needes be a monstrous mishapen thing in ioyning the Christians of these later daies with the Apostles without any betwixt and fosâ—â—ating as it were the feete of the body hard to the eares without any other members betwixt the one and the other And thus hauing framed this mery conceit in your owne heade you call vpon your frendes to laugh at it with you and so you proceede in telling vs that whiles we take this course we fly without wings and climbe without a ladder and despise the counsell of Salomon which after your maner you interpret that we should reckon by succession the pastours that haue succeeded in continuance of one kinde of doctrine the which you say you haue shewed you haue done To what purpose now is all this seeing in trueth neither we doe thus cut of all Christians betwixt them and vs neither haue you shewed any such succession of pastours downe from them to you continuing in your doctrine Truely to no other purpose can they serue but to expresse your owne ridiculous vanity Howbeit because you called in the former Chapter for the names of those that haue caught vs to deny your real presence in the sacrament and vpon a conceit in your owne fansie that you haue posed vs you haue growen to bee thus full of these swelling wordes of vanity and because I feare neither you nor many of your disciples will vouchsafe to peruse those books that I sent you vnto for answere in that point yet haue hope that for your sake some of you may chauÌ„ce vouchsafe to reade this I will not sticke with you particulerly to satisfie your request a little further First therefore vnderstand that we haue learned to deny your kinde of reall presence of Christ himselfe the institutour of this Sacrament because he hath flatly and vehemently affirmed without exception Iohn 6.54 that whosoeuer eateth his flesh drinketh his bloud hath eternall life Whereas by the meanes of your doctrine it followeth because all that receiue this sacrament haue not faith but manie lacke it that it shall bee eaten of manie that shal be neuer the better by it but the worse We haue also further learned it of him in that in the same Chapter speaking of the eating of his body drinking of his bloud he drew his hearers from a grosse conceit of eating drinking him by their bodily mouthes by vsing of the word beleeueth in stead of eateth and drinketh ver 40.47 and cap. 7.38 by mentioning vnto them his ascention Iohn 6.62 lattly by saying vnto theÌ„ It is the Spirit that quickeneth the flesh profiteth nothing the words that I speake vnto you are spirit life ver 63. This finally we haue learned of him saying If any shall say vnto you Lo here is Christ there is Christ beleeue it not Math. 24.23 by his continuing at the table when he first instituted and ministred it vnto his Apostles without alteration either of his place or forme Mat. 26. Mar. 12. Luke 22.1 Cor. 11. The Apostles euaÌ„gelists haue also taught vs to deny it in that they teach vs that he visibly asceÌ„ded into heauen that he shall so also come againe wheÌ„ he coÌ„meth froÌ„ thence c. Act. 1.11 especially seeing his comming to iudgement is called his secoÌ„d comming Heb 9.28 and vntil the restitutioÌ„ of all things it is saied by Peter the heaueÌ„s must coÌ„taine him Act. 3.21 The EuaÌ„gelists in laying downe vnto vs the story of his natiuity life death so prouing vnto vs that he was is a true and perfect maÌ„ encourage vs also least we should with the Marcionites other heretiques denie the trueth of his maÌ„hood coÌ„tantly to â—â—â—y your reall preseÌ„ce for the maintenance whereof you are driueÌ„ to fansy a nuÌ„ber of things quite contrary to the nature trueth of his maÌ„hood And lastly in that reciting the words of the institution they tel vs that Christ commanded that to be done in remeÌ„brance of him Luke 22.19 1. Cor. 11.24 there Paul saith v. 26. As often as ye shall eate this bread drink this cup ye shew the lords death till he coÌ„e which words plainly argu that though the sacrameÌ„t be both rightly ministresâ— receiued yet it inferreth not any such real preseÌ„ce as you ther imagâ—â— Now betwixt them vs we finde infinite places in writers of all ages that teach vs still to denie your reall presence but amongst many marke these for example TertulliaÌ„ in his 4. booke against MarcioÌ„ interpreteth these words Hoc est corpus meum thus that is to say This is a figure of my body Augustine against AdamaÌ„tus the Manichee c. 12. writeth that christ doubted not to say This is my body wheÌ„ he gaue a signe of his body vpoÌ„ the 3. Ps he saieth that Christ admitted Iudas to a baÌ„quet where he coÌ„meÌ„ded a figure of his body to his disciples vpoÌ„ the 98. Ps he saith yee shal not eat this body that yee see neither shall yee drinke that bloud which they shall shed that crucify me I haue coÌ„mended vnto you a certaine sacrament it being spiritually vnderstoode will giue you life In his 3. booke therfore of