we inflame it in our selves by comforting others under their various temptations we gather experiences whereby we may comfort our selves in the like trials As the widows Cruse of Oyl and barrel of meale wasted not by emptying but filled rather And the milke in the Mothers breasts which by giving suck to the Child continually increaseth and not drawn out drieth up the sooner Let 's lay out our parts and gifts as opportunity is offered sincerely for God and to be sure we shall be furnished with gifts and parts graciously from God Parents do not use to let their Children want books whilst they have a mind to learn nor Masters their servants to want Tools or lights whilst they are willing to work nor doth the husbandman tilling his ground let his seeds-men want Corne when he seeth they will well and wisely sow and scatter it Thus Christian Conference is not alone beneficial to others but to our selves a great augmenter of parts and gifts I 'le give you for the Confirmation hereof an example of two Women to tell you their names and the places where they lived and died is needless both well in years I think forty at least before they began to mind to purpose the affairs of their souls and the concernments of Eternity both were deeply sensible of their gross ignorance and highly desirous to get knowledge in the things of God neither of them could read at all both were industrious one her eyes being pretty good learned to read the other being weak and dim sighted could not but she also so bestir'd her self in hearing Meditation Prayer and abundantly in Christian Conference putting questions to every one she met with whom she thought able and willing to instruct her that she grew eminent for such an one she was poor also in the knowledge and practice of Christianity and I hope are both long since with God 2 2. To the heart 2. Christian Conference is not onely profitable for the head by augmentation of parts but for the heart also by the communication of spiritual good things the best things to the best part the heart of man and it 's usual with God to bless Christian Conference especially where the hearts of speakers do design his glory the edification and salvation of the hearers Paul's holy temper design and practice 1 Cor. 10.33 I please saith he all men in all things not seeking my own profit but the profit of many that they may be saved and his counsel 1 Cor. 14.12 For as much as ye are zealous of spiritual gifts seek that ye may excell to the edifying of the Church If the question be made what spiritual gifts may be communicated by Conference I 'de answer what not the ignorant may be inlightned the erronious reduced weak Christians may be strengthned and the strong established the worst of sinners may be converted and the best of Saints quickned and all edifyed and saved Take each of these particulars distinctly 1 1. Ignorant inlightned 1. That the ignorant may be inlightned is as clear as the Sunrising turnes the night into day The word of God not alone preached by ministers in office ordain'd and commissionated by Christ to that end but read and discoursed of by private persons may and doth make wise the simple Psal 19.7 The entrance of thy words to wit when it first openeth the door of the understanding it giveth light it giveth understanding to the simple Psal 119.130 Pauls preaching to the Gentiles was to open their eyes and to turn them from darkness to light Act. 26.18 The daily experience that Godly Parents and governours of families have as to their Children and Servants brought out of darkness worse then that of Egypt into a Goshen where light abounds and in them abounds and that conveighed by Catechizing and 〈…〉 2 2. Erroneous reduced 2. For the reduction of erroneous persons into ways of truth scarce any means more efficacious and successful then that of Christian Conference for thereby the grounds of mistakes in opinions are detected and the scruples and doubts lying in mens spirits are discovered and so answers from Scripture and right reason may be presently pertinently and warmly applyed That of the Apostle speaks methink fully to the purpose Jam. 5.19 20. Bretheren if any of you do erre from the truth and one Convert him Let him know that he which converts a sinner from the errour of his ways shall save a soule from death and shall hide a multitude of sins Wherein we may observe as to our point in hand whom he speaks to Brethren even all whom he wrote to so that to reduce the erroneous in away of fraternal correption is a duty belonging to all none exempted brotherly love constraineth hereunto for if I must bring back the straying Ox or Ass of my enemy Exo. 23.4 much more the wandring soul of my brother Again what errours are here to be understood no doubt saith a learned Expositor errours in Doctrine Mars in Plo. and matters of Faith and those fundamentall errours also which are in a special manner destructive and bring death eternal death unavoidably and therefore it is said that he which converts him shall save a soule from death that is from Hell and damnation Now every petty errour about Scholastick subtilties is not so severely threatned as fundamental errours and heresies are which take off from Christ directly or indirectly such unrepented of bring inevitable ruin and destruction Yet I must grant though errours in Doctrine be principally intended yet errours in life and practice are not to be at all excused no not the least sin for the least sin deserveth death eternal death as wages due to it Ro. 6.23 But how doth he that Converts a sinner save his soule from death not by meriting or deserving life for him or by giving life to him but by being an instrument or means under God to repentance and so into the way of Salvation And lastly how doth he hide a multitude of sins that he doth by being a means to bring him to Christ for Righteousness whose Righteousness alone imputed to us and so made ours doth or can hide our sins so as they shall never be imputed to us or charged upon us Jer. 23.6 2 Cor. 5.21 Rom. 5.19 1 Cor. 1.30 And surely this work of converting sinners from their errours of saving soules from death and of hiding a multitude of sins is a gallant work this piece of service is high and noble service and this hath been is and may be done by the blessing of God in a way of Christian converse and Conference I need not give any farther confirmation by Scripture the constant experience not alone of Ministers but or private Christians who themselves have been sound in the Faith and whose hearts filled with a zeal for God and with love to and compassion for their erring brethren and who thereupon have laid out themselves much in Christian
