the deedes dye wiâ—h thâ— death of the Husband And therefore for troth I must giue praise to those whom you haue named but â—ouching their death for that the same was doone desperately there can be no cause of prayse preferred to such persons For that by sacred writ we are 〈◊〉 in what sorrow or 〈◊〉 soeuer we be not to shorten 〈◊〉 dayes by any stroke of death but paciently to take the same vntill by the prouidence of God we finde ease of all such euils And therefore Learning hath left no such lawde of the death of these Dames although their liues be woorthy the writing Therfore Madame you muste vale now and giue place to Learning or els you erre much in your oppinion for that you by their deathes make them to be renowned which rather deserue vtterly to be reprochefully reputed In that they to féede their fonde and amorous affection would by the losse of their 〈◊〉 breathe life into the bodyes of their buryed husbande 〈…〉 wish with my hart all women 〈◊〉 follow the same but touching theyr deathes that I referre to Diuines but surely on my part it is vtterly detested For I can appropriate no 〈◊〉 to such a pernicious 〈◊〉 ne can any man commend the same to be doone of constancie but rather frantick or foolishly And therefore Madame I cannot allow your argument to be good Ladie Why Sir I am sure I haue forged no fable whereby to make theyr prayse a president 〈◊〉 my purpose â—e séeke I to attribute to their dooinges any larger discourse then I can affirme â—y authority And therefore i◠〈◊〉 the contrary haue declared of 〈…〉 â—ene dead And if by their deathes they haue rather merited reproche then renowne who then is in the fault but those y â— haue painted their prayse in place of dysprayse For if their liues were honorable and their deathes odyous theyr liues should haue béene registred their deathes béene put in obliuion But I will not be perswaded although you deeme their desperation to be damnable but that those Dames doo yet liue in delight 〈◊〉 for at that time they rather chused death to winne a 〈◊〉 life thereâ—y then to liue licenciously to die a double death And therefore â—y opinion is these Ladyes although they knew not Christianity 〈◊〉 had and haue theyâ— foules the glory and gaine of 〈◊〉 on and therefore Learning 〈…〉 lâ—ttle to contend with 〈…〉 But now vnto a farther 〈◊〉 you will not allow Looue to be 〈◊〉 ouer Learning and therefore 〈◊〉 approoue it by an example 〈◊〉 shalbe no lesse familiar then faithfull What will you then giue ouer Scholler Madame I will â—iue you the hearing and as I like your reason so shall you heare my reply if it be good I will allow it if otherwise I muste and will confesse the conâ—rarie Ladie Well then Sir to the purpose WHen the King of Hetruria had sent his defâ—aunce to the Senate of Roome and that his Legats expected the aunswer of the Senatorâ— Mutius Scâ—â—uola and Coclius then Consuls béeing in the Senate theâ—â— was a controuersie betwéene 〈◊〉 they were deuided on contraâ—â—◠〈◊〉 parte helde it best to make 〈◊〉 with the Hetrurians and 〈◊〉 some to giue aunswer to the â—â—ntrary but especially Coclius who 〈◊〉 an eloquent Oration openly 〈◊〉 the Senate perswaded the Roâ—â—ines not to take truce but valiantly to prooue themselues as theyr noble Progenitors had doone before them Whose Oration béeing ended as you know Scaeuola replyed that Coclius had little care of his Countrey so to perswade them to warres when by their wisedomes they were able to appease the hatred of the Hetrurian King But whilest they contended about this case a Messenger came running 〈◊〉 into y e Senate house and brought ridings how the enemy was at 〈◊〉 the Feildes were couered with armed men and the Walles of Roome at point to bâ— scaled Which Coâ—â—â—us heaâ—ing now my Lordes quoth he defend Roome by your wisdome and Learning I leaue you and with that woord sodainly departed and hastily 〈◊〉 himselfe came firste to 〈…〉 where by an assault the enemy 〈◊〉 ready to enter But Coclius 〈◊〉 more the sauegarde of his 〈…〉 then surety of himselfe stoode in 〈◊〉 fence and kept the Bridge 〈◊〉 the whole Hoste of Heâ—rurians and when he sawe no remedy he fired the Bridge twixte him and the enemy and taking his halfe Shéelde which then he had left he refused not to leap into Tyber and so to hazarde his life rather then to leaue to his foes the conquest and spoile of his Countrey Héere was Looue more then Learning for if Learning could haue defended Roome I déeme