Christian doctrine he writeth thus This saying of Christ Except yee eate the flesh of the son of maÌ„ c. seemeth to coÌ„mand an heinous thing a wicked therefore it is a figure coÌ„maÌ„ding vs to be partakers of Christs passioÌ„ keeping in our minds to our great profit coÌ„fort that his flesh was crucified wouÌ„ded for vs. c. 16. he saith It is a miserable slauery of the soule to take the signes for the things signified in the same booke c. 5. And therefore in his 23. epistle he telleth vs that the similitude betwixt the signe the thing signified is the cause why the one beareth the name of the other in sacrameÌ„ts in his 57. questioÌ„ vpoÌ„ Leuitic he giueth vs this rule The thing that signifieth is woÌ„t to bear the name of the thing which it signifieth as Paul said The rock was Christ not it signified Christ but eueÌ„ as it had bene indeed which neuertheles was not Christ by substaÌ„ce but by signification So that his vsual doctrine is to teach vs in this sacrament to seeke christ in heaueÌ„ by faith thereby to make him present which otherwise is absent as you may read in his 50. tract vpon Iohn els where very often And with Augustine the rest of the fathers consent in this matter therefore nothing is more coÌ„moÌ„ with them then to call the outward part in this sacrament a signe figure similitude resemblance or representatioÌ„ as it appeareth in these places Chrysostom in his 83. Homil vpon Mat. Hierom in his 2. booke against IouiniaÌ„ Ambr. in his 4. booke of the sacraments c. 5. Basil in his lyturgy Ephr in his 4. booke against the impugners of Christs manhood by humane reason And Origen vpoÌ„ Leuit hom 7. teacheth vs that the letter
where I rest O most beautifull amongst all women follow thou the path that thy flocke hath made before thee setting thy tabernacle or thy lodge hard by the tabernacle of thy Shepheards If wee well note and vnderstand this answere it will learne vs that that shall suffice to keepe vs from running euer astray The sense is this O thou Christian which art troubled in thy conscience not knowing because of so many heresies which way thou shalt go or how thou shalt discerne the true religion from other false doctrine take my counsaile the which is to follow step by step the flocke that went before thee If that a thousand or two thousaÌ„d sheep run ouer a plaine those that come afterward doe not they knowe wel the path that is made before them Doe not they discerne the way that the first went Yes surely although there be no Shepheard to guide them And if thou doest answere that this doeth not suffice for I doe see diuerse pathes I see the path of the Caluinistes Cant. 1. the path of the Lutherans and the path of those of the Roman Church but yet doe not I knowe which flocke I should choose To this I answere thus set thy Tabernacle by the Tabernacle of the shepheardes and of thy Pastours I meane that a Then we may not leane to yours for this can it neuer doe I would haue thee to leane to that flocke that can leade thee from age to age and from yeare to yeare vnto the crosse of Iesus Christ on the which hee was nailed at noone daies and there it is where thou oughtest to quiet thy selfe and thy conscience Then to beginne If thou doest aske the Caluinistes Where is the true faith the which as they saie doeth consist in the true preaching of the worde of the Lorde and in the administration of the Sacramentes according to the institution of Iesus Christ they will answere It is at Geneua the Lutherans will answere at Wittemberge and the Anabaptistes will answere at MonasteriuÌ„ the Vbiquitaries they wil answer at â—ubing and the Trinitaries at Petricone and so consequentlie of the rest And then pursue and aske further where it was twentie yeares agone They will saie in the saied cities but if thou come to demaund of them where it was an hundred or two hundred yeares agone if they are ashamed anie thing at all to lye they wil not answere at all for there is none of them that can denie but that Luther who began to preach his new Gospell the yeare b This is a monstrous and impudent vntruth for constantly and generally wee say and proue by the Scripture that our religioÌ„ hath plentifull warrant both in the olde newe Testament 1517 was the first beginner of all these troubles the father of al those that teach this reformed Religion Then is it farre from that place where thy frend was nailed at middaie or where hee was crucified aboue 1500. yeares agone before the newe Church was dreampt of And therefore thou maiest easilie perceaue that this flocke cannot leade thee to the place that thou doest desire and consequentlie that is not the flock that wee should followe Then let vs come vnto the Roman Church and demaund where was this flocke an hundred yeares agone They will answere thee in France Spaine England Germanie and so ouer all Christendome And of thou aske where it was 500. yeares agone c They wil say