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A00276 A dialogue betweene a vertuous gentleman and a popish priest [ ... ]pleasaunt and profitable, both for ministers and gentlemen, men and vvomen, old and yong, made by I.B. I. B., fl. 1581. 1581 (1581) STC 1039; ESTC S120239 70,214 160

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they thinke to dwel vppon the earth alone this Wo do I heare alwaies sounde in my eares and it causeth mee to stand in awe fearing least for suche an offence it might fal on my selfe and therfore M. Parson to tell you my minde plainlie and what I thinke of these matters I doe so abhorre such couetous men and suche miserable wringing as is now a daies to much put in practise that I cannot like of those that vse it Par. You must like of them as the world is now or else few wil like of you Gen. How many doth dislike with mee for disliking with sinne I make no reckoning for I secke not the praise of men but my whole studie is that I may knowe best which waye to set foorthe the glorie of God and discharge my duetie vnto him of whome I am placed in office and I am taught not to * Exod. 23.2 follow a multitude to doe euil I know the most parte goe the wrong waye and I had rather deale iustly by my selfe then deale wickedly with companie for he that will commit sinne for company may chaunce to goe the diuel for companie If Noah and his companie had been companions with the wicked when the World was ouerflowed with water for the sinnes of the people no doubt of it but Noah and his companie had bene drowned for companie If Lot and his housholde had offended for companie they had no doubt beene burnt with the other Sodomites for companie If Caleb and Iosua had murmured againste God with the rest of the people for comapanie they had surelie haue bene kept out of the Land of promise with the rest for companie but let this hee oure comforte as it was theirs that if there be but eight persons in a whole Worlde but one housholde in a great citie but two men amongest manie thousand that feare God yet when the Lord sendeth his punishments amongst the people for their sinne the righteous shal be sure to haue no hurte a * Psal 91.7 thousande shal fal on their left hande ten thousand on their right yet there shal no harme come nere them Therefore M. Parson for mine own parte it is so farre from mee to participate with their offences that I abhor the companie of such as liue vngodlie Par. Mee thinkes you are to presise being a gentleman it were inough for mee my fellows to lead such a life as you speak of and yet I would not be bounde to liue so singuler a life for any thing a man may be holy and to holy if he be and if wee shoulde make choise of no company but such as are so holy wee may chaunce to seeke a greate while and yet go alone at the last Gen. I for my parte had as leaue to bee without companye as to bee in companye of those that liue wickedlie for he that toucheth pitch * Eccle. 13.1 2. Thes 3.14 Ephe. 5.7 shal bee defiled therewith and such as are conuersaunt with the vngodlie may chance to be infected with their dangerous diseases and S. Paul willeth suche as feare God not to bee companions of the wicked nor to haue any fellowshippe with the workes of darknesse Par. If the case doe stand with you that you wil chuse rather to bee alone then in such companie as dothe not like you and you wil like of none but those that liue vertuously I thinke it stoode you vppon to take greate deliberation in making choise of a good wife since the companie of the wicked doe so ill like of you Gen. You may well suppose that to bee true for so was I sure to finde it and because that amongest so manie women there are few good and as Salomon saide that amongst * Eccle. 7.30 a thousand he had not found one you maie well thinke a good wife harde to be gotten Par. What are they so scarse as you make them Gen. I haue tolde you what Salomon said and he was a man of great wisedome Par. Although good women were not plentie in his time yet there is good reason why there shoulde bee more liuing in these daies then euer there were for there dyed not a good woman a great while Gen. Oh M. Parson you speake more then you can prooue for death doth take the good as well as the bad and it was prepared for the one as well as for the other but belike you doe not knowe a good woman that you are of that mind Par. I praie you Sir by what tokens shall I know a good woman Gen. If shee be one that feareth God if she be holie as was Hester if shee bee constant as was Iudeth if she be vertuous as was Rebecca if she be chaste as was Susanna if she be obedient as was Sara if she loue Christ and his worde more then al the vanities of the worlde as did Mary if you find this in a Woman deubt not of her goodnesse but praise God for her and wishe her manie fellowes Par. What muste shee haue all this in her before she be good What if shee haue but two or thrée of these vertues is not that ynough if she be holie and obedient sometimes maie she not be a little curst a little couetous and maie not shee plaie the