which had the word Thanatos death twice in that place Otherwise it could not be that he who was ouer diligent in all other places would be so negligent in this A farder answere to the frame of your wordes as you haue placed them if any man for his satisfaction would receiue the name of death which compriseth both temporall and eternall death and by sinne gaâ⦠the victorie of our first parents but that the elect by Christ haue againe recouered the victorie ouer all sorts of death giueth answeare enough For sinne which the Apostle heere calleth the sting of death did not onely sting Adam and his ofspring with the death of the body but also with the death of the soule the wages of sinne being death in all parts of man and in all places of his abode and therefore sinne of his owne nature and force till it be pardoned by Christ is the sting no lesse of hell as in all the wicked then of bodily death as in all the Saints And heere by the way the Reader may obserue that for aduantage you are content to make bodily death in the Saints the sting of sinne which I trust is as much as the punishment of sinne since it stingeth vnto death The graue of the wicked is not to be named or reckned hell properly Whom doth the Apostle make to speake in that place the godly who haue the victorie ouer sinne hell and death or the wicked ouer whom those three get the conquest since the wicked doe not rise from death to life as the Saints doe but their bodides rising out of one pit fall into a farre worse which is the bottomlesse pit of eternall death damnation Hades is aduersary to the resurrection But hell heere would not be aduersary to the resurrection Therefore hades heere is not hell no not to the wicked Doth the Apostle dispute heere of the resurrection of the wicked to death euerlasting or of the Saints to celestiall blisse and glory though it be true that the bodies of the reprobate shall rise vp from the earth where they rested and be cast with their soules into euerlasting fire yet the Apostle heere debateth and prooueth the raising vp of Christs members to beare the image of the heauenly Adam and to haue death swallowed vp in victory Looke on the Apostles reasons and comparisons in this whole chapter and if any one of them naturall or theologicall agree to the resurrection of the wicked then let the Reader thinke you haue some vnderstanding of this place which now is vtterly none If Christ be not risen your faith is in vaine saith Paul and you are yet in your sinnes As in Adam all died so in Christ all shal be quickened euery one in his order Christs as the first fruits then those that are Christs at his comming There is one glory of the Sunne another of the Moone and another of the Starres So also shal be the resurrection of the dead The body is sowen in corruption dishonor and weakenesse it shall rise in incorruption in glory in power When this corruptible hath put on incorruption and this mortall hath put on immortalitie then shal be performed that which is written Death is swallowed vp in victory and the Saints shall haue iust cause to say ô death where is thy sting ô hades hell where is thy victory Thanks be to God which hath giuen vs victory through our Lord Iesus Christ. How farre are these things from all communion of the wicked though hell at that day shal be increased and aduanced as you call it with the bodies of all the wicked yet may the godly Saints of whom the Apostle speaketh most iustly reioice against hell and death as being now swallowed vp in victory that is vtterly defeated of all force to kill the body any more or to stay the soule any longer by meanes of death from her crowne of glory For the victory which God will giue vs through Christ our Lord against hell and death is not yet full till our soules and bodies be brought to eternall blisse And were it possible which is not that the soules of the Saints could for euer enioie the rest and blisse which now they haue without their bodies euen in this want of one halfe Satan should still haue some victory ouer them that is ouer their bodies though not ouer their soules Wherefore the victory is then full when both parts of man are freed from all things that hinder their heauenly inheritance And this the best interpreters confesse Peter Martyr Interim videas ordine quodam nostros iââ¦micos
recenseri insernum siue gehennam mortem peccatum legem In the meane while thou must see our enemies heere numbred in order hell or gehenna death sinne and the law Christ hath gotten the victory ouer all these and the fruit of that victory redoundeth to vs. Bullinger The Apostle declareth that the victory ouer sinne death and hell is gotten by the might and merits not of the saints but of Christ to whom the saints must yeeld all glory praise and thanks And this explanation hath very excellent degrees First â⦠hell to wit the excrlasting punishment whereby the dead are condemned to the second death the second is sinne which is the force of death and hell For by sinne came death The third is the law the strength of sinne The law being then taken away the force of sinne decaieth sinne being abolished the power of death ceaseth death being disarmed hell is ouerthrowen Hyperius If death shall then haue no more rule it followeth that neither hell shall preuaile against the godly For this must be vnderstood of them since the wicked shall not be deliuered from the power of hell In these words ô death where is thy sting ô hell where is thy victory either God as conquerer or the saints as giuing the praise of the conquest to God in a sort reproch death and hell with the losse of their power and strength And very aptly is death put first and then hell For men die before they be cast into hell in which the wicked tast the second or eternall death Moe might be brought but with wise men there can be no question that the Saints at the last day being then fully freed from all their enemies may giue thanks to God for the victory purchased by Christ against them all hell and Satan not excepted Also we are to note that the Apostle heere plainely alludeth to that of Hoseah O Sheol o kingdome of death I wil be thy destruction not ô hell The Prophet speaketh this to comfort Israel in their captiuity against their continuall destruction and raizings out of this world You will soone brest other men that will beard the Apostle in this matter so boldly as you doe Indeed you and some others thinke it a glory to take part with the Iewes contradicting all that the Euangelists Apostles alleage out of the law and the Prophets touching Christ and his kingdome and you vouchsafe to yeeld to the holy Ghost speaking in them no more skill or vnderstanding of the old Testament but to allude to it and as it were to play with it when the true literall sense of most places as you thinke is farre from that which they intend But this Iudaizing whiles you would seeme more then others to smatch of a little Hebrew I for my part detest and professe to the world I take that euery where to be the true and direct meaning of Moses and the Prophets which Christ and his Apostles collect from their words And therefore Ierom saith of this very place as I say of all others That which the Apostle referreth to the resurrection of the Lord nos aliter interpretari nec possumui nec audemus we neither can nor dare interprete otherwise Yea so well learned you are in the circumstances of the Prophets speach that you pronounce The Prophet speaketh this to comfort Israel in their captiuity shewing that now the Lord would stay his iudgment that way and death should now destroy them no more Whereas Israel was then in no captiuity as appeareth by the 16 verse of the same chapter Samaria shal be desolute And God had no meaning to tell the people he would now stay his hand and they should be destroied no more because in the two next verses he threatneth They should be spoiled dried and desolate they should fall by the sword their infants should be dashed in pieces and their women with child should be ripâ⦠Wherefore except you will haue the holy Ghost to speake contradictions as your manner is you must acknowledge that amidst the fearefull troubles destructions and desolations then and afore denounced by the Prophet against the whole kingdome of Israel God doth comfort his elect amongst them that whatsoeuer became of their bodies in this affliction approching he had his time when he would vtterly destroy the power of all their enemies not onely freeing them by death from tyrants and persecutors but sauing them from death and hell by his annointed Messias who should be a death to death and a destruction to hell And as this was the greatest comfort and onely hope that Gods children in their miseries could expect or desire so the Apostle keepeth right the Prophets meaning and sheweth the time when all this shal be performed that is when all teares shal be wiped from the eies of Gods elect and all their enemies sinne death and hell troden vnder their feete In this comfort and promise as hell was the chiefest enemy so of all others that must be conteined within the limits of Gods assurance and their deliuerance In vaine are all other promises of grace whiles that enemy standeth vnuanquished And therefore as we most needed so God most promised and Christ most performed the destruction of hell aboue and afore the death of the body which you so much talke of and from which you giue to the reprobate a resurrection as well as to the godly which is but a cold comfort to him that duely considereth it Next we come to the Reuelation First I haue the keyes of Hades that is of destruction or of the kingdome of death and of death Or we may take them as two words for oâ⦠and the same thing That is both of them for death What shew of reason haue you to bring in here Christs power ouer the damned soules in hell because there is mention else where of the key of hell therefore the key of Hades here is the same What colour of reason is there in this Euen so much as you can not resist For if it be certaine which the Scripture confirmeth that Christ hath the keyes of both that is as well of hell as of death and gate them both by submitting himselfe to death And Hades in the new Testament is taken for hell as hitherto we haue seene and euen with Saint Iohn the writer of this Reuelation it is a different thing from death what can Hades be here but hell That Christ by his obedience vnto death had all power in heauen and earth and hell giuen him the Apostle is very plaine Christ became obedient to the death euen the death of the Crosse. Wherefore or for which cause God highly exalted him and gaue him a Name aboue euery name that at the name of Iesus euery knee of those in heauen on earth and vnder the earth should bow and euery tongue confesse that Iesus is the Lord. As he himselfe also witnessed when he said
vs. 132. 133 How Christ shall the second time appeare without sinne 27 How far Christs sufferings must be extended 343 How Christs soule was in his Fathers hands 549 How Christ was in Paradise the day of his death 549 How Christ was like vs in all things sinne excepted 86 How Christ might feare and yet be freed from it 486. ââ¦87 How Christ loosed the sorrowes of death 624 How Christ must rise from the dead 627 What Christ discerned in all his sufferings 317 What Christ vndertooke for vs. 324 What things Christ inwardly beheld in the garden 387 Why Christ might dislike the death of the body 398 The ioynt sufferings of Christ in his bodily death most auaileable for our saluation 68 Euery thing in Christ was meritorious but not satisfactorie for sinne 179. 180 Both body and soule must suffer in Christ. 130. 131 Christs bodily death part of the punishment of our sinnes 11 By Christs corporal punishment we are freed from spirituall and eternall 222. 223 Christs blood could not be shed but by Satan and his instââ¦uments 231 Christs recompence for the wrong receaued at Satans hands 232 Christs suffering without the gate of the city 113. 114 Christs death was most iust with God in respect of his will to saue vs. 262. 263 Christs death not exacted as a debt but ââ¦eceaued as a voluntarie sacrifice 264 Christs doings aboue mans reason 310 The nature measure and purpose of Christs sufferings 332 The paines of Christs soule as of his body were equall to the strength of his patience 334 Christs faith did not faile in the sharpest of his paines 335 All Christs sufferings were righteous and holie 344. 438 Christs words Iohn 12. auouch not contraries 482. are expounded 483 Christs senses were not ouerwhelmed with feare and sorrow 477 Christs feares and sorrowes not like the reprobates 448. 449. 450 We must not increase Christs sufferings at our pleasure 478 Christs passió did not kil his soul but his body 528 Christs conquest secureth our soules seuered from our bodies 670 Christs Soule was not tormented with Gods immediat hand 34 Christs Soule suffered but died not for vs. 133 Christ soule suffered by all her powers but not the death of the Soule 136. 137. 140 Christs Soule chiefe patient in paine and agent in merit 179 Christs Soule could not merit if it wanted vnderstanding and will 480 Christs Soule in her greatest paines did most shew the life of patience and obedience to God 524 Christs Soule was passible but died not 533 Christs Soule was not fastned to hell three daies 551 Christs Soule was in glory before his Body 669 Christs Soule liuing by grace could no way be dead 523 Neither Scriptures nor Fathers vnderstââ¦nd Christs Soule by his Body 426. 427 Christs Soule was not crucified through infirmity 510 Christâ⦠Soule was not vnder the dominion of death 650 What wee must beware in the sufferings of Christs Soule 536 Many writers teach the sufferings of Christs Soule without the paines of hell 536 Why Christs Soule and not his Body was to conquere hell 668 It is not against the faith that Christes Soule should conquere hell 622 Christs manââ¦ood praied for that with all humilitie which hiâ⦠person by ââ¦ight might haue chalenged 378 Christâ⦠manhood might feare the glory of Gods iudgement 380 Christs manhood miââ¦ht feare the power of Gods wrath against our sinnes which he was to beare 380 Christs manhood might feare the sting of death as horrible to mans nature 381 Christs manhoode was to conquere hell 667. though by power of his Godhead 670 Christs flesh found no ease in death though his Soule were full of hope 424 Christs flesh was weake though his Spirite was willing 508 Christs flââ¦sh could not putrifie 623 Christs praier in the Garden was well aduised 397 Christâ⦠praier was no maze 4ââ¦7 Christs praier was not against his Fathers will 397. 465. 466. 470. 471. 472 Christs praier was full of faith 474. 475 Christs praier was with condition and reseruation of Gods will 382 Compassion and pittie are alwaies painfull 27 Compassion is affliction though it be a vertue 438 Christ more compassiââ¦nate then Moses or Paul 359 Christs complaint on the Crosse. 409 How many senses it may beare 418. 420. 421 The first sense 416 The second sense 418 The third sense 421 The fourth sense 430 The fift sense 432 The sixt sense 433 The Saints compââ¦aint in their afflications 418 The euent of Christs coââ¦plaint on the Crosse. 419 No shame for Christ to complaine on the Crosse as he did 420 Leo maketh Christs complaint on the Crosse an instruction no lamentation 432 We were conceaued in sin before we were quickned with life 173 Mans flesh is defiled in conception before the soule is created and infused 174. 175 None can be euerlastingly condemned for anothers fault 363 Christs conquest ouer hell and death 667 was ordered most to Satââ¦ns shame 669 Contradictions obiected by the Defender are easily answered 69 Contradictions in the Defender 320 A shamefull contradiction of the Defender 423 The words of the Creed examined 648 How long this clause of Christs descent to hell hath beene in the Creede 653. 654 Hades in the Creede muââ¦t signifie hell 649 Hell in the Creede is no new translation 652 The Creede continued from the Apostles times 664 Twelue parts of the Creede ââ¦64 What Crââ¦sse of Christ it was that Paul so much reoiyced in 73. 74 75 How the Fathers and new writers expound that place 76. 77 How farre the Crosse of Christ extendeth it selfe by the Scriptures 79 We reioyce in the effects of Christs Crosse. 81 Christ was not voââ¦de of all comfort on the Crossâ⦠410. 411 What comfort Christ had on the Crosse. 412 The death of the Crosse the greatest exââ¦anition of Christ. 433 Christs Soule was not Crucified through infirmitie 501 Figuratiuely the Soule may be said to be Crucified 80 What Cup Christ dranke of 373 What Christ meant by the houre and Cup of his Passion 443 Christ and his members must drinke of one and the same Cup. 353 What part of the Curse Christ bare for our sinnes 234. 235 Hanging on a tree was not the whole Curse of the Law 236 A double Curse of sinne 236 Two kindes oâ⦠Cââ¦rses in the Law 239 The bodily death which Chââ¦ist suffered was the Curse which he sustained 240 Cursing and blââ¦ssing compared doe manifest each the other 249 What is true Cursing and blessing from God 250 How Christ was made a Curse for vs. 257 Christs death was a kinde of Curse 259 Christ vndertooke to satisfie but not to suffer our Curse 260 The Curse for sinne is triple 266 Cyprian wrested by the Defender 274 D D Amnation What paines are essentiall to it 37. 39 The horror of Gods iudgements not neere the paines of the Damned 227 The Godly in this life feele not the paines of the damned 320 Sharper paines are reserued for the damned then now they feele 334 Christ was not
the proper wrath of God 19 What proper applied to wrath signifieth 18 The Scriptures often intermingle proper speeches with figuratiue 19 Proper opposed to Metaphoricall 123 A part may Properly denominate the whole 124 The ioynt sufferings of soule and body most proper to man 167 The whole suffering of Christ was not Gods proper action 303 What the Prophets foretold of Christes sufferings that the Euangelists confirme was verified 299 In punishing his elect God tempereth both loue and ââ¦ustice 147 Corporall death in all men is the punishment of sinne 149. 150. 151 God is most iust in punishing his Saints 262 The Defenders partition of punishment applied to Christ is insufficient and impious 153 All punishment is not for correction or vengeance properly so called 154 The godly iustly punished for their offences 256 Q QVaestion The first quaestion wholy peruerted 3 The chiefe points coincident to the first Question 9 Whether there be true fire in hell before the iudgement is not the Question 54 When and how farre Christ was forsaken are the things Questioned 414 R RAnsome To whom our ransome was paid 228 To saue from death is to raise from death 50 Whence their soules come that are raised to ãâã ââ¦25 Redemption by Christs blood most sufficienâ⦠67 The Scriptures teach no redemption buââ¦ââ¦y the blood and death of Christ. 127 Both body and Soule are redeemed by ãâã blood of Christ. 128. 129 The body hath not his redemption ãâã ââ¦fore the last day 129. 130 Christ vndertooke to be our ââ¦demer 4000. yeers before he was made man 280 The willing offer of the Sââ¦e to be our redeemer did induce the ãâã the whole Trinitie 281 The redeemer might pay as well for the prisoners as for him selfe 377 Christs sufferings ãâã way like the sufferings of the reprobate 331. 332 Christs feare ãâã sorrow not like the reprobates 448. 449 What is ãâã by sitting at Gods right hand 651 The claue of Christs descent to Hades was in the Creeââ¦e before Ruffinus time 655 What Ruffinus meaneth by Christes descent to hell 655 S SAcrifice Three properties of the true Sacrifice for sinne 99. 100 The bloody Sacrifices represented no death but onely bodily 105 No Sacrifices of the Iewes figured the death of Chââ¦ists Soule 106 What Salt flower oile and wine added to the Iewes sacrifices might signifie 109. 110 What fire did signifie in sacrifices 112. 113 What is consequent to the true sacrifice for sinne 272 Why the people laid their hands on the head of their sacrifices 277 Feare and sorrowe necessary in the sacrifice for sinne 379 More then affliction requisite to Christs sacrifice 437 A deââ¦d Soule is no sacrifice for sinne 527 Whââ¦t the Sacraments of the new Testament import 117 Sacraments doe constantly and continually signifie and represent the same 117 The Spirit oâ⦠sanctification is the holy Ghost 511 My exception to the Defenders instance of the Scape-goate 106 What was figured by the scape-goate 107 108 The scape-goate might in some sort be a signe of Christ. 108 How the Scripture limiteth Christs death 5. 180 What the Scriptures meane by the wages of sinne 12 What they meane by the wrath of God 15 Phrases of Gods wrath against the wicked in Scripture are improper 15. 16 Scriptures neuer mention that Chââ¦ist suffered Gods wrath 21. nor the death of the Soule 493. 49. 515 nor the paines of hell 399 ââ¦ow the Scriptures speake of Christs Passion 22 Scriptures often intermin le proper speeches ãâã figuratiue 48 The ââ¦riptures sometimes put a condition all to thin most certaine 473 True ãâã how to expound the Scriptures 435 Many pla s of Scriptures haue diuerse expositions 4â⦠which may be tolerated though they cannoââ¦ââ¦e reconciled 435 The Scriptures ãâã the words but not the errors of the heat en 612 Some Scriptures vnc ãâã ââ¦ine for a time 664 Satan was conquered fast by iustice then by power 229 Satans kingdome subiected to Christs mââ¦nhood 230 Satan assaulted Christ on the ââ¦rosse but by externail meanes 296. 297 Satan might doe nothing against ââ¦hrist but what Christ would 315 Satan worketh not but where he is 306 Christ ordered his conquest most to ãâã shame 669 What was impugned in the Sermons 2 The text of my Sermons was not mistaken 72 But rightly and orderly pursued 78 Our naturall knowledge commeth by Sense 196 Prouocations and pleasures come by the senses 200. 201 The soule for want of her senses sometimes ceaseth to sinne 206 Christs senses might not be ouerwhelmed as martyrs are 396 In what sense Ezekiah vseth the gates of Sheol 247 The lower Sheol signifieth hell and not the graue 557. 558 Sheol for hell Esay 14. 559. 560 The soules of the Saints are not in Sheol 571 Sheol is no meere priuation of this life 572 Sheol is properly a place vnder earth for the dead 573 The soules in Gods hands are not in Sheol 574 The Sheol of soules is more then a meere priuation 575 What Sheol is to the wicked and what to the godly 575 To what Sheol Iacob would descend mourning 576 Sheol no place for iust mans soules 577 There is neither knowledg nor praise of God in Sheol 578 Sheol is no destruction to the godly 575 What is meââ¦nt by meââ¦nt neere to Sheol or ãâã most dwelling there 500 The Defender abuseth Plato and Plato to haue a Sheol for all things 630 Prooueth Moses and Dauid to haue a Sheol for all thin s. 631 To what Sheol Corah and his company descended 631 The Desendours absurd proofes for the Sheol of all thin s. 632 The Similitude of an earthly suerty not fit for Christ though the name may well be vsed 282 283 No humane similitude can throughly fit Christes sufferings for vs. 293 Similitudes are not alwaies of things lawfull 293 Similitude is no equalitie 328 How we are freed from Sinne by Christ. 152. 153 We inherit sinne and death from our parents flesh 171 How sinne is communicated from the soule to the body 188. 189 All acts of sinne by the body 202 Bodie and soule that were ioyned in sinne shal be ioyned in paine 209 How sinne maketh men vncleane 265 How sinne was condemned in Christs flesh 268 How Christ was made sinne 269. 270 Our sinnes were imputed to Christ that is he was punished for them 272. 277 Inward and infinite Sorrow for sinne must bee found in Christs sacrifice for sinnes 372 Christ must as well sorrow as suffer for sinne 373 Inward and voluntary sorrow of the soule is a sacrifice to God 438 Sorrow differeth from paine 444 What sorrow is 444 We may both sorrow and reioice at one time 489 What meanes of suffering the Soule hath 24 The passibilitie of the Soule is but one facultie of the soule 25 The soules suffering by the body is the proper suffering of the soule 26 The meanes by which the soule suffereth paines 30 The soules suffering from and with the bodie not common with beasts 31 The substance of the
soule suffereth in and by all her powers 134. 135 The soules suffering by sympathy is the Defenders owne phrase 170 The soule is not deriued from the fathers of our bodies 171. 172 The Soule chiesly sinneth and chiefly suffereth but not onely 181. 182 What powers and faculties of the Soule the Fathers ãâã corporall and why 187 The Soule ioyned with the Body hath one state and seuered another 198 The Soule vseth her corporall spirits in thinking and remembring 207 The Soule leadeth and the flesh followeth to all sinne 210. 211 The Soule hath a ââ¦st of sinne and paine before the last day 213 The Soule feeleth paine and griefe by her vnderstanding and will 344 Whence theâ⦠Soules come that are raised to life 425 The Soule is a consequent to a liuing body but no part of it 426 The Soule is some time called flesh 529 The Soule taken for life 570 The Spirit of sanctification is the holy Ghost 511 Flesh and Spirit doe not alwaies note the two natures of Christ. 512 The Spirit signifieth the Soule of man 529 The preaching to the Spirits in prison 676 The law which curseth offendors admitteth no Suerties 264 Christ no way bound to be our Suertie 277 Christ a Suretie to vs of the new Testament 278 Though Christ may be called a voluntary Suerty yet was he truely a mercifull Redeemââ¦r 280 The similitude of an earthly Suertie not fit for Christ though the name may well be vsed 282. 2ââ¦3 The Law alloweth no offendois any Suerties 288 I mislike not the name but the bondage of a Suertie in Christ. 291. 292 Submission to God and compassion on man the generall causes of Christs Agony 347 Submission with great feare and trembling Christ yeeldeth to God sitting in iudgement 350. 351 The correcting of King Edwards Synode 675 The things misliked in king Edwards Synod ibid. T TArtarus a part of Hades with the Poets 613 Tartarus with the Pagans is hell 617 Tartarus taken for the aââ¦e ouer vs. 617 Christ could not be tempted to euill by any motion of his owne hart 304. 305. 306 Christ was tempted in the wildernesse by the suggestion of Satan 307 Christ was tempted after 40. daies 307 Christ was tempted all his life long but not inwardly 312 Perswasion tempteth as well as compulsion 314 Difference of outward and inward temptations 314 No temptations without desperation kill the soule 525 The Terror of God felt by Iob and Ionas were not the paines of hell 452 Tertullian ascribeth all sinne to the whole man 208 What forsaking Tertullian speaketh of 427 Tertullian nameth no death but of Christs body 428 Tertullian is farre from affirming the death of Christs Soule 532 Tertullian admitteth none to Paradise before the last day but Martyrs 594. 595. 596 Tertullian therein followed Montanus the Hereticke 597 How ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã Hades and Inferi concurre in signification 579 The storie of Thaddeus no fable 660 Thaddeus did not receaue adoration 662 Thomas how he might be called Iudas 660 Euill Thoughts defile the whole man 204 Our will the cause of our euill thoughts 200 Christs bodily transfiguration was imperfect and transitorie 458. 459 Triumphes are not secret and solitarie 664 V VEngeance proper to the wicked appeared not in the Crosse of Christ. 156. 157 All Christs infirmitie was Voluntarie 407 W VVHat the Scriptures meane by the Wages of sinne 12 A threefold death the Wages of sinne 13 Weakenesse appeared in Christs flesh but willingnesse in his spirit 424 Whole redemption and propitiation are verie large and doubtfull termes 103 The Whole man dieth though the soule liue 513 514 Euill thoughts defile the whole man 204 The whole man guilty of all sin 185. 186. 187. 208 Our Will the cause of our euill thoughts 200 What is ment by the Worme that neuer dieth 46 What the Scriptures meane by the Wrath of God 15 What proper applied to wrath signifieth 18 Christ suffered not the proper and meere wrath of God 19. 23 What Wrath of God Christ suffered 57 58 What is Gods Wrath against sinne 60 God hââ¦d neuer displeasure or Wrath against Christs person 61 God wrath against sinne hath many degrees and ââ¦arts 157 How the wrath of God in this life differeth from wrath to come 158 Christ might suffer the wrath of God and yet not the true paines of hell 159. 160 Wrath must be measured by Gods intention not mans discerning 165 The triall of Gods Saints is no effect of Gods proper wrath 313 What Christ discerned of Gods wrath against our sinnes 333 Christ did not apprehend of Gods wrath as the damned doe 335 Christ was to see more of Gods wrath against our sinnes then he felt 376 Christ might iustly feare the power of Gods wrath 380 Z ZAnchius what he teacheth of mans redemption 537 Faults escaped should thus be amended PAge 4. line 25. for fourth read foorth ibid. l. 34. infimities r. infirmities p. 26. l. 48. neighbour r. neighbour p. 38. title to his r. to hell p. 58. marg of agony r. of Christs agony p. 66. l. 47. death r. death p. 230 tit in subuerting r. in subiecting p. 353. l. 47. what to doe r. what they doe p. 428. marg in manibus r. in manus p. 466. l. 14. the comfort r. to comfort p. 468. l. 4. thambeesa r. thambeesai p. ââ¦69 l. 1. astonished r. astonished him p. 473. l. 38. because God r. because Iacob p. 485. throughout enlabeia r. eulabeia p. 487. l. 49. eisaekonstheis r. eisakoustheis p. 488. l. 6. eisakonstheis r. eisakoustheis ibid. 26. in marg Zinglius r. Zuinglius p. 502. l. 35. in members r. in my members p. 597. l. 23. since r. sense ibid. 32. affections r. afflictions p. 520. l. 20. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã r. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ibid. 22. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã r. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ibid. 24. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã r. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã p. 522. l. 17. Vigius r. Vigilius p. 523. l. 39. enstranging r. estranging p. 528. marg your r. the. LONDON Printed by Melchisedech Bradwood for John Bill 1. Sam. 2. Acts 26. The sermons The first and second Sermon of the Passion The Sermon of the Resurrection The Treaââ¦ise The Conclusion of the Sermons The Defence Treat pag. 95. De Trinitate li. 10. Epistola 99. Epistola 99. a Praefat pag. 9. lin 2. b â⦠Conclu pa. 243. l. 5. c Pag. 2. l. 10. d Sermons p. 8. lin 22. e Serm. p. 11. l. 24. f Serm. pa. 41. l. 14. g Serm. pa. 48. l. 34. h Serm p. 42. l. 2. i Serm. p. 73. li. 13. k Serm. p. 133. li. 13. l Ibidem li. 30. m l. 14. n l. 34. o fo 243. Their foure restraints of hell paines p Defence p. 7. l. 32. q Math. 8. vers 17. r 1. Pet 2. s Heb. 4. t Heb. 2. u Defence p. 7. x Prâ⦠p. 3. l. 8. y Serm p. 73. l. 13. z Serm. p. 78. l. 32. a Serm. p. 83. l.