it sufficiently supplied with Schollers But héer was Looue conquerâ—â— and whilste Looue labored by life to frée Roome froÌ„ ruine Learning lay soft at home expectyng when the enemie would come to fight with words But had Looue bothe by Coclius and after by Mucius Scaeuola â— béene no better Soldiers to their Countrey by theyr Looue then such Sâ—hollers by their 〈…〉 walles of Rome should then 〈◊〉 at this day the sloth of theyr 〈◊〉 Senators and prayse the Looue and vertue of Coclius and 〈◊〉 And though the one held 〈◊〉 a wrong opinion against the other when Mutius Scaeuola had heard what a valliant exployt was by Coclius atcheiued What quoth he shall Mutins he mewed vp in the Senate and heare such fame ringe in Rome of Coclius No. And with that woord he departed to the Campe of his enemy where he by his endeuor shewed such a Looue to his Countey as neuer was the like since the death of Curtius Whose example if I séeme to passe with out prayse I should sure ecclipse the honour that by him was doone to Roome and also wrong much the Knight who for his CouÌ„try counted his lyfe to be as nothing These and such other examples are ryfe in memory and therefore I but giue notyce of theyr noble nature But Sir how many were in Roome of your profession that for the publique weale would put himselfe in perill like to any of these that is to say Coclius Curtius or Mutius Scaeuola And how if I named Marcius Regulus Manlius Coriolanus yea or Scipio surnamed Africanus these were all Schollers yea and Senators But how many shewed like Looue to Roome as they did and had so small a guerdon for their good will Manlius after long and manye yeares venturing his life in the quarrell and right of his Countrey When he came vnto Roome was throwne ouer the walles into the riuer Tyber Coriolâ—nus was banished and when he 〈…〉 Voltians against the 〈◊〉 Roome they then fearing theyr destruction sent out his Mother Wife and children with charge not to returne till they with him had gotten truce Which once vnderstood of the Voltians when he returned to his Campe he â—as of them trayterouslie slaine Mâ—râ—us Regulus after many notable things by him aâ—chieued was cruelly stoned or presâ— to death by his owne
he regarding more the Looue of his Lamia then the safety or 〈…〉 〈…〉 take my Lamias life thou leauest 〈◊〉 her looue behinde with me She being dead as some writers affirme was by him kissed and imbraced as 〈◊〉 wheÌ„ she liued wheÌ„ he saw nâ— remedy but y â— law of nature must haue her due he causd her sepulcher to be made before his window whereas he vsed once a day whilste he liued to waile y e death of her In so much y e it was proponed by the Philosophers of Athens 〈◊〉 woorkes yet liue and in spight of 〈◊〉 they vaunt of victory Therefore Madame heere was looue loste with Lamia and though Demetrius 〈◊〉 her his Learning did loathe her And therefore I hope this example may make you content not to striue any further Ladie Nay Sir you shall not so shake me off séeing you by common Courtizans doe rather gaine glory then by loyall looue vsed of constant Ladyes I will now requite your example with the like although I might rather blushe then to boaste thereof Yet séeing we stand vpon example hetherto onely vpon prayse and disprayse of Looue I purpose now to wade a little farther and either to prooue Looue Soueraigne of Learning or Learning superior and looue his Subiect I am sure you are not ignoraunt of Flora for that I heard you name her of late the life of whom though I wish not to commend so will I not condemne her wisedome in the subtill Schooling and Nurtering of her Pupils or Schollers FLora was of byrthe noble of nature gentle of personage beautifull and of Looue liberall in so much that ouer the place where she dwelt she set vp this scrole or prescripte Except King Prince Dictator Praetor Consull Censor or Questor heere is no place for any to enter As for Emperor or Keyser they were not then knowne this was her vse she neuer set her honour like Layes to salery for Laies would commonly haue her hyer before hande Now Flora had this fetch she as not respecting Goulde or Siluer gaue her selfe to be gouerned by her Loouer And so by this meanes she got treasure infinite for why this was her common phrase béeing one day demaunded the cause by Noble men why she refused to aske what she would haue she aunswered thus I coÌ„mit my selfe quoth she to Princes and Noble men that according