so therefore it was so they will saie In the saied places And a thousand yeares agone likewise and likewise a thousand and fiue hundred yeares agone This flocke then will not leaue thee by the waie as the others doe but it will leade thee vnto the verie time of the death and passion of d This is also most vntrue for the popish doctrine from point to point wee are able to shew when it began and how it hath growen by degrees to that which it is not in a thousand years after Christ Christ by continuance of oâ—â— doctrine and by succession of pastours which Salomon doeth call the Tabernacle of the sheepe heardes And therefore this is the place where thou must seeke thy Tabernacle and quiet thy conscience to the ende that thou bee not a lost sheepe and that thou bee not readie to turne at euerie blast of new doctrine e None such coggers as Papistes in giuing the sence of the Scriptures who make not them the rule of their practise but their practise how mutable so euer the rule to giue the sence thereof by that our new coggers of the Scriptures doe set forth to deceaue the simple sheepe The IIII. Chapter TO this fourth chapter I answere that with Salomon to finde out the true Church of God wee as well as you exhorte Christes sheepe to followe the tracte of the flocke of Christ and to feede by the tentes or Tabernacles of his sheepheardes that so they maie bee ledde on and vp to Christ himselfe But then forasmuch as wee haue learned before by that which hath beene noted in the former Chapter concerning the fashion of heretiques especiallie seeing the same confirmed in you and other heretiques and apostataes in these our daies that euerie flocke is not Christes flocke that will pretende so to bee nor they alwaies his true sheepeheardes that are so accounted wee wish euerie one that wilfullie is not disposed to suffer himselfe to bee seduced by those that falsely thus pretende to learne to bee able as Saint Iohn hath taught all true Christians in the first Epistle and fourth verse to trie the spirites whether they be of God or no which they shall and may doe in trying both the flockes and their sheepheardes by the infallible worde of Christ contained in the Canonicall Scriptures For Christes sheepe will heare and obey his voice Ioh. 10. which vndoubtedlie and sufficiently is sounded in the written worde For the Scriptures are able to make a man wise vnto saluation through the faith which is in Christ Iesus For the whole Scripture is giuen by inspiration of God and is profitable to teach to improue to correct and to instruct in righteousnesse that the man of God may be absolute being made perfit vnto all good workes 2. Tim. 3. And therefore his true sheepeheardes will feede his sheepe with the sincere milke of this worde because that is it which they must desire as new borne babes doe milke that they may growe vp thereby if so be they haue tasted how bountifull the Lord is 1. Pet. 2. And because that is it according whereunto he that speaketh must speake because it is writen if any maÌ„ speake let him talke as the words of God 1. Pe. 4. By which rule if the flockes and sheepeheardes whom wee followe bee tryed they shal bee founde the sheepe whose tracte is to bee followed and the sheepeheardes by whose tentes is safe feeding And contrarilie by this rule your flockes and sheepeheardes come to the tryall of it when you
that it is possible that such filthy heretiques as Seruetus was may shewe themselues stout in dying But what is all this to proue that our martyrs haue broken the vnion of the Catholique Church or that they died as heretiques for heresie Before you can say any thing to the purpose either to proue them no true martyrs or to blemish their patience you should haue proued that their cause and religion for which they died was not the sound Christian trueth and faith but that you wil neuer bee able to doe And therefore both al this and what els you haue noted though falsely for there is no such thing in either of these two places out of Augustine contra Epistolam Petiliani of the Donatistes forwardnesse to die and out of Cyprians first booke of Epistles falleth downe to the ground as needles besides the questiō For whatsoeuer they there spake they spake it of heretickes therfore it hath no force against vs vntil you can proue vs so in alleadging Cypriās testimony by the way of parēthesis you say we know of what Church hee spake when hee sayed the heretiques that hee wrote of could not bee saued because they separated themselues from the Church the house of peace Indeed wee knowe that hee ment not your Church which is a bloudie house a house of warre cōtentiō a house of error superstitiō but the Church of Christ that was in his time to with yours is not so like as a drunken man is to a sober discreet man or a whore vnto an honest matrone for there is likelihood in substāce though not in quality yours is vnlike to the Church then