was neglected and loathed And vpon conference with the most reuerend Father the late Archbishop now with God was aduised in open audience to deliuer what the Scriptures teach touching our redemption by the death and bloudshedding of Iesus Christ the Sonne of God Which accordingly I did declaring by occasion of the Apostles words Be it far from me to reioyce but in the Crosse of Christ first the Contents and then the Effects of Christes crosse In the Contents of Christes crosse I shewed what Christ suffered by the witnes of holy Scripture and what he suffered not and there ioyned this issue That no Scripture doth teach the death of Christs soule or the paines of the damned to be requisite in the person of Christ before he could be the Ransomer of our sinnes and Sauiour of the world And because the proofs pretended for this point might be three Praedictions that Christ should suffer those paines Causes why he must suffer them and Signes that he did suffer them I likewise insisted on all three and shewed there were no such Praedictions Causes nor Signes of the true paines of hell to be suffered in the soule of Christ before he could saue vs. Wherein his Agonie in the Garden and Complaint on the Crosse were examined as well by the rules of holy Scripture as by the maine consent of all the Fathers And lest the death of Christ suffered in the bodie of his flesh on the altar of the Crosse as it is described in the Scriptures and the shedding of his precious bloud should be disabled or distrusted of any as no sufficient meanes or price of our redemption in the Effects of Christs crosse I prooued the merits of Christes suffering to be infinite in respect of his person who was God and of the perfection of his obedience vnto the death of the Crosse the maner of his offering to be bloudie foreshewed by the Sacrifices of the Law and sealed by the Sacraments of the Gospell the power of his death to be mightie as able to conquer Sinne Hell and Satan the comfort of his Crosse to be necessarie to which we must all be conformed to suffer with him before we can raigne with him the victorie thereof to be heauenly in that he rose the third day into a celestiall and eternall life hauing all his enemies vnder his feet Yet for peace sake I yeelded the name of hell-paines might in some sort be tolerated in the sufferings of Christ if we meant thereby great and intolerable paines as the word is sometimes metaphorically taken in the Scriptures at the least by our vulgar translation for the word indeed was Sheôl which is vsed aswell for the graue as for hell and so those speeches of Dauid That the paines of Sheol found him out or compassed him might import the paines of death which brought men to their graues And concerning that Article of our Faith Christ descended to Hell I taught it might not by the course of the Creed be referred to Christ liuing but to Christ dead and safely note the conquest which Christs manhood after death had ouer all the powers of darkenesse declared by his resurrection when he rose Lord ouer all his enemies in his owne person Death Hell and Satan not excepted and had the Keyes that is all power of death and hell deliuered him by God that those in heauen earth and hell should stoope vnto him and be subiect to the strength and glorie of his Kingdome These things were first vttered by speech and after committed to writing that aswell the parts as proofes of euery point might more plainly appeare to all that would examine them My care was in either of these to ioyne with the doctrine prescribed by the booke of Homilies to be taught in the Church of God to the people That there is none other thing that can be named vnder heauen to saue our soules but this only worke of Christes precious offering his bodie vpon the Altar of the Crosse. For so great was Gods wrath and displeasure towards sinne that he could be pacified by no other meanes but only by the sweet and precious bloud of his deere Sonne And so pleasant was this sacrifice and oblation of his Sonnes death which he so obediently and innocently suffered that God would take it for the onely and full amends for all the sinnes of the world As for Christs descent to hell I deliuered the same ends and intents which the booke of Homilies doth where it saith Christes death destroyed death and ouercame the Diuell His death destroyed hell with all the damnation thereof Christ passed thorow death and hell to the intent to put vs in good hope that by his strength we shall do the same He destroyed the Diuell and all his tyrannie and openly triumphed ouer him and tooke away from him all his Captiues meaning all the Elect and hath raised and set them with himselfe amongst the heauenly Citizens aboue These things thus preached and printed by me it may please your excellent Maiestie to vnderstand were first impugned by an hastie and humorous Treatise whiles my Sermons were yet vnder the Presse and after by a larger and warier Defence which is this that I now refute The Treatiser sliding from the things proposed by me wherein he could not open his mouth but with as many vntrueths as words did beare men in hand the question was Whether Christ suffered for vs the wrath of God or no whereas I mooued no such doubt but rather acknowledged That all which Christ suffered in soule or in bodie was the wrath of God against our sinnes if we speake as the Scriptures doe of punishments prouided ââ¦or this life where Christ did suffer and not of the wrath to come which is the vengeance prepared for the Diuell and the damned in another world And because in this Treatise I found moe distempered pangs of erroneous follie than aduised steppes of learning or religion I refelled the chiefe reasons thereof in a Conclusion added to my Sermons as they were in printing not thinking it worth my time or paines to make any longer resutation of him that remembred so little of that I had vttered and reasoned so loosely for that which he would establish No sooner were those Sermons and that Conclusion published but the curious Brethren seeing their kingdome of conceits impugned made their obseruations on both and sent their collections and reasons to the Treatiser that he might make a fresh Defence correcting in many things his former rashnesse and now leading him rather cunningly to cauill with the Fathers speeches than so proudly to disdaine their testimonies which maketh him not only to change his minde in many matters from that he sayd before but often to crosse himselââ¦e in the selfe same leafe whiles he doth not marke what he sayth out of his owne heart and what he bringeth out of other mens supplies and papers In this Defence for so they
Agonie after an Angell appeared from heauen and comforted or strengthened him with a message from God it seemeth rather an effect of Christes intentiue prayer which the Scripture there mentioneth than a consequent to any other passion or paine Christes intentiue prayer after comfort receiued by an Angell from heauen might proceed from his ardent desire care and zeale of our redemption from the wrath of God and protection from the rage of Satan And therefore as the Prophet foreshewed he should not onely beare the sinnes of many but pray for the Trespassers Christ might spend all the spirits and powers of bodie and soule in most vehement and feruent prayer euen vnto a bloudie sweat to haue all his members pardoned their sinnes and reconciled to God by the sacrifice of his bodie which he would offer for them and also to haue Satan cast out from accusing them and in the end trodden vnder their feet If Christes bloudie sweat were supernaturall we must aske no cause thereof but leaue it to his sacred will who could aboue nature doe what he would That it was no proofe of hell paines appeareth plainly because Christ after in greater paines on the Crosse did not sweat bloud and of all those whom these men imagine suffered hell paines in the Scriptures no one can be produced that euer sweat bloud The word forsaking vsed by Christ in his Complaint on the Crosse doth not in all the Scriptures inferre the paines of the damned but in the wicked it noteth reiection desperation and feare of damnation and in the godly it argueth want of protection or decrease of consolation in their troubles In Christ it might shew the time the cause the maner or the griefe of his being so long forsaken and left to the rage and reproch of his persecutors without any sensible signe of Gods loue towards him care for him helpe in his troubles or exse in his paines but it doth not prooue that Christ thought himselfe forsaken of Gods fauour grace or spirit which feare or doubt could not be in him without a manifest touch of error and want of faith Christ neuer feared nor doubted that he should or could perish vnder the hand of God persuing our sinnes in the bodie of his flesh but for the ioy set before him endured the Crosse and despised the shame and as S. Peter sayth of him at the time of his suffering he alwayes beheld God at his right hand that he should not be shaken and therefore his heart reioyced and his tongue was glad and his flesh rested in hope because his soule should not be forsaken in hell nor his flesh see corruption Christ was made a curse for vs in that he suffered the temporall and corporall curses of the Law threatned vnto sinners as all sorts of afflictions belonging to this life and in the end a painfull and shamefull death by which he abolished the spirituall and eternall curse of God due to vs for sinne but he was neuer inwardly truely nor eternally accursed of God since by tasting of our externall curse for a time he made vs partakers of his spirituall and celestiall blessednesse for euer Christ who knew no sinne was made sinne for vs that is either the punishment of our sinnes or the sacrifice for our sinnes for we were healed by his stripes and he gaue himselfe for vs a sacrifice of a sweet smell to God Being then an holy and acceptable sacrifice to God for sinne he was neither defiled nor hatefull to God with our sinnes but suffered the iust for the vniust that is he tooke vpon him the punishment of our sinnes though he were most innocent and by the holinesse of his person submitting himselfe to the death of the crosse purged our vncleannesse by his innocencie couered our guiltinesse and by his fauour with God reconciled vs that were enemies Christ bare the full punishment of our sinnes that is not all which we should haue borne for then he must haue beene euer lastingly reiected confounded and condemned to hell fire which are most horrible blasphemies but he bare so much of the punishments of this life where he suffered as in his person by the iust iudgement of God was most sufficient for all our sinnes TOuching Christs descent to hell the words are plainly cited by Peter out of Dauid that Christes soule after death should not be left in Hades which Saint Luke in his Gospell vseth for the place where torments are prepared for the wicked after this life And in that sense is the word vsed thorowout the New Testament as likewise the Greeke Fathers tooke it for the place vnder the earth whither the soules of all men were condemned for sinne and where the Diuels detaine and torment the wicked That Christ likewise descended to the lower parts of the earth and to the bottomlesse deepe after death is vouched by Saint Paul whereupon the whole Church of Christ from the beginning hath confessed his descent to hel to be a point of Christian pietie Peters Sermon in the second of the Acts intended not simply to proue that Christ was risen from the dead as Lazarus and others were but affirmed farder of him That God raised him vp to set him on Dauids Throne that is to make him King of Glorie This he prooueth In that Christes flesh could not see corruption nor his soule be forsaken in hell which was verified in none no not in Dauid who were all dead and saw corruption but only in the Messias It was therefore impossible that either death or hell should detaine Christ but he was to rise Lord of death and hell and the Sauiour of all his from both as appeared by his ascending to heauen and sitting at the right hand of God Neither was this strange to the Iewes who were taught to expect that to be performed by the Messias which God promised by his Prophet O Death I will be thy death O Hell I will be thy destruction Sheol in the Olde Testament signifieth the Graue and Hell that is the places whither the dead bodies of all men went and whither the soules of the wicked dead in sinne descended after death And therefore where it is distinguished from the death of the bodie or referred to the soule after death as it is in Dauids words applied by Peter to Christ it apparently signifieth Hell The ends of Christes descent are likewise deriued from the Scriptures as the destroying of the Diuels kingdome and triumphing ouer powers and principalities and making an open shew of them spoiling them by deliuering all his Elect dead liuing and yet vnborne from the right power and feare of eternall death taking into his hands the Keyes of Death and Hell that he might be Lord of all in Heauen Earth and Hell The Creed is not a Collection of Greeke or Hebrew phrases vnknowen to the people but a short summe of the Christian faith prouided for the simpler sort of men to learne by heart And therefore as
THE CROSSE OF CHRIST should be frustrate For the PREACHING OF THE CROSSE is to them that perish foolishnesse but to vs that are saued it is the power of God Christ crucified then being the very ground of our saluation and the Gospel declaring him to be the power of God to saue all that beleeue euidently the crosse of Christ was the maine doctrine of the Gospell which Paul preached to the Galathians and which the false Apostles mixed with circumcision and the righteousnesse of the law as well for the aduancing themselues being Iewes as for feare of their countreymen who vtterly disdained and egerly pursued all that taught a man hanged on a tree as a malefactor for so the vnbeleeuing Iewes conceiued of Christ to be the Sauiour of the world and complement of all Gods promises made to the seede of Abraham for their euerlasting blisse The rage of the vnbeleeuing Iewes against Paul for preaching the death and blood of Christ to be the Redemption of all the faithfull is manifest in many places of the Actes and of his owne Epistles which furie whiles the false Apostles sought to decline and somewhat to please and pacifie the Iewes they added circumcision and the obseruation of the law vnto the Crosse of Christ as necessary for iustification and saluation without which the death of Christ could doe vs no good This error then newly sowen among the Galathians to whom Paul before had preached Christ crucified as the sole and sufficient meane of their Redemption and Iustification through faith in his blood the Apostle throughout that large Epistle of his written vnto them with his owne hand doth purposely and mightily confute and is so farre from coupling any thing with Christ as requisite for righteousnesse or blessednesse and chiefly the law that he opposeth himselfe against men and Angels for the truth of his doctrine and resolueth cleane contrary to those false teachers and flatterers of the Iewish nation in most vehement manner Behold I Paul say vnto you that if yee be circumcised Christ shall profit you nothing Ye are abandoned from Christ whosoeuer are iustified by the law ye are fallen from grace His reasons are vrgent and euident If righteousnesse could be by the law then Christ died in vaine And that no man is iustified by the law in the sight of God it is plaine for the iust shall liue by faith now the law is not of faith For all haue sinned and are iustified freely by Gods grace through the Redemption that is in Christ Iesus whom God hath set foorth to be a Reconciliation THROVGH FAITH in his blood to declare his righteousnesse by the forgiuenes of sinnes As many then as are of the works of the law are vnder the curse but Christ hath redeemed vs from the curse of the law being made a curse for vs as it is written cursed is euery one that hangeth on a tree that the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentils through Iesus Christ. And that made the Apostle enter this disputation with so sharpe a rebuke to the Galathians for sliding from this Gospel or glad tidings of their saluation in the Crosse of Christ to circumcision and the works of the law O foolish Galathians saith he who hath bewitched you not to obey the truth to whom Iesus Christ was before your eyes described crucified among you And in this confident course he goeth on with plentifull and substantiall proofes that the Redemption righteousnesse blessednesse adoption freedome and sanctification of Gods children proceede from the grace of God and of Christ who gaue himselfe for our sinnes that he might tast death for all and are receiued by faith in the blood of Christ which confesseth him to be the Sonne of God and the only Sauiour of the world What marueile then if in the close of this example when Paul had shewed his care to haue the Galathians persist in this truth in that he wrote so long a letter vnto them with his owne hand which otherwise he did not vse he did also traduce the pride and pollicie of the false Apostles who partly to aduance themselues because they were Iewes partly to shunne the enuie of their countrimen frustrated the Crosse of Christ by adding circumcision and the obseruation of the law vnto it not that they themselues kept the law but only because they would not suffer persecution for preaching the Crosse of Christ which the vnbeleeuing Iewes so egerly resisted and impugned and withall professed of himselfe that howsoeuer they reioyced in the flesh that is in the circumcision of the Gentils yet God forbid that he should reioyce but in the crosse of Christ as the most sufficient meane of mans Redemption by which he was crucified to the world and the world to him what persecution soeuer he suffered for it And the verses following which you peââ¦uishly pull to patience in persecution pertaine directly to establish the truth and force of Christs Crosse. For in Christ Iesus saith he that is to attaine saluation by Christ crucified neither circumââ¦sion anââ¦leth any thing nor vncircumcision but a new creature that is Regeneration in Christ when the inward man of the hart is renued by faith through the operation of the spirit And as many as walke according to this Rule of doctrine by preaching and beleeuing the crosse of Christ for many walke after an other rule of whom I haue often told you that they are the enimies of the crosse of Christ peace be vpon them and mercy and vpon the Israell of God that is vpon as many as be Iewes within and not without and haue the circumcision of the hart in the spirit not in the flesh whose praise is not of men but of God And therefore from hence forth let no man put me to businesse as if I liked or allowed circumcision when and where pleased me For if I yet preach circumcision why doe I yet suffer persecution the slââ¦inder of the Crosse is abolished and the Iewes haue no cause of offence against me But of the Iewes fiue times receiued I fortie lashes sane one I was thrise beaten with rods I was once stoned I haue beene in stripes aboue measure in prison frequent in death often I beare in my body the markes of the Lord Iesus that is the signes of these persecutions suffered for his cause which prooue that in preaching the crosse of Christ I goe not about to please men but God For if I would please ââ¦en I were not the seruant of Christ. There is no miscoherence with the Text nor dissidence from the truth in this exposition which not my selfe alone but the auncient Fathers and best Diuines both olde and new haue imbraced yea it fully agreeth with the maine intent of Paul in this Epistle with the perpetuall vse of his words and with the cleare light of other places where
like persons and cause were vndertaken by the Apostle You only are found Sir Discourser that to shew neither learning nor reading but a presumptious ouerweening of your owne witte will needs make the Reader beleeue I vnderstand not the Text. But let vs heare your pure conceit how currantly it carrieth with it the words and circumstances of the Text. They vrge you to be circumcised onely least they should suffer persecution for the crosse of Christ saith Paul of those false teachers which peruerted the truth of the Gospell among the Galathians by teaching circumcision and the righteousnesse of the Law to be necessarie to saluation How expound you these words of the Apostle he may say you be vnderstood to say that he would not suffer persecution for commending the afflictions and shame of good Christians for Christs sake You should say THEY would not suffer persecution vnlesse you put Paul into the number of false teachers but that might be the scape of your Printer Come to your owne ouersights First then Christs personall sufferings are here quite excluded for Christ I trust shall haue an other title with you then the name of a good Christian among the many and so the crosse of Christ in this place by your exposition doth both exclude and include the proper sufferings of Christ. For afore you said here Paul doth ioyntly together vnderstand by Christs crosse the afflictions of the whole mysticall body of Christ both head and members Secondly where euer read you in the Scriptures that the Iewes raized persecutions against any for commending the afflictions of the godly If it be a truth name vs the place and the persons if it be a dreame of yours keepe it to your selfe the Scriptures can expound themselues without your ââ¦ansies That the Iewes had a furious disdaine and hatred against the person of Christ and specially against the shame and reproch of his crosse and for his sake against all that preached or beleeued him to be the Messias so long before promised and his death to be the Redemption of tââ¦e world the Euangelistes and Apostles euery where in their writings giue full testimony Paul himselfe first persecuting the Christians vnto death and afterward as sharply pursued by the Iewes for the very same cause best knew what offence the Iewes tooke at the infamous death of Christ on the crosse and how egerly they were bent against all that durst professe the name of Christ and therefore could speake in this case out of his owne experience that not the commending of the afflictions of the godly but the preaching of Christs death on the crosse to be the saluation of the world was the point that so much irritated the Iewes to lay violent hands on the Christians Thirdly did circumcision hinder the commending of the afflictions of the godly the Apostles and first spreaders of the Gospell as also Paul himselfe were circumcised and yet the chiefest fauourers and encouragers of the afflicted Christians so that circumcision was no impediment to like and allow the afl ictions of the godly But as Paul saw himselfe to be most odious to the Iewes because they held opinion of him that he taught all men euery where against the people the Law and the Temple and indeed he boldly professed that in Christ Iesus neither circumcision auayled any thing nor vncircumcision and that they were no longer vnder the Law since Christ had redeemed both Iew and Gentile from the curse and bondage of the Law so he could not but discerne the drift of those false teachers who to flatter the Iewes and to claw fauour with the enimies of Christs crosse taught circumcision and the righteousnesse of the law to be necessary vnto saluation as if the death of Christ without them could profit vs nothing You doe therefore not expound but peruert the words of Paul which I tooke for my text when as he reprouing those false teachers whom he before confuted for adding circumcision and the iustification of the law to the death of Christ thereby to mitigate the malice of the Iewes conceaued against the crosse of Christ you turne the Apostles words from doctrine to manners from preaching to not commending from the death of Christ to the afflictions of Christians and so of the highest point of our Redemption and Saluation by the crosse of Christ you haue found out a cold kind of scant allowing the troubles of the Saints But the Fathers which I brought ouerthrow not your sense they rather iustifie it Whether Augustine Chrysostome Ierome and Bede whom I cited for the sense of this place do take the word Crosse in this very sentence for the personall suffeââ¦ings of Christ on the crosse which was my assertion I referre it to the censure of the Reader vpon the sight of their sayings which he may finde in the conclusion of my Sermons I must confesse mine eyes be not matches if they speake not directly to that purpose Howbeit you haue a speciall gift to make a short returne of all the Fathers with a nihil dicit when they speake against you Indeed you are out of your element when you talke of Fathers for you neither like their credits nor allow their iudgements as in processe we shall more fully shew For the present to satisfie those that be soberly minded and to let all men see to your shame that I tooke my text right though you fondly seeke by your silly conceits to impeach it marke I pray thee Christian Reader whether both elder and later Diuines doe not concurre with me in that sense of Christes crosse which I auouched to be in Pauls words Christ was crucified vnder Pontius Pilate This sayth Augustine we beleeue and we so beleeue it that we reioyce in it Be it farre from me sayth Paul to reioyce but in the crosse of Christ. Happily some man sayth Athanasius beholding the Lord and Sauiour to be condemned of Pilate and crucified of the Iewes will cast downe his head for shame But if we learne the cause why the Lord suffered wee shall cease to blush and rather reioyce as Paul did in the Lords crosse Ignatius in his Epistle to those at Tarsus where Paul was borne sayth mindfull of Paul Holde it for most certaine that the Lord Iesus was truely crucified for Paul sayth Be it farre from me to reioyce but in the crosse of our Lord Iesus and truly suffered and died Cyril Be it farre from me to reioyce but in the crosse of the Lord Iesus Paul sayth he reioyceth in the death of Christ he knew Christ therefore to be God and to haue suffered for vs in the flesh Theodoret thus expresseth Pauls meaning Ego autem propter solam salutarem crucem me iacto mihi placeo I onely boast my selfe on that crosse of Christ which bringeth saluation and therewith I content my selfe Theophylact vpon the same words of Paul Illi inquit circumcisionem hanc
the hole that you would faine hide your selfe in To that intent which I set downe my reasons drawen from the Iewish sacrifices and Christians sacraments did and doe still stand effectuall For the olde sacrifices must figure and the new Sacraments must seale whatsoeuer death in Christ was the full and perfect ransome of our sinnes But they foreshew and confirme the bodily death of Christ onely they neither shew not signifie the death of the soule nor the death of the damned Therefore the bodily death of Christ onely is the full and perfect ransome of our sinnes the death of the soule and the death of the damned as they serued nothing to our Redemption so were they not suffered in the soule of Christ. Two cauils you offer against the first part of this reason touching the sacrifices of the fathers before and vnder the law One that they figured not the whole sacrifice as neither Christes Deitie his soule nor his resurrection the next that all the sacrifices of the Iewes did not signifie his bodily death because the Scape goate which was a sinne offering was not slaine Of trifling you talke much this is more then trifling it is plaine shifting Christes deitie could be no part of that sacrifice which suffered for sinne the diuine Maiestie can not suffer either paine or sorrow To what ende then come you in with Christes Godhead when you talke of his suffering for sinne His soule you say was not figured by those sacrifices The suffering death in his soule was indeed no way figured by them but that the mediatour should haue an humane soule to bee separated from his body by death before hee could make purgation of our sinnes that was more then figured by those sacrifices For since not the blood of beasts but of man and euen of the Sonne of God made man was by Gods promise to be shed for our sinnes It is euident that from life to death he could not come but by seuering his soule from his body And consequently he must haue a soule being a man which must be powred out vnto death before he could die euen as the powers of life in bloody sacrifices were parted from their flesh before they could be offered as sacrifices vnto God But I charge you vntruely when I say you expound your whole and absolute Redemption to be of all the fruites and causes of our Redemption you haue no such word nor meaning as fruites Your words are our whole and absolute Redemption and those I say containe the whole course of our saluation euen vnto the last step which is our glorification as I haue formerly prooued by Christes owne speech Againe if the resurrection of Christ which is your owne instance bee a part of that propitiatorie sacrifice because it was a necessarie consequent then all the benefites that Christ obtained for vs or bestowed on vs must be comprised in that his oblation for sinne For they are all necessarie consequents and effects of our Redemption and depend on these two branches his death to free vs from sinne and his resurrection to raise vs into a new and heauenly life now for euer He was deliuered to death for our sinnes and rose againe for our iustification From these two heads the Scriptures deriue not onely forgiuenes of sinnes but newnesse of life on earth and happinesse of life in heauen Yet you did not call them fruits Effects you called them and what is a ioyfull effect such as was Christs resurrection but a fruit and that as well in Christ as in vs When the Prophet saith of Christ he shall see the trauaile of his soule and be satisfied what meaneth he but the fruits and effects of Christs labour when for his obedience to death God highly exalted him and gaue him a name aboue euery name that euery knee should bow vnto him what is this but a fruite and reward of his humiliation first in his owne person then proportionably in all that be his Many of the Iewes sacrifices yea most of them did represent and signifie Christs bodily sufferings onely yet not all Therefore you may well deny mine assumption as you did before and affirme that certaine Iewish Sacrifices set forth the sufferings euen of the soule of Christ and not of his body only Did I any where say that all the Iewish sacrifices were bloudy or that all of them did represent Christs death and blood shedding Could I be ignorant that the Iewes had oblations made onely by fier as of flower wine and incense and also offerings of the first fruits and other things dedicated or presented to the Lord for the vse of his tabernacle and Temple Doth not the Apostle say Euery high Priest is ordayned for men to offer GIFTES and SACRIFICES for sinne Where gifts shew that things without life were offered as well as liuing beasts and birds which were slaine As then there was no cause nor neede I should so I neuer vsed the word ALL in that case vnlesse I added liuing or BLOODY Sacrifices For they by their life lost and blood shed figured the death of Christ Iesus But this ALL is your adding to my wordes that you may take occasion to pike some quarrell at them But you may well deny my assumption that no sacrifices of the Iewes did figure the sufferings of Christs soule I assumed no such thing neither did I meddle with the sufferings of Christs soule vnlesse they were the death of the soule or the paines of hell which the Scripture calleth the second death and I the death of the damned because none besides the damned die that second death but you plainly giue me the slip and conuey your selfe from speaking of the death of the soule or of the death of the damned which are the things in Question to the sufferings of the soule in generall of which I make no Question And though your meaning be vnder the sufferings of the soule to comprise the tormenting of Christs soule by the immediate hand of God with the selfe same paines which the damned do feele in hell Yet such is your cariage that euery where you suppresse your maine intent and make a faire shew with the sufferings of Christs soule as if you ment no more but that Christs soule must needs haue some sufferings proper to it selfe which you confesse I sundry times teach and yet you make your Reader beleeue I euer impugne You shall doe well to awake out of this slumber and call to minde that there are no sufferings of Christs soule now in question but the DEATH of the SOVLE or of the DAMNED which you dare not openly auouch and therefore you plaster them ouer with smoother termes of the sufferings of the soule to hide your secret mysteries till you meete with itching eares that will listen more to fansies then to faith Another peece of skill you shew in this place to ease your selfe of all proofe and thinke it enough if