to my beautye I may be pertaker of their bounty For quoth she by the Gods whom I doo serue there was neuer man gaue me so little but that I had more then I lookt for or double to my demaund There ought quoth she no sage woman to set her selfe to sale for all things in y â— world are rated at a price except Looue and y â— is not to be payed but with Looue so that none ought to demaund duety for the amorous pleasure she dooth to a man but for the Looue she beareth vnto him This was y e opinioÌ„ of this Courtezan who though she were coÌ„mon it was not so much for coyne as courtesie She sought to none yet was she sought of all The learnedst thought no shame to be her Schollers Then Ergo Looue was héere more regardant then Learning wheÌ„ Consuls Censores left all for lust Looue of Flora. Whether was Wit or Wisdome héere best Scholler Witte wan Looue and wealth and Wisdome loste wealth and gaynde Luste Scholler Sure Madame you scan the sence contrary for though Flora found such fortune as that the wisest and wealthiest were bondmen vnto her beautie yet she neuer held Learning in subiection Learning still had liberty to triumphe ouer Looue although the learned were snared by her subtilty So that if Looue haue conquered any blame the Booke bearer and not the Booke for Learning it self neuer yet hath nor will bende to beauty I stand vpon this oppinion Ladie Of trothe I beléeue you thinke your selfe in your study or els you would not speake so obscure but what figure you take I know not but wel I note all your woords are per Allegoriam But Sir according to my Lodgicke I will approoue that as long as the Learned are liuing they enioy Learning and the benefit thereof you cannot seperate them a sunder for conquere one and take bothe Euen as a man should say take my heart and take my life naming two when one would suffise Therefore Sir I say that if Loone subdue the Learned shee then is conqueror of bothe vnlesse you will make a distinction touching the person of the one and the property of the other and that you cannot for that they bothe are so faste lincked as nothing can sunder them therefore you erre if to the contrarye you conster the case Scholler Well then I perceaue you will haue it either to what perfection you please or els you wyll not giue ouer And therefore as I remember Cornelius Suetonius sheweth a notable example to the vtter abollishing of Looue which you tearme amorous or pleasauÌ„t pastimes and for because that you will not be perswaded that Looue can any way be reiected rightfully I will now by example prooue it to be so odious as you your selfe shall confesse it hath varyed from the lawes of Nature and this is the example THe Tirant Nero who not onely longe time mosteâ— inordinately and beastly spoyled a number of Uirâ—ins and chaste Ladyes but also finding a beautifull Boye more pleasaunt in his eyes then any other Uirgin or woman caused his secrets to be spoyled thinking thereby to haue him transformed to his owne pleasure by such a Metamorphosis as of a man to haue a woman Not long after he married him naming him Sporus endowing him with such secret duties as to a Wife are due by dowry Héere was lust more theÌ„ law of Nature and yet it was Looue But I hope you will not allow this séeing that Nature was héere a foe vnto her selfe in kindling so great a fire in Nero as could not be quenched without such a cursed coniunction This Luste of Nero quite extinguished the glory of Looue and makes the same so odious to the eares of such as reade this tragedy that men rather séeke by reason to brydle such fiery affections then to be found acquainted with such pestilent passions So that Cornelius and Suetonius doo leaue their Learning to be a Lampe or Loadstone vnto our liues that though we séeke to be rather thralle to Looue then by Learning to haue liberty yet theyr counsell is héerein to be ruled by Learning and not to raunge beyonde reason so that Learning is héere vtter enemy to looue Furthermore sithe I am so farre entred I will yet make a farther discourse of the vnnaturall Looue of a Father to his owne Childe that the terror of the tale may giue light as in a Glasse to beholde how vnchaste and inconstant Looue is for the moste parte Ladie Beginne your tale I attend the same with dilligence Scholler WEll Madame then know you