good-fellow a little somtimes when her husband is out of the waie Gen. No she must be altogether vertuous or else it were as good she were altogeather wicked for if she wil serue God shee must serue him alone for he is a ielous God and wil not part stakes with anie he will haue al or none if there be but one sinne found in a woman wherby she doth dishonor god it is inough to condemne her although shee thinke her self fraught with manie vertues Par. What do you thinke so I woulde faine know how you can proue that Gen. I will prooue it by this place of Scripture which saith they * Math. 5.19 Iam. 2.10 that offende in one point are guiltie of the whole law Par. In deede you saie true such a place there is but yet me thinkes it is harde dealing that when a man or woman hath kept a great manie of the commaundementes a great while and shal goe to the diuel at last for the breach of one of them beleeue me if you wil if it be true I thinke there is not a woman in this country that shall be saued for I neuer hard of the woman nor yet man that hath kepte the lawe so preciselie but that they haue offended one waie or other and what shal they then doe if the case do so stand Gen. This maie bee our comfort that that which of our selues wee can not doe and that part of the lawe which we doe not fulfil Christ * 1. Ioh 2.2 hath done it for vs if we take hold on him by faith and trust in him as our onelie Mediator and Redeemer Par. This is wel saide nowe I like you
doth tender his owne saluation to leaue no meanes vnsought for that might bring it to passe and to be most carefull for the same as that which doth deserue greatest labor if there be any that will say they would willingly do it if they knewe vvich vvay to beginne let * Iohn 5.39 them bring themselues acquainted vvith the vvorde of God vvhich is able to * 2. Tim. 3.16 make them vvise vnto saluation if they vvill say their knowledge is smal and the scriptures are hard to be vnderstoode let them seeke diligently * Mat. 7.7 pray hartily and knocke hard and the Lorde vvill open the doore of knowledge vnto them and giue them right hearts of a good vnderstanding if any vvill say they haue so much to deale in worldly affayres that they cannot spare one hour in the day to read the vvord of God let thē knovv except all their actions be measured by the lyne of Gods vvorde their labor is lost their time ill spent their hope is vaine their vvroks vnprofitable and * Deut. 28.17 all that they take in hande accursed if there be any that thinke themselues so well spedde that they need no more teaching let them learn to put their knowledge in practise in framing their liues according lest when they know * Luk. 12.56 much doe little their damnation be the greater if there be any that vvill say there are none so vnwise to do that which they know to be vnlawfull let them know that of that number there are too many and although the most part must of necessitie confesse that there is a God whom they ought to serue yet the diuell doth draw many with great force to liue as those that knovve no God such is the corruption of mans nature and so great are the assaultes of our enemie the diuell that vvhen vve knovv our duetie and see the path way that will lead vs vnto eternall lyfe yet through the suggestions of Satan and the deceitfulnesse of sinne we are drawne to tread the steps of death and euerlasting destruction And some there be to excuse this their fooly will defende their life though neuer so vile and that they may haue the bridle of licentiousnesse to tunne at ran done though against their consciences they will not spare to call euill good and good euill darknesse light and light darknes they that may make a faire shew in the worlde and regard not at all how manifestly they lye before the face of almighty God this fault vvas found in * Act. 5.4 Ananias Saphira his vvife for the vvhich they both lost their liues and this vvickednesse doth still remain amongst vs although the punishment be not so euidently seene of this number are so many as know their dutie and lead a life cleane contrary that knovv lying to bee a faulte and yet vvill not sticke to lye for aduantage that knovv it to be sinne to sweare and yet haue their mouthes full of vayne othes that know adultery to be abominable in the sight of God and yet liue in whordome al the dayes of their life that knovv murther to be a breach of the lavve and yet vvish their brothers throates cut that they may haue their good that know couetousnesse to be the roote of all euil and yet thinke lucre to be godlinesse that knovve the rewarde of sinne to be death and yet liue in vvickednesse al the dayes of their life these men knovve it yea and vvith all their hearts they knovv it and vvith shame ynough vvill not sticke to say it and shut vp al with tushe God is mercifull and vvith this cloake they thinke to couer their shame and by that meanes to set God besides his iudgements but vvhen they shall be arraigned before his iudgement seate to aunswere for the breache of his lavves I feare me this cloake of hypocrisie beeing