he had constantly in his eye When he came among persons of Quality being himself well born well educated of a generous spirit and a chearful temper his company and converse was usually very acceptable to them which gave him an advantage to tell them as he would plainly though prudently of what he saw amiss in them to mind them of the vanity of the World of better things above and to put them as he often would upon good designs to shew their thankfulness to God for his mercy to them Nor was there a person so mean but he could and would readily and humbly condescend to him as knowing what precious souls dwell in the poorest houses of clay He spake to such alwayes in their own dialect and in a phrase they well understood trying their knowledge and feeling the pulse of their souls if he found them ignorant or unsensible he would endeavour to awaken them by laying plain Texts of Scripture before them for their conviction If he met with humbled and burdened souls or such as were babes in Christ he would gather them as lambs in his arms and gently lead them to the Wells of Salvation If at any time there hapned to be a mixt company at the Table with him some serious Christians some Professors at large his manner was to be very free and pleasant in discourse with them which caused them all to give great attention to him then might you have seen how ever and anon the honey dropt from his lips while the company were hanging on them how skilful he was in dividing the Word aright to every one his portion and how wise in winning of souls If he observed any to take the boldness from his innocent mirth and pleasant humour to incline to vain and frothy discourse he would very dexterously turn to some more profitable matter and as occasion was given afford a serious reproof tempered with much kindness and love to their souls which was usually well taken at his hand If his occasions required his stay a day or two at any place he seldom departed before he had Preached to the People He found by much and long experience that a plain way of Preaching was most effectual to the ends for which that Ordinance was appointed and therefore he constantly used it even in the College and Vniversity though he could easily have appeared in another strain had he preferred an aiery Reputation with some before the Work of his Master and the real advantage of others To conclude I hope that many who some time were and some who yet are members of that Society having felt his fatherly care heard his sound and pious instructions and seen his godly examples do and will endeavour to hold a conformity thereunto If any neglect or despise them let them know assuredly that God will require it at their hands A Dialogue OR A DISCOURSE BETWEEN A Minister and a Stranger As they were On the High-way together ABOUT Soul Affairs By Edmund Staunton D. D. LONDON Printed for Tho Parkhurst and are to be Sold at the Bible and Three Crowns in Cheapside near Mercers Chappel And at the Gilded Bible on London-bridge under the Gate 1673. A Dialogue or Discourse between a Minister and a Stranger as they were on the High-way together Minister FRiend Good morrow to you How far Travel you this way Stranger To such or such a place Min. I shall be glad of your company Str. And I Sir of yours Min. Little thought you in the Morning of meeting me or I of meeting you Str. True Sir Min. Well Friend since by the Providence of God we are brought together and must be accountable to God at death and judgment how we spend our time whil'st we be together shall we talk of what concerns the good of our Souls and of the Things of God Stranger Yes Sir with all my heart if you please Minister Friend What think you then that your Soul is Str. I think that my Soul is my breath because when a man's breath is gone then he dyeth and his Soul is gone also Min. True Friend when the breath departeth the Soul departeth also yet the Soul of a man is not his breath because 1. Beasts and the Fowls of the Air breathe also and yet you do not think they have reasonable immortal Souls as we have 2. Our breath is but the Air drawn in and cast out again and can you reasonably imagine first that the Air thus sucked in and blown out again should be the Soul or Souls of men or secondly that the whole Region of the Air should be the rational and immortal Souls of men or thirdly that our Souls come in and go out of our bodies as the Air we breathe in doth Stranger Truly Sir you have convinced me that the Soul is not breath whatever it be Minister What else do you think it is Str. I think it is my blood most likely Not so because 1. Beasts and Birds have blood in them as well as Men and yet you do not think they have reasonable immortal Souls as we Men have 2. If our Souls were blood then when our Noses bleed to speak familiarly with you our Souls would even out at our Noses or when we cut our fingers our Souls would run out at our fingers ends Min. Friend guess once more what your Soul is Str. Sir Is it not my Conscience Min. No Friend the understanding will conscience and affections as love hatred are the faculties and endowments of the Soul but not the Soul it self Str. You say well Sir I pray tell me then what my Soul is Minister Friend not to trouble you with any curious definitions the Soul of man is a spiritual substance endowed with reason immortal created and infused into man informeth inliveneth the body doth and acteth all in man the Soul seeth in the eye heareth in the ear speaketh in the tongue c. zach 12.1 God formeth the spirit of man within him Stranger I thank you Sir this is more than ever I heard of before Min. Well Friend having spoken something concerning our Souls shall we speak a little concerning God Str. Yes Sir I like your talk very well Min. What do you think God is Is he an old man or a young Str. An old man surely he hath been a long time Min. No God is neither a young man nor an old man Str. If God be not a man why do the Scriptures speak of God as having eyes ears hands and feet c Min. This kind of speaking is not proper but figurative speaking of God after the manner of men stooping to our understandings and capacities but the Scripture speaking plainly and properly saith God is a Spirit John 4.24 Stranger You say right Sir God is a Spirit Minister Well Friend Are not the Angels spirits too They are called ministring spirits Hebr. 1.13 What then is the difference between God and the Angels Str. God is the greatest and highest of all the