when Diophes was Kinge of Egipt whose substaunce treasure and reuenues were vtterly consumen and spent to maintaine a sumptuous woorke which he had then in hande the number of whose workemen was not so fâ—we as one hundred thousand Who labouring long tyme vppon a pyle as the Author affirmeth wasted so much wealthe as that he was not onely destitute but also desperate to comprehend the same And séeing by no meanes possible the same could be finished but onely by the meane of money which then he did want He commeth to his Daughter and commaundeth her earnestly to giue her selfe to sensuall prostitution menacing her not onely to pitch a great price vpon her honor but also to embrace euery one that brought to her commodity Which soone after she fulfilled no lesse with regarde to her owne profit then also to performe her promise to her father For looke how many dealt or had dalliauÌ„ce with her of euery such she demaunded a Stone whereby at last she gathered such a gayne that the price thereof builded the Piramides a certaine hill which beareth on the top one hundreth and fiftie foote This Looue you must néedes confesse was neither good nor godly and therfore Learning in this place had béene better then Looue For then the excessiue expence of the father had neuer sought the sale and the spoyle of his owne séede but héere was Luste and no Learning which forced folly bothe in Father and Daughter Farther more as I remember Lodouicus Vartomanus writeth of a straunge and wonderfull wooing or looue making which in a prouince in India named Tarnassery is commonly vsed and thus it is WHat time as any young man becommeth amorous of any Dame he commeth to her and taking a péece of woollen cloathe which he dippeth in Oyle he clappeth the same to his naked arme and setting fier thereto he protesteth by his Gods to endure no lesse torment for her whom he looueth then that which in her sight she séeeth him to receiue signifying therby that there is no torment or martirdome that may be ministred to a man but that he is able to abyde the same for her sake But what thinke you Madame wrought Looue or Learning first the effect If it were Looue what néede he then to scorche his skinne If it were Learning as it caÌ„ be no other vnlesse Diuine inspiration put it in his head which if it were yet was it Learning although applyed leawdely to a more lasciuious Luste How thinke you Madame haue you examples enowe or wyll you any more Ladie My sence is almoste surprised with these detestable yea or rather diuelish discourses for amongst all these euils although I confesse they haue béene contributores to Cupid there hath not yet beene any without spot and yet the bad is as good as the best to reasoÌ„ with you But leauing them as they are not yéelding any whit to Learning What thinke you now Sir of such Dames whose vertues haue béene vaunted of the wisest praysed of Philosophers and Poets yea and so lamented of the learnedst as that neither Pen nor Poet was able to discourse the Looue and loyaltie which in their liues they ought to their husbandes ne like case to Recorde the reuenge with lyuing with theyr Husbands losse they vsed on themselues FIrste to begin with Porcia the Daughter of Cato and wife vnto Brutus who when shée vnderstoode of the slaughter of her spowse not hauing an instrument for death so ready as she wisht to shew the looue and loyalty she bare to her Brutus deuoured burning coales Cleopatra Quéene of Egipt at such time as the death of her Anthonius was once to her reuealed no myrthe no meate no delight was so much desired of her as death Whom when Octauius Caesar had perceiued and sawe by her passions that she could not preuent the same without perill of her person hee caused her to be strongely garded warâ—ly watched yea and so circumspectly conducted as that he déemed her safe from séeking slaughter of her selfe But how brought she to passe her will she approoued a straunger torment then either sworde or fier and that which moste deare she alwayes reserued for Anthonius she refused not to bestow bountefully on venemous Serpents wherewith her corpes was cleane consumed Thyrdly let vs not forget that loyall Ladye Arthemezia Quéene of Caria and wife of Mansolus who when her Husbands death was blowen into her eares wepte so bitterly with such aboundaunce of teares that well nighe all the moysture in her body conuerted into watry humores yea or rather floods of Salte droppes Whose death when with mourning and sorrowing shee had sufficiently supplyed she caused a moste sumptuous