founde on their backes vvill be taken for the liuery of their maister the diuell vvhom as they haue serued in this worlde vvithout any feare of God so shal they dwell vvith him for euer in fire euerlasting vvhich is prepared for him and his Angels These are the faultes of our time and such punishments doe follow such sinnes and the wickednes of the people is so great that we haue good cause to say vvith Dauid that it is * Psal 119. time O Lorde for thee to lay to thine hand But because these thinges are farre from you vvhich doe so ill like of them that you are an enemye to those that vse them you may thinke your self happie and thrise happie vvhom God hath deliuered from so great euils And for my selfe as I am by duety bounde to do you the best seruice that I may and haue receyued more benefites at your handes then euer I deserued I can but vvishe you that vvhich no man can giue you and pray for that vvhich you may obtaine that you may so serue the Lorde of heauen and earth during the time of your pilgrimage in this shorte and transitory vvorlde that vvhen this life shall cease and all vvorldly helpes shall fayle you you may haue God your father Christ your brother the holy Ghost your comforter the Angels your companions your inheritance aboue the Heauens vvith ioyes vnspeakable in a life that shall last for euer Amen Your worships humble seruant I. B. To the godly Reader THe estate of these our dayes is so dangerous the people so vngratious with sin so abounding vertue so little set by of almost al euery where the it may melt a christiā hart to meditate thereon such negligence in Magistrates suche rebellion in subiects such carelesnes in fathers mothers and suche disobedience in sonnes daughters that wheras we looke to receiue the fruits of the earth the blessings of heauen powred out vpon vs according so the prourise of the Lorde vnto his children the maruel is great the the sun doth not skorch vs the water drowne vs the earth gape redy to deuour vs for our disobedience and vnthākfulnes for the same What blessings are there which we haue not receiued and what sinn is ther but we haue committed what could a father do more for his owne children then to keepe them as the apple of his eye what tokens of ●asterdly impes can there be greater then to liue as vagabounds the regard not their father oh howe wel may this complaint of the Prophet be applied vnto vs that the * Esai 12. Lord hath brought vp children they haue done vnfaithfully against him ah sinfull nation a people laden with iniquitie a seede of the wicked such as haue forsaken the Lord and proud●ed the holy one of Israell to anger and as the Prophet Osee said of Israel so may it ●e sayd of England that * Ose 14.41 ther is no truth no mercy no knowledge of god in the land but swearing lying manslaughter theft adultery haue gotten the vpper
that they might knowe what they ought to doe and if I find anie so obstinate that will not learne or so vngodly that doth refuse to reforme his life I reforme my house and send him out of the doores for I knowe the roome of such to bee better then their companie and that one skabbed shéepe may marre a whole flocke and the companie of the vngodly to be so dangerous as no plague nor pestilence is so infectious and I haue learned of Dauid to looke vnto * Psal 10.16 such as are faithfull in the land that they may dwel with me and such as feare God those I make my seruants Par. These orders in bringing vp of your seruants in the feare of God deserue great commendations But if they doe their seruice faithfully as it becommeth them do you keep them continually in the seruitude of Egypt Gen. No for I am taught to * Eccle. 7 21. Deut. 15.13 loue a discrete seruaunt as mine owne soule and not to defraud him of his libertie nor leaue him a poore man and it is my duetie to doe vnto my seruants that which * Colo. 4.1 is iust and equall knowing that meself haue a master in heauen Thus M. Parson haue I shewed you my bringing vppe and howe from my Childehoode vnto this daie I haue lead my life and of these orders if it please you I can be contented you shal be a partner and if you be now any better perswaded then heretofore I wil willingly bestow the charge on you to finde you meate and drinke and all other thinges necessary for you as long as you liue if you will accept such intertainment as I can make you Par. Sir I am bound to thanke you for your good will moste heartelie but I doe not yet find any such necessity to be chargeable vnto any man as long as I am able to discharge my selfe Gen. Oh it gréeueth me to heare you are you alwaies one manner of man you haue tolde me that you haue no wife nor child to care for and what can you more desire then food and raiment Par. But what neede I become subiect to any mā when as I maie be master of seruantes my selfe Gen. For any subiection at your handes I neuer meant to looke for but if you can like of this offer you shal haue a chamber as your owne a man at your commaundement and you shall fare no worse then my selfe which I trust shal be sufficient to content either