trample vpon the credits of such men with a proud presumption of the text before you did better examine it Is it so repugnant to the Scriptures as you pretend to say the wicked are a Redemption or propitiation for the godly which in Moses the Scape-goate is said to be for the people Salomon saith COPHER LAZADDIC RASHAA a Redemption for the iust shall the wicked be and the transgressour for the righteous Where not onely the same sense but the same word is found which Moses vseth when he saith the Scape-goate shall be presented aliue before the Lord LECAPPEâ⦠AALAV to make Redemption or reconciliation by him So God by Esay said I gaue Egypt CAPHRECA to be thy Redemption that is to be plagued for thee that thou mightest scape And so God often layeth the burden on the wicked that should fall on the righteous and excuseth the one by the punishment of the other as he did typically on the Scape-goate truely on Christ for all the sinnes of the people Wherefore it was no such ouersight in Cyrill Ambroses and Bââ¦de to resemble the Scape-goate to the wicked when they are punished to spaâ⦠the godly as you would make it their coniectures are farre more considerate then yours the Sauiour of the world was counted among the wicked and vsed in shew as the wicked are when he bare our sinnes in his body and tooke our burden on him That which Mââ¦nster reporteth out of all the Rabines and especially out of Rabi Salom Kimchi and Aben Ezra that the Scape-goate was sent to a strong hill in the desert and there torne in peeces before he could touch the middle of the hill I leaue to each mans liking because the Scripture noteth no such thing Howbeit Tertullian saith extra ciuitatem abijciebatur in perditionem the Scape-goate was cast out of the Citie into perdition And Iustine Martyr in his Dialogue with Triphon the Iew saith the Priests and Elders sent Christ away as the Scape-goate laying their hands on him and doing him to death The very like are your three reasons brought to shew that the Holocaust can not signifie the sufferings of whole Christ and therefore not of his soule any way Whether the Holocaust were a figure of Christes sacrifice or did represent the ioynt sufferings of the whole manhood of Christ neither of these is in question betwixt vs. You tooke vpon you to shew that the Iewes by their sacrifices were directed to beleeue the suffering of that which you call hell paines in the soule of Christ when he offered himselfe for our sinnes That was the point which I denied The shedding of Christes bloud vnto death the Apostle in the ninth and tenth Chapters to the Hebrewes doeth plainely deduce from those bloudie sacrifices of the Iewes other sufferings of Christ from their sacrifices he doth not deriue The Holocaust you replied was euery whit chopt in peeces and altogether put into the fire and burnt I answered this was done after the death of the sacrifice whose dead body was wholly consumed to ashes with one and the selfe same sire and therefore this could not be referred to the proper sufferings of Christs soule which could not suffer any thing after the death of the body much lesse be wholly consumed with any sufferings common to the body since the body of Christ it selfe neither was nor could be consumed with any corruption or affliction Besides that you your self in the leafe before made a plaine resolution that those Sacrifices of beasts could not prefigure the immortall and reasonable soule of Christ. How then could the dead bodies of those beasts cut in peeces and quite consumed with fire represent the inward and proper sufferings of the soule Is there any Similitude concurring in all points and circumstances with the thing signified If it did it were the trueth it selfe and not a figure thereof And therefore all your illations that the Scape-goate which in some things disagreed from the Deitie and body of Christ could signifie neither were vaine and idle It sufficeth in figures warranted by the word of God that one principall action or circumstance bee common to both in how many things so euer they bee otherwise different But where is your warrant in the Scriptures that the burning of sacrifices when they were dead signified the sufferings of Christes soule Shew that and then wee will soone dispence with the rest of your rules and my reasons also Figures expressed in the word of God had no doubt their similitude to the trueth though we perhaps see it not and if any one point of resemblance be ratified by Gods authoritie that may and must content vs. But will you of your owne head make figures to fit your fansies and then claime the same prerogatiue which God himselfe hath What if many figures in the Law had as great disparagement as you call it To the things signified as the burning of the Holocaust to the sufferings of Christes soule Is that a president for you to deuise and establish what figures please you and thence to raise platformes for strange and newe doctrine The bodies of beastes first slââ¦ine were after caried out of the host Now these signified Christs going out of Ierusalem to be slaine but being yet aliue The burning of the beasts after they were dead was a sacrifice of a sweete sauour vnto God which in trueth is Christs very death and nothing done by him afterward whereby Gods anger is fully pacified toward vs. In figuratiue and bloudie sacrifices could you distinguish the suffering which was proper to the liuing creature that was offered from the offering which was peculiar to the Priest and from the accepting which belonged onely vnto God you would not thus iumble them together both in the figures signifying and in the thing signified That the bloud of the carnall sacrifices slaine vnder the Lawe did foreshew the bloudshedding and death of Christ Iesus for the sinnes of the world the Apostle to the Hebrewes is very plaine not onely calling him amongst other things ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã The shadow of good things to come and ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã a similitude for the time present but also making diuers comparisons betwixt them and the bloud of Christ and proouing by the first testament that the second must be ratified with bloud and death By which as by figures were sufficiently testified the ioynt sufferings of the whole manhood of Christ euen vnto death For the powers of ââ¦ife and sense in those creatures that had their bloud shed vntodeath naturally feeling and shewing in their kinde the paines and terrour of death were fiââ¦test to witnesse to all the beholders that the violent and bloudie death of the Messias which hee would vndertake for the ransome of their sinnes should bee grieuous and painefull euen to his soule And that being made so manifest to all mens eyes by the death
dull conceite or eger stomacke rather betrayed by your foolish rolling to so many what ifs then my reason any way refuted I alter you will say the order of it Though I spake then more shortly then now I doe because I had no leasure to stand so long thereon yet he that will Reade but the third part of that Section whence you take this shall finde the very same parts and words that now I vse there contained and expressed But I afterward defend the proposition with the condition annexed to bee simplie true When I saw your humour was so franticke that not vnderstanding my words you would presently pronounce them in the view of the whole Realme to be a notorious Paradoxe and impietie I bid you take your vttermost aduantage of my words and as they stoode though that were not my first intent they were sound and good and your impugning them was prophane and false I yet auouch the same For where the Scriptures teach no Redemption but by the death and bloud of Christ your other deuââ¦sed Redemptions by the death of the soule and paines of Hell I account no better then false and prophane And therefore if our soules be not that way redeemed which the Scriptures reueile which is by the death and bloud of Christ they are not redeemed at all And being not at all redeemed I would faine know by the best of your skill what benefit of Redemption our bodies shall or can haue more then the bodies of Infidels Yea set that redemption aside which the Scriptures attribute to the death and bloud of Christ and neither bodie nor soule can be saued but infidelity and the wages therof I meane damnation both of soule and bodie preuaile in all men So that you were not well in your wits when with such an heat and huffe you cried out What a Pradoxe is it yea what impietie But I must chuse whether I will speake this sophistically or absurdly you say Is it any sophistrie or absurditie to speake as the Spirit of God speaketh in the Scriptures Your MEERE bloud of Christ is indeed absurd Sophistrie for you imagine by that word that Christ shed his bloud for our sinnes without any meritorious action or passion of the soule concurring which in the Redeemer of the world was so impossible as nothing more If I speake otherwise than the Scriptures speake take your pleasure at it so you bring reason for it but whe I keepe my selfe within the compasse of their speech your aââ¦ouching that I speake Sophisticallie or absurdlie reprocheth the Scriptures whom I follow In either of those points which you impugne as that our soules are redeemed by the bloud of Christ and that our bodies haue not redemption in this life I haue the Scriptures plainly precedent before me and therefore except they speake sophistically or absurdly I in retaining their speech and sense can do neither The difference betwixt the deaths of the faithfull and infidels is a thing well known to me and approoued by me yet must the Apostles words stand true that in this life we haue not the Redemption of our bodies but we must waite for it till the time that all things be restored That Christ hath already purchased and obtained it for vs by his death and passion I make no doubt as also that we rest in hope assured of it but hope which is seene is not hope and though the soules of the Saints retaine a firme faith and full expectance of Gods promise for the raising and Redeeming of their bodies from corruption and in the meane time discerne and feele as well the comfort that is in the death of Gods elect as the great blessings and benefites that follow their death yet their bodies lying in dust haue no shew nor sense thereof much lesse haue they that which Paul calleth the Redemption of the body From which words Saint Austen collecteth very truely Si Redemptio corporis nostri secundum Apostolum expectatur profecto quod expectatur adhuc speratur nondum tenetur If the Redemption of our body by the Apostles doctrine must be wayted for that which is expected is still hoped for but not yet obtained Take then the Redemption of the body for the incorruption of the same as Paul doth whom in that point I followed and tell me what benefite of incorruption which is the word you so much storme at the bodies of the faithfull haue more then the bodies of infidels You range aside as your manner is to the ceasing of sinne in the godly and their resting from labours as also the entrance of their soules into heauen as if the bodies of the wicked did sinne in their graues or were tossed with troubles when they were dead and rotten or in the Saints your sight did not serue you to distinguish their soules from their bodies For when I say as Paul sayth their bodies haue not yet redemption you replie their soules after death haue an entrance into heauen Euen so when I say that the death of the bodie to the saints is a part of that wrath curse and punishment which God inflicted on all mankinde for their sinne in Adam as shall after God willing more largely appeare you oppose the benefits which God of his peculiar goodnesse towards his children hath reserued for them after they haue obediently and patiently submitted themselues to his diuine pleasure in bringing their bodies to corruption for the sinne that dwelleth in them And thus by your mangling of matters you confound in the godlie their soules with their bodies and in God himselfe his iustice against sinne with his mercy towards his owne You might haue learned of S. Austen rightly to seuer them as he doth though you crosse him in this as in most of the things that are in question betwixt vs. Quamuis bonis conferatur per mortem plurimum boni vnde nonnulli etiam de bono mortis congruenter disputaverunt tamen hinc quae praedicanda est nisi misericordia Dei quòd in bonos vsus conuertitur poena peccati Though much good come to the godlie by death whereupon some haue accordingly written of the benefits of death yet what els in this must we acknowledge but the mercie of God that the punishment of sinne is turned to good vses And so that ancient writer of the booke Hypognosticôn amongst S. Austens works Vt moriantur homines poena peccati est vt reuertantur ad vitam Domini miserantis est That men die is the punishment of their sinne that they returne to life againe is the Lords mercie Before you depart from this point that not the bloud of Christ nor his flesh without respect to the merit of his whole soule was the full price of redemption you will shew how sundrie of the ancient Fathers doe agree with you sufficiently in this matter though afterwards in my booke I seeme to bring them against you If
of the sword mans state and life on earth can not be maintained And therefore the politicke and penall lawes of Princes bee not derogatorie to Christes death nor iniuries to Christian men as the Libertines would haue them not because men haue more right to punish then God hath or their interest to punish could continue when Gods doth cease but for that it is expedient and needfull for vs so to bee gouerned in outward and earthly things till the time come when Christ will put downe all rule and all authoritie and power that God may be all in all Now if Christs death repeale not mans lawes how much lesse Gods irreuocable iudgements fastned to our nature and not hindering our saluation but renuing the memoriall of our sinne lest we should forget it or neglect it and teaching vs by tollerable and temporall paines what intollerable torments wee haue escaped by Gods mercies towards vs Wherefore Christ by his obedience vnto death hath shewed vs an example what to follow and thereby rather confirmed then reuersed his Fathers sentence for the time till he come to wipe all teares from our eyes and to restore vs to the glorious libertie of the sonnes of God which he hath presently purchased for vs though he will not presently execute it Lastly the death of Christ doeth not belong nor any benefite thereof but to such as repent and beleeue After his death Christ commanded repentance and remission of sinnes to be preached in his name among all nations and with all denounced He which will not beleeue shall be damned So that neither the incredulous nor the impenitent haue any part or pardon in Christes death and sufferings If then all the children of God would fully repent and perfectly beleeue surely all which they should suffer in this life I still except the naturall and as yet vnchangeable corruption of body and soule which abideth in them from their birth were onely trials of the graces and signes of their blessednesse Blessed are they saith our Sauiour that suffer persecution for righteousnesse sake for theirs is the kingdome of heauen When you doe well and suffer taking it patiently this saith Peter is acceptable vnto God But what praise is it if when yee be buffeted for your faults you take it patiently Now how many thousands are there in Christs flocke which defect in faith and specially in true repentance Yea how rare are they that repent when and as they ought Then hath Gods iustice cause enough and enough to punish all that either shrinke in faith neglect his will or slacke repentance notwithstanding the generall freedome obtained and proclaimed by the death of Christ and out of this number very few Christians are exempted Wherefore to make men beleeue that God hath no iustice or regardeth not his iustice to punish them in this life after hee hath once engraffed them into Christ because Christ hath suffered all the punishment of their sinnes for them is but to deceiue them God is most faithfull in his promises if we could take assured hold of them but if wee fall from them by diffidence or disobedience God wanteth no iustice to aggrauate his hand according to our deserts though in mercie he spare vs euen when he striketh vs and intendeth our conuersion and not our destruction how sharpe soeuer his plagues be which would be farre sharper if his loue towardes vs in Christ Iesu did not ouer-rule his iust displeasure against our sinnes The case with Christ was cleane otherwise He needed no amendment but that which he suffered was right punishment Right and proper if you may be moderator shall be what please you What is RIGHT AND TRVE PVNISHMENT you neuer define but pretending sinceritie when you come to the issue you enclose your conceites with verie proper right and such like phrases and so take your leaue But declare if you can or will vouchsafe to make others partakers of your mysteries what is proper and right verie and true punishment You must define punishment either by the paine which is suffered or by the purpose of the punisher that is by the cause for which it is inflicted You stand not in this place on the paine imposed but rather on the purpose of the punisher or cause of the punishment For if you measure punishment by the same paines then tell vs why the miseries of this life as penurie sicknesse and death be punishments in the wicked and not in the godly since they be the same in both setting aside the purpose of the punisher which is different in both They are you say for correction and amendment in the godly not for destruction and vengeance as they are in the wicked Then the purpose of the punisher by your intention maketh the paine to be punishment which being referred to another end as in other patients is no punishment though it be the selfe same paine in both And thence you draw your conclusion that since the sufferings of Christ could not be for correction and amendment in him therefore his afflictions euery one SMALL AND GREAT were true and proper punishments and the effects of Gods very wrath for sinne lying vpon him Otherwise the bodily afflictions which Christ suffered were the selfe same which the godly often suffer and yet you auouch them in the faithfull to be no punishments because they serue for correction and amendment in them which hauing no place in Christ you conclude his sufferings great and small to be true right and proper punishments But Sir how prooue you this diuision that all the punishments you call them paines which God inflicteth in this life are either for correction or for vengeance properly so called there is neither sufficiencie nor pietie in this partition of yours thus applied to Christ. For in the wicked Gods purpose is onely to reuenge sinne and therefore in the end God allotteth them the iust and full punishment of sinne which is euerlasting damnation And in the meane season during the time of his patience he mitigateth his hand in respect of that which shall follow but giueth them no inward grace to repent whereby they are in all their afflictions hardned and ripened for sorer vengeance as still repining and murmuring at the hand of God but neuer misliking or leauing their sinnes In the elect when they are disobedient and impenitent God persueth their sinnes with corporall and temporall plagues that they may returne and flie vnto him for mercie to which ende he giueth them grace in the midst of their miseries to acknowledge their offences and by faith to take hold of his promises made to them in Christ Iesus and so vpon their submission and conuersion he receiueth them to fauour whose persons he alwayes loued in his onely Sonne though he hated and scourged their vncleannesse In Christ Iesus the case was cleane different from the one and the other You confesse there was nothing in him to be corrected
conceale it and onely skirre at it here and there in SOME KIND OF SENSE Otherwise you offer nothing as yet to the Reader but the proper sufferings of the soule which I trust are not alwaies priuation of grace and exclusion from blisse For so the faithfull should neuer haue any proper sufferings of the Soule or else vtterly loose both the spirit and fauour of God which they neuer doe The other Authoritie which I cite In the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt die the death is not so sound you thinke For am I sure that death here is but the bodyly death onely and no more I no where say that death threatned in these words was onely the death of the body it is one of your rash and rude illations it is none of my assertions I knew that God gaue this Commandement and threatned this punishment as well to Adams posteritie as to his person Otherwise had this prohibition beene made to Adam alone neither could the woman haue beene within the compasse of it who was not then created when this precept was inioyned neither could Adams of-spring haue tasted of death as well as Adam if this penaltie had stretched no farder then to Adams person But he being the roote and stocke of all mankind as he receaued blessings by his creation which should be common to all that descended of him so by his transgression he lost them as well from his Issue as from himselfe and subiected them to the same death and condemnation that he did him selfe when he rebelled against God his Creator Death we see executed on all the children of Adam and therefore we may not doubt but death was threatned to them all before it was inflicted on them Howbeit the commination in this place is like to Gods thââ¦eats in all other places against the transgââ¦ssours of his Law It denounceth what shall ââ¦e due vnto all but it bindeth not God that he shall not haue power to release or mitigate what and to whom pleaseth him In death then here threatned I containe all kinds of death corporall spirituall and eternall either as expressed in the generall name of death which is common to them all or as consequent ech to other and coherent if by Gods goodnes and mercies in Christ Iesus they be not seuered Saint Austen learnedly and truely teacheth the same When it is asked what death God threatned to the first men if they transgressed the Commandement giuen them whether the death of the body or of the soule or of the whole man or that which is called the second death we must answere ALI When therefore God said to the first man what day soeuer yee eate thereof yee shall die the death that threatning contained what soeuer death there is euen vnto the last which is called the second death and after which there is none other If any man stand more strictly on the time and kinde of death when and which Adam should die by this Commination Saint Austen hath an other answere In that which was said yee shall die the death because it was not said deaths if we vnderstand that onely death whereby the soule is forsaken of her life which to her is God for she was not forsaken that she might forsake but she did first forsake that she might after be forsaken though I say we vnderstand that God denounceth this death when he said what day yee eate thereof yee shall die the death as if God had said what day yee forsake me by disobedience I will forsake you by iustice Surely in that death were the rest denounced which without Question were to follow For euen in that a disobedient motion rose in the flesh of the Soule disobeying for which they couered their priuie parts one death was perceaued wherein God forsooke the Soule And when the Soule forsooke the body now corrupted with time and wasted with age an other death was found by experience which God mentioned to Man when punishing sinne he said earth thou art and to earth shalt thou returne that by these two deaths that first death of the whole man might be accomplished which the second death at last doth follow except man be deliuered by the grace of God By Saint Austens iudgement concording with the Scriptures God threatned all kinds of death to the transgressor the death of the Soule the same houre to take place that he disobeyed the rest to follow in their order as next the death of the body and at last eternall death of body and soule if the grace of God by Iesus Christ did not release and free man from it That the death of the Soule tooke present hold vpon the disobeyers the Scripture giueth testimony sufficient when it noteth their shame feare and flight of Gods presence who before sinne was their delight ioy and blisse The death of the body was a long time differred in Adam euen nine hundred and thirtie yeeres before it did separate his Soule from his Body but it began presently to worke and shew his force in either of their bodies The sentence of mortalitie God called Death saith Theodoret. For after Gods sentence Adam euerie day expected or feared Death Beda saith the like That which God said In what day soeuer thou shalt eate thereof thou shalt die the Death was as if he had said Morti deputatus eris thou shalt be deputed or adiudged to death not that he should that very day die but be mortall Chrysostom imbraceth the same opinion In what dââ¦y soeuer yee shall eate of the tree yee shall die the Death But Adam liued still how then died he By the sentence of God and the nature of the thing it selfe For he that maketh him selfe subiect to punishment is vnder punââ¦shment sinonre tamen sententia If not by deede and execution yet by guiltinesse and sentence pronounced So that if we will rightly conceiue Gods commination to Adam we must so take the words of God as threatning Adam and his posteritie with all kinds of death to which they all should bee subiect as guiltie thereof and deseruing the same though hee would keepe to himselfe the dispencing and moderating thereof not binding himselââ¦e thereby but the offenders as euery supreame Iudge doth on earth after sentence giuen and before execution finished Else if wee ââ¦e God who is trueth it selfe to the rigour and tenor of those words without reseruing power to him to dispose of Adam and Adams of-spring at his pleasure and in the words Thou shalt die the death comprise the execution of all sorts of death which can not be reuoked then we conclude Adam and all his issue without remedie or mercie vnder all sorts of death that is vnder spirituall corporall and eternal death which is not onely an vtter ouerthrow to all Christian ââ¦eligion promising saluation in Iesus Christ but a mecre madnesse against all mankind deuoting them without exception or mitigation to eternall
of Christ on the Crosse. Now the relatiue following QVOD enim must either be referred to all that went before and so not to malediction apart from the rest or to that which went next before which is the chasticement of our peace And so either way you were ouer bold with your Author to referre his words whether pleased you And farder answere to Ierom there needed none For to no proofe needed no answere And yet what better answere could you haue then for Ieroms meaning since his words are not generall to haue Ieroms conclusion in that very place brought you which best serueth to shew Ieroms intent Of Christs hanging on the Crosse Ierom speaketh noting that to be a cursed kinde of death out of the Apostle which I am farre from denying So doth he of digging Christs hands and feete out of the Psalme and of the rest of Christs wounds and stripes by which we were healed out of the Prophet whom hee expoundeth All which Christ suffered for vs being in deed due to vs for our sinnes Leaue out your falsifying of Ieroms words and sense that whatsoeuer curse was due to vs for our sinnes Christ suffered for vs and I see no cause why Ieroms words should neede any answere That this place of Esaie and the whole Doctrine which I auouch touching these fufferings of Christ may be the better receaued let vs note that the publike Doctrine appointed by Authoritie to be taught throughout England expresseth the same Namely Nowels Catechisme Since the Scriptures which plentifully and plainly teach vs the true price and meanes of our saluation giue no warrant of your new found Doctrine and the whole Armie of Auncient and learned Fathers who could ill instruct the people committed to their charge if they themselues were ignorant of the true meaning of their Creed and Catechisme neuer heard nor thought of your late deuised Redemption by Christs suffering the very paines of hell and the same which the damned doe suffer without any dispensation or Qualification for so it liketh you to speake if you could produce moe new writers of your mind then you doe or can they must pardon me for not admitting any Doctrine touching our Redemption but what I see grounded on the plaine euidence of the Sacred Scriptures and so receaued in the Church of Christ before our Age. I list not to deuise or approue a new Saluation vnknowen till our time and if any man be otherwise minded he shall goe alone for me God grant me to be a member of that Church which hath reuerently receaued and faithfully beleeued the simplicitie of the Scriptures touching our Redemption by the death and bloud of Christ Iesus Howbeit I see many men speake diuersly that meane nothing lesse then your late found hell inflicted by the immediat hand of God on the Soule of Christ. Where then you dreampt in your Treatise as you still doe in your Defence that whosoeuer named the wrath of God in Christs sufferings or called his Crosse a cursed kinde of death was wholy of your side I did in few lines reprooue that folly of yours and since you quoted no speciall words neither out of Master Nowels Catechisme nor out of the Bible appointed publikely to be read in the Churches of this Realme nor out of the Booke of Homilies that were worth the standing on there was no cause why I should wast time to hunt after your meaning If you would haue an answere it was meete you made your Arguments and pressed your Authorities as well as you could and then you should soone see what I said vnto them But as I then foretold so you now performe Your buzzing head no where findeth the wrath of God or horror of Iudgement against our sinne to be apprehended by Christ but you straightway conclude all your conceits from the first to the last These words when I reade them in any man offend not me as they helpe not you except you wrest them after your manner to hide vnder them your new found hell and the rest of your presumptuous and irreligious humours Begin with the Catechisme and see what choise you haue made thence There it is thus taught He payd and suffered the paine due to vs and by this meanes deliuerd vs from the same With Christ as our suretie God dealt as it were with extremitie of law Christ therefore suffered and in suffering ouercame death the paine appointed by the euerliuing God for mans offence What of all this What one worde is here sounding towards the death of the soule or the death of the damned after this life The Catechisme in the very same sentence expressely speaketh of the painefull and reprochfull death which the Iewes inflicted on Christ the manner whereof is orderly described in the next answere before These things sayth the Catechisme the Iewes did vnto him cruelly maliciously and wickedly but Christ willingly of his owne accord suffered ALL THOSE THINGS from the Iewes to appease with this most sweete sacrifice his father offended with mankinde vtque paenas nobis debitas dependeret persolueret atque nos ex illis hoc modo eximeret and to pay and satisfie the punishments due to vs thereby to exempt vs from them Cum Christo quasi sponsore pro nobis sic passo Deus summo quasiiure egit God dealt after a sort seuerely with Christ as with a surety suffering thus for vs but to vs whose sinnes deserued punishments and due paines transtulit in Christum hee transferred on Christ God shewed singular mercie and clemencie All this is plainely referred to the punishments and paines which Christ suffered at the hands of the Iewes by the secret counsell and appointment of God that thereby he might pacifie the wrath of his Father and deliuer vs from the shame paine and death due to our sinnes which God transferred and remoued from vs to Christ that he might suffer them and we be freed both here and hereafter for them Wherein great fauour and mercie were shewed to vs and Christ as it were a Suretie subiected for vs after a sort to the rigour of the Lawe What hurt is there in these wordes if you leaue haling and pulling them from their right sense The Authour of the Catechisme warily forbeareth the generall which you seeke after so greedily and when hee commeth to the places that might seeme harsh he qualifieth them with quasi as it were not meaning to presse those phrases as you doe to the vttermost Wherefore he saith that Christ was quasi sponsor a kinde of suretie suffering for vs and that God dealt with him Quasi summo iure as it were with riger in respect of the lenitie shewed to vs. Which speeches if you poyson them not with your bitter conceits I mislike not so long as they be stretched no further then to SIC passo pro nobis Christ THVS suffering for vs at the hands of the Iewes to which the writer of the Catechisme wisely
