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A51741 A reformed catechism. The first dialogue in two dialogues concerning the English Reformation / collected for the most part, word for word out of Dr. Burnet, John Fox, and other Protestant historians ; published for the information of the people in reply to Mas William Kings answer to D. Manby's considerations &c. ; by Peter Manby. Manby, Peter, d. 1697. 1687 (1687) Wing M388; ESTC R30509 77,561 110

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Head of the Church of England under Christ as well in all spiritual things or causes as temporal what better Answers in brief could be returned to the Questions of Dr. Martin Cranmer having sworn that the King was Supream Head of the Church of England under Christ as well in all spiritual things or causes as temporal A. But how did he interpret those words as well in all spiriritual things or causes as temporal B. Fox tells you p. 662. viz. After this Dr. Martyn demanded of him who was Supream Head of the Church of England Marry quoth my Lord of Canterbury Christ is Head of this Member as he is of the whole Body of the Universal Church Why quoth Dr. Martyn you made King Henry the 8th Supream Head of the Church Yea said the Archbishop of all the people of England as well Ecclesiastical as Temporal And not of the Church said Martyn No said he for Christ is only Head of his Church and of the Faith and Religion of the same the King is Head and Governour of his People which are the visible Church What quoth Martyn you never durst tell the King so Yes that I durst quoth he and did in the publication of his Stile wherein he was named Supream Head of the Church there was never other thing meant page 662. This is Foxes account of the Dialogue received as he says from a better hand A. Did he answer any thing further concerning the Perjury objected to him B. Fox tells you Others who were present at his Tryal do thus report the effect of Cranmers words viz. while he in this sort made his Answer ye heard before how Dr. Story and Martyn divers times interrupted him with blasphemous Talk and would sain have had the Bishop of Glocester to put him to silence who notwithstanding did not but suffered him to end his Tale at full After this ye heard also how they proceeded to examine him of divers Articles whereof the chief was that at the time of his creating Archbishop of Canterbury he was sworn to the Pope and had his Institution and Induction from him and promised then to maintain the Authority of that See and therefore was perjured wherefore he should rather stick to his first Oath and return to his old fold again than continue obstinately in an Oath forced in the time of Schism To that he answered says Fox saving his Protestation which term he used before all his Answers that at such time as Archbishop Warham dyed he was Ambassador in Germany for the King who thereupon sent for him home and having intelligence by some of his Friends near about the King how he meant to bestow the same Bishoprick upon him and therefore counselled him in that case to make haste home he feeling in himself a great inability to such a Promotion and very sorry to leave his Study and especially considering by what means he must have it which was clean against his Conscience which he could not utter without great peril and danger devised an Excuse to the King of matter of great importance for the which his longer abode there should be most necessary thinking by that means in his absence the King would bestow it upon some other and so remained there by that device one half year after the King had written for him to come but after that no such matter fell out as he seemed to make suspicion of the King sent for him again Who after his return understanding still the Archbishoprick to be reserved for him made means by divers of his best Friends to shift it off desiring rather some smaller Living that he might more quietly follow his Book To be brief when the King himself spake with him declaring that his full intention was for his Service sake note this and for the good opinion he conceived of him to bestow that Dignity upon him Fox proceeds After long disabling of himself perceiving he could by no perswasions alter the Kings determination he brake frankly his Conscience with him most humbly craving first his Graces Pardon for what he should declare unto his Highness Which obtained he said that if he accepted the Office he must receive it at the Popes hand which he neither would nor could do His Highness being the only Supream Governour of this Church of England as well in causes Ecclesiastical as Temporal this was a Chaplain after King Henry's own Heart And therefore if he might in that Vocation serve God the King and his Country seeing it was his pleasure so to have it he would accept that Dignity and receive it of his Majesty and of no Stranger who had no Authority within this Realm Whereat the King said he staying a while and musing asked me How I was able to prove that At which time I alledged many Texts out of Scripture and the Fathers also approving the Supream and highest Authority of Kings within their own Realms shewing withall the intolerable usurpation of the Pope of Rome Afterwards it pleased his Highness quoth the Archbishop many and sundry times to talk with me about it and perceiving that I could not be brought to acknowledge the Authority of the Bishop of Rome the King himself called Doctor Oliver and other Civil Lawyers to advise with them how he might bestow the Archbishoprick upon me inforcing me nothing against my Conscience who thereupon informed him that I might do it by the way of Protestation and so one to be sent to Rome who might take the Oath and do every thing in my name which when I understood I said he should do it super Animam suam And I indeed bona fide made by Protestation that I did not acknowledge his Authority any further then as it agreed with the express Word of God And that it might be lawful for me at all times to speak against him and to impugn his Errors when time and occasion should serve me And this my Protestation I did cause to be inrolled and there I think it remains This says Fox is the faithful Relation and Testimony of certain Persons that were present at his Tryal before the Bishop of Glocester See page 661 662. Reader Remember what Doctor Martyn observes page 60. Hearken good People to what this man saith he makes a Protestation one day to keep never a tittle of that which he intended to swear next day See the Tenour of his Oath to the Pope page 28. of this Catechism A. What did he answer to the particular of Incontinency or breach of his Sacerdotal Vow B. Dr. Martyn objected that being in holy Orders after the Death of his first Wife he married a second named Ann and kept her secretly in the days of King Henry 8. Whereunto he answered that it was better for him to have his own Wife than to do like other Priests holding and keeping other mens wives But the Question is whether other mens vices could be any excuse for him he seems to suppose here every man to be
