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A04050 He [sic] begynneth an interlocucyon, with an argument, betwyxt man and woman & whiche of them could proue to be most excelle[n]t.; Debat de l'homme et de la femme. English Alexis, Guillaume, d. 1468? 1525 (1525) STC 14109; ESTC S103699 3,536 14

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¶ He begynneth an interlocucyon with an argument betwyxt man and woman whiche of them could proue to be most excellēt WHen Phebꝰ reluysāt most ardēt was shene In the hote sommer season for my solace Vnder the vmbre of a tre bothe fayre grene I lay downe to rest me where in this case ¶ As after ye shall here a stryfe there began Whiche longe dyd endure with great argument Bytwyxte the woman and also the man Whiche of them coulde proue to be moost excellent The man ¶ The fyrst whiche I herde was the mā that sayde Adam our forfather by womans shrewde councell To ete of an apple was pyteously betrayde Well happy is he that with you dothe not mell The woman ¶ Ihesu of a mayden and vyrgyn his mother Was incarnated to redeme that man had loste Set thou this one now agaynst the other And woman is more excellent in euery coste The man ¶ No women in to aungels neuer was transformed But women in to deuyls full ofte hath ben fygurate For theyr pryde in hell cruelly to be burned Vnhappy is he that hath one to his make The woman ¶ Many aungels to women haue ben transported More than to men for theyr chastyte Fyrst our dere lady thaungell exorted Sayenge the son of god in her conceyued shold be The man ¶ Ioseph by woman was put in pryson And Vrye was slayne by treason cruell Dauyd an adulterer with woman was become Well happy is he that with them doth not mell The woman Mankynde to delyuer out of this worldly payne And brynge hym to the ioye of the celestyall place God in his mother toke nature humayne Who dysprayseth women god sende hym no grace The man For woman was slayne the worthy prynce Amon The loue of them causeth moche dyspleasure By women was dysceyued the sage Salomon Whiche by the meane of them false ydols dyd adoure The woman That woman is moost replete with grace By good reason I shall proue playne For god in woman fyrst toke his place Whan into this worlde he came certayne The man Vyrgyll the sage clerke of great intellygence Betrayed was by woman as wryten ye may fynde Trustynge in her grace in euery mannes presence Was tyed at a wyndowe tyll men dyd hym vnbynde The woman God to vs by woman paradyse hath restored That before was loste by our great neglygence And aboue all sayntes hyghly hath honored Mary his mother woman of moost excellence The man Townes haue be destroyed and cytes many one Dyuers men for women be dampned depe in hell More ioyfull vnto man than woman hath be none Well happy is he that with them doth not mell The woman ¶ By y e meane of Hester the iudgemēt was respyted Of Assuerus her husband for the Iewes all Whiche sholde haue dyed had nat he delyted In her hye beautye and wordes peticyonall The man ¶ Pryam Paris and Deiphebus Fyrst by thoccasyon of women was slayne Also Troylus Hector and Helenus And all Troye hath ben confounded playne The woman ¶ Iudyth C. M. men and mo Made for to flye and yelde in confusyon After that Holefernus heed she had cut in two Whiche wolde haue dystroyed all the regyon The man ¶ Women theyr face and foreheed doth paynt For to deceyue both yonge and olde The stronge Sampson Dalyda dyd attaynt And hym betrayed his heed whē she had polde The woman ¶ Woman is honored in euery place For quene of erth and of heuen hye Whiche is petycioner for mannes trespace To good on theyr soules to haue mercye The man Some women can flatter and moost can lye To optayne mannes loue they can fayne well They wyll neuer leue it vntyll they dye Well happy is he that with them doth not mell The woman ¶ Woman is called treasure of grace In heuen our lady it is full suer For she for mannes soule doth so purchase That thousandes she saued by her prayer The man ¶ Some that hath be taken for very sage By womans loue dyd so hym indeuer That for it he solde all his herytage And after hath he dyed a myserable begger The woman ¶ Many hath offyces and good wages By women to lyue ryght prosperately Benefyces and auauntages To mayntayne men accordyngly The man ¶ When a yonge pegeon a woman hath gotyn She wyll make hym at length as stronge as a crane For surely she wyll neuer forsake hym Tyll that his croper bone wax very lame The woman ¶ Then loke a cawdell you do gyt And soone ye loke you a better norce For I harde say god gaue man wyt To knowe the better from the worse The man ¶ Women wyll speke and contrary say They wyll nat shame a lye to tell To scolde and brawle is all theyr