the bodies euen of the elect and therefore might iustly be so called in vs and much more in Christ though the force of that curse were quenched in Christ and the coherence thereof interrupted In floting to and fro you fell to the curse of the Law and the curse of God and there as your fashion is you auouched what you listed without any proofe or witnesse besides your selfe telling vs that Paul mentioned Christs hanging on the tree as a part of the curse of the Law thereby impolying the whole to be executed on Christ. The whole curse of the Law in my conclusion I shewed to be externall corporall internall and eternall plagues and punishments and asked you which of these you affirmed of Christ. Externall and corporall curses in Christ I did grant internall and eternall curses of the Law which are want of grace and losse of blisse with perpetuall damnation of bodie and soule I said could not be ascribed to Christ without enormous and haynous blasphemie To this when you should answere you turne with a trice to your world of wordes and say your question was Whether death to the godly were a curse properly or no. But sir remember the reason was yours which if you doe not fully prooââ¦e you must wholly loose You should therefore first define what a proper curse is and then applie the parts thereof as well to Christ as to the godly and in so doing we should soone haue seene both the sense and trueth of your speach Now you hold fast to the ambiguitie and vncertainetie of the word proper as though it were enough for you to deliuer Oracles with the breath of your mouth you say the worde and then the field is wonne Our question is not what death is in it selfe but what death is to the godly You are so wedded to your owne wordes that you vnderstand no man els and scant your selfe When I reason what the death of the godly is in it selfe I speake not of the death which they do no not suffer that is not their death at all which they no way feele but since they die the death of the bodie that death which they suffer is to them one thing in his owne force which they taste and endure and the consequents after death by Gods mercie prouided for his seruants are most euidently other things and he that cannot distinguish this is no way worthy to beare the name of a Diuine For the ioyes of Gods heauenly kingdome are after death prepared for the godly Shall we therefore say the ioyes of heauen are death Besides the smart and anguish which afflicteth the soule when she is driuen from her bodie death in it selfe is the separation of the soule from the bodie with priuation of sense and life in the bodie and resolution of the same into dust The ioyning of the soule with the bodie was a most wonderfull worke of God in his creation and consequently verie good by the plaine words of Moses Then is the dissolution of the soule from the bodie repugnant to that which is verie good and of force euill as being contrarie to good The making of mans bodie from the dust of the ground was likewise verie good by the same witnesse of Moses Then the returning of the bodie to dust againe must be an euill vnto man destroying that excellent worke of God And if sense motion and action be blessings of God on mans bodie then the bereauing of these must needs be curses in their kinde Yea since life was no small fauour of God bestowed on man when he made him a liuing soule as all the rest in their degrees was verie good then death which is the priuation of life is the taking of Gods good blessing from mans bodie which cannot chuse but be a curse It is recompensed you will say with a better blessing euen with the blisse of heauen The soule is but not the bodie so long as death preuaileth on it And this blessing consquent is no way pertinent to the nature of death no not as the godly do suffer it but it is a fruit of Gods fauour reserued for the faithfull in Christ Iesus who remoueth death from their soules and will doe the like from their bodies when the time commeth Without death you thinke we can not come to Gods presence And why is that but because the corruption of sinne dwelleth in our bodies which is not meet for the kingdome of God Corruption cannot inherit incorruption And whence came this corruption but from sinne and consequently the displeasure of God against sinne both brought corruption to our bodies and for corruption keepeth our bodies vnder death excluded for the time from his heauenly kingdome Yet this is no proper curse to the bodies of the Saints Had you but once declared what you meant by proper and true curses sixe lines had long since leuelled this question but you according to the heigth of your skill that neuer troubled your selfe but with a few fond conceits and some vnsetled sentences trace to and fro sometimes with no curse in any sort sometimes with no true curse and sometimes with no curse properly and will not be drawen to steppe one foot farther And though I haue no cause to how your timber that you leaue ragged yet for their sakes that would see the trueth I am content to square your worke Of Gods curse I must say as I did of Gods wrath for the wrath and curse of God are all one in effect it noteth either Gods detestation of sinne or his commination to sinne or which is most to this case Gods indignation or pnnishment prouided for sinne or executed on sinners For as man is sayd to blesse with his minde mouth or hand when he meaneth prayeth or doth good to any so is he sayd to curse by thought word or deed when he desireth vttereth or worketh euill to any God is likewise sayd to curse in soule when he detesteth and hateth euill in voice when he pronounceth or threatneth euill in iudgement when he decreeth or inflicteth euill To shew how execrable sinne is to God the Scripture sayth these things God HATETH and his soule ABHORRETH them And so the way of the wicked is ABOMINABLE to the Lord. The threats of God against sinne and his plagues vpon sinne are euery where extant in the Law and chiefiy in the 27. and 28. of Deuteronomie where not onely the greatest sinnes are namely and all sinnes in the close generally accursed but the manifolde plagues of this life persuing the states the bodies and soules of sinners are numbred Maledictum est omne peccatum siue ipsum quodsit vt sequatur supplicium siue ipsum supplicium quod alââ¦o modo vocatur peccatum quia sit ex peccato Accursed is all sinne sayth Austen as well the deed which prouoketh punishment as the punishment it selfe which in another sense is called sinne because it commeth from sinne
considerate Readers howsoeuer it may content you for the time But let vs heare the rest I answere it is not true which you say That Gods Law alloweth no Suertiââ¦s Vnderstanding here by Gods reuealed will and his most holy and gracious ordinance for vs. Though indeede this is not his Law properly but his Gospell You lacke here English as well as trueth except it be the Printers fault and not yours Vnderstanding here in your words hath nothing to follow it I thinke you would say Vnderstanding hâ⦠by Gods Law Gods reuealed will c. I neuer made doubt whether the Gospell proposed the wonderfull loue mercie good will and fauour of God the Sonne towards vs in offering himselfe to make the purgation of our sinnes in his owne person and likewise the wisedome power iustice clemencie grace and goodnesse of the whole Trinitie in accepting that offer for our saluation but such I said was the infinite dignitie of the person being true God that he could by no Law be bound but onely ledde by his owne good will and pleasure as a voluntary and free Sauiour Which libertie the iustice of God so farre tendred and preserued in the humane nature of Christ that he could not in rigour exact death as a debt from a Suertie but receiue it as a voluntarie sacrifice from a willing and free Redeemer for which cause neither the desert of our punishment nor the filth of our sinnââ¦s nor the trueth of our curse could cleaue vnto him but his death was innocent and altogether vndeserued though he died iustly to God as well in ââ¦espect of vs for whom he suffered who deserued farre worse as in regard of his owne will and offer who refused not the smart of death thereby to breake thâ⦠chaines of death and to deliuer vs from the power of darkenesse For the name of the law in generall how farre that word might be stretched I did not question since you spake directly of that law which accurseth and punisheth sinne as the Apostle doth alleaging in plaine words both the curse and punishment of Moses law Otherwise I knew the Apostles words in this verie Epistle Beare yee one anothers burden and so fulfill the law of Christ which is in libertie and loue to serue one an other as Christ did vs. No similitude you say can proue Christ in taking our person on him to be sinfull defiled hatefull and accursed I denie this saying vtterly I like your wit well that when you should go to proue your affirmatiues you fall to denie my negatiues This is a short way to shunne all paines and proofs for you to say what you list and when you denie the contrarie the matter is fully proued But Sir you forget that my assertion hath in it the plaine words of the Holy Ghost and the maine grounds of Christian religion that Christ as well in his nature and actions as in his sufferings and sacrifice was holie harmelesse seuered from sinners and vndefiled This you vtterly denie If you make no more bones in denying the words of God your Reader will as easily denie you to be a Christian whatsoeuer I do In his owne nature and in respect meerly thereof he suffered both at the Iewes hands and before God the iust for the vniust A faire gloze and full against the text When Christ died was it for himselfe or for vs that hee suffered He suffered not in any respect of or for himselfe no not before God and yet he suffered the iust for the vniust sayth Peter Which words Peter could not speake in respect of the Iewes who killed Christ for they tooke Christ to be most vniust and they had no meaning nor power to put him to death for the redemption of the world but Peter speaketh this of Christ who knowing himselfe to be iust and innocent in the sight of God was yet patient and willing when he suffered for the vniust By this example Peter often exhorteth the godly to follow Christes steppes and to suffer wrong patiently when they do well For that is more acceptable to God then when they are buffeted for their faults because they are blessed that suffer for righteousnesse sake as Christ did You turne the text cleane contrarie and would haue men beleeue that Christ was not only sinfull accursed and defiled with our sinnes but the greatest sinner and most vniust person that euer suffered as guiltie before God of all their sinnes for whom he died Yet this is not inherently but by imputation the Lord translating by his ordinance the sinne of men vpon him Afore we enter to speake farther of the filthinesse or guiltinesse of sinne inherent or imputed and the malediction on either I thinke it fit for the Reader to know what is conteined in those termes lest the Defender carie his conceits in a cloud as his meaning and maner is to do In sinne besides the auerting of the will from God by defection and hardning of the heart against God by rebellion the loue and affections of the soule which should be inflamed with sinceritie and puritie of Gods holinesse and goodnesse are wholly deiected and egerly fastened vpon base vile vaine and vncleane things and thereby the soule growing like to that which it loueth for loue causeth a societie and similitude with the things loued bââ¦ommeth base vile and vncleane in all her delights desires parts and powers Which impurenesse and pollution of the inward man when God beholdeth he reiecteth hateth and detesteth as well this corruption inherent in the soule as the deeds and acts of sinne past with vs but present still with him and accusing vs in his sight by the witnesse of our owne conscience which we can not auoid This when God setteth before the eyes of the wicked letting them see what they haue refused and what they haue embraced and how deformed and defiled they are in comparison of his beautie and sanctitie as also what they haue done against the light and leading of their owne conscience they fall ashamed of their vncleannesse and confounded with their guiltinesse finding the iust vengeance of God to hang ouer their heads with a desperate and most dreadfull expectation thereof These things are not doubted by any good Diuines and therefore it shall suffice shortly to touch some places teaching no lesse then I haue sayd To the vncleane and vnbeleeuing sayth Paul nothing is clâ⦠but euen their mindes and consciences are defiled Of euill thoughts and deeds proceeding from the heart our Sauiour-generally pronounceth These are the things which defile a man S. Peter sayth of the wicked They are led with sensualitie as bruit beasts perishing in their corruption and are not onely spots and staines but after they had escaped from the filthinesse of the world turne againe as swine to wallowing in the mire This is the vncleannesse of sinne as well inherited from Adam as
that iudgeth Iustly But if it be Ambitiâ⦠to let the Reader see that I follow the steps of so learned and approoued Teachers what is it for you being I trust no more then a Man to deuise a new Saluation a new Redemption which neither Scriptures nor Fathers either professed or published howbeit if these three Fathers whom you name and meane to cite make any way for your nââ¦w found fansies they shall content me also so you doe not peece out their Texts with your vntruths for then you alleage not them but your selfe vnder their shadowes The first who is Cyprian saith Christ sustained and suffered him selfe to bee called sinne and a curse by Moses and the Apostle because he had the like punishment as we should haue had bââ¦t not the like fault Cyprians words we haue already once heard and once answered there the Reader shal find them more at large they make nothing for you but rather against you For first it is euident by Cyprians sentence that Christ was callââ¦d sinne and a curse by Moses and the Apostle not for any guilt or fault deriued from vs but onely by reason of the likenesse of punishment with those that were sinners and accursed Then was not Christ defiled or sinfull by sustaining our person oâ⦠cause for so much as he had no likenesse nor communion with our sinne but only with our punishment Now the punishment which Christ suffered could not defile him but rather commend his obedience patience and charitie towards God and man But he had the like punishment as we should haue had Likenesse as well consisteth in the part as in the whole and if it were but like then was it not the same except you haue forgotten as well the rules of reason as of trueth Nullum simile est idââ¦m Nothing is like to it selfe If then it were like it was not the same What get yoâ⦠now by Cyprians words or what doe I loose by them Your slight answere that it was like in part not in all saluââ¦th not the matter It pleaseth not your affection but it fully remooueth your obiection and the trueth of it is most manifest For if Christs punishment were in all points like as we should haue had for our sinnes you know well enough by this tââ¦e how lewd and false that Assertion is which you would sow vnto Cyprian And therefore as likenes in part iâ⦠suââ¦cient to verifie Cyprians words so doth it iustifie his speech to be sober and sound which you would haue to be ââ¦ous and impious Cyprian meaneth Christs punishment was so like ours as waâ⦠possible We talke of Cyprians words which are extant not of his meaning which you know not and would faââ¦ne force to be like to yours This is a poore reply when you can say nothing out of Cyprians words against mine exposition of them for which I yeeld so iust ground to flie to your owne imagination of Cyprians meaning which yet is false and foolish For it was possible if we respect nothing but possibilitie omitting Gods Counsell and Decree for Christ to haue suffered longer time and other sorts of bodily paines as fire fleaing and such like at the Iewes hands so that your possibilitie was no part of Cyprians meaning but a waterish deuice of your own to frame Cyprians words to your fansie Alâ⦠by this your weââ¦ke answere you are contrary to your selfe in that you acknowlââ¦dge God vsed Christ as he doth sinners Well you may deuoutly dreame of Contrarieties but your eyes dasle too much to see them truely Doth euery Aduerbe of Similitude with you make a full and perfect Resemblance in all points I send yoâ⦠saith Christ as sheepe among Wââ¦lues Will you put hornes and haire vpon Christs Disciples to make them as sheepe The Sunne saith Dauid commeth foorth as a Bridââ¦groome out of his Chamber and reioyceth as a mighââ¦e Man to runne his Course Will you build a Chamber for the Sunne and allow him two feete and ten toes that he may leape and runne his race like a man As new borne babes saith Peter dââ¦ire thâ⦠sincere mââ¦ke of the word Will you bring men backe to their Cradles swadling cloââ¦ts and the teats of their Mothers that you may verifie this similââ¦tude in them There can nothing be more senselesse absurd and false then to require euery Similitude or Comparison to be full and perââ¦ct in all points Throughout the Scriptures any one thing that is common to many or any resemblance of that which an other hath ââ¦rueth to frame thence a Comparison or similitude So that any one punââ¦shment inflicted on Christ which Gods Law threatneth to sinners was suffââ¦cient to make good my words thââ¦t God vsed Christ as he doth sinners How then doe you conclude from my speech that Christ was vsed in all things as sinners are both here and in hell or that God laid on him punishment so lââ¦ke to that which we should haue had as was possible Tââ¦e it is though not by any force of my words alleaged by you that God by his secrââ¦te oââ¦dinance lââ¦id on his Sonne not onely the common Infirmities of mans Nature and miseries of mans life but also shame reproch paine and death which are by his Law reseââ¦ued and threatned to sinners but touching the death of the Soule or true paines of hell which all this while you fish for you finde nothing in my words nor in any of these Fathers whose names you abuse Athanasius saith Ipseper se sententiam soluit sââ¦b specie condemnati He himselfe satisfied and ãâã the sentence of the Law vnder the appearance of a DAMNââ¦D MAN Did not God then vse him as he doth sinners in all extremitie of punishment so far as was possible You doe wisely not to be ãâã in producing multitudes of Men. as you call them for you doe but shame your selfe and sincke your cause when you coââ¦e to shew the grounds of your Doctrine by the testââ¦monies of ancient Fathers As they say nothing for you so you vnderstand nothing in them no not the coherence or force of thââ¦ir words or sentences It is no small matter that here you vndertake out of Athanasius to prooue in Christ the appearance of a DAââ¦D MAN which by and by you interpret to be all extremitie of punishment vsed by God to sinners so farre as was possible the paines of the damned not excepted I would gladly aske you whether you purpose to cite places as you find them to seeke out the truth or only professe to picke out heere and there a word to make you availe to hide your head for shame You maruell what I meane I will soone tell you You alleage but fower words out of Athanasius besides Prepositions and Pronouns and in them you commit fiue notable faults and three of them grosse wilfull and wicked corruptions Sententiam you call the sentence of the Law Where Athanasius expresly noteth the sentence
of his seruants and none that trust in him shall perish yea He shall redeeme Israell from all his Iniquities And so God in his owne person speaketh by his Prophet I will Redeeme them from the hand of hell I will Redeeme them from death Repentance is hid from mine eyes Here is he that first vndertooke out cause and professed and promised to be our Redeemer ââ¦uen the Sonne of God who being the brightnesse of glorie and the Character of his Fathers substance or liuely Image of his Person supporting all things with the word of his power made the purgation of our sinnes by himselfe that is in his owne Person Now if you being a Christian haue any bands to tie God withall besides his loue and his truth you were best shew them forth we shall otherwise take you if you stand vpon it for little better then an Arian to lay subiection or seruitude on any of the Persons in the most glorious Trinitie The word is vsed in the Scripture it selfe he was made a Suretie of a better couenant Is not this sufficient to warrant the goodnesse and aptnesse of the similitude against your vndutifull reproofes of it It is not written in the Scriptures that Christ was made our Suretie to God much lesse that he was a Suretie bound to the Law to pay our debts for vs. Our debt was euerlââ¦ting damnation of Body and Soule which either Christ or we must pay or suffer if your prophane vrging of this Similitude take place The Scripture saith He was made a Suretie of a better Testament proouing expresly by the Comparison of two Testaments a former and a weaker which was the Law a later and a better which was the Gospell that Christ was not a Suretie of the Law nor to the Law as you falsely conceaue but of a better Testament then the Law that is he was Gods assurance to vs that all his promises of ââ¦ercie grace and glory should stand fast notwithstanding our iniquitie indignitie and Infirmitie were neuer so vnmeete and vnworthie thereof This Suretiship of Christ to establish with his bloud the new couenant which God made with vs not we with him without all respect of our merits to pardon our offences and to make vs heires of his heauenly kingdome the Scripture mentioneth which is no more like to your Suretiship then freedome is to bondage I therefore reprooued not the word which my selfe also did vse I reprooued your seruile applying the word to bring Christ from loue and libertie which led him to be our Redeemer vnto thraldome and debt to make him thereby sinfull and defiled with our vncleannesse And is it not worthie of reproofe when a word is vsed in the Scriptures to one purpose for you to take vpon you to draw it as you list to your deuices It is plainly written in the Gospell The Sonne of man came noâ⦠to be serued but to serue Will you hence presume your selfe to be Christs Master and take him bound to fulfill your Commandement as seruants must their Masters He saith of himselfe I am a worme and not a man Will you trample on him as you doe on wormes God hath giuen vs his Spirit as the pledge of our inheritance Shall we claime power ouer Gods spirit as we doe ouer pledges that are in our possession What wickednesse may not be bolstered if we stretch Similitudes vsed in the Scriptures farder then they were intended and we authorized You say Christ was not as a Suretie bound to the Law but of a better couenant euen of grace Verely a Suretie to vs of both Verely if you say that Christ was bound to vs or to the Law in both that is as well to beare our sinnes as to giue vs grace you broch two apparant blasphemies If you shift with saying Christ doth assure vs he hath done both for vs you slide from your former Assertion For that both these are done by Christ we bothagree only you would haue him when he bare our sinnes to be thereto bound and in that respect worthely condemned by the iust sentence of the Law which layeth the Penaltie on the Suretie when the Debtor cannot discharge it I told you that not onely we were in our selues to wicked and hatefull as being Enemies to haue any loue or fauour due to vs from God but also the Person of the Redeemer was so full of might and maiestie that no bands could be laid on him by the Lawe because he was afore the Law and aboue the Law that vndertooke our Redemption To this what reply yon He was a Suretie to vs of both But was he bound to vs or to the Law in either Why speake you not to that which is in Question It would well become the rest of your conceits to say that Christ was bound to redeeme vs being his Enemies and that the Sonne of God was bound to beare our burdens for vs. He promised so to doe Then the Loue of God which began it the Will which published it and the Truth which performed it are the more to be magnified by vs in the Sonne of God who could owe vs no duetie nor be bound to vs nor to the Law Those are the greatest bands that God can enter If Gods Counsels purposes and Promises be bands to barre the freedome of his fauour grace and mercie and in all these to impose on him a necessitie then is there in God no freedome but onely bondage which God forbid should come within any Christians hart He is most constant in all his thoughts words and waies which we may not thinke much lesse call debts to vs or bands to him without euident and extreame impietie but as he giueth all things to all and oweth nothing to any which the Scripture calleth his Grace whereof he is a giuer and not a Debtor so he cannot repent or change as men doe which we must ascribe to the infallible stedfastnesse of his most wise and glorious will the only Rule of all his gifts and works No band then if you know what a band meaneth can be fastned on God since that hath in it a debt which must of necessitie be yeelded whereto the partie may be compelled and forced by the right of the Law which chalenges in Gods promises are most prophane and heathenish Blasphemies It is written that Christ was made Hyponomon subiect to the Law or vnder the Law which you mightely denie against expresse Scripture You are so well acquainted with corrupting and deprauing other mens words that you make no care to doe the like to mine That Christ was vnder the Law I neuer denied no more then that he was vnder death but I said he was not bound to the Law no more then he was bound to death though he willingly for our sakes subiected himselfe to the rudiments of the Law for of those the Apostle speaketh to liue vnder them for a time
