Selected quad for the lemma: death_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
death_n	cause_n	sin_n	world_n	5,042	5	5.2006	4	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A13861	An aunsuuere made by Bar. Traheron to a priuie papiste vvhich crepte in to the English congregation of Christian exiles vndre the visor of a fauorer of the Gospel, but at lenghth bewraied himselfe to be one of the popes asses, thorough his slouche eares and than became a laughing stocke to al the companie, whom he had amased before with his maske : hereunto is added the subscription of the cheifest of the companie first, and afterward the subscriptio[n] of M. Ro. Watson ...	Traheron, Bartholomew, 1510?-1558?	1558 (1558)	STC 24167.7; ESTC S2369	25,888	69

wil as mē see that be awake Cold not god I praie you wil and ordaine Satans ministers to robbe Iob onles he delighted in their robberie for it selfe or of necessitee to auoide a greater inconuenience Cold not he wil and ordaine Achabs false prophetes to lie onles he delighted in their liyng for it selfe Cold not he wil and ordaine that Hophnie and Phineas shuld not heare their fathers good admonition bicause he wold kil them onles he delighted in their stubburne disobedience or of necessitee to auoid a greater inconuenience God than willeth thinges that he delighteth not in for them selues nether by reason of weakenes nor to auoide a greater inconuenience but to sette forth before mennes eyes his power his wisedom his righteousnes his goodnes and mercie Which vertues yet neuer to be knowen to the world we maie wel iudge to be an incōuenience touching vs but touching god it is none at al. For he might haue remained perfectly blisful in him selfe though he had neuer made vs. Awaie than with this vaine iangling But let vs se more of this gaie stuffe Our preatie Polyphemus wil not confesse that he goeth aboute to pulle god out of his throne For saieth he his office of gouerning consisteth not in this that it was his wil ordinance that Adam shuld sinne But if you take from god the ordaining gouerning and directing of Adās sinne and of al mennes sinnes you shal discharch him of a great parte of his gouernement and so farre like a young giaunt you go furiously aboute to pulle him out of his throne to your awne destruction But we ar demaunded an high quaestion how we can proue that thei which teach that it was not goddes wil that Adam shuld sinne do teach that thīges be dō whether god wil or no. I praie you master Doctor he that doeth the thing that you wold it shuld not be dō doeth he it not whether you wil or no But you saie that Adam sinned not whether god wold or no for god suffered him to sinne But that proueth not yet but that Adam sinned whether god wold or no. For one maie suffre a thinge to be don whether he wil or no. If you wil saie that god suffred it willingly than you graunt with vs that it was his wil that Adam shuld sinne And than you haue plaied the parte of a verie honest wise man al this while Where to myn aunswere that god testified to Adam by his commaundment what he alowed and what his pleasure was you replie that if god had willed decreed that Adā shuld through his awne faulte do the thīg which god had forbidden before god shuld therein haue willed and decreed the commaundment that he gaue before to be broken and than that had ben a contrarietee and repugnantie in him I aunswer that you haue more than serpentes eyes if you see that contrarietee and repugnantie You maie wel dreame that you see it in your sleepe but whan you awake you shal perceaue that it was but a vaine fansie a fliyng imagination For maie not a father laie vp apples in his chambre and giue a commaundment to his children that thei shal nor meddle with them and yet wil decree with him selfe as much as a mā maie wil and decree that thei shal steale them awaie and eate them to this ende that he maie ierke them wel and thriftely whereby while thei liue afterwarde thei maie feare to steale or to be lycorous or to breake their fathers commaundment Maie not I saie a father do al this onles he be contrarie and repugnant to him selfe Much more cold god wil decree that Adam shuld breake his commaundment thorough his awne faulte for a more excellent purpose without contrarietee repugnance in him selfe Whan afterwarde you saie that Adā in sinning did not the wil of god if by the word wil you meane goddes decree you misse the cusshion if by the word wil you meane that god alowed not Adams sinne ne had pleasure in it for the sinne it selfe I assente thereunto But how haue you than proued