play Well happy is he that with them doth not mell The woman ¶ The commynge of our lorde Ihesu Many deuout woman dyd prophecye Sybellys they were that it best knewe For to dysprayse women ye do now vnwyslye The man ¶ One must them gyue that they desyre To bete or correcte them they waxen worse They neuer wyll stynt for to requyre As longe as a peny is in ones purse The woman ¶ When all thappostles from our lorde flyed Women tyll his deth styll dyd hym ensue Neuer woman our lorde denyed As Peter dyd but euer was true The man ¶ When ye of ony man knowe the intencyon Whiche coulde be secrete ye publysshe it by and by Vnto your gosseppys ye make therof mencyon As soone as ye togyther byb charryng lyke a pye The woman ¶ Chryste after his deth for our consolacyon Fyrst shewed vnto woman personally To Mary magdaleyn after his resurreccyon Whiche for his deth be wayled greuously The man ¶ A Wyfe of her husbande Wyll haue the audyence As chyef maystres her tale to tell She wyll crye wepe except she haue the p̄emynēce Wyll happy is he that with them doth not mell ¶ The woman ¶ That a man shold a woman or his wyfe byleue By Abraham is sygnyfyed playne For god vnto Sara fyrst knowlege dyd gyue That a chyld shold be procreat bytwyxt thē twayne The man ¶ Many cauteloustrastes now women they haue To make them proper and coynte to seme For proude apparell euer styll they craue Yet be they moost stynkynge and fylthy within The woman ¶ Of good women haue be founde many one Whiche haue ben chast and holy vyrgyns pure And that out of goddes lawes neuer hath gone Wherfore in heuen now sayntys be they sure The man ¶ But now of euyll there be so many Theyr kynde encreaseth styll euery day From euyl in to worse so fast they multyplye That wolde the deuyll had one to cary thother away The woman One vyrgyn another for goddis loue hath martyred By compulsyon of man as scrypture hath exprest That in a day .xi. thousand dyed Wherfore to dysprayse women ye do not best The man ¶ Consyderyng the euyll which of women haue com How false they be how cursed and cruell One ought to flye them and from them to ronne For well happy is he that with them doth not mell The woman ¶ All the nobles of cyme passed And all the sayntes of paradyse Fyrst all from women they haue proceded For to dysprayse women in fayth ye be not wyse The man ¶ Do weye your blame and laude in balaunce To se of them whiche twayne weye moste And when that ye se there the dyfferaunce I trowe of your laude ye wyll make small boste The woman ¶ For all the blames and offence That agaynst vs women ye can laye Consyder the bounte of our ladyes excellence And all our euylles her goodnes dothe delaye La femme replique ¶ Now the conclusyon the woman thus began These infamous men with all theyr polecy All noble women wolde gladly defame Were not our goodnes excedynge theyr glory ¶ For Caym kylled Abell his gentyll brother And Iudas Ruben his father dyd slay Nero made open his owne mother To se the place where that he lay ¶ The men of Iury made god to dye Iudas scaryot hym solde by false treason And after hym selfe hanged this is no lye Wherfore styll in payne his soule it doth won ¶ Chrystes Apostles dyd hym denye Men dyd hym crucefye by great vyolence And tyrans enraged dyspyte fullye Ten thousande slewe of Innocence ¶ Also in a day they dyd confounde A .xi. thousande vyrgyns vnto theyr deth Some they heedyd and some they drownde Some they smolthered and stopped theyr breth ¶ Men they had peruerse courage As ye may se now euydently To do vnto sayntes suche oultrage Without offence and no cause why ¶ Men make warres and dyscencyons In euery place as ye may se Theftes mordres and traysons Replete with all iniquyte ¶ More men there be in pryson In chaynes bounde for theyr offence More women come vnto sermon To lerne goddys lawes with dylygence ¶ Of euery man in all degre Mother and norces women hath ben Of all that are and euer shal be Women haue fyrst thautorite clen ¶ Wherfore of vs ye ought say well For to myssay ye can not wyn And ye that hath no grace goodnes to tell To holde his peace is best for hym ¶ Do ye say of vs the best Syns we ye kept When ye were small For of lytell medlynge cometh moche rest And god amende the worst of vs all ¶ The auctor ¶ Of this argument the hole entent I marked it effectually And after I had herde them at this discent I presed towardes them incontynently But when they sawe me aproche them to Lest I wolde repreue theyr argument Full fast they fledde then bothe me fro That I ne wyst whyther they went Wherfore now to iudge whiche is moost excellent I admyt it vnto this reders prudence Whyther to man or woman is more conuenyent The laude to be gyuen and wordly magnyfycence ¶ Finis wynkyn de worde