in both Zischa you cal a martial minister of the Heborites or Hussites you would say or at least I am sure you should say a noble martiall Captaine for minister he was none of them whom their malitious enimies nickenamed Thaborites or Hussites for so they were called not as you call them At your pleasure you call Michael Seruet Caluins dearling but you cānot proue that he was euer in any such accoūt with Caluin why you should tearme him so But yet if he had beene so thorow his cunning in dissembling his heresie for a time the more commendation was it to Caluin that when he proued an obstinate heretique hee was so earnest and zealous in the cause of his God that all former affection set a part he furthered his due punishment as he did And for al your speech of his willingnes to die at Geneua and great patience in dying I cannot read but that he shunned death there as much as he could keeping or holding still his heresie and that thousands haue died on the gallowes for murder felonie and treason with as great shew of courage and patience as he But to let these things passe and to returne againe to your principall drifte in this which was as you shewe in the beginning of it to proue that neither our vocation nor religion could get any credit by the inuincible patience of our holy martyrs what hath bene saied as yet to proue this Your onely argument hitherto hath beene this The cause that a man dyeth for must bee good and hee must bee no heretique many heretiques haue dyed with great shew of patience Ergo c. This argument is starke naught for al these things in your antecedent may be graunted and yet of al them togither your conclusion followeth not These thinges which are not at al in question you haue proued but this that indeed should haue giuē life to your argument that ours died in and for an ill cause were heretiques which is indeede the thing onely in question like a wise man because you could not proue it you let alone But therfore you shall be contented for al your miserable crauing of it to bee granted you to be denied both it and your conclusion which without it you can neuer come vnto You will therefore proue as you make your reader beleeue that our Martyrs were such as died in an ill cause as heretiques and therefore went to hel But what be your proofes Ioachim Westphalus a Lutheran in a worke of his but it seemeth either you could not or would not tel vs in what worke for some politique reason you had doubtles mocked at Caluin for vaūting but where he made this vaunt or where we may finde it you tel vs not that within fiue yeares aboue an hundred had died for the religion of Geneua prouing vnto him that seeing there had beene far moe of the Anabaptistes put to death in lesse space and that the Deuill had his Martyrs his religion was no whit confirmed or countenanced by his Martyrs but they might for all his bragge be in the vauntgard of the Deuils martyrs What a miserable argument is this A contentious man in the heat of his contention saied thus to disgrace his aduersary and his side therefore therupon it shall follow that it was well and truely saied of him I thinke you will grāt me that Epiphanius and Chrysostome were good men both yet in heat of contention one against another Epiphanius burst out into such choler as he saied that he hoped the other should neuer die bishop to whō Chrysostōe answered as angerly again that he trusted the other should neuer returne aliue into his own cuntrey of Cypres infinite be the examples whereby we may see that men otherwise haue in heate of contention marueylously ouershot themselues one against another And therefore God forbid that vpon euery speach of disgrace vttered in such a case by one against another should by and by a firme argument be gathered that it is euen so as the one hath saied of the other But you will say you stād not so much vpō his speach against Caluins Martyrs as vpō that that there were mo of the Anabaptists that had died in a shorter space then he talked of and that otherwise the deuil hath had his martyrs which we cānot deny Hereupon indeed it followeth that an argument drawen to iustifie an opinion and the followers of it from the bare death and shew of patience of them that hold it is not good but so did neuer any of vs reason For first we labour to proue the cause good and that done then in the patience of such as haue died in so good cause togither with the cause we take comfort And yet in trueth we are sure we may speak it to the glory of God there were neuer either so many or any that so patiently died for any other opinion or opinions whatsoeuer as first and last died for the testimony of our religion For we account all them ours that haue from the beginning died for the glorious cause of the Gospell of Iesus Christ and in that we are able by the Scriptures to proue our religion to be the same we are sure we are not deceiued in our account In the conclusion of this Chapter to