that it was not goddes wil decree and ordinance that Adam shuld sinne Against myn aunswer to the fourth argument spoken of in my boke you haue brought nothing worthie to be rehersed Wherefore I passe ouer to myn aunswer to the fift argument Against him that obiected Adams fre wil I said that goddes wil and ordinance letted not but that Adā shuld do frely and willingly without compulsion that he did And how that might be I shewed by exemples which you touch not bicause thei were to hotte But to that you replie that I wringe Adams free wil al together on the lift hand that is to sinne death but I leaue not free wil to the right hand that is to the keping of goddes commaundment and aeternal life I aunswer that god made Adam in such integritee vprightnes perfection of nature that whā he wold do goddes commaundmentes he might do them frely and willingly haue abundant sufficientie of natural strenghth thereunto and whan he wold decline from goddes commaundement he might do the same frely and willingly thorough his awne faulte and not thorough want of natural strength And I saie that his fre wil stode in this vprightnes strength perfection of nature not in choise of this or that For if there were no free wil but where a mā maie choose whether he wil do the thīg that is good or the thinge that is euil than there were no fre wil in god whose wil is most free For he can do no euil but only the thinges that be good Wherefore where thinges be don frely and willingly and wihout compulsion thorough no want of natural strength there is free wil saie I. And this I know was in Adam but no such fre wil whereby he might disappoint goddes certaine purpose or whereby it shuld folow that god had yet determined nothīg certainly But now though manie thinges powred out to no purpose folow in this replication I maie not passe ouer that where I asked whether he wold saie this Death came in to the world by the enuie of the diuel ergo it was not ordained by god he aūswereth flatly that death was not ordained by god And allegeth a sentence for him out of the first of wisedom God made not death nether hath he pleasure in the destruction of the liuinge To this I saie that the autor of that boke meaneth no more but that god was not the propre cause of death but the diuels enuie and mannes sinne and yet it foloweth not but that god ordeined death for mennes sinne For a king in his realme ordaineth hanginge for theues and murtherers and yet is not the propre cause of their hanging but their awne nawghtines And I saie once more that he that saieth that god ordaineth not death for mennes sinnes saieth that men die besides goddes ordinance But this geare is to grosse where with

seing that S. Pau. saieth that he hath vessels prepared vnto destruction Willeth not the death of those whom he hath prepared to destruction Againe how childish sophistrie is this he that is the autor of life willeth no sinne which is the cause of death It semeth that you thincke that god willeth no man to die And than al men die besides goddes wil. Which no man I dare saie wil affirme onles he be starcke mad I aduise you therefore to leaue these toies of plaine fransie God giue to you and to me speedie repentance of our faultes opē your eyes in this matter as he hath vouch safed to open ours that we maie together agree in the truthe in vnfained humilitee and in christian loue which christian loue yet hath hir sharpnes wil bite the faultes that wil not other wise be amended Wherefore at my handes you shal loke to haue your boiles laūched to haue corrosies smarting plaisters laied vpon them vntil thei be cured Goddes spirite directe vs. ¶ Bar. Traheron your frend assone as you can loue the truthe ¶ TO THIS LETTRE OVR countrefaite protestāt sent me an aūswer stuffed with an huge heape of railing wordes wherevpon I wrote thus vnto him againe IF you be not sore sicke and feoble after so great thronges and after your deliuerance of such a swarme of innumerable railing wordes as it were of young diuels you maie be matched with anie she giaunt in the world in strong and lustie trauail in your faire happie childbed It semeth to me that in the middest of your rauinge traunce you had a litle witte remaining For whereas you despeared victorie in al other thinges you thought you wold ouer comme at the lest in railing scoffing taūting And surely you haue brought your swete purpose to passe For I yeld vnto you this noble victorie hold vp my hādes And bicause you haue a meruailous greedie hūger a thirst vnquencheable for vaine glorie you shal haue this praise at my hādes