to be damned and go to Hell for your sins Str. I hope not so great a sinner as to deserve Hell and damnation Min. Friend I must tell you that you and I and the best Men and Women that are deserve to go to Hell for their sins the least sin deserveth eternal death Rom. 6.23 The wages of sin is death Stranger What you say Sir I perceive is true for you bring Scripture to prove what you say Minister Why then say these words after me I am a sinner and such a sinner as that I deserve to go to Hell and be damned for my sins Str. I am a sinner and such a sinner as that I deserve to go to Hell and be damned for my sin Min. Did you ever in your life-time say so much before Str. Truly Sir I never thought or said so much before all the dayes of my life Min. It 's as true a word as ever you spake all your dayes Str. I believe it Sir Min. If you did indeed believe it Friend it would trouble you and make your heart ake within you Str. Sir how may that appear Min. Thus Friend if you did verily believe that you deserved to forfeit all your estate to be imprisoned all the dayes of your life to be hanged or burned to death would it not trouble you Str. Yes doubtless that it would Minister Friend You cannot but think that to go to Hell and to be damned for ever is a thousand times worse than all this and therefore if you did indeed believe it it would trouble you and that to some purpose Stranger I thank God Sir I was never troubled in mind all my life Min. Friend let me tell you that you had more cause to thank God if you could say that you have been troubled for your sins this be sure of that they who are not troubled for sin in this World mourning and repenting shall be troubled with a vengeance in the World to come when they lie in Hell under the wrath and curse of God tormented with fire and brimstone for ever because of their sins against God Str. I hope Sir I shall never come there I have alwayes been of a strong faith towards God Min. Friend what if your strong faith as you call it prove no better than a strong fancy or a strong presumption at the last and so deceive you Stranger I hope better Minister Friend if your faith and hope were right you would find 1. A difficulty and hardship in believing he that never doubted or never believed he that never saw his want of faith never lamented his unbelief hath cause to fear he hath no true saving faith at all It 's an easie matter to presume but it 's a hard thing to believe and hope aright in God Ephes 1.19 It 's the exceeding greatness of the power of God toward us who believe according to the working of his mighty power ver 20. Which he wrought in Christ when he raised him from the dead 2. Your faith and hope were they true would be grounded upon the Word and Promises of God 3. Faith and hope if right would purifie the heart and life Acts 15.9 1 John 3.3 Now whether you have this kind of faith and hope or no you had need look to it Str. I trust I shall Sir Min. Friend to return to what we a little before discoursed of it must be granted that you and I and all of us deserve the wrath and curse of God for ever how do you think to escape the damnation of Hell and to get Heaven and Salvation when you die Stranger I hope to be saved by my serving of God and good prayers and by leading an honest life how else should I be saved Minister Friend What do you hope to be saved for your good Works that is Popery and I presume you are no Papist Str. Sir All my Neighbours know I am no Papist I defie Popery from my heart Min. Friend let me tell you that to relie upon our own righteousness and to hope to be justified and saved for what we do is one of the most desperate and damnable points in all Popery and therefore whatever you may think of it if you trust unto your good prayers and your honest life as you call it as if that were enough to save you you are in that point a Papist Str. Oh Sir the Papists trust to their good works and merits Minister Friend What is it not a good work to serve God to say good prayers to lead an honest life c Stranger Yes surely Min. Why then surely to trust and relie upon them is to relie upon your good works which is plain downright Popery Str. I perceive Sir you are too hard for me but what would you not have men to serve God use good prayers and lead good lives Min. Yes Friend that I would and wish from my heart that you and I and all men served God more prayed and lived better but here 's the mischief and the Popery of it when men relie upon those works for justification and salvation Str. Why may not I safely do it Min. No the Word of God is expresly against it Rom. 3.20 By the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight Rom. 10.3 They who establish their own righteousness submit not unto the righteousness of God Eph. 2.8 By grace ye are saved through faith and that not of our selves ver 9. Not of works lest any man should boast and many such places I could tell you of Stranger Sir you bring so much Scripture that I cannot tell what to say to you Min. Friend it 's the Word of God by which we must be tryed and judged another day Rom. 2.16 In the day of Judgment when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my Gospel saith the Apostle and therefore we might do well to try and judge our selves by it now Str. You speak reason Sir Min. Friend deal plainly with me do not you think that though you have sometimes offended God yet you hope that your good works will satisfie and make amends for the bad and so all will be made even between God and you Str. Sir you hit me right I wonder how you come to know me so well I do indeed hope that my good works will answer for my bad Min. Friend I am a stranger to you it is not I that hits you and knows you it is the Word of God that hits you and knows you onely I may somewhat guess at your heart by my own naturally such as yours is Prov. 27.19 As in water face answereth to face so the heart of man to man Stranger If my good works my serving God my good prayers and my honest life will not serve me I pray tell me how then may I be saved Minister Friend did you never hear of Jesus Christ you speak never a word of Christ all this while why