common with you to al the solemnity of ceremonies that you vse now To trauell no further for the matter let vs but take a view of your rites and ceremonies in this case as they are set downe in your late Catechisme by the decree of the councell of Trent and Pius the fift Bishop of Rome writen and published for the instructioÌ„ of your parish Priests what and how to teach their people and we shall finde that these places doe not mention the one halfe of them by farre There first they are deuided in three rankes or sortes the first is of them that you by authority of that councell vnder paine of being anathematized must vse before the partie to be baptised come to the font the second is of such as be vsed in the baptizing of him and the third is of such as be vsed after Of the first stampe be these consecrating of the water with the oile of misticall vnction of Easter day and Whitsonday that shall serue for the whole yeare after as there shal be occasion to vse it the staying of the party without the Church dore vntill he either by himselfe or his Godfather for him promise the forsaking of the seruice of Sathan and his yeelding to enter into Gods seruice and family and being asked what he would haue answere be giuen that he would haue baptisme which being knowen theÌ„ it is saied further that he is to be instructed in the Cathecisme and is to answere it by himselfe or his godfather which done then in religious words and praiers exorcisme or adiuration to expell the deuil and to weaken and ouerthrow his power in him must be vsed a little salt must be put into his mouth the signe of the Crosse is to be made vpon his forehead eies brest shoulders and eares and lastly with the priests spettle his nostrels and eares must be anointed Now these things thus finished then he is admitted or brought to the font where next follow the rites of the second order which there are thus set downe then is he thrise asked whither he doe abreâ—ounce the deuill c. And thrise he or his godfather make answere abrenuÌ„tio I doe abrenouÌ„ce and then likewise he is asked whither he doe beleeue the twelue articles of the Christian faith whereunto answere is made credo I beleeue and lastly whither he will be baptized is demaunded wherunto answere being made volo I will he is baptized in the water in the font in the name of the father the sonne and holy Ghost either being dipt into the water or by hauing water poured or sprinkled vpon him according to the maner and fashion of the Church in that countrey where the party is baptized Where is also further shewed that it was the minde of that holy councel that at the most there should be but one godfather and one godmother thus to answere and vndertake for the baptized both because the order of discipline and instruction thorough a multitude of masters might be troubled and also because it was meet so to prouide least otherwise betwixt too many such spirituall affinities should grow as might hinder mariadge amongst men too much For as the writer of that booke further saieth most wisely by the Church it was decreed that there should grow such affinity not onely betwixt the baptized and baptizer but also betweene the baptized and the sureties and the baptized his true parents that thenceforth none of them might marry togither That also may not be forgotten that there also it is shewed that the naturall parentes of the party to bee baptized may not so promise answere for him that so that rather it weâ— appeare how farre this spirituall education differs froÌ„ the carnall Belike the authour of this Catechisme the councell Pope that set him a worke coÌ„maÌ„ded the publishing of his booke had quite forgotteÌ„ that S. Paul saieth to naturall pareÌ„ts yee fathers bring vp your childreÌ„ in instructioÌ„ informatioÌ„ of the Lord Ephes 6. ver 4. or else they were at a flat point they cared not whatsoeuer hee had taught Now your Ceremonies of the lust sort as he setteth theÌ„ out are these baptisme ministred finished the baptizeds crowne of the head is to be annointed with the holy chrisme a white garment or at least a white sudarioluÌ„ that is handkerchiefe or cloth to wipe away sweat withall is to be giuen him a burning waxe candle is to be put into his hand lastly his name must be giueÌ„ him Now I pray you what are the 5. things aforesaied mentioned in these places to such a nuÌ„ber as these And yet the Tridentine couÌ„cel whose mind this authour plainly set out thought al these so necessary can 13. de SacrameÌ„tis that it pronouÌ„ceth him accursed that shall coÌ„teÌ„ne omit or take vpoÌ„ him to alter any of these And the more is as it is euideÌ„t by your own doctors DuraÌ„d Dorbel Herolt others you obserue not these rites ceremonies with the opinioÌ„ that ecclesiasticall coÌ„stitutions of such matters ought only to be obserued wtal that is in hâ—lding stilfast the doctrine of ChristiaÌ„ liberty in your coÌ„scieÌ„ces obseruing theÌ„ for deceÌ„cy coÌ„lines edification wtout opinion of holines necessity merit therin for the better maintenaÌ„ce of order peace in the church but most grosly superstitiously idolatrously haue you taught meÌ„ to impute to a nuÌ„ber of them as naÌ„ely to your exorcism annointing crossing such force efficacy as that not only you haue made theÌ„ to encroch far vpoÌ„ the vse effect of baptism it self but also you haue do attribute so great so many spiritual graces effects to theÌ„ that litle or nothing is left as speciall to baptisme Nay who is so simple but that he seeth that these such other rites ceremonies amoÌ„gst you though it be neuer so euident that they be but of humane deuise inuentioÌ„ are more carefully vrged obserued theÌ„ that very order that expreslie it set downe in the scriptures theÌ„selues about concerning the administratioÌ„ of the sacrameÌ„ts if it were not thus you durst not so coÌ„trary to the doctrine order of S. Paul 1. cor 14. appoint vse rather as you do an vnknown tongue in the ministring of theÌ„ then a laÌ„guage that the people might vnderstaÌ„d be edified by so say ameÌ„ with vnderstaÌ„ding to your praiers thaÌ„ksgiuing Nether durst you thus to ad to the lords ordinaÌ„ces accurse theÌ„ that omit any of your additioÌ„s in the mean time take vpoÌ„ you quite coÌ„trary to the words of Christ drink ye al of this to bereaue the coÌ„moÌ„ people of the cup to the sacrameÌ„t of Christs body bloud wtall by your new found tearme and doctrine of concomitance peruerting quite the vse end of the sacrament in making it a sacrament of the life glory of Christ whereas by his ordinance it is a sacrament of his death and abasement for
last iudgement and yet here he findeth no third sort or place for them in the meane time no more then in the other But he was not very constant herein For in his 21 booke of the City of God cap 26. he saieth if in this meane time betwixt death the iudgemēt the souls of the departed be saied to suffer such a fire or there onely or there and here or therefore here and not there a fire he saieth of transitory tribulation burning vp their worldly smaller faultes I reproue it not because perhaps it is true de fide operibus cap. 14. hee saieth likewise whither in this life onely men suffer these thinges or after this life such iudgements doe follow them as I thinke saieth he this sence of Paul is not against the trueth namely to vnderstand him of the fire of tribulation or triall And in his Enchiridion cap. 68. he saieth that the fire that the Apostle speaketh of 1. Cor. 3. is the fire of tribulation through which both kinde of builders there spokē of must passe and tha such a thing may be after this life it is not incredible whither it be so or no it may be a questiō cap. 69. The like he hath of the 8 questions of Dulcitius in his answere to the first of them wherein it appeareth that he was very vncertaine whither there were or no any such fire of tribulation after this life any where before the last iudgement to purge men of some kinde of sinnes but what these sinnes were that staied men from going to heauen straight vpon their death whereof after they might get some releife and ease he saieth it was harde to finde and perillous to define and as for his owne part he confesseth that though to that time he had laboured to finde out what they were yet he could not lib. 21. de ciuit Dei Cap. 27. And how dangerous it was and is to fall into such doubts we may see in him For in the 24 Chapter of the same booke it appeareth that vpon this supposition that there might bee some such purging fire as he somtimes doubted of he moueth this sound question whither they shall bee saued whom the daie of iudgement shall finde vnpurged with this fire which yet might haue beene purged with it if it had not come so soone and he resolueth that with an other doubtful imagination that they suffering for a time some pains shal haue mercy as he thought not be condemned to hel and in this saied 20 booke of the City of God he hath an opinion cap. 25. that in the last iudgement before sentence bee pronounced some shall passe thorow purging paines And yet in the third question to Dulcitius he determineth it as a flat trueth to be beleeued that in the last iudgement there shall be no delay but immediatly vpon the second comming of Christ it shall be as we are taught Matth. 