and to taste of death that he might in the end abolish them both For as Christ would be Circumcised and Baptised though there was nothing in him needfull to be pared or washed away but rather that fulfilling all righteousnesse he might commend both the one and the other with his person and presence so would he obserue the ceremonies of the Law not tied like a Seruant vnto them but content to vse them as Lord ouer them till he saw his time which he did not sticke to professe of himselfe when occasion was offered The Sonne of man saith he of himselfe is Lord euen of the Sabboth And so likewise I say vnto you that here is one greater then the temple By which words of his it is euident that he was not bound to the Law who called himselfe as he was the Sonne of Man Lord of the Sabboth and so of all the Law but as he laide downe his life when the Law could not take it from him and was obedient vnto death though death were in his power so would he subiect himselfe to the carnall commandements of the Law though he were free from them as being the truth and end of the Law For the Law was our Schole-master to Christ to whom when we were come by faith which made vs the Sonnes of God we were no longer vnder a Schoole-master How much lesse then could Christ himselfe who freed all that beleeued in him from obseruing the Law be bound or of necessitie subiect to the Law which neede not lead him to himselfe nor could not force him that was personally the Sonne of God to be a seruant vnder the types and figures of the Law farder then his owne wil induced him I made a reason that Suerties bound to the law to pay other mens debts might not looke to haue all referred to their liking and power as Christ had to his but to answer the penalties of the law to which they were obliged ââ¦es forsooth such a Suertie as he was might worthely be a gratious Mediator he was no ordinarie Sucrtie You labour to binde Christ to the thraldome of condemnation by the similitude of humane lawes which subiect the Suertie to the ââ¦arre condition that they doe the debtour and now when you see that resemblance to faile you exempt him from the seruitude of Suerties because he was no ordinarie Suertie Doe you now finde there is great difference betwixt a Suertie and a Redeemer and howsoeuer the speech may be true that Christ was a kinde of Suertie for vs yet may we not make him a seruant obliged to vs or with vs but a willing and free Redeemer For after our transgression committed and iudgement giuen vpon Adam and all his posteritie by Gods owne mouth a Suertie commeth to late a Redeemer is not too late before execution and therefore the Scriptures doe euerie where giue vs a Redeen er to note that we were condemned and reserued vnder feare and danger of euerlasting punishment till the Redeemer interposed himselfe and offered such ransome and restitution as should more content and satisfie the holinesse and iustice of God then out condemnation could doe The person that vndertooke our redemption was not Christes humane nature which as then was not but the Sonne of God in his owne person assumed on him to make ful satisfaction for our disobedience not by suffering euerlasting death which was due to vs but by giuing a better and more pretious recompence then we were woorth And this he would doe by submitting himselfe to obey and serue in our nature and in our steed and so offer the most acceptable Sacrifice of humilitie and obedience vnto death that Gods holinesse might be honored which we dââ¦spised and his iustice satisfied which we prouoked Let all men therefore aduise themselues how they binde the person of the Sonne of God to their obligation or condemnation it was he and none other that vndertooke for vs and by whose fauour power dignitie sanctitie and humilitie ioyned in one person with our weake and fraile nature the worke of our redemption was performed You say he could not be bound to the Law because he was aboue the Law He was aboue the Law in his Godhead but in his manhood he became for vs vnder the Law If you speake of Christes manhood apart from his Godhead you vtterly ouerthrow all our saluation For set aside the personall vnion of man with God in Christ Iesus and his humane nature could do vs no good Since therefore his Godhead was from euerlasting and a perfect and distinct person in the Tââ¦initie before his manhood was created which had neuer any existence by it selfe but in coniunction with his Deitie from the first instant of his conception when we speake of the person of Christ we must speake either of his Godhead which was before his incarnation or ioyntly of both after his assumption of man into God Then either we had no Surctie for our redemption the foure thousand yeeres that Christes flââ¦sh was vnmade of his mother or els the Sonne of God in his owne person was our Suretie So that our Suretie for foure thousand yeeres could not be bound to the Law by your confession and when the same Sonne of God tooke vnto him our humane nature into the vnity of his perfon HE that is the Person could be no more bound to the Law then he was before For the Godhead was of more power to free the manhood of Christ in that Person from the Law then our flesh in Christ was to subiect the Godhead vnder the Law Wherefore the person remained free and vnbound yet would he submit himselfe to obserue the signes and sacraments of the Law as he did humble himselfe to the death of the Crosse to neither of which the person was bound by any legall seruitude but only by voluntarie submission that his obedience being no way tied might be the more precious in Gods sight For as the Lord of glorie was crucified and we are reconciled to God by the death of his Sonne so God sent his Sonne mââ¦de of a woman and made vnder the Law to redeeme vs and giue vs the adââ¦ption of children but as he was made flesh by no compulsion nor obligation no more was he subiââ¦ct to the Law by any other meanes then by his owne loue and liking for vs. Neither doth the Scripture binde the manhood of Christ vnto the Law For the Law was not giuen to the righteous sayth the Apostle Which if it were possible to be true in any it was most true in the manhood of Christ who had neither in birth life nor death any taint of sinne If ye be led by the spirit sayth Paul ye are not vnder the Law for against such there is no law Whether you thinke the manhood of Christ was endued and guided with the spirit I referre it to your owne conscience If it were then
against him was no law though in loue to vs which was the fulfilling of the law he would humble himselfe not vnder the law only but vnder the worst of men to be the contempt of men and reproch of the people If the Sonne shall make you free you shall be free indeââ¦d sayth our Sauiour For the seruant abideth not in the house for euer but the Sonne abideth for euer If then when we are made the sonnes of God by faith we can be no longer seruants to the law because the law ingendreth bondage which is repugnant to the libertââ¦e wherewith Christ hath made vs free how much lesse could the manhood of Christ which not only freeth vs but was personally borne the Sonne of God be a seruant and in bondage to the law sauâ⦠onely because he would humble himselââ¦e to serue in our steads This Paul learned of his master and followed in his maââ¦ter when he sayd Though I be free from all men yet haue I made my selfe seruant vnto all men and am made all things to all men that I might by all meanes saue some So that by your leaue it is a plaine errour in you because Christ submitted himselfe willingly to the lââ¦w to conclude his manhood was bound to the law ãâã ãâã not of ââ¦m else in his manhood bound to the law for vs but freely and voluntarily ãâã ãâã ãâã Gods gratious eternall decree appointing him so he became bound to the ãâã The ââ¦eader will finde in the end that your greatest strength is the mistaking oâ⦠oââ¦her mens words and abusing of your owne For when you haue wrangled foure leaues to ââ¦e Christ to the true curse of the law and to hang him by the iust sentence of the same law because he stood bound with vs as a Suretie to pay our debts now at last long lingering you say he did freely and voluntarily vndertake to redeeme vs yet loth to let go you adde and so became bound to the law Sir you should tell vs Wââ¦o did ââ¦ely and voluntarily vndertake our redemption and WHEN For if it were vndertaken by the Sonne of God long before Christes manhood was borne ãâã ãâã you the Sonne of God to the law which before you disclaimed And did ââ¦od thiââ¦ke you eternally decree and appoint his Sonne to be bound to the Law ãâã of ãâã if you appoint any of the persons in Trinitie to be one bound ãâã thââ¦n another with any manner of bondage or seruice Then as the Sonne coââ¦ld not ââ¦e boââ¦nd because he was God No more would the Father binde the Sââ¦nne whose loue to vs ledde him to vndertake our Redemption and to binde him that was willing was to distrust him which suspition I hope you will not impure to the Father against the Sonne The Father therefore in the same loue to vs wherewith his Sonne offered to be the person that should redeeme vs accepted the offer of his Sonne and gratiously decreed with one consent of the whole Trinitie as well the manner as the meane of our redemption which decree did not binde but accept and approoue the loue of the Redeemer And when the time came that the Sonne of God would execute this decree made as well by himselfe as the other persons in Trinitie he tooke an vndefiled humane bodie and soule into the person of his Godhead which he so repleââ¦ished with the woonderfull light and supported with the infallââ¦le strength of his spirit that it most willingly embraced and most earnestly affeââ¦ted the same submission and obedience which the diuine nature of Christ was pleââ¦sed to yeeld for our redemption So that the manhood of Christ neuer hauing any subsistence by it selfe apart from the Godhead of the Sonne it neuer had any humane action or pasââ¦ion in birth life or death which pertained not to the whole person consisting of God and man And in that respect the Scriptures say God sent his Sonnâ⦠maâ⦠of a womââ¦n and made vnder the Law and we are reconciled to God by the death of hiâ⦠Sonne the ãâã crucified the Lord of glorie and God purchased his church with his owne bloud Which speeches could haue no trueth in them as likewise our saluation no certaintie if the manhood of Christ could haue had any action or passion asunder from the Godhead The person therefore of God and man after his incarnation was subiect to the Law and euen the same person that from the beginning vndertooke our redemption and so not the manhood of Christ as you would shift the matter off but the person of God and man must be bound to the Law if our Suertie were bound May not God be bound by his promise Then must you say that God is bound to giue vs grace mercie and glorie because he hath promised euerie one of these and hath sworne to performe them and so you turne the whole Scriptures vpside downe and put your selfe in Gods place and make him your attendant and seruant because by an immutable decree he hath promised to heare vs when we call and helpe vs in time of need By this Diuinitie like to the rest of your deuices the loue fauour compassion bountie mercie trueth and maiestie of God shall be not onely a necessitie but euen a bondage vnto him which blasphemie no Christian eares I hope will enduââ¦e God therefore is a most mercifull promiser a most gratious giuer and a most faithfull performer his promises are assurances that he will giue what he saith but they are no bands that he must yeeld what he oweth because we haue neither meanes to deserue them nor ââ¦ight to chalenge them nor power to exact them but onely need to receaue them praier to entreat them and thanks to acknowledge them He is content to make himselfe our debtour by promise to let vs see how much we are bound to him that deseruing nothing we are yet by his mercy assured of all things Though he who ordinarily Redeemeth a prisoner from the Enemie be not bound but content so to doe yet a Suertie being content becommeth bound and so Christ our Redeemer became bound as a Suertie to pay our debt for vs. Though the Scriptures euerie where calling Christ a Redeemer and no where a Suertie to God for vs to pay our debts but Gods Suertie or assurance to vs doe by the verie name giue vs to vnderstand that God must needs be lesse bound then men which are not bound but content to redeeme others from their enemies yet you will haue your will in spite of Scriptures and Fathers and make Christ no Redeemer indeed by taking his freedome from him but biââ¦de him with your similitudes to doe that in thraldome which in loue and meââ¦cie he was content to doe for vs. And where Gods decrees and promises which aââ¦e most faithfull and firme assurances can not be called bonds in him without blaspheââ¦ie yet you will haue him bound to saue vs because he
flagitiorum maculas morte voluntaria suo innocente sanguine luisse atque eluisse It is euident that Christ admitted receaued and suffered of his owne good will the paines due to mans wickednesse but not due to him and with a voluntarie death and his owne innocent bloud did wash and clense the spots of our filthinesse And againe It is euident the Iewes had not in their power these things or times sed sua ipsum voluntate nulla vâ⦠coactum harc mortem pro nostra salute oppetijsse but of his owne accord without anie cââ¦action Christ died this death for our saluation Where also this is set downe as a true position that eligendae mortis optio penes ipsum fiââ¦t the election and direction of his death was left to his owne power and choise which the whole Church of Christ hath hitherto ascribed to the power and will loue and mercie of the Sonne of God reiecting your bands and obligations lately deuised to barre the freedome and abridge the power of the Sauiour of the worlde because you would tie him to the paines of hell You see not you will say how these Fathers make against you None otherwise but that they directly denie that which you affirme Christ you say though of good will he was at first content so to doe yet after became bound to the Law to pay our debts Now he that is bound must needs obey and so you lay on Christ not onely a necessity but also a dutie These Fathers with one consent disclaime al necessitie in the death of Christ and consequently they confesââ¦e he was free from all bands and debts but in loue and mercie as a free Redeemer he would giue himselfe for vs which was a farre greater price then we were woorth or could owe. And these multitudes of men as you call them though they be not of equall strength with the word of God which is the touchstone of all trueth yet doe they plainely prooue that you innouate the faith of Christes Church which in their seuerall ages they all beleeued and professed and for their faith they haue the manifest wordes of our Sauiour that none tooke his soule from him but he laid it downe of himselfe and the witnesse of the Apostle that Christ for loue gaue himselfe for vs which argueth that he was vrged thereto with no violence necessitie nor dutie much lesse was thereto bound and you for your deuice haue the curiositie of creditours the discredite of debtours of whom men require Suerties with bands because they trust not their words and promises much lesle their willes and dispositions But this iealousie in the Sonne of God is hainous blasphemie therfore there could be no cause to bind him as there could be no distrust of him since our miserie and his mercie were motiues enough to incline and continue his loue though we leaue him at his full libertie without all seruitude or necessirie Gods decree and his owne good will was that he should satisfie and pay none otherwise for vs then so as he did There can be no question but in creating condemning and redeeming man the Father the Sonne and the holie Ghost had one and the same will and decree yet except with the Arian heretickes you make an inequallitie of the persons in the most blessed Trinitie you can impose no seruice nor suffering on the Sonne of God by any decree but what must come from his owne good pleasure offer and perfourmance And that the Scriptures euerie where imply when they say Christ loued vs and gaue himselfe for vs that is he FIRST of loue towards vs OFFERED to serue and suffer in our places and AFTER of the same loue submitted himselfe to performe his purpose and promise of our saluation So that Gods decree was no iniunction nor ordinance that his Sonne should doe it but an ACCEPTATION of his Sonnes loue and mercie towards vs and an APPROEATION that it was a most sufficient recompence for all the transgressions of men And the Father is said to giue his Sonne for vs not that he loued vs better then he did his Sonne whom he infinitely loueth as himselfe and for whose sake onely he accepteth vs not that he vsed any authoritie or power ouer his Sonne to appoint him to this seruice but that knowing the strength and sufficiencie of his Sonne to be as his owne and seeing his loue and mercie towards vs which was common to him with the rest of the persons in that most glorious Trinitie the Father out of the same loue towards vs thought it fitter to accept the offer of his Sonne then that we should perish And therefore though the Father loued his Sonne as himselfe yet he was content his Sonne should beare our burden which we could not without euerlasting destruction and his Sonne could with exceeding honour and admiration of his mercie humilitie obedience and patience If you slide from the Godhead of Christ to his manhood to binde that because it was a Creature and not the Creator by diuiding the person of Christ you runne into the heresie of Nestorius condemned in the generall Counsell of ââ¦phesus and yet releiue not your selfe For the person and not this or that part of his nature must be the Redeemer since neither man could saue vs vnlesse he were also God nor God could die for vs vnlesse he were also man and so did sufââ¦er death in his humane nature So that the Suertie as you call him that vndertooke our saluation not onely from the beginning but before the world was precisely the person of the Sonne of God and not the humane nature of Christ and therefore you must either binde the Godhead of Christ as our Suertie or free his manhood from all bands Neither could any of Christs sufferings be of infinite price and merite for vs except we asââ¦ibe them to the voluntarie obedience of the person since the death of a iust man could not be the redemption of the worlde but the death of that person which was more woorth then all the world If then Christs sufferings take their force and value from the person they must likewise haue their freedome and election from the person Those sentences of your Authors Gregorie Austen and Ambrose if they be spoken simply seeme very harsh where they say that Christ could haue saued vs otherwaies then by suffering and dying for vs. For herein they oppose Gods absolute omnipotencie against his expresse and reuealed will which how it may be liked in Diuinitie I know not Yours is more harsh that reprooue them before you vnderstand them and chalenge that as false which is most apparantly true by the maine grounds of Christian Religion For if you auouch Gods power to extend no farder then his works as if God could doe no more then he hath done or will doe is a manifest denying of Gods omnipotencie which is larger then either his will or his
works and though his works must alwaies be measured by his wil yet must his power be limited to neither because God is able to doe many things which he neuer did nor will doe And in his works if you bind him with any necessitie to do as he did and leaue him not at libertie to doe all things according to his owne wisdome and will you reuiue the accursed error of the Manichees against whom Saint Austen fully resolueth Nullam ergo necessitatem patitur Deus neque necessitate facit quae facit sed summa ineffabili voluntate ac potestate God then suffereth no necessitie neither doth he the things which he doth with any necessitte but with a supreame and vnspeakeable will and power So that the words of Gregorie Austen and Ambrose are most true that God had other meanes in his power to saue vs then by the death of his owne Sonne but a BETTER or more conuenient way to demonstrate his loue and mercy towards vs and to manifest his wisedome power and iustice against sinne death and Satan he had not for no Question God chose the best And why these words should offend any Christian man I see no cause since they be both sound and sober They oppose Gods power against his expresse and reuealed will You were told it is an error to restraine Gods power to his will as if he could not doe more or otherwise then he hath done but in this you conceiue them not For they doe not say God had meanes to change his will or to alter his promise once published but when he first decreed this way to saue man it was in his power to haue appointed an other way if it had pleased him So that God was not tied to determine this way by any necessitie as if the power of euill preuailed against him or choyse of other meanes failed him but this in the wisedome of God common to all three persons in that most holy Trinitie was allowed as the most honorable and acceptable way to God and most fauorable and comfortable to man And this confession which you so much controle hath beene vsed by Diuines of all ages howsoeuer you know not what to make of it in your new Diuinitie Cyprian before their time Et sine hoc holocausto poterat Deus tantum condonasse peccatum sed facilitas veniae laxaret habenas peccatis effrenibus quae etiam Christi vix cohibent passiones God was able to haue pardoned so great sinne without this Sacrifice but the facilitie of forgiuenesse would loose the raynes to vnbridled sinnes which euen the sufferings of Christ doe skant represse Nazianzene euen with the eldest of them It was possible for God to saue man without taking flesh by his only will as he did and doth worke all things without the helpe of a Body Damascene after them He was not vnable that can doe all things by his Almightie power and strength to take man from the Tyrant that possessed him Bernard likewise Was not the Creator able to restore his worke without this difficultie He was able but he chose rather to wrong himselfe then the most lewd and hatefull vice of vnthankefulnesse should haue any colour in man Zanchius resolueth the same Could not mankind be deliuered by any other meanes then by Christs death who can doubt it Solo nutu iussu ac voluntate diuina poterat It might haue beene deliuered by the onely becke Commandement and will of God Master Caluin whose warinesse you so much commend where he maketh any thing for you doubteth not in this Assertion to ioyne with Ambrose Austen and Gregorie against you Poterat nos Dominus verbo aut nutu redimere nisi aliter nostra causa visum esset The Lord might haue Redeemed vs with a word or a becke of his but that for our sakes he thought good otherwise to doe it The Booke of Homilies on which you would seeme so much to depend goeth farder then either Ambrose or Austen saith Was not this a sure pledge of Gods loue to giue vs his owne Sonne from heauen he might haue giuen vs an Angell if he would or some other Creature and yet should his loue haue beene farre aboue our deserts All these Similitudes of Mediator Redeemer and Suretie may stand very well together in the office of Christ though you would perswade vs the contrarie yea rather they confirme ech other The names of Mediator Redeemer are exactly affirmed of Christ and often authorised in the Scriptures the name of Suretie to God for vs is not he is called Gods Suretie to vs of a better Testament then the Law because God in him and by him hath assured vs of his mercie and grace in this life and of his heauenly kingdome in the life to come And if you will needs vrge the Similitude of Sureties from the course and custome of humane Lawes which appoint and admitte Sureties they vtterly exclude vs in the case that we were in from hauing any Sureties For neither in Capitall crimes nor in Corporall paines doth mans Law allow any Sureties Againe no Suretie standeth bound for a seruant much lesse for a condemned dead person Since then we were not only the seruants of sinne but for haynous offences condemned Soule and Body to euer lasting perdition and already dead in Soule by sinne no course of Law allowed vs Sureties Moreouer the Prince who is the Lord ouer the Law may be no Suretie because he is not chalengable by the Law how then will you bind the King of Kings to be our Suretie as if the most Soueraigne were most subiected to the Law besides Christ freed vs by giuing himselfe and his life for vs. What Sureties doe so Christ bought vs with a Price to be his seruants Doe Sureties buy their debtors to serue them Christ gaue infinitely more then we were worth Is that possible for Sureties Christ did change our punishment in his person from eternall death to the death of the Crosse. Haue Sureties that libertie or authoritie We rested on Gods promise for our Redemption before it was performed Know you not that a bare promise by mans Law doth not bind though God be faââ¦thfull in all his words Albeit then Christ recompenced our debt and voluntarily by his owne death discharged our danger being no way thereto bound yet since he obserued none other conditions of a Suretie and no right or Law did allow vs Sureties I see no cause why you should change the honor of a free Redeemer so much mentioned in the Scriptures into the Thraldome of a Suretie bound with vs as you say to pay our debt which was euerlasting destruction of Body and Soule Our publike Churches Doctrine also auoucheth that ââ¦e was our Suretie Our Church alloweth that Catechisme to be taught in Schooles to Children with whom it may be you seââ¦ke to be sorted because you
neuer waded any farder vnlesse in one or two new writers that fit your fansie It doth approue likewise and appoint Erasmus Paââ¦aphrase to lââ¦e openly in the Church for euery man that doubteth of any thing in the nââ¦we Testament to reade for his instruction and yet you will not take euery word in Erasmus Paraphrase for the publike Doctrine of the Church of England For so you should ââ¦oone exclude the most of your new conceits But what saith the Catechisme that Christ was bound to suffer for vs or did endure the same damnation which we dââ¦serued It sayth that Christ was our Suretie The Catechisme goeth not so farre but sayth God dealt cum Christo quasi sponsore with Christ as it were with a Suretie Christ then did voluntarily assume some similitude but not the strict and exact condition of a Suretie euen by the tenor of the words which you cite though you guilefully translate them as if Christ had beene our Suretie It is one thing to hold Christ was our Suretie and ioyntly bound with vs by law to pay our debts which is your errour and another thing to say Christ was as it were a Suretie or did of his owne accord discharge our debts for vs. The Catechisme in this very section precisely noteth that he was not bound as Sureties be but of his owne will suffered for vs the cruell and wicked rage of the Iewes in putting him to death Haec quidem illi in eum crudeliter malitiose atâ⦠impiè perpetrarant verum ipââ¦e sua sââ¦onte ac volens haec omnia perpeââ¦s atâ⦠perfunctus est These things before described the Iewes did cruelly malitioââ¦ly and impiouâ⦠against him but he OF HIS OVVNE ACCORD and good will not bound suffered all these things And before he commeth to your words he sayth but it iâ⦠not vnusuall amongst men that one should vndertake and suffer for another By which he doth not meane that by right or law one man may be bound to suffer or die for another but by liking or loue men are sometimes thereto led Otherwise the law both of God man is directly against all such suffering Sancimus ibiesse poenaÌ ãâã est Peccata suos teneant authores nec vlterius progrediatur metus quam reperiaââ¦r delicium We appoint say the Emperours Arcadius and Honorius that punishment shall be there where the fault is Let offences binde their committers and let no feare of punishment extend farther than to such as be guiltie of the crime Gods law doth ratifie the same The wickednesse of the wicked shall be vpon himselfe The sonne shall not beare the ãâã of the father neither shall the father beare the iniquitie of the sonne but the same soule that sinneth shall die Wherefore the Catechisme if he vnderstood what he said as I truely thinke he right-well did could not deriue Christes bodily sufferings from any band or Suertiship allowed amongst men by Law but onely from Christes loue and will which is aboue all law by which indeed he humbled and emptied himselfe to the death of the crosse for our sakes when there was neither law nor band to compell him to it Also Cyprians words are plaine and can not beare any other sense than I make of them that Christ was a verie Suretie for his people and suffered such a forsaking of God touching sense of paine and want of present feeling of comfort in his paines as the damned doe I did well to say you neither vnderstood nor liked the meaning of Cyprian for where there is nothing in Cyprians words that bolstereth your error you haue made such a construction of them or rather such a contradiction to them that few men besides you could deuise the like For by them you bring the person of the Sonne of God in his humane nature that was alwayes full of grace and trueth To haue no MORE SENSE NOR COMFORT OF GOD for the time THAN THE DAMNED HAVE From which pââ¦stilent position though you kisse your hand in it I wish all the godly to blesse themselues But let vs first see on which words of Cyprian you graffe this golden fruit and then how true it is and agreââ¦able to the faith Your foundation ââ¦s because Cyprian sayth of Christ Thou diddest shew anxietates illius querimoniae verba esse dilââ¦ctorum tuorum quorum personam causam assumpseras the pensiuenesse of that complaint My God my God why hast thou forsaken me to be the words of thy beloued whose person and cause thou hadst assumed What is this to your purpose or how doth this patronize your violent and wicked assertion The dolors of Christs complaint on the Crosse that he was forsaken were the words of his beloued that is Christ spake those words in the name and behalfe of his Elect that they were forsaken of God not of his owne person as Austen saith of the same That was the voice of Christes members not of the head And Leo Sub redemptorum suorum voce clamabat Christ cried those words vnder the voice of his Redeemed Now this being Cypââ¦ans plaine speech that those were the words of his Elect finding themselues for their sinnes worthie to be forsaken of God how come you to turne Christ into his beloued that is the head into the members and his beloued into the damned and then to conclude of Christ that he had no more sense nor comfort of God in his paines than the damned haue Such another leape will easily bring you and your followers from faith to infidelity and if you take not heed the sooner from the number of the Elect to the rancke of the Reprobate which take so light occasion to draw Christ into the same desperation for the time with the damned Cypriââ¦ns words you say can not beare any other sense It is not enough for you shamefully to peruert Cyprians words but you must proudly proclaime in print that they can haue none other sense than you list to like of when his speech expresly doth import the contrarie If you had auouched so much of Christes words we would desire no better interpreter then Cyprian who saith those were the wordes of Christs beloued and so that forsaking had no direct application to Christes person but a mercifull relation to his members who might often inwardly feele that they were forsaken of Gods fauor and assistance for the time though not as the damned are MEE you thinke in Christes words must signifie his person and not his members But Cyprian is expresly opposite to you in that point and saith MEE there is as much as MY BELOVED or chosen members And for this exposition Cyprian hath the manifest precedence of the sacred Scriptures in which Christ often speaketh of his members as of himselfe by the verie same words Saul Saul why persecutest thou mee that is my members whom I loue and esteeme as my selfe and this is no cauilling euasion the Iudge at the last