of vs both Therefore if you can finde in your hearte to forsake your vngodlie promotion and liuings vnlawfullie possessed and becom a new man and seruaunt to God saie no longer nay but take this offer while you maie haue it Par. To haue a Chamber in your house and to forgoe a house of mine owne is so exchaunge the better for the woorse and to shut my selfe in a prison wheras I am now at libertie and whereas you offer mee one man to attend on me you maie knowe that I now am able to keepe thrée or foure faule fellowes which are readie at all times to serue my tourne and I am so well beloued amongst my parishioners that ther are few men or their wiues but are at my commandement to do for me the best that they maie therefore you to counsell mee to leaue all these commodities and bee chargeable to you is to trouble your selfe and doe me no pleasure Gen. Oh M. Parson I would not wishe you to thinke so but that I can be content to be at greater charge so that I might thereby doe you any good And these vanities which you account commodities are nothing but trains of the diuel to trap you in his gin for he could be contented to giue you all this worlde if it were his that hee might haue but your soule in the worlde to come therefore M. Parson I woulde you knew it that that which I haue sayde I wish you for the best and that you might be vnburdened of that great charge which is too heauie for you to beare Oh let not the loue of money worke the losse of your soule but be contented to lose somwhat for Christ which was contented to laie downe his life for you oh * VVis 1.12 seeke not your death in the error of your life make no tarying to turne vnto the Lorde and put not of from day to day vnlesse his wrath come suddenly and in the time of vengeance he do destroy you doe no longer sel your selfe to sinne this miserable world but set your affections in heauen where your redemer liueth for euer Come awaie from that whoore of Babylon drinke no longer of her poison leaue of from Papistrie and defie the Pope and al Poperie Par. Why I trust gentleman you doe not thinke that I am a Papist for so you might prooue me a traitor both to God and the Quéene Gen. Truelie M. Parson I haue taken you for no other al this while Par. Then I perceiue you haue beene farre deceiued for I would you knewe it I am as good a Protestant as the proudest of you al. Gen. What are you so I praie you what protestation can you make thereof that I maie be so wel persuaded of you Par. I can eate fleshe on Fridaies I care not if there were not one fasting daie in a whole yeare I can fal to my vittailes al the Lente I care not if the Pope were hanged so I mighte fare a penie the better for it I can bee as holy in the Church as any man although the flesh be somwhat fraile when I am abroade and a thousande such thinges can I doe which woulde be to long to reherse Gen. Oh I perceiue you are deceiued of your self for you are an Epicure out right What doe you account this to bee a Protestants life No M. Parson a Protestaunt is not knowne by these marks Par. No I praye you howe wil you know a Protestant Gen. If hee professe that there is no redemption * 1. Tim. 2.5 but in the bloud of Christ if the word * Gal. 3.24 of god dwel in him plentifully if his talke be alwaies of the * Heb. 9.26 commaundements of the Lorde if his profession and * Colo 6.7 Deut. 6.7 Rom. 2.13 his life doe agree if hee loue such as feare God for his sake if the world be * Psal 15.4 Gal. 5.24 crucified vnto him and he vnto the world if he be not hie minded but doth make himself equal with those of the lower sort If he * Phil. 3.8 count al the worlde but dung that he may winne Christ if hee loue * Psal 119. the lawe of the Lorde aboue golde or pretious stone If he be no * Ephe. 5.5 whoremonger no drunkard no vsurer no theefe no swearer no filthie talker no couetous person If he be no negligent Pastor if he be sory for his sinnes committed and doth seeke to become a
new man if he loue Christ and his Gospel so wel * Luk. 14.26 that he can be contented to loose his life for the same If you finde this in a man knowe him to be a Protestant as wel in deed as in name for this is required of him that wil be a professour of the gospel and bear the name of a Protestant Par. What are there no Protestaunts but such as haue al this in them then I think there be not manie Protestauntes amongest a great number of professors Gen. In deede I knowe Christes flocke is a litle flocke that it is an easier matter to bee called a Protestaunt then prooued a Protestant but yet some there are and that manie more then we knowe which do worship God in spirite and trueth and are appointed to be heires of the kingdome of heauen Of the which number M. Parson I long to finde you one and if you will once turn vnto Christ he wil be be merciful vnto you and there wil bee more ioie of so penitent a sinner then of * Luk. 15.7 ninety and nine iust persons If you did know the rewarde you should haue for following of Christe you would make haste to goe after him If you did knowe the ioies that God hath