Sepulcher or Shrine to be made and as the bodys wasted and consumed so dranke she vp still the duste of her deare Mansolus neuer leauing til the very bones had satisfyed her as the rest before Thus was her selfe the Sepulcher of her spowse déeming the woormes vnwoorthy for him although they were fed with her selfe Furthermore Liuie reciteth that when it was reported to Iulya how Pompaeus her husband was slaine in the féelde she tooke the same so sorrowfull that in the presence of Pompaeus she passed her life Also the wife of Brucollo an Allemaigne when for treasoÌ„ her husband was by the Emperor Claudius Marcello condemned to be deuoured of Lions she sued vnto the Emperor to participate the torment of her Husband And when she sawe no intercession would serue neither for his suretie of life nor for her selfe who desired to accompany him to death shée brake into such a furie as not regarding the torment she spake the moste vyle and reprochefull woordes she could inuent against the Emperor Claudius Yea and if his Garde had not béene shee had slaine him Which the Noble Emperor séeing and considering of the cause not onely pardoned her Husband and her selfe but also gaue them largely for to liue How thinke you now sir whether dooth Looue or Learning héere get moste prayse Learning in this place preferres Looue or els there had béene no memorie made of the liues of these chaste and constant Ladyes And therefore Learning hath made a Register and vollume of their vertues wishing others to immitate the like as did these honest Matrons whose liues is the onely Lampe or Loadestone for Ladyes How thinke you Sir can you alledge any thing to the contrary Scholler I cannot well condemne them ne will I els commend any partâ—â—â—ler person Ladie Why were they not chaste and constant to theyr husbandes that would not refuse to accompany them to the death Scholler I will not deny but theyr death did argue a great signe of constanâ—ie for that in such extremeties the losse of lyfe is a Touchestone either to trye Looue to be faythfull or els to bee fayned For otherwise there are many that wyll vowe in showe to taste any torment for the health or surety of their husbands but
Countreymen whom he had doone so much for Scipio likewise spending all his time in the wars and defence of his Country neuer found any such enemy as Roome which rewardeâ— him with banishment So that he dyed in a Uillage in the Countrey accusing Roome to be the enemy and author of all his euils Hanniball likewise found Carthage so vnkinde that flying in his olde age to Prusius â—or succour 〈…〉 and so rather then to yeelde to his foes poysoned himselfe These fellowes looued not to praâ—â— of Table Philosophie nor to make a 〈◊〉 sitting in theyr Ladyes lappâ—s For these Loouers neuer went to studie what elloquencâ— they should vse to please theyr Loouers but bluntly powred it out that bothe earth and Skies resounded the Eccho df theyr enuie And furthermore when as Dametria vnderstood that her sonne sent in the defence of his Countrey fayled to shew his valliancie according as it was in charge to him committed How aunswered she the Messenger Hath not my sonne quoth she wun fame to his Countrey No certainly quoth he but vtter dishonor by his cowardnes Well quoth shee and what he hath loste among his foes at his returne he shall finde amongst his freends he shall neuer bring confusion to his Countrey nor sorrow to my soâ—le 〈…〉 rewarde 〈…〉 sonne within a while came home and hauing then prooâ—â—â— valiant indéedâ— came according to the auncient custome of Câ—nquerâ—â—s Which whâ— she sawe she with teares séemed tenderly to welcome him But in the dead time of his sléepe she murthered him And béeing demaunded the cause shée replyed thus Héereby quoth shée I haue fréeed my selfe and â—ountrey from a cowarde and giuen victory to him by death that could not attayne it by life meaning that by his death his Countrey should neuer come to ruine by his cause Héere was a straunge kinde of Looue when the Common wealth was nourished before nature and the libertie thereof pawned by the pryce and corpes of her owne Childe But shee estéemed not his life so much as the Looue she ought to her Countrey yet was she Learned and 〈◊〉 Lawe of nature thought her sonne woorthye to taste such a torment Also Genutius when his enemyes Campe and his were so nigh as that the one would in time of truâ—â— visit â—he other he commaunded