Because you coyne new Principles of Religion you thinke your selfe Authorized to make newe Rules for Similitudes In the Scriptures it is not required that Similitudes made of God or of Christ his Sonne should be lawfull in euery part of the Comparison but onely that they be possible and so propose the thing which the holy Ghost would intimate The day of the Lord shall come euen as a Theife in the night Will you iustifie night Robbers because Christs comming is resembled to theirs Christ draweth a comparison from the vnrighteous Iudge to God and taketh likewise a Similitude from Vsurers and Extortioners to teach that God will haue his gifts carefully imployed Will you by that Parable make it lawfull to lend money for aduantage Or for men to reape where they did not sow because these things are proportioned to Gods graces Christ bringeth the Similitude of an vnfaithfull Steward that wasted his Masters goods and abated his Masters debts and saith the Lord and Master commended the vniust Steward that he had done wisely Will you hence vphold prodigalitie and infidelitie in seruants which cosen their Masters rather then they will worke or want Similitudes we see of things most vnlawfull are made and referred to Gods Actions by Christ himselfe and therefore it is no weakning to my Similitude whatsoeuer you say that no King hath power by Gods Law to lay bodily death on his Innocent Sonne I doe not by that resemblance make any thing lawfull or vnlawfull but shew how euill it becommeth Prisoners and Captiues to twite or vpbraid their Redeemers and deliuerers as if they were defiled and guiltie of their Sinnes for whom they mediate and intreate Of bodily death I spake neuer a word that is your Idle conceite added to my comparison But the Similitude fitteth not Christs sufferings in our Redemption No more doth any Similitude that man can make I say of Christs death as Saint Austen saith of his birth If you seeke for areason it shall not be wonderfull if you aske for an example it shall not be singular The Acts of men may in some sort resemble or imitate they cannot match or euen the works of God But why are you so curious in other mens Similitudes that are so carelesse of your own Doth your example of a Suretie fit the bodily sufferings of Christ I hope humane lawes haue no power nor practise to take mens liues away for Suretiship nay they allow no Sureties for any corporall paines as we saw before because no man is Master of his owne Body to engage the whole or any part thereof to be mangled or maymed vnlesse he will be an homicide of himselfe which Gods Law doth not permit nor mans Law accept How much lesse then doth your Suretie resemble the paines of the damned suffered in the Soule of Christ as you say from the immediate hand of God If men haue no power to pawne their owne Soules nor to kill other mens your similitude of a Suretie bound to the Law to pay an other mans debts is as wide from Christes sufferings as mine and farre wider For he must be Suretie not onely life for life but Soule for Soule which Mans Law doth not meddle with And yet your owne example of a Suretie serueth my turne to declare your Doctrine to be false as well as any other For if a Man fined by a Court for ryots contempts or other misdemeanures and committed to prison till he pay the same find friends that to purchase his libertie will make present payment of his fine haue you any reason or conscience to charge them as guiltie or partakers of those Riots or other offences done by him whom they deliuer If men may be Sureties Mediators and ransomers of others and yet not deserue to be blamed for other mens Crimes why could not the Sonne of God take vpon him the punishment of our sinnes and yet be most free from the fault and guilt thereof Because God did punish Christ you will say with his immediate hand which he would not doe if Christ were Innocent Soft Sir that is no way prooued but barely pretended by you that God was the Tormentor of Christs Soule with his immediate hand The Scriptures teach the contrarie that God deliuered him into the hands of sinners to doe what soeuer Gods hand and counsell had determined before to be done And though the wicked be the Rod of Gods wrath and the staffe in their hands is his Indignation Yet serue they their malice in afflicting the faithfull when God hath an other end which is most iust and holy to put his Saints to the tryall of their obedience and patience in suffering for righteousnesse sake that he may be glorified in them and they exalted and crowned by him In the cruell and wrongfull death of his Sonne to which Christ willingly submitted himselfe God had farre greater and waightier causes and works euen the Redemption of the world and the demonstration of his Diuine power and wisedome and such like which I haue often mentioned and therefore doe presently passe them with silence An other Reason of mine you impugne with marueylous skorne and detestation That seeing Christ on the Crosse spoyled powers and Principalities and made a shew of them openly triumphing ouer them Therefore I collected that Christ selt the diuels as the very instruments that wrought the very effects of Gods wrath vpon him I grant I tooke it to be not a ridiculous but impious iest rather then a tolerable reason for you to conclude that because Christ triumphed ouer diuels therefore diuels tormented his Soule with the very effects of Gods wrath which euery where you make to be the paines of the damned And surely as yet why I should conceiue better of it I see nothing either proued or produced by you First you assume that these words of the Apostle were spoken of Christ hanging on the Crosse but what Scripture assureth that besides your selfe you peremptorily put it into the Text by saying Christ on the Crosse spoyled Principalities but your additions are no good illations with me The place if you take the paines to turne to it doth rather shew the Contrarie To proue that the faithfull are tied neither to the Rites and shadowes of the Law nor to any submission or seruice of Angels the Apostle bringeth Christs death for the one where the hand-writing of Ceremonies that kept vs in bondage was fastned to the Crosse and so cancelled and we freed from it and for the other he bringeth Christs Resurrection by which all contrarie powers were openly spoyled triumphed and subiected to Christ as to the head of all power and principalitie Yee were buried with him in Baptisme saith Paul with whom yee were also raised and when yee were dead in sinnes and in vncircumcision of your flesh he quickned you together with him forgiuing your sinnes and cancelling the hanauriting of ordinances
sorow necessarie in the sacrifice for sinne of his sanctitie with godly sorrow which was despised with our iniquitie the mitigating of his anger with humble and earnest praier which was prouoked with our contempts were they not three different effects euen in Christ himselfe and so might stirre vp three religious affections of feare sorrow and prayer Why then should they be confounded in Christ whose humane nature might yeeld all three to God as well in respect of pietie to God and of charitie to men as in regard of his office for the satisfaction of our sinnes for he might not approch the presence of God as a Priest with our person and cause who were sinnefull though he were innocent and holy to make intercession and sacrifice for our sinnes but he must giue God his due glorie haue compassion on our miserie and mediate for our safetie As therefore I see no cause to exclude these affections and actions from the satisfaction for sin so I see greater reason to include them in the sacrifice for sin except we make Christ a Priest onely by his SVFFERINGS leaue him neither any honor of OFFERING nor right of PRAYING for vs in the purgation of our sins which were a strange kind of Priesthood no way answerable to the Leuiticall in that wherin the apostle compareth them For in the Law the Priest was to present the sacrifice to God and to pray for the trespasser which if you thinke needlesse in the true sacrifice that should propitiate the sinnes of the world you must correct the Apostle that maketh the Law a figure of the Gospell though the person of the Priest and the price of the sacrifice farre excell all that was vnder the Law b Defenc. pag. 99. li. 20. Furthermore you knit in within this foure other seuer all causes of Christes agonie as you recken them pa. 27. First his taking of our infirmities in his flesh to cure them Secondly his breaking the knot betwixt bodily death and hell which none but hee was able to doe Thirdly Gods anger which might be executed on his bodie but was mitigated by him Fourthly the desire he had to continue the feeling and enioying of Gods presence with his bodie As there is no one thing in the Scriptures that receiueth and hath more diuers opinions of it than Christes agonie in the Garden so I proposed as many as had any coherence with trueth and left the Reader to make his choise which he liked best Howbeit I did not pag. 27. recken foure seuerall causes of Christes agonie as you mistake but of the c Serm. pag. 27. li. 23. feare which Christ had and shewed of his bodily death His agony had other parts and affections besides feare and astonishment as sorow zeale submissiue and intentiue prayer and a bloudie sweat the obiects and ends whereof might be as different as the things themselues For example Christes feare in the Garden might haue many respects and causes as well as his sorow He might feare the glory of God now sitting in iudgement to receiue recompense for the sinnes of his elect For as Christ himselfe who best knew it confirmeth it by saying d Iohn 12. Christes manhood might feare the glorie of Gods iudgement Now at hand is the iudgement of this world now shall the Prince of this world be cast on t so wee must not thinke so mightie and weightie matters as the iudgement of the world and the casting out of Satan the accuser of his brethren and the admitting the Redeemer to present himselfe here on earth for our cause to the face of God in iudgement were decreed and setled by God without some reuelation of his glorie and maiestie meet for those persons and purposes For this is a rule which may euery where be obserued in the Scriptures that when God is described as a Iudge he is sayd to sit in a Throne and all the host of heauen to stand before him to resemble the glory of his iudgement as we finde in Daniel 7. vers 9 10. Esa. 6. vers 1 2. 1. Kings 22. vers 19. Wherefore Dauid sayth e Psal. 9. v. 7. The Lord hath prepared his throne for iudgement This Michaiah and Esay the Prophets say they SAW which whether it were by sight as Steuen f Act. 7 v. 55. looked stedfastly into heauen and with his eyes saw the glory of God and Iesus standing at the right hand of God or in spirit as Ezechiel waking and g Ezech. 8. sitting in his house with the Elders of Iudah before him was by a diuine vision brought to Ierusalem to see all the abominations there committed I dare not determine Christ himselfe sayth I saw Satan fall downe from heauen like lightning Which way soeuer Gods glory in iudgement was reuealed vnto Christ and beheld of Christ in the Garden it was able for the time of his humilitie to impresse a religious feare and trembling into his humane nature since Christ came now by iudgement to haue the burden of our sinnes taken from vs and layed vpon him that he might make satisfaction for them Another thing that Christ might iustly and yet religiously feare in the Garden offering now to ransome man from the wrath of God was the POWER of Gods wrath Hâ⦠might feare ãâã pââ¦wer of Goââ¦s wrath ãâã our sinne whiââ¦h hâ⦠was to ââ¦eare which is fully infinite and so farre exceedeth the strength and reach of mans nature that our earthly infirmitie to which Christ submitted himselfe for our sakes can not comprehend the greatnesse thereof nor thinke on the power thereof without feare and trembling h Psal. 90. v. 11 Who knoweth saith Dauid to God the power of thy wrath for according to thy feare that is as thou art feared so is thine anger Contempt and carelessenesse kindle and increase the wrath of God against vs feare and submission asswage it And when I name feare I meane not a dreadfull distrust of Gods purpose towards vs which is desperation but a perswasion and confession of his power ouer vs whereby we feare to displease him and tremble before him withall submission when we haue displeased him This feare Christ teacheth his disciples when he saith I will shew you Luc. 12. whom you shall feare feare him which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell yeâ⦠I say feare him not meaning they should firmely beleeue God would euerlastingly condemne them but that thinking on his power preuailing here and in hell they should beware to prouoke him and with all humilitie prostrate themselues before him when they had offended him to preuent his anger Christ you will say needed not thus to feare since he was no sinner For himselfe he needed not because he was innocent and obedient in all thinges to the vttermost but since he was at this time now to beare the burthen of our sinnes in his body and to haue the chasticement of our peace laid
the time though it were after restored with greater glory This I did not put for the cause of his agonie as you idlely amplifie but noted it as a respect that might worthily lead Christ to dislike or abhorre death in respect of his perfection and communion with God aboue all men and Angels saue for the will of his father and the good of man which ouerruled this dislike in him g Defenc pag. 105 li 22. You say excellent well but by your practise in all matters so farre as I see you neuer meane to obserue it in Gods cause let Gods booke teach vs what to beleeue and what to professe shew me then where you read in Gods word any or all these to be effectuall causes of this strange ãâã or ãâã my part I shall neuer beleeue you If I did professe to bind mens faiths to these causes of Christes agonie as you doe to your new redemption by the paines of the damned I would shew you where I redde them in the word of God or els I would leaue ââ¦ch beleeuer to his libertie but I forwarned all men that the Scriptures directly and particularly speaking nothing of the causes of Christes agonie the safest rule that I could find or they could follow was not to depart from any knowen and receaued grounds of Religion and principles of pietie for the causes thereof For since the Scriptures keep silence and our Sauiour himselfe would not shew it to all his Disciples but chose three from the rest to goe with him and tooke the darke time of the night and left those three whose eies were so heauie that they could not forââ¦eare sleepe about a stones cast before he would pray because he would not haue thââ¦m ãâã to all that he said or did in that place I see no reason why any man should be ouer curious in searching that which the word of God hath not precisely reuealed specially seeing no demonstratiue cause can be giuen of secret affections and voluntarie actions such as these were in Christ. And your audacious and presumptuous boldnesse is the more chalengeable for that you not onely take vpon you to giue the right and exact cause therof out of your owne braine but you light on such a cause as hath no foundation in any part of the Scripture nor any coherence with the maine positions of the Christian faith vnfalliblely deliuered in the word of God Wherfore I haue not transgressed my directions when I teach what iust and waighty respects of feare sorow zeale our Lord Sauior had in the worke of our redemption which might be the causes of that earnest prayer agonie and withall shewed the iudgements and opinions of diuers ancient and learned Fathers concerning the same but you as insolent in your conclusions as in your conceits take vpon you to specifie the full and true cause thereof for which you haue no shew of Scriptures nor touch of reason And such is the cause which you yeeld that thereby you crosse the chiefe streames of faith and trueth most currant in the sacred Scriptures and with all learned and religious antiquitie The same rule then binding you which bindeth me shew you what Prophet Euangelist or Apostle euer taught or thought the paines of the damned to be inflicted on Christes soule in the Garden by Gods immediate hand and that without the paines of hell we could not be ãâã or els my not beleeuing you will not excuse your enterprise you must answere to God and to all the faithfull for innouating the very roots and branches of their redemption by the bloud and death of Christ Iesus which you auouch to be vnsufficient for the ransome of our sinnes except your hell be thereto added when the Holy Ghost who should best know the trueth being the spirit of trueth hath expressed no such thing in all the Scriptures h Defenc pag. 105. li. 32. Your sixt and last maine cause is that Christ by this his bloudie sweate and ãâã praiers did nothing but voluntarily performe that bloudie offering and Priesthood ãâã in the Law This we simply grant If you should truely repeat and conceiue any part The ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã agonie of my writings you should put your selfe to more paines than you are willing to take iustly to refute it Wherefore your course is either to misrecite or to misconstrue all that you bring In the oblations of the Law which prefigured the death of Christ I obserued that not only the Sacrifice was slaine by the shedding of bloud but that the person of the Priest was sanctified as well as the sinner presented by the Priest to God with earnest and humble prayer to make atonement for the trespasse And since the trueth must haue some resemblance with the figure Christ might in the Garden performe some points requisite to his Priesthood as the sanctifying of himselfe with his owne bloud and presenting his bodie to be the redemption and remission of our sinnes with most instant and intentiue prayer for the transgressours This if you simply graunt as in wordes you say you doe tell vs now which way you will conclude Christes suffering of hell paines in the Garden from his bloudie sweat It hindereth not our assertion Much lesse doeth it further it but yet if there might be a cause of Christes voluntarie sprinckling himselfe with his owne bloud and dedicating it to Gods pleasure for mans redemption besides and without your hellish torments you will come shorter than you recken to make good your conclusion i Defenc. pag. 106. The Scriptures which you cite prooue indeed that Christ now executed his office of Priesthood but will you diuide and exempt his death on the Crosse from his Priesthood Who besides your selfe restraineth Christes euerlasting Priesthood either to the garden or to the crosse But it was one thing for Christ with feruent and submissiue prayer to present and submit his bodie which was his Sacrifice to the will of his Father as he did in the garden and another thing to receiue and admit the violent and wicked hands of the Iewes executing their rage on his bodie with all reproch and crueltie as he did on the crosse Now what had his Priesthood to do with the paines of hell since he was to present and performe the bloudie sacrifice of his bodie prefigured in the Law which he did in the garden and on the crosse And forsomuch as you grant that Christes bloudy sweat and his vehement prayers in the garden were pertinents to his Priesthood prefigured in the Law which indeed is k Hebr. 5. confirmed by the Apostle as you can shew no figure of suffering hell paines or the second death in the sacrifices of the Law no more doth either of these performed in the garden concerne any secret death of the soule which Christ there suffered from the immediate hand of God l Defenc. pag. 106. li. 14. Why say you not aswell that his death
the Garden and complained on the Crosse as if he were forsaken which things they thought vnfit for him that was God The Fathers to repell their heresie and to open this obscuritie insist plainly on these points that the Mediatour must be God as well as man and that the Godhead of Christ incarnate was impassible and could not suffer any violence or change but his manhood might and did suffer somethings in soule as feare and sorow and somethings in bodie as paines and death But generally when they speake of death they neuer intend as you doc the death of Christes soule as well as of his bodie but they meane plainly the death of the Crosse described by the Euangelists which is farre from the second death or the death of the damned c Defenc. pag. 111. li. 36. The very same doth Hilarie also where he sayth that this in Christ was Corporis vox The outcrie of his bodie he plainly meaneth it of his whole manhood the opposition being betweene it and his Godhead as the Scripture often doth If your authoritie be such that you may take bodie for soule and life for death where you will you may soone make a shew that the Fathers intend nothing against your doctrine but if you must proue it as well as say it then is it the most riotous and most ridiculous course that can be to take one contrarie for another for so you may proue darknesse to be light vice to be vertue falshood to be trueth and infidelitie to be faith What the Fathers taught touching the death of Christes soule when we come to the place we shall plainly see by their owne asserting and not by your peruerting in the meane time you were best bring stronger proofes than these that you will take the bodie for the soule if you meane to conclude any thing out of the Fathers for your croslegged doctrine d Trea. pag. 9. The Scripture often doth the like you say as you haue shewed in your Treatise There you haue childishly abused a number of Scriptures and yet no way prooued that any where the bodie signifieth the soule or standeth for the soule That the soule is a consequent to the bodie and the bodie likewise a consequent to the soule wheresoeuer The sââ¦ule is a cââ¦nsequent to ãâã ãâã ãâã but no part of it the Scripture speaketh of men liuing heere on earth is a sure and safe rule because no man heere liueth that doeth not consist of soule and bodie yet that is no proofe that what is attributed to the bodie must be verified of the soule much lesse that the one must be taken for the other Looke but to your owne examples where bodie is named e Rom. 6. Let not sinne reigne in your mortall bodies sayth the Apostle If here you will comprehend the soule vnder the name of the bodie you must grant in exact words that the soule is mortall which is an open heresie destroying the summe and effect of the Christian faith Againe f 1. Cor. 6. Euery sinne that a man doth is without the body but the fornicato-sinneth against his owne bodie If in this place the bodie conclude the soule then euery sinne saue fornication is without soule and body and consequently no sinne which is a doctrine a man would thinke meet for no Diuine The third instance which you bring hath not so grosse sequels but as plaine falshoods g Hebr. 10. Sacrifice and burnt offerings thou wouldest not but a bodie hââ¦st thou ordained me whereof the sacrifices offered by the Law were h Ibid. vers 1. shadowes Now did the bodies of beasts slaine or their bloud shed prefigure the Soule of Christ or the death of his bodie These be the places on which you build your vnsound obseruation that the Scripture doth often take the bodie for the soule which are so sensibly false that they need no Refuter But we reason of death which seuereth the soule from the bodie and therein to say the bodie must be taken for the soule is a very sincke of sottish absurdities and falsities For what can be more repugnant to trueth and sense than to take a dead bodie for a liuing soule and when they are so farre seuered by nature to say they must agree in name and the one be called the other Peruse now the Fathers which you would faine wrest to your purpose and see whether they doe not flatly contradict your deuice that the body in their speaches must be taken for the whole man and so the death of Christes body for the death as well of soule as of the body Epiphanius is the first that you would frustrate with your deuices and the first that shall conuince your falshood He saith the manhood of Christ spake these words Now seeing the deity together with the soule moouing to forsake his sacred body What death call you that where the soule moueth and forsaketh the body then in that complaint of Christs the thing forsaken was his body alone by the iudgement of Epiphanius and the deity i Epiph. contra ãâã ãâã 69. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã together with the soule did mooue ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã to forsake that sacred body Which way doth this prooue the soule or the whole manhood of Christ to be forsaken when Epiphanius expresly saith the deity with the soule did mooue to forsake the body Hilarie is the next whom you would infect with your fansie but finding no words in him meet for your matter you are forced shamefully to misconster the body for the soule and the death of the one for the death of the other which is all the hold you haue in Hilarie though you lustily would beare out the rest with the copy of your countenance Notwithstanding Hilarie doth not only preuent but also refute your mistaking For in plaine words he saith k ãâã ãâã ãâã 10. Querela derelicti morientis infirmit as est traditio spirit us morientis excessio est The complaint of Christ that he was forsaken was the infirmity of one dying the yeelding vp his spirit was his departure hence when he died And againe Tradens spiritum mortuus est Christ died by deliuering vp his spirit Sepultus est Christus quia mortuus est mortuus autem est quia moriturus locutus est Deus Deus meus quare me dereliquisti Christ was buried because he was dead and ready to die he said My God my God why hast thou forsaken me So that Christes death when he spake those words was not past nor present but then to come as Hilarie noteth by the future tence and was the deliuering vp of his spirit into his fathers hands I trust you dare not defend that Christ in or after the deliuering vp of his spirit suffered the paines of hell or the second death and yet saith Hilarie those words Christ spake of his death that was to come Tertullian is the last whose words though
Then notwithstanding your exception not worth a straw these are two maine grounds of the Christian faith that Christ dying descended to the decpe and rising ascended to heauen and hee that but doubteth in his heart of either of these by the apostles verdict emptieth and reuerseth Christs death and resurrection And did not this latter question who can descend to the deepe pertaine directly vnto Christ who onely of all men that euer were descended to the deepe of Hell and returned againe with safetie and glory we might not onely iustly doubt whoeââ¦er besides Christ descended to the deepe of the earth but our faith teacheth vs plainely ââ¦o denââ¦e that euer man Christ cxcepted did descend to the deepe supposing now that to signifie hell as you doe and yet doth not our faith frustrate the death of Christ but therein rather commend it and exalt it that neuer man was able to doe as he did that is dying and descending to subiect hell vnder his power and to deliuer all his from thence So that if the deepe heere doe signifie hell then is heere a plaine resolution of the Apostle that Christ dying descended to hell Now least you should take any pride in your peââ¦ting answere not worth a tagge of of a blew point the Reader shall see that all interpreters old and new and euen those on whom you would seeme most to relie haue with one consent comprised the person of Christ in these two questions and yeelded the Apostles answcre to be very extrauagant which God forbid vnlesse Christ were comprised as well in the questions as in the answeres Oecumenius The Apostle referreth these things to Christ. That is wauer not neither say in thy mind how did Christ descend from heauen or did Christ being dead rise from the deepe that is from the lowest places cast all such thoughts out of thy mind Theophylact. Stagger not saith the apostle neither doubtingly cast this in thy mind how Christ descended from heauen or how after death he rose from the deepe id est ex abditissimo profundissimo loco that is from the deepest and most hidden place Erasmus Who shall ascend to heauen that being spoken of the Law Paul interpreteth and applieth to Christ. For that is saith he to draw Christ from heauen Or who shall descend into the deepe that is who will beleeue the things that are spoken of hell except he see them this is sayth Paul to draw Christ backe from the dead as though he did not descend to hell or they desired that in their sight he would againe descend to hell Peter Martyr thus setteth the Apostles questions Who shall ascend to heauen to see whether God bee reconciled to vs by Christ or who shall descend downe into the deepe to see euerlasting death weakned and abolished by him that is by Christ Bucere The Apostle acknowledgeth in this question the deniall of Christ and that he draweth Christ downe from heauen which admitteth this doubt It is euident that the deepe is taken pro inferis for hell and in this sense the Apostle seemeth to haue vsed this word the deepe for hee addeth that is to bring Christ backe from the dead to wit to account his descent to hell to be void and his victorie ouer death and Gehenna Hyperiââ¦s Say not who shall descend into the deepe thou art eased of this trouble by Christs resurrection from the dead and from hell Gualtere Who shall descend to the deepe to see whether death be disarmed hell gates broken open the Diuels kingdome subuerted and we truely redeemed from all these doâ⦠not they denie death to haue beene conquered by the merit and resurrection of Christ and therefore would haue him againe to die and to returne to hell to doe that once more which he hath alreadie performed Piscator The heart of him that beleeueth doth not descend by his thoughts to the deepe to trie whether victorie be obtained against eternall death For if he doubt of this he must also doubt whether Christ were dead ad inferos descender it and descended to hell Beza Because the law proposed heauen but vnder an impossible condition and threatned the deepe that is destruction for the offence to which we are all subiect whosoeuer cleaueth to the righteousnesse of the law of force is compelled to crie out who shall ascend to heauen or descena into the deepe to take me hence and lead me thither But contrariwise faith suggesteth that Christ is he which ascended to heauen to carrie vs thââ¦ther with him and descended into the depth of death to abolish him that had power of death Take which of these expositions you will it is euident in euery one of them that by the Christian faith both these impossible actions as man thinketh of ascending to heauen and descending to the deepe were performed for vs in the person of Christ and therefore now to doubt of either is to weaken eneruate the power of Christ who most perfectly hath accomplished both to saue vs from one and bring vs to the other And heere also by the deepe those whom you would seeme to follow vnderstand destruction and eternall death as all the rest doe from which Christ hath freed vs by descending and destroying them for vs. This I say the dead heere importeth the generall condition and state of all the dead as it is opposed to the state of the liuing Yea it is not vnlikely that the former word Abyssâ⦠the deepe is vsed also heere by the Apostle to signifie not hell but euen this condition and state of death which is a gulfe bottomlesse neuer satisfied and vnrecouerable like as Sheôl in Hebrew doth likewise properly signifie You shew your selfe by your saying to haue little care what you say that not onely you crosse all Expositors without exception but euen the Scriptures themselues without any respect of trueth or touch of conscience For where the Apostle proposeth this last point Who shall descend to the deepe and returne againe as possible onely to Christ and to none else by your vntidie tale that the deepe heere signifieth the generall condition of the dead opposed to the liuing you make the apostle a weake reasoner or rather a plaine lyer For could Paul at this time be ignorant that Elias and Elizeus raised some from the generall condition of the dead that Christ restored three from death Peter did the like for Tabitha Is there not plaine testimonie giuen in the Scriptures that through faith the women receaued their dead raised to life If this were not onely possible but so vsuall as the Scriptures declare how could Paul make this actioÌ of descending to the deepe possible but only to Christ wherefore I say you must be better aduised or else you shew yourselfe in an open and impudent falshood to ruffle and reuell with the holy Ghost testifying that many haue gone to the condition