25. Hereby we see how wattering and inconstant euen famous learned men become when they once wander without the light of the word after the discourses and reasonings of the wit of man How much better had it bene for Augustin in these questions to remember the rule and to haue followed that which he gaue others in such cases as I shewed before in the cōclusion of the former point out of his second booke de pecca meritis remiss Cap. 36. Yet in none of these places or else where can I finde that he once dreamed of such a purgatory fire as the papists teach which should be materiall and of the same nature that the fire of hell is saue onely that it is not eternal as that Wherefore I conclude of him as of Origen these things considered the arguments are like to be very doughty and strong that are brought from any mention that Augustine maketh of purgation after this life either to proue popish purgatory or praier to relieue the soules of them that bee there And euen as I haue saied of these two so might I likewise of most of the ancient fathers from whence they would seeme at any time to fetch countenance for this their purpose they are so variable wauering and inconstant in their speeches most of them about this matter but this I hope is and will be sufficient to proue the weakenesse of Albins arguments from these two to iustifie his praying for the dead because these two in some of the places quoted by him when he can get them to come no nearer the point haue in some sort spoken of purging of men after this life in paines Now therefore likewise I am to shew how weake there arguments be drawen frō some mention found in some of the fathers of some kinde of remembring the dead in praiers Which easily may be conceiued if we vnderstād that first there may be an honourable mētion or remēbrāce made of those that are dead in the Lord without any praying for them at al to shew our thankefulnes to God for the good exāple they left vs both of liuing holily dying Christianly the better to prouoke others by so remēbring of thē to imitate their good example and lastly so to nourish in our selues the hope of a ioiful resurrection and to testifie our loue and Christian affection towardes them so departed which questionles was all that was done a long time at the keeping of the memories of their deathes or at anie time else and of this very well may both Tertullian and Cyprian be vnderstoode in the places here quoted by Albin as I will shewe anon From such a fashion of mentioning the deade in our prayers euery simple man may see popish praying for them hath no countenance at all Secondly we ought to be aduertised that forasmuch as they that are dead in the Lord haue not yet their consummation nor shall not before the last day that in that respect also for such of whom we fully are perswaded that they so died that they haue their part in the promisse thereof praiers may be made by the godly aliue very lawfully And therefore thus we graunt the ancient fathers might pray for the dead and thus we our selues as appeareth here in England by the forme of praiers appointed to be vsed at the buriall of the dead refuse not to pray that we with those brethrē and sisters of ours that depart hence in the Lord may haue our perfect consummation and blisse at the last day in the generall resurrection And yet of praiers thus made for such onely by them or vs neither popish praying for the dead nor purgatory haue any ground Lastly it is euident that many of the ancient fathers of abūdāce of loue towards their frendes departed whose soules they were fully perswaded were in rest and in ioy and felicity with the Lord in heauen as they shew euen in the very places when their praiers for them are set downe prayed yet vnto God for them Thus praied Nazianzē for his
pulled downe and they cast out and those that did offer sacrifice vnto theÌ„ grieuously punished then saieth he the iustice is not certaine through the pâ—ssion or for hauing suffered death but the death and passion is glorious when it is for the sustaining of the true faith And therefore saieth he our sauiour because he would not haue the simple deceiued vnder this colour of trueth he did not onely say blessed are those that suffer but hee added for iustice But this can in no wise be attributed vnto those heretiques that suffer to seperate the vnion and concorde of the Catholique church c In that booke it appears these Donatists did indeed complaine and yet brag of their persecutioÌ„s but thus much I finde not there testified against them or of theÌ„ In his booke de haeresibus ad quod vult Deum he writeth to this effect of them And in his booke de vnitate Ecclesiae contra Epistolam Petiliani he doeth write that the Donatists which were a sect of heretiques that raigned in his time to confirme their doctrine they did not attende that others should put them to death but they did cast them selues downe from high places others did burne themselues in the fire to be honoured after their death as Martyrs and that is more they did threaten men if they would not kill them d He writes in that epistle no such thing you had the worst lucke in quoting of your testimonies that euer had aâ—y for 3. for one you cite wrâ—ng S. Cyprian in like maner doeth write in the first booke of his Epistles in the first Epistle that though an heretique suffer death for Christ that doeth not confirme him as a Martyr but that his