finding that nothing went so near the King's Heart Edward VI as the ruin of Religion which he apprehended would follow upon his Death when his Sister Mary should come to the Crown upon that he and his party took advantage to propose to him to settle the Crown by his Letters Patents on the Lady Jane Grey then newly married to Guilford Dudley Northumberlands fourth Son how they prevailed with him to pass by his Sister Elisabeth who had been always much in his Favour I do not so well understand But the King being wrought over to this on the 11th of June Mountague Chief Justice of the Common-Pleas Baker and Bromly two Judges with the King's Attorney and Solicitor were commanded to come to Council There they found the King with some Privy-Councellors about him The King told them he did now apprehend the danger the Kingdom might be in by the Succession of his Sister Mary So he ordered some Articles to be read to them of the way in which he would have the Crown to descend They objected that an Act of Parliament could not be taken away by any such Device yet the King required them to take the Articles and draw a Book according to them They asked a little time to consider of it So having examined the Statute of the first year of his Reign they found that it was Treason not only after the King's Death but in his life time to change the Succession Secretary Petre in the mean time pressed them to make haste When they came again to the Council they declared they could not do any such thing for it was Treason And all the Lords should be Guilty of Treason if they went on in it Upon which the Duke of Northumberland who was not then in the Council Chamber being advertised of this came in great Fury calling Mountague a Traitor But the Judges stood to their Opinion They were again sent for and came on the 15th of June The King was present and somewhat sharply asked them why they had not prepared the Book as he had ordered them They answered that whatever they did would be of no force without a Parliament But the King said he would have it first done and then ratified in Parliament and therefore required them on their Allegiance to go about it and some Councellors told them if they refused to Obey that they were Traytors This put them in a great Consternation and Old Mountague thinking it could not be Treason whatever they did in this matter while the King lived and at worst that a Pardon under the great Seal would secure him consented to set about it if he might have a Commission requiring him to do it and a Pardon when it was done both these being granted him he was satisfyed The other Judges being asked if they would concur did all agree being overcome with fear except Hales But Cranmer still refused to do it after they had all signed it and said he would never consent to the Disinheriting of the Daughters of his late Master Many Consultations were had to perswade him to it but he could not be prevailed on till the King himself set on him who used many Arguments from the danger Religion would otherwise be in together with other Perswasions so that by his Reasons or rather Importunities at last he brought him to it NOTE The Doctors excuse for this unjust Act of Cranmers importunity the same that naughty Women are said to pretend for their Incontinency If he did this only as submitting to his Princes importunity how came he after King Edward 's Death to Subscribe the aforesaid Letter And to do both after he had said he he would never consent to the disinheriting of King Henry 's Children The Reader may now understand the reason why he answered little or nothing to the Treason objected to him by the Bishop of Glocester because there was too much Truth in it And methinks this excuse which Burnet makes for him does him no service namely that he stood off a good while but at last with much a do was perswaded into this Conspiracy against K. Henry 's Children How does this answer the Character which Fox gives of him in causes pertaining to God and his Prince no Man more stout no Man more constant then he But whether he was in reality so unwilling to this Action is a question which the indifferent Reader may easily resolve Since he could not but apprehend that Queen Mary would call him to an account for the troubles he had brought upon her Mother and indeed upon the whole Church and Kingdom of England For amongst all the English Bishops anno 1533. King Henry could not find such another Person as Burnet confesses to serve him in the See of Canterbury Now as for Mountague Chief Justice of the Common Plea's and the rest of the Judges who at last consented to the advancement of Lady Jane Grey you may observe them scrupling the matter not out of Conscience but apprehension of the Law. All that they desired was to be indemnified from the danger of Law. A. Now go on to relate how he acquitted himself of the other particulars laid to his Charge Heresie Perjury Incontinency B. Although he answered nothing to the Bishop of Glocester concerning the point of Treason yet I remember somewhat in Fox which he reply'd to Doctor Martyn the Queen's Proctor viz. I protest before God I was no Traytor but indeed I confessed more at my Arraignment than was true Martyn returns that is not to be reasoned at this present you know you were condemned for a Traytor Fox page 653. 3 Vol. A. Is there no more in Fox as to that point B. Not a word more that I can find A. Then proceed as to the particular of Heresie B. John Foxes words are these As for the matter of Heresie and Schism wherewith he was charged he protested and called God to witness that he knew none that he maintained But if that were an Heresie to deny the Popes Authority and the Religion which the See of Rome hath published to the World these later years then the Apostles and Christ himself taught Heresie and he desired all then present to bear him witness that he took the Traditions and Religion of that usurping Prelate to be most false erroneous and against the Doctrine of the whole Scripture That he is the very Antichrist so often preached of by the Apostles and Prophets For it was most evident that he had advanced himself above all Emperors and Kings of the World whom he affirmeth to hold their Estates and Empires of him as their Chief and to be deposed at his good Will and Pleasure That he hath brought in Gods of his own Framing and invented a new Religion full of Gain and Lucre. This Enemy of God and of our Redemption is so evidently painted out in the Scriptures by such manifest Signs and Tokens that except a man will shut up his Eyes and Heart against the