of the dead opposed to the lyuing and yet bin restored to life againe And consequently in spite of your heart Abyssus the bottomles deepe must not onely keepe his signification perpetuall in the new Testament which is the place appointed for the diuels but descending thither with returne must import an impossible condition to all men ââ¦aue onely to Christ which in the generall condition and state of the dead is nothing so Besides that the condemned to hell are truely dead and so called in the Scriptures is vnknowne to none of any learning saue to you Death and hell saith Saint Iohn deliuered vp their dead And if the second death bâ⦠the truest and terriblest death that is wherein both soule and body are for euer dead then hell is most properly the place of the dead since all there are adiudged to euerlasting death where in the condition of death opposed to the liuing heere on earth the soules of the Saints doe liue with God and taste neither torment nor death Touching the word Abyssus the bottomlesse pit with which you play at your pleasure this may sufââ¦ce that throughout the Scriptures the word is neuer vsed for the graue For the depth of the sea and bottom of earth it is vsed in the old Testament and metaphorically for the deepe counsels of God and desperate troubles of men but in the new Testament it is onely vsed for the bottomlesse pitte whither Diuels are afraid to goe as appeareth by their petition to Christ not to be commanded to depart ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã into the bottomlesse deep and where they are lockt and kept when pleaseth God This meaning the Syriacke translator an auncient writer of no small credit seemeth to haue sith he turneth it abyssum sepulchri the deepe of the graue The Syriacke translation I reuerence for antiquity but you bring the Latin traÌslator of the Syriacke that is partiall by your leaue rendreth the Syriacke word according to his owne supposition For though the man were very learned that made the Latin translation yet in this and some other things he yeelded ouer much to the priuate affections of some men with whom he liued conuersed The words in Syriacke are who shall descend latââ¦ehuma dashiul to the deep of sheiul Where sheiul in Syriacke hath the same deriuation and signification that Sheôl hath in Hebrew and therefore standeth as indifferent to the Sheââ¦l of soules which is hell as of bodies which is the graue Againe Tehuma in Syriacke being all one whith tehoma in Chalday and thence taken as they both are froÌ tehom in Hebrew and throughout the Scriptures tehom the deepe being neuer applied to the graue but to the great and vnsearchable deepes of the sea of the earth and of hell it hath neither sense nor truth that Tehuma in this place should be applied to the six foot depth of a graue Lastly Tehuma without addition is vsed by the Sayriack Translator for the deepe of hell to which the Diuels desired not to be sent And sheiul alone is also put by him to signifie the place of torment where the rich Gluttons soule was punished after death The Arabicke Translator keepeth the same sense which the Syriack doth saying who is he that descended ILEY AFFAâ⦠LGIAHIM to the lower places of hell GIAHIM being vsed by the same Translator in S. Lukes Gospell to expresse the place where the Rich mans soule after death was tormented So that the Syriacke Arabicke Translators fully refute your conceit of the graue besides the sound and sufficient reason alleadged formerly by me to which Translators must confirme their words that the Apostles speach heere cannot be construed of the graue without a manifest and inexcusable falsehood For where then the sense of these words must be None euer descended to the graue that returned saue Christ this is so false that children will not endure it to be thought Apostolike therefore will you nill you the bottomlesse deepe here in this place of the apostle must signifie that deepe to which neuer man descended and returned but only Christ. Which if it be not hell we desire to know of you and your friends what place you can plot vs out to fitte these words The Apostle may also insinuate in this word a seeking to the deepest and fardest parts of the sea to learne somewhere if it might be among all the creatures how to fulfill keepe the law For so Moses whom here he doth cite expressely signifieth then so the Apostle also signifieth the very same You thought the Sextens would deride you if you should rest on this resolution that euery day they digge bottomlesse pits to burie men in when they themselues so easily get out of them and therefore you now put forth to sea and goe a diuing to see whether you can catch cockles in the deepe or no to learne of them how the law of God may be fulfilled A pattern of your profound learning if a man would seeke he shall need goe no farder then this Page and the next where he shall find how ignorantly absurdly and vntruely you roue at the matter and meaning of Moses and Paul and misse them both as wide as the sea is broad For Moses speaketh no word of the depth of the sea much lesse of seeking to all creatures how the law of God might be fulfilled Neither doth the Apostle exactly cite the wordes of Moses as you imagine but somewhat altereth them that he may fitte them to Christ with greater effect and comfort then Moses could vnto the law Moses speach is faire and plaine The Iewes to whom he deliuered the law written could not pretend the knowledge of Gods will to be hidde in heauen nor farre remooued from them beyond the seas that they should wish some would goe vp to heauen to bring it them or ouer the sea to fetch it but the word saith Moses to the people is very neere vnto thee in thy mouth and in thine heart for to doe it That is written before thine eies that thou mightest read it and pronounced in thine eares that thou maiest remember it if thou wilt take heed to obserue it I take heauen and earth to record I haue set before thee life and death blessing and cursing Moses doth not say the performing of the law was not in heauen nor beyond the sea but the knowledg of the law Otherwise you make Moses teach that the fulfilling of the law was in their mouthes hearts which is an open error and repugnant to the trueth of the Gospell For if righteousnesse might be by the law then Christ died without cause As you come nothing neere to Moses meaning so you swarue farder from Pauls The right way to decline death threatned to the breakers of the law and to obteine life promised to the obseruers thereof is not to looke to the law which we cannot obserue but to Christ who
ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã Hades below was stirred to meete thee So likewise he citeth and alloweth Platoes words When death draweth neere the tales that are told ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã of things in Hades how he that heere dealeth vniustly shall there be punished and were laughed at then trouble the soule least they prooue true Irââ¦us saith Heerein Christ legem mortuorum seruauit did as other doe that diâ⦠and conuersed three daies vbi erant mortui sancti where the dead Saints were And this he calleth locum inuisibilem the vnseene world What meaneth thiâ⦠but Hades as we take it yea a little before he expresly calleth it Paradise Neuerthelesse I grââ¦nt that he thought this vnseene world was indeed beneath in the earth Wherein his proofes doe vtterly faile him as you your selfe doe fully grant and professe in this point as well as we In time you may learne some skill to alter and counterfait the Fathers writings but as yet your cunning faileth you You doe not marke or will not see that Irenaeus in this Chapter expresly confuteth a number of your positions and subuerteth the whole frame of your meere priuatiue Sheol and not Irenaeus but your sense put to Irenaeus his words against his manifest meaning is all the hold you haue in thisplace Irenaeus condemneth two of your assertions as erroneous the one that Christes soule after death went vpward to heauen and descended not downeward to the lower parts of the earth The next that the soules of the Saints as soone as they die ascend to the highest heauens Haeretici simulatque mortui fuerââ¦t dicââ¦t se supergredicaelos Hereticks as soone as they be dead say they ascend aboue the heauens They will not vnderstand that if this were so as they say the Lord himselfe surely would not haue made his resurrection on the third day sed super crucem expirans confestim vtique abiââ¦sset sursum relinquens corpus terrae but giuing vp the ghost on the crosse would no doubt haue straightwaies gone vpward leauing his bodie to the earth But now he staied three daies where the dead were As he refelleth your imaginations so he nothing relieueth your assertions though you touch nothing of his which you turne not awrie with corrupting his sense or his sentence Christ kept the law of the dead saith Irenaeus that is say you he did but as others that die and conuersed three dââ¦es where the dead Saints were The lawe of the dead which Irenaeus heere speaketh of is to expect the resurrection of their bodies till the time prefixed by God His wordes are As then our Master non statiââ¦ââ¦lans abiâ⦠did not straight after death ascend vp but staied the time appointed for his resurrection by the Father so we ought to endure the time of our resurrection prefixed by God and so to be assumed as many as the Lord shall count woorthy You make a new law of your owne for the dead which Irenaeus neuer thought of and the iââ¦sible place appointed for their soules vntill the resurrection if you will haue it to be the same which Irenaeus saith Christ had must be the lower parts of the earth which I trust is not Paradise If therefore saith he the Lord obserued the law of the dead and staying vntill the third day in the lower parts of the earth then rose in his flesh and so ascended to his father how should they not be confounded who say their inward man leauing the body heere in supercelestem ascendere locum ascendeth to the highest place of heauen Touching the place where Christs soule seuered from his bodie was as the transcriber or printer before you mistooke the word sanctorum in Irenaeus for sanctus so you the second time corrupt the same in saying Christ conuersed three daies where the dead Saints were in steed of Vbi erant mortui where the dead were This place is twise before alleadged by Irenaeus where the word sanctus is referred to God and not to the dead Commemoratus est dominus sanctus Israel mortuorum suorum qui dormierant in terra sepultionis The Lord the holy one of Israêl remembred his dead which slept in the earth of their buriall and descended to them So in his 4 booke and 39 chapter he repeateth it againe Recommemoratus est dominus sanctus Israel mortuorum suorum qui prââ¦dormierunt in terra defossionis The Lord the holy one of Israel remembred his dead which before his comming had slept in the earth digged to lay them in that is in their Graues Iustine Martyr citeth the Greeke words to like effect The Lord God out of Israel remembred his dead that slept ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã in their graues This being the true tenor or translation of this sentence it is euident that the transcriber or printer of Ireneus mistooke Sanctorum for Sanctus and you more wilfully presume to put the word Sanctus to the former period of purpose to imply that Christ went no whither but where the souls of his Saints were But you vtterlie peruert Ireneus meaning for Christs going to them doth not exclude his goinge els whither and in those generall words Christ conuersed three dayes with the dead are comprised not only the graue and place of buriall where the Lords dead were but as appeareth by Ireneus proofes following the Heart and lower parts of the earth euen the nethermost Infernum hell where others were which were no Saints and the souls of the Saints were not except you mind to establish Limbus out of these words Now what hath your priuatiue Sheól and Hades to do with these words heere are places described in the earth and vnder the earth where if you set the soules of the Saints vntill the day of resurrection you empty Paradise and quite deny the Saints deceased to be in any part of heauen since heauen is aboue and not vnder the earth And though you say Ireneus proofes doe faile him for his purpose they are plaine and full as that Christ was in the heart of the earth and descended to the lower parts of the earth and that of Dauid applied by him to Christ Thou hast deliuered my soule from the nethermost hell There is therfore nothing in these words of Ireneus that fauoreth your new found hades though the souls of Christs disciples after death be granted to go to an muisible place prepared for them by God which whether it be Paradise or heauen or a place vnder earth for thither ââ¦aith Ireneus Christ descended but he doth not say that the souls of his Disciples shall thither goe till the resurrection as you falsly collect it cannot be your hades which is a meere priuation of this life and hath no positiue thing in it much lesââ¦e a certaine and defined place for the soules of his Saints And where you presume as your manner is that Ireneus a little before calleth this
inuisible place expresly Paradise if that were so you must then confesse your hades is not common to good and bad and hath in it not only an heauenly place but an happie state which I trust you will not allow to the wicked and so hades and heauen to be all one with you which thing you so much disclaime But by your leaue it is not so your friends and you are ouerbold with Ireneus to make him say what you list Six and twenty Chapters before this he saith the elders which were the Apostles Disciples deliuered that such as were translated that is remooued hence with their bodies without dying as Enoch and Elias were translated thither euen to Paradise and there remaine they which were translated euen to the end shewing now a beginning of incorruption Againe he further sheweth that in the Scripture he taketh hades to be al one with death or the dominion of death where he readeth the text thus Vbi est mors aculeus tuus Vbi est mors victoria tua Death where is thy sting Death where is thy victory You shew your selfe to be well read in the fathers that cannot tell whether Ireneus wrote in Greeke or in Latin and therefore in steed of a most learned and most eloquent writer as Ierom calleth him you bring vs the authority of an vnknowen and obscure interpreter Were there no more but the very place euen now cited and abused by your selfe the parts whereof are found in Ireneus thrice after three seuerall interpretations as for example in Terra sepultionis in terra defossionis in terra stipulationis it were enough to shew the Author neuer wrote in Latine that varieth so much from himselfe and that the translator was verie seely but there are other arguments infinite the Greeke wordes expressing the conceits of heretikes aboue 120 euery where be retained the stile throughout exactly resembling the Greeke phrase the manifold citations thereof by the Greeke Fathers as 18. whole Chapters by Epiphanius 22. peeces and parts thereof by Eusebius and 14. by Theodoret besides Polycarpe his instructor and teacher euen in his youth who was altogether a Grecian But we shall not need to seeke reasons for it since Ierom so many hundred yeeres agoe when the originall was extant numbreth Ireneus amongst the Greek writers We shall seeme saith he to crosse the opinions of many auncient writers of the Latins Tertullian Victorinus Lactantius of the Greekes o omit the rest I will make mention onely of Ireneus Bishop of Lions And againe To name the Greeke writers and to ioine the first and last together Ireneus and Apollinarius Ireneus then writing in Greeke and citing the Apostles words likewise in Greek you cannot proue by the rude and late translation of his works which we haue how he read the Apostles text Gregorie Bishop of Rome more then 600 yeeres after Christ saith Scripta beati Irenei iamdiu est quòd solicite quaesiuimus sed hactenus ex ââ¦is inueniri aliquid non potuit The writings of blessed Ireneus we haue long and carefully sought for but hitherto nothing of his can be found he meaneth in Latin for before and after euerie Greek diuine as Basil Cyril Theodoret Occumenius Aretas Anastasius Damascen Procopius Nicetas cite Irenaeus workes and words The Latin translation of the Apostles words 1 Corinth 15 Death where is thy sting death where is thy victory I shall haue fitter occasion by and by to examine Tertullian doth likewise For speaking of Inferi which he taketh for the same that hades is he noteth it as the place quo vniuersa humanitas trahitur whither all mankind must goe and therefore of Christes going thither he saith Because he was a man therefore hee died according to the Scriptures and was buried according to the same also heere he satisfied the common law of nature by following the forme of mens dying and going to the world of the dead If you should not peruert both Tertullians wordes and sense neither would make for your purpose And though you gain not much by corrupting the coherence of his wordes yet are you so vsed to haue all to your liking that you cannot hold your hand from disordering other mens speeches Christ saith Tertullian being God because he was also man and died according to the Scriptures and was buried according to the same euen in this satisfied the law by performing the course of an humane death apud Inferos in the places below In steed of Legi the law you say the common law of nature apud Inferos you translate going to the world of the dead These bee your fansies added to Tertullians wordes and no parts of his purpose In the meane while you dissemble and therein abuse both your selfe and your Reader that euen in that Chapter and the sentence before Tertullian describeth Inferi to be a place vnder the earth whither the soules of good and bad descend after death the good to a kind of refreshing which is plainely Limbus so much refused by your selfe the bad to punishment His wordes in the fiue and fiftie Chapter which you quote precedent to those which you cite are these Nobis inferi non nuda cauositas nec sub diualis aliqua mundi sentina creduntur sed in fossa Terrae in alto vastitas in ipsis visceribus eius abstrusa profunditas Siquidem Christum in corde Terrae triduum mort is legimus expunctum id est in recessu intimo interno in ipsa Terrâ⦠operto intra ipsam cauato inferioribus adhuc abyssis superstructo We beleeue Inferi to be no bare hollownesse nor any sincke vnder the world but in the gulfe of the earth and in the depth of vastitie and in the very bowels of the earth an abstruse profunditie For we reade that Christ was the three dayes of his death in the heart of the earth that is in an inward place within the midst thereof and couered with the earth and hollowed within the same and seated ouer mighty deepes below If this be your world of the dead let any man of vnderstanding iudge whether this be not a plaine euident description of that which the latter writers called Limbus and whether there can be any fuller delineation of it then a place vnder the earth and in the midst thereof euen hollowed in the bowels of the earth and couered with the same hauing vnder it mighty deepes And that in it there is as well rest for the good as torments for the wicked And the continuation of the very same sentence which you guilefully bring for your world of dead and the conclusion of both are deliuered by Tertullian in these words if Christ did performe the course of an humanc death in places below neither did ascend into the higth of the heauens before he descended into the lower parts of the earth there to make the
may doe well to leaue this outfacing Scriptures and Fathers it may seeme a shift for a time but it will end with your shame By the whole text it is euident Peter had no reason nor purpose to speake to the Iewes of Christes soule being in hell If you may be iudge Peter shall say nothing but what hitteth your hand right It is more then plain by the whole purport of Peters speech that he ment to prooue Christ to be raised vp as Lord of all his enemies and Sauiour of all that obey him To rise simply from death was not sufficient to shew the eternitie and soueraigntie of Christs kingdome but he must be raised as the only Lord that should sit on Dauids throne and haue all things in heauen earth and hell subiected vnto him From our enemies if hee could not deliuer vs he could be no Sauiour of ours he must therefore tread them all vnder his feete when he rose from death before we could hope to be freed from them by his force And to this end Peter expresly maketh mention that God scattered the sorrowes of death and hell before him when he raised him vp that all the faithfull might be assured as Christ conquered and destroied the diuell in his owne person when he rose from the graue so he could and would doe the like for all his members by freeing them from the power of Hades and conforming them to his death and resurrection This God had promised to his people by his Prophet saying I will redeeme them from the hand of hell I will deliuer them from death O death I will be thy death O hell I will be thy destruction Repentance is hid from mine eies This Dauid foretold the Messias should performe in that his soule should not be forsaken that is left destitute of power or honour no not in hell Of this deliuerance from their enemies and from the handes of all that hated them spake the Prophets that were from the beginning of the worlde This was the oath that God sware to Abraham that they being deliuered out of the handes of their enimies should serue him without feare of sinne death or hell This the Iewes beleeued and expected in the Messias and therefore neither were they I meane the elect among them so ignorant vnbeleeuing and stubborne as you pretend three thousand being conuerted with this one Sermon neither was this so strange and vncouth a thing as you imagine being so often promised and prophesied vnto them Neither did Peter intend onely Christes resurrection as you suppose his chiefe scope being to shew them the strength and height of Christs heauenly kingdome And where you flourish that this was not subiect to sense and without all example of the like in the whole law and namely no figure foreshewing any such thing these be obiections meeter for perfidious Iewes then for those that would seeme to be beleeuers How many points of faith are not subiect to sense Christes sitting at the right hande of God in glorie will you not beleeue because it is not subiect to sense and without an example of the like and no figure foreshadowing any such matter Of Christes ascending to heauen and his returne to iudge the quicke and the dead haue you any examples or figures in the whole law and yet it is no such hard matter to proportion our deliuerance from hell and Satan to the bondage of Israell in Egypt and the ouerwhelming of Pharoh and all his host in the bottom of the redde sea The like might be said of Sampsons death who being weake and bound slew all his enemies of Dauid and Goliah of Daniell in the Lyons denne without harme of Ionas lying in the Whales bellie and such like which though in all things they match not Christs conquest ouer Satan and the destruction of him and his kingdome as no figures can do yet are they resemblances of that which you so much dissemble Howbeit as I said of Christes birth buriall descending to Hades rising ascending sitting in heauen and comming to iudge the law did not yeeld any expresse and visible figures as it did of his death and sacrifice We haue seene that Hades hath no such meaning in the Acts which yet is the only place whereon you build This were sufficient to end this argument but yet it shall be good to trie whether any where hades properly signifieth hell Verily it doth so signifie no where at all in the Scriptures Yet I graunt it is and ought to be translated hell in two places Matth. 16. v. 18. Luk. 16. v. 23. not that the word it selfe doth necessarily signifie hell but because the circumstances heere doe require that meaning as the fittest and best for these particular purposes We haue seene you beate your braines about Hades to make it any thing rather then tha tindeed it is both by the generall opinion of all Pagan Poets and by the constant assertion of all the Greeke Fathers We haue also seene you turne winde your selfe you know not whither sometimes to haue it the place for soules departed this world sometimes the state of such soules sometimes the power of death and sometimes the priuation of this life and so to crosse and controle your owne conceits that you could not tell where to set foote without falling Now as he that is blinde maketh no difference betwixt day and night no more doth your wilfull yet witlesse imagination perceaue any distance betwixt trueth and falshood And hauing held your owne so well that no shifting or shuffling can make you ashamed you will now proceed to a farder triall of other texts of Scriptures to see whether you can outface them with your fansies and figures as you haue done them that be already ouerpast I make no doubt but if you may sit sole Iudge in your owne cause you will quickly pronounce for your selfe but if you must prooue as well as pronounce you will make as many errors in your proceedings as there be holes in a sieue Howbeit you grant that in two places of the new Testament Hades is and ought to be translated hell not for that the word of it self doth so necessarily signifie but because the circumstances require that meaning Which is as much as if you said there are two places in the new Testament where hades is must be taken for hel neither can you with all your sleights shifts auoid the same the circumstances of the text so euidently demonstrate the Euangelists tooke hades for hell This by your leaue is some preiudice to your cause and a bridle to your boldnesse that the holy Ghost doth twice in the Gospels by your owne confession vse hades for hell and why he doth not vse it in that sense in other places there is no impediment but your proud will and waste wordes Saint Luke is so cleere as no exception can be taken to it that Hades is the
as you doe tending all to expresse one thing but seeke a little to shew vs what matter is contained in them you should soone see what labour you haue lost in this Carrecke of words which you haue newly brought vs home Your meere and simple death which you say is nothing els but the going asunder of the soule from the body hath of necessitie thus much in it It is the separation of the soule from the body which is the cause of life in the body It is the dissolution of the person which consisteth of body and soule It is the priuation of life which endeth with the departing of the soule It is the continuing of death since possibly there is no regresse from the priuation to the habite without the mightie hand of God working aboue nature For the soule departing neuer returneth till God commaund by whose word heauen and earth were made What now after death becommeth of both parts of man is no hard matter to conceaue Salomon saith Dust meaning flesh first made of dust returneth to earth as it was and the spirit to God that gaue it by him to be disposed and adiudged to ioy or paine as pleaseth him The body then goeth to corruption the soule receaueth iudgement where it shall remaine in hell or heauen till the bodie be restored againe which shall be at the last day Descending to hades after death cannot be verified of the whole person of man but in respect of the parts Referred to the body it is as much as buried and laide in the place where it shall putrifie and returne to dust Applied to the soule it must signifie the place to which the soule is caried which I say must be vnder earth since heauen is neuer called by that name nor expressed by that word either in the Scriptures or in any other sacred or prophane writers The power and dominion of death which you so much speake of is nothing else but Gods ordinance that from death there is no returne to life till hee appoint If then there be no dominion nor kingdome of death preuailing or ruling in heauen where the soules of the Saints are without their bodies then Christ in ascending to heauen descended not to Hades Againe with what trueth can you auouch Christes soule came vnder the full power and dominion of death since death had no power ouer the bodie or soule of Christ longer or farder then he himselfe would permit and his soule free from all bands and paines of death destroied the dominion and kingdome of death to which it was alwaies superiour and neuer subiect but onely that he might shew himselfe with greater power to be conquerer of death rather in rising from the dead then in declining the force of death as if he were not able after death and in death to dissolue the dominion and power of death Wherefore your exaggerating the power and dominion of death OVER THE SOVLE of Christ and that IN HEAVEN whither you graunt Christes soule went after death is not onely a vaine and idle flourish but a poisoned and pestilent doctrine if you take not heed to it since no power of death but Christes will to shew himselfe Lord of life and death either seuered his soule from his bodie or bestowed his soule in any place after death or detained him in the condition of death but he was free to die when he would and rise from death when he would which euerteth all power and dominion of death ouer him how much soeuer in wastefull wordes you auouch the contrarie Touching the proprietie of wordes that you say is as true as the rest For Hades hath no such natiue and proper sense as you talke of but exactly and directly when it is referred to a place and not to a person signifieth a place of darknesse where nothing can be seene as with one consent Heathen and Christian writers acknowledge And the word descending after death which you must applie to the soule ascending to heauen you childishly change into the fall of the person from lise to death or inconstantly varie you know not how to Christes submission when he died or his abasement by lying held and subdued so long time in death Where againe you incurre the same sands that you did before in affirming Christ was held and subdued of death for the time which is plainly false doctrine since he would abide that time in death least any should thinke him not truely dead but was neuer vnder the power and dominion of death And as for lying held in death that phrase is strangely referred to the soule of Christ which ascended to the third heauen with more honour and ioy then it receaued in this life heere on earth What Ruffine saith is not much to be regarded if we beleeue S. Ierom neither was Ruffines faith sound nor his authoritie any thing in the Church and yet were he woorth the respecting he maketh more against you then for you For first these wordes are not vsed as an exposition of Christs descent to Hades but Ruffine saith Diuina natura in mortem per carnem descendit non vt lege mortalium detinerââ¦tur a Morte sed vt per se resurrecturus ianuas mortis aperiret The diuine nature of Christ descended to death by his flesh not to be held of death after the law of mortall men but that rising of himselfe hee might open the gates of death Where he saith the diuine nature descended to death he speaketh not of the soule but of the godhead of Christ which words by your leaue require a sober interpretation and yet in respect of the diuine glory the phrase of descending vnto death signifieth Christes submission to die not his descent after death And withall he refelleth two of your fansies first that Christ was was not held of death which you say he was Secondly that he followed not heerein the lââ¦w of mans nature which you say he did And that Christes soule descended to hell by Ruffines opinion his wordes are plaine enough in many places He applieth that to Christ which Dauid saith Thou hast brought my soule out of hell and alleaging the place of Peter In his spirit Christ preached to them which were in prison heerein saith ââ¦e it is declared quid operââ¦ââ¦gerit in Inferno What Christ did in hell So that the lesse hold you take of Ruffine the better for you and your cause he will doe more harme then good If any thinke this to be somewhat figuratiue yet is it verely so familiar and easie to all people as that other word in the Creede is he sitteth at the right hand of God yea it is farre easier When you can diue deepe into your owne fansies you thinke them as familiar to all others as to your selfe If this were so easie and readie with the simpler sort as you make it me thinkes it should not so much trouble