death is the very punishment of his errourâ— and that he cannot go to heauen which is the mansion of the humble for seeing that he doeth seperate himselfe froÌ„ the house of peace which is the church yee know well of what church he doeth speake that he cannot be receaued into heaueÌ„ c. All those that haue writen the histories of the BohemiaÌ„s doe say that in the time of e Zischâ— was a famouâ— souldier captain but minister he was none one Zischa a martial minister of the heresie of the Heborits or Hussites there were a certaine sect of heretiques called Adamites like vnto the olde heresie of the Nicholaites for they did saie as these doe that mens wiues should bee common and they vvent all naked euery one taking the woman hee liked best whom hee did carie vnto their minister and before him hee did saie the holie ghost doeth inspire me to lie with this person then the saied reuerent father did giue him his blessing saying Increase and multiplie and so they went awaie This aboue named Zischa although hee had done a number of wicked deedes yet hee determined to abolish and take awaie this sect f And therefore popish traytours that are executed amongst vâ— for high treason though they seeme to take their death neuer so patiently we lawfully couÌ„â— call tâ—aitours though you â—anonize them for Saints and so he caused two women to be burnt for this abhomination the which two notwithstanding the torment of the fire did sing and giue thankes to God for that it had pleased him to permit them to die for so holy so iust a quarrell Did not Michael Seruet who was once master Caluins dearling rather desire to suffer at Geneua then he would confesse that Christ was God and yet notwithstanding his great patience or to saie the trueth diuilish obstinacy cannot be sufficient to make him a Martyr nor to perswade you to beleeue his doctrine g What need all these seing none of vs euer stande vpon the bare sufferings of meÌ„ no more then you you should yet haue named the places where these things are writen and not thus haue sent vs to seeke we cannot tell where There is a certaine minister of the Lutherans called Ioachim Westphall who in a worke of his doeth mocke at Caluin who did vaunt that within these fiue years aboue an hundred had suffered death to sustaine the Gospell of Geneua and he doeth answere him at large prouing that the sect and doctrine of the saied place ought not to bee approued for the multitude of false martyrs for the Anabaptists whoÌ„ he doeth iustly coÌ„deÌ„ne haue had of their sect a great many more for in lesse theÌ„ three years there haue suffered a great number more then euer there did suffer of Caluinists in fifteene And to conclude this matter the saied Westphal doeth say that the deuill hath his Martyrs euen as well as God with whom like a good sergeant he doeth march giuing the vauÌ„tward vnto the martyrs of the Caluinists that haue suffered at Geneua h The more to blame are they if they should say so but though heat of contentioÌ„ caused Westphalê° to write so bitterly I thinke very few will ioyne with him in this iudgemeÌ„t sure I am they whom you cal Caluinists doe not iudge so of them because of that 1. Co. â— v. 15 So that if one demaund of the Lutherans whither go those that die in the Religion of Caluin of Beza or of the Anabaptists they saie to the Diuell And if one demande of the Caluinists in like maner whither go the Anabaptists and the Lutherans they saie likewise to the Diuell And who would put the like question to the Anabaptists I am assured they would saie at the others to the Diuell For my part I beleeue you I assure you all three i This argueth a most diuelish and profane spirit in the writer And seeing that yee agree so well that one serue for an others harbenger we were very fooles if wee should stay your passage but let you go all to the Diuell for company for I thinke if you were all gone our debates would cease and hell would be so full that the deuill would long for no more The XXXI Chapter YOu neede not to tell vs that Augustine and Chrysostome haue taught that it is not the death but the cause that maketh a martyr For we know that to be a most certaine trueth and the generall doctrine of all good writers both olde and new and therefore you might haue spared your paines bestowed in the proofe of this And therefore most willingly wee acknowledge as Christ hath taught vs that onely they are blessed martyrs that suffer for righteousnes sake Mat. 5. and none to be martyrs howe patientlie soeuer they seeme to suffer their deathes that by for an il cause either in life or doctrine And yet we are not ignorant that many haue died in lewde and for lewd opinions who yet haue seemed to die willingly and cherefully and therefore wee deny not but that it may be true that some such wicked women of that beastlie heresie of the Adamites were put to death in Zischaes time in Bohemia died as you write and