vpon paine of death no man for any cause the Trumpet of truce once sounded should encounter his enemy Not long after it hapened a noble youth comming towards the Campe of Genutius from the other side bothe in signes and woords of reproche challenged Briaro the sonne of Genutius who knowing the daunger yet séeing the hautie heart of his enemie answered Neuer shall it be sayde that a Consulles sonne of Roome will suffer himselfe to bee so scorned and turning himselfe towardes his foe gaue him that which to crakers and praters is moste due in so muche that hée slewe him Whereat the Souldiours reioysyng thinking to haue had praise of 〈◊〉 bewrayeth the whole summe Which when he heard béeing mâ—â—ued therewith that his commaundement was no more regarded Goe quoth he take him whippe him at a â—â—ake and after strike of his head Neuer shall the Lawe of the Romaines be broken by Genutius How thinke you Sir hee was Consull and he bothe knew Looue Learning and Lawe yet was Looue preferred héere before bothe Therefore you now cannot otherwise but accoumpte this saying true Amor vinciâ— omnia For héer generally Loue is still Conqueror and Learning the onely Uassaile and Subiect vnto Looue Scholler You haue waded very farre in searching authorityes but sure Madame you are yet wide of the white your Shaftes are well shotte but they light very short of the Marke and therefore Madame I hold it best you rather giue ouer with indifferencie then to weary your selfe and loose all in the end Ladie Well sayde Sir I am content that I serue you vaine 〈◊〉 to giue you delight by my 〈◊〉 to trye your wit and capacetie and séeing you are so plesauntly disposed haue with you for company but first I pray you make me resolution 〈◊〉 this demaund Who was the wisest that 〈◊〉 was the Learnedst that euer was the Loouingst that euer was the liberallest that euer was and the strongest that euer was Loe this is all therefore commaunde your wittes into your counting house and let me sée how finely you can define of this Demaund it is as good for you as a Doncaster bitte therefore hemme and to it with a courage What faynte you all readie nay soft you must yet sift a little farther turne the backside of your braynes once the backside of your braynes once more ouer 〈◊〉 now man no metuas be not afraide Scholler Tush Madame these your quippes I 〈…〉 delightfull as your disputation 〈◊〉 etting that passe I now apply my selfe to the aunswer of your demaunde The 〈◊〉 that euer was sinâ—◠〈…〉 was Sâ—llomon for that there was no Riddle nor Allegor 〈…〉 but by his wisdome he made 〈◊〉 â—aâ—e open But yet for all his wisdome he fell from God and was by Looâ—e made thrall to a number of vices But why Madame stande we héere vpon Me thinkes you inâ—er 〈◊〉 vpon necessitie because you want matter to follow your argument which if you doo I shall not onely 〈◊〉 in 〈◊〉 a Ladie but reioyse that by my meanes your minde shall bee altered from Looue Ladie Forwarde Sir you haue yet mist the marke and gon some what downe the winde but shoote once more Who was the Learnedst that euer was Scholler If a man may aime 〈…〉 then were the sonnes of 〈◊〉 the learnedst for knowing and 〈◊〉 the secreates and Misteries of the Heauens they found that the world should be destroyed either 〈◊〉 fire or water And therefore to leaue a memorie behinde them of such 〈◊〉 hidden misterie they erected 〈…〉 the one of earthe and the 〈◊〉 of brasse in which they orderly engraued the Science of Astrologie and Astronomis thinking that if the worlde were consumed with fire the 〈◊〉 of Earthe should yet be 〈◊〉 and if with water then the other of Brasse So that I déeme them the Learnedst for that they were the founders of Learning Ladie All this is labour lost well what and who was the loouingst that euer was Scholler The 〈◊〉 that euer was I déee◠〈…〉 our Sauiour Christe whose 〈◊〉 was such towarde vs poore sinners that he disdayned not to leaue Heauen to come and take 〈◊〉 nature héere vpon him on earth 〈◊〉 so of his mercy he might make â—â—tisâ—action for our sinnes whose 〈◊〉 otherwise had béene â—leane 〈◊〉 of saluation So that I affirmâ— his Looue towards vs neuer was is or shalbe the like Ladie So sir come no more aâ— that scantling I pray you for you haue hit the Clowte in the middest 〈…〉 againe who was the liberalleâ—â— that euer was Scholler The liberallest that euer was was Esau for he solde bothe his inheritaunce and also the blessing of God to his