also that you ar the the ioliest scold and the greatest railer that euer I heard or shal eare I thinke But shal I not thincke that you wold sporte your selfe in plaie refresh your forworen witte with a preatie pleasant frantike imagination whā you wrote in the beginnīg of your lustie lettre after that you had powred out at one belche more than halfe a dousen malitious railing wordes that you were taught by S. Pet. not to rendre rebuke for rebuke Thought you it so good a thinge to take a while a litle pa●time in your ioieous fransie that you passed not how longe men shuld lawgh at your mad behauior afterwarde But if I shuld medle with al your straūge prankes with al your new follies I shuld shew my selfe litle lesse fond than you ar I wil therefore pike out here and there that I thincke maie combre a simple reader Otherwise to saie the truth al your gaie stuffe is such as i● might be better despised than aunswered In regard of the vnlerned and to shew you your foule fete while you glorie in your p●cockes fethers I must do some what against myn awne iudgemēt stoupe so to houg● your hammes behinde that you shal be see● to halte in this matter Bicause I said tha● you wrested S. Au. not ōly violently but also with some losse of a good conscience you permitte to your selfe to affirme that plaie Antichristes parte so proudly to presume to haue a place in mānes conscience But if I plaie Antichristes parte in iudging your conscience by the manifest frutes thereof whose parte plaie you whan in your writinge you iudge so often that to be in my herte whereof you neuer saw frute nor sparke nor anie maner of likelihod I thācke god Wel I beleue ere it be long you shal fele whose parte you haue plaied You be verie angrie that I doubted whether you vndrestode S. Aug. wordes and you wold haue me to impute the faulte of your trāslation to want of diligent examination For you had leuer al othet faultes shuld be found in you than lacke of lerning Wel I am cōtente for this once that you shal wipe awaie one faulte with another and that men shal rather compte you rashe to runne blind fold for hast thā not to vndrestād so easie latine wordes But you be so good a man than you wil teach me my grammer to For you saie I englissh impleret he fulfilled For thorough hast to teach you sticke not to make a lie For this is my translation These be the great worckes of god c. that he fulfilled c. Where I make impleret the subiunctiue mode and not the indicatiue mode as you ether shamelesly or vnlernedly affirme You englisse the word impleret might fulfille so might I to if I wold haue shewed my selfe as ignorant as you ar For might fulfil maketh the sentence doubteful For god might fulfille his wil though he did not fulfille his wil. But S. Aug. ment not to leaue the sentence in suspense that god might fulfil his wil did not but he ment to teach cerrainly that he did fulfille his wil. And thus by turnīg the subiūctiue mode in to the potential you haue takē great paines to shew your selfe as ignorant in grammer as you did before and do afterward in logike Where I said that S. Aug. meaneth that Adam did that god wold not in it selfe and for it selfe bicause you can not confute it you wold auoide it with a meruailous preatie shift For you aunswrr that if it might be permitted to you so to wrest euerie autor you wold haue none against you that I affirme myn vndrestanding only vpon a lordly autorite Howbeit if you haue leasure to be at home a litle while you shal vndrestand that I affirme not my saiynge vpon myne awne autoritee but vpō a good ground For if you denie that or the like to be S. Au. meaning you shal make him to speak not opposita cōtraria as you vnaduisedly powre out your wordes at auenture but plaine cōtradictorie sētēces to fighte against him selfe But now at the last you shew an high point of wit and lerninge For where I proued that it was S. Augustines minde that Adā sinned by goddes wil and ordināce out of these his wordes No thinge is don c. and out of the other sentences alleged before you saie that none of those places proue the matter For saie you al those places speake of goddes prouidence whereby al thinges haue their being and ar gouerned If al thinges be gouerned by goddes prouidence as you confesse than sinful actes ar gouerned by his prouidence also comme not to passe besides his wil and ordinance And what a preatie argument of yours is this sinne is a deprauation of nature and the absence of righteousnes ergo it cōmeth not to passe by the ordinance of god But I weene that the Iues committed in procuryng of