prepared for those that loue him were such as the * 1 Cor. 2.9 eye hath not seene the eare hath not hard nether the hart of man hath euer conceiued you woulde thirste after them as the Hart doth for the water brooks If you did knowe howe * Psal 84.1 amiable are the dwellinges of the Lorde of Hostes your soule woulde haue a desire and longing to enter into the courts of the Lorde yea your heart and your fleshe would reioice in the liuing God If you did know that in his presence is the * Psal 16.12 fulnes of ioy that at his right hand there are pleasures for euermore you wil chuse rather to be a * Psal 84.11 doore keeper in the house of youre God then to dwel in the tentes of the vngodlie If you did know the glorie they shal haue in his kingdome that suffer for his sake in this world you would set more by the * ●eb 11.16 rebuke of Christe then by al the treasures of Egipt Beware of that subtil serpent the Diuel which goeth aboute like a * ● Pet. 5.8 roaring Lion readie to deuour you it is his persuasions the makes you in loue with this world and if it lay in him he would saie vnto you as he did vnto Christ that he * Mat. 4.8 woulde giue you al the kingdomes in the worlde to fal downe worship him for riches and other vanities of the world being vnlawfully possessed are nothing but baites of that subtile Serpent to intrap such as be not warie of him Therefore as you loue the safetie of your self depart from that which is euil remember * Rom. 6.23 that euerlasting life is the gift of God and the reward of sinne is euerlasting damnation and know that one sweete loost from Christes cheekes is better then al the faire countenances of the world and an angrie countenaunce from his face is able to crush al their enimies in peeces Therfore auoid his displeasure beware of his wrath get into his fauor and continue in his fear and you shal stand though the earth fal and shal be sure of the victorie though al the world were set against you Par. For your good councel I most heartelie thank you with your gentle persuasions you haue greatlie moued me therefore I mean to take another order with my self which I trust shal like you wel enough Gen. I pray you M. Parson let me hear that order Par. Thus I doe determine to lay my plot because it is a feareful thing to fall into the handes of the liuing God and greate dangers are like to befal those that cōtinue in their sinne I wil take such a order that I wil not spende much but liue sparingly a while vntil I haue gotten a good peece of mony in my purse that may maintaine me during my life and then I wil departe from my liuings and repent for al matters halfe a dozen yeares hence Gen. But what if you should chauuce to dye M. Parson before these yeares come out Par. In deede that is the worst I neuer thought on that Gen. Oh in any wise haue care of that for death commeth manye times vnlooked for and you are not sure of your life one houre and if death should ouertake you in your sinnes you are lost for euer Therefore I wold wish you not to delay the time any longer but deale wisely for your selfe while you may for if you be once gone * Psal 50.22 no man may deliuer you nor make agreement vnto God for you Par. Truely Gentleman you say honestly your persuasions are verie strong and if I might be sure to obteine the fauor of God and inherite the kingdome of heauen by suche meanes as you haue shewed me and that there were no doubte of it I could be contented to yeeld vnto you but I must tel you plain my benefices are swéete and if I should forsake them all and go to the diuel at last it would grieue me Gen. To put you oute of doubte for that matter heare what Christe himselfe saith which is the dore whereby you must enter into heauen whosoeuer * Mar. 19.29 saith he forsaketh house or brethren father or mother wife or children goodes or landes for my names sake shal receiue an hundred folde in this world and in the world to come life euerlasting Par. What is ment by that hundred fold that if I put awaie my benefices I shall haue them againe and manie more then I care not how soone I depart with them Gen. No M. Par. you must not thinke so but this knowe that God is able to giue you a thousande times more as you maie see by the example of * Iob. 42.10 Iob but the meaning is this that you shal in this whorlde haue such peace of conscience which the vngodlie are without that you shal saie with Paule you are as * 2. Cor. 6.10 hauing nothing and yet possessing all things and in the world to come ioies vnspeakable in a life that shal last for euer Therefore M. Parson think no time so happie as that which you bestow in procuring of your self that which wil stick by you for euer Par. Oh this comfort is great and these wordes haue stroken me to the heart Gen. How doe you M. Par me thinkes your collour doth begin to change Par. Oh oh oh Gen. What are you not wel that you looke so ill Par. Oh sicke sicke Gen. I woulde we had some Ginger for you or a little Aquauitie Par. Oh I am sicke I am sicke Gen. Wil you ride to some towne and we will send your water to some phisition Par. Oh no