their Creede yet retained the sense and meaning of them in that they were perswaded this was the law of humane necessitie without Christ that as mens bodies were buried so their soules descended to hell which descent Christ refused not to restore men as Hilarie and others auouch This you say was Ruffines owne meaning who going about to proue by the Scripture that Christ descended to Infernum sheweth that he meaneth his death hereby his buriall I suppose few men will trust you hauing tried you false so often Ruffine going about to prooue by the Scripture of the old Testament that euery part of Christes passion and his resurrection was fore-shewed in the law and the Prophets plainely distinguisheth his death buriall and descent to Hell For Christs death he saith spiritum post haec scribitur reddidisse after this it is written that hee gaue vp the Ghost This was fore spoken by the Prophet saying into thy handes I commend my spirit Sepultus quoque perhibetur He is then said to be buried For which he alleageth a place of Ieremie and addeth Euidentissima haec Sepulturae eius indicia propheticis vocibus designata sunt accipe tamen alia These most manifest signes of his buriall are expressed in the Prophets speeches and yet thou shalt haue other Where he alleageth three other places of Scripture how fitly to his purpose I need not pronounce Then commeth he to Christes descent to hell and saith Sed quód in Infernum descendit euidenter praenunciatur in Psalmis That also he descended to hell is evidently fore told in the Psalmes Now whether his places bee aptly cited or no is not to the question though you make that your whole aduantage For first they be as aptly cited as the rest Next they haue euery one of them somewhat more in Rusfines apprehension then of Christes buriall For hee standeth not onely on those wordes the dust and corruption of death but hee fastneth most on the words of descending and bringing downe in limum profundi to the mire of the deepe Which things though you flurt at as waighing light in your eyes it is certaine he intended thereby more then the graue as is euident by his owne wordes For citing the place of Peter thus In which spirit Christ descended to preach to the spirits inclosed in prison which were incredulous in the dayes of Noe he addeth in quo quid operis egerââ¦m in Inferno declaratur in which it is declared what Christ did in hell In the graue I trust Christ did nothing In Paradise he did not preach to those that were in prison disobedient in the dayes of Noe. Since then this end of Christs descent to hell is expressed by Ruffinus and this could not bee done either in the graue where nothing can be done or in heauen where these disobedients were not in prison It is cleere that Ruffinus had no such meaning as you make him by Christes descent to intend no more but his death and buriall He holdeth indeed that Christ went downe to Infernum that is to Limbus patrum as an opinion then common among them and worthie as he thought to be beleeued If hee ment this as you now confesse then he ment more by Christes descending to Infernum then Christes death and buriall And so by your owne mouth you are conuinced of a lie fathered on Ruffinus against both his words meaning And yet I find no such expresse mention or description of Limbus in Ruffines words as you would seeme to impose vpon him He mentioneth Christs conquest ouer hell quód Inferna sibi Regna ãâã that Christ would subiect the Infernali kingdome to himselfe qui mortis habebat Imperium disruptis Inferni claustris velut de profundo tractus he that had the rule of death was drawen as it were from the deepe the cloisters of hell being broken open He saith also Animabus de Inferni captiuit ate reuocatis the soules being reuoked from the captiuitie of hell but whom he thereby meaneth he expressed before with the Apostles words when he said qui simul consuscitauit nos simulque sedere fecit in caelestibus Christ raised vs vp together with himselfe and made vs sit in heauenly places with him So that if you and your friends when you prate so much against all or the most of the auncient fathers as vpholding Limbus would bethinke your selues that most of them speake indifferently as well of the liuing and yet vnborne as of the dead before Christes time when they say that soules were deliuered out of the bondage and captiuitie of hell and Satan you should doe them lesse wrong and lesse deceaue your selues then now you doe And for those fathers that indeede were of this opinion that before Christes resurrection Abrahams bosome was vnder the earth you shall doe well to thinke and speake more reuerently of them considering what master Bullingere a learned and graue Diuine resolued euen of that point Sinus Abrahae aliud non est quam portus salutis vbi autem fuerat quondaÌ hic locus an apud superos an apud inferos nolo pronunciare imo malo ignorare quam temere definire quodliteris sacris expressum non habeo In his vt curiosus esse nolo ita nihil desinio cum nemine super hac re contendere volo Satis mihi est intelligere fateri veteres sanctos in refrigerio loco vtique certo non in tormentis ante ascensionem Domini fuisse vt maximé ignorem vbi ille locus fuerit The bosome of Abraham is nothing els but an entrance or port of saluation Where this place formerly was whether aboue in some part of the heauens or below vnder the earth I will not pronounce Yea I had rather be ignorant thereof then roshly to define that which I find not expressed in the Scriptures In these things as I will not be curious so doe I determine nothing neither will I contend with any man about this matter It shall suffice me to vnderstand and confesse that the godly of the old Testament were in a certaine place of rest not in terments before the oscension of Christ though I know not where that place was That it was no part nor member of hell we haue S. Austins firme resolution grounding himselfe on the words which our Sauiour in the Gospell ascribeth to Abraham Betweene you and vs there is a great gulfe setlââ¦d But whether it were vnder the earth till Christs resurrection of that some fathers doubted wherein we may not be reprochfull to them though we dissent from them since the Scriptures as this great Diuine thinketh expresly decide not the question Ignatius you thinke is cleerely yours likewise one Thaddeus by Eusebius report one of the 70. disciples which the Euangelist Luke speakes of Also Athanasius Creed Ignatiâ⦠saying Christ desââ¦ended to hades alone but rose againe with many meaneth euidently
no death of the Soule 519 The Fathers professe true fire to be in hell 46 The Fathers plainly remoue the death of Christs Soule from the worke of our redemption 330. 331 All Christs Feares were holy 215 Feare and sorrow in Christ were sufferings for sinne 345 Christs Feare in the Garden was religious 371 Christs ââ¦eare and sorrow were painfull but religious sufferings 372 What Feare and sorrow Christ was to yeelde vnto God when he offered the ransome of our sinnes 374 What things Christ might iustly and greatly feare in the Garden 380 ââ¦eare may be intellectââ¦ue or sensitiue 383 Christ might feare many thinges besides hell paines 385 Why Christ feared more then Mattyrs doe 395 Christ might iustly feare the pââ¦wer of Gods wrath 380 Figuratiuely the Soule may be said to be crucified 80 Fire in hell is not allegoââ¦icall 40. 41. 42. 43 The Fathers professe tââ¦ue fire to be in hell 46 It is possible that brimstone may bee mingled with fire in hell 47 The same fire punishââ¦th the wiââ¦ked both bââ¦fore and after iudgeââ¦ent 55 What fire did signifie in sacrifices 112. 113 What fire might note in the holocaust 116 How Christ was Forsaken on the crosse 409 How farre and wherein Christ was Forsaken are the things questioned 414 What forsaking could not be found in Christ 414 We were forsaken of God till Christ ãâã vs by his death 417 Christ neuer forsaken of hope and comfoââ¦t ââ¦7 God shewed by the present euent that he had not forsaken hââ¦s sââ¦nne 419 We stââ¦iue not for the word but for the sense and maner of forsaââ¦ing 431 G GEhenna was not vsed in speaking to the Gentiles 618 God can doc more then he will 23 Gods loue to Christ appeared euen in his death 20. 21 Gods purpose in the death and crosse of Christ. 154. 155. 156 God vseth meanes and instruments in punishing 33 God tempereth loue and iustice in punishing his elect 147. 255 God worketh good by euill 254 God is iust as well in forgiuing as in punishing sin 262 God was able to saue vs otherwise then by Christs death 287 God was the author of all Christes afflictions but not with his immediate hand 298. 299 God vieth his creatures to performe his iudgements 302 God is the principal agent in all our sufferings but not with his immediate hand 302 Gods hand worketh whatsoeuer meanes he vseth 300. 301 Gods loue to his sonne ouerswaied his hatred to our sinnes 268 Gods iustice in subiecting Satans kingdome to Christs manhood 230 The Gospell differeth much from the Law 264 How the Graue is aâ⦠habitation for the godly 575 God would not haue our flesh as yet freed from the Graue 670 Christ was not Guilââ¦y of our sinne though he took our punishment on him 162. 163 The whole man is guilty of all sinne 185. 186 187. 208 Guilty stretcheth as well to the punishment as to the fact .266 A mediator not guilty of the sinne for which he doth mediate 276 H HAdes what it signifiââ¦th with the Greeke Fathers 589. 590. 591. 592. 593 Hades what it is with Chrylostom 589 Athââ¦nasius taketh Hades for hell 599. 6ââ¦0 Hades in Athanasius Creed is not the graue 659 Hades with Ignatius is not the graue 657 The soules of the godly are not in Hadââ¦s 602 Hades is a place of darkenesse 609 How Hades is vsed in the new Testament 629 Hades with new writers is the graue or hell 609. 610 611 Hades is a place vnder the earth 613 Hades an vnseene and darke place 618 Hades in the Creed must signifie hell 649 Hades is not the ignominie of the graue 651 Hades was first the name of the diuell 615 Hades is hell or the diuell in the new Testament 619 Hades is hell in the new Testament without any figure 621 Why Hades signifieth hell in the new Tââ¦stament 647 Hades with the Pagans was the place not the state of the dead 616 The whole created world is Hades with the Defââ¦nder 615 Hades in effect is nothing but death with the Defender 624 How ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã and Inferi concurre in signification 579 How the Defender wauereth about Hades 619 How Hades is vsed in the Reuelation 642 How Hades shall be cast into hell fire 644 S. Luke maketh Hades a place of torment 621 What Hades Matth. 11. 23. is threatned to Capernaum 630 Many Greeke copies haue Act. 2. 24. the sorrowes of Hades 625 Hades in the Scriptures opposed to the highest heauens 635 Christ loosed the sorrowes of Hades 625. 626 The wall of Hades not broken but by Christ. 657 Hades hath not all the dead 646 Hades followeth after death 643 Hades taken for the rulers or persons in hell 647 The soules of the godly are not in Hades 602 Hanging on a tree was not the whole curse of the law 236 Hanging on the crosse a cursed kind of death 237 Innocents and penitents not truely accursed though Hanged on a tree 238 Hard speeches should rather bee qualified then strained to the highest 271 All affections make sensible alterations in the Heart 1ââ¦3 194 The heart is the seat of mans affections and actions 2ââ¦3 The Hââ¦art suggesting euill sinneth 311 The ioyes of Heauen are proper to the place 455 456 The sight of God in this life ââ¦uch differeth from the sight of his face in Heauen 456 The Saints of God had some sight of God in earth but not comparable to that in Heauen 460 The soules ââ¦re not yet in the same height of Heauen where Christ is 5ââ¦0 541 How many Heauens the Scriptures make 541. 542 The graces of God in earth are not the ioyes of Heauen 461 Why the Heauens are compared with hell in the Scriptures 634 God is not the immediate and principall inââ¦cter of Hell paines 2â⦠29 The sentence of the iudge containeth the essence of Hell paines 35 Christ suffered not the substance of hell paines 36 Reiection from Gods kingdome essentiall to Hell paines 37. 38 Malediction essentiall to Hell paines 38 Hell fire is not allegoricall 40. 41 42. 43. 49. 53 54 I neuer said Hell fire was materiall 44 The Fathers professe tââ¦ue fire to be in Hell 46 51. 52 So doe later Diuines 49. 50 It is possible that brimstone may be mingled with fire in Hell 47 Chaines there are in Hell though not of iron ââ¦7 Whether there be true fire in hel before the iudgment is not the question 54 Christ suffered not the essentiall part of hell paines 56 Hell paines not the cause of Christs agonie 58. 59 The sharpnesse of Hell paines 60 The foretast of iudgement in Hell is neither full finall perpetuall nor genââ¦rall 210 Positiue punishment now in Hell 214 The suffering of Hell paines no way necessarie to our saluation 220 Men may feare but not feele the truâ⦠paines of hel in this life 320 The paines of hell are no naturall affections 383 Christ might feele somewhat extraordinarie yet not the paines of hell 391 The vehemencie of hell
8. b Rom. 8. c Ephes. 2. d Rom. 8. Iohn 3. Coloss. 3. Ephes. 1. g Ephes. 1. h Galat. 1. i 1. Thess. 1. k Defenc. pag. 72. li. 11. l Genes 3. m Luke 16. n 2. Cor. 4. o Iam. 4. p 1. Pet. 5. q Defenc. pa. 72. li. 30. r Defenc. pag. 72. li 36. s 1. Cor. 15. t Defenc. pag. 72. li. 8. u Defenc. pag. 73. l. 1. x August contra ââ¦austum Manââ¦h li. 14. cap. 12. y Contra Paustum li. 14. ca. â⦠z Ibidem a Luke 13. b August de Trinitate li. 4. cap. 12. c August contra Faustum li. 14. cap. 6. d 1. Cor. 6. d 1. Cor. 6. e Defenc. pa. 73. li. 7. f Gen. 2. v. 19. g Iaâ⦠1. h Acts. 15. i 1. Pet 1. k Rom 3. l Geââ¦es 3. Gââ¦d worââ¦th good by ââ¦uill m August de cââ¦uitate Dââ¦i li. 13. cap. 6. n Ibidem o Ibidem li. 13. cap. 7. p Defenc. pag. 73. li. 10. q Dan. 9. r Barue 1. 3. s Reuel 22. t Auguââ¦t de ciuitate Dââ¦i li. 22 ca. 22. u Ibidem x August in expositione epistolae ad Romanos incââ¦ata y August de vera reââ¦igione ca. 15. z Ibidem b The fââ¦rth Sunday after th ãâã c Defenc. pag. 7â⦠li 20. d August contra ââ¦ustum ãâã li. 14. ca. 4. e Ibid ca. 6. f Defenc. pag. 7â⦠li. 22. How Christ was made a Curse for vs. g Iohn 1. h Esay 9. i 2. Cor. 5. k Galat. 3. l Cyrill in Defensio 1. Anathematis ad Oriââ¦ntales m Ose. 13. n Epiphanius contra Marciâ⦠heres 42. o Defenc. pag. 73. li. 25. p Esa. 53. 1. Pet. 2â⦠q 1. Pet. 3. r Act. 3. s t u Ambros. in ãâã ed Galat. cap. 3. x Nazianz super illud quum consummââ¦sset Iesus hossââ¦me y Defenc. pa. 73. z li. 26. a Coââ¦inth 4. a Coââ¦inth 4. b Phil. 3. c 1. Ioh. 3. d Augââ¦st in ãâã 70. e f Defenc. pa. 73. i. 28. g Defââ¦nc pag. 73. li 36. h Conclus pa. 268 li. 17. i Defenc. pag. 52. li. 1. k Dââ¦fenc pag. 74 li. 1. l Defenc. pag. 74 li. 19. m Defenc. pag. 74. li. 31. n Pag. 11. li. 25. 27. k Defenc. pa. 74. li. 23. q Defenc. pa. 74. li 33. r Ibid. li. 36. s Defenc. pag. 75. li. 4. t Ibidem li. 7. u Matââ¦h 27. x Defenc. pag. 75. i. 8. Christ was ââ¦st and Innocent in his death y 1. Pet. 3. z Psa. 145. v. 17 a Matth. 20. b 2. Thââ¦ss 1. c â⦠Iohn 1. d e Defenc. pag. 75. li. 11. f Iohn 10. g Esâ⦠53. h Defenc. pag. 75. li. 17. i Defenc. pag. 25. li. 26. k Defenc. pag. 75. li. ââ¦0 The second person in Trinitie could not be bound but by his loue to vs ward l Defenc. pag. 75. li 32. m Defenc. pa. 75. li. 33. n Defenc. pag. 75 li. 38. The Gospel differeth much from the Law Christs death not eracted as a deââ¦t but receââ¦ue as a voluntarie sacââ¦ce o Galat. 6. p Galat. 5. q Defenc. pag. 7â⦠li. 7. r Hebr. 7. s Defenc. pag. 76. li. 26. t 1. Pet. 3. u 1. Pet. 2. x 1. Pet. 3. y Defenc. pag. 76. li. 20. How sinne maketh men vncleane z Tit. 1. a Math. 15. b 2. Peter 2. v. 12 c 2. Peter 2. v. 13. d 2. Peter 2. v. 20. e 2. Peter 2. v. 22. f Rom. 2. g 1. Iohn 3. h 1. Cor. 4. h 1. Cor. 4. i Gen 43. k 1 Cor. 11. l Matth 26. m Mark 14. n Mark 3. The Curse for sââ¦nne is triple Christ not defile with our sinnes o Heb. 7. v. 27. p Luke 1. v. 35 q 1. Pet. 2 r 2. ââ¦or 5. s Heb. 9. t 1. Pet. 1. u Iohn 1. x Epâ⦠5. y Habac. 1. z Rom. 3. a Defenc. pag. 76. li. 9. Christ could not clense vâ⦠of he were defiled by vs. b Ezech. 18. vers 20. c Genes 18. vers 25 â⦠Vers. 23. The loââ¦e of God to hiââ¦ââ¦onne ouerââ¦d his hââ¦red against ââ¦r sinnâ⦠e Defenc. paâ⦠76. li. 11. f Heb. 2. g Heb. 4. h Heb. 9. veâ⦠ââ¦6 â⦠28. h Heb. 9. veâ⦠ââ¦6 â⦠28. k Chrysost. Hoâ⦠13 ââ¦n Epist. ad Romanâ⦠l Contra ãâã lââ¦â⦠cap. 2. m Defenc. pag. 76. li. 14. n Defenc. pa. 76. li. 37. o Origen li. â⦠in 8. cap. epist. ad Romanos p Cyrill epist. ad ãâã dââ¦ââ¦pro ãâã q Hiero. in 2. ad Corinth cap. 5. r August ââ¦tra ãâã li. 2. ca. 2. s Idââ¦m contra Pelag. ãâã de pââ¦cato origiâ⦠li. 2. ca. 32. t Priâ⦠iââ 5 cap. 2. ad Corinth u Sedulius iâ⦠ãâã locâ⦠x ââ¦eda in 8. ca. epist. ad Romanes y Conciliâ⦠Tolet. 11. iâ⦠confess ãâã z ãâã 8. epist. ad Romanos a Beza in â⦠ca. 2. epist. ad ãâã b Trââ¦melij obserâ⦠it in 2 ad Corinth 5. v. 21. c The second Seââ¦moÌ of the Passiââ¦n pâ⦠5. d Defenc pag. 76. li. 18. e Heb 9 v 26. f Ibid. v. 28. How Christ shall the second time appeare without sinne g August cââ¦ntra duas Epist. Pelag. li. 3. ca. 2 h August contra ãâã li. ââ¦4 ca 4. i Chrysost. in 5. ca. 2. Epist. ad Corinth k Theodor. in 8 ca. Eââ¦ist ad Romanos * Theophylact. in 5. ca. 2. Epââ¦st ad Corinth l August de verbâ⦠Apost ââ¦rm 14. m Defenc. pag. 76. li. 16. Hard speeches should rather be qualified then strained to the highest n Caluinus in 5. cap. 2. epist. ad Corinth o Defenc. pag. 76. li. 22. The Apostle maketh thâ⦠a consequent not â⦠comparison p Defenc. pag. 76. li. 29. * Esay 5. q Defenc. pa. 76. li. 33. r Defenc. pag. 76 li. 35. You would noâ⦠faââ¦e to citâ⦠Fathers if yoâ⦠had theâ⦠s Defenc. pag. 66. li. 38. t Defenc. pag. 77. li. 3. u Ibidem li. 4. x Defenc. pag. 77. â⦠6. y Matth. 10. z Psal. 19. a 1. Pet. 2. b Defenc. pag. 77. li. 8. * What Athanasius speaketh of Adam the Defender referreth to Christ. c Athanasius de Incarnationâ⦠Christi d Philip. 2. v. 6. 7. e Athanas. vt supra e Athanas. vt supra f Defenc. pag. 17. ââ¦d marg li. 8. g Defenc. pag. 77. l. 15. h Dioââ¦i de Diuinâ⦠Nomââ¦nibus cap. 4. i Pââ¦sal Hââ¦mil 9. quod Deus non sit Author ãâã k Defenc. ââ¦ag 77. li. 17. In his Sacrifice to God Christ was a willing offerer in his Martyrdome from men he was a patient sufferer A Mediator ââ¦ot gââ¦iltie of the sinne for which he ââ¦th mediat * 1. Iohn 3. l Defenc. pag. 77. li. 23. m Leuââ¦t 16. 21. n Leuit. 3 v. 2. 8. 13. o Leuit. 3 v. 2. 8. 13. Why the People laââ¦d their hanââ¦s on the heads of their Sacrifices o Leuit. 7 v. â⦠6. 10. v ââ¦7 p Leuit. 1. v. 4. q 13. 17. r Defenc. pag. 77. li. 30. Christ no way ââ¦ound
saith of their sinnes as he doth of their death that God turneth them and all things else to the good of those that loue him Touching Gods fatherly Anger against the sinnes of the faithfull for their amendment which Musculus mentioneth He doth not say as you doe it is no Anger neither doe I defend any other kinde of Anger in God then such as a Religious and wise Father in some sort resembleth when he persueth the wickednes of his vnruly sonne Whose person though he fauour as being his Sonne and by chastisement seeke to reforme yet is he or ought he to be not in words or lookes onely but inwardly and truely displeased and offended with the lewdnesse of his Sonne And though loue doe temper the correction that he meane not to kill or ouerthrow his owne flesh and blood yet the zealous Father spareth not to make his Sonne throughly smart till he confesse mislike and leaue his former loosenesse and frame himselfe obediently to his Fathers will Doth not this Father as much hate the vices as he loueth the person and seeketh the welfare of his Sonne And since his Sonne will not be otherwise recalled may not the sharp correction which the Father vseth to represse the vnbridled and vntamed appetites of his licentious child be called punishment The Scriptures so speake and so doe the Fathers as also the later writers onely this fabler hath found out a new faith and new phrases of Gods improper wrath and vntrue punishment of sinne which God vseth toward his children that prouoke him with their impuritie and iniquitie It may not be said properly that Gods Iustice leadeth him to inflict these things on vs as you affirme but his holinesse and loue Your mouth belike is the measure of proper speeches If you intend that not onely Iustice but also Loue did and doth lead God to inflict these things on vs you say the same that I affirme but if you meane as you must if you will crosse my position that Loue without Iustice did and doth lead God to inflict these things on vs then speake you both absurdly and wickedly For the Scriptures ascribe Iustice and Iudgement to God in chastening his Church and punishing the sinnes of his seruants as well as they doe Loue and holinesse When the Prophet told Roboham and the Princes of Iuda that they had left God and therefore God would leaue them in the hands of Shishak the King of Egypt the King and Princes humbled themselues and said the Lord is iust When Ierusalem was burnt and her people caried captiue to Babilon the Prophet lamenting her miserie saith the Lord hath afflicted her for the multitude of her transgressions and teacheth her to say Iust is the Lord for I haue rebelled against his mouth Daniel at the time when God would deliuer his people from that Captiuitie maketh confession of his and their sinnes and saith All Israell haue transgressed thy law and departed from hearkning to thy voice Therefore the curse is powred vpon vs because we haue sinned against him And the Lord hath watched ouer this euill and brought it vpon vs because the Lord our God is iust in all that he doth for we would not heare his voice The Leuites after their returne making confession of their sinnes vnto God mentioning their afflictions doe adde And thou Lord are iust in all that is come vpon vs because thou hast kep t thy truth and we haue done wickedly The Apostles confesse the like after Christs comming If our iniquitie saith Paul commend the Iustice of God what shall we say Is God vniust in punishing God forbid Very plainly the same Apostle denounceth Gods iustice and vengeance to all Christians that wrong their brethren You know saith he what Commandements we gaue you by the Lord Iesus that no man oppresse or defraud his brother for the Lord is the Auenger of all such things as we foretold and protested vnto you And to the Colossians He that doth wrong shall receaue at Gods hand for the wrong which he hath done and there is no respect of persons The recompence of a mans hands that is works shall God giue vnto him either in this life if he repent or in the next if he persist Lo saith Salomon the righteous are repayed on earth he meaneth the euill which they haue done to others how then the wicked and the sinner For here in this life is the time that iudgement beginneth at the house of God If it first begin with vs saith Peter what shall be the end of them who obey not the Gospell of God Howsoeuer you tattle that God vtterly forgetteth his Iustice in afflicting his Church the Scriptures teach vs that Iudgement beginneth here at the house of God for an example of the iust iudgement of God against the wicked and that the very righteous are repayed on earth the wrongs which they do to others God by his Apostle openly professing himselfe to be the Auenger of such beleeuers as wrong or defraud their brethren Now whether there may be Iudgement Requitall and Reuenge in this life from God against euill without some admixture of his iustice though he purpose not to destroy the penitent I leaue it to the Christian Reader to consider Hath not Christ then borne the burden of our sinnes to free vs from all punishment Christ hath not presently and generally freed vs and euery part of vs from all corruption and affliction of sinne he will doe it at his appointed time when the day of our redemption commeth In the meane time our inward man is freed though our outward man dayly perish For Christ must raigne till he haue put all his and our enemies vnder his feete The last enemie that shall be destroyed is death Then shall be the end of sinne death and corruption in all his and not before though we be alreadie redeemed by Christ from it in Gods purpose and promise which shall then bee fully performed and in part whereof we presently haue an assurance in that our soules are renewed in this life by grace and receiued in the next to a blessed rest and comfort till that day rise when Christ will set a crowne of righteousnesse on them all that loue his comming Againe we are presently freed from all that which is solely the punishment of sinne and hath no farder or other profit or vse in it then onely to punish and reuenge sinne And such are none of these things whereof wee speake For God in them all hath so tempered a taste of his iustice with his manifold and great mercies that it is not expedient for vs as yet to be wholly freed from them This respect preuaileth so farre with God that whiles the world must dure hee hath subiected his children to the capitall and penall lawes not of Christian Magistrates onely but euen of infidels also for that without discipline
hath destroied death and purchased life for vs. And therefore after Chriââ¦s resurrection and ascension to aske who shall ascend to heauen to procure vs life or who shall descend into the deepe to destroy death for vs is to frustrate through infidelity that which Christ hath done for vs. If we confââ¦sse with our mouths and beleeue with our hââ¦arts that God hath raised vp Iesus from the dead to be Lord ouer all that is to giue life and saue from death whom he will we shal be saued this is the Apostles purpose As for merit-mongers of whom you say the Apostle speaketh these words it is an idle and drowsie conceit of yours These words doe no waies fitte presumers on their merits for they thinke they shall ascend to heauen by their workes they aske not who shall ascend and in the bottom of the sea what merits can you deuise or to what creatures there should Pharises seeke how to fulfill the law what bables be these to be wreathed into the Apostles words or who but you would place all the creatures of God either in heauen or in the bottom of the sea If you cannot write as a diuine speake yet as a man of common sense or vnderstanding And all these senses you say the Apostle may insinuate in this word I thinke as soone all as one but that the deepe in one and the same sentence should signifie the graue the bottom of the sea and the whole state of the dead is a flower of your field it groweth in no wise mans garden I may not omit to shew how you deale here againe with the Text. You alleage it ââ¦e descended into the deepe But he is cunningly added neither are these words meant of him Your eyes be not paires that perceiue not the difference betwixt a quotation and a conclusion gathered out of the Apostles words In the 220 page with which you cauill the letter b pointing to Rom. 10. in the margine is set after he and next before descended to the deepe So that any sober man might soone see I alleaged not this word he as out of the text but inferred it as the true meaning of the Apostle And whether I haue better reason to say these words are meant of Christ as all Interpreters new and olde doe than you haue to say they are meant of a Pharââ¦aicall Merit-monger that seeketh to learne of fishes in the deepe of the sea how to fulfill the Law let the Reader iudge now he hath heard vs both The like praââ¦se you vâ⦠againe in the Psalme There is no word to exprââ¦sse beneath which you put into the text of your owne head Were there no word importing so much yet so long as the word added is expresly ratified by many places of Scripture as appeareth Esay 14. vers 9. and Prouerbs 15. vers 24. in plaine words that Sheol is beneath and the addition is in another letter different from the rest before and after your Mastership might haue taken it for an explication inserted and not for any part of the text cited But you neuer suppose that the Printer may sometimes mistake or mis-set my directions and that maketh you so fast to fome at mouth with my falsifying the word of God of purpose and for aduantage where you rather lie of purpose or for aduantage since I doe not offer there to build any thing on that word nor so much as mention it in my collection there which if I would haue done Scriptures enough besides this would warrant my assertion And what if you whet your teeth against the trueth and the word there of it selfe will beare this addition without any corruption is not your time well spent to play the Bedlom in this sort and in the end to betray your owne ignorance and malice The Septuagint translate the word ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã if I descend or go downe to Sheôl whom the Greeke Fathers follow The West Church kept the same word as is euident by all the Latine Fathers The Chaldaie paraphrase sayth Veêmuc lishjol If I depresse or humble my selfe downe to Sheol where the word is mac to be depressed downe or humbled low Ierom sayth If I lie downe in Sheól New Writers well skilled in the Hebrew tongue as Pellican Pomerane and others continue the word of descending and many that change it retaine the same sense as Vatablus Heââ¦raismus prosietiam descendam ad Ima it is an Hebrew phrase importing thus much If I doe descend to the parts beneath Westhmerus expoundeth it Si descendam in infima loca terrae If I descend to the lowest places of the earth Mollerus Si ettam descendam ad Ima If I should descend to the places beneath Dauid Kimchi obserueth that this word is not only to spread but withall it hath in it the force of lematta below beneath Augustââ¦us ââ¦stinianus translated the Arabick with the word of descending If all these haue falsified the word of God in so translating and expounding this place then haue I mistaken in following their iudgements but that I falsified of purpose or for an aduantage that is the meale of your mouth not vnlike the rest of your griest Howbeit it is eââ¦ident the Hebrew word hath in it as Kimchi noteth the signification of sub infra and in that respect importeth a bed where a man lieth downe in a lower position than he had before For which cause I might lawfully render the word as I did If I lie downe or lodge beneath in sheól Since Sheol by the Scriptures is a place whither a man must descend though indeed to preuent all challenge I was content to expresse the force of the word in another letter Our second and most principall reason is this If there be not one place of Scripture to proue that Christs soule was in hell then you ought to denie that opinion but you haue not indeed any one place that proueth it therefore it ought to be denied You shew your Logâ⦠where little need is keepe it if you be wiââ¦e till it may stand you in more steed Euery Child knoweth or at least hath heard that faith must depend on the word of God Wherefore if it be no where written we meane not to beleeue it But if when the words be plaine you will wrest them with figures and phrases to another purpose then giue vs leaue if your proofes be not sound and good to tell you that our faith relieth on the singlenesse and plainnesse of the word of God so receaued and beleeued since Christ had a Church on earth And though you can make shewes with diuers acceptions and figuratiue senses of words yet that is no reason to reuerse the trueth written For giue me the like liberty without regard of faith and trueth and I can shift of any word whatsoeuer in the Scriptures yea the chiefest and mainest grounds of Religion I can elude with different